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Well, for those who still don’t understand the situation about Israel, it’s God given… to anyone I guess. But let this clip do the explaining. Wonderful graphics from Nina Paley, set to the music of Quincy Jones and sung by the recently departed the great Andy Williams.
21 comments
1 |
War On Music Fri, Nov 16, 2012 10:39:56am |
The religious Ideologists/nationalists are running on an assumption based on the primitive works in the 21st century.
| 2 |
Buck Fri, Nov 16, 2012 10:46:05am |
Not good at all.
The land in question was part of the Ottoman Empire and was lost in WW One.
The Allied Powers at the San Remo conference in 1922 returned the land to the Jewish People. This was voted on at the conference, at the Anglo-American Convention (1924) and at the League of Nations. The United Nations accepted this in full when they opened their door and replaced the League of Nations.
This land was not conquered through bloodshed by the Jews, it was defended with blood. This isn't about God, or the bible. This is about international law and very recent history.
It was recognized in 1922 that the Jews were the indigenous people of the land. There a binding international commitment to the Jewish people, based on the “historical connection of the Jewish people to Palestine and the grounds for reconstituting their national home there,” a commitment which has never been revoked.
The Legal Title to Palestine was therefore transferred peacefully from the Allied Powers … to the Jewish people.
Britain was given a mandate to help with that transfer. Just like France was mandated to transfer the land we now call Lebanon to the people who reside there.
| 3 |
Flavia Fri, Nov 16, 2012 11:28:05am |
re: #2 Buck
The land in question was part of the Ottoman Empire and was lost in WW One.
The Allied Powers at the San Remo conference in 1922 returned the land to the Jewish People. This was voted on at the conference, at the Anglo-American Convention (1924) and at the League of Nations. The United Nations accepted this in full when they opened their door and replaced the League of Nations.
....
This isn't about God, or the bible. This is about international law and very recent history.
....
The Legal Title to Palestine was therefore transferred peacefully from the Allied Powers … to the Jewish people.
Britain was given a mandate to help with that transfer. Just like France was mandated to transfer the land we now call Lebanon to the people who reside there.
I could have quoted absolutely everything you posted, but that would have been gratuitous. Every single letter you wrote was the stone cold truth. WHY IS IT SO HARD TO GRASP???
| 4 |
War On Music Fri, Nov 16, 2012 11:31:52am |
So, the history of re: #2 Buck
Not good at all.
The land in question was part of the Ottoman Empire and was lost in WW One.
The Allied Powers at the San Remo conference in 1922 returned the land to the Jewish People. This was voted on at the conference, at the Anglo-American Convention (1924) and at the League of Nations. The United Nations accepted this in full when they opened their door and replaced the League of Nations.
So, the decision to "return" the land to the Jewish people was made in 1922 by a group of White Anglo-Saxon Protestants in Europe and America, on the basis of a conquered nation in a war that was based on little more then imperialist conquest. It's a good thing this decision was made with the full participation of the Arab people who lived on that land.
At least Buck is being honest that the Zionist mythology that an all powerful and vengeful old-bible god mandated the land to the Jewish people because they and they only are the "chosen" people is pure bullshit, and is honest that Israel is founded as a colonial client-state of British Imperialism. (if we are talking international law, international law recognizes a Arab Palestinian state on the bases of the '67 boarders, but I have no doubt that Buck is a Eretz Yisrael Hashlemah person, who sees an Israel from the brook of Egypt to the Euphrates).
| 5 |
researchok Fri, Nov 16, 2012 11:51:25am |
re: #4 War On Music
Not to worry. Muslims count themselves as 'chosen' as well- even moreso.
As do Christians.
Reality sucks, doesn't it.
And let's not forget the rest of the Middle East was carved up as well, though that seems to bother you not in the least.
Not in the least. I wonder what sets Israel apart for you?
/
| 6 |
researchok Fri, Nov 16, 2012 11:59:58am |
re: #5 researchok
You know what else is funny?
You don't seem top be at all concerned with the stated genocidal intent of the Arab world toward Israel but you do seem obsessed with the imaginary idea Israel will expand her borders even further.
Had the Arabs not kicked out UN Peacekeepers in 67, massed troops on Israel's borders and threatened her annihilation (in addition to the promises of rape and booty), there would be no occupation or 'expansion' of Israel.
Like I said, reality sucks, doesn't it?
If you are up to it, ask what the Israelis found when they liberated Jerusalem (which despite promises and agreements, Jews were barred from their holy sites)
| 7 |
Vicious Babushka Fri, Nov 16, 2012 12:12:48pm |
What this cartoon shows, is that this land has been fought over and conquered many times, by many different nations. The Jews happen to be the current owners (they are also the only nation that is shown twice).
So what is the message of this cartoon? It would seem to be that "might makes right" and the land belongs to the biggest badasses.
There is no spot on earth that hasn't also been fought over and conquered by different nations, and so, what makes this any different?
| 8 |
researchok Fri, Nov 16, 2012 12:51:08pm |
| 9 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Nov 16, 2012 1:05:36pm |
re: #4 War On Music
So, the history of
So, the decision to "return" the land to the Jewish people was made in 1922 by a group of White Anglo-Saxon Protestants in Europe and America, on the basis of a conquered nation in a war that was based on little more then imperialist conquest. It's a good thing this decision was made with the full participation of the Arab people who lived on that land.
At least Buck is being honest that the Zionist mythology that an all powerful and vengeful old-bible god mandated the land to the Jewish people because they and they only are the "chosen" people is pure bullshit, and is honest that Israel is founded as a colonial client-state of British Imperialism. (if we are talking international law, international law recognizes a Arab Palestinian state on the bases of the '67 boarders, but I have no doubt that Buck is a Eretz Yisrael Hashlemah person, who sees an Israel from the brook of Egypt to the Euphrates).
Oh, just go to hell and take your willfully distorted history with you. I don't have the energy for this crap today.
| 10 |
researchok Fri, Nov 16, 2012 1:14:59pm |
| 11 |
CuriousLurker Fri, Nov 16, 2012 1:22:29pm |
re: #7 Vicious Babushka
What this cartoon shows, is that this land has been fought over and conquered many times, by many different nations. The Jews happen to be the current owners (they are also the only nation that is shown twice).
I thought I saw Jews at least 3 times. Wouldn't that be about right: 1st temple, 2nd temple, the present...?
So what is the message of this cartoon? It would seem to be that "might makes right" and the land belongs to the biggest badasses.
I think that's our (human) understanding of it. To me the message seemed to be asking all the believers "Is this what your God had in mind? Really??"
There is no spot on earth that hasn't also been fought over and conquered by different nations, and so, what makes this any different?
I don't have hard data to back it up, but I suspect this tiny sliver of land has been fought over more than any other on our planet.
| 12 |
Bob Levin Fri, Nov 16, 2012 1:49:18pm |
I'm sorry. I must fix this post just a little bit.
| 13 |
Dark_Falcon Fri, Nov 16, 2012 2:49:46pm |
re: #10 researchok
That's what he counts on.
Reality and truth are anathema to him.
"War on Music" has Destro's hostility and contrariness, but he lacks any ability to actually make an argument or post something non-controversial. All he does on LGF is troll.
| 14 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Fri, Nov 16, 2012 3:17:23pm |
I find it unfortunate that people are trying to bring blame into the work when it isn't assigning any. The video is pointing out that there has been a very long history of violence on this land. And that the violence isn't easily ascribable to an abundance of fertile land or natural resources. It ends with the horrifying possibility of nuclear war unless cooler heads prevail.
Sometimes I lay awake at night wondering what could be done to avoid such an outcome. Some people want to blame Israel, or blame Muslims, or blame the UN, etc etc. But ascribing blame isn't going to fix or prevent anything. Clearly the status quo isn't enough so I wonder where do we go from here?
| 15 |
researchok Fri, Nov 16, 2012 4:37:45pm |
I don't have hard data to back it up, but I suspect this tiny sliver of land has been fought over more than any other on our planet.
And all the killings are an expression of God's Will.
There is something very wrong here. Maybe 'tragic' is a better word.
Everyone acknowledges the land is sacred- and no one is content with that.
God has one hell of a sense of humor.
| 16 |
Buck Fri, Nov 16, 2012 8:18:34pm |
re: #4 War On Music
The same people gave land to Iraq, Lebanon and Syria.
Was that also imperialist conquest?
Arabs constituted 37 percent of the total immigration to pre-state Israel. In your terminology, the descendants of Arabs who immigrated in pursuit of jobs and economic opportunity are “indigenous,” while the descendants of Jewish immigrants who fled discrimination, violence, and genocide are “colonizers.”
And NO international law DOES NOT recognize a Arab Palestinian state on the bases of the '67 boarders (sic).
That is disputed, and unresolved. It was certainly offered in 1948 by the new Jewish state, but it was clearly refused by the Arabs.
If you offer to sell a house, and the buyer refuses (thinking they can just steal it) then the offer expires and is null and void.
| 17 |
Eclectic Infidel Fri, Nov 16, 2012 9:18:46pm |
re: #9 SanFranciscoZionist
Oh, just go to hell and take your willfully distorted history with you. I don't have the energy for this crap today.
Yes, the patience wears thin.
| 18 |
Aligarr Fri, Nov 16, 2012 10:02:37pm |
Somehow , I don't think Andy Williams had this in mind when he sang that song .
| 19 |
Buck Fri, Nov 16, 2012 10:08:01pm |
re: #4 War On Music
Israel is founded as a colonial client-state of British Imperialism.
Just to be extra clear. Britain didn't conquer the land that was known as Palestine the British Mandate.
There was no "Imperialism" involved. Britain was given a mandate to help the Jews re-create a country. They were supposed to help. As another example, at the same time France was mandated to help create Lebanon. That is how it was done, peacefully for both Arab and Jew.
No colonial client states, no British Imperialism.
It's a good thing this decision was made with the full participation of the Arab people who lived on that land.
In fact, that is exactly what happened. Arabs received land at the same time. They actually received the lions share of the land. And later a large portion of the British Mandate was given away to even more Arabs, Trans Jordan. The Jews kept only a small piece.
That small sliver was only the land that was for thousands of years the Jewish homeland.
I repeat: This land was not conquered through bloodshed by the Jews, however it was defended with blood.
| 20 |
William of Orange Sat, Nov 17, 2012 5:57:08am |
Here's a list of the people who conquered Israel as explained by the maker of this clip.
It seems like the holy war is raging on in the comments over there...
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