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1 CuriousLurker  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 5:42:07pm
“And I want to tell you how deeply we appreciate this stand of courage and integrity.”

*gag*

2 windsagio  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 5:46:48pm

Ben just sees a kindred spirit.

“I cannot bear Netanyahu, he’s a liar,” Sarkozy told Obama, unaware that the microphones in their meeting room had been switched on, enabling reporters in a separate location to listen in to a simultaneous translation.

“You’re fed up with him, but I have to deal with him even more often than you,” Obama replied, according to the French interpreter.

3 researchok  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 6:10:16pm

re: #2 windsagio

Imagine that. A politician who lies.

4 windsagio  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 6:12:30pm

re: #3 researchok

that’s what you said last time, there are levels.

Imagine now a politician who’s so untrustworthy that other politicians hate on him for lying.

Again, the connection with Beck is so very clear.

5 SpaceJesus  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 6:30:53pm

what a couple of asshats

6 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 8:06:03pm

Despite everything, I’m slightly amazed that I’m reading this on LGF.

7 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Mon, Nov 21, 2011 11:02:31pm

Anybody still has doubts about the Awakening?

8 researchok  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 12:22:35am

re: #4 windsagio

I disagree.

Politicians will say and do anything- even associate with some very ugly people if they perceive it will give them political advantage.

This isn’t unique to Israeli politicians.

9 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 2:52:45am

Apparently Benny loves himself some raving freakazoid nut sandwich.

Pathetic.

10 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 3:06:00am

re: #8 researchok

No, not all politicians are the same. I have no idea why you want to believe they are. It goes against all common sense.

11 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 3:55:06am

This is continuation of a previous conversation, that moved from doubt (see Sergey’s comment) about whether Netenyahu will speak as some forum to claims that Netenyahu has the blood of Rabin on his hands. It was a discussion that, to me, showed some emotional undercurrents here—undercurrents which would make some Jews very uncomfortable. I’ll just say, these discussions don’t feel…quite Kosher, especially the seeming glee expressed at attributing nefarious motives to Netenyahu, a graduate of MIT.

Being a graduate of MIT means little other than to give evidence, quite clear evidence, that Bibi is not stupid.

So why would he do this? Does it have to do with Israel’s geopolitical position? No. Any economy doing as well as Israel’s is not short on ties to other nations. They may not be strong and warm diplomatic ties, but they are the ties that diplomats listen to.

How about Bibi as being the agent carrying out some Israeli far-right agenda? That seems popular when attributing motivation. However, the only agenda in Israel is to survive one more day. Each day the goal is to survive one more day. Politics in Israel is not the same as politics in the US. There are people in Israel, Jews, who want to live in new homes with effective plumbing. That’s not quite so right wing.

Can it be that Bibi doesn’t know about these groups, how they really feel about Jews? No. Any Jew that cares about Judaism is fully aware how everyone across all political spectrums feel about Jews. It’s an issue that doesn’t go away.

So why would Bibi make such a statement, knowing full well who Glenn Beck is? The answer is quite benign, but to see this obvious answer, one would have to give up the idea of nefarious motivations, of attributing Rube Goldberg guilt over Rabin’s assassination.

Even if he speaks by video at the Awakening, he will be speaking about what he always speaks of—the evils of tyranny, and giving thanks for support. Political support? Not so much.

Because it’s all about tourism. If you don’t know the importance of tourism to the Israeli economy, then you don’t know Israel. And if you don’t know the demographics of the tourism industry, then you don’t know Israel. And if you don’t know Israel, then you don’t know Israelis. All that’s left are blind accusations.

re: #2 windsagio this comment:

Here are two stories that are a follow up. Sarkozy is retracting his statement and apologizing for the gaffe.

12 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:01:42am

re: #11 Bob Levin

Political support? Not so much.

Because it’s all about tourism.

Really?

13 Decatur Deb  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:05:54am

The French ambassador to Israel is Christophe Bigot.
Diplomatic Fail.

14 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:06:13am

re: #11 Bob Levin

Why would he endorse Beck, who promotes anti-semitic authors?

15 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:11:45am

re: #12 000G

Yep.

16 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:13:40am

re: #13 Decatur Deb

I don’t understand. The Ynet article mentions Bigot’s name as relaying the letter.

17 Decatur Deb  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:14:17am

re: #16 Bob Levin

I don’t understand. The Ynet article mentions Bigot’s name as relaying the letter.

Bigot.

18 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:14:35am

re: #15 Bob Levin

Oh wow. That’s your actual explanation.

By the way, you never answered this: You claimed that Bibi was the only person in the Israeli government who was connected to foreign nations, who was international in scope.

Is there any reason you don’t think that Avigdor Lieberman, and his entire department, are international in scope?

19 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:14:40am

re: #14 Obdicut

Yes. But you need to understand the Tourism industry for this to make sense.

20 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:15:15am

re: #17 Decatur Deb

Oh. Pun. Got it.

21 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:15:49am

re: #19 Bob Levin

Yes. But you need to understand the Tourism industry for this to make sense.

I understand tourism, thanks. It’s important. I also understand that Glenn Beck promotes anti-semitic authors. Seems to me you’re making a rather heavy charge against Bibi— that he considers tourism dollars in Israel more important than not condoning a loony dude who promotes anti-semitism abroad.

22 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:16:13am

re: #18 Obdicut

They don’t know how. It’s either Bibi or Peres. Peres goes first.

23 Decatur Deb  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:17:55am

re: #20 Bob Levin

Oh. Pun. Got it.

It’s a curse. I once told my kibbutznik secretary she should work for the Ministry of Tsurism.

24 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:18:03am

re: #22 Bob Levin

They don’t know how. It’s either Bibi or Peres. Peres goes first.

I’m sorry, who is they, and what don’t they know how to do?

Are you just saying the Israeli Foreign Ministry are all incompetents?

25 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:18:05am

re: #21 Obdicut

It’s the classic tightrope that Jewish leaders have always had to walk. I’m actually making a benign charge. He’s bolstering the tourism industry.

26 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:18:46am

re: #23 Decatur Deb

My Hungarian friend pronounces one of my names, Joseph, like “yourself”. He works that into some pretty subtle puns at times.

27 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:19:40am

re: #25 Bob Levin

It’s the classic tightrope that Jewish leaders have always had to walk. I’m actually making a benign charge. He’s bolstering the tourism industry.

No, you’re not. He’s bolstering the tourism industry at the expense of endorsing someone who promotes anti-semitic authors. And engages in a hell of a lot of evil shit as well.

That’s not a benign charge, and I’m confused as to why you think it is.

28 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:20:32am

re: #24 Obdicut

Are you just saying the Israeli Foreign Ministry are all incompetents?

Pretty much. They are attuned to their constituency. This is a coalition government. It could fall any day. They are not trained in international relations. I’m sure we agree on this. Are you sure you want to keep talking? I’ve got to run pretty soon.

29 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:23:45am

re: #28 Bob Levin

Wow.

Um, no, dude. Go ahead and take off. Bibi is really just the head of tourism who doesn’t care that the person he’s endorsing promotes anti-semitic authors (including holocaust deniers) as well as someone who’s said incredibly evil things about the President and liberal Jews, the foreign ministry are incompetents, and that’s your defense of Bibi and Israel’s government.

30 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:23:55am

re: #27 Obdicut

What’s the opposite? Him neglecting the tourism industry to take a stand than has nothing to do with realpolitik?

Have you noticed the protests in Israel lately? Very much tied to the economy.

31 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:25:00am

re: #29 Obdicut

Then you don’t understand the tourism industry. I’ll take off, you do some research. We should both be better for it.

32 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:25:28am

re: #30 Bob Levin

What’s the opposite? Him neglecting the tourism industry to take a stand than has nothing to do with realpolitik?
.

Realpolitik tends to be something invoked when the speaker is endorsing something ethically reprehensible.

And yeah, the opposite would be him castigating someone who endorses anti-semitic authors, because that kind of shit is very dangerous to Jews.

More and more, I’m getting the impression that Bibi and others in his political mindset in Israel don’t care much about Jews who don’t live in Israel.

33 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:25:58am

re: #31 Bob Levin

Then you don’t understand the tourism industry. I’ll take off, you do some research. We should both be better for it.

Facile and foolish. If you have a point to make, make it, don’t just wave your hands and say I don’t understand something.

34 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:26:48am

re: #32 Obdicut

That’s 1)not true and 2) a whole nother discussion.

35 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:28:17am

re: #33 Obdicut

And this is why we don’t speak. All you have to do is make some statement that shows you have a good grasp of the tourism industry rather than insult me.

36 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:35:06am

re: #33 Obdicut

Oh, that’s the rules? You get to insult me and I have to take it, or else.

37 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:35:48am

re: #35 Bob Levin

And this is why we don’t speak. All you have to do is make some statement that shows you have a good grasp of the tourism industry rather than insult me.

We do speak. You try to dodge away from it. Please don’t refer to ‘we’ for your own actions.

I understand how important the tourism industry is to Israel, and how much they’re hurting right now. That doesn’t mean that the tourism industry’s importance outweighs that of speaking out against anti-semites. Should Israel promote tourism from neo-Nazis to come and laugh at the Chassids?

The tourism industry is not something that’s a big challenge to understand. The more tourism, the more dollars into Israel— and the more people that see Israelis living, or trying to live, nice, normal lives. That’s all very well and good— for Israel.

38 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:36:15am

re: #36 Bob Levin

Oh, that’s the rules? You get to insult me and I have to take it, or else.

Or else what? What am I going to do to you? Ask you more questions you find uncomfortable? How terrible.

39 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:37:51am

re: #15 Bob Levin

Yep.

So Bibi wants to promote Israel as a tourism destination to RWNJs by praising one of the RWNJs who by the way happens to peddle anti-semitic bullshit? Am I understanding this correctly, at least roughly?

40 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:42:16am

re: #39 000G

Yep. That is the bulk of the trade, and has been for many years. Jews only visit two months of the year, the rest, the folks you don’t particularly like. However, that’s their spiritual journey. It’s impossible to predict the outcomes of such quests.

41 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:44:46am

re: #38 Obdicut

I was referring to the downdings. Usually your questions don’t make me uncomfortable, they just tell me the things you haven’t read. For instance, you didn’t mention that for 10 months of the year the tourism customers are evangelicals. I don’t think you knew that.

42 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:55:07am

re: #41 Bob Levin

Why did you think I didn’t know that? And why wouldn’t you just say that, instead of playing a gotcha game?

And you’re seriously whining about downdings? That’s the ‘or else’?

The case that you’re making— that Israel is purposefully courting right wing nut job evangelicals who, here in the US, have attitudes that are downright dangerous for Jews because their tourism dollars are important— is pretty harsh against Israel. In addition, it ties Israel ever-closer to the positions of the religious right in the US, which include literally fanatical objections to Israel giving up land. It may be your view that Israel shouldn’t give up land, but that should be something decided by the Israeli people as a whole, not by the Israeli economy being beholden to Americans who have that view.

In addition, you appear to be overlooking the visitors from Europe, who also visit Israel during those 10 months. Their numbers are smaller than those from the US, but they still exist.

43 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 4:55:19am

re: #40 Bob Levin

Yep. That is the bulk of the trade, and has been for many years. Jews only visit two months of the year, the rest, the folks you don’t particularly like. However, that’s their spiritual journey. It’s impossible to predict the outcomes of such quests.

But you think that mock-praise for Beck in order to covertly bolster the evangelical tourism, mock-praise that isn’t easily identifiable as mock except by people having at least faint knowledge of the tourism trade in Israel, does not in any way amount to political support?

44 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 5:53:26am

I’m not sure what tourism has to do with a whole Premier(!) addressing evangelicals, I really don’t.

45 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 6:18:03am

re: #44 Sergey Romanov

I’m not sure what tourism has to do with a whole Premier(!) addressing evangelicals, I really don’t.

A lot of the increase in tourist trade over the past decade has been Evangelicals going to see the Holy Land.

46 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Nov 22, 2011 6:38:50am

re: #45 Obdicut

And if BN addresses A2012, suddenly there will be an influx of new tourists, or something?

47 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Nov 23, 2011 5:53:44am

re: #46 Sergey Romanov

And if BN addresses A2012, suddenly there will be an influx of new tourists, or something?

More just he’s schmoozing with them to keep them coming in ever-greater numbers.

That’s Levine’s actual defense of him, that he’s just being a tourism salesman.


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