It’s Darwin Day in the US, Where Far Too Many Fanatics Still Reject Evolution

Anti-science fanaticism persists, 100 years later
Science • Views: 30,540

I was going to start this post by wishing everyone a Happy Darwin Day (it’s Charles Darwin’s birthday), but unfortunately it’s not a very happy occasion — because this country still has far too many religious fanatics who refuse to accept the fact of evolution through natural selection: On Darwin Day, 5 Facts About the Evolution Debate.

Of all the major religious groups in the U.S., white evangelical Protestants are the most likely to reject evolution. A solid majority (64%) of white evangelicals in a 2013 poll said that humans and other living things have always existed in their present form, while only 27% said that humans evolved. These views are largely mirrored by the positions of large evangelical churches, such as the Southern Baptist Convention and the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod, which explicitly reject evolutionary theory as being in conflict with what they see as biblical truth.

Some people will try to tell you this is just a private belief and doesn’t matter; but these people are not only indoctrinating their children with this Dark Ages anti-science rejectionism, they’re continually trying to force their views on everyone else’s children by sneaking creationism into public schools. And since this strategy has been consistently foiled by the courts, they’re now using a new technique to get at the children of America: taxpayer-funded religious schools that teach young Earth creationism and reject evolution entirely.

In an age when science and technology are vitally important skills, another entire generation of kids is having their critical thinking abilities deliberately sabotaged by fanatics.

This matters.

Also see

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430 comments
1 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 11:25:25am
2 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 11:28:56am

Ashton Carter was just confirmed as the new Secretary of Defense.

3 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 11:29:57am
taxpayer-funded religious schools

This should stop.

4 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 11:30:22am
5 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 11:30:42am

chabad.org

In fairness to your question, I should add that there have been those who have attempted to align Judaism and evolution, some of them quite respectable Torah scholars. None of them, however, have managed to make a plausible reading out of Genesis with their theories. Their error stems from the belief that evolution has been somehow scientifically proven. This is simply not the case. While Darwin’s theories and their modern counterparts may have proven a useful paradigm for certain studies, they cannot at all stand the rigor through which a theory must be put in the academic world in order to be accepted as “proven.” Their sole claim to acceptance is the human mind’s endemic fear of saying, “We don’t understand.”

6 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 11:33:27am

re: #3 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD
Agreed, missing link maybe though?

7 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 11:36:19am

re: #5 Great White Snark

None of them, however, have managed to make a plausible reading out of Genesis with their theories.

Why would that be a definitive test?

8 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 11:36:50am

Interestingly, the writer at Chabad tries to define for science what poof is. OTOH I never see scientists looking to define ideas found in religion. Hmmm.

9 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 11:37:11am

re: #7 jaunte

Why would that be a definitive test?

because, shut up!

10 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 11:38:19am
One step simpler: Evolution says that a dumb universe can create intelligent beings. Genesis says that an intelligent universe may sometimes look dumb, until you look deeper.

Mixing these two together is then an exttreme form of syncretism.

Raising the question, “so what?”

11 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 11:39:10am

re: #7 jaunte

I’m with the writer about how evolution may not fit what it says in Genesis. Okay that’s their expertise. I can accept that. But making claims about science is right over the edge of credibility. What proof is, is simply not their expertise or responsibility.

12 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 11:39:20am
Speaking of Evolution: Tesla to unveil new battery to power homes, says Elon Musk

And…..

A Compilation of Tesla P85D “Insane Mode” Launch Reactions - (Explicit Language!)

13 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 11:39:44am

re: #5 Great White Snark

Rabbi Slifkin tried a very cautious approach to evolution in his books, but was quickly shouted at by many other Orthodox rabbis. This is not limited to Christian fundies.

14 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 11:41:58am

In the beginning, there was nothing then God said “Let there be LIGHT!”

There was still nothing, but now you could see it.

15 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 11:43:16am

re: #8 Great White Snark

Interestingly, the writer at Chabad tries to define for science what poof is. OTOH I never see scientists looking to define ideas found in religion. Hmmm.

I am a member of Chabad, and that polemic is simply not correct.

Orthodox Jews did not have any problems accepting evolution, or accepting the fact that the earth is millions of years old. The Jewish “calendar year” is not even mentioned anywhere in Scripture and was in fact calculated during the rabbinical period. The Zohar speaks of “millions of years of creation”

In the 1970’s a rabbi published some anti-evolution books (which turned out to be all based on materials that were put out by Christian evangelicals) that gained popularity among scientific illiterates.

16 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 11:43:56am

re: #14 Kragar

In the beginning, there was nothing then God said “Let there be LIGHT!”

Then He created Thomas Edison.

17 Rocky-in-Connecticut  Feb 12, 2015 11:43:57am

I’d like to see a Venn diagram of Whites who hold racist beliefs and those that reject Science and believe humans were created in their present form.

I predict a correlation above 90%.

18 Ace-o-aces  Feb 12, 2015 11:44:19am

re: #13 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Rabbi Slifkin tried a very cautious approach to evolution in his books, but was quickly shouted at by many other Orthodox rabbis. This is not limited to Christian fundies.

No, but it’s confined to a very small sliver of Judaism. Mostly Ultra-Orthodox, and even then, not all of them.

19 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 11:44:52am

re: #13 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Rabbi Slifkin tried a very cautious approach to evolution in his books, but was quickly shouted at by many other Orthodox rabbis. This is not limited to Christian fundies.

The way Rabbi Slifkin has been treated is shameful.

20 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 11:45:23am

This matters!

Indeed it does. If you don’t think that teaching evolution matters, consider that medical advances, biotech, and genetics other related industries would not exist but for the understanding of evolution. This is an increasingly important part of the US economy, and undermining the education system diminishes the economic vitality of the nation over the long run.

This has economic effects in the long term. And that matters and will continue to matter.

Much more immediately, once again I repeat with emphasis:

Science belongs in a science classroom.
Religion does not belong in a science classroom.

If you want to teach religion, it belongs in a class on religions, sociology, or other social sciences. It has no place in the science classroom. Creationists may try to couch it in terms of teaching the controversy or that it’s intelligent design or other similar wordings, but scientists have shown evolution exists, it is occurring at present, and that ID and other creationist iterations do not meet the criteria for being considered in a science classroom (like the ability to be tested, repeated, etc.). Religion is based on belief, not facts.

21 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss  Feb 12, 2015 11:45:51am

Kentucky flim-flammer and creationist Ken Ham has designated this “Darwin Was Wrong Day.”

I do believe there’s a related Twitter hashtag…not that I’m assed to go look.

But how about we-revisit that whole discussion of how intelligent design is a giant ideological bait-and-switch that eliminates any non-literal interpretation of the Bible *and* undermines basic premise of empirical research?

Or that any and all “well truth lies in between faith and science” statement is meaningless if faith can make any old claim justified with Appeal to Authority, and science has to do the accommodation.

Or how about we talk about all the current active “discussions” in US politics and culture where science has to bash its massive head against a wall of “nuh-uh, God—by way of my megachurch pastor and his collection of televangelist books—says no.”

22 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 11:45:54am

Darwin Day in Texas:

23 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 11:46:02am

re: #2 Backwoods_Sleuth

Ashton Carter was just confirmed as the new Secretary of Defense.

I never really thought he was that qualified……

24 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 11:46:33am

re: #18 Ace-o-aces

No, but it’s confined to a very small sliver of Judaism. Mostly Ultra-Orthodox, and even then, not all of them.

Yep, just like with the Christians. Although I suppose the percentage of religious American Jews accepting evolution is probably higher than that of Christians.

25 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 11:47:21am

re: #16 WhatEVs

In the beginning, there was nothing then God said “Let there be LIGHT!”

Then He created Thomas Edison.

And the first schism occurred, as Nikolai Tesla said, wait a moment. It should be AC, not DC.

AC/DC then tried to reconcile the differences, and published their thesis as For Those About To Rock. /

26 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 11:47:27am
27 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 11:48:44am

If you accept the fact that the Earth is only 5000 years old and God can create the entire universe out of nothing, including evidence that it has been around for millions of years, then you have to also accept the fact that the universe might actually only be a few minutes old and that everything you have ever known was simply created by God to trick you.

Or you could trust science and not be a moron.

28 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 11:48:59am

re: #15 The Vicious Babushka

Well this is confusing. Apparently this varies.
Each Friday some youngsters come into my office from Chabad, and sometimes do tefillin with my boss. In discussions about evolution as the bosses daughter was in a Jewish school, they carefully explained that fossils etc are a test of our faith and that Genesis for the Orthodox Jew should be taken as written. Students of Liebovich. Forgive my spelling is in error.

All very polite but firm.

29 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 11:49:18am

Look at this “Jewish Scientist”==>

30 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 11:49:22am

re: #19 The Vicious Babushka

The way Rabbi Slifkin has been treated is shameful.

And he’s been very humble about it:

31 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 11:49:54am

re: #8 Great White Snark

Interestingly, the writer at Chabad tries to define for science what poof is. OTOH I never see scientists looking to define ideas found in religion. Hmmm.

Defining your opponents view is a staple of conservative argument. “You atheists believe…” is a phrase you might see frequently.

32 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 11:50:06am

re: #26 klys (maker of Silmarils)

Gonna be close to 90 degrees here on the Central Coast today. I’ve never seen anything like it. Water the pots in the morning, and by afternoon they look like they’ve been in a microwave.

33 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 11:51:03am

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

That’s way too Harvard for me. I don’t even understand it.

34 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 11:51:07am

re: #28 Great White Snark

Well this is confusing. Apparently this varies.
Each Friday some youngsters come into my office from Chabad, and sometimes do tefillin with my boss. In discussions about evolution as the bosses daughter was in a Jewish school, they carefully explained that fossils etc are a test of our faith and that Genesis for the Orthodox Jew should be taken as written. Students of Liebovich. Forgive my spelling is in error.

All very polite but firm.

They are scientific illiterates who have read the books of anti-evolutionist Avigdor Miller.

35 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 11:51:21am

re: #31 Zamb

Defining your opponents view is a staple of conservative argument. “You atheists believe…” is a phrase you might see frequently.

“This drives liberal nuts…” and “Why do you hate America?” are also right up there.

36 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 11:51:52am

re: #5 Great White Snark

chabad.org

D’oh.

BREAKING: Non-scientist Trying to Define Science… Again.

37 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 11:52:07am

I find it interesting that those who claim to believe in the special creation of each species also tacitly accept Evolution, since they are almost universally in favor of animal experimentation in the development of pharmaceuticals for humans. If you believe that each species was created separately, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason to believe that any drug you test in any animal species will work in a human being. By their logic, we are no more closely related to chimpanzees than we are to bananas.

38 Romantic Heretic  Feb 12, 2015 11:52:20am

re: #14 Kragar

In the beginning, there was nothing then God said “Let there be LIGHT!”

There was still nothing, but now you could see it.

Have you ever read Asimov’s story The Last Question?

39 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 11:52:35am

re: #6 Great White Snark

Agreed, missing link maybe though?

I hate you.

That was supposed to be my pun.

40 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 11:52:44am

My grandson has a collection of Rabbi Slifkin books and model dinosaurs.

41 makeitstop  Feb 12, 2015 11:53:21am

re: #33 Skip Intro

That’s way too Harvard for me. I don’t even understand it.

He tweeted something this morning that barely even held together as a sentence.

Whatever Chuck C has, it’s contagious and Ben caught it.

42 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 11:54:27am

re: #35 Kragar

“This drives liberal nuts…” and “Why do you hate America?” are also right up there.

YOU LIBERALS THINK… is the classic fallacy of the Straw Man.

43 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 11:54:28am

re: #21 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss

Kentucky flim-flammer and creationist Ken Ham has designated this “Darwin Was Wrong Day.”

I do believe there’s a related Twitter hashtag…not that I’m assed to go look.

But how about we-revisit that whole discussion of how intelligent design is a giant ideological bait-and-switch that eliminates any non-literal interpretation of the Bible *and* undermines basic premise of empirical research?

Or that any and all “well truth lies in between faith and science” statement is meaningless if faith can make any old claim justified with Appeal to Authority, and science has to do the accommodation.

Or how about we talk about all the current active “discussions” in US politics and culture where science has to bash its massive head against a wall of “nuh-uh, God—by way of my megachurch pastor and his collection of televangelist books—says no.”

More atheists using it than theists I think.

44 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 11:54:50am

re: #27 Kragar

If you accept the fact that the Earth is only 5000 years old and God can create the entire universe out of nothing, including evidence that it has been around for millions of years, then you have to also accept the fact that the universe might actually only be a few minutes old and that everything you have ever known was simply created by God to trick you.

Or you could trust science and not be a moron.

I refer to this as the ‘God As A Colossal Jokester’ hypothesis.

45 mr.fusion  Feb 12, 2015 11:55:31am

I’m going to punt on commenting in this thread

46 KingKenrod  Feb 12, 2015 11:55:46am

I wonder where the “Supreme being guided evolution” idea originated. It probably makes the least amount of sense of ANY of the viewpoints. I guess it’s a way for people smart enough to know evolution is fact to avoid divine retribution.

47 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 11:56:47am

re: #27 Kragar

If you accept the fact that the Earth is only 5000 years old and God can create the entire universe out of nothing, including evidence that it has been around for millions of years, then you have to also accept the fact that the universe might actually only be a few minutes old and that everything you have ever known was simply created by God to trick you.

Or you could trust science and not be a moron.

It gets recycled and the memories of an interesting past are implanted in our minds every Thursday.

For those of us who have minds.

48 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 11:56:49am

re: #45 mr.fusion

I’m going to punt on commenting in this thread

Punter.

49 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 11:58:07am

re: #45 mr.fusion

I’m going to punt on commenting in this thread

Sticking in the conservative boat?

50 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss  Feb 12, 2015 11:58:08am

re: #45 mr.fusion

I’m going to punt on commenting in this thread

I’m more comfortable with rugby than American football, so I’m going to form a ruck.

51 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 11:58:26am

re: #46 KingKenrod

Dunno, for God time shouldn’t matter, so the diff between instant creation and billions of years isn’t significant.

52 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 11:58:38am

re: #45 mr.fusion

I’m going to punt on commenting in this thread

Just Walker away. /

53 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 11:58:42am

Gotta point out I never ever heard Chabad or any jewish person ever pine for creationism or the Torah to be part of secular education. Never ever. Unlike fundie Christians who have tried to insist and lobby and cajole and take over PTA meets.

54 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 11:59:01am

re: #46 KingKenrod

I wonder where the “Supreme being guided evolution” idea originated. It probably makes the least amount of sense of ANY of the viewpoints. I guess it’s a way for people smart enough to know evolution is fact to avoid divine retribution.

Lets priest/scientists like de Chardin and Lemaitre keep up their memberships.

55 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 11:59:33am

re: #46 KingKenrod

I wonder where the “Supreme being guided evolution” idea originated. It probably makes the least amount of sense of ANY of the viewpoints. I guess it’s a way for people smart enough to know evolution is fact to avoid divine retribution.

To be fair, a truly omnipotent supreme being COULD set up everything at the start to turn out any particular way it wants it to at any particular point in time. This makes me wonder why so many who believe in predestination don’t also believe in Evolution and Big Bang cosmology.

56 calochortus  Feb 12, 2015 12:00:01pm

re: #44 Blind Frog Belly White

I refer to this as the ‘God As A Colossal Jokester’ hypothesis.

The Omphalos Hypothesis The author of the book back in the 1850s really thought he was on to something that would bring together science and faith. Victorian Englishmen (and presumably, women) weren’t amused by the concept of God the Trickster and the idea landed with a dull thud.

57 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss  Feb 12, 2015 12:00:02pm

re: #48 Decatur Deb

Punter.

Boating punter; prostitute-seeking punter; or a little-of-column-A, a little-of- column-B?

58 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 12:00:03pm
59 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:00:29pm

re: #42 The Vicious Babushka

YOU LIBERALS THINK… is the classic fallacy of the Straw Man.

I’ve always seen “believe” rather than “think” or any other word, I assume to put science and observation on par with religion.

60 Romantic Heretic  Feb 12, 2015 12:01:25pm

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

Look at this “Jewish Scientist”==>

[Embedded content]

What the hell would you know about biological sex, Ben?

61 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 12:02:17pm

re: #60 Romantic Heretic

What the hell would you know about biological sex, Ben?

His wife gave birth to a child. So do we assume it’s a virgin birth or that some other guy is the daddy?

62 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:02:18pm

re: #60 Romantic Heretic

What the hell would you know about biological sex, Ben?

I had sex with another Biologist. It was amazing.

63 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 12:02:39pm

Imagine the fake outrage and hateful vile from the right if Candidate or President Obama said he is “going to punt” on a question.

64 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:02:54pm

“What we’ve made is basically a very small test tube,” said Xu Liu, who led the work while he was a graduate student at Brown. “We can do biochemistry on the single strand in that very confined space.”

The key to the technology, Liu said, was making that test tube small, but not too small. If it were too small, the DNA wouldn’t have enough room to curl up, which would cause it to squirt out the hole at the top of the device. Using some theoretical calculations and a bit of trial and error, the researchers settled on a cage that’s about 1.5 micrometers square.

65 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 12:04:13pm

re: #25 lawhawk

Excellent!

66 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:04:35pm

re: #62 Blind Frog Belly White

I had sex with another Biologist. It was amazing.

Have sex with a skydiver. It’s damn near terminal.

(Yes, that happened. They were fired.)

67 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:05:06pm

Referring back to something said in the previous thread:

68 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 12:05:51pm

re: #66 Decatur Deb

Have sex with a skydiver. It’s damn near terminal.

(Yes, that happened, they were fired.)

Obviously.

69 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:06:48pm

re: #66 Decatur Deb

Have sex with a skydiver. It’s damn near terminal.

(Yes that happened, they were fired.)

In my case, the amazingness didn’t hinge on her being a Biologist. The fact that we were dating at all - THAT hinged on her being a Biologist.

70 Romantic Heretic  Feb 12, 2015 12:06:49pm

re: #56 calochortus

The Omphalos Hypothesis The author of the book back in the 1850s really thought he was on to something that would bring together science and faith. Victorian Englishmen (and presumably, women) weren’t amused by the concept of God the Trickster and the idea landed with a dull thud.

Well if there was something Victorian gentlemen were opposed to it was fun. No wonder they were addicted to pornography.

71 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:07:07pm

I need to sit down and read “The Uplift War” again sometime soon.

72 Iwouldprefernotto  Feb 12, 2015 12:08:14pm

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

Look at this “Jewish Scientist”==>

[Embedded content]re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

Look at this “Jewish Scientist”==>

[Embedded content]think biological sex is a construct.

What the hell does this mean? I thought the problem with liberals is that they enjoyed sex too much.

73 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:08:54pm

re: #70 Romantic Heretic

Don’t show it to Santorum:

There was a young man from Peru,
Who had nothing whatever to do;
So he took out his carrot
And he buggered his parrot,
And sent the result to the zoo.

74 Romantic Heretic  Feb 12, 2015 12:09:40pm

re: #61 The Vicious Babushka

His wife gave birth to a child. So do we assume it’s a virgin birth or that some other guy is the daddy?

If it was a virgin birth Ben would never stop bragging about it. I’ll go the adultery angle.

Artificial insemination is not out though. But given Ben’s ‘conservative’ beliefs he might be opposed to it because Librul Science!!!11!!

75 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 12:09:47pm

re: #72 Iwouldprefernotto

What the hell does this mean? I thought the problem with liberals is that they enjoyed sex too much.

Gays.

76 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:12:07pm
77 Romantic Heretic  Feb 12, 2015 12:13:01pm

re: #76 Kragar

And Americans worry about Islamic terrorism.

78 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:13:47pm
79 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 12:14:15pm

re: #12 Dr. Matt

And…..

A Compilation of Tesla P85D “Insane Mode” Launch Reactions - (Explicit Language!)

[Embedded content]

How much will it cost, I wonder? When this kind of innovation first happens, not many can afford it. Just sayin’. : )

80 calochortus  Feb 12, 2015 12:14:16pm

re: #70 Romantic Heretic

Well if there was something Victorian gentlemen were opposed to it was fun. No wonder they were addicted to pornography.

Not really. Victorian gentlemen enjoyed fun as much as anyone. They were more opposed to other people having fun.

81 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:14:25pm

re: #34 The Vicious Babushka

They are scientific illiterates who have read the books of anti-evolutionist Avigdor Miller.

A quote from that guy from your link:

Hitler was not only sent by Heaven, but was sent as a kindness from Heaven … Because assimilation and intermarriage are worse than death … and the German Jews and others ignored the Torah-teachers and refused to desist from their mad race into assimilation, the Nazis were sent to prevent them and rescue them before they were swallowed up by the nations.

82 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 12:15:50pm

re: #61 The Vicious Babushka

His wife gave birth to a child. So do we assume it’s a virgin birth or that some other guy is the daddy?

Parthenogenesis.

83 iossarian  Feb 12, 2015 12:16:10pm

re: #75 b_sharp

Gays.

Careful. If you say it three times in front of a mirror you’ll be compelled to put up some fabulous drapes.

84 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 12:16:25pm

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

Tell us about science, Dems who link autism with vaccines, say babies aren’t babies in the womb, and think biological sex is a construct.
— Ben Shapiro (@benshapiro) February 12, 2015

1. What Dems are linking autism to vaccines?
2. The Bible states life begins with breathing air.
3. Why is obsessing over the definition of sex?

85 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 12:18:15pm

re: #83 iossarian

Careful. If you say it three times in front of a mirror you’ll be compelled to put up some fabulous drapes.

This place could use a little fabulousness.

86 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:18:42pm

re: #67 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Referring back to something said in the previous thread:

[Embedded content]

The W. White quote is overstatement (to say lynching is only possible under Christianity). It is functionally the same as the witchcraft panics in shamanic Africa and other traditional societies. Stay away from mobs, no matter whose icon or fetish they’re carrying.

87 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 12:19:09pm

Here is evolution in action right before your very eyes:

88 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:19:39pm

re: #64 jaunte

I started my career sequencing DNA back in 1980. Back then it was incredibly labor intensive just to get a couple hundred bases, and to stitch it together into a couple thousand-base stretch took months. The idea of sequencing the whole genome of a couple billion bases seemed like a pipe dream. So of course, somebody figured out how to do it faster, and they managed it. Now you can see all the genes, as well as all the irrelevant crap, in the human genome.

Then somebody figured out how to do it even faster, so we could sequence all the mRNA in a sample, and see what’s actually being expressed.

Now someone’s figuring out how to do it faster still. Gotta love Science!

89 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 12:19:47pm

re: #81 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

A quote from that guy from your link:

He was a total asshole.

90 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss  Feb 12, 2015 12:20:39pm

re: #72 Iwouldprefernotto

What the hell does this mean? I thought the problem with liberals is that they enjoyed sex too much.

It means that liberals, in addition to enjoying sex, are okay with gays being same-sex attracted and trans people choosing their gender.

Because wingnut downthereologists and manographers understand that your crotch is the only index of who you are, and what your brain says, or how your nervous system encodes arousal, are filthy lies. And if you just get God-shamed enough, shocked a few times, and molested by a conversion counsellor, you’ll understand that who you really are is who these people demand you be.

Brought to by the same brilliant minds who don’t understand the idea of “consenting adults.”

91 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:21:23pm

re: #86 Decatur Deb

It is indeed an overstatement: for starters, the “curse of Ham” thing is not limited to Christianity and is also present in Islamic and Judaic thought (not saying that all Muslims and Jews believe it). So his logic is wrong. The use of the term “Christian violence”, however, is legitimate.

92 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:21:28pm

re: #79 Justanotherhuman

How much will it cost, I wonder? When this kind of innovation first happens, not many can afford it. Just sayin’. : )

$105,000. More than a Challenger Hellcat, less than a number of slower cars.

93 Dr Lizardo  Feb 12, 2015 12:21:29pm

I’ve decided Imma have to see this.

An Iranian B&W skateboarding vampire spaghetti western - filmed in Taft and Bakersfield, CA.

Sounds good.

94 CuriousLurker  Feb 12, 2015 12:22:26pm

OT, but I need to get this out of my system and you guys are the lucky winners. // If it gets tl;dr you can just skip to the last paragraph as that pretty much sums it up.

I don’t want to get drawn into a long discussion about this because it’s very emotional to me, but I do want to say this: Many if not most Muslims, both in the U.S. and around the world, are never going to believe that the murder of those three young people had nothing to do with them being Muslim.

Muslims overseas won’t believe it because of our drone strikes & wars in which hundreds of thousands of Muslims have been killed, and because of our support for dictators and our willingness to look the other way when they commit atrocities on their people because it’s in our best interests.

Muslims here in America will also find it difficult if not impossible to believe it had nothing to do with Islam. Why? Because we wake up every single day hearing the media, politicians, pundits and other public figures tell us how horrible Islam is—even if they don’t say it openly, how can one believe that any decent person would voluntarily choose to follow such a horrible religion?

You guys have NO IDEA what it’s like to be America’s bogeyman—you just don’t. This has been going on for decades now and it was made exponentially worse by 9/11.

This is what the murders look like from a Muslim perspective:

The mainstream (national) media went a full 12 hours (at least) before reporting on this. If the identities of the victims and perpetrator had been switched there would’ve been wall-to-wall national coverage starting almost immediately. That reinforced the idea that Muslim lives don’t matter, they’re cheap, even when the lives belonged to decent, productive young Americans that any parent would be proud to call their own.

As mentioned, we face a constant barrage of anti-Muslim sentiment—hell, there’s a whole well-financed industry dedicated to churning it out—yet we’re expected to believe this same constant barrage doesn’t affect non-Muslims, the actual target audience of all the negative framing? We’re supposed to believe that out of the many neighbors this murderous thug had confrontations with, he just “happened” to snap over parking that day? He just “happened” to go into the home of these young Muslims and shoot them in the head as if they were rabid dogs that needed to be put down?

Sorry, I don’t buy it. Does that come from an emotional rather than a logical place? Maybe, but I can assure you that if I feel that way, so do many other (if not most) Muslims because we all share the same daily experience of being America’s bogeyman.

Those three young people did everything right. They were exemplary citizens: educated, tolerant, law abiding Americans who went out of their way to help others, both non-Muslim and Muslim. And what did they get for thier efforts? A bullet in the head. THAT is how it looks from my side of the fence.

95 iossarian  Feb 12, 2015 12:23:32pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

Exactly.

96 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:23:38pm
97 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 12:23:44pm

re: #79 Justanotherhuman

How much will it cost, I wonder? When this kind of innovation first happens, not many can afford it. Just sayin’. : )

Like most advances, they start off cost prohibitive. See: calculators, the PC, VCR, CD players, DVD players, Flat Screens, etc. Early adopters are the key. Early adopters need to make up 15 to 18% of the market before prices come down.

98 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 12:24:18pm

re: #83 iossarian

Careful. If you say it three times in front of a mirror you’ll be compelled to put up some fabulous drapes.

Well, it’s that or Betelgeuse shows up.

99 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:24:38pm
100 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:25:16pm
You have no idea how wrong you are and it delights me.

Maybe this is a Chuck C. Johnson sock.

101 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:26:33pm

re: #99 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Ask him if he’s okay with testing human pharmaceuticals under development on bananas, since to a Creationist we’re as related to them as to primates.

102 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:26:54pm

re: #91 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

It is indeed an overstatement: for starters, the “curse of Ham” thing is not limited to Christianity and is also present in Islamic and Judaic thought (not saying that all Muslims and Jews believe it). So his logic is wrong. The use of the term “Christian violence”, however, is legitimate.

The only answer to to a Christian Confederate with a musket is a Christian Abolitionist with a Sharps repeater. Violence just picks up the flavor of ideology as it’s passing through the psyche.

103 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 12:27:42pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

OT, but I need to get this out of my system and you guys are the lucky winners. // If it’s tl;dr you can just skip to the last paragraph as that pretty much sums it up.

I don’t want to get drawn into a long discussion about this because it’s very emotional to me, but I do want to say this: Many if not most Muslims, both in the U.S. and around the world, are never going to believe that the murder of those three young people had nothing to do with them being Muslim.

Muslims overseas won’t believe it because of our drone strikes & wars in which hundreds of thousands of Muslims have been killed, and because of our support for dictators and our willingness to look the other way when they commit atrocities on their people because it’s in our best interests.

Muslims here in America will find it difficult if not impossible to believe it had nothing to do with Islam. Why? Because we wake up every single day hearing the media, politicians, pundits and other public figures tell us how horrible Islam is—even if they don’t say it openly. How can one believe that any decent person would voluntarily choose to follow such a horrible religion?

You guys have NO IDEA what it’s like to be America’s bogeyman—you just don’t. This has been going on for decades now and it was made exponentially worse by 9/11.

This is what the murders look like from a Muslim perspective:

The mainstream (national) media went a full 12 hours (at least) before reporting on this. If the identities of the victims and perpetrator had been switched there would’ve been wall-to-wall national coverage starting almost immediately. That reinforced the idea that Muslim lives don’t matter, they’re cheap, even when the lives belonged to decent, productive young Americans that any parent would be proud to call their own.

As mentioned, we face a constant barrage of anti-Muslim sentiment—hell, there’s a whole well-financed industry dedicated to churning it out—yet we’re expected to believe this same constant barrage doesn’t affect non-Muslims, the actual target audience of all the negative framing? We’re supposed to believe that out of the many neighbors this murderous thug had confrontations with, he just “happened” to snap over parking that day? He just “happened” to go into the home of these young Muslims and shoot them in the head as if they were rabid dogs that needed to be put down?

Sorry, I don’t buy it. Does that come from an emotional rather than a logical place? Maybe, but I can assure you that if I feel that way, so do many other (if not most) Muslims because we all share the same daily experience of being America’s bogeyman.

Those three young people did everything right. They were exemplary citizens: educated, tolerant, law abiding Americans who went out of their way to help others, both non-Muslim and Muslim. And what did they get for thier efforts? A bullet in the head. THAT is how it looks from my side of the fence.

I have no words CL.

104 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:27:53pm
105 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:28:30pm

re: #96 Charles Johnson

Genetics play no part in evolution. Confirmed Fact!

106 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:29:13pm

re: #79 Justanotherhuman

How much will it cost, I wonder? When this kind of innovation first happens, not many can afford it. Just sayin’. : )

I’d add that the Bay Area is lousy with Tesla Model S’s. I see more of them on any given day than I do other Challengers - probably 5 times more.

107 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:29:25pm
108 calochortus  Feb 12, 2015 12:29:40pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

All I can offer here is sympathy.

The murderer has been described as scaring all of his neighbors regardless of race, creed or color. However there is no reason to think fear/hate of Islam didn’t just give him that little extra bit of permission to go ahead and kill them.

Try to remember that there are a lot of people who know Muslims are pretty much just like everyone else.
{{{CL}}}

109 Dr Lizardo  Feb 12, 2015 12:29:41pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

Bingo.

110 bratwurst  Feb 12, 2015 12:29:57pm

There are two kinds of people who have trouble with evolution:

1) religious extremists

2) people who pander to religious extremists.

NRO is #2.

The end.

111 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:12pm

re: #97 Dr. Matt

Like most advances, they start off cost prohibitive. See: calculators, the PC, VCR, CD players, DVD players, Flat Screens, etc. Early adopters are the key. Early adopters need to make up 15 to 18% of the market before prices come down.

Right. I don’t think we had a color TV until 20 yrs after they came out. : ) I did, however, have a Mac computer in 1993. Floppy disk, of course. I sort of pick and choose what innovations i want and can afford at the time.

112 calochortus  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:12pm

re: #107 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

OK, I’ll bite. Why do we have new flu vaccines every year?

113 iossarian  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:18pm

The earth, round or flat: who cares?

WHY DOES NO-ONE ASK OBAMA HIS OPINION ON THE MOON-CHEESE THEOREM?

114 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:21pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

OT, but I need to get this out of my system and you guys are the lucky winners. // If it’s tl;dr you can just skip to the last paragraph as that pretty much sums it up.

…snip.

I doubt he would have killed his neighbors if they hadn’t been Muslim. I doubt he would have killed those Muslims if they hadn’t been his neighbors. Pathology cannot be sifted more finely over the Internet.

115 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:21pm
“…The relevance of evolutionary biology to medicine is also poorly understood by educated members of the public. Perhaps more disturbing are misunderstandings - and even a lack of understanding - of the relevance of evolutionary biology for medicine (in theory and in practice) by medical professionals.”

………………..

“…There are probably many reasons for the paucity of bridges. One stems from the inadequate appreciation of the pervasiveness of evolutionary principles. From secondary school through medical school, the fundamental relevance of evolution to all human life has often been ignored or even suppressed.

We believe it is important for the public, as consumers of medical services, and for medical practitioners themselves to have a greater appreciation of the medical implications of evolutionary biology. At its cutting edge, evolutionary biology has serious consequences for our understanding of human health and well-being - consequences that we ignore at our peril.”
Evolution and medicine: the long reach of “Dr. Darwin”

116 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:22pm

re: #107 Charles Johnson

Should be good for a laugh:

117 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:25pm

re: #107 Charles Johnson

I suppose if evolution is not responsible for the flu, then god is just a big old mean poopyhead.

118 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:31:57pm

re: #108 calochortus

However there is no reason to think fear/hate of Islam didn’t just give him that little extra bit of permission to go ahead and kill them.

Could be. Theoretically.

119 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:32:05pm

re: #107 Charles Johnson

I remember when I was in high school and there was a big fight about teaching evolution in the school. In the end some students could opt out with a signed slip. I think we just found what happened to all those kids.

120 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:32:21pm
121 dog philosopher ஐஒஔ௸  Feb 12, 2015 12:32:31pm

amazing facts!

Obama was born (per his father) and indoctrinated as a Muslim, so in his own words when the political winds shift he’ll side with the Muslims.

He’s black (well, 1/8, but anyway …) so he’ll side with Trayvon.

He’s gay (ref. Man Country and Larry Sinclair’s cornhole) so he’ll side with the gays.

He’s a Communist (thanks a lot, Frank Marshall Davis) so he’ll always disparage America through false equivalencies and straw men.

In other words, he’s FOR everything he sees in the mirror. He’s against everything else

122 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:32:51pm

re: #112 calochortus

OK, I’ll bite. Why do we have new flu vaccines every year?

My guess is they just think it wears off.

123 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:32:56pm
124 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:33:38pm

re: #119 Zamb

My job making bricks doesn’t depend on architecture!!!

125 retired cynic  Feb 12, 2015 12:33:59pm

re: #123 Charles Johnson

Amazing. What a cluster of f%^&s.

126 CuriousLurker  Feb 12, 2015 12:34:29pm

re: #114 Decatur Deb

I doubt he would have killed his neighbors if they hadn’t been Muslim. I doubt he would have killed those Muslims if they hadn’t been his neighbors. Pathology cannot be sifted more finely over the Internet.

Good point, thanks.

127 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 12:34:36pm

Actually, some people are more evolved than others, biologically.

Some of us never get wisdom teeth. : )

128 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:34:46pm

re: #116 Kragar

Should be good for a laugh:

[Embedded content]

129 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:35:19pm

re: #107 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Not only is Evolution the reason we need a new vaccine every year, it’s also a crucial part of the development process. Every new vaccine strain has to undergo adaptation to growing in eggs, so it grows in eggs without killing them outright. That adaptation is Evolution.

130 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 12:35:49pm

re: #128 Kragar

omg…these people are stunningly stupid! Do they even read what they tweet?

131 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:35:49pm

re: #129 Blind Frog Belly White

Not only is Evolution the reason we need a new vaccine every year, it’s also a crucial part of the development process. Every new vaccine strain has to undergo adaptation to growing in eggs, so it grows in eggs without killing them outright. That adaptation is Evolution.

It’s microevolution, you satanic tool! //

132 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:36:08pm
133 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:36:16pm
134 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:36:25pm

re: #128 Kragar

Now we are just handing out loved ones phone numbers to strangers on the internet? I’m starting to think biology is not the only subject that was skipped.

135 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 12:36:25pm

re: #116 Kragar

Should be good for a laugh:

[Embedded content]

Big Pharma just screwing us over, of course.

136 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 12:36:30pm
137 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 12:36:58pm

re: #129 Blind Frog Belly White

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

138 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 12:37:35pm

re: #111 Justanotherhuman

Right. I don’t think we had a color TV until 20 yrs after they came out. : ) I did, however, have a Mac computer in 1993. Floppy disk, of course. I sort of pick and choose what innovations i want and can afford at the time.

When I was in elementary school, I had a teacher who would show off his calculator that he paid $200 for in the early 70s.

Texas Instruments SR-10: vintagecalculators.com

It was just a basic calculator and there was actually a delay when you entered problem.

139 iossarian  Feb 12, 2015 12:37:44pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

It’s just Pavlovian response time. Evolution is mentioned, shriekers shriek.

140 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:38:02pm
141 #FergusonFireside  Feb 12, 2015 12:38:41pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

Exactly X2

142 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 12:38:59pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

Home schooling? Creationism in classrooms? Pushing religion into science texts (affecting curricula for not just local yokels, but nationally as publishers will take some books and use them nationally). Etc.

The creationists and right wing are going to send us kicking and screaming back generations.

143 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:39:07pm
144 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:39:15pm

re: #138 Dr. Matt

When I was in elementary school, I had a teacher who would show off his calculator that he paid $200 for in the early 70s.

Texas Instruments SR-10: vintagecalculators.com

It was just a basic calculator and there was actually a delay when you entered problem.

I paid $150 for it. (A week’s pay.) It had a square root function, lifesaver for my classes.

145 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 12:39:34pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

Hey, I’ll be 74 in a few days and I was taught evolution, too.

Either there are some real dumb-asses out there or they’re just meanly joshing you.

146 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:40:17pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

Science is taught in schools, but in the real world it runs head-on into the strong ‘Know-Nothing’ strain in American culture, in which anyone’s opinion is equally valid, and requiring proof is considered to be elitist.

147 darthstar  Feb 12, 2015 12:40:24pm
148 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:16pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

It’s like I said above, some parents demanded their kids be taken out of lessons on evolution/genetics in high school. I’m 28, it just won’t fucking stop.

149 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:16pm

Good grief what a maroon.

150 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:23pm
151 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:36pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

Don’t allow yourself to think self-selected blog commenters are the “nation”, you’ll walk in front of a train.

152 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:43pm

these idiots on twitter just proved the tweet I posted in #1

153 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:49pm

re: #147 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Why won’t Obama listen to the Generals! But not THOSE Generals, and not about THAT!!!

154 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:52pm
155 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 12:41:57pm

re: #138 Dr. Matt

I’m old enough to remember those, of course. : )

Remember transistor radios that were pretty small and you could carry in your pocket? My BFF’s parents bought her one for her BD and it cost $70 in 1957 and that was a princely sum. : )

156 calochortus  Feb 12, 2015 12:42:06pm

Time to head out and enjoy all that global warming. I’m not actually thrilled to have mid-70s here this week, but as long as we do, I’m going outside.

157 CuriousLurker  Feb 12, 2015 12:42:09pm

re: #108 calochortus

All I can offer here is sympathy.

The murderer has been described as scaring all of his neighbors regardless of race, creed or color. However there is no reason to think fear/hate of Islam didn’t just give him that little extra bit of permission to go ahead and kill them.

Try to remember that there are a lot of people who know Muslims are pretty much just like everyone else.
{{{CL}}}

Thanks. {{{calochortus}}}

You know what worries me the most? If I feel this upset about the whole thing, what about younger people who are more easily influenced? What if the wrong person/group gets a hold of one of them and feeds those feelings, magnifying them until they go out and do something terrible? I worry that the hate & fear being manufactured (by Muslim extremists and their American counterparts, including opportunistic politicians) is going to create an endless cycle of… *smh*

158 darthstar  Feb 12, 2015 12:42:23pm
159 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 12:43:14pm

re: #142 lawhawk

Home schooling? Creationism in classrooms? Pushing religion into science texts (affecting curricula for not just local yokels, but nationally as publishers will take some books and use them nationally). Etc.

The creationists and right wing are going to send us kicking and screaming back generations.

Not just that. They are going to make us unable to complete on a global scale. We’re going to wind up being a population of people who can only perform menial tasks, unable to think for themselves, unable to think critically for the challenges that face us - as a global society - for decades to come.

It’s not just taking us back generations, it’s ruining the futures of young Americans for decades to come.

160 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:43:35pm

It’s just unreal. A deluge of sheer idiocy.

161 dog philosopher ஐஒஔ௸  Feb 12, 2015 12:44:09pm

re: #155 Justanotherhuman

I’m old enough to remember those, of course. : )

Remember transistor radios that were pretty small and you could carry in your pocket? My BFF’s parents bought her one for her BD and it cost $70 in 1957 and that was a princely sum. : )

i miss the days when all pop tunes went through the same charts and the am radio stations would announce their billboard ranking that week before they played them. you could root for a particular song you liked and feel good if it reached NUMBER ONE! ONE! ONE! ONE!

162 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 12:44:27pm

re: #150 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

163 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:44:41pm

re: #160 Charles Johnson

It’s just unreal. A deluge of sheer idiocy.

[Embedded content]

Darwin Day meets Feast of Fools.

164 retired cynic  Feb 12, 2015 12:44:46pm

re: #160 Charles Johnson

It is unreal. I don’t see how you could say those things if you were trying, with both hands, to be sarcastic. <shudder!>

165 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:45:39pm
166 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:46:15pm

“The Principle” is actually a film that argues the Sun revolves around the Earth.

Provocative.

167 nines09  Feb 12, 2015 12:46:17pm

I’ll bet you never knew there were so many crazy people before the intertoobs.

168 Dr. Matt  Feb 12, 2015 12:46:21pm

re: #155 Justanotherhuman

I’m old enough to remember those, of course. : )

Remember transistor radios that were pretty small and you could carry in your pocket? My BFF’s parents bought her one for her BD and it cost $70 in 1957 and that was a princely sum. : )

Yeah. I never had one though. I think my first portable radio was a first generation walkman (might have been a walkman knockoff). It had a tape deck, only FM radio, and the tape deck had play, stop, and ffw…NO REWIND!

169 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:46:32pm

re: #165 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Might want to see Idiocracy.

170 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:47:06pm

Despite positing only the belief in microevolution, what YEC views imply is actually a kind of hyper-evolution no “evolutionist” has ever dreamed of.

Here we find that she is placing 1500 species of birds into one single kind. This means that there was only one species on the ark that has now become a whopping 1500 species. YECs use some amazing mental gymnastics that go on to explain how two dog-like individuals could contain enough genetic variation to become all the species of canines alive today including all domestic dogs. Those genetics absolutely defy all that is known about genetics. In this case Lighter seems to admit that natural selection and mutation isn’t enough to create all this genetic variety. So then how are 1500 species created from one species in 4000 years? All these birds started with just a couple of genomes and now there are thousands of variations of genes where there were there could only be a few in those birds on the Noah’s ark. Those new variations in genes either formed by mutation from pre-existing genetic information or God stepped in and created them in some new act of special creation. Lightner says it couldn’t be by any standard naturalistic mechanisms which implies some form of special creation. But her reference is to a particularly contorted genetic explanation having to do with meiotic genetic exchange which, although totally unrealistic and unsupported, is nonetheless an attempt at a wholly naturalistic explanation despite implying that naturalistic means won’t work. You can say you don’t think natural selection and mutation can explain the origin of all these species but if you come up with another genetic means of this happening you are just coming up with an alternate mechanism of evolution but its still evolution. If you are confused, you should be, I am too. YECs seem to be grasping at any straw they can to explain the enormous genetic variation that exists today while limiting the number of total individual species on the ark to a number, which is still unrealistically large, that could fit on the ark.

thenaturalhistorian.com

171 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:47:37pm
172 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 12:47:38pm

re: #161 dog philosopher

i miss the days when all pop tunes went through the same charts and the am radio stations would announce their billboard ranking that week before they played them. you could root for a particular song you liked and feel good if it reached NUMBER ONE! ONE! ONE! ONE!

Do you mean the days of payola? : )

173 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:48:13pm
174 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:51:00pm

My dentist doesn’t have to think about evolution to pull out wisdom teeth!!!

175 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 12:51:21pm

re: #137 WhatEVs

I am stunned by those Twitter exchanges. Have we really become that fucking stupid as a nation? Don’t they teach science any longer. I mean, sure, I am 55 and all, but they taught us this shit when I was a kid.

I’m at a loss.

Episodes like this convince me that somewhere around 1980 I was shunted into an alternate universe in which large numbers of Americans gleefully endorsed idiocy. I’m 66, and they taught this stuff when I was a kid.

176 retired cynic  Feb 12, 2015 12:51:36pm

I see stark raving loonies, all right. Sheesh!

177 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 12:52:12pm

re: #167 nines09

I’ll bet you never knew there were so many crazy people before the intertoobs.

Not surprised there are so many stupid/crazy, just a little shocked they can find the power strip every morning.

178 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:52:23pm
179 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 12:52:28pm

re: #176 retired cynic

- I’m invincible!
- You’re a looney.

180 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:53:23pm
181 Mike Lamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:54:41pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Maybe this is the problem…the people that argue evolution is wrong don’t even know what the fuck evolution is…

182 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:55:04pm
183 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:55:31pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

Evolution would explain the flu virus growing legs and walking around. Not a different strain.

Lolwhut? As George Carlin would say, “Some people are fucking stupid!”

184 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 12:55:57pm

Oh, this is so begging for a caption contest.

185 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:56:17pm
186 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 12:56:38pm

re: #184 lawhawk

Why does Ted Cruz have a testicle-looking chin?

187 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 12:56:48pm

re: #181 Mike Lamb

Maybe this is the problem…the people that argue evolution is wrong don’t even know what the fuck evolution is…

Exactly.

188 retired cynic  Feb 12, 2015 12:57:17pm

There oughta be a law, where you have to demonstrate that you can think your way out of a wet paper bag before they allow you to drive, have a job, get on the internet, or even walk around outside a strait jacket. These people are not only ignorant, they are PROUD of it.

189 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 12:57:21pm

re: #186 Backwoods_Sleuth

He’s a Ballchinnadian.

190 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 12:57:28pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

OMFG. I have to go bang my head against the wall.

I will be back once I bandage my bleeding concussion.

191 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:58:25pm
192 CuriousLurker  Feb 12, 2015 12:58:39pm
193 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:58:53pm

“If mutation works it sticks.”

Right wing science.

194 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 12:58:59pm

Let me get this straight. Evolution is only when an established species has a drastic change to its physical makeup creating a new species? Basically what they think is that one day a group of fish just sprouted legs and fur and became dogs? I guess that explains why they often ask “well why can’t I fly?” as some sort of refutation.

195 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 12:59:44pm
196 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 1:00:26pm

re: #186 Backwoods_Sleuth

And I was going to go with:

The Kochs handed me a pile of cash THIS big!

I know that I oppose opening relations with Cuba, but you should have seen the box of Cubans I got. Muy grande.

Huge pool of GOP candidates for WH in 2016, but my clown car can fit only this many.

197 OhNoZombies!  Feb 12, 2015 1:00:32pm

Oh my glob, they’re so stupid!
I mean…are they serious?!?
I just can’t.

198 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 1:00:49pm

re: #195 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

199 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 1:00:57pm

re: #186 Backwoods_Sleuth

Why does Ted Cruz have a testicle-looking chin?

It’s under his dick head.

200 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 1:01:25pm

re: #191 Charles Johnson

Have you asked them what parts of biology and medicine have nothing to do with evolution?

201 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:01:59pm

re: #192 CuriousLurker

“I don’t need atheists to apologize or atheist organizations to issue condemnations about the killings of three Muslim students yesterday [allegedly] by an atheist man. I don’t hold all atheists responsible for the hate-filled actions of this man,” Khan said. “I hope the world will learn to afford Muslims the same courtesy.

This.

202 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 1:03:16pm

re: #194 Zamb

Or that scientists are confirming that the infamous bed bug is differentiating into two separate and distinct species - one that cohabits with people and one that feeds off bats.

The common bedbug, Cimex lectularius, feeds not only on humans but on other animals, especially bats. So as well as collecting human-feeders, the researchers gathered bedbugs from bat roosts in houses, churches and castles.

Little was known about the bugs that depend on bats for their meals. “The big thing that this paper adds is the bat side,” said Dr. Fountain, who was not involved in the new study.

Dr. Booth compared DNA sequences from 214 bedbugs. Those that live with bats, he found, were genetically quite distinct from those living with humans.

“The pattern was so stark, I’d never seen anything like it,” Dr. Booth said.

The results support a hypothesis that Dr. Balvin and other researchers have put forward to explain how bedbugs started making life unpleasant for humans. They argue that Cimex lectularius started out living in caves, feeding on bats. When early humans showed up in the caves, some of the bedbugs turned their attention to their new hosts.

“This paper shows that that is true,” Dr. Booth said.

When humans left caves and began building dwellings, they brought their new admirers along. But humans represented a new challenge for the insects, requiring new adaptations.

For one thing, we sleep at night, not in the daytime, which meant that the bedbugs had to shift their schedule. Dr. Balvin and his colleagues also have found that bedbugs that feed on humans have longer, thinner legs than those on bats, perhaps because bedbugs that feed on people no longer need to cling to bats hanging from cave roofs.

The insects also evolved adaptations for feeding on human blood. Researchers at Masaryk University in the Czech Republic have found that bedbugs adapted to feeding on humans have a shorter life span if they drink only bat blood.

203 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:03:27pm

re: #196 lawhawk

I still think his chin looks like a testicle in that photo…

204 OhNoZombies!  Feb 12, 2015 1:03:40pm
The bird did not turn into the cat.
205 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 1:04:09pm

How about a little Scientology stupid to liven up the day?

The founding belief of Scientology:

Xenu (/ˈziːnuː/),[1][2][3] also called “Xemu”, was, according to Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard, the dictator of the “Galactic Confederacy” who 75 million years ago brought billions[4][5] of his people to Earth (then known as “Teegeeack”) in a DC-8-like spacecraft, stacked them around volcanoes, and killed them with hydrogen bombs. Official Scientology scriptures hold that the thetans (immortal spirits) of these aliens adhere to humans, causing spiritual harm.[1][6]

en.wikipedia.org

Well that sounds reasonable.

206 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:05:07pm

re: #205 Skip Intro

How about a little Scientology stupid to liven up the day?

The founding belief of Scientology:

Xenu (/ˈziːnuː/),[1][2][3] also called “Xemu”, was, according to Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard, the dictator of the “Galactic Confederacy” who 75 million years ago brought billions[4][5] of his people to Earth (then known as “Teegeeack”) in a DC-8-like spacecraft, stacked them around volcanoes, and killed them with hydrogen bombs. Official Scientology scriptures hold that the thetans (immortal spirits) of these aliens adhere to humans, causing spiritual harm.[1][6]

en.wikipedia.org

Well that sounds reasonable.

As reasonable as any other creation story. About as plausible too.

207 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 1:05:13pm

re: #159 WhatEVs

Not just that. They are going to make us unable to complete on a global scale. We’re going to wind up being a population of people who can only perform menial tasks, unable to think for themselves, unable to think critically for the challenges that face us - as a global society - for decades to come.

It’s not just taking us back generations, it’s ruining the futures of young Americans for decades to come.

You say that like it is not an intended part of the GOP plan.

208 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:05:22pm

dammit…missed my nap. Where is my to-do list?

209 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 1:05:30pm

re: #205 Skip Intro

How about a little Scientology stupid to liven up the day?

The founding belief of Scientology:

Xenu (/ˈziːnuː/),[1][2][3] also called “Xemu”, was, according to Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard, the dictator of the “Galactic Confederacy” who 75 million years ago brought billions[4][5] of his people to Earth (then known as “Teegeeack”) in a DC-8-like spacecraft, stacked them around volcanoes, and killed them with hydrogen bombs. Official Scientology scriptures hold that the thetans (immortal spirits) of these aliens adhere to humans, causing spiritual harm.[1][6]

en.wikipedia.org

Well that sounds reasonable.

I’m going out to talk to my radishes.

210 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 1:06:10pm

re: #206 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

As reasonable as any other creation story. About as plausible too.

Well, a 20th century creation story, for sure.

211 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:06:24pm

re: #175 Higgs Boson’s Mate

Episodes like this convince me that somewhere around 1980 I was shunted into an alternate universe in which large numbers of Americans gleefully endorsed idiocy. I’m 66, and they taught this stuff when I was a kid.

Before that, parents just usually dumped their kids at school gratefully and asked the teachers to take charge of the kid’s education. They respected teachers and wouldn’t have thought of questioning what was being taught. And if any parent with an agenda like we see today (such as book removal, etc) tried to get a teacher fired, well, they were told to stuff it.

I would have never thought the State would allow forklift drivers (yes, I know one) and others like her to ‘educate’ their kids at home with no real social network of their peers, except the ones they saw in church.

212 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:06:30pm

re: #209 Decatur Deb

I’m going out to talk to my radishes.

Check to make sure they didn’t grow feet and teeth while you weren’t looking…

213 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 1:08:04pm

re: #212 Backwoods_Sleuth

Check to make sure they didn’t grow feet and teeth while you weren’t looking…

I’m certain some of these twits are making the same joke elsewhere, however unsarcastically.

214 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 1:08:35pm

re: #184 lawhawk

Indeed.

“So you got 9/10 in the latest round of skeet shooting using live peasants as targets?”

215 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 1:09:13pm

re: #214 EPR-radar

The 10th drifted a little to the left. /

216 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:09:38pm

“…Hickey came down the stairs & poked around trying to get a rise out of the 10 people we had in the Capitol Rotunda. On what was probably his 4th attempt, he said that not only was Creationism science, but that evolution was racist. One of our members balked and said Hickey needed to get an education on what evolution actually is. This prompted Hickey to storm off & send the highway patrol down to visit us for a few seconds.”
capjournal.com

217 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:10:28pm
218 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:10:30pm

An Evolutionist! Release the hounds, Smithers!

219 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:10:45pm

re: #216 jaunte

Evolution is “Racist

So logically he should celebrate it, no? ////

220 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:11:26pm
“Hickey is pastor of a large non-denominational evangelical congregation in Sioux Falls who drives home each weekend to preach on Sundays, although the church’s large staff otherwise keeps things running while he serves during the legislative session, he said.”
221 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:11:51pm

re: #200 Zamb

There’s no point in discussing anything with this crowd. I just block, mute, and move on.

222 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:12:17pm
223 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:12:18pm

re: #205 Skip Intro

How about a little Scientology stupid to liven up the day?

The founding belief of Scientology:

Xenu (/ˈziːnuː/),[1][2][3] also called “Xemu”, was, according to Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard, the dictator of the “Galactic Confederacy” who 75 million years ago brought billions[4][5] of his people to Earth (then known as “Teegeeack”) in a DC-8-like spacecraft, stacked them around volcanoes, and killed them with hydrogen bombs. Official Scientology scriptures hold that the thetans (immortal spirits) of these aliens adhere to humans, causing spiritual harm.[1][6]

en.wikipedia.org

Well that sounds reasonable.

LMAO. Almost literally.

224 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 1:14:08pm

re: #217 Charles Johnson

Ah, there’s a blast from the past. The Pet Jawa. Rusty. Who seems a bit rusty about facts and logic.

225 Kragar  Feb 12, 2015 1:14:31pm

re: #221 Charles Johnson

There’s no point in discussing anything with this crowd. I just block, mute, and move on.

“Here is documented evidence proving our point.”
“YOU’RE NOT GOING TO TRICK US! COMMIE!”

and Blocked.

226 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:14:55pm

SQUIRREL!!!

227 Jack Burton  Feb 12, 2015 1:15:07pm

re: #195 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

JHC this is like being bukkaked with stupid.

I’m going to have an ulcer knowing that there are people that stupid. They aren’t even pulling the microevolution vs macroevolution bullshit either. Just straight up bronze age bullshit.

228 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:16:00pm

re: #227 Jack Burton

JHC this is like being bukkaked with stupid.

I’m going to have an ulcer knowing that there are people that stupid. They aren’t even pulling the microevolution vs macroevolution bullshit either. Just straight up bronze age bullshit.

Dogs evolved into domestic pets during the Bronze Age…

229 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:16:25pm

The originator of “evolution is racist” line of arguments is YEC Jerry Bergman. The same Bergman who managed to get his letter published in David Duke’s newsletter:

NAAWP News. 1985 [ca December 1]. Page 2: “Letters to the Editor”:

Gentlemen:

There have been many discussions relative to reverse discrimination in academia, a serious problem which is of major concern to many professionals.

Advertisements often state: “Minorities are strongly encouraged to apply.”

In actuality, quite often minorities are hired over better qualified whites.

etc., etc.

230 lawhawk  Feb 12, 2015 1:17:09pm

re: #229 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

And the circle is complete….

231 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:17:30pm
232 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 1:17:50pm

re: #227 Jack Burton

JHC this is like being bukkaked with stupid.

I’m going to have an ulcer knowing that there are people that stupid. They aren’t even pulling the microevolution vs macroevolution bullshit either. Just straight up bronze age bullshit.

The aggressive stupidity of creationism is a perfect representative of US movement conservatism as a whole.

The entire enterprise is stupid and evil.

233 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:18:04pm

re: #229 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Actually, there’s a pretty good argument that creationism stems from racism.

234 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:18:11pm
235 OhNoZombies!  Feb 12, 2015 1:19:20pm

I wonder if attitudes would change if, say, human origins were traced back to Norway…
Nah, I don’t wonder at all.

236 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:20:09pm

re: #233 Charles Johnson

Actually, there’s a pretty good argument that creationism stems from racism.

I’m not sure one can be considered the cause of the other, but they do go hand in hand.

237 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 1:20:52pm

I’m always amazed at the stupid things Creationists say. One I knew told me that if I believed in Evolution, and if humans originated in Africa, then I was saying that Africans were less evolved than Europeans.

The immensity of the stupidity boggled me.

238 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:21:21pm

re: #229 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Later that same Bergman published this article:

Darwinism’s influence on modern racists and white supremacist groups: the case of David Duke
by Jerry Bergman

Racism is a major social problem in many nations today. A review of the writings of prominent modern racists, focusing on David Duke, finds that Darwinist ideas were critically important in developing and maintaining their racist ideas. David Duke, the most prominent racist in America today, heads the largest white supremacist organization in the world. His influence can be gauged by the fact that he was elected to serve in the congress of the state of Louisiana. His extensive writings about the central influence of Darwinist ideas on the development of his racist views are reviewed in this paper.

239 retired cynic  Feb 12, 2015 1:22:06pm

re: #231 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Not while conscious.

240 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:23:25pm

Victim was a homeless man who was throwing rocks.

Officer in Pasco shooting was once named in excessive-force lawsuit

blogs.seattletimes.com

241 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 1:24:19pm

re: #234 Backwoods_Sleuth

Is anyone surprised by this?

242 retired cynic  Feb 12, 2015 1:24:52pm

re: #241 Higgs Boson’s Mate

Not at all.

243 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 1:25:15pm

re: #233 Charles Johnson

Actually, there’s a pretty good argument that creationism stems from racism.

I would assume so. If God created us all exactly how we are then why are some different if not to signal something about that particular group? If we are created in God’s image then the different group must be less godly and be closer associated with the beasts of the earth than humanity. Funny though that this is being spouted off by white people to declare the browns subhuman when the first humans were pretty brown, especially the ones coming up with the original creation myths.

244 CuriousLurker  Feb 12, 2015 1:25:24pm

re: #201 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

This.

Seconded.

245 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:25:33pm

Self-described as a “Palinista” from Texas.

246 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 1:26:35pm

re: #245 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Self-described as a “Palinista” from Texas.

That explains a lot. Unfortunately.

247 gwangung  Feb 12, 2015 1:26:43pm

re: #94 CuriousLurker

OT, but I need to get this out of my system and you guys are the lucky winners. // If it gets tl;dr you can just skip to the last paragraph as that pretty much sums it up.

I don’t want to get drawn into a long discussion about this because it’s very emotional to me, but I do want to say this: Many if not most Muslims, both in the U.S. and around the world, are never going to believe that the murder of those three young people had nothing to do with them being Muslim.

Muslims overseas won’t believe it because of our drone strikes & wars in which hundreds of thousands of Muslims have been killed, and because of our support for dictators and our willingness to look the other way when they commit atrocities on their people because it’s in our best interests.

Muslims here in America will also find it difficult if not impossible to believe it had nothing to do with Islam. Why? Because we wake up every single day hearing the media, politicians, pundits and other public figures tell us how horrible Islam is—even if they don’t say it openly, how can one believe that any decent person would voluntarily choose to follow such a horrible religion?

You guys have NO IDEA what it’s like to be America’s bogeyman—you just don’t. This has been going on for decades now and it was made exponentially worse by 9/11.

This is what the murders look like from a Muslim perspective:

The mainstream (national) media went a full 12 hours (at least) before reporting on this. If the identities of the victims and perpetrator had been switched there would’ve been wall-to-wall national coverage starting almost immediately. That reinforced the idea that Muslim lives don’t matter, they’re cheap, even when the lives belonged to decent, productive young Americans that any parent would be proud to call their own.

As mentioned, we face a constant barrage of anti-Muslim sentiment—hell, there’s a whole well-financed industry dedicated to churning it out—yet we’re expected to believe this same constant barrage doesn’t affect non-Muslims, the actual target audience of all the negative framing? We’re supposed to believe that out of the many neighbors this murderous thug had confrontations with, he just “happened” to snap over parking that day? He just “happened” to go into the home of these young Muslims and shoot them in the head as if they were rabid dogs that needed to be put down?

Sorry, I don’t buy it. Does that come from an emotional rather than a logical place? Maybe, but I can assure you that if I feel that way, so do many other (if not most) Muslims because we all share the same daily experience of being America’s bogeyman.

Those three young people did everything right. They were exemplary citizens: educated, tolerant, law abiding Americans who went out of their way to help others, both non-Muslim and Muslim. And what did they get for thier efforts? A bullet in the head. THAT is how it looks from my side of the fence.

Frickin’ right.

248 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:26:58pm

“The Darwin crowd,” best buddies with “The Semmelweis crowd.”

249 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:26:58pm

re: #237 Blind Frog Belly White

I’m always amazed at the stupid things Creationists say. One I knew told me that if I believed in Evolution, and if humans originated in Africa, then I was saying that Africans were less evolved than Europeans.

The immensity of the stupidity boggled me.

Hey, we all have a head, a spine, 2 arms, 2 legs and walk upright, regardless of skin tone.

That constitutes a species—homo sapiens, IIRC. : )

250 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:27:33pm

re: #249 Justanotherhuman

Hey, we all have a head, a spine, 2 arms, 2 legs and walk upright, regardless of skin tone.

That constitutes a species—homo sapiens, IIRC. : )

tell that to the kangaroos…

251 De Kolta Chair  Feb 12, 2015 1:28:16pm
252 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 1:29:10pm

re: #195 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

I’ve had the ‘micro vs macro’ argument. They always fall back on there being some kind of mechanism, which they can neither describe nor prove to exist, that prevents accumulated microevolutionary changes from adding up to macroevolutionary changes, no matter how many millions of years you give it.

But they can see all felid species from a single pair of protocats within 4500 years. But note also that it’s not even 4500 years, since they have to accept that it had all happened by the time other historical writings document the existence of different cat species.

253 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:29:49pm
254 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:30:52pm

re: #252 Blind Frog Belly White

Have you heard any creationist explanations for why large mammal niches were filled by marsupials in Australia until very recently?

255 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:31:05pm

re: #252 Blind Frog Belly White

They always fall back on there being some kind of mechanism, which they can neither describe nor prove to exist

They want you to accept this mechanism as your personal savior.

256 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 1:31:21pm

re: #254 jaunte

Have you heard any creationist explanations for why large mammal niches were filled by marsupials in Australia until very recently?

“God Did It.”

257 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:31:50pm

re: #256 Blind Frog Belly White

Early stop-off point for the Ark?

258 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:31:50pm
259 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:31:56pm

re: #250 Backwoods_Sleuth

tell that to the kangaroos…

I once dated a Macropodidae but it didn’t work out. : )

260 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:32:03pm

re: #251 De Kolta Chair

Embedded Image

Lamarkian - heredity of acquired traits.

It ain’t evo.

261 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:32:32pm

re: #258 Charles Johnson

antigenic drift/shift

Hah. I knew they would try to say that wasn’t an evolutionary process.

262 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:32:36pm

re: #258 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

somebody abused the googles…

263 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:33:06pm

re: #260 b_sharp

Lamarkian - heredity of acquired traits.

It ain’t evo.

It’s evo, just not the synthetic evo theory.

264 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:33:22pm

re: #252 Blind Frog Belly White

I’ve had the ‘micro vs macro’ argument. They always fall back on there being some kind of mechanism, which they can neither describe nor prove to exist, that prevents accumulated microevolutionary changes from adding up to macroevolutionary changes, no matter how many millions of years you give it.

But they can see all felid species from a single pair of protocats within 4500 years. But note also that it’s not even 4500 years, since they have to accept that it had all happened by the time other historical writings document the existence of different cat species.

That’s where ‘kinds’ comes in. Ever changing, never defined, ever useful, never doubted.

265 gwangung  Feb 12, 2015 1:35:17pm

re: #252 Blind Frog Belly White

I’ve had the ‘micro vs macro’ argument. They always fall back on there being some kind of mechanism, which they can neither describe nor prove to exist, that prevents accumulated microevolutionary changes from adding up to macroevolutionary changes, no matter how many millions of years you give it.

But they can see all felid species from a single pair of protocats within 4500 years. But note also that it’s not even 4500 years, since they have to accept that it had all happened by the time other historical writings document the existence of different cat species.

If you can’t define it, let alone provide evidence that it exists, then it can’t be taken seriously as science.

266 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:35:27pm

re: #263 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

It’s evo, just not the synthetic evo theory.

A no longer accepted version.

267 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:36:35pm

re: #252 Blind Frog Belly White

I’ve had the ‘micro vs macro’ argument. They always fall back on there being some kind of mechanism, which they can neither describe nor prove to exist, that prevents accumulated microevolutionary changes from adding up to macroevolutionary changes, no matter how many millions of years you give it.

But they can see all felid species from a single pair of protocats within 4500 years. But note also that it’s not even 4500 years, since they have to accept that it had all happened by the time other historical writings document the existence of different cat species.

This is my go-to argument when the theist characterization of micro/macro shows its ugly head.

268 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:36:41pm

Federal judge in Alabama orders judge in Mobile to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples - @campbellnyt
see original on twitter.com

269 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 1:36:51pm
antigenic drift/shift

It’s just steps. I’m not “walking.”

270 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:36:55pm

re: #266 b_sharp

A no longer accepted version.

Not bad for its time tho.

271 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 1:37:06pm

re: #255 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

They want you to accept this mechanism as your personal savior.

Well, you see, in Genesis they talk briefly about ‘Kinds’. From that brief mention comes the whole field of Baraminology, designed to try and squeeze observation into a predetermined conclusion.

272 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:38:24pm

re: #271 Blind Frog Belly White

Well, you see, in Genesis they talk briefly about ‘Kinds’. From that brief mention comes the whole field of Baraminology, designed to try and squeeze observation into a predetermined conclusion.

Single-handedly developed a few years ago by Dr. Kurt Wise…

273 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:38:27pm

re: #263 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Evo makes you Dance!

274 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:38:59pm

re: #270 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Not bad for its time tho.

Headed in the right direction, but got cut off at the pass by a more recent scientist.

Didn’t Stalin hire a Lamarckian to grow crops?

275 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:39:55pm
276 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 1:40:22pm

re: #272 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Single-handedly developed a few years ago by Dr. Kurt Wise…

You might say their argument evolved.

277 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:40:52pm

re: #271 Blind Frog Belly White

Well, you see, in Genesis they talk briefly about ‘Kinds’. From that brief mention comes the whole field of Baraminology, designed to try and squeeze observation into a predetermined conclusion.

See? They don’t need no taxonomy…too methodically scientific. Lazy bastards.

278 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:40:54pm

re: #274 b_sharp

Headed in the right direction, but got cut off at the pass by a more recent scientist.

Recently revived a bit as transgenerational epigenetics.

279 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:42:12pm
280 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 1:42:23pm

war is peace
freedom is slavery
ignorance is strength

281 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:42:49pm

re: #279 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Is that a fucking threat?

282 Mike Lamb  Feb 12, 2015 1:43:30pm

re: #202 lawhawk

Bed bug research? Someone clearly overslept the day they handed out dissertation subjects…

283 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:43:49pm

re: #276 Blind Frog Belly White

Creationists of all sorts claim that somehow information can’t evolve by itself.

I guess English existed in Jesus’ time. [cue the jokes…]

284 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:44:26pm

re: #281 Justanotherhuman

Is that a fucking threat?

what?

285 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 1:45:18pm

re: #275 Charles Johnson

Why should it recede? Such stupidity is politically useful for the US right.

I can still remember the time when a very intelligent conservative at Stanford started defending creationism in a coffeehouse conversation with me. He couldn’t have taken it seriously (being much more of a libertarian than a fundamentalist Christian), but was apparently motivated by the political utility of flying that flag given the opportunity.

286 #FergusonFireside  Feb 12, 2015 1:45:46pm

I just can’t.

287 Mike Lamb  Feb 12, 2015 1:45:50pm

re: #234 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

My shocked face, etc.

288 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:45:57pm

re: #278 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Recently revived a bit as transgenerational epigenetics.

Not really. The mechanisms are different. Modern epigenetics is during the development stage. It still stems from germ cell mutations. Lamarckian was about changes acquired after birth.

289 OhNoZombies!  Feb 12, 2015 1:46:17pm

re: #281 Justanotherhuman

Is that a fucking threat?

I think he’s saying that the shoe is on the other foot.
If one person from a minority group does something wrong, the whole group is responsible, but if a white guy does something, he’s a lone wolf.

290 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:46:46pm

re: #284 Backwoods_Sleuth

what?

His phrasing was poor, I suppose.

291 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:47:09pm

re: #286 #FergusonFireside

And once again Nightcrawler comes to mind.

292 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Feb 12, 2015 1:47:49pm

I seem to recall that they made a film on Charles Darwin a few years back to celebrate the 200th anniversary of his birth or something…and that the movie was not even released in the US because the distributors did not want to deal with all the negative publicity they expected to face.

293 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 1:47:52pm

re: #288 b_sharp

Not really. The mechanisms are different. Modern epigenetics is during the development stage. It still stems from germ cell mutations. Lamarckian was about changes acquired after birth.

At least Larmarkian evolution was a scientific theory with a plausible mechanism and testable predictions.

Thus it is infinitely better than any form of creationism, once that is passed off as science.

294 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:48:00pm

re: #288 b_sharp

I would say Lamarckian was in general about inheritance of acquired traits. Some of this is true, as I gather.

295 #FergusonFireside  Feb 12, 2015 1:48:07pm
296 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 1:48:19pm

Happy Darwin Day!!!

I’d bake a cake, but that takes science. And since science is looked down upon by the GOP…I will not make the cake as a symbol.

In a way, it is a recognizance the era of 100+ years of progressive movements which made the U.S. great is now in peril of becoming extinct.

297 #FergusonFireside  Feb 12, 2015 1:49:22pm

re: #291 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

And once again Nightcrawler comes to mind.

I need to see that. I think.

298 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:50:24pm

re: #294 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

I would say Lamarckian was in general about inheritance of acquired traits. Some of this is true, as I gather.

Do you have a link?

299 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:50:31pm

re: #290 Justanotherhuman

His phrasing was poor, I suppose.

I’m not seeing what you’re seeing, but mileage varies, I suppose.

300 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:50:40pm

re: #295 #FergusonFireside

[Embedded content]

Isn’t that Mark Kelly, Gabby Giffords’ husband?

301 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:51:14pm

re: #300 Justanotherhuman

Isn’t that Mark Kelly, Gabby Giffords’ husband?

His twin brother.

302 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:53:19pm

re: #293 EPR-radar

At least Larmarkian evolution was a scientific theory with a plausible mechanism and testable predictions.

Thus it is infinitely better than any form of creationism, once that is passed off as science.

Creationism will never be passed off as science among the science community.

It will only be passed off by people who don’t matter.

303 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 1:54:26pm

re: #298 b_sharp

Here’s one review: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

304 b_sharp  Feb 12, 2015 1:54:57pm

re: #303 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Here’s one review: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Thanks

305 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 1:55:06pm
306 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 1:56:39pm

re: #283 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Creationists of all sorts claim that somehow information can’t evolve by itself.

I guess English existed in Jesus’ time. [cue the jokes…]

Ah, the ‘information’ thing. This is classic Creationist argument - if you can’t debunk something, you draw an analogy to it, and debunk the analogy.

307 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 1:56:45pm

re: #299 Backwoods_Sleuth

I’m not seeing what you’re seeing, but mileage varies, I suppose.

‘you better’ sounds a bit commanding, esp coming from a non-Muslim (I assume), although I’m all for Muslims speaking their minds whenever they wish and without fear, as any others should do. I’m a democrat. : )

308 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Feb 12, 2015 1:56:55pm

re: #20 lawhawk

Science belongs in a science classroom.
Religion does not belong in a science classroom.

.

These people do not understand the difference between religious scriptures and a scientific or historical text. They also confuse real life with television series. There is no arguing with them, all we can do is try to limit the amount of damage that they cause.

309 Charles Johnson  Feb 12, 2015 1:57:01pm

OK, I think I’ve reached Peak Wingnut for the day. Check out the Wall Street Journal article at the top of this search page.

google.com

310 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 1:57:52pm

re: #290 Justanotherhuman

His phrasing was poor, I suppose.

My read was tit for tat on calls for people to stand up and object to the crimes by their own kind. Not threatening just demanding.

311 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:00:34pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

Jenny McC, really? Ugggh.

312 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:01:27pm

re: #307 Justanotherhuman

‘you better’ sounds a bit commanding, esp coming from a non-Muslim (I assume), although I’m all for Muslims speaking their minds whenever they wish and without fear, as any others should do. I’m a democrat. : )

I think you misunderstood what he is saying. He’s not speaking to Muslims.

313 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 2:01:40pm

re: #311 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Jenny McC, really? Ugggh.

Well, he does describe her as a ‘third tier’ celebrity…

314 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:02:05pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

OK, I think I’ve reached Peak Wingnut for the day. Check out the Wall Street Journal article at the top of this search page.

google.com

Jesus. What a fucking moron.

315 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:02:11pm

re: #307 Justanotherhuman

‘you better’ sounds a bit commanding, esp coming from a non-Muslim (I assume), although I’m all for Muslims speaking their minds whenever they wish and without fear, as any others should do. I’m a democrat. : )

He was talking to non-Muslim Americans, who demand that Muslims speak out every time something happens.

316 Kilroy01  Feb 12, 2015 2:04:04pm

The only real difference between microevolution and macroevolution is a vowel.

317 GlutenFreeJesus  Feb 12, 2015 2:04:10pm

re: #12 Dr. Matt

Those people aren’t over-embellishing one bit. :)

318 TedStriker  Feb 12, 2015 2:04:27pm

re: #28 Great White Snark

Well this is confusing. Apparently this varies.
Each Friday some youngsters come into my office from Chabad, and sometimes do tefillin with my boss. In discussions about evolution as the bosses daughter was in a Jewish school, they carefully explained that fossils etc are a test of our faith and that Genesis for the Orthodox Jew should be taken as written. Students of Liebovich. Forgive my spelling is in error.

All very polite but firm.

I’m sorry, but I’d have to be telling them:

319 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:04:42pm

re: #279 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Allow me to reinterpret: “If you’re one of those people who requires every Muslim to publicly denounce any crime committed by an Muslim anywhere, you are morally bound to publicly denounce THIS crime, or you’re just a bigot.”

320 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 2:04:58pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

OK, I think I’ve reached Peak Wingnut for the day. Check out the Wall Street Journal article at the top of this search page.

google.com

The WSJ is even worse than I remember it, Before Murdoch. Check out the comments. “Climategate”, so help me.

321 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 2:05:28pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

“…The people doing basic science should learn a well-proven truth about basic politics: Any cause taken up by politicians today by definition will be doubted or opposed by nearly half the population. When an Al Gore, John Kerry or Europe’s Green parties become spokesmen for your ideas, and are willing to accuse fellow scientists of bad faith or willful ignorance, then science has made a Faustian bargain. The price paid, inevitably, will be the institutional credibility of all scientists.”

So Henninger thinks scientists should become politicians by remaining “apolitical” to mollify the uneducated, or they will lose “credibility.”

322 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 2:06:00pm

re: #315 Backwoods_Sleuth

OK, now I feel stupefied.

323 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:07:12pm

re: #322 Justanotherhuman

OK, now I feel stupefied.

It’s twitter’s requirement to say something in 140 characters or less.

324 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 2:07:39pm

re: #321 jaunte

So Henninger thinks scientists should become politicians by remaining “apolitical” to mollify the uneducated, or they will lose “credibility.”

So much for “Science is true, whether you believe it or not”. Have to change that to “Science isn’t true if the wrong people agree with it”.

325 Fourth Football of the Apocalypse  Feb 12, 2015 2:08:15pm

re:
#305

As a proud West Virginian, I love this story: All 5 residents of a WV town voted to ban LGBT discrimination

OK, but Tony Perkins and Bryan Fischer still think this oppresses them somebody. /

326 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 2:08:37pm

re: #324 Skip Intro

“Nobody will believe you if you use science to disagree with me.”

Ok, then.

327 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 2:09:44pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

OK, I think I’ve reached Peak Wingnut for the day. Check out the Wall Street Journal article at the top of this search page.

google.com

That WSJ article is an astoundingly cynical piece of BS. The writer attacks McCarthy and the anti-vaxxers, then flips and uses their media skill at manipulation as a threat to climate scientists. “If dimwits did it to vaccination, we can do it to you.” He’s willing to accept infections to get a shot at climate change.

328 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 2:10:14pm

re: #324 Skip Intro

So much for “Science is true, whether you believe it or not”. Have to change that to “Science isn’t true if the wrong people agree with it”.

It seems not excessive to postulate a day when the American Dream will be having your own coathanger with which to roast sparrows.

329 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:10:56pm

re: #319 Blind Frog Belly White

And the group choice is usually absolutely arbitrary. A [insert worldview] killer is also a member of [insert ethnicity/race] group, as well as a human being. As the latter he belongs to your group in any case. When are you gonna denounce him? It may be objected that this is too general and that one has to look for more immediate worldview roots of a particular crime, like [a particular interpretation of a sacred book]. This of course only emphasizes the arbitrariness even more, for there may be [thousands, millions, …] adherents of this worldview that do not share this interpretation at all.

330 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:12:30pm

re: #329 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

I don’t think I have a worldview.
More like a neighborhood or backwoods view.
Pretty much, be nice to other people and always offer food and drink.

331 Skip Intro  Feb 12, 2015 2:13:07pm

Has anyone flown United lately?

Is this really true?

Newsmax TV is the default channel available to fliers on United flights, and liberals are not happy having to watch the Republican-leaning RWNJ station.

thedailybeast.com

332 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 2:13:15pm

re: #328 Higgs Boson’s Mate

It seems not excessive to postulate a day when the American Dream will be having your own coathanger with which to roast sparrows.

So many Bryans, so few Darrows.

333 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 2:14:13pm

re: #281 Justanotherhuman

Is that a fucking threat?

I read it as if you blame all Muslims for everything, all whites are responsible for Hicks. And to denounce both him and the murders.

334 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:14:30pm

re: #330 Backwoods_Sleuth

I don’t think I have a worldview.
More like a neighborhood or backwoods view.
Pretty much, be nice to other people and always offer food and drink.

Yeah, but what about that [insert name] guy, who also had no worldview and offered poisoned food and drink to his guests? Denounce, denounce!

335 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:14:43pm

I know some very smart people who get very stupid as soon as the topic turns to AGW. These are guys who can strip the bark off a Creationist argument, point out all its logical flaws, and ridicule the stupidity behind them. They pinpoint and shoot down every bad argument - ‘It’s faith-based!”; “Scientists lie about believing it to keep their grant money!”; “Scientists fake their data to push some nefarious purpose!”

Change the topic to AGW, though, and they start making EXACTLY THE SAME ARGUMENTS, right down to the ‘nefarious purpose’ one (to destroy Capitalism).

It’s disheartening.

336 thedopefishlives  Feb 12, 2015 2:15:11pm

Evening Lizardim from the bitterly cold wild north country. How go things among the lizardfolk?

337 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 2:15:54pm

Ymre: #290 Justanotherhuman

His phrasing was poor, I suppose.

I had to read it a few times, myself.

338 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:16:10pm

re: #335 Blind Frog Belly White

Case in point: Glenn Morton.

339 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:16:43pm

re: #334 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Yeah, but what about that [insert name] guy, who also had no worldview and offered poisoned food and drink to his guests? Denounce, denounce!

Always sniff the food before eating.
Words to live by…

340 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 2:17:00pm

re: #336 thedopefishlives

Evening Lizardim from the bitterly cold wild north country. How go things among the lizardfolk?

Swiftly rising spring tide of derp.

341 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:17:22pm

re: #339 Backwoods_Sleuth

Always sniff the food before eating.
Words to live by…

That’s why I always use Iocaine powder.

342 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:17:23pm

re: #336 thedopefishlives

Evening Lizardim from the bitterly cold wild north country. How go things among the lizardfolk?

There be snow and cold outside here.
Me no like.

343 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:20:15pm

re: #330 Backwoods_Sleuth

I don’t think I have a worldview.
More like a neighborhood or backwoods view.
Pretty much, be nice to other people and always offer food and drink.

And music.
There must ALWAYS be music.

And art!

And cats and dogs.

OK…I’ll stop…

344 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 2:20:37pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

OK, I think I’ve reached Peak Wingnut for the day. Check out the Wall Street Journal article at the top of this search page.

google.com

What the hell did I just read?

The freaking Wall Street Journal, a tool of News Corp (Murdoch/FOX) is crying that third rate actress dinged the credibility of science and now science is reeling because everyone is doubting. And science brought it upon itself.

Hello. This is the pot calling the kettle black. FOX/New Corp and now the WSJ are also part of the problem as they have enabled the doubters.

What a great article for Darwin Day. If we continue on this path then all types of religions will be back big time as people will be forced to believe the only hope is for a god or another entity to help them fight off things like viruses and plagues. They will have bought into the thinking science can’t help them.

Hello 1300…we’re back.

345 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:21:05pm

re: #343 Backwoods_Sleuth

YOU KNOW WHO ELSE LOVED DOGS????

//

346 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:21:33pm

re: #345 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

YOU KNOW WHO ELSE LOVED DOGS????

//

with ketchup…

347 jaunte  Feb 12, 2015 2:21:37pm

re: #345 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

DARWIN!

348 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:21:59pm

re: #347 jaunte

DARWIN!

HE TOO! OMG OOMG!!

349 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:22:27pm

re: #344 ObserverArt

What the hell did I just read?

The freaking Wall Street Journal, a tool of News Corp (Murdoch/FOX) is crying that third rate actress dinged the credibility of science and now science is reeling because everyone is doubting. And science brought it upon itself.

The only people “reeling” are the ones who were already off-balance to begin with.

350 thedopefishlives  Feb 12, 2015 2:22:28pm

re: #340 Decatur Deb

Swiftly rising spring tide of derp.

Ship ‘em up here. The cold will swiftly reduce their numbers. Derp does not have a terribly long lifespan upon the frozen tundra.

351 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 2:22:34pm

Are the Kehoes up to their old tricks?

HPD: One person shot at Capital One Bank near Galleria

khou.com

352 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 2:23:16pm

re: #347 jaunte

DARWIN!

Spoiler: Beagle was a ship.

353 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 2:24:01pm

re: #331 Skip Intro

Has anyone flown United lately?

Is this really true?

Newsmax TV is the default channel available to fliers on United flights, and liberals are not happy having to watch the Republican-leaning RWNJ station.

thedailybeast.com

Just gives me another reason not to fly…

354 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:25:25pm

re: #338 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Case in point: Glenn Morton.

Don’t know him. But an example of it is a former friend of mine* who correctly countered attacks on Darwin the man by pointing out that in Science we don’t weigh the validity of a hypothesis on the basis of who came up with it, so attacking Darwin - even if successful - left the Theory untouched.

This same guy attacked Phil Jones of the Hadley CRU, based on the ‘Climategate’ nonsense, and when I pointed out that there were other groups that had their own data and analysis that agreed with Jones, he said, “But he is the most prominent.” I.e., discredit Jones, discredit AGW.

Exactly the same approach, which he pointed out was flawed in one case, he used in another.

*Wonderful guy, even invited me to Montana to hunt and helped me get my first deer. Then he went back to where I’d shot it, took a branch off the Juniper tree it had been standing under and a piece of the leg bone (we butchered it in the field), and used them for the handle and bolster (respectively) of a knife he made for me to have a memento.

355 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 2:26:29pm

re: #336 thedopefishlives

Evening Lizardim from the bitterly cold wild north country. How go things among the lizardfolk?

Heading for bitterly cold here in Ohio too. Though not as bitter as what you are experiencing.

I have but one word…Brrrr!

356 bratwurst  Feb 12, 2015 2:27:29pm

re: #331 Skip Intro

Has anyone flown United lately?

Is this really true?

Newsmax TV is the default channel available to fliers on United flights, and liberals are not happy having to watch the Republican-leaning RWNJ station.

thedailybeast.com

Fortunately United sorted that out several weeks ago. When I flew about 3 weeks ago the default was CNN.

357 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 2:28:42pm

re: #354 Blind Frog Belly White

Morton was a prominent anti-YEC (and former YEC) geologist previously involved with TalkOrigins, who turned into a flaming AGW denier.

Another case of a prominent anti-creationist and denier is Ian Plimer, but unlike Morton, he had already been known to be very sloppy in his anti-YEC criticisms.

358 KingKenrod  Feb 12, 2015 2:28:53pm

re: #344 ObserverArt

What the hell did I just read?

The freaking Wall Street Journal, a tool of News Corp (Murdoch/FOX) is crying that third rate actress dinged the credibility of science and now science is reeling because everyone is doubting. And science brought it upon itself.

Hello. This is the pot calling the kettle black. FOX/New Corp and now the WSJ are also part of the problem as they have enabled the doubters.

What a great article for Darwin Day. If we continue on this path then all types of religions will be back big time as people will be forced to believe the only hope is for a god or another entity to help them fight off things like viruses and plagues. They will have bought into the thinking science can’t help them.

Hello 1300…we’re back.

And the only given example of science losing its credibility is the preferred switch in nomenclature from “global warming” to “climate change”.

But that was only done because it was obvious people who didn’t understand the issue confused local weather (ignoring the “global” in global warming) with global temperatures. “Global warming” doesn’t mean it gets warmer everywhere.

359 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 2:30:56pm

I just got home and this thread is full of more Derp than I have ever seen collected in one place.

What kind of pie should I make? The choices are:

1. Lemon Meringue
2. Vanilla Cream with Mixed Berry topping

I’m tending to the Lemon Meringue but I have a bunch of bags of mixed berries in the freezer that I need to use up.

360 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:31:46pm

re: #359 The Vicious Babushka

I just got home and this thread is full of more Derp than I have ever seen collected in one place.

What kind of pie should I make? The choices are:

1. Lemon Meringue
2. Vanilla Cream with Mixed Berry topping

I’m tending to the Lemon Meringue but I have a bunch of bags of mixed berries in the freezer that I need to use up.

vanilla cream with mixed berries sounds really good.

361 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 2:32:39pm

re: #359 The Vicious Babushka

I just got home and this thread is full of more Derp than I have ever seen collected in one place.

What kind of pie should I make? The choices are:

1. Lemon Meringue
2. Vanilla Cream with Mixed Berry topping

I’m tending to the Lemon Meringue but I have a bunch of bags of mixed berries in the freezer that I need to use up.

Your second choice sounds berry good to me.

362 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 2:32:57pm

re: #359 The Vicious Babushka

2 sounds divine. Got a recipe?

363 thedopefishlives  Feb 12, 2015 2:34:40pm

re: #359 The Vicious Babushka

I just got home and this thread is full of more Derp than I have ever seen collected in one place.

What kind of pie should I make? The choices are:

1. Lemon Meringue
2. Vanilla Cream with Mixed Berry topping

I’m tending to the Lemon Meringue but I have a bunch of bags of mixed berries in the freezer that I need to use up.

Yes.

364 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 2:35:41pm

re: #342 Backwoods_Sleuth

There be snow and cold outside here.
Me no like.

It is colder inside my house than it is outside and I PREFER IT THAT WAY BECAUSE IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE WINTER THERE IS THIS CONCEPT CALLED SEASONS AND I KNOW IT’S HARD CALIFORNIA BUT COULD WE PRETEND TO TRY.

Ahem.

365 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss  Feb 12, 2015 2:36:49pm

re: #347 jaunte

DARWIN!

The correct answer is: Not Pavlov

366 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:37:01pm

re: #335 Blind Frog Belly White

I know some very smart people who get very stupid as soon as the topic turns to AGW. These are guys who can strip the bark off a Creationist argument, point out all its logical flaws, and ridicule the stupidity behind them. They pinpoint and shoot down every bad argument - ‘It’s faith-based!”; “Scientists lie about believing it to keep their grant money!”; “Scientists fake their data to push some nefarious purpose!”

Change the topic to AGW, though, and they start making EXACTLY THE SAME ARGUMENTS, right down to the ‘nefarious purpose’ one (to destroy Capitalism).

It’s disheartening.

When you see that kind of cognitive dissonance, libertarians are usually not too far behind.

367 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:38:46pm

re: #364 klys (maker of Silmarils)

It is colder inside my house than it is outside and I PREFER IT THAT WAY BECAUSE IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE WINTER THERE IS THIS CONCEPT CALLED SEASONS AND I KNOW IT’S HARD CALIFORNIA BUT COULD WE PRETEND TO TRY.

Ahem.

LOL, you and the Mr. can come to NJ and walk my dog when it’s 16° outside if that makes you feel better.

368 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:38:56pm

re: #365 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss

The correct answer is: Not Pavlov

Another dog situation…

369 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 2:39:05pm

re: #365 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss

The correct answer is: Not Pavlov

Pavlov? Wasn’t he the guy who proved that if you ring a bell every time you give money to a Republican the Republican will eventually salivate when you just ring the bell?

370 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 2:39:33pm

re: #367 Mattand

LOL, you and the Mr. can come to NJ and walk my dog when it’s 16° outside if that makes you feel better.

It was sort of nice the first year but it turns out some of us like and miss seasons…

371 The Ghost of Tonalite Gneiss  Feb 12, 2015 2:40:30pm

re: #366 Mattand

When you see that kind of cognitive dissonance, libertarians are usually not too far behind.

IT’S COUNTER-INTUITIVE, THEREFORE IT MUST BE TRUE, RIGHT?

372 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:40:53pm

re: #369 Higgs Boson’s Mate

Pavlov? Wasn’t he the guy who proved that if you ring a bell every time you give money to a Republican the Republican will eventually salivate when you just ring the bell?

Or like when Obama takes a position on something and they are automatically against it. Like mandated health insurance, for instance.

373 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 2:41:42pm

re: #364 klys (maker of Silmarils)

It is colder inside my house than it is outside and I PREFER IT THAT WAY BECAUSE IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE WINTER THERE IS THIS CONCEPT CALLED SEASONS AND I KNOW IT’S HARD CALIFORNIA BUT COULD WE PRETEND TO TRY.

Ahem.

Usually there’s the wet season and the dry season in CA, for a grand total of two seasons.

These days there the dry season and another dry season, and it requires GOP math to get the count up to two.

374 thedopefishlives  Feb 12, 2015 2:42:12pm

re: #370 klys (maker of Silmarils)

It was sort of nice the first year but it turns out some of us like and miss seasons…

Mrs. Fish and I are both on record saying that we could never truly be at home anywhere outside the Midwest. Sure, the weather is much better in other places, but SEASONS. Also, Mrs. Fish is a snow addict and if she didn’t have winter, I’m pretty sure she would wither and die.

375 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:42:38pm

re: #370 klys (maker of Silmarils)

It was sort of nice the first year but it turns out some of us like and miss seasons…

I don’t mind winter so much. I don’t get cold easily. It’s the freaking sub arctic temperatures that have been driving me nuts.

376 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:43:16pm

re: #366 Mattand

When you see that kind of cognitive dissonance, libertarians are usually not too far behind.

Correct.

377 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 2:43:30pm

re: #374 thedopefishlives

Mrs. Fish and I are both on record saying that we could never truly be at home anywhere outside the Midwest. Sure, the weather is much better in other places, but SEASONS. Also, Mrs. Fish is a snow addict and if she didn’t have winter, I’m pretty sure she would wither and die.

Take my experience and learn from it. THIS WAY LIES PERIL AND DEATH AND MISFORTUNE AND ALL CAPS RANTS ABOUT THE FACT THAT IT IS FUCKING 74 DEGREES OUTSIDE AND I AM SICK OF THIS SHIT.

378 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:45:22pm

I used to work with a woman who would type her emails in all caps. She did this because she wanted to get the recipient’s attention. I think she continued to do it even after it was pointed out that is considered shouting.

379 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:45:46pm

My lawyer brother-in-law just emailed me to ask me my opinion about whether children whose parents refuse vaccination should be prevented from attending school when there’s no public health crisis.

He got both barrels.

380 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 2:45:59pm

re: #359 The Vicious Babushka

I just got home and this thread is full of more Derp than I have ever seen collected in one place.

What kind of pie should I make? The choices are:

1. Lemon Meringue
2. Vanilla Cream with Mixed Berry topping

I’m tending to the Lemon Meringue but I have a bunch of bags of mixed berries in the freezer that I need to use up.

There are no bad choices here. Use the fruit.

381 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 2:46:30pm

re: #359 The Vicious Babushka

I just got home and this thread is full of more Derp than I have ever seen collected in one place.

What kind of pie should I make? The choices are:

1. Lemon Meringue
2. Vanilla Cream with Mixed Berry topping

I’m tending to the Lemon Meringue but I have a bunch of bags of mixed berries in the freezer that I need to use up.

I will weigh in with a vote that you make both pies and then send me #2.

382 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:46:33pm

re: #380 Great White Snark

There are no bad choices here. Use the fruit.

Lemon Meringue.

383 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 2:46:51pm

re: #366 Mattand

When you see that kind of cognitive dissonance, libertarians are usually not too far behind.

I’m still bemused by one libertarian I knew who had an amazing tendency to turn every conversation about politics to Pol Pot. It was like the underpants gnome version of libertarianism:

1) Policy proposal X would be a government regulation
2) The Pol Pot regime had lots of regulations
3) ???
4) Therefore proposal X is ***EVIL***

This was coming from a Stanford Ph.D. in physics (a surprising departure from the usual pattern of engineers being more susceptible to this crap).

384 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:46:54pm

Speaking of shouting: Apple’s dictation tool is one of the most frustrating things ever.

Sometimes it works…

Sometimes it doesn’t purple monkey dishwasher.

385 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 2:47:40pm

re: #374 thedopefishlives

Mrs. Fish and I are both on record saying that we could never truly be at home anywhere outside the Midwest. Sure, the weather is much better in other places, but SEASONS. Also, Mrs. Fish is a snow addict and if she didn’t have winter, I’m pretty sure she would wither and die.

I’m perfectly happy to only hear reports about winter conditions for the rest of my life.

386 thedopefishlives  Feb 12, 2015 2:48:07pm

re: #384 Mattand

Speaking of shouting: Apple’s dictation tool is one of the most frustrating things ever.

Sometimes it works…

Sometimes it doesn’t purple monkey dishwasher.

Time to dig deep into the archives of the Interwebs…

387 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 2:48:29pm

re: #381 klys (maker of Silmarils)

I will weigh in with a vote that you make both pies and then send me #2.

Will you share?

388 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:48:42pm

re: #379 Blind Frog Belly White

Here’s what I wrote:

I think your right to choose to endanger your own child ends when it endangers mine. If people are stupid enough to wish to put their own children at risk by not vaccinating, those children should not be allowed out in public where they might threaten those who cannot be vaccinated.

Moreover, though, I don’t think parents should have the option in the first place. We don’t “own” our children. We take on the responsibility to protect their rights, including the right to live. Denying needed medicine infringes that right.

We have the luxury of worrying about side effects of vaccines because we haven’t had to worry about the diseases they prevent, so we’ve lost sight of the toll in deaths, severe illness, and permanent disability that come with getting the actual disease. For a long time, irresponsible parents have been able to get by on the herd immunity of the rest of us, because the number of unvaccinated children was small. Now it has become large enough that they threaten those to young for vaccination, as in the Disneyland case.

This may seem severe, but I have little tolerance for kowtowing to pseudoscience at the cost of public health.

389 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 2:48:55pm

re: #383 EPR-radar

I’m still bemused by one libertarian I knew who had an amazing tendency to turn every conversation about politics to Pol Pot. It was like the underpants gnome version of libertarianism:

1) Policy proposal X would be a government regulation
2) The Pol Pot regime had lots of regulations
3) ???
4) Therefore proposal X is ***EVIL***

This was coming from a Stanford Ph.D. in physics (a surprising departure from the usual pattern of engineers being more susceptible to this crap).

This gets a +1 for underpants gnome.

390 Backwoods_Sleuth  Feb 12, 2015 2:49:39pm

re: #378 Mattand

I used to work with a woman who would type her emails in all caps. She did this because she wanted to get the recipient’s attention. I think she continued to do it even after it was pointed out that is considered shouting.

Not to mention, completely unreadable.
Back in the Usenet days, there was an older guy who kept pointing out that he was typing in all caps “for clarity”, despite everyone telling him it was nonsense. We figured he needed glasses and refused to get them (we also figured he may have also needed a hearing aid based on no other evidence than his stubbornness about eyeglasses).
We eventually just ignored him and he went away.

391 klys (maker of Silmarils)  Feb 12, 2015 2:49:50pm

re: #387 WhatEVs

Will you share?

Sure, we can have a party here. OUTDOORS EVEN because CA has no concept of appropriate seasonal weather. I’ll make guacamole.

392 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 2:50:13pm

re: #358 KingKenrod

And the only given example of science losing its credibility is the preferred switch in nomenclature from “global warming” to “climate change”.

But that was only done because it was obvious people who didn’t understand the issue confused local weather (ignoring the “global” in global warming) with global temperatures. “Global warming” doesn’t mean it gets warmer everywhere.

Exactly. But we must keep in mind who’s butt the WSJ kisses.

Or is that Koch?

393 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:51:14pm

re: #383 EPR-radar

I’m still bemused by one libertarian I knew who had an amazing tendency to turn every conversation about politics to Pol Pot. It was like the underpants gnome version of libertarianism:

1) Policy proposal X would be a government regulation
2) The Pol Pot regime had lots of regulations
3) ???
4) Therefore proposal X is ***EVIL***

This was coming from a Stanford Ph.D. in physics (a surprising departure from the usual pattern of engineers being more susceptible to this crap).

I know two people who are continuing their studies, and some of the stories they’ve told me about their professors are a little disheartening.

We went on a ghost tour in Philly that was run by one of these guys, and had one of his students run our tour. A lot of borderline Alex Jones conspiracy theory nonsense.

Wasn’t freaking cheap, either.

394 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 2:51:57pm

re: #389 klys (maker of Silmarils)

This gets a +1 for underpants gnome.

The funny thing is that it turns out that underpants gnome arguments are above average for libertarian arguments. I didn’t realize that at the time.

395 Swift2991  Feb 12, 2015 2:52:11pm

If we lived in a country with no weapons beyond a spear, no technology beyond fire, then it wouldn’t be important what those people thought— for them, yes, for others, no. A nation that spends $600 bilion a year on weapons? That has the Bomb? Something is very, very wrong.

396 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 2:54:02pm

re: #391 klys (maker of Silmarils)

Sure, we can have a party here. OUTDOORS EVEN because CA has no concept of appropriate seasonal weather. I’ll make guacamole.

If you knew how badly I want to move to CA, you’d understand the frozen tears plunking down my face right now.

397 Swift2991  Feb 12, 2015 2:55:26pm

re: #383 EPR-radar

Can we develop a vaccine against libertarianism?

398 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 2:55:28pm

VB, maybe you should make the lemon meringue and for insurance, a cobbler with the mixed berries?

Just a thought. : )

399 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 2:55:51pm

re: #383 EPR-radar

I’m still bemused by one libertarian I knew who had an amazing tendency to turn every conversation about politics to Pol Pot. It was like the underpants gnome version of libertarianism:

1) Policy proposal X would be a government regulation
2) The Pol Pot regime had lots of regulations
3) ???
4) Therefore proposal X is ***EVIL***

This was coming from a Stanford Ph.D. in physics (a surprising departure from the usual pattern of engineers being more susceptible to this crap).

Libertarianism is one of those things that sound really good to young people, like Communism or boy bands, but which should cause embarrassment in adulthood when reminded of it.

400 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 2:56:42pm

re: #397 Swift2991

Can we develop a vaccine against libertarianism?

Can we look larger at one which eradicates ignorance?

401 Mattand  Feb 12, 2015 2:57:18pm

re: #397 Swift2991

Can we develop a vaccine against libertarianism?

We need to consult the Invisible Hand first.

ALL HAIL THE INVISIBLE HAND!!!! MAY THE FREE MARKET WISDOM OF ITS CUTICLES RAIN DOWN UPON US!!!!!

402 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 2:57:55pm

re: #399 Blind Frog Belly White

Libertarianism is one of those things that sound really good to young people, like Communism or boy bands, but which should cause embarrassment in adulthood when reminded of it.

Unfortunately, a lot of those “young people” are edging into their dotage.

403 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 2:58:12pm

re: #397 Swift2991

Can we develop a vaccine against libertarianism?

That would be difficult. After all, libertarianism is simply an especially shrill ‘solution’ to one of the oldest problems in moral philosophy —- the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

404 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 3:00:10pm

re: #400 WhatEVs

Can we look larger at one which eradicates ignorance?

The only people who would take them don’t need them.

405 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 3:00:29pm

re: #363 thedopefishlives

Yes.

The only answer.

I wish VB wouldn’t torture us so. By this time she should know we want all pies all the time.

And then to know we won’t be given any pie at all is inhumane.

Detroit is not that far from Columbus…

406 Justanotherhuman  Feb 12, 2015 3:03:31pm

Military approves hormone therapy for Chelsea Manning, memo shows - @USATODAY
read more on usatoday.com

407 Zamb  Feb 12, 2015 3:03:40pm

re: #383 EPR-radar

I’m still bemused by one libertarian I knew who had an amazing tendency to turn every conversation about politics to Pol Pot. It was like the underpants gnome version of libertarianism:

1) Policy proposal X would be a government regulation
2) The Pol Pot regime had lots of regulations
3) ???
4) Therefore proposal X is ***EVIL***

This was coming from a Stanford Ph.D. in physics (a surprising departure from the usual pattern of engineers being more susceptible to this crap).

Pretty common argument. Hitler had gun control, therefore if we have gun control, genocide happens. Hitler had a healthcare plan, therefore if we have a healthcare plan, genocide happens. Basically person X is bad, therefore anything person X did was bad. It’s as if what the person actually did in order to be considered bad has no meaning once they have been turned into the prime example of evil.

408 RealityBasedSteve  Feb 12, 2015 3:04:32pm
Don’t forget… you can’t leave him in the garage either….
409 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 3:04:51pm

re: #407 Zamb

Pretty common argument. Hitler had gun control, therefore if we have gun control, genocide happens. Hitler had a healthcare plan, therefore if we have a healthcare plan, genocide happens. Basically person X is bad, therefore anything person X did was bad. It’s as if what the person actually did in order to be considered bad has no meaning once they have been turned into the prime example of evil.

Jonah Goldberg-level reasoning.

410 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 3:05:01pm

re: #404 Blind Frog Belly White

The only people who would take them don’t need them.

There’s that. :-(

411 RealityBasedSteve  Feb 12, 2015 3:05:05pm

re: #405 ObserverArt

The only answer.

I wish VB wouldn’t torture us so. By this time she should know we want all pies all the time.

And then to know we won’t be given any pie at all is inhumane.

Detroit is not that far from Columbus…

VB and the pie is how I know that it’s Thursday.

RBS

412 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 3:05:47pm

re: #369 Higgs Boson’s Mate

Pavlov? Wasn’t he the guy who proved that if you ring a bell every time you give money to a Republican the Republican will eventually salivate when you just ring the bell?

And just look at all the dogs that are lined up for 2016. One who fashions himself a pure breed and a bunch of mutts all with tongues out and dribbling and ready to bite the others if they even make a move toward the treats.

The Conservative Pack, not PAC.

413 Great White Snark  Feb 12, 2015 3:08:24pm
CL earlier
…Those three young people did everything right. They were exemplary citizens: educated, tolerant, law abiding Americans who went out of their way to help others, both non-Muslim and Muslim. And what did they get for thier efforts? A bullet in the head. THAT is how it looks from my side of the fence.

Wow. That’s as real as it gets. Ever offer a friend a shoulder to cry on? Can’t quite get CL’s heartfelt post from earlier out of my head. She’s right I have no idea. But it hurts to see the pain the bigots and louts among my own have caused. She’s not logged in this moment, this is my point to you guys. Confront the bigots. When a friend says something hateful or just kinda ignorantly insulting like a bull in a china shop of a conversation, say something. If it’s a friend they will listen and at least think. If they react terribly harshly well you might have some thinking to do.

it only takes a few of us to help offset these cretins. We too have social networks as amplifiers. Don’t let the bigots turn them into completely unsocial networks.

Any way back to the shoulder to cry on. I can offer that but perhaps a screaming towel may be the better tool. Scream as loud as she might but still keep the ears intact.

#MuslimLivesMatter

414 De Kolta Chair  Feb 12, 2015 3:08:36pm
415 Decatur Deb  Feb 12, 2015 3:10:05pm

re: #378 Mattand

I used to work with a woman who would type her emails in all caps. She did this because she wanted to get the recipient’s attention. I think she continued to do it even after it was pointed out that is considered shouting.

Once had an ancient Royal portable that only had caps. It was ahead of its time.

416 Higgs Boson's Mate  Feb 12, 2015 3:11:16pm

re: #400 WhatEVs

Can we look larger at one which eradicates ignorance?

What? And destroy the two party system?

417 EPR-radar  Feb 12, 2015 3:12:25pm

re: #407 Zamb

Pretty common argument. Hitler had gun control, therefore if we have gun control, genocide happens. Hitler had a healthcare plan, therefore if we have a healthcare plan, genocide happens. Basically person X is bad, therefore anything person X did was bad. It’s as if what the person actually did in order to be considered bad has no meaning once they have been turned into the prime example of evil.

In present-day Germany, there are laws on the books that require inventors to get non-trivial income from inventions they make that end up being patented by their employers. This seems like an improvement relative to US law, where the employers have all rights and income and the inventors basically have none.

Funny thing is that this law in Germany was put into place by the Nazis.

418 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 3:12:34pm

re: #399 Blind Frog Belly White

Libertarianism is one of those things that sound really good to young people, like Communism or boy bands, but which should cause embarrassment in adulthood when reminded of it.

Dang, now you are old enough to know that some people never grow up.

I have a brother, now 75, and he acts about 10…maybe terrible 2 politically.

419 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 3:16:10pm

re: #383 EPR-radar

I’m still bemused by one libertarian I knew who had an amazing tendency to turn every conversation about politics to Pol Pot. It was like the underpants gnome version of libertarianism:

1) Policy proposal X would be a government regulation
2) The Pol Pot regime had lots of regulations
3) ???
4) Therefore proposal X is ***EVIL***

This was coming from a Stanford Ph.D. in physics (a surprising departure from the usual pattern of engineers being more susceptible to this crap).

I guess he used Pol Pot because he thought he could get around the Godwin Rule that way.

420 De Kolta Chair  Feb 12, 2015 3:17:38pm

“This caricature of a young Charles Darwin riding a giant beetle was drawn by fellow beetle collector Albert Way in 1832.”

— From The National Museum of Australia

421 ObserverArt  Feb 12, 2015 3:17:50pm

re: #403 EPR-radar

That would be difficult. After all, libertarianism is simply an especially shrill ‘solution’ to one of the oldest problems in moral philosophy —- the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

I just copied this comment and put it in a word doc that I use to beat people over the head. It will be used in part again…and again. In fact, I have a target in sight…and when he goes off on another libertarian rant, whop!

Thank You.

422 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 3:19:58pm

Why are you having teh angers at me?

When I eat The Pie, every bite I think of each and every one of you! That way it is the same as if we are all eating The Pie together!

423 The Vicious Babushka  Feb 12, 2015 3:22:46pm

I just made the pie crust. If I am going to make an egg-based filling and/or a meringue it’s probably better to wait until tomorrow because these deteriorate quickly.

424 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Feb 12, 2015 3:28:00pm

re: #422 The Vicious Babushka

Why are you having teh angers at me?

When I eat The Pie, every bite I think of each and every one of you! That way it is the same as if we are all eating The Pie together!

You’ve truly earned your nickname!

//

425 Blind Frog Belly White  Feb 12, 2015 3:28:26pm

re: #422 The Vicious Babushka

Why are you having teh angers at me?

When I eat The Pie, every bite I think of each and every one of you! That way it is the same as if we are all eating The Pie together!

Lovely thought, but I still don’t taste any Lemon Meringue!
////

426 OhNoZombies!  Feb 12, 2015 3:31:27pm

re: #422 The Vicious Babushka

Why are you having teh angers at me?

When I eat The Pie, every bite I think of each and every one of you! That way it is the same as if we are all eating The Pie together!

I know that trick!
Are you sure you haven’t met my mother?

427 WhatEVs  Feb 12, 2015 4:01:55pm

re: #416 Higgs Boson’s Mate

What? And destroy the two party system?

Feature. Definitely not a bug.

There’ll always be two (and more) parties. Having the top two being sane is something to strive for.

428 lostlakehiker  Feb 12, 2015 9:37:30pm

The quote about how white evangelical protestants are most likely to not accept evolution is an accurate quote from the article. But the article itself presented its statistics in an odd way. Here is another quote from the article:

These beliefs differ strongly by religious group. White evangelical Protestants are particularly likely to believe that humans have existed in their present form since the beginning of time. Roughly two-thirds (64%) express this view, as do half of black Protestants (50%). By comparison, only 15% of white mainline Protestants share this opinion.

Now if white mainline protestants are more numerous than white evangelicals, which seems implicit in the word “mainline”, then the overall percentage of white protestants, evangelical and mainline, aggregated into a whole, who reject evolution can at most be just shy of 40%.

Is there a similar split in black churches, with some of them evangelical and some of them mainline, and with different views on evolution? The author didn’t break it out. So we really don’t know what would happen if they looked at just the pool “members of black evangelical protestant congregations.”

429 CuriousLurker  Feb 13, 2015 2:51:20am

re: #413 Great White Snark

Wow. That’s as real as it gets. Ever offer a friend a shoulder to cry on? Can’t quite get CL’s heartfelt post from earlier out of my head. She’s right I have no idea. But it hurts to see the pain the bigots and louts among my own have caused. She’s not logged in this moment, this is my point to you guys. Confront the bigots. When a friend says something hateful or just kinda ignorantly insulting like a bull in a china shop of a conversation, say something. If it’s a friend they will listen and at least think. If they react terribly harshly well you might have some thinking to do.

it only takes a few of us to help offset these cretins. We too have social networks as amplifiers. Don’t let the bigots turn them into completely unsocial networks.

Any way back to the shoulder to cry on. I can offer that but perhaps a screaming towel may be the better tool. Scream as loud as she might but still keep the ears intact.

#MuslimLivesMatter

Just now saw this—thank you. {{{GWS}}}

430 lostlakehiker  Feb 13, 2015 11:01:19am

re: #17 Rocky-in-Connecticut

What about Steve Sailor and his ilk? They surely don’t fit inside the two circles.


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