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454 comments

1
GlutenFreeJesus  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:05:11pm

Answer: Duh.

2
VegasGolfer  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:11:55pm
3
retired cynic  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:13:22pm

I hope, hope, hope he’s right! Thread.

4
Belafon  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:26:19pm

re: #2 VegasGolfer

As replies are pointing out, it’s not all of Congress.

5
Belafon  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:27:43pm

re: #3 retired cynic

I hope, hope, hope he’s right! Thread.

[Embedded content]

6
GlutenFreeJesus  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:28:01pm

Shit. Hadn’t thought of this. And I wouldn’t put it past Trump/Republicans to do this…

7
Aussie Apocalypse  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:29:56pm

re: #5 Belafon

“He was a police officer. He joined the FBI and was a sniper on SWAT teams. He was on the Joint Terrorism Task Force”

In short: Balls of Tungsten Hardcore.

8
Belafon  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:31:30pm

re: #6 GlutenFreeJesus

Shit. Hadn’t thought of this. And I wouldn’t put it past Trump/Republicans to do this…

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Trump ain’t going to call the National Guard. He’d have to be responsible for something.

And while there will be protests, there will be just as many people setting up voter registration tables.

9
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:31:58pm

re: #6 GlutenFreeJesus

Shit. Hadn’t thought of this. And I wouldn’t put it past Trump/Republicans to do this…

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I don’t trust Republicans at all but I think if any suspension of elections happened, there’d be hell to pay & the judges wouldn’t let it happen but the GOP is playing a sick game here.

10
Belafon  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:33:10pm

re: #9 HappyWarrior

I don’t trust Republicans at all but I think if any suspension of elections happened, there’d be hell to pay & the judges wouldn’t let it happen but the GOP is playing a sick game here.

Part of Trump’s problem is that he can’t seem to get the Democrats or those pesky judges to just do what he wants.

11
Kragar  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:33:38pm
12
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:35:48pm

re: #10 Belafon

Part of Trump’s problem is that he can’t seem to get the Democrats or those pesky judges to just do what he wants.

Yep.

13
scottslemmons  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:37:37pm

re: #5 Belafon

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Isn’t Wray the guy who hid Chris Christie’s cell phone from investigators? Why is he sticking it to Trump? I don’t mind if he’s doing it, but I don’t know how you go from a guy hiding evidence for a corrupt Republican to a guy putting the screws on another corrupt Republican.

14
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:42:39pm

re: #3 retired cynic

I hope, hope, hope he’s right! Thread.

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I’m wondering who this Hoarse guy is.

And if his tweets have been fact checked. He lays out a lot of facts, not just BS commentary.

??

15
BeachDem  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:46:17pm

re: #3 retired cynic

I hope, hope, hope he’s right! Thread.

[Embedded content]

That was the most (and only) positive thing I’ve seen today. I needed it.

So, show of hands—who’s going to watch the (deva)state of the uniom?

Not enough money or alcohol in the world to make me do it—I think I’ll have to go on total news/internet blackout tomorrow night. I just can’t even…

16
JordanRules  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:47:48pm

re: #13 scottslemmons

I remain confused.

17
Kragar  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:48:32pm
18
BeachDem  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:48:38pm

re: #14 Stanley Sea

I’m wondering who this Hoarse guy is.

And if his tweets have been fact checked. He lays out a lot of facts, not just BS commentary.

??

Just curious—do we even know that Hoarse is a guy?

19
JordanRules  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:49:31pm

re: #17 Kragar

Mueller is absurd to criticize and yet…

20
Aussie Apocalypse  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:49:50pm

re: #18 BeachDem

Assuming they are human.

21
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:51:21pm

re: #15 BeachDem

That was the most (and only) positive thing I’ve seen today. I needed it.

So, show of hands—who’s going to watch the (deva)state of the uniom?

Not enough money or alcohol in the world to make me do it—I think I’ll have to go on total news/internet blackout tomorrow night. I just can’t even…

Not tomorrow satan.

No way. I’ll follow here maybe, waiting for the riot.

Broadchurch has my life, as planned.

22
Belafon  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:52:14pm

re: #14 Stanley Sea

I’m wondering who this Hoarse guy is.

And if his tweets have been fact checked. He lays out a lot of facts, not just BS commentary.

??

Never trust any single source, no matter how reliable. But the one thing that Horse Whisperer does sparingly is speculate.

23
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:55:20pm

re: #17 Kragar

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Is this verified?

I’m weary of another opportunist telling us what we want to hear.

24
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:56:28pm
25
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:56:30pm

re: #20 Aussie Apocalypse

Assuming they are human.

Exceptional next gen Russian bots.

26
JordanRules  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:57:02pm

re: #22 Belafon

Yeah, I’m highly cynical these days. I get the good feels from their threads and there isn’t a lot of super suspect stuff, but I still approach with a lot of caution at this point. I’ve seen too many accounts start off cool and then evolve into weirdness.

27
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:59:16pm

re: #22 Belafon

Never trust any single source, no matter how reliable. But the one thing that Horse Whisperer does sparingly is speculate.

But has it been fact checked?

Like past tweets?

Just feels like the after inauguration dream weavers.

I would like my speculation to be proven wrong.

28
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 8:59:47pm
29
makeitstop  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:01:21pm

re: #15 BeachDem

That was the most (and only) positive thing I’ve seen today. I needed it.

So, show of hands—who’s going to watch the (deva)state of the uniom?

Not enough money or alcohol in the world to make me do it—I think I’ll have to go on total news/internet blackout tomorrow night. I just can’t even…

Not watching SOTU, I got a Knicks game. Screw that guy.

30
retired cynic  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:02:59pm

re: #27 Stanley Sea

But has it been fact checked?

Like past tweets?

Just feels like the after inauguration dream weavers.

I would like my speculation to be proven wrong.

S/he has been one of the twitter-ers that have been well-received here, and I have not seen complaints or false threads. S/he does avoid conjecture. Have no idea who it is, but probably not just Joe Blow from Podunk.

31
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:06:11pm

I’m going to avoid SOTU. Hearing Trumps voice and seeing that face pisses me off. I’ll probably read.

32
Kragar  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:06:24pm

re: #23 Stanley Sea

Bowdich is a Mueller guy.

“In 2011, Mr. Bowdich was selected to handle the transition of a new FBI Director given that Director Mueller’s 10-year term expired in September 2011. After Director Mueller received a two-year extension, Mr. Bowdich was named as the special assistant to the associate deputy director.”

33
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:06:44pm

re: #30 retired cynic

S/he has been one of the twitter-ers that have been well-received here, and I have not seen complaints or false threads. S/he does avoid conjecture. Have no idea who it is, but probably not just Joe Blow from Podunk.

I don’t have the capacity to do this, but I would love a review of the past tweets fact v fiction.

34
Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:08:13pm

JFC on a flaming pogo-stick. It would be bad enough if this were just a couple of brutal morons but it’s a whole organized movement, with its own secret Facebook page and international conferences. To probably nobody’s surprise there is a whack-job American church involved.

PARENTS ARE MAKING THEIR CHILDREN DRINK BLEACH TO ‘CURE’ THEM OF AUTISM

Parents are making their children drink industrial bleach to “cure” them of autism, with the potentially deadly practice traced back to a cult in the United States.

According to the British tabloid Sunday People, six British police forces probed cases in which children as young as 2 were forced to undergo the potentially lethal treatment.

The treatment being administered is CD (chloride dioxide) or MMS (“miracle mineral solution”), with a secret Facebook group touting its use to desperate parents in the United Kingdom.

The method was promoted by a controversial U.S. church with a branch in Los Angeles: the secretive Genesis II Church, founded by Jim Humble, a former scientologist.

A 2016 investigation by Eyewitness News and ABC News found an underground network clustered in Southern California, promoting MMS on Facebook as a cure for ailments including cancer, Parkinson’s and autism in children.

I have an idea: We can cure these cultists of brain rot by locking them up for the next 40 years.

35
Stanley Sea  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:08:53pm

Just trying to direct my energy correctly.

GAH

36
retired cynic  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:09:21pm

re: #34 Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines

OMG! Forty years is not long enough! And double for whoever is promoting it!

37
makeitstop  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:10:08pm

re: #18 BeachDem

Just curious—do we even know that Hoarse is a guy?

He’s mentioned that he’s a divorced father.

38
BeachDem  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:10:18pm

re: #32 Kragar

Bowdich is a Mueller guy.

Just looking at pictures of Bowdich, I’d say he’s someone with whom one should not fuck. (and I don’t mean that in the biblical sense.)

39
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:10:23pm

re: #34 Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines

JFC on a flaming pogo-stick. It would be bad enough if this were just a couple of brutal morons but it’s a whole organized movement, with its own secret Facebook page and international conferences. To probably nobody’s surprise there is a whack-job American church involved.

PARENTS ARE MAKING THEIR CHILDREN DRINK BLEACH TO ‘CURE’ THEM OF AUTISM

I have an idea: We can cure these cultists of brain rot by locking them up for the next 40 years.

Speaking as someone on the spectrum who has struggled with it, I believe more than ever we need to educate the population about what autism actually is. This is just so fucked up.

40
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:12:45pm
41
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:15:39pm
42
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:16:03pm

re: #40 jaunte

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Trump is the best asset the Kremlin has. We need to find out why he’s so servile to Putin.

43
ObserverArt  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:16:20pm

re: #31 HappyWarrior

I’m going to avoid SOTU. Hearing Trumps voice and seeing that face pisses me off. I’ll probably read.

I’ll be watching Big Ten Bouncing Ball and other stuff. He’s just going to be blowing smoke anyway.

If someone yells “you lie…all the damn time!!!” I think we will hear about it. I can wait ‘til later.

44
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:16:45pm

re: #41 jaunte

[Embedded content]

We’re Putin’s lackeys sigh.

45
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:17:21pm

re: #43 ObserverArt

I’ll be watching Big Ten Bouncing Ball and other stuff. He’s just going to be blowing smoke anyway.

If someone yells “you lie…all the damn time!!!” I think we will hear about it. I can wait ‘til later.

Yeah it’s just going to be more damn lies.

46
scottslemmons  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:17:29pm

re: #42 HappyWarrior

Trump is the best asset the Kremlin has. We need to find out why he’s so servile to Putin.

Trump idolizes strongmen, and Putin’s the chief strongman on the world stage. I reckon it’s no more complicated than that.

47
dog philosopher ஐஒஔ௸  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:20:53pm

re: #40 jaunte

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if democrats take the house this year, i predict in 2019 or 2020 trump will ignore the fact that a bill passed by the republican senate was voted down in the house and sign it into law anyway

48
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:21:31pm

re: #46 scottslemmons

Trump idolizes strongmen, and Putin’s the chief strongman on the world stage. I reckon it’s no more complicated than that.

I think Putin has dirt on him tbh.

49
retired cynic  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:23:36pm

re: #48 HappyWarrior

I think Putin has dirt on him tbh.

Nothing else fits the facts as we know them.

50
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:24:41pm
51
HappyWarrior  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:26:39pm

re: #49 retired cynic

Nothing else fits the facts as we know them.

It’s interesting to think about. Just makes me sick that Trump is our President.

52
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:37:01pm
53
austin_blue  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:39:09pm

Not enacting the sanctions, passed by the Congress and signed by Trump is a complete surrender by the Administration to the Rule of Law.

It’s a complete capitulation by the Trump Administration to the Russians.

At what point do we call them traitors? Really, what will it take?

I think we all know that this is about money laundering for Russian Oligarchs to fund Trump’s businesses, but really, what will it take to bring down this criminal enterprise?

54
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:42:51pm
55
Citizen K  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:44:01pm

re: #53 austin_blue

But they’re Republicans. They are the only real Americans that exist, therefore they can’t be traitors by definition, QED.

56
jaunte  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:44:48pm

And if you think Clyburn is exaggerating:

57
austin_blue  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:49:28pm

The Executive Branch of our government is a criminal enterprise. Full stop.

The Legislative Branch of our government is supporting this criminal enterprise.

This is how representative democracies die.

Our Kristallnacht is just around the corner for us if we don’t stop this.

58
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:52:22pm

consortiumnews.com

Robert Parry, who uncovered a treasure trove of documents showing that Ronald Reagan’s campaign interfered with Jimmy Carter’s attempts to free the American hostages in Iran, and uncovered much of the information in the Iran-Contra scandal has passed away.

His son has written a final article about his father on his father’s Website.

59
retired cynic  Jan 29, 2018 • 9:53:52pm

re: #58 Anymouse 🌹

Important guy. How much farther we would have been along this disastrous fork in the road without people like that, who can say?

60
Joe Bacon 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:07:00pm

re: #58 Anymouse 🌹

consortiumnews.com

Robert Parry, who uncovered a treasure trove of documents showing that Ronald Reagan’s campaign interfered with Jimmy Carter’s attempts to free the American hostages in Iran, and uncovered much of the information in the Iran-Contra scandal has passed away.

His son has written a final article about his father on his father’s Website.

The sad truth is the honest ones like Robert and Gary Webb get marginalized while the Maggies are taken as gospel truth.

61
austin_blue  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:07:15pm

This has been just a horrible day for the American experiment of Democracy. At a fundamental level, I just can’t even.

The fact that the Congress, the media, and the general population has not gone “Hey, wait a minute!” is just insane.

We lost our soul today. I don’t know how we will get it back.

I’m off to the rack. I wonder what kind of America to which I will wake up.

(I expect extra likes for not dangling a participle.)

62
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:16:19pm

Here is my speculation. Hopefully I do not sound like a downer… And, I agree that I have been wrong before. Far too many times.

My suspicion is that Putin and his friends have been using Trump for money laundering.(Into, and out of, real estate) For well into the 9 figures. And that Trump had little cash beyond that for most of the 21st Century. His whole family is vulnerable there. Including to the NY State AG.

I also suspect that Trump will eventually successfully fire Rosenstein and Mueller at some point. But that it will not matter if the Dems can do well enough in the 2018 mid-terms.

Remember that Nixon was able to fire the first special prosecutor. And it still did not end well for him.

The other thing that can happen is that a crisis, domestic, economic or foreign can affect the elections as well. In the short term there is likely to be a rally around the flag boost. However, it will fade in time and become another negative. The Bush-Iraq wars fit this mold.

63
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:20:15pm

re: #61 austin_blue

This has been just a horrible day for the American experiment of Democracy. At a fundamental level, I just can’t even.

The fact that the Congress, the media, and the general population has not gone “Hey, wait a minute!” is just insane.

We lost our soul today. I don’t know how we will get it back.

I’m off to the rack. I wonder what kind of America to which I will wake up.

(I expect extra likes for not dangling a participle.)

In the meantime, it appears that the Republicans held a middle of the night “pain capable 20 week abortion ban” bill (none of such having anything to do with science), mostly to paint Democrats as “pro-baby death.”

wonkette.com

Tonight, the Senate is expected to vote on a bill that would ban abortions after 20 weeks. This would be very, very bad for anyone who can get pregnant, on account of the fact the vast majority of abortions after this time are due to fetuses with severe, unsurvivable defects.

It’s extremely unlikely the vote will pass — even though Trump announced at the March For Life that he was eager to sign it. It would require 60 votes, and the GOP only has 50. (John McCain is still feeling poorly.) There is almost no way they would get 10 Democratic Senators to sign on — and it’s unlikely that Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins will be too into it either.

The bill, introduced by Lindsay Graham, is titled the “Pain-Capable Unborn Child Protection Act” — based on the fact that they have decided that a fetus can feel pain at 20 weeks. Of course, according to the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, a fetus actually cannot feel pain until around 24 weeks.

64
Citizen K  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:22:38pm

re: #61 austin_blue

re: #63 Anymouse 🌹

Christ, how bleak.

I’m still not sure we even make it to November at this rate.

65
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:24:36pm

re: #62 ckkatz

Here is my speculation. Hopefully I do not sound like a downer… And, I agree that I have been wrong before. Far too many times.

My suspicion is that Putin and his friends have been using Trump for money laundering.(Into, and out of, real estate) For well into the 9 figures. And that Trump had little cash beyond that for most of the 21st Century. His whole family is vulnerable there. Including to the NY State AG.

I also suspect that Trump will eventually successfully fire Rosenstein and Mueller at some point. But that it will not matter if the Dems can do well enough in the 2018 mid-terms.

Remember that Nixon was able to fire the first special prosecutor. And it still did not end well for him.

The other thing that can happen is that a crisis, domestic, economic or foreign can affect the elections as well. In the short term there is likely to be a rally around the flag boost. However, it will fade in time and become another negative. The Bush-Iraq wars fit this mold.

This does seem to be moving a lot faster than Watergate did. Though I was only a teenager, I distinctly remember the dribble of news over the Watergate Hotel break-in turning into a conspiracy to bug the Democratic National Committee took a couple years to unravel.

The only real difference here is a) Computers instead of hotel, and b) Using a foreign power instead of so-called plumbers.

66
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:26:38pm

re: #63 Anymouse 🌹

I am glad that you reminded me that the Repugs have essentially only a 50-49 Senate majority. Hopefully that will slow them down through the 2018 elections.

67
Citizen K  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:27:46pm

re: #62 ckkatz

re: #65 Anymouse 🌹

The problem here is that Watergate bringing Nixon down required a Republican Party that was actually willing to hold Nixon accountable in the end and take it on the chin.

Our current Republican party has actually become even more devoted to Trump the more shit comes out. They will not save us, and in fact are using it to reap the rewards.

We’re fucked. Yes, I’ll be less cynical and depressed about this come morning more than likely, but it’s clear the GOP from top to bottom wants this, or at the very least is willing to maintain it for their own advantage.

68
scottslemmons  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:27:58pm

re: #57 austin_blue

The Executive Branch of our government is a criminal enterprise. Full stop.

The Legislative Branch of our government is supporting this criminal enterprise.

This is how representative democracies die.

Our Kristallnacht is just around the corner for us if we don’t stop this.

I completely understand feeling discouraged, because I’m a monstrous pessimist 99.999% of the time. The problem is — how do we stop this? Best case, we’re stuck waiting for November. And the Republicans seem entirely confident in the Russians’ ability to flip the election their way.

So with the Executive and Legislative branches firmly on the side of evil, and the strong possibility that the election will be compromised — no one’s asking what “stopping this” entails. What are we prepared to do? If marching doesn’t cut the mustard, what’s next? Fighting and dying? Or hiding and keeping our fingers crossed that someone else will fix things?

This is why we need to be making concrete plans about how to get vulnerable populations, activists, allies, scientists, artists, writers, and hopefully, our families and friends to safety in other countries.

69
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:30:57pm

re: #65 Anymouse 🌹

I also was a teenager back then. In the backwater of Pittsburgh. I do not remember much news until near the end.

I suspect that things felt a lot more fast moving in DC at the time.

And yes, I agree that computers/internet/social media has had a major on the US. (It reminds me of how newspapers and railroads affected the pre-Civil War political maneuvering.)

70
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:35:38pm

re: #67 Citizen K

The problem here is that Watergate bringing Nixon down required a Republican Party that was actually willing to hold Nixon accountable in the end and take it on the chin.

Our current Republican party has actually become even more devoted to Trump the more shit comes out. They will not save us, and in fact are using it to reap the rewards.

We’re fucked. Yes, I’ll be less cynical and depressed about this come morning more than likely, but it’s clear the GOP from top to bottom wants this, or at the very least is willing to maintain it for their own advantage.

But remember what brought the GOP around: The prospect of a bloodbath in the midterm elections at the time.

The GOP then supported President Nixon with all the same things you’re hearing now: Liberals are blowing all this out of proportion, it’s all irresponsible reporting, &c.

The GOP came around right when their conservative gravy train looked like it was going to go off an uncompleted bridge.

If they see their gravy train this time round doing the same thing, they’ll push Trump out the door as well.

The worst part of this is my whole life every time the electorate seems to think “this time conservatives running for office will be different.” No, difference is not really a thing in conservatism, gaining and maintaining power is.

Nixon, Reagan, both Bushes, all had huge numbers of people in their administrations indicted and convicted of crimes. Democrats under Clinton, Carter, and Obama, almost none.

71
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:37:16pm

re: #68 scottslemmons

I agree that the situation can easily be considered depressing.

But I take heart that the Trump support is being slowly eroded.

And that at some point, hopefully in 2018, it will collapse to government representation closer to it’s 30%. And it is very hard to govern a democracy with such a small minority.

The issue is the need to convince people to chnage their minds. And that takes time.

The ability to hold hearings in Congress and start turning over the rocks to see what creepie crawlies skitter away is vital.

72
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:41:29pm

re: #70 Anymouse 🌹

But remember what brought the GOP around: The prospect of a bloodbath in the midterm elections at the time.

The GOP then supported President Nixon with all the same things you’re hearing now: Liberals are blowing all this out of proportion, it’s all irresponsible reporting, &c.

The GOP came around right when their conservative gravy train looked like it was going to go off an uncompleted bridge.

If they see their gravy train this time round doing the same thing, they’ll push Trump out the door as well.

The worst part of this is my whole life every time the electorate seems to think “this time conservatives running for office will be different.” No, difference is not really a thing in conservatism, gaining and maintaining power is.

Nixon, Reagan, both Bushes, all had huge numbers of people in their administrations indicted and convicted of crimes. Democrats under Clinton, Carter, and Obama, almost none.

Yup, what you said!

And yes, the folks in power are slimy and ruthless. But that has generally proven a bug, not a feature in US History.

73
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:42:16pm

re: #71 ckkatz

Yup, there is a reason they call it the “crazification factor.” (The 27% or so of conservatives who will vote for R-Beelzebub.)

Trump is near that now. The problem is Congress: When pollsters ask about Congress, a huge number of people will say Congress is horrible, but a huge number will say their own Representative or Senator is not the problem.

75
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:49:46pm
76
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:50:07pm

re: #74 Anymouse 🌹

And then there is the question of exactly where was Grandma, and what was she doing there, when she found that.

Heh… Reminds me of the time I helped clean out my Great Aunt’s place. My grandfather handed me what looked like a mug and asked me what it was. He was amused at my response of “a mug?”. It was a chamber pot.

77
Citizen K  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:52:19pm

re: #75 Anymouse 🌹

Sadly, I expect many of his colleagues at the Times already have their templates of ‘Trump became president tonight’ at the ready and just waiting to be filled in.

78
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:56:35pm

re: #75 Anymouse 🌹

Sounds like a good intelligence test for talking heads. But I think that I will be providing some feedback to the sponsoring show too. And then writing the show off. Like a lot of others, I am all out of ****s to give.

79
The Ghost of a Flea  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:57:07pm

re: #76 ckkatz

Chamber pots used to be nicknamed “thunder mugs.”

80
Targetpractice  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:57:49pm

re: #77 Citizen K

Sadly, I expect many of his colleagues at the Times already have their templates of ‘Trump became president tonight’ at the ready and just waiting to be filled in.

Oh, you can be sure that the “Both Sides” crowd are already have the templates for their “Trump was impressively presidential” stories prepared and ready to go.

81
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:58:21pm

re: #78 ckkatz

Sounds like a good intelligence test for talking heads. But I think that I will be providing some feedback to the sponsoring show too. And then writing the show off. Like a lot of others, I am all out of ****s to give.

There’s an awful lot of upset commentary at Mr. Blow’s tweet (directed at the magic balancefairyist media, with names and at signs).

82
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 10:58:52pm

re: #77 Citizen K

Sadly, I expect many of his colleagues at the Times already have their templates of ‘Trump became president tonight’ at the ready and just waiting to be filled in.

I have mixed feelings about the NYT. It has had some good material. But it also has some really stupid stuff. But yes, I am starting to get tired of some of their writers.

83
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:00:46pm

re: #77 Citizen K

Sadly, I expect many of his colleagues at the Times already have their templates of ‘Trump became president tonight’ at the ready and just waiting to be filled in.

Maggie Hackerman, Russ Doubt-hat, &c, plus whoever it was who wrote the “why we need Stephen Miller” and “the friendly Nazi next door” articles.

I know my regional paper will have a glowing review of the SOTU ready to go.

84
Citizen K  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:03:34pm

re: #82 ckkatz

I have mixed feelings about the NYT. It has had some good material. But it also has some really stupid stuff. But yes, I am starting to get tired of some of their writers.

The problem is that they have good reportage that they summarily ignore in order to normalize and enable Trump, and Baquet has gone on the record for his contempt for his liberal readership. And the editorial edicts from above soft-handing Trump, giving Miller cover, alongside the endless swiping at HRC while demanding she stop being a public thing in the same breath….it’s over.

They’ve made it clear what side their on it seems like. Charles Blow, Krugman, and Sopan Deb are pretty much the only things left that aren’t utterly embarrassing.

85
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:04:55pm

re: #79 The Ghost of a Flea

Chamber pots used to be nicknamed “thunder mugs.”

Heh, did not know that.

I have not had occasion to encounter one since that day in the late 1960s in St Joseph Mo.

My Great Aunt’s father had served in the Civil War. (10th Kansas Cavalry, iirc) We also found an old powder horn. My grandfather poured out the powder onto the driveway and ignited it. He then said that the ladies of the house had been concerned about the old muzzle loader that had gone with the powder horn and had disposed of it many years previously. But they had not realized that powder horn still had powder in it.

It was an interesting look into an older way of life.

86
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:13:53pm

re: #84 Citizen K

The problem is that they have good reportage that they summarily ignore in order to normalize and enable Trump, and Baquet has gone on the record for his contempt for his liberal readership. And the editorial edicts from above soft-handing Trump, giving Miller cover, alongside the endless swiping at HRC while demanding she stop being a public thing in the same breath….it’s over.

They’ve made it clear what side their on it seems like. Charles Blow, Krugman, and Sopan Deb are pretty much the only things left that aren’t utterly embarrassing.

I agree, there is a lot to dislike about the NYT. The Nazi next door articles amongst them. On the other hand, it is an interesting statement of contempt to paint Trump supporters as deplorable Nazis.

Looks like NYT just raised their subscription price. Another reason to throw in the towel.

87
ckkatz  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:16:45pm

Well time to head to bed. We are due snow here (Northern Virginia) through rush hour. That should make things entertaining.

88
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:23:58pm

re: #86 ckkatz

I agree, there is a lot to dislike about the NYT. The Nazi next door articles amongst them. On the other hand, it is an interesting statement of contempt to paint Trump supporters as deplorable Nazis.

Looks like NYT just raised their subscription price. Another reason to throw in the towel.

What we call today the folks who supported Hitler because they were concerned about jobs, or infrastructure, or immigration, or Making Germany Great Again, or any other reason?

Nazis. We don’t care why they supported him.

89
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:36:46pm

Payday lending firms sometimes make loans against pending legal settlements.

Some firms are now looking to cash in on the MeToo movement by offering lending against pending sexual harassment suits.

nytimes.com

Companies that offer money to plaintiffs in anticipation of future legal settlements are racing to capitalize on sexual harassment lawsuits.

That is setting off alarms in some quarters because the industry, like payday lenders, has a history of providing cash at exorbitant interest rates to customers who need the money for living and sometimes medical expenses.

(more)

90
Kragar  Jan 29, 2018 • 11:40:13pm
91
Lupin  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:07:28am

I understand the hand-wringing here, but you’ve got to face up to the facts that you now live in a rather different country than the one you remember from, say, 20 years ago, and it’s only going to get more “differenter”.

That has happened throughout history to many, many people in many, many countries. Things chance, not always for the better. History is a bitch that way. Remember the Bellamy family trying to adapt and survive in UPSTAIRS DOWNSTAIRS.

Historians will be discussing the many causes for that change for centuries to come, but ultimately it’s not important now. I’ve been writing on blogs for now 15 years, starting on DKos and Billmon’s in 2003, that the US is moving towards a democrature à la Brazil/Russia, and so far I’ve been proven right.

One might speculate that, as the first two decades of the 20th century saw the end of the old colonial empires, the first two decades of this century are seeing the end of the US of A as it once was. There’ll be a lot of bad things about it, for sure, but also good things. Nothing lasts forever. One has to roll with the punches.

92
Lupin  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:10:42am

According to some papers here, Trump want to start a trade war with the EU because he’s mad that we won’t let him build his f*cking golf courses here.

I’m amazed the Scots haven’t yet set fire to the damned thing.

93
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:15:54am

re: #91 Lupin

Well, we’ll have to see. We have examples in the recent past of conservative overreach in our government.

Mass movements such as the Women’s Marches show that a significant portion of the populace isn’t going to take this lying down.

Every generation has to make a political stand against conservatism’s tendency toward authoritarianism. That is partly why the USA has had six so-called “party systems,” where each time there is a re-alignment of the political system. (They usually ended in the destruction of one of the two major parties.)

The GOP is an unstable coalition of political nihilists, corporations, Evangelical Christians, and small-l libertarians. Such coalitions of disparate groups have never held together too long in any other time in our or any other country; there is no reason to believe that “this time it’s different.”

Someone noted above that Democratic messaging might be encapsulated in the phrase “with liberty and justice for all” (with emphasis on all).

94
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:17:57am
95
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:30:34am
96
Anymouse 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:42:52am

Catch y’all later … my bed is calling me …

97
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 2:03:21am

re: #49 retired cynic

Nothing else fits the facts as we know them.

one of things that make him strong!

98
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 3:00:03am

Republicans argued in briefs to Sam Alito that its unfair to donor’s money not to continue to use gerrymandered congressional districts in Pennsylvania which are unfair to voters. Alito being Alito, there is a good chance he will stay the Pennsylvania Supreme Court’s order even though its based on the Pennsylvania Constitution.

99
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 3:23:31am

re: #98 Big Beautiful Door

Republicans argued in briefs to Sam Alito that its unfair to donor’s money not to continue to use gerrymandered congressional districts in Pennsylvania which are unfair to voters. Alito being Alito, there is a good chance he will stay the Pennsylvania Supreme Court’s order even though its based on the Pennsylvania Constitution.

Donors’ money has precedence over voters’ right to representation?

100
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 3:25:00am

A stalker obsessed with guns killed four people at a Pennsylvania carwash. Meanwhile in Kentucky the General Assembly debates increasing school safety the only way they know how, with MOAR GUNZ!!!!

101
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 3:26:11am

re: #99 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Donor’s money has precedence over voters’ right to representation?

According to the GOP, yes. Of course that is directly in line with the GOP’s belief that money has more rights than people.

102
Patricia Kayden  Jan 30, 2018 • 3:54:04am

re: #99 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Donors’ money has precedence over voters’ right to representation?

Yes!! That’s the whole point of Citizens United.

103
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 3:59:00am

re: #102 Patricia Kayden

Yes!! That’s the whole point of Citizens United.

‘twas a rhetorical question, especially as relates to Alito…

104
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 4:15:00am
105
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 4:33:56am

How is this a thing? Has this always been the case?

106
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 4:36:15am

Trump already fucked farmers over by pulling out of TPP. That’s billions of farm stuff not going overseas. Now…

107
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 4:39:40am

re: #106 MsJ

Farm state Republicans warn Trump: Don’t hurt us by fooling with NAFTA

that’s just a friendly request, they will still continue to vote for him.

108
jeffreyw  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:01:50am

Imgur


Good morning!

109
Barefoot Grin  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:06:48am

re: #106 MsJ

Trump already fucked farmers over by pulling out of TPP. That’s billions of farm stuff not going overseas. Now…

[Embedded content]

One of the few things I will ding HRC for is caving on TPP when Bernie pushed her. That was a time to push back and explain what was at stake. I know Obama tried to sell it, but all the air was taken by the campaigns at that point.

110
Sea Mexican!  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:20:52am

re: #34 Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines

JFC on a flaming pogo-stick. It would be bad enough if this were just a couple of brutal morons but it’s a whole organized movement, with its own secret Facebook page and international conferences. To probably nobody’s surprise there is a whack-job American church involved.

PARENTS ARE MAKING THEIR CHILDREN DRINK BLEACH TO ‘CURE’ THEM OF AUTISM

I have an idea: We can cure these cultists of brain rot by locking them up for the next 40 years.

I get the threat of washing the kid’s mouth with detergent for having a potty mouth, but Dear God, this is stupid.

111
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:26:27am

re: #109 Barefoot Grin

One of the few things I will ding HRC for is caving on TPP when Bernie pushed her. That was a time to push back and explain what was at stake. I know Obama tried to sell it, but all the air was taken by the campaigns at that point.

Sanders really dumbed down the debate on that issue.

112
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:50:13am

ANY POLITICIAN THAT OPENLY (read LOUDLY) CALLS DONALD TRUMP A LIAR AT THE SOTU SPEECH WILL RECEIVE A $500 DONATION TO THEIR REELECTION CAMPAIGN FROM MY BROKE ASS.

113
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:52:34am

re: #107 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

that’s just a friendly request, they will still continue to vote for him. The farmers should be angry, and next time register it by voting for those who actually care about their lives.

FTFY

114
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:55:57am

re: #109 Barefoot Grin

One of the few things I will ding HRC for is caving on TPP when Bernie pushed her. That was a time to push back and explain what was at stake. I know Obama tried to sell it, but all the air was taken by the campaigns at that point.

I agree completely. We were well positioned before this trump thing came in. Obama drove TPP to ensure the US was well represented and protected. Now it’s all going to shit.

115
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 5:56:03am

Thoughts about various conversations here on LGF yesterday:

“Democrats need to do better at messaging. Make it simple and stick to it.”
“Nunes’ memo is like Al Capone’s vault: There’s nothing there.” - Ted Lieu
“That’s a bad analogy because it doesn’t quite map to what’s going on.”

This is why Democrats don’t have a simple message.

116
darthstar  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:02:37am
117
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:03:28am

re: #33 Stanley Sea

This account seems to be particularly careful. Take the release of the Senate and House reports on FusionGPS. Horse Whisperer read through both of them, pulling relevant information, in order. If they are pulling our leg, they are playing the very long game version.

118
Barefoot Grin  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:07:29am

re: #111 HappyWarrior

Sanders really dumbed down the debate on that issue.

Yep. That was his angry populist message based, I’m guessing on not even knowing the details.

119
Joe Bacon 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:07:30am

re: #82 ckkatz

I have mixed feelings about the NYT. It has had some good material. But it also has some really stupid stuff. But yes, I am starting to get tired of some of their writers.

I appreciate Charles for pointing out that folks signed up with Amazon Prime can get a discount subscription to the Washington Post. I was paying the full price until he pointed it out.

120
Joe Bacon 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:12:13am

re: #99 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Donors’ money has precedence over voters’ right to representation?

That is the ACLU’s position which really angers me to no end. They insist that money is free speech…

121
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:13:27am

re: #118 Barefoot Grin

Yep. That was his angry populist message based, I’m guessing on not even knowing the details.

I was surprised with how uninformed on the issues he was for a man in office as long as he’s been. Just frustrating.

122
jeffreyw  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:26:25am

re: #120 Joe Bacon 🌹

That is the ACLU’s position which really angers me to no end. They insist that money is free speech…

Wow! Talk about the “long game”.

123
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:27:49am

re: #117 Belafon

This account seems to be particularly careful. Take the release of the Senate and House reports on FusionGPS. Horse Whisperer read through both of them, pulling relevant information, in order. If they are pulling our leg, they are playing the very long game version.

Plus, his English is pretty good. :D

124
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:29:18am

re: #121 HappyWarrior

I was surprised with how uninformed on the issues he was for a man in office as long as he’s been. Just frustrating.

Populists do not have to know anything…they just scream the loudest.

Trump and Bernie…two sides of the same coin, like a dumb and dumber sammich.

125
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:29:32am

re: #123 MsJ

Then he’s not from ‘round here.

126
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:30:14am

re: #120 Joe Bacon 🌹

That is the ACLU’s position which really angers me to no end. They insist that money is free speech…

What I don’t like about that position is that it implies no matter what its supporters say that some speech matters more than others. Now, I have seen it argued that unions could do the same thing as people like the Mercers and Kochs but A) Unions aren’t strong as they once were because of well people like the Kochs and Mercers and B) more importantly, that’s a collective voice, the Mercers and Kochs are literally buying politicians. Adelson is another guy. The post CU world results in a political landscape where politicians worry more about offending their sugar mommies and daddies than they do the voters and that simply is wrong. Citizens United was easily one of the worst SCOTUS decisions in decades.

127
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:30:29am

re: #115 Belafon

This is why Democrats don’t have a simple message.

I thought the Democrats message was hate Trump.

128
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:30:49am

re: #116 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Also on Earth 1, Every Congressional Committee is conducting an investigation of President Clinton’s emails.

129
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:31:17am

Greets and saluts from the Resistance in the NYC on this snowy morning. Trump’s about to deliver a snow job to Congress today, taking credit for inheriting Obama’s economy and ignoring fact that businesses are using the tax scam to boost their bottom line and making PR moves that do little to actually boost worker salaries (one shot bonuses aren’t sticky the way salary hikes are).

Of course, it’s also expected Trump will make a statement during the SOTU about bringing Mueller’s investigation to an end.

Trump has interfered with the investigation from the moment he was made aware of it. He fired Comey because of it. He sought to have Sessions stop it. He sought to have McCabe end it.

He’s got his flacks in Congress running interference and conspiring with Trump to end it including Nunes.

He’s talking with Hannity and coordinating agitprop with Fox.

So, of course, which is more likely - that Trump is innocent and is interfering in an ongoing investigation that would result in obstruction of justice charges because of that interference, or Trump’s guilty as all hell and is interfering because he’s trying to derail a legitimate investigation.

Occam’s Razor? Trump’s cronies are all guilty as sin and Trump’s interfering because he thinks he’s above the law. With this GOP in place, he may well be right - because the GOP isn’t holding him or his cronies accountable. Worse than that, they’re spreading misinformation and lies that smear the FBI, law enforcement, and intel community.

This is a party of patriots?

Patriots for what country, because interfering in US elections by consorting with Russians to throw the election is conspiracy against the US. Lying about meeting with Russians is criminal offense. Lying about all their actions? Again, we’re talking criminal acts.

This whole thing reeks.

130
wheat-dogg  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:31:18am

re: #105 MsJ

If you owe more than $25,000, the IRS can tell State to revoke your passport. This can create problems for expats, as you can imagine.

131
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:31:30am

re: #124 MsJ

Populists do not have to know anything…they just scream the loudest.

Trump and Bernie…two sides of the same coin, like a dumb and dumber sammich.

They are more alike than their supporters will ever admit but I agree. It’s a lot of loud noise from both men and not a lot of actual beef.

132
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:31:31am

re: #127 Shropshire Slasher

I thought the Democrats message was hate Trump.

‘Twill suffice. (until we get our shit together)

133
darthstar  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:34:03am

re: #128 Big Beautiful Door

Also on Earth 1, Every Congressional Committee is conducting an investigation of President Clinton’s emails.

Sounds like a beautiful place by comparison.

134
I Would Prefer Not To  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:34:19am

The dow is down 200 points. Much as I hate losing money, gives trump one less stupid thing to brag about.

135
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:36:27am

re: #134 I Would Prefer Not To

That bond bubble has been expected to pop for a while. Hold onto your pants, here comes inflation!

136
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:37:01am

re: #134 I Would Prefer Not To

Trump takes credit for one year jump in the markets. He ignores and claims Obama seeing market more than double on his watch was bogus, and ignored Main Street.

It’s trickle down BS all the time from Trump and the GOP.

Meanwhile, majority of companies aren’t boosting wages and they’re using the tax scam to pad their bottom line. Those that have given bonuses are doing it for the PR boost (ego stroking Trump, not because it’s the right thing to do after depressing wages for years on end).

137
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:37:47am

re: #135 Shropshire Slasher

That bond bubble has been expected to pop for a while. Hold onto your pants, here comes inflation!

200 points doesn’t mean what it used to mean. Yours is a bit of an overreaction.

138
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:38:35am

re: #136 lawhawk

Trump takes credit for one year jump in the markets. He ignores and claims Obama seeing market more than double on his watch was bogus, and ignored Main Street.

It’s trickle down BS all the time from Trump and the GOP.

Meanwhile, majority of companies aren’t boosting wages and they’re using the tax scam to pad their bottom line. Those that have given bonuses are doing it for the PR boost (ego stroking Trump, not because it’s the right thing to do after depressing wages for years on end).

[Embedded content]

Yep. It’s just a temporary thing and then when memory fades, they’ll go back to screwing their workers and crying that expecting them to pay their employees a decent wage is SOCIALISM!

139
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:44:25am

re: #134 I Would Prefer Not To

The dow is down 200 points. Much as I hate losing money, gives trump one less stupid thing to brag about.

Only natural after the market’s surge; it could go right back up tomorrow. Oil is dropping as well after its run up to $66 per barrel.

140
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:45:54am

re: #137 Belafon

The bond market is another bubble.

wsj.com

141
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:47:54am

I’m so torn on SOTU. I don’t want to give Trump the ratings but I really want to see how much of a fucking trainwreck it will be.

142
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:50:58am

re: #141 Eclectic Cyborg

I’m so torn on SOTU. I don’t want to give Trump the ratings but I really want to see how much of a fucking trainwreck it will be.

Feel free. Big ratings are a sign of an awakening electorate. We want them to see us coming.

143
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:51:17am

re: #141 Eclectic Cyborg

I’m so torn on SOTU. I don’t want to give Trump the ratings but I really want to see how much of a fucking trainwreck it will be.

Go ahead and watch, you individually can’t effect the ratings much.

144
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:52:23am

re: #143 Big Beautiful Door

Go ahead and watch, you individually can’t effect the ratings much.

Oh, I know. It’s more of a principle thing.

145
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:55:02am

DOW circuit breaker

Market-wide circuit breakers provide for cross-market trading halts during a severe market decline as measured by a single-day decrease in the S&P 500 Index. A cross-market trading halt can be triggered at three circuit breaker thresholds—7% (Level 1), 13% (Level 2), and 20% (Level 3). These triggers are set by the markets at point levels that are calculated daily based on the prior day’s closing price of the S&P 500 Index.

146
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:56:30am

re: #110 Sea Mexican!

I get the threat of washing the kid’s mouth with detergent for having a potty mouth, but Dear God, this is stupid.

people are eating tide pods out of sheer self-professed stupidity, but this is idiocy with an agenda, and a scary one at that

147
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:56:58am

Harley-Davidson profit drops sharply as company moves ahead with plans to close Kansas City plant

Hurt by a continued slide in motorcycle sales, Harley-Davidson Inc.’s recent-quarter profit plummeted, the company said Tuesday, adding that it’s planning to close its assembly plant in Kansas City, Mo., resulting in the loss of 800 jobs there.

Snap On could be in trouble as well, they are increasingly reliant on their loan programs for a decreasing auto tech labor force for its profits.

The Monkey Wrench in Snap-on’s Strategy

Shares of Snap-on have tooled along nicely for years, rising 130% since 2012 to $181, handily topping the broad market’s 99% gain during the same period. The joyride, however, might be over relatively soon.

The advance in the stock (ticker: SNA) of this well-known maker of high-quality automotive tools, diagnostic equipment and software has come courtesy of earnings that nearly doubled to $9.20 a share in 2016 from $4.71 in 2011. But potential headwinds could cause Snap-on to miss consensus earnings-per-share expectations this year, denting its hot stock performance.

With about 4,900 franchisees and a $10 billion stock-market value, the Kenosha, Wis., company is its industry’s biggest player. Its Snap-on in-house financing arm has boosted sales at a faster clip than otherwise might have been the case, given the decelerating growth in the number of U.S. auto mechanics over the past two years. Some 70% of Snap-on’s revenue comes from the domestic market.

Consequently, results from financing have become crucial; they generated 27% of operating profit in last year’s third quarter—the biggest percentage ever—versus just 4.3% in 2010. (Fourth-quarter and full-year numbers won’t be reported until Feb. 8.) The problem is that an increasing number of borrowers are falling behind on their payments.

148
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:56:59am

re: #145 Shropshire Slasher

DOW circuit breaker

OK? And?

Edit: The S&P would have to lose 200 points to trigger the first one. It’s only down 20.

149
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:57:42am

re: #148 Belafon

Dow is down 300

150
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 6:59:35am

re: #149 Shropshire Slasher

Dow is down 300

Which is only a 1% drop.

151
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:02:05am

re: #150 Big Beautiful Door

I guess there is still time to be back up in positive territory before the SOTU address.

152
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:04:56am

re: #151 Shropshire Slasher

I guess there is still time to be back up in positive territory before the SOTU address.

Nice attempt at a recovery, but you didn’t quite stick your landing.

153
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:06:12am

re: #147 Amory Blaine

Reason number 10 001 why ubiquitous financing is a big fucking problem.

154
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:06:36am

re: #111 HappyWarrior

Sanders really dumbed down the debate on that issue.

That whole thing was a tricky mess. I know a lot of left leaning people that were still upset with NAFTA. A claim that it took jobs away, etc.

Bernie made ground on it. Hillary more or less had to go there as it was going to be a contentious point in the debates and may well have hurt her in the primaries.

I think the whole trade issue was turned into a Republican hammer to bash Democrats just after Clinton signed NAFTA, even though it was put together under Bush 1 and accepted by conservatives.

This is why the Democrats need an organization that is solely responsible for fighting back against Republican narratives and setting narratives for Democrats. Also it is needed to help influence the media.

If NAFTA was explained better and it’s good things publicized more it might not have been used to scare people into hating TPP.

155
Dave In Austin  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:07:00am
156
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:07:06am

re: #153 Eclectic Cyborg

Reason number 10 001 why ubiquitous financing is a big fucking problem.

It’s what destroyed Nortel and caused the Telecom crash in the early 2000s.

157
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:09:32am

I’m no auto tech, but I like and own used snap on wrenches and ratchets (currently searching for reasonably priced used metric line wrenches). I do know a few techs though and they borrow a lot of money for tools off the truck. There is also pressure in the industry to buy their outrageously priced toolboxes which can easily approach $10,000 for tech “credibility”. These loans are about 17% and can be difficult to pay down on a ~$20 an hour job.

158
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:10:08am

re: #151 Shropshire Slasher

I guess there is still time to be back up in positive territory before the SOTU address.

Sometimes the Dow will take a loss for the day, and sometimes it can regain all or most of the losses that same day. But after a big run up its neither unusual or concerning to see a one day drop. Its not news unless it keeps dropping for several days and turns into an overdue correction.

159
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:10:29am

re: #154 ObserverArt

That whole thing was a tricky mess. I know a lot of left leaning people that were still upset with NAFTA. A claim that it took jobs away, etc.

Bernie made ground on it. Hillary more or less had to go there as it was going to be a contentious point in the debates and may well have hurt her in the primaries.

I think the whole trade issue was turned into a Republican hammer to bash Democrats just after Clinton signed NAFTA, even though it was put together under Bush 1 and accepted by conservatives.

This is why the Democrats need an organization that is solely responsible for fighting back against Republican narratives and setting narratives for Democrats. Also it is needed to help influence the media.

If NAFTA was explained better and it’s good things publicized more it might not have been used to scare people into hating TPP.

Oh no doubt about that.

160
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:11:57am

re: #155 Dave In Austin

[Embedded content]

This is what the Trumpanzees voted for. Ann Coulter drinks the tears of children whose parents are deported.

161
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:15:23am

re: #127 Shropshire Slasher

I thought the Democrats message was hate Trump.

Why do I feel like you are being disingenuous with that comment?

Should I guess that is a criticism, or maybe you don’t hate Trump???

I think there are many Republicans that also hate Trump. How does that fit in your world?

How about yourself? Do you hate Trump, is it that simple to you?

162
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:16:16am

re: #161 ObserverArt

Yeah, hate is a byproduct not the message.

163
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:20:25am

re: #156 Belafon

It’s what destroyed Nortel and caused the Telecom crash in the early 2000s.

Mid 2000s housing bubble too.

164
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:21:37am

re: #127 Shropshire Slasher

I thought the Democrats message was hate Trump.

Also see you being disingenuous. The message was: Look at Trump objectively as someone with no record of public service, someone whose record as a private businessman is not open to public scrutiny, and someone whose education and character do not make him suitable for the office of President and Chief Executive.

That was re-spun and sold to us by Fox as “Hate Trump”.

165
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:27:33am

I like gaming and stuff, but it is very tempting to sell my video card I bought over a year ago. I could sell it used for double what I paid for it.

Bitcoin mania is hurting PC gamers by pushing up GPU prices

166
Joe Bacon 🌹  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:32:17am

re: #165 Amory Blaine

I like gaming and stuff, but it is very tempting to sell my video card I bought over a year ago. I could sell it used for double what I paid for it.

Bitcoin mania is hurting PC gamers by pushing up GPU prices

167
garzooma  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:33:59am

Speaking of messaging, who here knows the names Roy Cockrum, Scott Comer and Eric Schoenberg?

168
DodgerFan1988  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:35:16am

I’ve been saying this to my friends since the beginning, it’s wishful thinking to think Trump will get indicted. He and his minions are not going anywhere. The only way to remove him from office is the old fashion way, voting.

169
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:36:24am

The message has always been Trump is unfit and he proves it on a daily basis.

170
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:41:29am

re: #168 DodgerFan1988

I’ve been saying this to my friends since the beginning, it’s wishful thinking to think Trump will get indicted. He and his minions are not going anywhere. The only way to remove him from office is the old fashion way, voting.

It is not Mueller’s job to fix things. Only we can do that.

At the same time, I don’t think our Democracy is gone. It has survived a period when huge chunks of the population have been oppressed and killed. It has survived people, even American citizens, being deported. It’s survived people being run out of office, and numerous White House scandals. It’s survival depends on us.

171
Dave In Austin  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:41:34am
172
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:42:58am

re: #169 HappyWarrior

The message has always been Trump is unfit and he proves it on a daily basis.

But again, supporters see that as a feature, not a bug.

173
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:43:20am

re: #168 DodgerFan1988

You seriously don’t think Mueller wil nail Trump for obstruction?

174
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:44:14am

re: #173 Eclectic Cyborg

You seriously don’t think Mueller wil nail Trump for obstruction?

I hope that a lot more about Trump’s finances comes out in the course of this investigation. It will not get him run out of office but it could damage him and his party massively.

175
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:45:24am

re: #172 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

But again, supporters see that as a feature, not a bug.

Of course they do.

176
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:45:27am

re: #168 DodgerFan1988

I’ve been saying this to my friends since the beginning, it’s wishful thinking to think Trump will get indicted. He and his minions are not going anywhere. The only way to remove him from office is the old fashion way, voting.

[Embedded content]

I agree. No matter how many members of the Trump Administration are indicted and convicted, its extremely unlikely you will ever get enough GOP Senators to vote to remove Trump himself from office.

177
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:45:59am

re: #173 Eclectic Cyborg

You seriously don’t think Mueller wil nail Trump for obstruction?

Not to mention, yesterday’s refusal to enforce Russian sanctions falls afoul of his obligation to see that laws are enforced. That’s a basic part of his job, and he’s willfully failed.

178
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:46:38am

re: #177 makeitstop

Not to mention, yesterday’s refusal to enforce Russian sanctions falls afoul of his obligation to see that laws are enforced. That’s a basic part of his job, and he’s willfully failed.

Sanctions passed by an overwhelming majority of Congress. Trump is Putin’s bitch.

179
Interesting Times  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:46:49am

re: #115 Belafon

Thoughts about various conversations here on LGF yesterday:

“Democrats need to do better at messaging. Make it simple and stick to it.”
“Nunes’ memo is like Al Capone’s vault: There’s nothing there.” - Ted Lieu
“That’s a bad analogy because it doesn’t quite map to what’s going on.”

This is why Democrats don’t have a simple message.

The bolded portion is a perfect example of hyper-analysis-induced-paralysis (and yes, people in the reality-based community are terrible for that. GOPers and other reactionaries don’t give a fuck; they, as Ghost of a Flea often puts it, see words as weapons to wield however they see fit, truth and nuance be damned).

What I’ve always said is, do everything they do EXCEPT the lying and gaslighting - use their effective rhetorical tools, but for good instead of evil.

It can be done. Remember “same-sex marriage” being framed as “marriage equality”? It worked - public perceptions on that issue seemingly changed overnight.

180
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:47:23am

re: #173 Eclectic Cyborg

You seriously don’t think Mueller wil nail Trump for obstruction?

It is the official position of the DoJ that the President cannot be indicted while in office. This is a long-standing interpretation of the Constitution.

181
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:48:31am

re: #11 Kragar

Oh, in a just world, we’d have Mueller executing search/seizure of books/records/computer files in the White House as Trump’s delivering his SOTU.

Trump returns to the WH to find the FBI all up in his stuff, asking WTF is going on, only to hear that the FBI is conducting search in ongoing criminal investigations in to multiple persons associated with Trump.

The post-SOTU tweets would be epic.

182
A hollow voice says, Covfefe.  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:48:45am

re: #141 Eclectic Cyborg

I’m so torn on SOTU. I don’t want to give Trump the ratings but I really want to see how much of a fucking trainwreck it will be.

NPR always runs it live. Instead of watching, listen to it and give them a boost. It’s better for your blood pressure, anyway.

183
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:49:59am

re: #137 Belafon

200 points doesn’t mean what it used to mean. Yours is a bit of an overreaction.

Same way that 1000 point jumps aren’t valued the same way that they were when we went from 9000 to 10000.

1000 point jump at 20000 is a smaller percentage gain than when it was at 10000. Basic math, not that any of the right wing blithering idiots care. They just see round numbers.

184
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:50:45am

We’re guaranteed that the GOP will do everything possible to undermine the next Dem president if we weren’t already. We need to make the GOP a permanent minority.

185
Dave In Austin  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:54:24am

Morning Lizardem.
We have a visitor in West Texas. Odessa to be exact……..
May I present THe Ghost of Odessa…..

The Ghost of Odessa
186
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:54:50am

re: #169 HappyWarrior

You mean that common message about fitness that was served at the Democratic Convention repeatedly and that HRC communicated every damn time she could??

187
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:55:31am

re: #184 HappyWarrior

We’re guaranteed that the GOP will do everything possible to undermine the next Dem president if we weren’t already. We need to make the GOP a permanent minority.

“We” meaning voters. I do think Trump has pointed out to a lot of people that they can’t wait for others to do their job, hence the voting we’ve seen this year. It’s going to take voters to make them a minority party.

And anyone who claims to be left but tries to split the vote in any way will be, when I’m being polite, called a Russian bot.

188
Interesting Times  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:55:41am

THREAD:

Especially this last part:

(hint, hint to certain doomsayers here whose posts are infused with constant “woe is me, there’s no point in even trying because we’ll fail anyway” downerism)

189
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:58:53am

re: #186 JordanRules

You mean that common message about fitness that was served at the Democratic Convention repeatedly and that HRC communicated every damn time she could??

Yep, the one that was ignored by the media and Bros alike.

190
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:59:52am

re: #187 Belafon

“We” meaning voters. I do think Trump has pointed out to a lot of people that they can’t wait for others to do their job, hence the voting we’ve seen this year. It’s going to take voters to make them a minority party.

And anyone who claims to be left but tries to split the vote in any way will be, when I’m being polite, called a Russian bot.

A tool of the Russians for sure.

191
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 7:59:56am

re: #189 HappyWarrior

Exactly!!

192
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:00:18am

re: #188 Interesting Times

THREAD:

(hint, hint to certain doomsayers here whose posts are infused with constant “woe is me, there’s no point in even trying because we’ll fail anyway” downerism)

If you’re only feeling fear, but not anger, then you’re doing it wrong.

Also, though, don’t confuse hope with optimism (I can’t read the thread, so I don’t know what’ she touches on). As I said above, don’t hope it will be fixed, and that someone else will do it. But if you don’t believe it can be overcome, if you aren’t somewhat optimistic, you won’t really try.

193
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:00:55am

re: #147 Amory Blaine

Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

GE, GM, Chrysler, Ford, etc., all increasingly relied on their financing arms to profit from lending to customers. When those customers stopped paying, not only did the profits dry up, but the entire enterprise was exposed as a sham and collapsed on its own weight.

It nearly ended GM and Chrysler entirely - bankruptcy reorganizations, Ford had to recapitalize/reorganize its debt outside bankruptcy, GE is moving to divorce itself from financing and focus on manufacturing, and other companies are doing similar moves.

And yet, companies are finding themselves right back in this mess.

194
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:03:02am

re: #193 lawhawk

A symptom of Wall Street’s need to return more of a profit than the year before.

195
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:03:14am

re: #191 JordanRules

Exactly!!

Still pisses me off. Sigh.

196
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:03:30am

New trailer

197
Interesting Times  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:07:50am

re: #192 Belafon

Also, though, don’t confuse hope with optimism (I can’t read the thread, so I don’t know what’ she touches on). As I said above, don’t hope it will be fixed, and that someone else will do it. But if you don’t believe it can be overcome, if you aren’t somewhat optimistic, you won’t really try.

Here’s the text of the entire thread:

I fear it is done.

That said, I will never stop fighting - nor should you.

I woke up on 11/9/2016 to the clear realization we had lost a war most people had no idea we were even fighting.

For the record:

This is NOT a reflection on Mueller or his investigation.

The unfortunate reality is laws are just marks on paper if there is no one both able and willing to enforce them.

Mueller cannot save our republic from a GOP that refuses to enforce the law.

No one in the Republican Party appears able and/or willing to do so.

Democratic efforts have been shut down by the GOP.

There is no indication any GOP lawmakers will do what is necessary to enforce the rule of law vis a vis the Trump administration.

Political journalists should have been consulting with experts in criminal psychology.

Failure to do so and the (ongoing) resulting expectation Trump will think and/or behave like a person with a conscience has led to a failure of imagination with devastating consequences.

We are watching the systematic destruction of the United States occur with relatively minimal outcry.

This is happening in part because of denial, yes, but it is also happening because a lot of journalists are too afraid to identify obvious patterns for fear of looking uncool.

Please STOP sending me @HoarseWisperer’s thread and Bowditch articles.

The findings of Mueller’s investigation rely on Congress for enforcement.

There is NO evidence the GOP will enforce the law against Trump (or his criminal co-conspirators) and plenty of evidence they won’t.

Right now despair AND hope are our enemies.

Our best chance is to be courageous enough to see things clearly EXACTLY AS THEY ARE.

If you do so, you will likely feel fear and anger - both of which are ENERGIZING.

You fight evil because you must - not because a win is certain.

I believe what she means by “hope” being an enemy is that we shouldn’t “hope” some magical external event (e.g. Mueller probe wrap-up) will swoop in deus ex machina-style and save us.

198
retired cynic  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:11:29am

Let’s have a little courage. The NASA photo of the day features an upclose image of Venus from the Japanese robotic Akatsuki. Wow, as they say.

apod.nasa.gov

This is the way to start every day. Lends a little perspective.

199
retired cynic  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:14:23am

Sanctions? What sanctions?

Trump. Russia. Election. Quid, Pro, Quo.

Charlie Pierce

200
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:17:25am

re: #199 retired cynic

Sanctions? What sanctions?

Trump. Russia. Election. Quid, Pro, Quo.

Charlie Pierce

Also - Team Trump Just Blew Its Cover

(Yeah, it’s Schindler. But he’s right.)

201
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:20:11am

re: #196 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

New trailer

I’m entirely in favor of the typography in that title.

Trailer looks good, too.

202
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:22:45am

re: #29 makeitstop

Not watching SOTU, I got a Knicks game. literally anything else to do. Screw that guy.

203
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:23:26am

re: #197 Interesting Times

Here’s the text of the entire thread:

[Embedded content]

I believe what she means by “hope” being an enemy is that we shouldn’t “hope” some magical external event (e.g. Mueller probe wrap-up) will swoop in deus ex machina-style and save us.

My main discouragement is that our only strategies for fixing this are (a) trusting Mueller to save us and (b) trusting the election in November. We’re dealing with a government that is champing at the bit to go full fascist — we should have more than just two plans.

204
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:24:18am

re: #34 Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines

JFC on a flaming pogo-stick. It would be bad enough if this were just a couple of brutal morons but it’s a whole organized movement, with its own secret Facebook page and international conferences. To probably nobody’s surprise there is a whack-job American church involved.

PARENTS ARE MAKING THEIR CHILDREN DRINK BLEACH TO ‘CURE’ THEM OF AUTISM

I have an idea: We can cure these cultists of brain rot by locking them up for the next 40 years.

natural selection is a slow process and problematically, sometimes if adversely affects innocents

205
The Vicious Babushka  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:24:42am

Who the hell “writes” on a legal pad by pulling up the edge.

Oh, nobody would do that if they were actually writing, which requires a flat surface, but only if they don’t want anyone to see that the pad of paper is actually just a blank prop.

206
Blind Frog Belly White  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:25:17am

re: #203 scottslemmons

My main discouragement is that our only strategies for fixing this are (a) trusting Mueller to save us and (b) trusting the election in November. We’re dealing with a government that is champing at the bit to go full fascist — we should have more than just two plans.

The problem is, if both of those don’t work, we’re into a whole different situation which will require much more drastic fixes. Talking about those much more drastic fixes at this point is easily portrayed as violent extremism.

207
calochortus  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:25:47am

re: #202 dangerman

Yeah. Mr. C. keeps saying how horrible it will be to watch. I keep saying, no one will make us watch it. ;)

Also too, I hate the way State of the Union speeches are turned into a series of one liners by near-constant applause. They should only allow 2 applause breaks for things like poverty being ended or world peace breaking out.

208
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:26:42am

re: #205 The Vicious Babushka

Trump hates.

That’s how he goes through the day.

He hates when others take credit for him.
He hates anyone who is disloyal or shows disloyalty.
He hates Obama and all that Obama represents.
He hates minorities.
He hates women.
He hates that others are more respected than he is - including Obama and Clinton.

He hates.

209
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:28:31am

re: #203 scottslemmons

My main discouragement is that our only strategies for fixing this are (a) trusting Mueller to save us and (b) trusting the election in November. We’re dealing with a government that is champing at the bit to go full fascist — we should have more than just two plans.

We have repeatedly demonstrated the ability to generate massive crowds for demonstrations. In the extremely unlikely event of a trumped up excuse to cancel elections, we should be able to paralyze the country.

210
calochortus  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:30:09am

Interesting item on an attempt to improve healthcare delivery.
The really interesting part is that health insurance stocks sank on the news. Almost as though they know they’re a big part of the problem.

211
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:30:23am

re: #130 wheat-dogg

If you owe more than $25,000, the IRS can tell State to revoke your passport. This can create problems for expats, as you can imagine.

Has it always been like that? (Thankfully, I am not affected but that’s kinda scary. After the trump tax scam, I upped my federal withholding to $600 a month since I recently sold my US houses and have no deductions and I don’t want to wind up paying a shitload of money at tax time.)

212
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:31:37am

re: #141 Eclectic Cyborg

I’m so torn on SOTU. I don’t want to give Trump the ratings but I really want to see how much of a fucking trainwreck it will be.

My husband said he never missed a SOTU and I am pissed he wants to give trump ratings.

I will watch a live blog. Listening to trump speak for any period of time makes me want to blow my fucking brains out.

213
Blind Frog Belly White  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:31:40am

re: #34 Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines

I said this the other day - people who haven’t gone through the grieving process over losing their imagined ‘normal kid’ can’t get past it. They can’t accept their child as they are, and not as they wanted them to be. They need there to be a way to get that ‘normal child’ back.

There isn’t one. And you must accept that.

And once you do, you can begin to appreciate who they are for real. Sure, a small percent of kids On The Spectrum will have severe issues all their lives. Mostly? They’ll learn coping mechanisms and strategies and they’ll find a place in the world.

But if you’re stuck with the idea that they’re broken and need to be fixed, you’ll never be able to help and encourage them to find their path. And you’ll be prone to charlatans who will sell you bleach, or chelation, or some other dangerous and ineffective ‘cure’ out of some belief that their condition is SO HORRIBLE that risking their lives is worth it.

Imagine how growing up with parents who feel that way about you will fuck you up.

214
freetoken  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:32:11am

re: #168 DodgerFan1988

Trump will not be indicted, at least while sitting in office.

However, minions are another story.

That is why Mueller must go forward, even if the GOP accomplices in the House keep Trump from facing justice.

Justice still needs to be carried out, and many people have been involved with the Trump crime family.

215
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:32:52am

re: #205 The Vicious Babushka

Potemkin Brand Legal Pads

216
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:33:30am
217
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:34:05am

re: #91 Lupin

I understand the hand-wringing here, but you’ve got to face up to the facts that you now live in a rather different country than the one you remember from, say, 20 years ago, and it’s only going to get more “differenter”.

That has happened throughout history to many, many people in many, many countries. Things chance, not always for the better. History is a bitch that way. Remember the Bellamy family trying to adapt and survive in UPSTAIRS DOWNSTAIRS.

Historians will be discussing the many causes for that change for centuries to come, but ultimately it’s not important now. I’ve been writing on blogs for now 15 years, starting on DKos and Billmon’s in 2003, that the US is moving towards a democrature à la Brazil/Russia, and so far I’ve been proven right.

One might speculate that, as the first two decades of the 20th century saw the end of the old colonial empires, the first two decades of this century are seeing the end of the US of A as it once was. There’ll be a lot of bad things about it, for sure, but also good things. Nothing lasts forever. One has to roll with the punches.

thought provoking and serious question

had clinton won in ‘16 would things be different going forward or just a delay of the inevitable?

218
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:35:12am

re: #203 scottslemmons

My main discouragement is that our only strategies for fixing this are (a) trusting Mueller to save us and (b) trusting the election in November. We’re dealing with a government that is champing at the bit to go full fascist — we should have more than just two plans.

All plans in a democracy ultimately depend on the voters. Once the voters choose to ignore all evidence in front of them, it’s all over.

As of right now, our biggest tools are protests, and people in government and the press that still give a shit about the country.

219
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:35:20am

re: #173 Eclectic Cyborg

You seriously don’t think Mueller wil nail Trump for obstruction?

Even if he does, he will take it to Congress which will do nothing.

220
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:35:27am

re: #212 MsJ

My husband said he never missed a SOTU and I am pissed he wants to give trump ratings.

I will watch a live blog. Listening to trump speak for any period of time makes me want to blow my fucking brains out.

I’ll be watching basketball. I can read about what the Trump-thing said later.

221
Blind Frog Belly White  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:37:16am

re: #219 MsJ

Even if he does, he will take it to Congress which will do nothing.

Unless he takes it to a Democratic Congress a year from now. A Democratic Congress may also choose to act on referrals the previous Republican Congress chose to ignore.

222
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:38:35am
223
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:39:03am

re: #217 dangerman

thought provoking and serious question

had clinton won in ‘16 would things be different going forward or just a delay of the inevitable?

If Clinton was President she wouldn’t be deconstructing the executive branch, undermining the ACA or signing massive tax cuts for the rich, so things would definitely be different. And we would have a whole different Supreme Court Justice and other federal judges.

224
The Vicious Babushka  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:40:18am

WUTTEHFUUUK

225
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:41:24am

re: #206 Blind Frog Belly White

The problem is, if both of those don’t work, we’re into a whole different situation which will require much more drastic fixes. Talking about those much more drastic fixes at this point is easily portrayed as violent extremism.

I’m not even worrying about that right now. I’m not opposed to having plans about violence, but those plans would basically be “Here’s how to notify your next-of-kin that you’ve been killed.”

On the assumption that our plans to Fix America Through Marching will fail, we need to be making serious plans on how to protect vulnerable populations when the institutions that would normally be taking care of that may be working to endanger them. We need to be making plans on how to get people out of this country and into safe countries, or into safe locations where they can be moved to safe countries eventually. We need to be making plans on how we’re going to get activists, scientists, artists, regime critics to safety. We need to be making plans on how we’ll be able to communicate.

Everyone is making plans for how we’re going to win, and winning is no longer guaranteed. We need to make contingency plans, and no one’s doing that.

226
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:42:03am

re: #130 wheat-dogg

If you owe more than $25,000, the IRS can tell State to revoke your passport. This can create problems for expats, as you can imagine.

its more than just ‘owe’
it looks like after you’ve exhausted all your due process, lost, and still then havent made any arrangement or agreement

227
Interesting Times  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:45:27am

re: #222 JordanRules

[Embedded content]

Ugh, West Virginia is well and truly fucked in the head. And North Dakota is right behind them - that makes me nervous for both Manchin and Heitkamp (i.e. can they still win if Cheeto Benito’s approval ratings remain so high in those states come November?)

228
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:45:38am

re: #222 JordanRules

Texas, 39% approval to 54% disapproval.

229
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:45:51am

re: #223 Big Beautiful Door

If Clinton was President she wouldn’t be deconstructing the executive branch, undermining the ACA or signing massive tax cuts for the rich, so things would definitely be different. And we would have a whole different Supreme Court Justice and other federal judges.

I’m still pissed at the stolen SCOTUS seat. That to me was among the most galling thing McConnell has done.

230
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:46:17am

re: #228 jaunte

Texas, 39% approval to 54% disapproval.

Come on over Senator O’Rourke please.

231
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:46:21am

re: #147 Amory Blaine

Harley-Davidson profit drops sharply as company moves ahead with plans to close Kansas City plant

called to take my 2001 into the local dealer. they wont touch it cause it’s more than 15 years old. ive been going there for 13 years. they sold the franchise last year. new owner’s policy

thats certainly not an incentive to buy a new bike from them. you dont need me as a service customer, then you lost me as any kind of customer.

232
Interesting Times  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:46:26am

re: #228 jaunte

Texas, 39% approval to 54% disapproval.

Now if you can only get those 54% to actually vote:

We didn’t vote because it wouldn’t make a difference… -_-
233
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:46:48am

re: #227 Interesting Times

Ugh, West Virginia is well and truly fucked in the head. And North Dakota is right behind them - that makes me nervous for both Manchin and Heitkamp (i.e. can they still win if Cheeto Benito’s approval ratings remain so high in those states come November?)

They have a difficult rope to cross for sure sigh.

234
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:46:52am

re: #228 jaunte

That was one that surprised me!

235
CongoJack  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:46:53am

re: #222 JordanRules

[Embedded content]

I’m surprised by Alaska - don’t they have legal weed? I thought they wouldn’t like the Trump admin cracking down on states rights.

236
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:48:48am

re: #235 CongoJack

I’m surprised by Alaska - don’t they have legal weed? I thought they wouldn’t like the Trump admin cracking down on states rights.

Too damn cold to notice I guess. Joking but you raise a good point.

237
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:49:15am

re: #234 JordanRules

Must be a non-gerrymandered poll.

238
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:49:28am

re: #235 CongoJack

Whats their white nationalist population and education system look like?

239
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:51:12am

re: #238 JordanRules

Whats their white nationalist population and education system look like?

That’s a good metric imo.

240
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:51:22am

re: #187 Belafon

“We” meaning voters. I do think Trump has pointed out to a lot of people that they can’t wait for others to do their job, hence the voting we’ve seen this year. It’s going to take voters to make them a minority party.

And anyone who claims to be left but tries to split the vote in any way will be, when I’m being polite, called a Russian bot.

I think people are forgetting how our government works.

If (yes, it is a big if) the House gets turned into a Dem majority the chances of Trump getting impeached go up.

Even if it isn’t controlled but is close and the trends look like as long as Trump is around the beatings to the Republicans will continue…even a GOP controlled congress might decide it is time to boot him.

First rule of politics…keep your position. If Trump is making that look difficult suddenly there is no reason to keep him.

Republican politicians are taking a chance on Trump and they know they are on a knife edge.

Politically it is much easier to dump Trump with his popularity ratings where they are. All it takes is some indication that he threatens your position.

241
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:54:44am
242
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:55:02am

re: #220 Big Beautiful Door

I’ll be watching basketball. I can read about what the Trump-thing said later.

I am going to be watching a mini-marathon of Major Crimes that I recorded the other day. I never watched this show when it was on live. Now we both find it funny and relatively well written. And it bucks the trend of everyone on the show has to be an asshole (thanks, Seinfeld). I find so many new shows have few or no redeeming characters. And I don’t like watching shows where everyone sucks.

Since he loves Major Crimes, I am hoping to tempt him. Maybe I will tell him I will delete them from the PVR. [[asshole mode on]]

243
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:56:13am

re: #221 Blind Frog Belly White

Unless he takes it to a Democratic Congress a year from now. A Democratic Congress may also choose to act on referrals the previous Republican Congress chose to ignore.

Which is why we need to do everything we can to keep facebook and twitter from allowing russian ratfucking.

244
Blind Frog Belly White  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:56:48am

re: #227 Interesting Times

Ugh, West Virginia is well and truly fucked in the head. And North Dakota is right behind them - that makes me nervous for both Manchin and Heitkamp (i.e. can they still win if Cheeto Benito’s approval ratings remain so high in those states come November?)

Today’s column by David Brooks is surprisingly readable, and actually makes sense (think ‘blind pig/acorn’). He analogizes the division between the 500 counties that welcomed diversity (and went for Clinton) and the 2900 that remained really white (and went for Trump) to the division between West and East Germany.

After the war, one part chose Capitalism and the other Communism. After 40 years, it was obvious which one worked, and which didn’t. Similarly, the 500 counties with the greatest diversity, and the largest number of immigrants have been the economic driver of the country, while the 2900 that stayed white have lagged behind.

Beyond simple diversity or lack thereof, though, there’s another issue I’ve talked about before - willingness to leave your comfort zone to make a better life. The 500 counties are chock full of people who went out in search of something better. The 2900, OTOH are full of people who think that prosperity should come and find them. Remember, these include those idiots in Coal Country who turned down retraining because Trump was going to bring back Coal.

That’s why Trump kept talking about “Bringing Back Coal” as a touchstone - it epitomizes the prosperity that comes to you, that you don’t have to move someplace else to claim. All you need do is wait, and the mine will reopen and you can get your old job back.

245
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:57:58am

re: #232 Interesting Times

Now if you can only get those 54% to actually vote:

[Embedded content]

This is the major issue in Texas. Texans — especially left-leaning Texans, especially Hispanic/Latino Texans — just do not fucking vote, and no one seems to have any idea how to turn that around.

246
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 8:59:53am

re: #203 scottslemmons

My main discouragement is that our only strategies for fixing this are (a) trusting Mueller to save us and (b) trusting the election in November. We’re dealing with a government that is champing at the bit to go full fascist — we should have more than just two plans.

+1 for content
+1 for correctly using “champing”
you can decide which one counts

247
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:00:07am

re: #208 lawhawk

Trump hates.

That’s how he goes through the day.

He hates when others take credit for him.
He hates anyone who is disloyal or shows disloyalty.
He hates Obama and all that Obama represents.
He hates minorities.
He hates women.
He hates that others are more respected than he is - including Obama and Clinton.

He hates.

Hey, I thought we were supposed to hate Trump and it was all we had???

248
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:01:14am

re: #244 Blind Frog Belly White

Today’s column by David Brooks is surprisingly readable, and actually makes sense (think ‘blind pig/acorn’). He analogizes the division between the 500 counties that welcomed diversity (and went for Clinton) and the 2900 that remained really white (and went for Trump) to the division between West and East Germany.

After the war, one part chose Capitalism and the other Communism. After 40 years, it was obvious which one worked, and which didn’t. Similarly, the 500 counties with the greatest diversity, and the largest number of immigrants have been the economic driver of the country, while the 2900 that stayed white have lagged behind.

Beyond simple diversity or lack thereof, though, there’s another issue I’ve talked about before - willingness to leave your comfort zone to make a better life. The 500 counties are chock full of people who went out in search of something better. The 2900, OTOH are full of people who think that prosperity should come and find them. Remember, these include those idiots in Coal Country who turned down retraining because Trump was going to bring back Coal.

That’s why Trump kept talking about “Bringing Back Coal” as a touchstone - it epitomizes the prosperity that comes to you, that you don’t have to move someplace else to claim. All you need do is wait, and the mine will reopen and you can get your old job back.

That’s very well said. I think too that is what separates Trump territory from Clinton turf. Clinton areas are much more diverse and frankly in the 21st century. A lot of those coal or steel counties are still fighting the past. I recently found some old newspapers from my grandparents hometown about the mills and mines closing down and this was the mid 70’s long before NAFTA, the Clintons, etc.

249
Ace-o-aces  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:02:30am

Black Panther, the first big budget Superhero movie with a mostly black cast is coming out this weekend. It’s getting overwhelmingly positive reviews. Ben Shapiro has already decided this is a liberal conspiracy.

250
Aucun pays pour les vieux ennemis  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:03:10am

re: #165 Amory Blaine

I like gaming and stuff, but it is very tempting to sell my video card I bought over a year ago. I could sell it used for double what I paid for it.

Bitcoin mania is hurting PC gamers by pushing up GPU prices

You could also make your costs back by mining altcoins (selling quickly) and still have the card for gaming. It’s only hurting the gamers who don’t mine when not gaming, and after a crash there will be a lot of cheap used cards available.

251
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:03:34am

re: #240 ObserverArt

I think people are forgetting how our government works.

If (yes, it is a big if) the House gets turned into a Dem majority the chances of Trump getting impeached go up.

Even if it isn’t controlled but is close and the trends look like as long as Trump is around the beatings to the Republicans will continue…even a GOP controlled congress might decide it is time to boot him.

First rule of politics…keep your position. If Trump is making that look difficult suddenly there is no reason to keep him.

Republican politicians are taking a chance on Trump and they know they are on a knife edge.

Politically it is much easier to dump Trump with his popularity ratings where they are. All it takes is some indication that he threatens your position.

Too right. I still believe that the Republican weasels in Congress will go along with Trump until they notice that their job is in jeopardy and Trump’s isn’t in the mid-term elections.

Self-preservation is the overriding principle for these dorks. Many of them have gotten the max personal gain out of the gig, and they’re deciding not to run for re-election.

A lot of them haven’t gotten to the point where they’ll be rich outside of government, and they’re the ones who will value their own skins over Trump’s. That’s a wild card, but I still believe that it will kick in as we get closer to election time.

252
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:03:47am

re: #222 JordanRules

253
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:04:08am

re: #249 Ace-o-aces

Black Panther, the first big budget Superhero movie with a mostly black cast is coming out this weekend. It’s getting overwhelmingly positive reviews. Ben Shapiro has already decided this is a liberal conspiracy.

It comes out February 16th here in the US.

Edit: And this white man is stoked (and I don’t use stoked very often).

254
Lupin  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:04:38am

re: #225 scottslemmons

I’m not even worrying about that right now. I’m not opposed to having plans about violence, but those plans would basically be “Here’s how to notify your next-of-kin that you’ve been killed.”

On the assumption that our plans to Fix America Through Marching will fail, we need to be making serious plans on how to protect vulnerable populations when the institutions that would normally be taking care of that may be working to endanger them. We need to be making plans on how to get people out of this country and into safe countries, or into safe locations where they can be moved to safe countries eventually. We need to be making plans on how we’re going to get activists, scientists, artists, regime critics to safety. We need to be making plans on how we’ll be able to communicate.

Everyone is making plans for how we’re going to win, and winning is no longer guaranteed. We need to make contingency plans, and no one’s doing that.

I don’t think you’ll end up with the military and troops in the street. This is not Chile. Though it pays to remember that everything Pinochet did then was deemed legal by the Chilean Supreme Court. So don’t trust your Constitution and legal system too much.

Trump won’t be forever; likely he’ll be gone in 2020, if not sooner. My guess is, he’ll never be inducted or prosecuted, but will end up his days in a gold-plated retirement home for senile tyrants. But what he destroyed, you’ll never get back, at least not significantly.

As I said, if you want to see the future of the US of A, look at Brazil for the societal environment, factoring in Russia’s military power and kleptocratic power structure. Roughly you’ll be there in 10 years.

It’s not hell on Earth; but you’ll need to adapt if you want to get up on top instead of in the favellas.

255
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:06:57am

re: #253 Belafon

It comes out February 16th here in the US.

Edit: And this white man is stoked (and I don’t use stoked very often).

I’ll have to wait for the home release — we don’t have a movie theater in town, and I hate driving two hours just to watch a movie and drive back home. But I’m looking forward to getting to see it eventually. The trailers are (hearts emojis).

256
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:07:40am

re: #249 Ace-o-aces

Black Panther, the first big budget Superhero movie with a mostly black cast is coming out this weekend. It’s getting overwhelmingly positive reviews. Ben Shapiro has already decided this is a liberal conspiracy.

[Embedded content]

Yawn get over yourself Ben.

257
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:08:09am
258
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:08:44am

re: #249 Ace-o-aces

I think the movie’s going to be great, because it’s got great actors from Chadwick Boseman on to Andy Serkis, Martin Freeman, and Michael B Jordan.

If it’s a great story and anywhere near as good as the other MCU movies, it’ll be one hell of a ride.

It would also figure that the special snowflakes are getting bent out of shape by the fact that it’s a predominantly black cast. As if that matters to whether a movie is good or not.

Edit:
As if there aren’t 100s or 1000s of movies with a predominantly white cast that have absolutely sucked. Or that critics hated and were successful or vice versa (critics loved, but were commercial flops).

Race isn’t going to be why this is successful or fails.

259
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:08:45am

re: #213 Blind Frog Belly White

I said this the other day - people who haven’t gone through the grieving process over losing their imagined ‘normal kid’ can’t get past it. They can’t accept their child as they are, and not as they wanted them to be. They need there to be a way to get that ‘normal child’ back.

There isn’t one. And you must accept that.

And once you do, you can begin to appreciate who they are for real. Sure, a small percent of kids On The Spectrum will have severe issues all their lives. Mostly? They’ll learn coping mechanisms and strategies and they’ll find a place in the world.

But if you’re stuck with the idea that they’re broken and need to be fixed, you’ll never be able to help and encourage them to find their path. And you’ll be prone to charlatans who will sell you bleach, or chelation, or some other dangerous and ineffective ‘cure’ out of some belief that their condition is SO HORRIBLE that risking their lives is worth it.

Imagine how growing up with parents who feel that way about you will fuck you up.

i have no kids and i cant really imagine. i guess every parent’s hopes, dreams, plans, about the future must sooner or later conflict with what a child is or hopes, dreams, plans her/himself.

and i guess this would be true of any physical or psychological /personality trait that got in the parent’s way of their own expectations

its like they dont recognize their children as individual people

260
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:10:14am

re: #253 Belafon

It comes out February 16th here in the US.

Edit: And this white man is stoked (and I don’t use stoked very often).

Cast looks great. Great director too. Same guy who directed Fruitvale Ststion. No wonder why Benny Boy hates it.

261
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:11:01am

re: #253 Belafon

The pics from the premier last night looked so badass and beautiful!!

Can’t wait!!

262
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:11:30am

re: #260 HappyWarrior

Cast looks great. Great director too. Same guy who directed Fruitvale Ststion. No wonder why Benny Boy hates it.

I’m curious how they’re going to react to “Black nation saves the world” in Avengers.

263
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:11:39am

re: #223 Big Beautiful Door

If Clinton was President she wouldn’t be deconstructing the executive branch, undermining the ACA or signing massive tax cuts for the rich, so things would definitely be different. And we would have a whole different Supreme Court Justice and other federal judges.

oh i agree 100% - that’s “current”

i am curious of how lupin thinks the rest of the 21st century would have unfolded

264
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:11:47am

I just wish the next time Shapiro went on one of his campus tours, someone reminds him he used to be paid by Bannon and his crocodile tears are bullshit.

265
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:13:10am

re: #229 HappyWarrior

I’m still pissed at the stolen SCOTUS seat. That to me was among the most galling thing McConnell has done.

dont make me pull out my favorite quote….

266
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:13:47am

re: #256 HappyWarrior

Yawn get over yourself Ben.

Ben knows his audience.

267
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:14:24am

re: #266 scottslemmons

Ben knows his audience.

Yep man babies like himself and POTUS.

268
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:14:48am

re: #262 Belafon

I’m curious how they’re going to react to “Black nation saves the world” in Avengers.

Freak out.

269
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:16:13am

re: #268 HappyWarrior

It’s already gonna be nuts considering that Wakanda is the most advanced society on the planet - and they’ve been hidden from the rest of the world on purpose.

The Eurocentric/America firsters - white supremacists/Nazis/KKK types will absolutely pitch a fit.

Fuck ‘em.

270
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:19:10am

re: #269 lawhawk

It’s already gonna be nuts considering that Wakanda is the most advanced society on the planet - and they’ve been hidden from the rest of the world on purpose.

The Eurocentric/America firsters - white supremacists/Nazis/KKK types will absolutely pitch a fit.

Fuck ‘em.

Yeah fuck em. I’m tired of their whiny bs.

271
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:19:40am

I wish I could find this — I think it was on Facebook somewhere, and the author deleted it — but I’ve read that conservatives and Trump supporters in particular are fucking terrified of the Black Panther movie. A black superhero — headlining his own major motion picture — in a world where an African country is the most advanced on Earth? It’s a direct fuck-you to everything they’ve ever been told.

I wouldn’t bet against Trump eventually attacking the movie on Twitter. And therefore, I wouldn’t bet against the movie doing even better than anticipated as a result.

272
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:21:01am

re: #271 scottslemmons

I wish I could find this — I think it was on Facebook somewhere, and the author deleted it — but I’ve read that conservatives and Trump supporters in particular are fucking terrified of the Black Panther movie. A black superhero — headlining his own major motion picture — in a world where an African country is the most advanced on Earth? It’s a direct fuck-you to everything they’ve ever been told.

I wouldn’t bet against Trump eventually attacking the movie on Twitter. And therefore, I wouldn’t bet against the movie doing even better than anticipated as a result.

I don’t think Trump himself will but his sons? For sure.

273
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:21:26am

Censoring data that should be public - showing that the Taliban are increasingly in control of Afghanistan and the opium production is on the rise:

274
retired cynic  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:22:15am

David Farenthold has an article in WaPo todayl

Nine Questions about President Trump’s Conflicts of Interest

275
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:22:42am

re: #273 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

And that’s why we can’t trust Mattis simply because he’s not totally batshit.

276
gocart mozart  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:26:02am
277
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:27:16am

re: #276 gocart mozart

[Embedded content]

I had faith you were going to quit, Marco.

278
Aucun pays pour les vieux ennemis  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:29:30am

re: #257 jaunte

279
Ace-o-aces  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:34:47am

re: #269 lawhawk

It’s already gonna be nuts considering that Wakanda is the most advanced society on the planet - and they’ve been hidden from the rest of the world on purpose.

Well, they’ll always have Latveria. Of course, Dr. Doom is Romani so maybe not.

280
Ace Rothstein  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:34:57am

Dow -335 right now.

281
danarchy  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:35:29am

re: #253 Belafon

It comes out February 16th here in the US.

Edit: And this white man is stoked (and I don’t use stoked very often).

The trailers look great and I am looking forward to it. Reading some of the comments after the premiere though I fear it is going to be really hard for it to live up to the hype. I expect it to be a great movie, but there are people saying things like it is going to “change the landscape of the genre forever” and stuff like that.

It is like the hype about Wonder Woman. It was a good movie, better than most DC attempts with the exception of a couple of the Batman movies, but it wasn’t exactly genre busting.

282
bill d. (b.d.)  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:36:53am

re: #280 Ace Rothstein

Dow -335 right now.

I wonder if they’ll be a quick line through in the SOTU speech?

283
Ace-o-aces  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:38:44am

re: #271 scottslemmons

I wouldn’t bet against Trump eventually attacking the movie on Twitter. And therefore, I wouldn’t bet against the movie doing even better than anticipated as a result.

In case anyone thinks Trump attacking “Black Panther” is a ridiculous idea, remember, this is an actual tweet from the man.

Again, the above is not from a parody account. That’s a real Donald Trump tweet.

284
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:39:40am

re: #283 Ace-o-aces

In case anyone thinks Trump attacking “Black Panther” is a ridiculous idea, remember, this is an actual tweet from the man.

[Embedded content]

Again, the above is not from a parody account. That’s a real Donald Trump tweet.

True never knew about that.

285
Ace-o-aces  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:40:09am

re: #281 danarchy

It is like the hype about Wonder Woman. It was a good movie, better than most DC attempts with the exception of a couple of the Batman movies, but it wasn’t exactly genre busting.

It did prove that people will go see a female led superhero movie if it’s reasonably well made.

286
Jay C  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:40:22am

re: #273 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

JFC! For some of us old geezers veteran observers, this brings back unpleasant memories of the Vietnam Era: supposedly “objective” analyses of a military situation (/intervention/involvement) being either manipulated or ignored in order to “justify” a - probably misguided and/or counterproductive - policy.

As I recall the story, in 1963 (?) President Kennedy sent both military (DoD) and civilian (DoS) delegations to South Vietnam to assess the state of that government’s counterinsurgency efforts. When they returned, Kennedy had them both to the WH to deliver a recap of their findings: and supposedly, when they done, asked them if they had even visited the same country…..

At least JFK listened to his “experts” - whatever his policy choices might have turned out to be - I shudder (as with most things) to imagine Trump in the same situation: he’d probably just hear the recaps, go on to regale them with golf stories and bragging about the stock market, then set policy via whoever was next in the room…

287
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:41:32am

Definitely a document that should be left behind at a copy machine.

288
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:42:36am

re: #271 scottslemmons

I wish I could find this — I think it was on Facebook somewhere, and the author deleted it — but I’ve read that conservatives and Trump supporters in particular are fucking terrified of the Black Panther movie. A black superhero — headlining his own major motion picture — in a world where an African country is the most advanced on Earth? It’s a direct fuck-you to everything they’ve ever been told.

I wouldn’t bet against Trump eventually attacking the movie on Twitter. And therefore, I wouldn’t bet against the movie doing even better than anticipated as a result.

Which makes me want even more the rumors that T’Challa/Black Panther will be taking Tony Stark’s place as the organizing figure in the next phase of the Marvel Universe.

289
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:43:07am

re: #287 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Definitely a document that should be left behind at a copy machine.

Where is Julian Assange now that we need him?

290
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:43:21am

re: #280 Ace Rothstein

It’s only 1.26% loss.

291
jeffreyw  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:43:59am

Lunch!

Imgur


chicken and roasted poblanos

292
Sir John Barron  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:45:46am

re: #287 jaunte

Definitely a document that should be left behind at a copy machine.

Not a chance now that this stays secret. Republicans are not honest brokers. No reason for business as usual.

293
Sir John Barron  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:47:48am

re: #249 Ace-o-aces

Black Panther, the first big budget Superhero movie with a mostly black cast is coming out this weekend. It’s getting overwhelmingly positive reviews. Ben Shapiro has already decided this is a liberal conspiracy.

Glad Ben is focused like a laser beam on the important issues.

294
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:47:50am
295
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:49:53am

re: #293 Sir John Barron

Glad Ben is focused like a laser beam on the important issues.

Gotta find something to whine about the next time he’s crying on a college campus. He really does suck as a commentator.

296
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:50:17am

re: #249 Ace-o-aces

Black Panther, the first big budget Superhero movie with a mostly black cast is coming out this weekend. It’s getting overwhelmingly positive reviews. Ben Shapiro has already decided this is a liberal conspiracy.

He is just bitter that Will Smith didn’t get the lead.

//

297
nines09  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:50:38am

re: #291 jeffreyw

Where do you park your food truck?

298
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:50:40am

re: #294 jaunte

Nunes memo fallout dominating a separate hearing before House Judiciary, where Goodlatte and Nadler spar over the memo, and the GOP Chairman rejected effort to investigate the matter, saying it would interfere with other panels

a memo about the alleged misdeeds of people investigating trump for misdeeds gets a hearings while trumps investigated misdeeds gets none?

299
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:50:46am

re: #294 jaunte

[Embedded content]

So glad Goodlatte is leaving. He’s a stain on this state.

300
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:51:34am

re: #289 Decatur Deb

Where is Julian Assange now that we need him?

At brunch with Vlad?

301
mmmirele  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:51:47am

re: #34 Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines

This has been going on for years now.

Parents who make their kids drink bleach, from VICE in 2015:
vice.com

Huffington Post 2012:
m.huffpost.com

Association for Science in Autism Therapy
asatonline.org

I’ve read “reports” from “parents” who have tried bleach on their autistic kids. These ” parents” go through their kids’ excrement and pull out pink strand they call works. Uh, no. That’s sloghed off intestinal lining, destroyed by the bleach.

I’m on the spectrum. I am HORRIFIED at children being tortured this way. And because kids with autism often have difficulty expressing themselves, I imagine these “parents” think everything’s just fine. It’s not!

302
Jay C  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:55:17am

re: #298 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

a memo about the alleged misdeeds of people investigating trump for misdeeds gets a hearings while trumps investigated misdeeds gets none?

Yep.
Welcome to the GOP Congress….

303
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:55:23am
304
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:55:42am

re: #301 mmmirele

This has been going on for years now.

Parents who make their kids drink bleach, from VICE in 2015:
vice.com

Huffington Post 2012:
m.huffpost.com

Association for Science in Autism Therapy
asatonline.org

I’ve read “reports” from “parents” who have tried bleach on their autistic kids. These ” parents” go through their kids’ excrement and pull out pink strand they call works. Uh, no. That’s sloghed off intestinal lining, destroyed by the bleach.

I’m on the spectrum. I am HORRIFIED at children being tortured this way. And because kids with autism often have difficulty expressing themselves, I imagine these “parents” think everything’s just fine. It’s not!

It’s scary.

305
Unshaken Defiance  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:57:29am
306
The Vicious Babushka  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:58:33am

A swarm of Russian bots is spamming Twitter with a bunch of idiotic conspiracies, including the claim they are “not Russian bots”

307
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:58:55am

re: #305 Unshaken Defiance

[Embedded content]

Watch the paint on the walls dry.

308
bill d. (b.d.)  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:59:06am

re: #289 Decatur Deb

Where is Julian Assange now that we need him?

Having a conversation with Shawn Hannity.

//

309
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 9:59:36am

re: #306 The Vicious Babushka

A swarm of Russian bots is spamming Twitter with a bunch of idiotic conspiracies, including the claim they are “not Russian bots”

[Embedded content]

WTF.

310
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:01:05am
311
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:02:05am

re: #310 Backwoods_Sleuth

I can’t wait until the NYT runs a review of Black Panther that’s just a mediocre white dude asking over and over again, “what if there was a White Panther”?

All Panthers Matter

312
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:02:07am
313
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:02:07am

re: #288 Belafon

Which makes me want even more the rumors that T’Challa/Black Panther will be taking Tony Stark’s place as the organizing figure in the next phase of the Marvel Universe.

Somewhat off-topic, but it drives me up the wall that Marvel is apparently planning on just writing characters out of the series when their actors move on to other projects. There’s no reason to dump Iron Man, Captain America, and Thor whenever Downey, Evans, and Hemsworth stop making Marvel movies. It’s not like they got rid of War Machine when Don Cheadle took over the role from Terrence Howard. I really doubt people would stop watching the movies if there was someone else under the CGI armor…

314
jeffreyw  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:02:45am

re: #297 nines09

Where do you park your food truck?

It’s on the corner.

315
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:03:08am

*barf*

316
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:03:28am

re: #313 scottslemmons

Somewhat off-topic, but it drives me up the wall that Marvel is apparently planning on just writing characters out of the series when their actors move on to other projects.

Those are marketing and production decisions that film studios make relating to their products.

317
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:05:04am

re: #316 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Obviously but it seems unnecessary.

318
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:05:21am
319
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:06:07am

re: #306 The Vicious Babushka

A swarm of Russian bots is spamming Twitter with a bunch of idiotic conspiracies, including the claim they are “not Russian bots”

[Embedded content]

Have you ever heard of a Russian Named “Peggy”?

320
A Mom Anon  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:08:32am

re: #304 HappyWarrior

No, it’s child abuse. Look up Kerri Rivera (sp) sometime. She’s got blood on her hands up to the elbows. I’m sorry, but if you are a parent and know your child is on the autism spectrum, then you KNOW autism is neurological and can’t be cured. Worked with, yes. But it’s not a disease, hence no cure. And of you know this and give your child fucking industrial bleach, your ass belongs in prison.

321
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:08:51am

re: #312 jaunte

I’m so old I can remember when the FBI was not my liberal friend.

322
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:09:55am

re: #320 A Mom Anon

No, it’s child abuse. Look up Kerri Rivera (sp) sometime. She’s got blood on her hands up to the elbows. I’m sorry, but if you are a parent and know your child is on the autism spectrum, then you KNOW autism is neurological and can’t be cured. Worked with, yes. But it’s not a disease, hence no cure. And of you know this and give your child fucking industrial bleach, your ass belongs in prison.

Yeah it certainly is. Some parents just can’t accept their children being on the spectrum.

323
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:10:07am

re: #280 Ace Rothstein

Dow -335 right now.

Any speculation (other than my own) as to why it is dipping today?

324
Decatur Deb  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:12:17am

re: #323 ObserverArt

Any speculation (other than my own) as to why it is dipping today?

Dunno. Too busy watching Bitcoin drop 10%.

325
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:14:23am

Cleanse is Luntzspeak for purge.

326
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:14:29am

re: #286 Jay C

JFC! For some of us old geezers veteran observers, this brings back unpleasant memories of the Vietnam Era: supposedly “objective” analyses of a military situation (/intervention/involvement) being either manipulated or ignored in order to “justify” a - probably misguided and/or counterproductive - policy.

As I recall the story, in 1963 (?) President Kennedy sent both military (DoD) and civilian (DoS) delegations to South Vietnam to assess the state of that government’s counterinsurgency efforts. When they returned, Kennedy had them both to the WH to deliver a recap of their findings: and supposedly, when they done, asked them if they had even visited the same country…..

At least JFK listened to his “experts” - whatever his policy choices might have turned out to be - I shudder (as with most things) to imagine Trump in the same situation: he’d probably just hear the recaps, go on to regale them with golf stories and bragging about the stock market, then set policy via whoever was next in the room…

I bet Lindsey Graham and John McCain will be real pissed about this. Both being Vietnam familiar and all. They both will probably raise a hell of a ruckus and say this needs to be made clear as this is what they swore would never happen again!

Right?

327
bill d. (b.d.)  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:14:40am

re: #323 ObserverArt

Any speculation (other than my own) as to why it is dipping today?

Jeff Bezos said that he was going to do healthcare what he did to bookstores.

328
Ace Rothstein  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:15:44am

re: #323 ObserverArt

Now -397. Huge bond sell-offs as yield rates have risen.

329
bill d. (b.d.)  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:15:50am

re: #324 Decatur Deb

Dunno. Too busy watching Bitcoin drop 10%.

Under $10k

330
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:16:11am

re: #315 Backwoods_Sleuth

331
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:16:41am

re: #287 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Definitely a document that should be left behind at a copy machine.

Or somehow mistakenly texted to a list of media members phones. Whoops!

332
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:17:37am

re: #325 Amory Blaine

Lets be fair, it’s barely a euphemism at this point. Everyone knows what the fuck he means.

333
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:18:53am

re: #297 nines09

Where do you park your food truck?

Out on the picnic table.

334
Skip Intro  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:19:25am

re: #323 ObserverArt

Any speculation (other than my own) as to why it is dipping today?

Profit taking.

335
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:19:25am

re: #330 Citizen K

[Embedded content]

LMAO.

336
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:19:26am
337
Charmingly Persistent  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:22:20am

re: #287 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Definitely a document that should be left behind at a copy machine.

This is when I really wonder if anyone on our side can play this game. If this really doesn’t “see the light of day” right after the Nunes memo is released - they don’t.

338
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:22:42am

re: #336 Backwoods_Sleuth

It seems impossible for a Republican to not fail upward, unless they literally convicted for murder or something.

339
lawhawk  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:23:44am

re: #336 Backwoods_Sleuth

Christie was spectacularly awful in his final term in office. He left with zero credibility and yet he’s got a job with a media outlet as a political commentator.

Why?

Why is he not knitting?

Asking for a friend.

Seriously, there’s no way he should have a job considering how poorly he was polling in NJ. He couldn’t even get a job on sports talk radio - that’s how bad it is for him, and yet ABC gave him a spot?

And yet right wingers will caterwaul about how the media is all liberal. Bullshit. This is just more proof.

340
scottslemmons  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:23:55am

re: #338 Citizen K

It seems impossible for a Republican to not fail upward, unless they literally convicted for murder or something.

I’m sure it’d be okay if they shot someone on 5th Avenue.

341
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:25:11am

RNC Not Ready to Return Wynn’s Donations

nope, no double standard

RNC chairwoman Ronna Romney McDaniel told Fox News that donations made by former finance chair Steve Wynn, who has been accused of sexually assaulting his employees, will only be returned if he’s found guilty.

bold mine
italics mine just for fun

342
Jay C  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:27:34am

re: #323 ObserverArt

Any speculation (other than my own) as to why it is dipping today?

The normal market cycle springing into action: the Chief Moron’s gibberings about the stock market notwithstanding, the equity market has been on a upward roll for quite a while: “natural” profit-taking is inevitable and likely.

And also (an unremarked factor I’ve noticed in recent years) - for an index measured (like the unrepresentative but universally noticed DJIA) in 20,000+ units, a 300-400-point selloff is less than half a percent on the net value. It looks a lot worse than it is: especially if the markets rebound over the next few trading sessions….

343
Ace-o-aces  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:27:41am

re: #330 Citizen K

344
DodgerFan1988  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:27:42am
345
nines09  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:29:57am

re: #314 jeffreyw

Of course it is….

346
nines09  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:31:35am

re: #333 ObserverArt

Na. Birds would get it.

347
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:32:24am

re: #341 dangerman

RNC Not Ready to Return Wynn’s Donations

nope, no double standard

bold mine
italics mine just for fun

Enjoy the high road, liberals!

//

348
Sir John Barron  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:32:30am

re: #336 Backwoods_Sleuth

I hated to retweet Sirota today, but couldn’t pass this one up.

349
danarchy  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:33:40am

re: #288 Belafon

Which makes me want even more the rumors that T’Challa/Black Panther will be taking Tony Stark’s place as the organizing figure in the next phase of the Marvel Universe.

In the animated avengers series there is sort of a power struggle between Black Panther and Captain Marvel as to who is the leader of the avengers in the absence of Cap and Tony. They end up sort of settling on BP being the big picture guy and CM being the field general. I wouldn’t be surprised if the same thing plays out in the MCU.

350
sagehen  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:34:14am

re: #313 scottslemmons

Somewhat off-topic, but it drives me up the wall that Marvel is apparently planning on just writing characters out of the series when their actors move on to other projects. There’s no reason to dump Iron Man, Captain America, and Thor whenever Downey, Evans, and Hemsworth stop making Marvel movies. It’s not like they got rid of War Machine when Don Cheadle took over the role from Terrence Howard. I really doubt people would stop watching the movies if there was someone else under the CGI armor…

How many Spidermans have there been? How many Batmans?

351
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:34:41am

re: #347 Amory Blaine

At this point, it’s not even about the high road. It’s about knowing that even if you tried, you’d get blamed and shat upon for doing even close to the same thing as the GOP did, and you’d never get forgiven for it, ever.

We’re fishing to run up the score because we can’t leave it in the ref’s hands. And the problem is ‘how’ to run up the score enough to keep it from being stolen from us again.

352
Dr. Matt  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:34:41am

This may explain why the GOP and Shitler are going extra ape shit against the FBI

353
Sea Mexican!  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:35:04am

re: #306 The Vicious Babushka

A swarm of Russian bots is spamming Twitter with a bunch of idiotic conspiracies, including the claim they are “not Russian bots”

[Embedded content]

I’ve seen more convincing arguments from Kik bots.

354
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:36:37am

re: #340 scottslemmons

I’m sure it’d be okay if they shot someone on 5th Avenue.

you know i want to start morphing this into:

would it be ok if he/they shot you on 5th avenue or just some other poor slob?

355
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:39:37am

re: #291 jeffreyw

Lunch!

[Embedded content]

chicken and roasted poblanos

our “cruel and usual (daily) punishment”

356
Amory Blaine  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:41:46am

Big drops in the crypto “market”.
coinmarketcap.com

357
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:44:13am

re: #356 Amory Blaine

Big drops in the crypto “market”.
coinmarketcap.com

I’m hoping that “conning people into giving them money and running away”-coin shows people just how useless a non-government backed currency is.

358
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:47:20am

Now we see why ABC has Christie:

359
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:47:55am

Thread, having to do with a tweet that was posted earlier, and the woman’s mention of Hoarse in her thread.

360
danarchy  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:48:58am

re: #350 sagehen

How many Spidermans have there been? How many Batmans?

Every time they introduced a new Spiderman they rebooted the series, every time they introduced a new batman it got worse and worse, until they rebooted with Christian Bale.

That is more of a correlation than causation though, Kilmer and Clooney just had shit stories and direction.

361
garzooma  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:50:43am

re: #354 dangerman

you know i want to start morphing this into:

would it be ok if he/they shot you on 5th avenue or just some other poor slob?

I asked above if anyone knew the names Roy Cockrum, Scott Comer and Eric Schoenberg. To answer my own question, they’re the poor slobs. They’re the DNC activists who had their emails stolen and published. They’re currently pursuing a lawsuit against the Trump campaign. But their names need to be put out there as the real life victims here. And whenever there’s mention of “the Memo” or “obstruction” or “attacks on the FBI”, there needs also be a mention that there are specific victims that these activities are aimed at. And it needs to be repeated “Americans don’t help foreign governments commit crimes against other Americans!

362
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:50:44am

I’m lost here. I might be reading this wrong, but is Wray suggesting McCabe left because he was going to get indicted for Buttery Mails? As in, he thinks McCabe was part of a legit conspiracy to help Hillary or some dumb shit like that?

363
Sir John Barron  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:51:41am

re: #358 Citizen K

Now we see why ABC has Christie:

Where’s the evidence?!

Normal person: In a campaign speech DJT begged Russia to hack Hillary’s account, he and his sons met in the Trump Tower with Russians who promised ‘dirt on Hillary’, DJT fired Comey for continuing to investigate Flynn and Russian election interference, DJT admitted to the Russians he fired Comey to shutdown the investigation….

Debunked! Dossier! Unmasking! Purge the FBI, DOJ and Deep State!

364
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:53:20am

re: #227 Interesting Times

Ugh, West Virginia is well and truly fucked in the head. And North Dakota is right behind them - that makes me nervous for both Manchin and Heitkamp (i.e. can they still win if Cheeto Benito’s approval ratings remain so high in those states come November?)

If a Democrat can win in Alabama, its possible to win anywhere, especially if the GOP cooperates and nominates a child molester.

365
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:57:29am

re: #361 garzooma

I asked above if anyone knew the names Roy Cockrum, Scott Comer and Eric Schoenberg. To answer my own question, they’re the poor slobs. They’re the DNC activists who had their emails stolen and published. They’re currently pursuing a lawsuit against the Trump campaign. But their names need to be put out there as the real life victims here. And whenever there’s mention of “the Memo” or “obstruction” or “attacks on the FBI”, there needs also be a mention that there are specific victims that these activities are aimed at. And it needs to be repeated “Americans don’t help foreign governments commit crimes against other Americans!

thanks. i totally missed it

366
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:58:03am

re: #362 Citizen K

I’m lost here. I might be reading this wrong, but is Wray suggesting McCabe left because he was going to get indicted for Buttery Mails? As in, he thinks McCabe was part of a legit conspiracy to help Hillary or some dumb shit like that?

He wasn’t going to get indicted, just move to some other position, essentially a demotion.

367
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:58:31am
368
Interesting Times  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:59:25am

re: #364 Big Beautiful Door

If a Democrat can win in Alabama, its possible to win anywhere, especially if the GOP cooperates and nominates a child molester.

True. There’s also this: America’s Most and Least Popular Senators

Starts off scary, but when you scroll down to the actual ratings…

Joe Manchin
Approve: 52%
Disapprove: 36%
Don’t know/no opinion: 18%
MOE: 2%

Heidi Heitkamp
Approve: 50%
Disapprove: 33%
Don’t know/no opinion: 17%
MOE: 4%

369
Charles Johnson  Jan 30, 2018 • 10:59:40am
370
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:00:39am

In other news: Maggie still simply Does Not Fucking Get It. Story at 11.

371
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:02:50am

If Trump can’t enforce sanctions on Russia, then there’s no reason to enforce immigration laws.

372
Kragar  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:02:54am

re: #367 Citizen K

373
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:04:23am

The Dreamers aren’t here illegally. They’ve been paying to stay ever since they became adults.

374
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:05:22am

re: #357 Belafon

I’m hoping that “conning people into giving them money and running away”-coin shows people just how useless a non-government backed currency is.

“MadoffCoin”

375
Dr. Matt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:06:21am
376
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:07:43am

Nunes: “We’re gonna need a bigger memo.”

377
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:07:48am

re: #373 Belafon

Unfortunately, many people’s answer to that is “once an illegal, always an illegal”. Doesn’t matter if you have no choice, doesn’t matter if you’ve made yourself part of a program to ensure you’re a contributing member of society and squeaky clean in all regards, doesn’t matter if you have all your roots here and are a better ‘citizen’ than most natural-born folk in this country.

Your very existence is a crime to ‘Real Americans’, therefore you are literally less than a person and need to get the hell out now where you ‘really’ belong: anywhere but here.

378
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:09:23am

re: #367 Citizen K

379
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:09:34am

re: #377 Citizen K

Unfortunately, many people’s answer to that is “once an illegal, always an illegal”. Doesn’t matter if you have no choice, doesn’t matter if you’ve made yourself part of a program to ensure you’re a contributing member of society and squeaky clean in all regards, doesn’t matter if you have all your roots here and are a better ‘citizen’ than most natural-born folk in this country.

Your very existence is a crime to ‘Real Americans’, therefore you are literally less than a person and need to get the hell out now where you ‘really’ belong: anywhere but here.

Luckily, they’re in the minority. Sadly, a good chunk of them are in Congress.

380
BlueSpotinAL  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:10:22am

re: #269 lawhawk

It’s already gonna be nuts considering that Wakanda is the most advanced society on the planet - and they’ve been hidden from the rest of the world on purpose.

The Eurocentric/America firsters - white supremacists/Nazis/KKK types will absolutely pitch a fit.

Fuck ‘em.

Wha? Wakanda is not a shithole?

381
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:11:43am

re: #379 Belafon

Luckily, they’re in the minority. Sadly, a good chunk of them are in Congress.

Not just that, but it’s clear our political climate gives those voices a disproportionate amount of credence compared to all others. They end up literally the only voices those in power hear, not for lack of shouting from the other side, but simply because they’re given all the megaphones. They’re simply treated as the only voices that actually exist to the point that they may as well be.

382
Dr. Matt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:11:45am

finance.yahoo.com

Dow Jones down -348.06 (-1.32%)

383
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:11:51am

re: #376 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Nunes: “We’re gonna need a bigger memo.”

A little wiggle room:

The second memo was written by Cody Shearer, a controversial political activist and former journalist who was close to the Clinton White House in the 1990s.

384
goddamnedfrank  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:12:17am
385
Kragar  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:12:47am
386
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:13:40am

Rick Wilson’s new piece at Daily Beast is pretty good: Trump Turns GOP Into a Conspiracy of Dunces

The Republican Party’s head-first dive into breathless conspiratorial fantasies in defense of Donald Trump is a brand-defining moment as the Party of Lincoln morphs into the Party of LaRouche. Listening as members of Congress, the Fox News/talk-radio world and the constellation of batshit-crazy people drawn to Esoteric Trumpism adopt increasingly baroque theories to protect The Donald isn’t just depressing; it’s tragic. A diseased slurry of fake news, post-Truth Trumpism, and Russkie agitprop infects the Republican Party. It’s an ebola of wild-eyed MK-ULTRA paranoiac raving, spreading to every organ of the Republican body politic.

This loon-centric new world of crazy talk has dissolved the old ideological skeleton of the GOP and reduced it from the Conservative Party of Ideas to the Crackpot Party of Infowars. Covering up the connections among Donald Trump, his campaign officials, and family members with Russia, and this president’s efforts to obstruct justice and derail special counsel Robert Mueller will come at a still-untallied cost to our nation, our institutions, and the dignity and reputation of the GOP. It’s going to get worse as Mueller closes in.

Last week, the ridiculous memo crafted by Fredo Nunes (R-Clownshow) and his staffers (is that you, Ezra Cohen-Watnick?) was the subject of hyperventilating conspiracy headlines across right-wing media. While breathless Republicans like Matt Gaetz (R-The Narcissus of Fox News) raced for the cameras screaming that this is a “worse than Watergate” bombshell, this fetid, steaming shitheap of lies, cherry-picked outrage-bait for the Fox booboisie, and crayon-scribble was full of tells that it was all Trump, and little truth. As they voted Monday night to release their version, while denying the Democrats the chance to release their rebuttal, the scam was clear. The first clue is that the memo is being rolled out as part of a PR effort so clumsy, obvious, ham-fisted, and covered in its own drool that it could only appeal to the most deluded Deep State fantasists. Naturally, it has been in more or less constant rotation on Fox News and the fever swamp of pro-Trump fake-news sites.

387
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:14:15am

re: #382 Dr. Matt

finance.yahoo.com

Dow Jones down -348.06 (-1.32%)

What’s driving this? Healthcare stocks from the Buffet/Bezos/forgot the 3rd person initiative?

388
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:17:22am

Schiff, putting in work.

389
Shropshire Slasher  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:17:25am

re: #387 MsJ

Apple is being probed by DOJ. bloomberg.com

390
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:19:39am

I just wrote a mean missive to one Paul Ryan. I suggest everyone write him and let him know what you think of his latest actions of protecting Trump by calling out the FBI.

Will it do anything? Who knows? It is our right and in a way our duty. If you can bitch here you can bitch on his contact form…even as awkward as it is.

I know one thing, telling Ryan where he can put his Ayn Rand books to keep them out of the sunlight is downright therapeutic.

Here is the link: https://www.speaker.gov/contact

391
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:19:50am

re: #388 makeitstop

Cover for when it leaks.

392
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:20:29am

re: #388 makeitstop

Schiff, putting in work.

[Embedded content]

I hope someone mistakenly releases it into the wild.

393
Dr. Matt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:23:14am

re: #387 MsJ

What’s driving this? Healthcare stocks from the Buffet/Bezos/forgot the 3rd person initiative?

Obama, Soros, Hillary, and librulz.

394
BeachDem  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:23:34am

re: #378 MsJ

[Embedded content]

Hey, he has Sarah Palin’s former lawyer pet poodle as his Chief of Staff, so…

395
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:23:39am

re: #393 Dr. Matt

Obama, Soros, Hillary, and librulz.

Well, *that’s* a given.

396
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:24:42am

re: #394 BeachDem

Hey, he has Sarah Palin’s former lawyer pet poodle as his Chief of Staff, so…

Well that explains it. 🙄🙄🙄

397
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:24:55am
398
Patricia Kayden  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:25:51am

re: #390 ObserverArt

Good for you. It’s okay to get it off your chest and let him know how you feel.

Will it make a difference? Not to that ogre. All he cares about is that his wealthy donors are happy with their tax cuts.

399
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:26:18am

re: #397 jaunte

[Embedded content]

If anyone should have a gripe at the FBI, it’s her.

400
JordanRules  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:28:01am
401
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:29:07am

re: #400 JordanRules

“I have a cunning plan!”

402
Big Beautiful Door  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:29:08am

re: #362 Citizen K

I’m lost here. I might be reading this wrong, but is Wray suggesting McCabe left because he was going to get indicted for Buttery Mails? As in, he thinks McCabe was part of a legit conspiracy to help Hillary or some dumb shit like that?

[Embedded content]

I think you are reading it wrong.

403
MsJ  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:29:26am

re: #398 Patricia Kayden

Good for you. It’s okay to get it off your chest and let him know how you feel.

Will it make a difference? Not to that ogre. All he cares about is that his wealthy donors are happy with their tax cuts.

No, no. He cares about killing social security, Medicare and our friends and family, too.

Ryan is a freaking ghoul.

404
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:36:21am

re: #398 Patricia Kayden

Good for you. It’s okay to get it off your chest and let him know how you feel.

Will it make a difference? Not to that ogre. All he cares about is that his wealthy donors are happy with their tax cuts.

That is why I told him sticking the Rand books where the sun doesn’t shine won’t hurt a bit since he has already bent over enough for the Kochs and others.

I closed by saying I hoped the good people of Wisconsin figure out all Paulie is an establishment taker and not a maker.

I know it probably doesn’t get to Ryan. I always have a hope that those reading his comments get a feel for how much he is despised. Maybe it changes one of his staff.

And, politics is all about numbers. If Ryan and McConnell get bombarded by huge amounts of negative messages it lets them know where they stand. And it helps others know there a lot of folks that do not like what they are doing.

Besides…if I am going to complain, I am going to do where it needs to be directed.

405
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:37:40am

re: #400 JordanRules

[Embedded content]

He’s going to keep pushing until something breaks.

And I don’t think the FBI is gonna break. In some form or fashion, they will strike back.

Won’t be pretty.

406
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:37:58am

re: #401 jaunte

“I have a cunning plan!”

“We’re going to need a bigger turnip…”

407
Kragar  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:38:56am
408
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:38:57am

re: #400 JordanRules

[Embedded content]

Because a person being able to testify on two different days is so fucking hard to pull off…

409
gocart mozart  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:40:17am
410
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:42:16am
411
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:45:01am

re: #405 makeitstop

He’s going to keep pushing until something breaks.

And I don’t think the FBI is gonna break. In some form or fashion, they will strike back.

Won’t be pretty.

Just think how easy it is to keep all of the FBI findings stored digitally somewhere. Trump and The GOP gang can try to stop the investigation but they will never be able to stop the actual process of info gathering and compiling. This is not going to go away.

I’m pretty sure FBI folks have “ways” of making sure this continues and it all gets to the public.

412
A Mom Anon  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:45:04am

re: #405 makeitstop

Yeah, keep fucking with the people who know where the bodies are buried. Smart move. I hope this blows up and takes down a bus load of these fucking smug assholes.

413
Mike Lamb  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:45:08am

re: #410 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

They really don’t care anymore. And we’re barely into year 2. I know November, 2020 is a fair ways off still, but these guys act like they are absolutely bullet proof—which is scary.

414
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:47:17am

re: #413 Mike Lamb

They really don’t care anymore. And we’re barely into year 2. I know November, 2020 is a fair ways off still, but these guys act like they are absolutely bullet proof—which is scary.

It’s also how the might fall, thinking they are bulletproof.

415
A Mom Anon  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:48:24am

re: #413 Mike Lamb

They act like that because in the “world of business” you can get away with all kinds of shitty shit and never be challenged. I doubt most of these spoiled fucks have ever been told no in their entire lives. Of course they’re cocky. That level of hubris makes people stupid, which works in our favor.

416
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:51:41am

Multiple Facebook pages are pretending to represent Native Americans and are pushing fake news stories. These pages, which have at least 1.1 million followers combined, are apparently linked to multiple fake news websites based in Kosovo. And at least one of those pages has been verified by Facebook. (my bold)

Since 2016, Facebook has been forced to reckon with foreign manipulation of its platform for both geo-political and monetary ends. While Russia and Macedonia are generally considered countries from where some of the largest quantity of fake news is generated, Kosovo is another major source. Media Matters identified at least eight Facebook pages that claim to represent Native Americans but have actually been used to push fake news stories from websites registered in Kosovo. Those pages include:

Native American Apache (two pages with same name);

Apache Native Americans (two pages with same name);

Cherokee Native Americans;

Native Americans Proud;

Native Americans Cherokee;

and Pawnee Native Americans.

417
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:52:31am

re: #416 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Very interesting.

418
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:52:46am

re: #412 A Mom Anon

Yeah, keep fucking with the people who know where the bodies are buried. Smart move. I hope this blows up and takes down a bus load of these fucking smug assholes.

The one thing that keeps me going these days is the belief that the people in federal law enforcement take their oath seriously, and they will not let this gang of thieves off the hook.

There are no doubt an awful lot of career professionals in both the FBI and CIA that are keeping score on all this shit Trump is dumping on them. And sooner or later, settling up is going to happen.

It might not even happen to ‘President’ Trump, but to ‘citizen’ Trump somewhere down the road. Revenge is a dish best served cold, after all.

419
KGxvi  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:52:52am

There’s a certain irony that the State of the Union is being held on the anniversary of Nixon’s 1974 address:

1974: State of Nixon

420
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:53:42am
421
wrenchwench  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:55:44am

My senator.

422
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:55:57am

Time for another piece on disappointed Trump voters.

423
KGxvi  Jan 30, 2018 • 11:59:01am

re: #422 jaunte

Turns out, there’s a lot of those, after all:

New polling on that first year of Trump shows that the President has a lot of work to do in bringing the country together. There are just 12 states where Trump’s job approval rating was above 50% for the entirety of 2017. That pales in comparison to the 41 states where then-President Barack Obama was above 50% approval for his first year on office.

He’s under 40% in Texas of all fucking places.

424
bratwurst  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:00:20pm

Nothing to see here, just a Republican running for office who has compiled a list of Jewish enemies…

425
KGxvi  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:05:31pm

re: #424 bratwurst

General rule, you refer to Jewish people as “Jews”, I immediately stop taking you seriously as anything other than a neo-nazi sympathizer.

426
Backwoods_Sleuth  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:06:01pm
427
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:07:07pm

re: #424 bratwurst

Nothing to see here, just a Republican running for office who has compiled a list of Jewish enemies…

Now that I know he needs more non-Jews, I’ll help balance things out when I get home.

I’m imagining Dr. Seuss spinning in his grave.

428
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:07:22pm

re: #422 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Time for another piece on disappointed Trump voters.

I hope the NY Times and Nicole from MSNBC hurry up and get to those folks to get a feel for how they feel about Trump now.

By the way…Lawrence O’Donnell had a disappointed Trump voter from Indiana on last night. Hopefully she is expressing all the same with her friends and family. Upset Trumpers can be soldiers for the next election.

Some that don’t get MSNBC might like to see this.

Iframe

429
Eclectic Cyborg  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:08:09pm

re: #423 KGxvi

He’s under 40% in Texas of all fucking places.

Dreamers and Hispanics.

430
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:09:53pm

re: #429 Eclectic Cyborg

Dreamers and Hispanics.

There’s a lot of farmers and businesspeople who are being hurt by his policies, and a lot of us have Latino neighbors.

431
Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:12:01pm

re: #423 KGxvi

Turns out, there’s a lot of those, after all:

He’s under 40% in Texas of all fucking places.

Some of them don’t think he’s conservative enough, for real. Others are disappointed that he won’t stop chemtrail spraying or admit the Moon landings were ‘shopped or order USGS to stop claiming the Earth is round.

432
Renaissance_Man  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:12:46pm

re: #428 ObserverArt

I hope the NY Times and Nicole from MSNBC hurry up and get to those folks to get a feel for how they feel about Trump now.

By the way…Lawrence O’Donnell had a disappointed Trump voter from Indiana on last night. Hopefully she is expressing all the same with her friends and family. Upset Trumpers can be soldiers for the next election.

Some that don’t get MSNBC might like to see this.

[Embedded content]

I guarantee you now that 90% of ‘Trump voters upset by Trump’ will vote Trump again in 2020.

Of those that don’t, 90%+ will have convinced themselves of the excuses that the NYT and others have given them - that voting Trump was a perfectly understandable thing to do and doesn’t reflect on them at all - and will vote enthusiastically for the next fascist the Republicans put forward.

The 1% of ‘Trump voters upset by Trump’ that actually vote differently will be those that stopped watching FOX for whatever reason.

By all means, we should be hopeful. I encourage it. But such hopes cannot include the idea that Trump voters will change their minds. It’s like believing in chemtrails and unicorns. Do not go down that road, there is only disappointment there.

433
The Major  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:17:19pm

re: #323 ObserverArt

Amazon, Berkshire Hathaway and JP Morgan Chase are announcing a new Healt Insurance initiative that has sent the stocks of United Healthcare, Aetna and others into the tank.

434
Shiplord Kirel, live from behind wingnut lines  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:17:45pm

Yet another shaman from the Temple of the Golden Calf, Bat Guano denomination.

Facebook Post

435
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:18:05pm

I wish I could feel bad for these people but I can’t. They were warned. They didn’t want to listen. They just dismissed any criticism of Trump. I don’t want them to suffer but of people I feel bad for, they ain’t it.

436
makeitstop  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:19:11pm

re: #428 ObserverArt

I hope the NY Times and Nicole from MSNBC hurry up and get to those folks to get a feel for how they feel about Trump now.

By the way…Lawrence O’Donnell had a disappointed Trump voter from Indiana on last night. Hopefully she is expressing all the same with her friends and family. Upset Trumpers can be soldiers for the next election.

Some that don’t get MSNBC might like to see this.

[Embedded content]

My problem with that woman is she was fine with Trump until he personally screwed her over.

Lawrence should have asked if she’d vote for Trump again. I get the feeling that she would have said she would if she got her job back.

437
A hollow voice says, Covfefe.  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:21:25pm

re: #432 Renaissance_Man

I guarantee you now that 90% of ‘Trump voters upset by Trump’ will vote Trump again in 2020.

Of those that don’t, 90%+ will have convinced themselves of the excuses that the NYT and others have given them - that voting Trump was a perfectly understandable thing to do and doesn’t reflect on them at all - and will vote enthusiastically for the next fascist the Republicans put forward.

The 1% of ‘Trump voters upset by Trump’ that actually vote differently will be those that stopped watching FOX for whatever reason.

By all means, we should be hopeful. I encourage it. But such hopes cannot include the idea that Trump voters will change their minds. It’s like believing in chemtrails and unicorns. Do not go down that road, there is only disappointment there.

I agree, but keep in mind also that the real hard-core of Trump supporters is 25% of the electorate, maximum.

Also, being hopeful isn’t enough. The demonstrated way to get people to vote is personal contact — phone banking, canvassing, talking to people in malls, and that’s what we’ve been neglecting. Start now.

438
The Ghost of a Flea  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:21:38pm

re: #115 Belafon

Thoughts about various conversations here on LGF yesterday:

“Democrats need to do better at messaging. Make it simple and stick to it.”
“Nunes’ memo is like Al Capone’s vault: There’s nothing there.” - Ted Lieu
“That’s a bad analogy because it doesn’t quite map to what’s going on.”

This is why Democrats don’t have a simple message.

I made a comment that wasn’t about messaging, you responded to it, and I responding in the same vein as my first comment.

At absolutely no point was I discussing Democratic messaging.

I always write long form, because my group I’m interested in interacting with is the board.

And, yes, I’m offended.

439
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:22:05pm

re: #436 makeitstop

My problem with that woman is she was fine with Trump until he personally screwed her over.

Lawrence should have asked if she’d vote for Trump again. I get the feeling that she would have said she would if she got her job back.

I get the feeling from many of those ‘disaffected Trump supporters’ that all they really need to do is distract them a bit more by punching down at a few minorities and pretending that this, THIS, will be the thing that brings their jobs back, and they’ll all be copacetic.

440
HappyWarrior  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:22:40pm

re: #436 makeitstop

My problem with that woman is she was fine with Trump until he personally screwed her over.

Lawrence should have asked if she’d vote for Trump again. I get the feeling that she would have said she would if she got her job back.

Exactly. That’s why I don’t feel bad. They don’t feel bad for the DREAMERS or others who live life in fear. I’m sorry she lost her job but not much sympathy.

441
Franklin  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:23:22pm

Haven’t been around lately, but wanted to drop this in here.

My At-Large City Councillor Ayanna Pressley is running to unseat Rep Capuano in MA7. MA7 is my states only minority majority district.

“Making progress on longstanding challenges requires a different lens and a new approach,” she said. “I will be a bold voice in Congress, as an advocate for the entire district and as a champion for opportunity. This moment in time demands nothing less.”

Pressely was Boston’s first black city councillor and her mother was an activist that worked as an advocate for tenants rights in Chicago.

Fun fact, at Ayanna’s mom’s funeral, then Senator John Kerry read the following (in part):

“Sandra was an amazing gift who came into our lives through the daughter she loved with all her heart,” Senator John F. Kerry said in a statement read at her funeral. “Sandra was a woman of immense faith, and sometimes I think she spent more time praying for me than I’d prayed for anything… . Sandra prayed for me in good times and bad. She called and told me she was praying for me when I ran for president and again when I found I was diagnosed with cancer.”

442
A hollow voice says, Covfefe.  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:23:56pm

re: #439 Citizen K

I get the feeling from many of those ‘disaffected Trump supporters’ that all they really need to do is distract them a bit more by punching down at a few minorities and pretending that this, THIS, will be the thing that brings their jobs back, and they’ll all be copacetic.

Only if some of them get their jobs back. If they keep hearing the same thing and their jobs don’t come back, they’re likely to at least stay home for the elections.

443
Belafon  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:26:45pm

re: #438 The Ghost of a Flea

I made a comment that wasn’t about messaging, you responded to it, and I responding in the same vein as my first comment.

At absolutely no point was I discussing Democratic messaging.

I always write long form, because my group I’m interested in interacting with is the board.

And, yes, for once I’m offended.

You did talk about how his comment was simplistic. And others have made the point that Democrats have trouble doing simple messages. We understand that issues are complex, which makes it hard to get messages into sound bites. My point was that there are a lot of people that know that “Capone’s vault” is a euphemism for when something is built up as a big deal, and then nothing was there. It’s a simple message to stick to.

And my comment above is about all of the stuff I’d read.

444
Citizen K  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:27:46pm

re: #442 A hollow voice says, Covfefe.

But that’s just the thing: how long and how many times do they need to get rolled by Trump and Co.’s promises before they start taking a ‘believe it when I see it’ approach? Seems like many of these will be just fine being told ‘the jobs will come back soon as this passes’.

445
jaunte  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:27:54pm

Pre-SOTU:

446
Renaissance_Man  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:35:43pm

re: #442 A hollow voice says, Covfefe.

Only if some of them get their jobs back. If they keep hearing the same thing and their jobs don’t come back, they’re likely to at least stay home for the elections.

I don’t believe that, and I don’t think you should either. All evidence shows that they will vote exactly as they are told to by FOX, whether they have a job or not, or quite frankly even if Trump were to personally murder one of their family members.

The number of Trump votes will increase in 2020, not decrease. I expect that the number of Democratic votes will also increase as well, by a greater number, but getting more votes does not necessarily win elections for Democrats.

447
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:35:47pm

re: #435 HappyWarrior

I wish I could feel bad for these people but I can’t. They were warned. They didn’t want to listen. They just dismissed any criticism of Trump. I don’t want them to suffer but of people I feel bad for, they ain’t it.

Should a person be punished for showing no consideration towards an idiot behaving like an idiot? - jo nesbo

448
dangerman  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:37:10pm

re: #436 makeitstop

My problem with that woman is she was fine with Trump until he personally screwed her over.

Lawrence should have asked if she’d vote for Trump again. I get the feeling that she would have said she would if she got her job back.

so she’s good as long as its someone else who gets shot on 5th avenue - re: #354 dangerman

449
ObserverArt  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:45:19pm

re: #446 Renaissance_Man

I don’t believe that, and I don’t think you should either. All evidence shows that they will vote exactly as they are told to by FOX, whether they have a job or not, or quite frankly even if Trump were to personally murder one of their family members.

The number of Trump votes will increase in 2020, not decrease. I expect that the number of Democratic votes will also increase as well, by a greater number, but getting more votes does not necessarily win elections for Democrats.

I’m trying to be good here.

But I have to ask; where do you get off telling people what they should believe?

What good are you doing with saying stuff like that?

I almost get the feeling you want people to give up. What other reason is there for saying that to another member?

450
Renaissance_Man  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:57:53pm

re: #449 ObserverArt

I’m trying to be good here.

But I have to ask; where do you get off telling people what they should believe?

What good are you doing with saying stuff like that?

I almost get the feeling you want people to give up. What other reason is there for saying that to another member?

It’s not meant as a challenge. It’s the same warning I gave you - don’t expect Trump voters to change their votes. That can’t be a consideration, because it’s not realistic. Nor do I want people to give up, quite the contrary. But we also can’t go telling ourselves comforting fictions like the idea that Trump voters might change.

451
Unshaken Defiance  Jan 30, 2018 • 12:58:04pm

re: #435 HappyWarrior

I wish I could feel bad for these people but I can’t. They were warned. They didn’t want to listen. They just dismissed any criticism of Trump. I don’t want them to suffer but of people I feel bad for, they ain’t it.

Blinded By Hillary, blinded by hate.The blind led the blind to a damn dark corner.

452
A hollow voice says, Covfefe.  Jan 30, 2018 • 1:06:45pm

re: #444 Citizen K

But that’s just the thing: how long and how many times do they need to get rolled by Trump and Co.’s promises before they start taking a ‘believe it when I see it’ approach? Seems like many of these will be just fine being told ‘the jobs will come back soon as this passes’.

At least once. We’re talking about people who hadn’t been rolled by Trump yet when they voted the last time..

453
A hollow voice says, Covfefe.  Jan 30, 2018 • 1:07:34pm

re: #446 Renaissance_Man

The number of Trump votes will increase in 2020, not decrease. I expect that the number of Democratic votes will also increase as well, by a greater number, but getting more votes does not necessarily win elections for Democrats.

Evidence?

454
cat-tikvah  Jan 30, 2018 • 1:26:27pm

re: #406 Backwoods_Sleuth

Is it shaped like a thingy?


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