The People Who Stand With Omar Mateen

Gay-bashing and gun-worshipping haters, step up and accept your awards!
Khal Wimpo (free internal organs upon request!)
Culture • Views: 75,603

Amidst all the accusations and counter-accusations, after the pain and tears, we are now starting to get down to the core issues behind Sunday’s massacre in Orlando:

  1. Fundamentalist religious hatred of Teh Ghey
  2. Disgruntled loser with history of violence
  3. Twisted aspiration to "be part of something bigger"
  4. Easy access to military-grade firearms
    5.

So yeah. We can see some common threads running through this, and connect them to other violent outbursts. Part of a global jihadist movement? Only in Omar’s dreams. The dreams in which he is the hero, feared and admired, looked upon with awe, and totally NOT gay, no, no never that. Macho, butch, strong. All the things that come with owning a gun - well, they don’t actually come with the gun, but boy, does the NRA and it’s bitch squad ever foist that idea upon zeta-male losers.

After the Charlie Hebdo massacre, there was a global rush to “stand with Charlie,” by people who supported the ideals of free speech and poking fun at ugly bigots. This time around, nobody wants to take ownership of the mix of toxic ideologies and memes that lead to hate-crimes like the shooting in Orlando. Funny, right? Well, social media has helpfully identified people whose rhetoric and stands on the easy availability of assault weapons to rage-filled loons makes tragedies like this possible.

So here are the People Who Stand With Omar Mateen.

Palin. Gay-bashing, gun-loving. Ignorant religious hatred. Friend of Omar.
A late convert. Preaches unthinking hatred of “the other.” Standing up for guns, gunz, GUNS!! Omar would’ve loved hanging out with him.
Santorum. Deep fundie whack-a-loon. Hates gays. Loves guns. Secretly happy that Mateen did his work for him.
Ol’ Crazy Eyes. Fundie whackjob. Loves guns. Hates gays.
Ann Coulter. Preaches hatred. Love of guns. Reflexive use of violence whenever feeling angry. Omar’s fellow traveler.
Rush Limbaugh. Patron saint of angry, gun-toting ignoramuses everywhere. Hates gays. Ideological mirror image of Omar Mateen.
Newt Gingrich. Introduced mindless toxicity to Washington politics. Did more to destroy civil discourse in the U.S. than any man since McCarthy. Loves easy access to assault rifles. Friend of Omar.
Rick Perry. Dumbass Texas governor & fundie loon. Corrupt and spineless. Caves to NRA. Bashes gays. Ooops! That means he’s a friend o’ Omar.

Jump to bottom

107 comments
1
nines09  Jun 14, 2016 • 12:32:28pm

For quite the while I see an NRA member sticker on a ride and I just know that driver is a total dick. You HAVE to be. The NRA isn’t anything it once was. Just like the GOP, the insane grifters are behind the wheel. It’s really a sad, sad day. But if that man/woman who proudly displays the NRA sticker didn’t pull it after Sandy Hook, this isn’t going to do it either. Sick. They are just sick. They have more in common with the terrorists than most Americans. They own this. They built this.

2
Charles Johnson  Jun 14, 2016 • 5:56:26pm

A seriously excellent post. Promoted!

3
Brian J.  Jun 14, 2016 • 5:57:15pm

There’s got to be a space for Dan Patrick and his ghoulish tweet somewhere.

4
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 5:58:01pm

re: #1 nines09

For quite the while I see an NRA member sticker on a ride and I just know that driver is a total dick. You HAVE to be. The NRA isn’t anything it once was. Just like the GOP, the insane grifters are behind the wheel. It’s really a sad, sad day. But if that man/woman who proudly displays the NRA sticker didn’t pull it after Sandy Hook, this isn’t going to do it either. Sick. They are just sick. They have more in common with the terrorists than most Americans. They own this. They built this.

I have to admit I do too. The NRA is a racist organization that uses fear and lies to promote a bullshit version of the 2nd amendment.

5
Great White Snark  Jun 14, 2016 • 5:59:04pm

Saw the thing on Newt wanting to start another Committee on Un-American activities. Fine with me as long as he is the first one charged, as the formation of the committee is such an act itself.

cnn.com

6
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:01:23pm

re: #5 Great White Snark

Saw the thing on Newt wanting to start another Committee on Un-American activities. Fine with me as long as he is the first one charged, as the formation of the committee is such an act itself.

cnn.com

Not just Gingrich. The Republicans in the House and the Senate. All of them.

7
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:01:38pm

The Bernie-associated imagery is getting ridiculous.

8
FormerDirtDart  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:02:41pm
9
darthstar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:02:53pm

re: #7 Nyet

The Bernie-associated imagery is getting ridiculous.

[Embedded content]

You’re going to miss him when he’s gone.

10
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:02:57pm

re: #7 Nyet

The Obama light-bringer stuff from 2008 was ghastly, but this somehow manages to be worse.

11
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:06pm

Polls unskewed.

12
Brian J.  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:20pm

re: #9 darthstar

You’re going to miss him when he’s gone.

Like the wart on my wrist.

13
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:31pm

re: #11 Nyet

Polls unskewed.

[Embedded content]

Good fucking grief.

14
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:38pm

re: #9 darthstar

You’re going to miss him when he’s gone.

I can’t wait to begin to miss him.

15
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:43pm
16
jaunte  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:47pm

re: #7 Nyet

Lots of wasted art-hours.

17
Stanley Sea  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:04:49pm

re: #7 Nyet

The Bernie-associated imagery is getting ridiculous.

[Embedded content]

I saw one of the imagined oval office. There was a portrait of Jane & a portrait of the bird.

18
teleskiguy  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:05:24pm

re: #9 darthstar

You’re going to miss him when he’s gone.

I hope his political career is finished after this. He’s a doddering old fool. Good riddance.

19
majii  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:05:40pm

A Catholic bishop in FL admits that religion has caused some Americans to hate LGBTQ Americans.
“”Sadly it is religion, including our own, which targets, mostly verbally, and also often breeds contempt for gays, lesbians and transgender people,” writes Bishop Robert Lynch on his personal blog. “Attacks today on LGBT men and women often plant the seed of contempt, then hatred, which can ultimately lead to violence.”…”“While deranged people do senseless things, all of us observe, judge and act from some kind of religious background,” he writes. “Singling out people for victimization because of their religion, their sexual orientation, their nationality must be offensive to God’s ears. It has to stop also.”“
rawstory.com

I don’t think it will be long before Bishop Robert Lynch becomes the target of LGBTQ-haters.

20
(((The Engineer Lobuno)))  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:06:12pm

re: #18 teleskiguy

I hope his political career is finished after this. He’s a doddering old fool. Good riddance.

I hope a challenger is on the way.

21
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:06:21pm

re: #15 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Fuck this hypocritical asshole.If Maheen had been anything other than a Muslim of Afghan parentage, Cruz wouldn’t even be pretending to care about LGBT Americans.

22
Brian J.  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:06:53pm

re: #20 (((The Engineer Lobuno)))

I hope a challenger is on the way.

There is, Al Giordano of Narco News.

twitter.com

23
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:07:03pm

re: #9 darthstar

You’re going to miss him when he’s gone.

Can’t see that happening for me, actually. Which is a damn shame.

I actually agree with Sanders that confronting the oligarchy is a critical issue that is often completely ignored by Democrats. But Sanders never did find a way to run on that message without pissing off way too many groups within the Democratic party coalition.

For some time now, he’s been nothing more than a sore loser.

Thanks, Senator Sanders, for moving us backward on your most important issue.

24
FormerDirtDart  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:07:14pm
25
nines09  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:07:48pm

To put it all in perspective. There was a war, no not a war, a “police action” or “conflict” or “intervention” called, uh where was that landing field? Oh. Yeah. Viet Nam. And we fought there for all kinds of reasons and to keep Democracy safe and make money. And finally after years of pretending it was all a bad dream, except when we needed a color guard or some military looking individuals to open a used car lot as the local preacher invoked the God Of Sales to ensure bountiful harvest, we thought maybe we could build a wall. In Washington DC. Make it dramatic. Hit you with the sheer number of KIA in that, uh, war. Powerful stuff. Men weep at the sight of it. Grow weak. Overtaken by the toll. All those names. All those souls. For what, and the worth, is for the future to determine. But there is no wall to the dead from domestic shootings. Mass or singular. Just a moment of silence. A prayer. A life torn up by the roots. A family destroyed. Lover dead. Wife. Husband. Daughter. Son. Talk ensues and the accusations go back and forth. There is no wall. There were more people shot dead by others and their own hand in this nation in the last 10 years than the entire Viet Nam “Conflict.” 58,209 total, combat and other deaths. Somewhere around 36 a day are killed by a gun here in the USA. Daily. There is no wall. There never will be a wall. Only the sobering truth. Year after year. No wall. Only graves. Lots of graves.

26
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:07:50pm

re: #22 Brian J.

I hope a serious challenger is on the way.

27
No Depression  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:08:01pm

re: #7 Nyet

The Bernie-associated imagery is getting ridiculous.

[Embedded content]

I really hate it when people put politicians on pedestals. It’s a surefire way to get disappointed and jaded.

28
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:08:14pm

He unfortunately isn’t even talking about the issues anymore that attracted so many to him. Just a bunch of bitter bullshit about how the primary was stolen from him.

29
Testy Toad T  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:09:20pm

re: #28 HappyWarrior

He unfortunately isn’t even talking about the issues anymore that attracted so many to him. Just a bunch of bitter bullshit about how the primary was stolen from him.

The one he never led, never even tied, by any metric at any point.

30
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:09:58pm

re: #28 HappyWarrior

He unfortunately isn’t even talking about the issues anymore that attracted so many to him. Just a bunch of bitter bullshit about how the primary was stolen from him.

That really is the last straw for me. If I were in Vermont, I’d vote for Sanders vs. a Republican, but that’s really not saying much.

31
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:10:00pm

re: #29 Testy Toad T

The one he never led, never even tied, by any metric at any point.

Right, it’s been catch up ever since South Carolina.

32
majii  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:10:11pm

re: #21 HappyWarrior

Cruz is like others in the GOP/TP. They never pass up an opportunity to pretend that they’re for something after being against it. They’re not fooling me. They’re still against LGBTQ Americans having the same rights they enjoy. If a bill to ban transgender Americans from using the bathroom they identify with came to the floor of the senate tomorrow for a vote, Cruz would vote for it, and then he’d claim he’s standing up for the rights of all Americans.

33
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:10:43pm

re: #32 majii

Cruz is like others in the GOP/TP. They never pass up an opportunity to pretend that they’re for something after being against it. They’re not fooling me. They’re still against LGBTQ Americans having the same rights they enjoy. If a bill to ban transgender Americans from using the bathroom they identify with came to the floor of the senate tomorrow for a vote, Cruz would vote for it, and then he’d claim he’s standing up for the rights of all Americans.

Certainly.

34
FormerDirtDart  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:11:34pm
35
darthstar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:11:35pm

I think all this vehemence and bitterness is temporary and you’ll all realize the primaries were much ado about nothing.

That said, you’re welcome to prove me wrong, but I honestly don’t see the benefit from it.

On the other side of the same side of the aisle, things are looking good for Hillary as Trump is basically self-selecting himself out of contention on an hourly basis. The key will be using his assholish nature to swing the House and Senate…both are within reach if the DNC gets its shit together.

36
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:13:11pm

re: #35 darthstar

I think all this vehemence and bitterness is temporary and you’ll all realize the primaries were much ado about nothing.

That said, you’re welcome to prove me wrong, but I honestly don’t see the benefit from it.

On the other side of the same side of the aisle, things are looking good for Hillary as Trump is basically self-selecting himself out of contention on an hourly basis. The key will be using his assholish nature to swing the House and Senate…both are within reach if the DNC gets its shit together.

No offense but it’s a lot of the supporters of the candidate you supported that are claiming that the election was stolen from him and the candidate himself is pretty much implying that. Why the hell shouldn’t that inspire some resentment and bitterness?

37
The Vicious Babushka  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:13:13pm
38
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:14:08pm

re: #32 majii

Cruz is like others in the GOP/TP. They never pass up an opportunity to pretend that they’re for something after being against it. They’re not fooling me. They’re still against LGBTQ Americans having the same rights they enjoy. If a bill to ban transgender Americans from using the bathroom they identify with came to the floor of the senate tomorrow for a vote, Cruz would vote for it, and then he’d claim he’s standing up for the rights of all Americans.

One thing that really gets me is this: Do Cruz et al. really think GLBT people are so stupid as to fall for such transparent bullshit? Most likely they do, since their business model is shoveling metric tons of similar-grade bullshit in the general direction of the GOP base every day.

Similarly, I don’t think there is one black person in the US, not already a Republican, that hears a GOP talking point about the “Democratic party plantation” and thinks it a cogent argument.

39
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:14:50pm

re: #35 darthstar

I was ready to shut up about Bernie last week, when there were signs he’s about to exit gracefully. After the campaign’s promise to continue to the convention though…

40
teleskiguy  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:15:21pm
41
Brian J.  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:16:41pm

re: #40 teleskiguy

[Embedded content]

Wouldn’t be the first Republican, or even the first successful one, to confuse movies with real life. Challenge him to get tested for Alzheimer’s.

42
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:16:51pm

re: #40 teleskiguy

Next step is killing someone on the street, as he promised. Ratings gonna soar.

43
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:17:07pm

Besides are the Sanders supporters that continue to claim Never Clinton NOT bitter? I’m not never Bernie in the unlikely event he gets nominated. See, that’s their arrogance. They just expect everyone to fall in line for Sanders if he were nominated but Clinton somehow has to kiss their ass to earn their vote.

44
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:17:46pm

re: #7 Nyet

The Bernie-associated imagery is getting ridiculous.

[Embedded content]

No kidding! His bow arm is bent, he’s not anywhere close to an anchor point, and the arrow’s on the wrong side of the bow!

45
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:18:09pm
46
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:18:19pm

Over at Huff Po, a lot of the so-called Bernie Bros in the comments sections of articles are new accounts (seen by clicking on their Facebook name); Wonkette has specifically noted the problem on their Website. I wonder how much is Bernie Bros and how much is rodent copulation.

An awful lot of people get wrapped up in their candidate (think PUMAs), and are unwilling to admit to themselves the campaign was not good enough after investing countless hours or many dollars in it.

That said, Senator Sanders at this point is not helping much. I understand he is meeting with Secretary Clinton now; I hope this provides a way for Sanders to gracefully concede and continue his vow to fight off Donald Trump and support the Democratic nominee.

I will be very disappointed if the candidate I supported (Sanders) decides burning down the house is more important than defeating the fascist and the party that nominated him.

47
darthstar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:18:33pm

re: #36 HappyWarrior

No offense but it’s a lot of the supporters of the candidate you supported that are claiming that the election was stolen from him and the candidate himself is pretty much implying that. Why the hell shouldn’t that inspire some resentment and bitterness?

Agreed…outrage at the outrage…go for it…but I’ve said all along it was bullshit and should just be ignored. Hillary’s people pulled the same shit in 2008 and I said the same thing then…ignore them and focus on the positive in your candidate. And never equate the candidate with their surrogates - otherwise I’d have serious reservations about Hillary’s stability given the level of pain some of her supporters wish upon Bernie.

I’ll vote for Hillary in November, of course. And no, I don’t resent her for beating Sanders fair and square. I don’t even resent her ‘guns, guns, guns’ strategy in the early primaries…it’s politics and politics is a business…none of the stuff said between them is personal.

48
teleskiguy  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:19:59pm

Three Kings is one of the best movies of the 90s. It’s been years since I’ve seen it but its impact is palpable. Three Kings is what happens when an auteur is given a big budget and the film succeeds.

49
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:01pm

/sigh

50
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:05pm

re: #40 teleskiguy

I’m sure that lots of money did disappear in Iraq. I’m also sure that almost none of that theft was perpetrated by US soldiers. Parasites that got in place because of the US invasion and occupation are the most likely suspects. If this money had been followed, it wouldn’t be surprising at all for the links to go all the way back to civilians in DC who were part of the war propaganda effort.

51
majii  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:14pm

re: #40 teleskiguy

No problem for Trump. If he’s asked about this, he’ll either claim that the MSM is lying by repeating exactly what he said, or he’ll say he’ll leave it to the American people to figure out what it means. Misconstrued also seems to be his new favorite word.

52
darthstar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:16pm

re: #43 HappyWarrior

Besides are the Sanders supporters that continue to claim Never Clinton NOT bitter? I’m not never Bernie in the unlikely event he gets nominated. See, that’s their arrogance. They just expect everyone to fall in line for Sanders if he were nominated but Clinton somehow has to kiss their ass to earn their vote.

PUMAs said the same. They all came around.

53
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:39pm

re: #42 Nyet

Next step is killing someone on the street, as he promised. Ratings gonna soar.

At Greensboro:

(The rest of Jared’s TL is terrifying.)

54
The Vicious Babushka  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:42pm
55
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:20:44pm

I’m bored with the boredom over the outrage over the outrage.

Someone wake me up when it’s over?

56
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:21:02pm

re: #45 Backwoods_Sleuth

This year is getting more ridiculous by the minute.

57
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:21:58pm

re: #46 Anymouse

Over at Huff Po, a lot of the so-called Bernie Bros in the comments sections of articles are new accounts (seen by clicking on their Facebook name); Wonkette has specifically noted the problem on their Website. I wonder how much is Bernie Bros and how much is rodent copulation.

From what I’ve seen, the rats, if they exist, are few.

58
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:22:29pm

re: #50 EPR-radar

I’m sure that lots of money did disappear in Iraq. I’m also sure that almost none of that theft was perpetrated by US soldiers. Parasites that got in place because of the US invasion and occupation are the most likely suspects. If this money had been followed, it wouldn’t be surprising at all for the links to go all the way back to civilians in DC who were part of the war propaganda effort.

the military contractors.

59
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:22:35pm

re: #52 darthstar

PUMAs said the same. They all came around.

I got news for you but I hated the PUMAs too. And the biggest difference between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton is the latter has a record of campaigning her ass off for other Democrats. The same can’t be said about Bernie so no I disagree with the attempt to falsely equate the two situations and would furthermore add that Clinton dropped out when winning becoming improbable. Listen if you want Bernie’s issues to be sincerely heard, you should want him out of the race. He’s causing nothing but resentment from people who normally might be sympathetic to his agenda.

60
majii  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:22:48pm

re: #41 Brian J.

I couldn’t believe it when I noticed the many references some GOP/TP pols were using from the TV series “24” a few years ago. They seemed to believe that Keifer Sutherland’s character, Jack Bauer, was a real person.

61
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:23:10pm

re: #52 darthstar

PUMAs said the same. They all came around.

I doubt that.

62
Charles Johnson  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:23:21pm
63
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:23:36pm

Sanders can stay in if he wants to but I don’t want to hear bitching from him if the DNC doesn’t take his demands at the convention seriously. Be a bitter loser, get treated like one.

64
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:23:57pm

re: #61 Nyet

I doubt that.

There are studies that suggest Obama lost 4% of the vote in 08 because he was black.

65
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:24:16pm

re: #55 klys (maker of Silmarils)

When it’s over over or when it’s para-meta-quasi-over?

66
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:24:24pm

re: #60 majii

I couldn’t believe it when I noticed the many references some GOP/TP pols were using from the TV series “24” a few years ago. They seemed to believe that Keifer Sutherland’s character, Jack Bauer, was a real person.

IIRC Injustice Scalia once referred to Jack Bauer in legal proceedings. Hopefully this was just during oral arguments as opposed to being in a written opinion of the Court.

67
Brian J.  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:24:57pm

re: #60 majii

I couldn’t believe it when I noticed the many references some GOP/TP pols were using from the TV series “24” a few years ago. They seemed to believe that Keifer Sutherland’s character, Jack Bauer, was a real person.

And he’s about to be President later this year (in ABC’s new show Designated Survivor).

68
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:25:07pm

re: #66 EPR-radar

IIRC Injustice Scalia once referred to Jack Bauer in legal proceedings. Hopefully this was just during oral arguments as opposed to being in a written opinion of the Court.

24 was always brought up by people during the torture debates I remember having with wingnuts.

69
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:25:26pm

re: #67 Brian J.

And he’s about to be President later this year (in ABC’s new show Designated Survivor).

Well he’s better than that other Canadian i guess.

70
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:26:20pm

re: #64 HappyWarrior

There are studies that suggest Obama lost 4% of the vote in 08 because he was black.

That’s how I recall it as well. It was pretty clear that race was definitely a factor in the 2008 democratic primary. Racists using “party unity my ass” as a cover for their actions would not have voted (D) in November.

71
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:27:53pm

re: #70 EPR-radar

That’s how I recall it as well. It was pretty clear that race was definitely a factor in the 2008 democratic primary. Racists using “party unity my ass” as a cover for their actions would not have voted (D) in November.

I can tell you with some older members of my own extended family that there definitely was hostility towards Obama because of his race.

72
No Depression  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:28:39pm

re: #68 HappyWarrior

24 was always brought up by people during the torture debates I remember having with wingnuts.

Don’t you know that shooting people in the knees is the solution to every problem? /

73
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:28:52pm

re: #59 HappyWarrior

I got news for you but I hated the PUMAs too. And the biggest difference between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton is the latter has a record of campaigning her ass off for other Democrats. The same can’t be said about Bernie so no I disagree with the attempt to falsely equate the two situations and would furthermore add that Clinton dropped out when winning becoming improbable. Listen if you want Bernie’s issues to be sincerely heard, you should want him out of the race. He’s causing nothing but resentment from people who normally might be sympathetic to his agenda.

I wasn’t able to vote, being disenfranchised in Oklahoma after only just coming out of homelessness. I did support Mr. Obama for President, and at least in the town I lived in the PUMA issue was very real.

Granted, there was no way that Oklahoma would go for either, but the PUMA argument raged nonetheless.

I gave up on the Sanders campaign some weeks ago as the writing was on the wall. Mrs. Clinton has already argued he had the right to run his campaign as he sees fit, and to take his delegates to the convention if that is what he wants to do. (At that point, he will go down in the first ballot.)

I am hoping he comes out of this meeting with Mrs. Clinton on board rather than a sore loser. Sanders could be a valuable asset if he chooses to work with the Democrats rather than take his ball and go home.

74
Nyet  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:29:25pm

The PUMAs were among the original birthers too. TexasDarlin and Philip Berg come to mind.

75
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:30:32pm

re: #73 Anymouse

I wasn’t able to vote, being disenfranchised in Oklahoma after only just coming out of homelessness. I did support Mr. Obama for President, and at least in the town I lived in the PUMA issue was very real.

Granted, there was no way that Oklahoma would go for either, but the PUMA argument raged nonetheless.

I gave up on the Sanders campaign some weeks ago as the writing was on the wall. Mrs. Clinton has already argued he had the right to run his campaign as he sees fit, and to take his delegates to the convention if that is what he wants to do. (At that point, he will go down in the first ballot.)

I am hoping he comes out of this meeting with Mrs. Clinton on board rather than a sore loser. Sanders could be a valuable asset if he chooses to work with the Democrats rather than take his ball and go home.

You’re good man. I really have no problem with people who sincerely did vote their conscience for Bernie in the primary. That’s fine with me. Where he’s lost me is how he continues to attempt to de-legitimize Clinton as the winner of the Democratic primary. The allegations of fraud need to stop.

76
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:31:58pm

re: #68 HappyWarrior

24 was always brought up by people during the torture debates I remember having with wingnuts.

I saw the first season of 24 long after it first came out.

My main impression from that was how the point of view could serve as very powerful pro-torture propaganda.

The viewer sees the bad guys in action and knows they are up to no good for the entire season. When Jack Bauer finally catches a bad guy, the audience knows it’s a bad guy, so anything should go is an instinctive reaction.

In real life, nobody gets to be the audience with definitive knowledge of who the bad guys are and what they are up to.

77
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:32:07pm

re: #73 Anymouse

I’m fine with him taking his campaign to the convention.

I’m not really okay with the tone that has come out along with the demands that the Democratic party revise their rules for primaries. I feel like there has been very little introspection and awareness going on about why he’s lost.

78
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:33:07pm

re: #77 klys (maker of Silmarils)

I’m fine with him taking his campaign to the convention.

I’m not really okay with the tone that has come out along with the demands that the Democratic party revise their rules for primaries. I feel like there has been very little introspection and awareness going on about why he’s lost.

There’s that too. I have no issue with closed primaries. Bernie is seeking hte Democratic Party’s nomination. It makes sense that Democrats should be the people who get to decide who that nominee is.

79
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:34:36pm

re: #78 HappyWarrior

There’s that too. I have no issue with closed primaries. Bernie is seeking hte Democratic Party’s nomination. It makes sense that Democrats should be the people who get to decide who that nominee is.

Closed primaries are not why Bernie lost minorities.

An open primary didn’t help him win in CA.

I’ve seen no awareness whatsoever that his message isn’t resonating with people and he might need to change it. Inability to change in response to additional data is not a good trait for a President to have.

80
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:34:37pm

re: #75 HappyWarrior

Aw shucks, thanks.

On the birther movement, the derp was started by anonymous E-mails allegedly coming from the Clinton camp. It was not shown they were actual supporters (perhaps more rodent copulation). It was the National Review, then Donald Trump (along with Orly Taitz and other wingnuts) that really started with that, based on the anonymous E-mails.

Conservatives seem to have had an issue with Hillary Clinton’s E-mails (and everything else about her) for a long time; its not like since they were anonymous that it couldn’t possibly be a smear campaign against Mrs. Clinton.

81
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:35:11pm

re: #77 klys (maker of Silmarils)

I’m fine with him taking his campaign to the convention.

I’m not really okay with the tone that has come out along with the demands that the Democratic party revise their rules for primaries. I feel like there has been very little introspection and awareness going on about why he’s lost.

This process bullshit is really irritating. Caucuses are a bad idea, and open primaries are even worse.

Sanders is now advocating for these processes for no better reason than he did relatively well in them, which is really shitty behavior.

82
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:35:54pm

re: #79 klys (maker of Silmarils)

Closed primaries are not why Bernie lost minorities.

An open primary didn’t help him win in CA.

I’ve seen no awareness whatsoever that his message isn’t resonating with people and he might need to change it. Inability to change in response to additional data is not a good trait for a President to have.

They’re an excuse. But yeah we’re open here in Va and Clinton won big here. I agree, there’s no awareness that his message isn’t resonating and there is an inability to adapt. He’s showing more and more why he would make a poor President.

83
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:37:02pm

re: #80 Anymouse

Aw shucks, thanks.

On the birther movement, the derp was started by anonymous E-mails allegedly coming from the Clinton camp. It was not shown they were actual supporters (perhaps more rodent copulation). It was the National Review, then Donald Trump (along with Orly Taitz and other wingnuts) that really started with that, based on the anonymous E-mails.

Conservatives seem to have had an issue with Hillary Clinton’s E-mails (and everything else about her) for a long time; its not like since they were anonymous that it couldn’t possibly be a smear campaign against Mrs. Clinton.

Yeah I am not surprised at all to see NRO behind something bigoted and rotten. It’s what the racist Buckley would have wanted. The email thing is nothing but double standarded crap.

84
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:39:20pm

I have no desire for open primaries. I don’t want nominal independents, Libertarians, or Republicans choosing our candidates.

On caucuses I am of two minds. Here in Nebraska we have absentee ballots for those who cannot attend a caucus (but the Democratic Party here fouled that up: I got mine a month after the caucus). On the other hand, it most certainly draws out the process. On the third hand, actual Democrats got together to state why they supported one or the other candidates (Rocky de la Fuente had no supporters here). The caucus was run more like a combination meet-and-greet and party for us lonely liberals.

85
MsJ  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:39:43pm

re: #71 HappyWarrior

I can tell you with some older members of my own extended family that there definitely was hostility towards Obama because of his race.

We’re my father alive, I’d bet as a lifelong democrat, he would have, too. While he was far from Archie Bunker, he said some things over the years that made my go: WTF? Are you nuts?

86
Shimshon  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:40:37pm

I haven’t watched Obama’s speech yet, but EABOD CNN for your headline “Obama goes on tirade”

87
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:40:53pm
88
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:40:56pm

re: #83 HappyWarrior

It’s also noted that the derp surrounding Mr. Obama’s birth certificate was similar to the “show your papers” laws under Jim Crow (which would be a conservative issue, not a liberal one). There is some documentation that attack was designed to “other” Mr. Obama.

en.wikipedia.org

89
EPR-radar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:41:32pm

re: #79 klys (maker of Silmarils)

…

I’ve seen no awareness whatsoever that his message isn’t resonating with people and he might need to change it. Inability to change in response to additional data is not a good trait for a President to have.

[berniebro] Bernie Sanders, the bird-bringer, lost because Democratic primary voters are too stupid to vote in their own interests. [/berniebro]

Not really persuasive. On the other hand, I’ve learned something from this. Never use this argument on a Republican. Even if it’s true, it’s not going to work.

90
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:42:30pm

re: #87 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Clean sweep.

91
Brian J.  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:43:16pm

re: #90 HappyWarrior

Clean sweep.

Delegates look like they’ll go 16 to 4.

92
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:43:44pm
93
darthstar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:44:12pm

re: #86 Shimshon

I haven’t watched Obama’s speech yet, but EABOD CNN for your headline “Obama goes on tirade”

Obama’s speech was what you would expect…strong, deliberate, calm, devastating to his detractors, passionate, and inspiring. We are better than the loudest among us. We need to remember that.

94
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:44:33pm

re: #92 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Another reminder that a GOP debate crowd once booed an openly gay service member. (I was saying boourns)

95
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:44:51pm

re: #89 EPR-radar

[berniebro] Bernie Sanders, the bird-bringer, lost because Democratic primary voters are too stupid to vote in their own interests. [/berniebro]

Not really persuasive. On the other hand, I’ve learned something from this. Never use this argument on a Republican. Even if it’s true, it’s not going to work.

It’s not a persuasive argument in part because it sets up the instinctive emotional reaction that I think most people have to being told “you’re wrong.” When emotions get in the way, it can be hard to move past to think rationally/logically. Some people are great at it or don’t struggle with that, but I think most humans get hung up on the emotional side of things and fail to move to the logical/rational stage.

I fully admit that I am less good at the logical/rational stuff until I’ve had time to allow my emotional reactions to play out (this can happen in a number of areas and is not limited to this particular example) so I like that I can at least recognize it and try to step back to allow that space to work before I say/do something stupid in response because I’m still operating in the emotional space.

/more of the philosophy of people from klys’s head.

96
mroop  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:45:43pm

re: #50 EPR-radar

I’m sure that lots of money did disappear in Iraq. I’m also sure that almost none of that theft was perpetrated by US soldiers.

This is the book to read. I don’t recall any soldiers stealing money, but what when on over there was mind boggling. This book is great!! Used copies for one measly penny (plus 3.99 shipping).

Imperial Life in The Emerald City: Inside Iraq’s Green Zone

In this acclaimed firsthand account, the former Baghdad bureau chief of The Washington Post gives us an intimate portrait of life inside this Oz-like bubble, which continued unaffected by the growing mayhem outside. This is a quietly devastating tale of imperial folly, and the definitive history of those early days when things went irrevocably wrong in Iraq.

amazon.com

97
darthstar  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:45:54pm

re: #94 HappyWarrior

Another reminder that a GOP debate crowd once banned an openly gay service member.

Booed, but yes.

98
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:46:20pm

re: #88 Anymouse

It’s also noted that the derp surrounding Mr. Obama’s birth certificate was similar to the “show your papers” laws under Jim Crow (which would be a conservative issue, not a liberal one). There is some documentation that attack was designed to “other” Mr. Obama.

en.wikipedia.org

It really is disgraceful crap. I remember Obama sponsoring a bill that would allow children of parents born on military installations abroad to be seen the same way as those born on the actual borders of hte US and the wingnut response was “He’s just doing it to divert artention from himself.” Typical hateful shit.

99
HappyWarrior  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:46:45pm

re: #97 darthstar

Booed, but yes.

Yeah I meant booed. Thanks.

100
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:48:03pm

On Ash Carter’s statement that I just read:

Are the conservatives going to whitewash that an Army Reserve Officer was killed in an LGBT club (like they are whitewashing the LGBT themselves), because it does not fit their narrative?

Mr. Carter specifically called out in his message standing out with the LGBT community across the nation. Good. (I’m not part of that community and seeing the way conservative politicians are trying to blot them out as if they never existed is sickening: no different than Jim Crow when they did the same.)

101
mroop  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:48:49pm

And Naomi Klein’s great piece.

Baghdad Year Zero: Pillaging Iraq in pursuit of a neo-con utopia
By Naomi Klein - September 1st, 2004

naomiklein.org

102
Shimshon  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:50:50pm

re: #93 darthstar

Obama’s speech was what you would expect…strong, deliberate, calm, devastating to his detractors, passionate, and inspiring. We are better than the loudest among us. We need to remember that.

That’s why CNN’s horrible headline makes me mad.

103
majii  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:52:49pm

re: #88 Anymouse

I know the birther movement was about making the president “the other” in the minds of millions of Americans because I’ve spent my entire life dealing with those who think the amount of melanin I have in my skin means that I am somehow less human than they are. Never mind any information to the contrary that proves that I’m what society calls a “good” person. For persons with this mindset, race explains everything, and someone with more melanin in his skin is automatically placed in a lower station in our society and is somehow thought to be a “danger” to it. It’s based on the principle of being guilty of “something” at first sight, requiring no evidence needed to prove it. It’s a helluva way to live in a nation whose citizens would be quick to claim that everyone here is equal.

104
Anymouse  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:54:20pm

re: #103 majii

I cannot claim to understand what that is like, though I grew up in the Jim Crow South with parents that were appalled by that (both in the Navy, Maryland would not have been their choice to live if it weren’t for the Navy).

105
mroop  Jun 14, 2016 • 6:58:37pm

re: #66 EPR-radar

IIRC Injustice Scalia once referred to Jack Bauer in legal proceedings. Hopefully this was just during oral arguments as opposed to being in a written opinion of the Court.

” The Globe and Mail reported that Scalia came to the defense of Jack Bauer and his torture tactics during an Ottawa conference of international jurists and national security officials last week.”

blogs.wsj.com

106
CriticalDragon1177  Jun 14, 2016 • 11:20:19pm

Khal Wimpo,

And off course now of these people will admit that allowing people to carry fully automatic weapons is a bad thing, because of course we “need” those guns to defend ourselves from criminals. Funny how almost all of the “good guys with guns” who actually do anything are professionals, and not rank armature civilians who barely took a two hour course on how to operate their gun.

107
CriticalDragon1177  Jun 14, 2016 • 11:23:08pm

re: #37 The Vicious Babushka

Good suggestion. “Constitutional scholar,” Bryan Fischer, is also worthy of inclusion on the list.


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