Well that's what you get when you live in an honor-shame society that Hezbollah and the Syrian military features prominently in.

I feel nauseated to the point where I just "vurped". I didn't like it...and now I have this funny feeling in my throat as if I just ate sand with a touch of gasoline.

MMM good eats at the Baron Estate...

Andrew B.

Israel is Real

The statement appeared aimed at countering criticism by some fundamentalist Sunni Muslims in Tripoli who accused Hassoun’s family of being “American agents and collaborators.”

Sounds like the family is trying to save its own hide from retaliation.

Send them back - all of them!

Couldn't the healine end with "fellow travellers"

How long before the Pentagon rethinks Muslims in the military?

1 year?

After another 9/11?

20 years???

Never?

On Thursday, two people were killed and three others wounded in a Tripoli gunbattle between members of the Hassoun clan and business rivals who taunted them as being American collaborators.

"Business rivals"?!?! What kind of "business" are these "families" involved in? Sounds like a clan of criminals and crazies to me.

#6 RighIsRight

I bet on never.

I'm going to discount the families reported "statements" at this point in time. What is important to me is what Hassoun, himself, has to say, or what the report will be after he is debriefed.

We cannot chose our relatives, or the conditions under which they are living.

They're just saving their asses.

Cowardly, but understandable.

he was forced to go to the United States and join the Marines because of the deteriorating economic situation caused by Lebanon’s 1975-90 civil war.

Oh i get it he was "forced" to come here...its time we stopped these "forced" trouble makers from coming here and instead "force" their asses out...

His story gets more and more fishy by the minute

uh, ted

We have not heard his story yet.

Time for those moderate Muslims to step up and show some loyalty outside the tribe.

He shoulda joined the Airforce.

Well maybe not:

Airdrop Mishaps

Turn up the sound.

If I was in their shoes I'd do exactly the same, assuming I'd still want to live at all if I was living in an Arab country under Syrian occupation and a growing influence of Iran-supported Islamaniacs like Hizb-Allah.

BTW, how come there are no Lebanese splodydopes in Syria?

...who taunted them as being American collaborators.

The guy is a deseter and will face punishment once the media spotlight fades.

Yes, he is a callaborator of an ideal that is not acceptable to his fellow muslims. I wonder when he is booted from the USMC, will he run home to Lebanon or settle back down in the US? Dollars to doughnuts he'll stay in America continuing to pay lip service to Islam, but will stay in the "oppressive USA."

Was this guy a useful arabic translator?

If not why wasn't he stationed in Alaska?

In WW2 most of the Japanese American soldiers
were sent to fight in Europe.

What is important to me is what Hassoun, himself, has to say, or what the report will be after he is debriefed.

I thought we stopped doing that to prisioners. :-)

What an embarrassment. What is the military thinking of? The armed forces should consist of citizens only.

There's something like 37,000 green card holders in the services, and they don't check papers very closely so some of those are illegal aliens. Unacceptable!

Someone who joins the military for financial reasons is a mercenary, a hired gun with no loyalty.

And a Muz mercenary is disloyal twice over.

I gather this family doesn't have his Marine Corps Boot Camp graduation picture hanging proudly on their wall, huh?

#15 snooze

BTW, how come there are no Lebanese splodydopes in Syria?

Not sure what you mean, but there probably are Lebanese splodeydopes in Syria...they're just passing through on their way to Iraq. And they are probably Leb. shi'ites from Hizbullah on an Iranian payroll.

I wish there was an article about the latest at the FBI. That handsome young fellow whose retiring soon, (forget his name and all) said in an interview yesterday on FOX that the FBI is making a huge effort to recruit arabs and muslims as an outreach to the community.

Him being Lebanese has NOTHING to do with it... Remember that General Abuzied (sp) is Lebanese.

I think the keyword here is ISLAM...

I have a couple of Lebanese friends who are in the army (well one is half Irish) But since they are not Muslim it poses no problems for them.

Since more than half of the Lebanese are Christian*, it was an ugly generality Charles.

(REAL Lebanese, not the half mule half Palestinian breed they got going in Lebanon now, you know the Lebanese that live in California LOL.)

#10 Arrr: You are right, but they probably also mean it.

I don’t understand why we allow Muslims in the military to be honest with you, they often end up hurting the troops more than helping them. I think for our safety and their well-being the military should impose a rule against it.

He could have went to Arafish and became a suicide bomber and received his sign on bonus. It would only be 1 paycheck but what a paycheck.

Wll the information is not out there so the possibilities could be
1. Was kidnapped
2. Went AWOL
3. Worked a deal to spy for his kidnapper
4. Was made to look like he went AWOL to actually
spy on the terroists for the US.

or there could be more.

#23 RayA

Since more than half of the Lebanese are Christian*, it was an ugly generality Charles.

Lebanon has not been anywhere near 50% Christian in the last 50-60 years. The demographics began to shift toward a Muslim majority in the years after WWII, aided by the influx of "Palestinians" after 1948, who helped destroy or otherwise drive out most of the Christian Lebanese. I don't have figures, but Lebanese Christians (in Lebanon, that is) are probably no more than 10%-15% of the population.

Incidentally, I don't believe Charles was generalizing about anybody, esp. not the Lebanese people.

RayA: Your point is taken, but I was merely echoing the AP release. Now that you mention it, this is another case of the media refusing to identify the real problem.

#23 RayA
I'm sure Charles is more than capable of defending himself, but as I read what he wrote, he specifically references Lebanese Arabs and the Hassoon clan. Nothing in there is a generality, quite specific on the other hand.

Until the USMC says otherwise, Hassoun is still a Marine, and should be afforded the right to be responsible for his own actions, not that of family members.

This story has had so many twists, false leads, and disinformation (and lots of it put out by Islamofascists in an effort to toy with Americans) I refuse to pronounce judgment on this individual until the USMC does their own investigation.

#18 ploome

No, I didn't see anything... I'm in Germany and anything to do with the US military is never shown in a postive light. This has not drawn to much attention in the EU press.

I have some experience with Lebanese. I have an uncle (by marriage) who is Lebanese... left in 67'. I have not seen him since 89' and have nothing against him, but I know for a fact he is anti-semetic. When I was a kid, my mom drug me up to Flint, MI, to see our cousins and one of them I refuse to even be in the same house with today. To keep it short, I have made it clear since I got back from GWI I want nothing to do with them as they are pure LLL -- anti-American, Jew hating dreck.

Him being Lebanese has NOTHING to do with it... Remember that General Abuzied (sp) is Lebanese. I think the keyword here is ISLAM...

nah... that lebaneseChristian woman hanan ashhan (sp not even close) is arafats left-hand man.

12 Darleen

true...ill give him the benefit of the doubt for now and also bet my bottom dollar he's in the brig by next week...

#25

I don't have figures, but Lebanese Christians (in Lebanon, that is) are probably no more than 10%-15% of the population.

OK, some fact check time, and a possible revision to my last post. There are mixed figures out there. This site says that 30% of the pop. is Christian. Wikepedia claims they make up 45%-50% . Nation master also claims 45%-50%. I guess my claim of 10%-15% was too low, but the claims of 50% still seem too high to me, esp. since I don't know if there are accurate figs. for the number of Palestinians in Lebanon, nearly all of whom are Muslims.

#31 ted

You may win that bet. But until the USMC says otherwise, I'm going to refrain from jumping to conclusions about this individual.

Now, trashing the clan in Lebanon is another thing. :-)

#29 Buckeye Abroad

When I was a kid, my mom drug me up to Flint, MI, to see our cousins and one of them I refuse to even be in the same house with today.

Ah, you have cousins in my home town! Sorry to hear your trip there was a dissapointment. Antisemitism is a huge problem throughout most Arab communities, even the most assimilated American ones.

Did you know that a crazy secret right wing pro freedom zionist cabal forced me to join LGF!

Ok,you got me it was my own appeasment philosophy that made me cave in.

Remember Bergs psycho-socialist father? Now we have the muslim version.
AHHH!

#25 I do not consider the Lebanese living in Lebanon now as “Lebanese” in any sense of nationality. As it is happening now in the Christian villages in Iraq, they are being displaced by outsiders. In the case of Iraqi Christians, it is the marsh arabs running from Kurdish territories and in the case of the Lebanese it was Palestinians and Syrians who were fighting Jihad in the Civil war.

There was an old agreement (this is from my father who lived there for six years, Im not sure how true it is) between the Christian and the Muslim factions before the civil war that for the sake of diplomacy they would always consider Lebanon to be 50/50 which is not always true.

The Lebanese Christians (and Syrian jews) are some of the first immigrants to the US from the middle east starting their migration in the late 1800's They have slowly been displaced by Muslims ever since.

20 years ago Christian villages in Iraq were 100% Christian (with the occasional hidden jew family) now they are less than 50% ... I would not call the Muslims living in the Christian villages as “Syriacs or Assyrians or Chaldeans” because that is simply not true. Same applies for Lebanon.

My opinion anyway.

#28 Darleen

I refuse to pronounce judgment on this individual until the USMC does their own investigation.

Right. We really don't know anything for sure.

Well I don't really blame the family. They are not Americans, and are not immigrants. When some Lebanese cabdriver in NYC makes that kind of comment, it's a lot more offensive and my response would be, "well if that's how you feel then you should go back where you came from." But these people stayed where they came from.

I also have to say that I admire that little dig they got in there -- you know, how it's all Syria's fault that he was forced to go be a marine...

So much for the family. As for the marine himself, he had better have a damn good story or he's going to spend time in Leavenworth!

cathy :-)

Members of a particular minority ethnic group in a particular country, say that setting up a counter-terror database could: be misused against "innocents"; cause the particulars to live in angry ghettos; cause particulars to chose not to grace the majority with their presence, by immigrating. But, could it prevent terror?

[Link: www.dw-world.de...]

A day after interior ministers of Germany's 16 states broadly agreed to set up a federal database for Islamic extremists and terror suspects, Turkish organizations in the country sharply criticized the move and warned of possible misuse. "Who will check whether innocent people will also be included in the database?" asked Hakki Keskin, chairman of the Turkish Community in Germany. "Terror is terror and can't just be limited to Islam," he added. Celal Altun, general secretary of the Turkish Community in Berlin raised doubts over the legality of such legislation. "Even if the security of a state takes priority, such measures amount to an invasion in the constitutional rights of a person," Altun said. He cautioned that millions of immigrants could be spied upon if such a database was set up. "They (the immigrants) will then retreat into their worlds -- that will hamper integration," he added.

#34 mick

Yeah, her older brother lived there awhile as well, so up to Fllint we went. We were (still are) pure working class types, so that was considered our summer vacation. A trip to Flint and a day at Cedar Point.

I do have some good memories of Flint, but the Arabs there are thick as theives.

My grandmother told me that shortly after 9-11 "that" part of the family came down to Florida to visit. When CNN would report of a suicide bombing in Israel, THEY WOULD FUCKING CHEER. She would leave the room. I think the breaking point was when they were driving down the road and the radio announced the amount of US flags hanging out to show solidarity with what happend in NY, my aunt cynically said, "who cares." At that point, my grandfather pulled the car over and calmly turned around and said, "I care." They were asked to leave that day and told in not so many words to never come back.

I love my grandparents.

Mickthemick

Actually I think 10-15% is an accurate number for those living in Lebanon now. I was referring to Lebanese all over the world which I believe is more than half.

Let me put it this way...

I lived and worked in Dearborn Michigan and then in Sterling Heights (areas with many middle easterners and Mediterraneans) I have yet to meet a “Lebanese” Muslim... It is even more true of the ones in California, they are of the earlier migrations and they are probably 90% Christian.

Thanks for the hat tip, Charles.

peace be upon me

But, could it prevent terror?

No. As someone who works in information technology, I can assuredly tell you that keeping and maintaining databases will solve nothing if the will to act upon the collected information does not exist.

The CIA, FBI, and other counter terror organizations must be prevented from acquiring new technological toys and be forced to infiltrate the terror organizations and supporting communities (e.g Arabville) with people. Human intelligence and subversion from within terror organizations are worth 1000 spy satellites and all the lame duck databases in the world.

#41 RayA

You are right. 85% of Arabs living in the US are Cristians who ran for their lives from the loving treatment of their fellow Muslim Arabs from the start of 20th century on.

As for Lebanon, both 'statistics' most probably are right - Christians are ~ 40%-50% of Lebanese excluding Paleos (though I read somewhere, may be Free Lebanon, that Syria is encouraging Muslims from Syria to settle in Lebanon thus actively islamizing Lebanon), and 15% including Paleos, to whom Lebanon does not extend citizenship.

#14 Geepers

Your link tried to install a virus on my PC. Norton caught it, but FYI.

Scan type: Realtime Protection Scan
Event: Virus Found!
Virus name: Download.Trojan
File: C:WINDOWS~GLH0000.TMP
Location: Quarantine
Computer: xxx
User: xxx
Action taken: Clean failed : Quarantine succeeded : Access denied
Date found: Sat Jul 10 18:53:53 2004

Unless something comes out to change my mind, I say him, his family and the horse they rode in on go back to Danny Thomas land. No deposit, no return.

Buckeye,

Hell, I don't even know you, and I love your grandparents. ;)

[and all the lame duck ]
[but Bush is acting like a lame duck for some time now ]

Just learned a new phrase Stalin?

a (once) good friend of mine recently married a syrian muslim woman, whose father (now deceased) worked for the fraudi royals (he left them with enough $$ so they don't have to work. my friend became a muslim). her mother lives in beirut, although most of the family is from syria. he's going to beirut this fall, and told me that he might be going to syria. i asked him if there were any visa problems seeing as how he's an American and there might be repurcussions because of the Syria Accountability Act - he said that if he goes to syria "they won't go through official channels."

she now gets american citizenship. they're both outspokenly anti-american.

there's nothing more suspicious than well-moneyed muslims with nothing to do but ruminate on how evil america is.

i have all but broken off contact with him - i want nothing to do with the both of them.

i have the FBI tips page bookmarked.

PostalWorker, It's from StrategyPage, they're pop-up whores.

#51 Geepers

Cool. Norton ripped it a new one.

Treason is alive and well.

Maybe Kerry and Edwards-baby will send him a "get well soon" card for the "hardships" he endured before and after impersonating a US MARINE.

makes me wanna curse...:(

owl

Regarding counter-terrorism and espionage against the Islamofascists... Reuel Marc Gerecht, a former CIA officer now with American Enterprise Institute, just published an essay in The Weekly Standard about reforming the CIA that's highly detailed in its analysis and recommendations.

[Link: www.weeklystandard.com...]

#41 Ray
I also work in Dearborn, I also come into contact with various moslems from various countries. Believe me there are quite a few moslem Lebanese in the Dearborn area. I know at least 30 moslem families that are from Lebanon. Most of them are two face liars and I had to tolerate them in my work environment.
In fact during the civil war in Lebanon, one moslem Lebanese had just graduated from Wayne State, with a Master Degree in Engineering. I commented to him that he should be excited in getting a well paying job.
He replied, I am going back to Lebanon and fight. Never heard from him again.
Among the hundreds of moslems that I had the displeasure of dealing with only a handful are decent people, about one out ten.
I also have friends that are Christian Lebaneses and it is hard to fathom that they came from the same racial stock as the Lebanese moslems.
By the way I purposely put the small caps on moslems, for they are small mnded people

Soon to Go Postal Worker,

"Just learned a new phrase Stalin?"

If you are so damn in need of something to kick around each evening, buy a dog. Say something useful and without insult after insult and maybe I will take you seriously.

#56 Joseph Dzhugashvili

Say something useful and without insult after insult and maybe I will take you seriously.

From someone who calls himself Joseph Stalin, maybe you should rethink.

Nevermind, I forgot who I am talking to.

Well dang Joe. You say Bush is acting like a lame duck, then call a database a lame duck database, claiming that you are in IT. Hmmm.

I *never* in my IT career ever heard someone calling a database a "lame duck".

Neither would I ever hear any pundit of any kind call what Bush is doing as a lame duck.

So I think you are B.S.n' us.

And your nick is offensive as hell.

Such a nice patriotic all-American family.
We should let many more of them come to this country.

#59 Mik

Such a nice patriotic all-American family. We should let many more of them come to this country.

This is my dilemma. I actually know more than a few Arab Americans who proudly serve in our military. How do we still be America and keep the assholes out?

#60 reaganite

Joe would say to intern everyone, then let the ones out that fit the right profile for a "citizen" ala "Star Ship Troopers".

#61 PostalWorker

Joe would say to intern everyone, then let the ones out that fit the right profile for a "citizen" ala "Star Ship Troopers".

It's funny how many "hate" emails I got yesterday for bashing this asshat. The ones who sent them are surprisingly muted today...

Hate mail? Glad I shut mine off.

#63 PostalWorker

Hate mail? Glad I shut mine off.

Earthlink's spam/junk mail filter actually works pretty well. So I don't have to put up with them more than once.

"...forced to work in a position that they may not like.”

Well, Wassef Ali Hassoun, perhaps when you leave the comforts of the German hospital you can decide to live in poverty without compromising your precious Muslim integrity, or re-join the rest of the free world that understands MONEY buys goods and services... and take "another job you don't like".

Is everyone with less than desirable jobs now a victim?

What a sellout.

How is being a marine not desirable? WHy did he join in the first place? Did he think it would be a cakewalk? If so he is a fucking moron.

The fact is he may have made a deal to save his ass. I won't blame him in that case. If he went to the other side, then I say life in the brig.

I'll reserve judgment for now until the full story is known but if this turns out to be another REMF profiling slacker shirking his responsibilities well then I have two words:

CODE RED.

#56 Joe

Last night you said you would change your nic if it offended anyone. It offends me. Please change it.

I know people who did time in Joe's Gulags and you paying hommage to a genocidal maniac is not funny nor appropriate. You nic might as well be Adolf Hitler in my eyes.

Explosion on bus in Tel Aviv.

#69 Baldy

Shit. Got a link?

I will continue to give this Marine the benefit of the doubt. I have heard so many different things from his family, both in the US and Lebanon, that I don't know what to think ABOUT THEM. I have STRONG doubts about his family in the US though, considering the conflicting versions they've offered.

#70 PostalWorker - It was just a NEWS ALERT on Fox News, only said "Explosion reported on bus in Tel Aviv" (I have sound off, it was just a few secs)...

Ok Baldy, I see Charles already linked it. Thanks!

The kidnapping, I think was a HOAX. As they've been intimating all along.

1. He goes AWOL. Not captured off his base, but AWOL.

2. The group that claims to have him, no one's heard of.

3. He shows up unharmed, 500 miles away in his family's homeland, none the worse for wear...

4. Having promised the "kidnappers" not to rejoin the Marines.

Well, that's one way to desert. Elaborate but effective.

OT: Federal Indictment Over Bio Materials ALARMS Art World (Houston Chronicle/NYT)Artist included E. coli in work; censorship seen in legal action

The case began as the result of an investigation that was prompted by the sudden death of Kurtz’s wife at their home in Buffalo on May 11. Kurtz phoned 911, and a paramedic noticed laboratory equipment in the house.

Baldy (#75),

WTF? That's about the looniest thing I've ever seen.

Lady of Shalott: He goes AWOL. Not captured off his base, but AWOL. The group that claims to have him, no one's heard of. He shows up unharmed, 500 miles away in his family's homeland, none the worse for wear...
Having promised the "kidnappers" not to rejoin the Marines.

Exactly. He manages to go through Iraq, Syria and occupied Lebanon unharmed. If we let this deserter off without a court martial and time in the brig, we're going to bleed for it.

Is the bogus hostage game becoming a trend?
AP Kills Story on Pakistani Hostages

BAGHDAD, Iraq (news - web sites) — Kill BC-Iraq-Pakistani Hostages. The video of the threat to kill three Pakistani hostages is old footage.

The AP

And I don't know why AP should start letting facts get in the way now. It never seemed to matter before.

#74 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)
#77 The Bruce

Sounds plausible enough. The only question that keeps me from condemning the guy is how he ended up at the US embassy in Beiruth?

All the points you rise show that he organized his desertion and also that he had help in doing so, i.e. kidnaping claims, moving fron Iraq to Beiruth and etc. The same people who helped to hide him could provide him with safe heavens to wait the affait over and also inform his relatives in Tripoli. Him ending up at the US Embassy does not fit in somehow, IMO.

So Marine Cpl. Wassef Ali Hassoun was forced to join the evil US Marines by the “difficult” living conditions in Lebanon. Think about this.

Compare and contrast Hassoun's behaviour to the Italian hostage who defiantly stated, "Watch how an Italian dies" as his captors sliced his head off.

Recall the words of Will Shakespeare, "A coward dies many deaths . . ."

How then would you classify Hassoun?

FIVEOFNINE:

I also graduated from Wayne for undergrad! You want to talk about liberal-leaning school. They are the reason why I vote republican LOL Was converted in 98 after a drunken rant by Conyers at a "get out and vote" campaign.

I met my Lebanese friends through there, they were all Christian and so Americanized that they made my mother blush by describing their dating habits. Actually my mom said something like : "yer not planning on marrying any of them are you?" I said no, Im marrying a Jew LOL. But I truly did not meet any Lebanese Moslems, mostly Palestinian Moslems LIVING in Lebanon or from Lebanon. Maybe I subconsciously avoided the Moslem ones *shrug*.

Lebanese people are like the french of the arabic world, they consider everyone to be beneath them and are notorious for cussing people to the extent of blasphemy... This was all before the Civil war btw (and from what my father described to me) , not sure how things are now and most of the ones in the US have already been integrated in the American society and the only thing they retain from their ancestry is their last names.

Its hard to generalize about Moslems, I try not to, the only generalization that I can make of them is that they are epidemically xenophobic. They do not try to understand other cultures but quick to convert them to their own. After living in the US all their lives, they are still uneasy about having Americans or non Moslems visit their homes, its really interesting. That might explain why you didn’t see them as good people. I have a couple of Moslem friends, we avoid politics and religion and limit the acquaintance to the social level.

Scratch his name from the Marine Corps rolls, shoot him and DEPORT his suck a$$ family!

#34 mick the mick

Antisemitism is a huge problem throughout most Arab communities, even the most assimilated American ones.

..some of it has to do with a primitive envy of Jewish acculturation to American society and contribution of Jews to American culture...jealousy