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1 Kragar  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 2:31:51pm
What Greenwald is saying is that NSA doesn’t just collect records of calls, it actually records a billion cellphone calls per day.

And stores and sorts them how exactly? Its far more likely this means that calls and chats which have been flagged as suspicious and under investigation can be monitored and give real time notification, not every call made in the US, let alone the world.

Once again, more misinformation and bullshit from Greenwald.

2 Heywood Jabloeme  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 3:08:38pm

I don’t know where you get the Bullshit part as the documents that he published that were leaked by Snowden have all been spot on.

As to where they are archived? In places like the facility that the NSA is building in Utah? Let me guess, it’s a billion dollar facility for playing Angry Birds.

3 Heywood Jabloeme  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 3:11:01pm

I would suggest that anyone really curious as to what is going on hear spend less time what the critiques are of Grenwald and Snowden, and actaully read the leaked documents themselves and the reporting of them.

LGF is turning into the equivalent of Climate Deniers for the NSA leaks!

4 Heywood Jabloeme  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 3:22:34pm

“Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., is “deeply troubled” by the top U.S. intelligence figure’s public lie about domestic spying on Americans, the senator’s office said.

Wyden said National Intelligence Director James Clapper’s office within days admitted privately Clapper lied in public testimony at an open congressional hearing March 12, but Clapper refused to acknowledge this formally to the committee for 14 weeks.”

Read more: upi.com

So I’ve got a question - If Clapper has formerly and publically admited that he lied when he said that the US Govt wasn’t spying on US citizens what does that make Obama?

5 Randall Gross  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 4:07:44pm

1. real time doesn’t exist, the closest you can get is near real time.
2. notification, even if near real time, does not require direct access to anything in any of those companies. (study SNMP traps, alerts, thresholds and what they can do — then you can come back and talk about this intelligently. )

6 Heywood Jabloeme  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 4:51:35pm

Randall - if you think splitting hairs regarding the distinction between real time and real time bolsters you pathetic attempt at making a point by throwing around technical jargon you are really naive. BTW - super genious these aren;t my claims they are on the document produced by the NSA and made by EXPERTS in various articles, one which I provided the link to here. Why don’t you try reading and stop blathering shit?

7 Randall Gross  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 6:03:56pm

re: #6 Heywood Jabloeme

It’s not tech jargon, it’s how it works. The main point is that no direct connection is needed. Greenwald is still wrong. I wont’ be talking to you more since you are so partisan on this that you refuse to see facts. I’ve worked in deep tech for the telecom industry since the early 70’s — I might know what I’m talking about regardless of your capitalized EXPERTS!

8 Heywood Jabloeme  Tue, Jul 2, 2013 8:58:13pm

Randal - Ok, so you read the leaked slides from the NSA where they use the term “real time” and so you conceede that right? Just wanted to get that straight. By the way, it is from the same set of slides that showed that the NSA is collecting the Metadata ect. And as Greenwald claims in this piece there are many more on the way. So what does it do to YOUR case for Obama if the NSA doesn’t have direct access to internet techonolgy companies servers, which would back up what the tech execs are saying, but instead serptiously do “real time” servalence with the technolgies you describe, without the tech companies knowledge. Takes the burden off the tech execs and places right on his on the Congress’ shoulders doesn’t it?

Have you ever frequented the Climate Denialist sites where one “lone wolf” everyman expert physicist makes one post that he claims invalidates all the other experts claims regarding Climate Change?

Ok, so sure, you are an expert that doesn’t consistently read the facts yet claims to have such knowledge that disproves claim that is made by many other experts. And your claim of “partisanship” on my part is freaking helarious. 23 Dem Senators are partisan like me. The NYT, WaPo and the Atlantic and the Daily Show and Steven Colbert and all of MSNBC are all partisan like me.

Greenwald is a creepy, name dropping, hyperventalating user of vapid hyperbole. Everything that Charles has written about him is right-on. Same goes for Snowden.

The problem for us is that they are right on the facts and Obama is totally wrong. His statements on the subject have changed and as more facts come out he will be forced to change them again. He better get out in front of this.

So I ask, what will it look like when a rag like the Guardian writes a piece that simply summerizes what has leaked and reported when, what statements have come from Congress, who has admitted to lying and the various (I count 3) statements from HIM PERSONALLY that are not consistent and have changed when the facts have changed? It will happen and when it does, he will have only hard questions to answer.

This is bad law, bad policey and if he wants to own it then I don’t think that he has carefully thought through what it will mean to him and his legacy. If you want to read that I come to the conclusion that I am partisan, then you are living proof that Greenwald was right when he used the term “Obama worshipers”.


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