A Renewed Commitment to Nonviolence

MLK Day 2017
Opinion • Views: 40,150

“Nonviolence is a powerful and just weapon, which cuts without wounding and ennobles the man who wields it. It is a sword that heals.”-Martin Luther King, Jr.

As a student at UCLA, I had the extreme fortune to study Nonviolence and Social Movements under the iconic Reverend James Lawson. In this class we learned not only about the civil disobedience actions he led during the lunch counter sit-ins and freedom rides that are such an integral part of the Civil Rights struggle in America, we also learned about Gandhi, the Polish Solidarity movement, and the DREAMERs. Of all the courses I took in college, this one made the most lasting impression on me. I walked away from that course with a strong conviction that nonviolence is the only way to go about effecting social change.

As we prepare to inaugurate Donald Trump, many of us are looking towards the future and anticipating the need to come together for rallies, protest and civil disobedience. We have already seen a taste of this during and after the election, when thousands of people took to the streets all over the country to protest the election of a person who is so reviled. What we saw in these first protests of the Trump era was the eruption of violence, and even some isolated incidences of rioting. While the vast majority of the people protesting were peaceful, the evening news and social media focused on the violence. If our goal is to win people over to our point of view, violence and destruction of property is antithetical to our movement. It is imperative that we train a new generation of activists on the importance of nonviolent civil disobedience and on how to respond to violence that they face during their civic actions.

If what I am seeing with online organizing comes to fruition over the next few years, our “slacktivism” is about to turn into sustained activism. And I am afraid we are wholly unprepared for this moment in time. We must understand that the people who were part of effective social change in the past were trained and disciplined in the art of nonviolence. Reverend Lawson and his counterparts spent months preparing for their sit-ins. They planned everything that they could plan, down to how they should dress, and they anticipated and prepared for the responses they knew they would get. They took turns playing the role of agitator and agitated, they made people commit to responding to provocations with peace.

As I prepare to attend my local Women’s March on January 21st, I have been trying to find videos of nonviolent civil disobedience training. I have been looking for short videos which I can spread to fellow marchers which teach not only the principles of nonviolent resistance, but actually show situations that marchers may face, and illustrate the proper way to respond. I haven’t had any luck finding such videos. If you have a talent for making informative and entertaining videos, you could do us all a real service by producing some training videos for #TheResistance. If you plan to get involved in this movement, educate yourself on peaceful social movements of the past. Find people who can train you, and your friends, and your activist groups. If we want this movement to be successful, if we want to win hearts and minds of our fellow Americans, we need to reinvest in the philosophy of Dr. King and nonviolence.

“When they go low, we go high.” — Michelle Obama

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167 comments

1
wrenchwench  Jan 16, 2017 • 4:26:42pm
I have been looking for short videos which I can spread to fellow marchers which teach not only the principles of nonviolent resistance, but actually show situations that marchers may face, and illustrate the proper way to respond.

They gotta be out there somewhere. All I can find is history books, which would be some help, especially in the context of a discussion group. Some here. One here (maybe more, look around.)

Those who taught us seem to be rather old now. I don’t know where the successors are. (I’m so old, there were no ‘DREAMERs’ when I was in class.) You sound like you could write the script. Then the need is to find the video-making talent and equipment. It’s much easier to find ‘social justice’ teaching materials than ones on non-violence.

It will be a long haul. It is an on-going battle. Let’s do it non-violently. Thanks for the Page.

2
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:04:08pm

Non-violence is a weapon when all the other side wants to do is fight.

3
Charles Johnson  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:06:46pm
4
I Would Prefer Not To  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:08:03pm

re: #3 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Wow. How does someone like this get through life? Graduate from school? Have any friends?

5
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:09:02pm

I am all but certain that there will be violence.

At the Trump inauguration or at some rally or protest. And regardless of how it originates or why, it will be blamed on people opposing Trump and held up as proof of their hatred and intolerance, to be followed by cries of “We cannot be expected to stand idly by while Leftists are ruining our country…”

And that will be the end of any last trace of civil political discourse in our nation.

6
The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:10:22pm

Sounds like it’s high time to ressurect the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee.

7
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:10:37pm

re: #4 I Would Prefer Not To

Wow. How does someone like this get through life? Graduate from school? Have any friends?

No end of people to associate with who share those views…

8
The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:13:11pm

re: #3 Charles Johnson

9
electrotek  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:13:45pm

re: #8 The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)

Someone is channeling their inner Breivik. Fucking Hell.

10
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:15:51pm

re: #5 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

According to Daily Kos, O’Keeffe has been caught attempting to pay people to start something.

11
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:16:05pm

By the way, welcome, hatchling. Congrats on the promotion.

12
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:18:36pm

“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

13
unproven innocence  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:19:20pm

re: #12 Eclectic Cyborg

Gandhi?

14
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:20:11pm

I will say it’s enouraging that Trump’s election has thrust into political action many people who otherwise wouldn’t be so passionate.

Apathy is seldom a winning move.

15
The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:20:17pm

Also, completely OT, I think Grocery Outlet has it in for me. Cherry Garcia icecream bars at two for a dollar? Are you trying to kill me?

16
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:20:22pm

re: #13 unproven innocence

Gandhi?

Yep.

17
Bass Reeves  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:20:36pm

I sometimes wonder if the overt focusing of the CRM on MLK is used to divert attention from other players in the period? MLK was vocal and strident and nonviolent, others who had a significant impact were not. I will ponder this anew when I drive by the intersection of MLK and Malcom X on my way off of work.

But really, I think people romanticize MLK’s legacy to the point where they…underestimate…how much at least the fear of violence contributed to what we consider progress in the country.

**I am not advocating violence, just bemused by this continual renewal towards nonviolence by people who are just not inclined to be violent in the first place.

18
TedStriker  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:20:40pm

re: #13 unproven innocence

Gandhi?

Not quite, though it’s often (mis)attributed to him:

snopes.com

19
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:22:34pm

re: #18 TedStriker

Not quite, though it often (mis)attributed to him:

snopes.com

Whoops. My bad. That’s what I get for trusting the first Google result.

20
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:23:11pm

re: #17 Bass Reeves

I sometimes wonder if the overt focusing of the CRM on MLK is used to divert attention from other players in the period? MLK was vocal and strident and nonviolent, others who had a significant impact were not. I will ponder this anew when I drive by the intersection of MLK and Malcom X on my way off of work.

But really, I think people romanticize MLK’s legacy to the point where they…underestimate…how much at least the fear of violence contributed to what we consider progress in the country.

**I am not advocating violence, just bemused by this continual renewal towards nonviolence by people who are just not inclined to be violent in the first place.

Individuals vs mobs. A mob is an animal, and has its own instincts sometimes different than the individual.

21
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:25:15pm
22
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:26:00pm

Still more OT, I know.

SPmHZBhifvti5XpymCxKBnxJNzS4vCASK3NiwQ2aQe3HwssJYPk6ZRGowyBkzM2S6tqY8ppXQzWEClflmbUB8YxkJtWwCv/wVqmQjZdAfjCzVXKddbAz1tgu07deTSgSqSpWUou1FkGo3G7IswYV0BrBYrWRLMh1pAUuGzcLOKxWYprGyq6tQkQmZKgJlvgwMR16nvR1+lzyrWjA00fFEk0Fnfb00IrSY+PsCwjBrvedf+WvbkCTyoZbxYBiUV8qKyX999JR1XUJ7g92fUpON76kcskCeE8w5whpHFjBweCdewdreJa8KXNXHsyRZIFI

23
TedStriker  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:26:03pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

Whoops. My bad. That’s what I get for trusting the first Google result.

It’s not something that Gandhi said exactly, it was a summary of his philosophy (made decades after his death), combined with a speech made by a union leader named Nicholas Klein in 1914:

And, my friends, in this story you have a history of this entire movement. First they ignore you. Then they ridicule you. And then they attack you and want to burn you. And then they build monuments to you. And that, is what is going to happen to the Amalgamated Clothing Workers of America.

24
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:27:21pm
25
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:27:56pm

Anyone else feel their blood pressure getting gradually higher as the 20th approaches?

26
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:28:17pm
27
unproven innocence  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:28:39pm

re: #19 Eclectic Cyborg

Whoops. My bad. That’s what I get for trusting the first Google result.

Looks like you were close. From the snopes link (in comment #18)

Gandhi’s name has been associated with this quote since at least 1982, when the Workshop Of Nonviolence Institute summed up Gandhi’s philosophy in an issue of WIN Magazine:

Gandhi once observed that every movement goes through four stages: First they ignore you; then they abuse you; then they crack down on you and then you win.

The misattributed quote, then, is most likely a combination of Klein’s 1914 speech combined with an attempt to summarize Gandhi’s nonviolent doctrine and philosophy.

28
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:30:45pm

sigh

29
Charles Johnson  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:31:12pm
30
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:33:15pm

re: #29 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Sounds normal.

/

31
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:33:40pm
32
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:33:48pm

re: #28 Backwoods_Sleuth

sigh

[Embedded content]

And how is it that he “answers” to the “voter”? Which voters and by what means?

33
Moebym  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:34:01pm

re: #3 Charles Johnson

I thought Republicans liked war…? But I guess war, to them, is like Nazi-ism: Condemn it as evil, but engage in it anyway and claim it isn’t evil when you do it.

re: #25 Eclectic Cyborg

Anyone else feel their blood pressure getting gradually higher as the 20th approaches?

Yes. So much so I’ve been feeling consistently ill for the past couple of days, and on and off the last two months.

34
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:34:40pm

re: #17 Bass Reeves

I sometimes wonder if the overt focusing of the CRM on MLK is used to divert attention from other players in the period? MLK was vocal and strident and nonviolent, others who had a significant impact were not. I will ponder this anew when I drive by the intersection of MLK and Malcom X on my way off of work.

But really, I think people romanticize MLK’s legacy to the point where they…underestimate…how much at least the fear of violence contributed to what we consider progress in the country.

**I am not advocating violence, just bemused by this continual renewal towards nonviolence by people who are just not inclined to be violent in the first place.

The training in the philosophy is needed to avoid hitting back, not hitting in the first place. The renewal would be for those who now fear being hit.

The strategy is always up for renewal. New tactics are needed where the old ones have been adjusted to by the opponents. They used to try to fill the jails to bung things up, but then the police would just put everybody on a bus, write them each a citation, and let them go.

And when the opponents are shooting, not using dogs and bats, new strategies and training are needed.

35
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:35:53pm

re: #32 Sir John Barron

And how is it that he “answers” to the “voter”? Which voters and by what means?

I believe he’s gonna find out in 2019, if not sooner.

36
Hecuba's daughter  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:39:40pm

re: #35 Backwoods_Sleuth

I believe he’s gonna find out in 2019, if not sooner.

Aren’t you making the unjustified assumption that a majority of voters are intelligent and pay attention to what happens between elections?

37
EmmaAnne  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:40:19pm

re: #17 Bass Reeves

I am really skeptical that marches and deonstrations are effective at all anymore. They seem like a ritual we go through to show we care, and the polititians cordially ignore them.

A representative from Colorado, Mike Coffman, has no trouble ignoring such things, but he was seriously unnerved when an unexpected number of people showed up to his last town hall.

I am going to the Women’s March in Denver on Saturday, but that is the only one. My energy is going towards calling and writing and showing up where the politians are.

38
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:40:49pm

re: #36 Hecuba’s daughter

Aren’t you making the unjustified assumption that a majority of voters are intelligent and pay attention to what happens between elections?

Bevin can just ask Ernie Fletcher how well that plan works.

39
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:40:59pm
40
unproven innocence  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:41:55pm

re: #34 wrenchwench

The training in the philosophy is needed to avoid hitting back, not hitting in the first place. The renewal would be for those who now fear being hit.

The strategy is always up for renewal. New tactics are needed where the old ones have been adjusted to by the opponents. They used to try to fill the jails to bung things up, but then the police would just put everybody on a bus, write them each a citation, and let them go.

And when the opponents are shooting, not using dogs and bats, new strategies and training are needed.

They stopped being peaceful when they started kicking and throwing the teargas grenades back.

41
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:42:37pm

re: #37 EmmaAnne

Sometimes you march, sometimes you sit at the front of the bus.

42
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:42:54pm
43
ObserverArt  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:43:02pm

re: #11 wrenchwench

By the way, welcome, hatchling. Congrats on the promotion.

Yeah welcome EWhite!

I like you avatar image. Looks like the little one is playfully attacking the back of your head. Cute kid, nice setting.

44
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:43:26pm

re: #25 Eclectic Cyborg

Anyone else feel their blood pressure getting gradually higher as the 20th approaches?

LN1ctcRsbrHErXEtZD/O9euY5EyoXm0Ofk6HJXUFQMjfQI0IQj5+yOKdvT98XJSz9ASv97nGBThIlcVsaNe0SBzGT2NOApaTywXV23SoRHwt+FY6tWTIZW1IuybrkNFF7w4GSmo3kG/2uPYki0Hi3igwvDOUrEHBkFow21eq7z8=

45
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:46:16pm

oh…

gonna need popcorn.

46
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:47:41pm

re: #25 Eclectic Cyborg

Anyone else feel their blood pressure getting gradually higher as the 20th approaches?

Don’t get mad. Get active. No retreat. No surrender.

The line must be drawn here. Here and no further. The GOP won in November for a whole host of reasons, but they didn’t win a majority of the vote. They don’t have a mandate, and they certainly have no plan for what to do that fulfills their obligation to protect and defend the nation from threats foreign and domestic or to protect the General Welfare. Repealing Obamacare/ACA would be a direct violation of the constitutional requirement for the Congress to act to protect the general welfare (Art 1, Sec 8). The GOP ignoring all the Trump ties to Putin, along with the Russian actions in shaping the election outcome is a direct threat to the US (and ignoring, or delaying action to investigate, is a violation of these officials’ oath of office).

Oh, and when that fails - I’m the mutherfucking guns of the Navarone. I’m superfly TNT. /

47
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:48:30pm
48
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:50:30pm

re: #36 Hecuba’s daughter

Aren’t you making the unjustified assumption that a majority of voters are intelligent and pay attention to what happens between elections?

The ones whose kids can’t get jobs or into grad school because their UofL degrees are worthless will certainly know.

49
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:53:04pm

A lot of Kentucky voters might not be too smart, but crap like this is going to backfire on Bevin. That includes the blatant lies about bringing back all those coal jobs, taking away people’s health insurance, and that new right-to-work law he just signed. Shit like that hits people in their wallets.
This thing about UofL’s accreditation is going to hit the university’s athletic programs very hard. You do NOT mess with Kentucky sports.

50
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:55:09pm
51
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:56:37pm

re: #28 Backwoods_Sleuth

sigh

[Embedded content]

Also, let’s talk about Hillary’s email corruption.

/

52
Skip Intro  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:58:03pm

Useful term to know these days.

53
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 12:59:48pm

re: #49 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

A lot of Kentucky voters might not be too smart, but crap like this is going to backfire on Bevin. That includes the blatant lies about bringing back all those coal jobs, taking away people’s health insurance, and that new right-to-work law he just signed. Shit like that hits people in their wallets.
This thing about UofL’s accreditation is going to hit the university’s athletic programs very hard. You do NOT mess with Kentucky sports.

Look, who cares about the accreditation as long as they can still field a football and basketball team.

54
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:00:10pm

An Avenger SAM launch vehicle is now at the DAPL drill pad at the Standing Rock reservation.

Yes, the drill/pipeline company now has US army anti aircraft artillery to use against Native American protesters and their super dangerous camera drones.

55
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:00:23pm

re: #10 Belafon

According to Daily Kos, O’Keeffe has been caught attempting to pay people to start something.

They don’t need to pay people, just drop enough hints about what “needs to be done”…

56
Charles Johnson  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:00:46pm
57
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:01:30pm

Blast from the past (this is from 2014, and yes, this is Trump’s official account):

He really does think people who aren’t agreeing with him (haters and losers) are fuckups.

There’s some projection there - so far beyond IMAX that it’s splitting atoms with his mind.

58
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:02:52pm
59
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:03:04pm

re: #57 lawhawk

Blast from the past (this is from 2014, and yes, this is Trump’s official account):

[Embedded content]

He really does think people who aren’t agreeing with him (haters and losers) are fuckups.

There’s some projection there - so far beyond IMAX that it’s splitting atoms with his mind.

Also wonderful gutter language for our evangelical hero.

60
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:03:21pm

re: #7 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

No end of people to associate with who share those views…

And they’re all projecting their hatred onto normal people, pretending the people they want to kill want to kill them.

61
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:03:48pm
62
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:04:09pm

re: #56 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

So the deplorables are continuing their hatefest of Ana Navarro, too? That’s comforting.

/

63
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:04:29pm

re: #47 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Car registration is for mostly for tax purposes. Gun registration list have, historically, been used for confiscation in the past.

A better tack might be to have a “gun owner” registration (like voter registration!). The government doesn’t have to know what you own, but you are registered as a law abiding owner.

64
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:04:36pm

re: #61 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Not anything weird or bizarre about this.

/////

65
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:05:05pm

re: #56 Charles Johnson

66
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:05:52pm
67
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:05:53pm

re: #10 Belafon

According to Daily Kos, O’Keeffe has been caught attempting to pay people to start something.

This is fine. What’s outrageous is George Soros paying people to do stuff like protest which we know confirmed FACT.

///

68
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:07:05pm

latest accuser:

69
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:09:15pm

re: #68 Backwoods_Sleuth

latest accuser woman to be torn down with personal attacks, called names and receive anonymous death threats:

Former Apprentice contestant files defamation suit against Donald Trump

70
The Vicious Babushka  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:10:28pm

#Questions4Betsy

71
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:11:57pm

re: #37 EmmaAnne

I am really skeptical that marches and deonstrations are effective at all anymore. They seem like a ritual we go through to show we care, and the polititians cordially ignore them.

Getting news coverage can open some eyes. That’s almost always part of the planning.

72
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:12:35pm
73
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:13:13pm

re: #71 wrenchwench

Getting news coverage can open some eyes. That’s almost always part of the planning.

Trump owns the News Coverage. Nobody is going to risk airing things that might piss him off…

74
Patricia Kayden  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:13:14pm

re: #5 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I am all but certain that there will be violence.

At the Trump inauguration or at some rally or protest. And regardless of how it originates or why, it will be blamed on people opposing Trump and held up as proof of their hatred and intolerance, to be followed by cries of “We cannot be expected to stand idly by while Leftists are ruining our country…”

And that will be the end of any last trace of civil political discourse in our nation.

There were multiple incidents of videotaped violence against protesters at Trump rallies — many of which were encouraged by Trump himself. That was the end of civil political discourse in our nation. That is what was rewarded when Trump became President.

75
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:13:42pm

re: #70 The Vicious Babushka

#Questions4Betsy

[Embedded content]

and she still hasn’t paid the $5.3 million fine from 2008 for violating campaign finance laws in Ohio.

76
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:13:49pm

re: #54 Scottish Dragon

Talk about harkening back to the Colorado mining strikes.

77
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:13:57pm

re: #73 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Trump owns the News Coverage. Nobody is going to risk airing things that might piss him off…

Bet me.

78
Patricia Kayden  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:14:41pm

re: #72 Scottish Dragon

I guess many of us were naive to think that this was over. Looks like it’s about to get uglier in ND. It’s amazing how protecting a water source could be so controversial given what has happened in Flint, Michigan.

79
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:14:49pm

re: #37 EmmaAnne

I am really skeptical that marches and deonstrations are effective at all anymore. They seem like a ritual we go through to show we care, and the polititians cordially ignore them.

OTOH, silence is acceptance.

80
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:15:08pm

re: #74 Patricia Kayden

There were multiple incidents of videotaped violence against protesters at Trump rallies — many of which were encouraged by Trump himself. That was the end of civil political discourse in our nation. That is what was rewarded when Trump became President.

And that is why I am all but certain it will continue at an even more ramped-up level…Brown-Shirts-in-the-Streets level…

81
makeitstop  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:15:35pm

I haven’t seen this posted yet today.

Popular neo-Nazi blogger resigns over revelation his wife is Jewish

The founder of the popular right-wing blog The Right Stuff resigned over the revelation that his wife is Jewish.

Mike Enoch, who also co-hosts “The Daily Shoah” weekly podcast, was outed over the weekend as Mike Peinovich, a website developer from New York. On the podcast, which has about 100,000 regular listeners, Peinovich as Enoch talked about killing Jews and spouted neo-Nazi invective.

The release of Peinovich’s personal details came after the identities of the other podcast panelists were made public earlier in the week by a rival website called 8chan. The invented surname reportedly is a reference to Enoch Powell, a far-right British politician and Nazi sympathizer.

82
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:15:43pm

re: #77 wrenchwench

Bet me.

I do not like to wager over other people’s misfortune.

83
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:16:57pm

re: #70 The Vicious Babushka

I don’t know, but when I see Devos, I automatically think that’s misspelling of Davros. /Dr Who reference.

84
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:17:02pm

re: #74 Patricia Kayden

There were multiple incidents of videotaped violence against protesters at Trump rallies — many of which were encouraged by Trump himself. That was the end of civil political discourse in our nation. That is what was rewarded when Trump became President.

The conservative closed universe believes only that liberals were attacking and beating Trump supporters outside the rallies. I saw this shit again at Dreher’s place yesterday. Of course, the sources for these claims are always the usual cast of Albanian bot farms and Infowars, but it will be used to justify retaliation and assaults or shootings of liberal protesters.

85
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:18:58pm

re: #70 The Vicious Babushka

#Questions4Betsy

[Embedded content]

“Well, I hate them. Does that count?”

/

86
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:18:59pm

Not sure I agree with the commutation, but there it is.

87
electrotek  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:19:48pm

This was last seen in Playa Del Carmen and the narcos are calling out the organizer of the BPM Festival. Anyone good with Spanish here?

88
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:19:57pm

re: #82 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I do not like to wager over other people’s misfortune.

You sure seem to enjoy talking up the possibilities, though. Don’t make me bite my tongue so much.

89
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:20:01pm

YIKES!

90
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:20:01pm

re: #84 Scottish Dragon

The conservative closed universe believes only that liberals were attacking and beating Trump supporters outside the rallies. I saw this shit again at Dreher’s place yesterday. Of course, the sources for these claims are always the usual cast of Albanian bot farms and Infowars, but it will be used to justify retaliation and assaults or shootings of liberal protesters.

Having black skin used to be enough to justify retaliation.

I know we all want this to go away and come out with the good side on top. But it isn’t going to go away on its own.

91
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:20:21pm

re: #78 Patricia Kayden

I guess many of us were naive to think that this was over. Looks like it’s about to get uglier in ND. It’s amazing how protecting a water source could be so controversial given what has happened in Flint, Michigan.

They have the money to buy the best weapons and troops around.

And I’m saying that as a former 67V army soldier.

USMC General Smedley Butler was right:

“I served in all commissioned ranks from second lieutenant to Major General. And during that period I spent most of my time being a high-class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and for the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer for capitalism. I suspected I was just part of the racket all the time. Now I am sure of it.”

92
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:20:47pm

re: #86 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Not sure I agree with the commutation, but there it is.

I don’t necessarily agree either, but she has at least served time for it so I am of mixed mind and am neither outraged or enthusiastic about it.

93
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:21:27pm

re: #86 lawhawk

Thank God.

And Obama…

94
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:23:20pm

Trump supporters yo! Yeah, President Trump will move the date of the Super Bowl. Because that’s truly what’s important in life.

Same with the nitwits who voted for Trump but wanted to keep Obamacare, support for Planned Parenthood, abortion rights, birth control, and voting rights.

95
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:23:40pm

re: #81 makeitstop

96
The Vicious Babushka  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:23:59pm
97
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:24:21pm

re: #94 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Trump supporters yo! Yeah, President Trump will move the date of the Super Bowl. Because that’s truly what’s important in life.

Same with the nitwits who voted for Trump but wanted to keep Obamacare, support for Planned Parenthood, abortion rights, birth control, and voting rights.

Magical thinking.

98
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:24:48pm

Manning did her time - she was convicted for the crimes of passing classified info to Wikileaks.

Assange is holed up in an embassy to escape justice for allegedly raping a woman.
Snowden is holed up in Russia as a Putin puppet to avoid facing justice in the US for his crimes of passing on classified info.

One of these is not like the rest.

99
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:25:18pm

re: #86 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Not sure I agree with the commutation, but there it is.

I think her mental health may have played a large part in the decision.

100
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:25:55pm

re: #89 Backwoods_Sleuth

YIKES!

[Embedded content]

101
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:26:24pm
102
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:26:28pm

re: #99 Backwoods_Sleuth

I think her mental health may have played a large part in the decision.

The sentence was overly harsh IMO. Murderers have gotten less time.

103
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:26:40pm

re: #88 wrenchwench

You sure seem to enjoy talking up the possibilities, though. Don’t make me bite my tongue so much.

I am just expressing a serious concern. It has happened before and I see no signs of any willingness to end it: too many of the wrong sort of people feel that it would advance their agenda.

104
Patricia Kayden  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:26:42pm

re: #89 Backwoods_Sleuth

So Black Conservatives are okay with using racist terms against Black people? Alrighty then.

105
makeitstop  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:27:16pm

re: #94 lawhawk

Trump supporters yo! Yeah, President Trump will move the date of the Super Bowl. Because that’s truly what’s important in life.

The other day I posted a story about a guy being busted with guns & ammo out here and made a mention of ‘methland.’

Medford is pretty much the home plate of methland.

106
The Ghost of Senator Incitatus  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:28:46pm

re: #99 Backwoods_Sleuth

I think her mental health may have played a large part in the decision.

The decision to put her constantly on solitary as well, I suspect. At some point, the decisions made by her minders cross beyond normal punishment and into cruel and unusual.

107
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:30:16pm

re: #105 makeitstop

The other day I posted a story about a guy being busted with guns & ammo out here and made a mention of ‘methland.’

Medford is pretty much the home plate of methland.

I lived there for one summer when I was apprenticing with Oregon State Ballet in Ashland back in 1991.

Medford was one really fucked up little city.

108
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:30:27pm

re: #104 Patricia Kayden

So Black Conservatives are okay with using racist terms against Black people? Alrighty then.

Conservative black people. Just like Conservative Christians, it’s the insane politics that they identify with, and they never get to the religion or racial identity part of what they call themselves.

It’s funny that he’s so Conservative that he uses archaic racist terms.

109
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:30:42pm
110
Charles Johnson  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:31:14pm
111
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:31:54pm
112
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:32:03pm

re: #109 Backwoods_Sleuth

113
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:32:12pm
114
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:32:59pm

re: #103 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I am just expressing a serious concern. It has happened before and I see no signs of any willingness to end it: too many of the wrong sort of people feel that it would advance their agenda.

I may call out for some specifics when you express your serious concerns.

Brown-Shirts-in-the-Streets level

…for instance. When and where?

115
petesh  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:33:33pm

re: #6 The Madness of King Orange (aka Sophist)

Sounds like it’s high time to ressurect the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee.

There might just be someone around who could advise on that. Point of fact, there are actually lots.

116
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:34:10pm

re: #73 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Trump owns the News Coverage. Nobody is going to risk airing things that might piss him off…

No, he doesn’t. He’s managing to piss off the press more and more each day. Fox and the right wing alt media might bend a knee for him but the others I highly doubt will. This is the United States, not Russia. The first time he orders a journalist or blogger arrested for reporting something negative about him will be a bridge to far.

117
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:35:12pm

re: #89 Backwoods_Sleuth

YIKES!

[Embedded content]

You’re a lackey for Republicans. What’s your point, Sheriff?

118
makeitstop  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:35:23pm

re: #107 Scottish Dragon

I lived there for one summer when I was apprenticing with Oregon State Ballet in Ashland back in 1991.

Medford was one really fucked up little city.

Oh, not Oregon (though I’ll take your word or it). This is Medford, NY on Long Island.

119
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:36:09pm

re: #116 Bubblehead II

No, he doesn’t. He’s managing to piss off the press more and more each day. Fox and the right wing alt media might bend a knee for him but the others I highly doubt will. This is the United States, not Russia. The first time he orders a journalist or blogger arrested for reporting something negative about him will be a bridge to far.

Keep in mind, however, that he (and 40 years of GOP propaganda) has already primed his own believers to not only refuse to believe the MSM but to actively hate them.

120
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:36:20pm

re: #118 makeitstop

Oh, not Oregon (though I’ll take your word or it). This is Medford, NY on Long Island.

LOL…

121
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:36:22pm

re: #114 wrenchwench

I may call out for some specifics when you express your serious concerns.

…for instance. When and where?

I will admit that was rhetorical flourish, but Trump has actively encouraged violence at his rallies, why should he stop now?

122
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:36:51pm

re: #116 Bubblehead II

No, he doesn’t. He’s managing to piss off the press more and more each day. Fox and the right wing alt media might bend a knee for him but the others I highly doubt will. This is the United States, not Russia. The first time he orders a journalist or blogger arrested for reporting something negative about him will be a bridge to far.

The Conservative goal seems to be to turn us into Russia. They like the totalitarianism and bigotry. The rest of us will keep fighting, but Trump has millions of morons that will defend him against anything, and pretend the media that criticize him are fake-news.

123
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:36:51pm

Bevin probably forgets that Ernie Fletcher also thought he was above the law but still was indicted for shenanigans while he was governor.

124
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:36:52pm

re: #118 makeitstop

Oh, not Oregon (though I’ll take your word or it). This is Medford, NY on Long Island.

Yet another opportunity for the NPR intern to make a cross-country wrong-way trip!

125
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:37:07pm

re: #119 Scottish Dragon

Keep in mind, however, that he (and 40 years of GOP propaganda) has already primed his own believers to not only refuse to believe the MSM but to actively hate them.

While true, these people don’t even make up the majority of the Trump voters.

126
makeitstop  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:37:18pm

re: #120 Scottish Dragon

LOL…

Although our Medford is pretty messed up, too.

127
lawhawk  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:37:22pm

That this needs to be stated shows how little people pay attention to details.

Manning wasn’t pardoned. Her sentence was reduced. She’s still a convicted felon for stealing and passing classified intel on to Wikileaks. You can disagree with reducing the length of her sentence (and it’s likely the result of conditions of her treatment), but this was not a pardon. She’s still guilty.

128
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:37:22pm

re: #86 lawhawk

Not sure I agree with the commutation, but there it is.

I was wondering what all the loud popping noise was. Wingnut heads exploding.

129
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:37:23pm

Gonna lay down for a bit. Had a really good day subbing a for a drama teacher at a nearby Jr High. Great kids in all classes, which is not real common.

130
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:38:03pm

re: #119 Scottish Dragon

Keep in mind, however, that he (and 40 years of GOP propaganda) has already primed his own believers to not only refuse to believe the MSM but to actively hate them.

At least a quarter of the country is in a hoax-media-driven cult. This will make it hard to address real problems, when they can’t engage with reality enough to even perceive real problems.

131
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:38:25pm

re: #116 Bubblehead II

No, he doesn’t. He’s managing to piss off the press more and more each day. Fox and the right wing alt media might bend a knee for him but the others I highly doubt will. This is the United States, not Russia. The first time he orders a journalist or blogger arrested for reporting something negative about him will be a bridge to far.

I wish. It is not fear of a dictator’s reprisal that keeps them in line, it is fear of a flagging bottom line. Trump knows how to exploit that fear.

Just like he knows how to get contractors to settle for pennies on the dollar rather than risk getting nothing at all.

I am going into a pessimistic tailspin here as the 20th approaches…I truly hope that things do not turn out this bad.

132
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:39:38pm

re: #122 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

The Conservative goal seems to be to turn us into Russia. They like the totalitarianism and bigotry. The rest of us will keep fighting, but Trump has millions of morons that will defend him against anything, and pretend the media that criticize him are fake-news.

Don’t forget the quasi-state religion as well. Dreher loves that about Russia: Orthodox Christianity is state supported and protected!!!!!!!

He couldn’t wait for the girls in Pussy Riot to be sent to the Lubyanka to rot.

For trespassing.

133
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:39:47pm

re: #121 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I will admit that was rhetorical flourish, but Trump has actively encouraged violence at his rallies, why should he stop now?

I don’t expect anything good out of Trump. I also expect the rhetorical flourishes to be more insightful and less inciteful.

134
The Vicious Babushka  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:40:08pm

Why would the US even want to extradite Assange? He’s wanted by Sweden.

135
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:40:35pm

LOLOLOLOL

136
Scottish Dragon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:40:56pm

re: #133 wrenchwench

I don’t expect anything good out of Trump. I also expect the rhetorical flourishes to be more insightful and less inciteful.

Upding for general clever turn of phrase. :)

137
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:42:15pm

re: #124 wrenchwench

Yet another opportunity for the NPR intern to make a cross-country wrong-way trip!

My favorite was the British couple who drove to Nuremberg (in Bavaria, SE Germany,) looking for a concert at the Nurburg Ring, (in the Rhineland-Palatinate in West-Central Germany) 450 miles and 4 hours’ drive away.

138
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:42:16pm

re: #136 Scottish Dragon

Upding for general clever turn of phrase. :)

Speelchecker called me out for one of those. :)

139
Tyrion  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:42:17pm

re: #135 Backwoods_Sleuth

LOLOLOLOL

Guess that means he’s not going to be on his own show anymore.

140
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:43:00pm
141
austin_blue  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:45:57pm

re: #89 Backwoods_Sleuth

YIKES!

[Embedded content]

That man is stone crazy.

142
allegro  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:46:39pm

re: #140 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Blossom would upding that as well but she doesn’t have an account.

143
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:48:15pm
144
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:48:35pm

re: #142 allegro

Blossom would upding that as well but she doesn’t have an account.

I was thinking of Blossom when I saw it!

145
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:51:27pm

A Republican congresswoman was booed on Monday during a Martin Luther King Jr. Day speech where she discussed Republican plans for repealing ObamaCare.

The crowd called Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers (R-Wash.) a “liar” and chanted about saving healthcare during a speech in Spokane, Wash., the radio station KXLY reports.

McMorris Rodgers, chairwoman of the House Republican Conference, has been a strong proponent of repealing outgoing President Obama’s healthcare law.

146
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:53:01pm

re: #110 Charles Johnson

147
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:55:50pm

re: #145 Backwoods_Sleuth

Angry crowd shouts “liar” at GOP lawmaker during speech on ObamaCare repeal

How rude and disrespectful.

148
Belafon  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:56:37pm

re: #147 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

How rude and disrespectful.

I agree, she shouldn’t be lying.

149
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 1:59:27pm

re: #119 Scottish Dragon

Keep in mind, however, that he (and 40 years of GOP propaganda) has already primed his own believers to not only refuse to believe the MSM but to actively hate them.

Understood. But also take into account that the MSM gets a lot of their breaking news stories from local affiliates. The locals where these incidents may occur will have more trust in their local stations/paper than they would a national organization.

150
GlutenFreeJesus  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:00:18pm

re: #10 Belafon

According to Daily Kos, O’Keeffe has been caught attempting to pay people to start something.

He can pay me. And I’d take the $ and run.

151
nines09  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:02:24pm
152
makeitstop  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:03:54pm

re: #151 nines09

[Embedded content]

Video

I always liked that song. I did it in a band for a while.

153
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:03:57pm

re: #122 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

The Conservative goal seems to be to turn us into Russia. They like the totalitarianism and bigotry. The rest of us will keep fighting, but Trump has millions of morons that will defend him against anything, and pretend the media that criticize him are fake-news.

True, but we rank in the millions as well (and if the popular vote is any to go by, outnumber them by at least 3 million).

154
Timothy Watson  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:04:15pm

re: #140 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

“Fuck this shit! And this shit! And this shit too!”

155
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:04:35pm

re: #147 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

How rude and disrespectful.

Obama-thugs.

/

156
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:05:34pm

It’s never simple.

157
GlutenFreeJesus  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:06:09pm

re: #37 EmmaAnne

I am really skeptical that marches and deonstrations are effective at all anymore. They seem like a ritual we go through to show we care, and the polititians cordially ignore them.

A representative from Colorado, Mike Coffman, has no trouble ignoring such things, but he was seriously unnerved when an unexpected number of people showed up to his last town hall.

I am going to the Women’s March in Denver on Saturday, but that is the only one. My energy is going towards calling and writing and showing up where the politians are.

Protests are going to have to be local at their offices where they think they are safe from scorn.

158
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:06:17pm

re: #145 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

the replacement plan will be “terrific”.

159
Sir John Barron  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:08:13pm

re: #101 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

can’t be certain but sounds an awful lot like no f**ks to give, Obama.

160
Mike Lamb  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:08:39pm

re: #127 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

That this needs to be stated shows how little people pay attention to details.

Manning wasn’t pardoned. Her sentence was reduced. She’s still a convicted felon for stealing and passing classified intel on to Wikileaks. You can disagree with reducing the length of her sentence (and it’s likely the result of conditions of her treatment), but this was not a pardon. She’s still guilty.

Right…ask someone who was commuted vs. pardoned how that little distinction impacts getting a job…

161
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:09:28pm

re: #131 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

I wish. It is not fear of a dictator’s reprisal that keeps them in line, it is fear of a flagging bottom line. Trump knows how to exploit that fear.

Just like he knows how to get contractors to settle for pennies on the dollar rather than risk getting nothing at all.

I am going into a pessimistic tailspin here as the 20th approaches…I truly hope that things do not turn out this bad.

I’m not. The shit gibbon is so full of himself that he will do something so outrageous that the republican House and Senate will have no choice but to impeach. Hell, they will probably help him do it so they can get Pence in as POTUS. If that happens, then I will start to worry.

162
Bubblehead II  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:11:09pm

re: #134 The Vicious Babushka

Why would the US even want to extradite Assange? He’s wanted by Sweden.

Ummm, his outfit published classified material from both Manning and Snowden perhaps?

163
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:13:54pm

re: #161 Bubblehead II

I’m not. The shit gibbon is so full of himself that he will do something so outrageous that the republican House and Senate will have no choice but to impeach. Hell, they will probably help him do it so they can get Pence in as POTUS. If that happens, then I will start to worry.

Exactly. Truly a rock and a hard place. Pence is not as likely to inadvertently start a shooting war, he will be too busy declaring war on all the gains that we have made (and taken for granted) in personal freedoms, women’s, LGBT and minority rights over the past 50 years…

164
wrenchwench  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:14:16pm

I got a phone call from the guy who picked up his AirDyne yesterday. I saw his name on the caller ID, and said, ‘uh-oh’ before answering. He thanked me for doing a great job. ‘It’s so quiet!’ That’s what matters to AirDyne people. No noises. I thanked him for the call. I’m still the AirDyne queen!

165
William Lewis  Jan 17, 2017 • 2:29:35pm

re: #86 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Not sure I agree with the commutation, but there it is.

I think that’s the most appropriate response. It says she did something wrong but that the sentence given was an obscenity. Hopefully she can get therapy to help with all her issues that was never going to happen in a military jail.

166
Khal Wimpo (no longer entitled to his own facts)  Jan 17, 2017 • 3:30:53pm

re: #87 electrotek

This was last seen in Playa Del Carmen and the narcos are calling out the organizer of the BPM Festival. Anyone good with Spanish here?

[Embedded content]

Yeah, that’s not good. It’s a declaration of war by the most violent drug cartel in Mexico:

(rough translation) “This is proof that we are here. This is just the beginning, we are going to cut the heads off of the narcos in the Gulf Cartel, The Pelones, El Chapo’s guys. We are the Original Ugly Zetas.”

According to the NarcoData site, there is about to be a huge uptick in violence in the area, due to a new formulation of the traditional Black Tar heroin into something that looks like China White (and that thus is marketable in the cities on the East Coast, opening up a multi-billion market).

Look for a lot of bodies to start dropping in the next six months.

167
JP Chgo  Jan 18, 2017 • 12:18:00pm

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