Pages

Jump to bottom

7 comments

1 Rightwingconspirator  Jan 15, 2015 8:56:59am

Hello Jimmah!

Free speech is a principle well preserved here in the states. When the KKK publishes or marches it enjoys not just the 1st Amendment but also the ACLU etc. Not sure exactly how the EU handles that, just aware of some specific illegalities like pro Nazi speech or icons.

The discussion at least in my view about content rings out as a separate bell note. People that are offended by some of that content have every right to refrain from buying or viewing and enjoy the right to object themselves.

Given our history as I point out above with the KKK, we can and do call out some content as racist and offensive and despicable. Should a terror attack make me hesitate to note that in my view Charlie Hebdo is a horrible little rag? One that if it had simply gone away absent any violence I would not miss one bit? I say not. We must be able to support the right and still sometimes despise objectionable content.

2 KerFuFFler  Jan 15, 2015 9:12:26am

re: #1 Rightwingconspirator

Should a terror attack make me hesitate to note that in my view Charlie Hebdo is a horrible little rag? One that if it had simply gone away absent any violence I would not miss one bit? I say not. We must be able to support the right and still sometimes despise objectionable content.

Exactly so. And furthermore, people who despise the ‘objectionable’ content must be as free to express their thoughts as the purveyors of the original ‘objectionable’ content. Just because someone was inexcusably attacked for expressing offensive images does not mean that those same images and the rationale for publishing them become immune from criticism.

3 CriticalDragon1177  Jan 15, 2015 9:28:09am

re: #1 Rightwingconspirator

Excellent point.

4 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Jan 15, 2015 12:39:04pm

Freedom of speech cannot be absolute, and it’s not absolute in the US. It’s just the speech that is for some reason not free is said not to be covered by the 1st amdt. But it’s still a limitation.

5 goddamnedfrank  Jan 15, 2015 1:51:29pm

re: #4 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Freedom of speech cannot be absolute, and it’s not absolute in the US. It’s just the speech that is for some reason not free is said not to be covered by the 1st amdt. But it’s still a limitation.

I’d also say that while FoS is an awesome ideal, especially with regards to publishing rights where generally nobody can ever be made to consume content against their will, it is also a very new arrival on the world stage. One can recognize the ethical superiority of the live and let live operating philosophy behind freedom of speech, and yet still acknowledge that the western democracies that champion this right are themselves the outliers, and that this concept doesn’t have much historical inertia behind it as yet.

This doesn’t legitimize the reaction in any way, but put it in context. If personal freedom and secular government were easy they would already be the default state for human societies. Instead these concepts run very much against humanity’s baser and more deeply engrained instincts.

6 Aye Pod  Jan 15, 2015 2:29:47pm

re: #4 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Freedom of speech cannot be absolute, and it’s not absolute in the US. It’s just the speech that is for some reason not free is said not to be covered by the 1st amdt. But it’s still a limitation.

Shouting “Fire!” in the theatre right? Well of course, but he is responding to people who think they can deny your freedom of speech by lobbing an adjective at it. Once we say that you can say anything except that which some person or persons finds offensive (and how much more persuasive this argument always seems to become when backed up with violence) then anything can become unsayable. That’s why it has to be, in this sense “absolute”.

7 EPR-radar  Jan 15, 2015 2:51:53pm

re: #5 goddamnedfrank

I’d also say that while FoS is an awesome ideal, especially with regards to publishing rights where generally nobody can ever be made to consume content against their will, it is also a very new arrival on the world stage. One can recognize the ethical superiority of the live and let live operating philosophy behind freedom of speech, and yet still acknowledge that the western democracies that champion this right are themselves the outliers, and that this concept doesn’t have much historical inertia behind it as yet.

This doesn’t legitimize the reaction in any way, but put it in context. If personal freedom and secular government were easy they would already be the default state for human societies. Instead these concepts run very much against humanity’s baser and more deeply engrained instincts.

As I’ve gotten older, I’ve become much more cautious about criticizing anti-free speech laws that seem to have a solid basis (e.g., anti-Nazi laws in Germany). It’s very hard to say when, if ever, such laws should be ended.


This page has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2021-06-05 2:51 pm PDT
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds Tweet

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal
Square Cash Shop at amazon
as an LGF Associate!
Recent PagesClick to refresh
Netflix’s the Sandman - Behind the Scenes (2021) Neil Gaiman, Gwendoline Christie I've heard about Sandman for ages from all my nerdpals but being DC averse, never read it so I am looking forward to this. The Sandman is a new dark fantasy Netflix series based on The Sandman comic book ...
Thanos
4 days, 17 hours ago
Views: 363 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 5 •
#Thegreatpoolpondconversion - 210606We thought we were done with some of this... but there's more rock washing and hauling.And there's gonna be more pebble washing and top soil hauling. Saturday we washed the ton of rocks delivered a few weeks ago.We left them ...
Dangerman
5 days, 7 hours ago
Views: 291 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 6
Tweets: 0 •
The Disco Biscuits Shem Rah Boo→Tractorbeam Jam→I Know You Rider @ Red Rocks [VIDEO] Never miss a Sunday show! The Boys are back at Red Rocks for the closing show of an incredible 3-night weekend. The Disco Biscuits play a crowd favorite, Shem Rah Boo →Tractorbeam Jam → The Grateful Dead's "I Know ...
teleskiguy
1 week, 1 day ago
Views: 431 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 0 •
Alanis Morissette X Willie Nelson - on the Road Again the Jagged Little Pill 25th anniversary tour with garbage and liz phair is coming to the US this summer & to the UK/europe this fall with liz phair ✨✨ we moved some shows around (salt lake city, portland, seattle, ...
Thanos
1 week, 3 days ago
Views: 642 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 5 •
#Thegreatpoolpondconversion - 210530Three days in a row is too much! Saturday we installed the new panel.Clear, easy to read and now we have good info from the 3 meters at the bottom. Sunday we decommissioned the temporary garbage can filter.We installed the ...
Dangerman
1 week, 3 days ago
Views: 581 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 2
Tweets: 0 •
Flag Observances for June June 14 is designated as Flag Day. It is a commemoration of the Second Continental Congress’s adoption of the flag as the national symbol of the United States in 1775. In the same session after adoption of the flag, ...
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷
1 week, 4 days ago
Views: 557 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 0 •
Science Friday: What Happens When the Colorado River Runs Dry? This segment is part of The State of Science, a series featuring science stories from public radio stations across the United States. This story was reported by Luke Runyon on KUNC. Dry conditions are the worst they’ve been in ...
teleskiguy
1 week, 5 days ago
Views: 734 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 4
Tweets: 11 •
Sigrid - Mirror (Live on Later) Subscribe – bit.lyStream more music videos on BBC iPlayerPlay all-day music mixes to match your mood on BBC Sounds This video:Watch Sigrid perform Mirror filmed at the Norwegian Centre for Design and Architecture, Oslo. From the BBC's flagship music ...
Thanos
1 week, 6 days ago
Views: 754 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 •
Umphrey’s McGee: Bridgeview, IL 5/15/21 (Full Show) [VIDEO] Sit back and relax with nearly three hours of pro-shot video from night two of Umphrey's McGee At the Drive Inn, outside SeatGeek Stadium in beautiful Bridgeview, IL. Filmed on 5/15/21 by TourGigs. Set 1: Bathing Digits, Mulche's Odyssey, ...
teleskiguy
2 weeks, 6 days ago
Views: 932 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 0 •