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1 researchok  Sat, Feb 18, 2012 2:13:30pm

Well, this ought to provoke conversation.

I agree a strong public schools system is the ideal but we don't have one- and it is unlikely we ever will- too many competing interests.

However, to tell parents they are violating progressive ideologies because they want to home school their is patently absurd and unfair.

A parent is the default caretaker of their children, not the state or ideologues. History is replete with catastrophic examples of what happens when the state rather than the parent decides what is best for the child.

2 EiMitch  Sat, Feb 18, 2012 5:31:15pm

I understand the fear of the religious right's idea of "homeschooling." The wingnuts are brainwashing their children with a radical, closed-minded worldview. That is just plain abusive.

On the other hand, the public system isn't working in many places. We can debate whether its caused by internal or external factors. Whether its political and/or social. But what about who parents refuse to wait out the debate, to wait for the system to be fixed? Who are we to scoff at parents who choose to take action now to educate their children? They're just being good parents.

If anything, we need to better regulate homeschooling. And those regulations should be crafted not to discourage homeschooling, but to help it. Homeschoolers and public teachers should be speaking with one another, not dismissing each other as "the enemy." They should try to hear out each others' point of view, trade advice, and whatnot. This shouldn't be another political/cultural battleground.

3 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 18, 2012 6:06:18pm

If the public system isn't working it's because many people don't want it to work. Because let's face it. A well educated electorate is a danger to those with power. They'll know enough to say, "Now just a cotton picking minute. That's not true."

Also, there is a dichotomy in the purposes we've assigned to schooling. Our belief in schooling is that of the Enlightenment; that knowledge will allow us to be good. But, its real purpose is that of an assembly line; to turn out human resources suitable for employment. The fact that we cannot decide between which of these ideas schooling is for means that our education system is unfocused and ineffectual.

Which is why I'm not a fan of home schooling. If our education system is unfocused and ineffectual how much worse will a system with hundreds of thousands of differing visions be?

4 EiMitch  Sat, Feb 18, 2012 7:35:15pm

re: #3 Romantic Heretic

If our education system is unfocused and ineffectual how much worse will a system with hundreds of thousands of differing visions be?

Ask the parents teaching college level math to 13-year olds.

I keep hearing from teachers and experts on tv (not fox, fyi) that federal standards have hurt education and state and local municipalities should make these decisions. Why? Because one size doesn't fit all, teaching is an art not a science, etc.

This kinda conflicts with what you're saying here.

I'm not saying everyone should homeschool. Thats not practical for most working parents, and frankly some parents aren't wise enough to be teaching. What I am saying is "you're making sweeping generalizations? Bad RH! Very bad!"

Like I said, we need to regulate this, not discourage it. In some cases, homeschool is actually the best solution available. The least we can do is figure out which is which.

If the public system isn't working it's because many people don't want it to work.

Thats not always true. This another sweeping generalization. Studies have shown that schools in impoverished areas don't do as good of a job. It doesn't necessarily mean that those schools are short on funding. Rather, its about the students' homes. Poor kids lack the resources other kids have to help with their homework. Or the parents (or single parent) are working alot and are simply too busy to help their kids with their homework. Or the kids are distracted by family woes.

The point is that poverty is one of the biggest culprits, along with No Child Left Behind. But while its simple and easy to point to bad politicians and say "its all your fault," ending poverty is complicated and hard.

You do have a point about needing to decide on the purpose of the education system. I'll give you that. But what is right or wrong for education isn't nearly as simple as you make it sound. When you discuss this topic in the future, I suggest you be less judgmental and more flexible. Children aren't all the same.

5 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 18, 2012 8:20:54pm

I never said they were. In fact that's why I call the education system an assembly line. Because like an assembly line it doesn't make good use of 'non-standard materials.' Like an assembly line it tosses them on the scrap heap.

On No Child Left Behind, I have a number of friends who are teachers in the U.S. and they without exception loathe it. There's no flexibility in it. No Child Left Behind, as I understand it has a single standard for what a successful student is and as you point out, children aren't all the same.

Poverty is indeed a major cause of problems, which is one of the purposes of the federal government in my opinion: to make sure money is funnelled to those places with little money. It's a wise investment on the government's part. Unfortunately the state and municipal governments interfere with this for their own reasons. Plus I think a lot of people believe the poor deserve what they get, which doesn't help.

I'll admit I generalized, but at 4,096 characters I've hardly got space for a thesis. /

6 Velvet Elvis  Sat, Feb 18, 2012 9:48:30pm

A good friend of mine was homeschooled for 12 years. The result was that her serious learning disabilities were not noticed until she got to college and almost flopped out on her belly.

Public schools suck, but things like basic study skills and how to take notes need to be taught in some kind of standardized way if homeschooled kids are going to seek any kind of college degree.

I'd also not be opposed to requiring a college degree for one parent of a home schooled student, assuming a two parent household.

7 Bob Levin  Sun, Feb 19, 2012 12:32:49am

re: #5 Romantic Heretic

Do not underestimate the power of textbook representatives, whose job is to convince school boards that their books provide the best education. The books are far beneath the capabilities of advanced students, not at all thought provoking for those students needing some provocation--yet they are a perfect fit for the many kids who simply are not aware that there are other things to learn besides what is put in front of them.

I like to think that any parent who reads these texts will want to home school their children.

I would anticipate changes in the future as paper texts go by the wayside. This should already be causing tidal waves in the Education Departments at the Universities. And if teachers don't keep up with these emerging trends, then we'll start to see another trend, where the kids are more knowledgeable about the subject matter than the teacher.


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