Cranston teen atheist speaks out against Woonsocket veterans memorial

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Cranston teen atheist speaks out against Woonsocket veterans memorial

Going to Hell in a Handbasket

Dustoff848

Culture • 5/17/12 9:32:20 am • Views: 1,149

16-year-old Cranston RI athiest teen Jessica Ahlquist, who already has one ACLU victory under her belt, is now reaching out to support the removal of a cross from a 1921 WW I and WW II monument.

She tweeted,

‘This should settle some of the confusion around the Woonsocket memorial controversy. I now support its removal.’

Oh, since SHE is against it, then I guess it must come down.

Evil Cross Adorning 1921 WWI and WW II Monument

ACLU Victory Woonsocket Veterans Teen Jessica Ahlquist

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29 comments

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Gus Thu, May 17, 2012 10:22:02am

Thanks for posting this. We atheists gotta stick together. :P

This should settle some of the confusion around the Woonsocket cross memorial controversy. I now support its removal. cautionchurchahead.com/2012/05/histor...
— Jessica Ahlquist (@jessicaahlquist) May 15, 2012

kreyagg Thu, May 17, 2012 10:38:49am

I often wonder what some christian symbols might look like had the Romans been more into impaling criminals rather than crucifying them.

Especially some of the very graphic representations found in Catholic churches.
Or people wandering around with little gold plated spikes dangling from their necks.

Locker Thu, May 17, 2012 10:44:35am

Oh, since SHE is against it, then I guess it must come down.

SHE isn't against it you fucking tank tread, the 1st Amendment is against it.

EiMitch Thu, May 17, 2012 11:00:08am

Yes, it is insensitive (to say the least) to build a memorial based on the assumption that everyone in the service was a christian. In WWII alone there were the Navajo code-talkers in the Pacific theater. And I trust everyone reading knows enough that I need not even mention jews. You'd think such obvious examples would warrant a bit more consideration from memorial designers.

Oh, and 1st amendment, separation of church and state, etc.

Having said that, come on! Us atheists need to be a bit more selective of our battles. We should be going after the far right a-holes who say we're not "true" American patriots, we can't be trusted with office, its impossible for us to be "moral," etc.

Or better yet, we should be trying to educate the public that "America was founded as a christian nation" is just historical revisionism. And while we're at it, we should also draw attention to the Orwellian irony of how the very people claiming "all men are created equal" was a christian idea are rationalizing that non-christians (especially us non-believers) should be treated as second-class citizens at best.

Instead, we're just going after little symbols. Thus we're reinforcing the stereotype that we're a bunch of negative nancys.

Lets stop aiming low. Or to paraphrase George Carlin, leave symbols to the symbol-minded.

Dustoff848 Thu, May 17, 2012 11:33:51am

re: #3 Locker

SHE isn't against it you fucking tank tread, the 1st Amendment is against it.

I prefer "fucking Rotor Head" if you don't mind. Don't associate me with the Armor types.

Guess all those crosses in Arlington should come down as well.

Gus Thu, May 17, 2012 11:37:32am

re: #5 Dustoff848

I prefer "fucking Rotor Head" if you don't mind. Don't associate me with the Armor types.

Guess all those crosses in Arlington should come down as well.

No. Because the crosses at Arlington represent the religion of the individual service men and women and other national figures buried there.

Randall Gross Thu, May 17, 2012 1:03:34pm

I don't have a beef with her opinion, and I agree with it. If the Gagne brothers were buried underneath that cross then I would disagree.

[Link: www.cautionchurchahead.com...]

but they aren't buried there.

SidewaysQuark Thu, May 17, 2012 1:23:33pm

re: #4 EiMitch

Us atheists need to be a bit more selective of our battles.

I hear that. I'm as critical of Christianity as anyone can be, but this is a memorial, for crying out loud, and a tastefully-constructed one. I personally don't interpret a crucifix as a middle finger to me. There's bigger fish to fry elsewhere.

SidewaysQuark Thu, May 17, 2012 1:27:28pm

...

SidewaysQuark Thu, May 17, 2012 1:31:12pm

re: #3 Locker

SHE isn't against it you fucking tank tread, the 1st Amendment is against it.

Our interpretation of the 1st Amendment now would be against building a new monument as such. Times were different in 1921. This is a historical monument - let it stand. We can't whitewash away the past according to today's standards, nor should we.

Gus Thu, May 17, 2012 1:39:08pm

re: #8 SidewaysQuark

I hear that. I'm as critical of Christianity as anyone can be, but this is a memorial, for crying out loud, and a tastefully-constructed one. I personally don't interpret a crucifix as a middle finger to me. There's bigger fish to fry elsewhere.

You can't heard cats. So the notion of atheists being a single minded collective will never happen. Thus, you'll have some people taking on different "battles." So while I may have ignored something like this I am perfectly willing to support Jessica Ahlquist in this "battle." It's much like being on the left politically. I am personally not on the side of those with regards to NDAA, drones, Bradley Manning, etc. However, I still support their right to bring these issues to the table.

I just noticed that one of the tags reads, "Teen Jessica Ahlquist." Seems kind of weird to add "teen" to her name.

wrenchwench Thu, May 17, 2012 1:45:09pm

re: #11 Gus

I just noticed that one of the tags reads, "Teen Jessica Ahlquist." Seems kind of weird to add "teen" to her name.

Good 'tagging' requires additional attention since the 'suggested tags' feature was added. Sometimes I use the suggested ones for the humor value. Many times I have to type my own to make them useful.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, May 17, 2012 2:14:49pm

re: #11 Gus

You can't heard cats. So the notion of atheists being a single minded collective will never happen. Thus, you'll have some people taking on different "battles." So while I may have ignored something like this I am perfectly willing to support Jessica Ahlquist in this "battle." It's much like being on the left politically. I am personally not on the side of those with regards to NDAA, drones, Bradley Manning, etc. However, I still support their right to bring these issues to the table.

I just noticed that one of the tags reads, "Teen Jessica Ahlquist." Seems kind of weird to add "teen" to her name.

I would be proud of any hypothetical kid of mine with enough political clarity to speak up about this stuff (as opposed to being hostile to intellectual curiosity like a lot of kids I knew in high school)

blueraven Thu, May 17, 2012 2:51:26pm

It is one thing to be against a prayer banner at school and speak out about that. I support her effort there.

But I hardly think atheists should be led around by a 16 year old in trying to remove every cross on every memorial. It is very silly and a losing strategy.

shutdown Thu, May 17, 2012 3:00:45pm

re: #10 SidewaysQuark

Our interpretation of the 1st Amendment now would be against building a new monument as such. Times were different in 1921. This is a historical monument - let it stand. We can't whitewash away the past according to today's standards, nor should we.

I agree in principle, but not in this particular instance. It is a monument to a period of history; the monument itself has no intrinsic historical value. The crucifix on the monument should not be allowed to continue to represent all the fallen. We have the legal tools today to refine the monument, and we should. Monuments erected by the public on public land should represent all Americans.

ProMayaLiberal Thu, May 17, 2012 3:02:45pm

I'll make one small point here.

This is trying to force a very harsh form of secularism that flat out doesn't have a history here. Save this crap for France.

Is the Marble Cross condemning your beliefs or attacking you for your differences, or trying to force you change your ideals?

No? Then leave it there.

Eclectic Infidel Thu, May 17, 2012 3:46:43pm

Not sure why the article is getting so many down dings, so gave ya a plus 1 for the heck of it.

As much as an existential atheist and secular humanist that I am, well, I think there are other battles to be fought that are more worthy. I agree completely in principle, but this battle may easily turn out to be more trouble than it is worth.

Dark_Falcon Thu, May 17, 2012 10:18:58pm

re: #16 ProGunLiberal

I'll make one small point here.

This is trying to force a very harsh form of secularism that flat out doesn't have a history here. Save this crap for France.

Is the Marble Cross condemning your beliefs or attacking you for your differences, or trying to force you change your ideals?

No? Then leave it there.

Agreed. It was intended to memorialize those who died. It is the height of disrespect to suggest desecrating such a monument. I hope this girls email and social media turn into a river of flame and that she is shunned at school. I do not advocate acts of violence against her, nor the breaking of any laws, but it should be made very clear to her that to push this issue will make her into any outcast.

If you refuse to respect those who died defending your freedom, then you are anti-patriot, worthy only of mockery and contempt.

goddamnedfrank Thu, May 17, 2012 11:12:20pm

re: #18 Dark_Falcon

Agreed. It was intended to memorialize those who died. It is the height of disrespect to suggest desecrating such a monument. I hope this girls email and social media turn into a river of flame and that she is shunned at school. I do not advocate acts of violence against her, nor the breaking of any laws, but it should be made very clear to her that to push this issue will make her into any outcast.

If you refuse to respect those who died defending your freedom, then you are anti-patriot, worthy only of mockery and contempt.

It is disgusting the way you simplemindedly equate opposition to a christian cross monument with disrespect of all of those who died. You're making her point for her by conflating a single denomination's religious symbol with the memory of thousands of diverse servicemen. When such an action is taken or condoned by the federal government it violates the establishment clause.

Gus Fri, May 18, 2012 7:52:27am

re: #18 Dark_Falcon

If you refuse to respect those who died defending your freedom, then you are anti-patriot, worthy only of mockery and contempt.

This is a load of bullshit worthy of a dictatorship and not America. Not the least of of which no one is "refusing to respect these people". This is poisoning the well and a typical right-wing tactic. It's absurd and you are being absurd with this rhetoric.

Dustoff848 Fri, May 18, 2012 9:43:58am

re: #17 Eclectic Infidel

Not sure why the article is getting so many down dings, so gave ya a plus 1 for the heck of it.

I think it's the Red 'Cross' in the picture next to my username. I'm sure that is not appreciated by many as well.

Gus Fri, May 18, 2012 9:44:35am

re: #21 Dustoff848

I think it's the Red 'Cross' in the picture next to my username. I'm sure that is not appreciated by many as well.

Seriously?

Dustoff848 Fri, May 18, 2012 9:47:19am

re: #22 Gus

Seriously?

No, not seriously. Though I bet many don't get the 'Dustoff' reference.

Gus Fri, May 18, 2012 9:50:53am

re: #23 Dustoff848

No, not seriously. Though I bet many don't get the 'Dustoff' reference.

Good. I'm pretty sure people recognize it as the international symbol of the Red Cross, MEDEVAC, USN Corpsman, etc.

Obdicut Fri, May 18, 2012 12:01:26pm

re: #18 Dark_Falcon

What about Jewish veterans, Dark?

Jewish veterans who fought against Hitler, whose troops were Christian, who called the Jews a lesser race and the faithful Jews an abomination?

Do you think they'd want to be buried under a cross?

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Fri, May 18, 2012 1:38:13pm

re: #18 Dark_Falcon

Agreed. It was intended to memorialize those who died. It is the height of disrespect to suggest desecrating such a monument. I hope this girls email and social media turn into a river of flame and that she is shunned at school. I do not advocate acts of violence against her, nor the breaking of any laws, but it should be made very clear to her that to push this issue will make her into any outcast.

If you refuse to respect those who died defending your freedom, then you are anti-patriot, worthy only of mockery and contempt.

Harrassing kids on the internet! Very republican, well done, good job

Simply Sarah Fri, May 18, 2012 1:44:03pm

re: #18 Dark_Falcon

Agreed. It was intended to memorialize those who died. It is the height of disrespect to suggest desecrating such a monument. I hope this girls email and social media turn into a river of flame and that she is shunned at school. I do not advocate acts of violence against her, nor the breaking of any laws, but it should be made very clear to her that to push this issue will make her into any outcast.

If you refuse to respect those who died defending your freedom, then you are anti-patriot, worthy only of mockery and contempt.

OK, dude, that crosses the line and it's not even a close call.

skullkrusher Fri, May 18, 2012 2:07:26pm

re: #25 Obdicut

they're probably already pissed that they're buried under a parking lot

ProMayaLiberal Fri, May 18, 2012 7:01:32pm

re: #18 Dark_Falcon

And that is a million steps too far. She is just being like every other teenager in High School who thinks they know everything and tend to be a bit naive and blinkered in ideas.

We all went through that phase. She just chose an unusual target.

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