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1 Charles Johnson  Jun 3, 2014 8:51:10pm
2 3eff Jeff  Jun 3, 2014 8:56:13pm

That was great. I know everyone here probably gets this, but what you have right now is the “Fast Lane”. Without spending lots of money to build out physical infrastructure, they cannot make a faster “fast lane”. They can just drop everyone else’ packets and slow stuff down. That’s just how routers work.

It’s a protection racket. Nothing less.

3 Romantic Heretic  Jun 3, 2014 8:56:23pm

Saw that earlier today. Laughed out loud a number of times. That dingo line is brilliant.

Oliver demonstrates once again that comedy is the most uncontrolled use of language and so most dangerous to those with power.

4 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 8:57:03pm

The company which brings us John Oliver, HBO, is a content packager for Time Warner, one of the companies against which he rails.

The large media conglomerates own us more than we readily admit.

5 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:06:37pm

The way to overcome this cable problem is very straightforward - public data providers.

Like with water companies, public ownership is not complicated. Like with roads.

The religious fixation on a gospel of wealth has long had free reign in this country and it is rare for politicians to succeed in swimming upstream against that.

Again, the only reason most of our residential high speed data capabilities are owned by private companies is because of the anti-social activities of rich and powerful men, who want to be even richer and more powerful.

I’d rather see publicly owned transmission systems, with privately owned content providers/packagers.

6 darthstar  Jun 3, 2014 9:07:19pm

Orly Taitz has over 50,000 votes. Fortunately, that means she’s only getting about 3% of the vote.

graphics.latimes.com

7 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:09:30pm

re: #6 darthstar

I was so tempted…

8 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:11:51pm

There are some communities in this country who have done, or are trying, community owned networks. In order to change the way things work, we may have to do it from the ground up.

9 darthstar  Jun 3, 2014 9:13:29pm

Everyone’s having fun with Maureen Dowd’s piece on recreational pot. Apparently she ate about half a chocolate bar when she was only supposed to eat 1/16th of it. Spent the whole night baked out of her brain.

10 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:15:13pm

Meanwhile, down in MS:

Sen. Thad Cochran In Close GOP Primary With Chris McDaniel In Mississippi

With 95 percent of the vote in, Cochran, 76, had 49.0 percent and McDaniel, 41, a state senator, had 49.4 percent, according to the AP. Thomas Carey had 1.6 percent. Under Mississippi law, a candidate must top 50 percent to avoid a runoff. The winner will face former Rep. Travis Childers, who easily won the Democratic nomination.

McDaniel is quite the wingnut. If he does win the nomination the main election should prove quite interesting.

The Democrat nominated is himself rather backwards, but I guess that ought to be expected.

11 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 9:15:35pm

re: #1 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

12 EPR-radar  Jun 3, 2014 9:18:01pm

re: #11 Gus

I saw this out of the corner of my eye, and read one of the headlines as “Wombats of mass destruction”.

13 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 3, 2014 9:18:57pm

re: #9 darthstar

Everyone’s having fun with Maureen Dowd’s piece on recreational pot. Apparently she ate about half a chocolate bar when she was only supposed to eat 1/16th of it. Spent the whole night baked out of her brain.

Hey, Maureen? You going to eat that other half? Mind sharing?

14 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 9:22:25pm

I noticed something. People are having a nervous breakdown about the 5 Taliban being released.

15 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:24:33pm

Fun fact: Mississippi hasn’t sent a Dem to the Senate since 1989

16 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:25:05pm

re: #15 Eclectic Cyborg

Fun fact: Mississippi hasn’t sent a Dem to the Senate since 1989

Somehow I don’t think that’s going to change. I’d give Childers a shot if there was a presidential election.

17 darthstar  Jun 3, 2014 9:25:45pm

re: #14 Gus

I noticed something. People are having a nervous breakdown about the 5 Taliban being released.

OMG who? They were due to be released next year anyway. This is all much ado about nothing. As I tweeted earlier, Obama could trade the rest of the detainees for a used Eagles CD and we’d be better off.

18 darthstar  Jun 3, 2014 9:26:39pm

re: #16 HappyWarrior

Somehow I don’t think that’s going to change. I’d give Childers a shot if there was a presidential election.

The teabag antics in the general will be enough to help the Democrats across the board.

19 palomino  Jun 3, 2014 9:27:04pm

re: #14 Gus

I noticed something. People are having a nervous breakdown about the 5 Taliban being released.

They only give a shit because it’s all wrapped up in something that Obama could get credit for.

20 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:28:02pm

re: #18 darthstar

The teabag antics in the general will be enough to help the Democrats across the board.

Well this is Mississippi. I wish I could be optimistic but I really do think McDaniel could win this thing.

21 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:28:04pm

re: #18 darthstar

The teabag antics in the general will be enough to help the Democrats across the board.

I think the GOP have better odds of retaking the Senate this year than we might like to think.

Not that I’m happy about that.

22 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:28:47pm

re: #14 Gus

I noticed something. People are having a nervous breakdown about the 5 Taliban being released.

Do they seriously think that the Obama administration and military isn’t going to be watching over those guys like a fly on shit?

23 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:29:21pm

re: #19 palomino

They only give a shit because it’s all wrapped up in something that Obama could get credit for.

And this gets back to what i’m talking about downstairs. The opportunists piss me off much more than the true believing nutjobs.

24 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:29:32pm

Meanwhile, locally, our recorder, who gained some attention for petitioning against same-sex marriage, is still running away with vote, at least for the early ballots:

ASSESSOR/RECORDER/CO. CLERK

Precincts: 1616
Counted: 0
Percentage: AV%

Vote for: 1
'ERNIE' DRONENBURG
111180
59.35%
SUSAN GUINN
55516
29.64%
JONATHAN A. GORDON
13799
7.37%
GEORGE W. MANTOR
6826
3.64%

Maybe the daily vote will change it, but I don’t know.

25 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:31:36pm

Current MS results, 97% of districts reporting:

Chris McDaniel 147,451 49%
Thad Cochran (Inc.) 146,071 49%

26 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:32:04pm

re: #25 Eclectic Cyborg

Current MS results, 97% of districts reporting:

Chris McDaniel 147,451 49%
Thad Cochran (Inc.) 146,071 49%

Run off I’m thinking.

27 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:32:52pm

re: #26 HappyWarrior

Run off I’m thinking.

More than likely. Has to be 50+1 either way to avoid it.

28 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:32:52pm

re: #26 HappyWarrior

A run-off will have a lower turnout than even a primary election.

This would benefit the wingnut, no?

29 Kragar  Jun 3, 2014 9:32:57pm

re: #15 Eclectic Cyborg

Fun fact: Mississippi hasn’t sent a Dem to the Senate since 1989

Fun Fact: There are foreign crapholes I’d gladly move to before living in Mississippi

30 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:33:20pm

re: #28 freetoken

A run-off will have a lower turnout than even a primary election.

This would benefit the wingnut, no?

Yep always does.

31 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:33:45pm

re: #29 Kragar

Fun Fact: There are foreign crapholes I’d gladly move to before living in Mississippi

There really are good, sane decent people down here. But this state does have issues for sure.

32 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:33:51pm

re: #27 Eclectic Cyborg

More than likely. Has to be 50+1 either way to avoid it.

Yeah I don’t see with 3%> to go any of them getting over the hump.

33 Kragar  Jun 3, 2014 9:34:12pm

re: #31 Eclectic Cyborg

There really are good, sane decent people down here. But this state does have issues for sure.

I’m more than willing to help them get out.

34 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:34:12pm

A runoff would also mean more weeks of being subjected to attack ads. Yay.

/

35 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 9:34:27pm

re: #17 darthstar

OMG who? They were due to be released next year anyway. This is all much ado about nothing. As I tweeted earlier, Obama could trade the rest of the detainees for a used Eagles CD and we’d be better off.


36 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:35:50pm

re: #34 Eclectic Cyborg

A runoff would also mean more weeks of being subjected to attack ads. Yay.

/

Netflix should offer free streaming to sane Mississippians.

37 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:36:09pm

The way the wingnuts are outraged you’d think the Taliban guys were released on to the streets of Baltimore or something.

38 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 9:36:15pm

39 palomino  Jun 3, 2014 9:37:04pm

re: #21 Eclectic Cyborg

I think the GOP have better odds of retaking the Senate this year than we might like to think.

Not that I’m happy about that.

I’m afraid you’re right. The Dems are defending more Senate seats. Some in deep red states like Louisiana and Arkansas. And others in states that could go either way.

Legislatively it won’t make that much difference, since the House will stay GOP and thus continue to block anything remotely moderate passed by a Dem controlled Senate. But it could be a real pain in the ass when it comes to confirmations, from SC Justices on down.

40 Charles Johnson  Jun 3, 2014 9:38:09pm

Fan mail!

so mad magazine isnt funny in satirizing the presidents decision to release a bunch of lowlife murderers in exchange for what could be a lowlife deserter, but Colbert satirizing the fact that he may decide to obliterate the lowlife murderers freedom with a drone attack is? thats just some kind of sick sense of humor you got there, that a president releasing prisoners only to track them down and kill them is funny. I would not be at all surprised if the drone happy President did just that, since he can kill whoever he wants with the stroke of a pen, but funny? really? I guess that would be about as funny as bringing home a “prisoner of war” or whatever Bergdahl turns out to have been, only to try him for treason and sentence him to death by firing squad. hilarious!

41 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 9:39:20pm

42 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:39:36pm

re: #39 palomino

Likely loss of 3 Dem senators - Dakota, Louisiana, and Arkansas.

Longshot loss of Dem senator - Iowa.

So yeah, it’s going to be a difficult job to get any legislation done for the next couple of years.

43 blueraven  Jun 3, 2014 9:41:59pm

re: #25 Eclectic Cyborg

Current MS results, 97% of districts reporting:

Chris McDaniel 147,451 49%
Thad Cochran (Inc.) 146,071 49%

uh oh. 98%

Chris McDaniel 149,347 50%
Thad Cochran (Inc.) 146,835 49%

44 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:42:14pm

It’s sad the best we can hope is a Democratic hold of the Senate not for better legislation but so Congress doesn’t go completely insane. Sigh if only turn out had been higher in 2010 and people hadn’t bought the TP lies and bullshit. We not only wouldn’t have the GOP House today but we wouldn’t have the GOP controlling state legislatures and thus the future of redistricting. My worry is even if we do elect a Dem in 2016 that there may be significant Democratic Party fatigue in 2020 and the same thing will happen again. I think the GOP knows they’re fucked with higher turnouts which is why do anything possible to make voting as hard as it can be.

45 HappyWarrior  Jun 3, 2014 9:43:33pm

re: #43 blueraven

uh oh. 98%

Chris McDaniel 149,347 50%
Thad Cochran (Inc.) 146,835 49%

We’re going to have an openly neo-confederate senate candidate for a major party in 2014. Excuse me while I weep a little even if I’ve never felt any allegiance to the Republican party.

46 freetoken  Jun 3, 2014 9:44:59pm

For those who missed it, yesterday Gallup released their biennial poll on creationism. It got a little bit of coverage in the usual outlets, like in HuffPo, but not as much as I would have thought.

Anyway, there are a few questions I have about the results, particular in the significant changes that show up in the parameters about education level response.

The long term trend shows increasing acceptance of natural evolution.

But the decline in creationism is very slight. It’s long term trend is slower than the demographic changes, which means that as a part of our society creationism is very “sticky”.

47 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 3, 2014 9:46:14pm

re: #43 blueraven

uh oh. 98%

Chris McDaniel 149,347 50%
Thad Cochran (Inc.) 146,835 49%

I’ll be damned.

48 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 10:17:59pm
49 Gus  Jun 3, 2014 10:18:21pm

I’ll be outside having a smoke. Won’t be taking a shit though.

50 Amory Blaine  Jun 3, 2014 10:57:45pm

re: #11 Gus

There’s a typo.

51 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 3, 2014 11:10:36pm

Gus, watch out for guys with long beards.

As for your re: #48, is Wikileaks suggesting Bergdahl was merely walking out to take a shit when he got pinched, and not deserting his post as the RWNJs are alleging?

52 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 12:22:00am

Looks like the castration expert won the primary for the Republican nomination for US Senate from Iowa. Joni Ernest is a standard issue atavist. Iowa is a purplish state, and Ernest’s opposition to farm bills might be enough to do her in.

So, the Democrats might keep that Senate seat from Iowa.

53 goddamnedfrank  Jun 4, 2014 12:25:45am

re: #51 wheat-dogghazi

Gus, watch out for guys with long beards.

As for your , is Wikileaks suggesting Bergdahl was merely walking out to take a shit when he got pinched, and not deserting his post as the RWNJs are alleging?

That’s the way I read it. “We were attacking the post,” would indicate this happened just outside, that he’d just stepped out to relieve himself in privacy.

54 The Ghost of a Flea  Jun 4, 2014 12:35:09am

Relevant part:

UPDATE: 0610z LLVI TRAFFIC FROM REDRIDGE: freq 162.1 1- W ARE READY FOR THEM. 2- ALL THE NUMBERS ARE MESS IT. WE ARE WWAITING FOR THEM. 1- LOL THEY KNOW WHERE HE IS BUT THEY KEEP GOING TO WRONG AREA. 2- OK SET UP THE WORK FOR THEM. 1- YES WE HAVE A LOT OF IED ON THE ROAD. 2- GOD WILLING WE WILL DO IT. 1- WE WERE ATTACKING THE POST HE WAS SITTING TAKING EXPLETIVE HE HAD NO GUN WITH HIM. HE WAS TAKING EXPLETIVE, HE HAS NOT CLEANED HIS BUTT YET. 2- WHAT SHEAM FOR THEM. 1- I DONT THINK HE W 2-YES LOOK THEY HAVE ALL AMERICANS, ANA HELICOPTERS THE PLANES ARE LOOKING FOR HIM. 1- I THINK HE IS BIG SHOT THAT WHY THEY ARE LOOKING FOR HIM. 3-CAN YOU GUYS MAKE A VIDEO OF HIM AND ANNOUNCE IT ALL OVER AFGHANISTAN THAT WE HAVE ONE OF THE AMERICANS. 1- WE ALREADY HAVE A VIDEO OF HIM.

55 sagehen  Jun 4, 2014 1:26:27am

FCC site crashes after Oliver asks ‘Trolls’ To Comment On Net Neutrality
talkingpointsmemo.com

John Oliver’s attempt on Sunday to motivate people to comment on the Federal Communications Commission’s net neutrality rules was apparently successful.

After Oliver’s “Last Week Tonight” segment explaining the net neutrality debate aired, the FCC website crashed, according to Recode.

56 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 1:32:14am

MP3 Audio

57 sagehen  Jun 4, 2014 2:38:25am

Is it silly to brag about game scores? I’ve been wasting way too much time on that 2048 game, and…. it is possible to get a 4096 square. I’ve done it. Twice. My high score is 52,720. I really need to stop doing this.

58 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 2:46:02am

In case anyone out there wants to criticize me because I will acknowledge that I haven’t thought much about those 5 elderly Taliban prisoners who were released for Sgt Bergdahl, well, they should go for it. If they’re going to be a danger to me personally, well, we’ll have to wait and see. I could get creamed by a bus meanwhile.

It’s not those guys I’m so worried about as the ones (you know, the ones who hate not just the govt, but this country, too) who keep complaining that the NSA is invading our privacy and are working to get it dismantled or made less effective in keeping tabs on people like those guys if they’re actually going to start planning attacks. Yes, let’s have oversight and keep a handle on those who would abuse their authority, but limit giving that responsibility to the adults who have actually studied and understand the issues, okay? And for crying out loud, don’t give away the nation’s secrets while you claim you’re working for “reform” because IMHO, that’s treason, no matter who you are.

Have I got my priorities wrong? I don’t think so.

59 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 2:47:26am

re: #57 sagehen

Is it silly to brag about game scores? I’ve been wasting way too much time on that 2048 game, and…. it is possible to get a 4096 square. I’ve done it. Twice. My high score is 52,720. I really need to stop doing this.

That’s terrific! I’m nowhere in your league, since my “high” score is about 1/10th of yours. : )

60 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 3:13:28am

President Obama says G7 meeting will be important to show international community stands behind Poroshenko - @Reuters
End of alert

1h
Obama says he discussed a plan for restoring peace, economic growth with Ukraine’s President-elect Poroshenko - @Reuters

Lech Walesa, onetime leader of the pro-democracy Solidarity trade union that ended communism in Poland, said his country should join the eurozone to become fully free and safe from Russia - @Reuters
End of alert

61 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 3:17:39am

NATO commander says Russian irregulars, Russian-backed forces, Russian financing are very active in eastern Ukraine, says ‘this has to stop’ - @Reuters
End of alert

8m
All NATO reinforcement steps will comply with 1997 pact with Russia, Moscow has broken agreement, NATO commander says - @Reuters
End of alert

11m
NATO’s top military commander says portion of Russian force on Ukraine border ‘looks like it intends to remain - @Reuters
End of alert

62 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 4:29:03am
63 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 4:36:39am

Morning all.

Looks like a day to keep an eye open for big storms rolling through the central Ohio area. Forecasts are for severe thunderstorms all day long from noon until late tonight.

So, I see Dark_Falcon took some major heat last night in the “Mad Magazine” thread. I guess I do not see how this country suffered, especially the big-money men, before the Citizens United rulings. I do see the common man suffering though after them.

Conservative eh? I guess I no longer know what that means in regards to the U.S. Constitution.

Meanwhile…what craziness awaits us regarding the POW/Taliban swap today? I feel a bout with severe media fatigue coming on.

64 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 4:48:50am

re: #63 ObserverArt

Meanwhile…what craziness awaits us regarding the POW/Taliban swap today? I feel a bout with severe media fatigue coming on.

I expect a lot of armchair psychoanalysis of the video posted by the Taliban. We’re going to see a lot of modern day Bill Frists, diagnosing Bergdahl’s treason and/or desertion based on his body language in the video or what the fuck ever. Should be fun.

65 Dark_Falcon  Jun 4, 2014 4:49:48am

re: #63 ObserverArt

Morning all.

Looks like a day to keep an eye open for big storms rolling through the central Ohio area. Forecasts are for severe thunderstorms all day long from noon until late tonight.

So, I see Dark_Falcon took some major heat last night in the “Mad Magazine” thread. I guess I do not see how this country suffered, especially the big-money men, before the Citizens United rulings. I do see the common man suffering though after them.

Conservative eh? I guess I no longer know what that means in regards to the U.S. Constitution.

Meanwhile…what craziness awaits us regarding the POW/Taliban swap today? I feel a bout with severe media fatigue coming on.

What sort of clarification would you like? I might not be able to give to you till tonight, but if you’re unclear on something I said regarding the Constitution please let me know.

That’s just for ObserverArt this morning, as I’d risk being overwhelmed if I opened that offer up generally.

66 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 4:50:30am

Nothing but a can of worms…

Federal prosecutor in Germany opens investigation into alleged NSA surveillance of Chancellor Angela Merkel’s phone - @AP
End of alert

67 BongCrodny  Jun 4, 2014 4:52:25am

re: #45 HappyWarrior

We’re going to have an openly neo-confederate senate candidate for a major party in 2014. Excuse me while I weep a little even if I’ve never felt any allegiance to the Republican party.

A failed experiment that didn’t even last FIVE years and people get cow-eyed over it as if it were the second coming of fucking Atlantis.

68 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 4:53:23am

re: #40 Charles Johnson

Speaking of being buried under loving fan mail:

69 A Mom Anon  Jun 4, 2014 5:13:52am

On a slightly more hopeful note in GA, Michelle Nunn (D) is holding good numbers in our race for the Senate here. She’s going to be facing either Jack Kingston or David Perdue, both trying to out wingnut each other to pieces in the run off. Which gives her a bit more time to make an impact before the winner turns their sights on her.

For governor, it looks like Nathan Deal (R- Corrupt as Hell Bastard) still has better numbers than Jason Carter (D-Who needs to spend some money on a campaign, I’ve seen no ads or anything from him yet). Deal seems to be wearing a Teflon suit. He just got hammered for buying an endorsement from a publication saying he’s creating all these great jobs here by making GA more “business friendly”. Hasn’t phased him a bit. Figures.

Dems don’t spend money here, we’re written off as hopeless outside of Atlanta and maybe Athens. Not sure how things will ever change without an investment of some sort.

70 Dr Lizardo  Jun 4, 2014 5:20:42am

In the California primaries, it looks like Governor Brown will be facing off against Neel Kashkari this November, as Mr. Kashkari defeated TP fave Tim Donnelly by four percentage points.

I know Mr. Kashkari is considered a RINO by the wingnuttier elements out there, as well as possibly a SEEKRIT MOOZLIM!! but that being said, I’d say as things stand right now, Governor Brown stands an excellent chance of being re-elected to a fourth term.

Looks like the wingnuts aren’t as strong in California as they are in other places.

71 A Mom Anon  Jun 4, 2014 5:21:18am

re: #63 ObserverArt

Hell, I’d just like to hear what they would like to do FOR the American people at this point. And not some boilerplate response about “lowering taxes, getting big government off your back and helping job creators create jobs”. HOW? I have yet to hear anything outside of “if you can’t dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit” responses. Show me WHY I should vote for Republicans, that’s all I ask. I get tiny chirping crickets in response.

72 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Jun 4, 2014 5:21:26am

Wow the media really wants bergdhals blood. I normally never watch the news but I’m at the dentists office. It is fucking disgusting how they’re exploiting the parents of the soldiers who died in the area.

73 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 5:21:40am
74 Cheechako  Jun 4, 2014 5:23:56am

Had an earthquake about 20 minutes ago in SE Alaska. 5.7 and shook the house a little and woke us up. Epicenter was about 100 miles NW of Juneau. Glad I have quake insurance but no damage this time.

75 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 5:24:30am

A documentary-style movie maker, a “new style” journalist, and a low level contract sysadm—these are the people who are allowed to make policy in the US these days, circumventing the democratic process?

These privileged white people who call themselves “Socialist Workers” think so.

socialistworker.org

These are the “proletariat” who make up the SWP:

Party leaders Jack Barnes and Mary-Alice Waters sold their West Village condominium for $1.87 million. splinteredsunrise.wordpress.com

76 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Jun 4, 2014 5:25:04am

Oh and dark the main thing that’s confusing about your stance on the constitution is that you feel it gives rights to non people, specifically corporations. This is odd to me because the founders were very skeptical if and concerned by corporations even when they were far less powerful.

77 A Mom Anon  Jun 4, 2014 5:32:36am

Yosemite National Park’s Facebook page is full of entries right now about a little boy who was sworn in as a park ranger, arranged via the Make a Wish Foundation. It’s totally adorable. He’s rode a horse, helped fight a fire and a host of other ranger type duties.

Link

78 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 5:32:51am

re: #70 Dr Lizardo

Wingnuts here are geographically isolated, as far as political influence, into pockets in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada and inland portions of SoCal.

The strongest presence, as far as political influence, is in Orange and San Diego counties. Issa easily was the lead vote getter in that district’s primary. Duncan the Lesser also skipped on through.

At the state level the GOP has been neutered.

And we didn’t even have to call in Joni from Iowa to do that bit.

79 NJDhockeyfan  Jun 4, 2014 5:37:48am
80 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 5:38:24am

Your morning Hitler, courtesy of Life Saver Ministries in Alabama

gawker.com

81 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 5:40:22am

re: #80 darthstar

Your morning Hitler, courtesy of Life Saver Ministries in Alabama

gawker.com
[Embedded image]

Wouldn’t that get you jail time in Germany? : )

82 Dr Lizardo  Jun 4, 2014 5:40:31am

re: #78 freetoken

Wingnuts here are geographically isolated, as far as political influence, into pockets in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada and inland portions of SoCal.

The strongest presence, as far as political influence, is in Orange and San Diego counties. Issa easily was the lead vote getter in that district’s primary. Duncan the Lesser also skipped on through.

At the state level the GOP has been neutered.

And we didn’t even have to call in Joni from Iowa to do that bit.

Ah, OK. Where are those other inland portions of SoCal where the wingnuts roam the earth? San Bernardino County/Inland Empire/Riverside County by any chance? Or north of the Tehachapi Mountains? I’m thinking Kern County.

83 William Barnett-Lewis  Jun 4, 2014 5:41:22am

Today is the 25th anniversary of the Chinese government’s massacre of the pro-democracy protesters in Beijing’s Tiananmen Square.

I have paged a photographic memory of the day here: littlegreenfootballs.com

Please think of them and remember their sacrifices today. And if some Wingnut whines about Obama’s supposed oppression, smack them hard.

84 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 4, 2014 5:46:37am

re: #83 William Barnett-Lewis

Today is the 25th anniversary of the Chinese government’s massacre of the pro-democracy protesters in Beijing’s Tiananmen Square.

I have paged a photographic memory of the day here: littlegreenfootballs.com

Please think of them and remember their sacrifices today. And if some Wingnut whines about Obama’s supposed oppression, smack them hard.

Thanks for that. I paged about the big anniversary gathering in Hong Kong today, and just now added a link to my own blog about the 1989 protests and military suppression.

Here’s another famous photo, taken the day after the protests were brutally put down: Tank Man.
Image: tankman.jpg

85 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 5:47:20am

re: #82 Dr Lizardo

Ah, OK. Where are those inland portions of SoCal where the wingnuts roam the earth? San Bernardino County/Inland Empire/Riverside County by any chance? Or north of the Tehachapi Mountains? I’m thinking Kern County.

Sierra Nevada counties.
Riverside and parts of San Bernadino counties.
Orange county.
San Diego county except the bulk of the southern metropolitan area.

Only about a third of the state identifies with the GOP. And half of them are considered RINOs by the true believers, but the RINOs are too laid back to bother to actually change the party or start a new one.

86 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 5:49:39am

So, who here thought that the NRA might be having a moment of sanity in criticizing the aggressive open carry gun enthusiasts in Texas? Anyone?

Well, looks like they’re going to chalk up the criticism to someone who was voicing their own opinion and not that of the NRA as an official organization.

They’re just as extreme as the open carry extremists.

87 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 5:50:53am

re: #86 lawhawk

So, who here thought that the NRA might be having a moment of sanity in criticizing the aggressive open carry gun enthusiasts in Texas? Anyone?

Well, looks like they’re going to chalk up the criticism to someone who was voicing their own opinion and not that of the NRA as an official organization.

They’re just as extreme as the open carry extremists.

[Embedded content]

They got rick-rolled?

88 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 5:51:48am
89 William Barnett-Lewis  Jun 4, 2014 5:51:51am

re: #84 wheat-dogghazi

Brave to show up even in Hong Kong.

There were rumors in the US Military at the time that the protests were not put down sooner because there were allegedly division sized battles being fought outside Beijing against PLA troops who mutinied in support of the students. We’ll never know the truth of that but it would not surprise me.

90 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 5:52:10am

Republicans are doing a shitty job of sabotaging Obama and America:

91 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 5:56:26am

How easy is it to criticize the US govt from the relative safety of a foreign country?

I suppose it depends on how much publicity and money you can get from it.

92 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 4, 2014 5:58:14am

re: #89 William Barnett-Lewis

Brave to show up even in Hong Kong.

There were rumors in the US Military at the time that the protests were not put down sooner because there were allegedly division sized battles being fought outside Beijing against PLA troops who mutinied in support of the students. We’ll never know the truth of that but it would not surprise me.

Based on my cursory research, there’s truth to that. There were an estimated 3,500 soldiers and officers who disobeyed orders, and at least seven retired PLA generals who advised against mobillising the army against the citizenry. There was also dissension in the ranks of the Politburo. Some were sympathetic to the protesters, but the socialist hardliners wanted to keep a tight lid on the populace.

93 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 6:00:03am

Because it’s crazy to bring a POW home, don’tcha know:

94 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 4, 2014 6:02:15am

re: #89 William Barnett-Lewis

Here’s a roundup of links about the Tian’anmen protests, courtesy of shanghaiist.com.

shanghaiist.com

95 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:02:21am
96 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:03:42am

Libertarians…heh.

97 William Barnett-Lewis  Jun 4, 2014 6:04:14am

Well, off to start training for the night clerk position. THAT should be much easier on me than the McD’s job. Till later folks.

98 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 6:04:53am

re: #88 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Nothing new, I heard wingnuts as early as Sunday theorizing that the White House had brought Bergdahl back to great fanfare, knowing he was a deserter if not collaborator, just to get the VA out of the press.

99 Cheechako  Jun 4, 2014 6:07:26am

re: #93 Lidane

Because it’s crazy to bring a POW home, don’tcha know:

Her advice isn’t even worth the 5 cents Lucy charges.

100 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:11:39am
101 Rightwingconspirator  Jun 4, 2014 6:12:15am

re: #95 darthstar

Well look who won the GOP primary for governor… The Not A Tea Party Guy

102 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 6:14:22am

Beautiful!

103 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:17:34am

re: #101 Rightwingconspirator

Well look who won the GOP primary for governor… The Not A Tea Party Guy

Yeah…it’s a tough state for crazy fucks. But Brown got only 54.5% of the vote compared to Kashkari’s 19%. Not enough to prevent a runoff in November.

Oh, and let’s not forget the Republican Enthusiasm Gap advantage over Democrats this year…per the numbers.

104 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:20:26am
105 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 6:21:44am

re: #65 Dark_Falcon

What sort of clarification would you like? I might not be able to give to you till tonight, but if you’re unclear on something I said regarding the Constitution please let me know.

That’s just for ObserverArt this morning, as I’d risk being overwhelmed if I opened that offer up generally.

Dark,

I would think a true conservative would be all in favor of extremely strong protection of individual rights…not corporate. Maybe I see things wrong, but I would think giving power to corporations would be more of a liberal/progressive thing. Yet, here we are with everything all flip-flopped.

I can’t think the forefathers would have been able to see the enormous wealth and power a company can gain. They wrote much of the U.S. Constitution to protect people from the powers of a big government. I think they would have put the same type of protections against large corporations for many of the same reasons…to give the individual a powerful voice, had they seen how big and powerful a corporation could become.

I see Obi is making the same point in #76.

106 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:21:54am
107 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 4, 2014 6:26:27am

If anyone is interested, the South China Morning Post has a live blog of the Tian’anmen vigil on Victoria Peak. Photos, too.

108 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 6:29:48am

re: #103 darthstar

Speaking of runoffs…

Club for Growth PAC urges incumbent Sen. Thad Cochran, R-Miss., to drop out of runoff with Tea Party challenger Chris McDaniel - @JessicaTaylor
see original on twitter.com

109 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 6:32:50am

re:
#101
rightwingconspirator

The Tea Party has never failed. It has only been failed. //

110 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 6:35:03am

re:
#108
Justanotherhuman

Well, obviously Cochran should just immediately do whatever the Club for Growth wants./

111 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:38:38am
112 Rightwingconspirator  Jun 4, 2014 6:39:35am

re: #109 Bulworth

California Republicans are not as crazy by and large. And you can tell by how the national GOP invests in California candidates. it almost doesn’t.

113 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 6:44:59am

Anyone know about the team that picked up Bergdahl in the helicopter. One guy in blue jeans, another guy in tan slacks, looks like only one wearing normal military uniform. CIA? OGA? Contractors?

114 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 6:51:41am

re: #98 Targetpractice

Nothing new, I heard wingnuts as early as Sunday theorizing that the White House had brought Bergdahl back to great fanfare, knowing he was a deserter if not collaborator, just to get the VA out of the press.

The kicker is that *if* you assume Obama acted totally out of political expediency (and does not have an iota of empathy and responsibility towards his position as CinC) the trade made piles of sense even then. It disarmed the possibility of the massive (and continuous through at least 2016) uproar that would have been triggered if Bergdahl had died in Taliban captivity.

115 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 6:51:50am

re: #86 lawhawk

So, who here thought that the NRA might be having a moment of sanity in criticizing the aggressive open carry gun enthusiasts in Texas? Anyone?

Well, looks like they’re going to chalk up the criticism to someone who was voicing their own opinion and not that of the NRA as an official organization.

They’re just as extreme as the open carry extremists.

[Embedded content]

So, they have no control over gun issues. I guess OCT (Open Carry Texas) can see themselves as powerful as the NRA now.

Lovely!

116 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 6:53:40am

re: #90 darthstar

Republicans are doing a shitty job of sabotaging Obama and America:

[Embedded content]

They’ll be better at crippling us if they take the Senate in November.

117 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:54:17am
118 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 6:54:51am

Does it really matter who picked up Bergdahl from our side? The point is we brought a POW home. Period.

Dude is in the hospital right now and is being debriefed. If there is a reason to charge him with anything, the military will take care of it.

119 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 6:55:31am

re: #118 Lidane

Does it really matter who picked up Bergdahl from our side? The point is we brought a POW home. Period.

Dude is in the hospital right now and is being debriefed. If there is a reason to charge him with anything, the military will take care of it.

And if they don’t I’m sure Allen West will lead the charge asking why.
///

120 Lidane  Jun 4, 2014 6:56:19am

re: #115 ObserverArt

So, they have no control over gun issues. I guess OCT (Open Carry Texas) can see themselves as powerful as the NRA now.

Lovely!

I am eagerly awaiting the list of businesses who kick the OCT dipshits out and summarily ban guns from their buildings. That will be fun,.

121 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 6:57:22am
122 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 6:58:39am

re: #118 Lidane

Does it really matter who picked up Bergdahl from our side? The point is we brought a POW home. Period.

Dude is in the hospital right now and is being debriefed. If there is a reason to charge him with anything, the military will take care of it.

Just wondering about the logistics of how these things are done.

123 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 7:01:48am

re: #118 Lidane

Does it really matter who picked up Bergdahl from our side? The point is we brought a POW home. Period.

Dude is in the hospital right now and is being debriefed. If there is a reason to charge him with anything, the military will take care of it.

As noted yesterday, the Army’s been pretty lax with prosecuting deserters. They may very well decide, if Bergdahl is found to have deserted, that five years in enemy captivity is enough to qualify as “time served” and simply take steps to have him discharged as quickly as possible.

That, of course, would be a disservice to the man, as he’d have it hanging over his head for the rest of his life that he was a deserter but never had a chance to plead his case in a court.

124 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:06:43am

A political theatre indeed:

Some Republicans Delete Twitter Praise For Bowe Bergdahl’s Release

125 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 7:08:37am

re: #120 Lidane

I am eagerly awaiting the list of businesses who kick the OCT dipshits out and summarily ban guns from their buildings. That will be fun,.

Your post for some reason triggered a scenario in my fertile imagination

Scene: OCT members surrounding a store. They are spread out around the building two-each every few feet and behind a small stack of sandbags in kneeling and prone positions.

Leader Kory Watkins is on a bullhorn yelling: “Come out with your hands up, we will not be deterred from entering your store with our guns. All store employees except one cashier must exit so that we can enter and shop. Once we are finished, we will stand down and you can have your store back.”

126 Dr Lizardo  Jun 4, 2014 7:11:04am

re: #125 ObserverArt

Your post for some reason triggered a scenario in my fertile imagination

Scene: OCT members surrounding a store. They are spread out around the building two-each every few feet and behind a small stack of sandbags in kneeling and prone positions.

Leader Kory Watkins is on a bullhorn yelling: “Come out with your hands up, we will not be deterred from entering your store with our guns. All store employees except one cashier must exit so that we can enter and shop. Once we are finished, we will stand down and you can have your store back.”

Horrifyingly enough, I can actually see that happening.

127 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 7:18:36am

re: #126 Dr Lizardo

Horrifyingly enough, I can actually see that happening.

Operation Shop CVS Pharmacy.

128 1Peter G1  Jun 4, 2014 7:18:47am

But the internet isn’t a public utility is it? And it cannot be regulated as such. If someone wants to build a dedicated line to carry their own traffic how are you going to compel them to handle general traffic. The short answer is you can’t. And that is exactly what they are going to do.

129 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:19:08am

re: #127 ObserverArt

Operation Shop CVS Pharmacy.

Target Target.

130 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:20:26am

re: #128 1Peter G1

But the internet isn’t a public utility is it? And it cannot be regulated as such.

Sure you can.

If you run a private hospital, you have to accept anyone who shows up at your ER and treat them. And you have to eat the cost if it turns out they’re uninsured.

131 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 7:24:11am

re: #129 freetoken

Target Target.

I like that one.

Subvert Subway

Takeover Taco Bell

This is fun.

132 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:24:14am

Operation Safety-on Safeway.

Operation Glock H&R Block.

133 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 7:24:34am

re:
#124
freetoken

Stay classy, wingnuts

134 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 7:26:53am

Happy Birthday @AskDrRuth - sex expert, former sniper…

135 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:27:13am

re: #132 freetoken

Operation Safety-on Safeway.

Operation Glock H&R Block.

Fire in the Kohl’s.

136 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:27:31am

Pacific Theaters of Operation.

Corral Golden Corral.

137 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 7:29:07am

Morning Lizards. Here’s a question. If the Army really had any suspicions about Bergdahl being a deserter, why did they promote him, not once, but twice?

Bergdahl was promoted twice after he was taken prisoner in June 2009. He was promoted to the rank of specialist in June 2010 and then sergeant in June 2011.

And pending the results of the investigation is scheduled for another one.

Report: Bergdahl Scheduled For Promotion

138 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 7:29:45am

I know you’ll all be surprised to learn, as I just did, that one Allen West did once upon a time just a few months ago blame Obama for not doing anything to bring Bergdahl home.

nomoremister.blogspot.com

139 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:31:50am

re: #137 Bubblehead II

I reckon there’s all kinds of shenanigans behind the scenes of how he came to be in captivity. But to be honest I also don’t really care. If he deserted, fine. If his unit screwed up and the deserting story is just a cover-up, fine. That can all get sorted out by the investigation that is presumably underway, but to me it’s not a big story.

140 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:32:14am

Submachine Subway.

Seven-chamber 7-Eleven.

141 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 7:32:45am

re: #137 Bubblehead II

Morning Lizards. Here’s a question. If the Army really had any suspicions about Bergdahl being a deserter, why did they promote him, not once, but twice?

Bergdahl was promoted twice after he was taken prisoner in June 2009. He was promoted to the rank of specialist in June 2010 and then sergeant in June 2011.

And pending the results of the investigation is scheduled for another one.

Report: Bergdahl Scheduled For Promotion

I’m more curious about the NDAs that supposedly every soldier who has since run his mouth off to the press was required to sign. I’ve seen the bit in every story from the wingnut press, but nowhere have I seen confirmation from the Pentagon that these men were required to sign an NDA. And I really question why those NDAs ran out conveniently in time for them to go to whichever newspaper or news station would have them to vent their spleens about the man.

142 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 7:33:31am

The one part that the gun nuts always seem to ignore, and the politicians always seem to sneak in is that when they talk about open carry, it’s always everywhere but the place where the politicians work. You can’t bring guns into the legislative office buildings and capitol buildings of those states where open carry is on the books.

Can’t imagine why that’d be the case? Oh wait, it’s common sense. The law enforcement and politicians agree that open carry would create too much of a risk to those in those office buildings to secure them properly, and the politicians don’t want strange folks entering their building with guns.

That they can do so everywhere else? That’s not their problem - 2d Amendment and all that nonsense.

What makes the legislative buildings any more or less important than the department store, mom and pop shop, or other businesses/restaurants for safety from heavily armed folks entering? It’s that these politicians don’t value those lives nearly as much as their own.

143 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 7:34:21am

Open Carry-in Krogers

Project Long Rifles in Long John Silver’s

144 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:34:23am

re: #142 lawhawk

The one part that the gun nuts always seem to ignore, and the politicians always seem to sneak in is that when they talk about open carry, it’s always everywhere but the place where the politicians work. You can’t bring guns into the legislative office buildings and capitol buildings of those states where open carry is on the books.

Can’t imagine why that’d be the case? Oh wait, it’s common sense. The law enforcement and politicians agree that open carry would create too much of a risk to those in those office buildings to secure them properly, and the politicians don’t want strange folks entering their building with guns.

That they can do so everywhere else? That’s not their problem - 2d Amendment and all that nonsense.

What makes the legislative buildings any more or less important than the department store, mom and pop shop, or other businesses/restaurants for safety from heavily armed folks entering? It’s that these politicians don’t value those lives nearly as much as their own.

Not to belittle your point, which is well-made and updinged, but I’ve always thought that was kind of obvious.

145 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 7:34:31am

re: #137 Bubblehead II

Those promotions are all based on service time. But if there are issues with his rank and claims of desertion, then his rank will be reduced accordingly and charged appropriately under the UCMJ.

146 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 7:34:50am

re: #140 freetoken

Submachine Subway.

Seven-chamber 7-Eleven.

AK K-mart

147 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 7:34:58am
148 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:35:09am

“You mean, someone could walk in off the street into my office with a gun? But that’s preposterous!”

149 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 7:35:16am

re: #146 Feline Fearless Leader

AK K-mart

Home Ammunition Depot

150 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 7:35:42am

re: #144 iossarian

Obvious points are obvious, except that the open carry folks ignore them, and the 2d amendment absolutists ignore that the laws on the books do allow for limitations, including on open carry. It’s time to let the NRA and the OC types that they can’t and shouldn’t get their way.

151 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 7:36:05am

re: #149 Decatur Deb

Blood, bath, and beyond. /

152 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:36:29am

Reload at RE/MAX.

153 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 7:36:47am

re: #151 lawhawk

Blood, bath, and beyond. /

Chili’s Con Carnage

154 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:36:49am

re: #150 lawhawk

Obvious points are obvious, except that the open carry folks ignore them, and the 2d amendment absolutists ignore that the laws on the books do allow for limitations, including on open carry. It’s time to let the NRA and the OC types that they can’t and shouldn’t get their way.

Unfortunately we’re dealing with voters who can’t or won’t understand that the anti-Bergdahl screamers were pro-Bergdahl screamers seven days ago.

155 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:37:03am

re: #153 Decatur Deb

Chili’s Con Carnage

Internet won.

156 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 7:37:38am

re: #139 iossarian

I reckon there’s all kinds of shenanigans behind the scenes of how he came to be in captivity. But to be honest I also don’t really care. If he deserted, fine. If his unit screwed up and the deserting story is just a cover-up, fine. That can all get sorted out by the investigation that is presumably underway, but to me it’s not a big story.

Problem is as we have seen before. The military is very good at covering their butts. So, even if there is an investigation, will it be legit? We don’t have a great history of the actual truth rushing to the front.

157 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:37:55am

re: #151 lawhawk

Blood, bath, and beyond. /

We’ve always called it that in my household.

158 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 7:38:18am

S&W @ A&W.

159 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 7:40:11am

Piggly Quigley Down Under

(It’s a stretch but I had to get Piggly Wiggly in there somehow.)

160 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 7:41:22am

re: #159 iossarian

Piggly Quigley Down Under

(It’s a stretch but I had to get Piggly Wiggly in there somehow.)

A&P Rounds

161 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 7:42:23am

re: #159 iossarian

Piggly Quigley Down Under

(It’s a stretch but I had to get Piggly Wiggly in there somehow.)

Publix Execution

162 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 7:42:25am

re: #137 Bubblehead II

Morning Lizards. Here’s a question. If the Army really had any suspicions about Bergdahl being a deserter, why did they promote him, not once, but twice?

Bergdahl was promoted twice after he was taken prisoner in June 2009. He was promoted to the rank of specialist in June 2010 and then sergeant in June 2011.

And pending the results of the investigation is scheduled for another one.

Report: Bergdahl Scheduled For Promotion

I think it’s a technicality: Captive / POW / MIA Entitlements
The military has done an investigation but there’s been to trial or hearing to definitively categorize him as a deserter so the scheduled promotion paperwork goes through. I think the military can retroactively reverse promotions and accumulated pay if a ruling is made later.

163 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 7:47:09am

Meanwhile in Libya….
Libya: Islamist militias seize PM’s office

Libyan militias loyal to new Prime Minister Ahmed Maiteeq, who is backed by the Muslim Brotherhood, stormed the prime minister’s office on Monday ahead of a planned Supreme Court session to adjudicate the dispute between him and interim Prime Minister Abdullah al-Thinni.

Al-Thinni last week refused to hand power to Maiteeq because of questions over his appointment, and demanded that divided lawmakers resolve the political standoff.

164 wheat-dogghazi  Jun 4, 2014 7:47:12am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

I think it’s a technicality: Captive / POW / MIA Entitlements
The military has done an investigation but there’s been to trial or hearing to definitively categorize him as a deserter so the scheduled promotion paperwork goes through. I think the military can retroactively reverse promotions and accumulated pay if a ruling is made later.

Well, that would suck. “While you were a POW, we promoted you to sergeant. Now that you’re back, we’ve busted you down to Pfc. Welcome back!”

165 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 7:48:40am

re: #164 wheat-dogghazi

Well, that would suck. “While you were a POW, we promoted you to sergeant. Now that you’re back, we’ve busted you down to Pfc. Welcome back!”

There were officers in the Union army in the American Civil War who had ranks up to Major General of Volunteers who went back down to their regular rank of Captain after the war ended.

166 GeneJockey  Jun 4, 2014 7:48:42am

re: #157 iossarian

We’ve always called it that in my household.

Us too.

167 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 7:49:00am

re: #164 wheat-dogghazi

Well, that would suck. “While you were a POW, we promoted you to sergeant. Now that you’re back, we’ve busted you down to Pfc. Welcome back!”

A troubled draftee in my unit muffed a suicide attempt. He was docked “bad time” pay for his time in the hospital and recovery, and had his draft service time extended by that much. Didn’t help his morale.

168 GeneJockey  Jun 4, 2014 7:49:27am

re: #165 Feline Fearless Leader

There were officers in the Union army in the American Civil War who had ranks up to Major General of Volunteers who went back down to their regular rank of Captain after the war ended.

IIRC, Custer was one such, a Brevet General.

169 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 7:50:17am

re: #147 darthstar

[Embedded content]

or please read a Mississippi history book.This is literally the home of Jefferson Davis. Hell it probably helped McDaniel more than it hurt.

170 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 7:51:18am

re: #168 GeneJockey

IIRC, Custer was one such, a Brevet General.

Even now, becoming a general involves several steps. One is called ‘frocking’, which lets them don the uniform and rank, but not yet draw GO pay.

171 The War TARDIS  Jun 4, 2014 7:55:32am

re: #163 Killgore Trout

The Muslim Brotherhood has roughly the popularity of Syphilis in Libya right now. They lost the election, but have down every underhanded trick in the book to seize power. Libya needs to ban their ass when this is over, because the Muslim Brotherhood aren’t going to win. They started in better positions in Tunisia and Egypt, and lost both of them.

172 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 7:56:03am

re: #137 Bubblehead II

Morning Lizards. Here’s a question. If the Army really had any suspicions about Bergdahl being a deserter, why did they promote him, not once, but twice?

Bergdahl was promoted twice after he was taken prisoner in June 2009. He was promoted to the rank of specialist in June 2010 and then sergeant in June 2011.

And pending the results of the investigation is scheduled for another one.

Report: Bergdahl Scheduled For Promotion

That’s something I wonder about too. In any case deserter or not, it was the right thing to bring the guy home.

173 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:00:13am

What annoys me though about the whole Bergdahl thing is the lack of empathy for the guy. Okay, you’ve been a captive of the Taliban five long years. And good news, you’re finally going home. Oh and by the way a bunch of people are calling you a traitor and saying you should be shot. Lots of scummy people out there who are going to make what already one would be a difficult transition back to mainstream society for Sgt. Bergdahl more difficult. I don’t fault the Army for doing an investigation. I do have a problem with wingnut assholes like Todd Kinkannon telling the guy’s father that if Bowe were his son, he’d want him shot or the two faced wingnuts who wanted him released by all means turning on him because they hate the President who secure the release more than anything else.

174 NJDhockeyfan  Jun 4, 2014 8:02:30am
175 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 8:02:50am

re: #142 lawhawk

The one part that the gun nuts always seem to ignore, and the politicians always seem to sneak in is that when they talk about open carry, it’s always everywhere but the place where the politicians work. You can’t bring guns into the legislative office buildings and capitol buildings of those states where open carry is on the books.

Can’t imagine why that’d be the case? Oh wait, it’s common sense. The law enforcement and politicians agree that open carry would create too much of a risk to those in those office buildings to secure them properly, and the politicians don’t want strange folks entering their building with guns.

That they can do so everywhere else? That’s not their problem - 2d Amendment and all that nonsense.

What makes the legislative buildings any more or less important than the department store, mom and pop shop, or other businesses/restaurants for safety from heavily armed folks entering? It’s that these politicians don’t value those lives nearly as much as their own.

Actually Idaho does allow open carry in the Capitol building. Though the last time someone was stupid enough to actually do it, the pro-gun nuts flipped their collective shit.

176 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 8:02:50am

re:
#173
HappyWarrior

These are just very awful people.

177 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:03:08am

re: #174 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Well there’s lunch and dinner for the next two weeks. Now I’m craving fish tacos.

178 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 8:03:24am

re: #168 GeneJockey

IIRC, Custer was one such, a Brevet General.

“Brevet” rank was a sort of unofficial additional rank given temporarily to avoid seniority issues or as a reward pending official approval of a promotion. (I think general officer rank required approval pretty high up in the War Department, or even Congress.)

IIRC, Custer had brevet rank of Major General in the regular army plus Major General of Volunteers since he was a division commander. He reverted to a regular army rank of Captain in 1866. Then promoted to Lt Colonel when taking command of the 7th Cavalry. (Plus a brevet Major General rank again as well at the request of Sheridan.)

The whole brevet system in the US is sort of an odd duck. Basically a way to handle situations where the army was spread too thin to properly officer.

en.wikipedia.org

179 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:04:18am

re: #176 Bulworth

re:
#173
HappyWarrior

These are just very awful people.

They really are. I never thought I’d see a returned POW attacked because Obama freed him but there we go. We’re dealing a truly nasty hatred here that goes beyond mere dislike for party.

180 The War TARDIS  Jun 4, 2014 8:05:19am
181 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 8:06:08am

Mad Office Max

182 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:06:31am

re: #178 Feline Fearless Leader

“Brevet” rank was a sort of unofficial additional rank given temporarily to avoid seniority issues or as a reward pending official approval of a promotion. (I think general officer rank required approval pretty high up in the War Department, or even Congress.)

IIRC, Custer had brevet rank of Major General in the regular army plus Major General of Volunteers since he was a division commander. He reverted to a regular army rank of Captain in 1866. Then promoted to Lt Colonel when taking command of the 7th Cavalry. (Plus a brevet Major General rank again as well at the request of Sheridan.)

The whole brevet system in the US is sort of an odd duck. Basically a way to handle situations where the army was spread too thin to properly officer.

en.wikipedia.org

Indeed, brevet ranks tend to be something done when the Army’s in a pinch for officers sufficiently high enough on the totem pole to command a badly needed unit. Sometimes the promotion is made permanent upon the end of hostilities, other times its just for the duration and the officer returns to his official rank once relieved of duties. It’s generally always a wartime deal, though there’s the occasional instance in peacetime when unforeseen consequences demand the temporary promotion of an officer to fill a slot until a proper replacement can be found.

183 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 8:08:01am

re: #180 The War TARDIS

She’s hot!

//

184 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:10:04am

This talk of brevets though has me with a question for our military history buffs. Would the extremely high number of deaths during the Civil War explain why so many were able to rise through the ranks quickly despite many not having military experience? Hate to use Nathan Bedford Forrest as an example but he was a guy with no military experience at the start of the war who started as a private but ended it a general. You never really read about that during WWII where someone started out a private and made it that far. Hell, you don’t even really read about captains making it that far by WWII’s end. So question I guess, was it the causalities that allowed for such rapid advancement.

185 makeitstop  Jun 4, 2014 8:11:35am

re: #161 Decatur Deb

Publix Execution

You’re on a roll this morning.

186 NJDhockeyfan  Jun 4, 2014 8:12:19am

re: #180 The War TARDIS

[Embedded content]

Brilliant disguise…how did they notice it was a man in that burka?

//

187 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 8:13:59am

re: #173 HappyWarrior

What annoys me though about the whole Bergdahl thing is the lack of empathy for the guy. Okay, you’ve been a captive of the Taliban five long years. And good news, you’re finally going home. Oh and by the way a bunch of people are calling you a traitor and saying you should be shot. Lots of scummy people out there who are going to make what already one would be a difficult transition back to mainstream society for Sgt. Bergdahl more difficult. I don’t fault the Army for doing an investigation. I do have a problem with wingnut assholes like Todd Kinkannon telling the guy’s father that if Bowe were his son, he’d want him shot or the two faced wingnuts who wanted him released by all means turning on him because they hate the President who secure the release more than anything else.

Sadly this has quickly turned into a partisan pissing match and the first thing to go out the window is simple cognitive thinking. We do have a lot of reports that Bergdahl may have deserted but now I’m seeing speculation (without any supporting evidence) that his unit is lying, swift boating and trying to cover up their own wrong doing. Now there’s an automatic assumption that if you believe Bergdahl may have deserted you’re a wingnut falling for some sort of cover up. There’s a lot of bitching about smearing Bergdahl from people willing to smear the rest of his unit as liars. There’s more interest in winning the partisan pissing match than learning what actually happened.

188 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 8:14:55am

re: #184 HappyWarrior

This talk of brevets though has me with a question for our military history buffs. Would the extremely high number of deaths during the Civil War explain why so many were able to rise through the ranks quickly despite many not having military experience? Hate to use Nathan Bedford Forrest as an example but he was a guy with no military experience at the start of the war who started as a private but ended it a general. You never really read about that during WWII where someone started out a private and made it that far. Hell, you don’t even really read about captains making it that far by WWII’s end. So question I guess, was it the causalities that allowed for such rapid advancement.

Partially that, but also heavily political connections. Many volunteer units got to elect their officers - so a local who was popular or who had helped form the regiment often could start at a colonel, major, or captain.

I think Forrest got his officer rank by helping form a unit a little later than his initial service as a private soldier. From there it was promotion by merit, and having some backers to help smooth the way.

Getting above division commander in the Union Army during that period pretty much required being a West Pointer due to internal politics. Some of the early generals (such as Butler) got around this, but by 1864 some very good divisional commanders (such as Logan) got passed over for corps command due to being “political” generals.

189 The War TARDIS  Jun 4, 2014 8:16:30am

re: #183 b.d.

This clown is a coward to the worst degree.

Personally, I want to see him punished. Harshly.

190 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:17:30am

re: #188 Feline Fearless Leader

Partially that, but also heavily political connections. Many volunteer units got to elect their officers - so a local who was popular or who had helped form the regiment often could start at a colonel, major, or captain.

I think Forrest got his officer rank by helping form a unit a little later than his initial service as a private soldier. From there it was promotion by merit, and having some backers to help smooth the way.

Getting above division commander in the Union Army during that period pretty much required being a West Pointer due to internal politics. Some of the early generals (such as Butler) got around this, but by 1864 some very good divisional commanders (such as Logan) got passed over for corps command due to being “political” generals.

Yeah, Forrest got bumped straight up from private to lieutenant colonel by virtue of having enlisted despite being exempt and offering to use his wealth to outfit an entire regiment of cavalry with horses and equipment. Since the Confederacy relied in large part upon volunteers, compared to the North’s reliance mostly on conscription, a lot of leaders who weren’t former US Army officers were men with connections or wealth prior to the war.

191 NJDhockeyfan  Jun 4, 2014 8:17:55am

Abbas has chosen terrorist group Hamas over peace…is getting new offices this week.

192 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 8:18:13am

re: #187 Killgore Trout

Sadly this has quickly turned into a partisan pissing match and the first thing to go out the window is simple cognitive thinking. We do have a lot of reports that Bergdahl may have deserted but now I’m seeing speculation (without any supporting evidence) that his unit is lying, swift boating and trying to cover up their own wrong doing. Now there’s an automatic assumption that if you believe Bergdahl may have deserted you’re a wingnut falling for some sort of cover up. There’s a lot of bitching about smearing Bergdahl for people willing to smear the rest of his unit as liars. There’s more interest in winning the partisan pissing match than learning what actually happened.

Typical.

Most of what I am seeing from the one side is roughly in this priority:
1. The most important thing was that we got him back alive.
2. Once he is checked out and debriefed the Army can follow due process, investigate fully his capture, and make decisions based on the *facts*.
3. There is blowback against the smear campaign that is going on. Bloviating about whether Bergdahl is this, or that, is simply baseless speculation.

193 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:19:03am

re: #187 Killgore Trout

Sadly this has quickly turned into a partisan pissing match and the first thing to go out the window is simple cognitive thinking. We do have a lot of reports that Bergdahl may have deserted but now I’m seeing speculation (without any supporting evidence) that his unit is lying, swift boating and trying to cover up their own wrong doing. Now there’s an automatic assumption that if you believe Bergdahl may have deserted you’re a wingnut falling for some sort of cover up. There’s a lot of bitching about smearing Bergdahl from people willing to smear the rest of his unit as liars. There’s more interest in winning the partisan pissing match than learning what actually happened.

See, it didn’t need to be a partisan pissing contest. The same elected officials who pushed Obama to get him out at all costs are now attacking the guy. I also have a big problem with a major news network (FNC) suggesting his father is a Taliban member.

194 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:19:12am

re: #187 Killgore Trout

Sadly this has quickly turned into a partisan pissing match and the first thing to go out the window is simple cognitive thinking. We do have a lot of reports that Bergdahl may have deserted but now I’m seeing speculation (without any supporting evidence) that his unit is lying, swift boating and trying to cover up their own wrong doing. Now there’s an automatic assumption that if you believe Bergdahl may have deserted you’re a wingnut falling for some sort of cover up. There’s a lot of bitching about smearing Bergdahl for people willing to smear the rest of his unit as liars. There’s more interest in winning the partisan pissing match than learning what actually happened.

Killgore, if I didn’t already have the fresh memory of Jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman in my head to question the veracity of any soldier commenting on the actions of another, I’d still be able to recall events like My Lai, where everybody involved was willing to tell investigators with straight faces that they’d found the little village brimming to the eyes with guns and angry Vietcong.

195 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 8:20:29am

Does everyone remember around the time of the first Gulf war, when many conservatives, veterans groups, military families, media and others said they would never allow their soldiers to be mocked and derided like the returning soldiers of Viet Nam were? They hated all the protests, the name-calling, the outright hate shown for anything military. There would be parades and cities holding events to welcome back their soldiers.

Yeah, I remember that too.

196 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 8:21:23am

re: #190 Targetpractice

Yeah, Forrest got bumped straight up from private to lieutenant colonel by virtue of having enlisted despite being exempt and offering to use his wealth to outfit an entire regiment of cavalry with horses and equipment. Since the Confederacy relied in large part upon volunteers, compared to the North’s reliance mostly on conscription, a lot of leaders who weren’t former US Army officers were men with connections or wealth prior to the war.

Both sides conscripted heavily by 1864, and both were still mainly volunteer forces through the battles of 1863. The Army of the Potomac was close to its lowest manpower level at Gettysburg due to 2-year volunteer enlistments expiring.

And the Union used some extra incentives to get volunteers to re-enlist for the duration at that point; special regiment designations, paid bonuses, and extra leave.

197 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:21:51am

re: #195 ObserverArt

Does everyone remember around the time of the first Gulf war, when many conservatives, veterans groups, military families, media and others said they would never allow their soldiers to be mocked and derided like the returning soldiers of Viet Nam were? They hated all the protests, the name-calling, the outright hate shown for anything military. There would be parades and cities holding events to welcome back their soldiers.

Yeah, I remember that too.

I am old enough to remember when they accused us of hating the troops because we had the audacity to be opposed to the war. Shit, hating on the troops is as pointless as blindly hating the federal government.

198 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:22:25am

re: #195 ObserverArt

Does everyone remember around the time of the first Gulf war, when many conservatives, veterans groups, military families, media and others said they would never allow their soldiers to be mocked and derided like the returning soldiers of Viet Nam were? They hated all the protests, the name-calling, the outright hate shown for anything military. There would be parades and cities holding events to welcome back their soldiers.

Yeah, I remember that too.

I remember the legend of hippies spitting on returning veterans and POWs. Funny how I see no hippies spitting on Bergdahl…

199 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:23:04am

re: #198 Targetpractice

I remember the legend of hippies spitting on returning veterans and POWs. Funny how I see no hippies spitting on Bergdahl…

This quasi hippie is glad he’s home.

200 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 8:24:06am

re: #193 HappyWarrior

See, it didn’t need to be a partisan pissing contest. The same elected officials who pushed Obama to get him out at all costs are now attacking the guy. I also have a big problem with a major news network (FNC) suggesting his father is a Taliban member.

It all goes to feeding the narrative that Obama is a Muslim in disguise. So, he was all about saving a turn-coat soldier and family that has turned against America and gone all Taliban.

Gotta remember that middle name…Hussein!

It’s all they need to know.

201 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:25:21am

re: #6 darthstar

Orly Taitz has over 50,000 votes. Fortunately, that means she’s only getting about 3% of the vote.

graphics.latimes.com

She got 92,995 in total. Is it legal to identify these people? Because they are likely dangerous, mentally unstable, and armed.

202 Skip Intro  Jun 4, 2014 8:25:49am

re: #142 lawhawk

What makes the legislative buildings any more or less important than the department store, mom and pop shop, or other businesses/restaurants for safety from heavily armed folks entering? It’s that these politicians don’t value those lives nearly as much as their own.

Politicians have gophers to go run their errands in places where the little people have to shop, so they’re in no danger from the gun humping lunatics they’ve unleashed upon the general public.

Still, I await the NRA demanding that loaded weapons be allowed in all buildings where politicians conduct their business, as well as the courts. I see no provision in the sacred Second Amendment preventing that. In fact, where does it say you can’t carry loaded weapons onto a commercial airliner?

There are plenty of new frontiers for the lawyers and lobbyists of the NRA to explore.

203 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:25:56am

re: #200 ObserverArt

It all goes to feeding the narrative that Obama is a Muslim in disguise. So, he was all about saving a turn-coat soldier and family that has turned against America and gone all Taliban.

Gotta remember that middle name…Hussein!

It’s all they need to know.

I know and it’s making me increasingly angry and sad at the same time. It makes me think that while this nation continues to come a long way. We’ve got a large number of people who are eager to keep us in the worst elements of the past.

204 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 8:26:26am

re: #201 Dr. Matt

She got 92,995 in total. Is it legal to identify these people? Because they are likely dangerous, mentally unstable, and armed.

Or the 2-3% who simply hate government regardless of its form or efficiency.

205 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 8:26:41am

re: #194 Targetpractice

Killgore, if I didn’t already have the fresh memory of Jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman in my head to question the veracity of any soldier commenting on the actions of another, I’d still be able to recall events like My Lai, where everybody involved was willing to tell investigators with straight faces that they’d found the little village brimming to the eyes with guns and angry Vietcong.

I’ve been thinking of that too and that’s why I’m wary of either side politicizing this to the point where the talking points no longer account for the reality of what happened. Yes, the military and government often advance a narrative that they deem politically advantageous, that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s true.

206 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 8:28:11am

re: #205 Killgore Trout

I’ve been thinking of that too and that’s why I’m wary of either side politicizing this to the point where the talking points no longer account for the reality of what happened. Yes, the military and government often advance a narrative that they deem politically advantageous, that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s true.

So, what are the conflicting narratives you are seeing, and who is promoting which ones?

207 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:29:14am

re: #205 Killgore Trout

I’ve been thinking of that too and that’s why I’m wary of either side politicizing this to the point where the talking points no longer account for the reality of what happened. Yes, the military and government often advance a narrative that they deem politically advantageous, that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s true.

The only narrative I see being advanced so far is one by Republican strategists that this soldier is a deserter, possibly a collaborator, and his life was not worth the release of five Gitmo detainees. The unspoken belief that it would have been better that he was just left to rot in Taliban custody unless they released him, no string attached.

208 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:30:11am

re: #204 Feline Fearless Leader

Or the 2-3% who simply hate government regardless of its form or efficiency.

They must really hate gummit to cast their ballot for someone completely incompetent and unqualified to hold any public position.

209 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:31:09am

re: #208 Dr. Matt

They must really hate gummit to cast their ballot for someone completely incompetent and unqualified to hold any public position.

Well there’s a lot more than 2-3% that do that. The whole Tea Party wave of 2010 was filled with incompetents and unqualifieds who I wouldn’t vote for dog catcher let alone Congress.

210 Charles Johnson  Jun 4, 2014 8:32:04am

re: #187 Killgore Trout

Sure, both sides of this argument are exactly the same.

Pathetic.

211 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:32:33am
212 Skip Intro  Jun 4, 2014 8:32:36am

re: #201 Dr. Matt

She got 92,995 in total. Is it legal to identify these people? Because they are likely dangerous, mentally unstable, and armed.

In CA, your position on the ballot is random. Taitz probably picked up a lot of votes simply by being the first name on the list, because some people actually vote that way.

213 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:33:14am

Anyhow, as for Bergdahl. let the Army do its investigation. If he did in fact desert. Well then he deserves punishment under the military code of justice. If he did not, let’s try to help him readjust to society and not say crap like he was a Taliban sympathizer because he was against the war and that he was learning the language of the country where he was deployed to.

214 freetoken  Jun 4, 2014 8:34:20am

re: #213 HappyWarrior

Regardless of anything else, he was kidnapped and held hostage.

215 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:35:31am

re: #214 freetoken

Regardless of anything else, he was kidnapped and held hostage.

Exactly.

216 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:37:18am

re: #213 HappyWarrior

Anyhow, as for Bergdahl. let the Army do its investigation. If he did in fact desert. Well then he deserves punishment under the military code of justice. If he did not, let’s try to help him readjust to society and not say crap like he was a Taliban sympathizer because he was against the war and that he was learning the language of the country where he was deployed to.

Hell, even if he did desert, there’s the strong possibility that the Army will consider his five years in captivity as “time served” and just cashier him out. Only reason to real court-martial him would be if there was serious evidence to corroborate a charge of collaboration.

217 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:37:29am

I mean for fuck sake we actually got people on major news stations suggesting that POTUS should get impeached over this. If this had happened in the Reagan years, the goddamn right would want Reagan canonized by the Roman Catholic Church right there on the spot. Obama does it? Oh, IMPEACH!

218 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 8:38:27am

re: #207 Targetpractice

The only narrative I see being advanced so far is one by Republican strategists that this soldier is a deserter, possibly a collaborator, and his life was not worth the release of five Gitmo detainees. The unspoken belief that it would have been better that he was just left to rot in Taliban custody unless they released him, no string attached.

Yes, it’s entirely possible that a lot of Republicans are going to have egg on their faces. They’d be better off acknowledging the reality that he needed to be retrieved and either offer a reasonable alternative or acknowledge the unpleasant prisoner swap was a necessity.
At the same time I would have advised the White House (unless they know something we don’t) to temper their talking to points to something like “We looked at all the options and this is the best we could do. ” I think Susan Rice’s statement that Berdahl served with honor and distinction don’t wuite match the evidence we have. It seem likely that he at least made some careless mistakes and possibly willfully put others at risk. Just a little distance is all that’s needed, some vague statements about ‘we’ll learn more soon” .

219 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:38:28am

re: #187 Killgore Trout

Sadly this has quickly turned into a partisan pissing match and the first thing to go out the window is simple cognitive thinking.

“Partisan pissing match”? RWNJs are fuming that the POTUS brought home one of his troops while the progressives……well, the progressives are happy that a POW is returned alive. Sorry, the only “people” making this a “partisan pissing match” are the conservatives. In fact, as noted here and elsewhere, many of the same conservatives that are lambasting our POTUS for getting our POW home, were demanding action not that long ago. The “partisan pissing match” is just another case of Blacktracking and Obama Derangement Syndrome.

220 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:38:36am

re: #216 Targetpractice

Hell, even if he did desert, there’s the strong possibility that the Army will consider his five years in captivity as “time served” and just cashier him out. Only reason to real court-martial him would be if there was serious evidence to corroborate a charge of collaboration.

Yep. I feel for the guy, I really do. To put things in perspective, he was a captive longer than our whole involvement in WWII plus a year and change.

221 bratwurst  Jun 4, 2014 8:39:57am

re: #187 Killgore Trout

Sadly this has quickly turned into a partisan pissing match and the first thing to go out the window is simple cognitive thinking.

re: #205 Killgore Trout

I’m wary of either side politicizing this to the point where the talking points no longer account for the reality of what happened.

A broken record

222 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:40:00am

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Yes, it’s entirely possible that a lot of Republicans are going to have egg on their faces. They’d be better off acknowledging the reality that he needed to be retrieved and either offer a reasonable alternative or acknowledge the unpleasant prisoner swap was a necessity.
At the same time I would have advised the White House (unless they know something we don’t) to temper their talking to points to something like “We looked at all the options and this is the best we could do. ” I think Susan Rice’s statement that Berdahl served with honor and distinction don’t wuite match the evidence we have. It seem likely that he at least made some careless mistakes and possibly willfully put others at risk. Just a little distance is all that’s needed, some vague statements about ‘we’ll learn more soon” .

You’re suggesting that the White House and Democrats were wrong in saying that a soldier, a man who volunteered to serve his country in time of war, served with honor and distinction? Do you believe that the White House is trying to push a narrative that Bergdahl’s actions were totally honorable and any suggestion otherwise is a lie?

223 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:41:54am

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Yes, it’s entirely possible that a lot of Republicans are going to have egg on their faces. They’d be better off acknowledging the reality that he needed to be retrieved and either offer a reasonable alternative or acknowledge the unpleasant prisoner swap was a necessity.
At the same time I would have advised the White House (unless they know something we don’t) to temper their talking to points to something like “We looked at all the options and this is the best we could do. ” I think Susan Rice’s statement that Berdahl served with honor and distinction don’t wuite match the evidence we have. It seem likely that he at least made some careless mistakes and possibly willfully put others at risk. Just a little distance is all that’s needed, some vague statements about ‘we’ll learn more soon” .

Are you seriously going to compare Rice saying that Bergdahl served with honor and distinction with Boehner who wants a hearing on this? What the hell is the WH supposed to say and yes I do think he did serve with honor. He got captured and did try to escape. No, we don’t know if he deserted or not but there’s not a damn thing wrong or comparable to the attacks on the administration and Bergdahl with Rice saying that.

224 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:42:28am

Really this is some weak MBF.

225 makeitstop  Jun 4, 2014 8:42:39am

Here we go again.

226 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 8:43:12am

OMG! MBF! Outrage!
Inconsistencies from both sides in Bergdahl release

227 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 8:44:18am

BTW, how’s the newest latest Benghazi hearing going? Has the Truth finally been discovered? /

228 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 8:44:44am

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Do you acknowledge that the whole brouhaha is but Republican politicking? Why would anyone even still be talking about the guy right now if not for them? The whole topic is beyond boring.

229 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:45:01am

re: #226 Killgore Trout

OMG! MBF! Outrage!
Inconsistencies from both sides in Bergdahl release

It is MBFing to do the both sides when one side is merely welcoming a soldier home and the other has people demanding that the president who got him released be impeached. Sorry if that uncomfortable truth “outrages” you.

230 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 8:45:23am

re: #207 Targetpractice

The only narrative I see being advanced so far is that one by Republican strategists that this soldier is a deserter, possibly a collaborator, and his life was not worth the release of five Gitmo detainees. The unspoken belief that it would have been better that he was just left to rot in Taliban custody unless they released him, no string attached.

And the effect of this can be seen all over the internet.
Mainstream news website comments tell the sorry tale.

6 • Reply•Share >
Avatar
Blue Hoss NorthlanderLJ • 2 hours ago
Hang Him….High!

4 • Reply•Share >
Avatar
Lore Earll • a day ago
TRAITOR. He’d better not leave this town full of absolute MORONS because the rest of the world isn’t fooled. He’s a traitor and should be HUNG.

6 • Reply•Share >
Avatar
The Nephilim Lore Earll • a day ago
HANG’EM HIGH

231 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:45:24am

re: #226 Killgore Trout

OMG! MBF! Outrage!
Inconsistencies from both sides in Bergdahl release

Weak. Very. Did you even read it? The only “partisan pissing match” is coming from the right…..as usual.

232 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 4, 2014 8:46:28am

Latest news out of MS is that Thad Cochran and Chris McDaniel are likely heading to a runoff.

Here’s a statistic that should drive home how politically slanted this state is:

Total number of votes in District 4 Democratic primary: 10 400
Total number of votes In District 4 Republican primary: 103 000

233 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 8:46:37am

re: #228 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Do you acknowledge that the whole brouhaha is but Republican politicking? Why would anyone even still be talking about the guy right now if not for them? The whole topic is beyond boring.

No, I don’t put mch stock into what Republicans are saying but I am interested in the first hand accounts of those who served with him or are familiar with the investigation.

234 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:47:45am

re: #233 Killgore Trout

No, I don’t put mch stock into what Republicans are saying but I am interested in the first hand accounts of those who served with him or are familiar with the investigation.

Yes, because Pat Tillman’s unit, who provided first hand accounts, were very accurate and forthcoming.

235 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:47:48am

re: #226 Killgore Trout

OMG! MBF! Outrage!
Inconsistencies from both sides in Bergdahl release

Funny, the article mentions nothing about Rice’s comments. It in fact seems to focus entirely on the details of the prisoner swap, namely that Republicans are suddenly against the very suggestion of a swap, while the White House is arguing that it has the authority to make a decision when time is crucial.

236 gwangung  Jun 4, 2014 8:48:04am

re: #233 Killgore Trout

No, I don’t put mch stock into what Republicans are saying but I am interested in the first hand accounts of those who served with him or are familiar with the investigation.

Best done when the statements are in court or in administrative review when they are properly cross -examined; relying on “summaries” is not very wise.

237 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 4, 2014 8:48:14am

Tornado warnings suck.
Fortunately, this particular storm is about 15-20 miles north of me.

238 Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 4, 2014 8:48:17am

The current scenario is actually interesting. They are currently counting absentee and affidavit ballots.

An affidavit ballot, is of course, a ballot submitted by someone who did not have a proper photo ID at the polls yesterday and must show one to an MS elections official within a few days in order for their vote to officially count.

239 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:48:48am

re: #233 Killgore Trout

No, I don’t put mch stock into what Republicans are saying but I am interested in the first hand accounts of those who served with him or are familiar with the investigation.

And yet, nowhere have we seen Democrats suggesting that the men in Bergdahl’s unit are lying about him. Yet we have Republicans shopping them around to call the man everything from a deserter to a collaborator.

240 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 8:49:07am

re: #233 Killgore Trout

No, I don’t put mch stock into what Republicans are saying but I am interested in the first hand accounts of those who served with him or are familiar with the investigation.

That’s the point. Why would you be interested in the first hand accounts about Bergdahl in the first place? Why would anyone at this point?

241 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 8:49:59am

re: #224 HappyWarrior

Really this is some weak MBF.

Youtube Video

242 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:50:16am

re: #240 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

That’s the point. Why would you be interested in the first hand accounts about Bergdahl in the first place? Why would anyone at this point?

Why would anybody take them at their word in the first place? Haven’t we been burned enough times in the past to be automatically skeptical of anything a soldier has to say other than under oath?

243 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 8:50:42am

re: #226 Killgore Trout

OMG! MBF! Outrage!
Inconsistencies from both sides in Bergdahl release

The article has nothing to do with Bergdahl’s roll in his capture. Good try at deflection though.

You keep talking about evidence for desertion but there really is only speculation at this point.

Did he leave the post? Sure, but that alone does not mean he deserted.

244 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 8:51:04am

Let’s just face it, it’s not a story about Bergdahl, it’s a story about the Republican freak out about Bergdahl.

245 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:51:19am

re: #239 Targetpractice

And yet, nowhere have we seen Democrats suggesting that the men in Bergdahl’s unit are lying about him. Yet we have Republicans shopping them around to call the man everything from a deserter to a collaborator.

Exactly. This is why this both sides are just as bad/wrong here is particularly stupid in regards to this story. The “worst” is Rice saying that Bergdahl served with honor and distinction. Compare that with those in the Republican Party who are already convinced that he deserted and some who even think he was a collaborator despite them not that long ago wanting POTUS to do all he could to get him freed. This isn’t both sides do it. This is one side exposing itself for the assholes they are.

246 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:52:18am

Just last month the conservatives were rallying behind Cliven Bundy only to end up with massive amounts of egg on their face. It’s only a matter of time before the same thing happens to them regarding Bergdahl. They.never.learn.

247 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:53:47am

re: #246 Dr. Matt

Just last month the conservatives were rallying behind Cliven Bundy only to end up with massive amounts of egg on their face. It’s only a matter of time before the same thing happens to them regarding Bergdahl. They.never.learn.

They’ll be claiming they supported Bergdahl all along. If they could have contained their anti-Obama ragegasms for once, they may have come out of this actually looking like decent human beings who don’t react to events by sheer hatred of who lives at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

248 darthstar  Jun 4, 2014 8:53:55am

re: #246 Dr. Matt

Just last month the conservatives were rallying behind Cliven Bundy only to end up with massive amounts of egg on their face. It’s only a matter of time before the same thing happens to them regarding Bergdahl. They.never.learn.

They’ll never learn so long as the President is still black. It’s too bad we don’t have another African American contender waiting in the wings for 2016.

249 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 8:54:14am

He could be a deserter or a hero, for all I care - because I don’t.

250 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 8:55:02am

re: #244 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Let’s just face it, it’s not a story about Bergdahl, it’s a story about the Republican freak out about Bergdahl.

Yup. Exactly. And sadly the so-called librul media like MSNBC and CNN are jumping into the fray to help elevate the fake outrage.

251 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 8:55:12am

re: #218 Killgore Trout

At the same time I would have advised the White House (unless they know something we don’t) to temper their talking to points to something like “We looked at all the options and this is the best we could do. “

Yeah, hard to imagine they might know something we don’t. //

I think Susan Rice’s statement that Berdahl served with honor and distinction don’t wuite match the evidence we have.

OFFS, “we” have evidence? There was a previous investigation, but the results are classified so “we” don’t have squat. A new investigation will be opened, but until it’s completed all we have is a bunch of hearsay.

Army will conduct ‘comprehensive’ review of Bergdahl disappearance, captivity

WASHINGTON — The Army will conduct a “comprehensive” review of the disappearance and subsequent capture of Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl by Taliban forces in 2009, the service announced Tuesday afternoon.

Pentagon spokesman Col. Steve Warren told reporters Tuesday morning that an Article 15-6 investigation into Bergdahl’s disappearance had been conducted, but it is closed and the results are classified.

That investigation was conducted by Combined Joint Task Force-82 in Afghanistan.

It could be awhile before the new review is launched.

“Our first priority is ensuring Sgt. Bergdahl’s health and beginning his reintegration process. There is no timeline for this, and we will take as long as medically necessary to aid his recovery … The Army will then review this in a comprehensive, coordinated effort that will include speaking with Sgt. Bergdahl to better learn from him the circumstances of his disappearance and captivity,” Secretary of the Army John McHugh said in a statement. […]

stripes.com

252 makeitstop  Jun 4, 2014 8:57:42am

Not this shit again…

253 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 8:57:58am

Honestly, I think if the Army had any inkling he deserted or was a collaborator, they wouldn’t have promoted him.

254 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 8:59:50am

re: #253 HappyWarrior

Honestly, I think if the Army had any inkling he deserted or was a collaborator, they wouldn’t have promoted him.

It seems odd that the Army, if they really believed him a deserter and/or collaborator, chose not to classify him as such by now. It could be that the previous investigation simply did not find enough evidence to support either charge. We probably won’t know for months or years.

255 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 9:00:04am

re: #244 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Let’s just face it, it’s not a story about Bergdahl, it’s a story about the Republican freak out about Bergdahl.

I agree, but would also add that the entire goddamn media has added to the freak out.

It is disgusting.

256 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 9:00:28am

re: #255 blueraven

I agree, but would also add that the entire goddamn media has added to the freak out.

It is disgusting.

The media’s part of the damned problem.

257 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 9:01:27am

re: #254 Targetpractice

It seems odd that the Army, if they really believed him a deserter and/or collaborator, chose not to classify him as such by now. It could be that the previous investigation simply did not find enough evidence to support either charge. We probably won’t know for months or years.

This is my thought too. We’ll see what happens. In any case, we did the right thing getting him back. The military prides itself on leaving no man behind. Funny how the uber patriots ignore that principle when it comes to a POTUS they don’t like getting involved with that.

258 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 9:02:56am

Let’s see. Members of Bergdahl’s military unit who were around 5 years ago and have had the ability to expound on their views for the past 5 years, versus the guy who has yet to make a public statement on his own behalf. The chairborne brigades have already tried and convicted Bergdahl based on hearsay by those other members in the unit, even though the investigation as to what happened will only be complete after Bergdahl has been debriefed and given his statement. If charges are pending, then we’ll hear that Bergdahl has been allowed to retain a lawyer for proceedings, etc.

The same members of that unit are shopping around their stories via a GOP operative. There’s no partisan action there. /Jedi hand wave.

I’ll wait to see the full results of the Army investigation, even though the right wing has already gone and convicted him even though no charges have been filed, let alone an investigation completed.

259 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 9:04:14am

re: #254 Targetpractice

It seems odd that the Army, if they really believed him a deserter and/or collaborator, chose not to classify him as such by now. It could be that the previous investigation simply did not find enough evidence to support either charge. We probably won’t know for months or years.

There is a process for that kind of situation: “Suspension of Favorable Personnel Actions”. They didn’t use it.

apd.army.mil

260 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 9:04:27am

re: #257 HappyWarrior

You can complain that we gave up too many Taliban detainees for Bergdahl. That we might have been able to get away with giving up some number less than 5, but we aren’t entirely privy to those negotiations and what was asked/offered.

261 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 9:04:59am
262 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 9:08:32am

re: #260 lawhawk

You can complain that we gave up too many Taliban detainees for Bergdahl. That we might have been able to get away with giving up some number less than 5, but we aren’t entirely privy to those negotiations and what was asked/offered.

Armchair Diplomacy. I will tell you what was refreshing was a former Bush administration official saying they would have done the same thing and totally in effect telling Cheney that he’s basically a dick who will question anything the Obama administration does.

263 kirkspencer  Jun 4, 2014 9:10:40am

re: #257 HappyWarrior

This is my thought too. We’ll see what happens. In any case, we did the right thing getting him back. The military prides itself on leaving no man behind. Funny how the uber patriots ignore that principle when it comes to a POTUS they don’t like getting involved with that.

There’s a bit in every RWNJ’s favorite military science fiction novel, Starship Troopers, that I’ve been using to bring several up short.

A trooper in basic runs rampant - kidnapping, murder, the works. ‘Why did we insist the civilians turn him over so we could hang him? Because he is ours, and the military takes care of its own, for good and ill.’

Bergdahl is ours and we take care of our own, regardless what the story turns out to be.

264 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 9:11:55am

re: #253 HappyWarrior

Honestly, I think if the Army had any inkling he deserted or was a collaborator, they wouldn’t have promoted him.

I asked about this back at 137. Consensus seems to be that without any compelling evidence of wrong doing on Bergdahl’s part, he was due those promotions and was thus given them. BTW, thanks to those Lizards that responded.

265 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 9:12:14am

re: #260 lawhawk

You can complain that we gave up too many Taliban detainees for Bergdahl. That we might have been able to get away with giving up some number less than 5, but we aren’t entirely privy to those negotiations and what was asked/offered.

The president could have traded a turkey sandwich and the RWNJs would have bitched that it was too much…..he could have used store brand turkey instead of Boar’s Head.

266 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Jun 4, 2014 9:15:03am

If Bergdahl did desert then he should face those charges but the freakout would be comical if it wasn’t so sad. I guess it should be expected at this point and for the foreseeable future.

267 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:16:14am

re: #240 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

That’s the point. Why would you be interested in the first hand accounts about Bergdahl in the first place? Why would anyone at this point?

I think the circumstances of his capture are relevant to the story.

268 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 9:17:23am

And now Fox is trying to float a new twist on the swap, citing “military intelligence sources” who say that the White House also considered pursuing a cash ransom before pushing forward with a prisoner swap, didn’t consult the intel community on the dangers of releasing these prisoners, and that Panetta and Clapper disapproved of the swap.

Gotta love those conveniently nameless “sources.”

269 lawhawk  Jun 4, 2014 9:17:30am

re: #262 HappyWarrior

Yes, seeing one of the Bush officials saying they’d do the same thing was refreshing, in part, because they did far more - they released Taliban without any quid pro quo.

And what we know about the five doesn’t entirely stand up to scrutiny. There’s lots of conflicting information about the five who were released, but here’s a pretty comprehensive take on a couple of those involved, including Mullah Fazl. Several other outlets claim that both Fazl and Mullah Norullah Noori engaged in mass murder of civilians, which would be a war crimes.

270 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:17:36am

re: #237 Backwoods_Sleuth

Tornado warnings suck.
Fortunately, this particular storm is about 15-20 miles north of me.

So, it’s starting is it? I woke up to all day warnings for at least the southern half of Ohio, and they did say the Ohio River area would be the main zone for nastiness.

Buckle up…could be a rough one.

271 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:17:49am

re: #251 CuriousLurker

A new investigation will be opened, but until it’s completed all we have is a bunch of hearsay.

Agreed

272 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 9:18:00am

re: #264 Bubblehead II

I haven’t read through all the earlier comments in this thread yet, so I haven’t seen the answers others gave you, but here’s something from the article I linked to in my #251:

Dempsey also told the AP that Bergdahl’s promotion to staff sergeant, which was expected soon, won’t necessarily happen because he is longer missing in action, and therefore is no longer eligible for automatic promotions.

Army officials would not discuss Bergdahl’s promotion status on-the-record when contacted by Stars and Stripes. […]

273 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 9:18:09am

re: #267 Killgore Trout

I think the circumstances of his capture are relevant to the story.

How? Besides this MBF that the White House was wrong to describe his service as honorable?

274 A Mom Anon  Jun 4, 2014 9:18:21am

re: #258 lawhawk

Here’s what gets me about this:

First, do we even know the guys splashed all over the TV are in any way legit? Were they vetted? By whom? And why in the ever loving hell are Republican political consultants the ones who got them interviews with Our Shitty Media outlets? That last question is the one that I keep coming back to. A guy who worked on Mitt Freaking Romney’s presidential campaign has his grimy mitts(heh) all over this and no one is batting an eyelash?

Now, this next thing could be complete bullshit or not, so I don’t know, but it’s been hinted at that there’s proof that this whole desertion thing is a lie and that Bergdahl was captured while leaving his post to go to the bathroom. It came up a few times on the radio this morning (and granted this was by callers to talk radio, so who the hell knows), but I haven’t had the time to investigate that yet. There also seems to be some sort of Tillman like twist to this story in that the guys in his unit weren’t real fond of his opinions and the way he went about things. In other words, the investigation into this hasn’t even really got rolling yet, and even if it does, how much the public will ever know is questionable.

Beyond all of that, the guy is coming home, that really should be the end of the bullshit. But of course, now that the Usual Suspects have sunk their rotten fangs into this, the guy and his family are going to be harassed for god knows how long once he’s finally back in Idaho.

275 gwangung  Jun 4, 2014 9:20:27am

re: #267 Killgore Trout

I think the circumstances of his capture are relevant to the story.

Then you’ll have to wait, because they certainly are NOT out there right now.

276 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 9:20:53am

re: #275 gwangung

Then you’ll have to wait, because they certainly are NOT out there right now.

But his *concern* certainly is.
:p

277 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 9:22:09am

re: #269 lawhawk

Yes, seeing one of the Bush officials saying they’d do the same thing was refreshing, in part, because they did far more - they released Taliban without any quid pro quo.

And what we know about the five doesn’t entirely stand up to scrutiny. There’s lots of conflicting information about the five who were released, but here’s a pretty comprehensive take on a couple of those involved, including Mullah Fazl. Several other outlets claim that both Fazl and Mullah Norullah Noori engaged in mass murder of civilians, which would be a war crimes.

I don’t disagree that these guys were terrible humans, but they were POWs for 10 years and they hadn’t been charged in civilian or military courts during that time. Why?

278 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:22:10am

re: #244 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Let’s just face it, it’s not a story about Bergdahl, it’s a story about the Republican freak out about Bergdahl.

That and to heap as much garbage as possible on Obama.

By the way, if Killgore uses a Magic Balance Fairy scale, he must have a thumb on one of the platters.

279 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 9:25:33am

re: #278 ObserverArt

That and to heap as much garbage as possible on Obama.

By the way, if Killgore uses a Magic Balance Fairy scale, he must have a thumb on one of the platters.

280 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:27:49am

re: #244 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Let’s just face it, it’s not a story about Bergdahl, it’s a story about the Republican freak out about Bergdahl.

Yes, I understand a lot of people see it that way but I’m not terribly interested in what Sarah Palin has to say or which side has the goofiest beards because it doesn’t help my understanding of what actually happened.

281 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:27:57am

re: #250 Dr. Matt

Yup. Exactly. And sadly the so-called librul media like MSNBC and CNN are jumping into the fray to help elevate the fake outrage.

Chris Matthews is a fine example. He was all enraged last night. I did not see Monday’s show.

I don’t watch him all the time, but I notice over the last few weeks the couple times I caught the show he has been an insufferable dick to his guests. That would be more so than usual.

I’m beginning to wonder if there has been a dictate given to him and others that there is a new way at MSNBC…the Comcast way.

282 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 9:28:32am

re: #267 Killgore Trout

I think the circumstances of his capture are relevant to the story.

Zzz. Still missing the point. The whole freaking story is irrelevant.

283 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:29:14am

re: #281 ObserverArt

Chris Matthews is a fine example. He was all enraged last night. I did not see Monday’s show.

I don’t watch him all the time, but I notice over the last few weeks the couple times I caught the show he has been an insufferable dick to his guests. That would be more so than usual.

I’m beginning to wonder if there has been a dictate given to him and others that there is a new way at MSNBC…the Comcast way.

I saw a headline from Mondowiess this morning accusing him of being a warmonger and neocon.

284 BeenHereAwhile  Jun 4, 2014 9:31:42am

re: #69 A Mom Anon

On a slightly more hopeful note in GA, Michelle Nunn (D) is holding good numbers in our race for the Senate here. She’s going to be facing either Jack Kingston or David Perdue, both trying to out wingnut each other to pieces in the run off. Which gives her a bit more time to make an impact before the winner turns their sights on her.

For governor, it looks like Nathan Deal (R- Corrupt as Hell Bastard) still has better numbers than Jason Carter (D-Who needs to spend some money on a campaign, I’ve seen no ads or anything from him yet). Deal seems to be wearing a Teflon suit. He just got hammered for buying an endorsement from a publication saying he’s creating all these great jobs here by making GA more “business friendly”. Hasn’t phased him a bit. Figures.

Dems don’t spend money here, we’re written off as hopeless outside of Atlanta and maybe Athens. Not sure how things will ever change without an investment of some sort.

Haven’t lived in Middle GA in 15 years, so am curious how much cross-over voting, if-any takes place in GA general elections today.

As I’ve posted before, Michelle Nunn would appear to appeal to the traditional rural democratic base, given her family’s middle GA political background.

285 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:33:19am

Chuck Todd: WH Thinks People Are Trying to ‘Swift Boat’ Bergdahl
I’ll take this with a grain of salt. Todd’s report yesterday about the White House expecting euphoria is pretty questionable too. I’m pretty sure the White House expected some reaction but I suspect they could have fine tuned their talking points better.

286 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 9:35:31am

re: #269 lawhawk

Yes, seeing one of the Bush officials saying they’d do the same thing was refreshing, in part, because they did far more - they released Taliban without any quid pro quo.

And what we know about the five doesn’t entirely stand up to scrutiny. There’s lots of conflicting information about the five who were released, but here’s a pretty comprehensive take on a couple of those involved, including Mullah Fazl. Several other outlets claim that both Fazl and Mullah Norullah Noori engaged in mass murder of civilians, which would be a war crimes.

Somebody just posted CNN’s take on the five prisoners and not a one is even alleged to have American blood on their hands. Two were arrested while helping our forces, two others surrendered, and none of them is charged with a crime against the US. “Worst of the worst,” my ass.

287 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 9:36:15am

re: #272 CuriousLurker

CL, you mentioned Mulla Nusreddin a coupla threads back, in ex-USSR he is mostly known as Hodja Nasreddin, this variant of the name popularized by Leonid Soloviev’s books about him, as well as by the subsequent half a dozen or so films (this one being the most popular, unfortunately without any subtitled versions available). Interesting how folkloric elements travel around the world.

288 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 9:36:38am

re: #285 Killgore Trout

Chuck Todd: WH Thinks People Are Trying to ‘Swift Boat’ Bergdahl
I’ll take this with a grain of salt. Todd’s report yesterday about the White House expecting euphoria is pretty questionable too. I’m pretty sure the White House expected some reaction but I suspect they could have fine tuned their talking points better.

Killgore, have you anything to contribute today besides concern trolling? Do you have anything to accuse the White House of besides not choosing their words carefully when speaking about Bergdahl?

289 The War TARDIS  Jun 4, 2014 9:36:47am

re: #286 Targetpractice

But my question would be, what did they do to the Afghans.

290 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 9:37:56am

re: #289 The War TARDIS

But my question would be, what did they do to the Afghans.

Legally, that’s not our concern. Whatever crimes they are alleged to have committed against the Afghan people have to be referred either to the UN or to the Afghan government. We do not have the legal jurisdiction to try them for crimes against the Afghan people.

291 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:38:19am

re: #289 The War TARDIS

But my question would be, what did they do to the Afghans.

What they did is already known, what they’re going to do remains to be seen.

292 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 9:38:28am

Chuck Todd owns 8 pairs of GOP knee-pads, one for each day of the week and a back-up pair.

293 BeenHereAwhile  Jun 4, 2014 9:38:57am

re: #153 Decatur Deb

Chili’s Con Carnage

Burger Grenade

294 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 9:39:57am

re: #280 Killgore Trout

Yes, I understand a lot of people see it that way but I’m not terribly interested in what Sarah Palin has to say or which side has the goofiest beards because it doesn’t help my understanding of what actually happened.

Tired shtick is tired.

295 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 9:39:58am

re: #274 A Mom Anon

We don’t know squat and we’re not gonna know squat until the Army is done investigating everything. As someone already pointed out, that could be months or even years. Again, from the same Stars and Stripes article I referenced earlier (it’s an excellent article, very informative):

“As for the circumstances of his capture … we’ll learn the facts,” Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Martin Dempsey said in a statement on his Facebook page. “Our Army’s leaders will not look away from misconduct if it occurred.” […]

In his Facebook statement, Dempsey said the military would “learn the facts” about Bergdahl’s capture “when he is able to provide them.”

The U.S. military plans to dedicate a lot of resources to facilitate Bergdahl’s reintegration. The Landstuhl Regional Medical Center in Germany, where Bergdahl has been receiving care since his arrival Sunday, said in a statement that the team of personnel who will assist in the soldier’s reintegration will likely involve hundreds of people — including Army investigators and attorneys — from multiple branches of the military. […]

Until a report on the results of the investigation is released by the military, everything else is just gossip & speculation. It’s really waste of time to keep rehashing non-facts, but since the right seems to have designated this as their new political football, I guess we’re gonna hear about it ad nauseum.

296 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 9:42:10am

re: #285 Killgore Trout

Chuck Todd: WH Thinks People Are Trying to ‘Swift Boat’ Bergdahl
I’ll take this with a grain of salt. Todd’s report yesterday about the White House expecting euphoria is pretty questionable too. I’m pretty sure the White House expected some reaction but I suspect they could have fine tuned their talking points better.<

B.S. It doesn’t matter what was said or what wasn’t said, the RW sycophants would have lashed out at this administration. If the POTUS didn’t have a Rose Garden announcement and left it to a Pentagon press release, the right-wingers would have been screeching that the POTUS was hiding, or not forthcoming, or was afraid, etc., etc.,

297 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 9:43:02am

re: #287 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

CL, you mentioned Mulla Nusreddin a coupla threads back, in ex-USSR he is mostly known as Hodja Nasreddin, this variant of the name popularized by Leonid Soloviev’s books about him, as well as by the subsequent half a dozen or so films (this one being the most popular, unfortunately without any subtitled versions available). Interesting how folkloric elements travel around the world.

I’m familiar with a bunch of the anecdotes from an old on-line “fortune cookie” program that resided on a VAX machine I used. A number of Nusriddin (referred to as Nasruddin I think) anecdotes where in that program’s text results if you ran it.

298 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 9:43:23am

Okay the WH doesn’t call him a hero who serves his country honorably. I guarantee you that someone read McCain would get puffy about that. Sooner or later this shit just has to stop. And I do blame the right and Republican Party for turning a non-political story into an attack story.

299 iossarian  Jun 4, 2014 9:45:06am

re: #296 Dr. Matt

B.S. It doesn’t matter what was said or what wasn’t said, the RW sycophants would have lashed out at this administration. If the POTUS didn’t have a Rose Garden announcement and left it to a Pentagon press release, the right-wingers would have been screeching that the POTUS was hiding, or not forthcoming, or was afraid, etc., etc.,

Quite literally, in this case, Obama is being attacked for doing something that the attackers were asking him to do, right up to the moment at which he did it.

There’s no way to respond to that intelligently.

300 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:45:44am

re: #295 CuriousLurker

We don’t know squat and we’re not gonna know squat until the Army is done investigating everything. As someone already pointed out, that could be months or even years. Again, from the same Stars and Stripes article I referenced earlier (it’s an excellent article, very informative):

Until a report on the results of the investigation is released by the military, everything else is just gossip & speculation. It’s really waste of time to keep rehashing non-facts, but since the right seems to have designated this as their new political football, I guess we’re gonna hear about it ad nauseum.

And even after that…we can’t be sure we really know what happened. You mention years. Well, it could be years after the years it takes the military to produce a report before the real info trickles out. All the damage will have already been done and everyone will not be looking for the real facts after all that time.

301 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 9:45:55am

Frankly, how aren’t people trying to swift boat him? If you listened only to the right, you’d think that Bowe Bergdahl was another John Walker Lindh not a guy who signed up for our military. A lot of the criticisms of him from his fellow service members are on silly stuff like him not being a drinker and BBQ eater. As for the beards, i don’t care either but it wasn’t me that had people on my news station claiming that the man’s father’s beard made him look like a Taliban member all the while my network in the past has had on the Robertson clan with their similar beards without any questions about their beards. It’s not both sides do it. It’s one side acting out here.

302 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 9:46:09am

re: #299 iossarian

Quite literally, in this case, Obama is being attacked for doing something that the attackers were asking him to do, right up to the moment at which he did it.

There’s no way to respond to that intelligently.

There is, but it’s fairly obscene for a presidential statement.

303 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 9:46:45am

re: #287 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

CL, you mentioned Mulla Nusreddin a coupla threads back, in ex-USSR he is mostly known as Hodja Nasreddin, this variant of the name popularized by Leonid Soloviev’s books about him, as well as by the subsequent half a dozen or so films (this one being the most popular, unfortunately without any subtitled versions available). Interesting how folkloric elements travel around the world.

It is indeed interesting. I have a book called World Tales that delves into many familiar tales, each one preceded by an introduction tracing its history around the world. It’s a fun, fascinating read. We’re not as different as we think. ;)

304 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 9:46:46am

re: #295 CuriousLurker

since the right seems to have designated this as their new political football, I guess we’re gonna hear about it ad nauseum.

Wait, what exactly are you saying here?

/

305 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 9:46:47am

re:
#298
HappyWarrior

Obama doesn’t have Bergdahl’s parents over to the WH or announce the safe return of Bergdahl himself—-

Y does Obumo hate real Americans who live in Idaho??? Is Obama ashamed of Bergdahl???! Why does HE hate are troopses???!??!?

306 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:48:08am

re: #299 iossarian

Quite literally, in this case, Obama is being attacked for doing something that the attackers were asking him to do, right up to the moment at which he did it.

There’s no way to respond to that intelligently.

It’s the old Lucy holding the football for Charlie Brown to kick it this time thing.

307 Belafon  Jun 4, 2014 9:48:39am

I was expecting an epic front page on this one from Greenwald: What Excuse Remains for Obama’s Failure to Close GITMO?

308 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 9:49:03am

re: #303 CuriousLurker

Well, there *is* this after all. ;)

309 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 9:49:28am

re:
#299
Iossarian

Exactly

310 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 9:50:56am

I mean at this point. You just want to say fuck it. Obama gets Bin Laden? ANd there they were acting like it wasn’t a big deal even though Bin Laden evaded the US for the last two years of Clinton’s presidency and Bush’s whole presidency. There they were. accusing Obama of spiking the football for showing joy in the fact OBL was dead. There they were being upset since the photos weren’t released to the public or in the even morbid cases upset that the body wasn’t brought home so they could get some petty revenge.

311 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 9:52:04am

re: #307 Belafon

I was expecting an epic front page on this one from Greenwald: What Excuse Remains for Obama’s Failure to Close GITMO?

You could make that Page!

312 Belafon  Jun 4, 2014 9:52:59am

re: #311 wrenchwench

If I were at home, I would. Someone else can have the credit if they want it.

313 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 9:53:11am

re: #307 Belafon

I was expecting an epic front page on this one from Greenwald: What Excuse Remains for Obama’s Failure to Close GITMO?

What a rambling pill of excrement. He’s upset that President Obama hasn’t closed Gitmo….even though he can’t without congressional approval. Then rants about indefinite detention though 5 prisoners were just released but GG claims he broke the law by releasing them without congressional approval. What a circular mindfuck of idiocy.

314 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 9:53:23am

re: #304 wrenchwench

Wait, what exactly are you saying here?

/

Gives a whole new meaning to “green footballs” doesn’t it? //

315 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 9:53:48am

re: #296 Dr. Matt

B.S. It doesn’t matter what was said or what wasn’t said, the RW sycophants would have lashed out at this administration. If the POTUS didn’t have a Rose Garden announcement and left it to a Pentagon press release, the right-wingers would have been screeching that the POTUS was hiding, or not forthcoming, or was afraid, etc., etc.,

Agreed, Republicans were going to complain no matter what happened but much of the mainstream criticism probably could have been avoided or at least tempered.

316 Decatur Deb  Jun 4, 2014 9:53:56am

Dawn breaks over GOProud:

LGBT Republican Group GOProud Going Out of Business

advocate.com

317 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 9:54:02am

re: #314 CuriousLurker

Gives a whole new meaning to “green footballs” doesn’t it? //

Or maybe the old one, we just don’t know!

318 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 9:54:03am

re: #313 Dr. Matt

What a rambling pill of excrement. He’s upset that President Obama hasn’t closed Gitmo….even though he can’t without congressional approval. Then rants about indefinite detention though 5 prisoners were just released but GG claims he broke the law by releasing them without congressional approval. What a circular mindfuck of idiocy.

Despite all his rage he’s still just a douche with a (web)page?

;)

319 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 9:54:31am

re: #315 Killgore Trout

Agreed, Republicans were going to complain no matter what happened but much of the mainstream criticism probably could have been avoided or at least tempered.

How?

320 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:56:57am

re: #315 Killgore Trout

Agreed, Republicans were going to complain no matter what happened but much of the mainstream criticism probably could have been avoided or at least tempered.

Are you really doing anything different from that media?

321 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Jun 4, 2014 9:58:18am

re: #319 Dr. Matt

How?

By listening to Killgore, of course. Whether this is part of his troll persona or his ego is actually massive enough to think he’s a superior spin doctor to everyone on Obama’s team, is the unknown quantity.

322 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 9:58:51am
323 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 9:59:00am

re: #316 Decatur Deb

Dawn breaks over GOProud:

LGBT Republican Group GOProud Going Out of Business

advocate.com

I wonder what influenced that decision.

Nod…nod…wink…wink.

324 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Jun 4, 2014 9:59:58am

re: #320 ObserverArt

Are you really doing anything different from that media?

It’s a chief part of Killgore and NJDhockey’s schtick to lambaste the media for the exact same behavior that they themselves engage in constantly, the barely-following-the-story-but-happy-to-weigh-in punditry.

325 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:01:00am

re: #307 Belafon

I was expecting an epic front page on this one from Greenwald: What Excuse Remains for Obama’s Failure to Close GITMO?

I saw it as such a transparent piece of faux outrage clickbait that it didn’t even rile me, it was pretty weak.

326 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 10:03:46am

re: #313 Dr. Matt

Well, his point is that since Obama allegedly claims that he is not bound by the Congress in the matter of releasing the prisoners, he has no excuse in not releasing them. That would amount to de facto abolition of Gitmo, though de jure it would still exist - the physical complex, that is. This conundrum is perhaps the only interesting detail to emerge out of the Bergdahl non-story.

327 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:05:12am

Oboma not closing Gitmo now immediately means he just wants to keep them prisoners forever and torture them all the days long and hes an evil man and worser than Bush!!11

328 Mike Lamb  Jun 4, 2014 10:05:35am

re: #285 Killgore Trout

Chuck Todd: WH Thinks People Are Trying to ‘Swift Boat’ Bergdahl
I’ll take this with a grain of salt. Todd’s report yesterday about the White House expecting euphoria is pretty questionable too. I’m pretty sure the White House expected some reaction but I suspect they could have fine tuned their talking points better.

Of course they are fucking Swift Boating him. How is that even a question? This is a despicable course of action even if he did desert. And if he’s “cleared”? He should have about 20 defamation suits lined up. Media and the GOP are making it dangerous for this guy and his family.

The WH isn’t wrong—there should have been an extremely positive reaction no matter the circumstances of his capture. If he served honorably, it’s awesome that we got him back. If he deserted, it’s awesome that we got him back. Now we get to deal with him.

These guys that they’ve interviewed via the GOP operative? Thanks for your service, but fuck you with your comments. You know where you made those comments from? Your fucking home. Deserter or not, the guy has been in a goddamn cave for 5 years. Have some common fucking decency for like 15 minutes.

329 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Jun 4, 2014 10:05:36am

Really, this Bergdahl stuff is turning my stomach. Not since Terri Schiavo have I seen this amount of ghoulishness and bizarre obsessions and idiotic speculation. The media’s response—mirrored here by Killgore—is to paw through this guy’s history in an atavistic way, as though this guy is the one who screwed up the whole War on Terror, as though he’s the reason why other soldiers died. It reminds me nothing more than misplaced guilt from people whose policies led us sending wave after wave of young men and women out into harm’s way, people who want to avoid their own culpability for the war that we’ve been fighting for more than a decade now.

330 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:06:16am

re: #329 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

Really, this Bergdahl stuff is turning my stomach. Not since Terri Schiavo have I seen this amount of ghoulishness and bizarre obsessions and idiotic speculation. The media’s response—mirrored here by Killgore—is to paw through this guy’s history in an atavistic way, as though this guy is the one who screwed up the whole War on Terror, as though he’s the reason why other soldiers died. It reminds me nothing more than misplaced guilt from people whose policies led us sending wave after wave of young men and women out into harm’s way, people who want to avoid their own culpability for the war that we’ve been fighting for more than a decade now.

Awesomely said.

331 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 10:07:26am

re: #328 Mike Lamb

Of course they are fucking Swift Boating him. How is that even a question? This is a despicable course of action even if he did desert.

Case in point: Fox News Contributor Behind PR Campaign For Soldiers Critical Of Bowe Bergdahl

332 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 10:07:35am

re: #315 Killgore Trout

Agreed, Republicans were going to complain no matter what happened but much of the mainstream criticism probably could have been avoided or at least tempered.

Which is why you’ve been… never mind. You win. I can’t take it anymore—there are too many other things I’d rather be doing than this. BBL, lizards.

333 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:09:03am

re: #331 Dr. Matt

Case in point: Fox News Contributor Behind PR Campaign For Soldiers Critical Of Bowe Bergdahl

Grenell should start going by Dick because that’s what he is. A sleazy dick.

334 calochortus  Jun 4, 2014 10:09:15am

I think I’m getting old and crotchety. (Well, no doubt about the old part…)
I watched a few minutes of Today this morning-you know, the show that used to actually have some news on it a couple decades ago? I thought they might mention if there were any important news at the top of the hour.
Not so much. There was random speculation about Bergdahl being a traitor followed by cute baby animals, with a lot of snickering over the words “Somali wild ass.” I thought I had been magically transported to a bus filled with 15 year olds.
I mean I wasn’t expecting The News Hour or anything, but really.

335 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 10:09:22am

re: #332 CuriousLurker

Which is why you’ve been… never mind. You win. I can’t take it anymore—there are too many other things I’d rather be doing than this. BBL, lizards.

:D

336 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 10:09:35am

re: #332 CuriousLurker

Which is why you’ve been… never mind. You win. I can’t take it anymore—there are too many other things I’d rather be doing than this. BBL, lizards.

[Embedded image]

Concur. Personal pledge to not engage with the resident concern troll on political topics from now on. Not worth the cost in neurons.

337 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:09:46am

Actual NRO tweet just now:

Obama has turned Bergdahl into one of most hated soldiers in American military history.

You. Just. Can. Not. Make. This stuff up.

338 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:10:18am

339 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 10:10:46am

re: #338 Gus

[Embedded image]

What, no invasion stripes?
:p

340 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:11:05am

re: #337 Bulworth

Actual NRO tweet just now:

Obama has turned Bergdahl into one of most hated soldiers in American military history.

You. Just. Can. Not. Make. This stuff up.

OBAMA’S FAULT!!!!!

341 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:11:15am

re: #337 Bulworth

Actual NRO tweet just now:

Obama has turned Bergdahl into one of most hated soldiers in American military history.

You. Just. Can. Not. Make. This stuff up.

Well what starts out as a pro-segregationist rag remains a rag. That’s pathetic even for those assholes tho.

342 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 10:11:39am

re: #338 Gus

Yes,

343 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:12:35am

Yes, it’s Obama’s fault that Bowe Bergdahl is so hated. It;s Obama out there saying that he deserted his post without evidence, it’s Obama calling him a Taliban collaborator, and it’s Obama out there harassing his family. Really fuck you NRO. You’re no better than Stormfront.

344 Mike Lamb  Jun 4, 2014 10:13:09am

re: #337 Bulworth

Actual NRO tweet just now:

Obama has turned Bergdahl into one of most hated soldiers in American military history.

You. Just. Can. Not. Make. This stuff up.

So when Bergdahl sues for defamation, are the going to name Obama as a non-party at fault for making them call Bergdahl a traitor or will they go straight to bringing him in as a third-party defendant for entrapment?

345 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 10:14:16am

re: #343 HappyWarrior

Yes, it’s Obama’s fault that Bowe Bergdahl is so hated. It;s Obama out there saying that he deserted his post without evidence, it’s Obama calling him a Taliban collaborator, and it’s Obama out there harassing his family. Really fuck you NRO. You’re no better than Stormfront.

But Obama is rubbing his hands in glee since he has diverted things from Benghazi with a simple Rose Garden announcement.
///

346 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:14:32am

I would love to see the Bergdahls ruin these people. I wouldn’t shed a tear if the NRO’s offices closed forever and the building was converted to a gay strip club.

347 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 10:16:03am

re: #337 Bulworth

Actual NRO tweet just now:

Obama has turned Bergdahl into one of most hated soldiers in American military history.

You. Just. Can. Not. Make. This stuff up.

Kilgore, explain to us 1) how this is Obama’s fault, and 2) how he could have avoided this.

348 allegro  Jun 4, 2014 10:16:34am

re: #346 HappyWarrior

I would love to see the Bergdahls ruin these people. I wouldn’t shed a tear if the NRO’s offices closed forever and the building was converted to a gay strip club.

I think they prefer their gay strip parties private. That way they don’t have to worry about local laws making their dildo displays illegal and shit.

349 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:16:58am

re: #347 Dr. Matt

Kilgore, explain to us 1) how this is Obama’s fault, and 2) how he could have avoided this.

Well you know, he could have just let Mitt Romney and John McCain become president because it’s good to spoil children when they’re throwing tantrums.

350 Ding-an-sich Wannabe  Jun 4, 2014 10:17:12am

“And then Killgore was like and everybody was like . Then suddenly …”

351 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:18:03am

re: #348 allegro

I think they prefer their gay strip parties private. That way they don’t have to worry about local laws making their dildo displays illegal and shit.

Wouldn’t NRO offices be in NYC or Washington where such laws wouldn’t be a problem? Point is I’d love to see NRO go out of business and its building converted to something that the bigots there would hate.

352 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:18:58am

How well I remember when PBO refused all demands to rescue Bergdahl, saying things like “he’s a traitor, a deserter, there’s this Pentagon report, all his fellow soldiers criticizing him, and his dad has this Taliban beard, why doesn’t he just get a razor already.” It’s plan he hates the troops and America. /

353 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 10:19:05am

re: #351 HappyWarrior

Wouldn’t NRO offices be in NYC or Washington where such laws wouldn’t be a problem? Point is I’d love to see NRO go out of business and its building converted to something that the bigots there would hate.

If GOProud reforms as a for-profit organization perhaps they can run it.
/

354 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:19:46am

Related.

355 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:20:08am

re: #352 Bulworth

How well I remember when PBO refused all demands to rescue Bergdahl, saying things like “he’s a traitor, a deserter, there’s this Pentagon report, all his fellow soldiers criticizing him, and his dad has this Taliban beard, why doesn’t he just get a razor already.” It’s plan he hates the troops and America. /

I remember POTUS telling his father on Twitter that if Bowe was his son that he’d want to shoot him himself. Oh wait, that was Todd Kinkannon.

356 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:21:32am

And then PBO didn’t want to have Bergdahl’s parents over to the WH, he just wanted to golf and the Bergdahl’s were invited over to Sarah Palin’s to discuss their son’s return. /

357 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 10:22:29am

Sergey Ding-and-Such tries to catch up on Bike to Work Day.

Youtube Video

358 NJDhockeyfan  Jun 4, 2014 10:23:06am
359 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:23:08am
360 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 10:23:23am

re: #334 calochortus

I think I’m getting old and crotchety. (Well, no doubt about the old part…)
I watched a few minutes of Today this morning-you know, the show that used to actually have some news on it a couple decades ago? I thought they might mention if there were any important news at the top of the hour.
Not so much. There was random speculation about Bergdahl being a traitor followed by cute baby animals, with a lot of snickering over the words “Somali wild ass.” I thought I had been magically transported to a bus filled with 15 year olds.
I mean I wasn’t expecting The News Hour or anything, but really.

It is not your father’s Today Show. It is a complete mess now. All entertainment and if you notice it pushes other ‘family’ products.

361 jaunte  Jun 4, 2014 10:23:52am

This whole kerfuffle could have been moderated and tempered if only the Bergdahls had refused to be seen with the President.

362 A Mom Anon  Jun 4, 2014 10:24:35am

re: #295 CuriousLurker

I know, that’s the sad part. I mean FFS the Chamber of Commerce and some of the local businesses in his home town are getting nasty phone calls and the guy isn’t even home yet.

So way to go Denizens of Wingnuttia! Jesus H. Christ, MD, Esq., LLC these people suck.

363 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:24:38am

Bergdahl is a traitor and a deserter whose responsible for the deaths of more than 50 of his fellow American solidiers and hates America and Obama has made him the most hated soldier in American history. Confirmed. FACT.

364 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:25:31am

re: #361 jaunte

This whole kerfuffle could have been moderated and tempered if only the Bergdahls had refused to be seen with the President.

or better refused to be grateful in his helping return their son. They should have refused to meet with him like some of the football players do! Then Bob Bergdahl would be a bearded American patriot just like Phil Robertson and Robert E. Lee before him.

365 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:26:15am
366 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 10:26:46am

re: #326 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Well, his point is that since Obama allegedly claims that he is not bound by the Congress in the matter of releasing the prisoners, he has no excuse in not releasing them. That would amount to de facto abolition of Gitmo, though de jure it would still exist - the physical complex, that is. This conundrum is perhaps the only interesting detail to emerge out of the Bergdahl non-story.

Might be a good point if he hadn’t jumped on the “Obama bad…he broke the law, just like Bush” bandwagon. He cant have it both ways.

Why cant he at least give Obama some points for doing what Glenn himself appears to think was the right thing?
This is what bothers me so about Greenwald. There is a hatred there, similar if not equal to the RWNJs. He never relents even when he agrees with the President.
Maybe this is a beginning for Obama to close down Gitmo. Hell, it cant get much worse than this!

367 calochortus  Jun 4, 2014 10:26:48am

re: #360 ObserverArt

It is not your father’s Today Show. It is a complete mess now. All entertainment and if you notice it pushes other ‘family’ products.

No, I didn’t stick around long enough to see what they might have been pushing. Sigh.

368 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:27:17am

re: #362 A Mom Anon

I know, that’s the sad part. I mean FFS the Chamber of Commerce and some of the local businesses in his home town are getting nasty phone calls and the guy isn’t even home yet.

So way to go Denizens of Wingnuttia! Jesus H. Christ, MD, Esq., LLC these people suck.

What will be sad and sadly not out of the realm of possibility is them being forced to move. Really what the hell is wrong with people. We don’t need to give Sgt. Bergdahl a parade everywhere he goes but damn it, let’s help the guy get used to being home after five long years. Let’s not threaten him or his family. Let’s be better than that.

369 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 10:27:56am

re: #358 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Ugh, I’m not sure if they’re going to get it. I think the White house has ruled out other similar deals, Bergdahl being a special case since he’s military.

370 The War TARDIS  Jun 4, 2014 10:28:06am

re: #366 blueraven

I think Greenwald is a bigot toward Obama.

371 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 10:28:09am

re: #362 A Mom Anon

I know, that’s the sad part. I mean FFS the Chamber of Commerce and some of the local businesses in his home town are getting nasty phone calls and the guy isn’t even home yet.

So way to go Denizens of Wingnuttia! Jesus H. Christ, MD, Esq., LLC these people suck.

Yep.

Emails to Hailey call for city to cancel Bergdahl celebration

372 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:28:10am

re: #366 blueraven

Might be a good point if he hadn’t jumped on the “Obama bad…he broke the law, just like Bush” bandwagon. He cant have it both ways.

[Embedded content]

Why cant he at least give Obama some points for doing what Glenn himself appears to think was the right thing.
This is what bothers me so about Greenwald. There is a hatred there, similar if not equal to the RWNJs. He never relents even when he agrees with the President.
Maybe this is a beginning for Obama to close down Gitmo. Hell, it cant get much worse than this!

It’s because GG is a self-righteous asshole.

373 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:29:00am

re: #371 Bubblehead II

Yep.

Emails to Hailey call for city to cancel Bergdahl celebration

Now, that’s just a shame. This should be a welcome homecoming for the guy. Sigh, people are such assholes.

374 Charles Johnson  Jun 4, 2014 10:30:52am

Un freaking real. The hypocrisy is mind-blowing.

375 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:30:55am

re:
#373
HappyWarrior

U our Obama’s Chicago blackshirt thugs sending these emails to traitor’s hometown?

376 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 10:31:13am

re: #358 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Not seeing any articles on the Afghan hostages but this just showed up
French hostage held by al Qaeda calls on President Hollande to negotiate his release

A video has been released of the French hostage Serge Lazarevic who has been held for two years in the Sahara by al Qaeda’s North African wing.

In it Lazarevic says he is ill and in a critical condition.

He called on France to negotiate with his captors, as they did in 2010 for four other French nationals who were kidnapped and then set free.

Lazarevic, is the last of a series of French hostages held by militants in the Sahara region.

377 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 10:32:51am

Hailey, Idaho.

Just think about that.

Oh well, maybe some of the people of that town will be changing some of their thought processes about politics after this hands-on lesson.

378 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 10:32:55am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

Un freaking real. The hypocrisy is mind-blowing.

[Embedded content]

The wingnuts stand over the body of their victim, screaming “WHY DID YOU MAKE ME DO THAT?!”

379 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 10:33:16am

nbcnews.com

I don’t feel much pity for this guy. I do for the poor citizens who are being driven from their homes by the violence.

380 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:33:30am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

Un freaking real. The hypocrisy is mind-blowing.

[Embedded content]

You know what, I’ll say it loudly and proudly here, I’ve never liked NRO. I never thought too much of WFB either. Sure, he wasn’t an anti-intellectual but he was a guy who made his early bones by being a McCarthy apologist and remained one. A guy who condoned segregation because he bought the slanderous lies about civil rights being a Communist subversive operation. someone who only distanced himself from the JBS because he knew they were making relatively sane cons like himself look bad. This bullshit is just the same as what was published in the NRO over a half century ago.

381 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:33:50am

See what U made me do??!?!?!!

382 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 10:33:53am

re: #373 HappyWarrior

Now, that’s just a shame. This should be a welcome homecoming for the guy. Sigh, people are such assholes.

I’d bet 99% of them are from outsiders.

383 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:34:46am

IT’S JUST LIKE IF RUDOLPH HESS WAS RELEASED BACK TO NAZI GERMANY DURING WW2!!11!!!!!

384 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 10:34:47am

re: #376 Killgore Trout

Not seeing any articles on the Afghan hostages but this just showed up
French hostage held by al Qaeda calls on President Hollande to negotiate his release

this has never happened before.
Thanks Obama!

//

385 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 10:35:00am

ah, here it is
AP Exclusive: Videos of couple held in Afghanistan

An American woman, then pregnant, went missing in Afghanistan in late 2012 with her Canadian husband. Then her family received videos last summer showing the couple in captivity. The videos now have been provided to The Associated Press.

On camera, Caitlan Coleman calls on the U.S. government to help free her, her baby and husband Joshua Boyle from Taliban captors.

The videos were emailed to Coleman’s father last July and September by an Afghan man with self-proclaimed ties to the Taliban.

They offer the first clues about what happened to the couple since they lost touch with their families. U.S. officials consider the videos authentic.

The families are making the videos public now because of the publicity surrounding the rescue of Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl.

386 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:35:15am

re: #377 ObserverArt

Hailey, Idaho.

Just think about that.

Oh well, maybe some of the people of that town will be changing some of their thought processes about politics after this hands-on lesson.

Apparently Halley is the county seat of Blaine County, one of the few strongly Democratic parts of Idaho. your point still stands though.

387 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:35:29am

re: #382 Justanotherhuman

I’d bet 99% of them are from outsiders.

Of course.

388 jaunte  Jun 4, 2014 10:36:17am

re: #362 A Mom Anon

I know, that’s the sad part. I mean FFS the Chamber of Commerce and some of the local businesses in his home town are getting nasty phone calls and the guy isn’t even home yet.

Yes, that’s just bizarre, over the top, irrational hatred. I’d hate to be held responsible for everything that some random stranger in Houston does.

389 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:36:18am

I wonder what Idaho’s GOP governor, Senators and House Rep think about this?

390 GeneJockey  Jun 4, 2014 10:36:19am

re: #337 Bulworth

Actual NRO tweet just now:

Obama has turned Bergdahl into one of most hated soldiers in American military history.

You. Just. Can. Not. Make. This stuff up.

Nobody would believe it if you did.

391 A Mom Anon  Jun 4, 2014 10:38:07am

re: #373 HappyWarrior

I’d also bet most of those emails are from right wing bloggers and their flying monkeys. Fuck them, let the town decide what they want to do. I’d bet most of the people who live there know the family, Bowe and what kind of people they are and they’ll proceed onward, unless the Bergdahls decide it’s too much for him to take, and that too is a possibility.

392 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:00am

RIP, my good soldier.

Chester Nez, last of the 29 Navajos who developed an unbreakable code that helped win World War II dies at 93 - @AP
End of alert

393 GeneJockey  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:02am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

Un freaking real. The hypocrisy is mind-blowing.

[Embedded content]

Oh. Ralph Peters. That explains a lot.

394 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:02am

How does America:

Sleep at night.

Look in the mirror.

Go to church.

Justify their thinking.

Call themselves educated.

Want to be treated as they treat others.

Consider it has a soul.

I just don’t get it anymore. This is not the country I grew up in.

395 Mike Lamb  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:02am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

Un freaking real. The hypocrisy is mind-blowing.

[Embedded content]

We need a German word of this. “Hypocrisy” doesn’t even begin to describe what is occurring.

396 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:02am

Bergdahl hysteria combines a wingnut/classical liberal convergence.

397 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:08am

re: #385 Killgore Trout

ah, here it is
AP Exclusive: Videos of couple held in Afghanistan

proof…it is Obama’s fault! Except it happened a year ago.

398 Killgore Trout  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:36am

Exclusive: Afghan villagers recall when Bergdahl stumbled into their midst

Until now, few details have emerged about the circumstances of Bergdahl’s disappearance from his base. But The Washington Post has reached Afghan villagers who spotted Bergdahl shortly after he slipped away from his base. To them, it’s clear something was wrong with the American. And he seemed to be deliberately heading for Taliban strongholds, they say.

“It was very confusing to us. Why would he leave the base?” said Jamal, an elder in the village of Yusef Khel, about a half-mile from the American military installation. (Like many Afghans, he goes by only one name). “The people thought it was a covert agenda - maybe he was sent to the village by the U.S.”

Locals remember Bergdahl walking through the village in a haze. They later told Afghan investigators that they had warned the American that he was heading into a dangerous area.

“They tried to tell him not to go there, that it is dangerous. But he kept going over the mountain. The villagers tried to give him water and bread, but he didn’t take it,” said Ibrahim Manikhel, the district’s intelligence chief.

“We think he probably was high after smoking hashish,” Manikhel said. “Why would an American want to find the Taliban?”

399 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:41:49am

The “Circle of Well, Actually.”

400 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 10:42:51am

re: #377 ObserverArt

Hailey, Idaho.

Just think about that.

Oh well, maybe some of the people of that town will be changing some of their thought processes about politics after this hands-on lesson.

Doubt it. Hailey (and the wood River Valley) pretty much votes Democratic.

Presidential Elections

1996 46.7 % Dem
2000 47.1 % Dem
2004 59.1% Dem
2008 65.7% Dem
2012 58.8% Dem

401 klys  Jun 4, 2014 10:43:00am

re: #332 CuriousLurker

Which is why you’ve been… never mind. You win. I can’t take it anymore—there are too many other things I’d rather be doing than this. BBL, lizards.

[Embedded image]

This keeps happening more and more often and it makes me sad, because I like the community here, and I like most of the discussions, but if the people who actually contribute the things I find useful keep getting chased away, well…

In the meantime, KT will just continue to present every article uncritically as if they are actually relevant and continue the partisan discussion he claims to abhor.

402 wrenchwench  Jun 4, 2014 10:43:31am
403 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:43:39am
404 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:44:25am

How are we to tell the Bergdahl outrage twitter ribbons from the Benghazi outrage twitter ribbons?

405 Targetpractice  Jun 4, 2014 10:45:19am

re: #404 b.d.

How are we to tell the Bergdahl outrage twitter ribbons from the Benghazi outrage twitter ribbons?

The former are shaped like a noose.

406 Dr Lizardo  Jun 4, 2014 10:46:15am

re: #394 ObserverArt

How does America:

Sleep at night.

Look in the mirror.

Go to church.

Justify their thinking.

Call themselves educated.

Want to be treated as they treat others.

Consider it has a soul.

I just don’t get it anymore. This is not the country I grew up in.

Well, in truth, if you look back at American history, there are these periodic episodes of mass stupidity taking hold. This is one of these episodes.

It’s pretty much a gigantic, collective dumb-ass attack.

407 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:48:17am
408 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 10:48:26am

re: #400 Bubblehead II

Doubt it. Hailey (and the wood River Valley) pretty much votes Democratic.

Presidential Elections

1996 46.7 % Dem
2000 47.1 % Dem
2004 59.1% Dem
2008 65.7% Dem
2012 58.8% Dem

Thanks for the info. Must be all the ski bums and ex-hippies (typed in jest).

: )

409 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 10:48:58am

re: #389 Bulworth

I wonder what Idaho’s GOP governor, Senators and House Rep think about this?

They’re keeping their yaps shut. For now.

Our View: As Bergdahl Controversy Swirls, Idaho’s Leaders Hide

The silence is deafening and exemplifies the foggy political whirlwind that now swirls around Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl’s release from Taliban captivity. Idaho’s leaders are staying far from the actual issue, which brings nearly 15 years of U.S. behavior since 9/11 into focus. It’s a weak, inadequate response.

410 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:49:33am

re: #406 Dr Lizardo

Well, in truth, if you look back at American history, there are these periodic episodes of mass stupidity taking hold. This is one of these episodes.

It’s pretty much a gigantic, collective dumb-ass attack.

Changing times tends to bring out the best and worst in people. That’s been my lesson the past six years and I think ultimately the triumph and at the same time tragedy of Obama’s presidency.

411 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:49:47am
412 klys  Jun 4, 2014 10:49:49am

re: #407 Gus

Right after he finishes cuddling up to Putin while simultaneously ending the conflicts in Syria and Ukraine by invading and turning both of them into nation-building exercises.

And won’t that be a diplomatic trick.

//

413 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:49:59am

414 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:50:11am

re: #409 Bubblehead II

They’re keeping their yaps shut. For now.

Our View: As Bergdahl Controversy Swirls, Idaho’s Leaders Hide

The silence is deafening and exemplifies the foggy political whirlwind that now swirls around Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl’s release from Taliban captivity. Idaho’s leaders are staying far from the actual issue, which brings nearly 15 years of U.S. behavior since 9/11 into focus. It’s a weak, inadequate response.

Cowards.

415 Rightwingconspirator  Jun 4, 2014 10:50:35am

I found out everything I needed to know in this headline.

GOP Strategists Are Arranging Media Interviews To Attack Bowe Bergdahl

On Tuesday, BuzzFeed identified Richard Grenell, who once served as an aide to U.S. ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton and later worked for Mitt Romney’s 2012 presidential campaign, as playing a key role in publicizing Bergdahl’s critics.

I am unconcerned with partisan concerns.
We’d want him back no matter why or how he left or was captured. GOP partisan is as GOP partisan does.

416 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:51:34am

Military members GOP approve of:
1.) Guy who didn’t show up for National Guard Duty
2.) Guy who traded weapons to Iran to fund the Contras
3.) Guy who quit because he tortured an Iraqi policeman

417 jaunte  Jun 4, 2014 10:51:54am

re: #411 Gus

The 5 GITMO detainees are carrying yellow cake and aluminum tubes with the intent to create WMDs in Qatar! Mushroom clouds.

We can send the Open Carry Texas dudes after them.

418 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:52:16am
419 Feline Fearless Leader  Jun 4, 2014 10:52:24am

re: #411 Gus

That was actually yellow cake mix and cupcake tins. But you know how the media blows everything out of proportion.
///

420 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:53:28am

We’ll grab those Gitmo guys in Qatar when we go play the World Cup matches.

I can already picture the movie that will be made!!

421 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:53:44am

re: #418 Gus

[Embedded content]

Right after they buy back more purple heart bandaids. Yeah, I still haven’t forgotten that pathetic shit fest at the 2004 RNC.

422 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 10:53:54am

re: #391 A Mom Anon

I’d also bet most of those emails are from right wing bloggers and their flying monkeys. Fuck them, let the town decide what they want to do. I’d bet most of the people who live there know the family, Bowe and what kind of people they are and they’ll proceed onward, unless the Bergdahls decide it’s too much for him to take, and that too is a possibility.

I know nothing about his parents, but I kinda get the feeling that dad and mom are pretty sharp, thinking people.

I get the feeling we will be hearing from them over a lot of this crap. I think Mr. Bergdahl is capable of a big STF for the Fox-like media.

423 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 10:53:57am

re: #419 Feline Fearless Leader

That was actually yellow cake mix and cupcake tins. But you know how the media blows everything out of proportion.
///

Clearly they’ll try to make a WMD in Qatar and eventually ship to Iran who will use it to nuke Israel. Why are you antisemitic?
— Class of 2004

424 b.d.  Jun 4, 2014 10:54:20am

BOYCOTT THE QATAR WORLD CUP!!! IT’S NOT REAL FOOTBALL ANYWAYS!!

425 Bulworth  Jun 4, 2014 10:54:36am

re:
#421
HappyWarrior

Yeah, that was the worst.

426 klys  Jun 4, 2014 10:55:07am

re: #422 ObserverArt

I know nothing about his parents, but I kinda get the feeling that dad and mom are pretty sharp, thinking people.

I get the feeling we will be hearing from them over a lot of this crap. I think Mr. Bergdahl is capable of a big STF for the Fox-like media.

Well, just remember that it’s the WH’s fault on the talking points that caused the mainstream media to pick up on this.

///////////

427 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 10:55:08am

re: #338 Gus

re: #342 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

Here’s the orange guy’s angry brother and his green angry cousin:

 

re: #350 Ding-an-sich Wannabe

“And then Killgore was like and everybody was like . Then suddenly …”

LOL, I had to leave or risk…

428 blueraven  Jun 4, 2014 10:55:17am

Ralph Peters and NRO have some nerve.

Peters was suggesting the Taliban kill Bergdahl back in 2009, right after he was captured.

Youtube Video

429 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 10:55:28am

re: #414 HappyWarrior

Cowards.

Elections coming up.

430 Dr Lizardo  Jun 4, 2014 10:55:58am

re: #410 HappyWarrior

Changing times tends to bring out the best and worst in people. That’s been my lesson the past six years and I think ultimately the triumph and at the same time tragedy of Obama’s presidency.

Yep.

The RWNJ’s went a little apeshit during the Clinton years, I recall. Granted, the Obama presidency has really made them lose their minds in an exceptional way. If HRC is elected President, it’ll continue through her term, though the focus will be more misogynistic than anything else.

But the largest contingent of the haters are getting up there in age, and time will certainly solve the matter through the process of natural diminuation.

431 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:56:23am

re: #425 Bulworth

re:
#421
HappyWarrior

Yeah, that was the worst.

Remember kids, party over people. It doesn’t matter if your party mocks a military award because the opposition must be defeated at all costs. By all means necessary.// But yeah sarc aside, that was just shameful. I found out that the guy behind that bullshit was from my state.

432 jaunte  Jun 4, 2014 10:56:56am
433 klys  Jun 4, 2014 10:57:21am

re: #430 Dr Lizardo

Yep.

The RWNJ’s went a little apeshit during the Clinton years, I recall. Granted, the Obama presidency has really made them lose their minds in an exceptional way. If HRC is elected President, it’ll continue through her term, though the focus will be more misogynistic than anything else.

But the largest contingent of the haters are getting up there in age, and time will certainly solve the matter through the process of natural diminuation.

My first recollection of the Republican party in politics was the government shutdown in the 90s and then the impeachment of Bill Clinton.

They have done nothing to convince me of their sanity on any level since then.

434 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:57:45am

re: #430 Dr Lizardo

Yep.

The RWNJ’s went a little apeshit during the Clinton years, I recall. Granted, the Obama presidency has really made them lose their minds in an exceptional way. If HRC is elected President, it’ll continue through her term, though the focus will be more misogynistic than anything else.

But the largest contingent of the haters are getting up there in age, and time will certainly solve the matter through the process of natural diminuation.

I was a little younger than my brother is now during the Clinton years and man I thought I heard some crazy crap about Clinton back then that the kids were echoing from their parents. Just crazy shit. But the stories the kid brother tells me about what he hears. He’s resigned to the fact that we’re one of the few liberal families out here.

435 Justanotherhuman  Jun 4, 2014 10:58:41am

re: #427 CuriousLurker

Here’s the orange guy’s angry brother and his green angry cousin:

[Embedded image]   [Embedded image]

LOL, I had to leave or risk…

[Embedded image]

CL, no worry. I think even if Bergdahl was having misgivings about being in Afghanistan (he probably had no choice in the matter), and was trying to understand the locals and what they were being put through, that just increases my admiration for him.

He saw them as human beings.

I’m just mystified as to why some people are incapable of thinking that way, no matter who “they” and “them” are.

436 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 10:58:49am

re: #433 klys

My first recollection of the Republican party in politics was the government shutdown in the 90s and then the impeachment of Bill Clinton.

They have done nothing to convince me of their sanity on any level since then.

Mine too. One of my earliest memories is the shut down since my mom was out of work and I just remember later the chain mails they sent around the office that mocked Gingrich that she showed me.

437 ObserverArt  Jun 4, 2014 11:00:07am

re: #406 Dr Lizardo

Well, in truth, if you look back at American history, there are these periodic episodes of mass stupidity taking hold. This is one of these episodes.

It’s pretty much a gigantic, collective dumb-ass attack.

Yeah, I guess. I think my problem is we as people are supposed to advance through time. I don’t see much advancement anymore. Sure technology advances go on, but the people seem to want a regression to some ‘simpler times’ that really were not all that good.

Well, not good for everyone.

Be back later…

438 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 11:00:57am

re: #432 jaunte

[Embedded content]

This is one of his platoon witnesses.

439 GeneJockey  Jun 4, 2014 11:01:19am

re: #433 klys

My first recollection of the Republican party in politics was the government shutdown in the 90s and then the impeachment of Bill Clinton.

They have done nothing to convince me of their sanity on any level since then.

Indeed, they’ve largely been taken over by people who thought the ones who impeached Clinton weren’t extreme enough.

440 makeitstop  Jun 4, 2014 11:01:53am

re: #432 jaunte

[Embedded content]

The NYT is every bit as complicit in advancing the lies surrounding Bergdahl as CNN is.

They can all ESAD. The media in this country has become way beyond worthless.

441 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 11:02:22am

re: #439 GeneJockey

Indeed, they’ve largely been taken over by people who thought the ones who impeached Clinton weren’t extreme enough.

We live in a world where George W. Bush is considered one of the saner ones. George W. Bush, the guy who I was willing to go to Pennsylvania to campaign against is now the representative of sane conservatism. Pardon me while I weep some.

442 klys  Jun 4, 2014 11:02:40am

re: #438 Gus

This is one of his platoon witnesses.

But the only thing that matters is what he says about Bergdahl, not anything about his motivations or whatnot, and how dare anyone even consider that he might be lying, because that’s horrible.

//

Never mind that it is one of the fucking scummiest things I can think of to attack a fellow soldier for being fucking rescued.

443 Dr Lizardo  Jun 4, 2014 11:03:29am

re: #433 klys

re: #434 HappyWarrior

I know one wingut who used to complain constantly about Obama. I told him quite bluntly, “Look. You’re 76 years old. I’m 41 (at that time). You’ll be dead in a few more years. Barring an accident or ill-health or some other catastrophe, I won’t. Your voting days are drawing to a close. Mine will continue for three or four more decades (knock on wood). You are obsolete. I am the future, and those younger than me are even more liberal on most social issues than I am. Your time has passed. The future belongs to us, and when you’re dead and gone, you won’t be missed. You’ll simply be regarded as a historical anachronism.”

Strangely, he never replied to that. Go figure.

444 Dr. Matt  Jun 4, 2014 11:05:02am

re: #430 Dr Lizardo

Yep.

The RWNJ’s went a little apeshit during the Clinton years, I recall. Granted, the Obama presidency has really made them lose their minds in an exceptional way. If HRC is elected President, it’ll continue through her term, though the focus will be more misogynistic than anything else.

I was pretty apolitical for most of Clinton years, but I was a supporter. Back in those days I would frequent the NHL boards on ESPN and there was a small, but loud contingency of RNWJs that would turn every thread into anti-liberal bitchfests. I never understood it. It was annoying. But, my awakening came at the hands of Tom DeLay. That MFer is the reason why I became a rapid and active lefty. I hated Delay then as much as I can’t stand Palin today. Two vile dolts.

445 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 11:06:13am

Time to close GITMO. The end.

446 HappyWarrior  Jun 4, 2014 11:07:23am

re: #443 Dr Lizardo

I know one wingut who used to complain constantly about Obama. I told him quite bluntly, “Look. You’re 76 years old. I’m 41 (at that time). You’ll be dead in a few more years. Barring an accident or ill-health or some other catastrophe, I won’t. Your voting days are drawing to a close. Mine will continue for three or four more decades (knock on wood). You are obsolete. I am the future, and those younger than me are even more liberal on most social issues than I am. Your time has passed. The future belongs to us, and when you’re dead and gone, you won’t be missed. You’ll simply be regarded as a historical anachronism.”

Strangely, he never replied to that. Go figure.

That goes with another thing. They really really despise Gen-Y and attack it all times because of the generation’s generally socially liberal worldview. Really, while it’s true that Obama got many young people to vote for him, conservatives have done a lot on their own to ensure many of us while we won’t all become dyed in the wool Democrats have become socially liberal and opposed to the social reactionarism represented by the Republican Party.

447 Bubblehead II  Jun 4, 2014 11:09:43am

re: #438 Gus

This is one of his platoon witnesses.

That web page he links to is, shall we say, out there. Almost Pamella grade islamaphobia. No, I will not provide a link to this drek.

In a recent article titled “Sodomy ‘For the sake of Islam’,” Raymond Ibrahim, an associate fellow at the Middle East Forum, reported that Abdullah Hassan al-Asiri, who plotted to assassinate Saudi Prince Muhammad bin Nayef in 2009 with a bomb hidden in his rectum, had apparently relied on a fatwa by an obscure cleric permitting sodomy to “widen” his anus to accommodate the explosives.

// Must not have heard about butt plugs.

448 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 11:10:26am

What an idiot.

449 Gus  Jun 4, 2014 11:10:51am

re: #447 Bubblehead II

That web page he links to is, shall we say, out there. Almost Pamella grade islamaphobia. No, I will not provide a link to this drek.

In a recent article titled “Sodomy ‘For the sake of Islam’,” Raymond Ibrahim, an associate fellow at the Middle East Forum, reported that Abdullah Hassan al-Asiri, who plotted to assassinate Saudi Prince Muhammad bin Nayef in 2009 with a bomb hidden in his rectum, had apparently relied on a fatwa by an obscure cleric permitting sodomy to “widen” his anus to accommodate the explosives.

// Must not have heard about butt plugs.

Fjordman is on their “board.”

450 piratedan  Jun 4, 2014 11:11:11am

re: #427 CuriousLurker

well plainly stated, I’ve come to learn that KT is simply not a good faith player and as such, I tend to simply not read the vast majority of their posts. I do like to be open to discourse from both sides (hence why I still engage with DF on occasion) but KT’s plan here is apparently as community concern troll and until Charles bans them, I’ll ignore them and save my time and efforts for people who will actually engage in the discussion.

451 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 4, 2014 11:15:17am

re: #383 b.d.

IT’S JUST LIKE IF RUDOLPH HESS WAS RELEASED BACK TO NAZI GERMANY DURING WW2!!11!!!!!

We traded a convicted KGB Colonel for Gary Powers and another guy.

452 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 11:20:50am

re: #438 Gus

This is one of his platoon witnesses.

Lovely. Gatestone Institute & Raymond Ibrahim with the ridiculous fake stories. We’re in straight-up Islamophobia industry territory now. What’s next, Geller, Spencer & Gaffney? Maybe they can hire Yerushalmi to file lawsuits for them.

453 CuriousLurker  Jun 4, 2014 11:24:12am

re: #447 Bubblehead II

That web page he links to is, shall we say, out there. Almost Pamella grade islamaphobia. No, I will not provide a link to this drek.

In a recent article titled “Sodomy ‘For the sake of Islam’,” Raymond Ibrahim, an associate fellow at the Middle East Forum, reported that Abdullah Hassan al-Asiri, who plotted to assassinate Saudi Prince Muhammad bin Nayef in 2009 with a bomb hidden in his rectum, had apparently relied on a fatwa by an obscure cleric permitting sodomy to “widen” his anus to accommodate the explosives.

// Must not have heard about butt plugs.

Yep. Raymond Ibrahim is a Egyptian Coptic Christian who hates Muslims and is in deep with the Islamophobes.

Welp, at least now we know where the right is going with this shit. Strap on your seat belts—things are gonna get real ugly.

454 sagehen  Jun 4, 2014 12:07:20pm

re: #103 darthstar

Yeah…it’s a tough state for crazy fucks. But Brown got only 54.5% of the vote compared to Kashkari’s 19%. Not enough to prevent a runoff in November.

Oh, and let’s not forget the Republican Enthusiasm Gap advantage over Democrats this year…per the numbers.

It’s not a “runoff”, it’s a general election.


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