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Christians More Supportive of Torture Than Non-Religious Americans

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dog philosopher ஐஒஔ௸12/20/2014 2:18:16 pm PST

re: #95 Islamo-Masonic Vourdalak

The question about where we atheists get out values from is not entirely unfair. But the thing is, there are no objective moral values regardless of whether God exists. Just as there can be no objectively tasty food. Values are always in the eye of the beholder. If God exists, his take on the values is just his opinion.

Now, one may believe in objective values - I find that not quite rational but whatever. But when someone says that the values are ontologically grounded in God - that is just a statement of faith. It’s not any sort of a logical derivation. An atheist who believes in objective moral values can supply assert that they exist as part of being itself - and she will be on exactly the same footing as any theist.

So belief in objective moral values doesn’t require God. If morality is the only reason to believe in a deity, I’m afraid I’m this case Occam’s razor is pretty merciless.

too easy for a right winger to misunderstand you and think you say you believe in “relativistic morality”

i just tell them “if you don’t hurt people only because you think god will punish you if you do, and not because you couldn’t possibly live with yourself if you harmed another living thing, your conception of morality is merely childish and possibly even sociopathic”