When bigots say “You’ve lost my vote”, here’s the proper response

A dark and stormy covfefe
Politics • Views: 19,669

Mayor Jim Watson received hundreds of retweets and favourites on Twitter when he announced on the social network Thursday that the Pride flag would fly at City Hall until the end of the Olympics.

But at least one person was not pleased with the move, telling the mayor: “This is a stupid waste of time. You’ve lost my vote.”

Watson’s response also went viral.

Rainbow flags are flying across the country during the Winter Games in Sochi in response to a Russian law that makes it illegal to spread “propaganda for non-traditional sexual relations” to minors.

The flag is also flying in Toronto. Or course, mayor Ford is apoplectic at the decision.

More: Jim Watson Tweet in Support of Pride Flag Goes Viral

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191 comments
1 nines09  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 2:35:44pm

Nailed it.

2 The War TARDIS  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 2:57:53pm

In regards to Ford, why do we care about what a coked-out fuckwit has to think?

3 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 3:41:29pm

re: #2 The War TARDIS

In regards to Ford, why do we care about what a coked-out fuckwit has to think?

Well Ottawa and Toronto are both in Ontario I believe. Anyhow good on the mayor. Sometimes bigots have to be told some harsh truths.

4 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 6:14:00pm
The flag is also flying in Toronto. Or course, mayor Ford is apoplectic at the decision.

He is. The city flew the Rainbow flag anyway. To mollify the silly drunk they put the Canadian flag up as well.

By then he was too drunk to notice. Probably.

5 ausador  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 6:24:33pm
This is a stupid waste of time. You’ve lost my vote.

Slightly shorter response I would have used…

Good.

6 fern01  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 8:25:44pm

The fool would never have voted for him in the first place - nothing there to lose.

7 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Feb 8, 2014 9:39:52pm

Ottawa is my hometown and birthplace. Proud of Watson for smacking that sucker down.

8 missliberties  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 7:25:08am

re: #2 The War TARDIS

In regards to Ford, why do we care about what a coked-out fuckwit has to think?

Entertainment value?

9 Political Atheist  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 11:56:59am

Congrats on the Promotion!

10 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 11:59:34am
11 Bear  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:02:54pm

re: #10 Charles Johnson

?

12 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:04:54pm

The driver was a drunk 21 yr old woman.

Diamond Bar wrong-way freeway crash leaves 6 dead; driver arrested for DUI, manslaughter

abclocal.go.com

And 5 more dead in a single crash in FL, among others,.

5 die after wrong-way crash on I-275 in Tampa in night of several fatal crashes

tampabay.com

13 Stanley Sea  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:07:06pm

re: #12 Justanotherhuman

The driver was a drunk 21 yr old woman.

Diamond Bar wrong-way freeway crash leaves 6 dead; driver arrested for DUI, manslaughter

abclocal.go.com

And 5 more dead in a single crash in FL, among others,.

5 die after wrong-way crash on I-275 in Tampa in night of several fatal crashes

tampabay.com

DAMN

14 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:09:31pm

re: #11 Bear

?

!

15 Bear  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:13:05pm

re: #14 Charles Johnson

C.J. miss the pictures you posted in the past. More please.

16 Eventual Carrion  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:13:15pm

re: #14 Charles Johnson

!

(V)(;,,;)(V)

17 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:23:31pm

re: #13 Stanley Sea

DAMN

Texas has superficially harsh and strict drunk driving laws but they are riddled with exceptions and loopholes that allow most drunk drivers to walk free, even after multiple convictions. The prevailing theory is that the justice system and the legislature are themselves infested with drunkards and they don’t want to be hoist by their own petard, at least no more than is necessary to keep the yokels voting their way.

18 Belafon  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:39:11pm

re: #12 Justanotherhuman

isn’t the solution to this more guns?

//

19 jaunte  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:41:33pm

re: #16 Eventual Carrion

Zoidberg!

20 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:44:07pm

re: #18 Belafon

isn’t the solution to this more guns?

//

No, its drinking less booze.

21 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:44:46pm

Speaking of proper responses:

22 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:45:48pm

Who the hell cares? It’s a freakin’ LEGO movie. It’s supposed to be mindless fun.

23 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:46:21pm

On topic, one of the things (among many) that I love about my country is that, generally speaking, Canadians have a VERY low tolerance for bigoted BS.

24 Belafon  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:46:57pm

re: #22 Eclectic Cyborg

And it was a lot of fun.

25 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:50:02pm

re: #21 Lidane

Speaking of proper responses:

[Embedded content]

I’m surprised no one on FNC accused 12 Years a Slave of having an anti white message. Or that could have happened and I missed it.

26 b_sharp  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:52:07pm

re: #10 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

It’s all in the crazy ass users.

27 b_sharp  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:53:21pm

re: #23 Eclectic Cyborg

On topic, one of the things (among many) that I love about my country is that, generally speaking, Canadians have a VERY low tolerance for bigoted BS.

Uhhh.

28 Feline Fearless Leader  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 12:55:11pm

re: #16 Eventual Carrion

(V)(;,,;)(V)

Is that Zoidberg chasing the last anchovie?

29 RadicalModerate  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:01:03pm

If this is true, this guy needs to be locked up for the rest of his life.

Groping suspect might be abortion clinic bomber

SNOHOMISH — Police believe the man who groped an 11-year-old girl at a Snohomish grocery store last month is the same man who fire-bombed abortion clinics in Everett and Bellingham in the 1980s. At least eight people identified Curtis Anton Beseda as the man seen in video surveillance released to the media on Tuesday. Prosecutors on Friday charged Beseda, 58, with first-degree child molestation in connection with the groping.

Of course, Beseda is considered a hero to the religious right.

Beseda became a convicted martyr for the anti-abortion movement in the 1980s after he was sentenced to 20 years in prison for arsons at abortion clinics. The unemployed roofer frequently picketed outside the Feminist Women’s Health Center in Everett. He set three nighttime fires there in 1983 and 1984, eventually forcing the women’s health clinic to close. He also was convicted of an arson at a Bellingham clinic. Beseda was revered by other anti-abortionists and was honored at a national banquet in 1995. He sent a letter from prison, which was read at the banquet. The letter urged support for Shelly Shannon, an Oregon woman who was sentenced to 30 years in prison for shooting an abortion doctor in Kansas in 1993, as well as setting fire to six abortion clinics.

30 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:05:12pm

re: #29 RadicalModerate

If this is true, this guy needs to be locked up for the rest of his life.

Groping suspect might be abortion clinic bomber

Of course, Beseda is considered a hero to the religious right.

“Pro life”

31 Kragar  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:08:04pm

Star Wars meets 40k - Awesomeness ensues

32 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:08:31pm

Listening to the new Broken Bells. Good stuff.

33 ObserverArt  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:13:46pm

re: #12 Justanotherhuman

The driver was a drunk 21 yr old woman.

Diamond Bar wrong-way freeway crash leaves 6 dead; driver arrested for DUI, manslaughter

abclocal.go.com

And 5 more dead in a single crash in FL, among others,.

5 die after wrong-way crash on I-275 in Tampa in night of several fatal crashes

tampabay.com

The image of the burnt Ford Explorer indicates that both cars never even hit the brakes as that front end is driven all the way back, under and around to he right passenger side. The engine must be down under the vehicle or in the front passenger seat.

Knowing that the Explorer is a fairly stout vehicle, I am relieved not to see the Hyundai Sonanta. So sad, four 20 year olds. What an unnecessary waste of life.

34 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:15:55pm

re: #32 HappyWarrior

Listening to the new Broken Bells. Good stuff.

I’m really enjoying it as well, everyone needs to get this one.

35 ObserverArt  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:17:09pm

re: #32 HappyWarrior

Listening to the new Broken Bells. Good stuff.

I miss the Shins.

36 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:18:43pm

re: #34 Randall Gross

I’m really enjoying it as well, everyone needs to get this one.

Totally. Alas see they’re already sold out in DC for their show in March.

37 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:21:05pm

38 KingKenrod  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:25:16pm

LOL

39 Eventual Carrion  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:25:22pm

re: #28 Feline Fearless Leader

Is that Zoidberg chasing the last anchovie?

(V)(;,,,;(V) 

             ><(((;>

40 Kragar  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:28:18pm

re: #39 Eventual Carrion

(V)(;,,,;(V)

><(((;>

WWCD?

~^(;,,;)^~

41 Kragar  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:30:14pm

About that last great bastion of Freedom and Liberty…

43 RadicalModerate  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:30:59pm

re: #33 ObserverArt

The image of the burnt Ford Explorer indicates that both cars never even hit the brakes as that front end is driven all the way back, under and around to he right passenger side. The engine must be down under the vehicle or in the front passenger seat.

Knowing that the Explorer is a fairly stout vehicle, I am relieved not to see the Hyundai Sonanta. So sad, four 20 year olds. What an unnecessary waste of life.

The updated story mentions that the Sonata had just reached the crest of a hill when it was struck by the wrong-way driver, they very likely never even saw the Explorer coming. Also, from the video, it was very apparent that he was traveling well above the speed limit as well, as he was easily outpacing the vehicle that made the recording - there was a shot of the speedometer right after impact, which showed they were going about 65mph.

44 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:32:28pm

re: #41 Kragar

About that last great bastion of Freedom and Liberty…

[Embedded content]

Yeah but Vlad hates gays so something freedom.

45 Kragar  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:32:52pm

re: #42 Charles Johnson

[Embedded image]The telephone from Terry Gilliam’s masterpiece, Brazil.

“He’s got away from us, Jack.”

46 thedopefishlives  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:33:24pm

Afternoon Lizardim from the frigid but beautiful wild north country. How go things among the lizardfolk?

47 Kragar  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:38:30pm

Brazil, one of the greatest movies a studio never wanted anyone to see.

48 ObserverArt  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:39:53pm

( V )(‘–’)( V )

49 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:40:14pm

re: #41 Kragar

So between Bitcoin being illegal and Snowden being free from Obama dronez in Russia, what are the morans at Reason to do?

50 RadicalModerate  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:41:20pm

So says the guy who had the white nationalist “Southern Avenger” as his social media director.

Rand Paul warns his former home state, Texas, could turn blue

Speaking Saturday night at the dinner, Paul stressed that the country’s top immigration priority should be border security but said the party needs to have a “better attitude” when talking about resolving the country’s broken immigration system.

“People who are Hispanic or Latino, they have to believe that we want them in our party, so it is an attitude thing as much as it is policy,” he said.

One of those messages, he said, should be: “If you want to work and you want a job and want to be part of America, we will find a place for you.”

His line drew mild applause from the audience.

“That was kind of tepid,” he said.

51 ObserverArt  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:43:04pm

re: #42 Charles Johnson

[Embedded image]The telephone from Terry Gilliam’s masterpiece, Brazil.

One of my top 10 all time favorite movies, and #1 for black/dark comedy.

52 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:46:38pm

re: #41 Kragar

About that last great bastion of Freedom and Liberty…

[Embedded content]

The dudebro tears droppeth as a gentle rain from heaven…….

53 Feline Fearless Leader  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:47:40pm

re: #46 thedopefishlives

Afternoon Lizardim from the frigid but beautiful wild north country. How go things among the lizardfolk?

Overcast, 30F, and some flurries. But the meatloaf just came out of the oven and the potatoes should be finished in 15 minutes.

54 thedopefishlives  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:49:15pm

re: #53 Feline Fearless Leader

Overcast, 30F, and some flurries. But the meatloaf just came out of the oven and the potatoes should be finished in 15 minutes.

Tonight’s low: -21 F (-29.4 C). Tomorrow night’s low: -15 F (-26.1 C). Yeah, it’s going to be cold up here.

55 ObserverArt  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:49:18pm

re: #53 Feline Fearless Leader

Overcast, 30F, and some flurries. But the meatloaf just came out of the oven and the potatoes should be finished in 15 minutes.

Be right over…

56 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:50:57pm

re: #50 RadicalModerate

So says the guy who had the white nationalist “Southern Avenger” as his social media director.

Rand Paul warns his former home state, Texas, could turn blue

I’d be tickled blue if Texas became purple let alone blue. As for immigration, Rand has only the xenophobic base of his party to blame for the party’s perception with Latinos. They’re not going to ignore the fact that the GOP has a nominee who talked about self-deportation and hired the writer of Arizona’s law for his immigration adviser.

57 Feline Fearless Leader  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:52:08pm

re: #55 ObserverArt

Be right over…

Have a decent, but not staggeringly good, Pinot Noir to go with it.

58 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:55:24pm

re: #52 Dr Lizardo

The dudebro tears droppeth as a gentle rain from heaven…….

And all those moments will be lost, like tears in rain…

59 RadicalModerate  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:57:57pm

re: #53 Feline Fearless Leader

Overcast, 30F, and some flurries. But the meatloaf just came out of the oven and the potatoes should be finished in 15 minutes.

Mid 40s here - after almost a week of temperatures not getting above freezing, and two inches of snow (which is significant for the Dallas area) that was almost completely missed by local forecasters.
Checking the forecast - it looks like we’re going to get another bout of snow/ice starting tomorrow morning.

Yay.

60 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 1:58:41pm

Lebanon president says asked Hollande for advanced weapons to stand up to Israel

Lebanese President Michel Suleiman said Sunday that he had asked French President Francois Hollande to provide Lebanon with advanced weapons to stand up to repeated Israeli violations.

“I asked [Hollande] for advanced weaponry with which Lebanon can sand up to Israel,” Suleiman said in a statement Sunday on his Friday meeting with the French leader in Tunisia, where the two attended the ceremony marking the endorsement of the North African nation’s new constitution.

61 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:01:03pm

re: #58 Targetpractice

And all those moments will be lost, like tears in rain…

I’ve… seen things you people wouldn’t believe. NSA metadata being collected off the shoulder of Orion. I watched Bitcoin glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those… moments… will be lost in time, like tears… in… rain. Time… to die.

62 chadu  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:01:31pm

re: #22 Eclectic Cyborg

Who the hell cares? It’s a freakin’ LEGO movie. It’s supposed to be mindless fun.

But it’s oppressing me, by somehow violating what I believe to be my First Amendment Rights or the Commandments of Amurrica!

63 chadu  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:03:49pm

re: #47 Kragar

Brazil, one of the greatest movies a studio never wanted anyone to see.

Reminds me I need to buy DVDs of Baron Munchausen and Erik the Viking (that last is TJ rather than TG, but whatevs).

64 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:08:19pm

A decent article on the Swiss immigration vote
Europe elections: Swiss lessons for Brussels

It is often said that the Swiss are different. They enjoy most of the benefits of the European Union but are not in it. They believe in direct democracy, in consulting the people, in a way that most other European nations would shy away from.

And now the Swiss voters have defied Brussels and their own government. They were warned that the free movement of workers was integral to participating in the EU’s single market. Any restrictions would damage relations with the EU. The business community argued that limiting migrants would undermine the economy
….
For Brussels there are no easy options. Free movement of people is one of its core principles. It sees it as integral to the single market. It has reminded the UK of this and if it embraces a compromise with the Swiss, other countries might chose to follow.

65 wrenchwench  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:11:03pm

Hey, the internet is back!

66 wrenchwench  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:11:35pm

Had a little outage, all day until now.

67 RadicalModerate  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:12:05pm

re: #56 HappyWarrior

I’d be tickled blue if Texas became purple let alone blue. As for immigration, Rand has only the xenophobic base of his party to blame for the party’s perception with Latinos. They’re not going to ignore the fact that the GOP has a nominee who talked about self-deportation and hired the writer of Arizona’s law for his immigration adviser.

Given the last state party platform that Texas Republicans put forth, they are increasingly embracing neo-Confederate, if not outright white nationalistic ideas, many times under guise of “religious freedom”, and the state and congressional candidates they are pushing to the forefront bears out this contention.

Before anyone says I’m being over-dramatic on this, how else would you label a party that advocates the repeal of Affirmative Action, as well as the Voting Rights and Civil Rights Acts?

68 thedopefishlives  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:13:28pm

re: #66 wrenchwench

Had a little outage, all day until now.

Welcome back. :)

69 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:14:07pm

re: #64 Killgore Trout

A decent article on the Swiss immigration vote
Europe elections: Swiss lessons for Brussels

That’s gonna be a tough one as to what, if anything, Brussels can do about it. On the one hand, Switzerland is not in the EU per se; it maintains its long-standing neutrality. On the other hand, the agreements it signed with the EU back in 2007 will now likely have to be renegotiated, and that could prove testy.

70 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:18:10pm

re: #66 wrenchwench

Had a little outage, all day until now.

Did you start to get the jitters?

71 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:18:22pm

re: #56 HappyWarrior

I’d be tickled blue if Texas became purple let alone blue.

Seriously. I’ll be happy with Texas as a purple state instead of the deep red pile of fail we currently have.

As for immigration, Rand has only the xenophobic base of his party to blame for the party’s perception with Latinos. They’re not going to ignore the fact that the GOP has a nominee who talked about self-deportation and hired the writer of Arizona’s law for his immigration adviser.

Even beyond all that, the single greatest reflection of the right’s view of immigrants and immigration was their freakout over the Coca-Cola Super Bowl ad. It’s hard to ignore that many people, including political figures, having a cow over “America the Beautiful” being sung in multiple languages.

If they freak out that much over a commercial to sell carbonated sugar water, how do they feel about the people who break their backs working the fields as migrant farm workers or in meat packing plants, or building houses or whatever?

72 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:20:24pm

re: #69 Dr Lizardo

That’s gonna be a tough one as to what, if anything, Brussels can do about it. On the one hand, Switzerland is not in the EU per se; it maintains its long-standing neutrality. On the other hand, the agreements it signed with the EU back in 2002 will now likely have to be renegotiated, and that could prove testy.

It sounds like a tough situation for everybody. The Swiss are worried about being flooded with immigrants and the EU can’t afford to lose relations with the strong Swiss economy. Maybe the EU project was too ambitious. Maybe if they started off with a more exclusive club of stronger economies then they could slowly expand and absorb weaker ones. All the dead weight is a big problem for them.

73 wrenchwench  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:22:15pm

re: #70 Targetpractice

Did you start to get the jitters?

Been kinda busy, fortunately. And still working on a bike for a silly girl who just decided to take off on tour, and she ain’t ready…. Maybe her bike will be.

74 thedopefishlives  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:30:41pm

re: #73 wrenchwench

Been kinda busy, fortunately. And still working on a bike for a silly girl who just decided to take off on tour, and she ain’t ready…. Maybe her bike will be.

I spent my entire morning in the freezing sub-zero cold, changing the belt and tensioner on my Fishmobile. The work goes so much slower when it’s so cold, I have to come in and get warmed up. Maybe one of these days I’ll plug in the torpedo heater and heat the garage.

75 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:32:47pm

re: #72 Killgore Trout

It sounds like a tough situation for everybody. The Swiss are worried about being flooded with immigrants and the EU can’t afford to lose relations with the strong Swiss economy. Maybe the EU project was too ambitious. Maybe if they started off with a more exclusive club of stronger economies then they could slowly expand and absorb weaker ones. All the dead weight is a big problem for them.

The EU expanded too far too fast.

Speaking of which, the stars seem to be aligning somewhat for Turkey and their protracted 50-year quest to join up. The new German Foreign Minister seems to be supportive of the idea, the Romanians are going to bat for Turkey, the Brits have long wanted Turkey in the EU, and the current French government seems…..well, less overtly hostile to the idea.

That’s an interesting one; I’d reckon that if tomorrow, by some fluke of history, Brussels made Turkey a straight-up EU member state, the shrieks would be epic.

On the other side of the coin, the EU and Turkey are in the process of eliminating visa restrictions both ways, with a target date of 2017. That’s only three years away, and should that go down, that means visa-free travel for Turks to the EU and vice-versa.

That’ll be interesting.

76 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:33:33pm

re: #65 wrenchwench

Hey, the internet is back!

re: #66 wrenchwench

Had a little outage, all day until now.

Heh, good to see you. Things aren’t quite the same when you’re not here.

77 prairiefire  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:33:34pm

re: #74 thedopefishlives

Heat the garage. It’s better for all the belts, gears and such. We had a bit more snow. We put food out for the birds. They are delighted.

78 thedopefishlives  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:35:14pm

re: #77 prairiefire

Heat the garage. It’s better for all the belts, gears and such. We had a bit more snow. We put food out for the birds. They are delighted.

I do need to get a real garage heater to put out there. The torpedo heater works fine for projects (or it would, if I used it more), but it’s not exactly suited for maintaining a temperature.

79 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:37:00pm

“Put the twins away…OK, top shelf, or on the floor with the shoes?”

80 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:39:36pm

re: #75 Dr Lizardo

The EU expanded too far too fast.

Speaking of which, the stars seem to be aligning somewhat for Turkey and their protracted 50-year quest to join up. The new German Foreign Minister seems to be supportive of the idea, the Romanians are going to bat for Turkey, the Brits have long wanted Turkey in the EU, and the current government seems…..well, less overtly hostile to the idea.

That’s an interesting one; I’d reckon that if tomorrow, by some fluke of history, Brussels made Turkey a straight-up EU member state, the shrieks would be epic.

on the other side of the coin, the EU and Turkey are in the process of eliminating visa restrictions both ways, with a target date of 2017. That’s only three years away, and should that go down, that means visa-free travel for Turks to the EU and vice-versa.

That’ll be interesting.

That is going to be very interesting to watch. It really seems the timing for bringing Turkey into the fold is really bad. Erdoᇺn has massive domestic problems, human rights abuses and was probably laundering money/gold for Iran. They’re in the process of strengthening ties with Iran and seem to be on a strong track towards a permanent Islamist government. I’m not sure how Turkey’s choices are going to fit in with UN standards for human rights but it will be interesting to see them try.

81 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:39:41pm

re: #79 Pie-onist Overlord

“Put the twins away…OK, top shelf, or on the floor with the shoes?”
[Embedded image]

LOL

82 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:40:58pm

re: #79 Pie-onist Overlord

Heh, the one on the bottom seems to be having a blast.

83 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:41:15pm

In the meantime, this made the news in Ostrava. A sheep got loose, and police were dispatched to gun it down in a horrific, wooly massacre put a leash on it and leave it in the care of an animal control organization.

moravskoslezsky.denik.cz

84 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:43:00pm

re: #83 Dr Lizardo

In the meantime, this made the news in Ostrava. A sheep got loose, and police were dispatched to gun it down in a horrific, wooly massacre put a leash on it and leave it in the care of an animal control organization.

moravskoslezsky.denik.cz

Wow, how do you handle all the stress & excitement? //

85 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:44:46pm

re: #80 Killgore Trout

That is going to be very interesting to watch. It really seems the timing for bringing Turkey into the fold is really bad. Erdoᇺn has massive domestic problems, human rights abuses and was probably laundering money/gold for Iran. They’re in the process of strengthening ties with Iran and seem to be on a strong track towards a permanent Islamist government. I’m not sure how Turkey’s choices are going to fit in with UN standards for human rights but it will be interesting to see them try.

Over the decades, Turkey has made a number of changes to bring it into line with EU standards; they still have some ways to go, of course. Perhaps the Europeans are looking at Turkey and its relatively young and dynamic population and thinking, “Ah ha……labor pool” for the longer-term future. Until quite recently, Turkey’s economy was growing significantly - presumably if the Turkish Central Bank can ignore political interference from the AKP government, they’ll likely be able to pull out of it, but with Erdogan, you never know.

86 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:48:23pm

re: #79 Pie-onist Overlord

“Put the twins away…OK, top shelf, or on the floor with the shoes?”
[Embedded image]

My twins fit snug on the hangers between my shirts ;)

87 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:52:40pm

re: #84 CuriousLurker

Wow, how do you handle all the stress & excitement? //

It’s not easy. The excitement charges the air like electricity some days.

*snore* Wha?! Where was I?

There are occasional high-profile crimes here - there was one near Brno, where a 15-year old girl was gang raped, thrown off a balcony, which she survived (35 foot fall), then brought back upstairs and strangled to death. Then her body was thrown in a dumpster; the three miscreants are on trial, and they’re looking at life in prison if convicted.

The crime itself occurred in March of 2013. The accused are all Czech young men in their early 20s.

So, it’s not all sunshine and roses here. Brutal and horrible things do happen.

88 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:54:11pm

In other news, my son says he signed up for Obamacare this week and he didn’t find it difficult or confusing at all. He used the healthcare.gov site as he lives in Wingnutistan, NC and they don’t provide a state exchange. He was ecstatic to learn that he’s eligible for a couple of hundred dollars tax credit to help defray the cost.

Oh, and while we were talking the subject of politics and the importance critical thinking skills came up. He didn’t know what a “straw man” argument was, but as soon as I described it he said, “Ohhhhhh, okay. I know what that is—me and [GF’s name] do that all the time!”

89 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:55:22pm

re: #87 Dr Lizardo

There are occasional high-profile crimes here - there was one near Brno, where a 15-year old girl was gang raped, thrown off a balcony, which she survived (35 foot fall), then brought back upstairs and strangled to death. Then her body was thrown in a dumpster; the three miscreants are on trial, and they’re looking at life in prison if convicted.

The crime itself occurred in March of 2013. The accused are all Czech young men in their early 20s.

E gad, that’s horrible. *shudder*

90 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:58:03pm

re: #89 CuriousLurker

E gad, that’s horrible. *shudder*

It’s a quite shocking case here in the Czech Republic, as a crime with that level of brutality is mercifully rare here. I’ve read Czech-language accounts from the trial (and the Czech media pulls no punches) and to say this young lady suffered the tortures of the damned is an understatement. Interestingly, ‘torture’ is exactly one of the charges the three accused face.

91 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:01:20pm

re: #89 CuriousLurker

E gad, that’s horrible. *shudder*

I forgot to add that the Czech media does not name the suspects, and won’t identify them unless they are convicted. That’s standard operating procedure, even for the tabloid media.

92 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:02:43pm

re: #91 Dr Lizardo

I forgot to add that the Czech media does not name the suspects, and won’t identify them unless they are convicted. That’s standard operating procedure, even for the tabloid media.

Interesting. I had no idea. What about the victim?

93 Bear  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:03:46pm

re: #90 Dr Lizardo

Isn’t there a line from Gilbert and Sullivan’s Mikado about letting the punishment fit the crime? Sounds as if this should be the case.

94 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:04:41pm

re: #93 Bear

I believe so.

95 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:04:49pm

re: #92 CuriousLurker

Interesting. I had no idea. What about the victim?

She’s been identified. Apparently, the accused have been formally identified; permission was given by the local prosecutor’s office to do so.

You can run the link through Google Translate: tn.nova.cz

96 ObserverArt  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:06:40pm

re: #79 Pie-onist Overlord

“Put the twins away…OK, top shelf, or on the floor with the shoes?”
[Embedded image]

Is dad on the phone getting instruction from mom? And, if mom saw dad handling the twins that way, would mom be upset with dad?

And C’lurker is right, the one on the bottom is having a blast. I have a feeling the other likes it too…twins.

I think its a cute photo. But, I also wouldn’t be surprised if some saw that as dangerous and not a proper way to tote kids around. You know how people can be about kids…especially not their own. I hope you understand what I mean.

97 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:07:53pm

re: #85 Dr Lizardo

Over the decades, Turkey has made a number of changes to bring it into line with EU standards; they still have some ways to go, of course. Perhaps the Europeans are looking at Turkey and its relatively young and dynamic population and thinking, “Ah ha……labor pool” for the longer-term future. Until quite recently, Turkey’s economy was growing significantly - presumably if the Turkish Central Bank can ignore political interference from the AKP government, they’ll likely be able to pull out of it, but with Erdogan, you never know.

Good points. I forgot about the aspect of the cheap labor pool being a plus.

98 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:10:38pm

re: #97 Killgore Trout

Good points. I forgot about the aspect of the cheap labor pool being a plus.

We all like cheap labor, no?

99 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:11:05pm

re: #17 Shiplord Kirel

Texas has superficially harsh and strict drunk driving laws but they are riddled with exceptions and loopholes that allow most drunk drivers to walk free, even after multiple convictions. The prevailing theory is that the justice system and the legislature are themselves infested with drunkards and they don’t want to be hoist by their own petard, at least no more than is necessary to keep the yokels voting their way.

If you’re arrested for DUI in TN, you get an Ignition Interlock (breathilizer) installed in your vehicle for a period of no less than 6 months up to a year.

You also spend a weekend in jail, and subsequently spend some hours picking up trash on the side of the highway.

The Ign Interlock has a camera which takes video of the person performing the breathlizer test along with an internal GPS which provides real time location of the vehicle at which time the test is being performed.

Since the Ign Interlock is sensitive to alcohol as well as alcohol precursors, orange juice, bananas, mouthwash, and pepperoni, etc, can create issues preventing the offender from starting their vehicle.

With court costs and Ign Interlock leasing, typical costs if a DUI in TN starts at $10,000 when all is said and done.

100 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:11:30pm

re: #97 Killgore Trout

Good points. I forgot about the aspect of the cheap labor pool being a plus.

Oh, it is. Large parts of Europe are turning into a geriatric home, to be honest, and the Europeans are either going to have to import a labor force if they want to keep things going, or, cut back on some of the social-welfare programs.

I’m not knocking the social-welfare programs; there’s many of them I quite like, such as paid maternity/paternity leave, care for pensioners and the disabled, etc. But of course, that costs $$$, and if you don’t have tax-paying workers to keep it afloat, you’re gonna have to cut it back significantly. So in the next decade or so, Europe’s going to have to make a major decision as to the longer-term future.

101 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:12:08pm

re: #100 Dr Lizardo

Or just start making more babies.

102 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:14:30pm

re: #101 freetoken

Or just start making more babies.

Sure, but you’re also looking at 18-20 years until those kids become tax-paying productive citizens. Europe doesn’t really have that long; a decade is best guess for when there are more pensioners than there are workers.

Most likely, the Europeans will choose to import a labor force.

103 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:16:31pm

re: #102 Dr Lizardo

Well, Europeans could import teenage women from distant lands, impregnate them, and then they can have the best of both worlds.

Seems easy enough, if diabolical.

104 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:17:15pm

re: #101 freetoken

Or just start making more babies.

I forgot to add; my city, Ostrava, will lose 25% of its population over the next 25 years. And if a proposed deal to rescue a “too big to fail” mine falls through, the unemployment rate here is going to be staggering; it’s already at 15%, and that’s not as bad as some areas, one of which I recall has a 48% unemployment rate.

Everyone goes to Prague, because that’s where the moola is, and if they don’t go to Prague, they go to Germany, the UK, Ireland, etc.

105 Archangelus  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:17:21pm

re: #79 Pie-onist Overlord

“Put the twins away…OK, top shelf, or on the floor with the shoes?”
[Embedded image]

Have to ask, what symbol is that on the top of the kippah?

106 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:17:52pm

re: #100 Dr Lizardo

Oh, it is. Large parts of Europe are turning into a geriatric home, to be honest, and the Europeans are either going to have to import a labor force if they want to keep things going, or, cut back on some of the social-welfare programs.

I’m not knocking the social-welfare programs; there’s many of them I quite like, such as paid maternity/paternity leave, care for pensioners and the disabled, etc. But of course, that costs $$$, and if you don’t have tax-paying workers to keep it afloat, you’re gonna have to cut it back significantly. So in the next decade or so, Europe’s going to have to make a major decision as to the longer-term future.

The US is in much the same boat now. As I’ve noted before, if not for the massive influx of immigrants from Central and South America, this country would presently be either barely above replacement or beginning its own population drop. The Boomers are beginning to retire from the workforce, which is why most long-term budget projections see an absolute nightmare in the 10-20 year period.

107 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:18:49pm

re: #106 Targetpractice

The US is in much the same boat now. As I’ve noted before, if not for the massive influx of immigrants from Central and South America, this country would presently be either barely above replacement or beginning its own population drop. The Boomers are beginning to retire from the workforce, which is why most long-term budget projections see an absolute nightmare in the 10-20 year period.

Bingo.

108 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:22:32pm

re: #98 freetoken

We all like cheap labor, no?

It is one of those dirty little secrets that nobody talks about when the topic of immigration comes up. Lefties like immigration and open borders but never think about the economic plus of an injection of cheap labor. Righties hate immigration but are happy to exploit the illegal immigrants for cheap labor. There’s a lot of talk about immigration but very little of it actually addresses the economic realities.

109 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:28:05pm

re: #99 BeenHereAwhile

If you’re arrested for DUI in TN, you get an Ignition Interlock (breathilizer) installed in your vehicle for a period of no less than 6 months up to a year.

You also spend a weekend in jail, and subsequently spend some hours picking up trash on the side of the highway.

The Ign Interlock has a camera which takes video of the person performing the breathlizer test along with an internal GPS which provides real time location of the vehicle at which time the test is being performed.

Since the Ign Interlock is sensitive to alcohol as well as alcohol precursors, orange juice, bananas, mouthwash, and pepperoni, etc, can create issues preventing the offender from starting their vehicle.

With court costs and Ign Interlock leasing, typical costs if a DUI in TN starts at $10,000 when all is said and done.

The ignition interlock thing is here in Texas. In fact, not having a car isn’t a deterrent to getting one, either. Scooters or any other type of motorized vehicle would have to be fitted with one. And there are even mobile breathylizer units for people without cars that have to be carried around 24/7 because they will go off randomly, requiring tests at all hours of the day and night.

110 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:35:58pm

re: #108 Killgore Trout

There’s a lot of talk about immigration but very little of it actually addresses the economic realities.

Because no one wants to admit that we have entire industries in this country (agriculture, construction, hospitality, etc.) that are propped up on the backs of illegal immigrant labor. All the xenophobes and bigots on the right can have their delusional fantasies of rounding up and deporting millions of people and of setting up sniper towers and land mines on the border, but the truth is we NEED that immigrant labor. Might as well allow them to be citizens and pay their taxes openly, then.

Of course, making them citizens also makes them eligible to vote and gives them protections and rights that they don’t have now, so we can’t allow that. /////////

111 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:37:33pm

re: #99 BeenHereAwhile

Since the Ign Interlock is sensitive to alcohol as well as alcohol precursors, orange juice, bananas, mouthwash, and pepperoni, etc, can create issues preventing the offender from starting their vehicle.

I get how one could ferment or distill all the other things to create booze, but pepperoni vodka sounds positively terrifying. I imagine that process is powered by a forsaken child.

112 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:40:50pm

re: #110 Lidane

Because no one wants to admit that we have entire industries in this country (agriculture, construction, hospitality, etc.) that are propped up on the backs of illegal immigrant labor. All the xenophobes and bigots on the right can have their delusional fantasies of rounding up and deporting millions of people and of setting up sniper towers and land mines on the border, but the truth is we NEED that immigrant labor. Might as well allow them to be citizens and pay their taxes openly, then.

Of course, making them citizens also makes them eligible to vote and gives them protections and rights that they don’t have now, so we can’t allow that. /////////

It’s not simply that we have those industries built upon illegal labor, it’s that those industries operate as they do now because that labor is not only cheaper, many of the jobs where that labor works were previously union ones. If the wingnuts got their wish and every immigrant got sent home tomorrow, the economy would collapse. 11 million people gone from the economy, gone from the jobs, gone from spending money on products and services? The Great Recession would seem like a fond memory by the time it was all over. And forget about “entitlement reform” where we could grandfather anybody in, because there’s no way we could afford to keep the social safety net running.

113 Ming  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:41:06pm

Hello everyone. Sorry for the o/t, but I just read the following, recommended by Sam Harris, about Snowden, Greenwald, and Assange. Absolutely fascinating. Apologies if this has already been posted here at LGF. I’m generally sympathetic to libertarian principles, but the libertarian world is a strange one indeed.

114 Feline Fearless Leader  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:41:46pm

Went from flurries to outright snow here in Philly an hour or two ago. About a 2” accumulation already and sticking to the secondary streets.

115 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:45:50pm

re: #99 BeenHereAwhile

Since the Ign Interlock is sensitive to alcohol as well as alcohol precursors, orange juice, bananas, mouthwash, and pepperoni, etc, can create issues preventing the offender from starting their vehicle.

Now I’m wondering what happens when you ferment a mash of all those things together?

The abyss! It stares back!

116 jaunte  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:45:54pm

re: #111 goddamnedfrank

I get how one could ferment or distill all the other things to create booze, but pepperoni vodka sounds positively terrifying.

These folks are probably working on it: bakonvodka.com

117 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:47:16pm

re: #116 jaunte

There should be another rule of the Internet, like Rule 34 (If it exists, there is pr0n of it) regarding flavored vodka:

“If there is food, there is a flavored vodka of it.”

118 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:50:44pm

re: #109 Lidane

The ignition interlock thing is here in Texas. In fact, not having a car isn’t a deterrent to getting one, either. Scooters or any other type of motorized vehicle would have to be fitted with one. And there are even mobile breathylizer units for people without cars that have to be carried around 24/7 because they will go off randomly, requiring tests at all hours of the day and night.

I am curious, does TX require the in vehicle interupt video camera and GPS location system. This is something TN updated and mandated in July 2013.

In TN, it’s pretty much - if you want to drive, you get a restricted license with an interlock installed. Get caught driving a vehicle with out the interlock, go to jail until the judge decides to let you out.

If you decide not to drive, you lose your license until after a year, and the judge decides otherwise.

Second DUI, successful completion of first program or no, go to jail.

There appears to be an LEO bounty for DUI arrests.

Apparently the state is making money off enforcement of the law.

119 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:55:26pm

re: #111 goddamnedfrank

I get how one could ferment or distill all the other things to create booze, but pepperoni vodka sounds positively terrifying. I imagine that process is powered by a forsaken child.

Yep, pepperoni by itself completely craters the interrupt system.

With pepperoni vodka, might have to notify the IAEA.

120 Feline Fearless Leader  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:55:43pm

re: #111 goddamnedfrank

I get how one could ferment or distill all the other things to create booze, but pepperoni vodka sounds positively terrifying. I imaging that process is powered by a forsaken child.

Depending on how the breathalyzer in question works there are a number of substances (or medical conditions) that can interfere with the machine getting an accurate blood alcohol estimate.

en.wikipedia.org

121 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:55:59pm

re: #105 Archangelus

Have to ask, what symbol is that on the top of the kippah?

Friendship Circle, organization dedicated to helping families of children with special needs (Down Syndrome, autism, etc.)

122 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:56:41pm

re: #72 Killgore Trout

It sounds like a tough situation for everybody. The Swiss are worried about being flooded with immigrants and the EU can’t afford to lose relations with the strong Swiss economy. Maybe the EU project was too ambitious. Maybe if they started off with a more exclusive club of stronger economies then they could slowly expand and absorb weaker ones. All the dead weight is a big problem for them.

They tried to make Europe a country without actually being a country. They forgot that in any nation some of the nation is going to be less…successful…than the other parts and the more successful parts have to help them.

Like Northern Italy helps Southern, or the blue states carry the red.

Nothing wrong with it. It’s just the way things are.

123 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:57:32pm

re: #118 BeenHereAwhile

I have no idea, honestly. I just know the interlock thing is required and that not having a car isn’t an excuse, since any motorized vehicle will be required to have one, and not having a car generally means a person gets the mobile one they have to carry around all the time.

124 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:59:25pm

re: #106 Targetpractice

The US is in much the same boat now. As I’ve noted before, if not for the massive influx of immigrants from Central and South America, this country would presently be either barely above replacement or beginning its own population drop. The Boomers are beginning to retire from the workforce, which is why most long-term budget projections see an absolute nightmare in the 10-20 year period.

But it’s not so much a matter of population. It’s a matter of where the money is being concentrated. For instance, Africa is underpopulated for its land mass, contrary to the belief of those in First World countries, where development encourages overcrowding.

There are 7.1 billion people on the planet right now.

How many do you think it can sustain comfortably, esp in light of climate change?

125 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:59:55pm

re: #98 freetoken

We all like cheap labor, no?

As long as it isn’t us, personally.

126 Stanley Sea  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:04:07pm
127 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:04:17pm

re: #120 Feline Fearless Leader

Depending on how the breathalyzer in question works there are a number of substances (or medical conditions) that can interfere with the machine getting an accurate blood alcohol estimate.

en.wikipedia.org

With all the tobacco smokers in TN, COPD is also an issue.

The breathalyzer test requires forceful exhalation, inhalation, and exhalation.

People with COPD aren’t physically capable of completing the breathlizer test.

128 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:07:46pm

re: #126 Stanley Sea

A “libertarian” wingnut I know posted some derp from The Blaze about that. I valued my brain cells too much to read it.

I’ll have to check out that article.

129 jaunte  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:10:52pm

eyeroll

130 wrenchwench  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:16:16pm

re: #129 jaunte

eyeroll

You mean this?

By Charles Johnson’s own current

Registered since: Feb 9, 2014 at 4:10 pm
No. of comments posted: 0
No. of Pages posted: 0

131 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:17:36pm

This is a bunch of horseshit:


Yeah, no. Three more years of people stuck in immigration limbo? WTF.

132 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:19:21pm

re: #130 wrenchwench

One of the recently banned.

133 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:20:35pm

re: #113 Ming

I’ve always thought that the undereducated and pseudo-sophisticated Snowden was no hero but a common criminal who Greenwald, a well-educated huckster and opportunist, and Poitras, a film maker with an agenda, from a well-off Boston family, latched onto. By creating the meme that Snowden was “genius-level” intelligent which was buttressed by the odd comment here and there by people who were either anonymous or hadn’t actually worked with him, his legendary “brilliance” grew but has never been actually proved.

And I still think he’s a criminal. A clever, amoral one. And I think both Greenwald and Poitras aided and abetted him more than anyone knows.

134 Mattand  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:21:49pm

re: #113 Ming

Hello everyone. Sorry for the o/t, but I just read the following, recommended by Sam Harris, about Snowden, Greenwald, and Assange. Absolutely fascinating. Apologies if this has already been posted here at LGF. I’m generally sympathetic to libertarian principles, but the libertarian world is a strange one indeed.

I’ll get around to reading it eventually. I’ve got a low tolerance for Harris, due to his general “I’m not saying Muslims are barbarians, but they’re all barbarians” gestalt.

135 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:22:15pm

re: #131 Lidane

This is a bunch of horseshit:

[Embedded content]


Yeah, no. Three more years of people stuck in immigration limbo? WTF.

It’s Chuck calling John of Orange’s bluff. The whole “trust” BS is the GOP trying to kill the bill that’s on the table, so Schumer is squashing that talking point like a bug. As if he really needs to do so, when the GOP is transparent about its hopes of putting off the issue until next year, when they expect to have the Senate and so will be in a position to pass a “strong” bill.

136 wrenchwench  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:23:24pm

re: #132 Charles Johnson

One of the recently banned.

Like gum stuck to your shoe.

137 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:27:52pm

re: #131 Lidane

This is a bunch of horseshit:

[Embedded content]


Yeah, no. Three more years of people stuck in immigration limbo? WTF.

Politically it’s kind of a smart move though, assuming they can actually push it through. The Tea People would go into fits of apoplexy over something like this, and the delayed timeframe would sustain the rage, give them delusions of being able to stop the plan before it’s actually implemented. Thus ensuring that the GOP / Tea Party civil war stays red hot through the 2016 primary and probably general election. The optics of a bunch of GOP candidates, mostly governors and ex-governors along with revanchists like Cruz all condemning the plan while tearing apart semi-moderates on the issue like Rubio would put another huge wedge between the party and hispanic / latino voters.

So yeah, the plan sucks, but it’s better than nothing and could end up putting the final nail in the GOP’s coffin.

138 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:30:17pm

In working on genealogy I’ve become more educated about this continent’s past population events and what has transpired the past 500 years.

The narrative that would put Spanish speaking individuals as being “foreigners” just doesn’t hold up. Rather, they are better described as “the conquered”. The Mexican-American war, and the associated conflicts before and after with Spain or Spanish settled areas (like California), have resulted in English speaking citizens of the US thinking that they somehow are the original owners of the land. That’s a very narrow and highly selective view of the past.

This gets back to the last election, where Romney blatantly lied about the past, but the all-too-milquetoast “media” refused to call him on it (even if a few liberal minded individuals tried.)

139 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:32:46pm

re: #137 goddamnedfrank

Politically it’s kind of a smart move though, assuming they can actually push it through. The Tea People would go into fits of apoplexy over something like this, and the delayed timeframe would sustain the rage, give them delusions of being able to stop the plan before it’s actually implemented. Thus ensuring that the GOP / Tea Party civil war stays red hot through the 2016 primary and probably general election. The optics of a bunch of GOP candidates, mostly governors and ex-governors along with revanchists like Cruz all condemning the plan while tearing apart semi-moderates on the issue like Rubio would put another huge wedge between the party and hispanic / latino voters.

So yeah, the plan sucks, but it’s better than nothing and could end up putting the final nail in the GOP’s coffin.

Sure. I can see that. And really, it’s not like the GOP needs even more help in pushing away everyone that’s not a rich straight white evangelical Christian male CEO, although I’m happy to see the Dems give them a hand. I just hate the idea of even more immigrants being exploited in the process.

140 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:33:16pm

re: #138 freetoken

In working on genealogy I’ve become more educated about this continent’s past population events and what has transpired the past 500 years.

The narrative that would put Spanish speaking individuals as being “foreigners” just doesn’t hold up. Rather, they are better described as “the conquered”. The Mexican-American war, and the associated conflicts before and after with Spain or Spanish settled areas (like California), have resulted in English speaking citizens of the US thinking that they somehow are the original owners of the land. That’s a very narrow and highly selective view of the past.

This gets back to the last election, where Romney blatantly lied about the past, but the all-too-milquetoast “media” refused to call him on it (even if a few liberal minded individuals tried.)

Indeed many Hispanic families have been in this country and continent for longer than most White families. Which specific Romney lie are you referring to here though?

141 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:34:29pm

re: #140 HappyWarrior

Which specific Romney lie are you referring to here though?

Someone brought up a question about the US directly influencing Latin American countries through means such as dictators, which he flatly denied.

142 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:35:08pm
143 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:35:56pm

re: #141 freetoken

Someone brought up a question about the US directly influencing Latin American countries through means such as dictators, which he flatly denied.

Ah yeah. Thanks for the reminder. The media really did give him a free pass on a lot of his bullshit.

144 b.d.  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:35:57pm
Ben Shapiro OUT at Breitbart News

The invisible hand of the market is clapping right now.

dailycaller.com

145 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:36:29pm

re: #144 b.d.

The invisible hand of the market is clapping right now.

dailycaller.com

I guess he was either too whiny for them or not whiny enough.

146 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:36:49pm

re: #144 b.d.

Q: What is the sound of one economic hand clapping?

A: Bitcoins.

147 jaunte  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:39:05pm

re: #144 b.d.

Shapiro [snip] declined to comment on the matter. In fact, when I wrote him, he formally declined and cc’d his lawyer.

He’s so sensitive.

148 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:39:35pm

Reuters stretching for headlines, now combining unrelated crashes for bonus death toll
11 dead after wrong-way car crashes in Florida and California

149 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:40:43pm

re: #126 Stanley Sea

[Embedded content]

Fucking incredible! Reminds me of the old days. : )

Nothing on the national news. I found it on only 1 of the 3 major broadcast TV stations in Charlotte, and they downplayed it.

wbtv.com

As did the Charlotte Observer: charlotteobserver.com

Both reported that the permit called for 20K marchers.

This isn’t unusual for local reporting in this area, though.

150 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:40:55pm

re: #148 Killgore Trout

It’s a very quiet day and the media outlets are really dredging for stories.

Not that there aren’t plenty of tragedies in the world, but mostly they don’t generate the eyes-on-product that corporate media need.

151 b.d.  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:40:56pm

re: #147 jaunte

He’s so sensitive.

Hahhaha

I can only imagine that there is no love loss between Breitbart and the DailyCaller.

152 wrenchwench  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:41:20pm

Whoa.


Police believe the man who groped an 11-year-old girl at a Snohomish grocery store last month is the same man who fire-bombed abortion clinics in Everett and Bellingham in the 1980s.At least eight people identified Curtis Anton Beseda as the man seen in video surveillance released to the media on Tuesday. Prosecutors on Friday charged Beseda, 58, with first-degree child molestation in connection with the groping.A judge issued a $250,000 arrest warrant for Beseda. Police say he hasn’t returned to his Snohomish apartment in a few days. His vehicle also is missing.

[…]

I hope he lands in jail very very soon.

153 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:43:08pm

re: #150 freetoken

It’s a very quiet day and the media outlets are really dredging for stories.

Not that there aren’t plenty of tragedies in the world, but mostly they don’t generate the eyes-on-product that corporate media need.

The Olympics are taking up a lot of MSM space, I’ll be happy when it’s over with.

154 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:43:49pm

re: #153 Killgore Trout

The Olympics are taking up a lot of MSM space, I’ll be happy when it’s over with.

Yeah, Sochi is maxing out the eye-hours as far as media products.

155 lawhawk  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:47:44pm

re: #137 goddamnedfrank

The GOP’s latest argument against immigration reform is that they don’t trust the president to implement it? It’s horseshit, but that’s all they have. So, the natural response is to take the President out of the equation and make the effective date after the President leaves office.

Not that it will make a difference, but it lays bare the fact that the GOP simply can’t get anything done and it’s all because of their blind hatred of the president.

156 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:49:13pm

Yeah, we’re going to get some crap. Beginning sometime tomorrow. And I’m supposed to get blood work done at 8 am. That storm must be moving faster than expected.

157 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:49:48pm

re: #137 goddamnedfrank

Politically it’s kind of a smart move though, assuming they can actually push it through. The Tea People would go into fits of apoplexy over something like this, and the delayed timeframe would sustain the rage, give them delusions of being able to stop the plan before it’s actually implemented. Thus ensuring that the GOP / Tea Party civil war stays red hot through the 2016 primary and probably general election. The optics of a bunch of GOP candidates, mostly governors and ex-governors along with revanchists like Cruz all condemning the plan while tearing apart semi-moderates on the issue like Rubio would put another huge wedge between the party and hispanic / latino voters.

So yeah, the plan sucks, but it’s better than nothing and could end up putting the final nail in the GOP’s coffin.

That’s another benefit to Schumer’s suggestion, that the GOP will spend the next 3 years basically replaying how they’ve spent the last 4 with regards to the ACA: Passing repeal bill after repeal bill in the vain effort that they can stop the oncoming storm, while using the bill’s repeal as a litmus test for presidential candidates in ‘15-16. What better way to get the xenophobia out and in the open than making Republicans stand up on stage and promise to deny millions of hopeful immigrants the chance at citizenship simply to satisfy a shrinking base of aging WASPs?

158 HappyWarrior  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:51:24pm

re: #155 lawhawk

The GOP’s latest argument against immigration reform is that they don’t trust the president to implement it? It’s horseshit, but that’s all they have. So, the natural response is to take the President out of the equation and make the effective date after the President leaves office.

Not that it will make a difference, but it lays bare the fact that the GOP simply can’t get anything done and it’s all because of their blind hatred of the president.

Which is something the Dems should ride home. Even Teddy Kennedy was willing to work with Bush on immigration after the Iraq fiasco. The Dems need to drive the point home to the voters that the GOP refuses to do anything constructive because Obama hatred is more important than fixing pressing policy matters. They’re going to hate whoever succeeds Obama as the Dem’s standard bearer whether that person is Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, or someone else.

159 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:51:49pm

Snow predicted for Mon, Tues and Wed here, and on Wed “potential for some snow accumulation”.

Waahhh.

160 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:52:07pm

Need to nap for a few short hours before the wood stove needs refueling.
In the meantime….

161 Interesting Times  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:52:26pm

Romantic Heretic, are you still here? Nasty little rightwing shill went and crapped all over your page.

162 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:53:14pm

re: #156 Justanotherhuman

FSM, I wish they’d quit trying to force that winter storm naming meme.

163 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:53:54pm

re: #155 lawhawk

The GOP’s latest argument against immigration reform is that they don’t trust the president to implement it? It’s horseshit, but that’s all they have. So, the natural response is to take the President out of the equation and make the effective date after the President leaves office.

Not that it will make a difference, but it lays bare the fact that the GOP simply can’t get anything done and it’s all because of their blind hatred of the president.

The “trust” BS, upon further reflection, is the GOP’s attempt at conning minorities into believing that the effort to kill immigration reform this year is not strictly to satisfy a xenophobic base. No, instead they really “want” to pass reform, but they can’t “trust” the President. “It’s not that we want to deny you citizenship,” they tell anybody willing to listen,” it’s just we don’t trust a president who’s deported more people in six years than his predecessors did to enforce the border security goalposts we set up.”

164 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 4:55:14pm

re: #162 Rev_Arthur_Belling

I agree. It’s such a transparent attempt to try and play off of tropical cyclones and that long history of tracking them by name.

There’s something very revealing about this, about the human need to “name” things. It’s one of the underlying urges upon which religion is based.

165 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:00:28pm

Bill Keller leaving NYT. Retire, already—surely you have the money and you can’t take it with you, even if you invest a little bit in your new “venture”.

Bill Keller, Former Editor of The Times, Is Leaving for News Nonprofit

nytimes.com

Exactly what is a “news nonprofit” anyway?

166 jaunte  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:01:02pm
167 Lidane  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:01:45pm

re: #157 Targetpractice

What better way to get the xenophobia out and in the open than making Republicans stand up on stage and promise to deny millions of hopeful immigrants the chance at citizenship simply to satisfy a shrinking base of aging WASPs?

Start airing more commercials with songs like God Bless America, America the Beautiful, and The Star Spangled Banner being sung in other languages.

168 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:01:52pm

re: #162 Rev_Arthur_Belling

FSM, I wish they’d quit trying to force that winter storm naming meme.

Someone will name their newborn “Pax”. Wait for it.

169 darthstar  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:02:34pm

re: #166 jaunte

I was just coming by to post that tweet.

170 CuriousLurker  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:04:23pm

OT Drive-by: Before I call it a night, I just want to recommend a movie from last year that I just watched and (enjoyed enormously) last night.

The Croods is funny, touching, and filled with metaphors for the changes & conflicts we see happening around us today, both socially/culturally & politically.

G’nite, lizards.

Youtube Video

171 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:05:39pm

re: #153 Killgore Trout

The Olympics are taking up a lot of MSM space, I’ll be happy when it’s over with.

Ukraine will get more brutal once the Olympic spotlight moves out of Sochi next door.

172 b_sharp  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:06:41pm

re: #166 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Looks shopped.

173 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:07:47pm

re: #170 CuriousLurker

>OT Drive-by: Before I call it a night, I just want to recommend a movie from last year that I just watched and (enjoyed enormously) last night.

The Croods is funny, touching, and filled with metaphors for the changes & conflicts we see happening around us today, both socially/culturally & politically.

G’nite, lizards.

[Embedded content]

My g-grandson loves it. On Netflix. Good soundtrack, also. : )

174 Targetpractice  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:11:46pm

re: #171 BeenHereAwhile

Ukraine will get more brutal once the Olympic spotlight moves out of Sochi next door.

Yep, once the games are over and Vlad no longer has to worry about how he’ll look on the world stage, the tanks will start rolling.

175 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:13:33pm

I gather our society is suffering from severe information overload, which is why we’re becoming numb to just about everything.

176 bratwurst  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:13:36pm
177 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:14:35pm

re: #176 bratwurst

Are they selling their new brownie cookies?

178 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:15:55pm

re: #171 BeenHereAwhile

Ukraine will get more brutal once the Olympic spotlight moves out of Sochi next door.

Probably Syria as well. Putin’s buddies gotta take care of some business.

179 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:16:28pm

All right. This is the meme from Russia about Ukraine. And Snowden gets mentioned. From the Kiev Post, with a link to VOR.

Voice of Russia: Washington admits spending billions on Ukraine regime change (VIDEO)

kyivpost.com

“As we have already learned from the Edward Snowden problem, sooner or later all secrets are revealed, and people have to be held accountable for their words and actions, even if it all happened in a comfortable atmosphere, with only a small circle of people sharing the delicate information.”

180 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:16:29pm

re: #176 bratwurst

[Embedded content]

Obvious photoshop is obvious.

181 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:18:21pm

re: #175 freetoken

I gather our society is suffering from severe information overload, which is why we’re becoming numb to just about everything.

Nope. People are becoming less discerning and inattentive, at many levels.

182 freetoken  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:18:36pm

I suppose they mean well, but IMO it’s a failure at the start:

The difficult, the dangerous, and the catastrophic: Managing the spectrum of climate risks

[…]

We argue that the notion of a single, global threshold of dangerous climate change, has outlived its usefulness as a focus for the climate discourse. In its place, we propose a new climate risk management framework that incorporates the inherent limits to mitigation and adaptation, and links scientific risk assessment with social values and risk perceptions. This risk management quadrants framework overcomes the problems with the dangerous threshold by restructuring the climate challenge around minimizing collective suffering, rather than averting a distant catastrophe.

Political naivete of scientists, on display again.

183 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:27:12pm

re: #161 Interesting Times

>Romantic Heretic, are you still here? Nasty little rightwing shill went and crapped all over your page.

Thanks. I replied. I said some things I should regret. But I won’t.

184 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:52:06pm

re: #176 bratwurst

[Embedded content]

Yeah, I heard they were expecting great things from their new cookie recipe.

185 BongCrodny  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 5:58:14pm

re: #126 Stanley Sea

NC on the march! 15 Photos From The Massive Progressive Protest You Didn’t Hear About This Weekend

I note that the signs all tend to be spelled correctly.

[/snark]

186 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 6:33:32pm

re: #73 wrenchwench

Been kinda busy, fortunately. And still working on a bike for a silly girl who just decided to take off on tour, and she ain’t ready…. Maybe her bike will be.

Well, some people say you tour yourself into shape, never worked well for me, much happier when I’m at least in something like touring shape before anything more than a weekend trip. Good luck to her.

RBS

187 b_sharp  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 7:21:58pm

re: #166 jaunte

[Embedded content]

I was wrong.

188 dell*nix  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 7:32:39pm

OT Hard drives on copy machines not being wiped? facebook.com

Anyone else seen this story?

189 socrets  Sun, Feb 9, 2014 8:43:58pm

I’m pretty sure Mayor Rob Ford thinks he’s hallucinating.

190 Bulworth  Mon, Feb 10, 2014 6:57:17am
@Awesomely11 if you have that point of view, I really don’t want your vote.
— Jim Watson (@JimWatsonOttawa) February 6, 2014

Persecution!!! Tyranny!!1

191 GunstarGreen  Mon, Feb 10, 2014 7:28:43am

re: #29 RadicalModerate

If this is true, this guy needs to be locked up for the rest of his life.

Groping suspect might be abortion clinic bomber

Of course, Beseda is considered a hero to the religious right.

We need to make sure every single child is born.

So that we can molest them in a few years.

/spit.


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