LGF

The Cowardice of Michael Moore

Thu, Jul 1, 2004 at 4:15:09 pm PDT

Lots of writers are stepping up to point out the lies and gross distortions in Michael Moore’s Fahrenheit 9/11; here’s Melanie Phillips’ take: Farragoheit 9/11.

Moore would have you believe that the terrorist threat to America was all invented by President Bush in order to serve his friends’ financial interests. Forget 9/11. Forget all the evidence that persuaded Bush’s predecessor, President Clinton, of the threat from rogue states combining with terrorism and weapons of mass destruction. Moore believes this threat was entirely fabricated by President Bush, and all those Americans who believed it are made to look stupid.

Indeed, what is so striking is the deep contempt Moore has for his fellow Americans, and the bottomless regard for himself. For Mooreland is populated by the stupid, credulous or corrupt — except, or course, for Michael Moore.

And then we get to Iraq. Here the film’s lies turn disgusting. For pre-invasion Iraq is portrayed as a happy, relaxed place with carefree, smiling people — until the Americans start dropping bombs on it for no good reason. There’s no mention whatever of the terror inflicted on the Iraqi people by Saddam, the hundreds of thousands killed or tortured by his regime.

No mention that, way before George W Bush, the Clinton administration was convinced that Saddam and al Qaeda were linked. Instead, just grisly pictures of the casualties of war, the gross exploitation of the grieving mother of a dead soldier, and the lie that Saddam never killed or threatened any American (presumably the assassination attempt on George W’s father during a visit to Kuwait in April 1993 doesn’t count). And all punctuated by manipulated footage of the current President designed to present him as moronic or malign.

Exactly so. Another good new site devoted to specifically fact-checking Moore is Fahrenheit Fact.

I saw the film today, and yes, it’s amazingly mendacious. Since there are already so many others doing a great job of debunking “Two Cheeseburgers” Moore, I’d like to write about an aspect of the film that nearly pulled me in—and ended up making me furious at Moore.

Moore knew he would have to deal with the actual 9/11 attacks somehow; so after the long, boring intro explaining how Bush stole the 2000 election (please, moonbats, stop with this already), we see the footage of the 9/11 atrocities.

Well, actually no—we don’t. Moore cuts to a black screen, and plays only the sounds of the attacks, before an extended montage of drifting ashes and papers, artfully floating through the air while mournful music plays.

At first, I thought this was a clever and effective way to evoke the memories of the worst terrorist attack on US soil.

And then, the question occurred to me: why would someone who clearly understands the power of images choose not to show the most powerful images of our time?

Because Moore knew that if he showed those images, which have been mostly absent from media for almost 3 years, he ran the risk of awakening the anger and feelings of intense danger we all experienced that day.

And that was a risk he could not run—because it could very well spoil the tone of the rest of the film, and expose him for the smirking, unserious buffoon he is.

After the blank screen 9/11 section of the film, he cuts almost immediately to scenes from talk shows, with bumbling people trying to sell anti-terrorism gadgets, and interviews several anti-Bush talking heads about the “climate of fear” that the Bush administration imposed on the country.

Moore is a canny filmmaker. He realized that if he segued immediately to this snarky, derisive viewpoint after showing people jumping to their deaths from the top of the World Trade Center, some of the Moore Koolaid drinkers might feel twinges of conscience; they might remember what it felt like to see the largest buildings in New York City collapse, crushing and ripping apart the bodies of thousands of their fellow Americans. Some of them might even start to come out from under Moore’s cinematic spell, if such an ugly reality were allowed to intrude.

They might get mad. And some of them would be mad at him.

So Moore, cowardly to the bottom of his hateful little shriveled soul, cut to a black screen.

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1 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:16:37pm

Fuggedaboutit 9/11.

2 Dave Ray  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:16:56pm

sickening cowardice

3 Walter E. Wallis  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:18:20pm

Whenever I start to disagree with Moore's opinion of the intelligence of Americans, I remember that millions pay to see his moves.

4 Laurence Simon  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:18:48pm

Moore's online ads are claiming that it's the #1 movie in America. It isn't. It's Spiderman-2. According to Boxofficemojo.com, S-2 earned more in opening day receipts than Moore's film has done since it opened.

Moore vs. the Facts and Figures?

Moore loses.

5 Tango  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:20:38pm

Why did you see this movie, Charles? You only give the fat bastard more money and publicity.

6 RickZ  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:21:52pm

Charles, your comments on the film (which I refuse to even consider paying to see) brought up a question: Can some sort of civil suit be brought against Moore for naming a film "Fahrenheit 9/11" without even deigning to show the atrocity that was 9/11??? Maybe by the families of those that perished? The City of New York? Somebody? Anybody?

7 Charles  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:24:22pm

Tango: I saw the film so that I can legitimately criticize it.

And it was exactly what I expected it to be.

8 Jheka  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:24:23pm

OT:

Tom Lantos introduces bill to eliminate aid to Egypt:

The main link and my blog thread on it

Also, Lantos has introduced (and the house passed) a bill which will cut down on the influence of dictatorships in the UN and increase U.S. influence:

[Link: www.house.gov...]

Anytime anyone says that there's no thing as a good Democrat, all I have to do is point to Congressman Lantos.

9 Ratbert  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:27:15pm

To bad he won't change the name of the film to "Supersize Me"

10 Michael Moore's coffin  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:27:31pm

I really do want to see it. free. I can't honestly dis something I haven't seen.

Now, MM, get in the box!!!

11 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:28:06pm
and expose him for the smirking, unserious buffoon he is.

I beg to differ, Charles. Moore is actually a serious buffoon.

I plan to see the movie if only to see first-hand the selective and misleading way in which information can be packaged to serve the propogandist's desire to affect the way people think. I see the film as a study in mind control as previously imagined by George Orwell, with the American public becoming Moore's Winston Smiths, programmed to despise Big Bush.

12 Oktober  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:28:10pm

#5

your $7 is not going to do much to moore's multi million dollar income. I recommend seeing it to start debates with people, because not only will it be so easy to debunk every lie in the film, it will also make you look/feel smart and cool. :P

13 AZ Lizard Kisser  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:32:09pm

#5

You can always buy a ticket for "Dodgeball" or something, then sneak in to see it...as I plan on doing this weekend :) He's not getting my money, that's for sure.

14 ShiksaGrrrl  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:32:17pm
Why did you see this movie, Charles? You only give the fat bastard more money and publicity.

Comeon you guys, its already on the internet if you REALLY must see it?


Again, this gal ain't giving him $0.05 worth of my $$ but would enjoy downloading it and making sure everyone else I know, liberals be damned sees it for free as well.


;-)

15 Craig  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:32:20pm

Let's talk about cowardice. Now, let's talk about little mickey moore. But I repeat myself.

16 Craig Abu Al-Boo-Boo  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:32:43pm

If you must see it, download it. Tell Moore you're poor.

He'll understand.

17 Connecticut Yankee  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:32:54pm

#6 RickZ

I'm not a lawyer, but I think one of the lizardoid minions who is commented a week or so ago that Ray Bradbury might have grounds for a civil suit because MM ripped off his book title.

18 Almostout  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:34:10pm

Way OT:

I need a favor from those here who are experts on finding out information:

Majed Khalil and his brother Khaled Khalil, both Venezuelan businessmen, were recently denied visas to the US.
Majed Khalil has 2 companies incorporated in Florida. Hardwell computers and Orinoco Enterprises. The line of business of the former is abvious but I have had zero success in finding out what the latter does with no sucess. The only record with that name seems to be for a trucking company in Zambia from 1999.
Does anyone here know how to find out what a corporation's line of business is?

19 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:36:25pm

The culture of denial.
A war is so inconvenient in my life right now, dude. This can't be happening, I am not willing to understand it.
///moonbat logic, and they feel better

20 Ratbert  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:37:00pm
And all punctuated by manipulated footage of the current President designed to present him as moronic or malign.

Bush is a moron, so sayeth the dreaded mother-in-law. Over and over again. But she's from Boston, maybe that explains it.

I like to ask these types, if he's so stupid, how did he manage to earn an MBA Harvard. Maybe the guy's not a rocket scientist, but really, he's far from stupid.

21 Ringo the Gringo  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:37:39pm

A new film called "America's Heart and Soul" opens this weekend. Go see it. Maybe, just maybe, this patriotic movie will make more money than Michael Moore's pile of horse shit...maybe.

22 Connecticut Yankee  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:38:57pm

On the light side: Michele over at A Small Victory has a wonderful Photoshop about the type of person who goes to see MM's flick:

[Link: asmallvictory.net...]

23 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:39:08pm
24 Chris L.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:40:16pm

Charles and readers:
Has anyone ever come across either a piece or a letter by Alan Dershowitz that was in Variety Magazine in May? I think it had to do with Moore at the Cannes Fest, and I was wondering if Moore had made some anti-Israeli remark. Many thanks.

25 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:41:03pm

What disturbs me most is Moore's blithe insistence that the terrorist threat exists only in the minds of Republicans, and only to serve their agenda of divesting Americans of their civil rights. Has Moore read nothing about the Islamists and their agenda? Or does he think that jihad, sha'aria and the desire to restore the Caliphate are figments of John Ashcroft's overheated imagination too?

26 RickZ  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:42:25pm

# 18 Almostout:

If the corporation is incorporated in Florida, then it is a matter of Florida public record. Even Registering To Do Business in Florida requires a company to list the business acitivities, the type of business it will be engaged in. If it's a partnership, the laws might be less stringent as to listing the activities.

27 Buckaroo  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:42:37pm

Charles, Thank you for pointing out **yet another** manipulative trick MM pulled with this monstrosity -- of course, the networks will babble about how "artistic" it is instead of "dishonest" ...

:-(

28 Charles  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:43:19pm

Chris L: see here.

Before a delighted Cambridge crowd, Moore reflected on the tragedy of human existence: "You're stuck with being connected to this country of mine, which is known for bringing sadness and misery to places around the globe." In Liverpool, he paused to contemplate the epicenters of evil in the modern world: "It's all part of the same ball of wax, right? The oil companies, Israel, Halliburton."

29 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:43:31pm

#18 almostout:
Check out the State Corporation Commission of Florida. You will get officers, registered agents, etc.

30 Almostout  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:44:44pm

"The line of business of the former is abvious but I have had zero success in finding out what the latter does with no sucess."

I should read: The line of business of the former is obvious but I have had zero sucess in finding out what the latter does.

Preview is my friend...

31 piglet  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:45:33pm

Are these the guys?


MIJ Minister and BIV must clarify fishy links with new Arab businessmen

Venezuelan business sectors claim that Interior & Justice (MIJ) Minister Diosdado Cabello is mixed up in the purchase of Eveba tuna co bases in Cumana (Sucre). Eveba deputy president, Majed Khalil denies the charges alleging that the new owners have nothing to do with Cabello and that the purchase was business ... "a business opportunity."

Rumors have been circulating for several weeks that Minister Cabello and new owner, Arab businessman Khaled Khalil are connected.

Critics point to the ease with which Khalil received a hefty Banco Industrial de Venezuela (BIV) credit and ... according to media sources ... the Castro family sold Eveba to the Arabs for $30 million, even though its real value is estimated at $10 million.

The Arabs paid $2 million in cash and the rest was made out through BIV loans. However, the BIV gave out $8 million because of liquidity problems but opened a credit line for the remaining $20 million to be paid in 6 years.

Khalil denies the loan, saying he paid with" fresh money." Political sectors are now asking the Minister to clarify his and BIV's role in the deal. Eveba is said to have 10-15% of the domestic tuna market.

[Link: www.vheadline.com...]

32 [Engineer]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:48:49pm

#18 Almostout

Does anyone here know how to find out what a corporation's line of business is?

Go here and put his name, last name first like this Khalil, Majed.

Looks like he has those two businesses and he updated the records in May this year.

33 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:49:04pm

#24 Chris L.

I don't know about the Dershowitz comments, but I know that in one of his books Moore says that, were the situation reversed, Israelis would have resorted to suicide bombings too. Thus demonstrating once again that he knows nothing about Israelis or Palestinians.

34 NC  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:49:08pm
Moore knew that if he segued immediately to this snarky, derisive viewpoint after showing people jumping to their deaths from the top of the World Trade Center, some of the Moore Koolaid drinkers might feel twinges of conscience

You're giving them an awful lot of credit.

35 Alouette  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:49:18pm

I hate this Stupid Fat Man

This title is really a hint about his avoirdupois.

36 Almostout  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:50:01pm

Ann,

I already did. I even wrote to them but they said that, when registering a company, the registrant is not obligated to state what line of business the company will be in.

Thanks anyways.

37 levi from queens  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:50:49pm

to 18--alomostout--I just googled--trucking company in Zambia

here is the next link which seems to be pictures of naked straightr mjen to be perused by gay peoiple:

Summary on google: Seducing straight amateur guys, sex for money, naked man f... All Images contained on this site are copyrighted Orinoco Enterprises
PTY LTD Copyright 1999 - 2002 All Right Reserved E-MAIL

secuding straight men

Seems like gay porn is the line of business.

38 Elcid  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:51:40pm

Funny, fat boy doesn't look himself in this picture, but it IS him...well maybe a reincarnate.
here

39 [Engineer]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:52:01pm

#18 Almostout

By the way, most incorporation papers say some like "any legal line of business" or something similar. The yearly reports might give you a clue.

40 Bob G.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:53:44pm

Since Moore has compared the jihadis fighting against us in Iraq to our own revolutionary soldiers and "minutemen," I was hoping the movie would share some stories about how George Washington used to kidnap innocent civilians and saw their heads off...

41 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:53:53pm

#38 Elcid

Michael Moore after Jenny Craig?

42 RepJ  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:53:55pm

Of course the fat coward doesn't have the courage to show the most important pictures in recent history. Instead, he deals with lies and his tinfoil hat theories.

OT

Charles, My husband was trying to find your site and typed in "little green footballs" in google. The second one down is the "LGF quiz". They don't like you very much, so sad to say. They are sick.

43 Charles  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 2:55:58pm

RepJ: yes, that site is run by one of my more idiotic and persistent stalkers.

44 Almostout  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:00:48pm

Piglet,

Yes, those are the guys.

Ritz and Engineer,

The records for Orinoco Enterprises, INC found in the Corporation register of Florida do not state what type of business the company is in. It does say that it is active, though. Is there any other register that I can try?

45 Right Wing Conspirator  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:01:04pm

On the topic of ChunkyButt,...if anyone is up for a serious case of - WTF are you thinking. Just bop on over to DU for their MM article.
Moore and More is Needed
example -

The New Republic, meanwhile (apparently still suffering from the Stephen Glass episode), accuses Moore of unsupported accusations. To back this up, the article cites Moore's contention that an oil pipeline was part of Bush's motivation to attack Afghanistan.


The moon is made of green cheese...hey, I put that in movie and no took the time to debunk it. So it is obviously true.

Kind of like Gord assumption that if he posts the last post regarding a subject, then he is correct.

And these are the folks that are going to be challenging Bush in November. I fear for this country.

46 Buckeye Abroad  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:01:11pm

#10 Michael Moore's coffin

You posted the following a few days ago:

...I'm still empty.

I giggled the whole day on that. Thanks!

47 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:02:38pm

More evidence that F-911 will result in the pop-left suffering the mother of all backlashes:

48 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:03:17pm
Because Moore knew that if he showed those images, which have been mostly absent from media for almost 3 years, he ran the risk of awakening the anger and feelings of intense danger we all experienced that day

Why let a little thing like the deaths of 3,000 people get in the way of an otherwise "brilliant" thesis? You wouldn't want to confuse folks with the facts, would you?

49 Gordon  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:03:33pm

Charles, you are developing an obsessive dislike for Michael Moore's new movie and Michael Moore himself (I guess the latter has been the case for quite a while).

This time, you're completely on the mark. Keep up the information about Moore's lies and tactics. He's much more dangerous than John Kerry's wife, and deserves the attention.

I commend you for actually going to see the movie. It will provide you more insight into the lies and cowardice Moore shows.

I for one don't plan to see it. Well, maybe if someday it's on a double bill at a brew pub theatre with a movie I really want to see. That's how I saw Bowling for Columbine, and it was, in the end, a piece of America-hating dreck. I think I'll take your word for it (and the word of the people who are fact-checking Moore's fat ass) that Michael Moore has not undergone a Damascene conversion.

50 nonic  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:04:55pm

#18 Almostout

The state's Secretary of State's office should have records of the incorporation, including purpose and function of the business.

51 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:05:19pm

#47 Shiplord Kirel

In other news, Mel Gibson is in talks to screen The Passion of the Christ at the Lubavitch Centre.

52 hepcat  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:05:58pm

If I never hear about Moore and his eFF'n film again - it'll be too soon.

53 veebee  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:07:55pm

Gordon #49
Wow!

54 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:10:05pm

#36 almostout:
Call the appropriate county business licensing department.

Let us know.

{scurrying around helping with dinner, feeding cats, coffee on for morning, what else?...}

55 Right Wing Conspirator  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:10:45pm

#47 Shiplord Kirel

Please oh please oh please let Butterbutt go to Kandahar or Mosul and watch it with the troops so he can recieve the accolades that he so deserves.


/wishful thinking

56 Chris L.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:12:43pm

Charles and Scaramouche:

Many thanks! Yep, that sounds like Moore all right :-)

57 Almostout  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:12:43pm

Levi from queens,

I have the feeling that their line of business is other than porn. I do not think that the US government will revoke thier visas on those grounds.

58 nonic  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:13:30pm

#17 Connecticut

Bradbury HAS publicly objected to use of his title without even asking permission, and Bradbury has asked that the title of the movie be changed. Saw this linked from Drudge last week.

Unfortunately, book titles cannot be copyrighted, at least not in this country.

59 Sydney Carton  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:13:41pm

Charles,

Great observation. To my knowledge, you're the first person to point out this little bit of psychological manipulation. I was under the impression, based on what I've heard so far, that Moore entirely ignores 9/11.

60 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:15:15pm

#51 Scaramouche

It seems probable that Pentagon officials have analyzed the film, and they are very confident that it will result in a backlash against the pop-left, thereby solidifying troop morale in the face of non-stop media attacks.
Sort of an updated "this is the enemy" presentation.

I have also seen it, with my ultra-lib friend Harvey. He called it "a load of horseshit" and a "disaster for us" (meaning the Democratic Party).
It is really that bad, a boring, strident, condescending conspiracy screed, on the same level as Fox Entertainment's notorious Conspiracy Theory: Did we go tot the Moon?, but without the laughs.

61 Lizard by the Bay  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:17:41pm

OT

There goes Bill Cosby, telling the truth again.

And just LOOK at how Jesse Jackson feels about it! Talk about a picture being worth a 1,000 words! Priceless.

62 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:19:54pm

Re: #60
Arrrghhh,
The loathesome Moon hoax show (which is what I usually call it) was actually entitled Conspiracy Theory: Did We Land on the Moon?

63 Elcid  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:20:47pm

"In June 2002, U.S. officials say intelligence had revealed that Zarqawi and members of al-Qaida had set up a weapons lab at Kirma, in northern Iraq, producing deadly ricin and cyanide."

Wouldn't the above kinda shoot in the ass the theory that there "were NO ties"?

The pisser is WHO reported the paragraph above.

I'll be damned

64 Lizard by the Bay  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:22:40pm

Hmmm, the LGF javascript for linking added an unnecessary "amp;" into my links.

I'll try again.

The Cos telling the truth.

Jesse puckering big time.

65 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:23:35pm

#60 Shiplord Kirel

It seems probable that Pentagon officials have analyzed the film, and they are very confident that it will result in a backlash against the pop-left,

Not so fast there partner! AAFES distributes films in military theaters. AAFES is well known for it's liberal slant.

While I was deployed AAFES had these items for sale. A DVD glorifying Fidel Castro, Shrillery Clinton's book, many other like items too numerous to list.

I know many GIs, myself included, who have vocally protested AAFES on many occasions.

66 Elcid  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:24:23pm

41 scaramouche

"Michael Moore after Jenny Craig?"

Gee and here I thought she was married..:).

67 SoCalJustice  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:25:18pm
The Cowardice of Michael Moore

Cowardice?

Au contraire.

M'man Moore's clearly not afraid of the deleterious effects of:

1) heart disease;

2) high blood pressure;

3) clogged arteries; and

4) high cholesterol.


He's a very brave man. Especially at the dinner table.

68 veebee  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:25:59pm

Lizard Boy

He also had harsh words for struggling black men, telling them: "Stop beating up your women because you can't find a job."

Liberal media is finally taking sides.

69 Oktober  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:27:09pm
70 Cato the Elder  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:28:41pm

Screw Moore. Forget about him. He'll be nothing but a freaking footnote in, oh, about two months.

Click here and rejoice, O Lizardoids:

What? A Pro-American Movie?!?

71 A Recovering Liberal  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:29:38pm

Simply, Bill Cosby rules.

72 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:30:00pm
73 nonic  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:30:14pm

#60 Shiplord

Then your friend Harvey agrees with Richard Cohen in today's Washington Post

Baloney, Moore or Less

74 WriterMom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:30:56pm

OT: Gordon has outdone himself with a comment about the Jews making the Palestinians do a "death march" across the Sinai.

He has, therefore-officially compared Jews to Nazis. If anyone has ever given this dreck the benefit of the doubt, please don't. If he's still around don't feed him. He's an antisemite.

Gord-dreck's post.

75 kimberly  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:32:32pm

#59 - I agree entirely. I've heard quite a few lefties spout about the "powerful" image of having a blank screen with only sounds of the attack, and no one to my knowledge, either, has asked the question of why someone who understands the power of image would choose to leave those out.

Charles, you're impressive.

But I bet I know Mike Al-Moor's defense against the charge of cowardism. I bet he'll claim that using the actual images would have been exploitative (after all, only nasty Republicans do that). This would force him to admit that the reality of 9/11 does enrage people, true, but it would also allow him to take a fantasy-land high moral ground. He could claim that he DIDN'T use 9/11 imagery specifically so he could avoid enraging and manipulating people; his plan is we won't notice that the entire movie is an attempt to enrage and manipulate people - into hating George Bush, and George Bush alone.

He wants us to hate whom he has defined as the enemy, and he's slick at choosing his propaganda. Thus, imagery of innocents falling to their deaths was a tad inconvenient for his purpose.

76 ballantrae  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:32:43pm

#49 Gordon

Man, every time I think I've figured you out, you throw another curve ball at me. From now on, whenever I see a posting by you I'll just reflect on what I think you're going to say and then assume the opposite.

:)

-ron

77 A Recovering Liberal  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:33:14pm

Hey, I mentioned "America's Heart & Soul" on Monday morning. You're just now noticing it??

78 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:34:03pm

Predictably, The Nation's Katha Pollitt loved it.

79 LRFD  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:35:47pm

OT:

Ok, I'm trying to do some photoshopping, but am having a problem. I'm looking for fat, scuzzy looking pictures of Michael Moore. Think of the one posted on the homepage of IMAO for what I'm trying to find.

Anyway, I keep googling away and all I can find are pictures that make him look like a bum on the street, instead of the half-shaven gorrilla we know he is. If anyone has a link to a bunch of these pictures, I'd be very thankful

80 Cato the Elder  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:38:25pm

Katha should get a real first name and STFU.

81 Cato the Elder  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:39:27pm

Sorry, Recovering: my boss just put up the link to the movie today. Guess we're both behind the curve.

82 J.D.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:40:03pm
83 Elcid  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:40:12pm

Ahhh my sweet, vicious Ann baby.

Saddam In Custody -- Moore, Soros, Dean Still At Large
Ann Coulter. July 1, 2004

here

84 kmilby  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:42:02pm

Great Point Charles, appreciate the post

85 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:42:33pm
86 Lizard by the Bay  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:42:49pm

#79

I don't know how usefull they are, but there are a couple of scuzzy pictures of "Ballsniffer" Moore in this inspired bit of comedy from Allah.

87 TheMarkSide  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:44:30pm

[Link: www.lt-smash.us...]

It seems someone didnt like Linda's endorsement of MM and his movie. Priceless.

88 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:45:39pm

PBS at 9:00 has an interview with three unsuccessful suicide bombers from their cells in an Israeli prison. At least, I think that's what it's about. My mother just called to ask me to tape it for her, and sometimes she can be a little fuzzy about the details.

89 veebee  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:46:27pm

Scaramouche #78

Well, OK, so Moore isn't Mark Twain

I'm glad Katha figured that out.

90 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:47:09pm

Reaganite
AAFES's slant doesn't really matter.
The DoD authorities do have the power, and the legal right, to prohibit any material they deem harmful to morale or cohesion. Things like the Castro DVD sneak in because there is no mechanism outside AAFES itself for reviewing every single item in advance. This changes only when someone complains.

That consideration would not apply to F-911, since it is one of the most discussed and hyped movies in history. It is not sneaking in like, say, Noam Chomsky's latest screed on the bargain table at the PX.
The brass knows about and they could keep it out, but they have made a concious choice not to.
I have seen it, I agree with that decision.

91 scaramouche  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:48:15pm

Info on the PBS show on suicide bombers:
[Link: www.pbs.org...]

92 justdanny  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:48:23pm

Oh, now I get nodrog's post here kissing Charles's ass. He just screwed up and revealed himself for the true anti semite POS he really is on another thread.

Fuck you nodrog.

The firey head is a bullshit liar. The guy behind the curtain is an admitted anti semite.

Why is this guy here ??

93 Annelid[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:48:49pm
94 Iron Fist[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:49:04pm
95 elbud  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:49:07pm

Spittle on the TV Screen Alert

Fatso will be on Charlie Rose tonite.

96 Baldy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:49:23pm

#79 LRFD here's a side view of him eating, don't know if "edited": [Link: www.gravett.org...]

97 Right Wing Conspirator  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:50:05pm

#79 LRFD

I don't really know what your looking for, but -

High School pic
hot and sexy pic :-P
Another one.
Another one again.
And another one.

98 deadman  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:50:13pm

Reaganite: Did you solve your drusearch problem?

On topic:

How long after the attack did the media quit running footage of the planes and Pentagon. I know the really bad stuff was pretty much gone by the next day. What was the name of that documentary made by the film crew that was in the lobby of the WTC when the planes hit?

99 nonic  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:50:16pm

#64 Lizard

Thanks for the story link. That's the kind of thing that can really give you hope that maybe an entire segment of the population will stop wasting their opportunities and their lives.

Now if there was just an imam who would come forward and tell the same kind of truth to his constiguency...

100 WriterMom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:50:34pm

Every time that POS claims to be a moderate, and not an enemy of the Jews, I'm going to be tempted to post his DEATH MARCH link.

101 cathyf  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:51:34pm

Now I'm no expert on iMovie or anything, but Charles, your description gave me an idea:

The movie has already been ripped off and is floating around the Internet, right? Can somebody get a copy, and then edit in 20-30 minutes of 9/11 footage right after Mike al-Moor's no-pictures segment. Then post it on the Internet (preferably in someplace like Singapore far away from US court orders)

Any takers?

cathy :-)

102 WriterMom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:52:05pm

Sorry-refering of course to Gordon...should have made that clear.

103 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:54:25pm

#90 Shiplord Kirel
AAFES has it's own command structure, I wouldn't be so sure if I were you.

104 Baldy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:54:29pm

#79 LRFD here's one of him, looking obese, with "Obesity Kills More Americans than Saddam." button/sticker [Link: www.neoflux.com...]

105 foreign devil  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:54:59pm

Well said, Charles! Moore always looks like an unmade bed and like he smells bad. Ever since I heard that story about him throwing a bunch of actors/waiters out of a job without notice who were working on his one-man show in England last year. He quit the show in a fit of pique thereby leaving a number of workers without any means to earn a living, all the time complaining that the production promised him was not what he got and whining about how hard done by he was. He must be a millionaire by now with all the movies and books he's had. For him to show contempt towards people working on the show who, though they aren't the stars, are every bit as good at their jobs as he is at his and deserve his respect.

I never got off on his brand of chuckling understated humor, where he always laughs as if he knows something you don't. But he doesn't have any special insight into what it takes to put the world right and in fact, his condescending sneering is decidedly unhelpful and give aid and comfort to the supporters of America's enemies, the Jihadists.

He needs a darned good thumping!

106 Lizard by the Bay  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:55:55pm

#102

Writermom, we knew.

Gordon is class A troll material. He knows how to walk that fine line where he's trolling but putting forth just enough reason in his arguement to not get banned. Still, even a master trol will let the mask slip, as he did with that post.

I say Charles should put him on double secret probabtion. One more goof and GONE!

107 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:56:15pm

#98 deadman

Reaganite: Did you solve your drusearch problem?

HiJackThis fixed it, and a few other problems I didn't know I had!

108 Iron Fist[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:56:16pm
109 Baldy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 3:59:38pm

#79 LRFD This one is VERY good IMHO, MM squinting, scuzzy beard: [Link: online.swank.com...]

110 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:00:18pm
111 Baldy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:01:35pm

O'Reilly just mentioned HezbALLAH's support of the film (as Most Ridiculous...) I'm so glad he mentioned it, though I wish he would mention at "top" of show, with list of HezbALLAH bombings...

112 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:02:00pm

Ann Coulter on Fox, guys...

reaganite: Good!

113 WriterMom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:02:26pm

#106 Lizard By the Bay

I just wanted to bring attention to his remarks. He obviously won't be able to talk his way out of that doozy.

114 Luigi  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:02:32pm

OT

This site says we imported 1,660,000 barrels of oil per day from Saudi Arabia in 2001. I have no way of knowing if its accurate. Even at $30/barrell that is $49,800,000 per day going to the Saudis, or $18,177,000,000 per year.

More than eighteen billion per year to the Saudis for oil.

Of course, we're just one of their customers. The site says they export 7,380,000 barrels/day. Even at $30/barrel (which it isn't) they're raking in $80,811,000,000 per year.

Just thought you'd like to know. If anyone has more accurate figures, please post.

115 SoCalJustice  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:03:46pm

Re: Wide Angle (no, not Michael Moore, but the show on PBS discussing suicide bombers).

It was introduced by Mishal Husain, who is just smokin' hot.

Anyway, now it's time to watch the program. Sigh.

116 LRFD  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:05:36pm

Thank you all for the links!

In about a minute here I found better material than in twenty looking through yahoo pics. LGF Lizards are the best kinds of Lizards.

117 Donna V.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:07:01pm

In the WSJ a few days ago there was a story which included the White House'sl reaction to F911. Some Bush spokesman I had never heard of simply said "The eagle doesn't notice the fly."

I really think there's going to be a backlash to this rabid anti-Bush coverage. I caught a few seconds of CNN this afternoon and the lawyer who defended Noriega was saying he didn't think Saddam could get a fair trial in Iraq. Boy, that's going to keep most Americans up at night - worrying whether the Butcher of Baghdad is going to get a fair shake from the Iraqis.

Come to think of it, I hope CNN as this guy on all the time. He's. 1. a lawyer and 2. a lawyer who defends thugs. Those two things are enough to give many Americans instant indigestion.

118 goldsmith  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:07:25pm

Michael Moore is a war profiteer. Please pass it on.

119 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:10:58pm

OT: Ive got on a Discovery Ch Special ...Nazi Hunters are looking for one of the last alive Nazis of note. A didn't get his first name...Bruner...

They are going over how they caught Mengele and then I suppose on to Bruner and where he went and where he has ended up. Looked to me that he might be in an Arab Country? We will see.

Wonder why no one talks about the Connection between Islam and Nazis..then and AFTER the War. Who helped Nazis live out their lives in luxury? Lots of Arabs did..thats what. Why dont we discuss this?

First...how DID those people get into Argentia so easily? Who helped them and paid for it and supported them? Is there a real ODDESSA? Yes...there is.

120 Jheka  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:12:46pm

#118 Goldsmith:

Of course he is. So is Micah Wright. So is Peter Arnett and Robert Fisk and any number of other Left wingers who have made a cottage industry of teling lies to the eager gibbering leftist horde.

121 WriterMom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:12:50pm

Alois Brunner? Something like that. I think there is a major Nazi still happily in Syria.

122 leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:12:54pm

YES...this IS about the RAT LINE.

123 Right Wing Conspirator  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:16:03pm

#98 deadman

I think the one you are talking about is 9/11.

124 Charles  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:17:35pm

I had the Alois Brunner tale linked at LGF in April of last year.

Here's the story of this disgusting creature, who's been given refuge in Syria: Brunner After The War.

125 Cam  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:19:49pm

Kinda OT:

I really dig the os-so-islamic beard Saddam has grown - do ya' think he's trying to pass himself off as some sort of victim of religious profiling or something?

126 WriterMom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:21:55pm

There's a lot of Nazis still living hapily here in Canada while our government does squat. All of them are described as nice quiet guys who garden all volunteer in the community-could never hurt a fly kind of thing.

127 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:24:19pm

Arafish's Uncle:
Grand Mufti

128 Baldy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:28:35pm

Rep Charlie Rangel just mentioned recruitment of "poor" Americans, and used as a reference, F 9/11. The Dems...

129 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:30:10pm

#128 Baldy
I got as far as "Rep Charlie Rangel" and was ready to punch my monitor. What a POS he is.

130 struan al kufr  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:30:49pm
Little known film on WWII is unearthed

By DAVID ROSS

It qualifies almost as a modern minor archaeological find— The discovery in a Hollywood back lot of an abandoned film archive, sound stage and studio unused since WWII.
It probably wouldn’t even merit a second glance if the filmmaker hadn’t turned out to be a distant relative, maybe even an ancestor, of a current director who is being lionized in print and on the screen for his documentary about the origins of our current war on terror.
The dusty studio, which was padlocked and the key thrown away in 1943, almost as though someone was ashamed of it, was pried open this week to reveal a few cans of precious (but hazardous) nitrate film. The only surviving reels of a now legendary piece of filmic history, long talked about in hushed tones by film buffs, but never before screened.
Other pieces of cinematic history were scattered amidst the cobwebs: a director’s chair reinforced with rebar, an oversized ball cap, an autographed copy of Ten Days That Shook the World and a framed photo of “Uncle Joe and Me” with the inscription: “To Mickey, with much affection and admiration. Stalin.” It also includes of photo of a WWII Tiger tank that “Mickey” is shown riding on for a short time before its treads collapse.
The sound stage was part of a battery of studios that were used by the Bureau of Motion Pictures under the Office of War Information shortly after the attack on Pearl Harbor to produce films such as The Nazis Strike, Divide & Conquer, The Memphis Belle and Battle of Britain as part of the Why We Fight series.
Less well-known is the fact that a maverick film-maker, 4-F but drafted anyway, was forced by the Army to produce a propaganda film to improve the morale of the troops. The resentful draftee fooled his wartime bosses and filmed a subversive little documentary known as Fahrenheit 1941. It labors to show that the Japanese and the Germans couldn’t possibly be allies because the Germans didn’t take part in the Dec. 7, 1941 Pearl Harbor sneak attack.
The film then mocks the U.S. high command for committing troops to North Africa “when the real enemy, Hitler, is obviously in Germany.”
It also offers “proof” that the U.S. deliberately invited the attack by cutting off Japan’s oil supplies in the summer of 1941, all, it asserts, to help Franklin Delano Roosevelt’s friends in the oil industry make a killing.
The director includes interviews of sources who claim that FDR knew ahead of time about Pearl Harbor, but that he allowed it to happen because his friends held shares in the Krupps arms factories in Germany.
Most devastating is a privately filmed home movie with an apparently unparalyzed FDR rolling around on the White House floor with his grandchildren, aiming a good natured kick at Eleanor and doing somersaults on board the “floating White House” the USS Potomac, before resuming his seat in a wheelchair just in time to greet a delegation of reporters.
The director introduced some revolutionary (for the times) documentary techniques that many have mistakenly attributed to Orson Welles or Leni Riefenstahl. It often shows the smirking director interrogating life size cardboard figures of Dwight Eisenhower, George Marshal and FDR, leaning over with his ear cupped and snickering, “What? No answer? I thought so!”
Why the film was never released is obvious. The government discovered that it was clutching a viper to its bosom shortly before Fahrenheit 1941 was due to open. Mickey’s studio was shut down, and the ancestor of the current hit director escaped to the Third Reich where he was employed for awhile making short propaganda films hailing the positive steps that Germany was making in providing housing for Jewish settlers being relocated to Poland.
He was later shot on orders of Heinrich Himmler.

Copyright © 2002, Palomar Community Newspapers, dba Valley Roadrunner

131 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:31:24pm
132 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:31:50pm

Chas: Thanks for putting up the links. Well...everyone..read what Chas put up and if you are interested urther...listen to Discovery right now. Probably a playback later tonight as well.

They dont know yet if this Fischer..thats been living in Syria is in fact Bruner...doing investigation to find out.

Nevermind just Bruner...the whole DEAL makes me sick and very angry. WE have unfinished business with several Organizations... and SHAME on them. And are they doing similar things NOW?

133 Donna V.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:36:54pm

Great article by Matt Labash in the Weekly Standard detailing the lies he has told about his early life. Here's a great quote:

Donald Priehs, Moore's high-school teacher, helped him get elected to the school board at the age of 18. Now Priehs echoes the sentiment of the Flint Journal and some of Moore's friends when he says, "Moore has always used Flint. . . . Michael is not the great benefactor."

Priehs recalls the beginnings of Moore's modus operandi: "He made a proposal one year that we abolish homecoming at Davison. You know why he wanted to? Because he himself is nothing but a big blob. He loathed the athletes because they got all the good girls. Michael couldn't have gotten a date if he'd put gold bullion on the table." To redeem what Priehs considers a revenge-of-the-nerds fantasy, Priehs says Moore, whom he labels a "conniving opportunist," wanted to donate the homecoming savings to UNICEF.

One Trick Phoney

BTW, there's lots of good stuff in this week's Weekly Standard - a few more articles on F911 plus great fiskings of Mario Cuomo and Jimmah, who has really outdone himself by being a worse ex-President than President:

The Muse of Malaise

Money quote:

Herbert Hoover accepted the verdict of history when he lost in 1932 to Franklin Roosevelt, keeping a profile so low he was all but invisible. Carter instead reacted as if he had retired by choice with the thanks of the nation.

LOL!

134 Baldy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:37:00pm

OT: Kerry Spokesman Comments on Latest Bush Ad, "Yakuza" (John Kerry's website)

But four years before September 11th, John Kerry wrote a book on the impending threat of international terrorism and how to take it on. The facts speak for themselves.”
135 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:37:49pm

More:
Mufti given the mission

the younger al-Husseini shortened his name in order to disguise his family ties. Ever since then, the world has known the mufti's most famous disciple as Yasser Arafat.
136 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:41:55pm
137 Ms. Andi  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:42:00pm

#92 justdanny

Who is this "nodrog"? Can't find him. Sorry, maybe I'm dense today.

138 realwest  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:45:08pm

#49 Gordon - double uh-oh; that's the SECOND time today I've agreed with one of your posts. It's either the meds or you are finally using your brain to really analyze "facts" and get over your over the many years developing knee jerk reactions. Either way is ok, but I hope it's the latter.

139 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:46:04pm

#137 Ms. Andi
Read it backwards.

140 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:46:43pm

#137 Ms Andi:
It's the backwards Gordon.

The only reason I got it is I just read what that lying, Jew-hating POS posted (WriterMom has been directing people to it).

141 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:47:27pm

Just read the articles Chas...Thanks again. And why is this OK...that he has just been protected in Syria all this time? Nothing done about it. Not even discussion about it. Like he wasnt there..like he didnt do what he did..and like it isnt the Arab World protecting him. And of course THEY arent Jew HATERS...just cuse we are Jews and nothing political ...

The new technology shows that yes..Fischer is probably Bruner and is or was in Syria.

Im shaking my head in sorrow really.

142 Ms. Andi  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:47:29pm

LOL! reaganite,

I just figured that out before I used the refresh button.

DOH!

143 Ms. Andi  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:48:22pm

thanks cba, ugh I'm slow today.

144 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:48:36pm

realwest:
Yes, he did make two sensible posts today. But he also posted this, which completely counteracts any positive effect his fleeting good sense had on my opinion of him.

In fact, my opinion of him has never been lower.

145 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:49:54pm

#142 Ms. Andi
Read the link WriterMom has been posting. Regardless of how many resonable posts he makes, he has once again shown his true colors. F*ck him.

146 Old Guy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:51:36pm

How things have changed. In my day if someone said the things Moore has spoken about the country, the people, the President, etc., we would have kicked the shit out of him. Trust me. It was a different time--for instance, if you got a bad grade in school, or G-d forbid the principal called your parents--your father, before the slap, would have said "what'd you do wrong"?
Most important of all, you were very careful what you said because a knuckle sandwich came quickly if you pissed someone off. We weren't very sensitive were we?

No question there were leftists/moonbats but most were either sequestered in Hollywood or on the campi of some but not all college campus's. And even then, they were intelluctuals, hoping for the "brave new world". Today, you have young people--mostly with sophoric minds doing the same stupid things their parents did in the mid-late sixties. Of interest, all the characters of the hippie movement during the sixties--where are they now--selling insurance, stocks, leading pedestrian lives?

Michael Moore is the end product of a generation with too much time on their hands; too much money and no discipline. To justify their existence they media and LLL's use terms expressing "moral equivalence" where none exits. Also, from the senventies we have "FEELINGS"!! The Alan Alda mentality.

For me, simply put, MM is a rat's asshole.

147 Donna V.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:52:02pm

Ha! Here's Mario Cuomo's take on Lincoln, as interpreted by Andrew Ferguson:

No reader will be surprised that Mario Cuomo, in surveying the span of Lincoln's life and absorbing the vast expanse of Lincoln's writing, has discovered that Mario Cuomo and Abraham Lincoln have one hell of a lot in common.

And, of course, George W. Bush and Lincoln have nothing in common. In fact, Mario compares Dubya to Jefferson Davis.

Cuomo: Lincoln reminds me a hell of a lot of me

148 Joel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:52:22pm

Melanie Phillips is a terrific writer. Her blog is well worth checking into every day. She is fearless is pointing out the anti Semitism of what she refers to as the "chattering classes" of Britain.

149 Ms. Andi  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:52:50pm

#145 reaganite

I've been tiresome and weary of him for awhile now.

The link says it all.

150 steve miller  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:53:45pm

time for a votekick.

151 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:54:27pm

Last on this..In the program is says former Nazis set up a Concentration Camp in Chile..in the 70's patterned after the German Camps. BASTARDS. Thats what comes from helping these people escape to S. America.

OUTRAGEOUS. And no one seems to be talking much about THAT EITHER...What is protecting these people ALL THIS TIME? WHO?

152 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 4:56:08pm

#149 Ms. Andi

I've been tiresome and weary of him for awhile now.

Far more polite than I would have said.

153 Joel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:00:15pm

Jefferson Davis actually was one of the best Secretary's of War (Defense Secretary) that we ever had. He was Sec. of War during the administration of Franklin Pierce.

Mario Cuomo (who was elected Governor of my state 3 times due to weak Republican opposition) looks and sounds like one of those guys gunned down at the end of Godfather I.

154 peace be upon me  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:03:18pm

Yeah, the Softliners - the Bush-Powell/Michael Moore continuum - are hypocrites. Moore didn't react to the WTC slaughter, but how did Bush? On Sept. 11, 2001, I heard an early radio report that as many as "20,000" persons may have been murdered at the WTC (I once took pictures of the Brooklyn Bridge from the observation floor). For over a year, memoryhole has been posting the video record of Bush reading from a child's book at a Texas school, while thousands of his fellow countrymen were burning to death. What should he have done? Show the same concern and revulsion as the rest of us. Why the callous orientation? Because he is an over-achieving rich kid whose world view is skewed by the pathological status-defense mentality of elites.

Explain why you trust GWB?

155 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:04:56pm

#151 Leah:
I watched it, too.
MOAB needed there.

156 steve miller  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:07:04pm

Oh, and now Camel Prophet shows up. Can HWSNBN be that far off?

157 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:07:14pm

#154 peace be upon me Camel Prophet
How ya doing you old hemorrhoid?

158 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:07:44pm

#156 steve miller
Bastid! You beat me to it!

159 Ann  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:08:48pm

#154:
You need to learn, child.

160 Elcid  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:15:46pm

Baldy

"But four years before September 11th, John Kerry wrote a book on the impending threat of international terrorism and how to take it on. The facts speak for themselves.”

If the junior senator from mass. was that much of a 'seer', why didn't mr. 'seer' tell then president clinton? OR have we finally found the true blame for all of the terror...john kerry.

Would he like another purple heart for that?

And please baldy, I'm not bustin your chops, I just get so god damn angry at all of these asshats that "saw this coming"...and only NOW say they saw it coming. It's like I voted for it, before I voted against it.

Questions for kerry...if you read and wrote about impending threat of international terrorism, why didn't you fucking do something about? What the fuck good did the book do senator kerry?

161 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:18:06pm

#159 Ann

You need to learn, child.

Shhh! Wait until peace be upon me Camel Prophet claims to be "new" here!

162 Elcid  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:26:05pm

147 Donna V

"No reader will be surprised that Mario Cuomo, in surveying the span of Lincoln's life and absorbing the vast expanse of Lincoln's writing, has discovered that Mario Cuomo and Abraham Lincoln have one hell of a lot in common."

Trust me, there is NO Lincoln in ANY cuomo. For one to compare himself to Lincoln, the likes of cuomo, would be me trying to compare myself to Einstein. Where is cuomo's face on Mt Rushmore?

Ahhh, maybe his ass is sticking out the back of da mountain, huh?

163 NTropy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:26:56pm

#116 LRFD

Here's a two or three I was working on but was less than happy with…

Mikkkael "Deathstar" Moor
Michael "Howard's Johnson" Moore
Michael "eats the world" Moore

And I just realized how to make that last one more complete,

164 justdanny  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:30:20pm
What should he have done? Show the same concern and revulsion as the rest of us. Why the callous orientation?

Answer to question one:
Well got in his teleporter and zipped to the WTC and used his ice lazar zip ray gun and frozen the building and telepathically telekinetically removed all the people to nearby hospitals at the speed of light of course.

Comment on your answer:
If the President of the United States had responded the way I did that day, I would not want him to be my President.

Answer to question two:
Thats a loaded trollish question. I did not see "callous". And only someone wishing to see that would call that look on his face, when he did not rush out of that room full of children, but sat there for a few more minutes "callous". I saw the face of a man trapped instantly by the weight of the world, sitting in front of children.

Explain why you trust GWB?

Naw, dont think I will. Its a secret.

165 William  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:31:08pm

Another site that exposes the lies of Moore and his propaganda:

Fifty-six Deceits in Fahrenheit 911
[Link: www.davekopel.com...]
 

166 realwest  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:32:51pm

#144 CBA - uh oh. I didn't see that other thread (I hardly ever get to read all the threads every day) and the two posts of his which I did see today were sensible - I almost thought someone had hijacked his nic. I'm sorry folks. As I hope you all know, I'm not anti-semitic and could never support such, such shit.
Again, my apologies to all (except, of course, Gordon).
:

167 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:35:41pm

reaganite and steve miller:
Why do you say that? From what I remember of CP's posts, they were very LONG and FULL OF CAPS AND BOLD CAPS and I believe some of the links were good but I can't vouch for that personally because I usually scrolled past them.

pbum's post is distinctly idiotarian, but it does not match my memory of any of CP's.

168 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:36:56pm

realwest, I immediately understood that you hadn't seen that thread, which is why I posted it for you (and anyone else who hadn't seen it). No worries, you have cred here!

169 NTropy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:37:06pm

My question regarding PBUM and CP is this; are you or were you ever also GI Joe and Michael Glazer?

170 brent  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:40:39pm

I have had this thought in my mind all nite, at least since seeing this topic brought up. How can you not show 9/11 in all its tragic glory in a film named after that day?

How can you gloss over that, go into the insanity of anti-terrorism marketing. How can you dwell on the evil of the American soldiers, all the while ignoring mass graves a million dead in the Iran / Iraq war?

Just once I'd like to see 9/11 played out in full, with the voice over of MM talking about how we are making such a big deal over an act of terrorism, how you're more likely to be hit by lightning. Better yet, show Abu Ghraib and prisoners w/ panties on their heads, but then slip into the torture films of Sadaam's prison. Show the amputations, show the arm breaking, show the tongue cuttings... All the while, play that fat pantload talking about Sadaam as the old man, the myth of a dictator.

And then count Mike's 15 minutes up.

My dream.

171 tommy  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:45:04pm

I know better than to feed the troll, but what the hell, #154, you complain that Bush maintained a calm, steady demeanor while he finished reading to a bunch of innocent, impressionable children, all the time knowing that two cruise missiles had smashed into the World Trade Center. That has to be the most airheaded, immature, and silly remark a supposed adult has ever made. Has one of us personally faced so grave a moment -- where the lives of millions, indeed billions, of people hang in the balance? One who finds himself in such a crisis is entitled to at least seven minutes to gather himself. I bet you take longer to decide what to coffee to order.

172 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:49:23pm

Ann...Wasnt that somthin? OY. ALL I can say right about now.

Need a joke..need a Dog to kiss...chocolate...a little sex perhaps (just kidding--wouldnt want those Liberals to think we are GROSS over here... or something)...

Nevermind listening to the SWORD SWOLLOWING Speical. (its interesting but verrryyy wierd) That ought to get my mind off of what I just saw.. G-d DAMN those SOBs.

173 moonflower  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:50:02pm

Charles -

I applaude you for going to see this film. You had to, I understand that - otherwise you could not comment in good conscience. That would only be important to you. Conscience is not a factor in the lll/democratic party these days.

I am getting confused these days. Not confused about President Bush. My president. Confused about my fellow humans in America and in this world. How can they not see what has and is happening? September 11, 2001 - this was a body blow to America. We did not seek it out.
We did not see it coming. It woke me up. Big time.

I knew before about "Islam". I was horrified when the 1997 slaughter took place in Luxor, Egypt. One of my favorite places. I went there in 1999. Still I did not get it. I did not get islamofacists until 2001. Now I get it. Why doesn't every American?

Because all they see on ABC-CBS-NBC-CNN is . . . It is all America's fault. It is almost like an abused wife's situation. The wife knows she is abused, but the husband keeps telling her it is her fault. The wife is the Bush Administration and the husband is the "PRESS".

I go on too long.

President Bush and Prime Minister Blair are the visionaries here. God bless them. And God bless America.

174 Donna V.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:50:31pm

justdanny: Yeah, it amazes me when people criticize Bush's initial reaction to 9/11. I guess he should have jumped up and screamed "Holy F'ing sh*t, the ME is glass! We're nuking right now!" at the camera.

Joel: Cuomo made the reference to Jeff Davis because both he and Dubya started "preemptive wars."

Firing on Fort Sumter is the same as bombing Afganistan and Iraq, I guess. The analogy would only hold true if Yankee terrorists in a hot air balloon had been firing poison darts down on the citizens of Charleston,..., I read Shelby Foote's Civil War history and somehow he neglected to mention that incident.

elcid: LOL!!

175 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:50:47pm

#167 cba

Why do you say that? From what I remember of CP's posts, they were very LONG and FULL OF CAPS AND BOLD CAPS and I believe some of the links were good but I can't vouch for that personally because I usually scrolled past them.

I won't bother to search for the posts, but trust me, it's CP. It's trying to disguise itself but it always slips when it comes to me and [Engineer]. Same old hatred, same old Camel Prophet.

176 Cam  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:54:07pm

PBUM:

On Tuesday my adopted dad died, unexpectadly, by electrocution. When I first heard the news, I was in a blank fugue for a good 20 minutes. I imagine that I had the "deer caught in headlights" look, although I honestly cannot recall. Who are you to try to suggest that the president should react any differently? I doubt very much that seconds after hearing of the WTC you would have jumped to action without reflection on the loss that we had suffered.

It takes a certain person to become president. I am heartened that you will never rise that far.

177 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:56:52pm

#176 Cam
I was in Sarasota on 9/11. I was the senior team leader at the airport. Trust me, behind the cameras all hell was breaking loose. W did good, he acted as a President should.

178 Cam  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 5:59:40pm

#177 reaganite :

W did good, he acted as a President should.

Damn straight.

179 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:00:13pm

#69 Oktober

Allah slays me sometimes!

ROTFLMAOTHNTPMP

180 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:02:43pm

#178 Cam

Damn straight.

Most of what I know I can't talk about. One day I'll be able to. I liked W before 9/11, more so during and after.

181 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:04:07pm

I don't normally listen to Rush Limbaugh (for no other reason than that I'm at work when he is on) but I was driving to DeWitt county, Texas to watch some oil wells get plugged and abandoned, and Rush repeated something I've heard here.

People need to see the 9-11 images again, to refresh their memories of what they are up against.

Interestingly enough, in an email to my extreme LLL brother (the one who left his kids to chase a younger woman), mentioning Moore's theories about an oil pipeline in Afghanistan, he wrote back that while Moore stretches the truth, he is simply the left's version of Limbaugh.


There is a lot about RL I don't agree with, but even when he was doctor shopping for drugs, he had more integrity in a finger than Michael al Moor does in 350 pounds of quivering lard.

182 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:07:33pm

PBUH:
[Explain why you trust GWB? ]

Explain why you are such a deranged idiot and I will.

183 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:08:02pm

#176 Cam:
I'm so sorry. My sincere condolences.
{{{Cam}}}

184 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:09:33pm

Nicely said, Charles. Very poignant.

185 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:09:54pm

BTW, I don't know why Camel Prophet stopped posting under that name. He caught one very mild criticism from Charles about occasionally going over the top, and I guess left in a huff. OK, he didn't trust GWB very much, but he linked to a lot of good stuff. Only problem I ever had w/ CP was he would occasionally attack other non-troll posters, sometimes even regulars, whom he perceived as not hardline enough.


I don't think PBUM is CP first new nick back. I forget the nick, but somebody was doing a lot of CP style posting for a few days, then stopped.

186 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:10:31pm

Cam described what happens to a civilian when something horrible is reported to you. W...isnt a Navy Seal --He isn't FBI or CIA trained and prepared AGENT...Hes not been trained into NOT going into shock. He heard what he heard..He wasn't told anything to do..and so..he sat there and ingested it. Thats the normal thing normal people do. PLUS I would assume he knows that he has to wait for his people to TELL him where to go etc. At times like that...he doesnt get to say what to do..others tell the President what to do ..physically. *** FIRST you got to make the President SAFE.

Only special people are trained NOT to go into shock at times like that... We dont vote for..Special Forces People to be our President. Our President is usually not THAT far off of what normal citizens are ..Maybe richer..but ...about the same as we are.

Going after W. for his reaction to 9/11... isn't fair really ...Cheep shot.

187 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:10:50pm

#176 Cam
Between packing and phone calls I missed most of your post. I'm sorry. My condolences.

188 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:14:44pm

Cam: Now that you came back...I wanted to offer my condolences as well.

189 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:16:23pm

#186 Leah
A good friend of mine told me a story about a guy who just joined his firm. Now this firm does some pretty weird things for the country. This guy who now works for them could have any job he could ever want.

Anyway, the gist of the story is when he applied to NASA for a job I'm not at liberty to say which. He was asked why of all the candidates they should choose him. He thought about it and replied "I kill people with a knife". NASA sent the rest packing.

Those of you with google skills could find out who he is. Ex-SEAL.

190 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:16:58pm

OK, reaganite, I found pbum's first post with the new nick and the style of that one is just how I remembered CP's posts.

I'm a believer! Although the fact that both you and steve miller had the same thought assured me of the correctness of the opinion. I just like to see things for myself.

Ahem, reaganite, I believe steve miller was ahead of you on this one. Does that mean you owe him a beer?

And am I the first person to refer to the Piss-Artist Formerly Known As Camel Prophet as "pbum"? I'd like to think so.

191 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:18:15pm

#176 Cam

:-(

Sorry to hear the sad news. I hope you are okay.

192 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:19:51pm

190

I think CP/PBUM, despite subscribing to Moorish fantasies about GWB being a Saudi agent, is on our side.

193 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:20:20pm

#190 cba

Ahem, reaganite, I believe steve miller was ahead of you on this one. Does that mean you owe him a beer?

*Rolling eyes* What were you saying?

Umm, well, yeah, you're right.

194 jinnderella  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:20:25pm

#178 Cam: I am so sorry. I only just heard.

(((uberhugs)))

195 Dar ul Harb  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:20:25pm

That Mike Moron... he's doing so much for the film industry.

I might not ever have tried BitTorrent if it wasn't for downloading his deranged nonsense.

19 hours to go...

196 Cam  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:20:33pm

reaganite, cba, Leah:

Thank you very much.

197 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:23:14pm

#192 Ed:
Well, he ain't no Michael Moore, but I still will give him the old scroll-by treatment.

198 jinnderella  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:25:33pm

Hi, realwest-- did you get your cookies?

199 Leah  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:26:38pm

OK...how shall I say this...This way..Ordinary people of the US dont EXACTLY know ***ALL that goes into keeping America America.

My Dad had his Top Security Clearance..and even tho hes dead and I didn't promise anything. to the Govnt...I keep HIS promise.. Whatever I know..I keep to myself..

This is what the families do...

R: Dad was Public Health (later in life)..probably would have ended up working with you. Dont think we had those problems to the extent we have no when Dad was active..but had it been in present time..you too would have worked together...Practicing and all kind of thing.

200 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:26:54pm

Night-night

201 zulubaby  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:28:26pm

Cam, I'm so sorry for your loss.

202 Cam  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:30:36pm

z'babe, jinnderella:

Thank you also.

203 Geepers  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:35:43pm

Cam, My condolences.

204 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:35:58pm
205 jinnderella  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:44:13pm

I am mortally sick of our culture being hijacked by these loons!! Artists? Feh! Already this week I've had to throw out my They Might Be Giants, David Byrne, REM, and (*sob*) Blink 182. I turned down tickets to the Warp Tour (even tho I fancy Yellowcard) because the organizers are showing a liberal get-out-the-vote documentary, and registering voters on site.
Why isn't it kewl to be a neocon? How can Mike Al-Moor be a cultural icon? He is so...so...physically repulsive!

206 Donna V.  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:44:58pm

Cam: That's awful. I am so sorry for your loss.

207 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:45:03pm

#204 ploome hineni

first name Bill?

Umm, maybe?

208 Baillie  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:48:43pm

I met a traveler from an antique land
Who said: "Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed.

And on the pedestal these words appear --
"My name is Ozymandias, king of kings:
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"

Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.

209 Geepers  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:49:12pm

cba,

Where Charles spills the beans about pbum. (scroll up three posts)

And I spotted him way before these amateurs, when he was posting as "islam is peace". ;-)

210 reaganite  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:51:15pm

#209 Geepers
I never saw that! BUSTED!

211 Bleeding heart conservative  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:51:22pm

LLLQ:What about all the people that died for the oil war?

A: Would you have supported the Iraqis if they had overthrown Saddam themselves? Yes? How many people would have died in that conflict--more or less? So how many lives did we save by joining the Iraqi resistance?

212 cba  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:53:33pm

Geepers--
Man, you're good!

213 Abu Maven  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 6:56:47pm

Moore lied. People died.

214 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:01:42pm

Moore farted, people departed.

215 deadman  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:01:49pm

Turns out MM is not an anti-semite after all. From Jonah Goldberg's column on Townhall:

During the Florida recount, Michael Moore wrote "There are tens of thousands of people who lived through [the Holocaust], escaped the ovens and are now living out their final years in South Florida. . I will not allow those who survived to . be abused again."

Come on. At least everyone here can agree that the 2000 Florida election was right up there with the Holocaust in the long list of human tragedies. As MM points out, Jews were "abused" in both instances.

216 Geepers  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:03:03pm

cba,

What can I say? ;-)

Really just a weird ability to remember stuff.

217 Abu Maven  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:03:07pm

#214 Postalworker

LOL

218 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:07:10pm

Moore is a deluded, insulting freak. I hope he throws himself in front of a bulldozer. Then again I have more respect for Cat than that.

219 SwampWoman  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:14:38pm

Oh, Cam, so sorry to hear about your loss. Please extend my condolences to the rest of the family as well.

220 SwampWoman  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:20:53pm

#205 Jinderella

Oh, SHIT! They Might Be Giants AND Blink 182? Dammit!

Okay, I already know Willie is an ol' hippie, so I ain't gettin' rid of him.

221 SwampWoman  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:31:11pm

#215 Deadman

JCS estimates that there are between 9,000 and 11,000 Holocaust survivors in South Florida. JCS has a policy that it will provide basic social services -- housing, food and a minimum amount of home health care -- to Holocaust survivors if they need it.

Well, hit me with a stick, but I'm tryin' to see how between 9,000 and 11,000 folks turn into "tens of thousands" of Holocaust survivors in South Florida. Damn it, doesn't Michael Moore check his facts on anything?

Maybe it was a grammatical thing, yeah, that's it. He actually said "ten of thousand" and an editor corrected it to read "tens of thousands".

222 steve miller  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:31:29pm

I was chiming in with reaganite - he was way first. pbum and iip were too special to be believed. reaganite has an amazing ability to spot the fakes. I think I understand why he has the job he has.

223 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:33:55pm

Advice to members of the Armed Forces who might be seeing Moore's film:

This is the enemy.
The enemy holds you and your family in contempt.
He believes that you are naive.
He believes that you are callous and childishly brutal.
He believes that you represent what he sees as an inferior social class.
He praises those who kill and mutilate your comrades and fellow citizens.
He is rich and powerful but he is not invincible, for lies are his only weapons.
See this film, for knowing the enemy is the first step to defeating him.

224 steve miller  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:37:02pm

and Cam - words can't make up for a loss of a loved one. I think of the people who have faded away in my life - they move, or we change jobs, or whatever. But family is something that always stays with you - and when someone close suddenly dies, you have all these conversations that you can no longer complete. You have a funny story, or a moment of insight, or just some news to share - but that family member is gone.

I am sorry for your loss.

225 jinnderella  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:43:46pm

#220: Yes, Swampwoman, it is true. All I can say is thank the Muse that I can keep my Peter Gabriel and Oingo Boingo. :)
How is your friend doing?

226 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:44:33pm
227 Powderfinger  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:45:30pm

I'm leaving to go see Mike al-Moor's Adventures in Treason, but the Wayans Brothers are getting my money. Does anyone have any Dramamine?


Cam, I'm sorry for your loss. That's tragic. You have my sympathies.

228 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 7:55:27pm

Cam,

I don't know what to say, except after my Mom died, I realized how bad it hurts to lose a parent. Time will heal it in a way, but not all the way. The ache just gets further away as time goes by.

229 realwest  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:00:04pm

CAM - my sincere condolences on your loss. May God be with you and him, and please know that we are here for you.

230 Athos  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:05:42pm

Charles,

The same didn't really dawn on me when I saw it - I was already pretty well repulsed by the message. But for some reason, when I got home, I replayed the 9/11 memorial program that Rudy Guliani hosted on HBO, and I tivo'ed. Now it wasn't the same as the live feeds, or the pictures of the people choosing to leap to their deaths rather than burn - but it was a vivid reminder of that horrible day.

As you mention it - that was why I felt compelled to play that show (which I watch periodically since I don't want to forget).

I've got too many el cubo associates so that I had to see F9/11 in order to effectively debate / educate them. I've found that they wouldn't take the effort to learn / earn credibilitiy - and if I do, and back my arguments with facts - they ultimately either run away from the facts or learn and begin to question the taste of the koolaid they have been drinking.

What is really needed now, is a reminder of why we are fighting. And no, this reminder isn't a dissheveled Saddam nitpicking while in the dock, but a reminder of 3000 fellow Americans - civilians for the most part - being murdered in cold blood by islamofascists.

As MM said - by the odds, the bulk of those killed didn't vote for President Bush - but President Bush didn't hold that against them. He held the culprits and their leaders / supporters accountable. And started the road to avenge them. And the job is not yet done.

MM reminds us - the job isn't done -and that we need to in November decide on who will be the best one to finish the job started.

Clue - it isn't John Kerry.

231 Right Wing Conspirator  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:07:52pm

#176 Cam

My prayers for you and your family. I am so sorry to hear that.

232 jinnderella  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:27:37pm

#229 Realwest!! Did you get your cookies?

233 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:43:13pm

Cam

I will be thinking of you...he was an amazing man...and the feelings you describe are those too many of us have experienced. It is a testament to his goodness and decency, and bless you for what you and the family did today...{{{Cam}}}

RealWest

I hope you are feeling better!

Reaganite

Re the President and that day in Sarasota? Sarasota principal defends Bush from "Fahrenheit 9/11" portrayal

Michael Moore's film "Fahrenheit 9/11" criticizes President Bush for listening to Sarasota second-graders read a story for nearly seven minutes after learning the nation was under attack on Sept. 11, 2001.

But Gwendolyn Tose'-Rigell, the principal at Emma E. Booker Elementary School, says Bush handled himself properly.

"I don't think anyone could have handled it better," Tose'-Rigell told the Sarasota Herald-Tribune in a story published Wednesday. "What would it have served if he had jumped out of his chair and ran out of the room?"

"Fahrenheit 9/11," which won the top honor at last month's Cannes Film Festival, portrays the White House as asleep at the wheel before the Sept. 11 attacks. Moore accuses Bush of fanning fears of future terrorism to win public support for the Iraq war.

Bush told the federal 9/11 Commission, which released its report last week, that he remained in the classroom because he felt it was "important to project strength and calm until he could better understand what was happening." Moore says Bush failed to take charge.

Tose'-Rigell, who was at Bush's side, did not hear what White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card whispered when he squeezed past her to tell the president of the attacks, but "I knew it was something serious."

"The president bit his lip and clenched his jaw," she said. "I didn't know what happened, whether it was something with his wife or children or something with the nation. I remember praying that God would watch over our school and protect our children."

She said the video doesn't convey all that was going on in the classroom, but Bush's presence had a calming effect and "helped us get through a very difficult day."

Tose'-Rigell said she plans to publish her account of the morning of Sept. 11 from pages she wrote in her journal following the attack. The principal said she didn't vote for Bush. "But that day I would have voted for him."

I had posted that on another site re the PoS...

234 Globular Cluster  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:47:20pm

If I hear any more about Fahrenfart 911 I will get seriously annoyed.

235 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:51:18pm

#234 Globular Cluster

LOL OJ trial part 2

236 jinnderella  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 8:53:20pm

D'oh, I am schtoopid! It's way past your bedtime, Realwest! I forgot the time diff. Get better soon and be sure to refrigerate the jerky after opening! :)

237 quark2  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 9:23:28pm

@176 Cam

I was on the thread the other night when you posted you had to leave due to a sudden death.
My condolences to you and your family.


OT
Finally gordon nodrog has stepped over that red line.
I have witnessed over and over the bitterness he strikes out with against Charles and a few of our regular posters such as zulubaby. I would submit I think he's terribly envious of the fact he will never don the shiny green scales of a lizardoid minion.
But seriously, for the fact he can indeed show intelligence and reasoning he fails measurably by falling back into his old L3 ways.
I think Gordon needs to find a more compatible place to view his news and post his comments.
Shame On You Gordon

238 PostalWorker  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 9:56:49pm

#237 quark2

Yep, it's time to ship ol' gonad, er I mean Gordon to Saudi. He will fix the world's islamist problem there if we do. Or maybe get his fucking head cut off. One or the other.

239 quark2  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 10:49:09pm

@238 Postal Worker

Are you having any problems accessing LGF? I've been timing out when trying to post.
As far as nodrog, I think we should focus on preparing ourselves and our families for what is coming. Let him spin his whirled peas. He'll get caught out with no backup system implemented and will expecting Big Brother (the government) to come to his rescue. It'll be too late when he realizes they aren't interested in rescuing his ass.
When he debates/disagress with honesty I have no problem with him, but these ugly untowards attacks he commits are just over the top.

240 someone  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 11:19:26pm

Geez, I preferred pbum/CP back when he was Nastification Agenda.

241 Thom  Thu, Jul 1, 2004 11:55:32pm

Gor-don is a piece of shit.

My jaw still drops every time someone defends him, or thinks he actually adds something to this place, just because he occasionally drops an ass-kissing post (and then actully congratulates the scumbag for showing a glimmer of rationality!). The fact of the matter is exactly as justdanny pointed out:

Oh, now I get nodrog's post here kissing Charles's ass. He just screwed up and revealed himself for the true anti semite POS he really is on another thread.

with the exception that he has outed himself many times.

Please stop giving this turd the benefit of the doubt!

242 V the K  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 1:42:58am

#49 was just one of those quarters I was talking about.

243 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 2:06:59am

To save me time, anybody want to link to Gordon's post where he really offended people? Is it on this thread?

244 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 2:10:55am

#74 has a link.

(I just control F'd (like John Kerry, but different) until I found it.

245 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 2:12:23am

Death March.


Okie-dokie.

246 Furious J  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 2:54:29am

Let's see... anti-semitic, claims to be conservative while embracing left-wing economic theory, constantly spouts inflammatory invective...

Gordo is Pat Buchanan.

247 a soldier's dad  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 3:19:46am

#246 Furious J

I think you've got something there. Gordo has been exposed!

248 peace be upon me  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 3:22:51am

All the above deflective anger, is symptomatic of cognitive dissonance. Secretly, you shiny-happy-people want to take the leap into the hard-line, but you remain prisoners of spin-rhetoric ("Islam is peace," "violent minority hijacked Islam," "Muslims want freedom," "Bush is a man of compassion,")

Forthwith and henceforth, you will abandon the soft-line, make war on the carpet-humping jihad-monkeys, and you will not question your destiny. No backtalk! And deliver respect; I'm new here.

Al-Qaeda to Europe: You're fucked!
[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

Me to Euro-Gordon: Fuck You!

249 Lewis  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 4:04:36am

#248 camel prophet islam is peace peace be upon me

Why do you keep insisting that you're new here?

Just keep posting interesting links, and I promise to ignore the froth collecting around the corners of your mouth. Oh, and the respect thing, too - sure.

Deal?

250 JustAHouseWife  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 4:04:52am

Everybody sing!...

Oh lord help me shut my trap with the crap that I spew!
Peace be upon me!

I hate Everyone, the USA, good people and YOU
Peace be upon me!

Peace be upon me
I need to take a pill
Peace be upon me
I should take drugs with Hillary and Bill

Peace be upon me
I suck
I lie
I'm a walking oil spill!


La la la..cha cha cha cha. LMAO..

251 TMF  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 4:08:03am

Psyops baby. Psyops. One thing you can say for him, Moore knows his psyops.

Get that man a job in the CIA!

252 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 4:23:57am

#153

Bush should have put on his spider man outfit sprang into action and saved the day for you unrealistic utopian retarded-leftwingers.

but then - what would you have to bitch about?

253 Lewis  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 4:58:05am

#252 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs

You mean to refer to #154 pbum, don't you?

I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think it's accurate to refer to him as a utopian left-winger.

I think, given his druthers, he'd turn the entire Middle East into one gigantic sheet of glass.

He's bigel plus.

254 steve miller  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 4:59:17am

w/b's to Camel Prophet. You sure post cogent arguments!

/must I?

255 growler  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:02:52am

I think I read somewhere that Moore stole his treatment of the WTC from some French filmmaker.

256 azul93gt  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:23:08am

I heard on Hewitt's radio show that former NY mayor Koch chastized Moore about Moore's statements that diminished the seriousness of the attacks on the WTC on 9/11. I'm astonished that Moore fails to acknowledge that 911 was the single biggest attack on US soil ever and the fact that it is only through professionalism and luck that the death toll was not +10K.

Also shouldn't the Uber-libs now embrace "right wing" kook Alex Jones since Farfromtruth 911 is basically a rip-off of Ales Jones', "9/11 - The Road to Tyranny?"

257 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:29:14am
#49 Gordon:

Charles, [...] you're completely on the mark. Keep up the information about Moore's lies and tactics. He's much more dangerous than John Kerry's wife, and deserves the attention.

I commend you for actually going to see the movie.

Wow, for a minute I thought I was reading the closed-caption feed from a rimjob video...

258 JustAHouseWife  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:33:00am

If someone went and made a movie with pictures and video of me in it, and was making money from it, and I didn't authorize it, wouldn't I be entitled to some of that money some how?

This one thing I don't understand. Why doesn't President Bush get a part the profit as well? If President Bush wasn't in the movie, there would be no movie. Is the President exempt because he is a public figure? I guess it would be like SNL or a political cartoon being sold to a newpaper, but does't this cross the line some how?

Do you sign a waiver when you take the Oath of Office??

Did the other people MM used in the movie get paid, or did he jip them with some kind of waiver as well ? If MM uses this money to support a political candidate in the next election, would that be ok to?

259 William  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:33:36am

Fifty-six Deceits in Fahrenheit 911
[Link: www.davekopel.com...]


'Missed it by 95 posts'
/Maxwell Smart

:p


Heh, not much free time these days, didn't read all the posts.  :-)

Glad to see the regulars are keeping the LLL pinned down.
 

260 azul93gt  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:41:51am

#49 Gordon

I commend you for actually going to see the movie.

Why? He saw the movie, and it only served to confirm what he already knew, which is that the movie is a POS tissue of lies. Why bother? The entire premise of the movie (if it even could be said that the movie has a premise) is flawed.

261 Geepers  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:52:00am

JustAHouseWife (#258),

If MM uses this money to support a political candidate in the next election, would that be ok to?

Well we might actually see some of the money going to Mickeys opponents. How would that be for poetic justice?

Big part of 'Fahrenheit 9/11' profit goes to charity

The real winner: a charity, or charities, as yet unnamed, that will receive about 60 percent of the net profit ultimately generated by the film -- a tally that could be tens of millions of dollars. The Weinsteins, meanwhile, will pocket about 40 percent of the net, according to people familiar with the deal.

And who will pick the charities that get the money? Disney, the company that refused to release the movie, without having to consult either the Weinsteins or Mr. Moore. It's all the unexpected result of yet another strange tussle between Disney and the Weinsteins, the corporate odd couple that has had a tough time getting along since Disney's 1993 acquisition of Miramax.

Mickey needs to blow some of dough on better contract lawyers.

262 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 5:57:07am

They close caption pornos for deaf/hearing impaired preverts?


Does the US govt. pay for that as part of the Americans w/ Disabilities Act?

263 azul93gt  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 6:05:57am

Does anybody else besides me have a problem with the genre of film that we know as the documentary?

Since a very young age I have been skeptical of the credibility of the documentary. I became skeptical after watching crap like "60 minutes" and "Frontline." If there ever was any "journalistic" value offered by the documentary it has gone the way of the majority of biased media. The documentary is the worst of the biased media because it also uses the Hollywood like cinemagraphic art to distort, insinuate, and emotionally shade. And from my experience the creators of documentaries have even less adherence to the principles of balanced reporting than other so-called journalists. The dubious methodology of the documentary is custom made for a charlatan like Moore.

264 JustAHouseWife  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 6:12:22am

Sheesh that should be.."Would that be ok -too- ?"

Thanks Geepers for the article. It all just seems to push the limits of free speech/profit/slander to me..free speech run amuck is more like it. SNL uses actors, cartoons are drawings, MM is using the actual person to profit off of.


The Commander in Chief is speaking right now...;)

265 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 6:16:31am

Lewis - yes I did mean #154. Well I just get so sick of all of this Bush-bahsing. Any response from Bush gets him kicked to the curb. I guess Bush isnt as perfect as the all-knowing omnipresent creature known as the Clinton.

266 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 6:29:42am
They close caption pornos for deaf/hearing impaired preverts?


Does the US govt. pay for that as part of the Americans w/ Disabilities Act?

Well, I was only making a joke, but now you've got me intrigued by the thought of a porn movie with all-Deaf performers. I wonder how you sign "Pizza boy -- he delivers" in ASL?

(I was once told that the ASL sign for lesbian is a formed by making the signed letter L near your mouth with the "web" between thumb and forefinger against your lips -- you figure it out. That's the only "porn" sign I know, though.)

267 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 7:01:26am
Well, I was only making a joke, but now you've got me intrigued by the thought of a porn movie with all-Deaf performers. I wonder how you sign "Pizza boy -- he delivers" in ASL?

Following up on my own thought (it is Friday), how do you convey wokka-chicka, wokka-chicka for hearing-impaired porn viewers? I guess they'd have to lower an actual disco ball and strobe lights onto the truckstop set after the hitchhiker signs to the motorcycle cop, "But officer, I've never done anything with another guy before..."

268 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 7:02:28am

266


I wonder if Penthouse and Playboy and ManDate and Hustler's Barely Legal are published in Braille for vision impaired pervs, or whether they hire somebody with a dignified voice, maybe Patrick Stewart, to do an audio books version.

(imagine with a Patrick Stewart voice) Candy just turned 18 today, and she couldn't wait to show off her firm yet supple body to you. She has blonde pigtails, of course, and is licking a lollipop...

269 zaylen  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 7:02:57am
so after the long, boring intro explaining how Bush stole the 2000 election (please, moonbats, stop with this already)

He's not the only one still spouting off this "stole the election" line. Check this article out.

US lawmakers request UN observers for November 2 presidential election.

I can't believe this garbage could actually come up on the US House floor!!

270 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 7:13:08am

OT

Second Eastern Pacific Tropical Cyclone of 2004 has formed. The EastPac is actually starting out rather slowly, which implies a busier than usual Atlantic season, although July is usually a rather dull month in the Atlantic as the tropical waves coming off Africa are still a little too far south, the eastern North Atlantic hasn't warmed up quite enough yet, and unlike June, it is becoming less likely a polar system gets far enough south and stalls to undergo slow transition to a sub-tropical then tropical system.

The other good news for the Atlantic, is that after going strongly negative in mid-June, the daily values of the Southern Oscillation Index have gone neutral, implying a hurricane season squashing El Ni&ntildeo will likely not occur before the heart of the Atlantic season August and September.

271 Lewis  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 7:25:08am

#265 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs

Lewis - yes I did mean #154. Well I just get so sick of all of this Bush-bahsing.

I know what you mean. Believe you me, I hate being forced to defend Bush, as there's a LOT that I can't stand about him (the proposed same-sex marriage ammendment and stem cell research spring immediately to mind), HOWEVER the ignorant idiocy of the Bush haters is driving me nucking futs.

I'm constantly trying to defend (some aspects of) this administration's foreign policy, and all of a sudden I'm getting labelled a conservative Bush lover. Irritating.

People I socialize with wear their Bush hatred like it's some sort of badge of honor. For them, 9/11 didn't rearrange their political priorities as it did mine - it, apparently, only served as further confirmation for them that America is evil, and is finally getting its just desserts.

They're blind to the fact that America, while kinda shiatty, sucks way the hell less than just about any other country on the planet. And their blind to the fact that Islam's hatred of the West generally and America specifically has, largely, nothing to do with colonialism or hegemony or the Kyoto treaty or corporate cronyism - and everything to do with the sick ideology of Islamic fundamentalism. They really think that if we adopted universal heathcare and gave everyone in the world a lollypop, that then no one would hate us anymore.

Self-righteous ignoramouses, all of'em.

272 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 7:48:10am
I wonder if Penthouse and Playboy and ManDate and Hustler's Barely Legal are published in Braille for vision impaired pervs

Actually, I've heard that Playboy did produce a few Braille editions on a experimental basis, once upon a time. Suffice to say the content was mainly Norman Mailer essays and lifestyle/"service" pieces (i.e., buying stereo equipment for your bachelor pad), though supposedly there were a few "tactile art" plates with raised lines so that one could feel the outlines of the bunny's boobs.

(imagine with a Patrick Stewart voice) Candy just turned 18 today, and she couldn't wait to show off her firm yet supple body to you. She has blonde pigtails, of course, and is licking a lollipop...

LOL!! Somebody hand me a spatula so I can scrape myself off the floor...

[wiping away tears]

It would be really cool if a company like Vivid -- which produces both straight and gay videos -- did an XXX-men crossover line, with Stewart dubbing voiceovers for the hetero titles and Sir Ian narrating the "all male" vids. (Hugh Jackman could cameo onscreen in both series, and wouldn't even have to change his name...)

273 Gordon  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 10:07:41am

Wow, I posted on point, IN AGREEMENT with Charles, and yet I still managed to hijack a thread.

Pretty neat trick, huh?

274 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 10:11:42am

273


You da man.

275 Trumpeter  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 10:55:22am
276 Trumpeter  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 11:02:02am

[Link: www.she-net.com...]

(Sorry. Charles' php code crushes & in the link. I try a direct cut & paste without a preview.)

277 rebmiami  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 11:11:13am

Just as the left always laments that it needs a Rush Limbaugh, we need a Michael Moore.

To do just what the linked piece suggests -- to show the jumpers, the wreckage. There is a lovely montage set to Enya or something that I use to get revved up every year...it is linked on here. We need a feature film that does that...

Memri quotes from Saudi imams ... in Mecca.

Quotes from CAIR humanoids about subverting the U.S. Constitution toward sharia

The embassy in Iran

Lebanon barracks

Black hawk down

Khobar

Kenya embassy

Cole

etc. etc.

High volume of graphic footage of Saddam's torture and the Taliban's

My second hand sources tell me that MM is a great propagandist, well we need to beat him.

What is the best organized way to do this?
I'll give money.

278 Jack Frost  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 11:41:32am

I disagree with the black screen criticism. I saw the film and thought that the absent images of the WTC were the artistic decisions of the Moore people or himself. I was just as angry all over again when that scene happened. I went to see it with friend and thought many of the same things you did- (in your criticism, Charles) but I do think it shows some truth about the Bush administration's incompetence. : his vacation time, his arrogance, his backwards view, his playing on the fear of 9/11 etc.

But I did draw the line where he tried to imply that there was no real threat, or that Bush was in league with the Saudis. Or the truly mad part, which has already been stated, that the Iraqis were just cheerful before the occupation.

I thought that Bowling For Columbine was much more anti American and a propaganda machine while Fahrenheit is more anti Bush and a little bit of fudging . maybe next time he'll actually make a documentary.

279 rebmiami  Fri, Jul 2, 2004 12:12:58pm

243 Ed Moran

regarding Genocide Apartheid

unless it ever apologized for it, and I don't think it did, I stopped giving this trolline entity the benefit of the doubt after its comments on this enormous thread at post 137, which I see has now been deleted.

It vacillates between trying to be a "contrarian voice of moderation" trying to prevent us all from becoming unbalanced in our antipathy toward Islam, and rabid unfounded personal attacks on the posters here.

I see something it said yesterday has caused people to "boycott" it.

Its mo is to lure you in with a reasonable sounding post, then flatten you with barking moral equivalence or worse.

scroll by, scroll by, it likes the negative attention or it would otherwise go strap on its tinfoil hat and go bark with the moonbats at DU or Daily Kos.

Then it would just be another undistinguished member of the pack.


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