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1 Charles Johnson  Wed, Oct 24, 2012 8:25:45pm

Testing.

2 Charles Johnson  Wed, Oct 24, 2012 8:34:59pm

Again.

3 sliv_the_eli  Wed, Oct 24, 2012 8:46:46pm

It never ceases to fascinate that the NY Times is almost always at the forefront of accusing Israel's current prime minister of interfering in the U.S. presidential election on behalf of the Republican candidate, but does not hesitate to trot out Israeli leaders in support of the Democrats' nominee.

I note, as well, that while the anecdotes Mr. Halevy recounts are accurate, the picture he seeks to paint is somewhat historically challenged. First, Republican presidents are not the only ones who have pressured Israeli leaders. Former President Jimmy Carter (D) -- great friend of Israel that he is -- twisted Prime Minsiter Begin's arm repeatedly during the Camp David negotiations that culminated in the Israel-Egypt peace treaty, and former President Bill Clinton (D) likewise asserted significant pressure on Prime Minister Netanyahu during the talks that led to the Wye River accords (not to mention prompting a clearly uncomfortable Prime Minister Rabin to shake arch-murderer Yassir Arafat's hand upon signing the Oslo Accords). Second, although presidents coming from the Democratic Party have generally been strong supporters of Israel, so, too, have Republican presidents. President Truman's (D) decision to recognize the newly independent State of Israel in the face of strong objections by his own Secretary of State and other key advisers is well known by every supporter of Israel. But so, too, are the extraordinary steps ordered by then President Nixon to re-arm Israel and enable it to defend itself after Egypt and Syria attacked on Yom Kippur 1973.

To suggest, as Mr. Halevy appears to do, that only nominees of one party (hint: it's not the party whose emblem is an elephant) will "throw Israel under the bus" is misleading, inaccurate and dishonest. The person who occupies the White House is the President of the United States, and can be expected to act in what he or she believes to be in the best interests of the United States. When, as during Gulf War I, the POTUS perceives that it is important to pressure Israel into refraining from responding to Iraqi missile fire, the President will do so. If, in the next four years, the President perceives a need to pressure Israel's leaders in the pursuit of US policy, I fully expect him to do it, regardless of who wins this year's election.

For those of us who support Israel, the question is not whether Democrats or Republicans are "good for Israel". In reality, both parties have earned that label over the past 60 years and it is important that that continue to be the case in the future. The real question for each of us who supports Israel is which candidate's views of US interests we believe to be more likely to advance what we believe to be in Israel's best interests. And that, my friends, is dependent upon much more than what political party the candidate hails from.

4 cinesimon  Wed, Oct 24, 2012 9:25:42pm

Bibi doesn't inject himself into U.S. politics?
How ridiculously naive.
And the NYT critique is a laughable cliche.

It never ceases to fascinate me that critics of the NYT seem only capable of criticizing the NYT from a rather obvious perspective of dishonesty. Cherry picking the articles you don't like is not serious criticism.

5 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Wed, Oct 24, 2012 9:44:21pm

Well I was going to throw Israel under a bus, but it turns out that Israel is a lot bigger and heavier than I thought.

(Who knew? It looks so tiny on the map)

/

6 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Oct 24, 2012 10:10:06pm

re: #3 sliv_the_eli

It never ceases to fascinate that the NY Times is almost always at the forefront of accusing Israel's current prime minister of interfering in the U.S. presidential election on behalf of the Republican candidate, but does not hesitate to trot out Israeli leaders in support of the Democrats' nominee.

Halevy is retired and doesn't represent the Israeli government. He's a private citizen. It's vastly more unseemly and improper for Netanyahu as a sitting PM to interject himself into and attempt to influence US politics.

7 sliv_the_eli  Thu, Oct 25, 2012 9:01:43am

re: #4 cinesimon

Bibi doesn't inject himself into U.S. politics?

Now, if only that was what i said. The issue, and the points of my post, were:

1. To note the hypocrisy of the NY Times on the subject, which, though a cliche, has only become so by virtue of the "grey lady's" conduct; and
2. To note that it is inaccurate, and ultimately self-defeating, for key Israeli public figures -- and, yes, Mr. Halevy is very much a leading Israeli public figure -- to argue in favor of one American political party over another, regardless of which one they might prefer (and, BTW, that goes for Netanyahu same as it does for Halevy).

But, hey, if it works for you to redirect the discussion to something that was not actually said, so be it.

8 sliv_the_eli  Thu, Oct 25, 2012 9:10:27am

re: #6 goddamnedfrank

Halevy is retired and doesn't represent the Israeli government. He's a private citizen. It's vastly more unseemly and improper for Netanyahu as a sitting PM to interject himself into and attempt to influence US politics.

While it is true that Halevy does not represent the Israeli government, he is nevertheless a leading public figure in Israel. (See, for example, his bio at the following link: [Link: www.afhu.org...]
My objection is not to his attempting to influence US politics -- I am a big believer in free speech and the interchange of ideas -- but with the wisdom of explicitly trying to promote one US political party as inherently more pro-Israel than the other. As a strong supporter of Israel, I believe it is critical to maintain support for Israel in this country on a bi-partisan basis.

As to Prime Minister Netanyahu, I have no problem with his attempting to influence US politics, either. He has an obligation to represent the citizens of his country and, to the extent that means he has to attempt to influence the politics of its closes ally, I would expect him to do just that. However, one thing you never have and never will hear Prime Minister Netanyahu say, or even suggest, is that one of our political parties is necessarily more pro-Israel or anti-Israel than the other.


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