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11 comments

1 Alexzander  Mon, Nov 7, 2011 11:50:12am

Thank you for this thorough and fair discussion. Oakland is definitely an outlier.

On the Canadian front, at Occupy Vancouver, a heroin user OD’d (and past) at the emcampement over the weekend. It has caused a lot of uproar from all sides and may be the end of the encampement (if the Mayor has his way). There is a fatal OD in Vancouver every three days.

2 Bob Dillon  Mon, Nov 7, 2011 1:57:58pm

“I walk around downtown Oakland without special concern, even after dark.”

My office was near the Clorox Bldg. Some associates still have their offices nearby - a couple in the Rotunda Bldg at Ogawa Plaza. I too have walked around (I was raised in Oakland - circa. ‘42) without special concern but the punks in hoodies walking Broadway carrying baseball bats - and getting away with it - I have always found a bit unnerving.

re: #1 Alexzander

“Oakland is definitely an outlier” … Amen!

3 _RememberTonyC  Mon, Nov 7, 2011 2:33:17pm

Thanks for sharing this. I have heard similar stories about the small businesses near Zucotti Park in NYC. The protestors are hurting many “Mom and Pop” businesses and at some point those business owners need to have THEIR rights protected too.

4 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Nov 7, 2011 3:28:57pm

They’re a bunch of stoner bums IMO who are only hurting small business owners.

And Mayor Quan is a useless git.

Regardless, many attempts have been made to revitalize downtown Oakland only to fail over and over.

So bring out the OPD - do nightly raids - get the bums out and Mayor Quan, please, grow a spine.

5 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Nov 7, 2011 4:12:01pm

I’m guessing Occupy Oakland is largely composed of Berkeley residents. There are a lot of anarchists there.

It is a quandary. Certainly the goal of things like general strikes is to hurt the economy of the city in order to force government officials to act. That doesn’t mean a lot of little guys don’t get hurt along the way. It really is something of a quandary.

I’m by no means opposed to the occupy movement and spent a day on legislative plaza with the Occupy Nashville folks.

I’ve read that OWS has so much money and material aid coming in they are not even soliciting donations. If they have that much cash, maybe they could compensate small business owners who are immediately affected.

6 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Nov 7, 2011 9:21:30pm

re: #5 Conservative Moonbat

I’m guessing Occupy Oakland is largely composed of Berkeley residents. There are a lot of anarchists there.

It is a quandary. Certainly the goal of things like general strikes is to hurt the economy of the city in order to force government officials to act. That doesn’t mean a lot of little guys don’t get hurt along the way. It really is something of a quandary.

I’m by no means opposed to the occupy movement and spent a day on legislative plaza with the Occupy Nashville folks.

I’ve read that OWS has so much money and material aid coming in they are not even soliciting donations. If they have that much cash, maybe they could compensate small business owners who are immediately affected.

‘Occupy’ as a whole has been peaceful, but Occupy Oakland has not been. I’m compelled to agree with EI: Occupy Oakland has to be dispersed and ended. One thing I would do, though, is that I’d make clear that Occupy San Francisco and the other ‘Occupy’ protests are not being targeted. Oakland is a special case. I’d also bring in state police to do as much of the cracking down as possible, since I don’t want OPD’s failures clouding the issue.

7 Bob Dillon  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 8:29:12am

re: #6 Dark_Falcon

‘I’d also bring in state police to do as much of the cracking down as possible, since I don’t want OPD’s failures clouding the issue.

Now, the politics involved in pulling that off would be interesting indeed. Former Mayor + Present Gov. + Present Mayor - OOradicals + State Police = ???? Probably good to distance the county sheriff as well. /

There is and has been a “problem” with the legal system in Oakland and Alameda County for a long, long time. Repeat criminals re-arrested move thru the system and are back out on the street within DAYS!

The DAs decisions on who to go after and who gets a deal are politically motivated to keep numbers (read - cook the books) looking good.

Remember the drug dealer in Fruitvale a few years back? Arrested many, many times and released quickly. Even a petition, filed in desperation from local residents, to the judge did no good to keep him incarcerated. Finally “someone” walked up to him on the street in broad daylight and shot him in the head - terminating his life. There was little interest in finding whodunit. No eye witnesses could be located.

A significant number of my clients are black, live in Oakland/East Bay and have downtown businesses. Almost all of them have lost a close relative to violence. But we keep electing self serving wimps and hand wringers … and - there are no long term political solutions in recorded history to this kind of challenge that I am aware of.

That is why I am a strong supporter of law enforcement warts and all.

8 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 10:57:31am
9 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 11:31:54am

re: #6 Dark_Falcon

I’d also bring in state police to do as much of the cracking down as possible, since I don’t want OPD’s failures clouding the issue.

What you read about Oakland has little to do with actual Oakland, so your police-state solutions will not work there.

10 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 11:34:45am

re: #7 Bobibutu

Now, the politics involved in pulling that off would be interesting indeed. Former Mayor + Present Gov. + Present Mayor - OOradicals + State Police = ??? Probably good to distance the county sheriff as well. /

There is and has been a “problem” with the legal system in Oakland and Alameda County for a long, long time. Repeat criminals re-arrested move thru the system and are back out on the street within DAYS!

The DAs decisions on who to go after and who gets a deal are politically motivated to keep numbers (read - cook the books) looking good.

Remember the drug dealer in Fruitvale a few years back? Arrested many, many times and released quickly. Even a petition, filed in desperation from local residents, to the judge did no good to keep him incarcerated. Finally “someone” walked up to him on the street in broad daylight and shot him in the head - terminating his life. There was little interest in finding whodunit. No eye witnesses could be located.

A significant number of my clients are black, live in Oakland/East Bay and have downtown businesses. Almost all of them have lost a close relative to violence. But we keep electing self serving wimps and hand wringers … and - there are no long term political solutions in recorded history to this kind of challenge that I am aware of.

That is why I am a strong supporter of law enforcement warts and all.

I’m not a strong supporter of OPD, or the mentality that excuses BART police actions like Johannes Mehserle’s (you might not, but you replied to someone who does, and whose solution to everything that makes him feel personally uncomfortable is to get somebody to bomb it or overpolice it.) That’s a major element to Occupy Oakland. Any civil protest post-Oscar Grant is going to have that as a major component.

11 Bob Dillon  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 1:39:40pm

re: #10 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I’m not a strong supporter of OPD, or the mentality that excuses BART police actions like Johannes Mehserle’s (you might not, but you replied to someone who does, and whose solution to everything that makes him feel personally uncomfortable is to get somebody to bomb it or overpolice it.) That’s a major element to Occupy Oakland. Any civil protest post-Oscar Grant is going to have that as a major component.

The problem that I have is that drug dealers and gangs in general run pretty much free. OPD is undermanned. Every cop is not angelic or perfect. Nor are the gang bangers and cartels who have ruined more lives and killed more innocents than the cops in Oakland, nationwide or even worldwide ever will. I’ll take the cops over the gang bangers anytime. I do not excuse anyone and am hardest on the rogue element within the military, alphabet soups and law enforcement.


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