Confirmed: The Investigation of Russian Interference Into the Election Is Now Focusing on Jared Kushner

Trump innermost circle
Politics • Views: 36,194

You don’t get much deeper into Donald Trump’s inner circle than this.

Investigators are focusing on a series of meetings held by Jared Kushner, President Trump’s son-in-law and an influential White House adviser, as part of their probe into Russian meddling in the 2016 election and related matters, according to people familiar with the investigation.

Kushner, who held meetings in December with the Russian ambassador and a banker from Moscow, is being investigated because of the extent and nature of his interactions with the Russians, the people said.

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294 comments

1
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:06:59pm

Derschowitz was caling this an attack on Jared’s Civli Liberties. Pretty laughable.

2
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 7:08:07pm

First 18 precincts in from Montana, and Quist is ahead by 11% or 2,000 votes.

hosted.ap.org

3
makeitstop  May 25, 2017 • 7:09:32pm

What’s the over-under on Jared just not coming back?

/half

4
Stanley Sea  May 25, 2017 • 7:09:44pm

Gestapo

5
piratedan  May 25, 2017 • 7:10:52pm

somehow I get the feeling that these guys are even less intelligent than the ones that surrounded Nixon. About the only guy that appears savvy enough to have not completely compromised himself (doesn’t mean I don’t think he’s guilty though) is McConnell. If the GOP rank and file can be shamed into facing this treason, it’s going to get incredibly ugly. I fully expect Mr. Putin to protect his investment and we’ll see all manner of crap being dumped in order to give himself a free hand to shape the Rodina as he sees fit.

6
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:11:16pm

re: #4 Stanley Sea

Gestapo

[Embedded content]

And this guys is why I am proud to have the job I do trying to help people get their citizenship.

7
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 7:11:18pm

… And it’s gone. Gianforte now with an 11-point lead or more than 7,500 votes.

8
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 7:11:33pm

re: #309 Charles Johnson

It’s really bad right now. I hope we can pull out of this tail spin, but the bad people have been working on this nightmare for decades and it isn’t going to be easy.

My one-track mind keeps going back to the loss-of-God problem that our society is experiencing.

To a person, every Trumper on my Facebook stream is also highly religious.

I realize there are Trumpers, and those old (R)s who voted for him out of party loyalty, who may not be so religious, but there is a reason Trump so openly courted the likes of Graham Jr. and Falwell Jr. and their compatriots.

The rise of fascism in Europe followed after the disaster of WWI. That disaster also was part of a general decline in Christianity in Europe that had been gaining momentum.

Substantially, we spend our lives trying to not think about death, but it is always in the back of our minds. And so we have to reckon with it somehow. This is the source of power of religion (the other source being a sense of community.)

The ongoing public change in sexual mores has really hit American Christianity hard, more so than anything Darwin had written.

There are many older people in this country who are very uncomfortable with these changes, and this angst was tapped quite well by the Trump machine, who by using the cover of Falwell et. al. got the religious Americans to buy a wolf in sheep’s clothing.

Anyway, the feeling of angst in a population can be exploited by anyone with some skill at marketing.

When we see some who want to be identified as “liberal” pushing all sorts of questionable stories, they too have discovered that there is a market of people who so desire a certain outcome that they will buy a story that delivers it to them, true or not.

This is the heart of the loss-of-God problem: the overwhelming desire to have a story, a good story, told to oneself.

9
FormerDirtDart  May 25, 2017 • 7:12:10pm
10
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 7:12:44pm

Saw this guy twice today. His one eyebrow could kick my ass. Filed this one under “No shit.”

11
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:12:56pm

re: #9 FormerDirtDart

[Embedded content]

Wingnuts are going to be confused. Ties to Thiel, good! TIes to S-S-Soros!, bad!

12
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:13:28pm

re: #10 darthstar

Saw this guy twice today. His one eyebrow could kick my ass. Filed this one under “No shit.”

[Embedded content]

I need to get a shirt that says paralegal then.

13
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 7:14:10pm

re: #5 piratedan

somehow I get the feeling that these guys are even less intelligent than the ones that surrounded Nixon. About the only guy that appears savvy enough to have not completely compromised himself (doesn’t mean I don’t think he’s guilty though) is McConnell. If the GOP rank and file can be shamed into facing this treason, it’s going to get incredibly ugly. I fully expect Mr. Putin to protect his investment and we’ll see all manner of crap being dumped in order to give himself a free hand to shape the Rodina as he sees fit.

His claim not to be compromised could be taken more seriously if he hadn’t pressed for the Administration to hire his wife.

15
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 7:17:39pm
16
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:17:57pm
17
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 7:18:02pm

And at 15% in Quist is back on top. I see there’s a spoiler in the race named Wicks with 6% of the vote.

18
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 7:18:07pm

re: #8 freetoken

… had to edit that missive quite a bit. Started writing it downstairs and poof, a new thread, so had to copy and paste.

Anyway, I expect for the rest of my life that our society is going to yoyo between the fascistic party and just chaos. I don’t see any social movement that will harmonize the competing belief systems in America today. I don’t know if I will see a great war, bigger than Vietnam or Iraq I or Iraq II, say on the scale of WWII, in my lifetime.

19
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 7:18:13pm

re: #12 HappyWarrior

I need to get a shirt that says paralegal then.

But do you have the physique of a paralegal? I do have one that says ‘Data Nerd’ - but I fit the bill so it’s okay. I also have one the EAs at work gave me: “I am an Enterprise Architect. I solve problems you don’t know you have in ways you can’t understand.” Yeah, it’s arrogant, but I only wear it to work.

20
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 7:19:32pm

I want to see Jared get scared, pull a shitload of money out of the bank, and disappear to the Maldives or someplace like that for six months without telling anyone.

21
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 7:20:12pm

re: #19 darthstar

But do you have the physique of a paralegal? I do have one that says ‘Data Nerd’ - but I fit the bill so it’s okay. I also have one the EAs at work gave me: “I am an Enterprise Architect. I solve problems you don’t know you have in ways you can’t understand.” Yeah, it’s arrogant, but I only wear it to work.

Mine says “Software Engineer” with the rest of those words.

22
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:20:43pm

re: #20 darthstar

I saw that White Collar episode!!

23
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:20:45pm

re: #16 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Fuck off Huckleberry. People from all NATO countries answered Article V to help our nation after 9/11. What did your sons do? Oh yeah, they tortured a dog. Those “deadbeats” you talk about are our fucking allies but then again you and Trump care more about Russia than any of our actual allies becaues in Trump’s case, they pander to his giant ego but in your case, it’s ebcause you and Vlad both bond over your shared hate of the idea of gyay people having the same rights as you.

24
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:20:51pm

re: #20 darthstar

He seems more like the “tries to buy several judges” type.

25
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 7:20:51pm

re: #20 darthstar

This may interfere with solving the ME problem and re-inventing the government.

26
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:21:28pm

re: #19 darthstar

But do you have the physique of a paralegal? I do have one that says ‘Data Nerd’ - but I fit the bill so it’s okay. I also have one the EAs at work gave me: “I am an Enterprise Architect. I solve problems you don’t know you have in ways you can’t understand.” Yeah, it’s arrogant, but I only wear it to work.

I don’t know what kind of physique a paralegal would have. I’m a fairly big guy.but not OMG THAT GUY’S BIG.

27
prairiefire  May 25, 2017 • 7:21:39pm

re: #18 freetoken

Anyone can start a Christian church now a days. By skirting the line of consecration since Peter, no one has to be accountable. Allllll kinds of baloney and preying on people’s fears and prejudices.

28
Weaselone  May 25, 2017 • 7:22:05pm

re: #17 Skip Intro

And at 15% in Quist is back on top. I see there’s a spoiler in the race named Wicks with 6% of the vote.

I noticed that too. If I recall, in the governors race there was also a libertarian who basically took the margin of victory (about 4%). Possible that the libertarian siphons enough votes here to put Quist on top?

29
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 7:23:14pm

re: #25 Skip Intro

This may interfer with solving the ME problem and re-inventing the government.

I’m sure he’ll make the same amount of progress either way.

Quist’s lead is down to 1% or 1,710 votes with 18% of precincts reporting. Looks like a lot of lead changes tonight. (I seem to recall that Clinton did better in the early precincts in the D primary than in the later ones, but I’m not sure how that will translate here. I didn’t torture myself by staying up that late in November.)

30
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 7:23:21pm

re: #28 Weaselone

Or the other way around. Wouldn’t be the first time.

31
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:23:25pm

re: #28 Weaselone

I noticed that too. If I recall, in the governors race there was also a libertarian who basically took the margin of victory (about 4%). Possible that the libertarian siphons enough votes here to put Quist on top?

It’s definitely possible.

32
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:24:20pm
33
stpaulbear  May 25, 2017 • 7:24:42pm

Fucking autoplay Arby’s ads. Keeps dragging me to the top of the comments for the duration of the ad.

34
Weaselone  May 25, 2017 • 7:26:13pm

I wish I knew which precincts were reporting.

35
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:26:24pm

re: #32 JordanRules

[Embedded content]

It’s too bad that Jason lost his Senate race because I really like this guy and think he would make a great new addition to the Dem Party. I ehar he’s considering a run for President in 2020 which I think is a mistake. He’s not ready yet but I guess he feels sort of trapped since Missouri just elected a GOP governor and he sure as hell isn’t going to primary Claire Mac.

36
makeitstop  May 25, 2017 • 7:26:47pm

re: #24 jaunte

He seems more like the “tries to buy several judges” type.

He probably still thinks he’s bulletproof and will probably end up doing something really stupid. The pressure in the Man-Baby’s inner circle must be crushing right now, and they’re about due for some epic mistake.

Guess we’re going to have to put off peace in the Middle East for a while.

37
Nyet  May 25, 2017 • 7:26:56pm

re: #33 stpaulbear

Fucking autoplay Arby’s ads. Keeps dragging me to the top of the comments for the duration of the ad.

38
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 7:27:01pm

re: #32 JordanRules

[Embedded content]

Someone should tell Jared he won’t really get to take over the family business until he proves he can take one for the team.

39
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:27:46pm

Same.

40
Aucun pays pour les vieux ennemis  May 25, 2017 • 7:28:02pm

re: #16 jaunte

41
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:29:18pm

The Fourth Circuit as you guys know upheld the injunction against the immigration ban today. Can’t wait to hear how they’er just a bunch of liberals anyhow.

42
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:29:24pm

re: #34 Weaselone

mtelectionresults.gov

43
calochortus  May 25, 2017 • 7:29:37pm

re: #19 darthstar

re: #21 Belafon

And as far as I’m concerned it’s not arrogant, it’s true. I do not pretend to understand anything I can’t put my hands on and manipulate-and I don’t understand all the stuff I can do that with.

44
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:30:00pm
45
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:30:17pm

re: #40 Aucun pays pour les vieux ennemis

[Embedded content]

I’m ashamed to admit that I once thought Huckabee was a decent guy in 2008 even with all the homophobia.

46
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:30:25pm

re: #35 HappyWarrior

Agreed. I hope he finds a good spot in the party.

47
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:30:39pm

“Alleged assault” says Fox

48
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:31:17pm

re: #44 jaunte

[Embedded content]

When Trump treats reporters the way he does, damn right he should be blamed. But I get it Team Greg, personal responsbility is only for those who aren’t as wealthy or as white as your fatcat canidate.

49
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:32:06pm

re: #47 jaunte

“Alleged assault” says Fox

FFS their own camera crew has told what happened. If this were a Democratic candidate, FNC would be demanding that President Obama or wheover the defacto Dem party had personally apologize for it. FNC is such a pathetic network.

50
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:33:09pm

re: #46 JordanRules

Agreed. I hope he finds a good spot in the party.

We need young blood. I really really do not want Sanders to emerge as the frontrunner in 2020 simpy for having been runner up this last time and having high name recon and to show that I’m being fair, I don’t want that to happen to Biden either if he runs. And I love Joe Biden.

51
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:33:25pm

re: #49 HappyWarrior

“We report, you decide to think what we tell you to think.”

52
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:34:16pm

re: #51 jaunte

“We report, you decide to think what we tell you to think.”

“Yes, we said we were fair and balanced but today’s opposite day.”

53
EPR-radar  May 25, 2017 • 7:35:58pm

re: #10 darthstar

This picture goes in the dictionary to define “brick shithouse”.

54
piratedan  May 25, 2017 • 7:36:55pm

re: #44 jaunte

how about blaming the guy who did the actual assaulting?

Not saying that Trump didn’t set the table, but Gianforte is the bastard who sat down at it.

55
calochortus  May 25, 2017 • 7:37:43pm

re: #49 HappyWarrior

FFS their own camera crew has told what happened. If this were a Democratic candidate, FNC would be demanding that President Obama or wheover the defacto Dem party had personally apologize for it. FNC is such a pathetic network.

Was this a Faux News Network team or a local Fox affiliate? The latter can be a decent source of news (or not. They vary.)

56
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:38:12pm

Most pathetic thing I saw was Franks trying to blame the left for it. These types really are for personal responsibility only for those they deem less than themselves. They never apologize for their fuck ups.

57
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 7:38:29pm

I think we ought to start asking people if they have a skeptics group, people they can go to to ask if something is true or not. Some group who they know will debunk them if they’re wrong, and that they’ll trust. And then ask them to name something, either political, historical, or scientific, that their skeptics group corrected them on.

There are a few places for me, and LGF is one of them.

58
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:38:39pm

re: #55 calochortus

Was this a Faux News Network team or a local Fox affiliate? The latter can be a decent source of news (or not. They vary.)

I think it’s cable FNC but I can’t tell.

59
calochortus  May 25, 2017 • 7:39:14pm

re: #58 HappyWarrior

I think it’s cable FNC but I can’t tell.

Fair enough.

60
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:39:14pm

re: #55 calochortus

FNN

61
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 7:39:16pm

AP shows Gianforte ahead again by 238 votes with 22% reporting. The AP’s vote totals are slightly more advanced than the state’s.

62
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:40:18pm

re: #54 piratedan

It’s all about repeating the message: Media Blaming President Trump.
Trump is cast as a victim, and by extension so are all Rs and conservatives, so, Gianforte justified to defend himself against an attack question.

63
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:40:48pm

re: #62 jaunte

It’s all about repeating the message: Media Blaming President Trump.
Trump is cast as a victim, and by extension so are all Rs and conservatives, so, Gianforte justified to defend himself against an attack question.

Which in turn will make the base feel like victims.

64
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:40:59pm

Sneaky medias with their questions, Precious.

65
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:41:38pm

re: #64 jaunte

Sneaky medias with their questions, Precious.

Liberals are snowflakes and too sensitive but that mean reporter asked a mean question!

66
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:41:54pm

As this race looks like it may be close, just like in November (MI, WI etc), let’s not forget​ this…

67
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 7:43:25pm

re: #62 jaunte

It’s so predictable I’m surprised it keeps working so well for them. They control the entire government and most of the states but always they’re victims.

68
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 7:43:44pm
69
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 7:44:03pm

re: #44 jaunte

That screenshot of Greg Gutfeld. God almighty.

70
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:44:18pm

re: #67 Skip Intro

It’s so predictable I’m surprised it keeps working so well for them. They control the entire government and most of the states but always they’re victims.

THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS BAD.
But you’re in charge of both Congress and the Presidency, maybe the federal government’s programs have to do with you?
SHUT UP!

71
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:44:26pm

re: #67 Skip Intro

It’s so predictable I’m surprised it keeps working so well for them. They control the entire government and most of the states but always they’re victims.

It doesn’t have to make sense; it feels right.

72
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:45:08pm

re: #69 Myron Falwell

That screenshot of Greg Gutfeld. God almighty.

And then yeah it’s definitely FNC. Man I can’t stand Gutfeld. So smug for no damn good reason. If you ever heard that guy talk, you’d think he invented the wheel. Instead, he’s just a smug right wing dick who thinks he’s witty.

73
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:45:47pm

The music of Gillian Welch, a good beer, and good company. This is a good night.

74
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 7:45:58pm

re: #68 freetoken

Streams of umbrellas:

[Embedded content]

Video

Memories…

75
BeachDem  May 25, 2017 • 7:46:27pm

re: #4 Stanley Sea

Gestapo

[Embedded content]

Wingers also hate Ann Arbor because they have a living wage ordinance. How DARE that city pay people more than minimum wage.
/

76
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 7:46:38pm
77
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:49:02pm

re: #75 BeachDem

Wingers also hate Ann Arbor because they have a living wage ordinance. How DARE that city pay people more than minimum wage.
/

My one wingnut friend really hated that one CEO who gave his employees a decent wage. The right wing media was doing anything it could to paint the guy as as bad because he actually wanted to treat his employees like human beings. You know, I’ve never been a business owner but if I were, I’d want to treat my employees well, I’d want people to say “Yeah I work for HW and he’s a great guy and you should work there or go there for such and such service.” I just don’t get why supposedly pro business conservatives think being pro business is treating your employees like dirt.

78
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 7:49:31pm

If Jared had gone where his grades merited—SUNY New Platz or maybe Binghamton, solid state schools—he would have learned some valuable lessons. But no, dad had to fix things…

79
FormerDirtDart  May 25, 2017 • 7:49:42pm
80
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 7:49:47pm

re: #67 Skip Intro

It’s so predictable I’m surprised it keeps working so well for them. They control the entire government and most of the states but always they’re victims.

That’s what Fox News, Rush and Lumpy, and the typical RWNJ claptrap websites are there for. A steady diet of misinformation coupled with white male resentment equals an endless victim mentality.

81
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 7:51:23pm

This race is fuckin’ close.
mtelectionresults.gov

82
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:52:09pm

re: #80 Myron Falwell

That’s what Fox News, Rush and Lumpy, and the typical RWNJ claptrap websites are there for. A steady diet of misinformation coupled with white male resentment equals an endless victim mentality.

That tells them that liberals are out to get them. Hold Limbaugh responsible for a lot of the decline in discussion in this country. With Rush, it became very acceptable to see the person you disagreed with as something less than human let alone American. And despite what he says, he’s not a satirist. I’ve read Jonathan Swift. Rush wouldn’t know actual satire if it bit him on his ugly face.

83
calochortus  May 25, 2017 • 7:52:15pm

re: #77 HappyWarrior

My one wingnut friend really hated that one CEO who gave his employees a decent wage. The right wing media was doing anything it could to paint the guy as as bad because he actually wanted to treat his employees like human beings. You know, I’ve never been a business owner but if I were, I’d want to treat my employees well, I’d want people to say “Yeah I work for HW and he’s a great guy and you should work there or go there for such and such service.” I just don’t get why supposedly pro business conservatives think being pro business is treating your employees like dirt.

It’s what they dream of doing when they finally are in a position of power over anyone.

84
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 7:52:27pm
85
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:52:31pm

re: #81 darthstar

This race is fuckin’ close.
mtelectionresults.gov

[Embedded content]

It’s not going to be called till morning.

86
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:52:45pm

re: #83 calochortus

It’s what they dream of doing when they finally are in a position of power over anyone.

Sure is.

87
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:52:51pm

I’d like to see how many folks utilized same day voter registration in MT today.

88
FormerDirtDart  May 25, 2017 • 7:53:16pm
89
Interesting Times  May 25, 2017 • 7:53:19pm

re: #81 darthstar

This race is fuckin’ close.
mtelectionresults.gov

[Embedded content]

Turnout of 26%? Remember when the French were bemoaning about their lowest ever…at 74%? -_-

90
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:53:33pm

re: #87 JordanRules

I’d like to see how many folks utilized same day voter registration in MT today.

They have that? Well I must say I’m more optimistic than i was going in.

91
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:54:04pm

re: #88 FormerDirtDart

[Embedded content]

Smells like intimidation to me.

92
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 7:54:06pm

re: #81 darthstar

26% turnout. Pathetic.

This is what a dieing democracy looks like.

93
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 7:54:50pm

re: #92 Skip Intro

26% turnout. Pathetic.

We get these low turnouts and then bitch about what we have. Not that I think our candidates are always perfect but I hate hearing bitching from people who don’t even participate.

94
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 7:55:40pm

re: #88 FormerDirtDart

[Embedded content]

Won’t that be a little tough with audio involved?

95
Stanley Sea  May 25, 2017 • 7:56:14pm
96
Charles Johnson  May 25, 2017 • 7:56:52pm
97
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 7:56:54pm
98
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 7:57:20pm

re: #90 HappyWarrior

Yup! I hope it helps.
Turnout looks especially lazy though. Sigh.

99
Interesting Times  May 25, 2017 • 7:57:30pm

re: #93 HappyWarrior

We get these low turnouts and then bitch about what we have. Not that I think our candidates are always perfect but I hate hearing bitching from people who don’t even participate.

Indeed. And a number that abysmal can’t be explained by voter suppression laws alone (unless the Native American population there is much higher than I’m thinking).

The key to Democratic victories is to ignore the trumpchump GOPer cultists and try to get those non-voters to bloody well show up for a change.

100
Weaselone  May 25, 2017 • 7:57:57pm

re: #92 Skip Intro

26% turnout. Pathetic.

I’m pretty sure that’s based on the counted votes, not the total cast. Otherwise, there’s only about 1000 more votes to count.

101
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 7:57:59pm

re: #96 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

The caveat to that is that early voters can’t change their vote.

102
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 7:58:31pm

re: #96 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

To be fair, most of the votes we’re seeing were cast before Gianforte’s body slam. And the Democrat’s a Sandbagger, so we didn’t send the varsity.

103
Charles Johnson  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:02pm
104
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:10pm

re: #99 Interesting Times

Indeed. And a number that abysmal can’t be explained by voter suppression laws alone (unless the Native American population there is much higher than I’m thinking).

The key to Democratic victories is to ignore the trumpchump GOPer cultists and try to get those non-voters to bloody well show up for a change.

Indeed, we need not to go after the WWC guy who votes Republican but the person who doesn’t vote.

105
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:18pm

re: #99 Interesting Times

Indeed. And a number that abysmal can’t be explained by voter suppression laws alone (unless the Native American population there is much higher than I’m thinking).

The key to Democratic victories is to ignore the trumpchump GOPer cultists and try to get those non-voters to bloody well show up for a change.

6.3% of the population at the last census seven years ago, or 62,555 people.

106
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:28pm

re: #100 Weaselone

No, it’s voter turnout.

107
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:35pm

So Melania and the Pope have something in common…

Image: giphy.gif

108
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:42pm

re: #103 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

The man I heard on the audio definitely sounded like a man who has a hard time controlling himself.

109
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:51pm

re: #81 darthstar

This race is fuckin’ close.
mtelectionresults.gov

[Embedded content]

Oh look; the libertarian is playing the role of spoiler.

110
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 8:00:59pm

re: #103 Charles Johnson

111
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:01:28pm

re: #105 teleskiguy

6.3% of the population at the last census seven years ago, or 62,555 people.

Enough that could swing the election there. they’re a much bigger presence in Montana than they are in most states.

112
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 8:01:37pm

re: #109 Myron Falwell

Of course he is.

113
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:01:46pm

re: #109 Myron Falwell

Oh look; the libertarian is playing the role of spoiler.

Hopefully for Gianforte.

114
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:02:05pm

re: #110 Kragar

[Embedded content]

You may well be right.

115
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 8:02:11pm
116
BeachDem  May 25, 2017 • 8:02:29pm

re: #40 Aucun pays pour les vieux ennemis

[Embedded content]

Well, when Mike Huckabee AND Joe Walsh call you deadbeats, you might as well hang it up.
///
(or roll your eyes until they recede into your hairline.)

117
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 8:02:37pm

re: #109 Myron Falwell

Rush was a failed Top 40 DJ that took over for Morton Downey Jr. and grafted his insanity.

Oh look; the libertarian is playing the role of spoiler.

But Toxic Roger Ailes made him a national star.

118
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:02:50pm

re: #115 jaunte

[Embedded content]

It is working. Trump treats them like they’re the enemy and his lemmings eat it up.

119
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:03:41pm

re: #116 BeachDem

Well, when Mike Huckabee AND Joe Walsh call you deadbeats, you might as well hang it up.
///
(or roll your eyes until they recede into your hairline.)

I don’t think Huckabee’s pathetic tweet should be dignified with a response but I really feel a NATO country parent who lost a child in Afghanistan how many months his dog torturing son served in Afghanistan?

120
darthstar  May 25, 2017 • 8:04:57pm

So Trump’s lawyer sent Berkeley Breathed (Bloom County) a cease and desist order, saying Trump may be POTUS, but he retains commercial rights to his image.

121
Weaselone  May 25, 2017 • 8:05:04pm

re: #106 Skip Intro

No, it’s voter turnout.

Then why is the number going up?

122
FormerDirtDart  May 25, 2017 • 8:05:35pm

re: #89 Interesting Times

Turnout of 26%? Remember when the French were bemoaning about their lowest ever…at 74%? -_-

re: #106 Skip Intro

No, it’s voter turnout.

Np, it’s already up to 27%
The number will go up as precincts report in.

123
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 8:05:50pm

re: #121 Weaselone

Then why is the number going up?

The voter turnout figure is total votes counted divided by the state’s total number of registered voters. Thus, it is incomplete and can only go up.

124
calochortus  May 25, 2017 • 8:05:53pm

re: #120 darthstar

So Trump’s lawyer sent Berkeley Breathed (Bloom County) a cease and desist order, saying Trump may be POTUS, but he retains commercial rights to his image.

I’m pretty sure that and the Pope slapping his hand away are fakes.

125
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:05:57pm

re: #120 darthstar

So Trump’s lawyer sent Berkeley Breathed (Bloom County) a cease and desist order, saying Trump may be POTUS, but he retains commercial rights to his image.

And once again, they call us too sensitive? Fuck, Bush could laugh at being made fun of like an adult and man I did not like GW Bush.

126
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:06:18pm

re: #124 calochortus

I’m pretty sure that and the Pope slapping his hand away are fakes.

They’re fakes.

127
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 8:06:48pm

re: #82 HappyWarrior

Rush was a failed Top 40 DJ that took over for Morton Downey Jr. and grafted that whackjob’s moronic (and shitty) act with his generic DJ delivery.

It was a ripe situation for mass manipulation once Reagan (who Rush never voted for… he just didn’t vote) ended the Fairness Doctrine.

128
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 8:06:58pm

re: #126 HappyWarrior

129
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 8:07:18pm

re: #126 HappyWarrior

They’re fakes.

Trump’s lawyer claims the BB cease and desist letter is a fake, too. Unless that’s a fake, too, also.

130
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:07:27pm

re: #127 Myron Falwell

Rush was a failed Top 40 DJ that took over for Morton Downey Jr. and grafted that whackjob’s moronic (and shitty) act with his generic DJ delivery.

It was a ripe situation for mass manipulation once Reagan (who Rush never voted for… he just didn’t vote) ended the Fairness Doctrine.

Aha didn’t know that.

131
Skip Intro  May 25, 2017 • 8:08:19pm

re: #121 Weaselone

Looks like I read the graphic wrong. My error.

132
Weaselone  May 25, 2017 • 8:08:27pm

re: #123 Brian J.

The voter turnout figure is total votes counted divided by the state’s total number of registered voters. Thus, it is incomplete and can only go up.

Yes. I get that. Which is why bemoaning pathetic voter turnout because it’s only 26% right now when only about 190K of an estimated 400K votes have been counted is silly.

133
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:08:42pm

re: #128 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Ah okay then the cartoonist one is fake. I work at a law firm. We always use the same letterhead for our letters regardless.

134
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 8:09:38pm

Berkeley Breathed fucked up with that fake lawyer letter. I’ve lost some respect for him.

135
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 8:11:57pm
136
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:12:55pm

re: #135 teleskiguy

[Embedded content]

FALSE FLAG! MY EYES!

137
Charles Johnson  May 25, 2017 • 8:12:55pm
138
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 8:12:59pm

re: #117 Skip Intro

But Toxic Roger Ailes made him a national star.

Ailes took Lumpy - who was a generic Rush clone like so many others - and paired him with Alan Colmes.

Ed McLaughlin, a longtime exec at KGO 810 in San Francisco, is to blame for syndicating Rush (originally as a combo deal with Dr. Dean Edell).

139
calochortus  May 25, 2017 • 8:13:15pm

Mr. C. arriving home. Gotta run.

140
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 8:14:39pm
141
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:14:53pm

re: #138 Myron Falwell

Ailes took Lumpy - who was a generic Rush clone like so many others - and paired him with Alan Colmes.

Ed McLaughlin, a longtime exec at KGO 810 in San Francisco, is to blame for syndicating Rush (originally as a combo deal with Dr. Dean Edell).

No wonder why Lumpy was crying so much over anyone who dared to point out that his patron was a sexist pig. He literally owes Ailes his livelihood. Anyhow, Alan Colmes annoyed me when he was on H&C but in hindsight I respect him, I sure as hell couldn’t be with Sean Hannity for that long. Did Hannity even say anything when Alan passed away recently?

142
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 8:15:10pm

re: #130 HappyWarrior

Aha didn’t know that.

Yup, it actually was verified in multiple books about Rush.

The irony. A guy who whined about wanting another Reagan for years and years never voted when Reagan was on the ballot.

143
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:16:16pm

re: #140 Kragar

[Embedded content]

Are these like the warning signs when we lost that very Republican district in Kansas too? Yawn. This is a state that Trump won by 20% and one where the Republican has name recon and money. If Quist wins, that’s grand, but it by no means is a defeat for the Dems if he loses in a tight race.

144
BeachDem  May 25, 2017 • 8:16:24pm

re: #77 HappyWarrior

My one wingnut friend really hated that one CEO who gave his employees a decent wage. The right wing media was doing anything it could to paint the guy as as bad because he actually wanted to treat his employees like human beings. You know, I’ve never been a business owner but if I were, I’d want to treat my employees well, I’d want people to say “Yeah I work for HW and he’s a great guy and you should work there or go there for such and such service.” I just don’t get why supposedly pro business conservatives think being pro business is treating your employees like dirt.

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

145
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 8:16:41pm

re: #140 Kragar

[Embedded content]

And once again, we all need to keep this in mind. We’re not going to win them all. We’re not supposed to win the ones in safe Republican seats. If we do, awesome. If we don’t, but it’s close, it better start scaring Republicans, because we’re not even in midterm territory right now.

146
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:16:50pm

re: #142 Myron Falwell

Yup, it actually was verified in multiple books about Rush.

The irony. A guy who whined about wanting another Reagan for years and years never voted when Reagan was on the ballot.

Very interesting. Rush is actually my Dad’s age. The two guys couldn’t be any more different though.

147
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 8:16:59pm

re: #131 Skip Intro

Looks like I read the graphic wrong. My error.

For some reason I’m partially remembering an old Calvin and Hobbes where Calvin says:
“Good news, Dad, your poll numbers are up this week among six-year-olds…. Oops, I was holding the graph upside down.”

148
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:18:32pm

re: #145 Belafon

And once again, we all need to keep this in mind. We’re not going to win them all. We’re not supposed to win the ones in safe Republican seats. If we do, awesome. If we don’t, but it’s close, it better start scaring Republicans, because we’re not even in midterm territory right now.

If they have to win money in Montana that they won’t be able to spend in a purple district that we likely will win, it’s a win. I want Quist to win, of course I do, he’s one more cog towards a Dem Majority in the House but the fact that the Republicans are seriously sweating this and GA-06 should worry Republicans just like we had every right to worry when Walker won the Kennedy special e-election.

149
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 8:18:38pm

Gianforte’s lead is up to 9,200 votes (the largest of the night, numerically) or just over 4%. This is also the first time the state site has pulled ahead of the AP in reporting.

150
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 8:19:51pm
151
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:19:52pm

re: #144 BeachDem

[Embedded content]

EYirtxCI22Aox3yJvCBLf/akxyIJK2djCujk09/jAS0B/mQw6ysho5AfvDi2FMxYN1Q0tBbA4tzCtUKYbd71GCHBftZH9jzIoWddDKwKKDpHCeITdsZzIJ0/n+QZBpz7

152
Ace-o-aces  May 25, 2017 • 8:21:22pm
153
prairiefire  May 25, 2017 • 8:21:29pm

re: #134 teleskiguy

Hey, Reed Timmer is saying tornadic activity tomorrow in NE Colorado, including around the airport. I think you’re further west, just fyi

154
Belafon  May 25, 2017 • 8:22:33pm

re: #152 Ace-o-aces

[Embedded content]

Well, we also shouldn’t have one news station or party controlling the parameters of the debate either. Revive the fairness doctrine.

155
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 8:23:00pm

re: #153 prairiefire

Oh, there are no tornadoes where I live. You speak of the eastern half of the state, they get a lot of tornadoes there.

156
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:23:04pm

re: #152 Ace-o-aces

[Embedded content]

Asshole says what? It’s entirely within our right to boycott certain products. That’s freedom right there..

157
Ace-o-aces  May 25, 2017 • 8:23:10pm
158
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 8:24:17pm
159
retired cynic  May 25, 2017 • 8:25:10pm

re: #157 Ace-o-aces

Don’t put it past him to fake it.

160
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:25:16pm

HEre’s what gets me about Lumpy and Assenge. Lumpy hated Assenge and WL in the Bush years. In fact, I believe he even wanted Assenge arrested or worse. But when Assenge is doing shit Lumpy likes, Lumpy loves him. Lumpy’s worse than an ass, he’s a principle lacking ass. But then again so is Assenge.

161
majii  May 25, 2017 • 8:25:57pm

re: #78 Barefoot Grin

“If Jared had gone where his grades merited—SUNY New Platz or maybe Binghamton, solid state schools—he would have learned some valuable lessons. But no, dad had to fix things…”

My youngest brother, who lives in Washington State, and I were talking about something related to your comment a couple hours ago, which is that sometimes those who are accustomed to having things go their way, or to buying their way forward, end up reaping what they’ve sown. Never in their wildest dreams did Jared or Trump think others would ever hear about how they’ve abused the system and skirted laws to get ahead in life. We still don’t know exactly what they’ve been up to, but my female “spidey sense” has me thinking that whatever it is, it’s probably not good and if it’s fully revealed, they could both end up in a lot of legal hot water. Time will tell.

162
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 8:26:16pm

re: #158 Kragar

[Embedded content]

There is no class warfare! ///

163
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 8:26:18pm

re: #150 teleskiguy

Evidence that Van Gogh created Jupiter!

164
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:26:42pm

re: #158 Kragar

[Embedded content]

I just don’t get why people oppose better wages. More wages, more money to spend in the economy. Conservatives should be supporting living wages not fighting them like they’re Feudal lords but then again, they have more in common with feudal lords than Adam Smith.

165
FormerDirtDart  May 25, 2017 • 8:27:32pm

166
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 8:27:36pm
167
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 8:27:46pm

re: #163 freetoken

Evidence that Van Gogh created Jupiter!

[Embedded content]

And in “madness” could see things “normals” couldn’t and can’t.

168
plansbandc  May 25, 2017 • 8:28:09pm

It’s shocking to be alive to see the end of our democracy. I believe the good people will rise again, but it will take a long long time.

169
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:28:25pm

The one I really don’t get? Opposing sick leave for food workers.

170
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 8:28:35pm

re: #158 Kragar

Are they taking into account the fact that the increased wages will be spent buying stuff that they make?

171
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 8:28:38pm
172
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:28:55pm

re: #168 plansbandc

It’s shocking to be alive to see the end of our democracy. I believe the good people will rise again, but it will take a long long time.

I’m really thinking about my next tattoo being resistance inspired.

173
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 8:29:09pm

re: #154 Belafon

Well, we also shouldn’t have one news station or party controlling the parameters of the debate either. Revive the fairness doctrine.

Such a revival would have to be expanded to cable and the internet in order to be effective. And I’m not sure how that could be done… :/

174
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:29:27pm

re: #171 Kragar

[Embedded content]

I forget asshole, who was talking about “2nd amendment solutions” to fucking Health Care debates? Fuck off, you fucking pasty fuck.

175
weave  May 25, 2017 • 8:29:49pm

From FiveThirtyEight….

The Cook Report’s PVI (a bit more weighted to the 2012 election result than Harry’s adjusted partisanship) pegs Montana’s House seat at a score of R+11. That, more or less, means we think a Republican should win about 61 percent of the vote in a “neutral” political environment. When all is said and done, it’s likely Gianforte will be in the low to mid 50s. Keep in mind, the median House seat is only R+3, so, as Harry said, Democrats don’t need to win these kinds of districts to win the House. They need to over-perform by about 4 points on average, and Quist is on track to do that.

176
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:39:07pm

re: #175 weave

From FiveThirtyEight….

If Quist loses, it wlil be spun as a failure but it really shouldn’t. I want him to win obviously but I’m not going to be “Oh what could have been” if he loses.

177
FormerDirtDart  May 25, 2017 • 8:39:29pm
178
Targetpractice  May 25, 2017 • 8:41:08pm

re: #176 HappyWarrior

If Quist loses, it wlil be spun as a failure but it really shouldn’t. I want him to win obviously but I’m not going to be “Oh what could have been” if he loses.

If he loses, it’ll be spun as “proof” that Trump is not having a negative effect on the GOP, despite the fact that he won the state by double digits.

But if Quint wins, then when they’re not claiming “voter fraud,” they’ll insist that it’s not all that serious because they’ll just “get back” that seat next year.

179
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 8:41:17pm

re: #175 weave

From FiveThirtyEight….

Is 538 keeping track of the fact that Quist is barely going to crack 40 percent if Gianforte finishes in the low to mid 50s, since the Libertarian is on a steady 5-6% of the vote?

Oh well, grass grows, birds fly, sun shines, and Berniecrats waste millions of dollars in losing.

180
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 8:41:21pm
181
Targetpractice  May 25, 2017 • 8:41:31pm

re: #177 FormerDirtDart

[Embedded content]

“Hey shouldn’t have put himself in front of that bullet.”

182
Targetpractice  May 25, 2017 • 8:42:02pm

re: #179 Brian J.

Is 538 keeping track of the fact that Quist is barely going to crack 40 percent if Gianforte finishes in the low to mid 50s, since the Libertarian is on a steady 5-6% of the vote?

Oh well, grass grows, birds fly, sun shines, and Berniecrats waste millions of dollars in losing.

Getting
Republicans
Elected
Every
November

183
bratwurst  May 25, 2017 • 8:45:14pm

re: #176 HappyWarrior

If Quist loses, it wlil be spun as a failure but it really shouldn’t. I want him to win obviously but I’m not going to be “Oh what could have been” if he loses.

He’s a folk singer who disclosed the fact he performed at a nudist resort…running in a deep red state.

I would have been thrilled if he’d won, but the fact this is going to end up relatively close AND the GOP is stuck with this asshole are some consolation in my book.

184
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:46:18pm

re: #177 FormerDirtDart

[Embedded content]

“He had coming.”

185
Dave In Austin  May 25, 2017 • 8:47:05pm
186
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:47:36pm

re: #179 Brian J.

Is 538 keeping track of the fact that Quist is barely going to crack 40 percent if Gianforte finishes in the low to mid 50s, since the Libertarian is on a steady 5-6% of the vote?

Oh well, grass grows, birds fly, sun shines, and Berniecrats waste millions of dollars in losing.

God knows I don’t like Bernie’s arrogance more than any other Lizard but I’m really having a hard time faulting him if we lose this one. This is honestly a state where many people would vote for a Republican if he beat up a reporter. Oh wait.

187
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:48:30pm

re: #185 Dave In Austin

[Embedded content]

No, idiot the most American of Americans do. People who were in this country when your ancestors were afraid that the widow nextdoor was practicing witch craft.

188
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:48:58pm

re: #183 bratwurst

He’s a folk singer who disclosed the fact he performed at a nudist resort…running in a deep red state.

I would have been thrilled if he’d won, but the fact this is going to end up relatively close AND the GOP is stuck with this asshole are some consolation in my book.

Nailed it.

189
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:50:24pm

So yeah Quist is probably a bit too attached to Bernie but oyu know what, we’re going to have people who not just supporetd him but strongly supported him in the future. I have my own frustrations with Bernie. I’ve even called him an asshole here and suggested he has more in common with Trump than his admirers would like to admit but I won’t hold someone’s past support of Sanders if they’re the best chance between us and a Republican asshole ike Gainforte getting into office.

190
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 8:50:37pm

re: #186 HappyWarrior

God knows I don’t like Bernie’s arrogance more than any other Lizard but I’m really having a hard time faulting him if we lose this one. This is honestly a state where many people would vote for a Republican if he beat up a reporter. Oh wait.

At some point, the party’s got to stop jocking this guy if he keeps his mouth keeps writing checks he can’t cash. There is no earthly reason we should be sponsoring this clown’s endless book tour so that he can keep snarling about how Democrats are evil while promoting an agenda that he doesn’t understand and which has proven to be electoral poison everywhere in the First World. Winning center-left candidates are Macrons and Trudeaus, not Melenchons, Iglesiases, or (two weeks hence) Corbyns.

191
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 8:51:54pm

re: #180 Kragar

Wow, shocked, surprised, etc., &c.

192
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:52:18pm

re: #190 Brian J.

At some point, the party’s got to stop jocking this guy if he keeps his mouth keeps writing checks he can’t cash. There is no earthly reason we should be sponsoring this clown’s endless book tour so that he can keep snarling about how Democrats are evil while promoting an agenda that he doesn’t understand and which has proven to be electoral poison everywhere in the First World. Winning center-left candidates are Macrons and Trudeaus, not Melenchons, Iglesiases, or (two weeks hence) Corbyns.

Okay, how about we find some center left candidates to run then. The Montana Democrats chose Rob Quist. I think Bernie’s strategy is idiotic too but you know what, I’m not holding it against Quist that he was a Sanders supporter. I would be a hypocrite if I did because I hate the Berniebros who hold someone’s support of Clinton against them. You’re becoming what you hate in them. Don’t do that shit.

193
Amory Blaine  May 25, 2017 • 8:56:37pm

194
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 8:57:35pm

re: #193 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

Fleetwood Mac - Albatross (HQ)

This is actually my favorite by them.

195
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 8:58:44pm

re: #192 HappyWarrior

Okay, how about we find some center left candidates to run then. The Montana Democrats chose Rob Quist. I think Bernie’s strategy is idiotic too but you know what, I’m not holding it against Quist that he was a Sanders supporter. I would be a hypocrite if I did because I hate the Berniebros who hold someone’s support of Clinton against them. You’re becoming what you hate in them. Don’t do that shit.

We’ve got to win, Goddammit! We can’t do that while wasting $3,000,000 plus whatever the national party poured into this race to get this dude’s ass kicked to try to satiate the BernieBros’ grudges! It’s time to tell them off. It’s time to call their bluff. It’s time to tell Bernie and Ro Khanna and the rest of the clown car that if they want to go form their little Justice Party or whatever they want to call it, then hasta la vista! We can’t go on with a voice the party’s constantly promoting endlessly sucking up to the President, attacking his own party, and denying the Republicans’ Russian connections to cover his own ass.

196
The Ghost of Senator Incitatus  May 25, 2017 • 8:59:10pm

re: #164 HappyWarrior

There’s a strategy to make money by focusing on explosive increase in value by reporting gains and increasing the stock price, as opposed to slow growth by expanding facilities and controlling more of the market share than the competition. Controlling the means of production is expensive compared to destructive techniques such as the kind of venture capitalist pillage raids that groups like Bain Capital do: purchase a company and deliberately ruin it before declaring bankruptcy. The more extreme example of “do nothing, gain value” is Enron…with their fantasy-novel accounting method, brownouts and with their bullshit claims about innovation. Watch “The Smartest Guys in the Room” on Netflix: you can make money by making shit worse, then promising to make it better again.

This is a big part of why Marxist analysis doesn’t actually explain the current predicament: these people don’t want to control the means of production, they want to be the pass-through agent that takes a fee. They don’t wanted fixed real assets (factories, land), they want liquidity. Hence the pattern of buying companies to indebt and trash them, rather than make them work.

Several people have observed the Trumpian vision for the common wealth looks a lot like a corporate raid, but I have an eerier observation: stuff like AHCA carries the idea of “load with debt, leverage the terminal phase to obtain further profit” to every single person with medical issues. Human capital—part of the means of production that the bourgeoisie want to control—is expensive to maintain, so why not just short human life? There’s a billion Chinese people whose capital value is…fucking nothing, according to the central planning authority of their government. They live cheap in dorms, can’t complain, and people supposed to watch over them are a-okay if they die young.

In general, more and more of US finance is focusing on predatory means of making money—hidden fees, pushing people into mortgages they can’t afford, straight up faking projections. On top of that, there’s now a focus on short-term gains…profits have to keep going up every quarter…which is achieved by all kinds of shady-ass means. And now we have an entire party that’s facilitating this. Look at the fight against a fiduciary rule: how the fuck are you protecting your constituents by allowing businesses acting as advisors to deceive them about the motives of their advice?

197
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:01:35pm

re: #195 Brian J.

We’ve got to win, Goddammit! We can’t do that while wasting $3,000,000 plus whatever the national party poured into this race to get this dude’s ass kicked to try to satiate the BernieBros’ grudges! It’s time to tell them off. It’s time to call their bluff. It’s time to tell Bernie and Ro Khanna and the rest of the clown car that if they want to go form their little Justice Party or whatever they want to call it, then hasta la vista! We can’t go on with a voice the party’s constantly promoting endlessly sucking up to the President, attacking his own party, and denying the Republicans’ Russian connections to cover his own ass.

The party saw an opening here and took a chance. Look at it this way, we’ve got the Republicans playing fucking scared in Montana. We may not win this one, you may well be right there but this also means they- the Republicans will have less money to pump into races ike my district which are ones that we can beat them in. If you want Sanders discredited by all means be my guess but the guy has a lot of sway with people who do vote for our party. They may not be the base like they profess but Bernie does have a lot of supporters in our party and not all of them are idiotic Bernei Bros.

198
Amory Blaine  May 25, 2017 • 9:03:08pm

Is it ok to say anything yet?

199
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:03:39pm

re: #198 Amory Blaine

Is it ok to say anything yet?

Go for it.

200
No Depression  May 25, 2017 • 9:04:49pm

re: #158 Kragar

[Embedded content]

That right there is why the idea of throwing Wall Street bankers in prison appeals to so many people. I can’t say I’m entirely unsympathetic to the mindset to be honest, at least as far as Wall Street executives go. It wouldn’t surprise me if upwards of 90+% of them are white collar criminals that steal from the American people on a daily basis.

201
Amory Blaine  May 25, 2017 • 9:05:13pm

re: #199 HappyWarrior

No way, you ain’t holding my beer…

202
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:06:05pm

re: #201 Amory Blaine

No way, you ain’t holding my beer…

You’re right. I’d drink. You’re a big beer guy though IIRC. Ever have Kentucky Bourbon Barrel Ale? Got my hands on some of that the other day.

203
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:06:57pm

re: #200 No Depression

That right there is why the idea of throwing Wall Street bankers in prison appeals to so many people. I can’t say I’m entirely unsympathetic to the mindset to be honest, at least as far as Wall Street executives go. It wouldn’t surprise me if upwards of 90+% of them are white collar criminals that steal from the American people on a daily basis.

It is. There’s definitely a lot of stuff that makes me definitely sympathetic to the idea of a class revolution when you hear shit like that or when you see what Massey Energy did in WV.

204
Interesting Times  May 25, 2017 • 9:07:22pm

re: #195 Brian J.

We’ve got to win, Goddammit! We can’t do that while wasting $3,000,000 plus whatever the national party poured into this race to get this dude’s ass kicked to try to satiate the BernieBros’ grudges!

Well, there’s this from a few days ago:

In upset, Democrat Pellegrino wins 9th District Assembly seat

With all precincts reporting, Pellegrino won 58 percent of the vote to Gargiulo’s 42 percent, according to Suffolk and Nassau boards of election results posted Tuesday night.

The liberal wing of the Democratic Party and Working Families Party had invested heavily in the seat left vacant when Assemb. Joseph Saladino was appointed Oyster Bay supervisor. President Donald Trump had won the district with 60 percent of the vote.

And here’s Christine Pellegrino’s bio on OurRevolution.

205
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 9:08:18pm

Still enjoying this today!

206
Amory Blaine  May 25, 2017 • 9:08:24pm

You know I love you HappyWarrior.

207
bratwurst  May 25, 2017 • 9:08:30pm

re: #194 HappyWarrior

[Embedded content]

Video

This is actually my favorite by them.

Brilliance! This is probably my favorite, just because it was all over radio when I first got one in my room as a kid. Ridiculous rhythm section.

Fleetwood Mac - Hypnotized

208
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:08:53pm
209
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:09:24pm

re: #204 Interesting Times

Well, there’s this from a few days ago:

In upset, Democrat Pellegrino wins 9th District Assembly seat

And here’s Christine Pellegrino’s bio on OurRevolution.

You gotta take chances. Perhaps Quist wouldn’t have been my choice but you knwo what ) I’m not a Montanan, he won legitimately as did Clinton, and the party more than just Sanders saw an opening ehre and otok it. We’re not going to win all these but we should definitely try to play some offense instead of defense.

210
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:09:41pm

re: #206 Amory Blaine

You know I love you HappyWarrior.

Cheers.

211
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 9:09:43pm

Welp. Osoff up next! Let’s go!

212
Dave In Austin  May 25, 2017 • 9:10:38pm
213
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:10:53pm

re: #207 bratwurst

Brilliance! This is probably my favorite, just because it was all over radio when I first got one in my room as a kid. Ridiculous rhythm section.

[Embedded content]

Video

When I first heard the one I posted in Man On Wire, I was astounded that this was the same band that did Rhiannon and You Can Go Your Way. Don’t get me wrong. Good tunes but I love that tune. This is good too.

214
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:11:16pm
215
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:11:54pm

re: #211 JordanRules

Welp. Osoff up next! Let’s go!

Ossoff I actually feel better about. Much more diverse district and was much closer in November. However, I don’t think Handel’s going to hit anyone between now and then.

216
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:12:10pm

re: #209 HappyWarrior

You gotta take chances. Perhaps Quist wouldn’t have been my choice but you knwo what ) I’m not a Montanan, he won legitimately as did Clinton, and the party more than just Sanders saw an opening ehre and otok it. We’re not going to win all these but we should definitely try to play some offense instead of defense.

Pellegrino won a race with 10% turnout in a chamber where Democrats already had a supermajority. Not comparable to a Congressional race, and she won because of her 25 years as a teacher and due to heavy spending by the teachers’ union, not by promoting far-left positions. And need we examine the many faceplants of Our Devolution in recent months?

217
No Depression  May 25, 2017 • 9:12:14pm

I honestly don’t give a shit if candidates like Quist are Berniecrats. Yeah they can be obnoxious at times, but they’re way better than fucking Republicans. Getting those bastards out of power is the only thing that matters right now.

218
retired cynic  May 25, 2017 • 9:12:15pm

re: #214 teleskiguy

[Embedded content]

I’d like to know how the early votes shook out as opposed to those case in person today. If possible.

219
jaunte  May 25, 2017 • 9:12:44pm

re: #212 Dave In Austin

That makes me hear Jack Kingston saying “cawuckwahmble”

220
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:12:56pm

re: #215 HappyWarrior

Ossoff I actually feel better about. Much more diverse district and was much closer in November. However, I don’t think Handel’s going to hit anyone between now and then.

Agreed. Better candidate, much more promising district, weaker opponent, and no f***ing Sandbaggers.

221
JordanRules  May 25, 2017 • 9:13:10pm

re: #215 HappyWarrior

Ossoff I actually feel better about. Much more diverse district and was much closer in November. However, I don’t think Handel’s going to hit anyone between now and then.

Ha! I haven’t been able to predict shit since Nov 9 tho!

222
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:13:30pm

re: #216 Brian J.

Pellegrino won a race with 10% turnout in a chamber where Democrats already had a supermajority. Not comparable to a Congressional race, and she won because of her 25 years as a teacher and due to heavy spending by the teachers’ union, not by promoting far-left positions. And need we examine the many faceplants of Our Devolution in recent months?

Can you tell me someone who would have done just as well in Montana as Quist tonight who fit your standards? You really sound like the other side of the coin of a Bernie bro sometimes. I don’t like their ridiculous standards anymore than you do but the fact of the matter is Montana Democats chose to make Quist their guy.

223
Dave In Austin  May 25, 2017 • 9:13:33pm
224
wheat-dogg  May 25, 2017 • 9:14:01pm

re: #68 freetoken

I wuz there in January! You can sit in Starbucks and watch the migratory pattern of hoomans over your latte.

225
Dave In Austin  May 25, 2017 • 9:14:18pm
226
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:14:33pm

re: #222 HappyWarrior

Can you tell me someone who would have done just as well in Montana as Quist tonight who fit your standards? You really sound like the other side of the coin of a Bernie bro sometimes. I don’t like their ridiculous standards anymore than you do but the fact of the matter is Montana Democats chose to make Quist their guy.

Governor Steve Bullock. Senator Jon Tester. Moderate Democrats can still win statewide in Montana.

227
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:14:56pm

re: #217 No Depression

I honestly don’t give a shit if candidates like Quist are Berniecrats. Yeah they can be obnoxious at times, but they’re way better than fucking Republicans. Getting those bastards out of power is the only thing that matters right now.

Indeed, unless it’s someone like Alan Grayson, Tulsi Gabbard(Assad apologist), I can tolerate someone having supported Bernie in the primary. As I said, I don’t like the primary being a litmus test. I work with plenty of people who strongly supported Bernie and a lot of those people are just as if not more loyal Democrats than I am. Not every Sanders supporter was one of those brats who booed Hillary during the convention.

228
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:15:26pm

re: #220 Brian J.

Agreed. Better candidate, much more promising district, weaker opponent, and no f***ing Sandbaggers.

I have sentimental reasons for rooting for Jon. I want someone my age in Congress.

229
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:16:01pm
230
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:16:18pm

re: #221 JordanRules

Ha! I haven’t been able to predict shit since Nov 9 tho!

I had a dental appointment the day before the presidential election. Hygienist asks me who I think will win. I very confidently said Clinton. Oops! No idea who she was for though.

231
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:17:56pm

re: #226 Brian J.

Governor Steve Bullock. Senator Jon Tester. Moderate Democrats can still win statewide in Montana.

I obviously meant someone who could have ran. As I said, the Dem voters decided they wanted Quist as their nominee. Who are we to tell them that they should have chosen someone else? Give the guy credit. The guy isn’t loaded but ran a very good campaign in a state where another moderate Democrat, Clinton lost big in.

232
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:18:07pm

re: #230 HappyWarrior

I had a dental appointment the day before the presidential election. Hygienist asks me who I think will win. I very confidently said Clinton. Oops! No idea who she was for though.

Could be worse. In 2000, my College Bowl team held practices on Monday and Wednesday. At the Monday afternoon practice, my friend bemoaned the way the election was dragging on. I told, “By the next time we meet, it will all be over.”

His first words that Wednesday were, “You lied to us!”

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HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:18:23pm

re: #229 teleskiguy

[Embedded content]

Sam’s too radical for the GOP, Ski. He’s got one of them mustaches!

234
Interesting Times  May 25, 2017 • 9:18:26pm

re: #225 Dave In Austin

[Embedded content]

You just know how pumpkin pinochet and the both-siderist pundits will spin this: hurr hurr, Dems can’t even beat a GOPer who beats reporters!

235
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:18:54pm

re: #232 Brian J.

Could be worse. In 2000, my College Bowl team held practices on Monday and Wednesday. At the Monday afternoon practice, my friend bemoaned the way the election was dragging on. I told, “By the next time we meet, it will all be over.”

His first words that Wednesday were, “You lied to us!”

Yeah and I didn’t bet any money over it like my Dad did.

236
Amory Blaine  May 25, 2017 • 9:19:21pm

USA USA USA

237
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:19:40pm

Oen thing I’m not looking forward to and I will agree with oyu on this Brian, I’m not looking forward to the obnoxious Sanders bros who will insist that this would have been won with more money.

238
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 9:19:44pm

re: #225 Dave In Austin

The sad commentary was when they voted for Trump last November.

This is just affirmation that they are morally and intellectually bankrupt.

239
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:21:14pm

I’ve gotten into heated arguments with AM over this but this is what I’ve tried telling him that a lot of red state voters really just don’t give a shit. If it breathes, beats up reporters, and thinks the earth is younger than 10,000 year olds, many of them will vote for it. Kudos to Quist for running a good campaign but there’s something very wrong with the values of bright red area voters and I have no problem saying that.

240
Barefoot Grin  May 25, 2017 • 9:21:16pm

re: #193 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

Go Your Own Way - Fleetwood Mac 05 DEC 1977

241
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:23:06pm

re: #237 HappyWarrior

Oen thing I’m not looking forward to and I will agree with oyu on this Brian, I’m not looking forward to the obnoxious Sanders bros who will insist that this would have been won with more money.

According to the Green Papers, which itself cites FEC reports, Quist’s campaign had raised $3,263,535 as of May 5th. There was at least another $656,000 spent by outside Democrats on this race.

Four million bucks is plenty of money; if it wasn’t, then Our Revolting should have supplied it. After all, they raised over a million dollars a day to attack Hillary during early 2016, right? Or are they only able to raise money against Democrats?

242
mmmirele  May 25, 2017 • 9:23:24pm

re: #177 FormerDirtDart

I just found out something interesting. I can see Todd Starnes’ tweets here, but if I click on them, I’m blocked. I’m not sorry I’m blocked, because I’m sure I gave Starnes a piece of my mind about something legal in the past that he completely didn’t understand. But it’s interesting I can see the tweets on LGF.

243
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:23:43pm

re: #238 Myron Falwell

The sad commentary was when they voted for Trump last November.

This is just affirmation that they are morally and intellectually bankrupt.

You know what makes me sad as fuck? That the area my grandparents grew up in is now a staunchly GOP area. These people. They didn’t fall for Reagan’s crap but they ended up falling for Trump. Cambria County, probably not the only county that went for Mondale and for Trump.

244
plansbandc  May 25, 2017 • 9:24:23pm

re: #207 bratwurst

Play this on the jukebox every chance I get. <3

245
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:24:41pm

re: #241 Brian J.

According to the Green Papers, which itself cites FEC reports, Quist’s campaign had raised $3,263,535 as of May 5th. There was at least another $656,000 spent by outside Democrats on this race.

[Embedded content]

Four million bucks is plenty of money; if it wasn’t, then Our Revolting should have supplied it. After all, they raised over a million dollars a day to attack Hillary during early 2016, right? Or are they only able to raise money against Democrats?

Won’t argue with you there. I don’t know what they’re using that money on.

246
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:25:42pm

re: #242 mmmirele

I just found out something interesting. I can see Todd Starnes’ tweets here, but if I click on them, I’m blocked. I’m not sorry I’m blocked, because I’m sure I gave Starnes a piece of my mind about something legal in the past that he completely didn’t understand. But it’s interesting I can see the tweets on LGF.

I had honestly forgotten about Starnes and his weird nostagia about a time wehre a rainbow was a gift from God and not hijacked by the gays. The guy is only in his mid 40’s but talks like someone who remembers the mid 40’s well.

247
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:25:42pm

re: #243 HappyWarrior

You know what makes me sad as fuck? That the area my grandparents grew up in is now a staunchly GOP area. These people. They didn’t fall for Reagan’s crap but they ended up falling for Trump. Cambria County, probably not the only county that went for Mondale and for Trump.

My native county did too. Voted for that cretin by 42 points after voting for every Democrat except Humphrey and McGovern until 2000.

248
Myron Falwell  May 25, 2017 • 9:26:04pm

re: #242 mmmirele

I just found out something interesting. I can see Todd Starnes’ tweets here, but if I click on them, I’m blocked. I’m not sorry I’m blocked, because I’m sure I gave Starnes a piece of my mind about something legal in the past that he completely didn’t understand. But it’s interesting I can see the tweets on LGF.

I’d consider getting blocked by that looney tune a badge of honor. :)

249
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:26:21pm

re: #242 mmmirele

I’m blocked by Bryan Fischer ‘cause I sent him this after the Obergefell v. Hodges decision was handed down.

250
No Depression  May 25, 2017 • 9:26:53pm

re: #237 HappyWarrior

Oen thing I’m not looking forward to and I will agree with oyu on this Brian, I’m not looking forward to the obnoxious Sanders bros who will insist that this would have been won with more money.

That is pretty obnoxious. It’s like they forget that a lot of folks (and the powerful forces manipulating them) are hostile towards any kind of thought that even smacks of leftism. The sooner they realize that the U.S. is an intrinsically right-leaning country and that their work is cut out for them, the more effective they’ll be in reaching their goals.

251
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:27:46pm

re: #247 Brian J.

My native county did too. Voted for that cretin by 42 points after voting for every Democrat except Humphrey and McGovern until 2000.

Interestingly enough, the area where I have grown up and resided keeps on getting more and more Democratic. Hillary won by 10 points here. I believe Romney and McCain beat Obama in this district. It was very tight mind you but Clinton did too well here. What does frustrate me about Sanders is he does not seem to value at all the socially liberal affluent voters that are increasingly part of our base. I’d rather have those people than many in the WWC who would probably shout racial slurs at my niece and SIL if they ever saw her.

252
Interesting Times  May 25, 2017 • 9:28:15pm

re: #238 Myron Falwell

The sad commentary was when they voted for Trump last November.

This is just affirmation that they are morally and intellectually bankrupt.

I’ve been accused of being a doomer by some, but here’s the thing: if Dems/progressives/liberals want to win again, denial does them no favors. Didn’t Obama say trump would not be president because he had “too much faith in the American people”? Yeah, we all know how that worked out -_-

And yes, prior to the election, I clung to the same thoughts, even though I had this creeping sense of foreboding that just wouldn’t go away. I also remember dreading election day if only for the reason it would reveal how many millions of Americans found trump acceptable and approved of him.

Now that the worst has been confirmed - 96% of trump voters say they’d back him again - it’s safe for us to do one thing: write off 62 million members of the electorate as hopelessly brainwashed and unreachable. That’s liberating, in a way, because it means you no longer have to bang your head against the wall hoping they’ll come around.

Instead, figure out a way to win without them. Figure out how to help people get around these grotesque voter suppression laws, figure out how to win apathetic non-voters to your side, and figure out how to motivate and energize the Dem/liberal base. If you do that in the states where it matters, it just might be enough.

253
klys (maker of Silmarils)  May 25, 2017 • 9:29:05pm

G’night Lizards.

254
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:29:23pm

re: #250 No Depression

That is pretty obnoxious. It’s like they forget that a lot of folks (and the powerful forces manipulating them) are hostile towards any kind of thought that even smacks of leftism. The sooner they realize that the U.S. is an intrinsically right-leaning country and that their work is cut out for them, the more effective they’ll be in reaching their goals.

They complained about the DNC in Pompeo’s district. I mean I’m all for taking a chance as I’ve said but I’m not going to be upst when things go south. Whether they want to admit it, we do have a ceiling in these regions. And your’e right. So many of these people in these areas are hostile to anything remotely leftist sounding.

255
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 9:29:44pm

re: #251 HappyWarrior

San Diego county has slowly become more Democratic also.

The nation is changing. The rural vs. urban dynamic is really strong now. Religious vs. non-religious. Highly educated vs. minimally educated.

256
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:30:21pm

re: #249 teleskiguy

I’m blocked by Bryan Fischer ‘cause I sent him this after the Obergefell v. Hodges decision was handed down.

[Embedded content]

Such a snowflake. Bryan’s been quiet these days I’ve noticed though. Don’t see his weets on here. Maybe he finally made his peace and is one with the bears.

257
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:31:16pm

re: #255 freetoken

San Diego county has slowly become more Democratic also.

The nation is changing. The rural vs. urban dynamic is really strong now. Religious vs. non-religious. Highly educated vs. minimally educated.

Didn’t Orange County go Democratic this past year for the first time since 1936? This by the way is why I think Sanders is dead, dead wrong to fixate on the WWC in dying areas.s We should be focused on growing communities and many of those growing communities are diverse communities. OC being one of them.

258
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:32:39pm

I was just looking at the county-by-county vote in Colorado for the 2016 general election. Wild. Not uncommon to see a county that went to Hillary by 20 points right next door to a county (usually separated by a big mountain range) where Fuckface Von Clownstick won by 50 points!

Hillary carried my county by 21 points, BTW.

259
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:33:03pm

The Democratic Party of my grandfather’s youth was heavily comprised of working class men. We’ll welcome them into our party if they want to but they need to eralize that they share a party with racial minorities, women, immigrants, LGBT people, etc all of whom have issues that should be listened to. What infuriates me is this lie that Clinton didn’t address the working class’s concerns. She did, she just didn’t lie to them about returnng them to a mythological past like Trump/Sanders did.

260
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:34:30pm

re: #258 teleskiguy

I was just looking at the county-by-county vote in Colorado for the 2016 general election. Wild. Not uncommon to see a county that went to Hillary by 20 points right next door to a county (usually separated by a big mountain range) where Fuckface Von Clownstick won by 50 points!

Hillary carried my county by 21 points, BTW.

What do you think it is about those counties that closely border each other that have such wide gaps in results? I’m not really familiar with Colorado’s demographics. By the way, it is a beautiful state. I’ve told you about how my brother lived there for a while and of the places he and his wife have lived, it was by far his wife’s favorite.

261
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:36:48pm

I believe the New Deal Coalition collapsed when the Republican Party saw the bigtory that existed in the country and realized they could be a lot more successful catering to that than continuing on the path they had been since Ike. Goldwater, I don’t feel was a racist but the GOP fucked up big time by nominating an opponent of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. And Goldwater although I know he hated what the GOP became was part of their downward spiral.

262
Dave In Austin  May 25, 2017 • 9:36:55pm
263
Kragar  May 25, 2017 • 9:37:02pm

re: #249 teleskiguy

Every time I see “Gay Gestapo”, I just want to slap them and say “First, I hate you fuck nuts and second, just use Gaystapo. It sounds stupid the way you fucking say it.”

264
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:37:14pm

re: #259 HappyWarrior

The Democratic Party of my grandfather’s youth was heavily comprised of working class men. We’ll welcome them into our party if they want to but they need to eralize that they share a party with racial minorities, women, immigrants, LGBT people, etc all of whom have issues that should be listened to. What infuriates me is this lie that Clinton didn’t address the working class’s concerns. She did, she just didn’t lie to them about returnng them to a mythological past like Trump/Sanders did.

Honestly, I just want to get Biblical with these places now. Something along the lines of 1 Kings 12:11.

265
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:38:40pm

re: #263 Kragar

Every time I see “Gay Gestapo”, I just want to slap them and say “First, I hate you fuck nuts and second, just use Gaystapo. It sounds stupid the way you fucking say it.”

I always laugh whenever he said “Big Gay.” Gaystepo is just stupid just like Feminazi because the real Gestapo and Nazis weren’t exactly fond of either gays or feminism. I don’t get offended over it though I certainly wouldn’t blame a LGBT survivor of the Holocaust for feeling that way. It’s just pathetically absurd and that idiot Lively is responsible for that latter stupid oe.

266
Brian J.  May 25, 2017 • 9:38:48pm

And the AP joins the crowd and calls the race for Gianforte.

267
Joe Bacon  May 25, 2017 • 9:38:50pm

re: #243 HappyWarrior

You know what makes me sad as fuck? That the area my grandparents grew up in is now a staunchly GOP area. These people. They didn’t fall for Reagan’s crap but they ended up falling for Trump. Cambria County, probably not the only county that went for Mondale and for Trump.

Happy, Beaver County was solidly Democratic until Obama. Now it is totally red. My hometown council had a Democratic majority until they all switched to the GOP when Trump came to town…

268
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 9:41:04pm

re: #257 HappyWarrior

That Trump didn’t carry Orange county is a hopeful sign that Rohrbacher can be overthrown.

Trump did not do well here in California because we are not what he designed himself to serve. We are not desperate enough. The entire West Coast rejected him.

Part of this goes back to understanding how our society is changing. If you’re in a part of the country embracing the change wholeheartedly, chances are Trump didn’t do well.

If you are in a part of the country that is resenting the changes, then Trump probably did well there.

Trump played on resentment quite a bit. It was a big theme of the entire GOP. He went full in on the revanchism.

Problem is, this stew of resentment will not go away, because the change isn’t going to go away. Building a wall to keep out brown people won’t work because guess what, the brown people are already here. So are the atheists, the Muslims, and the LGBQT society. America is not what it was 100 years ago. We are changing.

And that scares people.

269
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:41:06pm

re: #260 HappyWarrior

What do you think it is about those counties that closely border each other that have such wide gaps in results? I’m not really familiar with Colorado’s demographics.

A few things. Think of Colorado like four different regions, The Front Range (all the cities north and south of Denver along the first big mountain range in the southern Rocky Mountains), the eastern plains (everything east of the Front Range), the Mountains, and the Western Slope (everything from the Utah border East for about a hundred miles).

So that complicates things. Thing to keep in mind is the dynamic between The Front Range/Mountains politics with the Eastern Plains/Western Slope politics, which is about as opposite as you can get.

The Mountains are just as liberal in a lot of cases as The Front Range, and that’s because of, well, the mountains. Ski areas, national forests, wilderness areas, which tend to liberalize political thought. Those communities are also more prosperous than their Western Slope/Eastern Plains counterparts, which means better schools and infrastructure and the like.

Colorado is very strange politically.

270
Interesting Times  May 25, 2017 • 9:41:31pm

re: #259 HappyWarrior

The Democratic Party of my grandfather’s youth was heavily comprised of working class men. We’ll welcome them into our party if they want to but they need to eralize that they share a party with racial minorities, women, immigrants, LGBT people, etc all of whom have issues that should be listened to. What infuriates me is this lie that Clinton didn’t address the working class’s concerns. She did, she just didn’t lie to them about returnng them to a mythological past like Trump/Sanders did.

I know I said (shortly after the election) that much of HRC’s messaging failed to reach the very people who would have been helped by her policies and hurt by trump’s, and while I still believe tactics and campaigning could have been a lot better, there’s one thing I didn’t realize about the WWC voters who supported Obama in 2008 and 2012 but went full trumptard in 2016 - they were angered by how he handled the Trayvon Martin killing and Black Lives Matter movement.

So…yes…classic “We’re not racist, how dare you imply we’re racist, and just for that, we’re gonna vote for the candidate endorsed by white supremacists! Derp.” Apparently some WWC voters were fine with Obama just as long as he didn’t act too blackity-blackity-black -_-

271
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:42:12pm

re: #267 Joe Bacon

Happy, Beaver County was solidly Democratic until Obama. Now it is totally red. My hometown council had a Democratic majority until they all switched to the GOP when Trump came to town…

Breaks your heart doesn’t it? My grandma’s sister dislikes Trump but my mom’s cousins and their children even the younger ones like Trump. And it really gets me given Trump’s Putinphila since three of my cousins are adopted from Russia and Putin banned adopting from Russia by Americans. Conversely though, I have found out that a lot of my extended family on my Dad’s side are quite Democratic. They live in Allegheny County though so much more urban folks with more exposure to people of many different backgrounds. It just sucks. Western Pa was a melting pot of so many different peoples when my family first arrived and it still is. I want that same welcome to be extended to Hispanics, Muslims, Asians, and others today.

272
Dave In Austin  May 25, 2017 • 9:43:05pm

re: #266 Brian J.

And the AP joins the crowd and calls the race for Gianforte.

Now Ryan gets to throw shade at this guy for the next 18 mos till the regular elections. And if Jacobs files a civil suit on this guy…..

273
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:44:10pm

re: #269 teleskiguy

A few things. Think of Colorado like four different regions, The Front Range (all the cities north and south of Denver along the first big mountain range in the southern Rocky Mountains), the eastern plains (everything east of the Front Range), the Mountains, and the Western Slope (everything from the Utah border East for about a hundred miles).

So that complicates things. Thing to keep in mind is the dynamic between The Front Range/Mountains politics with the Eastern Plains/Western Slope politics, which is about as opposite as you can get.

The Mountains are just a liberal in a lot of cases as The Front Range, and that’s because of, well, the mountains. Ski areas, national forests, wilderness areas, which tend to liberalize political thought. Those communities are also more prosperous than their Western Slope/Eastern Plains counterparts, which means better schools and infrastructure and the like.

Colorado is very strange politically.

Thanks man. Very interesting stuff. I definitely agree with you about wilderness tending to liberalize people. Same brother I think more or less had quasi libertarian views for a while but since he’s lived in places like Colorado and presently the Tahoe area, he’s become a huge environmental guy. He’s also valued education more too since he himself is a student as is his daughter.

274
Joe Bacon  May 25, 2017 • 9:45:13pm

re: #259 HappyWarrior

The Democratic Party of my grandfather’s youth was heavily comprised of working class men. We’ll welcome them into our party if they want to but they need to eralize that they share a party with racial minorities, women, immigrants, LGBT people, etc all of whom have issues that should be listened to. What infuriates me is this lie that Clinton didn’t address the working class’s concerns. She did, she just didn’t lie to them about returnng them to a mythological past like Trump/Sanders did.

Happy the factory jobs that employed our parents and grandparents and gave them the ability to buy a house, car, put the kids through college while the wife stayed home are no more. My nephews and nieces are all struggling to find jobs that pay probably a third in real wages of what my Dad earned. I ran the figures through my economic models and I discovered that in real 1960-70 dollars, I make around 60% of what Dad did when he was a boilermaker.

The American middle class peaked in October 1973, then three shocks hit it First, the OPEC oil embargo, second the abandonment of the Detroit labor standards where management decided to go all in to kill unions and third the Powell Memorandum plan for the Republicans to gear up their 24/7 Bullshit Machine to brainwash the masses. All three combined began the destruction of the middle class in this country. Sadly we are going to return to the Gilded Age where very few live like kings while the 99% live as peasants.

275
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:45:56pm

re: #270 Interesting Times

I know I said (shortly after the election) that much of HRC’s messaging failed to reach the very people who would have been helped by her policies and hurt by trump’s, and while I still believe tactics and campaigning could have been a lot better, there’s one thing I didn’t realize about the WWC voters who supported Obama in 2008 and 2012 but went full trumptard in 2016 - they were angered by how he handled the Trayvon Martin killing and Black Lives Matter movement.

So…yes…classic “We’re not racist, how dare you imply we’re racist, and just for that, we’re gonna vote for the candidate endorsed by white supremacists! Derp.” Apparently some WWC voters were fine with Obama just as long as didn’t act too blackity-blackity-black -_-

I’ve been having terrible thoughts about how my grandfather would have handled Trump. Part of me thinks he would have rejected him completely but another part of me knows that Grandpa, God love him definitely did have racial resentments that Trump could have exploited and he was also sentimetnal, I’m afraid he would have fallen in love with Melania (Grandpa was Slovenian in parentage, very proud but on the flip side, maybe he would have begged Amy Klobuchar to run.)

276
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:48:37pm

re: #274 Joe Bacon

Happy the factory jobs that employed our parents and grandparents and gave them the ability to buy a house, car, put the kids through college while the wife stayed home are no more. My nephews and nieces are all struggling to find jobs that pay probably a third in real wages of what my Dad earned. I ran the figures through my economic models and I discovered that in real 1960-70 dollars, I make around 60% of what Dad did when he was a boilermaker.

The American middle class peaked in October 1973, then three shocks hit it First, the OPEC oil embargo, second the abandonment of the Detroit labor standards where management decided to go all in to kill unions and third the Powell Memorandum plan for the Republicans to gear up their 24/7 Bullshit Machine to brainwash the masses. All three combined began the destruction of the middle class in this country. Sadly we are going to return to the Gilded Age where very few live like kings while the 99% live as peasants.

Interesting, I always attribute the decline of the American middle class to the election of Reagan and his war on the unions and the increase in CEO pay while worker pay stagnated. Thanks. Man to think what my other grandfather, the labor arbirator woud think of al lthis. He was middle class his whole life more or less, maybe even upper I’d say since he didn’t need the GI Bill to pay for his college education- only one of my four grandparents who went to colelge btw but he had an eye for the littel guy like I do.

277
Joe Bacon  May 25, 2017 • 9:50:31pm

I remember when Mark Perlman introduced me to the works of Joseph Schumpeter the renegade economist who predicted that Capitalism would self destruct from unchecked greed and America would wind up social democratic like Scandanavia. Schumpeter predicted that it would take 100 years for that to happen back in 1950. I got a feeling he overshot that figure by around 20 years…

278
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:51:51pm

re: #270 Interesting Times

I know I said (shortly after the election) that much of HRC’s messaging failed to reach the very people who would have been helped by her policies and hurt by trump’s, and while I still believe tactics and campaigning could have been a lot better, there’s one thing I didn’t realize about the WWC voters who supported Obama in 2008 and 2012 but went full trumptard in 2016 - they were angered by how he handled the Trayvon Martin killing and Black Lives Matter movement.

So…yes…classic “We’re not racist, how dare you imply we’re racist, and just for that, we’re gonna vote for the candidate endorsed by white supremacists! Derp.” Apparently some WWC voters were fine with Obama just as long as didn’t act too blackity-blackity-black -_-

I agree with that wholeheartily. And it’s something that those like Sanders don’t want to admit. And oyu know what, I get why we want to romanticize the WWC. Yo uguys knwo my story, my mom’s grandfathers were both immigrant coal miners who I don’t think ever considered voting GOP especially after FDR came along. but in mythologizing the WWC, we do ignore that the unions and I’m very pro union were definitely resistant to racial integration, civil rights, opposition to Vietnam War, etc. That’s why the New Deal Coalition collapsed. Not because the Dems abandoned the working class but because the Dems really were trying to become the party of every American regardless of his skin color and now sexual oriientation.

279
Targetpractice  May 25, 2017 • 9:52:08pm

re: #261 HappyWarrior

I believe the New Deal Coalition collapsed when the Republican Party saw the bigtory that existed in the country and realized they could be a lot more successful catering to that than continuing on the path they had been since Ike. Goldwater, I don’t feel was a racist but the GOP fucked up big time by nominating an opponent of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. And Goldwater although I know he hated what the GOP became was part of their downward spiral.

I’d argue that the Coalition really collapsed in ‘65 with the passage of the Great Society on the coal-tails of LBJ’s win in ‘64. The reason being is that it was with the passage of the Great Society that the “WWC” suddenly realized that equality was about more than just votes. The government was going to give “their” tax dollars to “those people” and it drove them into a lather. One that the GOP was able to exploit come ‘68 and has been doing so ever since.

280
Joe Bacon  May 25, 2017 • 9:52:52pm

re: #276 HappyWarrior

Interesting, I always attribute the decline of the American middle class to the election of Reagan and his war on the unions and the increase in CEO pay while worker pay stagnated. Thanks. Man to think what my other grandfather, the labor arbirator woud think of al lthis. He was middle class his whole life more or less, maybe even upper I’d say since he didn’t need the GI Bill to pay for his college education- only one of my four grandparents who went to colelge btw but he had an eye for the littel guy like I do.

Happy, I did not expect Quist to even come close to defeating the thug. I’m not getting my hopes up about Ossoff either. But part of me is gloating because now Paul Ryan has to deal with another Asshole in the House…

281
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:53:04pm

re: #279 Targetpractice

I’d argue that the Coalition really collapsed in ‘65 with the passage of the Great Society on the coal-tails of LBJ’s win in ‘64. The reason being is that it was with the passage of the Great Society that the “WWC” suddenly realized that equality was about more than just votes. The government was going to give “their” tax dollars to “those people” and it drove them into a lather. One that the GOP was able to exploit come ‘68 and has been doing so ever since.

See my above point heh.

282
Apocalypse  May 25, 2017 • 9:53:44pm

re: #266 Brian J.

Not really surprising. I would be interested in the Early Voting numbers involved.

283
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:54:16pm

re: #280 Joe Bacon

Happy, I did not expect Quist to even come close to defeating the thug. I’m not getting my hopes up about Ossoff either. But part of me is gloating because now Paul Ryan has to deal with another Asshole in the House…

Yeah I’m not either. Rooting harder for Ossoff than I was Quist TBH though. Purely sentimal reasons. Same age and similiar name.

284
Joe Bacon  May 25, 2017 • 9:54:55pm

re: #279 Targetpractice

I’d argue that the Coalition really collapsed in ‘65 with the passage of the Great Society on the coal-tails of LBJ’s win in ‘64. The reason being is that it was with the passage of the Great Society that the “WWC” suddenly realized that equality was about more than just votes. The government was going to give “their” tax dollars to “those people” and it drove them into a lather. One that the GOP was able to exploit come ‘68 and has been doing so ever since.

It was Wallace succeeding where Thurmond failed in 1948 to splinter the white working class away from the Democratic Party and into the arms of Nixon. Reagan, Ailes, Atwater and Gingrich sealed the deal…

285
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 9:55:36pm

re: #273 HappyWarrior

Keep in mind that even the Front Range is severely split politically. Think Boulder vs. Colorado Springs.

286
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:56:14pm

re: #284 Joe Bacon

It was Wallace succeeding where Thurmond failed in 1948 to splinter the white working class away from the Democratic Party and into the arms of Nixon. Reagan, Ailes, Atwater and Gingrich sealed the deal…

The Northern WWC that is. The modern GOP has more in common with Wallace than they do with Dewey, Ike, or dare I say it the version of Nixon that lost to JFK.

287
Don't Blame Me, I Voted for Kodos  May 25, 2017 • 9:57:28pm

What is most depressing about this outcome to me is that there are more than a few people on the right who now consider it open season on committing acts of violence against media members, and perceived liberals in general - all of Donald Trump’s rhetoric has been completely validated.
Gianforte’s assault on a reporter is only the beginning - we will be seeing much worse in the coming weeks/months.

288
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 9:57:29pm

re: #285 teleskiguy

Keep in mind that even the Front Range is severely split politically. Think Boulder vs. Colorado Springs.

Ah okay. I’ve got some family and friends in Boulder actually. My aunt’s been out there for gosh over 45 years now. My aunt and her first husband were pretty much hippies while my other aunt while not conservative politically and her husband were the total opposite.

289
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 10:00:23pm

One of my dad’s cousins tells me their grandfather hated Truman. I wish I could find out why heh since it seems everyone hated Truman when Truman wwas in office. So I don’t know if Pap Pap was someone wh thought Truman was unwrothy to replace FDR and it should have been someone more lefty or if he thought Truman was “soft on the Reds.” Know nothing about his political beliefs though I assume Democratic given Irish-American working class Catholics i those days were pretty heavily Democratic and his daughter, my Nana was staunchly Democratic but she may have came nto that on her own.

290
teleskiguy  May 25, 2017 • 10:00:53pm
291
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 10:01:24pm

FDR ran into problems too. He supposedly got to the point where he said he’d rather have a liberal Republican than a conservative Democrat.

Our system of elections enforce, indirectly in some cases, more directly in others, the idea of a two party system. But democracies all over the world show that if allowed the body politic will split into all sorts of divisions.

292
HappyWarrior  May 25, 2017 • 10:04:50pm

re: #291 freetoken

FDR ran into problems too. He supposedly got to the point where he said he’d rather have a liberal Republican than a conservative Democrat.

Our system of elections enforce, indirectly in some cases, more directly in others, the idea of a two party system. But democracies all over the world show that if allowed the body politic will split into all sorts of divisions.

There were a lot of decent liberal Republicans in those days. I have a biography from a directory of my dad’s other grandfather and he’s described as a supporter of the GOP. His son was staunchly liberal. Unfortunately I can’t tell you if my grandfather was a liberal like his Dad who just became a Democratic Party supporter or a rebel. I guess I like to think he was a rebel.

293
freetoken  May 25, 2017 • 10:05:03pm

With Sinclair buying Tribune, wingnuts now control the largest group of so-called independent television stations.

This follows the far right taking over AM radio through their hate-talk shows.

With the FCC now openly in the hands of the largest of corporate media, there is little to hope that broadcasting is going to be anything other than programming Americans to be servile to the upper .1%.

294
Joe Bacon  May 25, 2017 • 10:07:24pm

re: #293 freetoken

With Sinclair buying Tribune, wingnuts now control the largest group of so-called independent television stations.

This follows the far right taking over AM radio through their hate-talk shows.

With the FCC now openly in the hands of the largest of corporate media, there is little to hope that broadcasting is going to be anything other than programming Americans to be servile to the upper .1%.

The Republican 24/7 Bullshit Machine is tightening it’s grip on information. Just like Izvestia/TASS/Pravda did in the Soviet Union.’


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