Tech Note: Using Media Queries With PHP

Communicating across the client-server divide
LGF • Views: 40,950

One of the major hurdles in a responsive mobile-friendly design is that the code that runs on your server (in our case PHP code) doesn’t have any simple way to get the screen dimensions of the user’s browser.

As a result, many mobile designs for PHP require the use of complicated checks for many different types of mobile devices, which is kludgy from a programming standpoint, and violates the whole ethos of responsive design, in which you program for screen size, not device type. And it runs the risk of breaking in the future as well, like all kludges based on user agents.

After wrestling with it for a while, I’ve come up with something that works for me. It’s not ideal in some ways, but it does let your server-side PHP code respond to a browser’s screen dimensions.

The big caveat is that this little bit of Javascript code must run as the very first thing in the section of your HTML document, before any other Javascript and preferably before anything else.

From the PHP standpoint this has one drawback: if your PHP code needs to do anything specific to mobile devices before sending any output to the browser, you’ll still need to fall back on the messy user agent solution. But any PHP code that runs after this bit of Javascript will be able to respond to the screen size properly.

Here’s the code that goes in the head section:

Here’s how it works: the latest versions of all the major browsers have a Javascript method that duplicates the CSS media query functionality, called “matchMedia.” You pass it the same kind of string you’d use in your CSS code, and it returns a “MediaQueryList” object; the matches property is true or false depending on whether the device matches the media query.

So this little bit of code first makes sure matchMedia exists, then calls the method with a string specifying smartphone-sized devices. If the matches flag is true, it sets a session cookie (expires when you close the browser window) called “smartPhone.” That’s all there is to it.

From that point on in your PHP code, you can simply do something like this to respond to the screen size:

if ($_COOKIE['smartPhone']) {
  // do your mobile stuff here
} else {
  // do your non-mobile stuff here
}

This code is specifically written for smartphone-sized screens, but it could easily be adapted to support more screen sizes as necessary. I’ve found it very useful in building LGF’s responsive mobile design, so maybe it will come in handy for someone else out there in the Internets.

Also see

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370 comments
1 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 3:52:24pm

I see we’re entering into the magical “comment moderation means coverup and censorship” phase of the Bundy Rebellion

2 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 4:12:42pm

If you hadn’t heard yet for some reason, Trent Reznor is giving away this album for free, in several formats including high-res FLAC audio files.

theslip.nin.com

3 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 4:12:46pm

Once upon a time it used to rain in Southern California:

Tar Pits Bees Connect California’s Past to the Present

[…]

Now, with those specimens in hand, Holden and other Ice Age ecologists can get a finer understanding of what the end-Pleistocene world was like. From what’s known of living Megachile gentilis, Holden says, the presence of this leafcutter species at La Brea indicates that Ice Age Los Angeles was a moister environment with woody habitat near streams. The Pacific Northwest habitats where the bee lives now are a rough proxy for Los Angeles 23,000 years ago, giving us another line of evidence for how changing climate has dramatically altered ecology.

[…]

The “Tar Pit Bees” - a SoCal band name for sure.

4 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 4:15:08pm
5 Killgore Trout  Apr 12, 2014 4:15:09pm

Crimea Is Marked Differently In English And Russian Google Maps

The Russian news outlet RT discovered an interesting difference between the Russian and English-language versions of Google maps. In Russia, the controversially annexed Crimean peninsula is listed as part of Russia, while a number of international versions of Google maps show it as a disputed territory.


Interestingly, while Crimea is labeled as part of Russia on the map, it’s described as “Crimea, Ukraine” when using the search bar. Cities in Crimea are labeled as part of Ukraine in the search bar as well.

6 Killgore Trout  Apr 12, 2014 4:17:45pm

re: #1 Kragar

I see we’re entering into the magical “comment moderation means coverup and censorship” phase of the Bundy Rebellion

[Embedded content]

With all this relentless publicity from the Dems the Koch brothers are never going to win the election.

7 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 4:19:37pm

BLM sets Bundy’s 400 cattle free

MESQUITE (KSNV mynews3.com) — Nearly 400 head of cattle owned by Cliven Bundy were set free Saturday afternoon from their enclosure just a few miles west of Mesquite.

Several hundred Bundy backers converged on Bureau of Land Management holding pens all Saturday afternoon. Many of them were armed.

As police tried to keep Interstate 15 open for several hours, the crowd grew. Metro SWAT teams and other law enforcement agencies were involved to keep the peace and to keep the road open.

Eventually, the BLM freed the cattle shortly before 3 p.m. The animals headed south back along the Virgin River.

The gun humping loons won.

mynews3.com

8 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 12, 2014 4:20:37pm

re: #7 Skip Intro

The government can play a longer game.

10 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 4:24:26pm

re: #8 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

The government can play a longer game.

Yeah, I’ve heard that one before. Read about it, too.

11 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 4:26:43pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

With all this relentless publicity from the Dems the Koch brothers are never going to win the election.

What election would that be? The one for Wisconsin governor? Nah, couldn’t be because they already won that one.

I guess they’re just a couple of dumb-ass hicks who like to piss away hundreds of millions of dollars for no reason at all.

12 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 4:28:38pm

re: #9 Killgore Trout

Why one of Africa’s worst conflicts is getting worse

Leftover of colonialism?

13 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 4:30:14pm

re: #11 Skip Intro

Please don’t feed the troll.

14 Killgore Trout  Apr 12, 2014 4:31:03pm

re: #12 freetoken

Leftover of colonialism?

uh, no.

15 wrenchwench  Apr 12, 2014 4:32:39pm

re: #3 freetoken

Once upon a time it used to rain in Southern California:

Tar Pits Bees Connect California’s Past to the Present

The “Tar Pit Bees” - a SoCal band name for sure.

Have some illustrations and a soundtrack.

Youtube Video

16 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 4:33:00pm

re: #14 Killgore Trout

I ask that because CAR is a creation, a result of, French colonialism.

Why should there be a Central African Republic today?

How many times did European colonial powers paint lines on maps based on their Euro-centric notion of what nation-states ought to be?

17 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 4:34:03pm

Here’s what the user agent detection method looks like in PHP:

<?php
$useragent=$_SERVER['HTTP_USER_AGENT'];
if (preg_match('/(android|bb\d+|meego).+mobile|avantgo|bada\/|blackberry|blazer|compal|elaine|fennec|hiptop|iemobile|ip(hone|od)|iris|kindle|lge |maemo|midp|mmp|mobile.+firefox|netfront|opera m(ob|in)i|palm( os)?|phone|p(ixi|re)\/|plucker|pocket|psp|series(4|6)0|symbian|treo|up\.(browser|link)|vodafone|wap|windows (ce|phone)|xda|xiino/i',$useragent)||preg_match('/1207|6310|6590|3gso|4thp|50[1-6]i|770s|802s|a wa|abac|ac(er|oo|s\-)|ai(ko|rn)|al(av|ca|co)|amoi|an(ex|ny|yw)|aptu|ar(ch|go)|as(te|us)|attw|au(di|\-m|r |s )|avan|be(ck|ll|nq)|bi(lb|rd)|bl(ac|az)|br(e|v)w|bumb|bw\-(n|u)|c55\/|capi|ccwa|cdm\-|cell|chtm|cldc|cmd\-|co(mp|nd)|craw|da(it|ll|ng)|dbte|dc\-s|devi|dica|dmob|do(c|p)o|ds(12|\-d)|el(49|ai)|em(l2|ul)|er(ic|k0)|esl8|ez([4-7]0|os|wa|ze)|fetc|fly(\-|_)|g1 u|g560|gene|gf\-5|g\-mo|go(\.w|od)|gr(ad|un)|haie|hcit|hd\-(m|p|t)|hei\-|hi(pt|ta)|hp( i|ip)|hs\-c|ht(c(\-| |_|a|g|p|s|t)|tp)|hu(aw|tc)|i\-(20|go|ma)|i230|iac( |\-|\/)|ibro|idea|ig01|ikom|im1k|inno|ipaq|iris|ja(t|v)a|jbro|jemu|jigs|kddi|keji|kgt( |\/)|klon|kpt |kwc\-|kyo(c|k)|le(no|xi)|lg( g|\/(k|l|u)|50|54|\-[a-w])|libw|lynx|m1\-w|m3ga|m50\/|ma(te|ui|xo)|mc(01|21|ca)|m\-cr|me(rc|ri)|mi(o8|oa|ts)|mmef|mo(01|02|bi|de|do|t(\-| |o|v)|zz)|mt(50|p1|v )|mwbp|mywa|n10[0-2]|n20[2-3]|n30(0|2)|n50(0|2|5)|n7(0(0|1)|10)|ne((c|m)\-|on|tf|wf|wg|wt)|nok(6|i)|nzph|o2im|op(ti|wv)|oran|owg1|p800|pan(a|d|t)|pdxg|pg(13|\-([1-8]|c))|phil|pire|pl(ay|uc)|pn\-2|po(ck|rt|se)|prox|psio|pt\-g|qa\-a|qc(07|12|21|32|60|\-[2-7]|i\-)|qtek|r380|r600|raks|rim9|ro(ve|zo)|s55\/|sa(ge|ma|mm|ms|ny|va)|sc(01|h\-|oo|p\-)|sdk\/|se(c(\-|0|1)|47|mc|nd|ri)|sgh\-|shar|sie(\-|m)|sk\-0|sl(45|id)|sm(al|ar|b3|it|t5)|so(ft|ny)|sp(01|h\-|v\-|v )|sy(01|mb)|t2(18|50)|t6(00|10|18)|ta(gt|lk)|tcl\-|tdg\-|tel(i|m)|tim\-|t\-mo|to(pl|sh)|ts(70|m\-|m3|m5)|tx\-9|up(\.b|g1|si)|utst|v400|v750|veri|vi(rg|te)|vk(40|5[0-3]|\-v)|vm40|voda|vulc|vx(52|53|60|61|70|80|81|83|85|98)|w3c(\-| )|webc|whit|wi(g |nc|nw)|wmlb|wonu|x700|yas\-|your|zeto|zte\-/i',substr($useragent,0,4))) {
  // do your mobile stuff here
}
?>

Isn’t that beautiful?

18 Killgore Trout  Apr 12, 2014 4:35:39pm

re: #12 freetoken

Leftover of colonialism?

VOX links to this more detailed analysis, it’s really pretty interesting
Genocide-mongering does nothing to help us understand the messy dynamics of conflict in the CAR - By Louisa Lombard

19 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 4:40:20pm

re: #18 Killgore Trout

From that link:

[…]

As a result, everything that is ‘state’ and ‘nation’ in the CAR grows out of the French-Christian enterprise centred on the capital. Central African administrators from the south and west who are sent to the northeast (the few who actually take up their posts, that is — most prefer to reside in Bangui or other better-appointed places) — such as the town of Ndele, where I did much of my research — consider it Central African territory occupied by foreigners. However, these ‘foreigners’ may have lived in the country for generations. In making these claims, the government officials echo their colonial predecessors, who justified killing the raiding sultans because they were ‘foreign’ invaders with no right to rule over people here. The foreignness of the French to this area went unremarked, of course….

[…]

This is reminiscent of the artifices of Middle-Eastern boundaries - those straight lines - set up after the Ottoman control was removed (WWI).

20 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 4:43:46pm

And speaking of Middle-East conflicts:

The seductive allure of wars we’re not winning

[…]

But there’s another question on which I’d be interested in hearing from younger veterans. It’s this: The world’s best military establishment didn’t win in Iraq, and it won’t win in Afghanistan. Why is that?

I think the author, Andrew J. Bacevich, is trying to pull a quick one here.

His claim of “didn’t win in Iraq” doesn’t have any meaning without defining “win”.

The US clearly achieved several (if not all) of its military objectives in Iraq.

So in that sense we did “win”.

It’s just that “winning” is not all it’s cracked up to be.

21 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 4:45:29pm
22 wrenchwench  Apr 12, 2014 4:48:57pm

In other news, the Johnson Lab is hiring:

Research technician position: lizard behavioral evolution

No, really.

A full-time, NSF-funded, technician position is available in the laboratory of Dr. Michele Johnson at Trinity University in San Antonio, Texas. Projects in the Johnson lab focus on behavioral evolution in lizards, using approaches from the fields of ecology and neuroscience to study the physiological traits underlying social behaviors. We are searching for a motivated, team-oriented technician to join our dynamic research group.

I saw it on Facebook.

To apply for the position, please send the following materials to Dr. Michele Johnson at michele.johnson@trinity.edu: CV or resume, including contact information for 2-3 references, and a cover letter explaining why you are interested in the position. Review of applications will begin immediately, and the ideal start date is May 12, 2014. We strongly encourage women and minority candidates to apply, as we value working with a diverse team. Trinity University is an Equal Opportunity Employer.

23 IntoxiNation  Apr 12, 2014 4:51:27pm

Nice trick, but it seems like at that point you really aren’t responsive. For example, you set that cookie and redirect back to PHP to get the page based by size, but what happens if I have that cookie set in my tablet and I’m in landscape, then I decide to rotate to portrait? You could hook into window.onresize and do a reload when need be, but that really hurts the user experience (ie: You have a YouTube video in a post. Someone is watching it and tilts their device a bit too far. Well now the page reloads, restarting their video)

Honestly the best thing for responsive is to try and accomplish it in pure CSS and then throw a bit of javascript in if need be. That way the presentation layer stays client side. The whole “mobile first” design meme didn’t click with me at first, but if you do try and accomplish that, then it is relatively painless to achieve a responsive design through css, and if you really need something server side, then AJAX load it (not a concern like it used to be with search engines like Google now processing Javascript when scraping sites).

Crooks and Liars, while a CSS mess (rushing to get it done because of other pending projects), is responsive. I’m slowly going through and cleaning things up as I have the time, but we’re running about a 1/2 dozen media query rules in there (hard to see them as I have Drupal set to aggregate all the CSS files into 1 on demand). I’ve even got the banner ads responsive, through a bit of Javascript magic. We also support IE8+, though the site is usable for the less than 1.5% of visitors we get in 6&7.

24 wrenchwench  Apr 12, 2014 4:53:32pm

re: #23 IntoxiNation

Welcome, hatchling.

25 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 5:00:08pm

re: #23 IntoxiNation

In this case I’m using it to avoid loading some content that doesn’t go in the mobile version, and a couple of other content-related issues. Hopefully, if you’re designing for tablets already, it will able to display correctly in both portrait and landscape modes anyway — but you’re right that this could also be achieved by loading size-dependent content through Ajax.

26 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 5:17:55pm

Just got in from my first round of golf for the year, have a bucket of Buffalo wings, and watching the season closer for Justified. I’m happier than a Clam at High Tide.

RBS

27 wrenchwench  Apr 12, 2014 5:36:48pm

re: #26 RealityBasedSteve

Just got in from my first round of golf for the year, have a bucket of Buffalo wings, and watching the season closer for Justified. I’m happier than a Clam at High Tide.

RBS

I thought the first golf outing of the year involved a bucket of golf balls, usually. Those Buffalo wings tee up pretty good?

28 b.d.  Apr 12, 2014 5:38:06pm

Hi Lizards, I’ve been preoccupied all day. What’s happened today?

Did they find the plane?
Did Greenwald try to march into NSA Headquarters?
Have the wingnuts demanded any new product boycotted or any new individual fired?
Have they demanded that the Yankees forfeit the season?

29 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 5:42:49pm
30 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 12, 2014 5:43:53pm

re: #28 b.d.

Hi Lizards, I’ve been preoccupied all day. What’s happened today?

Did they find the plane?
Did Greenwald try to march into NSA Headquarters?
Have the wingnuts demanded any new product boycotted or any new individual fired?
Have they demanded that the Yankees forfeit the season?

Greenwald has been keeping a low profile, no doubt for fear of federal drones. He has had nothing to say about the outbreak of fighting in the Rio slums. In other news, Putin made a big move in Ukraine and right-wing partizans staged a diversionary operation in Nevada in support.

31 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 5:44:25pm

re: #29 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

What the hell do you call that hair style. It’s not a mullet… what the hell is it?

RBS

32 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 5:44:36pm
33 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 5:44:57pm

re: #29 Charles Johnson

Dennis Quaid’s cousin!

34 PhillyPretzel  Apr 12, 2014 5:46:27pm

For those who are interested and can pick up NJTV either broadcast or on online, Tommy Emmanuel and Friends will be airing at 9pm. Here is a link to NJTV: njtvonline.org

Here is some more from youtube: Youtube Video

35 ObserverArt  Apr 12, 2014 5:47:07pm

Why is it when I see Bundy Ranch, I think Brady Bunch?

By the way, I have to say this is the first time I can remember having a certified UFO sighting here at Little Green Footballs.

Project Blue Mold. Unidentified Food Object.

36 Charles Johnson  Apr 12, 2014 5:50:36pm

re: #31 RealityBasedSteve

What the hell do you call that hair style. It’s not a mullet… what the hell is it?

RBS

That’s what a mullet looks like after you’ve been sleeping in an underpass for a couple of weeks.

37 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 12, 2014 5:54:48pm

re: #29 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Mug shot from his last meth arrest?

38 wrenchwench  Apr 12, 2014 5:56:47pm

re: #31 RealityBasedSteve

What the hell do you call that hair style. It’s not a mullet… what the hell is it?

RBS

That’s the hair Donald Trump wishes he had.

39 wrenchwench  Apr 12, 2014 6:00:58pm

Later, lemurs lizards.

40 Amory Blaine  Apr 12, 2014 6:01:05pm

Nevada Cattle Rancher Wins ‘Range War’ With Feds

A Nevada cattle rancher appears to have won his week-long battle with the federal government over a controversial cattle roundup that had led to the arrest of several protesters.

Cliven Bundy went head to head with the Bureau of Land Management over the removal of hundreds of his cattle from federal land, where the government said they were grazing illegally.

Bundy claims his herd of roughly 900 cattle have grazed on the land along the riverbed near Bunkerville, 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas, since 1870 and threatened a “range war” against the BLM on the Bundy Ranch website after one of his sons was arrested while protesting the removal of the cattle.

“I have no contract with the United States government,” Bundy said. “I was paying grazing fees for management and that’s what BLM was supposed to be, land managers and they were managing my ranch out of business, so I refused to pay.”

41 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 6:21:07pm

re: #40 Amory Blaine

Nevada Cattle Rancher Wins ‘Range War’ With Feds

I predict Bundy will be crushed

42 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 6:24:23pm

“I was paying grazing fees for management and that’s what BLM was supposed to be, land managers and they were managing my ranch out of business, so I refused to pay.”

His neighbors were still paying and making it, so Bundy was probably a really shitty rancher.

43 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 6:24:43pm

Tonight… Charles explains some Code, Krager makes a Prediction, and RBS pretends he’s on Top Gear.

RBS

44 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 6:24:55pm

re: #42 Kragar

Just greedy.

45 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 6:27:34pm

re: #44 jaunte

Just greedy.

Having problems with your business? Just stop paying for things and steal resources to keep yourself in the green!

46 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 6:30:33pm

re: #45 Kragar

I’ve been reading the Bundyranch hashtag; all these idiots pretending to have won a ‘range war against the Feds’. They have left reality behind.

47 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 6:32:23pm

re: #46 jaunte

The Bundys are freeloaders.

Where are the always-diligent fiscal conservatives complaining about freeloaders?

48 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 6:33:40pm

re: #41 Kragar

I predict Bundy will be crushed

I hope that the Govt. plays the “long game” on this. They can sit him out, but I’m afraid that some of the Militia groups that have come in will force another confrontation, and it’s not going to end well for anybody involved.

This guy has become a rally point for the far wack-jobs in the right, just like Randy Weaver. No matter how it ends, we all know that it’s because Obama hates real Americans. ///

RBS

49 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 6:35:07pm

re: #47 freetoken

They may be taking the weekend off. This one seems to have been jumped on mostly by the 2ndAmndmt/Oathkeeper/shtf/bugout bag/survivalist/militia nuts. Also chemtrails/Chinese solar/Harry Reid/warrgrble.

50 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 6:36:36pm

re: #47 freetoken

It’s all about Harry Reid and his son wanting the land for a solar farm they’ve invested in, except there is no solar farm (the proposed one was hundreds of miles away, and it’s been DOA since 2012) and the Reids had no connection with it.

However, that hasn’t stopped the idiot crew from retweeting this fake news around a billion times this weekend - so far.

51 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 12, 2014 6:38:16pm

re: #41 Kragar

I predict Bundy will be crushed

They need to make an example of him. There is an intricately detailed video record of the events. The feds have probably already identified the militia poseurs who pointed their weapons at BLM employee or otherwise threatened violence. Needless to say (except to RWNJs) it is against the law to use threats of violence against public employees in the performance of their duties.
Since Bundy will not want the chairborne rangers mooching any longer than necessary, this mob will probably disperse to its home grottos within a few days. I predict a series of fugitive raids on trailer parks and crackerbox suburbs throughout the west in the next few weeks.

52 Amory Blaine  Apr 12, 2014 6:40:21pm

I give the BLM credit for not giving the teaparty assholes their martyr. In the meantime, if there isn’t a pushback from more level headed right wingers it may embolden them for their next cause.

53 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 6:41:21pm

re: #48 RealityBasedSteve

I hope that the Govt. plays the “long game” on this. They can sit him out, but I’m afraid that some of the Militia groups that have come in will force another confrontation, and it’s not going to end well for anybody involved.

This guy has become a rally point for the far wack-jobs in the right, just like Randy Weaver. No matter how it ends, we all know that it’s because Obama hates real Americans. ///

RBS

I’m waiting for Ted Cruz to tweet “I Stand With Cliven Bundy”. It won’t be long.

54 Chrysicat  Apr 12, 2014 6:41:53pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

With all this relentless publicity from the Dems the Koch brothers are never going to win the election.

I almost never downding. For that pile of crap, I made an exception.

55 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 6:43:33pm

re: #41 Kragar

I predict Bundy will be crushed

I’m predicting that he’ll end up paying the money he owes whether he likes it or not.

56 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 6:44:37pm

re: #47 freetoken

Where are the always-diligent fiscal conservatives complaining about freeloaders?

57 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 6:46:18pm

re: #55 Lidane

I’m predicting that he’ll end up paying the money he owes whether he likes it or not.

He hasn’t got a legal leg to stand on, but whether the government will pursue this or just wait for him to die is anyone’s guess.

I do find it disturbing that the BLM released his cattle. What was the point of the showdown? To give the RWNjs erections?

58 Stanley Sea  Apr 12, 2014 6:49:04pm
59 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 6:52:15pm

re: #57 Skip Intro

He hasn’t got a legal leg to stand on, but whether the government will pursue this or just wait for him to die is anyone’s guess.

IIRC they can just slap a lien on his property then wait him out. I think anyway. It would be the easiest, most expedient thing.

Another option would have been to sell his cattle at auction and take their money upfront, then give him whatever’s left. Have they even raised that possibility?

I do find it disturbing that the BLM released his cattle. What was the point of the showdown? To give the RWNjs erections?

No idea.

60 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 12, 2014 6:53:10pm

On a much more cheerful note, the holy grail of nostalgia sci-fi (at least to me) has fallen right into my greedy paws: Robinson Crusoe on Mars has made its appearance on Netflix streaming, in the beautifully restored Criterion version no less.
You have to forget nearly everything you know about the real Mars to enjoy this, but it is a rousing story with some great vintage effects if you can manage it.

61 Political Atheist  Apr 12, 2014 6:54:59pm

Well crap. Look at this LA Times headline

Citing armed protesters, BLM returns seized cattle to Nevada rancher

Paged.

62 prairiefire  Apr 12, 2014 6:55:51pm

Hey, Lizards! Hope everyone is well!

63 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 6:57:29pm

re: #61 Political Atheist

So basically, the government didn’t want a bunch of jacked up RWNJ yahoos to open fire on government workers doing their jobs.

Doesn’t mean they won’t find a way to get the money that Bundy owes.

64 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 6:58:21pm

re: #62 prairiefire

Hey, Lizards! Hope everyone is well!

The Lizards hold The Wall, the RWNJ’s are held to the north. All is good.

RBS

65 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 6:58:41pm

re: #61 Political Atheist

Citing armed protesters, BLM returns seized cattle to Nevada rancher

Well, that will give some people the wrong idea.

I suppose if they freeze Bundy’s assets the militants won’t be able to figure out who to shoot at.

66 jamesfirecat  Apr 12, 2014 6:58:49pm

Hey, guess who managed to go 7-2 at today’s grand pree magic the gather event in Philly today?

This guy!

(For reference 7-2 is the cut off point to make it into the next round of games and extra product (at least six packs worth of drafted cards) that will be up for grabs tommorrow!

67 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 6:58:55pm

Completely OT, but this came across my Twitter TL:

Was anyone asking for more Avatar films? Are sequels even needed? I don’t remember Dances With Wolves having a sequel. WTF. :p

68 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 7:00:21pm

re: #67 Lidane

Avatar 2: The Unobtanium Wars.

69 klys  Apr 12, 2014 7:01:11pm

re: #67 Lidane

Completely OT, but this came across my Twitter TL:

[Embedded content]

Was anyone asking for more Avatar films? Are sequels even needed? I don’t remember Dances With Wolves having a sequel. WTF. :p

He apparently always intended for there to be sequels.

Whether it’s a good plan is an entirely different question.

70 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:01:35pm

re: #66 jamesfirecat

Hey, guess who managed to go 7-2 at today’s grand pree magic the gather event in Philly today?

This guy!

(For reference 7-2 is the cut off point to make it into the next round of games and extra product (at least six packs worth of drafted cards) that will be up for grabs tommorrow!

Congrads.

RBS

71 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:02:05pm

re: #65 jaunte

Well, that will give some people the wrong idea.

I suppose if they freeze Bundy’s assets the militants won’t be able to figure out who to shoot at.

Oh yes they will. It will be some poor bastard mail carrier or other low level local evil government employee.

72 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:03:34pm

re: #67 Lidane

Completely OT, but this came across my Twitter TL:

[Embedded content]

Was anyone asking for more Avatar films? Are sequels even needed? I don’t remember Dances With Wolves having a sequel. WTF. :p

Well, hell, so what other news is there to totally crap up my weekend?

73 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:04:52pm

re: #69 klys

He apparently always intended for there to be sequels.

Whether it’s a good plan is an entirely different question.

Three scripts in six weeks? How could they be anything but good?

74 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:04:54pm

re: #72 Skip Intro

Well, hell, so what other news is there to totally crap up my weekend?

One concept… Expendables 4

RBS

75 klys  Apr 12, 2014 7:05:28pm

re: #73 Skip Intro

Three scripts in six weeks? How could they be anything but good?

Really, James Cameron is not exactly known for his compelling dialog to start with.

76 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:05:41pm

re: #74 RealityBasedSteve

One concept… Expendables 4

RBS

Starring Pauly Shore?

77 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 7:05:55pm

re: #73 Skip Intro

Three scripts in six weeks? How could they be anything but good?

LOL @ you for thinking that the script matters in a James Cameron film.

It’s all about the effects, yo.

78 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:07:15pm

re: #77 Lidane

I admit I’m probably the only person in the US who never made it through Avatar even one time.

79 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 7:08:07pm

re: #73 Skip Intro

Three scripts in six weeks? How could they be anything but good?

Trudy Chacon: We’re goin’ up against gunships with bows and arrows.
Jake Sully: Well, I guess we better stop ‘em.

80 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:08:41pm

re: #77 Lidane

LOL @ you for thinking that the script matters in a James Cameron film.

It’s all about the effects, yo.

Can we get Michael Bay involved in this project from hell?

And a cameo by Christopher Walken?

RBS

81 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:09:40pm

Is this a competition? How many weeks did it take George Lucas to write the three Star Wars prequels?

82 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 12, 2014 7:11:28pm

Somehow the propaganda surrounding the Bundy affair reminds me of the notorious Black Hills Gold Rush of the mid 1870s, when 25,000 greed crazed yahoos, prostitutes, grifters and gunslingers invaded the Black Hills in naked defiance of a recent treaty with the Lakota Indians and of (admittedly half-hearted) federal injunctions. They got away with it, too, but at a cost. They didn’t care about the cost, because it was Custer and his bedraggled force of destitute immigrants and impoverished farm boys who payed that price.

83 Killgore Trout  Apr 12, 2014 7:12:27pm

Much better video on the incident I linked to earlier
Pro-Russian Gunmen Seize Police Station in Eastern Ukraine

Liveleak Video

The Russians start shooting in the air for some reason, then shooting breaks out inside.

84 Backwoods_Sleuth  Apr 12, 2014 7:14:46pm

heh

85 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:15:06pm

I got to scratch Orb’s neck today.

If you are not jealous, you should be.

86 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:18:49pm

re: #55 Lidane

I’m predicting that he’ll end up paying the money he owes whether he likes it or not.

I’m thinking these RWNJ’s aren’t just living in another decade, but century and millennium.

87 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:20:36pm

re: #31 RealityBasedSteve

What the hell do you call that hair style. It’s not a mullet… what the hell is it?

RBS

Country Fried Mullet.

88 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 7:21:01pm

re: #78 Skip Intro

I admit I’m probably the only person in the US who never made it through Avatar even one time.

Oh, I sat through it. Enjoying it was another matter entirely.

Aside from the laughable plot, shitty dialogue and wooden acting, the overwhelming amount of 3D made me physically ill. I ended up with pretty severe simulator sickness when it was over. Never, ever again. I’ll pass on anything Cameron does in the future if it’s going to be wall-to-wall 3D.

89 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 7:25:08pm

re: #88 Lidane

It would have worked better as a porno.

90 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:26:22pm

I also got to scratch the neck of Blame.

Unbelievably well groomed horses.

I think they are treated better than the Queen.

91 theheat  Apr 12, 2014 7:26:29pm

re: #42 Kragar

Bundy is a millionaire. A millionaire shitbag.

92 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:26:45pm

re: #88 Lidane

Oh, I sat through it. Enjoying it was another matter entirely.

Aside from the laughable plot, shitty dialogue and wooden acting, the overwhelming amount of 3D made me physically ill. I ended up with pretty severe simulator sickness when it was over. Never, ever again. I’ll pass on anything Cameron does in the future if it’s going to be wall-to-wall 3D.

One of the best uses of 3D I’ve seen is HUGO, by Martin Scorsese. Yea, there were a few shots of things coming OUT of the screen, but he really took advantage of 3D to give depth to the field of view. He worked BACK, rather than out, and it was a fantastic movie.

RBS

93 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 7:27:05pm

re: #86 FemNaziBitch

I’m thinking these RWNJ’s aren’t just living in another decade, but century and millennium.

They’re living in their fantasy version of another century.

94 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 7:28:13pm

Here we go. Someone’s been ‘shoppin’!

95 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:28:28pm

re: #91 theheat

Bundy is a millionaire. A millionaire shitbag.

I’m not sure that a millionaire in the ranching business is doing all that well these days. Maybe a multi-millionaire.

Then again, if you count on not paying for the land you use, having to pay for it can really ruin your budget.

Can’t take as many vacations.

96 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:28:57pm

re: #93 Lidane

They’re living in their fantasy version of another century.

Yeah, the one in which the don’t pay their “staff”.

97 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:29:12pm

OMG… Top Gear has the car I learned to drive in, an Opal Kadet for one of their “cheap car challenges” I don’t think it will end well.

RBS

98 theheat  Apr 12, 2014 7:29:13pm

re: #95 FemNaziBitch

Free feed on public land for 20 years sure lowers the feed bill, though.

99 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:30:10pm

What was that saying I posted the other day?

Something to do with “we’ve always done it this way”?

Well, I’ve got news.
Spock is in touch with his feelings and there are new rules in Monopoly.

100 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:30:50pm

re: #98 theheat

Free feed on public land for 20 years sure lowers the feed bill, though.

Well, it was nice while it lasted.

101 theheat  Apr 12, 2014 7:32:37pm

re: #99 FemNaziBitch

It costs more to feed a dog or cat per month than one cow or steer on public land, which is less than $2. Of course, a steer or cow weigh 600-1000 pounds more than a cat or dog.

102 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 12, 2014 7:32:38pm

re: #97 RealityBasedSteve

OMG… Top Gear has the car I learned to drive in, an Opal Kadet for one of their “cheap car challenges” I don’t think it will end well.

RBS

I took a used one for a test drive back in about 1972. I made it onto the main street, at which point the vehicle coughed, stopped running, and starting emitting an ominous cloud of black smoke from under the hood. I pulled over and bailed out just as flames erupted. I called the fire department from a nearby store but the little car was fully involved before they got there. It was a burnt out hulk by the time the dealer got it back.

103 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:34:45pm

re: #102 Shiplord Kirel

I took a used one for a test drive back in about 1972. I made it onto the main street, at which point the vehicle coughed, stopped running, and starting emitting an ominous cloud of black smoke from under the hood. I pulled over and bailed out just as flames erupted. I called the fire department from a nearby store but the little car was fully involved before they got there. It was a burnt out hulk by the time the dealer got it back.

ROFLMAO!!!! I’ve seen 1 car that actually started to catch fire while I was watching, it’s scary how fast it goes from smoke and a glimpse of flame to fully involved, flames shooting out the windows. Seemed like it was 2 minutes max.

RBS

104 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 7:35:42pm

re: #101 theheat

That $2 a month probably doesn’t pay for the wear and tear on the land caused by a 1000 lb. animal.

105 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:39:11pm

re: #104 jaunte

That $2 a month probably doesn’t pay for the wear and tear on the land caused by a 1000 lb. animal.

There are some environmental changes that happen to the land when cows graze. I can’t remember —something to do with preventing erosion because they tear the grasses at the ground and don’t pull from the roots. Rhizomes continue to grow and secure the soil.

I don’t know how, exactly, that plays out with current climate conditions tho.

106 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 7:40:38pm

re: #105 FemNaziBitch

It seems like a pretty marginal place to raise beef cattle.

107 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 7:40:56pm

Ye haw…

108 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:41:27pm

The tour guide at Claiborne Farms described the process of the business of breeding horses.

Of course, the worst of my girlfriends was there.

Our husbands had to separate us.

109 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 7:42:32pm
110 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:42:36pm
BIG GOVERNMENT IS DANGEROUS!!!!!

re: #107 freetoken

Charlie just wants his family’s slaves back.

111 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:43:23pm

re: #110 Skip Intro

Charlie just wants his family’s slaves back.

Out West wouldn’t it be injuns and chinese?

112 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:44:40pm

re: #111 FemNaziBitch

Out West wouldn’t it be injuns and chinese?

North Carolina is out west?

113 goddamnedfrank  Apr 12, 2014 7:44:49pm

re: #86 FemNaziBitch

I’m thinking these RWNJ’s aren’t just living in another decade, but century and millennium.

Whiskey Rebellion dudes didn’t like Federal fees either. In response President Washington rode on their asses with an army. These guys aren’t living in the past, they’ve created a fictional one completely at odds with historical reality.

114 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:45:40pm

re: #112 Skip Intro

North Carolina is out west?

NEVER MIND

115 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 7:45:46pm

re: #113 goddamnedfrank

These guys aren’t living in the past, they’ve created a fictional one completely at odds with historical reality.

They’re graduates from the Jim DeMint School of History.

116 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 7:46:35pm

re: #112 Skip Intro

North Carolina is out west?

It’s near Perth.

117 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:48:07pm

re: #107 freetoken

Ye haw…

[Embedded content]

Or The Bonus Army, Or Little Rock, Or Kent State… I saw Charlie Daniels at the Western Washington State Fair about a bizillion years ago, good entertainer, but that’s all I few him as. He lives in the Nashville area, is occasionally a guest on one of the RW talk radio shows, where his views are treated like they mean something.

RBS

118 Skip Intro  Apr 12, 2014 7:48:37pm

re: #115 Lidane

They’re graduates from the Jim DeMint School of History.

Life was just wonderful in Columbia until that libturd bastard Booker DeWitt came along and ruined everything.

119 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 7:48:43pm

re: #116 freetoken

It’s near Perth.

And it tastes just like chicken.

RBS

120 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 7:59:26pm

Orb

121 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 8:04:56pm

The Teaser

I had no idea.

GF said she wouldn’t mine one.

122 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 8:07:06pm

re: #121 FemNaziBitch

The Teaser

I had no idea.

GF said she wouldn’t mine one.

sounds like my entire high school experience. :-(

RBS

123 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 8:08:13pm

re: #122 RealityBasedSteve

sounds like my entire high school experience. :-(

RBS

They said they made sure the Teaser wasn’t teased a few times a year to keep him interested in his job.

124 Romantic Heretic  Apr 12, 2014 8:17:05pm

re: #20 freetoken

And speaking of Middle-East conflicts:

The seductive allure of wars we’re not winning

I think the author, Andrew J. Bacevich, is trying to pull a quick one here.

His claim of “didn’t win in Iraq” doesn’t have any meaning without defining “win”.

The US clearly achieved several (if not all) of its military objectives in Iraq.

So in that sense we did “win”.

It’s just that “winning” is not all it’s cracked up to be.

It’s a case of the U.S. knows how to win wars. But it no longer know how to win the peace.

125 FemNaziBitch  Apr 12, 2014 8:19:51pm

nytol

126 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 8:24:03pm
127 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 8:27:16pm

re: #124 Romantic Heretic

It’s a case of the U.S. knows how to win wars. But it no longer know how to win the peace.

The only time we really won the peace was because George Marshal considered it the continuation of what he had done to win the war. Greatest non-combat general in the history of the US Army. I sometimes wonder if we could have won WWII without him.

128 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 8:36:22pm

re: #127 William Barnett-Lewis

The only time we really won the peace was because George Marshal considered it the continuation of what he had done to win the war. Greatest non-combat general in the history of the US Army. I sometimes wonder if we could have won WWII without him.

Given the material disparities, I’d say we would have beaten Japan as long as we had competent leadership. Germany is another story, as if we had not done as well its possible to imagine a resolution wherein Germany still loses but the Red Army ended up swallowing everything up to the Rhine instead of the Elbe.

129 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 12, 2014 8:39:02pm

re: #113 goddamnedfrank

Whiskey Rebellion dudes didn’t like Federal fees either. In response President Washington rode on their asses with an army. These guys aren’t living in the past, they’ve created a fictional one completely at odds with historical reality.

They just love that Fake Quote in which ol’ George claims that everyone needs GUNZ in case they have to fight against THERE OWN GOVERNMENT!!!!!!!!

130 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 8:39:15pm
131 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 8:40:20pm
132 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 8:41:07pm

re: #129 Pie-onist Overlord

They just love that Fake Quote in which ol’ George claims that everyone needs GUNZ in case they have to fight against THERE OWN GOVERNMENT!!!!!!!!

“WASHINGTON BELIEVED IN THE MILITIA!”

Meaning an organized group using uniform equipment and held to certain standards to augment the military during emergencies, not a gagglefuck of neck beards thinking they can take pot shots at Federal agents

133 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 8:42:27pm

re: #132 Kragar

Extra updings for “gagglefuck of neck beards.”

134 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 12, 2014 8:43:35pm

DUMBASS

135 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 12, 2014 8:44:33pm

Another Dumbass

136 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 12, 2014 8:44:44pm

Who was shot?

137 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 8:45:41pm

re: #132 Kragar

“WASHINGTON BELIEVED IN THE MILITIA!”

Meaning an organized group using uniform equipment and held to certain standards to augment the military during emergencies, not a gagglefuck of neck beards thinking they can take pot shots at Federal agents

To be fair, though, the real lessons of the Revolutionary War in terms of the proper use of militia forces normally do elude the understanding of the public. Said lessons require a fair bit of explanation and qualification, and even a small amount of nuance. These tend not to fit well into a Tweet or screed, nor will they normally be found in a history textbook at school.

The information is out there and there are good sources, but you have to want to know where to look.

138 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 8:45:49pm

Nevada, breadbasket of the Nation.

139 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 8:47:52pm

re: #135 Pie-onist Overlord

Another Dumbass

[Embedded content]

An upraised fist on a red background? That’s Communist iconography! The irony of that…uuhhhhh

140 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 8:49:57pm

re: #138 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Nevada, breadbasket of the Nation.

Where will the wingnut rachers get corn and soybeans to feed their livestock, I wonder? Because Barack Obama’s adopted home state of Illinois leads the nation in growing soybeans and is second in corn production as well.

141 BongCrodny  Apr 12, 2014 8:51:44pm

re: #138 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Nevada, breadbasket of the Nation.

Yeah, and your coffee comes in from the coasts. What are you going to do then, pal?

142 Political Atheist  Apr 12, 2014 8:52:07pm

So I’m working on a facelift for the website at my work. Going through old images ‘cause the look is contrast heavy and image intensive. One day one of the guys was making 18k rose gold. This is what it looked like at the time.
I just like how the little bits of fire showed how they scatter on the cold water.

18K Rose Gold in a hydrogen oxygen flame

143 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 8:54:08pm

re: #137 Dark_Falcon

To be fair, though, the real lessons of the Revolutionary War in terms of the proper use of militia forces normally do elude the understanding of the public. Said lessons require a fair bit of explanation and qualification, and even a small amount of nuance. These tend not to fit well into a Tweet or screed, nor will they normally be found in a history textbook at school.

The information is out there and there are good sources, but you have to >want to know where to look.

It doesn’t help that the real lessons about the militia’s utter failure were ignored by the US government until after the Spanish American War of 1898 when our emerging imperialism required a bigger regular army than killing Native Americans did… :whistles:

Sad part is the reforms were good and laid the ground work for the army that won WWII but it’s impossible to ignore that it was created out of the mess that was the that war and the resulting Philippine insurgency.

144 Feline Fearless Leader  Apr 12, 2014 8:54:31pm

re: #66 jamesfirecat

Hey, guess who managed to go 7-2 at today’s grand pree magic the gather event in Philly today?

This guy!

(For reference 7-2 is the cut off point to make it into the next round of games and extra product (at least six packs worth of drafted cards) that will be up for grabs tommorrow!

That explains the lack of Magic players in the game store in West Chester I frequent to play board games on Saturdays. They were all down in Philly.

145 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 8:56:12pm

re: #142 Political Atheist

So I’m working on a facelift for the website at my work. Going through old images ‘cause the look is contrast heavy and image intensive. One day one of the guys was making 18k rose gold. This is what it looked like at the time.
I just likes how the little bits of fire showed how they scatter on the cold water.

18K Rose Gold in a hydrogen oxygen flame

That’s neat. I’ve never tried any kind of metal working / jewelry making.

RBS

146 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 8:57:08pm

Evening lizards! My daughter got a rabbit yesterday from her friend. Now we have a dog, a cat, a fish, and a rabbit. Tomorrow I will spend the day making a rabbit hutch for the new member of the family.

Meet Oreo:

Oreo the rabbit

147 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 8:57:39pm

re: #139 Dark_Falcon

An upraised fist on a red background? That’s Communist iconography! The irony of that…uuhhhhh

And they have utterly no clue any more than they have of spelling.

148 theheat  Apr 12, 2014 8:58:07pm

re: #138 jaunte

Postal service, telephones, internet providers, public highways, and subsidies… how do those work again? //

149 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 8:58:12pm

re: #146 NJDhockeyfan

Evening lizards! My daughter got a rabbit yesterday from her friend. Now we have a dog, a cat, a fish, and a rabbit. Tomorrow I will spend the day making a rabbit hutch for the new member of the family.

Meet Oreo:

Oreo the rabbit

So, you have 3 pets, and 1 decorative accessory.

<Running for cover>

RBS

150 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 8:59:13pm

re: #148 theheat

You just wave your magic AR-wand and 2nd Amendment them into being.

151 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 8:59:43pm

re: #139 Dark_Falcon

An upraised fist on a red background? That’s Communist iconography! The irony of that…uuhhhhh

[Embedded image]

Maybe they are ironically hipster RWNJs.

RBS

152 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 9:00:37pm

re: #143 William Barnett-Lewis

They militia didn’t utterly fail, though. Used correctly, militia did have value.

153 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 9:01:24pm

re: #149 RealityBasedSteve

So, you have 3 pets, and 1 decorative accessory.

<Running for cover>

RBS

The hasenpfeffer jokes went over like a lead ballon last night.

154 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:02:32pm

veooz.com

155 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 9:04:00pm

FREEDOM!

156 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:04:03pm

500 homes burned.

157 Political Atheist  Apr 12, 2014 9:04:45pm

re: #145 RealityBasedSteve

That’s neat. I’ve never tried any kind of metal working / jewelry making.

RBS

Thanks. In that instance I was behind the camera, but I can tell you it’s fun to do. The nature of hydrogen is you need a lot of it so that means loud enough to require plugs. 4000 F flame. You learn where that heat is going fast. Jewelry is easier than most metals.

158 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 9:05:27pm

Well, a golf lesson, walking 18 holes, and a bike ride have left me about wore out. I’ll see you lizards later, I’m going to go curl up on my electrically heated fake rock.

Have a good evening, and don’t eat any bad flies.

RBS

159 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 9:05:59pm

re: #134 Pie-onist Overlord

So Bundy doesn’t owe money anymore?

Just because the government decided to protect their workers doing their jobs from getting killed by a bunch of jacked up RWNJs with guns doesn’t mean that anything has ended.

160 Amory Blaine  Apr 12, 2014 9:08:31pm

Feds Back Down in Nevada ‘Range War,’ Citing ‘Conditions on the Ground’

With the desert sun high, about two dozen cowboys on horseback appeared in a cloud of dust on the hills above the protest area, ready to ride about three miles away to take Bundy’s cattle back. “Until the cows come home!” the crowd cheered. Meanwhile, antigovernment “Patriot” groups such as the Oath Keepers, grew only more excited. Wiley Drake, national chaplain for the Oath Keepers, said the time had come to no longer bow to President Obama, whom he called a “half-breed.”

161 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 9:11:53pm

re: #152 Dark_Falcon

They militia didn’t utterly fail, though. Used correctly, militia did have value.

True enough, they made good canon fodder … O_o

That said, I found this the other day. When I get a few pennies together, I know what my next flintlock will be… ;)

veteranarms.com

I believe they have bayonets too …

162 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 9:12:40pm

re: #153 NJDhockeyfan

The hasenpfeffer jokes went over like a lead balloon last night.

I was fighting the urge to make Saurbratten jokes upthread…

163 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:15:51pm

re: #161 William Barnett-Lewis

The hand-mortar looks like it might have a bit of a kick:
veteranarms.com

164 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 9:18:05pm

re: #162 William Barnett-Lewis

I was fighting the urge to make Saurbratten jokes upthread…

Mmmmmm…I have Gerst Haus on my list of restaurants in Nashville I must visit before the summer is over.

165 darthstar  Apr 12, 2014 9:19:02pm
166 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 9:19:39pm

Swedish Boarding Axe Pistol

Just what you need for if you’re not sure if you want to shoot, slash or stab.

RBS

167 Amory Blaine  Apr 12, 2014 9:19:45pm

re: #157 Political Atheist

Bow to the Goat Lord

168 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 9:20:53pm

re: #164 NJDhockeyfan

Mmmmmm…I have Gerst Haus on my list of restaurants in Nashville I must visit before the summer is over.

It’s not bad… I’ve eaten there before. Just don’t make any plans for the evening (other than possibly invading Poland), since the Germans never bought into that whole “Light Cuisine” thing.

RBS

169 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 9:21:14pm

re: #161 William Barnett-Lewis

True enough, they made good canon fodder … O_o

That said, I found this the other day. When I get a few pennies together, I know what my next flintlock will be… ;)

[Embedded image]

veteranarms.com

I believe they have bayonets too …

Dan Morgan used militia effectively at the Cowpens, and Nathaniel Greene did so as well at Guildford Court house.

At the Cowpens the militia (having run after firing the requested two volleys at the British and then having been rallied) actually stood a charge from Bloody Ben Tarleton’s Legion Dragoons. Though that was after the Patriot force had mousetrapped a battalion of the 71st Highlanders (Fraser’s Highlanders). Of course, with victory that close to hand even men who might otherwise panic tend to find their nerve. But hold their nerve the militia did and the Legion having been repulsed, the 71st was surrounded and at last even the fierce-fighting Scots had to wave the white flag.

170 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 9:23:09pm

re: #166 RealityBasedSteve

Swedish Boarding Axe Pistol

Just what you need for if you’re not sure if you want to shoot, slash or stab.

RBS

The holy water sprinkler, part blunderbuss, part morning star

171 darthstar  Apr 12, 2014 9:24:26pm

Guys…stop with the sex toys already…there are children about.

172 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 9:25:53pm

re: #170 Kragar

[Embedded image]

The holy water sprinkler, part blunderbuss, part morning star

That looks like something from one of your miniatures.

RBS

173 theheat  Apr 12, 2014 9:26:06pm

re: #160 Amory Blaine

There’s gobs of babyklukkers involved in this movement. Until Bundy came along, they were all quietly seething and stockpiling guns for an imminent government showdown.

174 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:26:37pm

re: #170 Kragar

Reminds me of the Royal Armouries Museum in the Tower of London.

175 darthstar  Apr 12, 2014 9:27:32pm

I think it’s time to test the effectiveness of our F-16s against those cows and militia men.

I know, people will say, “But they’re AMERICANS!”…I do believe they’ve claimed otherwise in their rejection of US law.

176 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 9:28:00pm

re: #165 darthstar

[Embedded content]

I’m sorry but I must say that would be unwise. The wingnuts might well have responded to that by opening fire on the BLM men doing the culling. While the BLM perhaps should not have backed off when it did, to have started killing the cattle (likely with guns) while armed wingnuts were massed against other government personnel would have likely set off a bloodbath.

To fuse two themes together, fighting out in the open as was done during the Revolution is now impossible. Modern firepower, even bolt action rifles, is simply too deadly to stand in front of. If you want to put paid to the wingnuts, you have to catch them by surprise. (Yes you could just sic helicopter gunships on them, but the PR blowback from doing that would be cataclysmic).

177 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 12, 2014 9:29:01pm

re: #158 RealityBasedSteve

Well, a golf lesson, walking 18 holes, and a bike ride have left me about wore out. I’ll see you lizards later, I’m going to go curl up on my electrically heated fake rock.

Have a good evening, and don’t eat any bad flies.

RBS

ok, and now I really AM outta here…

RBS
Who’s off like a prom dress

178 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 12, 2014 9:29:13pm

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

I am well aware that in a few cases good officers of regulars found ways to use the weakness of militia to their advantage after long years of experience. I’m not sure that negates the many times that militia caused many more problems.

179 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 9:29:44pm

re: #172 RealityBasedSteve

That looks like something from one of your miniatures.

RBS

Spotlight: Combination Weapons

Holy water sprinkler with three gun barrels from the Tower of London
Dating from the 16th century and credited as Henry VIII’s walking staff, this pole weapon combines three match-lock guns, complete with coverings for the charges, with a multi-spiked head.

180 Dark_Falcon  Apr 12, 2014 9:33:24pm

Pacific Rimis finally on HBO, so I’m going to go watch that. Good Night, All.

181 BeenHereAwhile  Apr 12, 2014 9:33:34pm

re: #17 Charles Johnson

Here’s what the user agent detection method looks like in PHP:

[Embedded content]

Isn’t that beautiful?

Been reading LGF with an iPhone since 2009 (?) - well - before I registered.

It’s been a nice transition from “curses - another Flash video,” to something more friendly to the iOS platform.

Thank you.

182 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 9:35:32pm

re: #168 RealityBasedSteve

It’s not bad… I’ve eaten there before. Just don’t make any plans for the evening (other than possibly invading Poland), since the Germans never bought into that whole “Light Cuisine” thing.

RBS

There is a really good German restaurant in Staunton, Va that I’m going to miss. I am craving some good German food right now too.

183 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 9:39:26pm

Oh great. All the conservatives on my FB feed have started parroting the VICTORY OVER BIG GUBMINT idiocy.

I don’t have the heart to explain that the guy still owes money, has still lost every court case he’s ever faced, and that nothing has changed. The only thing that happened is that the BLM moved to protect their workers from a bunch of gun fetishists with delusions of armed rebellion.

184 goddamnedfrank  Apr 12, 2014 9:40:28pm

re: #179 Kragar

Spotlight: Combination Weapons

That thing looks super Orky.

185 Amory Blaine  Apr 12, 2014 9:41:06pm

All the BLM has to do is come back out during Palin’s show premiere. Walk in-walk out.

186 Amory Blaine  Apr 12, 2014 9:42:07pm

Precursors for the spork.

187 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:42:08pm

re: #183 Lidane

I doubt any of the visitors can afford to stay out there in Nevada a full week, so all the BLM has to do is wait a bit.

188 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:43:35pm

re: #186 Amory Blaine

I’m looking for a good matchlock foon, with an integral trident dagger.

189 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 9:44:23pm

re: #183 Lidane

Oh great. All the conservatives on my FB feed have started parroting the VICTORY OVER BIG GUBMINT idiocy.

I don’t have the heart to explain that the guy still owes money, has still lost every court case he’s ever faced, and that nothing has changed. The only thing that happened is that the BLM moved to protect their workers from a bunch of gun fetishists with delusions of armed rebellion.

And is probably busy IDing the dipshits who showed up to file charges against them when they get home

190 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 9:44:36pm
191 BeenHereAwhile  Apr 12, 2014 9:46:24pm

re: #84 Backwoods_Sleuth

heh

[Embedded content]

The driver won’t do that again.

In Miami, BMW means Break My Window.

192 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 9:49:26pm
193 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 12, 2014 9:53:34pm

It’s the killer rabbit!

194 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 12, 2014 9:54:52pm

re: #191 BeenHereAwhile

The driver won’t do that again.

In Miami, BMW means Break My Window.

In China, BMW means “Don’t Touch Me” (bu mo wo 不摸我).

195 BeenHereAwhile  Apr 12, 2014 9:57:01pm

re: #110 Skip Intro

Charlie just wants his family’s slaves back.

You’d never guess that back in the day, Charlie supported Jimmy Carter for President.

196 klys  Apr 12, 2014 9:57:33pm

It turns out the Internet really has some fantastic resources available.

Youtube Video

Wheeee, stitch and learn.

197 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 9:58:23pm

re: #187 jaunte

I doubt any of the visitors can afford to stay out there in Nevada a full week, so all the BLM has to do is wait a bit.

I think my favorite so far is the delusion that 1000 “patriots” can somehow “knock down” the American government. ROFL.

198 jaunte  Apr 12, 2014 9:58:28pm

re: #195 BeenHereAwhile

He bought me a beer once, but I think he’s been watching a little too much Fox News.

199 Lidane  Apr 12, 2014 10:02:50pm

Or 1,000 armed Latinos at an immigration rally. What would these “patriots” do then?

200 palomino  Apr 12, 2014 10:03:57pm

re: #195 BeenHereAwhile

You’d never guess that back in the day, Charlie supported Jimmy Carter for President.

Carter was a fairly devout evangelical Christian in those days. He may still be, I don’t know. Plus Daniels was from Georgia, like Carter. Those two things alone probably tipped the scales at least somewhat.

There’s also the fact that Daniels probably didn’t even know that Carter was very pro-civil rights, probably the most pro-civil rights governor in the south at the time.

201 palomino  Apr 12, 2014 10:04:38pm

re: #199 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Or 1,000 armed Latinos at an immigration rally. What would these “patriots” do then?

The “patriots” would mostly start shitting their Depends.

202 BeenHereAwhile  Apr 12, 2014 10:11:50pm

re: #164 NJDhockeyfan

Mmmmmm…I have Gerst Haus on my list of restaurants in Nashville I must visit before the summer is over.

Great restaurant.

203 goddamnedfrank  Apr 12, 2014 10:18:35pm

Profile of some guy who mentioned me.

Fighting against caucasiophobia, kuffarphobia, and Anti-Goyimism.

Yeah dude, we get it. You’re a fucking bigot.

204 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 12, 2014 10:28:49pm

re: #203 goddamnedfrank

kuffarphobia? Wazzat?

205 BeenHereAwhile  Apr 12, 2014 10:30:20pm

re: #198 jaunte

He bought me a beer once, but I think he’s been watching a little too much Fox News.

Oh, Charlie is still a genuine nice guy, he’s just gotten a little more extreme in his political views.

206 goddamnedfrank  Apr 12, 2014 10:44:43pm

re: #204 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

kuffarphobia? Wazzat?

Alternate spelling for Kafir. Literally means unbeliever in Arabic, mostly used to identify non-Muslims. Similar in use, but not actual literal meaning to Goyim in Hebrew, to identify non-Jews.

As distinguished from the term Heathen, which identifies people “not of the book.” Meaning people who are neither Christian, Jew, nor Muslim.

207 BeenHereAwhile  Apr 12, 2014 10:50:04pm

re: #200 palomino

Carter was a fairly devout evangelical Christian in those days. He may still be, I don’t know. Plus Daniels was from Georgia, like Carter. Those two things alone probably tipped the scales at least somewhat.

There’s also the fact that Daniels probably didn’t even know that Carter was very pro-civil rights, probably the most pro-civil rights governor in the south at the time.

Carter’s pro-civil rights stance was no secret during his presidential campaign.

As I’ve previously posted, Charlie is still a nice person. Unlike a lot of talent.

It’s just that those who have known Charlie since the 1970s, and didn’t make the same political transition, are kinda bemused by Charlie’s now public persona.

208 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 12, 2014 10:51:00pm

re: #206 goddamnedfrank

Alternate spelling for Kafir. Literally means unbeliever in Arabic, mostly used to identify non-Muslims. Similar in use, but not actual literal meaning to Goyim in Hebrew, to identify non-Jews.

As distinguished from the term Heathen, which identifies people “not of the book.” Meaning people who are neither Christian, Jew, nor Muslim.

OK, I thought that’s what it was, though from my time in South Africa, I think of a different meaning for kaffir. It’s the Afrikaner equivalent of the n-word.

209 Belafon  Apr 12, 2014 10:54:42pm

re: #199 Lidane

Actually, I believe Reagan showed what would happen if blacks showed up to protest.

210 Chrysicat  Apr 12, 2014 11:08:42pm
211 Chrysicat  Apr 12, 2014 11:18:34pm
212 Chrysicat  Apr 12, 2014 11:22:25pm
213 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 12, 2014 11:30:24pm

re: #212 Chrysicat

You trying to reason with the idiots? Good luck.

214 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 11:32:34pm
215 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 11:33:45pm

re: #213 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

You trying to reason with the idiots? Good luck.

Right wing nut jobs - the best technique is just to mock them mercilessly.

The goal of mocking is not change their minds, that’s just not possible or worth the effort. The goal is to isolate them, let them grow old and die, without being able to create any meaningful number of disciples.

216 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 11:36:53pm

re: #215 freetoken

Right wing nut jobs - the best technique is just to mock them mercilessly.

The goal of mocking is not change their minds, that’s just not possible or worth the effort. The goal is to isolate them, let them grow old and die, without being able to create any meaningful number of disciples.

Whats really great is when they whine about how they must be winning because they’re being mocked

“When you’re taking fire, you must be over the target!”

Or you walked into an ambush and got cut down because your dumbass is too dumb to fight effectively.

217 Single-handed sailor  Apr 12, 2014 11:39:20pm

re: #213 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

You trying to reason with the idiots? Good luck.

Drinking is easier on the brain cells./

218 Targetpractice  Apr 12, 2014 11:39:23pm

So the tyrannical government chose to put the safety of their agents first and left because they were being constantly harassed and confronted by armed nutjobs. Somehow I don’t think these wingnuts understand that if the government were as “evil” as they believe, it would have allowed them to ever puts its agents in danger in the first place.

219 Chrysicat  Apr 12, 2014 11:41:43pm

re: #215 freetoken

Right wing nut jobs - the best technique is just to mock them mercilessly.

The goal of mocking is not change their minds, that’s just not possible or worth the effort. The goal is to isolate them, let them grow old and die, without being able to create any meaningful number of disciples.

And specifically, the type of mocking in that Tweet. There are still a lot of people who might sympathize with the Right Wing in the wrong circumstances, but who are still sane enough to get upset when they realize that the wingnut’s answer to “What country do you live in?” is increasingly likely to not be “the USA”, but “Texas”, or “Arizona”, or “Virginia”. Get that idea out front of a moderate’s nose and they’re likely to be a lot less sympathetic to the TEAs.

THEN all that remains is to convince ‘em that a vote for anyone but the Dem in their local race is a vote for the TEAs.

220 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 11:46:11pm

re: #219 Chrysicat

The same people who want “STATES RIGHTS” for discrimination laws want the Feds to enforce their draconian drug laws, make Same Sex marriage illegal via Constitutional Amendment, and think that whole segments of the population should be arrested for immorality or failure to be “real Americans.”

Its never been about State Rights, its always been about their beliefs taking precedence over everyone else’s rights

221 Targetpractice  Apr 12, 2014 11:51:07pm

re: #220 Kragar

The same people who want “STATES RIGHTS” for discrimination laws want the Feds to enforce their draconian drug laws, make Same Sex marriage illegal via Constitutional Amendment, and think that whole segments of the population should be arrested for immorality or failure to be “real Americans.”

Its never been about State Rights, its always been about their beliefs taking precedence over everyone else’s rights

Ayep, all the way back to the days of the South screaming that the North was required to abide by the Fugitive Slave Act and that the federal government was likewise required to enforce it on Northern states that refused to do so.

222 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 11:51:16pm

re: #219 Chrysicat

Your conversation *cough* with that guy - if you look at whom he follows, it’s Bitcoin fanatics and Drudge, which is a fatal cocktail of stupid if there ever was one.

223 Chrysicat  Apr 12, 2014 11:53:34pm

re: #222 freetoken

Your conversation *cough* with that guy - if you look at whom he follows, it’s Bitcoin fanatics and Drudge, which is a fatal cocktail of stupid if there ever was one.

Oops. Sorry for wasting everyone’s time and Charles’s server space on that then :”>

224 Targetpractice  Apr 12, 2014 11:57:55pm

I’m still getting a serious undercurrent of disappointment from wingnuts about how the whole standoff ended, as if they were really hoping for an armed confrontation that turned into a shootout and are disappointed that it didn’t happen.

225 freetoken  Apr 12, 2014 11:58:55pm

I notice that Twitter just promoted a tweet by something called the “ConservativeTribune”:

WTF Twitter? Now promoting nut jobs?

226 Kragar  Apr 12, 2014 11:59:29pm

re: #225 freetoken

I notice that Twitter just promoted a tweet by something called the “ConservativeTribune”:

[Embedded content]

WTF Twitter? Now promoting nut jobs?

Anyone who pays the cash can get promoted

227 Kragar  Apr 13, 2014 12:06:27am

re: #224 Targetpractice

I’m still getting a serious undercurrent of disappointment from wingnuts about how the whole standoff ended, as if they were really hoping for an armed confrontation that turned into a shootout and are disappointed that it didn’t happen.

“How can we kick off the revolution if we cant get a massacre going?”

228 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 12:13:03am

re: #227 Kragar

“How can we kick off the revolution if we cant get a massacre going?”

Pretty much. They consider this a “victory,” but seem bummed that it came without a single shot being fired. They wanted another Waco or Ruby Ridge, if only to convince the less-committed that the government is the “real” bad guy.

229 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 12:24:32am

Just a reminder - the US does not have a monopoly on atavism:

Alberta homeschool convention offers creationist textbooks

[…]

For some parents, homeschooling fits better with their lifestyle than traditional schooling.

“For us, it was just a really good fit with our family and how we believed our children needed to learn,” said Coralee Mercer, a parent from Mundare, Alta., who has homeschooled her children for eight years.

Mercer says she has several children with learning challenges and she didn’t feel they were getting the help they needed in the public school system.

She also says the freedom to include creationism in the curriculum is appealing.

“I love the fact that I can take a subject — let’s say, for instance, biology, which some of our high school kids are doing right now — are being able to look at the creation side of things and discuss the opposite — the evolution side — and really look at that from our point of view and help our kids to explore it and to learn and to make educated decisions based on both sides.”

230 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 13, 2014 12:37:23am

re: #229 freetoken

Yet another example of People Who Just Don’t Get Science. Evolution is real; creationism is myth. Why not discuss how Prometheus brought fire to humanity vs. combustion in chem class?

231 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 12:43:49am

re: #224 Targetpractice

I’m still getting a serious undercurrent of disappointment from wingnuts about how the whole standoff ended, as if they were really hoping for an armed confrontation that turned into a shootout and are disappointed that it didn’t happen.

Of course. It’s the same sentiment we saw from Greenwald this weekend, shock and disappointment that the government didn’t do something insanely counter-productive. They both feel, somewhat correctly, that for the government to engage them head on as foes would legitimize their opposition.

Where the #BundyRanch supporters went off the rails was when they confined those 25 BLM agents at that motel, barricading them in with vehicles and not allowing them to drive away. That action met every criteria for a federal kidnapping charge, and we may well see arrests and prosecutions for that in the future. But that will happen on the government’s schedule, when they feel like it, not now with an armed militia so unscrupulous that many of them brought young children to the standoff.

232 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 13, 2014 1:10:02am

re: #231 goddamnedfrank

Of course. It’s the same sentiment we saw from Greenwald this weekend, shock and disappointment that the government didn’t do something insanely counter-productive. They both feel, somewhat correctly, that for the government to engage them head on as foes would legitimize their opposition.

Where the #BundyRanch supporters went off the rails was when they confined those 25 BLM agents at that motel, barricading them in with vehicles and not allowing them to drive away. That action met every criteria for a federal kidnapping charge, and we may well see arrests and prosecutions for that in the future. But that will happen on the government’s schedule, when they feel like it, not now with an armed militia so unscrupulous that many of them brought young children to the standoff.

The clock is ticking …

These are the same people who fear the government is spying on their every move, yet strut around defying federal LEOs in full view of said LEOs. I’d bet none of them bothered to obscure their license tags, too.

233 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 1:27:46am
234 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 1:41:43am

Executive Order 12548 — Grazing Fees

Ronald Reagan
The White House,
February 14, 1986

235 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 1:50:31am

re: #233 Amory Blaine

Forget Obamacare
Vermont wants to bring single payer to America

[…] The administrative savings of a single-payer system do come at a price. Single payer requires the government to make difficult decisions about what benefits they will and won’t cover — and often leave out pretty standard medical services, […]

DEATH PANELS!!!

236 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 1:51:09am

re: #225 freetoken

I notice that Twitter just promoted a tweet by something called the “ConservativeTribune”:

[Embedded content]

WTF Twitter? Now promoting nut jobs?

Twitter doesn’t decide which tweets to promote. It’s a service that they make money off of. You pay them money and in return the tweet gets “promoted” which makes it visible in the timeline of people that aren’t following you.

237 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 1:54:23am

Does anybody have a link to a specific, concise article regarding the #BundyRanch claim about Harry Reid and the Chinese solar farm? I’m fairly certain it’s bullshit. I’ve heard that the project was cancelled and never involved the grazing land Bundy’s using in the first place, but don’t have anything authoritative yet.

238 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 1:55:29am

re: #237 goddamnedfrank

All I’ve seen are a lot of claims with no proof.

239 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 1:59:47am

Earlier this week NPR’s Fresh Air had Bart Ehrman as a guest, plugging his latest book How Jesus Became God: The Exaltation of a Jewish Preacher from Galilee , complete with long form interview:

If Jesus Never Called Himself God, How Did He Become One?

It’s the usual Bart Ehrman interview, which I find to be frustrating in some regards (e.g., I think Ehrman should focus his language to be more accurate, even if technical language will challenge some listeners), and I think he over-simplifies and presents assumptions as facts at times, but at least NPR “goes there”:

MP3 Audio

Not unexpectedly, the usual sources are have harrumphs about NPR being government funded and they ought not be so anti-Christian, blah blah blah.

I suspect Ehrman will never show up as a guest on duck hunting shows.

240 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 2:02:28am

re: #238 Amory Blaine

All I’ve seen are a lot of claims with no proof.

It’d be nice if we could chase this one down and kill it with fire.

241 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 2:03:03am

re: #237 goddamnedfrank

Well, can we get any more authoritative than Jerome Corsi and WND?

wnd.com

242 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 2:08:04am

re: #238 Amory Blaine

All I’ve seen are a lot of claims with no proof.

Same here. Far as I can tell, it’s the usual “six degrees of Kevin Bacon” BS, where Reid is guilty by association. But you’ll notice none of these conspiracy theories explain why the courts ruled against Bundy twice, or can explain why it’s taken the BLM 20 years to make a move if they had such a hard-on for getting Bundy’s land for a solar farm.

243 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 2:08:29am

re: #240 goddamnedfrank

Sifting…

244 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 2:13:56am
245 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 2:17:52am

Here’s a map that supposedly shows all major solar projects in the US, color coded for operating, under construction & in development, and shape coded for photovoltaic vs concentrating (solar furnace) designs.

You can click on the shape and find information on the project, but since this area of NV and CA has a shit-ton of projects they’re represented by a confusing bunch of overlapping shapes.

Here’s a .pdf with the various nationwide projects listed, but again there’s a decent number to sift through and you can’t sort it by state or county.

246 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 2:20:07am

Right wing circles around this BLM “pulled” document “Cattle Trespass Impacts”. Gateway, freep, infowars you name it they all have the same article.

247 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 2:22:23am

Here we go. Looks like the project was killed middle of last year.

China’ s ENN Group nixes $6B Nevada solar project

The Chinese-owned Mojave Energy LLC has terminated plans to build a $6 billion solar project near Laughlin, Nevada after failing to find a buyer for the electricity.

248 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 2:23:49am

20 fucking years ago there were no plans for solar farms in Nevada. How do they explain the original charges?

249 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 2:24:49am

re: #248 Amory Blaine

20 fucking years ago there were no plans for solar farms in Nevada. How do they explain the original charges?

Time Travel - Area 51 and all that…

250 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 2:26:00am

re: #248 Amory Blaine

20 fucking years ago there were no plans for solar farms in Nevada. How do they explain the original charges?

They don’t. Or they try to make up some BS about how BLM has been trying to seize the land to see the mineral and water rights to private companies. One I’ve talked to is convinced that the BLM changed the rules back in ‘93 not to deal with dwindling resources and damage to the land, but because they wanted to put Bundy’s neighbors out of business.

251 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 2:27:11am
252 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 2:27:37am

Putin’s Russian : Crimea :: Bundy’s “Patriots” : Wild West

MP3 Audio

253 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 2:42:59am

re: #251 goddamnedfrank

I replied to your tweet… and got Bircher response.

No wonder I stay away from twitter.

254 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 2:53:19am

Fucking nutjobs.

255 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 2:58:28am
256 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 3:05:03am

re: #255 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

You mean unarmed federal agents fear armed nutjobs threatening their lives? Whodathunkit?

257 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 3:13:53am

re: #255 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

There is it, in a nutshell.

Dollard’s type will never feel powerful themselves. It’s all about the gunz.

Nice gun, sorry about your dick.

258 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 3:16:14am

re: #253 freetoken

I replied to your tweet… and got Bircher response.

No wonder I stay away from twitter.

Yep, I saw that. These people are want to deliberately reinforce with horribly biased sources. Took him to school. He at least seems willing to reading Fort Leavenworth decision. Linked him to wiki page on the Federal Enclave history and SC decision.

259 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 3:18:12am

The bar for #winning! is pretty low. He still owes the money.

260 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 3:19:00am

These guys are clinically insane.

261 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 3:20:30am

re: #257 Justanotherhuman

There is it, in a nutshell.

Dollard’s type will never feel powerful themselves. It’s all about the gunz.

Nice gun, sorry about your dick.

What they’ll take away from yesterday is the ill-informed belief that all they have to do in the future to fight off the government is just arm themselves and be as belligerent as possible. And to grab as many of their buddies they can to bring their own guns so as to outnumber the government agents.

Of course, the reality is that one of these days, they really are gonna find themselves in a situation where the government refuses to back down. Then they’re gonna do something stupid, somebody’s gonna get shot, and then the government really will clamp down on them.

262 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 3:26:14am

re: #260 goddamnedfrank

These guys are clinically insane.

[Embedded content]

That’s dogma to them: When the Supreme Court disagrees with their reading of the Constitution, then it’s because the Supreme Court has no authority to decide the constitutionality of laws. And they, of course, base this on the tired “It’s not in the Constitution, so it’s not legal!” BS.

263 Dr Lizardo  Apr 13, 2014 3:27:32am

re: #260 goddamnedfrank

These guys are clinically insane.

[Embedded content]

lolwut?

SCOTUS isn’t supposed to decide the constitutionality of laws?! Funniest shit I’ve heard all week ever.

*headdesk*

264 goddamnedfrank  Apr 13, 2014 3:29:06am

re: #263 Dr Lizardo

lolwut?

SCOUTS isn‘t supposed to decide the constitutionality of laws?! Funniest shit I’ve heard all week >ever.

*headdesk*

Yep, they’re still trying to overturn Marbury vs. Madison, 211 years later.

Keep fucking that chicken!

265 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 3:30:56am

I haven’t played in Drudge’s yard for many moons but uh, he’s headlining infowars on his page.

266 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 3:36:47am

re: #260 goddamnedfrank

These guys are clinically insane.

[Embedded content]

Which is why “arguing” with them is often fruitless.

Repeating what I wrote earlier, I believe mocking them is the only course. In due time they will die off, in the hope the more reasonable among us will be able to convince the youngsters to not follow the fools’ path.

267 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 3:37:16am

re: #265 Amory Blaine

I haven’t played in Drudge’s yard for many moons but uh, he’s headlining infowars on his page.

He’s done that quite a bit for a few years now.

268 Lidane  Apr 13, 2014 3:37:31am

re: #255 Amory Blaine

Yep. Because Bundy no longer owes money. And he’s now miraculously won every case in court. And he’s free and clear to do what he wants because the BLM didn’t want to risk getting their people killed by these nutjobs.

WTF.

269 Amory Blaine  Apr 13, 2014 3:40:11am

re: #268 Lidane

Youtube Video

270 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 3:46:36am
271 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 3:47:39am

Tweets can he harmful to teens’ futures

And to adults who are still juvenile, too.

272 Targetpractice  Apr 13, 2014 3:55:28am

re: #268 Lidane

Yep. Because Bundy no longer owes money. And he’s now miraculously won every case in court. And he’s free and clear to do what he wants because the BLM didn’t want to risk getting their people killed by these nutjobs.

WTF.

I wonder what good those guns are gonna do them when BLM simply files in court to have Bundy’s assets frozen and a lien put on his property for the unpaid fines? What good its going to do him when he can’t buy groceries, fuel up his truck, or pay his bills because all the money made off his cattle is going to pay the fees he’s tried to duck out on for 20 years?

273 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 3:55:55am

Newswires constantly pour out poorly written stories, amongst others which may be better quality. This morning’s Reuter’s story about the latest IPCC is not among the “better quality”:

Act fast to curb global warming, or extract CO2 from air - U.N.

So many inaccurate, misleading, or just illogical parts.

Consider this one paragraph, just two sentences:

Oil and gas firms say they are tackling global warming. On March 31, Exxon Mobil Corp said that all energy sources, including fossil fuels, had to be exploited to meet growing world demand.

You think the writer/editor could have included a “However” at the beginning of the second sentence, no?

274 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 4:02:27am

I just got hit by the old fanbox scam via junk mail.

Old scams never die, they just find a host server.

275 Lidane  Apr 13, 2014 4:04:24am

re: #272 Targetpractice

I wonder what good those guns are gonna do them when BLM simply files in court to have Bundy’s assets frozen and a lien put on his property for the unpaid fines? What good its going to do him when he can’t buy groceries, fuel up his truck, or pay his bills because all the money made off his cattle is going to pay the fees he’s tried to duck out on for 20 years?

When Bundy gets his assets frozen and a lien for his time, I would expect a series of RWNJ griftathons all over teh intertubes to pay for a sovereign citizen lawyer to try and beat the gubmint.

Should be fun.

276 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 4:05:40am

I see things have fallen apart quickly in Slaviansk, Ukraine. Contrast to how responsibly the BLM has handled the Bundy Bunch.

277 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 4:17:57am

re: #276 freetoken

I see things have fallen apart quickly in Slaviansk, Ukraine. Contrast to how responsibly the BLM has handled the Bundy Bunch.

Special forces sent to retake buildings in eastern Ukraine; pro-Russians open fire - @AP

1 Ukrainian state security service officer killed, 5 others wounded in ‘anti-terrorist’ operation in Slaviansk, eastern Ukraine, interior minister says - @Reuters
end of alert

278 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 4:21:24am

Hardly despair…just your troops posing as Ukrainians.

279 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 4:27:28am
280 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 5:10:46am

MERS kills foreigner in Saudi Arabia

Foreign man dies of deadly coronavirus in Saudi Arabia, as neighbouring Yemen reports its first case of the disease.

aljazeera.com

More about this highly transmittable, and deadly, virus; this isn’t the first report of it in the ME. There is no vaccine, and it’s not known how widely it could possibly be spread since there have been no “epidemics” reported thus far.

nejm.org

And another report from the CDC.

cdc.gov

281 lawhawk  Apr 13, 2014 5:32:12am

re: #260 goddamnedfrank

Marbury v. Madison simply doesn’t exist. The Supreme Court doesn’t exist. The strong federal government doesn’t exist. We need to revert to the Articles of Confederation, and the South should Rise Again.

Yeah, that pretty much sums up their combined worldview.

And these people will stop at nothing to provoke a crisis, and get a whole lot of innocent people killed - innocent people who are actually enforcing the laws of the state and country.

Laws that apply to everyone. Laws like herding fees for the right to graze herds on federal lands.

282 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 5:45:33am

The hate right is in full sail this weekend:

Derbyshire is going on about the hypocrisy of Jews, the wonders of eugenics and the importance of protecting his race.

Taki is equating Kanye and Kim K. with the Boston bombers.

The difference between those two and the Bundy’s is that Derb and Taki know more words with more syllables.

283 freetoken  Apr 13, 2014 5:47:59am

Oh, and this is happening on the What Theocracy? front:

Bill would name the Bible as Louisiana state book

Lawmakers are moving ahead with a proposal to name the Bible as Louisiana’s official state book, despite concerns the bill would land the Legislature in court.

A House municipal committee advanced the bill Thursday with an 8-5 vote, sending it to the full House for debate.

[…]

284 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 13, 2014 5:54:18am

re: #260 goddamnedfrank

These guys are clinically insane.

They get this idea from their literal interpretation of the Constitution, and total rejection of the Marshall court’s interpretation that judicial oversight is a necessary check against laws being unconstitutional. It’s an interpretation that’s nearly as old as the republic, and only nutjobs question its validity.

Of course, when SCOTUS rules in their favor, it’s all A-OK.

285 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 13, 2014 5:58:53am

re: #283 freetoken

Y’know, naming the Bible as Louisiana’s state book would suggest to thinking people that Louisianianianians are saying they wrote the Bible. Usually, states adopt a state whatever when that whatever is native to the state.

286 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 6:03:44am

re: #285 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

Y’know, naming the Bible as Louisiana’s state book would suggest to thinking people that Louisianianianians are saying they wrote the Bible. Usually, states adopt a state whatever when that whatever is native to the state.

Nawnsainse! Every raht-thinkin’ Amurrican is gonna know that it was done becuz o hayw it sarves as the very RAwK upon which all ci-vi-ly-ZAY-shun is based. We aren’t asserting that we wrote it—everyone KNOWS GAWD did thayut!

287 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 6:08:22am

This is a story I missed over the last year or so, but which, I think, gives you a rather interesting inside look at the mind of some of those RWNJ types we’ve been discussing, many of whom sound just a step away from this POS. And, BTW, both the Millerbergs had been sexually active with this 16 yr old babysitter who had multiple issues of her own, including drug use, before the night of her murder. These people, including the registered nurse wife, were scum who took advantage of a 16 yr old minor and killed her. This woman, who has taken great pains to try to make herself look like an innocent bystander, was a full participant but testified against her husband both to make herself look good and to try to mitigate her own role. Their 2 children should not be allowed anywhere near either of them. I hope Millerberg has to serve every single day for the rest of his life and that his wife follows in his footsteps, as she has done for the entirety of their “marriage”, knowing he was a 7 time felon and what he was about.

Five to life sentence for Millerberg in death of 16-year-old babysitter

standard.net

Revealed at sentencing was this little factoid:

“Shaw also revealed that Millerberg was a member of the Silent Aryan Warriors prison gang, something that had not been discussed in open court.”

288 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 6:09:42am

Long time lurker, first time poster.
Hello Lizards.
I suppose, given the strangeness of our times, my first comment should come at this time. Ukraine under stress from Russia and the Homeland (which isn’t my own, I should add) is threatened by elements any sane person would be wary of.
The first time I became aware of this site was back in 2004 and as I was a frequenter of antiwar.com, much of the content was considered to be Bush Admin-friendly and so it was not a place that I travelled in.
Time capsule: one of Antiwar’s columnists, Justin Raimondo, pedalled the line that the Orange Revolution was a US coup and that Yukashenko’s facial blotching was a false flag of some sort and not a kind of poisoning that, as it has become apparent, Russian agents are capable of perpetuating. I believed that horseshit.
Before I had come of political maturity, such conspiracy theories were my bread and butter. Anything that painted the Bush Admin in a criminal light, I lapped up with relish.
Skip forward. ANYONE who makes the argument that the United States cannot take a principled stand on the standard of democracy and freedom in the world in a post Iraq-invasion world are wrong, precisely because it can elect new leaders. No nation is without tarnish. Only a few can redeem themselves.
If Germany can, the US has already.
If there is any hope in America, a country I have come to love warts and all, it is to be found in the individuals who live there. LGF is a success story in the evolution of an ideal. nothing is perfect until it can accommodate change. I have learned, from this community the kind of thinking that actually takes society forward. That it exists in the virtual sense only, at times, should not be considered a setback.
In the past I have trucked in libertarianism assuming that it stood for my hopes for social justice but this illusion has been destroyed by my exposure to your ideas of how a democratic entity must exist in a real politik state.
The weaknesses of democracy must be tempered by an involved population.
My current government has been described as Tea Party-ish in persuasion.
Pro-rich mining and media interests.
Socially constrictive.
Austerity-oriented.
Pro-faith.
Anti-environment.
Anti-poor &c.

Even this government I disagree with on a policy basis has been undermined by the Snowden issue and so my country’s surveillance of our nearest neighbour has been revealed, damaging a relationship that otherwise would have mutual benefits in an effort against terrorism even if it requires mutual espionage.
LGF is ahead of the 8-Ball on this issue and Charles Johnson’s recent treatment of the Heartbleed problem is emblematic of this site’s dedication to freedom and security.
Furthermore, the other blogs… (shudder)
Hats off to you guys. I’ll forward the cakes and coffee as soon as we get the fucking bandwidth :D

289 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 13, 2014 6:20:53am

re: #288 Alyosha

We were too busy reveling in the demise of the USSR to realize that it had created a whole passel of problems that would not raise their ugly heads for years or decades.

The USSR did not begin to address the issue of the millions of Russians how living outside the borders of Russia: under the Soviet regime, it was merely an administrative issue.

Nor did it address the issues of trade, dividing up national assets, etc., which were simply left lying about for the oligarchs to seize in the ensuring chaotic political climate.

290 Lidane  Apr 13, 2014 6:25:44am

Lolwut:

291 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 13, 2014 6:27:42am
292 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 6:28:51am

re: #289 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

I agree, it was slightly before my time, but it’s interesting to note Russia’s recent rise in confidence. Putin’s rising from the death of term limits. Georgia before that and now Crimea and now Ukraine writ large. It is like others have pointed out that this is akin to the breakup of the Ottoman Empire under Western ‘management’.
My issue is the use of the political ‘Danzig Corridor’ ploy.
shiiiiiiiiiiiit…. have I Godwinned already?

293 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 6:30:20am

And it appears that Russian-led, pro-Russian segments in eastern Ukraine are attempting to block others and isolate themselves.

294 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 6:31:42am

The issue being the arbitrary borders imposed on Near Eastern nations by European colonial powers, if I wasn’t clear.

295 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 6:38:07am

re: #294 Alyosha

The issue being the arbitrary borders imposed on Near Eastern nations by European colonial powers, if I wasn’t clear.

The problem with that analogy is that no Western nation imposed borders on any part of the Soviet Union. It carved itself up, then implanted Russian majorities and near-majorities in the areas that had been carved off.

Sure, it was positive that those different jurisdictional boundaries would never mean anything, but it set them up. And before they started exporting Russians to outer Soviet republics, those were the natural boundaries of where-a-nation-would-be-reasonable-because-the-vast-majority-of-people-there-were-of-that-nation.

296 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 6:39:23am
297 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 13, 2014 6:40:05am
298 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 6:40:26am

re: #282 freetoken

The hate right is in full sail this weekend:

Derbyshire is going on about the hypocrisy of Jews, the wonders of eugenics and the importance of protecting his race.

Taki is equating Kanye and Kim K. with the Boston bombers.

The difference between those two and the Bundy’s is that Derb and Taki know more words with more syllables.

I know that some people can’t stand the Kardashian family, but damn! I also have to throw this in there, just because.

299 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 6:42:39am

re: #295 Chrysicat

I just realised where my analogy was off. Call this question utterly naive, but does that mean the breakup of the USSR was a kind of gerrymandering for the future payoff of the Russian state? If so then I seriously need to reconsider, a lot.

300 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 6:43:41am

re: #292 Alyosha

I agree, it was slightly before my time, but it’s interesting to note Russia’s recent rise in confidence. Putin’s rising from the death of term limits. Georgia before that and now Crimea and now Ukraine writ large. It is like others have pointed out that this is akin to the breakup of the Ottoman Empire under Western ‘management’.
My issue is the use of the political ‘Danzig Corridor’ ploy.
shiiiiiiiiiiiit…. have I Godwinned already?

No. Reviewing a current situation as it can be related to the run-up to and beginning of World War II is not a Godwin unless Adolf Hitler is specifically brought into the picture.

301 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 6:47:05am

re: #298 Dark_Falcon

I know that some people can’t stand the Kardashian family, but damn! I also have to throw this in there, just because.

Yeah, even teenagers can be pretentious as hell. And wrong.

302 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 13, 2014 6:48:00am
303 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 6:48:17am

Tiny crowd for a city of 700,000…

304 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 6:49:43am

re: #300 Dark_Falcon

I know only enough to say that after WWI that the corridor was granted as per treaty to Poland so that they had access to the sea. Alleged persecution of ethnic Germans was the casus belli for expansionism and that, I guess has been the rationale for Moscow in posting its military along the border. The hitherto unproven rough treatment of ethnic Russians.
And hi D_F

305 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 6:53:54am

re: #304 Alyosha

I know only enough to say that after WWI that the corridor was granted as per treaty to Poland so that they had access to the sea. Alleged persecution of ethnic Germans was the casus belli for expansionism and that, I guess has been the rationale for Moscow in posting its military along the border. The hitherto unproven rough treatment of ethnic Russians.
And hi D_F

Actually, in the case of Poland the casus belli was a series of false flag attacks on Germany by the SS that were blamed on Poland. The worst of these was a train station bombing that killed 22 people.

306 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 6:56:40am

re: #305 Dark_Falcon

Actually, in the case of Poland the casus belli was a series of false flag attacks on Germany by the SS that were blamed on Poland. The worst of these was a train station bombing that killed 22 people.

Think we might expect that sort of thing from the FSB inside Russia, or will they just stick with “The people in all of (the!) Ukraine that isn’t Kyiv are Russians and want to live in Russia!” and not pull any false-flag attacks on their own territory?

307 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 6:59:41am

re: #301 Justanotherhuman

Yeah, even teenagers can be pretentious as hell. And wrong.

I only threw in that DM piece because it’s something I do with freetoken sometimes. Not that you’re wrong though. But my main point stands: However DERPy they are, comparing Kim Kardashian and Kanye West to the Boston bombers is unfathomable. I don’t understand how someone can make that comparison, even if they’re a racist asshole.

308 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 7:00:46am

re: #306 Chrysicat

Think we might expect that sort of thing from the FSB inside Russia, or will they just stick with “The people in all of (the!) Ukraine that isn’t Kyiv are Russians and want to live in Russia!” and not pull any false-flag attacks on their own territory?

Likely not. They may stage a false flag attack, but most likely it will be on Ukrainian soil.

309 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 7:01:43am

re: #305 Dark_Falcon

I recall reading about the pioneer regiments and how they conducted such terroristic attacks on territories Nazi Germany wished to occupy. Perhaps I misremember the justification of annexation of another nation with the pretext of ethnic persecution in western Czechoslovakia.

310 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:01:44am

I am kind of surprised that Putin is willing to enervate the whole displaced nationalities thing. If he does, he’ll have a lot more trouble at the fringes of his empire than whatever he can gain from The Ukraine.

311 Killgore Trout  Apr 13, 2014 7:03:04am

The fact checking craze is sweeping the planet!
Fact-checking journalism gains momentum

Following the notoriety in the United States, similar fact-checking news organizations have sprung up on every continent, gaining attention in places ranging from Egypt to Australia, Chile and France, according to a Duke University study.

The study led by Bill Adair, a Duke faculty member who was a founder of PolitiFact at the Tampa Bay Times, identified 59 fact-checking groups globally, of which more than 15 are in the United States.

“It really surprised me how much fact-checking is going on around the world,” Adair told AFP.

“I had no idea there was this much, particularly in places such as Eastern Europe. These sites are using fact-checking and are holding politicians accountable for their promises. It’s really become a strong movement in journalism.”

Recognizing the growth, the Poynter Institute journalism school has organized the first global fact-checking summit, to be held in June in London.

“Fact-checking is quickly becoming an important new form of accountability journalism,” said Poynter president Tim Franklin.

“Poynter will play a leading role to help journalists do their best work and foster the growth of fact-checking, which is vital to democracies around the world.”

312 Dr Lizardo  Apr 13, 2014 7:03:56am

re: #305 Dark_Falcon

Actually, in the case of Poland the casus belli was a series of false flag attacks on Germany by the SS that were blamed on Poland. The worst of these was a train station bombing that killed 22 people.

I always thought it was the Gleiwitz Incident, part of Operation Himmler, but in terms of body count, yes, the train station bombing was certainly the worst.

313 BongCrodny  Apr 13, 2014 7:04:32am

re: #288 Alyosha

Long time lurker, first time poster.

I see no one broke out the traditional greeting yet, so…welcome, hatchling.

315 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 13, 2014 7:07:55am

re: #292 Alyosha

I agree, it was slightly before my time, but it’s interesting to note Russia’s recent rise in confidence. Putin’s rising from the death of term limits. Georgia before that and now Crimea and now Ukraine writ large. It is like others have pointed out that this is akin to the breakup of the Ottoman Empire under Western ‘management’.
My issue is the use of the political ‘Danzig Corridor’ ploy.
shiiiiiiiiiiiit…. have I Godwinned already?

I wondered why the USSR did not address these issues in 1991, then it became clear. Had they done so back then, Russia would have been compelled to make a lot of concessions, as they would have been negotiating from a position of weakness.

So they just let things fall apart.

But then after chaos reigned for nearly a decade, the Russian people welcomed a strong authoritarian leader who was in a better position to reconstruct the old Russian Empire under much more favorable terms.

316 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 7:12:25am

re: #315 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

That’s what escaped my attention for so long. I imagined that the breakup was actually facilitated by various nationalistic groups because, I mean, just look at the Baltic states and I thought know Ukrainian could ever forget the Holodomor. As always, its a bit more complicated than that.

317 Dr Lizardo  Apr 13, 2014 7:12:27am

BBL

318 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 7:12:31am

re: #315 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

I wondered why the USSR did not address these issues in 1991, then it became clear. Had they done so back then, they would have been compelled to make a lot of concessions, as they would have been negotiating from a position of weakness.

So they just let things fall apart.

But then after chaos reigned for nearly a decade, the Russian people welcomed a strong authoritarian leader who was in a better position to reconstruct the old Russian Empire under much more favorable terms.

Interesting, isn’t it? It’s almost like, if not landed on with both feet or, alternately, actively rehabilitated, it’s inevitable that the loser of a world-spanning conflict will be able to rebuild its strength in approximately 20 years, and then pose an even greater threat to world stability than it did before its first defeat…

…and it may have been inevitable with the Soviet/Russians (you’ve heard they declared the USSR breakup illegal, right? Does that mean officially they’re the Soviet Union again?). Between our Cold War arming and fighting the Gulf War, we were too economically weak to do a New Marshall Plan, and Russia probably would have first-struck before allowing us to land on her with both feet.

319 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 7:13:19am

re: #313 BongCrodny

That means a lot, thanks!

320 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 13, 2014 7:13:59am
321 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 13, 2014 7:14:39am

re: #316 Alyosha

Recall that the Russian minorities were a pampered group in the old Soviet republics: they had access to the best jobs and education. Now they have lost their privileges, and in some cases, even their right to vote.

322 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 7:16:57am

Added a little something to my #318 to make a more complete point…

323 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 7:17:31am

re: #309 Alyosha

I recall reading about the pioneer regiments and how they conducted such terroristic attacks on territories Nazi Germany wished to occupy. Perhaps I misremember the justification of annexation of another nation with the pretext of ethnic persecution in western Czechoslovakia.

One thing to be clear was that the SS personnel in question used the title of pioneeren as a cover. “Pioneer” as used by the Germany army during both World Wars meant ‘combat engineer’. Such units were part of the normal order of battle and did not behave especially badly.

What you may be thinking of are the Brandenburgers, who were German special forces troops.

324 b.d.  Apr 13, 2014 7:19:59am

The Intercept

Staff of 14 deadbeat Dudebros
$200 Million funding from Sugar-daddy
Paid junkets to Europe and North America for employees and families
Built on free Wordpress skeleton
Last word printed on website, over a week ago, April 4, 2014

Not a bad gig considering…

325 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:20:12am

re: #323 Dark_Falcon

One thing to be clear was that the SS personnel in question used the title of pioneeren as a cover. “Pioneer” as used by the Germany army during both World Wars meant ‘combat engineer’. Such units were part of the normal order of battle and did not behave especially badly.

What you may be thinking of are the Brandenburgers, who were German special forces troops.

You might want to reconsider that “did not behave especially badly”. No units of the Wehrmacht were immune from behaving especially badly.

326 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 7:20:36am

re: #323 Dark_Falcon

You’re right, the ‘pioneer’ I had in mind were those used by the SS for nefarious purposes. All combat engineers seem to be apolitical professionals in the course of conflict otherwise.

327 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:20:44am

…Or maybe the bar was set so low.

328 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:22:42am

Field Marshall Erich von Manstein tried to insist he had no interest in the especially bad behavior committed by the SS, but the record showed that he was continuously diverting troops to assist the SS in its especially bad behavior.

329 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 7:22:49am

re: #324 b.d.

The Intercept

Staff of 14 deadbeat Dudebros
$200 Million funding from Sugar-daddy
Paid junkets to Europe and North America for employees and families
Built on free Wordpress skeleton
Last word printed on website, over a week ago, April 4, 2014

Not a bad gig considering…

Well, in their defense, I don’t even have my RussiaToady domains properly parked yet. These startups can take a while!
//
Though, admittedly, I’m going to be running with basically no funds until/unless some angel investor sees the site once it’s live and swoops in to boost us up… :-P

330 Alyosha  Apr 13, 2014 7:24:43am

re: #321 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

Another thing which might be considered self-evident, given the nature of nation-state breakdowns. I mean, consider the absolute extreme of European-favoured Tutsi administrators in Rwanda and how that resentment festered.
That’s an extreme but I take your point.

331 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 13, 2014 7:29:31am

re: #325 SteveMcGazi

You might want to reconsider that “did not behave especially badly”. No units of the Wehrmacht were immune from behaving especially badly.

This is the result of a certain official talking point that was developed when the Allies reconstructed a German Army in the 1950’s: former Waffen SS officers were not allowed, as they were bad boys, but former regular army officers were okay because they were just good Germans doing their patriotic duty…

The distinction is much more nuanced than that: there were Waffen SS units that fought honorably and regular army units that committed atrocities, but this arbitrary line still looms over the historical debate.

332 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:29:36am

I can just imagine the phone call between President Obama and Dictator Putin: “You know Vlad, it really won’t be that hard for us to mobilize all of the separatists inside your own borders. Are you really sure you’ve thought this thing through?”

333 BongCrodny  Apr 13, 2014 7:29:43am

re: #329 Chrysicat

Well, in their defense, I don’t even have my RussiaToady domains properly parked yet. These startups can take a while!

Works for me!

334 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 7:30:11am

re: #325 SteveMcGazi

You might want to reconsider that “did not behave especially badly”. No units of the Wehrmacht were immune from behaving especially badly.

Behaving especially badly for that particular army, it perhaps should read. But I’m not going to change it, because trying to add in too much qualification robs a post of any punch and makes it less readable.

335 b.d.  Apr 13, 2014 7:32:08am

Pierre: Hey Glenn, how you hired all of your Dudebro friends and all with my money? That was a good thing you did, a really good thing.

Glenn: What’s your point? I have dogs to feed.

Pierre: Do you guys plan on like, doing anything with the website?

Glenn: Do you want for me to write about EBAY and the NSA Pierre?!?!

Pierre: No, no, no but c’mon. I’ve got a lot of money invested in you, how about exposing some other stuff or have the guys getting my money write something sometimes?

Glenn: Don’t tell me what to do and don’t bother me again you prick.

/click

336 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 7:32:17am

re: #333 BongCrodny

Oh, my. I didn’t know that. Unfortunately, my best friend-who-happens-to-be-a-webdev is engaged with actual paying products until early May, so it’ll only be going to the parking site for now.

Though I think that this will stay topical for long enough that I have a shot at making hay still… :-|

337 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:32:54am

When we needed a new Bundeswehr to counterbalance the Warsaw Pact, the only reason we didn’t want the real SS soldiers is because they had to much baggage. They were the worst of the worst. I guess you needed to put in some air quotes (is there an internet of text thingy for air quotes, or just a sarc tag?) around the patriotic duty bit.

338 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 7:34:41am

I would just offer a suggestion that differentiating part of the German Army in WW2 that didn’t behave as badly as somebody else is probably a road not worth driving.

339 BongCrodny  Apr 13, 2014 7:34:59am

re: #336 Chrysicat

Oh, my. I didn’t know that. Unfortunately, my best friend-who-happens-to-be-a-webdev is engaged with actual paying products until early May, so it’ll only be going to the parking site for now.

Though I think that this will stay topical for long enough that I have a shot at making hay still… :-|

Sorry, should have explained myself.

I thought that was just a typo, but I like it when a typo seems more appropriate than the correct spelling.

If that was your intention all along…awesome. ;-)

340 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 7:37:05am

re: #339 BongCrodny

Sorry, should have explained myself.

I thought that was just a typo, but I like it when a typo seems more appropriate than the correct spelling.

If that was your intention all along…awesome. ;-)

Oh, yeah, that’s part of the intent.

Though there’ll be plenty of reminders that it’s a parody site. I want to give Putin an ulcer, not earn a polonium enema. :-)

341 Eventual Carrion  Apr 13, 2014 7:39:24am

re: #155 Lidane

[Embedded content]


…not a citizen of the US,..

FREEDOM!

An illegal using public government assets. JAIL AND THEN DEPORT HIS ASS.

Edit: I also hope he isn’t voting, not being a citizen and all.

342 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 13, 2014 7:48:16am
343 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 7:58:08am
344 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 8:03:15am

re: #307 Dark_Falcon

I only threw in that DM piece because it’s something I do with freetoken sometimes. Not that you’re wrong though. But my main point stands: However DERPy they are, comparing Kim Kardashian and Kanye West to the Boston bombers is unfathomable. I don’t understand how someone can make that comparison, even if they’re a racist asshole.

Appropriating someone else’s culture/religion as a fashion statement (like the bindi), is just so wrong. And Gomez has been asked to stop wearing it by Hindu folks.

And, I wouldn’t have been caught dead in a pair of ripped, faded jeans (no one would have unless they worked in the fields) when I was a teenager. We may have been poor, but we wanted something better.

345 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 8:12:25am

re: #344 Justanotherhuman

Appropriating someone else’s culture/religion as a fashion statement (like the bindi), is just so wrong. And Gomez has been asked to stop wearing it by Hindu folks.

And, I wouldn’t have been caught dead in a pair of ripped, faded jeans (no one would have unless they worked in the fields) when I was a teenager. We may have been poor, but we wanted something better.

Yeah, but that second paragraph has basically been what even my 65-year-old mother’s peers might have worn at that age, and remained popular ever since. Well, not so much her peers, but that was Portland being 8-10 years behind the rest of the country for pop culture and fashion; she didn’t even meet her first hippie, or so she claims, until Dad was in grad school at AFIT…

346 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 8:16:02am

re: #344 Justanotherhuman

Appropriating someone else’s culture/religion as a fashion statement (like the bindi), is just so wrong. And Gomez has been asked to stop wearing it by Hindu folks.

And, I wouldn’t have been caught dead in a pair of ripped, faded jeans (no one would have unless they worked in the fields) when I was a teenager. We may have been poor, but we wanted something better.

_______________________________________________________________

The congregation—perhaps 400 strong and, again, two-thirds female—was all black. The congregants were dressed in all their finery, immaculately turned out in elegant hats and dazzling dresses; the older among them wore veils and gloves. Some might be inclined to laugh at this quaint sartorial echo of the respectability of a bygone age; but I learned long ago, when I practiced briefly in the townships of South Africa, that the yearning of poor people for respectability, their desire to appear clean and well-dressed in public, is not laughable in the least but is, on the contrary, something noble and inspiring. It is the prerogative of the unthinkingly prosperous to sneer at the bourgeois virtues, and I now recall my own adolescent gestures and affectations in that direction with distaste.

- Theodore Dalrymple (Bolding mine)

347 Dr Lizardo  Apr 13, 2014 8:17:57am

re: #344 Justanotherhuman

Appropriating someone else’s culture/religion as a fashion statement (like the bindi), is just so wrong. And Gomez has been asked to stop wearing it by Hindu folks.

And, I wouldn’t have been caught dead in a pair of ripped, faded jeans (no one would have unless they worked in the fields) when I was a teenager. We may have been poor, but we wanted something better.

I was in Stockholm in the mid-1990s and I recall a jeans shop in one of the shopping centers there selling Levi’s 501’s, with some major rips and holes in them, for well over $300/pair. These looked like things I would’ve used as rags or simply thrown away.

348 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 8:19:20am

re: #346 Dark_Falcon

- Theodore Dalrymple (>Bolding mine)

Well, it’s certainly something young “fashionistas” don’t understand, or if they do, just don’t care. I see it as part of being immature.

349 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 8:26:04am

Of course, some people would sum up this conversation as a bunch of over-30s shouting “Hey you kids, get off my lawn!”. :D

350 Romantic Heretic  Apr 13, 2014 8:27:43am

re: #220 Kragar

The same people who want “STATES RIGHTS” for discrimination laws want the Feds to enforce their draconian drug laws, make Same Sex marriage illegal via Constitutional Amendment, and think that whole segments of the population should be arrested for immorality or failure to be “real Americans.”

Its never been about State Rights, its always been about their beliefs taking precedence over everyone else’s rights

As I’ve noted before when I hear these people talking about ‘freedom’ or ‘rights’ my brain automatically replaces those words with ‘power’.

351 Chrysicat  Apr 13, 2014 8:28:05am

re: #346 Dark_Falcon

_______________________________________________________________

- Theodore Dalrymple (>Bolding mine)

I wish you could’ve found a better article to make your point that everyone should dress above their class…
…the rest of that one makes abundantly clear that Dalrymple’s the type of social conservative who wouldn’t be out of place teaching at Hillsdale…

352 Romantic Heretic  Apr 13, 2014 8:31:12am

re: #229 freetoken

Just a reminder - the US does not have a monopoly on atavism:

Alberta homeschool convention offers creationist textbooks

Well, it’s also Alberta which is the Canadian equivalent of Texas. It even has its own version of the Tea Party.

353 Romantic Heretic  Apr 13, 2014 8:35:45am

re: #242 Targetpractice

Same here. Far as I can tell, it’s the usual “six degrees of Kevin Bacon” BS, where Reid is guilty by association. But you’ll notice none of these conspiracy theories explain why the courts ruled against Bundy twice, or can explain why it’s taken the BLM 20 years to make a move if they had such a hard-on for getting Bundy’s land for a solar farm.

Becuz ‘sides bein’ evuhl FedGov is also incompe…incopme…not able to do things well!

354 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 8:37:16am

re: #351 Chrysicat

I wish you could’ve found a better article to make your point that everyone should dress above their class…
…the rest of that one makes abundantly clear that Dalrymple’s the type of social conservative who wouldn’t be out of place teaching at Hillsdale…

You’d be wrong about that. He’s very concerned about the underclass situation, but as the body of his work makes clear, in England that underclass is as much white as not and it started out among white people.

He’s not a racist and he works hard to be decent and understanding about the people he depicts. Moreover, I’m not sure he’s really a social conservative since he makes plain that the past had its own series of abuses. What he is however, is anti-leftist in that he believes the British left has systematically failed and refuses to admit said failure. It does not, repeat NOT therefore follow his idea of reform would be similar to that of a Marco Rubio.

355 Romantic Heretic  Apr 13, 2014 8:38:28am

re: #255 Amory Blaine

Snort. It’s evil of me but I’d love to see a couple of A10s with cluster munitions roll in on these idiots.

Don’t actually want it to happen but I’d giggle if it did.

356 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 8:39:17am

re: #351 Chrysicat

I wish you could’ve found a better article to make your point that everyone should dress above their class…
…the rest of that one makes abundantly clear that Dalrymple’s the type of social conservative who wouldn’t be out of place teaching at Hillsdale…

It doesn’t make the point itself any less valid, though.

Especially when you consider who the up and coming bourgeoisie is these days and how they dress.

357 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 8:44:30am

re: #355 Romantic Heretic

Snort. It’s evil of me but I’d love to see a couple of A10s with cluster munitions roll in on these idiots.

Don’t actually want it to happen but I’d giggle if it did.

I was just finishing a book about the US Army in WW2 called The Guns at Last Light. In the Epilogue it told the story of Joachim Peiper, whose troops committed the Malmedy Massacre at the Battle of the Bulge. His death sentence was commuted, but the book continues to mention that in 1976 he burned to death when his house was firebombed and all of the hoses at the local firehouse had been cut. The crime was never solved.
I thought that was awesome!

358 Justanotherhuman  Apr 13, 2014 8:48:38am
359 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 8:49:46am

re: #357 SteveMcGazi

I was just finishing a book about the US Army in WW2 called The Guns at Last Light. In the Epilogue it told the story of Joachim Peiper, whose troops committed the Malmedy Massacre at the Battle of the Bulge. His death sentence was commuted, but the book continues to mention that in 1976 he burned to death when his house was firebombed and all of the hoses at the local firehouse had been cut. The crime was never solved.
I thought that was awesome!

Instead of being judged, Peiper was effectively lynched. That’s not justice and its not “awesome”. If you doubt that, imagine if the person killed had been a former Black Panther whose home was burned down by white Southerners.

360 Dr Lizardo  Apr 13, 2014 8:54:31am

A very cool mini-bio of the VW Kombi - sort of a farewell after all these years.

Youtube Video

361 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 8:55:11am

re: #359 Dark_Falcon

Well he wasn’t a Black Panther and he wasn’t lynched by a bunch of white Southerners. Peiper remained active in a Waffen SS veteran’s group and it is possible that he was killed by his own friends, who were not far removed from organized criminals. He had been judged. His richly deserved death sentence was commuted. Granted, a crime was committed, but really, is anybody really going to jail over a bunch of vandalized firehoses?

362 Ryan King  Apr 13, 2014 8:55:52am

They’re just itchin for a fight. Years of paranoia fomented by talk radio then bloggers ranting about Muslim this, impeach for that, ‘fundamentally transforming America,’ etc.

The Survivalist Rambos are ready.

363 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 8:57:45am

re: #359 Dark_Falcon

BTW your selective outrage over my #357 and none for Romantic Heretic’s #355 is noted. Odd choice.

364 sattv4u2  Apr 13, 2014 8:58:52am

re: #363 SteveMcGazi

BTW your selective outrage over my #357 and none for Romantic Heretic’s #355 is noted. Odd choice.

If it makes you feel better, I didn’t like either!!!

365 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 9:00:56am

re: #364 sattv4u2

I’m fine with that. Dark Falcon just seemed kind of incoherent with his argument and his choice of victim. It ‘snot like RH was far upscreen from mine.

366 Dark_Falcon  Apr 13, 2014 9:08:35am

re: #363 SteveMcGazi

BTW your selective outrage over my #357 and none for Romantic Heretic’s #355 is noted. Odd choice.

re: #176 Dark_Falcon

I’m sorry but I must say that would be unwise. The wingnuts might well have responded to that by opening fire on the BLM men doing the culling. While the BLM perhaps should not have backed off when it did, to have started killing the cattle (likely with guns) while armed wingnuts were massed against other government personnel would have likely set off a bloodbath.

To fuse two themes together, fighting out in the open as was done during the Revolution is now impossible. Modern firepower, even bolt action rifles, is simply too deadly to stand in front of. If you want to put paid to the wingnuts, you have to catch them by surprise. (Yes you could just sic helicopter gunships on them, but the PR blowback from doing that would be cataclysmic).

I reposted something upthread that I wrote last night to illustrate that I have in fact addressed a point similar to that made by RH.

There is also the fact that I felt Romantic Heretic had inserted a sufficient disclaimer into his/her post.

367 SteveMcGazi  Apr 13, 2014 9:09:51am

re: #366 Dark_Falcon

Point taken

368 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 13, 2014 9:38:36am

re: #305 Dark_Falcon

Actually, in the case of Poland the casus belli was a series of false flag attacks on Germany by the SS that were blamed on Poland. The worst of these was a train station bombing that killed 22 people.

Bit late but in the run up to the revolution - 05 - 06 time frame, one of the many “anarchist” assassinations in Czarist Russia was by agent provocateurs from the Secret Police. It Soviets learned almost every evil they committed from the Czarists and “merely” refined them for even more efficient mass murder.

369 bluebonnetbunny  Apr 13, 2014 9:56:25am

re: #146 NJDhockeyfan

Hi, What a beautiful rabbit! Boy or girl? I have a friend who has cats and rabbits living together. I don’t know if you saw it, but I posted a link to an article on the House Rabbit Society’s website about bonding rabbits with other animals. Rabbits are very social animals. They can sicken and die if isolated or kept outside. It might take some time, but they should all get along - not sure about the fish though ! Here’s a picture of my Harry who was severely injured by a cat when he was only a few days old. My neighbor found him and brought him to me. He lived to be almost 10 years old. Here he is with a box of apple twigs that were a gift from a friend.
Harry and the apple twigs

370 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 13, 2014 12:11:55pm

re: #311 Killgore Trout

The fact checking craze is sweeping the planet!
Fact-checking journalism gains momentum

It’s so bizarre. I guess the media really managed to fool a lot of idiots by just slapping a ‘factchecking’ label on themselves.

It’s stupid for two reasons:

First, the factcheckers don’t use any sort of objective guidelines, they just go with whatever argument they choose at any particular time. Sometimes, they use a narrow, literal definition of true, other times they expand it into ‘impressions’ and subjectivity.

Second, every reporter should be a factchecker. That it would even exist as a separate tier is ridiculous.

But some people really get fooled by marketing tactics like that.


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