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1 jvic  Sat, Oct 22, 2011 12:23:21pm

Muller's op-ed is here. "Climate auditor" Steven McIntyre responds here.

2 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Oct 22, 2011 12:26:54pm
Muller didn’t reject climate science per se, but he was a skeptic, and a convenient one for big polluters and conservative anti-environmentalists — until Muller put their money where his mouth was, and launched the Berkeley Earth Surface Temperature project, in part with a grant from the Charles G. Koch foundation.

Such rich irony that a grant from a Koch foundation helped to fund a climate study. Let's see how this study turns out, whether this prof is gonna be in the Kochs' pockets or not, shall we?

3 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 22, 2011 1:41:10pm
Whatever the outcome of the BEST analysis, they have brought welcome and fresh ideas to a topic which, despite its importance, has had virtually no intellectual investment in the past 25 years.

McIntyre is really good dressing up his BS.

4 FreedomMoon  Sun, Oct 23, 2011 8:06:46am

Turns out ManBearPig was real along and Al Gore IS super awesome. My biggest concern is if it took this long to convince such a brilliant scientist, who I guess had his mathematical qualms with the hard science(?) how can we ever hope for the evolution denying-half of our country to ever rethink their view? I mean we're talking about people who are dubious and suspicious of anything with ties to science.

5 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 23, 2011 8:09:03am

re: #4 tacuba14

I really hope SP guys do their penance, as well as the Bullshit! guys.

6 FreedomMoon  Sun, Oct 23, 2011 8:19:00am

re: #5 Sergey Romanov

When the episode aired many years ago, I was actually on board with the whole 'we don't have enough evidence to be certain' movement, which changed probably the following year. With that said, I still find the episode funny, particularly the impersonation of Al Gore. In my head I'd like to think that they have come around too in light of all the additional evidence that has come out since the episode's inception.

7 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 23, 2011 8:20:57am

re: #6 tacuba14

Yeah. At least I have a hope that the people who have skewered Glenn Beck so brilliantly may, at last, have stopped buying some of the BS.

8 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Oct 23, 2011 10:54:09am

re: #4 tacuba14

Turns out ManBearPig was real along and Al Gore IS super awesome. My biggest concern is if it took this long to convince such a brilliant scientist, who I guess had his mathematical qualms with the hard science(?) how can we ever hope for the evolution denying-half of our country to ever rethink their view? I mean we're talking about people who are dubious and suspicious of anything with ties to science.

Trust me. Most of the brilliant scientists as in well over 90% of the legitimate scientific community, have been convinced by the data for a very long time. The remaining ~10% for the most part just haven't really looked into it. Mueller is not the biggest fish in the pond and pretty much the entire scientific community is convinced of the essential truth of AGW, that we are causing the warming and that the consequences of continuing to increase the warming will be catastrophic.

Mueller is also very enigmatic. No one is particularly sure what his game was or is. But one thing is clear. When he decided to seriously look into the data, he did it honestly.

9 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Oct 23, 2011 10:59:52am

re: #6 tacuba14

When the episode aired many years ago, I was actually on board with the whole 'we don't have enough evidence to be certain' movement, which changed probably the following year. With that said, I still find the episode funny, particularly the impersonation of Al Gore. In my head I'd like to think that they have come around too in light of all the additional evidence that has come out since the episode's inception.

That "additional evidence" was already overwhelming at the time of the show. People just weren't interested in doing actual due diligence by looking at it. Climate change has been something of a concern in the scientific community for over 100 years! The first serious report that this was a major issue by the National Academy, went out to president Johnson in 1965! It is not as if all those published studies and journal papers and calculations were kept secret of hidden from public view.

No, what happened was that Penn and Teller were full of shit themselves and didn't bother to do the most basic research before opening their mouths. At the time, you and most of America could not be bothered to read the actual science from the actual scientists. Most of America unfortunately still can't be bothered, because that involves like math and thinking and stuff. Ohhh look Snookie...


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