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1 researchok  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 12:41:53pm

Broken link

2 Bob Levin  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 12:52:25pm

It sounds as if there is some controversy, not much, but some. I don’t think the issue is whether or not the pageant was about life and survival, but rather, how tastefully was this done. Was the cosmetic company commercializing the history? I’d have to see the pageant, and of course, the final word is with the survivors. See? I’m hesitant to call them ‘contestants’.

3 sliv_the_eli  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 12:56:50pm

re: #1 researchok

Interesting. I see that my similar comment on the Yahoo-hosted page for the article has also disappeared. Hopefully this link will work:

[news.yahoo.com

4 sliv_the_eli  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 1:06:29pm

re: #2 Bob Levin

It sounds as if there is some controversy, not much, but some. I don’t think the issue is whether or not the pageant was about life and survival, but rather, how tastefully was this done. Was the cosmetic company commercializing the history? I’d have to see the pageant, and of course, the final word is with the survivors. See? I’m hesitant to call them ‘contestants’.

From my perspective, it doesn’t matter. I take the view that those of us who have been fortunate to not have to survive a Shoah have no right to question, much less criticize, the decision of those that choose to mark their survival in whatever way they choose.

I am reminded of the YouTube video of a Survivor dancing at Auschwitz, where the media tried to create a controversy out of it. My father, who is a Survivor, would never do that, but all the power to those who chose to celebrate life that way.

Either way, I have no standing to criticize.

And either way, the media have no business trying to stoke controversy here.

5 Bob Levin  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 1:17:15pm

re: #4 sliv_the_eli

We’re not there. Remember when Glenn Beck was trying to make a splash in Israel? He had an event at the Wall. Well, if you were at the Wall that day, you wouldn’t have noticed anything. In other words, I don’t know if any Israeli would notice this controversy, other than the players—the cosmetic company and this unnamed umbrella group.

If I were to take issue with the article, it would be here:

Israeli leaders, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, frequently make references to the Holocaust when discussing the threat they believe a nuclear-armed Iran would pose to the Jewish state.

That’s where such subtle messages are placed. It’s almost as if the entire article is there just to provide cover for this seemingly throwaway clause—where they really are trying to create controversy.

6 sliv_the_eli  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 2:11:24pm

re: #5 Bob Levin

If I were to take issue with the article, it would be here:


That’s where such subtle messages are placed. It’s almost as if the entire article is there just to provide cover for this seemingly throwaway clause—where they really are trying to create controversy.

Agreed. Hence the original point about AP looking to take something inherently positive — survivors of the Shoah asserting their inherent right to view and portary themselves as beautiful human beings — and trying to put a negative spin on it.

As for Prime Minister Netanayhu’s references to the Shoah with respect to the threat posed by the Iranian mullah-cracy, I have no issues with that, either. If only the world had listened and done something when Hitler told the world what he intended to do, many who were murdred would instead have lived. He is right, IMHO, to remind the world that, while many of its leaders are willing to largely ignore threats to commit genocide against the Jewish people and the residents of the national home of the Jewish people, he has a unique obligation to take those threats seriously.

7 Bob Levin  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 2:46:22pm

re: #6 sliv_the_eli

Are we getting to coffee time, and need to hear inflections and watch facial expressions?

It’s not a question of whether one agrees with Netenyahu—but that the Yahoo writer is turning what is a clear threat into something imagined. This is significant.

However, how Jews discuss upcoming events commemorating the Holocaust—there are always discussions—who to speak, what to say, celebration of life, tone. However, if you compare it to the article on Ynet, the Yahoo article is close—but Yahoo added the paragraph about Netenyahu, and thus forced this issue into the article about Iran being an imagined threat, creating the impression that what is real is not real. That’s the problem.

8 sliv_the_eli  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 3:09:28pm

re: #7 Bob Levin

Are we getting to coffee time, and need to hear inflections and watch facial expressions?

It’s not a question of whether one agrees with Netenyahu—but that the Yahoo writer is turning what is a clear threat into something imagined. This is significant.

However, how Jews discuss upcoming events commemorating the Holocaust—there are always discussions—who to speak, what to say, celebration of life, tone. However, if you compare it to the article on Ynet, the Yahoo article is close—but Yahoo added the paragraph about Netenyahu, and thus forced this issue into the article about Iran being an imagined threat, creating the impression that what is real is not real. That’s the problem.

I couldn’t have said it better myself. (Believe me, I tried. I just erased what I wrote rather than post it because it wasn’t better).

9 Atlas Fails  Fri, Jun 29, 2012 4:59:14pm

I agree with Bob. Apparently, there was a spot of controversy. I see no problem with reporting it with the rest of the story.


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