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1 Charleston Chew  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 1:51:53pm
We were vulnerable and unprepared for September 11, 2001.

True.

What if there were a viable, scientific means to significantly reduce the possibility of terrorist attacks,...

Sold!

...but because the approach is new and different, the most technologically advanced countries have not taken notice?

And you're sure that's the only possible reason? The same way I'm sure people don't like me because they're just jealous of how awesome I am?

Quantum physicist John Hagelin is a Harvard-trained scientist...

A physicist and a scientist! And someone "trained" at Harvard can't be full of shit. Just ask Lloyd Blankfein, George W. Bush, John Roberts, Antonin Scalia, William Bennett, Alberto Gonzales, Henry Paulson, David Vitter, Mitt Romney, Ralph Nader, Grover Norquist, Phyllis Schlafly, Lou Dobbs, or Mortimer Zuckerman.

He is one of the first scientists to apply the advanced knowledge of modern physics to social problems, such as terrorism.

Maybe the other scientists had good reasons not to.

"A universal principle in nature is that internally coherent systems possess the ability to repel disruptive external influences," says Dr. Hagelin.

"To demonstrate, I will attempt to shove this sword through my abdomen. Notice how the coherent system of by body repels.... Call a doctor."

Homeland Security tried -- and failed -- to create a defensive shield around the nation. Billions of dollars were spent constructing a "virtual fence" of sensors, cameras and radar around U.S. borders and to install high-tech radiation detectors at the nation's ports. These projects failed and were scrapped.

"Which is why no one uses any sensors, cameras, radars, or radiation detectors anymore. Failed!"

Dr. Hagelin: "Modern science has probed deeper levels of nature's functioning, from the macroscopic world of classical physics to the world of the atom, then to the underlying nucleus and the subnuclear. This exploration has culminated in the discovery of a single, unified field at the basis of all forms and phenomena in the universe."

Wait, I've heard of this:

"Because this unified field is vastly more powerful than any other level of nature's dynamics, a technology of defense based on the unified field will completely change the science and technology of defense."

"To demonstrate, I want you to take this gun and try to shoot me while I'm meditating. See? You can't... Is that doctor still here?"

"The orderliness of brain functioning in the individual spills over into society," says Dr. Hagelin. "Since the unified field is an all-pervading field at the basis of consciousness and matter, when unity is enlivened in the individual, unity is enlivened everywhere. This is a field effect."

So:

1.) Meditate.
2.) ?
3.) World Peace!

I was about to say that seems kinda flaky for a physicist-scientist, but then I noticed it was a Huffington Post link. To quote Stan Lee, "'Nuff said!"

2 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 2:08:20pm

re: #1 Charleston Chew

You have your opinion and 160 peer-reviewed publications do not sway it or spark your curiosity. Interesting.

[Link: www.doctorsontm.com...]

A total of 300 research studies on the Transcendental Meditation technique have been published in 160 peer-reviewed academic and medical journals. The peer-reviewed process ensures that the research has met the highest standards of scientific methodology, as determined by the leading scientists and research institutes of our times.

Leading academic and medical journals that have published TM research in the U.S.:
Archives of Internal Medicine (published by the American Medical Association)
American Journal of Cardiology
American Journal of Hypertension
Stroke (official journal of the American Heart Association)
Hypertension (official journal of the American Heart Association)
Psychosomatic Medicine (official journal of the American Psychosomatic Society)
Science (official journal of the American Association for the Advancement of Science)
American Journal of Physiology (official journal of the American Physiological Society)
Electroencephalography and Clinical Neurophysiology (now called Clinical Neurophysiology)
American Psychologist (official journal of the American Psychological Association)
Journal of Personality and Social Psychology (official journal of the American Psychological Association)
Intelligence
Journal of Conflict Resolution
“Over the past 10 years the editors and reviewers of the International Journal of Neuroscience have accepted several papers on Transcendental Meditation because they have met the rigorous standards of scientific publication. IJN is honored to have two Nobel laureates on its editorial board, and has a distinguished group of scientists from leading universities on every continent who judge the scientific value of the papers submitted for consideration.”
—Dr. Sidney Weinstein, Editor-in-Chief, International Journal of Neuroscience

Complete List of 160 Journals World-wide

3 Charleston Chew  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 2:35:00pm
A total of 300 research studies on the Transcendental Meditation technique have been published in 160 peer-reviewed academic and medical journals. The peer-reviewed process ensures that the research has met the highest standards of scientific methodology, as determined by the leading scientists and research institutes of our times.

What are the findings of those studies?

4 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 3:27:45pm

re: #3 Charleston Chew

What are the findings of those studies?

All good. Specifics are available here: [Link: www.truthabouttm.org...]

5 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 3:32:19pm

re: #3 Charleston Chew

More direct link: [Link: www.TruthAboutTM.org...]

6 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 3:37:57pm

re: #3 Charleston Chew

This will give you even more: [Link: www.TruthAboutTM.org...]

7 Charleston Chew  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 4:10:01pm

These links all seem to suggest that meditation can improve the health and well being of practitioners, which seems reasonable to me and which I already would have assumed.

But I don't understand the leap from "meditating helped me reduce my anxiety, focus my mind, and quit smoking" to "meditation by people in Jerusalem magically reduces the number of bombs in the war in Lebanon".

8 Charleston Chew  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 4:15:57pm

Also, all these people writing about it - Jeanne Ball, John Hagelin, David Orme-Johnson - have a financial stake in TM. I'm naturally skeptical when a salesman has positive things to say about their product.

9 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 4:21:57pm

re: #7 Charleston Chew

World-renowned quantum physicist and pioneering researcher at CERN and SLAC, John Hagelin, explains his published groundbreaking research establishing the existence of long-range "field effects" of consciousness generated through collective meditation, showing that large meditating groups can effectively defuse acute societal stress and providing a practical foundation for permanent world peace.

10 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 4:34:29pm

re: #8 Charleston Chew

That is why peer-reviewed scientifically validated research is useful in ones own personal research. However, personal direct experience is the most profound - beyond intellectual understanding. TM works in spite of what you believe - you need not even believe it will even work for you. Like gravity, it just works.

Financial stake? In a nonprofit 501(c)3 charity?

11 BishopX  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 6:44:14pm

Bobititu,

You're falling for the Chomsky effect here. Just because someone is brilliant in one field doesn't mean they know jack shit about another semi-related subject.

12 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 8:00:28pm

re: #11 BishopX

Your opinion and my personal experience differ. The scientifically validated and peer-reviewed, published data does not change based on a perceived effect or opinion.

13 EiMitch  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 9:28:18pm

If meditation, something that human beings have been doing for thousands of years is all it takes to prevent attacks, then why, oh why, haven't we come close by now? Anyone can do it, yet we had to wait for this messiah?

And thats only the first red flag.

Peer review is important. But when someone keeps playing the peer review card, while making little if any reference to the evidence being peer reviewed, then its just argument from authority.

Like Charleston Chew said, what do peer reviews on studies about meditation's health benefits have to do with national security?

Quit beating us over the head with prestige, and make your case. If you don't know what the difference is, then you have no business talking about science.

Before I forget, whats this stuff about "personal experience"? Are you switching from crying "peer review" to your own personal anecdotes? And then you backpedal with "The scientifically validated and peer-reviewed, published data does not change based on a perceived effect or opinion"? Really?!

If you can't be even remotely consistent, then how do you expect anyone to take you seriously?

14 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 10:25:39pm

re: #13 EiMitch

[Link: www.TruthAboutTM.org...]

COMPARISON OF TECHNIQUES

Issue: Are All Forms Of Meditation And Relaxation The Same?

The Evidence: There are many systems of meditation that widely differ from one another in their procedures, contents, objects, beliefs, and goals. Given these differences, it is not surprising that research has shown they have different subjective and objective effects.

Three Types of Meditation
Systems of Meditation
Comparative Research
Randomized Studies
Meta Analyses
Wide Range of Benefits
The Myth of the Relaxation Response
A Personal View
Three Types Of Meditation

Meditation techniques differ with regard to the sensory and cognitive processes they require (Shear, 2006), their neurophysiological effects (Travis & Shear, 2010), and their behavioral outcomes (Orme-Johnson & Walton, 1998). Travis and Shear have identified three types of meditation practices, classified according to their EEG signatures and the corresponding cognitive processes they entail (Travis & Shear, 2010).

1. Focused Attention techniques. The first type, which includes focused attention or concentration techniques, is characterized by EEG in the beta-2 (20-30 Hz) and gamma (30-50 Hz) frequency bands, which are associated with voluntary sustained control of attention to keep it focused on the object of meditation.

2. Open Monitoring techniques. The second type includes open monitoring or mindfulness-based techniques, which involve dispassionate non-evaluative monitoring of ongoing experience and are characterized by frontal theta (5-8 Hz) EEG, and perhaps occipital gamma (30-50 Hz) EEG (Cahn, Delorme, & Polich, 2010).

3. Automatic Self-Transcending techniques. The Transcendental Meditation technique falls within the third category, automatic self-transcending meditation, which is associated with alpha-1 (7-9 Hz) EEG, characteristic of reduced mental activity and relaxation. Whereas concentration and open monitoring meditations both require some mental effort (i.e., holding attention on its object or maintaining a stance of open monitoring, respectively), automatic self-transcending meditation is the effortless transcending of the meditation process itself (Travis, Arenander, & DuBois, 2004; Travis et al., 2010). It is said to automatically lead to the experience of “consciousness itself”, the screen of awareness without any objects of awareness, a low-stress state called transcendental or pure consciousness (Travis & Pearson, 2000).

15 Bob Dillon  Tue, Sep 13, 2011 10:31:01pm

[Link: www.truthabouttm.org...]

368. Orme-Johnson DW et al. International peace project in the Middle East: the effects of the Maharishi Technology of the Unified Field. Journal of Conflict Resolution 1988 32:776-812

369. Orme-Johnson DW et al. The effects of the Maharishi Technology of the Unified Field: reply to a methodological critique. Journal of Conflict Resolution 1990 34:756-768

370. Orme-Johnson DW et al. Preventing terrorism and international conflict: effects of large assemblies of participants in the Transcendental Meditation and TM-Sidhi programs. Journal of Offender Rehabilitation 2003 36:283-302

371. Gelderloos P et al. Creating world peace through the collective practice of the Maharishi Technology of the Unified Field: improved US-Soviet relations. Social Science Perspectives Journal 1988 2:80-94

372. Gelderloos P et al. The dynamics of U.S.-Soviet relations, 1979-1986: a simultaneous transfer function analysis of U.S.-Soviet relations. A test of the Maharishi Effect. Proceedings of the American Statistical Association, Social Statistics Section (pp.297-302). Alexandria, Virginia: American Statistical Association, 1990

373. Orme-Johnson DW et al. The influence of the Maharishi Technology of the Unified Field on world events and global social indicators: the effects of the Taste of Utopia Assembly. In Collected Papers, Volume 4 (pp.2730-2762) - see reference 2

374. Davies JL, Alexander CN. Alleviating political violence through reducing collective tension: impact assessment analysis of the Lebanon war. Journal of Social Behavior and Personality 2005 17:285-338

375. Orme-Johnson DW. The science of world peace. International Journal of Healing and Caring 2003 3:1-9

376. Leffler DR. A Vedic approach to military defense: reducing collective stress through the field effects of consciousness. Doctoral dissertation, Union Institute Graduate School, Cincinnati, Ohio, USA. Dissertation Abstracts International 1997 58:3298A. Also available from [Link: www.davidleffler.com...]

377. Brown CL.Overcoming barriers to use of promising research among elite Middle East policy groups. Journal of Social Behavior and Personality 2005 17:489-546

Dr. Hagelin covered this in his 1:14 minute lecture in #9 above (2nd video) - Not something that can be reduced to a couple of paragraphs.

16 Charleston Chew  Wed, Sep 14, 2011 6:40:50am

re: #10 Bobibutu

Financial stake? In a nonprofit 501(c)3 charity?

Yes, financial stake.

501(c)3 means they're exempt from federal income tax and donations to them can be deducted from federal income tax by the donors.

The people working for the organization can and do get paid. This is their job. This is their income. They're going to promote TM for the same reason McDonald's promotes hamburgers. There's money riding on it.

For instance, according to charitynavigator.org, the median salary of a charity CEO in 2008 was $147, 273.

14 CEOs of charities made over $1 million each that year.

CEOs probably make more money than most people working for charities and I have no idea how much money Jeanne Ball, John Hagelin, or David Orme-Johnson make promoting TM, but my point is that, yes, you can make moeny working for a charity.

17 Bob Dillon  Wed, Sep 14, 2011 8:07:07am

re: #7 Charleston Chew

These links all seem to suggest that meditation can improve the health and well being of practitioners, which seems reasonable to me and which I already would have assumed.

But I don't understand the leap from "meditating helped me reduce my anxiety, focus my mind, and quit smoking" to "meditation by people in Jerusalem magically reduces the number of bombs in the war in Lebanon".

When we have a bar of iron and shoot it with a bullet or stab it with a sword – intense kinetic gross interaction – (war/terrorist acts) an imprint will be left on the bar.

When we wish to take a subtler approach we can turn to physics and place a magnet in close proximity to the bar, without touching it. The magnetic field will cause a subtle, unseen, influence on the bar and when this happens a phase transition takes place in the bar of iron and it will become magnetized.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

This is scientific fact.

The question is, does this same phenomenon hold true in humans and society and could a positive influence on a subtle level be demonstrated by observing gross data in proximity to the groups in question.

What Dr. Hagelin is addressing is the research that would indicate that this is so.

While meditating, correctly understood and practiced, creates some influence, the groups he refers to in the studies were acting as a superconducting magnet does. Thus a greater influence.

The results were validated thru repeated experiments. The statistical outcomes were conclusive enough to cause the results to be published via the peer-review process.

18 Bob Dillon  Wed, Sep 14, 2011 8:53:56am

[Link: www.davidleffler.com...]

[Link: www.davidleffler.com...]

Here are the research citations, experiment designs and findings.


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