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Ming5000  Apr 3, 2016 • 4:34:17am

The article linked to here was written in response to criticism to the first article “Is Sam Harris Really a White Supremacist?”. The authors themselves state that they came to “mixed conclusions”.

To be clear, Harris is not endorsing white supremacy in the popular sense of the term; he doesn’t posit the essential superiority of whiteness. But when it comes to Islam, he has arrived at very similar conclusions. In doing so, he offers a dangerous example of how hardline atheist thinkers can evoke underlying prejudices under the guise of rational objectivity.

Before making a conclusion about Sam Harris yourself, PLEASE read the linked articles. To me, they are nothing more than click-bait with little analytical thinking and broad conclusions based on out of context quotes and links to similarly questionable articles. And, by the way, Sam Harris laments how the left’s lack of focus on the threat of Jihadism and Islamism surrenders to the right the whole dialogue about the problems and solutions.

Does the title of the article use a familiar trope? Some people are asking.

If you happen to care whether Sam Harris might be a white supremecist, here is a good podcast to listen to. Here Sam has a discussion with Douglas Murrey.

Sam Harris seems to one of those people who are smeared broadly as being “bad” without the nuance that the article authors portray they hope for.

jhncsy  Apr 3, 2016 • 7:12:10am

re: #1 Ming5000

Eh, I think people call Harris a racist because he has said that all Muslims should be profiled, despite actual security experts explaining that profiling doesn’t work. First, the number of terrorists compared to normal people in Muslim air travelers is about one to eight million, so you’d be harassing innocent people for dubious benefits. Second, if security is focused on people who “look Muslim” (whatever that means) then terrorists will recruit people who don’t fit the profile, as they’ve done before. Harris is arguing for security measures that harass innocent people and actually make airports less safe, all because he’s worried about Muslims.

Jayleia  Apr 3, 2016 • 8:27:29am

re: #1 Ming5000

And, by the way, Sam Harris laments how the left’s lack of focus on the threat of Jihadism and Islamism surrenders to the right the whole dialogue about the problems and solutions.

Sam Harris is a fucking moron. The only serious dialogue about that has been mostly on the left.

The Left: WALL OF TEXT, regarding history, how economic and social effects cause/prevent extremism, and how to influence those effects to help prevent that in the future. How to balance civil rights and security needs… TL;DR

The Right: Imma gonna secure Muslim neighborhoods, profile anyone that looks Muslim (yeah, Sam, I’m looking at you), block any Muslims from entering the country, prevent construction of mosques, see if sand can glow from precision carpet bombing…etc etc

The wrong wing is giving us violent, simple solutions that seem effective (but aren’t) and fit on a bumper sticker. The left wing is giving us long, boring solutions that are probably effective, (but we won’t know how effective for years), and fit…in multiple doctoral theses spread over many different disciplines

Ming5000  Apr 3, 2016 • 3:05:10pm

In the first link that you cite from Sam Harris’s website we have a debate between Sam Harris and Bruce Schneier. And, your second link is a further response in debate from Bruce Schneier. I think that the debates between Harris and Schneier are an honest debate about how to best defend airplanes from Islamic suicide bombers. I see two people debating how best to detect and foil in air bombings from the most likely source.

I think many “people” don’t really know the debate and only know headines like Thanos offered and settle on the “he is a racist” screed.

So, eh, if we disregard what “people” think, are you calling Harris a racist and white supremacist, or do you simply disagree with his airport security theories?

Ming5000  Apr 3, 2016 • 3:16:01pm

re: #3 Jayleia

I disagree that Sam Harris is a fucking moron.

When you go to the left vs right trope, I would normally agree with you. But, when we say “the right” I disagree that Harris is placed there. I am begging people to not take a surface cut and throw Sam Harris out as a racist, white supremacist, or a RWNJ.

Harris gets into trouble all the time by taking fringy positions and using indelicate straw men.

Here is a podcast with Sam Harris and Douglas Murray where much of what you referenced from both sides are discussed. Harris and Murray lament that much of the response from the left helps give too much support to the radical right response.

cinesimon  Apr 3, 2016 • 3:17:49pm

I don’t know if he’s a white supremacist, but I know he’s long advocated for the extreme right wing Israeli position of targeting Arab Israeli and Palestinian families, children and homes/farms because he sympathizes with the hateful idea that any Palestinian is a future terrorist.

cinesimon  Apr 3, 2016 • 3:19:12pm

re: #5 Ming5000

Yup, Harris is a large consumer of passive aggressive argument.

Jayleia  Apr 5, 2016 • 4:25:54am

re: #5 Ming5000

So, our response of being reasonable, calm, and rational instead of being total raging nutbars supports the arguments made by total raging nutbars.

I’m not even sure if I can even tally how many varieties of wrong that is.

No, I don’t think Sam Harris is what I’d call a white supremacist. I do, however think he’s very much a racist. See his comment about profiling people that “look Muslim” for evidence of that, it sounds as though he is conflating people of a particular race with people of a certain religion, that Sam Harris has a severe bias against…because Sam Harris is a fucking moron. And that’s before all of his other problems.

Never mind that it’s not just some random on the internet that disagrees with Sam Harris’s ideas about airport security, its most of the experts in the security field and objective reality that disagrees with him.

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