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1 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 9:05:00am

Don’t feel quite so bad about having my hidden chocolate stash now.

2 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 9:52:53am

So many people see only the extremes of selfishness and martyrdom. The idea of putting yourself first seems so wrong. Yet, financial gurus tell us to “pay ourselves first” if we want to have any savings account. Flight attendants say to put the oxygen mask on ourselves first, then our young children.

The idea is not to give so much away that we, lose ourselves as individuals and make ourselves slaves to the needs of others. Not to put the needs of others before our own responsibilities, which includes ourselves.

I think finding the balance is a life long endeavor, especially for parents.

It is sad when narcissistic individuals use what I call “righteous selfishness” as an excuse to avoid their responsibilities.

3 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 9:59:13am

Ayn Rand and Alice Walker: two very fucked up individuals.

4 calochortus  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 10:22:20am

I find it a little disturbing that, if I read this right, selfishly ignoring one’s children is considered a feminist principle.
I consider myself a rock-ribbed feminist, and my choice was to have children and stay home to raise them. I support the right of other women to not have children, or to have day-care for their children, or have the dad stay home-whatever works for them. I support parents who decide they have to a child up for adoption for whatever reason.

I do not support the rights of men or women to ignore their children, or blame them for being born.

5 What, me worry?  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 2:43:20pm

re: #4 calochortus

I find it a little disturbing that, if I read this right, selfishly ignoring one’s children is considered a feminist principle.
I consider myself a rock-ribbed feminist, and my choice was to have children and stay home to raise them. I support the right of other women to not have children, or to have day-care for their children, or have the dad stay home-whatever works for them. I support parents who decide they have to a child up for adoption for whatever reason.

I do not support the rights of men or women to ignore their children, or blame them for being born.

My mom was similar - a Head Start teacher working with young children. My mom was all about kids.

She was also a feminist and taught me the value of being female and standing up for myself which for me has always been the heart of feminism. Women deserve all the freedom and opportunities of the opposite sex.

At any rate, this story of Rand v Walker is a great example of how the far right fringe and the far left fringe finally meet around the circle.

6 What, me worry?  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 2:59:19pm

Michael, a great article and connection but I don’t know about your last paragraph. Trauma will happen to people and children will continue to be neglected and abused. Has it ever changed? or will it?

My grandmother was 12 when she came to the U.S. with her 9 year old sister. Torn from her parents and 5 brothers in Russia, they came here in 1921 to live with cousins, but really were strangers. They didn’t know the language nor the customs and were told that it was because of the war (the end of WWI) that it wasn’t safe for them to stay. It wasn’t, but little kinds don’t get that. My grandmother’s family were brutally massacred by the Ukrainians, the Nazi’s puppets.

My grandmother remained a bitter woman throughout her life. After the birth of my aunt, she swore not to have another child. She contracted phlebitis and nearly lost her legs so when she became pregnant with my mom, she became even more bitter.

My mother told me never did she hear the words “I love you” from her mom. At the end of the day, my grandmother read her a list of all the horrible things she did and what a terrible person she was. My mother was saved, oddly, but incredibly good looks. People were naturally attracted to her and eventually it brought her out of her shell.

She swore to never treat her children like this. To have compassion, love, caring and nurturing. Was she a perfect mom? No way! But she was a good mom. Still is!

My mother is almost 80 now. She finally wrote a book about her experiences as a kid growing up in the shadow of immigrant parents. I don’t know Alice Walker’s story, but I’m sure there is one to be so harsh to her child. I hope Rebecca Walker can find some comfort from something in her mother or maybe just know that this thing will never happen to her own child.

7 calochortus  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 3:34:00pm

re: #5 marjoriemoon

Amen.

re: #6 marjoriemoon

What an amazing family story. It is always fascinating to me how some people manage to come out of such situations relatively whole and others don’t.

8 What, me worry?  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 5:45:32pm

re: #7 calochortus

Amen.

re: #6 marjoriemoon

What an amazing family story. It is always fascinating to me how some people manage to come out of such situations relatively whole and others don’t.

Thank you!

We are all victims to our own circumstance and we all try to rise above it in our own way. Alice Walker was the daughter of sharecroppers, a civil rights activist who studied at the feet of MLK, a Pulitzer Prize winner for The Color Purple and with many more awards and accolades for other novels and writings.

She also hung out with extreme left wing groups like Code Pink and travelled to Gaza to deliver aid to the Palestinians. Odd that she had once married a Jew (Rebecca’s father) but later on also had a romantic relationship with Tracy Chapman. The woman went through a lot of changes

It doesn’t excuse child neglect and my heart goes out to Rebecca, but it seems to explain a complex woman and with her all greatness, had a very dark side.

I have an image in my mind I got back from my hippie days of each daughter standing on her mother’s shoulders. We grow a little taller and a little wiser with each generation.

9 What, me worry?  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 5:48:40pm

Sorry, my info here: [Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

10 calochortus  Mon, Jun 20, 2011 7:49:09pm

re: #8 marjoriemoon


I have an image in my mind I got back from my hippie days of each daughter standing on her mother’s shoulders. We grow a little taller and a little wiser with each generation.

Sadly, that’s not always true-I remember a book I read decades ago about a family that had 6 generations of females living (the youngest was an infant.) The writer had expected a tale of wisdom being passed from one generation to the next, but sadly, that was not the case. The eldest woman had been born into a well-to-do family that had fallen on hard times and none of the subsequent generations had risen out of poverty. (Having children young could have had something to do with that.) One of the women was asked why she didn’t warn her own daughter about the risks of marrying very young (as she had) and the reply was along the lines of “I figured she had a right to make her own mistakes.”
My take on it was even if she did, you could have shared your own experience with her first.


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