National Geographic Traveler Veers Off Track

Media • May 2012 • Views: 2,924

The May issue of National Geographic Traveler magazine features an article, “Jerusalem by the Book,” in which the author returns to Jerusalem with a guidebook written by his parents in 1951. Unfortunately, when he ventures into territory liberated by Israel in 1967, the author steps into politics and outside the confines of journalistic accuracy.

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55 comments

Romantic Heretic Fri, May 25, 2012 2:39:49pm

Once again, my opinion of the Middle East these days.

EiMitch Sat, May 26, 2012 7:39:27am

Do you ever link to any site besides camera? Ever?

That site is such incredibly one-sided bs. All they do is complain about how unfairly the world views Israel. Anyone who strays a millimeter from their "Israel is the victim, and the Palestinians are a-holes" narrative is demonized as part of a conspiracy to "delegitimize" Israel. Come on! Its not like the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is a freakin' high school popularity contest.

Camera even aimed their barbs at The Daily Show. Nevermind that TDS did a segment about Hamas making antisemitic cartoons. That gave TDS no leniency whatsoever when they recently criticized the US government for cutting funding to UNESCO over a symbolic gesture. Camera didn't care how many people around the world could suffer as a result. To them any price was worth sending a message against anyone who would send a pro-Palestinian message.

There is zero room for moderates in camera's view. Either you're so pro-Israel that your mouth foams, or else you're the enemy. So stop promoting that site here already, please.

ProGunLiberal Sat, May 26, 2012 1:36:21pm

re: #2 EiMitch

It's a bot. It won't respond.

EiMitch Sat, May 26, 2012 4:44:36pm

re: #3 ProGunLiberal

How did camera get a bot registered as a user?

Eclectic Infidel Sat, May 26, 2012 4:46:27pm

Good article. Haters are gonna hate.

LeoStraussGhost Sat, May 26, 2012 10:35:04pm

EiMitch what you said is clearly wrong, Camera is not radical at all.

freetoken Sat, May 26, 2012 10:45:20pm

re: #6 LeoStraussGhost

EiMitch what you said is clearly wrong, Camera is not radical at all.

"radical" would not be an adjective I'd use to describe CAMERA.

Maybe... "obsessive", "biased", "deceitful", "reactionary", "fundamentalist", or "erroneous", but never "radical".

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, May 27, 2012 11:04:06am

re: #7 freetoken

"radical" would not be an adjective I'd use to describe CAMERA.

Maybe... "obsessive", "biased", "deceitful", "reactionary", "fundamentalist", or "erroneous", but never "radical".

I dunno, maybe whitewashing Assad isn't radical these days...

LeoStraussGhost Sun, May 27, 2012 12:01:00pm

Wow, how LGF has changed, its more like being on 4chan or Reddit than back in the day.... Camera may be biased in favour of Israel but who else is? Almost every media outlet is biased against it so now you jump all over camera?
Camera doesn't purport to be unbiased where as AP does?
I think the point of CAMERA goes over the head of people who down vote this.

EiMitch Sun, May 27, 2012 12:18:12pm

re: #9 LeoStraussGhost

Or maybe you just hear what you want to. This isn't about who is on who's side. This is about who is sane and who is talking like Niccolo Machiavelli on crack.

Its true that Hamas and Fatah are corrupt warlords doing what they can to prolong the conflict. And its also true that major media corporations are treating this conflict like a sports match and pandering the "team" with the most "fans."

But none of that makes camera's insanity okay. The enemy of my enemy is not my friend.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Sun, May 27, 2012 1:03:24pm

re: #9 LeoStraussGhost

Wow, how LGF has changed, its more like being on 4chan or Reddit than back in the day... Camera may be biased in favour of Israel but who else is? Almost every media outlet is biased against it so now you jump all over camera?
Camera doesn't purport to be unbiased where as AP does?
I think the point of CAMERA goes over the head of people who down vote this.

yes, the psychos and creationists and 9/11 fetishists are gone from LGF

Boo hoo!

CuriousLurker Sun, May 27, 2012 4:28:22pm

re: #9 LeoStraussGhost

Wow, how LGF has changed, its more like being on 4chan or Reddit than back in the day...

Well, there's a brilliant tactic—instead of starting off with anything reasonable, you spend days stealth down-dining people, then you drop in with insults and whiny reminiscing about the old days & people who were bounced out of here on their asses for their extremism. You miss them? Go look them up, nobody's stopping you.

Camera may be biased in favour of Israel but who else is? Almost every media outlet is biased against it so now you jump all over camera?
Camera doesn't purport to be unbiased where as AP does?
I think the point of CAMERA goes over the head of people who down vote this.

Cry me a river. If CAMERA actually gave a damn what the people at LGF think about Israel, then they'd send an actual human over here to discuss things with us instead of just sending their mindless propaganda bot to dump & run. It's spammy, annoying and generally bad netiquette for them to do that.

LeoStraussGhost Sun, May 27, 2012 4:48:28pm

So your mad about camera's netiquette?
How about supporting Israel vs. the hordes of mindless haters?

EiMitch Sun, May 27, 2012 5:03:51pm

re: #13 LeoStraussGhost

Cherry picking one comment and ignoring the rest, eh? You're definitely hearing what you want to hear.

Everyone, Leo is most likely just a troll. Lets stop feeding him.

CuriousLurker Sun, May 27, 2012 6:28:36pm

re: #14 EiMitch

Insults, check. Complaints, check. Straw man, check. Red herring, check.

You're right...*GAZE*

Daniel Ballard Sun, May 27, 2012 6:33:49pm

re: #15 CuriousLurker

Classic case of Advocates Disease.
When your advocacy causes blindness. Curable but ya gotta want to...

LeoStraussGhost Mon, May 28, 2012 9:35:05am

What a bunch of egg heads, to call me a troll, go back and watch CNN then to get "unbaised" coverage.

Sophia77 Mon, May 28, 2012 3:12:44pm

I disagree that CAMERA is one-sided or inaccurate. Its role is to point out inaccuracies in reporting about Israel. In this case, I think some of the "corrections" aren't really necessary since the author is simply reporting what he heard, for example from the coffee shop owner.

That said, it never hurts, in the case of Israel, to provide perspective. People in general aren't necessarily well-schooled in modern (or medieval or ancient) Middle Eastern history and opinions are frequently made on the scantiest of information. Outlets like CAMERA seek to redress this dearth of factual information.

Why is this bad?

Also, comments like "foaming at the mouth" with regard to support for Israel (or any other political position) are prejudicial on their face.

As long as coverage of Israel is biased against Israel, there will be a need to point out errata. And antisemitism - prejudice against Jews - is anything but dead. So, there's a double need here for factual, historical information and frequently the press/media don't provide it.

Sophia77 Mon, May 28, 2012 3:15:26pm

Also, I am kind of surprised at the support in the above thread for Hamas, et.al.

In case you guys are wondering I only started posting here when LGF stopped being a right wing website, being from the far left.

So please, I'd appreciate it if I don't get attacked for being a neocon, so forth.

Sophia77 Mon, May 28, 2012 3:16:39pm

Anyway, I'm not a bot, forgive the 3 comments in a row; I'm also not from CAMERA, but I doubt if they have time or resources to send a person here to talk to you personally.

Honestly some of the comments above sound like they were written by spoiled children.

Varek Raith Mon, May 28, 2012 3:21:57pm

re: #19 Sophia77

Also, I am kind of surprised at the support in the above thread for Hamas, et.al.

In case you guys are wondering I only started posting here when LGF stopped being a right wing website, being from the far left.

So please, I'd appreciate it if I don't get attacked for being a neocon, so forth.

Hence the 'foaming at the mouth' description. No one here supports Hamas.
Jerk.

CuriousLurker Mon, May 28, 2012 3:32:55pm

re: #21 Varek Raith

Hence the 'foaming at the mouth' description. No one here supports Hamas.
Jerk.

Of course no one here supports Hamas. It's another idiotic straw man.

Skandal Mon, May 28, 2012 3:56:13pm

re: #12 CuriousLurker

If CAMERA actually gave a damn what the people at LGF think about Israel, then they'd send an actual human over here to discuss things with us instead of just sending their mindless propaganda bot to dump & run.

May I ask please ask how you presume to know that CAMERA actually sent Aigle here as opposed to some unassociated individual who happens to regularly post CAMERA links and is never willing to discuss them?

It's spammy, annoying and generally bad netiquette for them to do that.

If they are, in fact, doing that you're absolutely correct.

jaunte Mon, May 28, 2012 3:59:09pm

re: #23 Skandal

Aigle:
Registered since: Aug 20, 2009 at 11:22 am
No. of comments posted: 0
No. of Pages posted: 1,433
This is just being a parasite on the host's traffic.

Skandal Mon, May 28, 2012 4:07:34pm

re: #24 jaunte

You're correct, of course. My question regards the accusation or implication that CAMERA actually sends this person here as opposed to someone unassociated with CAMERA who happens to obviously strongly agree with CAMERA and consequently obsessively spams their articles on here ad nauseum. If it's the latter, then CAMERA can hardly be condemned for Aigle's annoying behavior.

Apologies if this question is irrelevant or unclear.

jaunte Mon, May 28, 2012 4:09:42pm

re: #25 Skandal

Oh no, perfectly clear. It's certainly a possibility, but given the numbers I think Aigle must be getting paid to do it.

Skandal Mon, May 28, 2012 4:20:12pm

re: #26 jaunte

If they are actually paying Aigle then they are hardly getting their money's worth. It seems to be a rather counter-productive strategy by creating a major irritant rather than engaging in worthwhile discussions.

Anyway, all the best.

CuriousLurker Mon, May 28, 2012 4:34:23pm

re: #23 Skandal

May I ask please ask how you presume to know that CAMERA actually sent Aigle here as opposed to some unassociated individual who happens to regularly post CAMERA links and is never willing to discuss them?

Well, jaunte has already given the same reply I would have. I suppose aigle could simply be the world's biggest CAMERA fan, but it strikes me as highly unlikely. If he's an advocate for Israel then he'd be posting content from other sources too, wouldn't he? Like Samson & Sliv used to do. Much as I disagreed with them sometimes, they at least stuck around to discuss things.

As someone who designs, builds, and maintains web sites for a living, I can assure you that an outfit like CAMERA keeps tabs on where their web site traffic is coming from, so I'm sure they're aware of aigle's existence and linking habits.

If they are, in fact, doing that you're absolutely correct.

Whatever the case, as you just said in your #27, the strategy is counterproductive.

Skandal Mon, May 28, 2012 4:42:31pm

re: #28 CuriousLurker

Thanks for response. Very much appreciated.

CuriousLurker Mon, May 28, 2012 5:18:55pm

re: #29 Skandal

Thanks for response. Very much appreciated.

You're welcome. Thanks for listening.

I'd like to add that as someone who has spent the past couple of years trying to learn more about Judaism, Israel, and Zionism, the sometimes defensive responses can seem pretty shrill & unfriendly, i.e. not conducive to making people want to learn or understand more.

I get where the defensiveness comes from. I'm Muslim and get the same way myself sometimes, but it isn't helpful. Bigots & haters deserve whatever snark they get, but those who are just trying to understand—or who have been misinformed, or who ask questions in a a way you find biased or insulting (due to lack of knowledge)—don't deserve shrill responses or accusations of being anti-Semites or terrorist supporters.

Same with me, I try not to jump the gun and assume someone is an Islamophobic bigot just because they said something that made me twitch. Sometimes it's my perception that's off, and jumping to conclusions not only fosters more confusion & bad feelings, but it also shuts down further dialog. That's not to say that there aren't stone-cold haters out there—there are, we both know that for a fact—but I don't believe there are as many as we sometimes imagine there are.

Maslow's hammer, y'know? Not everything is a nail that needs to be pounded.

Skandal Mon, May 28, 2012 5:42:13pm

re: #30 CuriousLurker

Absolutely. I could not agree more. Sincere questions with no ill-intent can often be, unfortunately, misunderstood. Rather than leap down someones throat a simple request for a clarification or elaboration is usually sufficient to maintain a civil tone and therein a productive exchange can ensue. I hope you're right about there not being as many haters out there as one might fear or imagine. Further, I truly hope we can exchange views in the future as there is undoubtedly plenty I can learn from you. Take care.

CuriousLurker Mon, May 28, 2012 5:46:50pm

re: #31 Skandal

Hopefully we can learn from each other.

You take care too. Enjoy what's left of the long weekend if you're in the U.S. ;)

Sheila Broflovski Mon, May 28, 2012 7:44:51pm

re: #13 LeoStraussGhost

So your mad about camera's netiquette?
How about supporting Israel vs. the hordes of mindless haters?

The reason that we don't like Aigle is because it spams articles from Camera but never, ever responds to a conversation. Camera is a pro-Israel site, nothing is wrong with that, but spamming blogs without taking part in the threads is stupid and deserves to be downdinged and made fun of.

Sophia77 Mon, May 28, 2012 11:48:47pm

Really? Well I responded, as an honest human being, and was attacked and called a jerk.

You know what? Who needs it.

I didn't like LGF when it was anti-Islam and now it appears to have morphed into being fashionably anti-Israel.

What am I missing here?

Sheila Broflovski Tue, May 29, 2012 4:24:10am

re: #34 Sophia77

Really? Well I responded, as an honest human being, and was attacked and called a jerk.

You know what? Who needs it.

I didn't like LGF when it was anti-Islam and now it appears to have morphed into being fashionably anti-Israel.

What am I missing here?

LGF is not anti-Israel, LGF is anti spambot.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Tue, May 29, 2012 4:58:53am

re: #34 Sophia77

Really? Well I responded, as an honest human being, and was attacked and called a jerk.

You're misrepresenting the events. You wrote:

Also, I am kind of surprised at the support in the above thread for Hamas, et.al.

Varek replied:

Hence the 'foaming at the mouth' description. No one here supports Hamas.
Jerk.

So you were called a jerk for a false and inflammatory accusation of "support in the above thread for Hamas". I checked and rechecked and I don't see "support in the above thread for Hamas".

Sheila Broflovski Tue, May 29, 2012 8:03:27am

Why we hate aigle:

Web site URL:
[Link: www.camera.org...]

Registered since: Aug 20, 2009 at 11:22 am
No. of comments posted: 0
No. of Pages posted: 1,433

It's a spammer!

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Tue, May 29, 2012 8:11:52am

re: #19 Sophia77

Also, I am kind of surprised at the support in the above thread for Hamas, et.al.

Please, point out these comments. I would like to downding them and report them to Charles.

CuriousLurker Tue, May 29, 2012 8:12:50am

re: #34 Sophia77

Really? Well I responded, as an honest human being, and was attacked and called a jerk.

You know what? Who needs it.

Does that usually work well for you? You know, coming in and shooting little poison darts while presenting yourself as reasonable & fair, then when you get called on it, misrepresenting what happened and playing the victim?

I didn't like LGF when it was anti-Islam and now it appears to have morphed into being fashionably anti-Israel.

What am I missing here?

See? You're doing it again—being manipulative & intellectually dishonest, trying to maneuver people into a defensive position. What you're missing is the fact that you're not fooling anyone.

CuriousLurker Tue, May 29, 2012 8:29:19am

re: #35 Learned Mother of Zion

LGF is not anti-Israel, LGF is anti spambot.

Apparently Sophia77 has deemed them morally equivalent.

re: #37 Learned Mother of Zion

Why we hate aigle:

It's a spammer!

You're wasting your time. Jaunte already pointed that out in his #24. This clearly isn't about what has actually happened or been said. You, of all people, hardly need to defend your support for Israel.

I loathe the game that's being played here.

Sheila Broflovski Tue, May 29, 2012 9:28:12am

re: #26 jaunte

Oh no, perfectly clear. It's certainly a possibility, but given the numbers I think Aigle must be getting paid to do it.

I don't think aigle is a person, aigle is a bot programmed by Camera to spam their links. I'd be interested to know if any other blogs which allow "pages" are spammed by Camera. For example, do they spam FreeRepublic?

Sophia77 Tue, May 29, 2012 10:32:34am

OK, I apologize if I misread the comments about Hamas.

However, the attacks on Camera were absurd.

I was subsequently attacked for simply pointing out some facts about Camera and also about media bias regarding Israel and also a general lack of knowledge about the Middle East.

If you collectively have a problem with a bot, please don't attack a person who has nothing to do with a bot.

And, if you really think "aigle" is a spambot, how about contacting Camera and asking? If you guys don't want to I will.

Sheila Broflovski Tue, May 29, 2012 10:37:47am

re: #42 Sophia77

OK, I apologize if I misread the comments about Hamas.

However, the attacks on Camera were absurd.

I was subsequently attacked for simply pointing out some facts about Camera and also about media bias regarding Israel and also a general lack of knowledge about the Middle East.

If you collectively have a problem with a bot, please don't attack a person who has nothing to do with a bot.

And, if you really think "aigle" is a spambot, how about contacting Camera and asking? If you guys don't want to I will.

I don't want to because they are already blocked for the amount of spam they deliver to my inbox.

Sophia77 Tue, May 29, 2012 10:38:22am

As to the "foaming at the mouth" comment, I stand on my assertion, that is ott and really unnecessary.

CAMERA did not in that piece say anything that isn't factual. Maybe Aigle is a spambot and maybe he/it isn't; but I am not a spambot and nor am I an unreasonable person but I don't like being accused of "foaming at the mouth."

Do you blame me?

One doesn't have to be "foaming at the mouth" to point out facts and why Camera provides a valuable service in the cause of reality.

Can we do without the hyperbole? If people are accused of "foaming at the mouth" for pointing out some facts, you must accept the fact that perhaps they are going to react.

Does this make sense?

I am surprised at the uncivil response here.

bratwurst Tue, May 29, 2012 10:39:47am

re: #44 Sophia77

Can we do without the hyperbole?

You can start any time.

Obdicut Tue, May 29, 2012 10:42:24am

re: #42 Sophia77

I was subsequently attacked for simply pointing out some facts about Camera and also about media bias regarding Israel and also a general lack of knowledge about the Middle East.

NO, you were attacked for stupidly claiming there was support for Hamas here.

There was no comment that was even slightly possibly interpretable as support for Hamas.

Why do you except not to piss people off when you do dumb shit like that?

Sophia77 Tue, May 29, 2012 10:43:20am

OK MOZ I understand if you're already being spammed. I will see if there's a way to contact a responsible human.

For the record I'm not playing a game. I'm just saying what I think and I also, what I know. I'm not a kid and I do invest a great deal of time studying ME and Jewish history and have something to offer if anybody is interested in hearing it.

It was stated in the thread above by Curious Lurker that he's getting "shrill and defensive responses" to questions about Judaism and Zionism.

Well, ask away!

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Tue, May 29, 2012 10:45:21am

Hamas = terrorists. Any supporter of Hamas should be banned, IMHO. Accusing someone of being a Hamas supporter is very grave, right there with the support of Nazis. Don't be surprised if you're flamed after that.

Interesting Times Tue, May 29, 2012 10:47:07am

re: #42 Sophia77

OK, I apologize if I misread the comments about Hamas.

Not so much "misread" as willfully misrepresented. This was the only comment made about Hamas:

Camera even aimed their barbs at The Daily Show. Nevermind that TDS did a segment about Hamas making antisemitic cartoons. That gave TDS no leniency whatsoever

How could one possibly misconstrue these words as Hamas support? EiMitch was talking about The Daily Show segment that exposed the vicious, disgusting anti-Semitic propaganda put forth by Hamas, and how Camera never gave them any credit for it.

Obdicut Tue, May 29, 2012 10:47:08am

re: #47 Sophia77

If you're just saying what you think, and you're so well-informed, why the fuck did you accuse people here of supporting Hamas?

Obdicut Tue, May 29, 2012 10:48:02am

re: #49 Interesting Times

Not so much "misread" as willfully misrepresented. This was the only comment made about Hamas:

No, there was this second one:

Its true that Hamas and Fatah are corrupt warlords doing what they can to prolong the conflict.

Obviously, calling them corrupt warlords is supporting them!

lawhawk Tue, May 29, 2012 10:49:38am

I really doubt anyone at LGF is a Hamas supporter, and I've been here long enough to have a good read on who's posting what.

Folks might not appreciate the aigle spambot (posting links and nothing more), but down dinging those posts is a far cry from actually supporting Hamas. In fact it's not even in the same universe.

CuriousLurker Tue, May 29, 2012 10:53:56am

re: #47 Sophia77

It was stated in the thread above by Curious Lurker that he's getting "shrill and defensive responses" to questions about Judaism and Zionism.

Well, ask away!

Um, no thanks. You're still spinning.

Sheila Broflovski Tue, May 29, 2012 10:56:45am

re: #47 Sophia77

OK MOZ I understand if you're already being spammed. I will see if there's a way to contact a responsible human.

For the record I'm not playing a game. I'm just saying what I think and I also, what I know. I'm not a kid and I do invest a great deal of time studying ME and Jewish history and have something to offer if anybody is interested in hearing it.

It was stated in the thread above by Curious Lurker that he's getting "shrill and defensive responses" to questions about Judaism and Zionism.

Well, ask away!

First of all, CL is a "she" not a "he" and she has received some shrill and defensive responses to normal comments that she posted here.

Second of all, no one here is opposed to pro-Israel advocacy. I would even put myself at the head of the "pro-Israel" contingent here.

The issue is Camera appears to be using a programmed bot to spam their links here, not with the content of the links.

Sheila Broflovski Tue, May 29, 2012 10:58:37am

One more thing: NOBODY but NOBODY would take issue with "aigle" posting a bunch of Camera links if he/she was an actual person who stayed around to chat about it.

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