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1 theheat  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 6:07:50am

Simple carbohydrates and red meat as far as the eye can see. A gritty, greasy, oily, filthy, black, sooty existence like the bottom of a coal mine. Education and enlightenment is shunned in favor of the workin' man in a filthy bitch beater that works hard, prays hard, and never gets ahead despite eternal toil. Stupid and simple becomes a singular virtue. Women have lots of babies and, for no scientific reason whatsoever, there's plenty of food, space, resources, and cheap housing for everyone.

This is the future the GOP is dragging the entire country toward, Goya's "Man Looking For Fleas In His Shirt."

2 BARACK THE VOTE  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 7:45:42am

re: #1 theheat

Simple carbohydrates and red meat as far as the eye can see. A gritty, greasy, oily, filthy, black, sooty existence like the bottom of a coal mine. Education and enlightenment is shunned in favor of the workin' man in a filthy bitch beater that works hard, prays hard, and never gets ahead despite eternal toil. Stupid and simple becomes a singular virtue. Women have lots of babies and, for no scientific reason whatsoever, there's plenty of food, space, resources, and cheap housing for everyone.

This is the future the GOP is dragging the entire country toward, Goya's "Man Looking For Fleas In His Shirt."

Can I just say again how much I love your rants? Well, I just did.

3 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 9:07:18am

'Right to work' is such a fucking Orwellian sobriquet.

4 theheat  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 10:57:44am

re: #2 iceweasel

Can I just say again how much I love your rants? Well, I just did.

Your stuff should be required reading for the idiots still believing the GOP is the party of fiscal responsibility. It' so much darker than that.

5 BARACK THE VOTE  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 11:00:13am

re: #4 theheat

Your stuff should be required reading for the idiots still believing the GOP is the party of fiscal responsibility. It' so much darker than that.


re: #4 theheat

Your stuff should be required reading for the idiots still believing the GOP is the party of fiscal responsibility. It' so much darker than that.

Aw, thanks! mutual admiration society, sweet!

But seriously, you're right-- it's extremely dark. And people still resist seeing it.

6 Decatur Deb  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 11:14:40am

Coincidence.

7 moderatelyradicalliberal  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 2:27:13pm

These people in blue and purple states are going to be very sorry for their reactionary voting in 2010. I'm sure they have no desire to become more like the deep south states, but that's what happens when you vote like Mississippi, Alabama and South Carolina. The can reverse course in 2012, but the damage in the meantime will be immense.

On the good news front, Gov Walker has completely erased the "enthusiasm gap" in Wisconsin.

[Link: andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com...]

8 nines09  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 3:05:53pm

re: #1 theheat

Simple carbohydrates and red meat as far as the eye can see. A gritty, greasy, oily, filthy, black, sooty existence like the bottom of a coal mine. Education and enlightenment is shunned in favor of the workin' man in a filthy bitch beater that works hard, prays hard, and never gets ahead despite eternal toil. Stupid and simple becomes a singular virtue. Women have lots of babies and, for no scientific reason whatsoever, there's plenty of food, space, resources, and cheap housing for everyone.

This is the future the GOP is dragging the entire country toward, Goya's "Man Looking For Fleas In His Shirt."


But it's a grassroots movement. Of the people. By the people. For the people.
Of course it all depends on which people you are, doesn't it?

9 theheat  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 5:14:30pm

re: #8 nines09

IIRC, slavery was a movement by the people, and most all the South was on board.

It's a swell arrangement unless you happen to be gay, non religious, the wrong religion, the wrong ethnic group, a woman, handicapped, or have any kind of affinity for education, science, art, international relations, concern for the planet, or care one whit about anyone but goddamned yourself.

I mean, except for that kind of silly stuff, fuck yeah, sign me up.

10 KingKenrod  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 5:40:23pm

For me, the forced payment of union dues as a condition of employment has as much moral legitimacy as a poll tax.

It is entirely legitimate that workers who see manufacturing jobs leaving their state for right-to-work states (or overseas) put some blame on unions who drive up the cost of labor but provide little benefit that our legal system doesn't already provide.

If I worked in a unionized field, I would join the union (provided they showed some amount of competence) because I see the benefits of organized labor. But I also see the bad side and would not force others to do the same.

How can people think that workers have a right to unionize, while at the same time claim a worker doesn't have the right to work unless they support the union? For me, the right to work is more important that guaranteeing unions have an adequate income stream.

11 sagehen  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 9:08:30pm

re: #10 KingKenrod

It is entirely legitimate that workers who see manufacturing jobs leaving their state for right-to-work states (or overseas) put some blame on unions who drive up the cost of labor but provide little benefit that our legal system doesn't already provide.

If unions are "driving up the cost of labor" (i.e., getting you higher wages than you'd have without them), how can you say you're not getting your money's worth from your dues? And how does our legal system "already provide" the benefits (individual lawsuits one at a time?) that come from collective bargaining?

This "adequate income stream" that people whine about for the unions... you do realize they're nonprofit, right? They spend that income on top-notch negotiaters and lawyers, support for politicians who are more concerned with workers' interests than the Koch brothers' interests, etc. Some of the top union people probably make pretty good salaries, but it's still not even close to what the top four or five levels or management at a Fortune 500 brings home.

I don't even know what the "bad side" is. They're not letting you offer yourself for jobs at less than prevailing wage? They're making it so 4000 unemployed people don't desperately beg to replace 4000 employed people for half the money, so there'd then be just as many unemployed, but the people who are still working will be making less?

12 nines09  Sun, Mar 13, 2011 9:12:02pm

re: #9 theheat
I'm with you. What is happening is a blatant GOVERNMENT anti-union action. Why is the government doing this? For you? For the economy? For the budget? As iceweasel says, "Follow the money."
I think Wisconsin has the best Governor money can buy.

13 kingkenrod  Mon, Mar 14, 2011 7:45:17am

re: #11 sagehen

If unions are "driving up the cost of labor" (i.e., getting you higher wages than you'd have without them), how can you say you're not getting your money's worth from your dues? And how does our legal system "already provide" the benefits (individual lawsuits one at a time?) that come from collective bargaining?

This "adequate income stream" that people whine about for the unions... you do realize they're nonprofit, right? They spend that income on top-notch negotiaters and lawyers, support for politicians who are more concerned with workers' interests than the Koch brothers' interests, etc. Some of the top union people probably make pretty good salaries, but it's still not even close to what the top four or five levels or management at a Fortune 500 brings home.

I don't even know what the "bad side" is. They're not letting you offer yourself for jobs at less than prevailing wage? They're making it so 4000 unemployed people don't desperately beg to replace 4000 employed people for half the money, so there'd then be just as many unemployed, but the people who are still working will be making less?

Those are fine points, but have nothing to do with denying someone the right to work unless they pay up. That's why I equated it morally with a poll tax - you are arguing that someone's basic human right can be denied because they won't pay a fee. Regardless of how beneficial unions are, it is fundamentally wrong.


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