Pages

Jump to bottom

6 comments

1 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Oct 16, 2012 8:26:09pm

It's difficult, because men wash out of these things in such vast numbers that the odds are good that many women attempting them won't succeed. And women are generally under much greater pressure to fail.

But when a man keels over, it doesn't mean that men in general aren't fit to do whatever it is. While each woman who doesn't make the grade will be seen as an exemplar of Why Women Can't And Shouldn't Try.

2 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Oct 16, 2012 9:08:48pm

It's a hell of a hard course. I looked at Ranger school and they have an equal washout rate so I can imagine what it takes. As Sgt Major Daly put it during the Battle of Belleau Wood, "Come on, you sons of bitches! Do you want to live forever?" That's the attitude any good Infantry NCO or Officer has to have and live by to get through either school.

Reality? I would have probably failed by the halfway point, had I gone for it. I was a good Infantry soldier but not good enough for that.

My sister? She'd have made it in a walk. OTOH, she also retired as a Command Sergent Major and was probably the most "Hoo-ah" female trooper I have ever known.

I do not doubt that there are women who will successfully complete that course. There won't be many who want to and fewer still who will succeed. But I'd follow any of them even willing to try. That's where the real brass balls are...

3 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 17, 2012 6:39:19am

re: #1 SanFranciscoZionist

It's difficult, because men wash out of these things in such vast numbers that the odds are good that many women attempting them won't succeed. And women are generally under much greater pressure to fail.

But when a man keels over, it doesn't mean that men in general aren't fit to do whatever it is. While each woman who doesn't make the grade will be seen as an exemplar of Why Women Can't And Shouldn't Try.

I think the question raised by some people (not by me and I'll want to hear if you think it's trolling) is "Is allowing the few women who can pass such a course into combat positions worth the disruption they will likely cause?"

I'm not going to try to answer the question myself. Instead I'll let LGF's veterans answer it.

4 Destro  Wed, Oct 17, 2012 7:01:27am

re: #3 Dark_Falcon

The era where the American military is planning on fighting the USSR's imagined blitz through the Fulda Gap is over. The American military is mostly a jobs program anyway and has been for about 30 years now.

As we kill more enemies with robot weapons and special forces going forward we will need and use less and less traditional combat units.

I am not saying this is good or bad. It just is.

5 CuriousLurker  Wed, Oct 17, 2012 7:37:15am

re: #3 Dark_Falcon

I think the question raised by some people (not by me and I'll want to hear if you think it's trolling) is "Is allowing the few women who can pass such a course into combat positions worth the disruption they will likely cause?"

I'm not going to try to answer the question myself. Instead I'll let LGF's veterans answer it.

I'm not a veteran, but I can read. I just read the article twice to make sure I wasn't missing anything. What disruption?

The women are part of the program because the Marine Corps sought them out as volunteers for research initiated by them on how female marines might perform in combat roles that are currently forbidden to them.

I saw no mention whatsoever of the women's participation or their washing out being the cause of any special disruption. Where are you getting that from?

Are you just assuming there must have been disruption since it's a non-standard program for women? If that the case then, yeah, there probably was as some people don't like change and will resist it even if it's positive.

It seems pretty clear to me that the higher ups in the Corps are being proactive in this matter, so they must've felt that the long-term benefits of whatever knowledge they're gaining through their research outweighs any short-term disruption. I say good on them for being forward thinking and specifically seeking out women.

6 Locker  Wed, Oct 17, 2012 9:45:45am

This is not a comment on who should or shouldn't be allowed to join or perform certain jobs in the military.

However, saying that co-ed units aren't a disruption to military operations is extremely naive. Consensual relationships, sexual assaults, soldiers fighting over love triangles now have to be managed.

Additionally, I was first deployed during Desert Storm, to the Cement Factory in Dhahran we shared the site with thousands of other troops, all planning forward movements. During this time, 3 of the 11 women in our unit were busted and sent home for prostitution.

I think this would be the same situation if units were all women and you started bringing men, or if units were entirely gay (men or women) but to say that it's not a disruption to the historic model is inaccurate... based on my experience.


This page has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2016-01-01 10:29 am PST
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds Tweet

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Recent PagesClick to refresh
STEALTHING: the Growing Movement of Men Who Secretly Remove Condoms During Sex Two years ago, a 19-year-old Florida teen posted a call for advice in the subreddit askgaybros. In the post, he said he met a guy on Grindr and went back to his place to hook up. When the guy ...
Birth Control Works
1 day, 9 hours ago
Views: 432 • Comments: 5 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 2
Comments: 0
: 0
Trump-Free Sunday Mornings-Daily Beast We think it’s time to go on a more balanced Donald Diet—call it a Sabbath for sanity. And that’s why we’re going to embark on a new experiment: Trump-free Sunday mornings. Barring major breaking news, for a few hours ...
Unshaken Defiance
1 day, 18 hours ago
Views: 197 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 3
Comments: 0
: 3
Video: John Muir - The Last Oasis John Muir - The Last Oasis is a short film directed by Michael Coleman a Martinez, California native inspired by the writings of naturalist, author and early advocate of wilderness preservation John Muir. Many of the locations featured in ...
teleskiguy
2 days, 5 hours ago
Views: 437 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
The Woman Who Saved Lower Manhattan From Becoming a Highway What makes a city? It's not the buildings (skyscrapers) or the streets (traffic), or the banks and government offices and shopping districts sandwiched between them. It's the people. This is obvious nearly to the point of tautology, yet in ...
Birth Control Works
2 days, 13 hours ago
Views: 336 • Comments: 2 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
Domestic Violence Shelters Make Plea for State Budget Resolution A group of domestic violence shelter representatives and other human services advocates gathered at Mutual Ground's headquarters in Aurora Wednesday morning to again make a plea for a resolution on the state's budget crisis and to call attention to ...
Birth Control Works
2 days, 15 hours ago
Views: 208 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
This Wasn’t the First Act of ‘River Piracy’ to Affect the Yukon’s Biggest Lake Image: Kluane11.jpg Author: Dermot Cole, Alaska Dispatch News Canadian geologist John Clague, whose research on Kluane Lake began in 1980, has long believed that the biggest river flowing into the largest lake in the Yukon Territory could be switched ...
Cheechako
3 days, 8 hours ago
Views: 254 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
BBC Radio 4 - Seriously… - Seriously… - 10 Women Who Changed Sci-Fi 10 Women Who Changed Sci-Fi As the Radio 4 documentary Herland examines how science fiction tackles ideas of gender in future worlds, we present a selection of great female authors who have radically altered the genre... Mary Shelley Credited ...
Birth Control Works
3 days, 8 hours ago
Views: 356 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 2
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
Housing Vouchers Would Change the Face of Poverty - Vice VICE: What should every renter understand about their rights?Matthew Desmond: Rights vary from city to city, so getting to know your rights is a matter of knowing where you live, as they can actually be very fair. For example, ...
Birth Control Works
3 days, 9 hours ago
Views: 331 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
Craig Finn - ‘Be Honest’ (Live at WFUV)wfuv.org • Follow @wfuv: ow.ly Craig Finn performs "Be Honest" live in Studio A. Recorded 2.21.17. Host: Eric HollandAudio: Jim O'HaraCameras: Sabrina Sitton, Michael Sperling, Kevin O'Malley & Alexandra ReillyEditor: Kevin O'Malley & Sarah Burns
Tarkloon
3 days, 9 hours ago
Views: 210 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0
Marvel’s Cloak and Dagger - Official Trailer Get your first look at the upcoming Freeform TV series about the two young Marvel heroes, starring Olivia Holt as Dagger and Aubrey Joseph as Cloak. Watch more trailers here! Check out the latest and greatest from IGN here! ...
Tarkloon
3 days, 9 hours ago
Views: 235 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
Shares: 0
Comments: 0
: 0