Virginia Same-Sex Marriage Ban Struck Down by Federal Court

Another defeat for the religious right
US News • Views: 31,069

The religious right continues losing their reactionary culture war, as a federal appeals court strikes down Virginia’s ban on marriage equality.

And this ruling will also affect conservative bans on same-sex marriage in West Virginia, North Carolina and South Carolina, so it’s a significant defeat for the forces of atavism.

“We recognize that same-sex marriage makes some people deeply uncomfortable. However, inertia and apprehension are not legitimate bases for denying same-sex couples due process and equal protection of the laws,” the divided three-judge panel of the 4th U.S. Circuit in Richmond concluded.

[…]

The 4th Circuit opinion also will affect marriage laws in other states within its jurisdiction, including West Virginia, North Carolina and South Carolina. Only Maryland has legalized same-sex marriage.

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69 comments
1 HappyWarrior  Jul 28, 2014 11:55:14am

Awesome news. Proud to be a Virginian today. Wish the Lovings were alive to see this. I’ll also take Pat Robertson’s melt down too. But this is why one of the proudest votes I ever cast was for Mark Herring. Ironically, he was running against the least insane GOPer on the ticket but the big difference between Herring and his opponent was that Herring would not defend VA’s ban on not just same sex marriage but also civil unions. This is a great day for Virginia.

2 Lidane  Jul 28, 2014 11:55:41am

I can hear the outraged ‘splodey heads from here. It’s beautiful.

3 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Jul 28, 2014 11:56:43am

Has there even been a decision that HASN’T found that banning SSM is unconstitutional?

4 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Jul 28, 2014 11:57:30am

oh, hate to go OT but I just have to put this out there. I highly recommend the “My Pillow” got mine Friday and it is awesomely comfortable.

5 HappyWarrior  Jul 28, 2014 11:58:06am

re: #3 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Has there even been a decision that HASN’T found that banning SSM is unconstitutional?

No, and that’s why the RR is flipping its shit. It knows that they were doomed when SCOTUS found DOMA unconstitutional. Good riddance I say. These laws being overturned were and are in the spirit of Jim Crow.

6 Lidane  Jul 28, 2014 11:59:00am

Meanwhile, Heritage is trying to use nullification to stop same-sex marriage:

Heritage Foundation Fellow Trots Out Radical Nullification Argument Against Marriage Equality

On Friday, Heritage promoted on its website a video clip of Anderson speaking at a Stanford University event, where he was asked by an attendee why he, as a gay man, should not be able to file a joint tax return if he gets legally married in California.

Anderson responded that legally married same-sex couples should not have access to all the trappings of legal marriage, because while in some states they can “be issued a marriage license,” they “can’t actually get married” because marriage is inherently a union of a man and a woman.

I love the sound of a dying ideology on a Monday. It helps a slow work day move faster.

7 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 11:59:34am

re: #5 HappyWarrior

No, and that’s why the RR is flipping its shit. It knows that they were doomed when SCOTUS found DOMA unconstitutional. Good riddance I say. These laws being overturned were and are in the spirit of Jim Crow.

“IT’S STATES RIGHTS WHICH IS WHY WE NEED A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT TO PROTECT MARRIAGE!”

8 HappyWarrior  Jul 28, 2014 11:59:48am

re: #6 Lidane

Meanwhile, Heritage is trying to use nullification to stop same-sex marriage:

Heritage Foundation Fellow Trots Out Radical Nullification Argument Against Marriage Equality

I love the sound of a dying ideology on a Monday. It helps a slow work day move faster.

Well given that Jim Demint was the closest thing the senate had to John C. Calhoun, that’s hardly a shock.

9 lawhawk  Jul 28, 2014 12:01:02pm

Here’s the text of the decision. There was a WV decision pending a ruling in this case, so the trial court there will have to be made consistent with this ruling.

Three other states in this Circuit have similar bans: North Carolina, N.C. Const. art. XIV, § 6; N.C. Gen. Stat. §§ 51-1, 51-1.2; South Carolina, S.C. Const. art. XVII, § 15; S.C. Code Ann. §§ 20-1-10, 20-1-15; and West Virginia, W. Va. Code § 48-2-603. The Southern District of West Virginia has stayed a challenge to West Virginia’s statute pending our resolution of this appeal. McGee v. Cole, No. 3:13-cv-24068 (S.D. W. Va. June 10, 2014) (order directing stay).

Also, the CNN report notes that in order to extend this to the other states, separate orders would have to be issued for affected states in the region outside Virginia.

10 jaunte  Jul 28, 2014 12:02:36pm
inertia and apprehension are not legitimate bases for denying same-sex couples due process and equal protection of the laws

Presiding Judge Paul Niemeyer, a George H.W. Bush nominee, dissented:

Judge Paul Niemeyer dissented. “Because there exist deep, fundamental differences* between traditional and same-sex marriage, the plaintiffs and the majority err by conflating the two relationships under the loosely drawn rubric of ‘the right to marriage,’” he wrote. “Rather, to obtain constitutional protection, they would have to show that the right to same-sex marriage is itself deeply rooted in our Nation’s history. They have not attempted to do so and could not succeed if they were so to attempt.”
politico.com

*Which the judge neglected to describe

11 Eclectic Cyborg  Jul 28, 2014 12:02:56pm

Does that mean SSM is legal in half the states of the Union now?

12 HappyWarrior  Jul 28, 2014 12:04:08pm

re: #10 jaunte

Presiding Judge Paul Niemeyer, a George H.W. Bush nominee, dissented:

*Which the judge neglected to describe

Pretty weak dissent but let’s be honest pretty much all the opposition to SSM is pretty weak sauce.

13 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 12:04:08pm
14 jaunte  Jul 28, 2014 12:04:15pm
“They would have to show that the right to same-sex interracial marriage is itself deeply rooted in our Nation’s history. They have not attempted to do so and could not succeed if they were so to attempt.”
15 HappyWarrior  Jul 28, 2014 12:04:48pm

re: #14 jaunte

Exa-fucking-ly.

16 makeitstop  Jul 28, 2014 12:05:33pm

re: #13 Kragar

Protip to #PalinTVShows subscribers: sure, the annual option is cheaper, but do you seriously think it’s going to last that long?

Good point. Past behavior says she’ll do 6 months then bail.

17 Lidane  Jul 28, 2014 12:07:08pm

re: #12 HappyWarrior

Pretty weak dissent but let’s be honest pretty much all the opposition to SSM is pretty weak sauce.

That’s because the only opposition to SSM comes down to either personal discomfort with teh ghey or religious beliefs, and neither of them are good enough reasons to deny civil rights to LGBT couples.

18 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 28, 2014 12:07:09pm

re: #16 makeitstop

Good point. Past behavior says she’ll do 6 months then bail.

Will the gameshow entry on the Palin TV network be called “Take the Money and Run”?
//

19 Eclectic Cyborg  Jul 28, 2014 12:08:18pm

The problem is the anti SSM groups try to argue only opposite sex marriages should be allowed because they can produce offspring, but this ignores the fact that some happily married hetero couples neither have nor want children.

So unless you want to make those marriages illegal too…

20 jaunte  Jul 28, 2014 12:09:41pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

The problem is the anti SSM groups try to argue only opposite sex marriages should be allowed because they can produce offspring…

Yeah, this is not a popular argument with adoptive parents.

21 dog philosopher  Jul 28, 2014 12:09:50pm

re: #13 Kragar

PalinTVShows

“hilarity ensues”

22 Higgs Boson's Mate  Jul 28, 2014 12:10:21pm

The arguments against SSM all boil down to “Because we say so.” That’s not something you want to take into a court.

I’m smiling.

23 William Barnett-Lewis  Jul 28, 2014 12:11:06pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

The problem is the anti SSM groups try to argue only opposite sex marriages should be allowed because they can produce offspring, but this ignores the fact that some happily married hetero couples neither have nor want children.

So unless you want to make those marriages illegal too…

Most of those kind of people would make those illegal as well. See “The Handmaid’s Tale” for details of their idea of utopia.

24 Lidane  Jul 28, 2014 12:13:01pm

re: #20 jaunte

Yeah, this is not a popular argument with adoptive parents.

Or with infertile couples.

Tell a couple who’s been struggling with infertility for years that the only valid marriages are the ones with kids. See how they react.

25 Higgs Boson's Mate  Jul 28, 2014 12:18:50pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

The problem is the anti SSM groups try to argue only opposite sex marriages should be allowed because they can produce offspring…

Then I guess that people past child bearing age shouldn’t be allowed to marry either.

26 Lidane  Jul 28, 2014 12:25:06pm

re: #25 Higgs Boson’s Mate

Then I guess that people past child bearing age shouldn’t be allowed to marry either.

Didn’t you know? The only purpose for sex is to make babies, and the only point to marriage is making it okay to have sex so you can make babies. Anything else is totally selfish and immoral.

///////////////

27 Testy Toad T  Jul 28, 2014 12:26:47pm

re: #26 Lidane

Didn’t you know? The only purpose for sex is to make babies fetuses, and the only point to marriage is making it okay to have sex so you can make babies fetuses. Anything else is totally selfish and immoral.

FTFY. Nobody gives a shit about transuterine free-air babies.

28 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 12:27:44pm

re: #26 Lidane

Didn’t you know? The only purpose for sex is to make babies, and the only point to marriage is making it okay to have sex so you can make babies. Anything else is totally selfish and immoral.

///////////////

SELF CONTROL, PEOPLE!

29 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 28, 2014 12:28:25pm

re: #28 Kragar

SELF CONTROL, PEOPLE!

[Embedded content]

Brave Patti ran away, ran away

30 Higgs Boson's Mate  Jul 28, 2014 12:30:15pm

re: #26 Lidane

Didn’t you know? The only purpose for sex is to make babies…

Good thing no one knew that when I was at Berkeley back in the Sixties.

These are the memories that make me a wealthy soul.

31 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 12:30:45pm

re: #29 Pie-onist Overlord

Brave Patti ran away, ran away

[Embedded content]

I think I forced her into a fetal position when I pointed out oral and anal sex have a 0% chance of pregnancy

32 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:30:54pm

re: #26 Lidane

Didn’t you know? The only purpose for sex is to make babies, and the only point to marriage is making it okay to have sex so you can make babies. Anything else is totally selfish and immoral.

///////////////

Fuck it.

33 aagcobb  Jul 28, 2014 12:33:01pm

re: #13 Kragar

[Embedded content]

I expect Palin to quit about half way through the year.

34 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:33:31pm

And the grandkid finally wakes up.

He was up til 4:30 last night PLAYING VIDEO GAMES!!

Arrggghhh.

35 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 28, 2014 12:33:45pm

OK, time to tap the Lizard hive mind for information.

Planning a late August vacation and have about 10 days off. Thinking of making a run down to western Tennessee and at least seeing a few major US Civil War battlefields (Chickamauga and Shiloh at the very least.) Then looping back out via Illinois and Indianapolis in order to visit friends on multiple stops headed back east. (Plus a visit to Wright-Patterson with a decent camera!)

Any additional suggestions for places to stop and see, or at least spend part of a day at? A place or two along the I-81 corridor between Harrisburg and Chattanooga might be in order as well.

36 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 12:34:43pm

re: #34 b_sharp

And the grandkid finally wakes up.

He was up til 4:30 last night PLAYING VIDEO GAMES!!

Arrggghhh.

I’m transitioning my kids back to a school schedule starting this week. My oldest girl just entered her “sleep all the time” phase

37 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:36:32pm

re: #36 Kragar

I’m transitioning my kids back to a school schedule starting this week. My oldest girl just entered her “sleep all the time” phase

He just graduated from high school. He’s done with school unless he decides to go to University or a trades school.

Or, he can look for a job.

Likely playing video games.

38 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:37:03pm

re: #36 Kragar

I’m transitioning my kids back to a school schedule starting this week. My oldest girl just entered her “sleep all the time” phase

I’ve been in my sleep all the time phase for decades.

39 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 12:40:38pm

re: #38 b_sharp

I’ve been in my sleep all the time phase for decades.

She gets up around 7, takes a nap around 11, gets up at 2, takes another nap around 7, gets up at 10, goes to bed at 1.

re: #37 b_sharp

He just graduated from high school. He’s done with school unless he decides to go to University or a trades school.

Or, he can look for a job.

Likely playing video games.

She’s 12, getting ready for middle school

40 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:44:33pm

re: #39 Kragar

She gets up around 7, takes a nap around 11, gets up at 2, takes another nap around 7, gets up at 10, goes to bed at 1.

She’s 12, getting ready for middle school

Is she at least reading in between all those naps?

41 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 12:45:48pm

The question is “Where is my daughter?”

Last summer’s answer was “Outside playing”

This summer’s answer is “In her room sleeping.”

42 Timothy Watson  Jul 28, 2014 12:45:52pm

re: #34 b_sharp

And the grandkid finally wakes up.

He was up til 4:30 last night PLAYING VIDEO GAMES!!

Arrggghhh.

Only 4:30? Quiter! I used to stay up until 6:00 am or so playing video games when I was younger.

43 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:50:06pm

re: #42 Timothy Watson

Only 4:30? Quiter! I used to stay up until 6:00 am or so playing video games when I was younger.

When I was his age video games didn’t exist. We had these things called booze, cars, drugs and rock & roll.

44 Timothy Watson  Jul 28, 2014 12:55:34pm

re: #43 b_sharp

When I was his age video games didn’t exist. We had these things called booze, cars, drugs and rock & roll.

Oh, I’m sure those are fun too, but Neverwinter Nights could be pretty addictive too. :)

45 b_sharp  Jul 28, 2014 12:56:31pm

re: #44 Timothy Watson

Oh, I’m sure those are fun too, but Neverwinter Nights could be pretty addictive too. :)

Uh huh.

46 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 28, 2014 1:04:41pm

My pet one was the “one more turn” phenomena playing the first Civilization game — and then suddenly realizing it was 5:30am.

47 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 1:06:11pm

re: #46 Feline Fearless Leader

My pet one was the “one more turn” phenomena playing the first Civilization game — and then suddenly realizing it was 5:30am.

“I will take this god damn city if its the last thing I do…”

48 Decatur Deb  Jul 28, 2014 1:08:32pm

re: #47 Kragar

“I will take this god damn city if its the last thing I do…”

“Just gonna play ‘til the next AI piles on.”

49 Higgs Boson's Mate  Jul 28, 2014 1:09:17pm

re: #44 Timothy Watson

Nothing can top the nail-biting excitement of The Bard’s Tale on an Apple II.

50 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 1:12:00pm

re: #48 Decatur Deb

“Just gonna play ‘til the next AI piles on.”

“Just as soon as I finishing building this Wonder I’ll…”

XXXX has just built the Wonder you spent 30 turns working on

“OH HELLS NO!”

51 Decatur Deb  Jul 28, 2014 1:13:13pm

re: #50 Kragar

“Just as soon as I finishing building this Wonder I’ll…”

XXXX has just built the Wonder you spent 30 turns working on

“OH HELLS NO!”

Somewhere between Civ I and III you lost the ability to recover the wonder investment.

52 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 1:16:10pm

re: #51 Decatur Deb

Somewhere between Civ I and III you lost the ability to recover the wonder investment.

In Civ V, you get it back in gold, but you can’t transfer the production points over to another wonder, everything starts from scratch

53 Decatur Deb  Jul 28, 2014 1:17:24pm

re: #52 Kragar

In Civ V, you get it back in gold, but you can’t transfer the production points over to another wonder, everything starts from scratch

Kid has given me his Steam access to try V, but I think I have to boot Windows to do it.

54 Higgs Boson's Mate  Jul 28, 2014 1:19:50pm

re: #51 Decatur Deb

That’s because starting a Wonder with the knowledge that the AI would beat you to it in order to bank Hammers had become an exploit.

Started playing Civ in 1991, beta tested Civ III, and stayed with it through Civ V. I’ve finally had enough.

55 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 28, 2014 1:20:39pm

re: #47 Kragar

“I will take this god damn city if its the last thing I do…”

Mine was watching an AI pour troops into that city right before my rich diplomat visited and bought the place.

56 Timothy Watson  Jul 28, 2014 1:23:25pm

re: #53 Decatur Deb

Kid has given me his Steam access to try V, but I think I have to boot Windows to do it.

I just got XCOM last week and, unfortunately, haven’t had that much time to play it. :(

57 Decatur Deb  Jul 28, 2014 1:25:19pm

re: #56 Timothy Watson

I just got XCOM last week and, unfortunately, haven’t had that much time to play it. :(

I’ve been stuck on IV for a couple years, but after I put a SSD in the laptop and went to Win 8, the DOS decided it was incompatible.

58 Archangelus  Jul 28, 2014 1:26:46pm

There is no such thing as “enough” of Civilization games in my experience ..

re: #56 Timothy Watson

I just got XCOM last week and, unfortunately, haven’t had that much time to play it. :(

Which one?

59 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 1:27:09pm

re: #56 Timothy Watson

I just got XCOM last week and, unfortunately, haven’t had that much time to play it. :(

Finally made it into Ultimate Vault Hunter mode on Borderlands 2

60 Timothy Watson  Jul 28, 2014 1:27:55pm

re: #58 Archangelus

There is no such thing as “enough” of Civilization games in my experience ..

Which one?

Enemy Within (the expansion for the new one).

61 Archangelus  Jul 28, 2014 1:28:19pm

re: #57 Decatur Deb

I’ve been stuck on IV for a couple years, but after I put a SSD in the laptop and went to Win 8, the DOS decided it was incompatible.

There’s some good virtualization software out there for loading older games that you could run if your system meets the requirements (mostly RAM related, the more the merrier)…

62 Kragar  Jul 28, 2014 1:32:21pm

re: #60 Timothy Watson

Enemy Within (the expansion for the new one).

I upgraded some troops to Mech early, but I usually only genemodded psychics

63 Decatur Deb  Jul 28, 2014 1:32:54pm

re: #61 Archangelus

There’s some good virtualization software out there for running older games that you could run if your system meets the requirements (mostly RAM related, the more the merrier)…

I’m going to try V on Steam, though I never won at each level of IV. Lizards posted that an expansion pack re-introduces Religion.

64 klys  Jul 28, 2014 1:33:26pm

re: #63 Decatur Deb

I’m going to try V on Steam, though I never won at each level of IV. Lizards posted that an expansion pack re-introduces Religion.

It does it quite nicely, too.

65 wrenchwench  Jul 28, 2014 1:35:30pm

Basically, if I understand correctly, NC throws in the towel because of the today’s 4th District opinion, as predicted in the post at the top. Video at the link is half statement, half answering questions.

66 ObserverArt  Jul 28, 2014 2:42:41pm

re: #24 Lidane

Or with infertile couples.

Tell a couple who’s been struggling with infertility for years that the only valid marriages are the ones with kids. See how they react.

Just a thought…I don’t think a traditionalist when thinking of marriage is concerned about adoption, infertility and childless marriages. I think they are stuck in the simple reasoning of male bits and female bits. Nothing else.

You have to keep in mind these are simple thinking people, they can not get past any other concepts but man and woman. There would be no reason to ask them to understand because their level of understanding goes no further than the simple male and female.

So, anything to do with law, fairness, equality…out the window. They are incapable of even trying to grasp such concepts. And, the fact is most of this is religion based and they accept what they have been taught, which many time means they do not question their religion either.

It is all about beliefs. And they never question their beliefs as it is way to scary for them to do so.

67 Romantic Heretic  Jul 28, 2014 2:45:51pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

The problem is the anti SSM groups try to argue only opposite sex marriages should be allowed because they can produce offspring, but this ignores the fact that some happily married hetero couples neither have nor want children.

So unless you want to make those marriages illegal too…

Shhhh! Don’t give ‘em any ideas!

68 Romantic Heretic  Jul 28, 2014 2:53:11pm

re: #56 Timothy Watson

I just got XCOM last week and, unfortunately, haven’t had that much time to play it. :(

Be prepared to have your ass handed to you. A lot.

Tip: Make sure your bench of soldiers is deep. Otherwise you’ll be trying the toughest missions with rookie soldiers, which really stacks the odds against you.

69 Romantic Heretic  Jul 28, 2014 2:58:33pm

re: #59 Kragar

Finally made it into Ultimate Vault Hunter mode on Borderlands 2

Don’t get the Tiny Tina’s DLC. There’s a boss in it that is nearly unbeatable unless you have the very best weapons and you never a mistake. I did heard of one person who beat it with blue level weapons. It took him two hours.

I finally gave up in frustration. The one time I got by this thing, because he got hung up on some scenery, I found even the boss fights were lightweight compared to him. This boss isn’t even at a major plot point either.

Worst piece of game design I’ve seen in ages.


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