Pages

Jump to bottom

7 comments

1 Rightwingconspirator  Jan 15, 2015 8:56:59am

Hello Jimmah!

Free speech is a principle well preserved here in the states. When the KKK publishes or marches it enjoys not just the 1st Amendment but also the ACLU etc. Not sure exactly how the EU handles that, just aware of some specific illegalities like pro Nazi speech or icons.

The discussion at least in my view about content rings out as a separate bell note. People that are offended by some of that content have every right to refrain from buying or viewing and enjoy the right to object themselves.

Given our history as I point out above with the KKK, we can and do call out some content as racist and offensive and despicable. Should a terror attack make me hesitate to note that in my view Charlie Hebdo is a horrible little rag? One that if it had simply gone away absent any violence I would not miss one bit? I say not. We must be able to support the right and still sometimes despise objectionable content.

2 KerFuFFler  Jan 15, 2015 9:12:26am

re: #1 Rightwingconspirator

Should a terror attack make me hesitate to note that in my view Charlie Hebdo is a horrible little rag? One that if it had simply gone away absent any violence I would not miss one bit? I say not. We must be able to support the right and still sometimes despise objectionable content.

Exactly so. And furthermore, people who despise the ‘objectionable’ content must be as free to express their thoughts as the purveyors of the original ‘objectionable’ content. Just because someone was inexcusably attacked for expressing offensive images does not mean that those same images and the rationale for publishing them become immune from criticism.

3 CriticalDragon1177  Jan 15, 2015 9:28:09am

re: #1 Rightwingconspirator

Excellent point.

4 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD  Jan 15, 2015 12:39:04pm

Freedom of speech cannot be absolute, and it’s not absolute in the US. It’s just the speech that is for some reason not free is said not to be covered by the 1st amdt. But it’s still a limitation.

5 goddamnedfrank  Jan 15, 2015 1:51:29pm

re: #4 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Freedom of speech cannot be absolute, and it’s not absolute in the US. It’s just the speech that is for some reason not free is said not to be covered by the 1st amdt. But it’s still a limitation.

I’d also say that while FoS is an awesome ideal, especially with regards to publishing rights where generally nobody can ever be made to consume content against their will, it is also a very new arrival on the world stage. One can recognize the ethical superiority of the live and let live operating philosophy behind freedom of speech, and yet still acknowledge that the western democracies that champion this right are themselves the outliers, and that this concept doesn’t have much historical inertia behind it as yet.

This doesn’t legitimize the reaction in any way, but put it in context. If personal freedom and secular government were easy they would already be the default state for human societies. Instead these concepts run very much against humanity’s baser and more deeply engrained instincts.

6 Aye Pod  Jan 15, 2015 2:29:47pm

re: #4 Prof. Backpfeifengesicht, PhD

Freedom of speech cannot be absolute, and it’s not absolute in the US. It’s just the speech that is for some reason not free is said not to be covered by the 1st amdt. But it’s still a limitation.

Shouting “Fire!” in the theatre right? Well of course, but he is responding to people who think they can deny your freedom of speech by lobbing an adjective at it. Once we say that you can say anything except that which some person or persons finds offensive (and how much more persuasive this argument always seems to become when backed up with violence) then anything can become unsayable. That’s why it has to be, in this sense “absolute”.

7 EPR-radar  Jan 15, 2015 2:51:53pm

re: #5 goddamnedfrank

I’d also say that while FoS is an awesome ideal, especially with regards to publishing rights where generally nobody can ever be made to consume content against their will, it is also a very new arrival on the world stage. One can recognize the ethical superiority of the live and let live operating philosophy behind freedom of speech, and yet still acknowledge that the western democracies that champion this right are themselves the outliers, and that this concept doesn’t have much historical inertia behind it as yet.

This doesn’t legitimize the reaction in any way, but put it in context. If personal freedom and secular government were easy they would already be the default state for human societies. Instead these concepts run very much against humanity’s baser and more deeply engrained instincts.

As I’ve gotten older, I’ve become much more cautious about criticizing anti-free speech laws that seem to have a solid basis (e.g., anti-Nazi laws in Germany). It’s very hard to say when, if ever, such laws should be ended.


This page has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2016-01-01 10:29 am PST
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds Tweet

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal
Square Cash Shop at amazon
as an LGF Associate!
Recent PagesClick to refresh
The America That Used to Be: Look in Your Passport - Try Not to Cry I looked in the pages of my passport today, checking out the stamps from all the cool places my work has taken me (and the terrifying places as well, but some of those have cool visa pages, so meh, ...
Khal Wimpo (not drinking damn fish tank cleaner)
5 hours, 40 minutes ago
Views: 91 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 3
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Harris, Parton, Ronstadt on Late Show, March 24, 1999 (Full, Stereo) "Trio II" was recorded in 1994 but not released until 1999, when Emmylou Harris, Dolly Parton, and Linda Ronstadt appeared on Late Show to perform Neil Young's "After the Gold Rush." The Glass Harmonica (or Armonica) was played by ...
Thanos
3 days, 13 hours ago
Views: 312 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 3 • Share to Facebook
Ratched You deserve someone to show you mercy. From the creator of American Horror Story, witness the origin of one of the world's most iconic characters, Nurse Ratched. Sarah Paulson stars in Ratched, coming to Netflix on September 18. SUBSCRIBE: ...
Thanos
4 days, 13 hours ago
Views: 334 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 0 • Share to Facebook
The Jaded Hearts Club - Reach Out I’ll Be There (Official Video) The Official Video for Reach Out I'll Be There by The Jaded Hearts Club. The new album You've Always Been Here is out 2 October, pre-order now: jadedhearts.lnk.to Listen to We'll Meet Again / Reach Out I'll Be There: ...
Thanos
4 days, 13 hours ago
Views: 511 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Raised by Wolves — New Ridley Scott Television Series Mother was programmed to protect everyone after Earth had been destroyed. When the big bad wolf shows up, she is the one we must trust. Subscribe: bit.ly Be the first to know more:HBO Max: hbom.axLike HBO Max on Facebook: ...
Thanos
6 days, 12 hours ago
Views: 684 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 3 • Share to Facebook
Black Pumas - Confines (Official Live Session With String Quartet) “Confines (Live in Studio)” is available now to stream/download. It is from the deluxe edition of the Black Pumas’ debut album which will be released digitally August 28 and physically October 9. Pre-order in 2xLP, 2xCD and digital formats: ...
Thanos
1 week, 1 day ago
Views: 817 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 3 • Share to Facebook
Orville Peck - Smalltown Boy (Official Audio) Official audio for Orville Peck’s cover of "Smalltown Boy" by Bronski Beat out now: orvillepeck.lnk.to Pre-save / Pre-add Orville's new EP Show Pony here: orvillepeck.lnk.to Amazon - orvillepeck.lnk.toApple Music - orvillepeck.lnk.toiTunes - orvillepeck.lnk.toSoundcloud -  orvillepeck.lnk.toSpotify - orvillepeck.lnk.toYouTube Music - orvillepeck.lnk.toYouTube -  orvillepeck.lnk.to Follow Orville PeckFacebook - facebook.comInstagram - instagram.comTwitter - @orvillepeck orvillepeck.com LyricsTo ...
Thanos
1 week, 2 days ago
Views: 859 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 6 • Share to Facebook
Norah Jones - to Live "To Live" is taken from Norah's newest album 'Pick Me Up Off The Floor,' out now and available to stream/download here: norahjones.lnk.to Connect with Norah:norahjones.cominstagram.comfacebook.com@NorahJones See Norah live: norahjones.com Music video by Norah Jones performing To Live. © 2020 ...
Thanos
1 week, 6 days ago
Views: 1,042 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 • Share to Facebook
Future Islands - for Sure (Official Video) 'For Sure' by Future Islands, out now on all platforms: futureislands.ffm.to A Film by Samuel Jerome MasonFinishing by John HarrisonRendered with GarageFarmSpecial Thanks to Anna, Jemima, Mike, Willy, Saad, Eric, Arsen Perish the painI was impoverishedThose ties that windAnd ...
Thanos
1 week, 6 days ago
Views: 1,029 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 2 • Share to Facebook
Andrew McMahon in the Wilderness - Get on My Wave I wrote and produced “Get On My Wave” with Kyle “King Tuff” Thomas the day we met last summer. I’ve struggled with releasing the song during the pandemic because it felt too happy; detached from the tumult of our ...
Thanos
1 week, 6 days ago
Views: 998 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 2 • Share to Facebook