“Name That Scandal” Open Thread

Politics • Views: 25,013

There’s been some speculation that in order to really go viral, the impeachment process needs to have a catchy nickname, like, dare I say it, Watergate.

But man, the -gate thing is so tired it wrapped around, got cool, and then got tired again. So if we’re going to need a hook for the Trump Horror to cut through the noise, I recalled that one of the most notorious political scandals in US history before Nixon was the Teapot Dome bribery scandal in the Warren G. Harding administration. (But unlike the present mess, Harding was never implicated.)

So in somewhat the same spirit, to kick off an open thread for the LGF community to come up with a viral, catchy name that will put this impeachment over the top, I’d like to propose… “Red Hat.”

“Red Cap” would also work if you’re a Linux disciple. (Programmer joke.)

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513 comments

1
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:33:59pm
2
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:35:51pm
3
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:37:08pm

Problem is that the Trumpers have completely shut off any input into their worldview from outside of Trump-land.

It’s like talking to creationists.

Because in many cases Trumpers are literal creationists.

In Trump we are looking at the butt-ugly end of American Christian fundamentalism.

4
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:37:33pm

I have to stick with the classic: “Stupid Watergate.”

5
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:37:41pm
6
mmmirele  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:39:18pm

I’m thinking “Stupid Watergate” too but I kind of like “Crackpot Dome.”

7
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:40:43pm

re: #6 mmmirele

I’m thinking “Stupid Watergate” too but I kind of like “Crackpot Dome.”

8
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:41:08pm

So Tulsi is going to commit suicide on live TV?

9
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:41:14pm

Interesting map at the link.

10
Shiplord Kirel, Friend of Moose and Squirrel  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:41:31pm

I re-submit my suggestion from the other night, TEABAG DOME.

11
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:41:54pm

Crackpot Dome is not bad either. But I always like to try to come up with something new that isn’t a spin-off of an earlier name.

12
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:42:45pm
13
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:43:19pm
14
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:44:17pm

Since Trump did a game show how about…

Let’s Make A Half-Assed Deal?

15
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:44:29pm

It’s been said on cable news tonite that effectively Those 50 nukes are Erdogan’s hostages.

16
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:44:47pm
17
Mescalero09  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:45:08pm

re: #13 gocart mozart

“I’ll take “Unemployed Game Show Hosts” for $100, Alex.”

18
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:45:28pm

re: #13 gocart mozart

“Intelligensia” is plural, Chuck.

19
Interesting Times  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:45:30pm

Worth remembering:

20
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:46:09pm

re: #16 Charles Johnson

You cannot shame the shameless.

21
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:46:41pm

re: #13 gocart mozart

[Embedded content]

Chuck supports a guy contemptuous of separation of powers. But I guess that’s too French for a fascist fuck like Chuck.

22
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:47:08pm

re: #13 gocart mozart

Gibberish. Don’t try to make sense of it, your head will explode.

23
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:47:55pm
24
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:48:08pm

re: #16 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

He’ll do as he’s done time and again: Give a half-assed “condemnation,” then immediately reverse himself before day’s end because he’s getting criticized in the wingnut press.

25
Eventual Carrion  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:48:25pm

I vote for VENONA.

26
BigPapa  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:48:26pm

QuidProGoProNo

27
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:49:36pm

QuidPorqueNo?

28
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:50:02pm

The problem with clever names is they make the thing sound nonserious.

That said, my suggestion is “the octopus.”

29
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:51:27pm

Quid Amateur Quo?

Speaking of GoPro, on my ride yesterday I was passed by a woman on a Time Trial bike, with a GoPro sticking out the top of her helmet like a blade. I guess someone finally figured that sticking a box on your head might add some aerodynamic drag.

30
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:51:35pm

How about…

Blunderball?

31
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:51:42pm

re: #24 Targetpractice

He’ll do as he’s done time and again: Give a half-assed “condemnation,” then immediately reverse himself before day’s end because he’s getting criticized in the wingnut press.

Zackly. So why bother? When cable heads do this, it’s just play-acting.

32
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:52:41pm

re: #30 Joe Bacon 🌹

How about…

Blunderball?

Blunderdome!

Two Men Enter, No Men Leave (because they’re too dumb to find the door).

33
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:53:31pm

re: #32 Blind Frog Belly White

Blunderdome!

Two Men Enter, No Men Leave (because they’re too dumb to find the door).

Blunderdumb!

34
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:54:06pm

re: #31 Charles Johnson

Zackly. So why bother? When cable heads do this, it’s just play-acting.

There are some that still cling to that vain hope that the man can somehow find his way to being “presidential,” but I think the majority now do it because the silence and/or reversal are just as much a story as the “condemnation.”

35
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:54:38pm

Kiev Coverup?

36
makeitstop  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:55:13pm

re: #35 b.d. (Lock Them Up!)

Kiev Coverup?

Kieverup?

37
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:56:12pm
38
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:57:25pm

re: #36 makeitstop

Kieverup?

Black Sea Blackmail

39
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 5:58:08pm

Dumbplomacy!

40
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:00:27pm

re: #18 Blind Frog Belly White

Drool Cups….

41
Yeah Sure WhatEVs  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:00:52pm

re: #6 mmmirele

I’m thinking “Stupid Watergate” too but I kind of like “Crackpot Dome.”

Crackpot Dope.

42
lawhawk  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:02:27pm

re: #11 Charles Johnson

Crackpot Dome is not bad either. But I always like to try to come up with something new that isn’t a spin-off of an earlier name.

Corruptalago.

43
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:02:35pm

Why is it so hard to come up with a name that rolls off the tongue like “Watergate?”

A simpleton like Trump should be easy to sum up in a simple catchy phrase.

44
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:03:30pm

Per Maddow, Parnas and Fruman met their $1 million bail (each) and are out and about.

45
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:04:28pm

re: #44 jaunte

Per Maddow, Parnas and Fruman met their $1 million bail (each) and are out and about.

They do have ankle bracelets and are being watched, though.

46
Mescalero09  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:05:29pm

re: #43 Charles Johnson

Maybe because there are so many crimes? Watergate was the hotel name. Simple. It was a crime and the cover up was the bigger crime. At Watergate.
With Trump it’s a fucking tsunami of crime here and abroad. Hundreds. And just about the entire GOP culpable.

47
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:06:10pm

re: #45 Charles Johnson

They do have ankle bracelets and are being watched, though.

I hope they don’t live in a high rise.

48
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:06:31pm

re: #35 b.d. (Lock Them Up!)

Kiev Kyiv Coverup?

re: #36 makeitstop

Kieverup Kyiverup?

FTFY

49
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:06:44pm

What’s the Russian for Sharknado?

50
Pawn of the Oppressor  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:07:31pm

I think we could just call it the Russian Doll Scandal for the way there’s just more and more every time you take away a layer.

I do like “Moron-Contra” though.

51
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:07:37pm

re: #43 Charles Johnson

Why is it so hard to come up with a name that rolls off the tongue like “Watergate?”

A simpleton like Trump should be easy to sum up in a simple catchy phrase.

I actually took a second to look into why “-gate” became the accepted norm for labeling “scandals” and (according to Wiki) the practice began with William Safire trying to diminish his former boss’ crimes by slapping “-gate” on every kerfuffle linked to a Dem in some way. You’ll notice that the practice never really applied to Repubs, as Iran-Contra didn’t really enter voters minds as “Iran-Contra-gate.” But then “-gate” suddenly became widespread when Clinton took office and the media made it their life’s work to destroy him politically and personally.

Perhaps we might follow in the same vein and go with “Ukraine-ghazi.”

52
NetworkKed  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:07:45pm

re: #43 Charles Johnson

Why is it so hard to come up with a name that rolls off the tongue like “Watergate?”

A simpleton like Trump should be easy to sum up in a simple catchy phrase.

Trump may be a simpleton, but he’s blundered and bulldozed his way into SO MANY layers of corruption that it’s really kind of impossible to reduce it to one core event/place that the rest of it has grown out of. So place names basically don’t work, like most of the previous famous scandals. He IS the scandal.

53
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:07:51pm
54
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:07:54pm

re: #44 jaunte

Are they ankle cuffed w/GPS?

55
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:08:07pm

акуланадо

56
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:08:17pm

re: #54 Dave In Austin

Yes.

57
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:08:33pm

re: #46 Mescalero09

Maybe because there are so many crimes? Watergate was the hotel name. Simple. It was a crime and the cover up was the bigger crime. At Watergate.
With Trump it’s a fucking tsunami of crime here and abroad. Hundreds. And just about the entire GOP culpable.

Sadly, this whole deal is more than likely to be named over some information we haven’t even heard of yet.

58
stpaulbear  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:08:37pm

re: #14 Joe Bacon 🌹

Since Trump did a game show how about…

Let’s Make A Half-Assed Deal?

The Apprehendice.

59
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:08:43pm

re: #50 Pawn of the Oppressor

I think we could just call it the Russian Doll Scandal for the way there’s just more and more every time you take away a layer.

I do like “Moron-Contra” though.

Matryoshka-gate.

//

60
lawhawk  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:09:41pm

re: #53 Charles Johnson

If you’re worried about crossing the line into criminality, you’re already too far over it.

Rule to live by…

Trumpworld: what line.

61
makeitstop  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:10:08pm

re: #43 Charles Johnson

Why is it so hard to come up with a name that rolls off the tongue like “Watergate?”

A simpleton like Trump should be easy to sum up in a simple catchy phrase.

Mar-a-Larceny

62
stpaulbear  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:10:44pm

Gah. Typo. I meant to write The Apprehendice.

63
uncah91  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:11:42pm

The Zelensky Affair

64
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:12:55pm
65
lawhawk  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:13:22pm

re: #61 makeitstop

Treason Tower

66
Mescalero09  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:15:47pm

Here’s my drivers license with my ..”GET THE FUCK IN THE CAR!”

67
BigPapa  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:17:22pm

Crimea River

68
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:18:03pm

re: #66 Mescalero09

Here’s my drivers license with my ..”GET THE FUCK IN THE CAR!”

[Embedded content]

But…but…Justice Roberts said that racism is over in America!

/////

69
Mescalero09  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:19:03pm

re: #68 Targetpractice

Yeah. It’s all over.

70
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:19:54pm
71
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:21:33pm

re: #70 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀

[Embedded content]

Translation: “We’re not covering for your ass on matters the public already knows about!”

72
The Ghost of a Flea  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:21:54pm

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

73
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:27:47pm
74
uriel  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:28:27pm
75
retired cynic  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:28:34pm

If Watergate, the hotel, named the entire Nixon mess, why not just call this one after DT’s favorite getaway, Mar-a-lago?

I do love some of those others, ‘though! Crackpot Dome, Stupid Watergate, Moron Contra. But they are clever. There ain’t nothin’ clever about DT’s messes. They are bludgeons!

(Have been gone for five days at a convention. We all deliberately refused to talk about the ongoing garbage, but driving home we just sank back into it with fury.)

76
Patricia Kayden  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:30:14pm

re: #9 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Interesting map at the link.

This is so cool. I’m on Piscataway land.

77
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:32:49pm

As much as we may hate the way that social media like Twitter and Facebook are run, and the way it’s been weaponized by forces big (Russia/China) and small (Trump), it’s hard to argue that we’d know as much about what’s going on in this administration without them. If we were still relying upon the TV and dead tree media to give us info, we’d likely still be totally in the dark about the original whistleblower complaint.

78
Eric The Fruit Bat  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:33:18pm

re: #75 retired cynic

How about Mar-a-Uh oh ?

79
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:33:48pm

re: #54 Dave In Austin

Are they ankle cuffed w/GPS?

And I bet there are more people watching them now than before.

80
retired cynic  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:34:03pm

re: #78 Eric The Fruit Bat

How about Mar-a-Uh oh ?

I just like it straight, rather than cute. But that’s just me!

81
Patricia Kayden  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:34:30pm

re: #74 uriel

Bloop!!

82
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:36:27pm

re: #74 uriel

Silly Woolery. He has no beef with Fascism.

83
Barefoot Grin  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:37:53pm

re: #13 gocart mozart

[Embedded content]

He got fucking schooled.

84
Mescalero09  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:39:38pm

just saw this……………..

85
I Would Prefer Not To  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:39:44pm

I like stupid Watergate. It ties trump to Nixon and the event is not a one time happening, but rather a continuation of republican crimes. And don’t be mistaken, when this is over they are going to pretend that this was unusual when it was just business as usual.

86
Decatur Deb  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:44:28pm

re: #15 Dave In Austin

It’s been said on cable news tonite that effectively Those 50 nukes are Erdogan’s hostages.

If someone farts in the direction of our weapons storage, the whole igloo array turns into a nuclear waste site in minutes. Trust me.

87
Yeah Sure WhatEVs  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:45:54pm

re: #78 Eric The Fruit Bat

How about Mar-a-Uh oh ?

Mar-a-Just Say No.

88
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:46:09pm

re: #86 Decatur Deb

If someone farts in the direction of our weapons storage, the whole igloo array turns into a nuclear waste site in minutes. Trust me.

It’s not that. If we remove them, if Trump removes them, we’ve basically signaled the end of our support for Turkey. After that, why would we be there? And once it happens, why would Turkey stay with NATO rather than join Putin. And then you have a country leaving NATO. What happens after that?

89
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:46:25pm

about right

90
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:46:38pm

re: #88 Belafon

It’s not that. If we remove them, if Trump removes them, we’ve basically signaled the end of our support for Turkey. After that, why would we be there? And once it happens, why would Turkey stay with NATO rather than join Putin. And then you have a country leaving NATO. What happens after that?

What are the Central European countries going to think?

91
DangerMan  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:52:13pm

re: #52 NetworkKed

Trump may be a simpleton, but he’s blundered and bulldozed his way into SO MANY layers of corruption that it’s really kind of impossible to reduce it to one core event/place that the rest of it has grown out of. So place names basically don’t work, like most of the previous famous scandals. He IS the scandal.

So Trumpgate
Or trumpgazi

92
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:54:07pm

Mar-A-Lard-O

93
Mescalero09  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:54:46pm

re: #91 DangerMan

American’s Shame.
Because that is being kind.

Later Lizards

94
Decatur Deb  Oct 14, 2019 • 6:54:48pm

re: #88 Belafon

It’s not that. If we remove them, if Trump removes them, we’ve basically signaled the end of our support for Turkey. After that, why would we be there? And once it happens, why would Turkey stay with NATO rather than join Putin. And then you have a country leaving NATO. What happens after that?

We’ve been drawing down our nukes in Turkey since 1990. Our Army artillery command, HQ’d in Italy used to have a bunch of 8-inch scattered about both sides of the Bosphorus. We pulled the last out of them out of there about the time I left. Army traded them off world-wide, mostly because they were a pain in the ass to secure and maintain.

95
EPR-radar  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:02:26pm

I like Teahadi Dome for the party-level scandal.

But for the Trump-specific stuff, I think it will just end up being “Trump”. As in 50 years from now, if civilization prevails, you’ll have slang like “You really Trumped that up” after someone has a giant fuckup.

96
Ace Rothstein  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:02:31pm

Rachel just said that Ghouliani’s homies are still in custody. They have not been bonded out yet.

97
goddamnedfrank  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:05:03pm

Finally beat Troy in Borderlands 3, goddamn what an annoying fight.

98
NO SMOCKING GUN!  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:05:22pm

Matt Bevin is so unpopular, Kentucky might elect a Democratic Governor. This should help.

99
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:05:39pm
100
Charles Johnson  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:06:33pm
101
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:06:53pm

102
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:08:31pm

re: #100 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

LOL, he’s tweeting FoxNews to ask them if this is big news or not? And if he should sue CNN?

Dear Lord, get a net!

103
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:09:55pm

re: #59 Targetpractice

Matryoshka-gate.

//

Kompro-Matryoshka

104
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:10:29pm

re: #99 jaunte

“The deliberative process privilege disappears altogether when there is any reason to believe government misconduct occurred.”

That ought to make a few more people more willing to talk.

105
goddamnedfrank  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:10:45pm
106
Rightwingconspirator  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:14:07pm

re: #43 Charles Johnson

I call this time and these things we discuss “TrumpFucked”. Stays on person and point, and are we not past sweating the F bomb much? Added edit- TrumpFucking, TrumpFuckery, TrumpFuckish…

107
Sherlock Hound  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:16:04pm

re: #27 jaunte

QuidPorqueNo?

QuidPourquoi

108
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:16:47pm

re: #103 Blind Frog Belly White

Kompro-Matryoshka

The Crime/Fraud Exception

109
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:17:22pm

Trumpster Fire.

110
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:17:50pm

re: #86 Decatur Deb

If someone farts in the direction of our weapons storage, the whole igloo array turns into a nuclear waste site in minutes. Trust me.

Someone’s got to order that. He won’t do it. I think he’d like to see them in Saudi

111
Sherlock Hound  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:19:26pm

re: #95 EPR-radar

I like Teahadi Dome for the party-level scandal.

But for the Trump-specific stuff, I think it will just end up being “Trump”. As in 50 years from now, if civilization prevails, you’ll have slang like “You really Trumped that up” after someone has a giant fuckup.

Tromper is already a verb in French. Learning French at the start of his administration, this was not a difficult word to remember.

112
Semper Fi  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:23:19pm

Trumpo-Kompromatzki

113
Patricia Kayden  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:25:10pm

114
Decatur Deb  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:25:33pm

re: #110 Dave In Austin

Someone’s got to order that. He won’t do it. I think he’d like to see them in Saudi

No orders would be needed—demolition is in the SOPs and Surety regs. We don’t let yahoos grab nukes.

115
Blind Frog Belly White  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:27:01pm

GOPerdammerung?

116
NO SMOCKING GUN!  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:32:12pm

Great point here. Citizens have to stay cool and collected with a gun in their face, because the trained professionals have a license to panic and shoot.

117
Barefoot Grin  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:41:32pm
118
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:43:28pm

re: #114 Decatur Deb

re: #114 Decatur Deb

No orders would be needed—demolition is in the SOPs and Surety regs. We don’t let yahoos grab nukes.

I didn’t know that. But now I do, thanx you.

119
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:44:17pm
120
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:44:32pm

re: #118 Dave In Austin

I didn’t know that. But now I do, thanx you.

Using conventional munitions?

121
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:47:17pm

re: #117 Barefoot Grin

[Embedded content]

Ivanka and Jared have been doing the same I believe.

122
Yeah Sure WhatEVs  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:47:19pm

re: #119 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Drug deal???

123
Patricia Kayden  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:48:34pm

re: #116 NO SMOCKING GUN!

Some citizens much more than others.

124
William Lewis  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:48:58pm

re: #120 Dave In Austin

Using conventional munitions?

I don’t know because I never needed to know but detonating the implosion explosive without the PU pit would be the best way to ensre they are never used.

125
Barefoot Grin  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:49:23pm

re: #122 Yeah Sure WhatEVs

Drug deal???

Mulvaney?

126
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:49:54pm

re: #122 Yeah Sure WhatEVs

Breaking the Too Shady For John Bolton barrier.

127
stpaulbear  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:50:32pm

re: #119 jaunte

Glad to see Mulvaney’s name getting dragged into it. I want to see him and his wife reduced to cleaning toilets at Walmart. All of these smug a-holes.

128
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:51:01pm

re: #122 Yeah Sure WhatEVs

Drug deal???

I think he was being metaphorical, in other words, whatever bad thing they are doing.

129
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:51:08pm
130
Yeah Sure WhatEVs  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:51:09pm

re: #125 Barefoot Grin

Mulvaney?

Imagine Bolton saving US…

This is the most fucked to timeline ever.

131
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:52:00pm

re: #130 Yeah Sure WhatEVs

Imagine Bolton saving US…

This is the most fucked to timeline ever.

Yeah this is so weird.

132
Dave In Austin  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:52:08pm

re: #124 William Lewis

It would be fine if they can breach the bunkers I’d think.

There may be fail safe divides built in.

133
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:52:41pm

re: #130 Yeah Sure WhatEVs

Imagine Bolton saving US…

This is the most fucked to timeline ever.

134
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:53:03pm
135
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:54:32pm

This is probably why Bolton got out. Didn’t want to get dragged down with these guys.

136
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:55:34pm
137
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:56:33pm

re: #115 Blind Frog Belly White

GOPerdammerung?

Fiasco!

138
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:56:44pm

re: #136 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Mulvaney is playing the role of Haldemann in this story.

139
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:59:12pm

Fuck this entire administration though. Trump and Trumpism needs to be repudiated soundly not just next fall but forever.

140
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:59:31pm
141
Semper Fi  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:59:50pm

re: #126 jaunte

Breaking the Too Shady For John Bolton barrier.

Apparently. Nice to know limits exist.

142
Patricia Kayden  Oct 14, 2019 • 7:59:51pm

re: #135 HappyWarrior

This is probably why Bolton got out. Didn’t want to get dragged down with these guys.

That’s highly possible. He needs to come forth and speak out if that’s the case. He could volunteer to testify before one of the impeachment committees.

143
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:01:30pm

re: #142 Patricia Kayden

That’s highly possible. He needs to come forth and speak out if that’s the case. He could volunteer to testify before one of the impeachment committees.

They should definitely subpoena him.

144
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:03:42pm
145
garzooma  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:03:44pm

re: #142 Patricia Kayden

That’s highly possible. He needs to come forth and speak out if that’s the case. He could volunteer to testify before one of the impeachment committees.

Or we can just wait for Trump to go after him, thus confirming that Bolton said it.

146
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:05:19pm
147
Ace-o-aces  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:05:33pm

re: #141 Semper Fi

Apparently. Nice to know limits exist.

Let’s be clear, this doesn’t mean we have to like him now.

148
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:06:11pm
149
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:06:47pm

Great article by Chait

150
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:08:13pm

re: #147 Ace-o-aces

Let’s be clear, this doesn’t mean we have to like him now.

Oh God no. I mean I’m glad not everyone was going along but this doesn’t change Bolton being a birther, Islamaphobe, supporting foreign policy that would be destructive, etc.

151
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:08:54pm

re: #150 HappyWarrior

152
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:10:03pm

re: #126 jaunte

Breaking the Too Shady For John Bolton barrier.

Bolton’s a warmonger, not a traitor.

153
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:10:36pm

re: #151 jaunte

[Embedded content]

I’m just glad it’s Trump and not kids. Unfortunately Bolton being the least fucked up actor in this mess is what the usual suspects like Greenwald will use to discredit it.

154
Rightwingconspirator  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:11:17pm

re: #43 Charles Johnson

Why is it so hard to come up with a name that rolls off the tongue like “Watergate?”…

Because at this extreme there are no words to describe…

155
De Kolta Chair  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:11:26pm

156
Barefoot Grin  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:15:09pm

I guess Mulvaney makes sense. What else is he going to do all day? He’s already wrecked the other institutions he nominally heads.

157
NO SMOCKING GUN!  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:15:23pm

This is funny.

158
plansbandc  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:15:51pm

re: #10 Shiplord Kirel, Friend of Moose and Squirrel

My favorite.

159
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:16:30pm
160
makeitstop  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:17:54pm

Me too

161
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:18:23pm
162
NO SMOCKING GUN!  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:18:49pm

re: #160 makeitstop

[Embedded content]

Me too

Reagan did drug deals, so why not?

163
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:18:54pm

re: #160 makeitstop

[Embedded content]

Me too

Oh definitely. Nothing will shock me about this administration anymore.

164
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:19:17pm

re: #162 NO SMOCKING GUN!

Reagan did drug deals, so why not?

Exactly.

165
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:20:54pm

166
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:22:05pm

So Patton Oswalt who grew up near here cut an ad for my State Senate candidate.

167
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:22:16pm

re: #165 jaunte

[Embedded content]

That’s a winner.

168
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:23:38pm
169
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:24:01pm

170
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:25:07pm

re: #107 Sherlock Hound

QuidPourquoi

I may be late with this …

Quid potpourris .

171
HappyWarrior  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:25:28pm

re: #168 gocart mozart

[Embedded content]

She deserves justice.

172
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:26:41pm

173
The Ghost of a Flea  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:27:41pm

re: #152 Belafon

Bolton’s a warmonger, not a traitor.

Well, except for that one time when he was in on pushing the nation into a war on faked intelligence.

174
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:29:54pm
175
Deep State SuperElite Satinist  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:31:47pm

re: #160 makeitstop

rosaclaire -
At this point, I’m willing to believe there is an actual drug deal.

Rudy Giuliani was a million-dollar lobbyist for Perdue Pharma, after all ….

176
goddamnedfrank  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:32:59pm
177
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:33:10pm

re: #173 The Ghost of a Flea

Well, except for that one time when he was in on pushing the nation into a war on faked intelligence.

I feel like we’re arguing about infinities here. I’m going to call Bolton’s aleph-zero. Trump is aleph-one.

178
mmmirele  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:36:56pm

Holy crap this testimony!

Fiona Hill, the White House’s former top Russia adviser, told impeachment investigators on Monday that Rudolph W. Giuliani, the president’s personal lawyer, ran a shadow foreign policy in Ukraine that circumvented U.S. officials and career diplomats in order to personally benefit President Trump, according to a person familiar with her testimony.

*snip*

In a closed-door session that lasted roughly 10 hours, Hill told lawmakers that she confronted Gordon Sondland, the U.S. ambassador to the European Union, about Giuliani’s activities which, she testified, were not coordinated with the officials responsible for carrying out U.S. foreign policy, this person said on the condition of anonymity to disclose details of her deposition.

*snip*

“Rudy Giuliani has clearly been a leading force for the administration in defining a shadow foreign policy in Ukraine,” Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-Md.) told reporters after emerging from Hill’s testimony, though he declined to say whether Hill testified to that effect. “There was an official foreign policy, which was attempting to counter corruption in Ukraine, and then there was Rudy Giuliani and the gang that couldn’t shoot straight who worked for him, who were involved precisely [in] connecting with corruption in Ukraine and promoting corruption in Ukraine.”

washingtonpost.com

179
DodgerFan1988  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:38:19pm
180
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:41:33pm
181
jaunte  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:43:54pm
182
The Ghost of a Flea  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:44:53pm

re: #179 DodgerFan1988

Bolton is Lawful Evil and the Trumpies are Chaotic Evil.

It’s not so much being the voice of reason as a continuation of the Blood War.

183
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:47:01pm

It
Is
Only
Monday

184
mmmirele  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:52:59pm

re: #183 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀

It
Is
Only
Monday

And for some of us, it was a holiday!

185
sagehen  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:57:41pm

Does Bolton have the juice to persuade a dozen R senators to convict Trump?

186
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 14, 2019 • 8:59:21pm

I’m reminded of Chris Hedges talking to East German dissidents in the first week of November 1989 and he asked for their consensus when the wall would open.

Their most optimistic prediction was probably five years in the future.

The wall fell on November 9, 1989…

187
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:00:17pm
188
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:06:20pm

re: #185 sagehen

Does Bolton have the juice to persuade a dozen R senators to convict Trump?

Likely not
But, good chance Putin has sufficient kompromat to convince a crap load of R senators to acquit Trump.

189
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:08:51pm
190
Ace Rothstein  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:14:12pm

These infrastructure weeks get better and better.

191
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:15:09pm

re: #183 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀

It
Is
Only
Monday

Monfriday

192
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:17:27pm

Since every day ends in day, Trump is just inserting fri in the middle.

193
gocart mozart  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:17:54pm
194
Belafon  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:18:40pm

re: #193 gocart mozart

Context?

195
Hecuba's daughter  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:19:30pm

re: #173 The Ghost of a Flea

Well, except for that one time when he was in on pushing the nation into a war on faked intelligence.

That’s still being a warmonger, not a traitor. Bolton wasn’t doing it to benefit himself financially or to promote an adversary like Russia. He really believed that the right strategy was to remove Saddam Hussein from power and he didn’t care that the rationale was false.

It was puzzling why he joined this administration in the first place unless he thought Trump was merely an ignoramus that he could control and mold as he saw fit; for some reason he did not understand that Trump was a Russian asset who had no loyalty to this nation. Bolton isn’t stupid; how could he be so naive?

196
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:20:46pm

After consideration, and looking over all the suggestions everyone has come up with, I’me changing my suggested name from “The Octopus” to “The Trumpnado.” His name has to be attached to it, and it seems the revelations are going to just keep coming.

(Why is it that every time I schedule a vacation, another storm breaks? I’m going to Italy next week, and I was looking forward to unplugging from the news for a while. Can’t do it now….)

197
Yeah Sure WhatEVs  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:21:46pm

re: #195 Hecuba’s daughter

That’s still being a warmonger, not a traitor. Bolton wasn’t doing it to benefit himself financially or to promote an adversary like Russia. He really believed that the right strategy was to remove Saddam Hussein from power and he didn’t care that the rationale was false.

It was puzzling why he joined this administration in the first place unless he thought Trump was merely an ignoramus that he could control and mold as he saw fit; for some reason he did not understand that Trump was a Russian asset who had no loyalty to this nation. Bolton isn’t stupid; how could he be so naive?

Or, alternately, Bolton thought he could talk trump into bombing everyone Bolton wants to bomb.

198
Ace Rothstein  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:24:36pm

re: #194 Belafon

The Hong Kong support by Rockets’ GM Darryl Morey, I assume.

199
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:25:23pm

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Wait until this gets mentioned on Fox & Friends tomorrow morning
A certain someone will have a manic episode

200
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:31:38pm
201
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:53:15pm

I leave for a couple hours and shit goes sideways.

202
DodgerFan1988  Oct 14, 2019 • 9:53:31pm

Conservatives taking advantage of an ABC News error and using it to deny Kurds are being massacred. There is no bottom for these lowlifes.

203
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:00:59pm

OMG, they used stock footage in a story.

204
Targetpractice  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:07:08pm
205
Hecuba's daughter  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:17:40pm

re: #202 DodgerFan1988

[Embedded content]

Conservatives taking advantage of an ABC News error and using it to deny Kurds are being massacred. There is no bottom for these lowlifes.

ABC did apologize as soon as they realized their error but unfortunately conservatives will seize on a single mistake to discredit an entire story or media organizations while conservatives are free to lie and lie again without any apparent consequences.

People do make errors but conservatives deliberately and repeatedly mislead — they unabashedly promote “alternative facts” and “truth is not truth” — phrases they coined and used in public. And the zombie masses who follow Trump bow their heads and blindly accept these concepts.

206
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:34:29pm

big quake. things fell.

207
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:35:32pm

Not so big quake up here (east bay). Nothing fell yet. Where are you?

208
dog philosopher ஐஒஔ௸  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:35:39pm

YOW!!

earthquake tremor in the east bay!

209
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:36:09pm

re: #207 A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!

Not so big quake up here (east bay). Nothing fell yet. Where are you?

Concord area.

210
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:38:48pm

M 4.5

211
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:39:27pm

I’m further south, in Berkeley. Some shaking, but nothing fell. (And I have a lot of stuff that could fall!)

212
Hecuba's daughter  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:42:05pm
213
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:42:13pm

Berkeley seismo lab is showing it between Concord and Walnut Creek, so you would be right on top of it, almost.

214
Hecuba's daughter  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:44:57pm

re: #211 A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!

I’m further south, in Berkeley. Some shaking, but nothing fell. (And I have a lot of stuff that could fall!)

Apparently 1 mile from Pleasant Hill, CA.

215
Ace-o-aces  Oct 14, 2019 • 10:50:59pm

re: #202 DodgerFan1988

216
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Oct 14, 2019 • 11:01:41pm

re: #213 A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!

M 4.5 - 1km SSE of Pleasant Hill, CA

217
Dr Lizardo  Oct 14, 2019 • 11:13:54pm

re: #88 Belafon

It’s not that. If we remove them, if Trump removes them, we’ve basically signaled the end of our support for Turkey. After that, why would we be there? And once it happens, why would Turkey stay with NATO rather than join Putin. And then you have a country leaving NATO. What happens after that?

I’m sure there’s an ambitious Lieutenant Colonel somewhere in the Turkish Army that looks at the Presidential Palace and says to himself, “You know, I’d very much like to live there”.

If Turkey tries to leave NATO, there will be an American-backed coup d’etat that will find Erdogan facing an impromptu firing squad, the Turkish Army taking over and martial law being declared. While it’s true that Erdogan has scoured the army and replaced its leadership with loyalists, it is impossible that he’s purged everyone from the army that doesn’t agree with him.

218
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 14, 2019 • 11:21:45pm

re: #216 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

M 4.5 - 1km SSE of Pleasant Hill, CA

[Embedded content]

So I’m about three times as far away from it as mcrab.

219
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 11:28:27pm

re: #218 A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!

So I’m about three times as far away from it as mcrab.

I’m about 3.6 miles away.

220
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 11:55:34pm

aftershock

221
Dread Pirate  Oct 14, 2019 • 11:56:19pm

It’s the aftershocks that fuck with your head.

222
goddamnedfrank  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:00:10am
223
Dread Pirate  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:19:59am
224
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Oct 15, 2019 • 2:06:05am
225
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Oct 15, 2019 • 2:22:48am

Very dry air down here in the corner of the country, so there are fire concerns growing as the week goes by:

226
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 2:57:01am

re: #215 Ace-o-aces

[Embedded content]

Or Jim himself with Darren Wilson. ABC fucked up but acknowledged it. That’s more than Jim or FNC or Trump ever does.

227
A Mom Anon  Oct 15, 2019 • 3:30:14am

I can’t keep up with you all, this place hops when the events of the day are a non stop shit show.

I am glad you all are here as some sort of anchor in the madness. I learn a lot from every thread on all kinds of topics. I wish I had more to offer and could be here more, but life is being a pain in the ass (and back and neck and so on). Today begins the arduous task of going through the basement and garage to prep for selling our home of 22 yrs in the coming months. My husband can no longer work, applying for disability is taking forever and we have to figure out what to do now. Husband’s 53rd birthday was yesterday, I’ll be 60 next year. I’m not sure what the hell starting over looks like at our age with no financial backup(long story, but there is literally NO retirement fund for us now, I am less than happy), but I am scared. It’s like we’re financially in our 20s but with lots better credit scores. I also have a son to think about as things roll forward. I’m tired of the stress and uncertainty. I know I’m not the only one going through shit either. It seems like there’s a pandemic of anger and sadness. And struggles.

I have hugs 🤗 if anyone wants one, coffee and pastries are on the table in the corner. The cinnamon rolls are my favorite….. ❤️

228
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 4:13:55am

re: #227 A Mom Anon

I can’t keep up with you all, this place hops when the events of the day are a non stop shit show.

I am glad you all are here as some sort of anchor in the madness. I learn a lot from every thread on all kinds of topics. I wish I had more to offer and could be here more, but life is being a pain in the ass (and back and neck and so on). Today begins the arduous task of going through the basement and garage to prep for selling our home of 22 yrs in the coming months. My husband can no longer work, applying for disability is taking forever and we have to figure out what to do now. Husband’s 53rd birthday was yesterday, I’ll be 60 next year. I’m not sure what the hell starting over looks like at our age with no financial backup(long story, but there is literally NO retirement fund for us now, I am less than happy), but I am scared. It’s like we’re financially in our 20s but with lots better credit scores. I also have a son to think about as things roll forward. I’m tired of the stress and uncertainty. I know I’m not the only one going through shit either. It seems like there’s a pandemic of anger and sadness. And struggles.

I have hugs 🤗 if anyone wants one, coffee and pastries are on the table in the corner. The cinnamon rolls are my favorite….. ❤️

I’m feeling disillusioned. I feel glass half full about getting rid of Trump but I’m more cynical about fixing it.

229
Dave In Austin  Oct 15, 2019 • 4:51:40am
230
Sufficient unto the day...  Oct 15, 2019 • 4:54:37am

zhaT2lfzPTxO1NmF3XkbewgHmbdHOyVpXqDavL93Bgjmcpkt43H4RRUaDkvUizTc

231
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 4:55:21am

re: #229 Dave In Austin

[Embedded content]

We didn’t hear about free speech with Kathy Griffin. Oh and video games are in fact blamed for shootings. I hate it but Meaghan McCain is right about this but I think it needs to be pointed out that this would never happen to an Obama or Biden rally.

232
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 4:56:09am

Don’t cry free speech when the administration is actively hostile to the spirit of the 1st amendment.

233
makeitstop  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:10:17am

re: #229 Dave In Austin

Thinking this video somehow will incite violence against media brands is no different than thinking Joker will lead to mass shootings or heavy metal music leads to satanic suicides or video games create mass shooters.

Don’t conservatives already say all those things? That’s a goddamn flimsy argument.

234
GlutenFreeJesus  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:11:06am

“The Red Scare”.

235
Thanos  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:11:49am

Since this is all about the calls, I’d go with “Trump’s Callmageddon”

236
makeitstop  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:12:48am
237
garzooma  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:19:21am

There was a piece in the NYT showing just how evil Giuliani is:

In 2014, Ukraine’s wildly corrupt president, Viktor Yanukovych, fled to Russia after mass protests on the Maidan, Kiev’s central square. During what Ukrainians call the Revolution of Dignity, police snipers killed dozens of demonstrators. In the revolution’s aftermath, a number of young idealists decided to plunge into politics, hoping to reform their troubled country from the inside. One of them was Serhiy Leshchenko, at the time perhaps the country’s most famous investigative journalist.[…]

Then Rudy Giuliani began attacking Leshchenko as a conspirator against America.

In 2016, Leshchenko had helped expose the “black ledger,” an accounting book of hundreds of pages found in Yanukovych’s former party headquarters. Among its many entries, it showed $12.7 million in secret payments to Paul Manafort. At the time, Manafort was running Donald Trump’s presidential campaign, but before that, he was one of Yanukovych’s most important advisers.

One of the reasons Manafort is in federal prison is that he failed to disclose or pay taxes on millions of dollars from Ukraine. But if you believe Giuliani, the black ledger was part of a plot to damage Trump.

During a Fox News appearance on May 10, Giuliani described the ledger as a “falsely created book” and Leshchenko as part of a group of “enemies of the president, in some cases enemies of the United States.” Last month, in an epic, ranting interview on CNN, he accused Ukraine’s leading anti-corruption organization, the Anti-Corruption Action Center, or AntAC, of developing “all of the dirty information that ended up being a false document that was created in order to incriminate Manafort.”

238
Thanos  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:19:46am

re: #235 Thanos

Since this is all about the calls, I’d go with “Trump’s Callmageddon”

most likely it’s going to end up being “Ukrainegate” however, it just takes one newscaster to say it.

239
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:28:02am

re: #237 garzooma

Wow!! No wonder he is refusing to testify before House Democrats. Let’s see if Lindsay is really stupid enough to call him to testify before the Senate. Senator Harris would chew him up and spit him out. He’s beyond sleazy. I’m glad that he’s being investigated by the FBI.

240
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:30:12am

re: #229 Dave In Austin

Odd argument for Miller to make given that Republicans (including Trump) continue to argue that video games lead to mass shootings.

241
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:32:15am

Good morning Lizards.

I sure didn’t expect to wake up to see the news that Bolton was going to be the torch holder of democracy.

May you live in interesting times

242
jeffreyw  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:33:09am

Good morning!

243
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:34:48am

re: #217 Dr Lizardo

I’m sure there’s an ambitious Lieutenant Colonel somewhere in the Turkish Army that looks at the Presidential Palace and says to himself, “You know, I’d very much like to live there”.

If Turkey tries to leave NATO, there will be an American-backed coup d’etat that will find Erdogan facing an impromptu firing squad, the Turkish Army taking over and martial law being declared. While it’s true that Erdogan has scoured the army and replaced its leadership with loyalists, it is impossible that he’s purged everyone from the army that doesn’t agree with him.

Imagine Trump trying to pull that off.

244
makeitstop  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:35:12am

re: #238 Thanos

most likely it’s going to end up being “Ukrainegate” however, it just takes one newscaster to say it.

People seem to like ‘Moron Contra.’ On Twitter this morning it’s popped up a few times.

245
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:40:50am

Pull the string and I’ll wink at you, I’m your puppet
I’ll do funny things if you want me to, I’m your puppet
I’m yours to have and to hold
Darling you’ve got full control of your puppet
Pull another string and I’ll kiss your lips, I’m your puppet
Snap your finger and I’ll turn you some flips, I’m your puppet
Listen, your every wish is my command
All you gotta do is wiggle your little hand
I’m your puppet, I’m your puppet
I’m just a toy, just a funny boy
That makes you laugh when you’re blue
I’ll be wonderful, do just what I’m told
I’ll do anything for you
I’m your puppet, I’m your puppet
Pull them little strings and I’ll sing you a song, I’m your puppet
Make me do right or make me do wrong, I’m your puppet
Treat me good and I’ll do anything
I’m just a puppet and you hold my string, I’m your puppet
Darling, darling, pull the strings, let me sing you a song any day
I’m your puppet baby, you can sing for me all night long
Honey, yeah

246
NO SMOCKING GUN!  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:42:23am

re: #244 makeitstop

People seem to like ‘Moron Contra.’ On Twitter this morning it’s popped up a few times.

I like “whatever drug deal Rudy and Mulvaney cooked up”

247
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:48:36am

American Media and the National Enquirer tabloid newspaper shredded sensitive documents about Donald Trump shortly before the 2016 election, the reporter Ronan Farrow alleges in a book published on Tuesday.

On CNN on Monday morning, Farrow said the safe contained details of alleged consensual affairs and payoffs and also allegations of assault by Jill Harth, who in a 1997 complaint accused Trump of “attempted ‘rape’”. In October 2016, amid a flood of allegations of sexual misconduct by Trump, she stood by that allegation in an interview with the Guardian.

An excerpt of that book published in Esquire last week said 43 women were making new allegations of inappropriate sexual behaviour by Trump.

theguardian.com

Won’t stop Franky Graham Cracker and the Pulpit Pimps from saying that Trump is Gawd’s Man!

248
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:49:59am

re: #246 NO SMOCKING GUN!

How is telling an aide to report your concerns to White House lawyers heroic? Shouldn’t Bolton have reported his concerns outside of the White House? White House lawyers are there to protect Trump.

249
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:52:34am

re: #246 NO SMOCKING GUN!

I like “whatever drug deal Rudy and Mulvaney cooked up”

[Embedded content]

250
NO SMOCKING GUN!  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:55:03am

re: #248 Patricia Kayden

How is telling an aide to report your concerns to White House lawyers heroic? Shouldn’t Bolton have reported his concerns outside of the White House? White House lawyers are there to protect Trump.

You are correct, but the tweet is damn funny. One of the fascinating aspects of Stupid Watergate is that Trump is so ignorant he hired Bolton as his NSA because he saw Bolton on Fox News a lot even though Bolton’s foreign policy goals were completely anithetical to Trump’s, who just wants to make corrupt deals.

251
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:56:05am

Greets and saluts from the most fucked up multiverse we’ve yet encountered where John ‘bomb ‘em all’ Bolton found something too distasteful and incompetent to get in the way of his plans to bomb the Middle East and needed to have his underlings go to the lawyers to tell them that everything has gone sideways.

Bolton’s not the hero we want, and he’s not a hero, but he’s the only one who apparently realizes that there are lines that you are not supposed to cross - namely conspiring with foreign powers to interfere in US elections.

It’s a pretty low fucking bar, but there it is.

Everyone in Trump’s inner circle is complicit, compromised, and criminal. Everyone. Mulvaney is directly implicated by Bolton. Pompeo. Perry. Pence. Trump.

All of them. There are now and never have been adults in the room in Trumpworld. We wouldn’t be in this mess had there been anyone smart enough to realize that this was illegal and criminal and that you shouldn’t do this stuff.

Never mind Trump blowing up US Middle East policy and throwing our allies the Kurds to the wolves in Turkey and Syria. Trump handed Syria back to Russia on a gold leafed plate.

252
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:58:27am
253
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:58:42am

Nyt does it in one sentence

“President Trump’s acquiescence to Turkey’s move to send troops deep inside Syrian territory has in only one week’s time turned into a bloody carnage, forced the abandonment of a successful five-year-long American project to keep the peace on a volatile border, and given an unanticipated victory to four American adversaries: Russia, Iran, the Syrian government and the Islamic State.”

254
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:00:36am
255
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:06:00am

re: #254 jaunte

Cue the fall of Saigon.

Because that’s the equivalent of what Trump has done. He’s enabled and encouraged Russia, Turkey, and Assad to slaughter our allies the Kurds and fill the vacuum Trump leaves in his wake.

The ethnic cleansing is on Trump.
The displacement is on Trump.

Losing our strategic position is on Trump.
This entire shitshow is on Trump.

256
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:06:14am

“Thanks for abandoning that base to the Russians. Now build another one.”

257
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:08:15am

re: #254 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Disgraceful

258
Dave In Austin  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:11:22am
259
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:17:04am

Tulsi’s threat to boycott has fallen through:

260
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:18:12am

re: #259 Belafon

The only place she should be is in the crowd. She’s backed by GOP ratfuckers and is an Assad apologist. Enough said.

261
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:18:15am

Cat break.

262
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:19:58am
263
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:22:43am

re: #258 Dave In Austin

Barr is using Christianity as a cloak to cover up his protection of a corrupt, racist, dangerous regime. There is nothing Christ-like about his behavior or the behavior of the odious president he’s protecting. Who is he fooling? He simply wants to force his brand of rightwing Christianity on a secular democracy.

264
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:24:38am

re: #258 Dave In Austin

265
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:32:03am

Max Boot wrote yesterday……. “Most of the time, the costs of the Trump presidency are inchoate — laws are broken, norms transgressed. But when it came to immigrant children in cages or Kurds in the line of fire, the costs are all too human and horrifying. Are you happy now, Trump supporters? Is all this worth a corporate tax cut?”

266
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:32:23am
267
Yeah Sure WhatEVs  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:32:34am

Speaking broadly, the whole trump thing is “Lieapalooza” but there are so many tentacles of lawlessness it’s hard to come up with a single “Gate”.

Octoscandal. Nah, too cerebral.

The NeverEnding Scandals. Well, yeah, duh. Maybe put a fluffy white beast around it.

Biggest Criminal Enterprise in US history. Nah, too big.

So many options.

268
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:37:46am

re: #265 DangerMan

Max Boot wrote yesterday……. “Most of the time, the costs of the Trump presidency are inchoate — laws are broken, norms transgressed. But when it came to immigrant children in cages or Kurds in the line of fire, the costs are all too human and horrifying. Are you happy now, Trump supporters? Is all this worth a corporate tax cut?”

MAGATS will respond…yes because of the judges he’s packing the courts with!

269
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:41:58am

I meant to do this yesterday at home, where I can copy the picture, but I forgot, but CBS has done an analysis of the delegates from the beginning of the primaries up until Super Tuesday, and the delegate totals for the candidates are:

Warren: 720
Biden: 577
Sanders: 159
O’Rourke: 30
Klobuchar: 5
Buttegeig: 3

270
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:42:22am

re: #75 retired cynic

If Watergate, the hotel, named the entire Nixon mess, why not just call this one after DT’s favorite getaway, Mar-a-lago?

I do love some of those others, ‘though! Crackpot Dome, Stupid Watergate, Moron Contra. But they are clever. There ain’t nothin’ clever about DT’s messes. They are bludgeons!

(Have been gone for five days at a convention. We all deliberately refused to talk about the ongoing garbage, but driving home we just sank back into it with fury.)

Mar-a-lagate?

271
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:43:32am
272
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:44:01am
273
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:51:42am

Rand Paul, corrupt weasel.

274
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:53:22am

re: #272 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Trump didn’t write that. No way…..excoriated? C’mon…..

275
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:55:01am

Trump is forcing Republicans to actively defend corruption.

276
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:55:04am

re: #273 jaunte

RAND PAUL: If we’re going to investigate Giuliani, then we should investigate Hunter Biden

Hunter Biden is the “both sides” argument that they are trying to keep afloat on.

277
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:55:33am

…and how corrupt do you have to be to participate in that?

278
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:55:52am

re: #275 jaunte

Trump is forcing Republicans to actively defend corruption.

But will that hurt them politically more than impeaching Trump?

He is counting on them just acquiescing.

279
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:56:25am

re: #276 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Don’t mention Ivanka/Jared!!!

280
jeffreyw  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:56:26am

I think you are all overthinking this naming thing. It’s Trump’s Treason. In years to come the name of Trump will elicit the same understanding to Americans that the mention of Benedict Arnold does today. In the old joke, a Brit takes Arnold’s name to mean hero. In the future the joke will be Russians saying the same about Trump.
That analogy does fall apart if you look too closely. Arnold was a competent general.

281
Rightwingconspirator  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:56:45am

re: #273 jaunte

What the current Republican excuse machine cannot withstand here is a simple “Follow the evidence” standard. Hence the ginned up conspiracies and evidence-free allegations. Follow the evidence is why Mueller was doing the right thing, the Iranian repayments were the right thing, Vince Foster really did kill himself without any “help”, they got nothing on the Bidens.

Maybe the loss of reality checks in the public mindset is a key factor.

282
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 6:58:01am

Thread:

283
Mike Lamb  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:01:05am

re: #273 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Rand Paul, corrupt weasel.

Rand’s response had plenty of angle, but not quite enough bargle.

284
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:04:36am
285
Interesting Times  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:14:29am

I approve this message:

286
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:15:01am

re: #284 Belafon

It’s easier to understand Trump’s view on the Kurds if you assume he genuinely cannot understand why you would ever want to help anyone else unless that person has something you need right now have read the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition

287
makeitstop  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:18:22am

re: #270 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Mar-a-lagate?

I still like ‘Mar-A-Larceny.’

288
danarchy  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:24:21am

re: #258 Dave In Austin

[Embedded content]

50 nukes? Are you talking about Inserlik, pretty sure those are still well under our control.

289
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:24:55am

Meanwhile on this chilly and foggy morning, Apple wants me to make my iphone experience faster and more delightful by upgrading to OS 13. Still passing…

290
makeitstop  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:33:57am
291
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:36:05am

re: #290 makeitstop

[Embedded content]

Where’s The Gong Show when you really need it?

292
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:37:13am

re: #290 makeitstop

Memo to Trump staff:

This is your future.

you already have a snake in your boot

293
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:42:41am

re: #290 makeitstop

This is why I stopped watching network TV

294
CleverToad  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:43:30am

re: #227 A Mom Anon

Hugs back, and a whole lotta sympathy on the pack-up after 22 years. Have been in my house 30 years, and the thought gives me chills down the spine. Also on the no-savings part, and the spouse in pain, and the figuring out how to start over in midlife, which all sound painfully familiar just now.

Cinnamon rolls sound good, though. Hang in there.

295
Mescalero09  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:43:47am

re: #290 makeitstop

Mitt Romney: Please clap.
Sean Spicer: Please vote for me.

296
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:43:59am

re: #293 Joe Bacon 🌹

This is why I stopped watching network TV

I have not owned a working TV set since spring of 2013…

297
danarchy  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:48:11am

re: #295 Mescalero09

Mitt Romney: Please clap.
Sean Spicer: Please vote for me.

Wasn’t that Jeb?

298
Dave In Austin  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:52:08am

re: #288 danarchy

50 nukes? Are you talking about Inserlik, pretty sure those are still well under our control.

Yeah, but they should have been removed long ago. Congressman said they are basics hostages at this point

299
Dave In Austin  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:54:31am

re: #289 A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!

Don’t do it. It’s trash

300
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 7:57:48am
301
(((Viking Sea Mexican)))  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:03:04am

re: #269 Belafon

I meant to do this yesterday at home, where I can copy the picture, but I forgot, but CBS has done an analysis of the delegates from the beginning of the primaries up until Super Tuesday, and the delegate totals for the candidates are:

Warren: 720
Biden: 577
Sanders: 159
O’Rourke: 30
Klobuchar: 5
Buttegeig: 3

If Biden can dry up the Bernie crowd, that would be a plus for whoever wins.

302
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:03:10am

re: #285 Interesting Times

they went from conservative to reactionary to flat out regressive in the course of a decade or so.

303
Teukka  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:06:49am

304
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:07:25am

Most of the scandals that got their own names got them because they had easily identifiable pieces. Watergate was the hotel. Teapot Dome was the location. Iran-Contra was also self-explanatory.

In that vein, the best name for this whole ordeal should be:

The Trump Criminal Conspiracy

305
Joe Bacon 🌹  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:07:44am

306
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:08:31am

re: #300 Patricia Kayden

[Embedded content]

One odd thing about that Bulgarian soccer flap: it’s quite ironic (to say the least) to see English managers complaining about “football hooligans” - and being in the right for once….

307
plansbandc  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:11:17am
308
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:18:44am

re: #301 (((Viking Sea Mexican)))

If Biden can dry up the Bernie crowd, that would be a plus for whoever wins.

This is going to sound stupidly punditly but…

There’s going to be two things I’d be watching for at the debate tonight. One is Bernie’s appearance, does he look healthy after his heart attack? Or did it take a toll on him? The other is how Biden deals with the fake Ukraine scandal.

I’ve got this strange feeling that this may be a spot where the dynamic of the race really shifts. I think Warren is probably already the frontrunner, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see Sanders and Biden slip and open the door for someone in the second tier to ascend.

309
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:25:28am
310
Teukka  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:25:47am
311
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:31:56am

re: #267 Yeah Sure WhatEVs

Speaking broadly, the whole trump thing is “Lieapalooza” but there are so many tentacles of lawlessness it’s hard to come up with a single “Gate”.

Octoscandal. Nah, too cerebral.

The NeverEnding Scandals. Well, yeah, duh. Maybe put a fluffy white beast around it.

Biggest Criminal Enterprise in US history. Nah, too big.

So many options.

i’m settling on ‘the trump administration’
covers it all

312
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:32:08am

re: #310 Teukka

Trump’s action, by removing US troops from Syria, has resulted in a domino fall of epic proportions that hits at the fundamentals of NATO.

Trump gave Turkey green light to go after the Kurds in Syria and Turkey. Trump green lights ethnic cleansing. Trump threatens sanctions against Turkey (because of course; impose penalties on doing exactly what Trump said/telegraphed Turkey should do).

Meanwhile, a host of EU/NATO countries are slapping Turkey for the ethnic cleansing, including halting military exports to Turkey.

Putin couldn’t be happier by this turn of events. Every last thing Trump has done has benefited not the US in the slightest, but delivered benefits to Russia and our rivals/enemies.

So, when Trump says he’s bringing our troops home from Syria, that too is a lie, when he’s redirecting an even bigger number to go to Saudi Arabia, which is further away than Syria, and to defend the mullahs who have spent decades exporting terrorists who threaten their regime (and the US - including over our presence in Saudi Arabia itself). There’s so much cognitive dissonance with Trump that his know nothing supporters can’t hardly keep up with the argle bargle. And GOPers in Congress are left acting like sputtering morons (well, they are; unless they’re complicit and criminal) trying to defend Trump’s actions that leave the US far worse off and more insecure than before Trump took office.

313
Teukka  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:33:01am

re: #309 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

My fave is the original definition of Sodomy (Eze 16:49-50):

“ ’Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen.
Verse 51 and 52 are pretty nice disses too.

Samaria did not commit half the sins you did. You have done more detestable things than they, and have made your sisters seem righteous by all these things you have done. Bear your disgrace, for you have furnished some justification for your sisters. Because your sins were more vile than theirs, they appear more righteous than you. So then, be ashamed and bear your disgrace, for you have made your sisters appear righteous.

314
Mescalero09  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:34:50am

re: #297 danarchy

Thought Mitt, you may be correct. So much pathetic. Hard to keep track.

315
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:36:08am

re: #314 Mescalero09

Thought Mitt, you may be correct.

It was Jeb. “Low energy Jeb”

316
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:36:15am

re: #312 lawhawk

And GOPers in Congress are left acting like sputtering morons (well, they are; unless they’re complicit and criminal) trying to defend Trump’s actions …

¿Por que no los dos?

317
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:37:29am

re: #273 jaunte

is guiliani in the government or not?
working for state or not?
trumps ‘personal attorney’ or not?
what is hunter biden to this admin? (but please, go ‘investigate’ if you want)

PS: it is actually quite conventional thinking to have, at the board of directors level, people who don’t know anything specific about the business. they have no preconceived notions, no industry prejudices or baked in thinking, and may be able to make decisions more soberly and objectively.

318
Mescalero09  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:38:41am

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

319
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:38:56am

re: #317 DangerMan

PS: it is actually quite conventional thinking to have, at the board of directors level, people who don’t know anything specific about the business. they have no preconceived notions, no industry prejudices or baked in thinking, and may be able to make decisions more soberly and objectively.

QFT

320
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:39:10am

re: #281 Rightwingconspirator

What the current Republican excuse machine cannot withstand here is a simple “Follow the evidence” standard. Hence the ginned up conspiracies and evidence-free allegations. Follow the evidence is why Mueller was doing the right thing, the Iranian repayments were the right thing, Vince Foster really did kill himself without any “help”, they got nothing on the Bidens.

Maybe the loss of reality checks in the public mindset is a key factor.

they’re not even trying to go after any of the evidence
just the witnesses and the process

321
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:40:14am

From Judd Legum’s Popular Information newsletter:

Welcome to Popular Information, a newsletter about politics and power — written by me, Judd Legum.

On Wednesday, Popular Information reported that Facebook was punishing a small Alaskan public radio station for publishing “clickbait.” The “clickbait” was actually a detailed report on a complex local ballot initiative. The station appealed Facebook’s decision, but its appeal was rejected.

But after Popular Information’s report, Facebook reexamined the decision, acknowledged it made “errors” in the application of its policy and rescinded the punishment.

Popular Information’s recent reporting has also spurred a national discussion on Facebook’s political advertising policies. You can read about it in this New York Times column, which credits Popular Information’s work.

This is the power of independent accountability journalism.

322
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:45:39am

re: #309 lawhawk

LOL

323
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:45:53am

re: #309 lawhawk

Why is Rubio using his official twitter account to post Bible verses? Could Rep Omar do the same with Koranic texts? I strongly doubt it.

324
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:47:19am

Wow, speak of visual revolution!

Kehinde Wiley’s Contemporary Counterpoint to Old Confederate Monuments Unveiled in Times Square, goes to ThisIsColossal. The sculpture is magnificent.

325
Interesting Times  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:47:35am

Now would be a great time to do this, given that Facebook’s idiotic and biased GOPer-enabling policies are under scrutiny/fire:

326
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:48:13am

re: #323 Patricia Kayden

Why is Rubio using his official twitter account to post Bible verses? Could Rep Omar do the same with Koranic texts? I strongly doubt it.

She should find something that matches the Bible, publish the Koran location, and then reply to the tweet with the Bible location.

327
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:50:38am

re: #323 Patricia Kayden

Why is Rubio using his official twitter account to post Bible verses? Could Rep Omar do the same with Koranic texts? I strongly doubt it.

It’s technically his personal account. He’s got one called @SenRubioPress that is his “official” account and then another one for campaign stuff @TeamMarco

Of course, he posts a lot of official sounding statements on his personal account, so, yeah…

And I’m guessing Omar could, though the reactions from the regressive right would be nasty. I suspect that Marco constantly posting bible verses is his way of trying to get the alligator to eat him last.

328
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:51:49am

re: #319 retired cynic

QFT

thx

it’s also a common problem at the ‘small business’ level.

- someone has a job - plumber, electrician, landscaper, customs broker, whatever.
- and thinks he can run a company that does that work better than his boss
- so he wants to start his own

time and again, i’ve seen it. doesnt understand that running a company that does that work has nothing to do with doing that work

he knows some - not even most of the operational aspects - ie installing sinks.
doesnt know anything about marketing, promotion, scheduling, finance, accounting, compliance, licenses, administration, and on and on.

so i say “open your own company you’ll go from working for an idiot to working for a moron”

329
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:52:21am

re: #325 Interesting Times

Now would be a great time to do this, given that Facebook’s idiotic and biased GOPer-enabling policies are under scrutiny/fire:

[Embedded content]

I suspect it’s mostly a case of the generals fighting the last war.

Digital ads are the future, I suspect.

330
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:53:59am

re: #327 KGxvi

It’s technically his personal account. He’s got one called @SenRubioPress that is his “official” account and then another one for campaign stuff @TeamMarco

Of course, he posts a lot of official sounding statements on his personal account, so, yeah…

And I’m guessing Omar could, though the reactions from the regressive right would be nasty. I suspect that Marco constantly posting bible verses is his way of trying to get the alligator to eat him last.

I find his faux piety exhausting.

331
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:54:11am

re: #329 KGxvi

I suspect it’s mostly a case of the generals fighting the last war.

Digital ads are the future, I suspect.

The only one that gets it is Warren.

332
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:54:48am

re: #330 HappyWarrior

I find his faux piety exhausting.

There should be a Bible verse somewhere about thinking that tweeting verses will keep you out of Hell.

333
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:55:35am

re: #331 Belafon

The only one that gets it is Warren.

Warren has some savvy people advising her. Biden and Bernie are still living in the pre Trump political environment imo.

334
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:55:52am

re: #331 Belafon

The only one that gets it is Warren.

AOC gets it but she is too young to run

335
Eventual Carrion  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:55:59am

re: #323 Patricia Kayden

Why is Rubio using his official twitter account to post Bible verses? Could Rep Omar do the same with Koranic texts? I strongly doubt it.

THIS right here!

336
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:56:34am

re: #330 HappyWarrior

I find his faux piety exhausting.

I find him entirely exhausting. I honestly had hope for him early on and thought he could have been the young moderating voice the GOP needed. But he’s such a spineless hack that I just want him to go the fuck away.

337
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:56:49am

re: #335 Eventual Carrion

THIS right here!

Or even a Jewish representative.

338
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:57:08am

re: #330 HappyWarrior

I find his faux piety exhausting.

he’s my senator (as it were)
i ignore him
it’s quite liberating

339
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:57:19am

re: #336 KGxvi

I find him entirely exhausting. I honestly had hope for him early on and thought he could have been the young moderating voice the GOP needed. But he’s such a spineless hack that I just want him to go the fuck away.

He has zero principles at all.

340
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:58:42am

Meet The Harpy Eagle, A Bird So Big, Some People Think It’s A Person In A Costume, goes to BoredPanda. I showed these images at the convention over the weekend, and the photo of the talons caused gasps and shrieks. Wingspan 7’4”, but weigh less than 20 pounds.

341
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:58:56am

re: #338 DangerMan

he’s my senator (as it were)
i ignore him
it’s quite liberating

I imagine so. I just wish he would stfu and stop trying to act like he’s this moral person because he knows scripture. He sells out immigrant communities to appease his party’s bigoted waste and then brags about his family story.

342
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 8:59:41am

re: #334 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

AOC gets it but she is too young to run

AOC’s use of social media is different from what a presidential campaign should be doing. They should be running “promoted” posts on FB, Insta, Twitter, Snapchat, and whatever other platforms they can find. AOC’s use is more bypassing the traditional media to speak directly to voters. There’s a place for that, and tbf that’s how most campaigns are using twitter, but that doesn’t help much if people aren’t retweeting/spreading the word. The paid digital ads gets your message directly in front of people outside the bubble.

343
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:00:53am

Biden imo lives in the world where Republicans are just people we disagree with. Bernie sees it as just plutocrats versus workers.

344
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:01:11am

re: #340 retired cynic

Meet The Harpy Eagle, A Bird So Big, Some People Think It’s A Person In A Costume, goes to BoredPanda. I showed these images at the convention over the weekend, and the photo of the talons caused gasps and shrieks. Wingspan 7’4”, but weigh less than 20 pounds.

[Embedded content]

Ok, I’m going to need at least 6 of those. Can they be trained to attack? Because that’s where the “at least” part comes in.

345
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:01:22am

re: #333 HappyWarrior

Warren has some savvy people advising her. Biden and Bernie are still living in the pre Trump political environment imo.

Good presidents can be deterimined in part by the people they surround themselves with during the campaign.

346
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:02:30am
347
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:04:40am

re: #345 Belafon

Good presidents can be deterimined in part by the people they surround themselves with during the campaign.

Why I’ll never be sold on Bernie. I dislike his advisers and surrogates. Obama had quality people like the two Daves.

348
Dave In Austin  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:08:30am

re: #327 KGxvi

Dominionists………… Camel’s nose under the tent.

349
Eric The Fruit Bat  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:08:35am

re: #340 retired cynic

Yikes! That’s not a flying cat, that’s a flying Mountain Lion….

350
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:09:14am

re: #343 HappyWarrior

Biden imo lives in the world where Republicans are just people we disagree with. Bernie sees it as just plutocrats versus workers.

Biden has that lawyerly mentality of “we might disagree but we can have dinner on Friday” which, generally speaking, is a good thing. But it doesn’t fit the world we live in because that mentality is based on all parties acting in good faith.

Bernie is just more worn over populism. And fuck populism.

351
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:09:37am

re: #337 HappyWarrior

re: #335 Eventual Carrion

THIS right here!

Or even a Jewish representative.

Naaah, Jews get a pass because “People Of The Book” or whatever (and overt antisemitism like that is still - more-or-less - considered rude).

Muslims, OTOH? Rep. Omar could tweet a verse as innocuous as “Allah wishes you a nice day” and it would probably generate a shrieking shitnado of Islamophobic bile: replete with inapt references to “Shariah Law!” “Beheadings!”, “Stonings!” “Clitorectomies!”, etc….

352
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:09:58am

To me, HRC 2016 was better than HRC 2008 since her team was more diverse in thought. Gone were Mark Penn who is just about one of the worst campaign people I’ve seen for a Democratic presidential contender.

353
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:10:32am

re: #350 KGxvi

Biden has that lawyerly mentality of “we might disagree but we can have dinner on Friday” which, generally speaking, is a good thing. But it doesn’t fit the world we live in because that mentality is based on all parties acting in good faith.

Bernie is just more worn over populism. And fuck populism.

Precisely.

354
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:11:43am

re: #351 Jay C

Naaah, Jews get a pass because “People Of The Book” or whatever (and overt antisemitism like that is still - more-or-less - considered rude).

Muslims, OTOH? Rep. Omar could tweet a verse as innocuous as “Allah wishes you a nice day” and it would probably generate a shrieking shitnado of Islamophobic bile: replete with inapt references to “Shariah Law!” “Beheadings!”, “Stonings!” “Clitorectomies!”, etc….

True enough. We’ve never had any truly devout Jews in elected politics in the social media age tho. You’re right though. An Islamic blessing would have them raging.

355
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:12:27am

re: #347 HappyWarrior

Why I’ll never be sold on Bernie. I dislike his advisers and surrogates. Obama had quality people like the two Daves.

Bernie is TOO OLD.

He just had a heart attack ON THE CAMPAIGN and the election is still over a year out. If Sanders won, he would take office eight months before his EIGHTIETH BIRTHDAY. That would make him by far the oldest POTUS ever elected.

Honestly, if Bernie were younger I probably wouldn’t for him either because I consider him something of a one trick pony, but age is the big disqualifier here.

356
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:13:02am

re: #345 Belafon

Good presidents can be deterimined in part by the people they surround themselves with during the campaign.

another reason why ‘outsider’ candidates are not such a hot idea

it’s one thing (and a good thing) to surround yourself with smart people

if you’re too far ‘outside’ you probably won’t know enough insiders - ie politicos. not even people who even understand how ‘inside’ works.

and you’re not really in a position to evaluate or vet strangers / insiders as capable and appropriate for your agenda

357
mmmirele  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:13:23am

I don’t think this got posted, but remember how Hobby Lobby’s closely held company got fined for bringing in looted cuneiform tiles a few years ago for their “Museum of the Bible”?

Turns out that wasn’t the only thing they were looting.

Hobby Lobby Scandal Widens as Museum of the Bible Admits Oxford Prof Sold Illicit Papyri to Green Family

In June The Daily Beast reported on the possibility that an illustrious award-winning professor at the University of Oxford had sold an ancient fragment of the Gospel of Mark that did not belong to him to crafting giant Hobby Lobby, Inc.

At the time of purchase the Green family, the owners of Hobby Lobby, planned to donate the fragments to Museum of the Bible, the charitable organization and D.C.-based museum they founded. Statements released today by Museum of the Bible and the Egypt Exploration Society reveal that the Mark fragment was just the beginning of the scandal. Investigations have revealed that (so far) 13 pieces in the Museum’s collection are in fact the rightful property of the Oxford-based nonprofit Egypt Exploration Society.

The artifacts in question are all Bible and Bible-related fragments; 12 were written on papyrus and one on parchment. In other words, just the kinds of things that fit the Green Family and Museum of the Bible’s interests. They are part of the Oxyrhynchus Collection, a vast collection of fragments from ancient trash-piles in the city of Oxyrhynchus (modern Al-Bahnasa) in Egypt. The collection was excavated in the late 19th to early 20th centuries and most of it is now the property of the Egypt Exploration Society, which acts as curator of an Oxford-based collection.

thedailybeast.com

LOTS more at the link. The writer, Candida Moss, is a professor of ancient history at University of Birmingham and this is right in her wheelhouse.

358
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:13:44am

re: #349 Eric The Fruit Bat

Yikes! That’s not a flying cat, that’s a flying Mountain Lion….

I encountered a golden eagle out in Utah a few years back while it was feasting on some carrion.

It. Was. Huge. Unfortunately, I didn’t have a clear shot of it to photograph.

359
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:14:29am

re: #355 Eclectic Cyborg

Bernie is TOO OLD.

He just had a heart attack ON THE CAMPAIGN and the election is still over a year out. If Sanders won, he would take office eight months before his EIGHTIETH BIRTHDAY. That would make him by far the oldest POTUS ever elected.

Honestly, if Bernie were younger I probably wouldn’t for him either because I consider him something of a one trick pony, but age is the big disqualifier here.

Age is a disqualifier for me. I really don’t like his style at all. He’s stuck in the 30’s.

360
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:14:30am
361
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:17:20am

re: #343 HappyWarrior

Biden imo lives in the world where Republicans are just people we disagree with. Bernie sees it as just plutocrats versus workers.

He shouldn’t be, how many wingnuts have come to his defense over this Hunter deal?

362
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:18:37am

re: #356 DangerMan

another reason why ‘outsider’ candidates are not such a hot idea

it’s one thing (and a good thing) to surround yourself with smart people

if you’re too far ‘outside’ you probably won’t know enough insiders - ie politicos. not even people who even understand how ‘inside’ works.

and you’re not really in a position to evaluate or vet strangers / insiders as capable and appropriate for your agenda

I’m old enough to remember when “outsider” meant that the candidate had been a governor with no DC experience on their resume. And there’s a place for that in politics, DC seems to make navel gazing an airborne contagion.

The biggest problem for Trump is that he’s nowhere near a serious thinker. He has no big idea thoughts on how government should work, no guiding principles, no ideology. And that’s one of the reasons his administration has both been a disaster and at the same time not nearly as bad as it could have been.

363
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:19:17am

re: #361 b.d. (Lock Them Up!)

He shouldn’t be, how many wingnuts have come to his defense over this Hunter deal?

Exactly. And I think that’s why people get frustrated with him. He still lives in the Tip O’Neill-Reagan after 5:00 mythos. And as someone who was there for how Obama was treated, he outta know better.

364
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:21:19am

re: #362 KGxvi

I’m old enough to remember when “outsider” meant that the candidate had been a governor with no DC experience on their resume. And there’s a place for that in politics, DC seems to make navel gazing an airborne contagion.

The biggest problem for Trump is that he’s nowhere near a serious thinker. He has no big idea thoughts on how government should work, no guiding principles, no ideology. And that’s one of the reasons his administration has both been a disaster and at the same time not nearly as bad as it could have been.

It’s what makes him unique. The Reagan Revolution and the Bushes. Oh yeah I disagree with that ideology but it’s a set ideology that actually has some real world to it. Trumpism is ignorance and about what benefits Trump either financially or politically.

365
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:23:20am

re: #361 b.d. (Lock Them Up!)

He shouldn’t be, how many wingnuts have come to his defense over this Hunter deal?

He still thinks that’s just how politics is done. And 40 years ago, that wasn’t abnormal, and at the end of a campaign, people went back to dinner with each other afterwards.

But it’s no longer a campaign tactic on the right. It’s embedded in their DNA now, and is a thing that must be defeated.

366
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:23:58am

I get why Biden thinks the way he does because he really has had friends who were Republicans and worked with them but he should have seen Birtherism as what it was.

367
gocart mozart  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:24:00am
368
Targetpractice  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:24:13am

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA *gasp* HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

369
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:25:06am

re: #357 mmmirele

I don’t think this got posted, but remember how Hobby Lobby’s closely held company got fined for bringing in looted cuneiform tiles a few years ago for their “Museum of the Bible”?

Turns out that wasn’t the only thing they were looting.

thedailybeast.com

Heh. This isn’t really “new” news, the Museum Of The Bible has been notorious for years for their acquisition practices (“practice” in the sense that they still haven’t gotten it right): in addition to paying big for numerous artifacts of dubious authenticity, their “authentication” procedures often seem to be something like:

Dealer: “Hey look, here’s an ancient papyrus of the Bible!”
MotB: “Wow! What’s it’s provenance?”
Dealer: “Provenance?”
MotB: “Yes, where does it come from?”
Dealer: “It’s the Bible. It comes from God”
MotB: “Cool. Where do we wire the money?”

370
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:25:08am

re: #351 Jay C

Naaah, Jews get a pass because “People Of The Book” or whatever (and overt antisemitism like that is still - more-or-less - considered rude). …

But Muslims are also People of the Book!

371
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:26:06am

Former head of Medicare, Medicaid & ACA for Obama:

372
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:26:18am

re: #370 retired cynic

But Muslims are also People of the Book!

Wrong Book.

373
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:26:22am

re: #368 Targetpractice

37% believe it’s likely that Trump will be impeached and removed. That seems like a very high number this early in the process…

374
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:26:33am

That’s a lot of billions.

375
HappyWarrior  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:27:18am

re: #371 jaunte

Former head of Medicare, Medicaid & ACA for Obama:

[Embedded content]

This is why I wasn’t in a rush to replace Pelosi. She knows her shit.

376
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:28:02am

re: #374 jaunte

That’s a lot of billions.

The people who currently get those billions would prefer to keep them and they own Congresspeople and Senators.

377
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:28:40am

re: #371 jaunte

Former head of Medicare, Medicaid & ACA for Obama:

Republicans: But it would be better just to cut $345B from Medicaid.

378
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:29:33am

Potentially $503 Billion back into the part of the economy that circulates.

379
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:29:56am

re: #372 Jay C

Wrong Book.

Nope. They start with the old Testament as well, and consider Jesus a prophet, as well as Abraham.

380
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:30:11am
381
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:30:32am

re: #362 KGxvi

The biggest problem for Trump is that he’s nowhere near a serious thinker. He has no big idea thoughts on how government should works

382
Targetpractice  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:30:33am

re: #361 b.d. (Lock Them Up!)

He shouldn’t be, how many wingnuts have come to his defense over this Hunter deal?

Biden, Pelosi, Hoyer, and even Schumer. These are people who cut their teeth before the days of Newt and the “Contract On America,” before Norquist and his “pledge” took hold, and before Bush v. Gore. Back in those days, you could rant and rail at each other all day on TV, then share drinks and cigars in the back room once the cameras were off. You know the General in Good Morning, Vietnam who says he wouldn’t buy an apple from Nixon but considers him a “good, close, personal friend”? That’s the situation that used to exist in politics.

Biden’s as much a political fossil as Sanders is.

383
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:30:37am

re: #379 retired cynic

Nope. They start with the old Testament as well, and consider Jesus a prophet, as well as Abraham.

Yeah, but one group is only interested in profits.

384
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:30:58am

re: #365 Belafon

He still thinks that’s just how politics is done. And 40 years ago, that wasn’t abnormal, and at the end of a campaign, people went back to dinner with each other afterwards.

But it’s no longer a campaign tactic on the right. It’s embedded in their DNA now, and is a thing that must be defeated.

im still leaning to the notion that this is a campaign tactic. to give just enough people ‘permission’ to vote “dem/not trump”.

were biden to win, and depending on what happened in the house/senate, i dont think he has any illusions about trying to govern that way. (he’s seen mcconnell)

385
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:31:04am

re: #383 Belafon

Yeah, but one group is only interested in profits.

One subgroup!

386
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:31:12am

re: #381 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

Well sure, if you want to get technical about it…

387
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:31:30am

re: #370 retired cynic

But Muslims are also People of the Book!

Actually, “People of the Book” was coined by Muslims to describe those other two religions.

388
Targetpractice  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:32:50am

re: #384 DangerMan

im still leaning to the notion that this is a campaign tactic. to give just enough people ‘permission’ to vote “dem/not trump”.

were biden to win, and depending on what happened in the house/senate, i dont think he has any illusions about trying to govern that way. (he’s seen mcconnell)

I genuinely believe that if Biden won the presidency, it would be a replay of the Obama years, with a lot of good-faith and genuine efforts at bipartisanship reduced to bloody chunks by a Republican Party whose base cannot abide any thought of the other side “winning.”

389
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:34:47am

re: #375 HappyWarrior

This is why I wasn’t in a rush to replace Pelosi. She knows her shit.

we hear so little of what’s actually going on

i’d bet she has 10 b-plans

390
retired cynic  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:34:54am

re: #388 Targetpractice

I genuinely believe that if Biden won the presidency, it would be a replay of the Obama years, with a lot of good-faith and genuine efforts at bipartisanship reduced to bloody chunks by a Republican Party whose base cannot abide any thought of the other side “winning.”

I think both Obama and Biden learned from the McConnell experience. Agree with dangerman. Glass half full.

Still worried about age.

391
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:37:16am

re: #388 Targetpractice

I genuinely believe that if Biden won the presidency, it would be a replay of the Obama years, with a lot of good-faith and genuine efforts at bipartisanship reduced to bloody chunks by a Republican Party whose base cannot abide any thought of the other side “winning.”

My approach would be this:

call in the “moderate” Republican Senators and maybe members of the House (if any are left in the House) and tell them, “look, we’re working on this, it’s something we know you support and would be good for your constituents. We want you to co-sponsor the bills, we want you to vote for it. We will let you give input and down the line, we can find something else that you support that we can work together on. But understand this: this is your one chance, you fuck us over like you did on the ACA and you’re cut out, you’re done, persona non grata. And I will take every opportunity to remind voters in your State/district that you tried to fuck them over, I will make it my personal mission to see that you lose your next election.”

392
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:37:44am

re: #379 retired cynic

Nope. They start with the old Testament as well, and consider Jesus a prophet, as well as Abraham.

One to look at Judaism, Christianity, and Islam: Judaism came first w/monotheism and rigid rules and doctrines for living a just life w/a code of conduct. Christians rebelled against the heterodoxy of Jewish leaders, saw the hypocrisy of the leaders, and split off as a reformation/modification of Jewish doctrine. Islam saw the Christian teachings as something that itself needed reform, and hews closer to Judaism in most aspects (a counter reformation).

When you compare Islam and Judaism, the parallels are striking; it’s truly like quarreling brothers (Isaac and Esau).

393
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:38:45am

re: #389 DangerMan

we hear so little of what’s actually going on

i’d bet she has 10 b-plans

If Warren is elected, and Democrats keep the House and gain control of the Senate, we will have a woman with plans in the House, a woman with plans in the White House, and Schumer in the middle.

394
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:39:18am

re: #388 Targetpractice

I genuinely believe that if Biden won the presidency, it would be a replay of the Obama years, with a lot of good-faith and genuine efforts at bipartisanship reduced to bloody chunks by a Republican Party whose base cannot abide any thought of the other side “winning.”

it’s certainly possible
but i want a pony
so i like to think they’d realize right off it’s not 2008.
or yes, maybe give ‘bipartisanship’ a try and then adapt right quick. (which is what obama maybe should have done more of)

395
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:39:26am

re: #392 lawhawk

One to look at Judaism, Christianity, and Islam: Judaism came first w/monotheism and rigid rules and doctrines for living a just life w/a code of conduct. Christians rebelled against the heterodoxy of Jewish leaders, saw the hypocrisy of the leaders, and split off as a reformation/modification of Jewish doctrine. Islam saw the Christian teachings as something that itself needed reform, and hews closer to Judaism in most aspects (a counter reformation).

When you compare Islam and Judaism, the parallels are striking; it’s truly like quarreling brothers (Isaac and Esau).

I read this book years ago, it was quite fascinating. Though I’m not sure it tells the whole story.

396
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:40:21am

re: #391 KGxvi

My approach would be this:

call in the “moderate” Republican Senators and maybe members of the House (if any are left in the House) and tell them, “look, we’re working on this, it’s something we know you support and would be good for your constituents. We want you to co-sponsor the bills, we want you to vote for it. We will let you give input and down the line, we can find something else that you support that we can work together on. But understand this: this is your one chance, you fuck us over like you did on the ACA and you’re cut out, you’re done, persona non grata. And I will take every opportunity to remind voters in your State/district that you tried to fuck them over, I will make it my personal mission to see that you lose your next election.”

you got my vote

397
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:40:56am

re: #395 KGxvi

I’ll have to look into that book.

398
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:41:28am

re: #392 lawhawk

One to look at Judaism, Christianity, and Islam: Judaism came first w/monotheism and rigid rules and doctrines for living a just life w/a code of conduct. Christians rebelled against the heterodoxy of Jewish leaders, saw the hypocrisy of the leaders, and split off as a reformation/modification of Jewish doctrine. Islam saw the Christian teachings as something that itself needed reform, and hews closer to Judaism in most aspects (a counter reformation).

When you compare Islam and Judaism, the parallels are striking; it’s truly like quarreling brothers (Isaac and Esau).

it really all comes down to who has the best food //

399
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:42:34am

re: #371 jaunte

This is an interesting trade off…

Republicans countered by pointing to another part of the CBO’s analysis, which found that the measure would reduce research and development of new drugs. The CBO estimate that drug companies’ revenues would be reduced by between $500 billion and $1 trillion over 10 years, leading to eight to 15 fewer new drugs coming to market over the next 10 years, out of about 300 total new drugs over that period.

Of course, it depends on what those 8-15 new drugs would be for. And it also probably doesn’t take into account how some drugs are researched for Condition A and end up being useful for Condition B (see, for example: the little blue pill).

400
piratedan  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:43:03am

re: #325 Interesting Times

this is all well and good, and in a just world, or a fair world it would be the case, but when have the networks shown, in the last 25 years, any reason to be fair and objective and give the podium, much less the microphone to the Dems?

I bet Wilson KNOWS this and understands it and its a backhanded swipe at their inability to get their message out, if no one gives you the access to broadcast the message, you don’t blame the guys WITH the message, you blame the guys screwing with the access.

401
KGxvi  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:44:02am

re: #397 lawhawk

I’ll have to look into that book.

It’s lacking, I think, on the archaeological side of study. But I think does a really good job explaining how God evolved over the years.

402
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:44:20am

re: #388 Targetpractice

I genuinely believe that if Biden won the presidency, it would be a replay of the Obama years, with a lot of good-faith and genuine efforts at bipartisanship reduced to bloody chunks by a Republican Party whose base cannot abide any thought of the other side “winning.”

Maybe: but with a Democratic House and (at worst, a tied) Senate, a President Biden (and/or VP Warren?) will get things done - or see to it that things get done. And if nothing else, make damn sure that GOP obstructionism gets the blame for stuff not getting done.
With all the Trump Trauma and impeachment flap, the legislative roadblocks Moscow Mitch and his creatures have put in place to stymie Dem initiatives have been a fairly underreported issue. Hopefully, when the campaign (to retire President Pence) gets underway, it will get back in the spotlight.

403
Targetpractice  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:44:24am

re: #391 KGxvi

My approach would be this:

call in the “moderate” Republican Senators and maybe members of the House (if any are left in the House) and tell them, “look, we’re working on this, it’s something we know you support and would be good for your constituents. We want you to co-sponsor the bills, we want you to vote for it. We will let you give input and down the line, we can find something else that you support that we can work together on. But understand this: this is your one chance, you fuck us over like you did on the ACA and you’re cut out, you’re done, persona non grata. And I will take every opportunity to remind voters in your State/district that you tried to fuck them over, I will make it my personal mission to see that you lose your next election.”

I’m too much of a cynic to really believe that this would really go anywhere except a repeat of Spring ‘09, when Obama brought the Congressional Repub leaders in as part of an effort to put together a bipartisan plan for dealing with the recession…only for them to strut in like hot shit, insist that they would only support more tax cuts, and then sneer to the press that they’d be told “I won” when he balked at their demands. Any spirit of “bipartisanship” is gonna quickly be buried under a metric foot of astroturfing as the spiritual successor to the “Tea Party” sprouts up.

404
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:44:24am

re: #399 KGxvi

This is an interesting trade off…

Of course, it depends on what those 8-15 new drugs would be for. And it also probably doesn’t take into account how some drugs are researched for Condition A and end up being useful for Condition B (see, for example: the little blue pill).

We can get more drugs with ads that say “Miraculous will cure your cancer as long as it doesn’t kill you first.”

405
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:44:32am
406
Eventual Carrion  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:45:35am

re: #371 jaunte

Former head of Medicare, Medicaid & ACA for Obama:

[Embedded content]

Sure wish the Dems had some ideas other then bringing down tRump!
/////

407
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:45:40am

re: #399 KGxvi

It might cut into the ad budget a bit.

“…Of the nearly $30 billion that health companies now spend on medical marketing each year, around 68 percent (or about $20 billion) goes to persuading doctors and other medical professionals—not consumers—of the benefits of prescription drugs. That’s according to an in-depth analysis published in JAMA this week. The study broke down exactly how health companies convinced us to spend enormous sums on our care between 1997 and 2016. In that time, health companies went from spending $17.7 billion to $29.9 billion on medical marketing. Meanwhile, US healthcare spending hit $3.3 trillion, or 17.8 percent of the GDP, in 2016.”
arstechnica.com

408
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:49:11am

Let’s get past the fact that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is so poorly named that it does a tremendous disservice to everyone involved. It should be the American Music Hall of Fame.

But diving into who the nominees are? I’m not familiar with T.Rex or MC5, and never listened to the Notorious BIG (but know who he was).

Those who I think should get in on this go-around (no order):
Pat Benatar
Thin Lizzy
Depeche Mode
Whitney Houston
nine inch nails
Notorious BIG
Motorhead.

409
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:52:01am

re: #408 lawhawk

Biggie was a great hip hop artist for his time, but he has no business being in a “rock and roll” Hall of Fame. I like your idea of making the American music hall of fame because that is functionally what it’s become.

Nice to see Soundgarden get a nod.

410
gwangung  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:52:31am

re: #399 KGxvi

This is an interesting trade off…

Of course, it depends on what those 8-15 new drugs would be for. And it also probably doesn’t take into account how some drugs are researched for Condition A and end up being useful for Condition B (see, for example: the little blue pill).

Take a third of that savings and use the NIH to conduct basic research and early applied research.

You’ll see A LOT of new drugs come onto the market…and not just slightly varied knockoffs of known drugs.

411
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:54:10am
412
gocart mozart  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:54:46am
413
garzooma  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:55:14am

re: #237 garzooma

There was a piece in the NYT showing just how evil Giuliani is:
[…]
In 2016, Leshchenko had helped expose the “black ledger,” an accounting book of hundreds of pages found in Yanukovych’s former party headquarters. Among its many entries, it showed $12.7 million in secret payments to Paul Manafort. At the time, Manafort was running Donald Trump’s presidential campaign, but before that, he was one of Yanukovych’s most important advisers.

One of the reasons Manafort is in federal prison is that he failed to disclose or pay taxes on millions of dollars from Ukraine.[…]

It occurred to me that if it wasn’t for the Maidan revolt in Ukraine, and for Leshchenko’s work in particular, Manafort would be at this very moment working with oligarchs to help Trump destroy American democracy. So thank a Ukrainian.

414
BeachDem  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:55:26am

re: #405 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

And let us not forget that Nikki Haley, that genius in aerospace technology and business, is on the Boeing board.

Based on total compensation for Boeing’s other 13 board members, Haley can expect to earn more than $300,000, well above her salary as U.N. ambassador.

415
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:58:47am
416
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 9:58:51am

re: #414 BeachDem

Trump lambasted Goldman Sachs and Hillary all through the 2016 campaign.

He proceeded to stock his cabal of cronies with Goldman Sachs alums, including Bannon and Cohn and Mnuchin.

Trump attacked DC and Hillary for lobbyists being part of government.

Everyone in Trumpworld is apparently a lobbyist - for another country. FARA violations all over the place, including Trump’s former NSA, Trump’s current personal lawyer, etc.

It’s all projection like IMAX.

417
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:00:20am

Musing about impeachment of others in the administration.

The idea that, say, the Attorney General, could be impeached in isolation because he did something so egregious that the president didn’t first can his ass…doesn’t make sense to me.

The only time i think you get to impeach anyone other than the president (excepting judges etc) is when they all do something together. Otherwise why wouldn’t the president act if it’s against his own interest? If it’s for his own interest, again, he’s involved.

And in isolation, a cabinet officer abusing the budget or in some other way behaving badly, unless the house/senate is the other party, but the president not canning him, it’s still an endorsement at the very least.

418
Eventual Carrion  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:02:58am

re: #408 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Let’s get past the fact that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is so poorly named that it does a tremendous disservice to everyone involved. It should be the American Music Hall of Fame.

But diving into who the nominees are? I’m not familiar with T.Rex or MC5, and never listened to the Notorious BIG (but know who he was).

Those who I think should get in on this go-around (no order):
Pat Benatar
Thin Lizzy
Depeche Mode
Whitney Houston
nine inch nails
Notorious BIG
Motorhead.

My votes for this list (no order either):
Pat Benatar
MC5
Todd Rundgren
Soundgarden
T.Rex
Thin Lizzy

Doesn’t know T.Rex or MC5? That’s too bad. Kick Out the Jams motherfucker.

419
Colère Tueur de Lapin  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:03:35am

re: #409 Eclectic Cyborg

Biggie was a great hip hop artist for his time, but he has no business being in a “rock and roll” Hall of Fame. I like your idea of making the American music hall of fame because that is functionally what it’s become.

Nice to see Soundgarden get a nod.

I love Kraftwerk, but….

420
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:04:26am

re: #399 KGxvi

This is an interesting trade off…

Of course, it depends on what those 8-15 new drugs would be for. And it also probably doesn’t take into account how some drugs are researched for Condition A and end up being useful for Condition B (see, for example: the little blue pill).

if the profits from some drugs are used to develop others then that ‘trade-off’ is just medical socialism

why should part of the price i pay for a drug i need today be used to develop some other drug i’m never gonna use (or even see)

//

421
Barefoot Grin  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:04:56am
422
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:05:03am

re: #418 Eventual Carrion

*mea culpa*

T.Rex did Get It On… (searching the deeper recesses of my music memories).

423
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:05:39am

re: #408 lawhawk

But diving into who the nominees are? I’m not familiar with T.Rex or MC5, and never listened to the Notorious BIG (but know who he was).

MC5 were a band way ahead of their time, proto-punk and trash, they deserve a nod

T Rex were bigin Europe (folk rock going into glam rock) but only had one big hit here in the US, bang a gong. This one is my favorite of theirs:

T. Rex - Hot love 1971

424
Egregious Philbin  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:06:05am

Once again the Rock and Roll HOF decides to put up boring stuff.

Where the hell is Harry Nilsson, Warren Zevon and Captain Beefhart?

Oh, but we have Pat Benetar who sang the same generic song every time….
Whitney Houston, there is a rocker…

Lame

425
BeachDem  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:07:13am

Bakari Sellers pulling no punches in his assessment of Tulsi:

“I firmly believe that Tulsi Gabbard stands on that stage as the antithesis to what the other 11 individuals stand for, especially when it comes to issues such as foreign policy,” he said. “There’s no question, there is no question that Tulsi Gabbard, of all the 12, is a puppet for the Russian government.”

426
Mike Lamb  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:07:30am

re: #405 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Aside from the fact that it’s not really nepotism, given that Joe Biden isn’t making the hiring decisions, the fact that they would even attempt to “go there” given Javanka’s existence is pretty stunning.

427
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:07:46am
428
Interesting Times  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:08:24am

re: #400 piratedan

this is all well and good, and in a just world, or a fair world it would be the case, but when have the networks shown, in the last 25 years, any reason to be fair and objective and give the podium, much less the microphone to the Dems?

If Tom Steyer can get his ads on the air everywhere except Fox, so can Dems (and if someone - e.g. a Sinclair station - refuses to air an ad, turn that into a news story).

And it’s not like Rick Wilson isn’t putting his money where his mouth is - he retweeted this:

And tweeted this:

429
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:09:02am

re: #424 Egregious Philbin

Once again the Rock and Roll HOF decides to put up boring stuff.

Where the hell is Harry Nilsson, Warren Zevon and Captain Beefhart?

Oh, but we have Pat Benetar who sang the same generic song every time….
Whitney Houston, there is a rocker…

Lame

Build your own museum and you can put in who you want.

430
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:09:23am

re: #411 jaunte

either reason is why we’ll never see it

431
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:09:56am

If a band is famous, but isn’t in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, what does it mean?

432
Egregious Philbin  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:10:15am

re: #429 Belafon

I will, and it will be the biggest and bestest museum ever!

HOF jumped the shark years ago with ABBA and Journey.

433
BeachDem  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:10:23am

re: #427 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Exposé : I’ll Never Get Over You Getting Over Me

434
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:10:41am

re: #431 jaunte

If a band is famous, but isn’t in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, what does it mean?

It means you won’t see them at the museum.

435
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:10:42am

re: #411 jaunte

Call went something like this:

Erdogan: Donald, I love you man. You’re an amazing President. So terrible what your opponents have put you through, so terrible…

Trump: I know, it’s a witch hunt. A total witch hunt.

E: It will be okay, Donald. You are strong like me. You will survive.

T: I am strong. Tremendously strong.

E: I have a small favor to ask. Would you be willing to pull your troops out of Syria? It will be great. You can get your people out of a war zone and sell it as ending a long running conflict in the Middle East. Good for re-election, no?

T: That would be good. That would get me votes. Many votes.

E: And don’t worry. Once you leave, I will handle the situation. Everything is under control.

T: You’ve got it under control?

E: Yes, Donald. You can trust me. I will look after Syria. You just bring those troops home and keep working on making America great again, yes?

T: Yes! Fantastic! This is a great deal, wonderful deal. You’re the best, Recep. The best!

E: Aww, you flatter me Donald.

T: No, really. You’re the best. This is tremendous!

E: Okay, so you’ll send those orders soon, right?

T: Yes, real soon.

E: Excellent. Oh and Donald? Be sure to tell President Putin about this. Important he stays in the loop on things, right?

T: Yes, important. Very important. I’ll tell him. You know he’s a great guy. Really, really great guy.

E: Yes, Donald. I know. I know. Okay, I have business to attend to. You get those orders out. Thank you, Donald.

[Call ends]

T: What a great deal! This is fantastic. I always win so much. Much winning, so great, so great…

E: (to his army) Okay, boys. It worked. Time to go to Syria and burn that bitch to the ground!

436
Hecuba's daughter  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:12:10am

re: #317 DangerMan

is guiliani in the government or not?
working for state or not?
trumps ‘personal attorney’ or not?
what is hunter biden to this admin? (but please, go ‘investigate’ if you want)

[Embedded content]

PS: it is actually quite conventional thinking to have, at the board of directors level, people who don’t know anything specific about the business. they have no preconceived notions, no industry prejudices or baked in thinking, and may be able to make decisions more soberly and objectively.

Objectively? Please.. If they are not experts in the field of the business, their only purpose is to enrich themselves and preserve a system designed to help the wealthy on the backs of the rest of us. They routinely approve higher pay and benefits for the executives so that their companies will approve similar packages for them. The whole system is corrupt to its core.

437
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:12:40am

re: #414 BeachDem

And let us not forget that Nikki Haley, that genius in aerospace technology and business, is on the Boeing board.

Based on total compensation for Boeing’s other 13 board members, Haley can expect to earn more than $300,000, well above her salary as U.N. ambassador.

the whole idea that no one profits from their name and experience in public life is ludicrous. wtf is a lobbyist?

and the whole idea that a politician controls their adult children (ie biden) is nuttier.

otoh, the R’s are really good at creating something out of whole cloth and making it stick.

438
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:14:32am

Get ready for more screaming from the pro-corruption party.

439
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:14:41am

re: #402 Jay C

ADD:

It’s of course, looking far (too far) ahead at this point, but JFTR, a quick check of the Senate roster shows 13 Democrats and 20 Republicans up for reelection in 2022 (with, I think, two retirements from the latter). The good news is that all the Dems are from solidly “blue” states, and seem (at first analysis) to be unlikely NOT to be returned. The bad news is that most of the GOPers are from solidly “red” states, and there doesn’t seem to be very many chances to flip the seats. Three, maybe? I can post a list if anyone’s interested.

440
Jebediah, RBG  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:14:48am

re: #359 HappyWarrior

Age is a disqualifier for me. I really don’t like his style at all. He’s stuck in the 30’s.

I was going to ask if you meant THE Thirties or HIS thirties but then I remembered that they are about the same thing.

441
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:15:21am

re: #422 lawhawk

*mea culpa*

T.Rex did Get It On… (searching the deeper recesses of my music memories).

bang a…

442
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:16:10am
443
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:16:30am

re: #440 Jebediah, RBG

I was going to ask if you meant THE Thirties or HIS thirties but then I remembered that they are about the same thing.

How crazy is it that in only 11 years it will be the thirties…again.

444
jaunte  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:17:42am

re: #443 Eclectic Cyborg

I’d like to see those car bodies come back, but with electric motors.

445
A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:19:24am

re: #439 Jay C

ADD:

It’s of course, looking far (too far) ahead at this point, but JFTR, a quick check of the Senate roster shows 13 Democrats and 20 Republicans up for reelection in 2022 (with, I think, two retirements from the latter). The good news is that all the Dems are from solidly “blue” states, and seem (at first analysis) to be unlikely NOT to be returned. The bad news is that most of the GOPers are from solidly “red” states, and there doesn’t seem to be very many chances to flip the seats. Three, maybe? I can post a list if anyone’s interested.

The interesting news is that we can reasonably question how many solidly “red” seats there still are, in view of interim election results. If you’re a Democrat, it’s a good year for chasing rainbows in red states, and we’re seeing a fair number of people doing it.

446
Dread Pirate  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:21:16am
447
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:22:52am

re: #436 Hecuba’s daughter

Objectively? Please.. If they are not experts in the field of the business, their only purpose is to enrich themselves and preserve a system designed to help the wealthy on the backs of the rest of us. They routinely approve higher pay and benefits for the executives so that their companies will approve similar packages for them. The whole system is corrupt to its core.

there’s nothing corrupt about the purpose and function of a corporate or not-for-profit governing board.

and it’s been demonstrated time and again that every member of a board need not have a full working knowledge of the specific industry.

people bring all kinds of skills and experience to the board room table.

448
piratedan  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:23:12am

re: #429 Belafon

musical taste is a matter of personal preference. For example, I would have no issue with Pat Benetar being in, as her music actually rocked (imho) and was done in a style where few women ventured and for nearly half a decade she dominated the airwaves and showed that her voice and musical stylings had range, have to admit that there is a journey there from Heartbreaker to We Belong in regards to musical expression.

For someone like the MC5, I could see them being in as an influencer, a harbinger of musical movements to come, but like others could argue, were they great in and of themselves, not for me to say.

An artist like Whitney Houston, great genre straddling voice, mondo record sales, is she a rock and roller? does it matter what I think that Rock and Roll actually is? I can totally get behind the idea that we either do a better job of defining what rock and roll is or is this a more aptly named Museum of Popular Music? Would Houston belong to both or only one exclusive of the other?

I think the terms need to be better defined because it seems that people who have a passion for music are always attempting to label and categorize music as a means of self-identity.

449
Dread Pirate  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:26:17am
450
Eventual Carrion  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:34:21am

re: #423 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

MC5 were a band way ahead of our time, proto-punk and trash, they deserve a nod

[snip]

[Embedded content]

When some younger kids start bringing out some older punk stuff I point them to MC5 and play them Kick Out the Jams. And remind them that it was put out in the late 60’s.

451
Jay C  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:37:26am

re: #445 A hollow voice says, Impeachmoot now!

The interesting news is that we can reasonably question how many solidly “red” seats there still are, in view of interim election results. If you’re a Democrat, it’s a good year for chasing rainbows in red states, and we’re seeing a fair number of people doing it.

OK: Here’s the list, FYI
(AZ is also up, as is GA - for Isakson’s replacement(?) * = retiring (?)

DEMOCRAT:
Harris (CA)
Bennett (CO)
Blumenthal (CT)
Schatz (HI)
Duckworth (IL)
Van Hollen (MD)
Cortez Masto (NM)
Hassan (NH)
Schumer (NY)
Wyden (OR)
Leahy (VT)
Murray (WA)

REPUBLICAN:
Shelby (AL)
Murkowski (AK)
Boozman (AR)
Rubio (FL)
Crapo (ID)
Young (IN)
Grassley* (IA)
Moran (KS)
Paul (KY)
Kennedy (LA)
Blunt (MO)
Burr* (NC)
Hoeven (ND)
Portman (OH)
Lankford (OK)
Toomey (PA)
Scott (SC)
Thune (SD)
Lee (UT)
Johnson (WI)

452
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:40:17am
453
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:40:28am
454
Interesting Times  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:41:42am

re: #428 Interesting Times

And it’s not just Rick Wilson:

455
BeachDem  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:41:53am

re: #439 Jay C

ADD:

It’s of course, looking far (too far) ahead at this point, but JFTR, a quick check of the Senate roster shows 13 Democrats and 20 Republicans up for reelection in 2022 (with, I think, two retirements from the latter). The good news is that all the Dems are from solidly “blue” states, and seem (at first analysis) to be unlikely NOT to be returned. The bad news is that most of the GOPers are from solidly “red” states, and there doesn’t seem to be very many chances to flip the seats. Three, maybe? I can post a list if anyone’s interested.

Well—it’s a solidly red state, but it’s Lindsey Graham, and we have one great candidate:

456
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:42:33am

re: #453 Charles Johnson

It was a perfect crime meeting

no quids were pro quoed in the making of the making of this agreement!

457
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:43:09am

re: #439 Jay C

ADD:

It’s of course, looking far (too far) ahead at this point, but JFTR, a quick check of the Senate roster shows 13 Democrats and 20 Republicans up for reelection in 2022 (with, I think, two retirements from the latter). The good news is that all the Dems are from solidly “blue” states, and seem (at first analysis) to be unlikely NOT to be returned. The bad news is that most of the GOPers are from solidly “red” states, and there doesn’t seem to be very many chances to flip the seats. Three, maybe? I can post a list if anyone’s interested.

Pete Sessions lost to Colin Allred in Texas in 2018. Anything is possible.

458
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:45:16am

re: #454 Interesting Times

There’s a line of thought that suggests when your enemy is shooting itself in the foot (or head), don’t interfere.

Another line of thought is that you amplify the messaging to remind everyone of all of Trump’s crimes.

I’d lean towards running ads and messaging, especially on FB and other social media to reach those who are already getting saturated with Trump’s nonstop agitprop bulkshit.

459
Citizen K  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:51:24am

re: #412 gocart mozart

It’s amazing how many people are wedded to the idea of Columbus as a paragon, and how it’s somehow inextricable from the very concept of America. It’s something I can’t really understand.

Then again, it’s probably just the underlying racism that attracts people.

460
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:51:37am

How did she get her job?

461
BeachDem  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:52:12am

re: #451 Jay C

OK: Here’s the list, FYI
(AZ is also up, as is GA - for Isakson’s replacement(?) * = retiring (?)

DEMOCRAT:
Harris (CA)
Bennett (CO)
Blumenthal (CT)
Schatz (HI)
Duckworth (IL)
Van Hollen (MD)
Cortez Masto (NM)
Hassan (NH)
Schumer (NY)
Wyden (OR)
Leahy (VT)
Murray (WA)

REPUBLICAN:
Shelby (AL)
Murkowski (AK)
Boozman (AR)
Rubio (FL)
Crapo (ID)
Young (IN)
Grassley* (IA)
Moran (KS)
Paul (KY)
Kennedy (LA)
Blunt (MO)
Burr* (NC)
Hoeven (ND)
Portman (OH)
Lankford (OK)
Toomey (PA)
Scott (SC)
Thune (SD)
Lee (UT)
Johnson (WI)

I don’t think that’s the 2020 list—woops—just noticed you said that’s the 2022 list—-sorry:

2020 Senate elections
washingtonpost.com

462
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:52:49am
463
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:53:55am

re: #460 Belafon
Did someone say nepotism?

464
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:54:37am
465
Patricia Kayden  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:58:05am

re: #442 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Irony has long been dead and buried.

466
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:59:13am

re: #465 Patricia Kayden

Irony has long been dead and buried.

After being drug through the street and brutally murdered.

467
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 10:59:55am

re: #398 DangerMan

it really all comes down to who has the best food //

And if you dig on swine (or shellfish).

468
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:01:59am

re: #459 Citizen K

It’s amazing how many people are wedded to the idea of Columbus as a paragon, and how it’s somehow inextricable from the very concept of America. It’s something I can’t really understand.

Then again, it’s probably just the underlying racism that attracts people.

we were raised and taught about he represents the triumph of the exploring human spirit and really did not get the rest of the story about what he helped bring about

469
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:03:58am

re: #442 lawhawk

Charles, I know you turned off the feature where it includes the parent tweet because Twitter does that automatically, but is there a way you can make it an account setting? At work I cannot see the parent tweet a lot of times. When they’re retweets, or whenever the parent is included in the reply tweet, I can copy the link down and preview it to see the original. But if there’s no original tweet referenced in the text, there’s no way I can see the context.

Thanks.

Edit: When I say “I know” I really mean “I think I remember you saying”.

470
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:19:53am

re: #469 Belafon

You mean because Javascript is blocked? Might be able to do that - I’ll check into it.

471
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:20:21am
472
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:21:19am

re: #470 Charles Johnson

You mean because Javascript is blocked? Might be able to do that - I’ll check into it.

More thank likely. Thanks.

473
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:23:50am
474
makeitstop  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:25:59am

We get to pick five nominees?

MC5,
Motorhead,
NIN,
Todd R.
Soundgarden.

(My wife will be mad I didn’t pick T. Rex (she adores Bolan), but that’s, umm, rock and roll.)

On a related note: we’re going to Town Hall tonight to see Frank Turner roll out his new album, No Man’s Land.

Turner wrote the album as a way of drawing attention to the lives of “fascinating women” whose amazing lives were overlooked due to their gender.[6] These women include Byzantine princess Kassiani, Huda Sha’arawi, Nannie Doss, Nica Rothschild, Sister Rosetta Tharpe, Jinny Bigham, Dora Hand and the CPR training manikin Resusci Anne.

Looking forward to it.

475
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:28:22am

re: #474 makeitstop

We get to pick five nominees?

MC5,
Motorhead,
NIN,
Todd R.
Soundgarden.

(My wife will be mad I didn’t pick T. Rex (she adores Bolan), but that’s, umm, rock and roll.)

On a related note: we’re going to Town Hall tonight to see Frank Turner roll out his new album, No Man’s Land.

Looking forward to it.

Turning the Rejected Princesses books into music.

476
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:28:23am

Rudy’s apparently parted ways with his then lawyer, no new lawyer has been announced.

Is it a matter of time before his old lawyer needs a lawyer of his own?

477
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:31:57am
478
b.d. (It's All True)  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:32:36am

re: #477 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

One and a half Scaramuccis

479
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:32:47am

re: #473 lawhawk

we’re living in Kakistan

480
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:42:37am

re: #476 lawhawk

Rudy’s apparently parted ways with his then lawyer, no new lawyer has been announced.

[Embedded content]

Is it a matter of time before his old lawyer needs a lawyer of his own?

when the lawyer’s lawyer’s lawyer’s lawyer’s need lawyers…

481
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:43:24am

re: #478 b.d. (Lock Them Up!)

One and a half Scaramuccis

gowdy never even crossed the threshold

482
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:43:55am
483
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:44:14am

re: #480 DangerMan

when the lawyer’s lawyer’s lawyer’s lawyer’s need lawyers…

How much of job creation is from Trumpworld keeping an army of lawyers employed? ///////////////////

484
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:45:20am
485
lawhawk  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:47:20am

Lawyers who represent themselves have fools for a client. Rudy is quickly falling into the same category as Trump. Guys who think they’re the smartest ones in the room, and they clearly aren’t.

486
garzooma  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:50:29am

re: #160 makeitstop

[Embedded content]
At this point, I’m willing to believe there is an actual drug deal.

Take a bow:

California cannabis king linked to Ukrainian who was indicted with Giuliani associates

A Ukrainian-born man indicted in a campaign-finance scheme along with two associates of Rudy Giuliani, President Trump’s personal attorney, is an officer in a Sacramento cannabis dispensary controlled by a local businessman with a considerable share of the city’s pot business, records show.

487
Charles Johnson  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:51:39am
488
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:52:44am
489
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:53:29am

re: #473 lawhawk

And Navarro is going with the “It was a joke!” excuse.

490
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:54:23am

re: #487 Charles Johnson

My full name anagrams to Manuel Polanski. I have a pseudonym if I need to do any public relations for myself.

491
Eclectic Cyborg  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:58:23am

re: #490 Belafon

My full name anagrams to Manuel Polanski. I have a pseudonym if I need to do any public relations for myself.

My name is tough to anagram. I always end up with whimsical European sounding names like Nephet Zdossan.

492
William Lewis  Oct 15, 2019 • 11:59:32am

re: #490 Belafon

My full name anagrams to Manuel Polanski. I have a pseudonym if I need to do any public relations for myself.

I’d never use an anagram when I have many perfectly good RPG character personalities I could use instead. Sean Tyler, Imperial Interstellar Scout Service, for example, would be a great great scientist to agree with me ;)

493
Eventual Carrion  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:00:21pm

re: #490 Belafon

My full name anagrams to Manuel Polanski. I have a pseudonym if I need to do any public relations for myself.

I ran my full name through an anagram prog and one it came out with was “midmorn rum sanely”. I think I’ll keep it.

494
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:02:49pm

re: #488 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀

this line of logic “president and due process’ is going to fall on its face soon

if / when it starts to be constitution-splained over and over it’s gonna look like none of them understood how any of this works

495
Jebediah, RBG  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:13:35pm

re: #408 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Let’s get past the fact that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is so poorly named that it does a tremendous disservice to everyone involved. It should be the American Music Hall of Fame.

But diving into who the nominees are? I’m not familiar with T.Rex or MC5, and never listened to the Notorious BIG (but know who he was).

Kick out the jams, motherfucker! As the MC5 was wont to shout.
MC5 & T. Rex don’t get in*, I shall boycott the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

*Not saying they are the only deserving acts on that list

496
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:15:23pm
497
William Lewis  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:19:57pm

re: #495 Jebediah, RBG

Kick out the jams, motherfucker! As the MC5 was wont to shout.
MC5 & T. Rex don’t get in*, I shall boycott the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

*Not saying they are the only deserving acts on that list

I want to see Pat Benatar get in because that would be a great induction concert.

498
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:21:46pm

sure, Jan

499
FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:24:05pm
500
Belafon  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:24:46pm

re: #499 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀

Who nominated their meat for the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame?

501
Backwoods_Sleuth  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:29:50pm

re: #473 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

502
Jebediah, RBG  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:30:35pm

re: #443 Eclectic Cyborg

How crazy is it that in only 11 years it will be the thirties…again.

Ooooh, does that mean Art Deco will be back?

503
Jebediah, RBG  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:31:26pm

re: #502 Jebediah, RBG

Cuz that bastard owes me $20

504
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:34:40pm

re: #496 Backwoods_Sleuth

@michaeldweiss
Two of America’s biggest enemies, Russia and Iran, simply cannot believe their luck that in a long line of strategic cock-ups and own goals, American elected a dumber-than-shit sociopath who has now gifted them (not even sold, but gifted) its interests and assets in the region.

i think it wasn’t luck

505
DangerMan  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:35:38pm

re: #498 Backwoods_Sleuth

the effing president of the united states is a loon

who does no work at all

506
Jebediah, RBG  Oct 15, 2019 • 12:36:23pm

re: #450 Eventual Carrion

When some younger kids start bringing out some older punk stuff I point them to MC5 and play them Kick Out the Jams. And remind them that it was put out in the late 60’s.

Do you add a little late ’60s Stooges? Personally, I really love that Asheton brothers sound.

507
Decatur Deb  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:11:28pm

re: #500 Belafon

Who nominated their meat for the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame?

Mr and Mrs Loaf.

508
gocart mozart  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:17:54pm
509
CleverToad  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:21:45pm

re: #454 Interesting Times

And it’s not just Rick Wilson:

[Embedded content]

In my fantasies about how to spend my mythical lottery winnings…
I would hire Hoarse Whisperer to do a Dem marketing campaign, either in general or focussed on impeachment for now. Maybe somebody could do a GoFundMe.

510
Dave In Austin  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:42:28pm

re: #494 DangerMan

I tweeted to that he needed to retake Gov 101

511
A Mom Anon  Oct 15, 2019 • 1:52:12pm

re: #474 makeitstop

Kim Thayill of Soundgarden did some gigs not long ago with the remaining members of MC-5. Might have been in Kerrang or on the Soundgarden Facebook page maybe.

512
cat-tikvah  Oct 15, 2019 • 2:27:12pm

re: #451 Jay C

I WISH Pat Toomey was up for re-election in 2020. Alas, we in PA will have to wait till 2022 to be rid of him.
Can’t come soon enough. Spineless rubber stamp.

513
Cheechako  Oct 15, 2019 • 5:09:15pm

re: #451 Jay C

OK: Here’s the list, FYI
(AZ is also up, as is GA - for Isakson’s replacement(?) * = retiring (?)

DEMOCRAT:
Harris (CA)
Bennett (CO)
Blumenthal (CT)
Schatz (HI)
Duckworth (IL)
Van Hollen (MD)
Cortez Masto (NM)
Hassan (NH)
Schumer (NY)
Wyden (OR)
Leahy (VT)
Murray (WA)

REPUBLICAN:
Shelby (AL)
Murkowski (AK)
Boozman (AR)
Rubio (FL)
Crapo (ID)
Young (IN)
Grassley* (IA)
Moran (KS)
Paul (KY)
Kennedy (LA)
Blunt (MO)
Burr* (NC)
Hoeven (ND)
Portman (OH)
Lankford (OK)
Toomey (PA)
Scott (SC)
Thune (SD)
Lee (UT)
Johnson (WI)

It’s Sullivan in AK


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