Drink if you had ‘stop and frisk’ in the opening sentence…
— Susan Glasser (@sbg1) February 20, 2020
Live stream here
nbcnews.com
Warren: Let’s not substitute one arrogant billionaire for another.
Warren: “I’d like to talk about who we’re running against. A billionaire who calls women fat boards and horseface … no I’m not talking about Trump, I’m talking about Bloomberg.”SO IT’S GONNA BE LIKE THAT
— Elie Mystal (@ElieNYC) February 20, 2020
re: #4 jaunte
Excellent. Bloomberg thinking he can just buy the D nomination is an idea that needs to die in fire.
Meanwhile Poope Orange Foolius is holding a rally for the foollowers. Are the TV channels showing an empty podium?
YOU GO GIRL
I’d like to talk about who we’re running against: A billionaire who calls women “fat broads” and “horsey-faced lesbians.” And no I’m not talking about Donald Trump. I’m talking about Mayor Bloomberg. #DemDebate
— Elizabeth Warren (@ewarren) February 20, 2020
re: #7 EPR-radar
Excellent. Bloomberg thinking he can just buy the D nomination is an idea that needs to die in fire.
Am I being paranoid/ridiculous in thinking Republicans are ratfucking Bloomberg into the Democratic primary?
I mean, what exactly is left-leaning or liberal about this guy? I hope the damn bigot gets curb stomped tonight.
Not just two jobs, but three.
Running ODNI is a part time job.
Germany is a dipshit vassal state.
And who even needs a special envoy to Kosovo/Serbia? What could go wrong there? https://t.co/fMDBXftPnK— Benjamin Wittes (@benjaminwittes) February 20, 2020
I hate that it’s Mayo Pete that’s bringing it up, but he’s right that Bernie really needs to get out if he can’t control his online supporters’ threats.
Sanders calls for decency on the internet which is like calling for shit to not stink.
— The Rude Pundit (@rudepundit) February 20, 2020
Biden seems to think a toothy smile is all he needs.
Bernie’s on the hot seat over his toxic followers, and he’s denying everything.
Why is village idiot chuck Todd part of his?
He’s going to say that choice is a bad thing because the choice is often for profit.
re: #17 Charles Johnson
Bernie’s on the hot seat over his toxic followers, and he’s denying everything.
That particular fish has thoroughly rotted from the head down. When Sanders and Trump are basically competing to hire from the same pool of spokesliars for senior PR positions, you know there’s a problem.
re: #16 Scottish Dragon
Biden seems to think a toothy smile is all he needs.
That worked well enough for Carter back in 1976, and it is a strategy that might even work in the kind of melee this debate may end up being.
Please tell me this is a middle finger.
The Middle Ages were so metal https://t.co/y53AbUrBVh
— Getty (@GettyMuseum) February 12, 2020
Elizabeth Warren pulling no punches tonight, bay-bee.
— Charles Johnson (@Green_Footballs) February 20, 2020
The media spent the past two weeks ignoring Elizabeth Warren, and she’s making damn sure that if that media doesn’t remember her, the American people absolutely will.#DemDebate
— Charlotte Clymer 🏳️🌈 (@cmclymer) February 20, 2020
We have to come up with a better way to get recognized rather than raising your hand.
And Bernie brings up Nina Turner as his beacon of good behavior? Yikes.
Why are they ALL screaming? I feel like they’re forming a circular firing squad and it scares the shit out of me.
re: #28 b.d. (Is Rush Dead Yet?)
We have to come up with a better way to get recognized rather than raising your hand.
Jeopardy buzzers?
I just looked it up, and there are still two more debates to go (2/25 and 3/15). JFC.
Oh, wow. a moderator is actually calling out Bloomie’s racism!
re: #33 EPR-radar
I just looked it up, and there are still two more debates to go (2/25 and 3/15). JFC.
I thought about going to Charleston (edit—actually can’t even remember if it’s in Charleston or Columbia—that’s how interested I am)for the one next week, but decided I’d pass. They’re having some big dinner the night before and a luncheon with “first spouses” or whatever. I’ll save my money and give it to Jaime Harrison instead.
Oh—and Bloomberg gives me the creeps.
Would somebody please tell Chuck Todd to stop muttering, “OK… all right, oh, OK… all right” while the candidates are talking? Nobody needs to hear this.
— Charles Johnson (@Green_Footballs) February 20, 2020
re: #37 Charles Johnson
Unprofessional hack.
re: #36 BeachDem
I thought about going to Charleston for the one next week, but decided I’d pass. They’re having some big dinner the night before and a luncheon with “first spouses” or whatever. I’ll save my money and give it to Jaime Harrison instead.
Oh—and Bloomberg gives me the creeps.
Still better than Trump, if he is the nominee
re: #39 NO SMOCKING GUN!
Still better than Trump, if he is the nominee
That goes without saying—blue no matter who is my default. We vote next Saturday 2/29 and I still haven’t made my final choice (torn between Amy and Elizabeth—not going to try to be strategic, because every time I try that, it bites me in the ass.)
DONALD TRUMP WANTS TO CUT MEDICARE AND MEDICAID. HE WANTS TO END PROTECTIONS FOR PEOPLE WITH PREEXISTING CONDITIONS. Will someone please say this? Good Lord, people, have you forgotten that you’re running against Trump? This is political malpractice. #DemDebate
— Paul Begala (@PaulBegala) February 20, 2020
re: #40 Scottish Dragon
Bloomberg wilting under the glare.
I’m so happy that Bloomberg is shitty at running for president as a Democrat as soon as there’s something he can’t deal with by throwing money at it.
Just look at him. Looks defeated and unsure. Biden was in command of that exchange .
re: #37 Charles Johnson
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He must be compensating for not asking 100% irrelevant questions.
Now Bernie’s kinda going with BrieBrie’s bullshit about Bernie and Bloomberg’s heart crap being the same. Ugh
Bernie turning into trump on stage right now
Trump’s doc scrawled out a letter saying he was the most fit man ever to run for the presidency.
Bernie, you’re full of shit.
I have to admit, Bernie is sharper than Biden.
So this is going well. pic.twitter.com/4o2gIgnWlZ
— subscribe to my newsletter (@brianbeutler) February 20, 2020
re: #50 jaunte
Stent comparison isn’t going to beat Trump.
His money might, but he won’t be the candidate.
re: #52 Targetpractice
Trump’s doc scrawled out a letter saying he was the most fit man ever to run for the presidency.
Bernie, you’re full of shit.
Well, Trump scrawled it and Dr. Feelgood signed it under duress…
Good Lord. Have Bloomberg’s lips always moved about as much as Steve Mnuchin’s?
Mike, you had months to get that shit together before announcing. Stop bullshitting us.
Klobuchar is killing me on this answer. She’s awful on race. AWFUL.
— Bakari Sellers (@Bakari_Sellers) February 20, 2020
re: #58 Targetpractice
Mike, you had months to get that shit together before announcing. Stop bullshitting us.
He’s a bit of an arrogant asshole, isn’t he?
Seen elsewhere: “Bloomberg? More like Hindenburg.”
LOL. And great news.
If you hadn’t demanded your minute-and-a-quawter for more than 10 seconds at the head, you might have had a chance to finish this diatribe, Bloomie.
re: #60 BeachDem
He’s a bit of an arrogant asshole, isn’t he?
It’s an occupational hazard of being a billionaire. They usually lose all ability to relate to people who aren’t asskissers or hirelings.
Warren is taking no prisoners tonight. Fuckin’ A!
HAHAHAHA. Warren [on Bloomberg]: “That’s like saying, I’ve been nice to some women.” Then calls on Bloomberg to release the women from non-disclosures agreements.
— Elie Mystal (@ElieNYC) February 20, 2020
Elizabeth Warren lands another major body blow. https://t.co/cMZKNhU1iv pic.twitter.com/o167jGv5ip
— Charles Johnson (@Green_Footballs) February 20, 2020
re: #11 Mattand
Am I being paranoid/ridiculous in thinking Republicans are ratfucking Bloomberg into the Democratic primary?
I mean, what exactly is left-leaning or liberal about this guy? I hope the damn bigot gets curb stomped tonight.
1. Climate change and other environmental policies
2. Gun policies
3. Immigration policies
4. Abortion/contraception policies
You fucking idiot!
Off-colour jokes are harassment!
This will destroy him with anyone who watches the debate.
The problem is, that’s maybe 20 percent of Dem voters.
And surprisingly, a lot of folks were upset that Bloomberg was ‘getting to be’ in this debate.
re: #59 Yeah Sure WhatEVs
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That makes me sad—I like Amy, but I also like and respect Bakari. Damn, is this shit ever going to be over? (BTW—Bakari was all in for Kamala Harris—and I’m still really sad they drove her out)
Holy shit that look on warren face would melt titanium steel
The scientific term for what Warren is doing to Bloomberg right now is filleting
— Sam Stein (@samstein) February 20, 2020
I didn’t know this about Bloomberg. Fucking hell.
From what I hear…
Warren tonight pic.twitter.com/5GzClQs0TN
— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) February 20, 2020
We have to face the fact that the nation’s destiny is based on the votes of people who are much less informed than we are. We can only hope that they will vote Democratic.
I haven’t seen somebody self destruct on stage like this since Rick Perry has his brain melt
Well, Bernie, while we’re talking about Bloomberg in 2004, how about you wanting to primary Obama in 2012, shall we?
Warren shot a campaign in Vegas just to watch it die.
I’m just listening to the debate. Elizabeth and Joe B are on fire.
re: #70 BeachDem
That makes me sad—I like Amy, but I also like and respect Bakari. Damn, is this shit ever going to be over? (BTW—Bakari was all in for Kamala Harris—and I’m still really sad they drove her out)
💯!
Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren may have just saved their campaigns tonight. Both are brutalizing both Bernie and Bloomberg.
Bloomberg really wanted to be on that debate stage tonight. I wonder if he still feels that way?
— Charles Johnson (@Green_Footballs) February 20, 2020
Ouch. That was a terrible tripping over one of the simpler Spanish-language names.
And Klobuchar is pretty nasty about being called out for having been called out.
And now she’s breaking down about thinking she was called dumb.
Amazing how a couple of primaries turn the field from a dry lecture into an episode of Jerry Springer.
Uh oh Amy is self destructing like Jim Phelps tape recorder…
re: #87 Joe Bacon 🌹
Uh oh Amy is self destructing like Jim Phelps tape recorder…
The Dean Scream wasn’t as devastating.
Elizabeth Warren steps in to defend Amy Klobuchar. This is amazing.
— Charles Johnson (@Green_Footballs) February 20, 2020
Yay Elizabeth.
It is turning into a WWE event. I’m just shaking my head and wishing they had fewer debates.
Thankfully, we know the rate from other sources: $17,000 a month — far above the market rate for home rentals in the area. Trump Org got paid, even when @realdonaldtrump wasn’t actually there.https://t.co/JIOHe66Hjx
— David Fahrenthold (@Fahrenthold) February 19, 2020
Good Lord, this is turning into a Politically Incorrect episode.
Not even an ep of Real Time.
Before IA: “Hey, let’s get along and work to defeat Trump.”
After IA: “YOU WANT A PIECE OF ME?!”
Maybe Bloomberg should have asked the entire city of New York to sign an NDA.
— Wyatt Cenac (@wyattcenac) February 20, 2020
The debates are not a circular firing squad. They are a chance for candidates to show who they are and to give those with weaknesses exposure to attacks so they can deal with them. The circular firing squad it what happens if, after the race is essentially decided, candidates are still having to deal with each other.
Warren’s tactic of tearing out Bloomberg’s organs one by one is calculated to demonstrate what she’d do to Trump. “You like what I did to this New York billionaire? Lemme get at the stupid one.”
— The Rude Pundit (@rudepundit) February 20, 2020
re: #71 Scottish Dragon
Holy shit that look on warren face would melt titanium steel
Good. Gives me hope she’ll rebound strongly after tonight.
One of these people MUST beat Trump in a little over nine months from now.
It could yet be any one of them on the stage.
Not one of them is perfect.
Any one of them is going to be infinitely better than what’s there now and what he’ll be emboldened to do in a second term.
I’m seeing a lot of us here working overtime to tear some of these imperfect candidates down.
Tell me what you’re going to do to lift them UP, whichever one of them it ends up being. (Even you, Bernie.)
So the refs ring the bell and the fighters go back to their corners. So far, Pete and Amy are looking a little deflated but still standing, Liz and Joe are looking a little more feisty tonight, while Mike and Bernie are trying not to hurl their guts out after several body blows.
re: #96 Belafon
The debates are not a circular firing squad. They are a chance for candidates to show who they are and to give those with weaknesses exposure to attacks so they can deal with them. The circular firing squad it what happens if, after the race is essentially decided, candidates are still having to deal with each other.
This. Super tuesday is less than a month from now, where shit will start getting real in terms of convention delegates. A brutal battle for the nomination that is properly settled when decided is just what the nominee will need as preparation for dealing with Trump, the Republicans and the goddamn both-sides media.
Good grief. Mike Bloomberg is running campaign ads during the debate.
re: #90 BeachDem
Yay Elizabeth.
It is turning into a WWE event. I’m just shaking my head and wishing they had fewer debates.
TBH, on some level, our candidate has to be able to take trump on, and trump is nothing but bombast.
It may not be what I want in a POTUS, but it’s the reality of the times.
and something they need to realize is that millions of early votes have already been cast in California…including mine for Elizabeth!
Maybe if we change Liz Warren’s name to Hillary’s emails the media will stop ignoring her.
— The Volatile Mermaid (@OhNoSheTwitnt) February 19, 2020
Advantage of listening to the debate on Sirius—No Bloomberg ads…or Steyer’s…
Joe coughs, leading to weeks of breathless wingnut speculation that he’s dying of a wasting disease.
//
I guess a Bloomberg campaign works a little bit like supply-side economics.
re: #108 Barefoot Grin
I guess a Bloomberg campaign works a little bit like supply-side economics.
Do I want to know what would be trickling down on our heads then?
Bloomberg arriving at the debate pic.twitter.com/LtHLSspeyF
— Andrew Todd (@mistertodd) February 20, 2020
Warren’s dismantling of Bloomberg over his treatment of women was one of the most precise and devastating political attacks I have witnessed in twenty years of following this stuff
— Judd Legum (@JuddLegum) February 20, 2020
Warren is brilliant.
hm i wonder why this guy knows so much about NDAs 🤔 https://t.co/KilURCSX9b
— Pam Vogel (@pamela_vogel) February 20, 2020
re: #109 Chrysicat
Do I want to know what would be trickling down on our heads then?
Even from the 1980s I could only think of “trickle-down” in terms of that feeling when you’re a kid and just couldn’t hold it a second longer on a freezing winter day—a moment of warm bliss followed by icy cold misery.
🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
‘This isn’t about how it turned out. This is about what it was designed to do to begin with. It targeted communities of color. It targeted black and brown men from the beginning’: Warren on Bloomberg’s stop-and-frisk policy #DemDebate More coverage: https://t.co/cEgsgghcD8 pic.twitter.com/uGSXuYVmHl
— Reuters (@Reuters) February 20, 2020
What the hell is that smirk and dance from Klobuchar while Warren’s tearing her to pieces?
I fell in love with Warren about 20 years or so ago when I heard her on Fresh Air talking about the evil shit that the credit card companies were doing to us. They would change due dates every three of four months, etc. Little stuff to nickel and dime everyone. She had done her homework very very well.
Meanwhile:
Fitton deleted his “global,warming” tweet but here it is. The president has retweeted this guy 10 times today. pic.twitter.com/mWMN2p0Qmr
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) February 20, 2020
NATE SILVER
9:57 PM
I mean, the thing to remember, as I talked about earlier tonight, is that it’s not enough for Bloomberg to merely hold his ground. He has to GAIN more before Super Tuesday to really accumulate enough delegates to become a real threat to win the nomination, or at least to win it without a brokered convention. And tonight is going to make that harder. As to whether it causes some type of downward spiral, I don’t know how to estimate the odds of that. It’s one of the roughest stretches in a debate I’ve seen though for any candidate, though, and it comes at a time when the media coverage round Bloomberg is shifting in the direction of greater scrutiny.
Remember when people complained about how the DNC was helping Bloomberg by letting him on the debate stage?#DemDebate pic.twitter.com/78VtSGgHN7
— Hans Noel (@ProfHansNoel) February 20, 2020
That is…wild. https://t.co/3e9FzmZeba
— Ezra Klein (@ezraklein) February 20, 2020
FYI, the Hunter S. Thompson of our time is live-tweeting the debate. https://t.co/ALHhMjHr4H
— Respectable Lawyer (@RespectableLaw) February 20, 2020
MODERATOR: Thank you both—
EW: Sorry, one moment. (Turns to Trump) Donald, here’s your chance. Get it out of your system.
DT: (coyly) What?
EW: I’m giving you a free shot. Say it now, or I’ll rip your guts out when you say it later. Take the deal.
DT: (pause, whisper) Pocahontas.— Mike Sacks (@MikeSacksEsq) September 12, 2019
Elizabeth is the most impressive person on the stage— by far.
Wonder if she’ll get a sentence of coverage tomorrow. Nah, probably not…
I’ll be surprised if @ewarren doesn’t get a big boost in polling from tonight. She’s the star on that stage, by far.
— Charles Johnson (@Green_Footballs) February 20, 2020
re: #125 The Pie Overlord!
Having that last bit be ‘Pocahontas?’ would be perfect.
But Trump will not be in any general election debate.
Did Elizabeth warren just say she shot a man in Reno just to watch him die?
— Irin Carmon (@irin) February 20, 2020
re: #121 Yeah Sure WhatEVs
NATE SILVER
9:57 PM
…. It’s one of the roughest stretches in a debate I’ve seen though for any candidate, though, and it comes at a time when the media coverage round Bloomberg is shifting in the direction of greater scrutiny.
Scrutiny applies only to Democratic candidates — if the media had done a half-way decent job in 2016, there would be no President Trump. The media needs to focus on Trump and his criminality.
My local classical music DJ just cracked wise at the end of Holst’s Mars (which sounds like the death star blowing up in John Williams soundtrack) that it was the sound of what was left of Bloomberg’s campaign. BOOM!
I was wondering if these shows were prerecorded - I now know they aren’t :D
Just wanted to note that Elizabeth Warren is the first person on stage to explicitly say that toxic dumps are disproportionately in Black and Brown communities. #DemDebate
— Voto Latino (@votolatino) February 20, 2020
Hello Bernie.
re: #132 William Lewis
My local classical music DJ just cracked wise at the end of Holst’s Mars (which sounds like the death star blowing up in John Williams soundtrack) that it was the sound of what was left of Bloomberg’s campaign. BOOM!
I was wondering if these shows were prerecorded - I now know they aren’t :D
Originally George Lucas wanted to use Holst’s The Planets as the soundtrack for Star Wars!
Not all oldies are golden.
Trump brings up Hillary Clinton then nods and gives a thumbs up as his Phoenix crowd chants “lock her up!” pic.twitter.com/6yDzvAaIP5
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) February 20, 2020
Just made another donation to Warren. The entertainment value and enjoyment I have gotten from her in this debate earned it. I am still pessimistic she can get the nomination but she is by far my favorite remaining candidate!
re: #126 BeachDem
Elizabeth is the most impressive person on the stage— by far.
Wonder if she’ll get a sentence of coverage tomorrow. Nah, probably not…
Warren team says it’s the best hour of fundraising the entire campaign. https://t.co/wsqxDODmFq
— Alex Thompson (@AlxThomp) February 20, 2020
Does someone do it for him? Honest question……
— And the Wind Cries “I’ll Speak to My Ministers!” (@DaveoutofAustin) February 20, 2020
Not listening to the debate. Thanks for the updates. This Warren supporter is happy on what he is hearing. Very happy. She may not win, but she needs to go down fighting…. Sending her more money tomorrow. Love you guys.
re: #126 BeachDem
Elizabeth is the most impressive person on the stage— by far.
Wonder if she’ll get a sentence of coverage tomorrow. Nah, probably not…
It will be very interesting to see if the US political media tries to erase this debate performance by Warren. Ignoring a good story like this isn’t done unless ownership has ordered it.
“I think I’m the only person on this stage who has ever started a business.” Mike Bloomberg
— Bette Midler (@BetteMidler) February 20, 2020
re: #138 Dave In Austin
I just figured he had a full body Dyson Airblade.
I am a 2 1/2 issue voter.
1. GET TRUMP OUT OF THE OVAL OFFICE and away from the ability to abuse his Executive Branch powers
2. GET HIS CULTISTS OUT OF POWER IN THE SENATE (and keep them in the House minority)
2 1/2. And by so doing, halt the Federalist Society takeover of the Judicial Branch and begin beating it back.
My contention here is that only when those 2 (and a half) things happen in November is there any hope for any other issues, no matter how crucial.
The environment, immigration, economic justice, healthcare reform, LGBTQ+ rights, women’s rights, international relations? They ALL follow from putting Any Democrat in the Oval Office and 51 Democrats in the Senate.
Any Democrat is going to get only a small fraction of their particular personal agenda through a Congress that will still be divided with a loud and very angry Republican minority. I’m OK with that. It means no matter how dangerous you think Any Particular Democrat might be, they’re not going to be able to pull off anything too far out of the Democratic mainstream.
And so if you’re spending all day here or on Twitter (or on Twitter and then reposting it here!) telling me how Any Particular Democrat is going to bring on some kind of apocalyptic nightmare scenario, I’m not feeling you.
We know what THE apocalyptic nightmare scenario is, because we’re in year four of it right now and can’t afford years five through eight.
re: #143 i(m)p(each)sos
I am a 2 1/2 issue voter.
1. GET TRUMP OUT OF THE OVAL OFFICE and away from the ability to abuse his Executive Branch powers
2. GET HIS CULTISTS OUT OF POWER IN THE SENATE (and keep them in the House minority)
2 1/2. And by so doing, halt the Federalist Society takeover of the Judicial Branch and begin beating it back.
My contention here is that only when those 2 (and a half) things happen in November is there any hope for any other issues, no matter how crucial.
The environment, immigration, economic justice, healthcare reform, LGBTQ+ rights, women’s rights, international relations? They ALL follow from putting Any Democrat in the Oval Office and 51 Democrats in the Senate.
Any Democrat is going to get only a small fraction of their particular personal agenda through a Congress that will still be divided with a loud and very angry Republican minority. I’m OK with that. It means no matter how dangerous you think Any Particular Democrat might be, they’re not going to be able to pull off anything too far out of the Democratic mainstream.
And so if you’re spending all day here or on Twitter (or on Twitter and then reposting it here!) telling me how Any Particular Democrat is going to bring on some kind of apocalyptic nightmare scenario, I’m not feeling you.
We know what THE apocalyptic nightmare scenario is, because we’re in year four of it right now and can’t afford years five through eight.
I know that Warren is strong on helping other candidates. Not so much with Bernie or Bloomberg.,
WTAF! Warren has explained all her plans to the minutest detail. Bernie has mumbled “something something and then it happens” #DemDebate #Warren2020 https://t.co/MomipZtbUG
— Strawberry Cheesecake Overlord (@Pie_Overlord) February 20, 2020
re: #136 Schweppes7
Just made another donation to Warren. The entertainment value and enjoyment I have gotten from her in this debate earned it. I am still pessimistic she can get the nomination but she is by far my favorite remaining candidate!
Right there with you—had to change computers to get to my ActBlue account, but she definitely deserves support tonight.
Remember when people were worried this would turn into Bloomberg vs. Bernie?
Answering a question with a question, Bernie Chávez?
That’s not going to go over well.
bloomberg dismissing worker participation in corporate governance as “communism” is some 1920s plutocrat shit
— b-boy bouiebaisse (@jbouie) February 20, 2020
re: #145 The Pie Overlord!
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Just like Hillary. She sweats the details, and everyone is like, “ShE’s NoT InSpIrInG!”
Fuck that.
Bernie gives me a headache. (Bloomberg gives me a stomach ache)
I photoshopped Tom Selleck’s mustache onto Buttigieg during the commercial break. #DemDebate pic.twitter.com/QRRXVGPIQo
— Kris (@Articulate_indy) February 20, 2020
re: #144 I Would Prefer Not To
I know that Warren is strong on helping other candidates. Not so much with Bernie or Bloomberg.,
You don’t have to sell me on Warren. She’s been at the top of my list since the beginning and still is, in no small part because of the way she’d lift up downticket Democrats.
I agree Bernie wouldn’t. I’m of mixed mind about Bloomberg. The money he’s sending to Stacey Abrams’ group ought to have a huge impact downticket.
re: #147 Belafon
Remember when people were worried this would turn into Bloomberg vs. Bernie?
This is going to be one hell of a case study in media manipulation of debate results.
Question 1: Will Warren’s good performance be erased?
Question 2: Will Bloomberg’s rotten performance be erased?
Wow, it took the rich asshole to point out Bernie is a fucking hypocrite.
re: #141 The Pie Overlord!
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Yep, and we’ve seen how well the current businessman is running the country.
Bernie got one thing right. We have socialism for the rich and market discipline for everyone else’s.
re: #153 bratwurst
He forgot to put him in a Hawaiian shirt and holding a M1911 too :D
Oh, Lord. Bernie’s wealth tax is going to start at a billion and eventually come down to hitting 5 mil, isn’t it?
re: #160 Scottish Dragon
Bernie got one thing right. We have socialism for the rich and market discipline for everyone else’s.
Same with laws.
re: #160 Scottish Dragon
Bernie got one thing right. We have socialism for the rich and market discipline for everyone else’s.
We live in a Golden Society where the billionaires get golden parachutes and everyone else get golden showers!
re: #163 Yeah Sure WhatEVs
Same with laws.
The words that made me the sickest, that I encountered for the first time in the ‘teens, were “binds but does not protect”. With a side of “protects but does not bind”.
re: #160 Scottish Dragon
Bernie got one thing right. We have socialism for the rich and market discipline for everyone else’s.
Part of the problem is that very few people can even being to understand what a $ billion really amounts to. E.g., $5000/day for five fucking centuries is about $1 billion.
To get to a Bezos level, that would have to be $600,000 per day for those five centuries.
“To be liked by Mitch.” Hitting below the belt!
re: #165 Joe Bacon 🌹
We live in a Golden Society where the billionaires get golden parachutes and everyone else get golden showers!
Best definition of Trickle Down I’ve seen.
re: #143 i(m)p(each)sos
And so if you’re spending all day here or on Twitter (or on Twitter and then reposting it here!) telling me how Any Particular Democrat is going to bring on some kind of apocalyptic nightmare scenario, I’m not feeling you.
We know what THE apocalyptic nightmare scenario is, because we’re in year four of it right now and can’t afford years five through eight.
If Bernie is nominated, I fear the apocalyptic nightmare scenario of not only a McGovern/Mondale scale loss, but also a thrashing down-ticket.
“We can’t be so eager to be liked by Mitch McConnell that we forget how to fight Republicans”
God DAMN. pic.twitter.com/5WVLsY87A3— Doktor Zoom (@DoktorZoom) February 20, 2020
re: #171 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀 No Capt’n😷Trips
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Professor WArren took the night off and Pirate Warren subbed in. “TAKE NO PRISONERS!”
Well, the media pretty much is going to have to talk about Warren tomorrow, huh?
90 minutes in. #DemDebate https://t.co/QYnsf2dffc pic.twitter.com/AVJOxLRMVi
— NBC Politics (@NBCPolitics) February 20, 2020
re: #171 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀 No Capt’n😷Trips
Was that vs. Biden?
re: #171 FormerDirtDart 🍕🐀 No Capt’n😷Trips
If you are looking for the candidate that will fight Republicans, there’s your choice.
re: #162 Chrysicat
Oh, Lord. Bernie’s wealth tax is going to start at a billion and eventually come down to hitting 5 mil, isn’t it?
He might propose such a thing.
So what?
Show me how he gets it into a bill that can even be introduced in a Congress with only a narrow D edge… or more so, how he’d get such a thing PASSED, and then I’ll start worrying about it.
re: #170 sagehen
And so if you’re spending all day here or on Twitter (or on Twitter and then reposting it here!) telling me how Any Particular Democrat is going to bring on some kind of apocalyptic nightmare scenario, I’m not feeling you.
We know what THE apocalyptic nightmare scenario is, because we’re in year four of it right now and can’t afford years five through eight.
If Bernie is nominated, I fear the apocalyptic nightmare scenario of not only a McGovern/Mondale scale loss, but also a thrashing down-ticket.
I don’t think so. Bernie is popular, and the country is a lot less white than in 1972.
re: #158 Belafon
Yep, and we’ve seen how well the current businessman is running the country.
The current businessman inherited oodles, and still went bankrupt repeatedly. Most of his companies failed.
Bloomberg businessman started with nothing, and built a business that makes him now the 8th richest man in America. Also, he’s giving away most of that money.
re: #179 sagehen
The current businessman inherited oodles, and still went bankrupt repeatedly. Most of his companies failed.
Bloomberg businessman started with nothing, and built a business that makes him now the 8th richest man in America. Also, he’s giving away most of that money.
My opposition to having a businessman as president is almost completely unaffected by whether the businessman in question is good (Bloomberg) or shitty (Trump) at doing business.
She published the book, wrote your book, got tenure, turned that meeting into an email, did the revisions, chaired the committee, chaired the department, was promoted to full, edited the collection, wrote your report for the Dean, was distinguished af. https://t.co/cKiwxmXdBv
— honor sachs (@drhonor) February 20, 2020
The janitors are gonna busy tonight with all the blood drawn tonight.
I don’t know. Saying he has a “narrow vision” and “we can’t gamble on a revolution” were pretty straightforward. https://t.co/pjQIfpWKMm
— digby (@digby56) February 20, 2020
hahahaha
The Forward actual lol https://t.co/eFeaMCRS7E pic.twitter.com/KNWCzJgqcA
— andrew kaczynski🤔 (@KFILE) February 20, 2020
re: #178 NO SMOCKING GUN!
I don’t think so. Bernie is popular, and the country is a lot less white than in 1972.
Bernie is a socialist. The vast majority of voters, as indicated in polls just last week, are very against socialism… Like 70%+.
Apologies for a bit of a rant.
Are all poor folks the same? Are all lower-middle-class people the same? Middle? Are all millionaires the same? And yet some think we are supposed to sit here and presume all billionaires the same. Bloomberg no different than a weapons maker. An energy guy.
Bloomberg is very unlikely to get my vote. But the holier than thou angry post Occupy vision is how you re elect Donald Trump.
Biden seemed to gain momentum there for a sec by getting angry over attacks on his family…and then Warren slammed him back to the mat. Ouch.
re: #178 NO SMOCKING GUN!
His popularity is being inflated by Republican ratfuckers.
re: #185 Yeah Sure WhatEVs
Bernie is a socialist. The vast majority of voters, as indicated in polls just last week, are very against socialism… Like 70%+.
He isn’t really a socialist though. I prefer Warren; about the the same, but she doesn’t call herself a socialist.
Ouch. Whitebread-on-whitebread violence.
And Klobucop goes right back to another Stockdale moment.— (((Chrysi Cat))) [no, Karen is STILL my sister!] (@chrysicat) February 20, 2020
re: #173 Targetpractice
“I am the Dread Pirate Warren. There will be no survivors.”
re: #186 Rightwingconspirator
Apologies for a bit of a rant.
Are all poor folks the same? Are all lower-middle-class people the same? Middle? Are all millionaires the same? And yet some think we are supposed to sit here and presume all billionaires the same. Bloomberg no different than a weapons maker. An energy guy.Bloomberg is very unlikely to get my vote. But the holier than thou angry post Occupy vision is how you re elect Donald Trump.
I don’t know anyone on this page who said they wouldn’t vote for Bloomberg if he won the nomination. I will tell everyone to vote for him. I don’t have to sit here, though, and think it’s a good idea for him to be the nominee. And while he’s a great businessman, the government is not a company. And he might have been pretty good for New York, but there were some not nice things going on there, and it’s a city that is both more liberal and richer than a lot of the country.
re: #186 Rightwingconspirator
Apologies for a bit of a rant.
Are all poor folks the same? Are all lower-middle-class people the same? Middle? Are all millionaires the same? And yet some think we are supposed to sit here and presume all billionaires the same. Bloomberg no different than a weapons maker. An energy guy.Bloomberg is very unlikely to get my vote. But the holier than thou angry post Occupy vision is how you re elect Donald Trump.
All billionaires have god-like power in the US political and economic system. That’s just a fact. Assuming Trump is, in fact, a billionaire, he is among the worst of the lot, but nobody should have that kind of power. It corrupts, absolutely.
So it remains true that billionaires should not exist as a matter of public policy, and that having one try to buy up the D nomination at a time like this is basically appalling.
re: #178 NO SMOCKING GUN!
I don’t think so. Bernie is popular, and the country is a lot less white than in 1972.
Exactly. Any Democrat (even Bernie) starts out of the gate with 200 or so EVs. California and NY aren’t going Trump, period. That’s close to 100 EVs right there. Nor New England (give or take a Maine EV up north). Nor Hawaii or Washington or Oregon or Delaware or Maryland or NJ. Or Illinois.
The days when any candidate could have the kind of 400 EV sweep that Nixon or Reagan did are gone. Let’s deal with today’s reality.
Pete/Amy is the best feud in the primary — no policy content, purely personal animosity.
— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) February 20, 2020
“I knew Ted Kennedy. Ted Kennedy was my friend. Mayor Buttigieg, you are no Ted Kennedy.”
///
re: #191 NO SMOCKING GUN!
He isn’t really a socialist though. I prefer Warren; about the the same, but she doesn’t call herself a socialist.
He’s a self-identified socialist. The word alone scares Americans (for no reason other than right wing scaremongering).
I do not think Bernie can in a GE.
Chuck Todd is a very annoying individual. Also, he needs to let the comb-forward go.
re: #196 EPR-radar
All billionaires have god-like power in the US political and economic system. That’s just a fact…
I posit the idea that what they do and how they act with that money is a worthwhile difference to hold in regard. Call me crazy.
So the non-Democrat says the Democrats’ process for the convention should not be followed, but that the Bernie process should prevail. Alrighty then.
re: #204 BeachDem
So the non-Democrat says the Democrats’ process for the convention should not be followed, but that the Bernie process should prevail. Alrighty then.
GAH!
re: #202 Rightwingconspirator
I posit the idea that what they do and how they act with that money is a worthwhile difference to hold in regard. Call me crazy.
Sure, there are differences from one billionaire to another, and it is legit to point out that Bloomberg is probably a more benevolent demigod/overlord than Trump.
It is also legit to point out that such demigods should not exist in the first place.
And that is what scares me; Sanders supporters thinking he has been cheated if he has the pluarlity but doesn’t win the nomination.
Great new hire there for ya CNN:
This is going to be the Mike Bloomberg debate. He’s new and rising.
— Andrew Yang🧢 (@AndrewYang) February 20, 2020
re: #207 NO SMOCKING GUN!
And that is what scares me; Sanders supporters thinking he has been cheated if he has the pluarlity but doesn’t win the nomination.
He ain’t getting the plurality.
re: #205 Yeah Sure WhatEVs
GAH!
And Bloomberg only “assumes” that there’s some kind of process—he really hasn’t worried his little head about it.
Amy talks about immigration reform, Pete says Amy would vote for Donald Trump’s judges, Amy looks like she is going to fucking end him. She is literally gripping her podium and muttering under her breath. He is needling her. I fear for the rat’s life
— Diana Wilde (@cocksaiIor) February 20, 2020
If the draft dodging coward spends two minutes on stage he is lying about his much he cares about and supports the military and veterans. Two hours tonight and not one word. And we wonder why that SOB is still supported by those in the military. Candidates need to wake up
— American Veteran (@amvetsupport) February 20, 2020
re: #206 EPR-radar
Sure, there are differences from one billionaire to another, and it is legit to point out that Bloomberg is probably a more benevolent demigod/overlord than Trump.
It is also legit to point out that such demigods should not exist in the first place.
Agree there. It’s not the money (excatly) but the power, and power surely corrupts.
re: #213 NO SMOCKING GUN!
The polls right now say he will.
Wait till Super Tuesday when Bernie fizzles.
re: #201 Ace Rothstein
Chuck Todd is a very annoying individual. Also, he needs to let the comb-forward go.
Or find one other chubby bald guy and another a big forehead and shaggy hair shooting out the sides and back to complete the brand. I can’t remember who would turn to Chuck to say “Oh, a wise guy eh???”
“Won every race down to the fourth grade”?!?
Amy, Amy, Amy. I realise you also realise that you broke down unrecoverably, but you should really’ve ditched that line. It just sounds incredibly arrogant to suggest that even losing once is a deal-breaker, NOT A LEARNING EXPERIENCE.— (((Chrysi Cat))) [no, Karen is STILL my sister!] (@chrysicat) February 20, 2020
re: #154 i(m)p(each)sos
You don’t have to sell me on Warren. She’s been at the top of my list since the beginning and still is, in no small part because of the way she’d lift up downticket Democrats.
I agree Bernie wouldn’t. I’m of mixed mind about Bloomberg. The money he’s sending to Stacey Abrams’ group ought to have a huge impact downticket.
Yes, but Bloomberg won’t be able to campaign with others. He’s somewhat toxic.
Also:
re: #208 b.d. (Is Rush Dead Yet?)
Great new hire there for ya CNN:
[Embedded content]
Those likes must’ve all come before the debate started, ‘cause I can’t imagine you haven’t been constantly dragged ever since Warren and Sanders ganged up on him.
— (((Chrysi Cat))) [no, Karen is STILL my sister!] (@chrysicat) February 20, 2020
re: #212 jaunte
Wake up to what? Like there’s a single military Trump supporter that’s going to go “Well, Biden made a good point about the military, so I’m going to vote for him.” If they’re already Trump supporters, nothings going to change. The rest of them are where we are, hoping our favorite will win, but voting Democrat.
So there was a lot of yelling and fighting tonight, but it seems like they hardly asked many questions about any issues. I know, we’ve heard it all before—but it seemed like a very shallow debate to me. YMMV
re: #217 Chrysicat
Isn’t it true that Warren is the only candidate on that stage who has defeated a Republican incumbent? Granted that MA Sen is low-hanging fruit, the point still remains.
re: #222 BeachDem
So there was a lot of yelling and fighting tonight, but it seems like they hardly asked many questions about any issues. I know, we’ve heard it all before—but it seemed like a very shallow debate to me. YMMV
Huh?
Here’s what the sound of Amy Klobuchar’s dying chances sounded like: #DemDebate https://t.co/9RptrN9T04
— Kevin Baron (@DefenseBaron) February 20, 2020
Honestly, there should be themed debates. Doing so educates the public far more on issues & actually serves the purpose of distinguishing who knows what they’re talking about +who doesn’t.
Climate debate. Foreign policy debate. Healthcare. Racial justice. Labor&Econ. Can’t hide. https://t.co/jot1HzKesk— Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (@AOC) February 20, 2020
re: #222 BeachDem
So there was a lot of yelling and fighting tonight, but it seems like they hardly asked many questions about any issues. I know, we’ve heard it all before—but it seemed like a very shallow debate to me. YMMV
I wondered if it was like that the whole way through. I only caught the end.
I’m afraid that one thing they’ve learned is that discussing substantive policy issues is for losers.
My take:
Warren won, Biden needed this and exceeded expectations, Bernie was Bernie and the BernieBros will be happy, Pete held his own but didn’t gain any ground, Amy tanked but Bloomberg is toast.
re: #215 Joe Bacon 🌹
Wait till Super Tuesday when Bernie fizzles.
Bernie has a big lead in CA; I don’t think he is fizzling.
re: #231 NO SMOCKING GUN!
Bernie has a big lead in CA; I don’t think he is fizzling.
I’m one vote for Warren in CA.
re: #226 jaunte
I agree. They would all have to be on PBS, though, which I wouldn’t be against.
Bernie just own-goaled himself by noting the very reason his presidency would be a failure: Change doesn’t come from the top down.
Glad I didn’t early vote yet here in Texas. Was leaning towards Warren but now will vote for her with enthusiasm.
Apparently unclear on the concept of confidential
It seems like news today, but then-Rep. Rohrabacher went on camera and told our LA station in September 2017 that he was engaged in a “confidential interaction” with the WH on a pardon for Assange.https://t.co/2563YgQ9Rg
— Steven Portnoy (@stevenportnoy) February 19, 2020
re: #213 NO SMOCKING GUN!
The polls right now say he will.
Let’s wait for actual votes instead of these mystical polls.
re: #224 Scottish Dragon
Huh?
As AOC put it—
Honestly, there should be themed debates. Doing so educates the public far more on issues & actually serves the purpose of distinguishing who knows what they’re talking about +who doesn’t.
Tonight just seemed very “gotcha” and snarky to me.
re: #232 Joe Bacon 🌹
.
The No Kids In Cages people from RAICES.
re: #238 goddamnedfrank
Apparently unclear on the concept of confidential
[Embedded content]
Rohrabacher has never been the sharpest knife in the drawer.
So I wasn’t watching the debate at the beginning but when everyone started going on about Warren I tuned in to see what all the hubub was. Unless the second half was substantially different than the first half of the debate, I didn’t see it.
re: #240 BeachDem
As AOC put it—
Honestly, there should be themed debates. Doing so educates the public far more on issues & actually serves the purpose of distinguishing who knows what they’re talking about +who doesn’t.Tonight just seemed very “gotcha” and snarky to me.
I wouldn’t be opposed to that, but trying to get the networks to not run a GOP rally at the same time would be tough.
100% of the debate is done, and there was 0% talk of the raging corruption fire and the need for reforms to prevent this from ever happening again, including the need for the next president to help set up obstacles to presidential overreach. So that just happened.
— Walter Shaub (@waltshaub) February 20, 2020
Must be a nice feeling to know you lit 500 million dollars on fire the last two months and you don’t even blink an eye.
NEW: The Nevada #DemDebate is over.
Elizabeth Warren, Amy Klobuchar and Bernie Sanders racked up the most speaking time. https://t.co/3GlFt66hEb pic.twitter.com/Uu1pjS1MFb— NPR Politics (@nprpolitics) February 20, 2020
re: #245 jaunte
[Embedded content]
The corporate media got what they’ve been trying to provoke for months: A debate where the candidates spent more time fighting than they did answering the questions.
re: #245 jaunte
Warren brought up corruption in two of her answers.
re: #246 Ace Rothstein
Must be a nice feeling to know you lit 500 million dollars on fire the last two months and you don’t even blink an eye.
Can you imagine having so much that a half billion $ is pocket change?
re: #245 jaunte
Just a question: How do you write reform laws in such a way that they’re enforced even if Congress is controlled by people who will let the president get away with violating them?
— (((IntheNumbers))) (@ItsNumbersMan) February 20, 2020
re: #245 jaunte
Who is this Shaub douchebag? There is no such thing as process reform that can contain the crime/corruption instincts that Republicans all have. The only way to even begin to remove crime and corruption from government is to vote Republicans out of office always and everywhere, at every level of government.
re: #245 jaunte
[Embedded content]
25% of the debate is over and no questions about ethics reform, conflicts of interest or Justice Department independence. It’s almost as if we don’t have a corrupt demagogue leading a fascist movement in an assault on democracy. Did I accidentally change the channel to 2016?
This too—so much. I just didn’t think they asked any particularly important questions.
re: #253 EPR-radar
former Director of @OfficeGovEthics
re: #254 BeachDem
This too—so much. I just didn’t think they asked any particularly important questions.
I think the questions were asked with the end in view of triggering attacks between the candidates, rather than eliciting illuminating responses.
Why is Chuck Todd the Political Director of MSNBC?
re: #253 EPR-radar
Who is this Shaub douchebag? There is no such thing as process reform that can contain the crime/corruption instincts that Republicans all have. The only way to even begin to remove crime and corruption from government is to vote Republicans out of office always and everywhere, at every level of government.
former Director of @OfficeGovEthics. I think trump fired him.
re: #256 retired cynic
I think the questions were asked with the end in view of triggering attacks between the candidates, rather than eliciting illuminating responses.
Ayep. “[Insert Candidate Name] has said this about you/your ideas in the past days/weeks, take this opportunity to put a shiv between their ribs on live TV.”
re: #253 EPR-radar
Who is this Shaub douchebag? There is no such thing as process reform that can contain the crime/corruption instincts that Republicans all have. The only way to even begin to remove crime and corruption from government is to vote Republicans out of office always and everywhere, at every level of government.
Shaub was the director of the government ethics office until he quit when he realized Trump wasn’t going to listen anyway. This is his particular concern, and I agree that we need to make sure the guidelines are reinforced. But it will take retaking Congress to making it happen.
re: #257 jaunte
Why is Chuck Todd the Political Director of MSNBC?
Because David Gregory had the job before him?
Was going to watch the recap but then Chris Matthews started yapping so, click.
re: #255 jaunte
former Director of @OfficeGovEthics
Ah. At least he’s apparently not a ratfucking both-siderist.
But there’s still an unreasonable level of optimism that lawless people like Republicans can be bound by process and legal reforms.
This was already apparent back in the W Bush era, with the “We act, you analyze, we act again while you’re still analyzing that first thing…” shit. Trump has turned that up to 11.
I think we would actually have to pass a constitutional amendment stating that the president and vice president are required to sell everything down to a single home, mutual funds, and cash in order to take the oath to prevent having what Trump has.
re: #264 Belafon
I think we would actually have to pass a constitutional amendment stating that the president and vice president are required to sell everything down to a single home, mutual funds, and cash in order to take the oath to prevent having what Trump has.
Even if this were done, so what? We have just had it proven in great detail that an unimpeachable US president is above all laws and customs.
re: #263 EPR-radar
I think Schaub, like many of us, is still feeling stunned at how much of our system was protected by norms, and vulnerable to a group of vandals that don’t give a shit.
re: #207 NO SMOCKING GUN!
And that is what scares me; Sanders supporters thinking he has been cheated if he has the pluarlity but doesn’t win the nomination.
Sanders supporters will think he was cheated even if he doesn’t have a plurality.
A “wealth tax” to fund domestic programs, what a radical idea that Democrats have never tried before, crazy stuff, wow. pic.twitter.com/c83x96sXcO
— Kevin M. Kruse (@KevinMKruse) February 20, 2020
re: #266 jaunte
I think Schaub, like many of us, is still feeling stunned at how much of our system was protected by norms, and vulnerable to a group of vandals that don’t give a shit.
Well, to be crude we can’t afford for any of the good guys to be in shock and dismay. Voting out Republicans always and everywhere at every opportunity is the only possible path to a solution, and the sooner every non-republican gets on board with this insanely simplistic-seeming approach to politics, the better.
Klobuchar imploded, some serious anger issues , “ temperament for the job “ ?
— Joseph Patrick (@JosephPatrick53) February 20, 2020
She can be baited as badly as the king can, val.
Make her think anyone called her stupid and she literally begins shaking with rage.
And she never really regained her calm afterwards.— (((Chrysi Cat))) [no, Karen is STILL my sister!] (@chrysicat) February 20, 2020
re: #265 EPR-radar
Even if this were done, so what? We have just had it proven in great detail that an unimpeachable US president is above all laws and customs.
I agree that McConnell and the rest of the GOP’s attitude is contributing to Trump. All the amendment does is prevent the person from getting into office. And yes, verifying it would have to be part of the rule.
re: #271 Chrysicat
[Embedded content]
And thought that “Not everyone can be as perfect as you, Pete” was a great way to show maturity.
You know who would be really, really good to hear from about the importance of the Culinary Union? Anthony Bourdain.
re: #264 Belafon
I think we would actually have to pass a constitutional amendment stating that the president and vice president are required to sell everything down to a single home, mutual funds, and cash in order to take the oath to prevent having what Trump has.
Maybe one or two single-family-at-the-largest homes in resort sites as well. As long as they’re not rented at anything above market value for the area and are only rented to people who either aren’t government employees or don’t know the First Family owns it.
That ski condo, or small ski home, would be nice to be able to return to at the end of the term, even if the Secret Service would never let them occupy it as president.
Please, please, Mr. VP, drag Chuck Todd for not asking the quest—
YES!!!!
re: #272 Belafon
I agree that McConnell and the rest of the GOP’s attitude is contributing to Trump. All the amendment does is prevent the person from getting into office. And yes, verifying it would have to be part of the rule.
Ah. I misread your proposal. Since it would apply to a president-elect, there’s a possibility the prior administration would actually enforce it. But if it’s one GOP administration to the next, enforcement is entirely up to the outgoing president, unless we completely change the powers of the presidency (which might actually be what’s needed).
re: #275 Chrysicat
Maybe one or two single-family-at-the-largest homes in resort sites as well. As long as they’re not rented at anything above market value for the area and are only rented to people who either aren’t government employees or don’t know the First Family owns it.
That ski condo, or small ski home, would be nice to be able to return to at the end of the term, even if the Secret Service would never let them occupy it as president.
That’s cool. We just need to make the emoluments clause NOT conditional on Congressional support.
I know that my opinion might not carry much weight as a man, but it felt to me like Klobucher really wanted to spin that “Are you calling me stupid?” moment as an attack on her gender.
re: #278 Belafon
That’s cool. We just need to make the emoluments clause NOT conditional on Congressional support.
How that hell do we do that without completely rewriting the constitution?
re: #280 EPR-radar
How that hell do we do that without completely rewriting the constitution?
That’s why I said a constitutional amendment.
Biden kicked Brian Williams in the ass repeatedly about attacking Hunter.
I’m howling pic.twitter.com/XttOqStkLV
— Josh Schrock (@Schrock_And_Awe) February 20, 2020
I will have to congratulate Sanders on making this statement:
SEN. SANDERS: It is my policy and i’m very proud of that policy. what we need to do to deal with this grotesque level of income and wealth inequality, to make sure those people who are working, do you know why, Mr. Bloomberg? It wasn’t you who made all that money—maybe your workers played some role in that as well.
re: #281 Belafon
That’s why I said a constitutional amendment.
The emoluments clause is already in the constitution. So what exactly would a super-emoluments clause look like? Would it set up a special emoluments police that is supreme on this one issue and is accountable to neither Congress nor the President?
That’s about the only way to take its enforcement out of the hands of Congress and the President, but it’s fairly clear this wouldn’t help.
It is magical thinking to believe that new laws or constitutional amendments are some kind of fix for Trump and the Republicans. The only fix is to vote them out of office, especially since that may eventually not be possible if there is too much fucking around by non-Republicans.
This is why I love Maxine!
It’s not enough for Barr to resign. I want him out of DOJ, disbarred, disgraced, & investigated for obstruction of justice. Barr sabotaged Mueller report, was in on Ukraine plot, & now he wants to free Trump’s criminal friends. In my estimation, they ALL belong in jail!
— Maxine Waters (@RepMaxineWaters) February 18, 2020
re: #282 Joe Bacon 🌹
Biden kicked Brian Williams in the ass repeatedly about attacking Hunter.
That was one of the better moments for Joe tonight, when he began to show some righteous anger for the way that he and his family have been treated. Too bad it was as part of a defensive response to a comment from Warren, who then proceeded to lay him out for how chummy he was with Mitch McConnell back in the day.
re: #258 Yeah Sure WhatEVs
former Director of @OfficeGovEthics. I think trump fired him.
Nah. They ignored every single time he told them “no you can’t do that,” “stop, please, that’s against the rules”, “there’s a reason for these policies y’know, it’s important”…. They refused to do anything he said, so he quit so he’d be able to speak publicly.
re: #285 EPR-radar
The emoluments clause is already in the constitution. So what exactly would a super-emoluments clause look like? Would it set up a special emoluments police that is supreme on this one issue and is accountable to neither Congress nor the President?
That’s about the only way to take its enforcement out of the hands of Congress and the President, but it’s fairly clear this wouldn’t help.
It is magical thinking to believe that new laws or constitutional amendments are some kind of fix for Trump and the Republicans. The only fix is to vote them out of office, especially since that may eventually not be possible if there is too much fucking around by non-Republicans.
Yes, and only white landowning men can vote, blacks were slaves, and Senators cannot be directly elected.
I know that we have to vote them out of office. It’s all I preach. But when they are out, we are going to try to put some things in place to reduce the chance of someone like Trump, or, more importantly, someone like Trump using government resources for personal gain.
re: #275 Chrysicat
Maybe one or two single-family-at-the-largest homes in resort sites as well. As long as they’re not rented at anything above market value for the area and are only rented to people who either aren’t government employees or don’t know the First Family owns it.
That ski condo, or small ski home, would be nice to be able to return to at the end of the term, even if the Secret Service would never let them occupy it as president.
Which wouldn’t have been any kind of problem for John Kerry or John McCain, because their pre-nups said all the money and property belonged to their wives.
The Democrats, live on TV,
Debated which issues were key,
& Liz, teaching class,
Handed Mike his whole ass,
A thing that we all love to see.— Limericking (@Limericking) February 20, 2020
re: #278 Belafon
That’s cool. We just need to make the emoluments clause NOT conditional on Congressional support.
The Emoluments clause has been looked at with a wink and a nod since the very beginning. Washington was one of the biggest landholders in the country and passed laws and pushed infrastructure bills that vastly increased the value of his western holdings. He remained involved in the day to day running of his estates and there are even documents in the archives where he directly solicits business aid from English officials.
It feels like unless a Saudi Prince hands the president a briefcase full of cash the whole emoluments thing isn’t going to get enough people worked up to make a difference.
re: #290 sagehen
Which wouldn’t have been any kind of problem for John Kerry or John McCain, because their pre-nups said all the money and property belonged to their wives.
Well, if my rule were in place, they probably wouldn’t have run for office. And they wouldn’t be able to sell it to immediate family.
Oh, and another amendment idea I have is that a president can’t pardon family, friends, business associates, and anyone that was appointed by the president.
Of all the bad takes prior to the debate, the ones that said Bloomberg could only benefit from being onstage tonight and the DNC were getting him on the stage to go after Bernie rank towards the top.
re: #292 danarchy
Yep. As I said, it shouldn’t be conditional on Congressional support.
re: #269 jaunte
A “wealth tax” to fund domestic programs, what a radical idea that Democrats have never tried before, crazy stuff, wow. pic.twitter.com/c83x96sXcO
— Kevin M. Kruse (@KevinMKruse) February 20, 2020
My continuing objection to the annual wealth tax is its enforceability. We cannot even get the IRS to investigate income taxes of the wealthy on a thorough basis— if they did their job, Trump would probably have been in prison 30 years ago.
For a wealth tax, it’s not as though you can just look at the balance of a stock portfolio at the end of the year. You have to evaluate other assets: artwork? collectibles? real estate? privately held companies? cars? boats? planes? etc.
Far more practical:
1. Repeal the 2017 tax law in its entirety
2. Increase estate taxes by adding additional brackets
3. Eliminate the carried interest loophole
4. Add brackets to income taxes.
re: #293 Belafon
Well, if my rule were in place, they probably wouldn’t have run for office. And they wouldn’t be able to sell it to immediate family.
Oh, and another amendment idea I have is that a president can’t pardon family, friends, business associates, and anyone that was appointed by the president.
Curbing the pardoning power is a solid idea. I’d extend it to include anyone who ever contributed more than $500 to the president’s political party or to any candidate or PAC affiliated with the president’s party.
re: #296 Hecuba’s daughter
Tax capital gains as ordinary income.
re: #296 Hecuba’s daughter
My continuing objection to the annual wealth tax is its enforceability. We cannot even get the IRS to investigate income taxes of the wealthy on a thorough basis— if they did their job, Trump would probably have been in prison 30 years ago.
For a wealth tax, it’s not as though you can just look at the balance of a stock portfolio at the end of the year. You have to evaluate other assets: artwork? collectibles? real estate? privately held companies? cars? boats? planes? etc.
Far more practical:
1. Repeal the 2017 tax law in its entirety
2. Increase estate taxes by adding additional brackets
3. Eliminate the carried interest loophole
4. Add brackets to income taxes.
All the IRS to keep part of the proceeds on any penalty collection over, say, $5M.
re: #295 Belafon
Yep. As I said, it shouldn’t be conditional on Congressional support.
Any condition would have to be enforced by someone. If not congress, then who? The DOJ…Ha! Some “independent” body appointed by (congress, the courts, the previous president, directly elected). What enforcement authority does this body have and who is it backed by. At the end of the day it is going to be congress and the courts.
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re: #296 Hecuba’s daughter
My continuing objection to the annual wealth tax is its enforceability. We cannot even get the IRS to investigate income taxes of the wealthy on a thorough basis— if they did their job, Trump would probably have been in prison 30 years ago.
For a wealth tax, it’s not as though you can just look at the balance of a stock portfolio at the end of the year. You have to evaluate other assets: artwork? collectibles? real estate? privately held companies? cars? boats? planes? etc.
In my experience of an actually existing wealth tax the IRS (or Direction générale des Finances publiques in my case) don’t actually have to do much work. They just tell you what you have to declare and you do all the work. They randomly pull a few cases out and check ‘em every year, coming down on anyone who cheated like a tonne of briques.
(I had no problem with paying it, as I was only slightly over the threshold, but it was a total pain in the arse calculating how much I was “worth”, to avoid problems I was almost always forced to overestimate it).