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Names of Itamar attack victims cleared for publication Saturday evening: Udi Fogel, 36, Ruth Fogel, 35, and their children Yoav, 11, Elad, 4, and three-month-old Hadas were stabbed to death. Surviving kids staying with grandparents
6 comments
1 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sat, Mar 12, 2011 5:13:48pm |
My heart goes out to the surviving kids. I hope Israelis catch the beast soon.
| 2 |
CuriousLurker Sat, Mar 12, 2011 5:38:43pm |
This is beyond horrifying. How does someone become such a monster that they can justify the brutal murder not only of innocents, but of little children? Of a BABY? How do these butchers even manage to drag themselves out of bed in the morning with their bodies wrapped around the heavy burden of such utterly corrupted, blackened souls?
And the surviving children, especially the boy that saw the murder and the girl who say the bodies, what will this do to their young hearts & minds? No child, and I mean no child anywhere EVER, should have to witness such a thing. May God bless them, keep them, and help them heal.
| 3 |
researchok Sat, Mar 12, 2011 5:46:36pm |
re: #2 CuriousLurker
This is beyond horrifying. How does someone become such a monster that they can justify the brutal murder not only of innocents, but of little children? Of a BABY? How do these butchers even manage to drag themselves out of bed in the morning with their bodies wrapped around the heavy burden of such utterly corrupted, blackened souls?
And the surviving children, especially the boy that saw the murder and the girl who say the bodies, what will this do to their young hearts & minds? No child, and I mean no child anywhere EVER, should have to witness such a thing. May God bless them, keep them, and help them heal.
How does it happen?
When you create an environment led by dysfunctional misfits, well, it is going to happen.
Another tragedy is that a kid born today into an environment led by Hamas or other dysfunctional 'religious' despots can be sure of only one thing- he or she will be taught to hate.
In the end, Muslims everywhere will pay the price.
| 4 |
CuriousLurker Sat, Mar 12, 2011 6:17:41pm |
re: #3 researchok
How does it happen?
When you create an environment led by dysfunctional misfits, well, it is going to happen.
Another tragedy is that a kid born today into an environment led by Hamas or other dysfunctional 'religious' despots can be sure of only one thing- he or she will be taught to hate.
If that's the case, then it means there is no foreseeable end to the 60+ years violent conflict. It will just continue to drag on indefinitely leaving a bloody trail of broken, wasted lives & misery in its wake.
In the end, Muslims everywhere will pay the price.
Jews are paying a price as well. Not only in loss of life, but in time, money, and effort that must be directed at dealing with hostilities instead of more productive endeavors.
The psychological toll of being locked in a decades-long death grip with your opponent cannot be healthy for either side.
The whole situation is depressing, confounding, and (seemingly) hopeless.
| 5 |
researchok Sat, Mar 12, 2011 6:39:24pm |
re: #4 CuriousLurker
If that's the case, then it means there is no foreseeable end to the 60+ years violent conflict. It will just continue to drag on indefinitely leaving a bloody trail of broken, wasted lives & misery in its wake.
Jews are paying a price as well. Not only in loss of life, but in time, money, and effort that must be directed at dealing with hostilities instead of more productive endeavors.
The psychological toll of being locked in a decades-long death grip with your opponent cannot be healthy for either side.
The whole situation is depressing, confounding, and (seemingly) hopeless.
Every word you say is true.
If a peace treaty were signed tomorrow- and embraced and endorsed by all parties, it would take 30 years for the cultures (both of them) to experience fundamental change. That's how long it takes for real change to take hold.
For example, it took the post war Germans 20-25 years to fundamentally change their society and effectively rejoin Europe- and they are Germans with ordnung.
Post war Israel was filled with psychologically traumatized and damaged refugees from the European Holocaust. They influenced the Israeli government for decades and that played into Arafat, et al, who needed to point to Israel as the great Bogeyman. It wasn't until the late 70's-early 80's that Israel really blossomed as a nation and saw herself less a victim and more as an 'equal' on the world stage.
Thus, even Gazans formerly under Israeli have a lower infant mortality rate than Libyans, a higher life expectancy and standard of living than Egyptians and higher literacy levels than Bahrain. This was result of the Israeli policies and programs in the aftermath of the Six Day War. They understood the 'victim mentality'.
Nowadays, it's a whole new game.
Sadly.
| 6 |
sliv_the_eli Sat, Mar 12, 2011 7:31:42pm |
re: #4 CuriousLurker
If that's the case, then it means there is no foreseeable end to the 60+ years violent conflict. It will just continue to drag on indefinitely leaving a bloody trail of broken, wasted lives & misery in its wake.
Jews are paying a price as well. Not only in loss of life, but in time, money, and effort that must be directed at dealing with hostilities instead of more productive endeavors.The psychological toll of being locked in a decades-long death grip with your opponent cannot be healthy for either side.
The whole situation is depressing, confounding, and (seemingly) hopeless.
re: #5 researchok
The question of whether there is any real hope for peace in our lifetimes has, since Oslo, hinged on whether the Palestinian leadership is willing to educate the younger generation for peace and co-existence. Because the West has failed to hold the PA accountable for their obligation to do so, or to use the huge sums of money with which they finance the Palestinian administration as leverage to force them to do so, an entire generation and more which could have been slowly re-educated to be amenable to the concept of co-existence are instead poisoned with the same bigoted, antisemitic tripe that led previous generations in the Arab world to threaten to finish what Hitler started. One need only look at the fact that only last week, the so-called "moderate" Fatah, Israel's supposed partner for peace, was as quick as Hamas to denounce UNRWA's plan for introducing basic education about the Shoah into the 8th grade curriculum.
The sad reality is that peace is not on the horizon. Most Israelis understand this, which is why their polity shifted to the right after the failure of the withdrawals from Lebanon and from Gaza, both of which brought more, not less, terror and neither of which brought the promised-for recognition from the rest of the world for Israel's willingness to take risks and make concessions for peace.
Just as sadly, the West and its opinion-influencing elites are, if anything, less inclined today than at any time in my memory to deal with this dispute with any modicum of intellectual honesty, as witnessed by the fact that the cold-blooded murder of a family, including a three-month old baby, is reported as an "attack on settlers" and not as the bestial act that it is.
Until and unless this changes, there is, sadly, no hope for peace. Israelis will continued to be trapped in an occupation that the overwhelming majority of them have not and do not want, but which the overwhelming majority of them understand is a matter of life and death.
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