The Westerlies: NPR Music Tiny Desk Concert

These guys have some serious brass
Music • Views: 44,594

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I know people still want to talk about this horrible election, but here’s some really good music to listen to before you jump back into the mosh pit.

Tom Huizenga | November 2, 2016 - Calling themselves “an accidental brass quartet,” the members of The Westerlies, like the prevailing winds, blew east to New York from their hometown of Seattle, where they were childhood friends.

Young musicians today routinely resist being pigeonholed into a single genre. Such is the case with this unconventional band, which, through its compositions and tight ensemble playing, reveals a built-in sympathy for improvised jazz, rigorous classical structures and sunshiny pop. Trumpeters Riley Mulherkar and Zubin Hensler and trombonists Andy Clausen and Willem de Koch can blow hard — after all, this is a brass band — but the surprise comes in their soft tones and subtle phrasing.

Clausen provides two tunes, beginning with “New Berlin, New York,” which sports a snappy theme, standing out like a bright tie on a smart suit. A scurrying pattern of interlocking notes furnishes the underlying fabric. His closing number, “Rue Des Rosiers,” conjures up the circus-like vibe of a Parisian street scene. A whimsical theme gradually coalesces from fragments and grows into a rollicking amusement. Between these two pieces, Hensler’s “Run On Down” evokes the calm beauty of Washington’s San Juan Islands, north of the band’s former home base.

The quartet has just released its ambitious second record, a double album of mostly original compositions. With The Westerlies’ open ears and confident musicianship, it will be fascinating to see which direction the band blows next.

The Westerlies is available now:
iTunes: itunes.apple.com
Amazon: amazon.com

SET LIST:
“New Berlin, New York”
“Run On Down”
“Rue Des Rosiers”

MUSICIANS:
Riley Mulherkar, Zubin Hensler (trumpet); Andy Clausen, Willem de Koch (trombone).

CREDITS:
Producers: Tom Huizenga, Niki Walker; Audio Engineer: Josh Rogosin; Videographers: Niki Walker, Nicole Boliaux; Production Assistant: CJ Riculan; Photo: Claire Harbage/NPR.

For more Tiny Desk concerts, subscribe to our podcast: npr.org

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706 comments
1
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:25:15pm

We need to find our modern-day Roosevelt, because Trump looks a lot like either Harding or Coolidge.

2
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:26:54pm
3
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:27:24pm

re: #1 Ziggy_TARDIS

We need to find our modern-day Roosevelt, because Trump looks a lot like either Harding or Coolidge.

He’s worse. Harding gave a speech in the South condemning the KKK at the peak of their popularity. Trump can’t even condemn the KKK and David Duke from a safe distance in the 21st century. Anyhow, election will be very interesting in 2020. No idea who I want yet obviously. Early, but right now I like Corey Booker because I think Criminal Justice issues are going to be big.

4
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:28:23pm

re: #2 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Somehow I can’t imagine the same attitude happening had roles been reversed. I don’t care if it sounds childish. I’m not giving him a chance. Why should I? When Republican leaders literally met the day Obama became President plotting ways to knee cap him.

5
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:29:29pm

re: #3 HappyWarrior

We need to combine that with a hard economic message. Elizabeth Warren is a good choice.

6
Tigger2  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:31:10pm
7
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:31:13pm

re: #5 Ziggy_TARDIS

We need to combine that with a hard economic message. Elizabeth Warren is a good choice.

She’s going to be 71 in 2020 and let me be honest here, I don’t know if Warren is presidential material. I think too many people have understandably been impressed with her progressive gravitas and think that should push her towards the Presidency. That said, I wouldn’t complain if she were the nominee. I just think someone younger is a better choice.

8
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:32:02pm

re: #6 Tigger2

[Embedded content]

I guess Andrew Jackson is too progressive for them if he thinks you should have to be 35 and a landowner to vote.

9
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:32:24pm
10
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:32:39pm

I don’t think I can start picking candidates for 2020 yet. Sorry guys.

11
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:33:53pm

re: #7 HappyWarrior

Wow, she looks good for her age.

Let’s look at Governors then. Mark Dayton or Tom Wolf?

12
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:33:55pm

re: #10 klys (maker of Silmarils)

I don’t think I can start picking candidates for 2020 yet. Sorry guys.

Fair enough. Let’s listen to some music.

13
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:33:58pm
14
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:34:21pm

re: #10 klys (maker of Silmarils)

Standard bearers must be found.

15
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:34:34pm
16
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:34:35pm

re: #11 Ziggy_TARDIS

Wow, she looks good for her age.

Let’s look at Governors then. Mark Dayton or Tom Wolf?

Yeah she’s a couple years younger than Hillary. I’m going to go with Klys here though. I’m a little politicked out for the day. Want to listen to some tunes.

17
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:35:49pm

re: #14 Ziggy_TARDIS

Standard bearers must be found.

Here’s the thing: it works better if they emerge.

Give it some time and the dust will settle. Things will be clearer. Someone will step forward. You’re not going to find all the answers tonight.

18
JasonA  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:36:42pm
19
Eclectic Cyborg  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:36:56pm

I suspect Trump will realize he can’t do a lot of the shit he said he would but he will also realize he can very easily blame Obama for any of his failures.

20
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:37:05pm

re: #10 klys (maker of Silmarils)

I don’t think I can start picking candidates for 2020 yet. Sorry guys.

My preliminary pick is Tammy Duckworth. Undeniable war hero, female PoC, no perceivable negatives I can see at this point. She may not end up being the best option for 2020 but if I’m in the Dem Senate leadership I’d be doing every goddamned thing in my power to make sure she gets a seat on the foreign policy committee.

21
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:37:30pm

re: #18 JasonA

[Embedded content]

Sigh.

22
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:37:37pm

re: #1 Ziggy_TARDIS

We need to find our modern-day Roosevelt, because Trump looks a lot like either Harding or Coolidge.

The scandals that engulfed Harding were pretty spectacular for their time. (Some of them are on display in the Fayette County Historical Society in Washington Court House, Ohio.)

Had he not conveniently died, I’m pretty sure that he would have been impeached.

23
Eclectic Cyborg  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:37:37pm

re: #18 JasonA

2020 can not get here soon enough.

24
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:38:08pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

I suspect Trump will realize he can’t do a lot of the shit he said he would but he will also realize he can very easily blame Obama for any of his failures.

And he’ll get away with that because why not.

25
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:38:39pm

re: #23 Eclectic Cyborg

2020 can not get here soon enough.

Hey I want to enjoy the few months I have left of my 20’s.

26
Citizen K  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:39:15pm

re: #18 JasonA

It’s not going to take long before literal murder comes of this shit.

And my cynical mind tells me those folks will get off scot free because it was one of those ‘others’.

27
prairiefire  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:39:56pm

re: #25 HappyWarrior

Hey I want to enjoy the few months I have left of my 20’s.

Oh stop, you can’t be that old.

28
Romantic Heretic  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:40:39pm

re: #2 goddamnedfrank

No, NYT, we don’t.

Because if we give him a chance the US will not have a chance.

29
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:40:52pm

re: #27 prairiefire

Oh stop, you can’t be that old.

What? I seem younger? I’ll take that as compliment.

30
prairiefire  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:41:03pm

re: #20 goddamnedfrank

Great idea for a great leader.

31
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:42:05pm

re: #20 goddamnedfrank

My preliminary pick is Tammy Duckworth. Undeniable war hero, female PoC, no perceivable negatives I can see at this point. She may not end up being the best option for 2020 but if I’m in the Dem Senate leadership I’d be doing every goddamned thing in my power to make sure she gets a seat on the foreign policy committee.

I like her too. I definitely am going to watching her in the Senate. Big fan of hers. Definitely someone to keep an eye on.

32
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:42:23pm
33
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:42:28pm
34
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:42:52pm

re: #22 Myron Falwell (no relation)

Did they ever find if he was poisoned by his wife or not?

35
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:44:16pm

re: #34 Ziggy_TARDIS

Did they ever find if he was poisoned by his wife or not?

I think that’s pretty much been debunked. They recently did however prove that he had a child with his mistress though as was widely believed for years. Those ancestry.com DNA tests came in handy there. One of Harding’s distant relatives matched with one of descendants of the daughter he had.

36
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:44:28pm

re: #32 Kragar

[Embedded content]

I don’t owe anything to that man.

37
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:45:36pm

re: #20 goddamnedfrank

My preliminary pick is Tammy Duckworth. Undeniable war hero, female PoC, no perceivable negatives I can see at this point. She may not end up being the best option for 2020 but if I’m in the Dem Senate leadership I’d be doing every goddamned thing in my power to make sure she gets a seat on the foreign policy committee.

Also, whatever potential issue her being born in Thailand might have previously raised was rendered moot when the GOP let Ted Cruz run in their primary. Trump would talk some shit but questioning the eligibility of a wounded US vet born to a US citizen vet serving in a foreign war would never gain traction.

38
Interesting Times  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:46:53pm

Whatever else one might say, this is one of the better protest chants:

39
stpaulbear  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:47:48pm

re: #11 Ziggy_TARDIS

Wow, she looks good for her age.

Let’s look at Governors then. Mark Dayton or Tom Wolf?

Mark Dayton had some mental health issues after his term as a US senator. He’s been a wonderful governor but there’s no way he’s ever back into national politics again.

40
Tigger2  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:48:12pm

re: #8 HappyWarrior

I guess Andrew Jackson is too progressive for them if he thinks you should have to be 35 and a landowner to vote.

That asshole could be just one catastrophic health problem away from losing everything he has like I did.

41
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:50:45pm

re: #37 goddamnedfrank

Also, whatever potential issue her being born in Thailand might have previously raised was rendered moot when the GOP let Ted Cruz run in their primary. Trump would talk some shit but questioning the eligibility of a wounded US vet born to a US citizen vet serving in a foreign war would never gain traction.

Tammy took some serious crap from Mark Kirk and handed it right back to him. Definitely a rising star.

42
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:50:52pm
43
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:52:29pm

re: #42 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

But it’s going to huge and the best presidential library you’ve ever seen.

44
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:52:49pm

Am I right in saying Trump is the oldest person ever elected President?

45
Barefoot Grin  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:52:54pm

re: #22 Myron Falwell (no relation)

The scandals that engulfed Harding were pretty spectacular for their time. (Some of them are on display in the Fayette County Historical Society in Washington Court House, Ohio.)

Had he not conveniently died, I’m pretty sure that he would have been impeached.

I wouldn’t wish that ill on Trump….

Because Pence.

46
LastYearsMan  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:53:25pm

re: #13 Myron Falwell (no relation)

Grab him by the beaver…

47
Barefoot Grin  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:53:25pm

re: #42 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Can’t we just download it to kindle?

48
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:54:11pm
49
Decatur Deb  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:54:48pm

Leader of the NAACP:

“…During this critical period of transition, we are calling upon President-elect Donald J. Trump to speak and act with the moral clarity necessary to silence the dog-whistle racial politics that have characterized recent months and have left many of our fellow citizens snarling at one another in anger and even whimpering in fear.

We are ready and willing to work with a new administration to protect and advance civil and human rights for all Americans. We are also prepared to fight any attempt to roll back the progress we’ve been working toward for more than a century…”

That’s the standard message from a losing side, unless you’re an asshole like McConnell.

50
whitebeach  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:55:20pm

re: #38 Interesting Times

Whatever else one might say, this is one of the better protest chants:

[Embedded content]

Sorry, I disagree. At this point it’s merely infantile, and besides, where were these people last month or last week. Or yesterday.

51
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:55:52pm

re: #15 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Vuvuzelas are still a thing? FFS.

52
Tigger2  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:56:04pm
53
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:57:09pm

re: #52 Tigger2

[Embedded content]

Oh those people so angry with Washington. //

54
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:57:47pm

Remember when McCain’s constituency had their vehicles spray painted by blah people after Obama won. But hey blah people should just listen right. //

55
blueraven  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:58:56pm

I mean…WHAT?

56
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:59:46pm

re: #3 HappyWarrior

Harding and Coolidge would be pissed at Trump’s election, looking at their histories. I do not agree with their politics, but they were decent men.

57
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 7:59:49pm

re: #55 blueraven

I mean…WHAT?

[Embedded content]

Yes, Paul, impeach a private citizen. Explaining perfectly why “non-career politicians” like you don’t belong anywhere near office.

58
Lidane  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:00:23pm

re: #5 Ziggy_TARDIS

Elizabeth Warren is a good choice.

No. She and Bernie both just pledged to work alongside Trump. Pass.

What the Democrats need to do is go on a massive talent hunt at the state and local level and start getting people elected across the country. And not just white liberals. Black liberals, Latinos, Muslims, immigrants from around the world who want to give back. Build a real, multicultural Democratic party from the ground up and get someone from that talent pool to ultimately go for POTUS.

59
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:01:14pm

re: #58 Lidane

I will be going to the Democratic Party some time this week.

60
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:01:44pm

re: #56 Ziggy_TARDIS

Harding and Coolidge would be pissed at Trump’s election, looking at their histories. I do not agree with their politics, but they were decent men.

I think ironically the best of the three 20’s presidents was probably Hoover. He was a genuinely good man- have you read about his efforts during WWI and later after the Bolshevik Revolution? Just someone who had I think a very outdated view on the role of government. I think Harding was crooked but as I said it took a lot of courage to do what he did with the KKK. Not a big Coolidge fan but mostly on policy, he doesn’t seem like a bad person.

61
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:02:04pm

re: #45 Barefoot Grin

I wouldn’t wish that ill on Trump….

Because Pence.

One other difference… Harding was very popular when he died, but that’s because the Ohio Gang Scandal hadn’t reared its ugly head yet.

We already know an unprecedented level of obvious scandals and conflicts of interest with Trump that would sink any other administration. Thus, a desire to shut down free speech and punish opponents.

62
Eclectic Cyborg  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:02:14pm

I wonder how emboldened some of these cops will be under a President Trump.

63
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:02:20pm
64
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:02:26pm
65
Decatur Deb  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:03:03pm

re: #58 Lidane

No. She and Bernie both just pledged to work alongside Trump. Pass.

What the Democrats need to do is go on a massive talent hunt at the state and local level and start getting people elected across the country. And not just white liberals. Black liberals, Latinos, Muslims, immigrants from around the world who want to give back. Build a real, multicultural Democratic party from the ground up and get someone from that talent pool to ultimately go for POTUS.

He’s not allowed to run again.

66
blueraven  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:03:24pm

re: #58 Lidane

No. She and Bernie both just pledged to work alongside Trump. Pass.

What the Democrats need to do is go on a massive talent hunt at the state and local level and start getting people elected across the country. And not just white liberals. Black liberals, Latinos, Muslims, immigrants from around the world who want to give back. Build a real, multicultural Democratic party from the ground up and get someone from that talent pool to ultimately go for POTUS.

If he wants to do infrastructure like he claims, then they should work with him.
If he wants to take away rights then they should fight like hell.

Like it or not, ( and I fucking hate it) he will be POTUS. We have to pick our battles.

67
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:03:44pm

re: #58 Lidane

No. She and Bernie both just pledged to work alongside Trump. Pass.

What the Democrats need to do is go on a massive talent hunt at the state and local level and start getting people elected across the country. And not just white liberals. Black liberals, Latinos, Muslims, immigrants from around the world who want to give back. Build a real, multicultural Democratic party from the ground up and get someone from that talent pool to ultimately go for POTUS.

Yeah we do need to build a true multicultural party. That to me is more important than purity tests. We can have a basic set of principles that we agree and some disagreements but the main goal should be to build a party that looks like America from the top down not just in the rank and file but with leadership too. I was hoping had Clinton-Kaine won, the Dem to replace Kaine would be Richmond’s African-American Rep, Bobby Scott who is the longest tenured Dem in VA’s delegation.

68
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:04:06pm

re: #60 HappyWarrior

I wonder if Coolidge’s behavior during his actual term was a result of the death of his son. He seemed to become sullen after it.

Warren was corrupt, but he did stand up to the KKK. Hoover was as you said.

69
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:05:09pm

re: #63 Ziggy_TARDIS

[Embedded content]

I am so sick of the puregressives saying this shit. Look at the platform guys. I am so sick of them crying because we didn’t become the cult of Bernie they wanted and some of them are still hamming about that.

70
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:05:17pm
71
Lidane  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:05:46pm

re: #66 blueraven

Like it or not, ( and I fucking hate it) he will be POTUS. We have to pick our battles.

Trump and his voters just told me as a Latina that my life doesn’t matter. I’m not feeling all that charitable towards them, nor do I feel any desire to work with Republicans on anything.

We’re going to have a GOP House, GOP Senate and GOP POTUS. Working with them and compromise is useless. Better to fight like hell with advocacy groups like PP and the ACLU to try and stop the most egregious attempts on our civil liberties. Let the GOP own this shit show from the top down.

72
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:05:50pm
73
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:07:24pm

re: #68 Ziggy_TARDIS

I wonder if Coolidge’s behavior during his actual term was a result of the death of his son. He seemed to become sullen after it.

Warren was corrupt, but he did stand up to the KKK. Hoover was as you said.

Yeah I have read about that and I’ve softened my stance on Silent Cal since I read about that. Still far from my favorite and in fact in my bottom tier but I don’t view him as a monster or epic fail like Andrew Johnson or James Buchanan or Franklin Pierce. Random note, crazy to think that we had Lincoln sandwiched in between three legit bottom tiers. I’ve come to like Grant’s presidency the more I learn about how he handled Reconstruction which relates back to Harding and the KKK curiously enoug.

74
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:07:51pm

re: #58 Lidane

No. She and Bernie both just pledged to work alongside Trump. Pass.

What the Democrats need to do is go on a massive talent hunt at the state and local level and start getting people elected across the country. And not just white liberals. Black liberals, Latinos, Muslims, immigrants from around the world who want to give back. Build a real, multicultural Democratic party from the ground up and get someone from that talent pool to ultimately go for POTUS.

Yes. So much so.

Ohio has been dominated by Republicans in state government simply because the Ohio Democrats have a small talent pool. Ted Strickland’s Senate candidacy was doomed from the start (although it didn’t flame out spectacularly like Ed Fitzgerald’s farce of a run to unseat Kasich). Strickland hurt Hillary a lot more than we probably thought.

75
Unshaken Defiance  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:09:00pm
76
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:09:19pm
77
Tigger2  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:10:10pm

re: #55 blueraven

I mean…WHAT?

[Embedded content]

78
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:10:16pm

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

79
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:10:58pm

re: #75 Unshaken Defiance

[Embedded content]

The man literally wants to edit Freedom of the Press to go after people he feels have wronged him in the media. I’m just imagining the reaction from Breitbart if Obama even joked about doing something like that. Trump is everything the right has projected onto Obama these past eight years- he’s mean, he’s unintelligent, surrounds himself with yes men, has no understanding of government, but he’s probably not from Kenya. //

80
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:11:24pm

re: #62 Eclectic Cyborg

I wonder how emboldened some of these cops will be under a President Trump.

“Sheriff” Clarke just ordered a larger cowboy hat for his inflated ego.

81
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:12:01pm

re: #76 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Uh no. They weren’t ever nice to us Obama and Clinton supporters so why on earth should I fucking be nice to them especially seeing how they acted at Donald Trump Presents the Nuremberg Rallies American Edition.

82
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:12:36pm

re: #80 Myron Falwell (no relation)

“Sheriff” Clarke just ordered a larger cowboy hat for his inflated ego.

Might Clarke be on a list for a big LEO position? Not FBI but perhaps ATF or something like that?

83
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:12:52pm

re: #73 HappyWarrior

Yeah.

I have some hope for the future, but we need to start acting now.

My Muslim Friends have hope, so I will too.

84
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:14:11pm
Draymond Green says…
85
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:14:52pm

re: #83 Ziggy_TARDIS

Yeah.

I have some hope for the future, but we need to start acting now.

My Muslim Friends have hope, so I will too.

Yeah my Hispanic extended family in laws aren’t. They dealt with Fujimori. We’ll deal with Trump and then kick his orange ass in 2020.

86
Decatur Deb  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:15:27pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

[Embedded content]

It’s what you do, or at least what you say. We condemned McConnell for precisely the same strategy. For the most part this is just a Victorian round of courtesies.

87
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:16:12pm
88
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:16:19pm
89
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:17:12pm

I mean let me put it this way, I won’t go out of my way to be hostile to a Trump supporter but I’m certainly not going to go out of my way to be nice and to understand them. Did they attempt to understand why I wanted my niece not to have a President who wasn’t a sexist pig or to have a President that respected everyone who lived here and genuinely cared about issues that could benefit everyone here. No, they didn’t and because of that, I have no desire to understand them or go out of my way to be nice to them. Maybe not every Trump supporter thinks like David Duke on race but you know what, I don’t care, they made their bed.

90
Joe Bacon  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:18:16pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

[Embedded content]

Charles, considering how the New York Times news section endlessly trashed the Clintons over the past 25 years—well that’s why I gave up on that paper.

91
Tigger2  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:18:23pm

re: #32 Kragar

[Embedded content]

92
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:20:14pm
93
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:22:10pm

re: #82 HappyWarrior

Might Clarke be on a list for a big LEO position? Not FBI but perhaps ATF or something like that?

Honestly I can’t think of anything he’s done this year because acting like a f—-ing lunatic vowing revolution on Twitter while talking to Lumpy three times a week.

Which means he’ll be Drumpf’s “Democrat” rep in the cabinet. ATF would sound about right for a whack job like him.

94
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:23:09pm
95
Eclectic Cyborg  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:23:18pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

[Embedded content]

They realize they have to kiss Trumps ass now for access and all that crap. Sad!

96
Citizen K  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:23:25pm

re: #76 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Meanwhile we have citizens shaming Hillary supporters and telling them to leave America because they’re not wanted. You have vandalism, firebombing, assault, etc.

Fuck you, NYT. Your sympathy is dropped on the side of the people who need the least sympathy right now.

97
Joe Bacon  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:23:33pm

re: #93 Myron Falwell (no relation)

Honestly I can’t think of anything he’s done this year because acting like a f—-ing lunatic vowing revolution on Twitter while talking to Lumpy three times a week.

Which means he’ll be Drumpf’s “Democrat” rep in the cabinet. ATF would sound about right for a whack job like him.

Except that the NRA has repeatedly pushed for dissolution of the ATF bureau claiming that it infringes on the 2nd Amendment.

98
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:24:04pm

re: #93 Myron Falwell (no relation)

Honestly I can’t think of anything he’s done this year because acting like a f—-ing lunatic vowing revolution on Twitter while talking to Lumpy three times a week.

Which means he’ll be Drumpf’s “Democrat” rep in the cabinet. ATF would sound about right for a whack job like him.

I keep on forgetting he’s technically a Democrat. There’s something wrong with him. There really is. I’m so sick of him attacking BLM in disgusting matters. Saying they were coordinating with ISIS really should have gotten him ridiculed but nope

99
jaunte  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:24:54pm
100
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:26:00pm

re: #97 Joe Bacon

Except that the NRA has repeatedly pushed for dissolution of the ATF bureau claiming that it infringes on the 2nd Amendment.

Presiding over its demolition then?

101
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:27:00pm

One thing that is going to be a trip is seeing Ol’ Lumpy on FNC defend everything Trump does after finding everything wrong with what Obama did including his burger eating habits.

102
blueraven  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:27:16pm

re: #71 Lidane

Trump and his voters just told me as a Latina that my life doesn’t matter. I’m not feeling all that charitable towards them, nor do I feel any desire to work with Republicans on anything.

We’re going to have a GOP House, GOP Senate and GOP POTUS. Working with them and compromise is useless. Better to fight like hell with advocacy groups like PP and the ACLU to try and stop the most egregious attempts on our civil liberties. Let the GOP own this shit show from the top down.

I agree, where policy is harmful, never compromise. But do we really want to be the party to obstruct infrastructure spending and projects? Jobs? How is that helpful?

Look, my husband and two children are Latino as well, so I get it.

103
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:29:57pm

re: #96 Kryptik: Just Done With It.

Meanwhile we have citizens shaming Hillary supporters and telling them to leave America because they’re not wanted. You have vandalism, firebombing, assault, etc.

Fuck you, NYT. Your sympathy is dropped on the side of the people who need the least sympathy right now.

That’s another reason why I have no desire to play nice with them.

104
makeitstop  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:30:18pm

re: #95 Eclectic Cyborg

They realize they have to kiss Trumps ass now for access and all that crap. Sad!

That, and they want to avoid the shitstorm they’re in for after going after Trump. I’m sure that when the whip comes down on the media, Trump is gonna go after NYT hammer and tongs.

105
Decatur Deb  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:30:34pm

If Trump is as crazy as we say, he’s going to generate a Republican NeverTrump faction in both houses. Cooperation between them and the Dems could be pragmatic.

106
KGxvi  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:30:43pm

re: #1 Ziggy_TARDIS

We need to find our modern-day Roosevelt, because Trump looks a lot like either Harding or Coolidge.

If you’re going to look for a new standard bearer, I’d suggest someone (relatively) young. And someone inspiring. The guys on Keepin It 1600 were talking about this on their latest podcast - too many Democrats fall in love with a resume, and ignore whether that person is right for the time. It happened with Kerry, it happened this time with Clinton (hell, it happened in 2008 with Clinton).

I’m not sure who the next person is for the Democrats, and being that I’m not a Democrat, probably doesn’t do much good for me to weigh in on it.

107
jaunte  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:30:47pm
108
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:33:51pm

re: #107 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Why is Hillary so vindictive?// Oh wait

109
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:36:21pm

re: #105 Decatur Deb

That’s possible.

110
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:37:50pm

re: #105 Decatur Deb

If Trump is as crazy as we say, he’s going to generate a Republican NeverTrump faction in both houses. Cooperation between them and the Dems could be pragmatic.

I would be very reluctant to team up with anyone who backed that yam in the election. Not saying it’s impossible, but let’s not forgive and forget, either.

111
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:39:19pm
112
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:39:41pm

re: #106 KGxvi

I don’t think you’re wrong. For Warren though, I think it’s more falling for her progressive rep and possibly overlooking her potential weaknesses. Honestly I think many in the party’s progressive wing value ideological purity to the point where they ignore diversity and inspiration. I actually remember reading when Tammy Duckworth first ran, some of the progressives preferred a candidate with a more progressive reputation but nowhere near as charismatic or inspiring as Tammy.

113
BeachDem  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:40:18pm

re: #58 Lidane

No. She and Bernie both just pledged to work alongside Trump. Pass.

What the Democrats need to do is go on a massive talent hunt at the state and local level and start getting people elected across the country. And not just white liberals. Black liberals, Latinos, Muslims, immigrants from around the world who want to give back. Build a real, multicultural Democratic party from the ground up and get someone from that talent pool to ultimately go for POTUS.

Keep your eyes on Bakari Sellers, not for 2020 (he’ll be just old enough, 36, but too soon) down the road. Word is that when Clyburn retires (he’s 76) Bakari is the heir apparent for his seat. He’s served in state government and is now a recognized face on CNN. He’s smart, charismatic, has a wonderful backstory and will, in my opinion, be someone to watch in the future.

114
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:42:16pm

re: #113 BeachDem

Keep your eyes on Bakari Sellers, not for 2020 (he’ll be just old enough, 36, but too soon) down the road. Word is that when Clyburn retires (he’s 76) Bakari is the heir apparent for his seat. He’s served in state government and is now a recognized face on CNN. He’s smart, charismatic, has a wonderful backstory and will, in my opinion, be someone to watch in the future.

I really like what I’ve seen out of him. Maybe Clyburn retires in 2018, Sellers runs, serves two terms and then takes on Scott?

115
BeachDem  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:44:43pm

re: #66 blueraven

If he wants to do infrastructure like he claims, then they should work with him.
If he wants to take away rights then they should fight like hell.

Like it or not, ( and I fucking hate it) he will be POTUS. We have to pick our battles.

Working with him on issues/projects as they arise is NOT the same as reaching out on day one with a giant olive branch (and in Bernie’s case, even a justification for the populist message to the middle class, which in fact, had little to do with who actually voted for Trump).

They didn’t have to say anything insulting—they could have merely kept their mouths shut.

116
whitebeach  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:47:04pm

re: #105 Decatur Deb

If Trump is as crazy as we say, he’s going to generate a Republican NeverTrump faction in both houses. Cooperation between them and the Dems could be pragmatic.

DD, I respect you like a most admired friend, but what in the years since roughly 1994 makes you think that this beautiful dreamworld has any chance of vaping into reality?

117
Unshaken Defiance  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:49:40pm

re: #66 blueraven

If he wants to do infrastructure like he claims, then they should work with him.
If he wants to take away rights then they should fight like hell.

Like it or not, ( and I fucking hate it) he will be POTUS. We have to pick our battles.

With every President, Congress, Senate we should feel free to vigorously support what we feel is right and consistently oppose what we feel to be wrong.

118
BeachDem  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:49:53pm

re: #76 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Sorry, Rabbi—that was the biggest crock o’shit I’ve read in a long time.

119
teleskiguy  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:52:46pm
120
Decatur Deb  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:53:12pm

re: #116 whitebeach

DD, I respect you like a most admired friend, but what in the years since roughly 1994 makes you think that this beautiful dreamworld has any chance of vaping into reality?

Nothing dreamy. Trump inspires hatred, and some of the Repubs will come to hate him more than they hate us. We better take scum and villainy where we find it, or it’s 4 years of bulldozing. Check Sen Murkowski’s record. Hard GOP, but fucks their leadership regularly because she was forced to be a write-in.

121
Romantic Heretic  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:53:28pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

[Embedded content]

They’re hoping that by begging prettily Trump will just shut them down instead of dragging them into the street to be shot.

122
Jack Burton  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:54:25pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

[Embedded content]

I think that they think they are trying to avoid getting put on an “enemies list”, or treated the way Putin treats the press.

123
Lidane  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:55:24pm

re: #102 blueraven

I agree, where policy is harmful, never compromise. But do we really want to be the party to obstruct infrastructure spending and projects? Jobs? How is that helpful?

Look, my husband and two children are Latino as well, so I get it.

Please. Like there’s ever going to be a jobs bill or anything related to infrastructure.

Trump and the GOP are going to go on a rights-destroying binge. They’re not going to care about roads and bridges, or giving people jobs.

124
blueraven  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:56:25pm

This has probably already been posted, but it is so Biden. Gonna miss him too!

125
Romantic Heretic  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:57:56pm

re: #102 blueraven

I agree, where policy is harmful, never compromise. But do we really want to be the party to obstruct infrastructure spending and projects? Jobs? How is that helpful?

Look, my husband and two children are Latino as well, so I get it.

If Trump and the GOP actually do any of those things I’ll pat them on the back.

But you know all they’re going to do is make it easier for rich people and fuck over everybody else.

126
Tigger2  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:58:45pm

My Great Nephew has a pretty good football season going.

hudl.com

127
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 8:59:11pm
128
BeachDem  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:01:04pm

re: #120 Decatur Deb

Nothing dreamy. Trump inspires hatred, and some of the Repubs will come to hate him more than they hate us. We better take scum and villainy where we find it, or it’s 4 years of bulldozing. Check Sen Murkowski’s record. Hard GOP, but fucks their leadership regularly because she was forced to be a write-in.

I think you’re giving Lisa too much credit, Deb. She’ll show her feisty side when there’s nothing really on the line, but when push comes to shove, she’s right there with her toe right smack where they say it should be.

129
blueraven  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:01:36pm

re: #125 Romantic Heretic

If Trump and the GOP actually do any of those things I’ll pat them on the back.

But you know all they’re going to do is make it easier for rich people and fuck over everybody else.

Probably. But he campaigned on it so we should call him to fulfill this promise. If he doesn’t - well then we point out he is just another lyin pol. Win, win.

130
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:02:45pm
This has probably already been posted, but it is so Biden. Gonna miss him too!

[Embedded content]

Uncle Joe will be missed. I’m sad the nation won’t get to know Uncle Timvand his harmonica instead we get Pence who is probably more miserable than Dick Cheney to be around.

131
Jack Burton  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:02:47pm

re: #127 goddamnedfrank

And they told everyone who wasn’t a white male that they matter less than their personal feelings.

132
BeachDem  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:03:08pm

re: #123 Lidane

Please. Like there’s ever going to be a jobs bill or anything related to infrastructure.

Trump and the GOP are going to go on a rights-destroying binge. They’re not going to care about roads and bridges, or giving people jobs.

Really—how many times did Boehner and the boys yell “Jobs Jobs Jobs” and then take a multi-week vacation and come back to vote to repeal Obamacare and hold another Benghazi hearing?

133
whitebeach  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:04:16pm

+
+
+
+
+
+

OK, in the midst of all the down, the above serendipitous and highly positive message sent out to lizards and the world by Hootie the all-black cat, somehow stomping on the right keys before I threw him off.

134
Decatur Deb  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:05:34pm

re: #128 BeachDem

I think you’re giving Lisa too much credit, Deb. She’ll show her feisty side when there’s nothing really on the line, but when push comes to shove, she’s right there with her toe right smack where they say it should be.

A couple of us have been watching her with amusement. She’s stuck it to them 4-5 times, IIRC the sequester vote that gutted Cruz.

135
baileylamb  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:05:51pm

I think they Republicans can succeed in getting rid of Social Security if that’s the first thing they do. I know, even before this election there were rumblings that younger generations (millenials who are more diverse than previous generations) did not want to pay for the retirement of people who hate them.
And don’t forget plenty of people never got social security, and still aren’t eligible for it.

136
HappyWarrior  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:08:05pm

re: #131 Jack Burton

And they told everyone who wasn’t a white male that they matter less than their personal feelings.

I really have come to loathe the far left for how they do everything to prevent progress. Their ego too is obnoxious. This isn’t Judy your party. Stop calling people Republicans who aren’t in 100% lockstep with you or holding grudges from the past.

137
CleverToad  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:12:04pm

Re-posting from RWC’s Page:

I’m going to sign off for a couple of days, to take some deep breaths and try to get something resembling sleep.
My 92-year-old mom is shaken and incredulous about the Trump win.
Husband and I are angry and horrified, scrambling to revise our short- and long-term plans.
My 18-year-old son is trying to stay un-depressed and focussed on school and friends, things close to home. I don’t think he realizes yet how much this is going to impact his career plans in engineering or science; or our ability to get him into anything but community college.

I want to believe the country will survive.
I know not all of the citizens will, and I’m heartsick.

Don’t know how long I can stay away, LGF is addictive. Thank you all for this community.

138
scottslemmons  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:12:12pm

I was just surfing around on TVTropes, and it suddenly occurred to me that we may be sitting in the front row seat for the origin story of Warhammer 40K…

139
Single-handed sailor  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:12:15pm

I am smoking weed legally in California right now. I’ve been waiting for this since 1970.

140
teleskiguy  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:13:35pm
141
Jack Burton  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:13:46pm

re: #136 HappyWarrior

I really have come to loathe the far left for how they do everything to prevent progress. Their ego too is obnoxious. This isn’t Judy your party. Stop calling people Republicans who aren’t in 100% lockstep with you or holding grudges from the past.

Personal observation. They want what they want *NOW*. They don’t do progress. They don’t do incrementalism. They don’t see or understand nuance, compromise, or shades of grey. You are with them 100% and when they want you, or you are worse than Hitler.

If they can’t get it, let the world burn. They are convinced they will make it through just fine and will be the ones that get to redesign everything after the fires out. (To be fair, the far right whack jobs salivating for TEOTWAWKI think the same thing.)

142
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:15:07pm

re: #127 goddamnedfrank

I don’t blame JUST Stein and Baraka for this fucked up election. But they played a part in the Democrats’ loss, and nobody can tell me otherwise. I watched it, and I have a good memory.

I can’t assign a weight to each of the factors that caused this. I don’t know which one was most responsible. But nobody can tell me that hard core Bernie Sanders die-hards and Jill Stein fans didn’t play a part, by convincing who knows how many idealistic young people to throw away their votes in this vitally important election.

I don’t blame the idealistic young people as much as I blame the handlers and media people who SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

143
BeachDem  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:16:18pm

re: #140 teleskiguy

[Embedded content]

Well of course, it is ALWAYS the job of Democrats to reach out to Republicans and NEVER the job of Republicans to reach out to Democrats, silly rabbit!

144
scottslemmons  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:20:10pm

re: #140 teleskiguy

[Embedded content]

So the press has dug out the playbook they used during the Dubya years. Maybe they think that’ll keep Trump from stringing them up by their ears. >:/

145
jaunte  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:21:47pm

Suddenly a bunch of Trump featurette puff pieces breaking out all over “journalism.”

146
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:22:21pm

re: #140 teleskiguy

147
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:28:29pm
148
dlnathan  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:30:41pm

re: #147 goddamnedfrank

Brutal

149
austin_blue  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:32:21pm

What a surreal day. Like most of us, I have been experiencing a “what the fuck just happened?” 24 hours.

Good night lizards. No nightmares. The Teflon Don is the President-elect.

Brrr…

It’s 70 degrees outside but I’m feeling the chill in my bones.

150
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:34:00pm

Just an amazing deluge of hatred and insults coming at me on Twitter from Bernie Sanders die-hards tonight.

151
freetoken  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:35:50pm

Anyone else having internet connection problems? Many sites are very slow for me to load.

152
Shazam  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:39:23pm

I wonder how many of those third party votes are from vote-traders who reneged and voted third party anyway, while the people they traded with did as well out of good faith.

153
Teukka  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:39:31pm

re: #76 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

154
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:39:33pm
155
Teukka  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:40:54pm

Ooops. Double post. Disregard.

156
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:41:38pm
157
Single-handed sailor  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:42:45pm

re: #151 freetoken

Anyone else having internet connection problems? Many sites are very slow for me to load.

Not me on AT&T Uverse in the East Bay.

158
freetoken  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:43:58pm

re: #157 Single-handed sailor

Not me on AT&T Uverse in the East Bay.

We’re having strong winds down here, a very dry and warm night. The santa ana winds might be causing problems somewhere, perhaps.

159
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:45:03pm
160
Single-handed sailor  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:49:37pm

re: #158 freetoken

We’re having strong winds down here, a very dry and warm night. The santa ana winds might be causing problems somewhere, perhaps.

It is that time of year. I used to like to go into the Santa Barbara mountains on those warm nights and listen to the howling of the wind in the trees.

161
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:49:44pm
162
TedStriker  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:50:59pm

re: #155 Teukka

[Embedded content]

163
Teukka  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:53:29pm

re: #162 TedStriker

164
TedStriker  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:55:47pm

re: #163 Teukka

[Embedded content]

165
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:57:19pm

The far left is just as fucking disgusting as the far right. Learning it again tonight.

166
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:58:53pm

Here we go again.

167
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 9:59:01pm
168
TedStriker  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:00:20pm

re: #165 Charles Johnson

The far left is just as fucking disgusting as the far right. Learning it again tonight.

Once again, it has been demonstrated that the political spectrum isn’t a line, it’s a circle, with the far left and far right being pretty much the same, with a lot of overlap in who and what they hate.

169
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:01:25pm

re: #166 Charles Johnson

Note that this deceptive “chart” comes from an extreme right wing anti-Muslim hate site.

170
Shazam  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:01:31pm

re: #167 goddamnedfrank

No puppet, no puppet. You’re the puppet.

171
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:10:48pm
172
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:15:44pm
173
Teukka  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:17:53pm

re: #164 TedStriker

[Embedded content]

*cringes*

174
Eclectic Cyborg  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:18:50pm

re: #150 Charles Johnson

Just an amazing deluge of hatred and insults coming at me on Twitter from Bernie Sanders die-hards tonight.

They just don’t ever fucking give it up do they?

175
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:19:02pm
176
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:25:04pm
177
The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:26:44pm

re: #105 Decatur Deb

If Trump is as crazy as we say, he’s going to generate a Republican NeverTrump faction in both houses. Cooperation between them and the Dems could be pragmatic.

Every Republican who crosses the aisle to work with the enemy will be primaried. Every. Last. One.

178
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:27:25pm
179
Cheechako  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:30:19pm

re: #128 BeachDem

I think you’re giving Lisa too much credit, Deb. She’ll show her feisty side when there’s nothing really on the line, but when push comes to shove, she’s right there with her toe right smack where they say it should be.

You’re correct. When Garland was first nominated she was for having hearings and a vote. Two days later she got her marching orders and was suddenly against having either.

And….she’s back!

180
Dave In Austin  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:31:48pm
181
Charles Johnson  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:34:44pm
182
The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:38:27pm

re: #139 Single-handed sailor

I am smoking weed legally in California right now. I’ve been waiting for this since 1970.

Don’t get too used to it. It’s still schedule 1, and that’s sure not gonna change now. The federal government is going to crack down on this.

Unless you think that the whole “states rights” bit was actually a principled stand they’ll apply evenly and fairly?

183
Lancelot Link  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:38:32pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

Guess who else the NYT thought should be given a chance…

New York Times, 1922
NEW POPULAR IDOL RISES IN BAVARIA
“Several reliable, well-informed sources confirmed the idea that #####’s anti-semitism was not so genuine or violent as it sounded, and that he was merely using anti-semitic propaganda as a bait to catch masses of followers and keep them aroused, enthusiastic, and in line for the time when his organization is perfected and sufficiently powerful to be employed effectively for political purposes.”

184
Dave In Austin  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:38:34pm
185
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:39:32pm
186
The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:43:17pm

re: #141 Jack Burton

Personal observation. They want what they want *NOW*. They don’t do progress. They don’t do incrementalism. They don’t see or understand nuance, compromise, or shades of grey. You are with them 100% and when they want you, or you are worse than Hitler.

If they can’t get it, let the world burn. They are convinced they will make it through just fine and will be the ones that get to redesign everything after the fires out. (To be fair, the far right whack jobs salivating for TEOTWAWKI think the same thing.)

That is because they are lazy and shallow.

Incrementalism is tiring and boring and requires constant work and doesn’t make you feel good.

A revolution is big and exciting and historic and makes you feel important, and after it’s over everything is fixed forever and you can stop having to think about it.

187
teleskiguy  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:47:10pm
188
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:54:19pm
189
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 10:58:40pm
190
William Lewis  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:00:48pm

re: #189 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

If so, I need to know where the Dumbledore’s Army recruiter is.

191
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:05:54pm
192
Tyrion  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:14:49pm

Obama’s approval ratings hit 56% in both Gallup and Rasmussen….RASMUSSEN!!
Hillary wins popular vote by over 200,000(at this moment)
.
.
.
.
.
Media - “Obama is rebuked”

I’m surprised that the media hasn’t gone with “Real America won last night”, yet.

It’s sickening. Even 2000 and 2004 weren’t this bad. I think “gaslighting” will be the new word for the year.

It’s obvious now, that the media is probably the single biggest problem we have in America. Starting on Jan 21st, it might not be, obviously, but until the media changes, this kind of crap will keep happening.

193
teleskiguy  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:17:16pm

re: #188 goddamnedfrank

194
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:19:06pm
195
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:22:00pm

Doctor Strange was enjoyable.

We’re renting Guardians of the Galaxy now. I haven’t seen it. I figure it should be excellent distracting mind candy.

196
Kragar  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:25:54pm

re: #195 klys (maker of Silmarils)

Haven’t seen it?

WAAAAAAHT!?

197
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:26:33pm

re: #196 Kragar

Haven’t seen it?

WAAAAAAHT!?

I’ve been slow.

I’M FIXING IT TONIGHT, OK?

198
Single-handed sailor  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:28:33pm

re: #182 The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)

Don’t get too used to it. It’s still schedule 1, and that’s sure not gonna change now. The federal government is going to crack down on this.

Unless you think that the whole “states rights” bit was actually a principled stand they’ll apply evenly and fairly?

If they do that I’ll take over a wildlife refuge in winter when it’s closed for the season. That’ll still be legal.

199
Sherlock Hound  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:30:56pm

re: #15 goddamnedfrank

But drum circles do!
//

200
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:32:32pm

Also cracked open the gin I brought back from Japan. A Japanese gin I had never seen before. I’m enjoying this immensely.

KO ON GIN

On a more useful note:

201
freetoken  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:33:52pm

re: #192 Tyrion

It’s obvious now, that the media is probably the single biggest problem we have in America.

To me, that sounds a bit too Trumpian.

“The media” are for-profit companies (in most cases) who exist to make money and they do that by getting readers/viewers/listeners. They seek out customers.

What your seeing is the result of servicing their customers.

And in many cases the customers are older, and will be more drawn to hating Obama, and Clinton.

Rupert Murdoch has made tons of money in this business, and others noticed, so we started to see a few years ago CNN in particular, but others also, service the older audiences and feed them the stories they want.

202
freetoken  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:38:18pm

Social media gives us a chance to interact with those others, the ones who don’t agree with us.

It’s hard, sometimes, not to defriend some of my Facebook friends. A few are malevolently dull, others are just malicious, others are just self-haters going through a crisis.

But if they are ever going to interact with someone outside their bubble, then I figure it might as well be me.

203
freetoken  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:39:27pm

This santa ana is a pain… always in November when they come I get a headache and nasal passages clog.

I’ve wondered if it somehow allergies, but I can’t think what it would be.

204
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:42:00pm
205
Jack Burton  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:43:37pm

re: #203 freetoken

This santa ana is a pain… always in November when they come I get a headache and nasal passages clog.

I’ve wondered if it somehow allergies, but I can’t think what it would be.

Probably. I have really bad allergies and Santa Anas are the bane of my existence.

206
teleskiguy  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:45:11pm
207
Blind Frog Belly White  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:56:16pm

A couple things. First about numbers.

First, don’t pay any attention to the people who tell you that turnout was low. We don’t know yet. People are looking at counted ballots and drawing conclusions that don’t hold up. We don’t yet know what we need to to draw proper conclusions about anything.

Second, Clinton will probably win the national popular vote by as much as 2 million votes. That would mean that the polls and polling averages were off by about an average amount these days. 2012 was off by a lot more, but in our favor. It feels like a blowout because we were expecting a blowout in our favor, but in fact it was close enough that 150,000 votes in the right places would have made it ours.

Third, there’s a tweet storm from Phil Mattingly that gives the lie to the idea that the Trump team were flying blind on turnout. They didn’t just fall into this. Mostly, it was the RNC. By contrast, the Clinton team missed the same data.

Next, on what happens next. I don’t fucking know. Indeed, NOBODY fucking knows. After the fights all through the Primary and the General, there’s not much love lost between Trump and the GOP. Trump isn’t a Conservative by their definition. He doesn’t really have a discernable ideology, and he is only loyal to people he needs in the immediate future. I would not expect Trump to automatically rubberstamp everything passed by the GOP Congress, and I would not expect the GOP Senate to rubberstamp his nominees for Cabinet posts.

Trump will not be loyal to the GOP Congress, is my bet. Who knows - he might even pass a big infrastructure bill. The country needs it. Should we block it out as revenge, if it can only pass with Dem support?

But yeah, the Supreme Court is fucked. And honestly, I’m not sure how much of the not-quite-the-apocalypse I’ve described above I even believe. I vacillate between feeling like it’s the end of the world, and like we might survive.

Somebody said the whole country is now North Carolina - a retrograde Conservative government presiding over an increasingly diverse population. And like North Carolina, a lot of the government is highly invested in denying the franchise to those who aren’t white.

208
goddamnedfrank  Nov 9, 2016 • 11:58:18pm
209
Single-handed sailor  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:00:10am

re: #203 freetoken

This santa ana is a pain… always in November when they come I get a headache and nasal passages clog.

I’ve wondered if it somehow allergies, but I can’t think what it would be.

I’d guess as an allergy sufferer and inhabitant of the grasslands east of the east bay hills, it could be dust from dried grasses blowing from the inland valley, or it could be a humidity change.

210
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:15:29am
211
freetoken  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:16:14am

re: #207 Blind Frog Belly White

Even adding a few million vote totals, I suspect we will still end up with a low turnout. The current popular vote counted is just shy of 120 million. In 2008 the total popular vote was around 126 million.

Are there 6 million provisional or uncounted ballots out there?

“Turn out” itself I think as a term is kind of misleading. If one means the share of registered voters that would be the more direct answer.

But I guess I am more concerned with the entire population of eligible voters. This would have to include the impact of population increase since 2012.

“Second, Clinton will probably win the national popular vote by as much as 2 million votes.”

That was my guess early Wed morning. Once all the recounts and dust settles we’ll see. Regardless, this turns out to be yet another year in which the plurality of voters’ wish was thwarted by our system.

212
Kragar  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:19:25am
213
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:29:39am

re: #71 Lidane

We’re going to have a GOP House, GOP Senate and GOP POTUS.

But I was reliably informed that the GOP is dying. / (Again.)

214
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:39:15am

re: #192 Tyrion

It’s obvious now, that the media is probably the single biggest problem we have in America.

Yeah. Chant with me, Genosse: LÜGENPRESSE!

215
Kragar  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:45:02am

This bitch…

216
teleskiguy  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:50:42am
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Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:56:13am
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Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:58:37am
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Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:59:53am

...

220
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 1:34:42am

re: #64 goddamnedfrank

HillaryClinton winning the popular vote and still losing to an unqualified serial abuser is the perfect metaphor for structural sexism.

It is a metaphor for an outdated electoral system

221
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 1:37:11am
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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 1:46:08am
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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 1:49:32am
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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 1:59:36am

Things have gotten weird over here, sorry.

225
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:01:02am
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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:04:10am
227
LastYearsMan  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:10:41am

You know, after the apocalyptic warnings about what a Trump presidency would bring, we pretty much need a major collapse. Because if it ends up being business as usual, a lot of people will end up looking like Chicken Little.

But if Kansas is a template, that just might happen.

(I bravely say that as someone who lives on another continent so is somewhat insulated).

228
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:14:21am
229
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:18:03am

re: #227 LastYearsMan

You know, after the apocalyptic warnings about what a Trump presidency would bring, we pretty much need a major collapse. Because if it ends up being business as usual, a lot of people will end up looking like Chicken Little.

But if Kansas is a template, that just might happen.

(I bravely say that as someone who lives on another continent so is somewhat insulated).

Don’t worry, I’m sure the guy whose own surrogates are saying they’re using an enemies list for appointments will still manage to attract the best available talent. No way that Administration will drastically overreach and exceed their abilities leading to disastrous consequences.

230
Shiplord Kirel  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:26:12am

DPRK News is hot today:

231
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:26:53am
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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:32:35am
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Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:48:37am
234
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:50:10am

re: #182 The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)

Don’t get too used to it. It’s still schedule 1, and that’s sure not gonna change now. The federal government is going to crack down on this.

Unless you think that the whole “states rights” bit was actually a principled stand they’ll apply evenly and fairly?

I somehow imagine that Trump might let legal weed stand just to make him popular with a certain segment of the population…

235
William Lewis  Nov 10, 2016 • 2:52:19am

So I was just reading one of the Bernie Bros as he was arguing, straight faced, that the Trumpenfuhrer is more leftist than Hillary.

Really? Smdh…

236
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:02:59am

re: #227 LastYearsMan

There is a difference between may and must. I don’t believe a collapse will happen but its probability has increased. I don’t believe a thermonuclear war will happen but ditto.

237
William Lewis  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:06:51am

re: #236 Nyet

There is a difference between may and must. I don’t believe a collapse will happen but its probability has increased. I don’t believe a thermonuclear war will happen but ditto.

An economic crash is essentialy guaranteed by the prospect of more military spending, lower taxes and economic illiterates who think defaulting on the national debt is a good thing.

238
Shiplord Kirel  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:09:21am

239
Dave In Austin  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:09:48am
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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:10:35am

...

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Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:15:47am

Sam Wang is welcome to eat any bug he finds back under that rock.

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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:23:16am
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Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:24:40am

re: #242 goddamnedfrank

If he means “violent or illegitimate means of protest” then he has a point

but only then

244
William Lewis  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:27:39am

re: #243 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

No, there can be a need for that when dealing with those who are trying to Ethnically Cleanse your neighbors or yourself.

245
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:27:40am

re: #210 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Yeah, I really want to hear from @jack, the moron whose non-existent TOS enforcement policies normalized white supremacism and poisoned political rhetoric for ages to come. F— him.

246
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:28:56am

I was wide awake 5 minutes before the alarm went off.

I slept like a rock last night. A previous night without sleep will do that.

Getting all coffee’ed up now.

247
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:30:07am

re: #244 William Lewis

No, there can be a need for that when dealing with those who are trying to Ethnically Cleanse your neighbors or yourself.

that is self-defense, not protest

248
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:30:28am

I rearranged the Tweetdeck to remove #tcot and my list of Deplorables, will replace with the best Twitter accounts of cute animals.

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William Lewis  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:32:46am

re: #247 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

that is self-defense, not protest

They will call it that when they call the SWAT team in.

250
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:35:39am

What is the name of that Twitter account that has unusual photos and cute animals? Emilio Pompsomething. I need MOAR CUTE BABY ANIMALS.

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Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:37:41am

re: #250 The Vicious Babushka

What is the name of that Twitter account that has unusual photos and cute animals? Emilio Pompsomething. I need MOAR CUTE BABY ANIMALS.

@ANIMALPlCTURES is one of them, and they’ve been posting a lot as of late.

252
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:41:19am
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Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:41:45am

So it seems that the last 24 hours have just been a repeat of the 24 hours after Gore officially conceded in 2000. The media has quickly rushed to set up a defensive perimeter around Trump, which is in part a defense mechanism for their own part in getting him elected. Meanwhile the far-left has started with its “if only you had given into our extortion racket” mantra, that if only we’d accepted their candidate and their platform, we would have won big Tuesday.

Here’s the thing for me: You can’t even make the excuse made in 2000 that people saw Dubya as a guy they’d want to have a beer with. Trump’s not the guy you have a beer with, he’s the guy who dumps a pitcher of beer on you while his friends jeer, then demands you pay for his new shoes because you got beer of them.

254
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:45:51am

I can see a plausible scenario where Putin’s strategy is actually to get the sanctions dropped and then immediately repay Trump by burning him horribly with document drops. The goal simply being to utterly humiliate and destabilize a currently fractured, weakened United States. Vova’s personal animosity towards America, born of the Soviet breakup, might just run that deep.

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Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:47:27am

re: #254 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Vova’s personal animosity towards America, born of the Soviet breakup, might just run that deep.

He is not going to let personal enmity get in the way of political expediency. He has a lot more to gain by playing Trump for all he is worth.

256
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:51:37am

re: #247 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

that is self-defense, not protest

Only when you are the target. I hope there wouldn’t be many bystanders in a critical case.

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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:51:39am

re: #255 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

He is not going to let personal enmity get in the way of political expediency. He has a lot more to gain by playing Trump for all he is worth.

Unless he thinks Trump is too dangerously unstable to reliably control, or just doesn’t give a fuck and sees the immediate promise of gravely damaging the internal unity of the United States as a bird in the hand.

I mean, you’re probably right but neither of those scenarios is entirely off the table IMHO.

258
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:52:42am

I suspect that, by the time Trump finally takes the oath, we’re going to find out that a lot of shit that was passed off as “rumor” during the campaign was in fact the Dog’s honest truth. Trump was basically coordinating with Moscow, he is in debt up to his eyeballs, that a number of foreign banks and entities are holding onto that debt, and that a lot worse things than “grab’em by the pussy” are hiding in media vaults.

Why do I think all of that? Because it would make total sense that the media, tired of years of Clinton “scandals,” sat on these stories so they’d have plenty of juicy bits and pieces to sell to the public for the next four years.

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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:56:59am

re: #256 Nyet

Only when you are the target. I hope there wouldn’t be many bystanders in a critical case.

The self-defense doctrine and legal defense applies to the defense of others, but what’s actually being discussed is an insurgent resistance, which any government would obviously cast as terrorism. And since the GOP now controls all three branches including the courts any such legal defense is moot.

We’re straying into the weeds here a bit.

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Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 3:59:25am

re: #259 goddamnedfrank

I was talking common, not legal def since such protests would be against legal measures so wouldn’t fall under legal self-defence.

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Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:01:57am

See, at this point, it’s hard as fuck not to assume that the media helped elect Trump for the purely cynical purpose of ratings. And yes, before anyone says otherwise, the media helped Trump get elected. They normalized his candidacy, they treated his insane utterings as valid policy proposals, they gave him the equivalent of billions in free advertising, and they provided wall-to-wall attack ads against Hillary. You could not tune into the nightly news on any given week without hearing “Clinton in trouble again for (insert “scandal”)” or “Clinton struggling to overcome (“optics” topic).” The fourth estate elected a president, just as they did in 2000.

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goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:09:18am
263
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:12:48am

re: #262 goddamnedfrank

Plus lots of rightists (who presumably came for that reason). But these sets mostly overlap.

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Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:14:48am

re: #262 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

I said this in another thread. when I lived in Texas I knew A LOT of wingnut Hispanics and most of them were also racist against African Americans.
My other home state of Florida has a lot of Cuban Americans who are wingnuts, and racist against not only AAs but other Hispanic groups whom they think they are racially superior to.

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Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:16:57am

re: #262 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

I think there might a simpler explanation: This wasn’t an referendum on the economy, it was a referendum on social issues. The last two elections were largely about the failure of the Bush economy and the lagging recovery. This election the economy was strong, unemployment was down below 6% the entire time, and we had a stock market at record highs. Just like Gore in 2000, Hillary was running on keeping her boss’ successes, but all people wanted to talk about was their own personal oxen and the goring thereof.

266
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:18:15am

The mind reels at the repercussions of a Trump presidency. His many business dealings will make ethics a challenge, whether to be ethical or hide from scrutiny. Career politicians aren’t entirely business or investment free and they deal with ethics on a large and complex scale.

But there’s never been a President Trump on his scale of business dealings as far as I know.

The Trump story has just ended it’s second book in the first of what might be a few trilogies. The first 4 years will be quite a shitshow.

267
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:18:56am

Best case scenario: Trump, more of an opportunist than an ideologue, “grows” into office somewhat, won’t follow the extreme parts of the rhetoric, will make do with a symbolic semi-wall to appease the peasants, won’t commence whole scale deportations, intensifies the current Obama policy instead. Even the best case is pretty horrible though (SCOTUS, for one; free reign for Putin). Rollbacks on many fronts, stagnation otherwise.

268
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:20:27am
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BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:23:13am

re: #267 Nyet

That’s a somewhat Pragmatic Rosy picture. One can hope. I can’t see him accomplishing all he’s said he would.

He’s probably still shocked he is where he is just like the rest of us. That won’t last.

270
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:23:20am

Oh, and climate change.

But I believe we’ve been irreversibly fucked on that front for some time now, so may not make a dent.

271
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:24:13am

re: #254 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

I can see a plausible scenario where Putin’s strategy is actually to get the sanctions dropped and then immediately repay Trump by burning him horribly with document drops. The goal simply being to utterly humiliate and destabilize a currently fractured, weakened United States. Vova’s personal animosity towards America, born of the Soviet breakup, might just run that deep.

I think it’s more than plausible. Putin smells the proverbial blood in the water.

272
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:27:45am

I think somebody say it right yesterday, the next couple months will be spent by the Trump campaign downplaying how much of his promises he’s realistically going to be able to accomplish. For example, McConnell’s pretty much said Congressional term limits are a non-starter, they’re nowhere on his list of priorities. And he’s also downplaying talk about building a wall, saying that Congress will address “immigration reform.”

The situation being set up is that the priorities of Congress and the priorities of Trump are gonna clash, with both sides basically expecting the other to do as they’re told. Which is why I again wonder if, in the next couple months, Ryan and McConnell are gonna revisit the idea of nuking the filibuster into non-existence if it means they can’t blame Democrats for their failures.

273
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:31:19am

re: #263 Nyet

Plus lots of rightists (who presumably came for that reason). But these sets mostly overlap.

Good point, got me thinking.

274
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:33:39am

re: #270 Nyet

Oh, and climate change.

But I believe we’ve been irreversibly fucked on that front for some time now, so may not make a dent.

The difference between tapping the breaks and stepping on the gas when your mile long train is already moving too fast for the next turn.

275
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:34:38am

re: #272 Targetpractice

I think somebody say it right yesterday, the next couple months will be spent by the Trump campaign downplaying how much of his promises he’s realistically going to be able to accomplish. For example, McConnell’s pretty much said Congressional term limits are a non-starter, they’re nowhere on his list of priorities. And he’s also downplaying talk about building a wall, saying that Congress will address “immigration reform.”

The situation being set up is that the priorities of Congress and the priorities of Trump are gonna clash, with both sides basically expecting the other to do as they’re told. Which is why I again wonder if, in the next couple months, Ryan and McConnell are gonna revisit the idea of nuking the filibuster into non-existence if it means they can’t blame Democrats for their failures.

“Folks, folks. I tried to build the wall, ok? And it would have been a beautiful thing. A BEAUTIFUL THING. But the Dems are blocking it BIGLY, ok? The Dems are blocking YOUR wall, ok?” ~ The Great Pumpkin

276
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:35:28am
277
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:36:23am

re: #273 goddamnedfrank

Good point, got me thinking.

[Embedded content]

I think there might be some class distinctions too. Middle and upper class Latinos think to themselves, “Trump isn’t talking about us, he’s talking about those people.”

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Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:37:11am

re: #275 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

“Folks, folks. I tried to build the wall, ok? And it would have been a beautiful thing. A BEAUTIFUL THING. But the Dems are blocking it BIGLY, ok? The Dems are blocking YOUR wall, ok?” ~ The Great Pumpkin

I don’t think it’s that unbelievable to say that the GOP might be willing to nibble at the filibuster, but leave it intact for at the next two years. They’ve got virtually no breathing room right now, can’t afford too many defections before bills start failing. They keep the filibuster somewhat intact, at least until 2018, they can blame the failure of bills on Democrats rather than just not having the votes.

279
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:38:24am

The wall was a ridiculous gimmick, but if he builds it while using it as an excuse to go back on his actually dangerous promises, let him. Yes, it’s a waste of money and a symbol of imbecility, but otherwise who cares.

280
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:38:45am

re: #267 Nyet

Best case scenario: Trump, more of an opportunist than an ideologue, “grows” into office somewhat, won’t follow the extreme parts of the rhetoric, will make do with a symbolic semi-wall to appease the peasants, won’t commence whole scale deportations, intensifies the current Obama policy instead. Even the best case is pretty horrible though (SCOTUS, for one; free reign for Putin). Rollbacks on many fronts, stagnation otherwise.

just thinking about his cabinet appointments sends shivers down the spine

281
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:39:22am

And yes, trying to think cynically-pragmatically here. What else have we got left?

282
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:39:38am

re: #279 Nyet

The wall was a ridiculous gimmick, but if he builds it while using it as an excuse to go back on his actually dangerous promises, let him. Yes, it’s a waste of money and a symbol of imbecility, but otherwise who cares.

Migratory land animals and ecologists I imagine, but point taken.

283
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:39:50am

re: #277 Timothy Watson

I think here might be some class distinctions too. Middle and upper class Latinos think to themselves, “Trump isn’t talking about us, he’s talking about those people.”

Ayep, it’s one of those things that always makes me snicker when I get told “minorities can’t be racist towards other minorites.” Sure they are, they just exchange “racial superiority” for “economic superiority.” As in “I’m rich enough that I don’t have to worry that my family will get dirty looks or worry about deportation, it’s those poor saps in the barrio who have to worry.”

284
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:41:50am
285
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:42:38am

The US has already built an imaginary wall by electing this sex predator in chief. Who will want to risk their lives to get to Trump’s America?

286
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:43:14am

Food for thought: what would the Internet look and sound like now if the position were reversed and it was DT who had come out ahead in the popular vote but lost the EC?

287
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:45:01am

re: #267 Nyet

Best case scenario: Trump, more of an opportunist than an ideologue, “grows” into office somewhat, won’t follow the extreme parts of the rhetoric, will make do with a symbolic semi-wall to appease the peasants, won’t commence whole scale deportations, intensifies the current Obama policy instead. Even the best case is pretty horrible though (SCOTUS, for one; free reign for Putin). Rollbacks on many fronts, stagnation otherwise.

I do believe he is more of an opportunist than an ideologue, which might be some sort of comfort if he wasn’t such a vainglorious bully overwhelmingly motivated by petty desires for revenge, fame and power for power’s sake.

288
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:45:13am

re: #283 Targetpractice

Ayep, it’s one of those things that always makes me snicker when I get told “minorities can’t be racist towards other minorites.” Sure they are, they just exchange “racial superiority” for “economic superiority.” As in “I’m rich enough that I don’t have to worry that my family will get dirty looks or worry about deportation, it’s those poor saps in the barrio who have to worry.”

There are also classes in certain Hispanic countries that come down to race and wealth, e.g. Colombia:
en.wikipedia.org

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Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:46:03am

re: #285 Nyet

The US has already built an imaginary wall by electing this sex predator in chief. Who will want to risk their lives to get to Trump’s America?

A lot of pro Putin Russians maybe.

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Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:46:29am

re: #286 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Food for thought: what would the Internet look and sound like now if the position were reversed and it was DT who had come out ahead in the popular vote but lost the EC?

Well, for one thing, the media would not be engaging in this truly pathetic display by suggesting that Trump supporters need to “give Hillary a chance.” Nor would so many morons be arguing that “the majority of Americans” had voted for her and so we needed to suck it up and come together as a nation.

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Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:47:12am

re: #279 Nyet

The wall was a ridiculous gimmick, but if he builds it while using it as an excuse to go back on his actually dangerous promises, let him. Yes, it’s a waste of money and a symbol of imbecility, but otherwise who cares.

They also aren’t taking into account the obvious forthcoming protests/demonstrations along both sides of the border that could delay Teh Wall for years. It’s not like this is automatically going to be built overnight in a vacuum.

292
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:47:32am

re: #286 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I for one would thank EC for saving the world this one time but would still be for abolishing it as soon as possible.

293
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:52:07am

I’m still wondering what justification or mechanism Trump will use to get Mexico to pay for the wall. A Wall Tariff?

294
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:56:40am

re: #292 Nyet

I for one would thank EC for saving the world this one time but would still be for abolishing it as soon as possible.

I would be in favor of retaining it (albeit in an altered form, based on the actual population and not the number of congressional seats) but only having it apply if no single candidate gains a majority.

(would not have affected 2000 or 2016 outcomes, though)

295
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:57:08am

In Vladimir Sorokin’s dystopian novels a future medievalized Russia builds a wall to separate itself from the decaying West. Sorokin is often credited with being prophetic, but this time he sort of got the country wrong.👀

296
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 4:57:26am

re: #293 BigPapa

I’m still wondering what justification or mechanism Trump will use to get Mexico to pay for the wall. A Wall Tariff?

TBH, I don’t think that he HAS a mechanism thought out beyond word salad speeches.

297
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:00:23am

re: #293 BigPapa

I’m still wondering what justification or mechanism Trump will use to get Mexico to pay for the wall. A Wall Tariff?

Trade war, that’s what it will end up being. He’ll try extorting them through threatening to cut back on trade or levy tariffs on Mexican goods, which will result in Mexico just looking for more ready markets. I’ve considered more than once the thought that Putin was engineering all this in order to further strengthen Russian-Mexican relations at the expense of US-Mexican relations.

298
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:01:54am

re: #277 Timothy Watson

I think there might be some class distinctions too. Middle and upper class Latinos think to themselves, “Trump isn’t talking about us, he’s talking about those people.”

That sounds like 1933, “Er meint nicht uns, er spricht wegen die Ostjuden”

299
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:02:12am

FFS, Trevor Bauer.

300
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:06:10am

re: #298 The Vicious Babushka

That sounds like 1933, “Er meint nicht uns, er spricht wegen die Ostjuden”

Time is a flat circle?

301
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:07:31am

re: #300 Timothy Watson

Time is a flat circle?

Or at the very worst, a scratched vinyl record.

302
Franklin  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:07:38am
303
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:10:34am

The assumption that Putin has something on Trump is not out there, but since it’s pure speculation, it won’t figure in my “calculations”.

I think that Trump has a territorial/gangster mindset when it comes to FP. I think he’ll meet with Putin and they’ll sort of divide the spheres of influence, with Trump promising not to meddle in Eastern Europe. This might be a good time for Putin to act in Ukraine, Belarus, a host of small semi-independent republics. The only limitations on that would be the European NATO members, who however, aside from Trump’s interference, are at a risk of facing their own often Putin-sponsored populist revolts.

304
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:12:42am

re: #303 Nyet

The assumption that Putin has something on Trump is not out there, but since it’s pure speculation, it won’t figure in my “calculations”.

I think that Trump has a territorial/gangster mindset when it comes to FP.

Fladimir Putin?

305
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:13:07am

re: #304 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Fladimir Putin?

Foreign policy.

306
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:14:15am

I’ve decided I’m in support of Democrats fighting tooth and nail on the charter school proposals and ACA repeal.

The infrastructure spending, I’m going to say, it’s not worth fighting over. I’ll take here in the DFW area as an example. We have a number of toll roads. But, a lot of the toll money is being used to construct the additional highways we need in this area. I-30, when it went through Dallas, used to be a toll road. At some point in the future, we can address ending the tolls on roads, but it’s been helpful in getting some construction done.

307
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:14:17am

re: #299 Myron Falwell (no relation)

[Embedded content]

I have no beef with those who tried to vote and couldn’t because of one form of voter suppression or another. Those people have a legitimate reason to be out there protesting these results and I support them.

But if they didn’t vote because (like my coworker) they didn’t feel there was a “point” to doing so or they voted third party in “protest” or because “both candidates are just as bad,” then they’ve got no fucking room to complain. Going out and protesting after the fact is the height of “privilege” in this nation, having the power to prevent something and yet doing nothing because you might have to compromise their precious feewings.

308
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:16:39am

re: #301 Myron Falwell (no relation)

Or at the very worst, a scratched vinyl record.

History doesn’t repeat itself, but it stutters.

309
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:17:13am

re: #307 Targetpractice

I have no beef with those who tried to vote and couldn’t because of one form of voter suppression or another. Those people have a legitimate reason to be out there protesting these results and I support them.

But if they didn’t vote because (like my coworker) they didn’t feel there was a “point” to doing so or they voted third party in “protest” or because “both candidates are just as bad,” then they’ve got no fucking room to complain. Going out and protesting after the fact is the height of “privilege” in this nation, having the power to prevent something and yet doing nothing because you might have to compromise their precious feewings.

And how many of those people did the Democratic Party try to get in touch with about volunteering for GOTV and they refused to help out?

They got time to protest now, but where were they during the GOTV drive?

310
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:17:18am

re: #307 Targetpractice

I have no beef with those who tried to vote and couldn’t because of one form of voter suppression or another. Those people have a legitimate reason to be out there protesting these results and I support them.

But if they didn’t vote because (like my coworker) they didn’t feel there was a “point” to doing so or they voted third party in “protest” or because “both candidates are just as bad,” then they’ve got no fucking room to complain. Going out and protesting after the fact is the height of “privilege” in this nation, having the power to prevent something and yet doing nothing because you might have to compromise their precious feewings.

Oh I agree. I definitely have a big beef with the third-party take-my-toys-and-go-home protest voters. They have absolutely no room to complain.

The minorities who COULDN’T vote or were heavily restricted from doing so, however…

311
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:17:43am
312
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:18:05am

re: #306 Belafon

I’ve decided I’m in support of Democrats fighting tooth and nail on the charter school proposals and ACA repeal.

The infrastructure spending, I’m going to say, it’s not worth fighting over. I’ll take here in the DFW area as an example. We have a number of toll roads. But, a lot of the toll money is being used to construct the additional highways we need in this area. I-30, when it went through Dallas, used to be a toll road. At some point in the future, we can address ending the tolls on roads, but it’s been helpful in getting some construction done.

Yeah, just a small flaw in that: Trump proposal is that the private companies keep the toll revenue, that the infrastructure expansion will be paid by the hiring of huge workforces which will in turn pay income and payroll taxes. It’s a modified form of “trickle down,” where we’re supposed to believe in the benevolence of those construction companies to not just sit back and wait for the government to spend money on the roads, then squeeze taxpayers from the other end.

313
freetoken  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:18:22am

The whole wall thing, like most of the stupid ideas of the sick campaign,was red meat for brown-people-hating masses.

As noted by Clinton, what “wall” currently exists, was already done as needed. There are fences along most of the border, supported by electronic surveillance.

In fact, the surveillance has been going on for some time, more to stop vehicles than humans, but still, it’s been there.

Fundamentally, and any idiot ought to know this, but the problem with a wall is that people can tunnel right under it. Tunnels used to be common in the desert.

The new administration is going to be quite a song and dance show, put on by the carnival barker. Lots of show, but little will be done.

I fully and completely expect the GOP Congress to gut the ACA. And the Senate will attempt to stack the court with anti-abortionists.

Beyond that, I doubt the Republicans in Congress are going to do anything that Trump has promised. There are not going to be new tariffs, they are not going to abrogate existing treaties. They are not going to make Apple make iPhones in the US. They are not going to keep Ford or Nabisco from building plants in Mexico.

A few may try to do the Muslim surveillance thing, but I do not believe enough Republicans in the Senate will be ok with that to interfere with the Dems blocking it.

Mass deportation is also going to be DOA in the Senate, as even some of the Republican Senators aren’t going to buy it.

And then there is “Little” Marco, Ted “my father killed Kennedy” Cruz, John “loser becaues he was captured” McCain, Lindsey “nobody” Graham… and who knows how many others Trump has insulted. Sure, for publicity they will be all smiles, but the daggers will come out in private.

So in general I see a lot of chaos, with the ACA and USSC issues being the only two (immediately) important ones.

Foreign policy will suffer mostly because of neglect.

Tax policy will be tempting but will be hard in detail because even though the Republicans will be glad to give their rich friends a tax break, the amount that Trump promised is clearly disastrous and they know it.

So yes, it could be a sh*tshow, but I expect it all will be mostly the old Republican machinery carrying out their top agendas and Trump going to lots of meetings with foreign leaders for camera.

And he’ll work on the ballroom problem.

314
b_sharp  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:22:08am

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Fucking unreal. The New York Times writes several editorials calling Trump a dangerous threat to the nation who’s unfit to be president. Now they’re telling us to give him a chance? WTF!

[Embedded content]

He now or will have the power to hurt them. They’re running scared.

315
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:25:03am

re: #293 BigPapa

I’m still wondering what justification or mechanism Trump will use to get Mexico to pay for the wall. A Wall Tariff?

There won’t be a wall.

316
Alyosha  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:26:55am

Slept 15 hours (thank the gods I had the foresight to take the week off) and woke up more depressed than yesterday. Cracked open a cask of cheap port to shoulder all the shit.
Thought I’d just post this. Has some nice sentiments. It’s a pity Radiohead hasn’t released ‘The Numbers’ album edit to YouTube because it has some gorgeous string arrangements.

The chorus is simply, ‘one day at a time.’

Radiohead - The Numbers: Jonny, Thom & a CR78

We call upon the people
The people have this power
The numbers don’t decide
The system is a lie
A river running dry
The wings of butterflies
And you may pour us away like soup
Like we’re pretty broken flowers
We’ll take back what is ours
Take back what is ours

This result hit me harder than I could possibly make my fellow countrymen understand. If I know even half of what you all are feeling, then your grief cannot be rushed.

Love you all.

317
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:27:27am

re: #313 freetoken

I have not really believed that Trump and the GOP were just going to mend all the burned bridges overnight, that either side was going to become a rubber stamp for the other. Trump is too egocentric to allow himself to be controlled by Congress, and even with their majorities Congressional Republicans don’t have the votes to overturn his vetoes without looking to Democrats. So where their views overlap, you’ll see things rammed through with haste, but where one or the other have a vested interest there will be contested progress if any at all.

The other factor to bear in mind is what I call the “Cheney Factor,” which is that Trump is not so much the guy running everything as the puppet ruler for a cabal that is going to run things from the shadows. Trump has said repeatedly that he will surround himself with “the best people,” which looks to be a pack of cronies who have long histories in politics and thus will have their own agendas. He’ll make speeches, play in front of the cameras, but he’ll leave enough of it in the hands of his inner circle that when they inevitably get caught up to no good, he can pull a Reagan-esque “I had no idea this was going on!”

I think we’ll really begin to get an idea of what the next four years hold over the next 3-4 months, as he begins setting up his cabinet for Congressional approval and Congressional Republicans begin outlining their priorities to the press.

318
jeffreyw  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:28:16am
319
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:28:55am

re: #310 Myron Falwell (no relation)

The minorities who COULDN’T vote or were heavily restricted from doing so, however…

That’s why we do GOTV. “Do you know your polling location? Do you need a ride to the polls? Do you have photo ID? Make sure you bring it with you. Even if you don’t have an ID right now, you can cast a provisional ballot on election day. Polls are open 6:00 am - 7:00 pm here in Virginia. What time do you plan on going to vote? [which helps to plan out their day because they might be taking care of kids or something because school is out]”

320
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:30:19am

re: #317 Targetpractice

The other factor to bear in mind is what I call the “Cheney Factor,” which is that Trump is not so much the guy running everything as the puppet ruler for a cabal that is going to run things from the shadows. Trump has said repeatedly that he will surround himself with “the best people,” which looks to be a pack of cronies who have long histories in politics and thus will have their own agendas. He’ll make speeches, play in front of the cameras, but he’ll leave enough of it in the hands of his inner circle that when they inevitably get caught up to no good, he can pull a Reagan-esque “I had no idea this was going on!”

He will soon tire with the daily grind of compromising and building consensus and fly off on high-profile trips to visit his favorite tin-horn dictator buddies while Pence and a select circle of Vested Interests are left to run things.

321
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:30:47am

A little levity.

322
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:30:53am

re: #313 freetoken

And then there is “Little” Marco, Ted “my father killed Kennedy” Cruz, John “loser becaues he was captured” McCain, Lindsey “nobody” Graham… and who knows how many others Trump has insulted. Sure, for publicity they will be all smiles, but the daggers will come out in private.

Not to sound cynical, but the next time anyone in that group exerts anything remotely resembling courage would be the first time.

323
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:31:32am

re: #314 b_sharp

I very much doubt anyone there is seriously scared of possible political repressions. It’s not Russia (yet). My working theory is they have two Trump features in mind: his opportunism and his susceptibility to flattery. Let’s face it, he’ll be President. Do you continue to antagonize him, no matter how deserved that is? It has been played, it didn’t work. Or do you try to achieve the least excremental “best case” scenario in which Trump is not wholly in the far right camp as far as actual decisions go?

I think Liz Warren, for one, had decided for the latter.

324
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:31:50am

re: #320 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

He will soon tire with the daily grind of compromising and building consensus and fly off on high-profile trips to visit his favorite tin-horn dictator buddies while Pence and a select circle of Vested Interests are left to run things.

Except, they can’t legally do that. The Constitution and laws passed by Congress give the President the power to do stuff, not whoever Trump decides to fill-in for the day.

325
freetoken  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:32:10am

re: #317 Targetpractice

I don’t think we’ll have to wait 4 months. Before the end of December it should be pretty obvious what will happen. Names have to be given to the Senate to approve appointments in the top positions.

I agree with the shadow president thing. I suspect that is why Trump kept Gingrich close - in order to have him be the inside guy who sort of manages the machinery of policy.

The question I have is - are Baron and Melania going to move into the WH? It’s a bit of a step down for them.

326
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:33:09am

re: #324 Timothy Watson

Except, they can’t legally do that. The Constitution and laws passed by Congress give the President the power to do stuff, not whoever Trump decides to fill-in for the day.

All he is required to do is sign the occasional bill that crosses his desk, otherwise, he is free to delegate to his heart’s content.

327
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:33:20am

re: #315 Sir John Barron

There won’t be a wall.

And if the wall isn’t built he might have some anger. When they did surveys of Donald Trump supporters, they said their most important issue was immigration.

There was even a guy who called into Glenn Becks show and threatened that bad things would happen if Trump did not keep his promise to build the wall.

Of course Trump supporters and the media never discuss all the white European and Canadian people who are here undocumented.

328
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:33:44am

Heh, wingnut wife of Buffalo Bills sportsball player said Richard Sherman, of Seattle sportsball team, should be castrated for his hit on her husband. Sherman responds:

“It’s not surprising at all,” Sherman said Wednesday. “This is a day and age, you’ve got the Ku Klux Klan running around. People say whatever they want, and there’s very little consequence. For her to say something like that and then have a B.S. apology like she did, it’s just the way of the world. I don’t let it bother me. It’s something I’m very used to. It’s just the way people are, the way people were raised.”

(snip)

“It’s more disappointing than anything,” Sherman said Wednesday. “But it’s also something that’s understandable. Ignorance has always been in this world. The core of this country has been built off of slavery and people owning people. So any time you understand that’s the core principles of the way the nation is built, then you’ve got to have some kind of sympathy for it.”

I suddenly like Richard Sherman.

329
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:34:23am

re: #312 Targetpractice

Yeah, just a small flaw in that: Trump proposal is that the private companies keep the toll revenue, that the infrastructure expansion will be paid by the hiring of huge workforces which will in turn pay income and payroll taxes. It’s a modified form of “trickle down,” where we’re supposed to believe in the benevolence of those construction companies to not just sit back and wait for the government to spend money on the roads, then squeeze taxpayers from the other end.

Tolls are a form of gas tax really, except, yes, they go to private business. But, like I said, ours are under construction everywhere. Now, I will tell you this, there are plenty of conservatives in this area that are unhappy that the tolls they are paying on the George HW Bush tollway (North and East Dallas area) are being used to pay for roads in Arlington. I personally don’t mind it, because we need the roads. But, at some point, this resentment can be used to end a lot of those tolls.

330
freetoken  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:35:08am

re: #324 Timothy Watson

Except, they can’t legally do that. The Constitution and laws passed by Congress give the President the power to do stuff, not whoever Trump decides to fill-in for the day.

All Trump has to do is sign things. He doesn’t have to do the actual work.

I really can’t see his daily schedule filled with detailed policy briefings that require him to sit for 3 hours and ask the questions.

He will sit for photo-ops. Other than that, he will just sign his glorious signature with that fat felt tip pen.

331
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:36:01am

re: #328 Sir John Barron

I’ve liked Richard Sherman for some time. I’m beginning to admire him.

332
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:36:02am

re: #327 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

And if the wall isn’t built he might have some anger. When they did surveys of Donald Trump supporters, they said their most important issue was immigration.

There was even a guy who called into Glenn Becks show and threatened that bad things would happen if Trump did not keep his promise to build the wall.

Of course Trump supporters and the media never discuss all the white European and Canadian people who are here undocumented.

I’m sure there will be some highly publicized “round-ups” and deportations of people who’ve overstayed their visas or come over illegally. There will be grand pronouncements about how many eleventy thousands illegal immigrants Trump has deported. But that’s about it. The rubes will suck it up.

333
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:36:54am

re: #326 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

All he is required to do is sign the occasional bill that crosses his desk, otherwise, he is free to delegate to his heart’s content.

Republicans blasted President Obama for being nothing but all razzle dazzle and having zero substance, even though that wasn’t the case in the least.

So of course they would be totally for something like this.

334
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:36:56am

re: #326 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

All he is required to do is sign the occasional bill that crosses his desk, otherwise, he is free to delegate to his heart’s content.

Ayep, he’ll do as Reagan and Dubya did: He’ll give them wide latitude, letting them operate with implied rather explicit approval, thus when they get caught in some truly dark shit, he can say that he had no idea what they were doing. He never would have approved if he knew what they were really up to.

335
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:39:27am

Speaking of the rubes, none of them will notice that this election disproved the rigged, NWO nonsense.

That is until Trump himself is a lizard globalist puppet in their eyes, which may be soon, depending on a few things.

336
wheat-dogg  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:39:40am

re: #316 Alyosha

Slept 15 hours (thank the gods I had the foresight to take the week off) and woke up more depressed than yesterday. Cracked open a cask of cheap port to shoulder all the shit.
Thought I’d just post this. Has some nice sentiments. It’s a pity Radiohead hasn’t released ‘The Numbers’ album edit to YouTube because it has some gorgeous string arrangements.

The chorus is simply, ‘one day at a time.’

[Embedded content]

This result hit me harder than I could possibly make my fellow countrymen understand. If I know even half of what you all are feeling, then your grief cannot be rushed.

Love you all.

I’m still in shell shock. I was not quite as useless in class this afternoon as I was yesterday, but if I stop to contemplate the potential damage Trump could do the presidency, the nation and the world order, I get really depressed.

337
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:41:03am

re: #335 Nyet

Speaking of the rubes, none of them will notice that this election disproved the rigged, NWO nonsense.

That is until Trump himself is a lizard globalist puppet in their eyes, which may be soon, depending on a few things.

Can you imagine how frothy Trump and the green pepe frogs would have been if Trump’s polls before the election had been like Hillary’s and Hillary won the EC but Trump won the popular vote?

338
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:41:11am

re: #336 wheat-dogghazi-mailgate

I’m still in shell shock. I was not quite as useless in class this afternoon as I was yesterday, but if I stop to contemplate the potential damage Trump could do the presidency, the nation and the world order, I get really depressed.

As an expat, the positive side is that my usual Holiday Season Homesickness will be considerably milder this year…

339
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:41:32am

re: #337 Sir John Barron

Can you imagine how frothy Trump and the green pepe frogs would have been if Trump’s polls before the election had been like Hillary’s and Hillary won the EC but Trump won the popular vote?

Armed revolt

340
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:41:48am

re: #207 Blind Frog Belly White

Best After-Action yet. Until real numbers are crunched, we’re just riding our biases.

341
Romantic Heretic  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:42:01am

re: #261 Targetpractice

You would think they’d learn better.

342
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:43:50am

What I learned about Donald Trump and the election results this morning from the first half hour of Morning Joke and NBC Today Show featuring Chris Christie.

Sunshine and Puppy Dogs!

Morning Joke was so taken by Hillary and Barack Obama’s speeches and how powerful and gracious they were. And he was also enamored with Donald’s wanting to bring this country together!

But Joke had to admonish the media because they were not reporting, they were campaigning, or something. I guess he says they all missed Americans that are hurting and how they all came out to vote for Trump.

Then Chris Christie reassured me that all of Trumps campaign rhetoric from birtherism to booting people out and building walls was just politics.

And all the talking heads from Mika and Joe to Savannah and Matt told me that it is now all okay.

I feel so so so much better now.

So, I am going to ignore all the racist crap and all of the reality of Trump’s character.

It was all just politics…all just a thing. Move along…ignore the history of Trump, Christie (now completely exonerated from Bridgegate), Rudy and Newt…they will be making a better America.

Right? Right?

And I am sick now…but I do still like puppy dogs. Not seeing many rainbows.

343
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:43:56am

Think of the current relationship between Trump and the GOP as that between Bane and Daggett in The Dark Knight Rises. Trump played along with the GOP after he won the nomination, he made all the right noises that they supported him even if they didn’t like him or his methods. They gladly gave him money and support that they could have found any number of ways to withhold. They effectively bankrolled his GOTV efforts and provided him the state and local-level infrastructure to win.

Now that he’s won, what reason does he have to keep playing nice with them? Do they feel in charge? Do they think that the money they gave him gives them control over him? He does not owe any allegiance to them, their marriage was one of convenience, they had something he needed in order to attain his goal. Now that he’s done that, they no longer have any leverage over him. He will actually become more popular by opposing them than he will if he goes along with them. When the man ran on opposition to the “the establishment,” he was talking about guys like Ryan, like McConnell, like Rinsed. There’s going to be a lot of people who hate him who will still cheer him every time he locks horns with them.

Yeah, there’s gonna be a shitload of damage done, we’ll be dealing with his SCOTUS picks for at least a generation. But the GOP’s gonna find that he’s no more interested in fulfilling their wishlist than they are in letting him rule by fiat.

344
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:45:15am
345
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:45:34am

re: #335 Nyet

Speaking of the rubes, none of them will notice that this election disproved the rigged, NWO nonsense.

That is until Trump himself is a lizard globalist puppet in their eyes, which may be soon, depending on a few things.

I would take it just to see the reaction on his buddy Alex Jones’ face.

NOOOOOOOOO!!! IT’S NOT FAIR IT’S NOT FAIR WAAAAAHHHH
346
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:45:55am

re: #343 Targetpractice

And people say that the GOP in Congress “will control Trump”? They really think Congressional Republicans won’t back down as soon as Trump calls out his followers on them?

347
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:48:08am

re: #343 Targetpractice

Someone better at it than me would find a way to play that, find a way to stroke Trump’s ego. Maybe something like the “Total Restructure Utility Municipality Plan”.

348
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:48:54am

re: #327 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

And if the wall isn’t built he might have some anger. When they did surveys of Donald Trump supporters, they said their most important issue was immigration.

There was even a guy who called into Glenn Becks show and threatened that bad things would happen if Trump did not keep his promise to build the wall.

Of course Trump supporters and the media never discuss all the white European and Canadian people who are here undocumented.

The Wall of Their Dreams cannot exist. An honest-to-god barrier like that would suck away the budgets and engineering capability of Mexico the US if they were enthusiastically cooperating. Like the reverse of a Roman road, it would be a couple 2000 mile turnpikes laid on edge.

349
wheat-dogg  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:49:29am

re: #338 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

As an expat, the positive side is that my usual Holiday Season Homesickness will be considerably milder this year…

I usually head back in the summer vacation time, but this time I may consider diverting to another location, say, Central America, and see if I can lure any family members down that way.

350
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:51:23am

re: #342 ObserverArt

What I learned about Donald Trump and the election results this morning from the first half hour of Morning Joke and NBC Today Show featuring Chris Christie.

Sunshine and Puppy Dogs!

Morning Joke was so taken by Hillary and Barack Obama’s speeches and how powerful and gracious they were. And he was also enamored with Donald’s wanting to bring this country together!

But Joke had to admonish the media because they were not reporting, they were campaigning, or something. I guess he says they all missed Americans that are hurting and how they all came out to vote for Trump.

Then Chris Christie reassured me that all of Trumps campaign rhetoric from birtherism to booting people out and building walls was just politics.

And all the talking heads from Mika and Joe to Savannah and Matt told me that it is now all okay.

I feel so so so much better now.

So, I am going to ignore all the racist crap and all of the reality of Trump’s character.

It was all just politics…all just a thing. Move along…ignore the history of Trump, Christie (now completely exonerated from Bridgegate), Rudy and Newt…they will be making a better America.

Right? Right?

And I am sick now…but I do still like puppy dogs. Not seeing many rainbows.

The 2009 Obama/Dem government saved the country and much of the world. Denying them that credit is a masterpiece of political deceit.

351
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:51:40am

re: #343 Targetpractice

Think of the current relationship between Trump and the GOP as that between Bane and Daggett in The Dark Knight Rises. Trump played along with the GOP after he won the nomination, he made all the right noises that they supported him even if they didn’t like him or his methods. They gladly gave him money and support that they could have found any number of ways to withhold. They effectively bankrolled his GOTV efforts and provided him the state and local-level infrastructure to win.

Now that he’s won, what reason does he have to keep playing nice with them? Do they feel in charge? Do they think that the money they gave him gives them control over him? He does not owe any allegiance to them, their marriage was one of convenience, they had something he needed in order to attain his goal. Now that he’s done that, they no longer have any leverage over him. He will actually become more popular by opposing them than he will if he goes along with them. When the man ran on opposition to the “the establishment,” he was talking about guys like Ryan, like McConnell, like Rinsed. There’s going to be a lot of people who hate him who will still cheer him every time he locks horns with them.

Yeah, there’s gonna be a shitload of damage done, we’ll be dealing with his SCOTUS picks for at least a generation. But the GOP’s gonna find that he’s no more interested in fulfilling their wishlist than they are in letting him rule by fiat.

Yeah, Trump will say, quite rightly, that people voted for HIM, in Wisconsin, in Michigan, in PA, etc. He already said, barely after he won the nomination, that it would be up to Ryan to get along with HIM.

352
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:51:44am

re: #346 Timothy Watson

And people say that the GOP in Congress “will control Trump”? They really think Congressional Republicans won’t back down as soon as Trump calls out his followers on them?

Exactly. And not to Godwin but we’eve heard about peopel who thought they could control someone before.

353
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:51:45am
354
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:54:23am

I know it may sound crazy to say now, but I have the impression that Trump will not have the stomach for social issues. He’ll spend all his focus on economic policy while partitioning off social and foreign policy off to his “best people.” He’s no stomach for fighting those sorts of fights, he doesn’t have any interest into getting into moralistic arguments. No, when it comes to social issues, he’ll end up being a weathervane: If it’s popular, he’ll support it. If polls show he’ll be negatively impacted, he’ll oppose it.

355
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:54:23am

re: #342 ObserverArt

What I learned about Donald Trump and the election results this morning from the first half hour of Morning Joke and NBC Today Show featuring Chris Christie.

Sunshine and Puppy Dogs!

Morning Joke was so taken by Hillary and Barack Obama’s speeches and how powerful and gracious they were. And he was also enamored with Donald’s wanting to bring this country together!

But Joke had to admonish the media because they were not reporting, they were campaigning, or something. I guess he says they all missed Americans that are hurting and how they all came out to vote for Trump.

Then Chris Christie reassured me that all of Trumps campaign rhetoric from birtherism to booting people out and building walls was just politics.

And all the talking heads from Mika and Joe to Savannah and Matt told me that it is now all okay.

I feel so so so much better now.

So, I am going to ignore all the racist crap and all of the reality of Trump’s character.

It was all just politics…all just a thing. Move along…ignore the history of Trump, Christie (now completely exonerated from Bridgegate), Rudy and Newt…they will be making a better America.

Right? Right?

And I am sick now…but I do still like puppy dogs. Not seeing many rainbows.

And the Lock Her Up!!! chants? And the Hillary For Prison tee-shirts? And the other vulgar stuff spewed by the mobs at his rallies?

No biggie. Just politics. Nobody really means that stuff. /

356
Romantic Heretic  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:55:18am
357
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:55:43am

re: #354 Targetpractice

I know it may sound crazy to say now, but I have the impression that Trump will not have the stomach for social issues. He’ll spend all his focus on economic policy while partitioning off social and foreign policy off to his “best people.” He’s no stomach for fighting those sorts of fights, he doesn’t have any interest into getting into moralistic arguments. No, when it comes to social issues, he’ll end up being a weathervane: If it’s popular, he’ll support it. If polls show he’ll be negatively impacted, he’ll oppose it.

He doesn’t care about the social issues, abortion, the gays, etc. He’ll sign off on whatever Pence puts before him. But he’ll be the best friend for gays, the best. He loves women.

/

358
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:56:36am

re: #354 Targetpractice

I know it may sound crazy to say now, but I have the impression that Trump will not have the stomach for social issues. He’ll spend all his focus on economic policy while partitioning off social and foreign policy off to his “best people.” He’s no stomach for fighting those sorts of fights, he doesn’t have any interest into getting into moralistic arguments. No, when it comes to social issues, he’ll end up being a weathervane: If it’s popular, he’ll support it. If polls show he’ll be negatively impacted, he’ll oppose it.

He’ll resurrect Scalia’s corpse and nominate him for SCOTUS. And he’ll figure that’s his contribution to the GOP’s social agenda.

359
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:58:28am

re: #354 Targetpractice

I know it may sound crazy to say now, but I have the impression that Trump will not have the stomach for social issues. …when it comes to social issues, he’ll end up being a weathervane: If it’s popular, he’ll support it. If polls show he’ll be negatively impacted, he’ll oppose it.

If he backs off on legalized weed, he will make himself very popular with a lot of voters. And pot is not the pressing social issue that abortion and LGBT issues are to the Christian fundies.

But he will make sure that the SCOTUS gets some seriously conservative nominees

360
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:59:00am

re: #353 goddamnedfrank

Yeah well now that he has been elected he does *NOT* want economic collapse that is directly linked to him.

361
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:59:10am

re: #358 Sir John Barron

He’ll resurrect Scalia’s corpse and nominate him for SCOTUS. And he’ll figure that’s his contribution to the GOP’s social agenda.

Ayep, I think what we’re going to see over the next four years is the GOP either slipping a lot of social change through as riders/amendments to bills or through the courts. That’s not to say that there will be shitty ideas that he will wrap his arms around despite the political cost, but the man’s ego is such that he will down an entire bill if it means he looks good by comparison to Congress.

362
Nyet  Nov 10, 2016 • 5:59:12am

We’re in a world of shit, that is the present reality.
There is a very long leading to a less shitty place, but it will have to be traveled, whether one likes it or not.
The only question is how much shit will have to be consumed on the way.
Being a purist in a world of shit means you go extinct.
With that in mind, yes, the decisions will have to be made which would have been unacceptable in a purer world, including occasional deals with the King of Feces himself.

363
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:00:26am

Trump’s election pretty much disproves the NWO conspiracy cranks. It’s quite apparent to me Trump himself didn’t expect to win, nobody but the True Believers expected him to win, it was a sloppy and ham fisted campaign and likely presidency.

Humans just aren’t smart and disciplined enough to really pull off a truly powerful and concerted NWO. We’re too sloppy. Is this some kind of solace? No, people still have power and can and does do damage.

But the answer is in front of our face: the NWO isn’t some hidden unknown power. It’s sloppy and unrefined, has a few secrets here and there but is fully known.

364
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:01:51am

re: #362 Nyet

We’re in a world of shit, that is the present reality.
There is a very long leading to a less shitty place, but it will have to be traveled, whether one likes it or not.
The only question is how much shit will have to be consumed on the way.
Being a purist in a world of shit means you go extinct.
With that in mind, yes, the decisions will have to be made which would have been unacceptable in a purer world, including occasional deals with the King of Feces himself.

It’s no big deal—nothing that LW infighting, namecalling, and identity politics can’t fix.

365
Franklin  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:02:34am

OK, I just did a page thingy. Please have a read? A lot of it is obvious to astute LGF’ers but hopefully we can share it out to those looking for more on what they can do and how local politics impacts the big picture.

There are pictures.

Damage Is Done, How Do We Move Forward?

366
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:02:37am
367
Unshaken Defiance  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:04:34am

Second morning I can not bring myself to turn on the tv. I can’t bear to watch. Anyone else?

368
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:04:35am

Trump’s already on a path to having his own Teapot Dome scandals, given who he’s already surrounded himself with - and that was before even running for President. That he’s going to be a scandal-ridden regime is not in doubt. The question will be how badly he will damage the institutions of government, how much the GOP will game the system to press their already considerable advantages, and how Democrats can wage a delaying effort until 2020.

To the last question, it starts now. It starts by identifying and working at the local level to get people realizing that Trump’s an empty suit who has no one’s interests at heart except his own. It means cutting thru the BS and picking strong leaders who can stand up to Trump’s incessant BS.

It means preparing for 2018 and what could be more losses in the Senate (because of the cycle, more D will be in play than this year), and still fighting to maintain and preserve the rights we hold dear.

369
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:04:46am

Well, I was in a coma for 12 hours, after not sleeping at all the night before. Still processing, still trying to see some way out from under this catastrophe.

A lot of people are going to be hurt or killed in the next four years. I’m probably going to wind up living on the street, but at least I won’t be murdered because of my complexion or sexuality—though I might be for the quarters I was saving up to use the shower at the swimming pool.

That said, and I shouldn’t be saying this since I won’t be one of the groups suffering the most, but I think we need the Rump administration to be the biggest shitshow possible. That’s the only way we’ll get the kind of wave election in 2020 that will allow us to do something about reapportionment and redistricting to start trying to turn things around.

Honestly, I expected HRC to win, and I was worried about that in 2020, that Dem fatigue would lead to a wave in the opposite direction. I know this seems like a GOP wave, because the polls were so far off, but turnout was lackluster, Rump actually lost the popular vote, the GOP lost seats in both houses. Remember a Democratic wave came in 2006—before the economic crash and after Bush actually did win the popular vote in 2004.

The press won’t do their job, so we need social media and word-of-mouth to publicize every shitty thing the slime demon tries to do in the next four years. It’s possible even the regressive left might have actually had enough by that time that they’ll get off their asses and vote for a Democratic candidate.

Just some thoughts—probably incoherent because I still feel like somebody brained me with a baseball bat.

370
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:05:12am

re: #367 Unshaken Defiance

Second morning I can not bring myself to turn on the tv. I can’t bear to watch. Anyone else?

I haven’t been able to since I turned off the TV Tuesday night. I’m still numbed by the whole thing.

371
Franklin  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:05:54am

re: #328 Sir John Barron

Heh, wingnut wife of Buffalo Bills sportsball player said Richard Sherman, of Seattle sportsball team, should be castrated for his hit on her husband. Sherman responds:

I suddenly like Richard Sherman.

I do too. I’m a Patriots fan (*ducks*) and I became a huge fan of Sherman’s during that SuperbOwl. His antics are for firing up his teammates and fans, but he’s a solid player with a good heart and a tough competitor.

372
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:05:59am

re: #362 Nyet

And we have moved into the alternative media reality: DT will be able to fail even more biglier than he ever did at business and will be praised for it while scapegoats are sought out to take the blame: minorities, gays ((bankers)), etc…

373
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:08:07am

re: #371 Franklin

I do too. I’m a Patriots fan (*ducks*) and I became a huge fan of Sherman’s during that SuperbOwl. His antics are for firing up his teammates and fans, but he’s a solid player with a good heart and a tough competitor.

He’s definitely not a thug. The way has never been in trouble off the field and in fact does a lot of good. He’s also smart as hell too.

374
GlutenFreeJesus  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:08:14am

We need to start working yesterday to gain back a majority in the House and/or Senate. We can head off Trump and Pence in 2 years.

375
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:09:07am

Tammy Duckworth for POTUS 2020

376
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:09:42am

We have to minimize the damage to the courts, especially since all of those court positions that “didn’t need to be filled under Obama” will suddenly need to be. And the Senate will be an issue with all of the Democrats having to defend, though most of the time, the party in power loses seats in the midterms. We’ll have to work on getting one of the chambers back under Democratic control.

377
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:09:47am

re: #374 GlutenFreeJesus

We need to start working yesterday to gain back a majority in the House and/or Senate. We can head off Trump and Pence in 2 years.

Tammy and Michelle!

378
Franklin  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:10:43am

re: #373 HappyWarrior

He’s definitely not a thug. The way has never been in trouble off the field and in fact does a lot of good. He’s also smart as hell too.

Exactly.

379
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:10:47am

re: #377 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Tammy and Michelle!

Duckworth/Booker 2020

380
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:11:18am

re: #378 Franklin

Exactly.

Richie Incognito, now that’s a thug.

381
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:11:35am

I hate that term though anyhow.

382
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:11:51am

re: #360 The Vicious Babushka

Yeah well now that he has been elected he does *NOT* want economic collapse that is directly linked to him.

At least in his mind he will have options in that regard, can sell it as a consequence of an imminent Iranian nuclear threat that required all out war. Netanyahu might even be eager to back up such assertions in exchange for promises that the Two State Solution is dead and buried. The resulting oil price spike would aid Russia and provide a convenient rationale for putting domestic well fracking on steroids.

383
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:12:03am

re: #374 GlutenFreeJesus

We need to start working yesterday to gain back a majority in the House and/or Senate. We can head off Trump and Pence in 2 years.

Your impulse is correct, but your timing is optimistic.

384
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:12:23am

re: #374 GlutenFreeJesus

We need to start working yesterday to gain back a majority in the House and/or Senate. We can head off Trump and Pence in 2 years.

Lots of people looking to 2020, and that’s not bad. I’m not seeing enough looking to mid terms. Mid Terms.

MID TERMS.

MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS.

Mid terms is what I’m trying to say.

385
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:12:27am

re: #370 HappyWarrior

I haven’t been able to since I turned off the TV Tuesday night. I’m still numbed by the whole thing.

Yesterday was awful. Almost vomited the night of the election. I was supposed to telework but couldn’t even do that. Called out sick. Am staying off Twitter, too. Watched some movies. Listened to some music. Went to my Bible study at church, which I didn’t feel like doing but that went OK. Feel much better today. Got up early, caught an early bus into work. My diet is not going to go well for a few days I’m sure. But I’m starting to cope.

386
Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:14:51am

So like I said yesterday, Tuesday night sucked, hardly slept ttuesday night and was a zombie yesterday. Last night I finally managed to sleep and slept well enough that I was up early enough to hit the gym. Between seeing the protests of this farce and the support of friends here and elsewhere I have to take heart and now figure out how I can help prevent this dumpster fire from becoming a national disaster.

387
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:15:03am

re: #366 BigPapa

FYI the guy who tweeted that is one of the most toxic of the Jill or Bust Jacobins.

388
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:15:33am

re: #384 BigPapa

Lots of people looking to 2020, and that’s not bad. I’m not seeing enough looking to mid terms. Mid Terms.

MID TERMS.

MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMSMID TERMS MID TERMS MID TERMS.

Mid terms is what I’m trying to say.

And local elections. I’m fortunate to have all Dem reps in the state legislature and I’ve donated some in the past to them. The DSCC and DCCC will also get some early money from me. I know not everyone is enamored with those organizations, but I understand the need to recruit the best candidates, even if their ideology isn’t perfect.

389
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:15:46am

I can’t decide which election year was worse, 2016 or 1968. I’m going to go with 1968 because not only was Richard Nixon elected but we had 2 assassinations of iconic leaders.

390
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:16:13am

re: #385 Sir John Barron

Yesterday was awful. Almost vomited the night of the election. I was supposed to telework but couldn’t even do that. Called out sick. Am staying off Twitter, too. Watched some movies. Listened to some music. Went to my Bible study at church, which I didn’t feel like doing but that went OK. Feel much better today. Got up early, caught an early bus into work. My diet is not going to go well for a few days I’m sure. But I’m starting to cope.

I went to work yesterday. I’m feeling better today too. Just still in disbelief. Happy that I got some genealogical documents from Slovenia, maybe I’ll find out Melania’s my cousin! // We need to take lessons from this election. Not play the blame game but learn.

391
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:17:09am

As a reminder, the GOP’s tax plan is more likely than ever to get enacted, now that Trump’s president-elect.

Let’s run down what this means.

Eliminating the estate tax, which would have a ripple effect to the state levels as well. It would be a $19 billion dollar giveaway - annually - just at the federal level.

Expect no effort to plug that revenue loss; it will come in the form of cuts in spending.

Slashing the top tax rate, which would be another massive giveaway to the rich.

Again, watch no effort to plug that revenue loss, which would be in the trillions of dollars over a 10 year period. Again, massive giveaway to the rich, and massive cuts to spending programs.

Who loses? All those angry white people in rural areas because they’ll be shouldering an even greater burden because they too rely on Medicare, Medicaid, SNAP and other govt programs, all of which are used by a majority of white folks. They wont see the expect tax cuts, and they wont see jobs come back, because trickle down doesn’t work. It’s a flood going the other way - the spigot of money and benefits flowing directly into the pockets of those who are most well off.

Tax simplification is a lot more than just cutting the tax rates or reducing brackets - each of which is easy enough to do without causing regressive effects. And the end-goal of the GOP is to starve the federal government’s social contract with the citizens of the nation - actively ignoring the general welfare clause of the US Constitution.

This needs to be repeated from now until the end of time. It isn’t in the general welfare of the nation to eliminate health care for millions of people. It isn’t in the general welfare of the nation to cut taxes so you can slash spending on safety net programs that millions of white people rely on.

The GOP doesn’t care. They want to redistribute wealth - with those least able to afford it shouldering the burden.

And how did this come to pass? Those white folks who were angry about Clinton who sat on their hands and didn’t vote, or decided what could be wrong with a Trump presidency.

You’re going to find out the hard way.

Teapot Dome will be nothing for this cabal.

392
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:17:45am

2nd day on the job, still playing the “sit and wait for the software installation”

393
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:18:24am

re: #387 goddamnedfrank

FYI the guy who tweeted that is one of the most toxic of the Jill or Bust Jacobins.

The Jill/Bernie or Bust types are going to be the first types to gripe when Trump shows his ugly self and how he is in fact vastly different from Clinton and I’ll be tempted to tell them told ya so but you were too busy bellyaching over Bernie to care.

394
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:19:50am

re: #392 The Vicious Babushka

2nd day on the job, still playing the “sit and wait for the software installation”

Another new job? Or just a new contracting site? I thought you had changed jobs a few months ago.

395
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:20:24am

I think what bothers me most though is how little people got out and voted. I mean yes the Trump voters bother me but they did do what they felt was their part in the process, so much of the Obama coalition didn’t bother showing up. I don’t know how President Obama feels today but so much of the coalition that made him President has a bad habit of not showing up at the worst possible times whether that’s 2010, 2014, and 2016.

396
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:20:37am

re: #391 lawhawk

As a reminder, the GOP’s tax plan is more likely than ever to get enacted, now that Trump’s president-elect.

Let’s run down what this means.

Eliminating the estate tax, which would have a ripple effect to the state levels as well. It would be a $19 billion dollar giveaway - annually - just at the federal level.

Expect no effort to plug that revenue loss; it will come in the form of cuts in spending.

Slashing the top tax rate, which would be another massive giveaway to the rich.

Again, watch no effort to plug that revenue loss, which would be in the trillions of dollars over a 10 year period. Again, massive giveaway to the rich, and massive cuts to spending programs.

Who loses? All those angry white people in rural areas because they’ll be shouldering an even greater burden because they too rely on Medicare, Medicaid, SNAP and other govt programs, all of which are used by a majority of white folks. They wont see the expect tax cuts, and they wont see jobs come back, because trickle down doesn’t work. It’s a flood going the other way - the spigot of money and benefits flowing directly into the pockets of those who are most well off.

Tax simplification is a lot more than just cutting the tax rates or reducing brackets - each of which is easy enough to do without causing regressive effects. And the end-goal of the GOP is to starve the federal government’s social contract with the citizens of the nation - actively ignoring the general welfare clause of the US Constitution.

This needs to be repeated from now until the end of time. It isn’t in the general welfare of the nation to eliminate health care for millions of people. It isn’t in the general welfare of the nation to cut taxes so you can slash spending on safety net programs that millions of white people rely on.

The GOP doesn’t care. They want to redistribute wealth - with those least able to afford it shouldering the burden.

And how did this come to pass? Those white folks who were angry about Clinton who sat on their hands and didn’t vote, or decided what could be wrong with a Trump presidency.

You’re going to find out the hard way.

Teapot Dome will be nothing for this cabal.

It will take at least 3 years for my barber to realize how badly we have been fucked.

397
Unshaken Defiance  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:20:44am
398
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:21:18am

re: #394 Sir John Barron

Another new job? Or just a new contracting site? I thought you had changed jobs a few months ago.

RGZVoYllIk2bMuT5Q/L+JCuV9+w4YgcalH/MBenhhJDfPU5M767oW//SQF2X5gYw9X+423UTtLyhWXL+YSf4u/UnJuZOxugc3w/LHl44Oc9UyU5powGTYv4donJbQ7SoT96Z3OUmHrU9OH5i0Ajjyw==

399
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:22:32am

re: #392 The Vicious Babushka

2nd day on the job, still playing the “sit and wait for the software installation”

Lemme guess—Microsoft is somehow involved?//

400
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:23:31am

re: #399 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

Lemme guess—Microsoft is somehow involved?//

How did you guess?

401
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:24:31am

People were talking yesterday about why Democrats have to compromise while Republicans don’t. The reason for that is this: Democrats are the party that knows how government works and how it affects people. Even a little progress on the right issues is better than none. Republicans, on the other hand, win when the government doesn’t work. Democrats opposing every Republican plan means Republicans win. Republicans opposing every Democratic plan means Republicans win.

402
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:24:58am

re: #393 HappyWarrior

The Jill/Bernie or Bust types are going to be the first types to gripe when Trump shows his ugly self and how he is in fact vastly different from Clinton and I’ll be tempted to tell them told ya so but you were too busy bellyaching over Bernie to care.

They’re utterly immune to introspection and shame. One of the main commonalities between both the far left and the alt-right is maintaining a demeanor so disaffected in affect, cynical in outlook and ironically detached from all reality that nothing ever really matters except ideological purity and the need to always argue that they’re always correct.

403
Jayleia  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:26:39am

re: #400 The Vicious Babushka

On the plus side, you can get plenty of important stuff done while waiting for installs…like looking for new recipes and hanging out here.

404
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:26:49am

re: #391 lawhawk

I was just thinking about what the first budget of the Trump administration is going to look like. I imagine that there will be squabbling in the House, but it will be between the emboldened “Freedom Caucus” and the leadership over how deeply into the bone they can cut. The former will say to cut it all, lock stock and barrel, because their orthodoxy says anything that isn’t in the Constitution isn’t legal. But the latter is going to look at massive cuts to entitlements and realize there’s no way they can sell that. Privatization and vouchers are things they’ll have to gradually move the country into, otherwise they’re gonna get crucified at the polls.

I’ll predict right now that Ryan will do what he did in the last two budgets: He’ll use the accounting trick of saying that much of the “cuts” will come from repealing the ACA, that it will “save” money and thus he won’t have to cut from other places. That way he can put off those cuts, if not avoid them altogether, and he’ll thrill the pants off the wingnuts who think the ACA’s repeal will mean a return to status quo antebellum.

405
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:27:03am

re: #402 goddamnedfrank

They’re utterly immune to introspection and shame. One of the main commonalities between both the far left and the alt-right is maintaining a demeanor so disaffected in affect, cynical in outlook and ironically detached from all reality that nothing ever really matters except ideological purity and the need to always argue that they’re always correct.

Yep.

406
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:28:05am

re: #393 HappyWarrior

The Jill/Bernie or Bust types are going to be the first types to gripe when Trump shows his ugly self and how he is in fact vastly different from Clinton and I’ll be tempted to tell them told ya so but you were too busy bellyaching over Bernie to care.

Speaking of which, I wonder when we’ll next see or hear from the Green Party?

The 2020 presidential vote, I’m sure.

Hey guys here we are. Why are you going to vote for the Democrat Corporate Party Whores? Vote for us, vote for purity! No, we haven’t done jacksquat to elect anybody or do anything since 2016, thanks for asking!

//

407
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:28:25am

re: #401 Belafon

People were talking yesterday about why Democrats have to compromise while Republicans don’t. The reason for that is this: Democrats are the party that knows how government works and how it affects people. Even a little progress on the right issues is better than none. Republicans, on the other hand, win when the government doesn’t work. Democrats opposing every Republican plan means Republicans win. Republicans opposing every Democratic plan means Republicans win.

Bad guys win most of the time because they don’t follow the rules/change the rules/make up the rules

408
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:29:26am

re: #404 Targetpractice

I was just thinking about what the first budget of the Trump administration is going to look like. I imagine that there will be squabbling in the House, but it will be between the emboldened “Freedom Caucus” and the leadership over how deeply into the bone they can cut. The former will say to cut it all, lock stock and barrel, because their orthodoxy says anything that isn’t in the Constitution isn’t legal. But the latter is going to look at massive cuts to entitlements and realize there’s no way they can sell that. Privatization and vouchers are things they’ll have to gradually move the country into, otherwise they’re gonna get crucified at the polls.

I’ll predict right now that Ryan will do what he did in the last two budgets: He’ll use the accounting trick of saying that much of the “cuts” will come from repealing the ACA, that it will “save” money and thus he won’t have to cut from other places. That way he can put off those cuts, if not avoid them altogether, and he’ll thrill the pants off the wingnuts who think the ACA’s repeal will mean a return to status quo antebellum.

The tax cuts will produce eleventy percent economic growth to pay for all the cuts.

///

409
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:29:30am

re: #406 Sir John Barron

Speaking of which, I wonder when we’ll next see or hear from the Green Party?

The 2020 presidential vote, I’m sure.

Hey guys here we are. Why are you going to vote for the Democrat Corporate Party Whores? Vote for us, vote for purity! No, we haven’t done jacksquat to elect anybody or do anything since 2016, thanks for asking!

//

I mean as much as the Libertarian Party’s values on economics are totally at odds with my own, I do see much more of an effort for them to get elected locally. The Greens meanwhile appear every four years and just bitch about how the Dems are awful and just as bad if not worse than the Republicans.

410
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:30:41am

re: #401 Belafon

People were talking yesterday about why Democrats have to compromise while Republicans don’t. The reason for that is this: Democrats are the party that knows how government works and how it affects people. Even a little progress on the right issues is better than none. Republicans, on the other hand, win when the government doesn’t work. Democrats opposing every Republican plan means Republicans win. Republicans opposing every Democratic plan means Republicans win.

That is true. When I was upset yesterday, I was talking more about how I didn’t like Trump’s win being linked to economics and a certain Senator once again ignoring the race baiting that was central to his campaign’s appeal.

411
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:30:46am

re: #389 The Vicious Babushka

I can’t decide which election year was worse, 2016 or 1968. I’m going to go with 1968 because not only was Richard Nixon elected but we had 2 assassinations of iconic leaders.

2016 was just suck a shock. I was way too optimistic about Hillary’s chances. We spent too much time making fun of DT’s boorishness and failed to see that he had a clear vision and strategy to get elected, and it played out in his favor.

412
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:31:20am

Got much better sleep than I did Tuesday night, and woke up feeling less sick than I did Wednesday morning.

Doesn’t change the fact that I still woke up in a country that despises me and wants me, my family, and those who look like me and my family on the first truck out and forever gone.

413
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:31:45am

The media continues to claim that Drump was elected because so many “Americans” are economically challenged and felt like they have been left behind…..yet, these same “Americans” re-elected their incumbents and gave the GOP majorities across the board. Drump was correct: the media is completely dishonest.

414
b_sharp  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:32:22am

re: #185 Kragar

[Embedded content]

When I go to retweet with comment this I can’t access the buttons.

415
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:34:02am

re: #343 Targetpractice

Think of the current relationship between Trump and the GOP as that between Bane and Daggett in The Dark Knight Rises. Trump played along with the GOP after he won the nomination, he made all the right noises that they supported him even if they didn’t like him or his methods. They gladly gave him money and support that they could have found any number of ways to withhold. They effectively bankrolled his GOTV efforts and provided him the state and local-level infrastructure to win.

Now that he’s won, what reason does he have to keep playing nice with them? Do they feel in charge? Do they think that the money they gave him gives them control over him? He does not owe any allegiance to them, their marriage was one of convenience, they had something he needed in order to attain his goal. Now that he’s done that, they no longer have any leverage over him. He will actually become more popular by opposing them than he will if he goes along with them. When the man ran on opposition to the “the establishment,” he was talking about guys like Ryan, like McConnell, like Rinsed. There’s going to be a lot of people who hate him who will still cheer him every time he locks horns with them.

Yeah, there’s gonna be a shitload of damage done, we’ll be dealing with his SCOTUS picks for at least a generation. But the GOP’s gonna find that he’s no more interested in fulfilling their wishlist than they are in letting him rule by fiat.

I see a guy on another forum that is a huuuge Tumper and he says Trump will not and cannot be controlled. He thinks he will change Washington because he is not tied to anything and can do what he wants when he wants.

Sounds like he doesn’t want a president…he wants a dictator.

I guess that fits in with what a lot of people that voted Trump in want.

416
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:35:07am

re: #415 ObserverArt

Wrong, Obama was a dictator, see all his Executive Orders which are tyranny Trump is Freedom.

////

417
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:35:13am

re: #410 HappyWarrior

That is true. When I was upset yesterday, I was talking more about how I didn’t like Trump’s win being linked to economics and a certain Senator once again ignoring the race baiting that was central to his campaign’s appeal.

And I will agree, and I hope Democrats (especially certain Independents) don’t think that economic progress solely for whites is progress.

418
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:35:42am

re: #413 Dr. Matt

The media continues to claim that Drump was elected because so many “Americans” are economically challenged and felt like they have been left behind…..yet, these same “Americans” re-elected their incumbents and gave the GOP a majorities across the board. Drump was correct: the media is completely dishonest.

Exactly. If you feel betrayed by Washington, that’s your right but don’t tell me you are and then actually increase control of Congress by the controlling party or even reaffirm that. These people weren’t upset with Washington for economic policy. They don’t like more inclusive social policies and that’s what has driven white working class voters to the GOP’s arms since LBJ’s years. They were all for things like Medicare and all these entitlements when it was pretty much limited to whites only but when LBJ came along and said “No, these are for everyone regardless of race”, that’s when all these blue collar types that have voted for Democrats for years decided “NO BIG GOVERNMENT!”.

419
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:36:00am

re: #413 Dr. Matt

The media continues to claim that Drump was elected because so many “Americans” are economically challenged and felt like they have been left behind…..yet, these same “Americans” re-elected their incumbents and gave the GOP majorities across the board. Drump was correct: the media is completely dishonest.

And now unemployment is like 5%. See how great Trump has already made America?

///

420
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:36:53am

re: #415 ObserverArt

I see a guy on another forum that is a huuuge Tumper and he says Trump will not and cannot be controlled. He thinks he will change Washington because he is not tied to anything and can do what he wants when he wants.

Sounds like he doesn’t want a president…he wants a dictator.

I guess that fits in with what a lot of people that voted Trump in want.

They want a bomb, as long as it doesn’t affect them.

421
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:37:03am
422
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:37:09am

The stock market is also at 18000 which is better than Obama who only got stock market up to 8000. See, Trump already making America Great Again.

///

423
Jayleia  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:37:36am

re: #411 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I disagree. The polls, which always have some outliers failed to indicate that ALL of them were outliers this year.

Yes, we spent lots of time laughing because we had no real indication that there was anything to worry about.

I also disagree that he had a real vision or strategy, other than a populism based off of pure malice.

It only played out in his favor, because there are fewer better angels of our nature than we thought there were.

424
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:37:39am

Which is more important as a top story?

This:
The Latest: Barron Trump youngest president son since JFK Jr
The Latest on the U.S. presidential transition (all times EST): 8:55 a.m. When President-elect Donald Trump
23 min ago

Or:

The Russians helped Trump win. Guess who’s Putin’s bitch now. Forget hostile takeover. That was a friendly sale.

425
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:37:41am

re: #395 HappyWarrior

Yeah, looking at the results, the big problem is that many Democrats simply did not turnout.

Hopefully, 4 years from now will be different.

426
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:38:08am

Trump has already gotten gas prices down to $2.40. America Made Great Again.

///

427
goddamnedfrank  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:38:38am

re: #401 Belafon

People were talking yesterday about why Democrats have to compromise while Republicans don’t. The reason for that is this: Democrats are the party that knows how government works and how it affects people. Even a little progress on the right issues is better than none. Republicans, on the other hand, win when the government doesn’t work. Democrats opposing every Republican plan means Republicans win. Republicans opposing every Democratic plan means Republicans win.

It’s related to the Paradox of Tolerance. Republicans don’t claim to be a tolerant Party and in fact campaign near constantly against tolerance, although in the past they were far more apt to sugar coat it in terms like traditional cultural and religious values. Now they’re basically running on pure hate, and it’s working. Democrats who do value tolerance are perceived by the shit faced bullies of the world as needing to therefore tolerate intolerance or risk being called out for hypocrisy.

428
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:39:03am

re: #424 lawhawk

Which is more important as a top story?

This:
The Latest: Barron Trump youngest president son since JFK Jr
The Latest on the U.S. presidential transition (all times EST): 8:55 a.m. When President-elect Donald Trump
23 min ago

Or:

[Embedded content]

The Russians helped Trump win. Guess who’s Putin’s bitch now. Forget hostile takeover. That was a friendly sale.

That should horrify people but hey isn’t little Barron just the cutest? // Not trying to pick on the kid mind you but more the media’s tendency to focus on things like that.

429
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:39:22am

re: #423 Jayleia

I disagree. The polls, which always have some outliers failed to indicate that ALL of them were outliers this year.

Yes, we spent lots of time laughing because we had no real indication that there was anything to worry about.

I also disagree that he had a real vision or strategy, other than a populism based off of pure malice.

It only played out in his favor, because there are fewer better angels of our nature than we thought there were.

Remember he lost the popular vote.

430
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:40:00am

re: #421 Myron Falwell (no relation)

[Embedded content]

Is Ron Fournier still yapping?

431
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:40:16am

re: #425 Ziggy_TARDIS

Yeah, looking at the results, the big problem is that many Democrats simply did not turnout.

Hopefully, 4 years from now will be different.

We can’t take it for granted that they will in four years. I still remember 2004. I thought no way would Bush win and sure enough. Crazy to think that Trump won by a bigger EV margin than Bush did in 2000 though granted he wasn’t as close to Bush was to Gore in popular vote. This feels like 2000 all over again.

432
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:40:46am

re: #423 Jayleia

I disagree. The polls, which always have some outliers failed to indicate that ALL of them were outliers this year.

Yes, we spent lots of time laughing because we had no real indication that there was anything to worry about.

I also disagree that he had a real vision or strategy, other than a populism based off of pure malice.

It only played out in his favor, because there are fewer better angels of our nature than we thought there were.

I also call bullshit on Clinton not having an economic vision at all to appeal to those feeling like they were struggling. Clinton pretty much adapted as much as she could of Bernie’s platform wholesale. It was drowned out by Trumps xenophobia and buffoonish pie-in-the-sky proclamations, and EMAILGAZHILEAKS!

Clinton had a fucking actual platform, and no one did shit to report on it. All the oxygen was sucked up by insinuating that Clinton was the most supercorrupt mega-Satan in the history of forever, and making a reality show villain out of Trump. Unfortunately, our country deifies assholes.

433
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:41:40am

re: #432 Kryptik: Just Done With It.

I also call bullshit on Clinton not having an economic vision at all to appeal to those feeling like they were struggling. Clinton pretty much adapted as much as she could of Bernie’s platform wholesale. It was drowned out by Trumps xenophobia and buffoonish pie-in-the-sky proclamations, and EMAILGAZHILEAKS!

Clinton had a fucking actual platform, and no one did shit to report on it. All the oxygen was sucked up by insinuating that Clinton was the most supercorrupt mega-Satan in the history of forever, and making a reality show villain out of Trump. Unfortunately, our country deifies assholes.

She talked a lot about making education more affordable for all (Bernie’s big goal) and the BoBers shat on her because she wasn’t Bernie.

434
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:42:22am

re: #425 Ziggy_TARDIS

Yeah, looking at the results, the big problem is that many Democrats simply did not turnout.

Hopefully, 4 years from now will be different.

And yet on election day and even before we were fed reports about how great turnout was and how many Hispanics were turning out to vote, blah blah blah. It’s the same thing every cycle. And there were plenty of GOTV efforts. But sometimes you do all you can or all you think you can, and it still isn’t enough. Sometimes there’s just a zeitgeist that is against us. Things are very difficult to control.

435
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:43:03am

re: #430 Sir John Barron

Is Ron Fournier still yapping?

Is there still a sun in the sky?

436
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:43:25am

Economic anxiety? Another good jobs report.

northjersey.com

The Labor Department says weekly applications for jobless benefits fell 11,000 to a seasonally adjusted 254,000. That’s down from a three-month high in the previous week. The four-week average, a less volatile measure, ticked up 1,750 to 259,750.

Applications, which are a proxy for layoffs, have remained below 300,000 for 88 straight weeks, the longest streak since 1970. Businesses appear to be confident enough in their future prospects to maintain their staffs. And when layoffs are so low, companies typically step up hiring. A separate report earlier this week showed layoffs near record-low levels.

IOW, what economic anxiety? And that will form the basis of Trump doing nothing on the jobs front. Because in reality there’s nothing for him to do. He can promise coal mine jobs all he wants, but the market has already decided those jobs aren’t needed - natural gas has seen to that. So too has solar and alt-energy.

So, if the coal miners want jobs, they need to look to those industries, or to health care and high tech, as Pittsburgh did and Rochester and Buffalo are doing.

437
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:44:26am

re: #433 HappyWarrior

She talked a lot about making education more affordable for all (Bernie’s big goal) and the BoBers shat on her because she wasn’t Bernie.

I think HRC should have run more explicitly on an Obama Administration record. That record was pretty good.

But Trump and the media managed to convince everyone the country was a hell-hole. Hillary tried to push back on that somewhat, but for the most part the message got muddled.

438
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:44:38am

re: #355 Sir John Barron

And the Lock Her Up!!! chants? And the Hillary For Prison tee-shirts? And the other vulgar stuff spewed by the mobs at his rallies?

No biggie. Just politics. Nobody really means that stuff. /

Matt Lauer actually asked Christie about that kind of thing, specifically about trying her for the emails. Christie blew it all off as just politics. It’s a new day.

By the way, Christie looks like he has found a new life. The last few times I’ve seen him he looked all beat down. Now, back to that positive Christie you can’t turn your back on for fear of stabbing. Trump energy baby!

439
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:45:36am

re: #436 lawhawk

Economic anxiety? Another good jobs report.

northjersey.com

IOW, what economic anxiety? And that will form the basis of Trump doing nothing on the jobs front. Because in reality there’s nothing for him to do. He can promise coal mine jobs all he wants, but the market has already decided those jobs aren’t needed - natural gas has seen to that. So too has solar and alt-energy.

So, if the coal miners want jobs, they need to look to those industries, or to health care and high tech, as Pittsburgh did and Rochester and Buffalo are doing.

I’ve gotten at it before but I feel bad for the miners that have lost their jobs but economies transition. Steel eventually replaced Iron in Pittsburgh. And Pittsburgh is as you get at a health care and high tech center.

440
Jayleia  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:46:02am

re: #429 Belafon

OK, also that the better angels of our nature happened to be all concentrated in the wrong states this time around.

Trying to keep laughing here…

And he’s not even in office yet
441
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:46:06am

re: #438 ObserverArt

Matt Lauer actually asked Christie about that kind of thing, specifically about trying her for the emails. Christie blew it all off as just politics. It’s a new day.

By the way, Christie looks like he has found a new life. The last few times I’ve seen him he looked all beat down. Now, back to that positive Christie you can’t turn your back on for fear of stabbing. Trump energy baby!

Christie’s a great guy. Had some bad staff, probably Democrats, who did some bad stuff. But everyone loves Chris Christie, he’s a real man of the people.

///

442
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:47:02am

re: #441 Sir John Barron

Christie’s a great guy. Had some bad staff, probably Democrats, who did some bad stuff. But everyone loves Chris Christie, he’s a real man of the people.

///

I wonder what position Trump has in mind for Christie. Seems that Newt and Rudy are getting the big ones. I thought Christie would be his AG designatee. Maybe he has him in mind for the Supreme Court vacancy?

443
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:47:50am

Oh, and I’m seeing some reports about how Clinton didn’t turn out blacks in the same percentage as Obama did in 2012.

Nope. The blame doesn’t fall on them, or on Latinos and other minorities who did vote for Clinton.

It falls on the white middle class people who were insulated from the immediate repercussions of not voting. They decided that either they’d not vote, believe the claptrap about the emails and indictments, or that Trump was better than Clinton, which objectively is bunk, but there it is.

The falloff in voting is most severe in states that enacted voter restrictions in time for 2016, and that too has a significant role in why Clinton lost.

What else could Clinton have done, when she was facing a hostile media (who played MBF at every opportunity), a FBI that played games with emails, the Putin-istas, Wikileaks, and Bernie/Stein-bots who wanted ideological purity and refused to consider the consequences (or if they did, decided it wouldn’t affect them).

444
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:48:26am

re: #442 HappyWarrior

I wonder what position Trump has in mind for Christie. Seems that Newt and Rudy are getting the big ones. I thought Christie would be his AG designatee. Maybe he has him in mind for the Supreme Court vacancy?

I can’t see Newt at State. Newt’s a joke at this point. But so is anyone else Rump might appoint. Like mustache Bolton.

445
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:49:50am

re: #444 Sir John Barron

I can’t see Newt at State. Newt’s a joke at this point. But so is anyone else Rump might appoint. Like mustache Bolton.

I thought it was pretty much more or less official from the horse’s mouth that Newt was Trump’s pick for SoS.

446
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:50:34am

re: #437 Sir John Barron

I think HRC should have run more explicitly on an Obama Administration record. That record was pretty good.

But Trump and the media managed to convince everyone the country was a hell-hole. Hillary tried to push back on that somewhat, but for the most part the message got muddled.

In 2008 Obama had a Democratic Congress. In 2010, the Democrats ran from Obama; they lost the House. In 2012, the Democrats ran from Obama, and continued hemorrhaging seats in Congress. In 2014, they ran from Obama, and the damage got even worse.

In 2016, Clinton ran on what was essentially an Obama record/platform that was even more explicit in racial/ethnic/gender equality - and the nation rejected it (by voting for Trump through the heartland) and people in battleground states sitting on their hands because feels.

447
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:50:54am

re: #443 lawhawk

Oh, and I’m seeing some reports about how Clinton didn’t turn out blacks in the same percentage as Obama did in 2012.

Nope. The blame doesn’t fall on them, or on Latinos and other minorities who did vote for Clinton.

It falls on the white middle class people who were insulated from the immediate repercussions of not voting. They decided that either they’d not vote, believe the claptrap about the emails and indictments, or that Trump was better than Clinton, which objectively is bunk, but there it is.

The falloff in voting is most severe in states that enacted voter restrictions in time for 2016, and that too has a significant role in why Clinton lost.

What else could Clinton have done, when she was facing a hostile media (who played MBF at every opportunity), a FBI that played games with emails, the Putin-istas, Wikileaks, and Bernie/Stein-bots who wanted ideological purity and refused to consider the consequences (or if they did, decided it wouldn’t affect them).

Especially with the VRA weakened. But yes I blame a lot of it on people whose economic conditions actually have improved since Obama became President but have “economic anxiety.”

448
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:51:53am

re: #367 Unshaken Defiance

Second morning I can not bring myself to turn on the tv. I can’t bear to watch. Anyone else?

Sports or crime TV for me…or YouTube music videos while I work.

I dipped my toe into Morning Joke and an hour of The Today Show just to see what they had to say…pretty much as expected.

Crime TV is good because it prepares me for the next four years. /

449
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:52:16am

Brenda Lawrence easily won re-election as Congressional Representative for Michigan 14th District.

450
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:53:11am

What pisses me off is we’re hearing about how we should understand Trump’s voters. I’m sorry but do these people care or want to hear about my concerns?

451
Franklin  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:53:25am

IF THIS DOESN’T SCARE THE SHIT OUT OF YOU I DON’T KNOW WHAT WILL.

452
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:53:56am

re: #448 ObserverArt

Sports or crime TV for me…or YouTube music videos while I work.

I dipped my toe into Morning Joke and an hour of The Today Show just to see what they had to say…pretty much as expected.

Crime TV is good because it prepares me for the next four years. /

Last night’s “South Park” kind of sucked because Matt and Trey had to retrofit it at the last minute. They were counting on a Clinton victory as part of their story arc. So now Garrison is President and he will go forward with his campaign promise to fuck everybody to death.

453
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:54:02am

re: #437 Sir John Barron

I think HRC should have run more explicitly on an Obama Administration record. That record was pretty good.

But Trump and the media managed to convince everyone the country was a hell-hole. Hillary tried to push back on that somewhat, but for the most part the message got muddled.

She did pretty much run on Obama’s record. What we ran into was Democratic whites, comfortable with their standard of living, deciding nothing needed to change. Somehow, that meant they didn’t have to vote rather than making sure she got into office.

454
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:55:04am

re: #436 lawhawk

Economic anxiety? Another good jobs report.

northjersey.com

IOW, what economic anxiety? And that will form the basis of Trump doing nothing on the jobs front. Because in reality there’s nothing for him to do. He can promise coal mine jobs all he wants, but the market has already decided those jobs aren’t needed - natural gas has seen to that. So too has solar and alt-energy.

So, if the coal miners want jobs, they need to look to those industries, or to health care and high tech, as Pittsburgh did and Rochester and Buffalo are doing.

Trump’s not bringing those jobs back. Nor is he going to be able to force companies to stay in the US, not when he’s cutting their taxes in ways that will make it more advantageous for them to outsource. Classifying China as a currency manipulator and starting trade wars is not going to bring back jobs, it’s going to scare off foreign companies who might see appeal in setting up shop in the US. The short-fingered vulgarian is only going to be able to get so far with threats and bullying before he faces blowback. This is not the 1950s and America is not the only game in town anymore.

455
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:55:26am

re: #451 Franklin

IF THIS DOESN’T SCARE THE SHIT OUT OF YOU I DON’T KNOW WHAT WILL.

[Embedded content]

Oh fuck you Sheriff Clarke, people do have a right to protest. It’s called the first amendment. Sigh, this is what’s frustrating. You seem to get one wingnut asshole out and another is eager to take his place. Sheriff Joe is gone- good riddance- but Sheriff Clarke has pretty much taken his place as America’s big metro area Sheriff that has a hard on for power.

456
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:55:47am

re: #451 Franklin

IF THIS DOESN’T SCARE THE SHIT OUT OF YOU I DON’T KNOW WHAT WILL.

The will of the people was Clinton based on popular vote. The will of a two century old anachronism is what has given us President Trump.

457
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:56:39am

Trump and the Republicans already know how they are going to spin any financial calamity. A few months ago his son said that once his Dad is President there will probably be a recession he will have to deal with in a few years that was brought about by the Obama administration.

458
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:57:31am

re: #457 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

Trump and the Republicans already know how they are going to spin any financial calamity. A few months ago his son said that once his Dad is President there will probably be a recession he will have to deal with in a few years that was brought about by the Obama administration.

Rich coming from the same crowd who cried STOP BLAMING BUSH when Obama actually did inherit a bad situation.

459
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:57:48am

VzRnCy8VXAjwlvA++a20iHtMDoVF9eOok3/AnNn5hfxo+d8f5t0H7kDrFnlJzgvu77uR77N64ybUS64IIUn5go5gFasgC2a2vMPjfn1MXEkCGDY2uxcC0HgOWcyHbGD63kBKXjQ/YQ6cjP8KJr/R3TngRYd01u+EdIRaEafz8d40ErlFxr3YVRszHrfHCYTvpgbS9IaaFaLg6yxgAApmQG6zpgOZ+yTazAmj5doWhnON6Xp9HRt9iqapjYZwr1NlATzqnkmPJVCjPDvcOQPhYdJZgQ2RnOEXndZyYRbeBxq7QAu8xZJ8vG1mGCsCxz//gVPZ8p5rQvMenwdPZ1mjr97Ew9QUBgn5Rkw84rU3t+8j6A9LRgu+7RBP7DRXSvLGudw2pPY3jnNvZpD9rfKzyjp3cWyQ454Vrwp/n1AVns8iI+wVFnkx2ScVmWdEXwtxMXBJuiXtcQtPer6ZjYNG+Q==

460
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:58:03am

re: #456 Belafon

The will of the people was Clinton based on popular vote. The will of a two century old anachronism is what has given us President Trump.

I wouldn’t expect Sheriff Asshole to understand that nuance.

461
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:58:36am

re: #453 Belafon

She did pretty much run on Obama’s record. What we ran into was Democratic whites, comfortable with their standard of living, deciding nothing needed to change. Somehow, that meant they didn’t have to vote rather than making sure she got into office.

Wait for better data. It’s going to take a couple weeks to collect and analyse.

462
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:59:10am

re: #451 Franklin

IF THIS DOESN’T SCARE THE SHIT OUT OF YOU I DON’T KNOW WHAT WILL.

[Embedded content]

Where was this shit when the Tea Party jackholes were being public nuisances?

463
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:59:19am

re: #457 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

Trump and the Republicans already know how they are going to spin any financial calamity. A few months ago his son said that once his Dad is President there will probably be a recession he will have to deal with in a few years that was brought about by the Obama administration.

It’s like I said Election Night when the market was plunging, any downturn from here on out will be spun as a “correction” now that the federal government isn’t artificially inflating the economy and cooking the books. The stock market was never really that high, unemployment was always really over 6%, and the economy was struggling to keep above water. But now Trump’s in charge and he’s gonna return America to unprecedented prosperity. And if he doesn’t, well, Obama’s to blame.

464
Teukka  Nov 10, 2016 • 6:59:22am

re: #456 Belafon

The will of the people was Clinton based on popular vote. The will of a two century old anachronism is what has given us President Trump.

Exactly why Finland abolished electoral colleges.

465
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:00:17am

re: #459 The Vicious Babushka

Obviously, you should purge them from your FB.

466
makeitstop  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:00:54am

re: #367 Unshaken Defiance

Second morning I can not bring myself to turn on the tv. I can’t bear to watch. Anyone else?

I haven’t watched cable news in better than 11 years, so I’m good.

I’d rather get my info here and on sites I can trust. The cable news spin is hypnotic, and I refuse to subject myself to it.

467
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:02:08am

re: #389 The Vicious Babushka

I can’t decide which election year was worse, 2016 or 1968. I’m going to go with 1968 because not only was Richard Nixon elected but we had 2 assassinations of iconic leaders.

I asked LGF members last evening, but I don’t think it was ever answered.

Do you remember people taking to the street in protest one day after Nixon was elected? I know we had all the turmoil in the Democratic convention.

Actually I asked if anyone knew of any protests after an election like we saw last night?

468
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:02:11am

re: #434 Sir John Barron

It’s likely the Republicans are going to cause an economic tire fire. They are so clueless on how the economy works, they are going to cause it to crash and burn. Quickly.

469
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:02:19am

re: #461 Decatur Deb

Wait for better data. It’s going to take a couple weeks to collect and analyse.

I’m partially talking about the 46% of the country that did not vote. But, the absolute Democratic numbers are down as well.

470
Teukka  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:02:40am
471
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:06:39am

re: #470 Teukka

I’m mulling over what to do if things get bad for Muslims in the US.

472
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:08:02am

re: #450 HappyWarrior

What pisses me off is we’re hearing about how we should understand Trump’s voters. I’m sorry but do these people care or want to hear about my concerns?

You want to co-opt them or defeat them. Either way, we have to fucking understand them.

473
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:08:06am

re: #471 Ziggy_TARDIS

I’m mulling over what to do if things get bad for Muslims in the US.

Did you see that Trump’s Muslim ban has disappeared?

While I understand the urge to flee (right now it’s really strong with me here in Texas to flee to somewhere a bit friendlier) there are all of these people who would be left behind that need as many allies as possible.

474
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:08:06am

re: #467 ObserverArt

I asked LGF members last evening, but I don’t think it was ever answered.

Do you remember people taking to the street in protest one day after Nixon was elected? I know we had all the turmoil in the Democratic convention.

Actually I asked if anyone knew of any protests after an election like we saw last night?

There were MAJOR PROTESTS in 1968 but they occurred after the assassinations of MLK & RFK. Also, the voting age was 21. Lots of anger from 18-20 year olds being old enough to fight but not old enough to vote.

475
Stephen T.  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:09:30am

re: #409 HappyWarrior

I mean as much as the Libertarian Party’s values on economics are totally at odds with my own, I do see much more of an effort for them to get elected locally. The Greens meanwhile appear every four years and just bitch about how the Dems are awful and just as bad if not worse than the Republicans.

I’ve never seen a Libertarian on a ticket other than a Presidential candidate. But I have seen Greens on State, County and Local tickets.

They didn’t win there, either.

476
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:09:51am

re: #472 Decatur Deb

You want to co-opt them or defeat them. Either way, we have to fucking understand them.

I would love to figure out a way to make people in South Dakota understand that, as long as they keep thinking they are punishing minorities, they are the ones who are going to get hurt.

477
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:10:01am

re: #467 ObserverArt

I asked LGF members last evening, but I don’t think it was ever answered.

Do you remember people taking to the street in protest one day after Nixon was elected? I know we had all the turmoil in the Democratic convention.

Actually I asked if anyone knew of any protests after an election like we saw last night?

No. I was a senior in High School when Nixon was elected—a lot of us wore black armbands the next day.

478
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:10:30am

re: #387 goddamnedfrank

FYI the guy who tweeted that is one of the most toxic of the Jill or Bust Jacobins.

Yeah, I’ve looked at the Unfollow button more than once with him. But I feel the need to stay connected to some voices even if I don’t agree with them or they say some WTF shit. He’s in that category.

479
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:11:33am

re: #475 Stephen T.

I’ve never seen a Libertarian on a ticket other than a Presidential candidate. But I have seen Greens on State, County and Local tickets.

They didn’t win there, either.

Here in Rockwall, the only party that had a competitor against the Republican for the US House was the Libertarian party. I voted for that person. As much as Anymouse likes to complain about Democrats not visiting his area, I see too many blanks here in Texas as well.

480
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:11:54am

re: #472 Decatur Deb

You want to co-opt them or defeat them. Either way, we have to fucking understand them.

I guess what I’m saying is this. They certainly aren’t going to take time to understand why you or I voted for Clinton. Why should I fall for the economic anxiety bs excuse?

481
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:12:00am

Obama will likely be leaving office with the third highest approval rating and the opposing party will have the house, senate, and WH. How the fuck does that happen?

*rhetorical question*

482
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:12:23am

re: #475 Stephen T.

I’ve never seen a Libertarian on a ticket other than a Presidential candidate. But I have seen Greens on State, County and Local tickets.

They didn’t win there, either.

I guess it depends where you are. They are non-existent here in Va.

483
BigPapa  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:12:36am

re: #477 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

No. I was a senior in High School when Nixon was elected—a lot of us wore black armbands the next day.

I was just wondering earlier how this candidate and election feels to older voters than me. This is the first election where I was very invested in the vote and first shell shocker to me personally. But how does it compare to the Bushes, Reagan, Nixon?

I don’t thing Trump is anywhere close to them. But I wanted somebody’s opinion that lived it.

484
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:12:58am

re: #481 Dr. Matt

Obama will likely be leaving office with the third highest approval rating and the opposing party will have the house, senate, and WH. How the fuck does that happen?

*rhetorical question*

I know. I just don’t fucking get it.

485
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:13:33am

re: #476 Belafon

I would love to figure out a way to make people in South Dakota understand that, as long as they keep thinking they are punishing minorities, they are the ones who are going to get hurt.

We have powerful tools of education, esp film and music. Time for a remake of Grapes of Wrath, with kick-ass CGI monsters. OTOH, sloppy undisciplined art and literature fucks us up. “Piss Christ” was worth 500,000 Trump votes when the RW media was done with it.

486
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:14:49am

re: #474 The Vicious Babushka

There were MAJOR PROTESTS in 1968 but they occurred after the assassinations of MLK & RFK. Also, the voting age was 21. Lots of anger from 18-20 year olds being old enough to fight but not old enough to vote.

What a life! I was too young (18) to vote to legalize abortion in 1970—“Don’t labor under a misconception; Vote for Proposition 20!”—and now I’ve lived long enough to see a government elected that will recriminalize it nationwide.

487
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:14:59am

re: #484 HappyWarrior

I know. I just don’t fucking get it.

I’ve been saying that over and over for the last 36 hours.

488
GlutenFreeJesus  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:15:57am

re: #383 Decatur Deb

Your impulse is correct, but your timing is optimistic.

While true, it’s the only chance we’ve got.

489
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:16:20am

re: #480 HappyWarrior

I guess what I’m saying is this. They certainly aren’t going to take time to understand why you or I voted for Clinton. Why should I fall for the economic anxiety bs excuse?

Understanding them means seeing through the BS. We need to get a grasp on what their real mix of motives is, fix what we can, and ignore only the most hopeless of the Irredeemables.

490
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:16:53am

re: #481 Dr. Matt

Obama will likely be leaving office with the third highest approval rating and the opposing party will have the house, senate, and WH. How the fuck does that happen?

*rhetorical question*

Because when you ease economic pressures on people, you reveal the cultural and economic fractures. When a person isn’t worried about finding a job, making a mortgage payment, or looking after his health, he has a lot of time to sit around and think about how much better “those people” have it than he does.

491
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:17:06am

re: #445 HappyWarrior

I thought it was pretty much more or less official from the horse’s mouth that Newt was Trump’s pick for SoS.

Seems a weird place for him. He’ll have to talk to people, strangers with weird accents. Why’d he want to do that?

/

492
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:17:35am

re: #489 Decatur Deb

Understanding them means seeing through the BS. We need to get a grasp on what their real mix of motives is, fix what we can, and ignore only the most Irredeemables.

Okay, fair enough understand what you’re saying now.

493
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:17:46am

re: #481 Dr. Matt

Obama will likely be leaving office with the third highest approval rating and the opposing party will have the house, senate, and WH. How the fuck does that happen?

*rhetorical question*

Voter apathy. Misogyny. White nationalism (supremacy). Bigotry. Racism.

Pu pu platter of crazy.

People are going to look back on Obama’s term in office and wonder WTF were people thinking in choosing Trump. Had they gotten so soft and fearful that they elected a Twitter troll as president who is wholly incapable of empathy.

It’s inevitable for a president to deal with a crisis and death of American citizens, whether in a mass shooting, a terror attack, etc., or NASA astronauts dying on a mission, etc. How Trump addresses the nation in those circumstances will be telling.

Until now, we’ve seen zero capacity to empathize. Addressing the nation in those situations requires empathy.

We shall see.

494
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:18:20am

re: #488 GlutenFreeJesus

While true, it’s the only chance we’ve got.

More likely 2020, and then only if he screws up unmistakably. Get ready for a long seige.

495
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:18:42am

re: #491 Sir John Barron

Seems a weird place for him. He’ll have to talk to people, strangers with weird accents. Why’d he want to do that?

/

It does amuse me that the Drain the Swamp campaign brought back two creatures that were in the swamp when I was an infant. Hell Newt got elected to Congress for the first time nearly 40 years ago.

496
Teukka  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:18:58am

Noted from my FB feed:
“I just love that Trump lost Orange County (CA).”

Even a dark cloud has a silver lining, albeit a hair thin one.

497
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:20:12am

re: #493 lawhawk

Voter apathy. Misogyny. White nationalism (supremacy). Bigotry. Racism.

Pu pu platter of crazy.

People are going to look back on Obama’s term in office and wonder WTF were people thinking in choosing Trump. Had they gotten so soft and fearful that they elected a Twitter troll as president who is wholly incapable of empathy.

It’s inevitable for a president to deal with a crisis and death of American citizens, whether in a mass shooting, a terror attack, etc., or NASA astronauts dying on a mission, etc. How Trump addresses the nation in those circumstances will be telling.

Until now, we’ve seen zero capacity to empathize. Addressing the nation in those situations requires empathy.

We shall see.

Also think it’s just very difficult for a party to win a third straight term. For most of this century anyway. Since FDR-Truman, only Reagan-Bush went 3 straight terms.

498
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:20:31am

re: #483 BigPapa

I was just wondering earlier how this candidate and election feels to older voters than me. This is the first election where I was very invested in the vote and first shell shocker to me personally. But how does it compare to the Bushes, Reagan, Nixon?

I don’t thing Trump is anywhere close to them. But I wanted somebody’s opinion that lived it.

I was more upset when Ronald Fucking Reagan got elected—that’s when I started considering the US a failed state. The stolen election of 2000—and to be honest 2004, although Kerry would then be one of those EV winners/PV losers—only confirmed that feeling.

I remember how happy I was on election night 1992 and 2008—but this country always manages to come back and break my heart.

499
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:20:37am

re: #496 Teukka

Noted from my FB feed:
“I just love that Trump lost Orange County (CA).”

Even a dark cloud has a silver lining, albeit a hair thin one.

Clinton actually won my county by a bigger margin than Obama did. Nevada and New Mexico and Colorado appear to be becoming firmly blue on the Presidential level. The thing is though, the upper Midwest has become more competitive. The challenge is going to be appealing to voters in both regions.

500
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:20:45am

re: #495 HappyWarrior

It does amuse me that the Drain the Swamp campaign brought back two creatures that were in the swamp when I was an infant. Hell Newt got elected to Congress for the first time nearly 40 years ago.

The Drain the Swamp bullshit was never founded on anything. What new faces actually contributed to this shit? Trump doesn’t count because he’s been a known fucking factor for decades, and ran four fucking years ago as well. What actual ‘outsiders’ were brought to the table here?

501
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:21:29am

re: #495 HappyWarrior

It does amuse me that the Drain the Swamp campaign brought back two creatures that were in the swamp when I was an infant. Hell Newt got elected to Congress for the first time nearly 40 years ago.

And why would Newt want to travel anywhere? Like out of the country?

/

502
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:21:31am

re: #487 Dr. Matt

Too many people did not vote. End of story.

503
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:22:01am

re: #500 Kryptik in Mourning

The Drain the Swamp bullshit was never founded on anything. What new faces actually contributed to this shit? Trump doesn’t count because he’s been a known fucking factor for decades, and ran four fucking years ago as well. What actual ‘outsiders’ were brought to the table here?

Only one that immediately comes to mind is Steve Bannon. And let that scary thought simmer in peoples minds: White House Chief of Staff Steve Bannon.

504
Weaselone  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:22:14am

re: #495 HappyWarrior

It does amuse me that the Drain the Swamp campaign brought back two creatures that were in the swamp when I was an infant. Hell Newt got elected to Congress for the first time nearly 40 years ago.

Are we sure they were saying “Drain the Swamp” and not “Dredge the Swamp”? Or is this just a case of draining the swamp to uncover all the Republican trash that would better have been left covered?

505
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:22:38am

re: #497 Sir John Barron

Also think it’s just very difficult for a party to win a third straight term. For most of this century anyway. Since FDR-Truman, only Reagan-Bush went 3 straight terms.

You know, I was thinking about that too granted when thinking about 2020 which I think will be very important as well since it’s going to be a census year and I just had a terrifying thought that party fatigue alone may propel the GOP to the WH that year. Maybe a small lining of this election is we don’t have to worry about that and Republicans again being able to control legislatures through Gerrymandering. That said, it doesn’t change any of my worries for the immediate next four years with Trump.

506
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:22:44am

re: #499 HappyWarrior

Clinton actually won my county by a bigger margin than Obama did. Nevada and New Mexico and Colorado appear to be becoming firmly blue on the Presidential level. The thing is though, the upper Midwest has become more competitive. The challenge is going to be appealing to voters in both regions.

Yup. Can’t lose Wisconsin, Michigan, PA and NH. Just can’t. Did Clinton win Minnesota? I don’t think I ever saw it called.

507
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:23:06am

How they voted in NYC (a map). Unsurprisingly, Staten Island voted overwhelmingly for Trump. There’s a sliver of Brooklyn that voted Trump as well, including where I used to live, plus Bay Ridge/Dyker Heights. There’s a few spots in Queens and Bronx (Whitestone/Throgs Neck, Middle Village, Ridgewood) that voted Trump as well, but Trump’s own backyard was solidly Clinton country.

The areas that voted Trump were predominantly white. And well off.

508
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:23:17am

re: #503 Targetpractice

Only one that immediately comes to mind is Steve Bannon. And let that scary thought simmer in peoples minds: White House Chief of Staff Steve Bannon.

But hey, this means Breitbart will get all those juicy White House exclusives now! //

509
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:23:31am

re: #503 Targetpractice

Only one that immediately comes to mind is Steve Bannon. And let that scary thought simmer in peoples minds: White House Chief of Staff Steve Bannon.

A truly awful person. One of the worst.

510
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:24:08am

re: #498 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

I was more upset when Ronald Fucking Reagan got elected—that’s when I started considering the US a failed state. The stolen election of 2000—and to be honest 2004, although Kerry would then be one of those EV winners/PV losers—only confirmed that feeling.

I remember how happy I was on election night 1992 and 2008—but this country always manages to come back and break my heart.

I’ll never forgive myself for not having made a bigger effort to vote in 2010. I was at college at the time and I was just confused as hell as how I would sent an absenttee ballot. I didn’t cause the Republican wave obviously but it’s the only major election I haven’t voted in and that election was the beginning of the mess that got us to today.

511
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:24:31am

re: #506 Sir John Barron

Yup. Can’t lose Wisconsin, Michigan, PA and NH. Just can’t. Did Clinton win Minnesota? I don’t think I ever saw it called.

I think she did win Minnesota but it was the closest it’s been in years.

512
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:24:38am

re: #509 Sir John Barron

A truly awful person. One of the worst.

Again, the sad fact is the country deifies assholes. Long as they keep the (insert minority slur here) down, they’re not ‘assholes’, they just ‘tell it like it is’.

513
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:25:01am

re: #506 Sir John Barron

Yup. Can’t lose Wisconsin, Michigan, PA and NH. Just can’t. Did Clinton win Minnesota? I don’t think I ever saw it called.

I’m still not ready to go mucking around in the election results for myself. I’m still too raw. Losing Wisconsin, Michigan and PA was very bitter.

514
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:25:46am

re: #509 Sir John Barron

A truly awful person. One of the worst.

So bad that even a little shithead like Ben Shapiro knows he’s bad news. Reince is suposed to be considered for a job too.

515
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:26:16am

re: #493 lawhawk

Voter apathy. Misogyny. White nationalism (supremacy). Bigotry. Racism.

Pu pu platter of crazy.

People are going to look back on Obama’s term in office and wonder WTF were people thinking in choosing Trump. Had they gotten so soft and fearful that they elected a Twitter troll as president who is wholly incapable of empathy.

It’s inevitable for a president to deal with a crisis and death of American citizens, whether in a mass shooting, a terror attack, etc., or NASA astronauts dying on a mission, etc. How Trump addresses the nation in those circumstances will be telling.

Until now, we’ve seen zero capacity to empathize. Addressing the nation in those situations requires empathy.

We shall see.

They will just pressure him to read the teleprompter. He has the ability to stay on message for about 30 minutes. Then all the media will talk about how he sounded “Presidential” just like they did during the election after he sounded sane for a short speech after weeks of “ima’ gonna’ sue those lying bitches when I win biggier than Hillary (aka human with a vagina)

516
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:27:51am

re: #512 Kryptik in Mourning

Again, the sad fact is the country deifies assholes. Long as they keep the (insert minority slur here) down, they’re not ‘assholes’, they just ‘tell it like it is’.

When people claim to be “non-PC,” by and large, they either:

** deify a-holes
** softly enable a-holes by turning a blind eye or mocking/slamming those upset at said a-holes
** are a-holes themselves
** all of the above

517
wheat-dogg  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:29:19am

re: #503 Targetpractice

Only one that immediately comes to mind is Steve Bannon. And let that scary thought simmer in peoples minds: White House Chief of Staff Steve Bannon.

Bannon’s a guy who would be caught up in a scandal within the first year on the job. From the looks of him, he’s a drinker and probably not all that nice of a guy, sober or drunk.

We went eight years with no White House scandals of any kind. Something to remind people about once the Trump Administration scandals start rolling in. The voters traded in a Ford Fiesta for an Edsel.

518
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:29:27am

People say “economic anxiety,” I say “economic envy.” Trump played to the same feelings that Bernie did, that people are not holding the jobs of yesterday that could feed a family of four and still have enough left over to put away for their child’s college education. That government is to blame for that, because they sold those jobs off in trade deals, or they regulated them to death, or they gave them to “those people.” He sold them a fantasy, about how he was going to undo all of that, bring back those “better days,” and how it was gonna be even better than before.

But he can’t make it happen, he can’t make companies bring those jobs back, he can’t make companies restore jobs that have been eliminated by modernization, and so many of the jobs “those people” have are not the union jobs of yesterday that paid generous wages and great benefits. Trump already made clear he thinks autoworkers are overpaid and that he refuses to negotiate with unions at his own businesses. Time killed the “good ol’ days” and nothing he does is going to bring them back.

519
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:30:00am

re: #515 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

They will just pressure him to read the teleprompter. He has the ability to stay on message for about 30 minutes. Then all the media will talk about how he sounded “Presidential” just like they did during the election after he sounded sane for a short speech after weeks of “ima’ gonna’ sue those lying bitches when I win biggier than Hillary (aka human with a vagina)

Also possible that he deliberately pitches his crazy to his live and TV crowd. There was a lot of WWE in his electorate.

520
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:30:02am
521
Mike Lamb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:31:08am

Would Trump even need Senate approval for deportations? Couldn’t he do other you EO?

522
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:31:09am

re: #520 Ziggy_TARDIS

[Embedded content]

Thanks guys.

523
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:33:19am

re: #517 wheat-dogghazi-mailgate

Bannon’s a guy who would be caught up in a scandal within the first year on the job. From the looks of him, he’s a drinker and probably not all that nice of a guy, sober or drunk.

We went eight years with no White House scandals of any kind. Something to remind people about once the Trump Administration scandals start rolling in. The voters traded in a Ford Fiesta for an Edsel.

I took my drivers’ test in an Edsel—another example of life going backwards….

524
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:33:50am

re: #521 Mike Lamb

Would Trump even need Senate approval for deportations? Couldn’t he do other you EO?

For many instances, the laws in place now would suffice. He only has to instruct his ICE leadership to be more aggressive

525
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:34:44am

re: #518 Targetpractice

People say “economic anxiety,” I say “economic envy.” Trump played to the same feelings that Bernie did, that people are not holding the jobs of yesterday that could feed a family of four and still have enough left over to put away for their child’s college education. That government is to blame for that, because they sold those jobs off in trade deals, or they regulated them to death, or they gave them to “those people.” He sold them a fantasy, about how he was going to undo all of that, bring back those “better days,” and how it was gonna be even better than before.

But he can’t make it happen, he can’t make companies bring those jobs back, he can’t make companies restore jobs that have been eliminated by modernization, and so many of the jobs “those people” have are not the union jobs of yesterday that paid generous wages and great benefits. Trump already made clear he thinks autoworkers are overpaid and that he refuses to negotiate with unions at his own businesses. Time killed the “good ol’ days” and nothing he does is going to bring them back.

I’ll say it again but I have no doubt at all that the Democratic primary voters made the right choice. Hillary would have made by far a better President than Bernie. To me, it’s so funny seeing Berners and even some NeverTrump wingnuts who hate Bernie anyhow trolling the Democrats for nominating her and using teh stupid argument “Well he was beating Trump in the polls.” It’s so funny to me because those same Berners would have been furious if hypothetical polling were used against Bernie and they love to crow about how they’re the voice of the people but we should have nominated Bernie because of hypothetical polling. If you think Bernie would have been better fine, that’s something we can disagree on but don’t tell me you want the people’s voices heard and then actually suggest that Bernie should have been the nominee based on hypothetical polling. Michael Dukakis once led George H.W Bush in the polls FFS.

526
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:35:12am

re: #521 Mike Lamb

Would Trump even need Senate approval for deportations? Couldn’t he do other you EO?

To do it on the scale he’s promised, he’d need a shitload more money that Congress is likely to appropriate as part of the budget. You’re talking figures into the three digit billion range or higher. In other words blowing a massive hole in the budget with no guarantee of success. Congress will probably give him the money to expand the ranks and perhaps accelerate deportations already pending, but they’re not going to issue him carte blanche to start hiring the numbers he’d need to remove 11m+ people virtually overnight.

527
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:36:43am

re: #526 Targetpractice

To do it on the scale he’s promised, he’d need a shitload more money that Congress is likely to appropriate as part of the budget. You’re talking figures into the three digit billion range or higher. In other words blowing a massive hole in the budget with no guarantee of success. Congress will probably give him the money to expand the ranks and perhaps accelerate deportations already pending, but they’re not going to issue him carte blanche to start hiring the numbers he’d need to remove 11m+ people virtually overnight.

Of course it won’t be carte blanche. They’re gonna take the money from those useless departments they were going to cut anyway, like the EPA, the ATF, Education, Interior, etc.

528
Teukka  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:38:02am

re: #526 Targetpractice

To do it on the scale he’s promised, he’d need a shitload more money that Congress is likely to appropriate as part of the budget. You’re talking figures into the three digit billion range or higher. In other words blowing a massive hole in the budget with no guarantee of success. Congress will probably give him the money to expand the ranks and perhaps accelerate deportations already pending, but they’re not going to issue him carte blanche to start hiring the numbers he’d need to remove 11m+ people virtually overnight.

Hate to break it to you, but you know, Endlösung was the cheapest solution, cheaper than deporting the undesirables in the Third Reich. There were a lot of policies in the Third Reich which were based on raw, unfettered capitalism. So congress not giving the deportation a big enough budget…

529
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:38:03am

re: #518 Targetpractice

People say “economic anxiety,” I say “economic envy.” Trump played to the same feelings that Bernie did, that people are not holding the jobs of yesterday that could feed a family of four and still have enough left over to put away for their child’s college education. That government is to blame for that, because they sold those jobs off in trade deals, or they regulated them to death, or they gave them to “those people.” He sold them a fantasy, about how he was going to undo all of that, bring back those “better days,” and how it was gonna be even better than before.

But he can’t make it happen, he can’t make companies bring those jobs back, he can’t make companies restore jobs that have been eliminated by modernization, and so many of the jobs “those people” have are not the union jobs of yesterday that paid generous wages and great benefits. Trump already made clear he thinks autoworkers are overpaid and that he refuses to negotiate with unions at his own businesses. Time killed the “good ol’ days” and nothing he does is going to bring them back.

I’m trying to figure out how to convince them that a big portion of that was that we decided that our wealthy just weren’t wealthy enough.

530
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:39:37am

re: #518 Targetpractice

People say “economic anxiety,” I say “economic envy.” Trump played to the same feelings that Bernie did, that people are not holding the jobs of yesterday that could feed a family of four and still have enough left over to put away for their child’s college education. That government is to blame for that, because they sold those jobs off in trade deals, or they regulated them to death, or they gave them to “those people.” He sold them a fantasy, about how he was going to undo all of that, bring back those “better days,” and how it was gonna be even better than before.

But he can’t make it happen, he can’t make companies bring those jobs back, he can’t make companies restore jobs that have been eliminated by modernization, and so many of the jobs “those people” have are not the union jobs of yesterday that paid generous wages and great benefits. Trump already made clear he thinks autoworkers are overpaid and that he refuses to negotiate with unions at his own businesses. Time killed the “good ol’ days” and nothing he does is going to bring them back.

Trump sold them the golden age with policies for the gilded age.

531
Timothy Watson  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:39:49am

re: #526 Targetpractice

To do it on the scale he’s promised, he’d need a shitload more money that Congress is likely to appropriate as part of the budget. You’re talking figures into the three digit billion range or higher. In other words blowing a massive hole in the budget with no guarantee of success. Congress will probably give him the money to expand the ranks and perhaps accelerate deportations already pending, but they’re not going to issue him carte blanche to start hiring the numbers he’d need to remove 11m+ people virtually overnight.

And when he just prints the money and tells Congress to go fuck themselves?

532
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:39:53am

re: #527 Kryptik in Mourning

Of course it won’t be carte blanche. They’re gonna take the money from those useless departments they were going to cut anyway, like the EPA, the ATF, Education, Interior, etc.

He’s going to hand the job over to volunteers. It’ll be beautiful, you’ll see!

533
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:41:47am

re: #532 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

He’s going to hand the job over to volunteers. It’ll be beautiful, you’ll see!

Look how well it’s working in the Philippines with Duarte!

(God I say that in sarcasm, but Trump and folks no doubt believe that in earnest. Another reason why my family probably has no recourse if the knives come out: it’d mean many of them going back to live under President Punisher.)

534
Donkey With No Name  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:42:01am

So it’s been a depressing 36 hours. I managed to get over to the university and drown sorrow in work: life must go on (and if it doesn’t the Trumpists win).

I’m probably quite odd in this regard, but my biggest worry is the potential destruction of the professional federal Civil Service. For all that they can bumble sometimes, the federal bureaucracy is full of good people who want to do right by their country and have the knowledge and experience to do so. In any normal administration they would push back on unconstitutional policies, and give advice to the best of their ability. If instead you have cabinet members who are petty, vindictive, small-minded ideologues (and especially if the civil service protections are rolled back) the best people will leave or be forced out, never to return. I know the Supreme Court gets everyone’s attention, but I think it’s worth putting a bit of effort into supporting the employees of the government through what are likely to be some very dark times.

I also worry about what one does about improving a country in which people aren’t able to recognize a man who literally lies all the time and gaslights everyone. Wish I had good ideas.

Aside: re “the Constitution won’t let him do that”: Trump personifies the spirit of “let him enforce it”. So unless sanctions up to and including impeachment are on the table, there’s no reason to believe that he’ll be stopped in anyone saying “you’re not allowed to do that”. But this is what happens when you elect a sociopath.

535
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:42:30am

And I have to say to Bernie as much as I did appreciate his campaigning for Hillary, he still doesn’t goddamn get it. He loves to talk about how people voted for Brexit or for Trump as a sign of their economic anxiety but ignored in the UK that very well off English voters were among the strongest supporters of leaving the EU while working class urban Scots were likewise eager to stay in the EU. It’s like that in the US too with the man. He ignores that yes the white working class has gone Republican but people making higher than the median income favored Trump, Clinton in fact won less well off voters. She also did well with minority working class voters too. The man just doesn’t get that and I really question anyone who sees him as a great leader when he can’t see things like that, that someone like me can. That doesn’t mean I think Bernie’s a bad person or his thoughts on the issues have no legitimacy but he needs to stop doing this.

536
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:42:35am

re: #531 Timothy Watson

And when he just prints the money and tells Congress to go fuck themselves?

And within the Federal budget process, there are lots of ways to ‘re-program’ unfenced monies without quite breaking the law. It gets the executives through the time needed to get more solid funding authorization.

537
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:43:06am

re: #531 Timothy Watson

And when he just prints the money and tells Congress to go fuck themselves?

Then I’m buying more popcorn.

Honestly, I expect all the deficit hawkishness to go away within the next year or so. Suddenly deficits won’t matter again, we’re gonna start borrowing like crazy to afford all of Trump’s spending, but it’ll be spending that we’re told will pay massive dividends. Tax cuts, tax credits, “investments,” and of course “rebuilding” the military. Reagan created a shitload of jobs by “rebuilding” the military. Funny how they all went away as soon as the Cold War ended…

538
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:45:07am

re: #534 Donkey With No Name

I also worry about what one does about improving a country in which people aren’t able to recognize a man who literally lies all the time and gaslights everyone. Wish I had good ideas.

It requires a people that don’t willfully double-down on what they already know to be bullshit. In other words, it may be an impossibility. Too many people gave into the woo not because they were necessarily convinced by him, but projected their own anxieties on his promises, damn what he was actually saying.

539
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:45:30am

re: #537 Targetpractice

Then I’m buying more popcorn.

Honestly, I expect all the deficit hawkishness to go away within the next year or so. Suddenly deficits won’t matter again, we’re gonna start borrowing like crazy to afford all of Trump’s spending, but it’ll be spending that we’re told will pay massive dividends. Tax cuts, tax credits, “investments,” and of course “rebuilding” the military. Reagan created a shitload of jobs by “rebuilding” the military. Funny how they all went away as soon as the Cold War ended…

Trillion dollar infrastructure plan. That’s what I’ve seen floated.

Spending that much on infrastructure would be awesome, and help reduce the backlog of crumbling infrastructure around the nation, from rail and bridges and tunnels, but expect most of the money to fuel road-building (especially the toll-variety). Mass transit and inner city infrastructure? Not so much - because the GOP will exact their revenge by under-funding urban areas, which didn’t vote for them.

540
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:46:11am

re: #537 Targetpractice

Then I’m buying more popcorn.

Honestly, I expect all the deficit hawkishness to go away within the next year or so. Suddenly deficits won’t matter again, we’re gonna start borrowing like crazy to afford all of Trump’s spending, but it’ll be spending that we’re told will pay massive dividends. Tax cuts, tax credits, “investments,” and of course “rebuilding” the military. Reagan created a shitload of jobs by “rebuilding” the military. Funny how they all went away as soon as the Cold War ended…

And when we do start have deficit problems, it will be Obama’s fault just like it was Carter’s fault. Was listening to Asa Hutchinson of Arkansas compare this to Reagan in 1980. Motherfucker, your guy didn’t even win the popular vote and unlike 1980. our economy was doing good.

541
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:47:05am

re: #485 Decatur Deb

We have powerful tools of education, esp film and music. Time for a remake of Grapes of Wrath, with kick-ass CGI monsters. OTOH, sloppy undisciplined art and literature fucks us up. “Piss Christ” was worth 500,000 Trump votes when the RW media was done with it.

And maybe that’s something the TV studios need to tackle. Modern Family is pretty good, but it doesn’t represent the Midwest. Neither did Friends. There need to be some comedies about small towns, and they need to be made so that it’s not the people that are being made fun of.

542
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:47:59am

wLQhJL0IrveIO39IYfKTWok0FyBku+iRcP3ZJWjxyQdEaJfZ9/qUsL5klcz/bOQJ+NXXxR7FYG1uFmp5bogDO85PBduhlCd0nCVyUtFdvOFzc7NxQwcPQ8oC0jzkF+hcfB1hoT9xquDO0Un514yp1MMB/6DB0ffhhcXAVWhuP8IUkvzPtKjCq9msplKNSJwc11xKRkY8jfNGnULxPl7DFnw0frAwHYtWg2pMZYc/K7dQL20JUJRc/Q==

543
Romantic Heretic  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:48:00am

Another bit of popular culture popped into my mind thinking about what happened. From Watchmen.

Nite Owl: What happened to us? What happened to The American Dream?

The Comedian: What happened to The American Dream? It came true! You’re looking at it.

544
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:49:55am

re: #539 lawhawk

Trillion dollar infrastructure plan. That’s what I’ve seen floated.

Spending that much on infrastructure would be awesome, and help reduce the backlog of crumbling infrastructure around the nation, from rail and bridges and tunnels, but expect most of the money to fuel road-building (especially the toll-variety). Mass transit and inner city infrastructure? Not so much - because the GOP will exact their revenge by under-funding urban areas, which didn’t vote for them.

Expect a lot of “Bridges to Nowhere” as the GOP also drop all their promises about ending pork barrel spending to pay back all those red districts that supported them. Now that they’ve got the run of the place, corruption will be rife again as everybody looks to get a piece of the guaranteed pie. The wish list of spending projects they’ve held off on because there was a Democrat in the White House is now gonna be unsealed and as much money thrown at them as possible.

545
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:50:03am

re: #542 Dr. Matt

[Embedded content]

IIRC it was simply RL economic struggle, to the point of even messing up broadband access. Could be wrong.

546
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:51:51am

re: #545 Decatur Deb

IIRC it was simply RL economic struggle, to the point of even messing up broadband access. Could be wrong.

Ugh. Wow. Hopefully he’s back on his feet.

Thanks for the info.

547
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:52:54am

re: #517 wheat-dogghazi-mailgate

The voters traded in a Ford Fiesta for an Edsel.

I was thinking more of a Ford Pinto.

548
Jenner7  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:52:58am

4Yg7k3bk1U/UlUSeVBIHXnNKhMff8HpD5N78zJVhunoypIJtQnYXN0AlcM2gtNSE6kdr7qJgePiMwL+jIzyvEnKPycPjC90mpbpP2L1eGmBCbu+s1aHlFgHUjz9P8nBU3H0+qKmIcqavWaux8CBvxi78CDpeakdgl6jijQeak1tdfWg6pCH0YUMmuy4o8jFY9iWBInF1dUWTIEm9F5ntGyP/P4ERx/HCzTSQopo6F4KVmtPZ/SRetdXJXYzIATHVrs+gaGwJ3NY=

549
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:54:30am

Some legit happy news:

550
Stanley Sea  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:55:46am

re: #542 Dr. Matt

[Embedded content]

TETRQwBr7V2f1iN2BpyDDaQkI7NQlcaVTQoRBL1Zdk1b/7AdPkNmZlDtajwLp6BEYVfiL5t35Wrjhmy5Y1kvtmHnS8nye4kn0wpiWowPecqkUbxyAPijGf3EdogGbcE6

551
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:56:00am

re: #544 Targetpractice

Yup. All that talk about not funding infrastructure and shovel ready projects during the height of the recession because it was going to balloon the debt will now be ignored because a GOPer is in office.

GOP double standard time.

The sad thing is that the infrastructure spending is needed and warranted no matter who’s in office. The GOP fought to stop it to gain political advantage, and will now spend on it (selectively of course) because it is again to their advantage to do so. It also neuters the opposition, precisely because there’s no good argument against the spending in the macro sense - only that they’d be spending it where it doesn’t benefit the most people (again, urban areas).

552
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:57:24am

re: #419 Sir John Barron

And now unemployment is like 5%. See how great Trump has already made America?

///

Problem is that a lot of these people lost well paid jobs with benefits and are now just eking out a subsistence living.

553
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:58:39am

re: #552 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Problem is that a lot of these people lost well paid jobs with benefits and are now just eking out a subsistence living.

But wages are also improving at a pretty good clip. Which a couple of years of that right before the recession will get credited to Trump.

554
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:59:37am

re: #552 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Problem is that a lot of these people lost well paid jobs with benefits and are now just eking out a subsistence living.

Or they’re killing themselves with 3 jobs per couple while they watch their kids slip away.

555
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:59:39am

In regards to what lawhawk posted above.

While the Feds cut cut and cut some more…people will still want stuff so states will raise, raise and raise some more. More taxes, fees, licenses at the state level, which will most likely be more expensive for everyone. Some states will do great, some states okay, some will struggle, and some will become hellholes.

States rights!

Anyone remember Grover Norquist?

He’s readying his bathtub.

556
EmmaAnne  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:59:47am

re: #404 Targetpractice

status quo antebellum

Ouch. That is horribly apt.

557
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 7:59:50am

re: #551 lawhawk

Yup. All that talk about not funding infrastructure and shovel ready projects during the height of the recession because it was going to balloon the debt will now be ignored because a GOPer is in office.

GOP double standard time.

The sad thing is that the infrastructure spending is needed and warranted no matter who’s in office. The GOP fought to stop it to gain political advantage, and will now spend on it (selectively of course) because it is again to their advantage to do so. It also neuters the opposition, precisely because there’s no good argument against the spending in the macro sense - only that they’d be spending it where it doesn’t benefit the most people (again, urban areas).

The only plausible argument will be what it was back during the Bush years: Rampant corruption. Pointing out how the “good stewards” of the budget are blowing billions on projects that do nothing to alleviate serious infrastructure issues and instead are thinly-veiled paybacks to Congresscritters for reliably delivering their district/state’s votes this year. But that probably won’t matter because those Republicans will build up popularity at home for “bringing home the bacon.”

558
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:01:58am

re: #455 HappyWarrior

Oh fuck you Sheriff Clarke, people do have a right to protest. It’s called the first amendment. Sigh, this is what’s frustrating. You seem to get one wingnut asshole out and another is eager to take his place. Sheriff Joe is gone- good riddance- but Sheriff Clarke has pretty much taken his place as America’s big metro area Sheriff that has a hard on for power.

We are compelled to accept Donald Trump as our legally elected President. But nothing beyond that.

559
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:02:20am

re: #555 ObserverArt

In regards to what lawhawk posted above.

While the Feds cut cut and cut some more…people will still want stuff so states will raise, raise and raise some more. More taxes, fees, licenses at the state level, which will most likely be more expensive for everyone. Some states will do great, some states okay, some will struggle, and some will become hellholes.

States rights!

Anyone remember Grover Norquist?

He’s readying his bathtub.

The self-sufficient states, mostly blue, will be OK, and those that get more money from the government will suffer more, which they’ll blame on the government. Vicious cycle.

560
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:03:54am

re: #463 Targetpractice

It’s like I said Election Night when the market was plunging, any downturn from here on out will be spun as a “correction” now that the federal government isn’t artificially inflating the economy and cooking the books. The stock market was never really that high, unemployment was always really over 6%, and the economy was struggling to keep above water. But now Trump’s in charge and he’s gonna return America to unprecedented prosperity. And if he doesn’t, well, Obama’s to blame.

We have entered the alternate media reality of the American idiocracy. Trump can screw up more bigly than he ever did in business, and he will be bailed out, the scapegoats will be found in the form of minorities, immigrants or (((bankers))).

561
Eventual Carrion  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:05:03am

re: #425 Ziggy_TARDIS

Yeah, looking at the results, the big problem is that many Democrats simply did not turnout.

Hopefully, 4 years from now will be different.

There are elections EVERY YEAR!

562
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:05:17am

re: #558 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

We are compelled to accept Donald Trump as our legally elected President. But nothing beyond that.

Which includes protesting.

563
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:05:20am

Second-hand from CNN, there are still 14 million presidential votes to count. Keep that in mind when trying to make conclusions about this.

564
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:05:41am

re: #559 Belafon

The self-sufficient states, mostly blue, will be OK, and those that get more money from the government will suffer more, which they’ll blame on the government. Vicious cycle.

And also blame liberals on food stamps whom they are positive are the reason for any debt the country has.

Wingnuts on any social program don’t count because they don’t exist.

565
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:05:58am

re: #561 Eventual Carrion

There are elections EVERY YEAR!

We have a gubernatorial election next year and a senate teh year after that and the GOP is going to be emboldened here after Trump came close to winning.

566
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:07:02am

Obama’s set to meet with Trump at the WH. Puke. Poor Obama.

567
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:07:34am

re: #564 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

And also blame liberals on food stamps whom they are positive are the reason for any debt the country has.

Wingnuts on any social program don’t count because they don’t exist.

It’s not “liberals” on food stamps, it’s “African Americans” on food stamps who always vote Democrat because they’re “on the plantation to get free stuff”

568
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:08:26am

Reading Twitter has filled me with Dread again.

569
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:08:40am

re: #451 Franklin

These temper tantrums from these radical anarchists must be quelled. There is no legitimate reason to protest the will of the people. pic.twitter.com
— David A. Clarke, Jr. (@SheriffClarke) November 10, 2016

Yet he didn’t say a damned thing about 4 years of teabagger party temper tantrums.

And “will of the people” (i.e., the popular vote) voted for Hillary.

570
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:09:52am

re: #568 Ziggy_TARDIS

Reading Twitter has filled me with Dread again.

Reconfigure your Twitter feed to only show accounts that post pictures of cute animals.

571
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:09:59am

re: #561 Eventual Carrion

There are elections EVERY YEAR!

Yup. Non-partisan elections are held every odd year. Plus ballot initiatives and whatnot. Ohio’s infamous Senate Bill 5 was rightfully repealed by referendum in an odd year (2011).

572
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:10:18am

re: #565 HappyWarrior

We have a gubernatorial election next year and a senate teh year after that and the GOP is going to be emboldened here after Trump came close to winning.

I contacted a civil rights organization today to see if we can make our volunteer voter registration group a permanent coordinated outreach. It’s driving me nuts that the quadrennial candidate campaigns spend vast time and effort to organize, then disappear in a puff of smoke or drift off into lame ‘advocacy’ organizations like OFA.

573
Dr. Matt  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:10:32am

As of 20 minutes ago, the video of this incident has over 1.2 million view on FB and over 5,000 comments in 16 hours.

Royal Oak ‘Build the Wall’ School Chant Brings Response by District

574
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:12:10am

re: #541 Belafon

And maybe that’s something the TV studios need to tackle. Modern Family is pretty good, but it doesn’t represent the Midwest. Neither did Friends. There need to be some comedies about small towns, and they need to be made so that it’s not the people that are being made fun of.

Yeah, this is turning in my head. One of the things that could be played on is someone moving in from the coast, probably a teacher, trying to deal with life in the smaller town. Maybe moving back because of the wife’s family. I imagine lots of Amazon deliveries.

575
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:12:28am

re: #572 Decatur Deb

I contacted a civil rights organization today to see if we can make our volunteer voter registration group a permanent coordinated outreach. It’s driving me nuts that the quadrennial candidate campaigns spend time vast time and effort to organize, then disappear in a puff of smoke or drift off into lame ‘advocacy’ organizations like OFA.

Had ACORN not effectively been destroyed by the RWNJs, that organization would/should have filled that void.

576
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:15:54am

re: #432 Kryptik: Just Done With It.

I also call bullshit on Clinton not having an economic vision at all to appeal to those feeling like they were struggling. Clinton pretty much adapted as much as she could of Bernie’s platform wholesale. It was drowned out by Trumps xenophobia and buffoonish pie-in-the-sky proclamations, and EMAILGAZHILEAKS!

Clinton had a fucking actual platform, and no one did shit to report on it. All the oxygen was sucked up by insinuating that Clinton was the most supercorrupt mega-Satan in the history of forever, and making a reality show villain out of Trump. Unfortunately, our country deifies assholes.

Damn…I just realized. Clinton would have been better off putting all her platform in an email, marked it “Secret Stuffs” then put little © marks by every point and the media and the Republicans would have been all over it with reports and investigations.

Sorry Hillary. I should have thought of that earlier.

577
Ziggy_TARDIS  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:16:10am

re: #570 The Vicious Babushka

What are you feeling?

578
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:17:39am

re: #573 Dr. Matt

As of 20 minutes ago, the video of this incident has over 1.2 million view on FB and over 5,000 comments in 16 hours.

Royal Oak ‘Build the Wall’ School Chant Brings Response by District

Before Tuesday, I might have believed that popular opinion would support the school. But now, I’m convinced that the school will get criticized for stepping in because that’s “political correctness” and they should have either stayed back or even encouraged the chanters.

579
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:18:53am

re: #559 Belafon

The self-sufficient states, mostly blue, will be OK, and those that get more money from the government will suffer more, which they’ll blame on the government. Vicious cycle.

I know if Washington, Oregon, and California (plus Hawaii, why not) cut ourselves off we’d probably be the most prosperous country in the world. Alabama and Mississippi would look like the Central African Republic in short order. But it’s those people in the big cities that are bleeding reel Murkins dry!

Edited: How did Idaho get in there?

580
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:19:27am

Yeah, my Buckeye state let me down. But I’m not surprised. My uncles and cousins there are racist (still call AA’s the n word and Jewish people are to blame for any banking problems) but they deny being racist with a passion.

581
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:20:23am

re: #578 Targetpractice

Before Tuesday, I might have believed that popular opinion would support the school. But now, I’m convinced that the school will get criticized for stepping in because that’s “political correctness” and they should have either stayed back or even encouraged the chanters.

How dare this school stifle legitimate public political discourse amongst the kids, for heaven’s sake! What kind of world are we leaving for them?! This must be that demon-child Hillary’s fault, that harlot!

582
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:22:12am

re: #450 HappyWarrior

What pisses me off is we’re hearing about how we should understand Trump’s voters. I’m sorry but do these people care or want to hear about my concerns?

No. You lost. Pipe down. You all had your 8 years. /

583
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:22:37am

re: #579 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

I know if Washington, Oregon, and Idaho (plus Hawaii, why not) cut ourselves off we’d probably be the most prosperous country in the world. Alabama and Mississippi would look like the Central African Republic in short order. But it’s those people in the big cities that are bleeding reel Murkins dry!

Alabama and Mississippi are the paradises they are precisely because they took the separatist path and refused to drop the ideology after the hammer fell. There’s a lesson in there somewhere.

584
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:23:17am

I do believe we’re gonna see a lot more of a regression in public discourse as people become emboldened by Trump’s being a boorish asshole and still winning the presidency. They’ll spin it as “telling it like it is” or doing away with “political correctness,” but what it will really be is simply their airing their inner racists and bigots because they feel there’s no backlash to doing so.

585
EmmaAnne  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:25:27am

re: #467 ObserverArt

There were protest after Bush II was elected. On inauguration day as I recall.

586
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:26:01am

Now that I know that SO many people in my country like people who “tell it like it is” This could actually be fun.

587
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:26:06am

re: #584 Targetpractice

I do believe we’re gonna see a lot more of a regression in public discourse as people become emboldened by Trump’s being a boorish asshole and still winning the presidency. They’ll spin it as “telling it like it is” or doing away with “political correctness,” but what it will really be is simply their airing their inner racists and bigots because they feel there’s no backlash to doing so.

They’ve been given the goahead to let the freak flag fly, because we’ve just had an election that validated the idea that this is “White AMerica” and only “White America”. Why would they not be emboldened by the idea that they just won ‘their country’ back?

588
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:26:43am

re: #584 Targetpractice

I do believe we’re gonna see a lot more of a regression in public discourse as people become emboldened by Trump’s being a boorish asshole and still winning the presidency. They’ll spin it as “telling it like it is” or doing away with “political correctness,” but what it will really be is simply their airing their inner racists and bigots because they feel there’s no backlash to doing so.

and more than a few cops who feel relieved because they believe that all that BLM nonsense is finally swept away…

589
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:27:11am

re: #465 Decatur Deb

Obviously, you should purge them from your FB.

Heh. Sly Deb…as always. Right over the head.

590
Dr Lizardo  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:28:34am

re: #579 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

I know if Washington, Oregon, and California (plus Hawaii, why not) cut ourselves off we’d probably be the most prosperous country in the world. Alabama and Mississippi would look like the Central African Republic in short order. But it’s those people in the big cities that are bleeding reel Murkins dry!

Edited: How did Idaho get in there?

Combined GDP of 2.978 trillion per annum. Just behind Germany and ahead of France. Easily, a “Pacific Republic” would be the fourth largest economy in the world.

591
Myron Falwell (no relation)  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:28:35am
592
Ace-o-aces  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:33:42am
593
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:34:01am

WikiLeaks Mocks Dems after election loss

msn.com

594
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:34:54am

re: #590 Dr Lizardo

Combined GDP of 2.978 trillion per annum. Just behind Germany and ahead of France. Easily, a “Pacific Republic” would be the fourth largest economy in the world.

Are you sure the Rump United States would still be in the top three? I’m not. But of course, it’ll never happen….

595
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:36:14am

re: #594 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

Are you sure the Rump United States would still be in the top three? I’m not. But of course, it’ll never happen….

Secession was a stupid idea in 1861, it was stupid when wingnuts suggested it in 2008 and it’s still stupid.

596
Dr Lizardo  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:36:43am

re: #592 Ace-o-aces

[Embedded content]

Heh…..wait until the “border wall” disappears. Or he walks it back and says it’d be too impractical to build and that deporting undocumented immigrants is well-nigh impossible.

Then his supporters will (maybe) realize they’ve been hustled. And I think they won’t be very happy.

597
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:36:45am

re: #592 Ace-o-aces

[Embedded content]

I’m not gonna hold my breath that he’ll suddenly be buddy buddy with Muslim populations here. Disappearing it from his site means a jack shit if it returns to his platform in an unwritten way anyway.

598
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:37:48am

re: #594 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

Are you sure the Rump United States would still be in the top three? I’m not. But of course, it’ll never happen….

What I mean is, Imagine cutting Germany or France (or the UK///) out of the EU, but leaving them with Portugal, Greece, etc. to support. Their GDP might look high, but as to overall prosperity?

599
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:37:54am

WikiLeaks and Putin hate Hillary. Because she was guilty of calling out these ass wipes.

600
Charles Johnson  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:37:59am
601
Mike Lamb  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:39:12am

re: #526 Targetpractice

To do it on the scale he’s promised, he’d need a shitload more money that Congress is likely to appropriate as part of the budget. You’re talking figures into the three digit billion range or higher. In other words blowing a massive hole in the budget with no guarantee of success. Congress will probably give him the money to expand the ranks and perhaps accelerate deportations already pending, but they’re not going to issue him carte blanche to start hiring the numbers he’d need to remove 11m+ people virtually overnight.

His 100 day “plan” was to deport 2 million.

602
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:41:54am

re: #595 The Vicious Babushka

Secession was a stupid idea in 1861, it was stupid when wingnuts suggested it in 2008 and it’s still stupid.

Secession couldn’t work, but I think you’re going to see a lot of passive resistance by the governments of those states, to name four, to implementing the worst of the policies that’ll be coming out. “Let him enforce it”, indeed.

603
Dr Lizardo  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:43:48am

re: #602 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

Secession couldn’t work, but I think you’re going to see a lot of passive resistance by the governments of those states, to name four, to implementing the worst of the policies that’ll be coming out. “Let him enforce it”, indeed.

I was thinking of that, and some form of passive resistance like this I could see happening. “Let him enforce it” or “Tell him to blow it out his ass” (to be less diplomatic) could be a response, depending on the issue.

604
Mike Lamb  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:45:33am

re: #569 Dr. Matt

Yet he didn’t say a damned thing about 4 years of teabagger party temper tantrums.

And “will of the people” (i.e., the popular vote) voted for Hillary.

And that freedom of association and free speech bit in the BoR? Fuck that noise…amirite?

605
BlueSpotinAL  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:47:45am

re: #578 Targetpractice

Before Tuesday, I might have believed that popular opinion would support the school. But now, I’m convinced that the school will get criticized for stepping in because that’s “political correctness” and they should have either stayed back or even encouraged the chanters.

If this happens, an opportunity to point out that people supporting Building the Wall don’t care if they hurt people.

606
ObserverArt  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:48:32am

re: #500 Kryptik in Mourning

The Drain the Swamp bullshit was never founded on anything. What new faces actually contributed to this shit? Trump doesn’t count because he’s been a known fucking factor for decades, and ran four fucking years ago as well. What actual ‘outsiders’ were brought to the table here?

Outside that Black fellow and his people.

607
Romantic Heretic  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:48:49am

re: #547 Myron Falwell (no relation)

I was thinking more of a Ford Pinto.

Except this Pinto will explode if someone looks at it funny, and it now has the power to take the whole world with it when it does.

608
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:49:30am

re: #605 BlueSpotinAL

If this happens, an opportunity to point out that people supporting Building the Wall don’t care if they hurt people.

Oh, no, no, no, this is where you’re wrong.

They care because they want to hurt people. Because those people are the wrong sort of people.

609
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:50:56am

re: #608 Kryptik in Mourning

Oh, no, no, no, this is where you’re wrong.

They care because they want to hurt people. Because those people are the wrong sort of people.

because their very existence here is illegal

610
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:52:19am

re: #596 Dr Lizardo

Heh…..wait until the “border wall” disappears. Or he walks it back and says it’d be too impractical to build and that deporting undocumented immigrants is well-nigh impossible.

Then his supporters will (maybe) realize they’ve been hustled. And I think they won’t be very happy.

Assumes facts not in evidence.

Namely that Trump walked back the 2,000 mile wall the day after he proposed it. He indicated that the wall would include natural barriers, including rivers, deserts, and mountain ranges. In other words, it was the same thing we have at present.

His supporters didn’t care.

They wont care now.

611
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:52:38am

The supposed liberal media is saying “people just didn’t understand how economically devestated Trump voters were.”

That’s why, at all his rally’s they weren’t chanting “Bring us good paying jobs!” They were chanting “” BUILD THE WALL!”

612
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:53:33am

re: #595 The Vicious Babushka

Secession was a stupid idea in 1861, it was stupid when wingnuts suggested it in 2008 and it’s still stupid.

Stupid ideas are stupid regardless of who raises them.

613
BlueSpotinAL  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:53:39am

re: #608 Kryptik in Mourning

Oh, no, no, no, this is where you’re wrong.

They care because they want to hurt people. Because those people are the wrong sort of people.

Yes, but there are a lot of people who voted Trump mainly for other reasons, and need to be reminded that their choices hurt children (not necessarily just immigrants) more than they rationalized.

614
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:54:04am

re: #611 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

The supposed liberal media is saying “people just didn’t understand how economically devestated Trump voters were.”

That’s why, at all his rally’s they weren’t chanting “Bring us good paying jobs!” They were chanting “” BUILD THE WALL!”

They keep on saying that but they ignore that Trump did better with voters who make above the median income and in fact made a killing with voters who say they’re better off now than five years ago. Now I’m sure some Trump voters did have some economic frustrations but that was always an excuse.

615
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:54:15am

re: #611 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

The supposed liberal media is saying “people just didn’t understand how economically devestated Trump voters were.”

That’s why, at all his rally’s they weren’t chanting “Bring us good paying jobs!” They were chanting “” BUILD THE WALL!”

Because Trump convinced them that undocumented immigrants are SWARMING ACROSS THE BORDER BY MILLIONS EVERY DAY TO TAKE AWAY THERE JERBS!!!!!!!

616
KerFuFFler  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:55:56am

re: #123 Lidane

Please. Like there’s ever going to be a jobs bill or anything related to infrastructure.

Trump and the GOP are going to go on a rights-destroying binge. They’re not going to care about roads and bridges, or giving people jobs.

I agree that they will go on a rights-destroying binge, but I also suspect they will be happy to spend on infrastructure as long as a GOP administration gets the credit for all those jobs and money filtering through the economy. Reagan ran up huge deficits as POTUS. The GOP cuts back on spending to hurt the economy whenever there is a dem in charge.

617
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:56:34am

BTW when people vote Democratic out of economic frustrations, Republicans call them moochers who just want a handout. Why should I be sympathetic to people like this? People who vote for candidates who are nothing but homophobic, sexist, xenophobic bullies. Oh and again if they were so frustrated with Washington, why reward the Republicans with Congress AGAIN?

618
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:56:34am

re: #611 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

The supposed liberal media is saying “people just didn’t understand how economically devestated Trump voters were.”

That’s why, at all his rally’s they weren’t chanting “Bring us good paying jobs!” They were chanting “” BUILD THE WALL!”

Build a Wall was code (not so thinly disguised) to go after The Other. Minorities and immigrants (legal or otherwise) who don’t look like the white America that these people wistfully recall as being the pinnacle of American culture and power (all while ignoring that this period was also when segregation remained, but under attack; the top tax rate was 90%, and unions were still empowered to protect workers rights across the nation - all the very things that these same people are attacking now).

619
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:57:07am

George Wallace used “frustrations” too but everyone knew what he was really all about.

620
meteor  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:58:52am

Democratic Underground still isn’t back yet.

621
electrotek  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:59:09am

In addition to Middle Eastern Christians who were more interested in fulfilling their sectarian dreams of bloodshed against their enemy, fellow Muslims are also in my crosshairs.

No, not the ones that knew how high the stakes were and voted for Hillary, like myself.

I’m speaking of the ones who either voted Green Party or didn’t bother voting because they were more fixated on which candidate is more pro-Israel or pro-Palestine, or which candidate will help their ancestral country more than the other. In addition, the ones who didn’t bother voting, either they didn’t like the candidates, or they don’t vote because they’re dumbass Salafis who think voting is haram. The ones who think that making dua (prayer) to substitute their decision to not vote will yield more benefit than that.

To those I described, are you happy? Are you happy that your self-absorbed and selfish nature has brought the American equivalent to Slobodan Milosevic as our President? You think it’s bad now, wait for the next 4 years and see how bad it will be.

I will ultimately hold you, and every single one of you, responsible for the rise of Trump. You could have used your vote in a strategic way and vote for the lesser of two evils in order to stem the tide of hatred. Yes, I know there will never be a candidate that you will agree with 100%. But due to your Goddamn fixation on Israel/Palestine and your outdated views about voting, we will all fucking suffer than to you lot.

See you in Judgement Day.

622
Citizen K  Nov 10, 2016 • 8:59:10am

re: #613 BlueSpotinAL

Yes, but there are a lot of people who voted Trump mainly for other reasons, and need to be reminded that their choices hurt children (not necessarily just immigrants) more than they rationalized.

How many of those people, once told of the level of hurt their vote helped cause, will still be all for it, perhaps moreso than before they were told?

623
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:00:11am

re: #617 HappyWarrior

Oh and again if they were so frustrated with Washington, why reward the Republicans with Congress AGAIN?

A strange psychological effect, I believe. They have seen Congress be so ineffective for so long that they assume it is all but powerless and vote for whatever name (or party) they feel most comfortable with.

624
electrotek  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:01:46am

Trump supporters remind me of Ahmadinejad supporters.

625
Targetpractice  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:02:51am

re: #605 BlueSpotinAL

If this happens, an opportunity to point out that people supporting Building the Wall don’t care if they hurt people.

They don’t care that people are hurt, because that’s the entire idea.

If you’re not Hispanic and you’re offended, then you’re “overly sensitive” and “too PC.”

If you’re Hispanic but not illegal and you’re hurt, then you should be identifying with the chanters because “those illegals” are the ones hurting you.

And if you’re the child of an illegal or an illegal yourself, then you’re right to be hurt because you’re what’s “wrong” with America.

626
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:03:08am

re: #624 electrotek

Trump supporters remind me of Ahmadinejad supporters.

Did he not campaign as an “outsider” and a populist?

627
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:03:19am

re: #624 electrotek

Trump supporters remind me of Ahmadinejad supporters.

Cult followers everywhere are the same, they see themselves as weak and helpless and want the “Big Strong Father” to take care of them.

In other words, moochers.

628
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:04:01am

re: #625 Targetpractice

They don’t care that people are hurt, because that’s the entire idea.

If you’re not Hispanic and you’re offended, then you’re “overly sensitive” and “too PC.”

If you’re Hispanic but not illegal and you’re hurt, then you should be identifying with the chanters because “those illegals” are the ones hurting you.

And if you’re the child of an illegal or an illegal yourself, then you’re right to be hurt because you’re what’s “wrong” with America.

What I love is we should understand their hurt feewees but they don’t give a damn about other people and even mock them.

629
Jayleia  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:04:13am

re: #624 electrotek

Trump supporters remind me of Ahmadinejad supporters.

And if the Trumpers were born and raised in Iran, they would be. Wingnuts gonna wing somewhere, no matter where they’re born.

630
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:04:34am

re: #603 Dr Lizardo

I was thinking of that, and some form of passive resistance like this I could see happening. “Let him enforce it” or “Tell him to blow it out his ass” (to be less diplomatic) could be a response, depending on the issue.

California’s the 800-pound gorilla. “Do you want the 35% of our taxes we don’t get back? Or not?” Washington’s 15% is small potatoes, but even that could hurt.

631
CuriousLurker  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:05:08am

re: #618 lawhawk

Build a Wall was code (not so thinly disguised) to go after The Other. Minorities and immigrants (legal or otherwise) who don’t look like the white America that these people wistfully recall as being the pinnacle of American culture and power (all while ignoring that this period was also when segregation remained, but under attack; the top tax rate was 90%, and unions were still empowered to protect workers rights across the nation - all the very things that these same people are attacking now).

Yeah, they conveniently forget that they got to the top of the heap by stepping on the backs of all the slaves & immigrants who did the actual hard physical labor of building this country. They’re still doing it. I wonder how many white Americans would be willing to take over the jobs of migrant farm workers, day laborers, etc. at the same rate of pay they get? I’m guessing close to none. And don’t even get me started on the genocide of the Native Americans.

632
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:05:27am

Any guesses as to what happens when the next inevitable terrorist attack happens?

633
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:06:13am

re: #631 CuriousLurker

Yeah, they conveniently forget that they got to the top of the heap by stepping on the backs of all the slaves & immigrants who did the actual hard physical labor of building this country. They’re still doing it. I wonder how many white Americans would be willing to take over the jobs of migrant farm workers, day laborers, etc. at the same rate of pay they get? I’m guessing close to none. And don’t even get me started on the genocide of the Native Americans.

You remember what happened when Georgia banned migrant laborers several years ago? Food rotted in the field.

634
CuriousLurker  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:06:44am

re: #633 The Vicious Babushka

You remember what happened when Georgia banned migrant laborers several years ago? Food rotted in the field.

Exactly what I was thinking of.

635
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:06:49am

re: #632 Sir John Barron

Any guesses as to what happens when the next inevitable terrorist attack happens?

Reactive terrorist attacks (aka pogroms)

636
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:07:01am

re: #632 Sir John Barron

Any guesses as to what happens when the next inevitable terrorist attack happens?

Depends on whether it is before or after the inauguration.

637
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:07:28am

re: #633 The Vicious Babushka

You remember what happened when Georgia banned migrant laborers several years ago? Food rotted in the field.

I believe Alabama also had negative consequences to their hostility towards immigrants too.

638
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:08:41am

re: #635 The Vicious Babushka

Reactive terrorist attacks (aka pogroms)

I really worry about how our nation would react to a major natural and/or man-made disaster that totally disrupts utilities and public order over a large area or for a large population.

Especially if there are some sort of foreign terrorists involved…

639
CuriousLurker  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:09:41am

re: #632 Sir John Barron

Any guesses as to what happens when the next inevitable terrorist attack happens?

Dude c’mon, you know the answer… Obama’s fault, he was weak!

Or are you thinking how they might try to come after American Muslims?

640
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:11:11am

re: #639 CuriousLurker

Dude c’mon, you know the answer… Obama’s fault, he was weak!

Or are you thinking how they might try to come after American Muslims?

Best to shoot first and ask questions later, right?

641
Sir John Barron  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:11:24am

re: #639 CuriousLurker

Dude c’mon, you know the answer… Obama’s fault, he was weak!

Or are you thinking how they might try to come after American Muslims?

Start bombing somewhere. Anywhere. Just a big freak-out.

642
nines09  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:11:29am

Man comes down the street and says he’s going to fuck up your friends and neighbors, build a wall, lock “them” up and inflict pain and suffering everywhere. Media says; “Well, let’s see if we can work with him.”
That’s the voice of a bullied person.

643
Jayleia  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:14:54am

re: #638 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

They don’t even need to be involved. White House Assistant Press Secretary Alex Fucking Jones will blame Them…whoever Them happen to be this week.

644
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:15:36am

re: #324 Timothy Watson

Except, they can’t legally do that. The Constitution and laws passed by Congress give the President the power to do stuff, not whoever Trump decides to fill-in for the day.

Who’s going to stop them?

645
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:18:47am

re: #643 Jayleia

They don’t even need to be involved. White House Assistant Press Secretary Alex Fucking Jones will blame Them…whoever Them happen to be this week.

Speaking of him. It’s pretty damn disturbing to think that a candidate that he backed is in the WH. His already authoritarian tendencies are going to go off on anyone who does to question God Emperor Trump.

646
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:22:30am

re: #632 Sir John Barron

Any guesses as to what happens when the next inevitable terrorist attack happens?

Benghazi!

647
Mike Lamb  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:22:47am

re: #641 Sir John Barron

Start bombing somewhere. Anywhere. Just a big freak-out.

Except these bombs might come with mushroom clouds…

648
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:23:34am

Via PZ:

649
CuriousLurker  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:23:47am

re: #640 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Best to shoot first and ask questions later, right?

Yep, I’m sure that’s how many see it. Hell, look how badly the collective “we” reacted to 9/11—people were ready to intern Muslims in camps. Others preferred to just shoot anyone the perceived as Muslim on sight. I’m guessing the Sikhs aren’t looking forward to another attack either as they invariably get shit on too.

I don’t worry too much about pogroms & such up here where I’m at because there are a LOT of Muslims around, plus I’m in an area that’s mostly black/afro-caribbean with some hispanics thrown in, and Jews around the edges in the more suburban areas.* I do have some concern for Muslims in less diverse parts of the country though.

*I could also remove my hijab and easily pass as Puerto Rican. I’m not an immigrant and have no accent, so that’s not an issue for me either.

650
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:24:08am

re: #367 Unshaken Defiance

Second morning I can not bring myself to turn on the tv. I can’t bear to watch. Anyone else?

Turned it off at 9:30 EST Tuesday—haven’t turned it on since. I just can’t look at his face or listen to his voice (nor those of the ridiculous pundits.)

651
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:24:54am

re: #642 nines09

Man comes down the street and says he’s going to fuck up your friends and neighbors, build a wall, lock “them” up and inflict pain and suffering everywhere. Media says; “Well, let’s see if we can work with him.”
That’s the voice of a bullied person.

One of the more disgusting displays of the campaign was the press managers letting their employees absorb shit from the rallies. They gave them ‘combat pay’.

652
Skip Intro  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:25:45am

re: #467 ObserverArt

I asked LGF members last evening, but I don’t think it was ever answered.

Do you remember people taking to the street in protest one day after Nixon was elected? I know we had all the turmoil in the Democratic convention.

Actually I asked if anyone knew of any protests after an election like we saw last night?

If you’re referring to Nixon/Humphrey then no, there were no protests. No one on the left wanted Humphrey. “Dump the Hump” was the slogan back then.

653
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:26:49am

re: #649 CuriousLurker

…snip

*I could also remove my hijab and easily pass as Puerto Rican. …

Might be the first use of that adaptive strategy.

654
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:29:10am

re: #653 Decatur Deb

Might be the first use of that adaptive strategy.

There was a tweet yesterday about women considering leaving off their hijabs.

655
ipsos  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:29:29am

Can we safely assume that the HRC campaign did NOT cancel its staffers’ credit cards at 2 AM Wednesday?

#class

656
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:30:36am

re: #654 Belafon

There was a tweet yesterday about women considering leaving off their hijabs.

Yeah, but did they join the Sharks?

657
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:32:02am

I cant even go into the problems of the Middle East. Ok I will.

One of the weaknesses of the liberal people is that if one side is wrong (in their opinion) the other side must be RIGHT!

Fuck that. I may be pro Jerusalem (I Cant believe I have to write that) But the liberals hearts are in the right place. Unfortunately, The extreme white wing seems to think that bankers are all Jewish people who are trying to take over the world! and Mexicans, especially the ones who don’t look “white enough” are the problem. Oh! and Jewish people!

658
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:32:23am

re: #655 ipsos

Can we safely assume that the HRC campaign did NOT cancel its staffers’ credit cards at 2 AM Wednesday?

#class

I would think if they had, that would have leaked. I know Kaine bought his key staffers all a signed harmoniac, a bottle of Virginia’s best wine, and a personal letter of thanks. I’m disappointed we lost but I’m glad to have supported this ticket and I’m going to be voting for Kaine for a fourth time two falls from now and I hope he’s considered for a cbainet position down the road. Don’t know if he’s presidential material but he’d be good in a position like AG or even SOS, he’s a lovely guy who genuinely cares about people, unlike Pence.

659
CuriousLurker  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:32:34am

re: #367 Unshaken Defiance

Second morning I can not bring myself to turn on the tv. I can’t bear to watch. Anyone else?

re: #650 BeachDem

Turned it off at 9:30 EST Tuesday—haven’t turned it on since. I just can’t look at his face or listen to his voice (nor those of the ridiculous pundits.)

Same here. I usually don’t watch TV anyway, but I’m avoiding online videos and even most newspaper articles about him.

Did I mention that I’m never going to refer to him as anything but the Orange Vulgarian or, if I must use the title “President,” then it’ll President Pussy-Grabber? It’s disrespectful of the office? I don’t give a shit—they’re his own words and he sullies the office by his very existence. *spit*

660
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:33:46am

re: #659 CuriousLurker

Same here. I usually don’t watch TV anyway, but I’m avoiding online videos and even most newspaper articles about him.

Did I mention that I’m never going to refer to him as anything but the Orange Vulgarian or, if I must use the title “President,” then it’ll President Pussy-Grabber? It’s disrespectful of the office? I don’t give a shit—they’re his own words and he sullies the office by his very existence. *spit*

It’s not as if he respected President Obama’s office by questioning his citizenship and calling him stupid. I mean with Bush, yeah I didn’t like him but he tried to be presidential in his campaigns.

661
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:34:09am

re: #652 Skip Intro

If you’re referring to Nixon/Humphrey then no, there were no protests. No one on the left wanted Humphrey. “Dump the Hump” was the slogan back then.

The 1968 Democratic Convention and the massive protests outside were the very definition of a shitshow.

662
Skip Intro  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:35:24am

re: #661 The Vicious Babushka

The 1968 Democratic Convention and the massive protests outside were the very definition of a shitshow.

My memory must be going. Was that after Nixon won?

663
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:36:22am

re: #413 Dr. Matt

The media continues to claim that Drump was elected because so many “Americans” are economically challenged and felt like they have been left behind…..yet, these same “Americans” re-elected their incumbents and gave the GOP majorities across the board. Drump was correct: the media is completely dishonest.

Per the Guardian:

Broken down by income bracket, 52% of voters earning less than $50,000 a year - who make up 36% of the electorate - voted for Clinton, and 41% for Trump.

664
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:36:33am

re: #662 Skip Intro

My memory must be going. Was that after Nixon won?

That was during the Democratic Convention in Chicago. Where Dan Rather earned his journalistic chops.

665
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:36:34am

re: #662 Skip Intro

My memory must be going. Was that after Nixon won?

That was when people realized that regardless of which major party you supported, you were going to get more war in Vietnam…

666
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:37:18am

re: #665 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

That was when people realized that regardless of which major party you supported, you were going to get more war in Vietnam…

And 18-20 year olds were old enough to die, but not old enough to vote.

667
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:38:13am

re: #663 BeachDem

Per the Guardian:

Broken down by income bracket, 52% of voters earning less than $50,000 a year - who make up 36% of the electorate - voted for Clinton, and 41% for Trump.

Are you hearing from your Kampaign Kid?

668
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:38:25am

re: #663 BeachDem

Per the Guardian:

Broken down by income bracket, 52% of voters earning less than $50,000 a year - who make up 36% of the electorate - voted for Clinton, and 41% for Trump.

But economic anxiety!

669
Skip Intro  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:38:34am

This was the question I responded to:

Do you remember people taking to the street in protest one day after Nixon was elected? I know we had all the turmoil in the Democratic convention.

Actually I asked if anyone knew of any protests after an election like we saw last night?

My answer stands: No.

670
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:38:59am

re: #653 Decatur Deb

Might be the first use of that adaptive strategy.

I remember being offended by a movie—Golden Earrings?—about an American soldier who hid out from the Nazis with a Gypsy band…. “Uh, you do realize the Nazis came a lot closer to their goal of killing all the Gypsies in Europe than they did with the Jews, right?”

671
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:40:08am

re: #663 BeachDem

Per the Guardian:

Broken down by income bracket, 52% of voters earning less than $50,000 a year - who make up 36% of the electorate - voted for Clinton, and 41% for Trump.

The people I work around at my government contractor job mostly voted for Trump. We’re upper middle class with at least a bachelor degree. They assume they’re not going to be affected. I am waiting to hear them wail the first year after the ACA is repealed, because a lot of this group is not quite old enough to qualify for Medicare.

672
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:41:26am

re: #663 BeachDem

Per the Guardian:

Broken down by income bracket, 52% of voters earning less than $50,000 a year - who make up 36% of the electorate - voted for Clinton, and 41% for Trump.

Was that further broken down by race?

673
Skip Intro  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:46:22am
PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA—You know who I don’t envy right now?

Judge Gonzalo P. Curiel out there in San Diego, that’s who.

Curiel is the judge who, sometime around Thanksgiving, is supposed to preside over the fraud trial of the man who is now president-elect of the United States. He also is the judge against whom the president-elect launched a racist diatribe that certainly would have ended any hope he had of being president, right? (Speaker Paul Ryan called it “textbook racism.”)

The pressure on Curiel at this point must be enormous because, as you’ve probably heard today, over and over again, it’s time for us to unify behind El Caudillo del Mar-A-Lago and not allow petty things like a massive conspiracy to commit fraud get in the way of the business of moving the nation beyond the tragedy of 4.9 percent unemployment. I hope Curiel’s got the native-born Hoosier grit to stand up against what’s coming down the road at him.

esquire.com

674
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:48:45am

re: #456 Belafon

The will of the people was Clinton based on popular vote. The will of a two century old anachronism is what has given us President Trump.

According to some of the BoB’s, she only won the popular vote because of California and he won the popular vote other places. They began their argument with the premise that she only won the nomination because of southern states (you know who…) and then the California crap—so, now on the alt-left, we have two groups of Dem voters who should not count. Spit.

675
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:50:13am

re: #673 Skip Intro

esquire.com

He’s going to do what he did to Curiel to any judge who dares cross the administration. I honestly found the attacks on Curiel more bothersome than the tape remarks since he was speaking as a presidential candidate when he went after Curiel.

676
Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:50:45am

re: #673 Skip Intro

esquire.com

Doesn’t matter. The boys and girls who love Trump will vote for him even if it meant they cant buy bad beer and snatch pussy. Ok Trump supporters will always let him grab Pussy.

677
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:51:15am

re: #674 BeachDem

According to some of the BoB’s, she only won the popular vote because of California and he won the popular vote other places. They began their argument with the premise that she only won the nomination because of southern states (you know who…) and then the California crap—so, now on the alt-left, we have two groups of Dem voters who should not count. Spit.

I am so sick of them. They can fuck off and start their own party for all I care, us in the center-left meanwhile will work for solutions based on actual reality.

678
ThomasLite  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:52:12am

re: #673 Skip Intro

Article III Judge: noun see: Honey Badger.

I’m fairly sure he’ll be AOK.

679
Belafon  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:52:43am

re: #673 Skip Intro

Judges get attacked frequently; look at the SCOTUS judges for proof. I’m sure Curiel can deal with it.

680
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:53:37am

re: #679 Belafon

Judges get attacked frequently; look at the SCOTUS judges for proof. I’m sure Curiel can deal with it.

Who will rid me of this troublesome judge?

681
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:54:02am

re: #474 The Vicious Babushka

There were MAJOR PROTESTS in 1968 but they occurred after the assassinations of MLK & RFK. Also, the voting age was 21. Lots of anger from 18-20 year olds being old enough to fight but not old enough to vote.

Barry McGuire - Eve Of Destruction

682
Skip Intro  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:54:15am

re: #675 HappyWarrior

He’s going to do what he did to Curiel to any judge who dares cross the administration. I honestly found the attacks on Curiel more bothersome than the tape remarks since he was speaking as a presidential candidate when he went after Curiel.

He’s going to need 24/7 security once the Trumpoids target him, and they will.

683
I Would Prefer Not To  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:56:25am

And it wasn’t just Donald Trump who won last night—it was his supporters too. The Klan won last night. White nationalists. Sexists, racists and buffoons. Angry young white men who think rap music and Cinco de Mayo are a threat to their way of life (or are the reason for their way of life) have been given cause to celebrate. Men who have no right to call themselves that and who think that women who aspire to more than looking hot are shrill, ugly, and otherwise worthy of our scorn rather than our admiration struck a blow for misogynistic shitheads everywhere. Hate was given hope. Abject dumbness was glamorized as being “the fresh voice of an outsider” who’s going to “shake things up.” (Did anyone bother to ask how? Is he going to re-arrange the chairs in the Roosevelt Room?) For the next four years, the President of the United States, the same office held by Washington and Jefferson, Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt, F.D.R., J.F.K. and Barack Obama, will be held by a man-boy who’ll spend his hours exacting Twitter vengeance against all who criticize him (and those numbers will be legion). We’ve embarrassed ourselves in front of our children and the world.

Read the Letter Aaron Sorkin Wrote His Daughter After Donald Trump Was Elected President

684
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:56:33am

I think this sentiment rings true for a lot of us here at LGF. It certainly has a bunch of my colleagues worried too. We’re in the NYC metro area and somewhat insulated as a result of a state/local government that is largely controlled by Democrats, but there are pockets of bigotry even here.

I have family down south, and they’re worried - worried about their friends and family, because the hate-mongers have come out in force.

685
The Vicious Babushka  Nov 10, 2016 • 9:57:24am

re: #681 BeachDem

[Embedded content]

I can’t decide which song sucked harder, “Eve of Destruction” or “Ballad of the Green Berets”

686
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:00:23am

re: #684 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

I think this sentiment rings true for a lot of us here at LGF. It certainly has a bunch of my colleagues worried too. We’re in the NYC metro area and somewhat insulated as a result of a state/local government that is largely controlled by Democrats, but there are pockets of bigotry even here.

I have family down south, and they’re worried - worried about their friends and family, because the hate-mongers have come out in force.

We’re political minorities where we live. County went for Clinton but this is a red area. My kid brotther was telling me the seniors overwhelmingly voted for Trump in the mock election. That genuinely saddens me. I’ve coached a lot of these kids’ younger brothers in basketball and know a lot of these families too.

687
lawhawk  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:00:45am

And now … for something completely different.

Rick Wakeman’s Journey to the Center of the Earth (because prog-rock):

Rick Wakeman - Journey to the Centre of the Earth - Argentina 2014

688
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:01:07am

re: #483 BigPapa

I was just wondering earlier how this candidate and election feels to older voters than me. This is the first election where I was very invested in the vote and first shell shocker to me personally. But how does it compare to the Bushes, Reagan, Nixon?

I don’t thing Trump is anywhere close to them. But I wanted somebody’s opinion that lived it.

As an official “old,” I can say that, as disappointed as I’ve been at some of the Presidents we’ve elected, I am totally horrified, disgusted and unable to deal with the fact that we have elected a vulgar reality star, who has made no disclosures about his financial ties, has zero government experience, a terrible business track record, a following of ignorant, hateful assholes and no coherent understanding of policy, governing, or much of anything.

I do not see how we recover from this one as the same country we were before.

689
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:01:22am

re: #685 The Vicious Babushka

I can’t decide which song sucked harder, “Eve of Destruction” or “Ballad of the Green Berets”

a song that combines the worst of both: The Spokesmen’s Dawn of Correction

690
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:04:20am

This just feels like how the lead up to the Spanish Civil War must have felt. I hope to God that it doesn’t come to that mind you but that’s how it feels. A country more divided than ever. I’m upset not just at Trumpers but also those who lean left but refused to vote for Clinton because she wasn’t perfect enough for them. Yes, she had flaws but you know what, Trump’s supporters overlooked all his flaws that were much bigger than Clinton’s. The fucking religious right voted in large numbers for a man who appeared in a Playboy video and you were upset because Hillary didn’t pander enough to you on health care?

691
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:04:38am

re: #489 Decatur Deb

Understanding them means seeing through the BS. We need to get a grasp on what their real mix of motives is, fix what we can, and ignore only the most hopeless of the Irredeemables.

Most of the articles I’ve read have used “understanding” them in the sense of empathizing/sympathizing with them. There’s where I have a problem.

692
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:08:02am

re: #691 BeachDem

Most of the articles I’ve read have used “understanding” them in the sense of empathizing/sympathizing with them. There’s where I have a problem.

Yes. I mean I think it’s important to understand why they voted too but I have no desire to sympathize or empathize with people who if they saw my SiL and her extended family would assume they were illegals, people who have not accepted that my gay friends have the right to marry, etc. They’re fond of telling us millennials to stop thinking we’re so special, well stop thinking we should care about your resentments that the country has changed you were a kid. Countries change.

693
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:08:35am

Wife’s Acquaintance: “Yaa! Trump won!”
Wife: “20 million people are going to lose their health insurance.”
WA: “Some people don’t deserve health insurance.”

HRC lost our county at 24%.

694
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:10:09am

re: #693 Decatur Deb

Wife’s Acquaintance: “Yaa! Trump won!”
Wife: “20 million people are going to lose their health insurance.”
WA: “Some people don’t deserve health insurance.”

HRC lost our county at 24%.

Jesus. That’s the sad part DD. We live with these people. Some of them are even our friends.

695
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:11:44am

re: #694 HappyWarrior

Jesus. That’s the sad part DD. We live with these people. Some of them are even our friends.

None of those fuckers are my friends, but I damn sure mean to understand them.

696
HappyWarrior  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:12:45am

re: #695 Decatur Deb

None of those fuckers are my friends, but I damn sure mean to understand them.

Sure we can understand them but we don’t have to sympathize with them either as has been suggested.

697
Decatur Deb  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:14:40am

re: #696 HappyWarrior

Sure we can understand them but we don’t have to sympathize with them either as has been suggested.

I sympathized with the rabid dog I shot in what the kids call my “Atticus Finch Moment”.

698
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:20:55am

re: #685 The Vicious Babushka

I can’t decide which song sucked harder, “Eve of Destruction” or “Ballad of the Green Berets”

Oh, the latter. By miles.

699
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:30:06am

re: #667 Decatur Deb

Are you hearing from your Kampaign Kid?

Have not yet—and the cell # I have for her says mailbox full. I need to get one of my friends on facebook to tell her to call me.

700
gocart mozart  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:38:06am
701
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:39:00am

re: #672 Belafon

Was that further broken down by race?

Not that I can see—the numbers came from CNN exit polling.

Even more to dispell the “it was economic anxiety” bullshit, not only did she win the under $50,000, but also, in aggregate, the under $100,000 total 49% to 45%.

edition.cnn.com

He took 81 fucking percent of white born-again evangelicals, so I don’t ever want to hear another word from those assholes about values or the sanctity of marriage or any of the other crap they spew.

702
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:44:04am

re: #685 The Vicious Babushka

I can’t decide which song sucked harder, “Eve of Destruction” or “Ballad of the Green Berets”

Definitely “Green Berets”

Eve of Destruction was totally annoying, but did contain some truths (that are, sadly, even more evident today)

Hate your next door neighbor but don’t forget to say grace

703
Tigger2  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:47:41am

re: #593 Edge of a dream AKA Cankles Mccellulite

WikiLeaks Mocks Dems after election loss

msn.com

Fuck those Russian pimps.

704
BeachDem  Nov 10, 2016 • 10:48:12am

re: #693 Decatur Deb

Wife’s Acquaintance: “Yaa! Trump won!”
Wife: “20 million people are going to lose their health insurance.”
WA: “Some people don’t deserve health insurance.”

HRC lost our county at 24%.

Brother-in-law’s friend: I voted from Trump, but I was really voting for Pence, because I really like Pence’s view.

Brother-in-law: But you’re gay.

Brother-in-law’s friend: Huh? (accompanied by blank stare)

705
sagehen  Nov 10, 2016 • 11:53:59am

re: #423 Jayleia

I also disagree that he had a real vision or strategy, other than a populism based off of pure malice.

It only played out in his favor, because there are fewer better angels of our nature than we thought there were.

It only played out in his favor because FSB and FBI worked together to ensure the election of someone who the CIA, NSA and entire foreign policy establishment, of both parties, believes to be dangerously incompetent.

706
sagehen  Nov 10, 2016 • 12:11:17pm

re: #451 Franklin

IF THIS DOESN’T SCARE THE SHIT OUT OF YOU I DON’T KNOW WHAT WILL.

[Embedded content]

This is the same guy that LAST WEEK was tweeting about the need for torches and pitchforks if his candidate didn’t win?!


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