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15 comments

1 Buck  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 1:38:58pm

In order to believe this you have to believe that Mao Zedong was on the left ('killed 45 million in four years'). You have to accept that Joseph Stalin was a lefty (17 million Russians killed).

You also have to think that Socialism is "left". I just don't know how to decide how many people were killed by Communism and Socialism (Lenin, Pol Pot, Castro, Ernesto "Che" Guevara and Kim Jung Il).

Billion is a silly number... it just rolls off the tongue.

A hundred million? Half a billion?

2 thecommodore  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 2:37:23pm

re: #1 Buck

In order to believe this you have to believe that Mao Zedong was on the left ('killed 45 million in four years'). You have to accept that Joseph Stalin was a lefty (17 million Russians killed).

You also have to think that Socialism is "left". I just don't know how to decide how many people were killed by Communism and Socialism (Lenin, Pol Pot, Castro, Ernesto "Che" Guevara and Kim Jung Il).

Billion is a silly number... it just rolls off the tongue.

A hundred million? Half a billion?

Anyone who is actually going to give this notion credence has no clue what socialism and communism really are, and the very real differences between the two.

But teabaggers believe (thanks largely to the likes of Glenn Beck) that Socialism, Marxism, and Fascism are almost one in the same, so in that cocoon, anything is possible.

3 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 3:19:15pm

re: #1 Buck

The idiotic part is not even the numbers (he probably counts all abortions too). It's that he seriously includes the American liberal left among the "left-wing" regimes of the 20th century. For him it's just "the left", no matter whether it's Stalin or John Kerry. Well, Hitler was on the right (not the free market type right, of course, the nationalist right) by all authoritative accounts, so should we count Phillips along with Hitler?

No sense of perspective, of history.

4 thecommodore  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 4:02:15pm

re: #3 Sergey Romanov

No sense of perspective, of history.

No common sense either.

5 Buck  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 4:42:18pm

re: #3 Sergey Romanov

Well, Hitler was on the right (not the free market type right, of course, the nationalist right)

Well, many (including Beck) think of Hitler as having more in common with Pol Pot, Stalin, Castro, Mao, Ernesto "Che" Guevara, Kim Jung Il and even Chavez than the "Less government, lower taxes, more freedoms" concept of the Right.

6 Buck  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 4:44:53pm

Of course, it is my belief that the political spectrum does not sit on a line, but is actually on a circle. The political center is at the bottom of the circle, and different ideoligies can be placed left or right of that spot. With the extreme left and extreme right meeting at the top in crazyville. That is where they share many views and traits.

This is why it is so hard to place a nutcases of the far right or far left in one group or the other.

7 bratwurst  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 5:26:44pm

re: #6 Buck

This is why it is so hard to place a nutcases of the far right or far left in one group or the other.

Yet you persist. Go back to keeping close track of what does and doesn't cause the ladies to walk of The View.

8 Buck  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 5:41:57pm

re: #7 bratwurst

Yet you persist. Go back to keeping close track of what does and doesn't cause the ladies to walk of The View.

????

9 HappyWarrior  Mon, Aug 8, 2011 11:27:11pm

re: #3 Sergey Romanov

The idiotic part is not even the numbers (he probably counts all abortions too). It's that he seriously includes the American liberal left among the "left-wing" regimes of the 20th century. For him it's just "the left", no matter whether it's Stalin or John Kerry. Well, Hitler was on the right (not the free market type right, of course, the nationalist right) by all authoritative accounts, so should we count Phillips along with Hitler?

No sense of perspective, of history.

Right, it would be equally assine if I lumped every right of center group with the Nazis, Franco's Fascists, Mussolini's regime, or the many in South America. You're only going to get a handful of truly nutty leftists who will defend Mao or Stalin.

10 thecommodore  Tue, Aug 9, 2011 1:23:41am

re: #5 Buck

Well, many (including Beck) think of Hitler as having more in common with Pol Pot, Stalin, Castro, Mao, Ernesto "Che" Guevara, Kim Jung Il and even Chavez than the "Less government, lower taxes, more freedoms" concept of the Right.

Well he doesn't. There may have been a large welfare state in place in Germany during the Nazi era, but they didn't create it. They used it to benefit themselves and the perceived master race at the expense of undesireables, who were conspicuously left out. This is one thing moronic books like Jonah Goldberg's Liberal Fascism carefully omits.

Another thing Goldberg and his ilk of nitwits who propagate the notion that Nazis and fascists were actually leftists (perhaps in an attempt to show that the teabaggers carrying the Obama-is-a-Nazi signs actually had a point, and it wasn't on top of their heads) is that fascism is highly militaristic and nationalistic (something leftists cannot be accused of), and often scapegoats and persecutes certain specific elements in society for the ills of that society, something some leftists cannot be accused of. Yes, Stalin, Mao, Castro, Pol Pot and others have a very high body count, but most of that was not directed at groups of people because of who they were and/or what they believed, and the evil they were believed to be propagating. It was directed at people who were believed to be enemies of the revolution, with members of their family thrown in for good measure.

This makes no difference to Beckheads, teabaggers, dittoheads, what have you. All someone needs is to be thought a "leftist" and they might as well be Stalin.

11 Buck  Tue, Aug 9, 2011 6:25:04am

re: #10 thecommodore

You are rationalizing. You ignore the traits you want to ignore, and only see the traits you want to fit.

"highly militaristic and nationalistic (something leftists cannot be accused of)"

Again.... in order for this to work you have to accept that Mao Zedong and Joseph Stalin were on the left. They were both "highly militaristic and nationalistic".

You define the right as persecuting:

often scapegoats and persecutes certain specific elements in society for the ills of that society, something some leftists cannot be accused of.

Yet you admit the left can be accused of persecution "directed at people who were believed to be enemies of the revolution, with members of their family thrown in for good measure."

Now if you cannot see that for all intensive purposes they are the exact same thing, then I can't help you. But it is really obvious to me.

12 Buck  Tue, Aug 9, 2011 6:36:02am

re: #10 thecommodore

And just for clarification, it is not only "Beckheads, teabaggers, dittoheads, what have you" who like to generalize about who is Hitler.

Calling the President Hitler didn't start on 2008.

And it continues today. Lefty's like to call anyone on the right Nazi's...

See here. Although I could give you many other examples.

13 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Aug 9, 2011 6:37:49am

re: #5 Buck

Well, many (including Beck) think of Hitler as having more in common with Pol Pot, Stalin, Castro, Mao, Ernesto "Che" Guevara, Kim Jung Il and even Chavez than the "Less government, lower taxes, more freedoms" concept of the Right.

That's why I added "by all authoritative accounts".

14 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Aug 9, 2011 6:43:35am

re: #11 Buck

Again... in order for this to work you have to accept that Mao Zedong and Joseph Stalin were on the left. They were both "highly militaristic and nationalistic".

Stalin absolutely was a conservative. A left-wing conservative, if you will, but a conservative nevertheless.

That's the point, isn't it? Lumping the American liberal left with anyone who has been called "the left" over decades is as idiotic as saying that Bush is Hitler.

15 Buck  Tue, Aug 9, 2011 7:38:01am

re: #14 Sergey Romanov

Stalin absolutely was a conservative. A left-wing conservative, if you will, but a conservative nevertheless.

Ok, so what I am saying is that the crazies have things in common with both the far left and the far right. A little bit from column A and a little bit from column B.


That's the point, isn't it? Lumping the American liberal left with anyone who has been called "the left" over decades is as idiotic as saying that Bush is Hitler.

Yes, I am saying exactly that (and vice-versa). However less specifically talking about Bush. Substitute Bush for GOP, or republicans, and you have the idea.


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