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1 Randall Gross  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:23:35am

Unless he drives in the same conditions and parks it overnight in the cold, it’s not the same thing. Growing up in Fairbanks, AK helped me understand what cold can do to batteries, and Li-I batteries are even more susceptible to cold effects than other types.

In the end what’s needed aren’t charging stations, but rather a charging lane on interstates.

2 lawhawk  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:40:04am

I’ve also seen Telsa released the black box data that showed that the NYT driver lied about his driving profile. The speed was consistently higher than they recommended, and that he never drove below 45mph as he claimed in the article.

I’ll wait to see the black box data from the CNN drive to know and compare parameters of the drive.

3 Major Tom  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:40:08am

Yes he should drive the car to manhattan, then aimlessly around parking lots, and occationally spiking the speed to over 80mph too… pssh… NYTs looks really stupid right now.

4 stabby  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:49:54am

The NYT article was strange.

People defend it on the grounds that the writer wasn’t lying by THAT much, but his speed was clearly faster than he said it was and he lied about having cruise control on, his speed was anything but constant averaging 10 mph higher or something with large spikes. What’s the point of even releasing an article with lies?

5 iossarian  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 11:18:01am

re: #2 lawhawk

I’ve also seen Telsa released the black box data that showed that the NYT driver lied about his driving profile. The speed was consistently higher than they recommended, and that he never drove below 45mph as he claimed in the article.

I’ll wait to see the black box data from the CNN drive to know and compare parameters of the drive.

The truth is presumably somewhere in the middle, but it’s clear as day that he vastly overstated the extent to which he drove “defensively”, and that he under-charged the car on at least one occasion.

Musk was also entirely correct to point out that Broder has expressed negative opinions on electric cars in the past. Overall I’d say he (Broder) may get away with it, but his reputation is surely going to be tarnished.

6 ReamWorks SKG  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 1:40:04pm

I drive an electric car; I’d never take one long distances. Even in the “CNN” case, the driver had to actively manage his drive.

Right now, they’re toys for the well-to-do. I’m not even sure how green they are. I have PVs on the roof of my house that brings my net electric use to zero over the course of a year. People who don’t do this are just burning coal in someone else’s neighborhood.

7 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 2:38:31pm

I got into this discussion a bit yesterday, Charles points out where Musk git himself a little too wound up. But he’s all in for tesla, so I get that. Anyway I found it easy to find tests where the Tesla behaved as expected.
Paged yesterday.

8 neilk  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 2:57:52pm

They’re “toys for the well-to-do” because they’re not well suited for long-haul road trips? Doesn’t make sense.

The normal usage pattern for cars is short round trips to and from the workplace. For anybody who doesn’t burn more than a tank of gas on the way to and from work, electric cars are every bit useful as internal combustion cars.

9 neilk  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 2:59:35pm

Broder tries to run out of energy and succeeds; the CNN team tries not to run out of energy and succeeds. No surprises.

10 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 3:02:51pm

re: #2 lawhawk

I’ve also seen Telsa released the black box data that showed that the NYT driver lied about his driving profile. The speed was consistently higher than they recommended, and that he never drove below 45mph as he claimed in the article.

I’ll wait to see the black box data from the CNN drive to know and compare parameters of the drive.

It’s worth noting that by taking the Tesla to a reported 85mph, the NYT reviewer was subjecting it to a 71% increase in aerodynamic drag over the recommended speed during those portions of the trip. People don’t appreciate that velocity is squared in that equation.

11 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 3:08:15pm

re: #10 goddamnedfrank

More importantly actually though, is that the power required to push through aerodynamic drag increases with the cube of the velocity. Meaning that in taking the car to 85 mph, the battery drain was exacerbated by an increased 123% over the drain incurred at 65 mph. So Broder was more than doubling the drain rate during those sections of the drive.

Musk and Tesla have every right to be pissed off.

12 neilk  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 3:14:37pm

I thought the worst misrepresentation was that Broder said he charged it for an hour when he really charged it for 47 minutes. I can’t see how the NYT gets away without retracting that.

13 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 3:40:47pm

It’s worth noting that there’s also a weird variation in driven speed in the Tesla graph on RWC’s page. between about mile 125 to 220 of the trip the line is nice and thin, meaning that Broder was able to maintain a fairly constant speed through this section. Before and after though the graph is full of noise, indicating near constant variation in speed. That hundred mile thin section is marked as cruise control and looks like it, everywhere else is Broder driving like a wild ass, with what seems like an average of 8 to 10 mph variation over virtually every couple of miles.

14 Etaoin Shrdlu  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 4:00:43pm

re: #4 stabby

What’s the point of even releasing an article with lies?

They didn’t think they’d get caught.

15 EPR-radar  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 4:03:44pm

re: #14 Etaoin Shrdlu

They didn’t think they’d get caught.

Probably an occupational hazard of being a journalist. If they get too used to reality as being that which they put in their articles, it can breed arrogance and disregard for facts. Broder would not have done what he did if he had realized that raw data for his drive would be available after his piece came out.


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