The Bob Cesca Show: Chimp With a Machine Gun

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Today’s program from our podcasting affiliate, The Bob Cesca Show:

Chimp With A Machine Gun: Buzz Burbank from Buzz Burbank News and Comment is here today; The Trump Crisis Day 152; Stephanie Miller in LA Weekly; Jon Ossoff and the Georgia special election; Sean Spicer in trouble; Trump’s lawyer confirms and denies Trump is under investigation; Mike Flynn worked for a company that sold spyware; Jared Kushner speaks; Witness flipping expert added to Mueller’s team; Claire McCaskill hammers befuddled Orrin Hatch; and much more.

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269 comments

1
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 5:55:53pm

Everything that’s left to report from SC-5 is GOP country - but, damn, if the best they can do in a special election is to win with the 53 or 54% Norman will end up getting, in a district that’s as Republican as SC-5, that’s exceptional news for us heading into 2016.

There are probably 80 or 90 GOP-held seats that are way less Republican than SC-5, and we only need to flip, what, 23 of them?

2
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 5:58:22pm

re: #1 ipsos

Everything that’s left to report from SC-5 is GOP country - but, damn, if the best they can do in a special election is to win with the 53 or 54% Norman will end up getting, in a district that’s as Republican as SC-5, that’s exceptional news for us heading into 2016.

There are probably 80 or 90 GOP-held seats that are way less Republican than SC-5, and we only need to flip, what, 23 of them?

Of course, GA-6 is one of them, and it’s looking like it’s not to be.

Damn you, James Hodgkinson. Damn you, Donald Sanders.

3
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:00:11pm

Hi everybody!

4
Targetpractice  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:01:31pm

re: #3 Varek Raith

Hi everybody!

Hi Dr Nick!

5
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:04:10pm
6
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:05:21pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

This is Georgia, and that’s a pullback.

7
BeachDem  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:05:33pm

re: #1 ipsos

Everything that’s left to report from SC-5 is GOP country - but, damn, if the best they can do in a special election is to win with the 53 or 54% Norman will end up getting, in a district that’s as Republican as SC-5, that’s exceptional news for us heading into 2016.

There are probably 80 or 90 GOP-held seats that are way less Republican than SC-5, and we only need to flip, what, 23 of them?

For example—Union County:

Mulvaney took it in 2016 59/38

This election in Union County:

Norman 50/ Parnell 49 (actually, took it by a total of 39 votes)

8
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:05:42pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

Europe is capable of learning from mistakes (its own and those of others)

9
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:07:39pm

re: #8 Interesting Times

We haven’t had a chance for the less red parts of the country to weigh in yet on whether we’re ready to stop being stupid. The only special elections we’ve had so far were in what were supposed to be districts so safely red that it was fine to pull guys like Zinke and Price and Mulvaney out of them, because how could a Democrat even make the race close?

10
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:08:53pm

re: #9 ipsos

We haven’t had a chance for the less red parts of the country to weigh in yet on whether we’re ready to stop being stupid. The only special elections we’ve had so far were in what were supposed to be districts so safely red that it was fine to pull guys like Zinke and Price and Mulvaney out of them, because how could a Democrat even make the race close?

Yep. Won’t stop the media and far left from calling the Dems failures if they don’t win though.

11
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:09:30pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Europe is all, “Whoa! Let’s not do that!”

America is all, “I meant to do that!”

12
Ace Rothstein  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:09:48pm

AP calls it for Norman.

13
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:11:18pm

re: #12 Ace Rothstein

AP calls it for Norman.

Damn. BD’s guy gave it a great effort tho.

14
Ace Rothstein  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:13:43pm

Think of it like this: If a Democrat were to lose to, say, Coroner or Lyin’ Ted by 3 points, it would be an earthquake here in ruby red Texas.

15
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:14:20pm

So, now that SC5 was closer than expected, the question arises - should the DNC have poured money into the district? Or did Parnell do better than expected because they DIDN’T?

I gotta think that a fair chunk of Handel’s vote is motivated by the usual ‘coastal elites’ bullshit.

16
Stanley Sea  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:14:20pm
17
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:14:59pm

A Democrat lost by just 3 points in South Carolina. That’s a big deal, folks. And Norman has to run again in 2018.

18
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:16:19pm
19
BeachDem  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:16:49pm

re: #13 HappyWarrior

Damn. BD’s guy gave it a great effort tho.

Fucking York County. Rock Hill Republicans. Ugh.

But Archie was a matador—just too many asshole Republican bulls…

20
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:17:19pm
21
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:17:20pm

re: #15 Blind Frog Belly White

So, now that SC5 was closer than expected, the question arises - should the DNC have poured money into the district? Or did Parnell do better than expected because they DIDN’T?

I gotta think that a fair chunk of Handel’s vote is motivated by the usual ‘coastal elites’ bullshit.

I think that’s a very legitimate question. If we, as political junkies, find ourselves getting burned out by the kind of incessant fundraising emails the Ossoff folks were sending out, imagine how thoroughly fried your average disengaged Georgia voter must be from nonstop TV ads, phonebank calls, direct mail and so on.

There’s a study to be done, by someone who’s more knowledgeable than I am, to figure out whether there’s a burnout point at which pouring ever more money into a race ends up keeping some voters away from the polls when you’d want to get them there.

22
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:17:32pm

re: #15 Blind Frog Belly White

So, now that SC5 was closer than expected, the question arises - should the DNC have poured money into the district? Or did Parnell do better than expected because they DIDN’T?

I gotta think that a fair chunk of Handel’s vote is motivated by the usual ‘coastal elites’ bullshit.

That is the chicken or egg question that always comes up after a tight loss. That is did the DNC invest not enough or was their lack of presence a benefit.

23
Ace Rothstein  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:17:36pm

One of my bucket list items is to help a Democrat win a US Senate seat from Texas. (I’m 45, so I have plenty of time, I hope)

24
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:18:00pm

re: #18 freetoken

That’s part of the much bigger problem of fundamentalist right wing Christianity.

25
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:18:15pm

re: #19 BeachDem

Fucking York County. Rock Hill Republicans. Ugh.

But Archie was a matador—just too many asshole Republican bulls…

I hope he considers another go of it but running for office is a busy thing.

26
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:18:51pm

I have a feeling 2018 will be a wave of almosts.
Sigh…

27
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:19:05pm

re: #23 Ace Rothstein

One of my bucket list items is to help a Democrat win a US Senate seat from Texas. (I’m 45, so I have plenty of time, I hope)

Senator O’Rourke and Senator Castro have nice rings to them:

28
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:19:39pm

re: #23 Ace Rothstein

I heard Annise Parker recently talking about maybe wanting to get back in to office.

29
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:20:19pm

re: #21 ipsos

I think that’s a very legitimate question. If we, as political junkies, find ourselves getting burned out by the kind of incessant fundraising emails the Ossoff folks were sending out, imagine how thoroughly fried your average disengaged Georgia voter must be from nonstop TV ads, phonebank calls, direct mail and so on.

There’s a study to be done, by someone who’s more knowledgeable than I am, to figure out whether there’s a burnout point at which pouring ever more money into a race ends up keeping some voters away from the polls when you’d want to get them there.

Right. Good observations.

30
lawhawk  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:20:31pm

Almosts and could’ves. Moral victories don’t help turn the tide against the regressive GOP that intends to harm all Americans, including the GOP voters themselves because they’re blind to the harm the GOP intends to do (or worse, think that those actions will somehow help them in the long run).

31
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:20:38pm

re: #24 Charles Johnson

That’s part of the much bigger problem of fundamentalist right wing Christianity.

When you can convince yourself in the face of all the evidence that Evolution didn’t happen and the Earth is 6000 years old, convincing yourself that a sexual assaulting, thrice-married serial adulterer with a long history of cheating employees, investors, creditors, contractors, and wives is a godly man.

32
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:20:38pm

re: #17 teleskiguy

A Democrat lost by just 3 points in South Carolina. That’s a big deal, folks. And Norman has to run again in 2018.

How many Dems got off their butts to vote? Three points is three points. Does it make a rat’s ass who lost the Super Bowl by a field goal?

33
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:22:35pm

re: #23 Ace Rothstein

One of my bucket list items is to help a Democrat win a US Senate seat from Texas. (I’m 45, so I have plenty of time, I hope)

Trump won Texas by just under 9 points in 2016.

He won SC-5 by 18 points in 2016. And our guy just closed that gap to a hair over 3 points tonight.

There’s reason to hope.

34
Barefoot Grin  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:22:58pm

re: #26 Varek Raith

I have a feeling 2018 will be a wave of almosts.
Sigh…

I think/hope the moves the GOP are making now—health care, tax cuts, etc. that are set to ease the pain for Republicans for ten years or so (cynically)—can be righteously exploited in 2018 if Trump’s Russia pain is made more immediate.

35
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:23:38pm

re: #30 lawhawk

Almosts and could’ves. Moral victories don’t help turn the tide against the regressive GOP that intends to harm all Americans, including the GOP voters themselves because they’re blind to the harm the GOP intends to do (or worse, think that those actions will somehow help them in the long run).

Pain is a great educator, and Trump hasn’t even begun to teach us yet.

36
MsJ  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:23:55pm

re: #16 Stanley Sea

I’m shocked they’re not going to do an autopsy. I’d be screaming for one.

37
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:23:55pm

re: #32 whitebeach

Mick Mulvaney won that same seat in 2016 by 21 points.

38
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:24:09pm

Dems why u no vote?!

39
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:24:29pm

We do need a victory at some point for psychological morale.

40
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:24:44pm

re: #35 Decatur Deb

Pain is a great educator, and Trump hasn’t even begun to teach us yet.

It’s the voters, stupid stupid voters. :/

41
goddamnedfrank  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:24:47pm
42
EPR-radar  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:24:54pm

re: #26 Varek Raith

I have a feeling 2018 will be a wave of almosts.
Sigh…

The House in 2018 could go either way, by very large margins. We have GOP gerrymandering and an anti-Trump wave, so everything will depend on whether the wave breaks the usually-safe GOP margins built into their gerrymandering.

43
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:24:58pm

re: #38 Varek Raith

Dems why u no vote?!

Too many damn purists in our party.

44
BeachDem  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:25:35pm

re: #22 HappyWarrior

That is the chicken or egg question that always comes up after a tight loss. That is did the DNC invest not enough or was their lack of presence a benefit.

Although Norman had more money, I don’t think it was really the deciding factor—just a lot of asshole republicans upstate.

Oh, and the NRCC gave Norman $97,000 and the DCCC gave Parnell $275,000, so they did come through, even for a low-key election.

45
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:25:43pm

America’s campaigns are too long. Look at Macron’s victory over LePen - first election 23 April. Run-off 7 May. 2 weeks.

GA06? First election 18th April. Run-of 20 June. Two MONTHS!

Somebody said that one of Ossoff’s problems, maybe fatal, is Ossoff Fatigue. I’m tired of seeing his face on FB, and the appeals for money and the whole damn thing dragging out…

46
EPR-radar  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:25:52pm

re: #31 Blind Frog Belly White

When you can convince yourself in the face of all the evidence that Evolution didn’t happen and the Earth is 6000 years old, convincing yourself that a sexual assaulting, thrice-married serial adulterer with a long history of cheating employees, investors, creditors, contractors, and wives is a godly man.

This is why I view creationism as the GOP’s training grounds for lie-telling.

47
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:25:57pm

re: #37 teleskiguy

Mick Mulvaney won that same seat in 2016 by 21 points.

Your point? It takes but one to win. Unless, of course, you’re talking about the popular vote for President of the United States.

48
retired cynic  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:26:06pm

re: #39 HappyWarrior

We do need a victory at some point for psychological morale.

Yeah, but…. special elections after a new president has pulled out people for his administration are almost always going to be in safe districts. I think the movement we have seen in the last four specials has been tremendous.

49
goddamnedfrank  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:26:09pm
50
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:26:22pm

re: #41 goddamnedfrank

Maybe we really do have to reach bottom before people start voting their economic interest again.

51
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:26:23pm

Don’t mind me, just salty.

52
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:26:49pm

re: #47 whitebeach

Fine. Let’s start to accept President-for-life Fuckface Von Clownstick. All is lost.

53
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:27:48pm

re: #46 EPR-radar

This is why I view creationism as the GOP’s training grounds for lie-telling swallowing.

FTFY

54
retired cynic  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:28:23pm

Nate Silver: “If we wind up with Handel winning by like 2 points and Norman winning by about 4 points, that’s by no means the worst outcome for Democrats. In fact, it’s a sort of par-for-the-course one, given expectations going in. But it’s just about the most annoying possible outcome for Democrats, closing the gap in a lot of places, but not winning anywhere yet.”

55
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:28:32pm
56
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:28:47pm

re: #52 teleskiguy

Fine. Let’s start to accept President-for-life Fuckface Von Clownstick. All is lost.

I said this where?

57
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:29:23pm

re: #56 whitebeach

I fucking said it. You convinced me. Dems will never be in power again.

58
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:29:25pm

re: #55 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Lol Chuck.

59
retired cynic  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:29:25pm

also Nate Silver: “Another thought — the polls were pretty consistent in showing movement toward Handel over the past week. Maybe that was news-driven (e.g., because of the Virginia shooting) or maybe it’s because Republican voters came home over the last few days amid a very high turnout. I’m just flagging that as something to consider when you’re assessing the results — the GOP seemed to have the stronger finishing kick.”

60
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:29:38pm

re: #44 BeachDem

Although Norman had more money, I don’t think it was really the deciding factor—just a lot of asshole republicans upstate.

Oh, and the NRCC gave Norman $97,000 and the DCCC gave Parnell $275,000, so they did come through, even for a low-key election.

There’s that too. Sometimes we have to acknowledge we have a ceiling in some places.

61
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:29:52pm

The NYT analysts are saying there’s still a lot of room left for GA-6 to swing either way. I’m not anywhere near throwing in the towel on this one yet.

nytimes.com

(behind the paywall; use incognito mode if you must…)

62
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:30:51pm

re: #57 teleskiguy

I fucking said it. You convinced me. Dems will never be in power again.

Not unless they can drag their asses to a voting booth. So I guess we’re together on this.

63
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:30:53pm

re: #57 teleskiguy

I fucking said it. You convinced me. Dems will never be in power again.

I suspect you’re overinterpreting what was said.

64
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:31:10pm

What is really grinding my gears is WTF is it going to take for people to frelling vote?!

65
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:31:13pm

Trump is, subjectively, objectively and figuratively… a drag.

66
EPR-radar  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:31:21pm

re: #53 Blind Frog Belly White

Republicans are heavily into both the telling and swallowing of their lies. Creationism is the perfect example. Many Republicans know this is complete bullshit, but they will happily propagate the lies to piss off liberals. Anyone who accepts these blatant lies is a fellow tribe member, so these also function as wingnut territory markers.

67
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:32:04pm

re: #54 retired cynic

Nate Silver: “If we wind up with Handel winning by like 2 points and Norman winning by about 4 points, that’s by no means the worst outcome for Democrats. In fact, it’s a sort of par-for-the-course one, given expectations going in. But it’s just about the most annoying possible outcome for Democrats, closing the gap in a lot of places, but not winning anywhere yet.”

Nate gets it.

68
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:33:08pm

Ok.
I feel better after ranting a bit.

69
covfefe  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:33:39pm

re: #30 lawhawk

We need some actual victories, or all this is for nothing in the end.

70
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:34:34pm

Heh, from DK;

bitches4Hillary
Jun 20 * 09:33:03 PM

enough of the whining already. It’s f’n hard to take down fascism. I’m a sure all the people in the French Resistance, the Revolutionary War, War in Europe and the Pacific, (not to mention the resistance to the Cylon’s attack on the Twelve colonies) are all rolling their eyes in some time warp bar and calling us unflattering earthy names insulting our sexual organs. There is no choice. So it continues to move in our direction that’s good….. on to the next one.. and the next one.

71
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:34:41pm

Nate Cohn, of the NYT’s Upshot, just now:

9:33 PM ET

The big missing piece is the mail absentee vote. It was clearly very good for Ossoff.

But we haven’t seen one single mail-in vote.

So we don’t have any real sense of just how good they will be for Ossoff.

72
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:35:00pm

re: #69 covfefe

We need some actual victories, or all this is for nothing in the end.

This is going to scare the shit out of the adult Republicans. Take it for a gift.

73
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:35:27pm

re: #66 EPR-radar

Republicans are heavily into both the telling and swallowing of their lies. Creationism is the perfect example. Many Republicans know this is complete bullshit, but they will happily propagate the lies to piss off liberals. Anyone who accepts these blatant lies is a fellow tribe member, so these also function as wingnut territory markers.

I think you may be underestimating the extent to which the tribalism actually drives not only professed beliefs, but ACTUAL beliefs. IOW, it becomes more than just a tribal identifier to, for example, deny AGW. The constant reinforcement for agreeing with the crowd, combined with confirmation bias, will drive lukewarm skeptics right into denial.

74
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:35:27pm

re: #72 Decatur Deb

This is going to scare the shit out of the adult Republicans. Take it for a gift.

QFT

75
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:35:29pm
76
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:35:59pm

re: #72 Decatur Deb

This is going to scare the shit out of the adult Republicans. Take it for a gift.

And the Orange Baby won’t understand it at all, which means he won’t understand how to deal with it going forward.

“BUT WE WON! BIGLY!”

77
Jebediah, RBG  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:36:46pm

re: #52 teleskiguy

Fine. Let’s start to accept President-for-life Fuckface Von Clownstick. All is lost.

NAWP!!!
It is hard to be patient - I want that fucker in prison yesterday - but I am going to stick with “pissed-off optimism.”
FVC is a pretty dim bulb, but I think even he is starting to appreciate how fucked he is. As for the GOP, they are seeing elections that should be easy walks turn into nail-biters.
By the time mid-terms roll around, we will be seeing a LOT of filthy dirty GOP’ers exposed by ongoing investigations and that will end up costing them.

78
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:36:53pm

re: #54 retired cynic

Nate Silver: “If we wind up with Handel winning by like 2 points and Norman winning by about 4 points, that’s by no means the worst outcome for Democrats. In fact, it’s a sort of par-for-the-course one, given expectations going in. But it’s just about the most annoying possible outcome for Democrats, closing the gap in a lot of places, but not winning anywhere yet.”

Yep, that’s a very good point. But in the era of the Trump Horror, closing the gap isn’t enough any more.

The pain from Trump’s nightmare policies hasn’t reached most of the population yet. But it will, and that’s the point where we’ll see some real realignment.

79
The Vicious Babushka  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:37:11pm

re: #49 goddamnedfrank

80
Weaselone  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:37:18pm

re: #67 HappyWarrior

Nate gets it.

It goes beyond a little bit irritating. A 2 point loss probably means that Handel’s people are correct in their assumption that the Alexandria shooting pushed her over the finish line.

81
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:37:29pm

re: #77 Jebediah, RBG

NAWP!!!
It is hard to be patient - I want that fucker in prison yesterday - but I am going to stick with “pissed-off optimism.”
FVC is a pretty dim bulb, but I think even he is starting to appreciate how fucked he is. As for the GOP, they are seeing elections that should be easy walks turn into nail-biters.
By the time mid-terms roll around, we will be seeing a LOT of filthy dirty GOP’ers exposed, and that will end up costing them.

Yes.

82
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:37:42pm

re: #75 jaunte

[Embedded content]

That’s really funny, coming from the guy who only stayed competitive in the 2012 race as long as he did because ONE GUY was pumping him full of money.

83
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:37:48pm

re: #75 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Whatever Newty.

84
Belafon  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:38:20pm

Ossoff fatigue is another form of purism.

85
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:38:41pm

re: #80 Weaselone

It goes beyond a little bit irritating. A 2 point loss probably means that Handel’s people are correct in their assumption that the Alexandria shooting pushed her over the finish line.

Save some of that for Kathy Griffin’s halloween costume.

86
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:39:08pm

What ever happens, happens.
Gotta just keep trudging forward.

87
RinaX  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:39:15pm

re: #30 lawhawk

Almosts and could’ves. Moral victories don’t help turn the tide against the regressive GOP that intends to harm all Americans, including the GOP voters themselves because they’re blind to the harm the GOP intends to do (or worse, think that those actions will somehow help them in the long run).

100% with you on this. As I said on another board, until EVERYONE, including red states, really start to be hurt, then this is going to happen. And unfortunately, we have yet to really feel the fallout from the Trump presidency that is coming. And if they somehow backload legislation to not allow the effects to be felt until after 2020, well, we’re just fucked.

88
EPR-radar  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:40:14pm

In 2012 Obama won FL, OH, VA, CO, PA, NH, IA, NV, WI, MN, MI with margins of 10% or less.

Romney won MO, AZ, GA, NC with margins of 10% or less.

That’s a perfect example of team (D) skating on thin ice, as hindsight makes painfully clear.

89
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:40:48pm

Reminder that reality gives us the facts we have to live with. You get to decide how you interpret them.

And no, I’m not talking about how the GOP likes to interpret climate change as not happening. I’m talking about “do you see reasons to be hopeful” or “how do you find the motivation to keep the fight going” because these are the things that matter going forward.

If Ossoff pulls out the win, it doesn’t actually defeat Trump. There’s still a fight ahead. Even if he doesn’t pull out the win, you have to wonder how many GOP reps are looking at the margin and considering what it might mean in their district. Of course, if they assume that we’re going to eat ourselves alive and give up after a loss, it might not matter so much.

I didn’t get any phone calls from the restricted number today so I’m going to take that as a win, personally.

90
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:42:15pm

re: #84 Belafon

Ossoff fatigue is another form of purism.

Well……..

Here’s the thing - I have had this “Christ, isn’t that done yet?” feeling for weeks, and I think it’s because the news is coming at us SO FUCKING FAST these days that the original election seems like another year ago!

91
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:43:43pm

More positive news from GA-6: Cobb (the reddest of the three counties by far) is already 78%. Fulton and DeKalb don’t even have half in yet.

92
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:44:06pm

Anyway ants are the scourge of the earth and my car’s AC is broken so really. My week feels pretty shitty anyway. But I’m going to find the hope where I can because there’s still shit to be done.

93
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:44:09pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

The pain from Trump’s nightmare policies hasn’t reached most of the population yet. But it will, and that’s the point where we’ll see some real realignment.

LGF user Renaissance Man (one of the most eloquently pessimistic among us) often says that trump will get more votes in 2020 - I suspect he might be basing this assessment on the pattern with Dubya Bush - lost the popular vote but won the EC in 2000, but then won both in 2004 thanks to a lackluster Dem candidate and the “war president” advantage.

So…assuming trump starts a war for shits and giggles and an approval bump, the question remains, are enough voters so utterly stupid they’d return to that pile of vomit, so to speak…

94
bratwurst  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:44:45pm

re: #35 Decatur Deb

Pain is a great educator, and Trump hasn’t even begun to teach us yet.

Is it a form of dyslexia that on first read I saw your post as “Palin is a great educator”?

I was like:

95
RinaX  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:45:26pm

re: #64 Varek Raith

What is really grinding my gears is WTF is it going to take for people to frelling vote?!

For it to affect them directly. Right now, a lot of people’s day to day lives haven’t changed much, regardless of political affiliation. That means that the majority that weren’t motivated to vote last November don’t see how anything’s different from their perspective. Most of what we agonize over is just a blurb on the web or a segment on the news before they change the channel.

I’m not depressed or angry at this outcome because I kind of expected it due to what I said above. People want Dems when there is a disaster to be fixed. It just hasn’t hit hard enough yet.

96
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:46:55pm

Karen Handel’s going to win. It’s over.

97
RinaX  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:47:14pm

re: #90 Blind Frog Belly White

Well……..

Here’s the thing - I have had this “Christ, isn’t that done yet?” feeling for weeks, and I think it’s because the news is coming at us SO FUCKING FAST these days that the original election seems like another year ago!

Agreed. I’m sick of hearing about political campaigns, period. And yet I force myself to follow them. I can’t imagine what it’s like for those less politically engaged.

98
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:47:24pm

From the previous thread:

re: #122 Brian J.

Mine is completely nonexistent. No more paved roads or schools or hospitals for these folks. Let their white power sustain them and their kids.

re: #125 HappyWarrior

Problem with that is you can’t do that without hurting other people.

re: #127 Brian J.

Those other people need to move, then; there’s no reason for them to hurt themselves by sustained contact with those who wish them dead.

I really get tired of the “they need to move” talk.

Send me sufficient money to buy a house (or even rent an apartment) elsewhere, and I’ll move. A job would be nice, too.

Contrarily, you could put money into the good fight for those of us trying to change that within.

Your fake concern is noted. Unless you are willing to help we poor who live in red areas move, you are just making such statements to make yourself feel better.

re: #280 ipsos

School boards. Town councils. All the things.

It’s a shame that so much of the coordination (such as it isn’t) and money (such as it is) comes through organizations such as the DCCC and DSCC that aren’t designed to do anything downticket, and that there’s not really a national DNC ability to focus on that kind of grassroots rebuilding of a national party.

It sure is, because the GOP does exactly that. This isn’t rocket surgery. It’s not like national parties have ever organised local and state-level resources in the past 240 years or so (oh wait, they have).

99
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:47:26pm

re: #96 Charles Johnson

Karen Handel’s going to win. It’s over.

Shit.

100
Jebediah, RBG  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:48:03pm

re: #93 Interesting Times

So…assuming trump starts a war for shits and giggles and an approval bump, the question remains, are enough voters so utterly stupid they’d return to that pile of vomit, so to speak…

One difference is that W didn’t have the cloud of possible treason hanging over him. And, as bad as he was, he wasn’t so incredibly, clownishly incompetent.

101
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:48:59pm

re: #99 HappyWarrior

Shit.

It’s worth remembering that this was always the most likely result.

102
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:50:10pm

re: #101 Blind Frog Belly White

It’s worth remembering that this was always the most likely result.

Indeed.

103
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:50:18pm

And if Charles is right, and checking Nate Cohn, Dave Wasserman, and Harry Enten it seems he probably is, we move on to the next race.

104
Kragar  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:51:02pm
105
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:51:37pm

re: #98 Anymouse 🌹

From the previous thread:

I really get tired of the “they need to move” talk.

Send me sufficient money to buy a house (or even rent an apartment) elsewhere, and I’ll move. A job would be nice, too.

Contrarily, you could put money into the good fight for those of us trying to change that within.

Your fake concern is noted. Unless you are willing to help we poor who live in red areas move, you are just making such statements to make yourself feel better.

re: #280 ipsos

It sure is, because the GOP does exactly that. This isn’t rocket surgery. It’s not like national parties have ever organised local and state-level resources in the past 240 years or so (oh wait, they have).

I never suggested that they need to move. As for money, you do know we have races in our backyards that we focus on too right? And let me tell you this again, I live in a red area. Please stop dismissing me as someone who lives in a bright blue area. I get frustrated with Republican voters because well I live it and see their intolerance towards those they deem not “real Virginians” or “real Americans.” As for being organized locally and state wide, there are always going ot be areas where we struggle because the voters there aren’t hospitable to our message. It’s just a fact. Doesn’t mean we ignore it but it does mean we are realistic too about expectations and knowing the areas.

106
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:52:05pm

re: #101 Blind Frog Belly White

It’s worth remembering that this was always the most likely result.

I know. Still disappointed. I was rooting for my namesake and fellow 30 year old hard heh.

107
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:52:15pm

re: #101 Blind Frog Belly White

108
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:52:38pm

re: #104 Kragar

[Embedded content]

Conservative voters in a nutshell.

109
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:53:07pm
110
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:53:09pm

re: #107 klys (maker of Silmarils)

[Embedded content]

Yes, yes indeed. And Handel had won statewide before too.

111
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:53:18pm

re: #108 HappyWarrior

Conservative voters in a nutshell.

If only we could put them in an ACTUAL nutshell…….

112
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:53:40pm

Oh goody, the purity patrol appears on DK.
*Closes tab*

113
ipsos  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:54:09pm

Most of the DeKalb vote just came in.

It’s over.

On to the next fight…

114
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:55:15pm

Also, this thread for folks who are feeling like none of it matters if we don’t have any wins to show for it:

115
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:55:27pm

In other news, yesterday’s little thunderstorm knocked a tree over in my backyard.
RIP $30 firepit.

116
Joe Bacon 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:55:32pm

I had to close the Kos thread. Same old same old purity police.

117
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:55:39pm
118
ObserverArt  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:55:45pm

re: #52 teleskiguy

Fine. Let’s start to accept President-for-life Fuckface Von Clownstick. All is lost.

Question. What are the traits of leftist snowflakes?

119
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:57:00pm

re: #118 ObserverArt

Question. What are the traits of leftist snowflakes?

They melt.

120
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:57:07pm

re: #105 HappyWarrior

I never suggested that they need to move. As for money, you do know we have races in our backyards that we focus on too right? And let me tell you this again, I live in a red area. Please stop dismissing me as someone who lives in a bright blue area. I get frustrated with Republican voters because well I live it and see their intolerance towards those they deem not “real Virginians” or “real Americans.” As for being organized locally and state wide, there are always going ot be areas where we struggle because the voters there aren’t hospitable to our message. It’s just a fact. Doesn’t mean we ignore it but it does mean we are realistic too about expectations and knowing the areas.

I didn’t say you suggested it: Brian J. did (I did the quote thingy here at LGF so you can read who said it). I quoted you for the context of his response.

121
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:58:19pm
122
covfefe  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:58:20pm

re: #111 Blind Frog Belly White

Austin Powers In A Nutshell

123
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:58:53pm

re: #120 Anymouse 🌹

I didn’t say you suggested it: Brian J. did (I did the quote thingy here at LGF so you can read who said it). I quoted you for the context of his response.

Ah ok. Sorry AM. I apologize.

124
ObserverArt  Jun 20, 2017 • 6:59:14pm

re: #70 Varek Raith

Heh, from DK;

bitches4Hillary
Jun 20 * 09:33:03 PM

enough of the whining already. It’s f’n hard to take down fascism. I’m a sure all the people in the French Resistance, the Revolutionary War, War in Europe and the Pacific, (not to mention the resistance to the Cylon’s attack on the Twelve colonies) are all rolling their eyes in some time warp bar and calling us unflattering earthy names insulting our sexual organs. There is no choice. So it continues to move in our direction that’s good….. on to the next one.. and the next one.

I’m starting to get part of the Leftist Snowflake traits.

125
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:00:04pm

Sarc tags are for lepers.

126
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:00:51pm

re: #117 Charles Johnson

Goddamit Charles, the doc just told me I need to cut back on the booze.

127
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:00:58pm

re: #125 teleskiguy

*gives teleskiguy a hand*

128
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:00:59pm
129
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:01:05pm

re: #123 HappyWarrior

Ah ok. Sorry AM. I apologize.

Z’alright.

Besides, we already don’t have paved roads, schools, or hospitals here. (We did have a one-room school in my town but it closed in 2005.)

130
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:01:10pm
131
ObserverArt  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:01:31pm

re: #72 Decatur Deb

This is going to scare the shit out of the adult Republicans. Take it for a gift.

Some are looking at the gift horse’s wrong end.

132
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:01:34pm

re: #127 jaunte

*gives teleskiguy a hand*

Now you need to be quarantined as well.

133
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:01:47pm

re: #127 jaunte

*gives teleskiguy a hand*

Thanks! I lost my other hand this morning, melted right off in the heat.

134
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:02:13pm

re: #129 Anymouse 🌹

Z’alright.

Besides, we already don’t have paved roads, schools, or hospitals here. (We did have a one-room school in my town but it closed in 2005.)

I know it’s no consolation as I don’t live in your state but I always support bond issues for schools, roads, etc.

135
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:03:06pm

To Jon Ossoff and Archie Parnell - thanks for fighting the good fight deep in Red territory! Trump would never have appointed Price and Mulvaney if their seats seemed like they were in danger, so not taking them was the more likely outcome. You guys narrowed the gap by something like 15-20%, which is nothing to sneeze at!

We get ourselves so wound up in expectation that we get depressed when we fail to overcome the odds. We have to stop that.

We need to be the Rabid Rat - we just keep coming at them, no matter what they throw at us. This is how the Tea Party won the Presidency - they didn’t get mopey when they lost, especially when they were expected to lose anyway. They just kept coming.

That’s gotta be us.

136
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:03:57pm

Generalissimo Franco, Liberator of Teruel, is still dead.

137
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:04:10pm
138
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:04:14pm

re: #135 Blind Frog Belly White

To Jon Ossoff and Archie Parnell - thanks for fighting the good fight deep in Red territory! Trump would never have appointed Price and Mulvaney if their seats seemed like they were in danger, so not taking them was the more likely outcome. You guys narrowed the gap by something like 15-20%, which is nothing to sneeze at!

We get ourselves so wound up in expectation that we get depressed when we fail to overcome the odds. We have to stop that.

We need to be the Rabid Rat - we just keep coming at them, no matter what they throw at us. This is how the Tea Party won the Presidency - they didn’t get mopey when they lost, especially when they were expected to lose anyway. They just kept coming.

That’s gotta be us.

Here, here

139
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:04:24pm
140
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:04:54pm

re: #133 teleskiguy

Thanks! I lost my other hand this morning, melted right off in the heat.

The floor is actually lava, eh?

141
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:05:17pm

re: #135 Blind Frog Belly White

We get ourselves so wound up in expectation that we get depressed when we fail to overcome the odds. We have to stop that.

142
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:06:04pm

re: #140 Varek Raith

The floor is actually lava, eh?

The leprosy gets worse as the lava flows.

143
makeitstop  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:06:25pm

Mike Pompeo, please move to the ‘compromised’ line, please.

Senior officials across the government became convinced in January that the incoming national security adviser, Michael T. Flynn, had become vulnerable to Russian blackmail.

At the F.B.I., the C.I.A., the Justice Department and the Office of the Director of National Intelligence — agencies responsible for keeping American secrets safe from foreign spies — career officials agreed that Mr. Flynn represented an urgent problem.

Yet nearly every day for three weeks, the new C.I.A. director, Mike Pompeo, sat in the Oval Office and briefed President Trump on the nation’s most sensitive intelligence — with Mr. Flynn listening. Mr. Pompeo has not said whether C.I.A. officials left him in the dark about their views of Mr. Flynn, but one administration official said Mr. Pompeo did not share any concerns about Mr. Flynn with the president.

The episode highlights a remarkable aspect of Mr. Flynn’s tumultuous, 25-day tenure in the White House: He sat atop a national security apparatus that churned ahead despite its own conclusion that he was at risk of being compromised by a hostile foreign power.

144
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:06:33pm

re: #142 teleskiguy

The leprosy gets worse as the lava flows.

Huh, I thought that was Spice.

145
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:07:26pm

re: #144 Varek Raith

Huh, I thought that was Spice.

OK, where were we again? The thread seems to be unraveling.

146
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:07:35pm

re: #97 RinaX

Agreed. I’m sick of hearing about political campaigns, period. And yet I force myself to follow them. I can’t imagine what it’s like for those less politically engaged.

Yup. The folks you find around here, at Daily Kos, FiveThirtyEight, &c are the people who enjoy following the ebb and flow of political fortunes (even in races thousands of miles away).

The average American, not so much. (At least I don’t own a television set to see a drumbeat of political adverts around election time.)

147
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:07:59pm

spammer is back
littlegreenfootballs.com

148
Varek Raith  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:08:07pm

re: #145 teleskiguy

OK, where were we again? The thread seems to be unraveling.

I dunno, Arrakis?

149
sagehen  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:08:29pm

re: #2 Brian J.

Of course, GA-6 is one of them, and it’s looking like it’s not to be.

Damn you, James Hodgkinson. Damn you, Donald Sanders.

Also… wasn’t Osoff doing a little better before Bernie opened his big mouth?

150
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:08:38pm

re: #121 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Bleh, that’s the same thing that was said about Kansas and Montana -_-

(and in Montana, you had GOPer voters outright *praising* Gianforte’s thuggish assault. So…if you want to understand the mindset of a GOPer voter, ask yourself, “what’s the cruel/stupid/fascist thing to do?” and assume they heartily support it)

Again, this goes well beyond trump for me - it reinforces how tens of millions of voters are staring into the abyss and not only liking what they see, but happily jumping right in.

It’s like having to stand helplessly (in Canada) and watch as America gets hooked on krokodil.

151
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:09:14pm

re: #148 Varek Raith

I dunno, Arrakis?

Is that the place with the sand snakes in Beetlejuice?

152
Joe Bacon 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:10:25pm

re: #151 teleskiguy

Is that the place with the sand snakes in Beetlejuice?

It’s Dune…

153
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:10:25pm

*groan*

154
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:10:56pm

re: #152 Joe Bacon 🌹

It’s Dune…

I know it’s Dune! I’m trying to really get the thread off the rails.

155
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:10:57pm

re: #150 Interesting Times

Bleh, that’s the same thing that was said about Kansas and Montana -_-

(and in Montana, you had GOPer voters outright *praising* Gianforte’s thuggish assault. So…if you want to understand the mindset of a GOPer voter, ask yourself, “what’s the cruel/stupid/fascist thing to do?” and assume they heartily support it)

Again, this goes well beyond trump for me - it reinforces how tens of millions of voters are staring into the abyss and not only liking what they see, but happily jumping right in.

It’s like having to stand helplessly (in Canada) and watch as America gets hooked on krokodil.

Trump really is the symptom. Remember Cruz was number two. It’s not like Jeb or even Rubio was.

156
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:11:00pm

Just posted this to Facebook:

Big kudos to Jon Ossoff and Archie Parnell tonight! Both of them, running in districts that went GOP by >20%, brought the margin to low single digits! Well done!

We do that everywhere, Paul Ryan’s looking for a new job, come January 2019!

157
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:11:30pm

re: #156 Blind Frog Belly White

Just posted this to Facebook:

Yes!

158
Dave In Austin  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:12:06pm

re: #153 teleskiguy

*groan*

[Embedded content]

My Dad has returned from the dead……

159
EPR-radar  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:12:15pm

re: #150 Interesting Times

Bleh, that’s the same thing that was said about Kansas and Montana -_-

(and in Montana, you had GOPer voters outright *praising* Gianforte’s thuggish assault. So…if you want to understand the mindset of a GOPer voter, ask yourself, “what’s the cruel/stupid/fascist thing to do?” and assume they heartily support it)

Again, this goes well beyond trump for me - it reinforces how tens of millions of voters are staring into the abyss and not only liking what they see, but happily jumping right in.

It’s like having to stand helplessly (in Canada) and watch as America gets hooked on krokodil.

These two things are both true:

1) tr*mp is a ghastly abomination, providing to be the worst president in US history in the first few weeks of his continual fuckup parade. Every day he is in office is an existential threat to all human life on the planet.

2) tr*mp is merely a small symptom of the much larger problem of roughly half the US electorate being malicious and stupid enough to vote tr*mp/Republican.

160
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:13:25pm

re: #154 teleskiguy

I know it’s Dune! I’m trying to really get the thread off the rails.

Saturn, actually

“You’ve been to Saturn, I’ve been to Saturn - Sandworms! You hate ‘em, right?”

161
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:14:42pm

re: #160 Blind Frog Belly White

Have to admit it’s been many years since I’ve seen that film. I forgot, yeah, it’s Saturn!

162
covfefe  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:15:05pm

Running Man is on the tube (or shall I say panel) tonight. I forgot it was staged in 2019* (oops. had 2017). In a lot of ways, it’s not far off.

163
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:15:43pm

re: #150 Interesting Times

In Montana, a great amount of the vote was already cast before Gianforte’s incident with the Guardian reporter. I recall reading a number of people calling their elections commission asking if they could change their votes in the wake of that.

164
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:16:09pm

The sunset tonight at my twenty is going to be epic. Like something out of a goddamned Monet painting. Maybe I’ll take a picture or two with the pocket glowing rectangle.

165
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:16:39pm

Karen Handel remains a destructive bigot wiling to punish children to maintain her prejudice.

166
EPR-radar  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:17:34pm

re: #165 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Karen Handel remains a destructive bigot wiling to punish children to maintain her prejudice.

Just like nearly everyone else in the Godforsaken Republican party.

167
BeachDem  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:18:33pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Yep, that’s a very good point. But in the era of the Trump Horror, closing the gap isn’t enough any more.

The pain from Trump’s nightmare policies hasn’t reached most of the population yet. But it will, and that’s the point where we’ll see some real realignment.

For Archie Parnell to be within 3 points of winning when Mulvaney won that seat in 2016 by 21 points might not be enough, but it’s pretty incredible here in South Carolina.

Remember, we’re the peeps who understand that some things happen incrementally.

Don’t get me wrong; I’d have been over the moon if Archie had won, but that was a pretty outstanding showing in a state where Dems hold no statewide offices and one national seat (Jim Clyburn’s.)

I put money and time (and hope and enthusiasm) into campaigns for candidates who have little chance of winning, but you have to start somewhere. I applaud them for running—for putting in the time and the effort and the pain it takes, and if we don’t get discouraged, things are working their way toward winning.

Yeah, close only counts in horseshoes, but when you live in a RED state like this one, coming within 3 points is a positive sign. If I didn’t believe that, I guess I’d just curl up in a ball, start sucking my thumb again and never leave the house. But I just won’t do that. So yeah, Archie lost, but a lot of people worked hard to get him that close, and it can only get better from here.

(And now, the cockeyed optimist portion of our program has concluded.)

168
ObserverArt  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:20:04pm

re: #135 Blind Frog Belly White

To Jon Ossoff and Archie Parnell - thanks for fighting the good fight deep in Red territory! Trump would never have appointed Price and Mulvaney if their seats seemed like they were in danger, so not taking them was the more likely outcome. You guys narrowed the gap by something like 15-20%, which is nothing to sneeze at!

We get ourselves so wound up in expectation that we get depressed when we fail to overcome the odds. We have to stop that.

We need to be the Rabid Rat - we just keep coming at them, no matter what they throw at us. This is how the Tea Party won the Presidency - they didn’t get mopey when they lost, especially when they were expected to lose anyway. They just kept coming.

That’s gotta be us.

Damn old optimist me is going to say tonight was good news for the states like Ohio, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and maybe some others. If deep deep red Southerner districts are this close, those small margins Hillary lost the EC in the above named states don’t look so hard to turn back over. Many of these states have pretty close elections in national and congressional election years. With some work they could be taken.

Just as long as we keep our collective shit together. Which seems to be a huge problem.

Later.

169
makeitstop  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:23:27pm

Hey, teleskiguy - Matt Taibbi agrees with your assessment of Kelly’s Alex Jones interview.

Kelly graphically demonstrated the benefits of not running from your interview subject. She challenged Jones over and over about Sandy Hook statements like, “The whole thing is a giant hoax.”

Jones offered a stream of nonsensical answers to these queries, to which Kelly asked brutal and correct follow-ups, like: What happened to the children, if they weren’t killed?

To which Jones squirmed and fidgeted and said ridiculous things like, “Listeners and other people are covering this, I didn’t create that story.”

After four or five exchanges of this sort, Jones in an offhand way suggested that maybe he was just playing “devil’s advocate” when he said what he said.

Kelly pounced. “Was that devil’s advocate?” She reread his direct quotes, repeating, “The whole thing is a giant hoax. The whole thing was fake.”

Jones paused for about five seconds before he answered. You could tell he was trying to a) remember what he’d said then, and b) think of what exactly he could get away with saying now. He was cornered.

I’m going to have to watch that interview now.

170
ObserverArt  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:23:35pm

re: #143 makeitstop

Mike Pompeo, please move to the ‘compromised’ line, please.

We got into some decent discussion on that in the previous thread. I was wondering if he had lawyered-up.

171
MsJ  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:25:01pm

Someone wanted to see early vs same day voting.

172
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:25:52pm

re: #169 makeitstop

I’m going to have to watch that interview now.

Here’s a link.

173
DodgerFan1988  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:26:47pm

Karen Handel tells Georgia’s working class go to hell by saying “I don’t support a liveable wage.” They vote for her anyway.

174
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:30:08pm

re: #173 DodgerFan1988

Karen Handel tells Georgia’s working class go to hell by saying “I don’t support a liveable wage.” They vote for her anyway.

More than half of the votes were cast before election day.

Plus, I wonder how many of the regular voters actually heard that remark in the debate?

For fence-sitters, the thing that might have pushed them into the Handel camp was the shooting in Alexandria.

175
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:34:03pm
176
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:34:45pm

re: #175 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Putin would win the GOP nomination for president as a Republican.

177
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:35:56pm

re: #149 sagehen

Also… wasn’t Osoff doing a little better before Bernie opened his big mouth?

Never trailed a poll before the final week.

I’m with Gus_802 in that Bernie Delenda Est, but the Democrats just don’t have the will to look past his narrow Bigoted Working Class voter base or the guts to do anything about a problem even when they see it.

178
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:37:54pm

Charles Pierce at Esquire:

A couple of Democratic senators from New England’s beachfront properties—Sheldon Whitehouse of Rhode Island and Richard Blumenthal of Connecticut—have come right up to the edge of saying what a great number of people have suspected for a while: Namely, that Michael Flynn, the former national security adviser and probably the worst executive branch hire since Albert Fall, has begun to sing sweet, sweet melodies to various investigators. If these two guys are right, then that would explain why everybody in the White House, except (possibly) the gardeners, are scrambling for lawyers. If these two guys are right, then the threat level on all things Russia (and, perhaps, all things Turkey as well) just went into the red zone.

There is more than enough reason to believe that Flynn holds the keys to the kingdom. The president* went to great lengths to keep him around and, when that fell through, he went to great lengths to keep in touch with Flynn, at least for a while. And the leverage the FBI or Whoever has on him keeps getting ratcheted up. Moreover, if you read down through that ABC News story, you discover that Flynn attached himself to a completely harebrained scheme to develop some sort of US-Russia private partnership arrangement concerning nuclear power in precisely the worst place in the world to have loose nuclear fuel lying around.

esquire.com

179
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:39:27pm

re: #178 Anymouse 🌹

Charles Pierce at Esquire:

esquire.com

As long as Article II, Section 2, Clause 1 exists, this is fantasy. Specifically, the part that says “The President… shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States.”

180
DodgerFan1988  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:40:37pm

re: #176 HappyWarrior

Putin would win the GOP nomination for president as a Republican.

Outlaw protests and criticism of his regime? Check.
Jails political opponents and homosexuals? Check
Assassinate independent journalists? Check

181
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:41:05pm
182
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:41:43pm

re: #180 DodgerFan1988

Fascism win

Outlaw protests and criticism of his regime? Check.
Jails political opponents and homosexuals? Check
Assassinate independent journalists? Check

Religious pandering? Check
Jingoistic nationalist? Check

183
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:41:52pm
184
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:41:59pm
185
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:43:04pm

re: #184 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

The GOP base still loves his pathetic ass.

186
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:43:41pm
187
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:44:26pm

re: #186 klys (maker of Silmarils)

[Embedded content]

That’s what America is all about.

188
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:44:47pm
189
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:45:56pm

re: #188 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Yep.

190
BeachDem  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:47:54pm

re: #181 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

As sad as I am that Ossoff lost, I’m thoroughly nauseated that the disgusting piece of trash that is Karen Handel won.

191
CBGB  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:50:59pm

I…I think my Twitter just got murdered.

192
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:52:25pm

re: #184 Charles Johnson

193
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:52:53pm

My brother-in-law battening down the hatches:

Tropical Strom Cindy is currently stationary, but expected to start moving WNW within twelve hours.

The predicted track of the storm carries it over the Texas coast well west of the Louisiana border, in the before-dawn hours Thursday. By Friday the storm is expected to be Tropical Depression Cindy centred over Memphis.

nhc.noaa.gov

It has an odd, heart-shaped tropical storm force windfield. (The point of the heart nearly touches the Mississippi Delta.)

194
Charles Johnson  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:54:49pm
195
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:55:32pm

re: #194 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Yes.

196
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:56:31pm

“…Well, there’s egg and bacon; egg sausage and bacon; egg and spam; egg bacon and spam; egg bacon sausage and spam; spam bacon sausage and spam; spam egg spam spam bacon and spam; spam sausage spam spam bacon spam tomato and spam…

197
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:56:38pm

re: #191 CBGB

I…I think my Twitter just got murdered.

What’s your handle? I’ll check.

198
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:56:58pm

re: #185 HappyWarrior

The GOP base still loves his pathetic ass.

It would appear the GOP convergence on fascism is fast approaching.

199
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:57:31pm

re: #198 Anymouse 🌹

It would appear the GOP convergence on fascism is fast approaching.

Yeah. Gets closer daily imo.

200
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:59:40pm
201
DodgerFan1988  Jun 20, 2017 • 7:59:53pm

re: #185 HappyWarrior

The GOP base still loves his pathetic ass.

Mussolini was popular too with his base.

202
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:00:12pm

re: #200 jaunte

[Embedded content]

What’s that German word?

203
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:00:16pm

re: #172 teleskiguy

204
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:00:29pm

re: #201 DodgerFan1988

Mussolini was popular too with his base.

Yep. Sure was.

205
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:01:55pm

re: #202 HappyWarrior

Backpfeifengesicht?

206
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:03:04pm

It’s easy to see Republican voters as fools, easily conned but when I read comments on stories, I see that a certain ugliness has never really left us. While people like you and I celebrated our first African American president, the legalization of ssm, etc, these people dreaded it. Be well to remember that Reagan had to be pressured into signing MLK Day.

207
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:03:19pm

re: #205 jaunte

Backpfeifengesicht?

Is that the punch face one?

208
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:03:36pm

re: #207 HappyWarrior

That’s the one.

209
HappyWarrior  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:04:07pm

re: #208 jaunte

That’s the one.

Ja then.

210
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:05:08pm

Does anyone here use AOL mail?

211
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:05:32pm

When Trump Doesn’t Tweet (goes to Electoral-Vote)

The article basically addresses the issue of when Trump doesn’t take to Twitter: When events go against his narrative (such as the attack on Muslims in London two weeks ago).

Given the state of the White House Press Office, the American public is largely forced to wait for information to come straight from the horse’s mouth. Fortunately, perhaps, the horse’s…er, mouth is happy to oblige, generally via his Twitter account. At least, on some issues. On others, as CNN’s Z. Byron Wolf observes, Donald Trump’s Twitter silence speaks volumes. He pointedly avoids subjects that are embarrassing to him, or that would force him to contradict his stated positions, or that would upset his base.

There is a case in point unfolding at this very moment. We recall that just two weeks ago, when several Muslims targeted Londoners for a terrorist attack, Trump was immediately on the social media platform talking about how, “We must stop being politically correct and get down to the business of security for our people.” He slammed London mayor Sadiq Khan, and also tried to score some pro-gun points by observing that the attackers used knives. On Sunday, however, the script was reversed. We now know that the latest London attack involved a caucasian man named Darren Osbourne, who shouted “I want to kill all Muslims” while trying to wreak vengeance on a mosque by driving a van into it. One person died and 11 were injured. Prime Minister Theresa May promptly denounced Sunday’s attack, describing it as, “every bit as insidious and destructive to our values and our way of life” as the incidents of June 4. Trump’s response? Silence on all fronts, thus far.

The June 4 and June 18 attacks are virtually identical. Deliberately so, since Osbourne was being governed by some version of “an eye for an eye,” and so tried to replicate the earlier attack as closely as he could. And yet Trump has nothing to say about the more recent incident. Does he believe Muslims are not people, and so are not worthy of comment? Does he think that only Muslims can commit terrorist attacks? Does he fear blowback from the base, even when his ally May does not? Did Osbourne’s actions strike a little too close to home, since it is not impossible to imagine a Trump supporter, fueled by Trump rhetoric, doing the same thing (as already happened in Portland)? It’s possible that the answer to any or all of these questions is “yes.” And, at very least, these questions speak to some of the messages that Trump is sending—whether he means to or not—when he speaks out on some issues, but says nothing about others.

212
blueraven  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:07:51pm

Great ad

213
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:08:05pm

re: #210 jaunte

Does anyone here use AOL mail?

A couple people in my E-mail stable do, but I am an evil Democrat so I have a private E-mail server. (::

(One could argue that AOL or Yahoo or whatnot are also private E-mail servers, just not servers you control.)

214
Teukka  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:08:07pm

re: #175 jaunte

[Embedded content]

My surprised face, let me show you it :|

215
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:11:16pm

The National Hurricane Center just came out with updated information on TS Cindy: Tropical Storm force winds are now on the Louisiana coast, though the storm has not moved. They have also adjusted the landfall path a little east from the last prediction.

216
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:12:12pm

Look out, Alabama.
al.com

217
Cheechako  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:14:43pm

re: #210 jaunte

Does anyone here use AOL mail?

Yes

218
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:14:55pm

re: #184 Charles Johnson

This proves without a doubt that Trump supporters are utterly unreachable. All they care about is pissing off liberals.

219
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:14:58pm
220
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:15:59pm
221
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:16:49pm

Fuckface Von Clownstick thanks Fox News for Karen Handel’s victory tonight. We’re well beyond Pravda level propaganda, folks.

222
blueraven  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:17:17pm

re: #220 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

Then what is the difference between D & R?

223
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:18:25pm

Thread:

224
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:19:12pm

An interesting thought I read somewhere else:

Kellyanne Conway said early in the campaign that Donald Trump should release his taxes. After seeing them herself, she clammed up about that idea.

At the moment, Mrs. Conway seems to be about the only person not entangled in this Russia mess … could she flip (wild-ass speculation here), particularly with just about everyone in the administration and their dog getting lawyers?

225
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:20:09pm

re: #216 jaunte

Weather maps can be so gloriously phallic.

226
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:20:23pm

re: #221 teleskiguy

Fuckface Von Clownstick thanks Fox News for Karen Handel’s victory tonight. We’re well beyond Pravda level propaganda, folks.

Thank you @FoxNews “Huge win for President Trump and GOP in Georgia Congressional Special Election.”

Just hold that thought, Mr President.

227
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:21:06pm

re: #225 teleskiguy

Turns out, Virginia is for Lovers.

228
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:23:16pm

re: #222 blueraven

Then what is the difference between D & R?

Rs win elections :/

Srsly tho, read the Joy Reid thread Jaunte just posted. We’ve also bemoaned low voter turnout among Dems without being able to figure out what to actually do about it. My personal theory is that non-voters who might otherwise go for Dems suffer from a combo of low-info, apathy, and learned helplessness. I also think they don’t perceive Dems as *fighting* for their interests (this touches on the whole caring/empathy thing, yes, but don’t forget the reality-TV-trash aspect of American culture. People *like* seeing a smack-down and feel nothing but contempt for “wimps.” That’s probably why “going high” isn’t working - non-voters perceive it as weakness, not strength).

229
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:23:23pm

re: #217 Cheechako

Yes

Shhh, Cheech, they’ll think we’re olds.

230
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:24:36pm

re: #222 blueraven

Then what is the difference between D & R?

We’re not the ones openly supporting genocide? We’re not the ones proud to be puppets of another government?

Honestly, you need to get the stars knocked out of your eyes. It’ll improve your vision.

231
Cheechako  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:25:27pm

re: #229 whitebeach

Shhh, Cheech, they’ll think we’re olds.

I am a bit older.

232
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:26:30pm

re: #230 Brian J.

The personal insults are getting old.

233
whitebeach  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:27:57pm

re: #231 Cheechako

I am a bit older.

Yes, sir, just a bit, and may you continue to be for a long and pleasant time.

234
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:28:29pm

re: #232 klys (maker of Silmarils)

The personal insults are getting old.

So is the rampant naivete I see here. This party, as Interesting Times notes, needs to get tough on its opponents, because that’s what Americans expect to see from their leaders!

235
jaunte  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:30:47pm
236
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:30:59pm

re: #234 Brian J.

I feel like you’re a few posts away from telling all of us to buy as many guns as we can and bury ammo in our backyard, and oh by the way, you’ll need a five year supply of dry goods stored in your bunker.

237
Don't Blame Me, I Voted for Kodos  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:31:25pm

re: #171 MsJ

Someone wanted to see early vs same day voting.

[Embedded content]

I think the best take on this map was from XKCD:

Surprisingly accurate though.
238
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:32:33pm

re: #234 Brian J.

So is the rampant naivete I see here. This party, as Interesting Times notes, needs to get tough on its opponents, because that’s what Americans expect to see from their leaders!

I’m sure telling people how stupid you think they’re being is a sure way to win them over. It does seem to be working very effectively for the Bernie Bros, am I right?

239
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:32:54pm

re: #237 Don’t Blame Me, I Voted for Kodos

I think the best take on this map was from XKCD:

[Embedded content]

That’s what happens when C-SPAN borrows the Weather Channel’s Doppler radar.

240
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:34:23pm

re: #238 klys (maker of Silmarils)

I’m sure telling people how stupid you think they’re being is a sure way to win them over. It does seem to be working very effectively for the Bernie Bros, am I right?

I can’t reach through the screen. What else can I do? I see people excusing the continued presence of the biggest cancer in American politics, whose vote-losing powers were just on display tonight AGAIN…

241
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:34:30pm

re: #238 klys (maker of Silmarils)

You know what? This is a good point.

Thank you Brian J. for pointing out how much of a fucking dullard I am. Perhaps I should just die.

242
JordanRules  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:35:17pm

re: #234 Brian J.

And if this ‘tough going’ stuff isn’t shown on the tele and isn’t pushed to FB feeds then what? That is more my contention than this ‘we don’t fight’ bullshit.

243
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:35:51pm

re: #241 teleskiguy

You know what? This is a good point.

Thank you Brian J. for pointing out how much of a fucking dullard I am. Perhaps I should just die.

Don’t do that.

If you do however, can I have your house? /s

244
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:36:56pm

re: #242 JordanRules

And if this ‘tough going’ stuff isn’t shown on the tele and isn’t pushed to FB feeds then what? That is more my contention than this ‘we don’t fight’ bullshit.

It needs to be something that cannot be ignored. Expel Sanders and his endorsers from the party- let them form their Justice Communist BS Party. Being the middle party of three will probably make the Democrats look better, and maybe they’ll finally take the gloves off and fight the far left as hard as they need to!

245
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:37:19pm

re: #243 Anymouse 🌹

Don’t do that.

I won’t, trust me.

If you do however, can I have your house?

It’s not my house. The owners live in Denver.

246
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:37:30pm

re: #242 JordanRules

And if this ‘tough going’ stuff isn’t shown on the tele and isn’t pushed to FB feeds then what? That is more my contention than this ‘we don’t fight’ bullshit.

See also: The news media covering Donald Trump’s empty podiums for half-an-hour every time he was coming out to speak.

Doesn’t matter that Hillary Clinton had well-thought plans for the future of the country: That podium was more important to cover.

247
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:37:52pm

re: #245 teleskiguy

I won’t, trust me.

It’s not my house. The owners live in Denver.

Can I have Denver then?

248
klys (maker of Silmarils)  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:39:23pm

re: #240 Brian J.

I can’t reach through the screen. What else can I do? I see people excusing the continued presence of the biggest cancer in American politics, whose vote-losing powers were just on display tonight AGAIN…

I’m supposedly on your side and you’ve done a fantastic job of alienating me so why the fuck do you think anyone is going to listen to you?

You’re so mad that people are coping in a way that’s different than the way you think they should be. That people have different principles and ways of working towards the same fucking goals. Heaven forbid anyone do it differently than the RIGHT WAY that has clearly been given to you and only you.

If you know exactly how to win, please go run for political office. Alternately, please go talk to a campaign. You can tell them exactly how stupid they’re being. The job offers will be fast and plentiful, I’m sure.

In the meantime, maybe stop lecturing people who are just as terrified and upset and hurting at the results as you are about how awful they are for not dealing with it in exactly the way you want?

249
teleskiguy  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:39:56pm

re: #247 Anymouse 🌹

Can I have Denver then?

You should see my landlord’s house in Denver. The neighborhood they live in is also home to a few Denver Broncos players.

So, no. You cannot have Denver.

250
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:40:19pm

re: #223 jaunte

I don’t know. We’re a pretty diverse bunch here in California, and the Democratic party owns the political advantage greatly now. It wasn’t always that way. And the Democratic party here didn’t grow because we don’t have divisions. Rather, I think just a lot of people decided the Republican party went off a cliff.

251
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:41:04pm

re: #244 Brian J.

It needs to be something that cannot be ignored. Expel Sanders and his endorsers from the party- let them form their Justice Communist BS Party. Being the middle party of three will probably make the Democrats look better, and maybe they’ll finally take the gloves off and fight the far left as hard as they need to!

So we should be fighting the Left? That strategy has really served well since the POUM.

252
William Lewis  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:41:58pm

re: #234 Brian J.

So is the rampant naivete I see here. This party, as Interesting Times notes, needs to get tough on its opponents, because that’s what Americans expect to see from their leaders!

You can never defeat the enemy by becoming the enemy.

253
Brian J.  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:44:08pm

re: #252 William Lewis

You can never defeat the enemy by becoming the enemy.

Nonsense. You can defeat the enemy by playing the enemy’s game back at him better than he can play it. You can’t do it by giving resources to your enemy, as Democrats routinely do. We give people health insurance and they spit in our faces because we also give it to brown and black people? It should be a cold day in Hades before we do that again.

254
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:46:25pm

I’m not going to blame the Democratic party for things that is more fundamental to our society than simply running a campaign.

Campaigns are important but benefit as a result of other things that occur.

255
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:46:37pm

re: #242 JordanRules

And if this ‘tough going’ stuff isn’t shown on the tele and isn’t pushed to FB feeds then what? That is more my contention than this ‘we don’t fight’ bullshit.

Well…I don’t know if you watched tonight’s Daily Show, but Trevor Noah had a pretty thought-provoking segment on this very issue - he showed footage of the GOPers demonizing Obamacare back when it was being passed, and even though everything they said was a filthy lie, it was delivered with exactly the kind of righteous fury that hits people right in the amygdala. Trevor then showed a Dem senator (forget his name) warning of the AHCA’s dangers, and…oy…poor guy sounded so tentative and timid and muddled compared to the GOPers :/

Again it goes back to something I’ve been saying for ages - no, Dems don’t have to *lie* like the GOPers, but they do need to learn some lessons from them re delivery, appeal to emotion, etc. Do that often enough, and they’ll go viral in spite of the corporate media ignoring them in favor of Cheeto Benito.

256
blueraven  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:46:49pm

re: #228 Interesting Times

Rs win elections :/

Srsly tho, read the Joy Reid thread Jaunte just posted. We’ve also bemoaned low voter turnout among Dems without being able to figure out what to actually do about it. My personal theory is that non-voters who might otherwise go for Dems suffer from a combo of low-info, apathy, and learned helplessness. I also think they don’t perceive Dems as *fighting* for their interests (this touches on the whole caring/empathy thing, yes, but don’t forget the reality-TV-trash aspect of American culture. People *like* seeing a smack-down and feel nothing but contempt for “wimps.” That’s probably why “going high” isn’t working - non-voters perceive it as weakness, not strength).

I think it is more about tribalism.

I think Hillary really screwed up with the deplorable tag…just pissed them off, like Mitt did with his 47% comment. That really offended the D’s.

Also I think Ds have to understand, with some exceptions, this is still a center, center/right country. We have to find the right candidates for the right areas and quit bitching at each other about left/far left/center left. What will work in CA will not necessarily work in PA.

As far as GA6 and SC5, they were always long shots.

257
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:48:00pm

Nate Silver made a good observation today, about the closeness of the elections. Yes, it must frustrate the Democratic party to come so close in those districts but still lose. But think again about those districts: they were Trump and GOP locks before, and today they were battles.

Come 2018, if things continue as now, many marginal Republican districts will fall.

258
retired cynic  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:48:55pm

re: #253 Brian J.

Nonsense. You can defeat the enemy by playing the enemy’s game back at him better than he can play it. You can’t do it by giving resources to your enemy, as Democrats routinely do. We give people health insurance and they spit in our faces because we also give it to brown and black people? It should be a cold day in Hades before we do that again.

If you are saying that we should not “give” people health insurance again, then I guess I will have to down ding the argument as being offensive. And I’ve tried to keep my fingers to myself all evening, too.

259
Anymouse 🌹  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:49:06pm

re: #249 teleskiguy

You should see my landlord’s house in Denver. The neighborhood they live in is also home to a few Denver Broncos players.

So, no. You cannot have Denver.

Damn. Denver’s a pretty nice city. I wouldn’t mind owning Denver. /s

260
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:49:29pm

re: #256 blueraven

Also I think Ds have to understand, with some exceptions, this is still a center, center/right country.

It’s a religious country.

Which is why I replied to Charles earlier with the one word answer: creationists.

261
JordanRules  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:49:29pm

re: #244 Brian J.

Okay, I appreciate that you affirm media attention and what it can do for the electorate being engaged. I just might overestimate this counties ability to delay justice. I don’t think so though…and that leads to me being unsurprised at the blatant disregard for laws, norms etc. To think we can elicit good, proportional coverage from the same press that ran so fast to the normalisation bunker leaves us on very thin ice.

262
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:50:30pm

And fighting a war against fundamentalist Christians is not going to work well for the Democratic party when a decent number of Democrats are still pretty religious themselves.

This is the quandry.

263
Interesting Times  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:52:57pm

Damn, this is one powerful thread, and helps put things back into perspective in another respect:

264
Blind Frog Belly White  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:53:01pm

re: #253 Brian J.

Nonsense. You can defeat the enemy by playing the enemy’s game back at him better than he can play it. You can’t do it by giving resources to your enemy, as Democrats routinely do. We give people health insurance and they spit in our faces because we also give it to brown and black people? It should be a cold day in Hades before we do that again.

Dude, do yourself a favor and go to Joy Reid’s Twitter feed. Start here:

You know what you DIDN’T hear from Republicans in November? “My vote has to be earned.”

265
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:58:15pm

GA-06 was a refight of the Spanish Civil War—important local issues overwhelmed by massive influx of money, ideas, and proxy footsoldiers from outside. It would have been nice to win, but I’ll celebrate a stalemate on the bad guys turf.

266
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:59:39pm

The culture war is being won out here in the West.

So American politics, which will follow everything else in this country, is becoming geographically defined in a way that is not the same as in previous eras of the US.

Our goal out here now is to get rid of some of the Republicans in close districts in California. But a secondary goal has to be to flip Arizona - a possibility. And to shore up New Mexico.

Heck, even the Mormons in Utah are slowing warming up to the idea of not locking up drug addicts, etc.

Sure, there are white gun-nut supremacists in the back country of Idaho and Oregon and even California. But they can be marginalized politically.

The political battle is won seat by seat in the state legislatures aross the country.

267
William Lewis  Jun 20, 2017 • 8:59:48pm

re: #253 Brian J.

Go home & come back when you’re ready to do the real work instead of trolling.

268
freetoken  Jun 20, 2017 • 9:00:33pm

re: #265 Decatur Deb

Where’s Picasso when we need him?

269
Decatur Deb  Jun 20, 2017 • 9:02:11pm

re: #268 freetoken

Where’s Picasso when we need him?

Waiting for Elizabeth Warren to go all Pasionaria.


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Trump’s Biggest Success: Proving the Inadequacy of Federal Ethics Laws Welcome to the greatest jacking in modern history. Money, reputation, our very brand as a nation. My congratulations to the writer. In fact, if the hapless Trump administration has shown anything, it is that our current ethics laws are ...
Unshaken Defiance
13 hours, 59 minutes ago
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Immigration: Focus LocallyIn these days of Trump and the Republicans attacking everything decent about America, it's too easy to focus on the immediate threat. Trump's Muslim band is back, but everyone is paying attention to the Republicans trying to steal our healthcare. ...
jhncsy
1 day, 11 hours ago
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‘Submit to Your Husbands’: Women Told to Endure Domestic Violence in the Name of God (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) The culprits were obvious: it was the menopause or the devil. Who else could be blamed, Peter screamed at his wife in nightly tirades, for her alleged insubordination, for her stupidity, her lack of sexual pliability, her refusal to ...
Birth Control Works
2 days, 11 hours ago
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West Virginia Families, Just Learning About Health-Care Access, Fear It Will Be Taken Away - Rewire In Vienna, West Virginia—just north of Parkersburg, along the Ohio River separating the two states—the only Planned Parenthood health center in the state sits among a scattering of gray and tan buildings beside the main road. A few days ...
Birth Control Works
2 days, 12 hours ago
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Trump Election Commissioner Used Dubious Data to Allege an “Alien Invasion” - Mother Jones Election officials and experts say there’s plenty of reason to doubt those claims.But they could still provide a blueprint for Trump’s commission, which has so far hinted at tighter restrictions on voting in the name of cracking down on ...
Tarkloon
2 days, 19 hours ago
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Inside the Middle East’s First Rape & Domestic Violence Crisis Program For the last year and a half, there’s been a new sight in the Kingdom of Bahrain. Lodged into stacks of newspapers, stuck to mirrors in restaurant bathrooms, and pinned to grocery store notice boards are small, blue-and-white fliers ...
Birth Control Works
3 days, 15 hours ago
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First Aid Kit - My Silver LiningFirst Aid Kit perform My Silver Lining at Glastonbury 2017
Tarkloon
4 days, 10 hours ago
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