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1 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 3:46:40pm

Have they considered meeting in Tampa next week?
///

seriously we in the west need to take a far more nuanced approach to Arab spring in particular and the area in general. By and large we are a very naive and ignorant population in this subject.

2 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 4:01:20pm

Yeah, this is the other shoe dropping.

It will become very interesting to say the least very shortly.

3 CuriousLurker  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 4:05:14pm

re: #1 Daniel Ballard

Nuance indeed. I think we, myself included sometimes, tend to think of the Arab Spring (and the Arab world in general) as a monolith. Nothing cold be farther from the truth. The social, political and religious dynamics can be vastly different from country to country. Heck, they can be different from city to city.

4 researchok  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 5:09:27pm

re: #3 CuriousLurker

I believe the only way to address these issues is head on.

Demanding answers to the most fundamental questions turns the focus inward- and that is where all change begins.

The questins are universal and illustrate why reading the classics matter.

Who are we? What are our responsibilities to each and to the state? What do we want to teach our children? How should we treat our elders? What is the proper place for moral and religious instruction? How ought we deal with people who different from us or who have different ideas?

These are universal questions, and the truest answers are determined by each of us, as individuals.

The questions address our universal, moral and religious selves.

They should not be answered by anyone other than ourselves.

5 CriticalDragon1177  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 6:05:15pm

CuriousLurker

What kind of choice is brutal dictatorship vs. brutal theocracy?

Not much of a choice, I wouldn't like having to choose the lessor of two evils in that situation.

6 CriticalDragon1177  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 6:07:18pm

re: #3 CuriousLurker

Nuance indeed. I think we, myself included sometimes, tend to think of the Arab Spring (and the Arab world in general) as a monolith. Nothing cold be farther from the truth. The social, political and religious dynamics can be vastly different from country to country. Heck, they can be different from city to city.

I agree. We need more rational people out there to counter the bigoted stupidity of people of people like both Robert Spencer and David Duke.

7 What, me worry?  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 6:25:47pm

It's probably true that revolution can only happen from within. Any outside force coming in is usually (always?) seen as an occupying force, whether they are or not. But I think it's true that the people must revolt for change to happen.

While no two situations are the same, sometimes the first devil is better than the second devil. But it's a risk I guess they feel they have to take. I just hope the rest of us can live with it. Remember that Iran and Assad are buddies, too. Adds a whole other dimension.

8 CuriousLurker  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 7:48:20pm

re: #4 researchok

I agree, the big moral/universal/philosophical questions are important, but when you're in the middle of a violent struggle against a brutally repressive dictator thoughts about lofty ideals are undoubtedly replaced with more immediately practical ones: How do we survive until tomorrow? How do we stop the torture, maiming, and dying? Who can provide us & our families with the basic measure of security & shelter that's a necessary prerequisite to having the luxury to contemplate answers to the higher questions?

The Syrian people are WAY past the point of no return now and they know it. To lose and have the Assad regime prevail...*shudder*...I don't even want to begin to contemplate what the consequences might be for anyone considered an enemy of the state. Turning back isn't an option.

9 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 22, 2012 9:11:09pm

re: #8 CuriousLurker

The Syrian people are WAY past the point of no return now and they know it. To lose and have the Assad regime prevail...*shudder*...I don't even want to begin to contemplate what the consequences might be for anyone considered an enemy of the state. Turning back isn't an option.

This. The factions will fight until someone emerges as the winner. This isn't optional.

I just can't imagine how many innocent people are trapped in harm's way as this plays out.


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