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1 researchok  Tue, Sep 27, 2011 6:02:07pm

WW, hasn't this kind of (mis)reporting gone on for a while?

Seems to me the border crime 'dueling narrative' has been going on for decades.

It does seem to have escalated under Bush and Obama, though. Ah, the power of the internet.

2 wrenchwench  Tue, Sep 27, 2011 6:10:01pm

re: #1 researchok

WW, hasn't this kind of (mis)reporting gone on for a while?

Seems to me the border crime 'dueling narrative' has been going on for decades.

It does seem to have escalated under Bush and Obama, though. Ah, the power of the internet.

You're right. I believe the purpose of lying about what it's really like at the border is to further the cause of those who say, "We must secure the border before we can address immigration reform!" If you ignore the statistics of fewer border crossers and the safety of border area cities, you can portray the border as something that will never be secure, therefore we never have to address immigration reform. Anyone who says "border security and immigration policy must be addressed together" is lying to you.

3 researchok  Tue, Sep 27, 2011 7:32:02pm

re: #2 wrenchwench

You're right. I believe the purpose of lying about what it's really like at the border is to further the cause of those who say, "We must secure the border before we can address immigration reform!" If you ignore the statistics of fewer border crossers and the safety of border area cities, you can portray the border as something that will never be secure, therefore we never have to address immigration reform. Anyone who says "border security and immigration policy must be addressed together" is lying to you.

I agree with that. Border security and immigration are distinct issues with very different agendas.

I don't believe that is a controversial notion. What remains is how to depoliticize the issues, with outside interests having undue influence- certainly on border states.

4 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 28, 2011 7:51:01am

re: #3 researchok

I agree with that. Border security and immigration are distinct issues with very different agendas.

I don't believe that is a controversial notion. What remains is how to depoliticize the issues, with outside interests having undue influence- certainly on border states.

It is perhaps THE controversial notion when it comes to immigration. A quick look, border security must precede immigration reform, shows people from Ron Paul and John McCain to John Huntsman and Gabrielle Giffords saying "security before reform". It looks like generally libertarians and liberals take either the view you expressed, that they are separate issues, or that immigration reform will help secure the borders.

You are correct that it must be depoliticized. I don't see it happening. Race is a large factor in the opposition to immigration from south of us, and it's so hard to change people's views about race, that I can't see the right wing letting go of "We Must Secure the Border First". And "No Amnesty", and "No Dream Act", those are just "bait" that will lure more border crossers.


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