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1 jaunte  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 4:25:31pm
The law requires that plaques celebrating the power of the Almighty God be installed outside the state Homeland Security building--and carries a criminal penalty of up to 12 months in jail if one fails to comply. The plaque’s inscription begins with the assertion, “The safety and security of the Commonwealth cannot be achieved apart from reliance upon Almighty God.”

Maybe Riner should be required to show where God said "Let there be plaques."

2 researchok  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 5:04:54pm

This will get tossed, for sure

3 Skip Intro  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 5:07:29pm

re: #2 researchok

This will get tossed, for sure

The real problem is that it got passed in the first place.

4 Tim Nadeau  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 5:26:29pm

I'm getting more and more compelled to come out. Yes, over the years, my late wife and I have concluded that all references to God are just this religion or that covering up that fact that belief is based on what you were told as a child. We both thought that is a very personal thing and the law has nothing to do with it.

5 EPR-radar  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 5:36:21pm

re: #2 researchok

This will get tossed, for sure

The lawsuit brought against this insane law won in District Court, but lost at the Apellate level. So a panel of Federal Appeals court judges thought this was constitutional.

The rot in the judiciary runs deep.

6 EPR-radar  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 5:41:10pm

For the record, this dingleberry Tom Riner is a Democrat. Republicans do not have a monopoly on abject stupidity.

7 Political Atheist  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 5:53:39pm

I would think that they violated their oath of office. And should be removed for it. This is the kind of thing that calls for federal intervention by Justice.

BTW why has this Page got so few retweets? I would think this would get dozens.

8 Ziggy Standard  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 6:25:13pm

Kinda OT but I'm coming to the conclusion that God is a way of demoting one's own conscience. One's conscience, assuming it is functioning normally, can't be fooled with rituals, can't be bargained with, and actually is omniscient with regard to your thoughts and motives and sees straight through all your bullshit.

Belief in God also creates the illusion that everything will be ok in the end, somehow, no matter what we do. No real or permanent harm can come to the universe as a result of our actions. The big caretaker in the sky will see to it that everything balances out in the end. He's got everything covered.

To the atheist how we behave here and now is everything and everything depends on it.

9 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 6:45:53pm

I recently listened to the best autobiography ever written. In it, Kurt Vonnegut said somethings about people who need religion. Very insightful.

He was compassionate and truthful.

10 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 6:47:12pm

re: #8 Ayeless in Ghazi

There is strong evidence that belief in god stems from humans' pattern-matching ability; the same capacity that allows us leaps of logic, that allows us to conceptualize about things that don't exist yet or can't immediately be proved leads to belief in god and the supernatural, as well.

It's not likely it can be gotten rid of. Even among supposed atheists, you'll find a lot who believe in 'luck' or some other supernatural belief.

What can happen, what is relatively easy, is to convince people that where religion and science differ, the religion is at fault.

Making people march all the way to the end of Dennett's aisle is extremely difficult.

But it is relatively easy to get people to accept that where science and religion are in conflict, it is the understanding of the religious belief that is in error.

11 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 6:51:30pm

I have no problem with the idea that magic is that which we do not yet have the science to explain. We see patterns that are there and will some day be explained. To say that "the Universe or a concept of G-d" is responsible is, to me, a way of putting it into words.

It's when people seem to NEED to force others to behave and believe according to their own fairy stories about what hasn't yet been explained that is insane to me.

If such beliefs help a person function thru their life and they aren't seriel killers, then WTF, I could care less. Just don't make laws that I must follow because of your unsubstantiated belief.

12 Destro  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 7:50:30pm

re: #10 Obdicut

There is strong evidence that belief in god stems from humans' pattern-matching ability; the same capacity that allows us leaps of logic, that allows us to conceptualize about things that don't exist yet or can't immediately be proved leads to belief in god and the supernatural, as well.

Religion was a tool - pray to god and hope to catch the animal or carry out a ritual and the hunt will go well. It is man trying to control or bargain with nature.

Over time religion became a way to organize society (circumcisions used to tamp down sex urges for example).

As we get get more advanced in science you no longer need to pray to a god to get your health back. You visit a doctor. As we become more advanced and can alter nature to our benefit we need god less and less as a tool to get stuff but religion still plays a role in organizing societal behaviors and that will be the hardest habit to break.

13 sagehen  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 9:01:15pm

re: #12 Destro

Over time religion became a way to organize society (circumcisions used to tamp down sex urges for example).

um... circumcisions don't tamp down sex urges. At all.

It's about preventing hideously painful infections. Remember that these rules were first written for nomadic desert people, they don't get to bathe very often. (most of the kosher rules are also health oriented -- when there was no refrigeration or pasteurization or microscopes or antibiotics or disinfectants, people who kept kosher still managed to avoid salmonella and e coli and trichonosis and a whole long list of problems that non-kosher people suffered from.)

14 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 9:13:31pm

re: #13 sagehen

um... circumcisions don't tamp down sex urges. At all.

He might have been referring to "female circumcision" which is practiced with the specific intent to "tamp down sex urges."

15 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 9:40:22pm

Riner is an example of how party affiliation means nothing in a state like Kentucky, which is squarely in the Bible Belt. He's a Southern Baptist minister in Louisville and adamant about the whole "Christian nation" stuff. He's served in the state House since 1981.

Kentucky also boasts such luminaries of the GOP as Mitch McConnell and Luap Dnar, or for more years that anyone can imagine kept Dems like William Natcher (old boy Southern pol, if there ever was one) and "Swindle" Ford in office.

I lived in KY for 30 years. Don't get me started on what it was like being a liberal there.

16 Destro  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 9:57:21pm

re: #13 sagehen

re: #14 watching you tiny alien kittens are

Yes, female circumcisions are used - the theory of its origins that I remember - to tamp down sexual urges.

I always assumed the male circumcision was done as a form of identity (different from the female version). Remember our ancestors were not that shy about nudity, especially male nudity. Other tribes practiced facial scarring or tattooing or teeth chipping or cranial elogation as part of tribal identity rituals. So I personally am not that fond of the theory that male circumcision was invented as a cleanliness adoptation or to control male sexuality (unlike the female version of it were it was clearly done for that purpose).

17 JamesWI  Wed, Nov 21, 2012 11:35:12pm

re: #5 EPR-radar

The lawsuit brought against this insane law won in District Court, but lost at the Apellate level. So a panel of Federal Appeals court judges thought this was constitutional.

The rot in the judiciary runs deep.

The excerpt of the article posted says it was overturned by the State appellate court, not Federal.

And seats on the Kentucky Court of Appeals are determined by election. Which is such a fantastic system we have in so many states.....vote for legislators who will pass blatantly unconstitutional laws, and vote for the judges who will review those laws, ensuring that those blatantly unconstitutional laws aren't overturned until they're appealed even further, wasting even more money and even more time in the justice system, which is already backed up enough as it is.


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