How can they reform without being shut down again? Unless they completely change their agenda?

Euopean have a happy suicide

Cue REM:

"It's the end of the world as we know it..."

There is a LAW at work here: The Law of Unexpected Consequences.

They'll be surprised when the outcomes are realized!

Here's the full release: [Link: vlaamsblok.be...]

How much of a party can it be, if the loss of $250,000 Euros puts it under? Is the Arab-European League a party receiving Belgian government support?

"Racist, eh?" They still think this is about race.

It has seen a spate of anti-Semitic attacks recently, while a radical Arab group has been staging vigilante patrols of North African neighbourhoods.

See, racism is bad, but not the racism of non-white, non-christians.

Between groups like this getting dismantled under pressure by fundamentalist muslim groups, and what just happened to Van Gogh, maybe we will finally see a NORMAL reaction from some Europeans? Maybe they wills tart fighting back? Maybe? Or not? :oP
Big litmus test!

#4 Carridine
RIght on.

Actually what the party officials said was that their members would be subject to criminal prosecution -- not that there would be

financial ruin for the Vlaams Blok with the loss of 250,000 euros (325,000 dollars) in annual public funding.

Read the release at post#5 for the real story.

Who are they racist against? and HOW racist are they?
Gas-chamber style racist? or two drinking fountian racist?

I'm not sure this isn't a good thing...

And how is this a gain for the muslims?

Just because this is a right wing organization doesn't mean they are on our side... there's lots of factions in Europe...

"This one Belgium will not be able to bury; it will bury Belgium"

wow.

Rooting for you guys.

A message from Frank Vanhecke MEP, Vlaams Blok Party Leader.Here.

First they want acceptance.

Then they want equality.

Then they want supremacy.

When--anywhere along the way, could they have been stopped/

anyone have links to any Belgian blogs?

I wonder how long before Islamists convince US judges to outlaw American Political parties and organizations?

Part of the new structure will probably go underground. And they will find a new way of funding their 'new' party.
If the courts think they've shut them up, they are probably in for a most unpleasant surprise.
Yet at the same time the coalitions of muslim groups don't come underneath any inspection.
Looks like the eu governance group are as a whole cowardly and very much afraid of what they are going to be forced to face eventually. Whether they want to or not.
The first small signs of civil discord and war.

Maybe the Flemings and Walloons will soon find that their greatest problem extends beyond each other. The [bigoted word]s will learn that the Fleming are not lemmings even if Wallonia is just another French SS division.

While it’s hard to approve of every one of Vlaams Blok’s policies

Does anyone have a link to what these policies are? I'm interested in reading them. Thanks!

Don't worry, Vlaams Blok changes its name and will get more votes than ever. This is LLL-judges showing how enlightened and intellectual they are. Vlaams Blok is at 24% in the polls.

In The Netherlands parties got forbidden as well but that hasn't stopped anyone. It's the "cordon sanitaire", the invention that all other parties won't form a coalition with Vlaams Blok, that has kept Vlaams Blok from being in charge. Not the left-wing judges.

It's probably only a matter of a short little time till the Islamonazis start their pogroms in the Antwerp shtetl.

If its any consolation, I've heard rumours of these handsome beasts waiting for just such an event.

A foreshadowing, I fear, of what may yet happen here: it becoming more important to stamp out "racism," both real and imagined, than to preserve free speech.

At least, that's how I read the article.

#12 Balisong

They are racist against Muslims, among others, according to Vlaams Blok's resonse:

The Ghent ruling, today reaffirmed by the Supreme Court, stated that our texts (though some were mere quotes of official statistics on crime rates and social welfare expenditure and another was an article written by a female Turkish-born Vlaams Blok member about the position of women in fundamentalist muslim societies) were published with “an intention to contribute to a campaign of hatred."

To want to preserve one's cultural heritage in this world today is a racist act.

#26 bigel

Somehow I can't picture the Hasid diamond dealers of Antwerp toting an Uzi.

Maybe not. But it wouldn't take many Minimis to stop a pogrom.

In many ways the Far-Right in Europe is both the cure to the Islamist problem, and a cause of it. They understand the problem posed by Islamic immigrants, but their racist beliefs spoil the idea of immigration reform and other anti-Islamist legislation in the eyes of more moderate voters.

Belgian has made a part of what's being a Belgian illegal. You must be a pretty nasty bunch since the immigrants wouldn't do it for you. They think you don't matter to yourself - why should they bother thinking about losers. It does smack of suicidal though.

This is one more step on the road to LLL tyranny in the EU. If you can get a political party shut down by labeling it racist, there's no limit to the extent to which the EU LLL will be able to shut down political opposition, stymie free speech, and fine and/or jail anybody that disagrees with them. This is why I will never support so-called Hate Crimes legislation in the U.S.--the kind of people who do support it would make it a hate crime to disagree with them.

#17 Dar

I wonder how long before Islamists convince US judges to outlaw American Political parties and organizations?

Yep, and it would undoubtedly enjoy the resounding success of prohibition, the 55 m.p.h. speed limit, and the probability of ever getting truthful answers to the questions on the job application that asks if you have ever used any illicit substance.

They Euros won't have to worry about being killed onesie-twosie for long...

[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

Religion of peace.

While the MSM abrogates its responsibility of mentioning AIDS as a possible cause of Arafat's illness, The New York Sun finds this in Holland:

Yesterday, the third-largest newspaper in Holland, De Volkskrant, ran a cover story about a local Web site that proclaimed homosexuality was an illness and called on the faithful to follow the teaching of the Koran and throw homosexuals from the tops of buildings.

#34 Luigi

Yesterday, the third-largest newspaper in Holland, De Volkskrant, ran a cover story about a local Web site that proclaimed homosexuality was an illness and called on the faithful to follow the teaching of the Koran and throw homosexuals from the tops of buildings.

I'm gonna hazard a guess that they ain't many 1-story ranch style houses in Holland.

The Europussies will continue in this manner until the Muslims make them pay for it in blood.

Then they'll come screaming to the US... "Save us! Save us!"

#29, Final Historian, what do you mean?
Right wing Europa has not been in power in Belgium for at least 30 years (when the first muslims came to Europe) and loads of people want to vote for them now.

From the Beeb

"We are the democratic voice of an ever growing number of Flemings who, in an entirely non-violent way, want to put an end to Belgium," Mr Vanhecke said on Tuesday.

"Our electoral strength is causing panic amongst the Belgian establishment. We will establish a new party. This one Belgium will not be able to bury; it will bury Belgium."

Court rules Vlaams Blok is racist

This scared the heck out of me. First time ever leftists have used courts to achieve what they can't by legislation or ballots (sarcasm).

Love all the loaded terms the AFP lavishes on the party too. Maybe they are "extremist right-wingers," but I can see this applied to anyone who doesn't have a hammer and sickle flag in his living room.

So what is it Europe? My take there is that the vast majority of the populace is more left wing, on average, than we are in America. That would leave room for moderates and conservatives too. But whereas we don't have any significant problems with right-wing extremists, Europeans are portrayed as having 20-33% of their population being rabid bigoted extremists. There's nothing at all between say Tony Blair and the Ku Kux Klan. Doesn't sound right to me, but will listen to what you have to say.

#28 Colt

But it wouldn't take many Minimis to stop a pogrom.

You forget about some other fine Belgian products, like the P90, and the 5.7 pistol.

You got to love it ---
Libs are scared of the evangelicals just wait until the
Muslims lay down their rules. Muslims think evangelicals are liberals, and liberals are for stoning.

Reason #206 Why I'm Glad Bush Was Re-elected:

Can you imagine how we'd be reacting to this if it was president-elect Kerry on the TV 24/7 right now?

With the prospect of Kerry nominating three or more SCOTUS jurists, and scores of other federal bench judges, we may have started down this road, too.

OK, well, we've perhaps started already (for example, Justice O'Connor citing international law in a recent opinion), and are merely delaying the inevitable. I, too, am concerned that free speech in the US is going to look more like, say, Canadian free speech in the years to come.

But who could deny that we'd be much further along in the upcoming decade if we had a Kerry-stacked court.

Eesh

29 Final Historian

From Le Pen in France, Haider in Austria, and now Vlaams Blok, the Right makes no distinction between race and a culture that is intent on destroying all other cultures. It is this blindness that alienates most people. This allows muslims and islamists to get away with literally murder, as any attack on islam is considered racist.

#37

I was referring to Europe in general, with France as a particular example. The National Front in France has ruined the name of immigration reform, thanks to its association with that racist Le Pen.

#42: I, too, am concerned that free speech in the US is going to look more like, say, Canadian free speech in the years to come.

Not with LGF around!

I did not realize Belgium was ruled by a Sharia court.

#42

Can you imagine how we'd be reacting to this if it was president-elect Kerry on the TV 24/7 right now?

Actually, if Kerry had been elected I think he literally would be on TV 24/7, after he had the Swiftvets all locked up.

Mark Steyn made a passing comment in an otherwise related article the other day that applies here:

The design flaw of the radical secular welfare state is that it depends on a traditionally religious society birthrate to sustain it.

The Belgians, like the rest of the non-Catholic Europeans, have been aborting themselves out of existence for so long that they must import their labor force. Labor is now coming from the Middle East, and their higher birthrate is causing the now-familiar demographic shift.

What's sad is that many of the original immigrants came to Europe to get away from the Islamocrazies. But as their children grow up in welfare state comfort, many of the kids respond to the call of jihad in their new homes. (This is separate from the jihadis who somehow manage to sneak past immigration controls. I fear that the appeal of the hard Right, as well as retaliatory atrocities like the burning of that mosque, are a consequence, and worse is on the way.

#34, Luigi,

actually that website is waiting for a "better time" to proclaim homosexuality is an illness.
I don't agree with them, but they should be able to say what they want to say.

The problem in The Netherlands is that free speech is limited to whatever is proper speech according to the state. I don't care that Van Gogh talked about "goat fuckers", i wouldn't care muslims talking about homosexuals being ill. They should have the right to say so. Now there is not a single party in Holland in favor of free speech. Left-wing don't want Van Gogh (or me) talking about goat-fuckers, right-wingers insist that muslims must say that they like gays. This infringement of free speech is bound to lead to explosions. We (europeans) saw it happen nearby, in Yugoslavia. Now it's happening in The Netherlands. The first bomb has gone off near a muslim school, the first attempts at burning down christian churches have happened.

I hope to evacuate before Holland looks like Israel.

#47

Actually, if Kerry had been elected I think he literally would be on TV 24/7, after he had the Swiftvets all locked up.

Oh God. I have images of Kerry subjecting us to 8-hour Castro- and Hugo Chavez-style monologues on all networks.

Thank God that's only happening in the bearded Spock universe

shudder

test

The Massachusetts Supreme Court took away our freedom to define the word marriage. Now, we are accused of Racism if we disagree with their new definition. We are already on dangerous ground here in the USA.

The design flaw of the radical secular welfare state is that it depends on a traditionally religious society birthrate to sustain it.

Well, a flaw. When you pay people not to work, it encourages them to not work. When you provide them a lifestyle better than they can dream of back home and open the immigration floodgates, it gets even worse.

I don't understand what it is about Europe that has them giving such extreme preference to Ummahns, when there are far better workers and prospective citizens/ residents to be had from other places.

OT: And sorry if I'm the last person to know that Firefox was coming out today, but

Firefox 1.0 browser came out today and it is still the best browser anywhere.

Its here

Sorry If I'm the last Geek to know

I feel like exercising my racist rights to free speech.

Piss be upon the raping murderer Mohammed.

Back ON topic:

The statement says that after being branded a "criminal organization," the party was forced to disband to protect its members. Could the government there truly punish and prosecute persons for belonging to a political party?

OT: could someone explain Ashcroft and Evans resigning? Is it because they've got better things to do or did they read kos?

49 Joep

We (europeans) saw it happen nearby, in Yugoslavia. Now it's happening in The Netherlands.

Ironic that you should mention Yugoslavia. Is'nt Milosovitch in Amsterdam? I wonder if he is smiling?

Dar ul Harbarian

I wonder how long before Islamists convince US judges to outlaw American Political parties and organizations?

Dar, it won't be too long. Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Conner was recently in the news stating she supported the idea of the U.S. being subject to International Law.

I also believe Hillary will get us there as well, if she is elected President.

The Liberals would LLLLLLLOOOOOOVVVVVEEEEE To do this to us. I think there will be a large backlash, remember you live on your in stinks and die on your feelings

I also believe Hillary will get us there as well, if she is elected President.

Kinda funny that Hillary is widely perceived as bein' the only member of the Democratic party with testicles.

#57, DP111,
he is (acutally in The Hague, not Amsterdam). Not that it was our (The People) choice to have the international court of justice here. (do not hold the Dutch government against the Dutch, that really is something different)
I'm not sure, but i thought the US adopted an act to invade us when we would hold US-soldiers for not abiding by international law :-)

It's funny, there is a brewing bench kerfuffle here in the States. This situation is a view to our future if the left takes the courts - God forbid. The moonbats believe if you're consrvative your a racsist.

If Kerry was there...
would he be a Belgium Waffle?

Oh, I can't help myself....

Get a better look at the The Belgian Anti-Racism Act

Note also that the Belgian bill does not speak of race but of so-called race. According to the politically-correct politicians who wrote the bill, human races do not exist. Racists, however, do exist. According to art 3, everyone who "cooperates" with them (in whatever way), is a racist too.

Moreover, it reverses the onus of proof. The complainant does not need to prove that the accused “discriminates” or propagates “discrimination;” it is up to the latter to prove that he does not.

Belgian
Belgian....

Drat, spelling ruined a perfectly dreadful pun.

US Secretary of Homeland Security Tom Ridge accompanied Powell to Mexico. He promised to ease security

Bush gives migration priority: Powell, in Mexico

Ease security? Ease security?? Didn't we just elect these guys on the basis of increasing security? At a time when we have seen a majority party in a democratic society taken down by the forces of uncontrolled immigration, we are going to ease security? I figured Powell was behind this, but Ridge supporting it too?

I wonder what the belgian courts will do about islamic racism towards Jews (including physical assaults on the Chief Rabbi in that country).

I bet they'll put that down to multiculturalism and blame the Jews for not all dying during the Holocaust.

What these 'judges' in the west don't understand is that the reaction in Holland to islamofascism is a kids tea party compared to the inevitable backlash that will eventually occur. But in their swish neighbourhoods with their suparannuated cotton woll existence, they can't see the writing on the wall.

DEmocracy cannot survive if free speech is limited to PC leftist diatribes. Ask Kerry. He found out the hard way that true democracy reflects the views we have, not the ones leftist dictators decree to be acceptable.

This is an opportunity for Vlaam Blok, not a setback, if they look at it in an American way. I mean, if they look at in a Euro way (oh no, the government won't support us anymore, we're finished, boo-hoo!) then yeah, they're done. But instead, why not say: screw the government funding. We're not a welfare case.

If they're a popular party, they can go to the people for support. Donations. Website. Neighborhood meet-ups.

Democracy shouldn't rely on government funding. If that's what Blok needs to survive, then they don't deserve anything more than what they've got.

#67 I wonder what the belgian courts will do about islamic racism towards Jews (including physical assaults on the Chief Rabbi in that country).

Didn't you get the memo? The "Zionists" are to blame for everything.

#60 Swamp Woman

Kinda funny that Hillary is widely perceived as bein' the only member of the Democratic party with testicles.

Perceived is the key word. Hillary is more liberal than John Skerry. Do a Google search on Hillary. There are over 500 sites listed. I know you can't read them all, but I think you may be quite surprised.

Nope, no testicles there.

What were you thinking by posting this Charles? A very highly placed source has this to say about LGF

America should be carpet bombed into dust so it can not infect the world with its blind ignorance of world politics .

We not only know nothing about the world around us but we shouldn't even be made aware of an outside world thus insuring our invincible aura of ignorance. Sheesh!!

Doesn't really apply, but thought it was funny

Subject: Fw: The old man

One sunny day in 2005 an old man approached the White House from
across Pennsylvania Avenue, where he'd been sitting on a park bench.

He spoke to the U.S. Marine standing guard and said, "I would like to go in
and meet with President Kerry."
The Marine looked at the man and said, "Sir, Mr. Kerry was not elected
President ."
The old man said, "Okay" and walked away.
The following day, the same man approached the White House and said
to the same Marine, "I would like to go in and meet with President Kerry."
The Marine again told the man, "Sir, as I said yesterday, Mr. Kerry was not
elected president and does not reside here."

The man thanked him and, again, just walked away.
The third day, the same man approached the White House and spoke to
the very same U. S. Marine, saying "I would like to go in and meet with
President Kerry."

The Marine, understandably agitated at this point, looked at the man and
said, "Sir, this is the third day in a row you have been here asking to
speak to Mr. Kerry. I've told you already that Mr. Kerry was not elected
president and does not reside here. Don't you understand?"

The old man looked at the Marine and said, "Oh, I understand. I just
love hearing it."
The Marine snapped to attention, saluted, and said, "See you tomorrow."

#70, American Infidel

Wait and see. Israel didn't start a war in the beginning, they learned. The word "war" is now used by politicians. We're learning.

It looks as though Europe is continuing in its
long slide back to mediocrity. It's stuff like
this that explains why so many of our ancestors
left the place for these more hospitible shores.

As a patriotic American I sincerely hope that
the democrat party realizes it has swung way
too far to the Left and furiously moves back
to the middle.

"Left of Center" is something most of us can
accept, even if we don't agree with their views.
"Extreme Far Left [or Right]" inspires nothing
less than maximum loathing from the vast
majority of Americans.

trespasser

this is an AFP article and the quote you have in your post:

US Secretary of Homeland Security Tom Ridge accompanied Powell to Mexico. He promised to ease security

is an interpretation by the writer, niether ridge nor powell said those words. What they did say is:

"We will use all kinds of tools and elements we have to reduce waiting times at the border, for people and products which cross our border," he said.

this the reporter interperates as reducing security....

read the article again by reading the quotes first and you will see how twisted the bias is by the reporter.

#75 "Left of Center" is something most of us can
accept, even if we don't agree with their views.

That's a good one.

60 Swamp Woman
I hope Zell Miller doesn't see your comment. I'm pretty sure he still calls himself a Democrat, although he is deeply disappointed with the state of his party. And Hillary is simply a Dragon-Lady.

BTW The story in Belgium isn't over yet. The Left managed to push the pendulum backwards, but they went too far, thereby making a swing in the reverse direction inevitable. Pendulums can only stop in the middle.

OT: "Daniel Johnson" - probably not his real name - has just made some Dutch Muslims, and those in the UK, very, very angry. Fatwah alert!
Dutch find the strength to take on their 'new Nazis'

What had he done to deserve such a fate? Submission, the film that occasioned the attack, is by no means an attack on Islam as a religion. It does not, as Rushdie did, ridicule the Prophet Mohammed. What it does is to denounce the barbaric treatment of women in many Islamic societies, focusing attention on forced marriage and the penalisation of rape victims under the guise of adultery. The imagery is deliberately provocative: verses from the Koran are inscribed on a naked woman, to drive home the message that Muslim women are human, too, beneath the veil.

It does not require much imagination to see how this tableau would strike strict Muslims, who regard the Koran as the literal, uncreated word of God, and whose customs forbid the public display of the female face, let alone her body. To them, the broadcast of such an image on television is both blasphemy and sacrilege. In their eyes, it adds to the gravity of the case that the Somali woman who wrote the script of Submission, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, is a former Muslim - in other words, an apostate. She has been condemned by fatwa and survives only under police protection.

Van Gogh, as a non-Muslim, was mistakenly assumed, both by the authorities and himself, to be less at risk. In his book Allah Knows Better, however, he added insult to injury by castigating the misogyny and puritanical attitudes of local imams. Defiant to the last, he refused to alter his bohemian lifestyle, as if the Netherlands were still the haven of toleration that it had been since the revolt against Spanish rule four centuries ago.

#66 trespasser

It's bad enough that Bush could hardly wait for the election to be over to send Powell off for another little surrender to Mexico.

It's worse than that.

Terrorists at the Border?
[Link: www.nbc4.tv...]

"We know for a fact that people coming from the Middle East are now coming into Mexico and spending a year, even two years in Mexico, to learn how to speak Spanish," the Border Patrol agent told NBC4.

"The key is to pass yourself off as a Mexican," said retired Army Colonel Ben Anderson.

One border agent says he knows of 10 "special interest aliens", presumably Middle Easterners, arrested in his station.

Joep (#49)

I hope to evacuate before Holland looks like Israel.

Have you ever been to Israel? It's magnificent, nothing like what the bottom feeders show you on the news.

Fatwa is a funny word. It's like an a attachment for an electric guitar...

Duuuude, that's a sweet fatwah wah.

dustyroadguy

OK, I did miss that little twist. I feel slightly better. Only slightly, however. I can never fully rest at ease as long as Powell is still in the administration.

tranferthem (#67)

I wonder what the belgian courts will do about islamic racism towards Jews (including physical assaults on the Chief Rabbi in that country).

The same thing they do everywhere -- look the other way.

I bet they'll put that down to multiculturalism and blame the Jews for not all dying during the Holocaust.

Or that.

#73 irishlas
Cute! Thanks for sharing. ;)

OT but sweet:

"I happen to like the guy [Bush].

"Now I base this on more than intuition, although that contributes. I have been watching the man off-camera, monitoring a series of small vignettes, many of which did not make the news. It was my decision not to run with some of this material before the election and to allow the public knowledge to be the currency of the debate. But now that the angel dust has settled and we are all a little bit high, I will lay out some of the little morsels of evidence that convinced me of his genuine hail-fellow-well-met status."

Stand-up guy

Kinda OT(speaking of religion and it's misuse)

Hitch drops the Big One, and strafes the survivors.

#79 American Infidel

You are right. In a previous post I said i hoped the Americans would bail us out again. This time (for me, the first time), i will just escape from Europe.

But: please, please don't hold our government against us. You must understand that the Europeans are not as free as the Americans are. Actually, that's the current topic: the party 24% of the people of Belgium would vote for is forbidden! FORBIDDEN! Can you imagine??

It's not Iraq (where 99.9% voted for Saddam), but the difference is not that big.

#89 andthenblammo!,

More like bayonets the wounded. And the dead.

Jus' makin' sure :-)

Re: Border Crossings

My father still lives in Mexico (as an "illegal immigrant") but works in the US (US citizen). The border wait has been getting longer and longer; I used to live down there and it would have been unbearable crossing at San Ysidro if we didn't have Sentri (or the "Privileged Pig Pass" as we call it). And even with that, the delay is getting pretty long. That definitly needs to be streamlined.

Perhaps we will reduce security by allowing Mexico to be the 51st state. :)

"Nothing is so powerful as an idea whose time has come."

The Belgians are going to have a tough time with this

I don't want to use Wade's hairbrush!

You're a trip.

#93 BTW, that's Victor Hugo.

trespasser

I fully understand your concern, they are mine as well, the boaders are a difficult issue......

I doubt Powell will be leaving soon, I could be wrong......

I haven't really been following what he has been doing, my attention has been focused on the election and Iraq and I'm not sure yet as to whether the problem is HIM or the State Department and the damage that albright et al did during their tenure......

I am not a big State Dept watcher or fan.....

W's proposition that the best boarder control is a rising Mexican middle class......that's the right direction, question is what is the best method and how to make sure the Islamofacists are stopped.......

#90 Joep

When you are planning the move to the United States, don't listen to Ed Moran. He'll try to talk you into Texas. But everyone knows Florida is better. ;-P

This is why its so important for Bush to get his supreme court and judges in place and break the senate Demorats from fillibustering them. Demorats and socialists in general will use any means possible to advance their agendia, regardless for the democratic process like voting.. free speech.. fair elections.. and legal voters..

#83 zulubaby,

No, i have not been to Israel. I believe it's a nice place to be, but they have to deal with attacks on an almost daily basis. That's not the kind of country i want to live in.

Beagle

their are less bugs in texas and you can still walk the streets with a six-gun on your hip.....

No offense, Florida sucks big time in the summer....

their are more insects per square inch than in the jungle.....

/joking

OT

All of you lgfers that read FrontPage, here's an alert.
An article about Tucson as the world's jihadis capitol.
And apparently our government has known about this for years.
So that makes sense about the chechens who came across the border into Arizona a month ago. Headed straight for Tucson to get their guns. What school do you think they'll attack from there?
And Powell wants to discuss easing security? I say he should ease security alright, by closing the border crossings altogether.

Okay we got our man re-elected. Now let's raise some sand about the borders issue.

#97 Beagle

The US would be a good option (if you'd let me in, I think i would have to gamble for a Green Card). Real liberty, of course would be without any government at all. Seastead would be even better.

Joep (#99)

I believe it's a nice place to be, but they have to deal with attacks on an almost daily basis.

Not that I'm trying to sell it to you, but your perception of Israel is not what the reality is. There are threats, yes, but they have a strong army and even stronger intelligence and attacks are prevented. Having said that, nowhere is safe anymore.

It just got me thinking ... I remember coming to the US during Apartheid and not recognizing the country they were reporting about on tv. It was so distorted it was amazing.

#103 zulubaby

I remember coming to the US during Apartheid and not recognizing the country they were reporting about on tv.

Are you talking about media distortions of America, or media distortions of South Africa (or both)? What were some examples? Not to go OT, but I'm very interested in your impressions, observations, etc.

mickthemick (#105)

I'm talking about the media here, in the US. What I saw on tv was grossly exaggerated and distorted. No wonder the world hated us. It was only after I'd been here and watched what the rest of the world was watching that I understood that.

#103. zulubaby

Ok, may be Israel is nicer than it appears on television. It still doesn't have the appeal the US has. The US is the only country recognizing Liberty as a different thing than freedom. Freedom is having someone allowing me to say what i want. Liberty is that no one can disallow me to say what i want. That's what i want and only the US recognizes this notion. The Netherlands doesn't, and Israel doesn't either. (The weather is a lot better in Israel, though)

Joep, you have no idea what Israel is about. It's nothing like The Netherlands. The US is referred to as "Big Satan" and Israel is referred to as "Little Satan". You can figure it out. Israel is not Europe, I assure you. Just so you know.

#106 zulubaby
OK, thanks for sharing! I remember being in college in Ann Arbor during the '80's and people talked about S.A. like it was Nazi Germany. I remember some group building one of those shanties in the middle of campus. Then the Palestinians had to have a shanty of their own. Ofcourse, the students who built these shanties did not take care of them. Over time, both were vandalized, and eventually fell down. The student groups who built them did not come out to pick up their mess. One night somebody set fire to one of the piles of rubble, then the university finally got involved. Ah, the '80's! I don't miss them a bit.

mickthemick (#109)

I remember being in college in Ann Arbor during the '80's and people talked about S.A. like it was Nazi Germany.

Any comparison to Nazi Germany is proof of ignorance. Nothing compares to what the Nazis did. South Africa was no picnic for black people, there's no disputing that, but like Joep's perception that Israelis are attacked everyday is exaggerated -- that's the media's doing. It's the same distortions that I saw with regards to South Africa.

Have we ever condoned discrimination on the basis of race? No, but that did not matter to the Belgian establishment and its political courts. We were condemned on the basis of a selection of excerpts from texts provided by the CEOFR.

. . .

The Ghent ruling, today reaffirmed by the Supreme Court, stated that our texts (though some were mere quotes of official statistics on crime rates and social welfare expenditure and another was an article written by a female Turkish-born Vlaams Blok member about the position of women in fundamentalist muslim societies) were published with "an intention to contribute to a campaign of hatred." Such a procès d'intention (a conviction based on speculation about our supposed motives) is a real disgrace, and the fact that the Belgian judiciary had to resort to this proves that no other reasons for convicting us could be found. We have never propagated, advocated or practised any discrimination. Never.

#110 zulubaby

Any comparison to Nazi Germany is proof of ignorance.

No arguments here. Like I say, we're talking about people who obviously couldn't even pick up after themselves, and didn't even take action when anti-black and anti-arab graffitti was spray-painted on their shanties. They just left the mess for other people to clean up. Anyway, thanks as always for sharing your observations. ;)

This is my first post. I turned to this site after all the negative press Bush was receiving just after that incredible, focused Republican National Convention. I knew it was an amazing convention even though the media immediately set out with their typical "fed them red meat" style of reporting. I finally was able to register a few days ago.

My take on the changes in Europe are similar to the USA. I don't think the EU realizes that there are many, many people out there who absolutely agree with the Vlaams Blok party. I am actually encouraged by this change of events because 1) it's going to revitalize the reorganized party; 2) it is surely going to piss off their base and get them motivated; and 3) it gives great media coverage to the unspoken and unheard majority who live daily with the incredible strain of these "un-assimilated" immigrants. Just think how many more voters they are going to receive once they reorganize.

I would venture that between 1/5 to 1/3 (maybe just a little more) of Muslims are Islamofacists or lean heavily in that direction (probably just waiting for when they think the tide changes in their favor). They do not want to "assimilate" they want to annihilate. Only by web-sites such as this (which receive much more readership than realized) can we continually reject and refute their lame cries of "racism" when they are the racists (the disturbing news from UCSF is not uncommon in the USA).

They use our freedom against us. They will not win because as voters clearly mandated last Tuesday, we see through their lies.

Go "New Vlaams Blok!" Be the new party for Belgium which sets a mandate for all to listen to in Europe. Go LGF in bringing Islamofacist lies to the public!

#110 zulubaby

Any comparison to Nazi Germany is proof of ignorance.

I forgot to add that these are the same idiots who today compare Israel to S.A. under apartheid, but you already knew that. ;)

“We will establish a new party. This one Belgium will not be able to bury; it will bury Belgium,” he said.

Hardly seems like a slogan that will make people vote for you... Maybe something was lost in the translation.

zulubaby,

I guess you know what Israel is like, and I won't pretend I do, because I don't. But having one politician killed for his opinion, one column writer killed for his opinion and since a few days, churches and mosques going up in smoke i am sure The Netherlands is going fast towards being a country Israel is depicted as. The situation has changed completely within 2 years. 28% of the Dutch would want to emigrate "whenever possible". Holland has stopped being a nice country if you want to smoke weird stuff, we've just turned into a country that found out that muslims have other things than just diverse food. I'll translate something for you, hold on.

#113 SoCal Republican

I don't think the EU realizes that there are many, many people out there who absolutely agree with the Vlaams Blok party.

Firstly, welcome to LGF! Secondly, I disagree, I think the so-called elite in the EU do realize there are many people who agree with Vlaams Blok, but these same people think it's their duty to save Europe from its own right-wing. We're talking about leftists who are the self-appointed guardians of truth, justice, and all that is good (at least, they're defending their own concepts of truth, justice, and the public good).

"In Flander's fields where poppies grow
beneath the crosses row upon row . . ."

Flemish take heart from the spirit of the ancestors
and do your part.

Use massive civil disobedience, take to the streets and proudly proclaim you are a Vlaams Blok party member.

Make sure the media knows.

Be passive, be peaceful, be polite and be arrested.

Overload the jails, the courts with your numbers.
Make sure the media knows.

It worked for Ghandi. It worked for Martin Luther King.
It can work for you.

Peaceful civil disobedience is the pee cee nightmare.
Take care, take your time and you will save yourselves.

It's interesting to note how the Vlams Blok has reached out to the Jews of Antwerp. And they see Israel as a bulwark against the Arabs.

I have no sympathy with racists although I believe that "racism" can be misused.

We should make a clear distinction: The "Arabs" are not a problem because they are Arabs but because of their religious ideology, fanatism, intolerance. This is what we have to fight.

For a long time Belgium has tacitly ignored or tolerated the suppression of Moroccan women, overlooked the fact that Moroccan immigrants (many now with Belgian passports) have more than one wife and even acknowledge the lack of rights these "wives" suffer. No wonder that this creates a backlash.

That said I'm absolutely no fan of those extreme nationalists. It's time that the democratic parties stop to shy away from the issue of real integration.

Those who refuse our Western society, our values, our tolerance cannot expect to be welcome here.

This is not about dark skin, smelly kitchens or whiny music... it's about our values. Anyone who cheered the death of Theo van Gogh can't expect to be accepted in our midst.

When publishing facts such as statistical data, Muslim women's statements on the position of women in Islam and the like constitutes "racism," the law has gone berserk. Advocating separate states for Wallonia and Flanders hardly constitutes "racism" either. Note they were not cited for errors, misrepresentation, violence, racism, sedition or anything but "intent" to be racist by publishing such statistics.

One can bet this law will not be applied to Islam, which discriminates against all non-islamics, advocates & perpetrates violence, and is not just racist but genocidal.

Another indication that Eurabia has gone insane. They are destroying legitimate political parties and criminalizing voters for voting for a party they choose.

I might think the Dims are done here, but the party is not being criminalized nor are its members just voting Democratic. It will reform itself or die a natural death because it is out of touch with the electorate.

Belgium has descended a very long staircase here into anti-democratic principles. The Looney Left here and abroad are veering into either a destructive insanity or a vicious totalitarian state of thought control.

#101 Applesweet

You're right. We've got to "Raise some sand" about the whole immigration issue!

Fascism returns to europe?

Maybe not quite, but its certainly headed in that direction.

Somehow I doubt the U.S. is going to want to bail out France & Friends this time.

# zulaby,

This is from a leaflet aimed at primary school, by the "National Anti-Racism Bureau" (heavily subsidized, of course). It's called "So What", literally, because English is considered a "cool" language. The rest needs translation. This is what 12 year olds, who just stopped believing Sinterklaas (similar to Santa Claus) is told.

The Netherlands is a multicultural society. This means that people with different backgrounds and habits live together. This yields a lot. See for yourself.

* Having guestworkers was good for economy
* The Netherlands become much more international because of the new-comers.
* Foreigners have introduced a lot of new music. Just think of salsa, rai, rap and kawina.
* The Netherlands are known for being good at sports thanks to the foreigners. Just think of the successes of colored Dutch in soccer, baseball, athletics and boxing.
* Accupuncture is by now very usual
* Foreign doctors work in a lot of hospitals
* Foreign architects have built very special houses, for example in Amersfoort and Almere
* Because of the multicultural society we can have almost all products of the whole world. Think of any product and you can buy it in the Netherlands. That's why you have a lot more to choose from. Just think about the unbelievable variation in food, music and clothes.
A lot of people can not live anymore without this rich diversity. Think about the awfull situation where you couldn't eat Turkish pizza, Vietnamese loempia, Arabic shoarma, Chinese bami, Surinam chicken-curry bread, Italian ice or French fries with peanutsauce.

It's here, in Dutch.

On now -- Lou Dobbs on "French Hypocrisy" for scalding the US on Iraq then going into Ivory Coast. The show repeats at 4a.m. ET. Next segment on Colin Powell negotiating "non-amnesty amnesty" for immigration-law violators.

mickthemick, yes, I'm painfully aware of being called a Nazi, again. First for being a South African, more recently for being a Jew. Where would the poisoned souls be without the Holocaust. Anyway, I survived that and I'll survive this too. It's painful though and battling the propaganda is tiresome.

Joep, what's going in The Netherlands is a backlash. The torching of mosques is being done by people who are angry with the Muslims for what they've done to van Gogh. That doesn't happen in Israel. The Muslims there are trying to destroy the Jews -- they mass-murder people, entire families, not buildings. I wish I had the time and energy to explain it all to you but if you so desire, Charles has some very informative links.

Myths & Facts Online
A Guide to the Arab-Israeli Conflict

Palestine Facts

Middle East Info

An Engineered Tragedy

Hamas Charter

It pains me that your perception of Israel is so negative. It's a magical place.

#117 mickthemick

Thanks for your welcome! I figured the elite in the EU were trying to blow over the Vlaams Blok base with their decision today to label them racist. But if they do understand the seriousness of the issue (and the unrest of their people), surely European history says "listen." Perhaps this latest ruling was actually a hint to Vlaams Blok to soften some of their stances for better digestion?

some were mere quotes of official statistics on crime rates and social welfare expenditure and another was an article written by a female Turkish-born Vlaams Blok member about the position of women in fundamentalist muslim societies

OMG CHOP OFF THEIR HEADS!

#66 Trespasser

For this I gave up body parts, so assholes like this can give our country away???? W is better than JFK but he's still a jerk when it comes to upholding the laws. It seems to me He swore to uphold all the laws of theland not just the ones he likes. Since when is turning a blind eye toward illegal acts upholding the law. Yeah, He 's doing good in Iraq but he's lousy in defending the border closer to home. I voted for him but had to hold my nose for this reason

Joep, thank you for taking the time to translate that, I appreciate it. What can I say, "multiculturalism" is going to be the death of us all. It's only "racist" if the criticism is directed at Muslims. Anyone and everyone else is fair game. The most hateful lies are uttered under the pretense of "free speech". I'm so conflicted about what is going on in The Netherlands. On one hand I think it's abhorrent that mosques and schools are being set on fire and bombed but on the other, I am pleased that the Dutch are fighting back. The world has gone mad, that's the only thing I know for sure.

Way OT) Thanks to "Inspector Gadget" for the cool shots! Northern Lights seen in Rochester Hills, Michigan taken between 10:30 and 11:00PM on 11/07.

applesweet (#101)

Okay we got our man re-elected. Now let's raise some sand about the borders issue.

Amen. I love a party but it's time to get back to work. Bush has 4 years to make good on our support. Let's see what he's got.

trespasser

At a time when we have seen a majority party in a democratic society taken down by the forces of uncontrolled immigration, we are going to ease security? I figured Powell was behind this, but Ridge supporting it too?

Ridge has been a wimp on illegal immigration, only exceeded by apologist-for-the-lawbreaking Asa Hutchinson. "Homeland Security" has come to mean a finger in the dyke against terrorists, not enforcement of immigration laws. Powell seems to have done a better job of defending this country as a general than as a diplomat.

Time to roll out letters to the White House, Sens & Reps. Reiterate the will of the voters!

Karl Rove never met an illegal alien he didn't like.

zulababy,

thank you for the links. I'll read them carefully. I'm sorry if i pained you by comparing things happening here to what happens in Israel. I do, however, think that setting fire to buildings is just the beginning. Van Gogh was not killed because he had some wrong opinions, he was shot in the legs. After that, Mohammed Bouyeri tried to cut his head off just the way he learned from extremist web sites. Mohammed wanted to die as well. Dutch Intelligence service tells us that he was not one of the 150 extremist muslims they monitor, which probably means there are hundreds, if not thousands of muslims that want to die for their muslim cause. After the killing of Van Gogh, i'm sure there will be just the same suicide bombings in the Netherlands as the ones in israel. It may take a week, or 6 months or 2 years but then it's just the same as the IRA or ETA.

Actually, given the amount of anti-American press that, believe it or not Europe, we in the US DO hear about; it is going to be very difficult to convince Americans to drop any more blood over there. Except possibly for the UK.

#73 Joke -- Irishlas, enjoyed that, thanks for the craic.

I don't know if Vlaams Blok are racist as painted -- this is the story that comes to us through the filter of the same media that declares my Republican party knuckle-draggin non-passport-ownin sister-marryin yada yada you know the bullshit. What minor fraction of this nonsense do we believe, or do we just reject it as a tissue of lies?

I do know that being in any confederation with the French is just unacceptable. Monsieur Le Shaftmonkey screws you every time. It's a bummer in Canada, it's a bummer in Belgium; in Switzerland I guess the Italian speaking part bumps along by ignoring the rest. Inclined to support my Flemish cousins in this, aren't you?

Joep, no apology necessary, I just love Israel so much and want you to know that it's not what you see on the news :-) It's filled with life and love and magic. It's a remarkable country. Bookmark those links and take your time reading them, they're well worth it. I'm sorry for what you're going through now. I'm truly horrified by the death of van Gogh, not only by the way he was so viciously and cruelly murdered but the reason for it too. It's barbaric. To think that somebody can be slaughtered like that in broad daylight -- it's too creepy to think about for long.

Dutch Intelligence service tells us that he was not one of the 150 extremist muslims they monitor, which probably means there are hundreds, if not thousands of muslims that want to die for their muslim cause.

There are thousands of them everywhere, they have sleeper cells all around us. Not just you in The Netherlands and not just in Europe, but in the US too. We are only seeing the beginning of it all now, it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better. But I want to fight back and I want Europe to fight back. I don't want to see Europe turned into an Islamic state and hope that they have the strength (and desire) to prevent that from happening. I've given up on France completely, it will be under shar'ia law. Perhaps the other European countries are watching and thinking that they don't want to see that happening to their country.

zulubaby, today was the cremation of Van Gogh. It was (of course) on national TV. I was so happy they condemned the bombing of an islamic school. That's not fighting back, that just fighting.
Fighting back would be to elaborate on "everyone an say what he wants in a free society". For example, by showing Submission, the last movie by Van Gogh that muslims didn't like because it attacked their believe. Every single broadcasting station that said they would air the movie eventually didn't. They didn't want to "stir up" things. Meaning: they didn't want their throats slit for airing a movie. Freedom of speech has turned into fiction in The Netherlands.

Another thing i haven't mentioned, there are people that have been threatened to be killed that *still* don't get protection by the government. "We cannot protect anyone that sends letters to a newspaper".
For law abiding citizens it is not allowed to carry a gun, btw.

#132 ibu

Ridge and Hutchinson are only carrying out the wishes of their boss. Hutchinson actually had a decent record of voting on immigration when in the House, but he has been a good soldier to Bush, who has never missed an opportunity to benefit Mexicans by screwing Americans.

Sadly, Bush is the best president Mexico ever had. If you think I am exaggerating, see...

The Mexichurian Candidate
[Link: www.vdare.com...]

We are only seeing the beginning of it all now, it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

Please, let it get better after getting worse. For the next five, ten years it will definately get worse over here.

Check out this picture of Van Gogh on the CNN website. Quite flattering, don't you think?

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

Also, since when is a great-grand nephew a "distant" relative? I think being the great-grandson of Theo van Gogh (an important sibling to Vicent) makes you direct. Am I wrong? Am I reading too much MSM bias in this?

#139 Brenda

vdare has lots of good commentators (with links to data, etc.) on illegal immigration. Allan Wall is an American who lives and works legally in Mexico (a teacher) and he always has plenty of choice things to say on Mexican perfidy and hypocrisy -- e.g. to get a Mexican driver's license one must prove Mexican citizenship or legal residence. Dr. Edward Rubenstein is a goldmine of data on the economic impacts on US citizens of illegal alien workers.

Joep,

As a naturalized American from Nederland (emigratred in 1956), I almost cry when I read and see what is happening to the country of my birth. I have had the good fortune to travel to many places during my lifetime and although I have enjoyed a lot of them from Australia to Zuid Africa, from Norwegen to Japan, there is is no place like the "good ole USA" With all our faults and all our problems, there are more "good people" here that truly care than anywhere else that I have ever been. I hope that you can get make it here, you will love it. I am forever grateful to the "Displaced War Persons Act" that allowed my family to emigrate here. I became a citizen while serving in the USNavy and have never regretted it.

#142, SoCal Republican ,

this is exactly the way Theo van Gogh liked to be depicted. The last months of his life he made a movie about the killing of Pim Fortuyn. See www.0605defilm.nl for clips of Theo van Gogh. Especially this.

#142 SoCal Republican

since when is a great-grand nephew a "distant" relative? I think being the great-grandson of Theo van Gogh (an important sibling to Vicent) makes you direct. Am I wrong?

Yes.

"Descent" refers to one's children, children's children, etc. by blood. (Not step-kids, and other relatives by marriage.) Vincent's great-grandson would be direct descent. Vincent's siblings' descendents are collateral relatives (parallel lines, not direct descent).

Joep (#138)

That's not fighting back, that just fighting.

You're right. I think that the anger should be directed at the savages that did this, not at schools. However, someone said that it was not a school, but a place where they were breeding terrorists. Do you know anything about that? I guess what I meant by fighting back is that the only thing that horrified me more than the bombings in Spain was the way the people responded. Roll over and you're doomed. Trying to make nice with terrorists has never worked and never will.

#143 ibu

Yes, I couldn't agree with you more about Vdare.com...

[Link: www.vdare.com...]

I had the opportunity about a month ago to get acquainted with Ed Rubenstein. I thought he did a great job with his recent article about environmental footprints; it was particularly effective coming from such a math wonky kind of guy.

The last I heard of Allan Wall, he was being called up for duty by his National Guard unit, even though he is a legal resident of Mexico. I hope he is well and safe.

#Attilla the Dutchman,

You're not the first telling me i should move to the US. I'm very happy for you there is a country like the US that jews could flee to. It's sad to know that Nederland used to be that place.

"freedom of speech had its limits under tough new anti-racism legislation. "

This is the danger of hate speech legislation: I oppose hate speech but attempts to legislate speech enables abuse like this.

It won't be long before street preaching is illegal in Canada on the grounds it might offend muslims or others. Religous broadcasting is outlawed (though muslim TV is allowed.)

Britain fined a preacher who used the Bible to speak against sexual immorality.

The is why the secular right needs to support religous conservatives, though you might oppose ideas, they need the ideological allies to preserve freedom of speech.

#zulababy

True, it's a muslim school known for being tightly connected to arabic extremist organizations. Though, as terrorists are usually 18-30 years old, it just isn't a good idea to scare the 5-11 year olds that are scared to go to school now. I'm ashamed of the white, non-muslim dutch, who think a good way to respond to the killing of Van Gogh is to start a civil war. That is definately not what Van Gogh would have wanted.

#143 ibu

Actually, the article just posted on vdare a couple hours ago is on the very topic of this thread.

Banned in Belgium
[Link: www.vdare.com...]

Joep (#153)

Though, as terrorists are usually 18-30 years old, it just isn't a good idea to scare the 5-11 year olds that are scared to go to school now.

If they're 18-30 years old then it isn't a school, it's a terrorist training camp or recruitment center and shouldn't be there in the first place. I understand the anger and frustration but it's never a good idea when people take the law into their own hands. Are the police effective there?

Zulababy,

not sure you understood my last message. This islamic school is a primary school, not some training camp.

The Dutch Police.. well what can i say.
Let's just say that the Zeeland (a province) department has been blamed for not handing out enough fines so speeding in that part of the country is not a good idea till next year.

More from Maarten Schenk's Blog

maarten.typepad.com...] target="_blank">

Last Saturday, Belgian TV journalists Coninx and Van Wijck hosted a panel on their TV show to analyze the results of the recent U.S. presidential elections. Guests were Alison Woodward, American sociology professor teaching in Brussels, Tom Naegels, left-leaning columnist, and Karel De Gucht, Belgian Foreign Affairs Minister. I made a transcript of their conversation, so that my American readers may know what is being said about them on Belgian state-funded television. (bittorrent of the segment, 115Mb, in Dutch)

Next time you are wondering where some Europeans get their ideas about America, remember that many of us get nothing but this kind of "information" on our TV screens and in our newspapers.

Read on and marvel at journalist Alain Coninx openly wondering if Americans are "retarded" for being so religious, professor Alison Woodward claiming we have state-churches in Europe and Karel De Gucht, our Foreign Affairs minister, stating that the outside world barely exists for most of middle America. And according to Frieda Van Wijck, the other journalist, most Bush voters cast their ballot out of religious motives...

Key:

VW = Frieda Van Wijck
AW = Alison Woodward
CX = Alain Coninx
DG = Karel De Gucht
TN = Tom Naegels

-------------------------------------------------- --------------

AW: One of the biggest differences between America and Europe is that America is indeed a very religious country. There have been surveys, the European Values Study (?) about the values of people in the world and the Americans are always distinct from the other countries, the developed countries, based on their religion.

CX: We have to be mindfull what we say, but are they a bit retarded? When I hear they don't accept the theory of evolution... Some at least.

DG: What you also have to take into account, is that in America faith has become a consumption article. Many of these churches preach via TV and local stations, which explains why many people regularily change churches. It has become a consumption article, and he who has the most charisma as preacher attracts most members, and they also pay for this. Two thirds of Americans are member of a church, pay for a church. So it is embedded for a part in moral conviction, which also has to do with the closed character of America. America is a very closed country, turned inward, not turned to the outside world. It also has to do with the commercializing of the faith which plays into, in a sort of perfidious way, what is the mainstream undercurrent of the Americans, namely commerce, activity and taking your own initiative. It is really plugged into that.

-------------------------------------------------- -------------
continued-

VW: What I also found surprising is that there were so many people who got their information from the internet. Are good newspapers not available everywhere in the U.S. then?

AW: No, not really. You have seen the large middle part of America that went largely for Bush, and that is also where print-media is not wel represented. The "good" newspapers are on the coasts: the LA Times, the Washington Post, the NY Times. And those are not spread in the middle, except if you have a special subscription. So most newspapers are local products, made with things from the wire services like Reuters or AP and now and then a NYT article. But people don't read "the big news".

DG: And the TV channels (?). CNN is mostly about international politics, but even NBC is way less about international politics, barely even. So in the middle of America, the outside world doesn't exist or hardly. The only thing that exists is their commander in chief that wages war and attacks Afghanistan and Iraq as reprisal for 911. That's the image that lives with the average American. While reality is somewhat more nuanced, of course.

CX: Too little Enlightenment, even there?

DG: Maybe also too little information.

CX: That goes together?

-------------------------------------------------- ------------

VW: How did they then have such a record turnout for this election, Mrs. Woodward?

AW: It has been said that the Republicans have organised an incredible machine during the last eight years. They were already successful in the last elections, and now they have translated this into an enormous organisation, also in the small and middle-size towns in America. It used to be that the Democrats were best in driving up turnout, but now Republicans have also played their (?), with their voters: primarily old people, certainly people of the church. Going to church is the biggest passtime in the U.S.

VW: That was the idea of Karl Rove, Bush's adviser, to go to the evangelicals?

AW: Yes, the so-called architect of the election, with a very organised machine coming from various church-communities and volunteer-centres they have gotten people on the streets and got S.U.V.'s to drive retirees to the ballot box. An impressive machine on the day of the election.

They will never get us.

Time for Belgian(s) to lose the head-like in Holland. Only then they`ll wake up.

Joep, if you're still around, you'll probably be interested in this: Van Gogh murder backlash begins

For all of those lamenting the suppression of the Vlaams Blok - you are aware that the Vlaams Blok were Nazi collaborators during WWII and actively participated in the deportation of Jews, right? Just wanted to make sure we were straight on that before we continue to cheer them on, mKay?

#161
Are you saying the Vlaams Blok invented time travel? They were founded in the 1970ties...

#161 ereshkigal

Not sure where you got your info, but Vlaams Blok has been established in 1978.

#161

As stated by True German Ally in #119,

It's interesting to note how the Vlams Blok has reached out to the Jews of Antwerp. And they see Israel as a bulwark against the Arabs.

I can't possibly imagine any "Nazi collaborators" even contemplating such a thing.

#162 mschenk

www.littlegreenfootballs.com...] target="_blank">

Scroll down to #27 for a concise history of the Vlaams Blok.

Ack. My HTML skills are nonexistent.

Rather than me screwing up another link, cut and paste:

[Link: www.littlegreenfootballs.com...]

The muslim immigrants were allowed into Europe as a result of socialist governments in the 50s and 60s as times economically were good, these socialists did this as some grand experiment and repetence for imagined crimes as colonialists. There were plenty of jobs and so why not?! Muslims spoke French and english. The thing is in Australia they imported a lot of europeans at the same time so it was a case of people leaving for a better life.....eg Greeks.

Of course this boom time was followed by a bust in the 1970s - when the aforementioned muslim immigrants should have been invited to leave.

Another massive myth that permeates this blog and wider discourse is that of "Europe needs more immigrants to help pay taxes for when the natives retire". This is bullshit propaganda that is played out by socialists and socialist government and their allies in the corporate right who want cheaper labour. However in all these studies they mention 2050, 2020 etc....THE MUSLIM IMPORTED WORKERS OF TODAY ARE THE RETIRED MUSLIMS OF TOMORROW. You import workers now - OF COURSE they are going to be retired and will need more workers imported to help the ones already here. Where does this leave native populations??? Well the answer is the right - Vlaams Blok etc. Lastly a few good souls are worried in this thread of alleged neo nazi links/thoughts etc. Well llook at why they were banned a turkish member wrote something about muslim treatment of women. Good luck burying the artificial construct of Belgium.

#165 Spiny Norman

Your inability to imagine it doesn't make it any less true. Google "vlaams blok" and "nazi collaborators". Or any other set of relevant terms in combination with "vlaams blok": WWII, Nazis, Waffen SS.

#161
The Vlaams blok has grown largely because of her jewish electorate in Antwerp.The biggest fault of the Vlaams Blok is that they don't embrace their jewish voters more openly in the press here IMO.
The Vlaams Blok has very concervative views on our society,they want women to become mostly housewives, they want an independent Flanders, are strongly opposed to abortion, want more security/police, etc,etc....
Strangely enough the Vlaams Blok does not receive much criticism for these points in the media or from other parties, if at all.There's of course only criticism agains their only very correct views and the only reason why simple brave people are voting for the Vlaams Blok : their anti-islam standpoints.

#163
There were.The concentration camps were full of them.

Just coming in over the wires now: an anti-terror raid in the Netherlands gone awry; three policemen injured, one seriously; apparently a plot to bomb the Hague and/or the airport in the making. Also, another Islamic school torched last night. More details and a link soon...

#169 ereshkigal

Yea, well, give me some specifics, not inuendo.

You can google 'Leonardo da Vinci Waffen SS' and get 1,530 hits. It does not mean that LdV was the precursor of Nazi/Fasci movements.

Lenin Waffen SS gives you 3,440 hits. The plot thickens.

Once again. Vlaams Blok has been founded in 1978. It means that it as an entity could not have been involved in WWII. As simple as that.

The siege in The Hague continues 500 meters from where I'm sitting. More police has been called in to replace the locals to maintain a perimiter. It is now known that a hand grenade was thrown at the police or was part of a booby trap that exploded on entry. Marines from the Special Assistance Unit (loosely translated) are ready and they normally shoot to kill, hopefully no-one except the terrorists will be hurt.

#169 ereshkigal

...and BTW, Sauwens was a member of Volksunie, not Vlaams Blok.

Pictures of the anti terror raid in The Hague :Here.

BTW It is true that a few ex -Volksunie politicians had radical right-wing views and therfore co-founded and created the Vlaams Blok.But the party were they came from :The Volksunie was always a mildly patriotic pro- Flemish political party that had many leftist views.The Vlaams Blok of today can and will not be compared with nazis ,and nazism.This would absolutely mean suicide for the Vlaams Blok and they know it and they have nothing in common with nazism at all.No matter how conservative or liberal some of the Vlaams Blok views may look,the anti-immigration/islam & security law is possibly the only very believable point they have,Both the Vlaams Blok and the political opponents know this.

For goodness sake - don't mourn Vlaams Blok! My enemy's enemy is not always my friend. There is no need to descend to murky extremism in order to fight the Islamist threat. Unless, of course, you secretly admire the Left's hypocrisy in marching shoulder to shoulder with theocratic murderers.
Time to wise up guys - yes, you've identified the problem (Islamism and the Leftists who act as their apologists and promoters) but you are going to have to be more careful about how you confront and contain it.

The future of Europe is bloody.
Consider: The Dutch are no longer fooled by multiculturalism, they do not wish to see a fanatical religious sect taking over their cities, integration has failed. There is only one way out, and we had a foretaste with the bombing of a (deserted) Islamic Madrasser a few days ago.

#39 model4

So what is it Europe? My take there is that the vast majority of the populace is more left wing, on average, than we are in America.

The difference is that unlike the US, Europe unfortunately has electable socialists. Once elected they then make new "racism" laws to protect the Muslims and it is then impossible to stop the Muslim immigration. The UK also has very strict "racism" laws limiting the freedom of speech.

First it was the fudge-packin' Dutch folding to the [bigoted word]s....

...now it is the Phlegms going spineless and attacking the purveyors of truth in dealing with the IslamoNazis (RoP (tm))...

...boy or boy...you white people in the Low Countries are going to get creamed when the [bigoted word]s start to roll...

...and we in the "States" are not going to help you.....

...either you get rid of the [bigoted word]s or the [bigoted word]s are going to get rid of you...

Sorry to hear comments about us Mexicans. The same way that lefties don't get it about the rest of the Americans, most Americans don't get it about Mexicans. They are still stuck in "sombreros" and that kind of primitive stereotypes. Then talking about Mexican "treachery", the "bloody National Anthem" and so on. It's very sad to be missrepresented so grossly. If ignorance of the way we really are continues like this, we will never be in the same wagon, where we could easily be. That article negates Mexican family values. They don't even have a clue of what they are saying. A couple of examples on the contrary invalidates the 20 plus million Mexican families down here. Right. Very objective. Abortion is not even an issue in Mexico, because of the strong family values, just to give you an example. Bush gets bashed because (the same as in Iraq) he sees further than a lot of people and he knows that a partnership with Mexico is very healthy for the US. Would you rather have an enemy population next door to the South? We are so bad, so dangerous that millions of us are living among you and there are no bombings, no terrorism, or the like. If we were muslims then you should be praying. But we are Westerners, Christians, we have a civilization that most Americans don't even care to learn about. All you see is "brownies" as that article calls us (I'm a 100% white for your great disappointment, and so are another 15 million Mexicans), servants, tequila and the works. I could go on and on, but to summe it up, most Americans understand Mexicans just as good as the left wing extremists in the States understand people who voted for Bush. Hope that gives you an idea. And the left is going to have a hard time for living so out of reality, right? Well, same here. Try to learn a bit more about the real Mexicans and not the stereotypes and missconceptions. Sorry for the rant.

Well, that didn't take long.

$325,000 per year?

If every LGFer contributed $10...

Naw, that would be too Zuniga-esque.

#180 MigueldowninMexico:

Mexicans don't smash planes into buildings. Canada is supposedly the most multicultural of all countries and the ONLY immigrant grouping I and most Canadians are wary of are Muslims. Russians? No problem. Indians? Check. Mexicans and Central Americans? Hola, amigos. Unless they are adherents of jihad. There are some white, born-in-Canada jihadists (converts). They are just as much a problem as the Yemenese immigrant.

Any political party which is plain old "anti-immigrant" is leaning a tad too far into brownshirt territory for me. "Anti-Islamofascist" is the dircetion we should take. In Canada we have not made that distinction (nor has the US to a large degress--guess who funds 3,000 US mosques?) and therefore anyone who cautions about allowing concentrations of jihad-generating Muslim populations is lumped in with the old-fashioned Aryan Nations types (who are as bad as the jihadists in the long run).

Arab-European League

AEL condemns attack on Faluja and salutes "resistance "

Arab Nationalist fighters will fight to Death in Ramadi

Prizewinner writer supports Iraqi "resistance"

Roy called on people to 'become the Iraqi resistance'

#157

I read that too and wondered why it was OK for the Dutch commentator to speculate on American religious types as possibly being "retarded" while any critical speech directed at Isalmicists who want to destroy your entire civilization would be intolerable.

#185 Armytramp

Why do they embrace the deathcult over their own civilization? It's the Stockholm syndrome gripping the West--you identify with your oppressor more than with your own culture...it's suicidal.

GW Bush won't let us commit suicide without a fight for our principles.

#180 MigueldowninMejico

Hola Miguel, and before you characterize all Americans as being clueless about your country and its "family values," let me tell you many of us are very familiar with your biggest export to us: People who apparently have no future in your own country, and are therefore self exiled non-English learning, Spanish-speaking but still illiterate young people who migrate north, break laws to sneak into our country, and many of whom join gangs and some who commit crime to support themselves.

I doubt any of these poor Spanish speaking kids on our streets, landscaping, laying bricks & chopping vegetables in our economy had access to the internet as you do, much less any prospect of learning to read in your own country, where your unions let teachers buy their jobs and then not show up to teach your citizens.

Your country's falling down on the job of providing a future for your own people so the US ends up propping up your economy on the backs of these poor people who send you their made-in-the USA "remittances" but get nothing in return.

Don't blame us for not being up on your lousy internal situation, we're busy feeding your countrymen and defending people's right to freedom worldwide.

#187 alegrias

A little known fact in the US: Mexico is rich. It has the highest GDP in Latin America, highest GDP per capita in Latin America and nearly half of the billionaires in Latin A.

The wealthy ruling class finds it cheaper to export their illiterate peasants north rather than pay to build necessary infrastructure and educate the population. Mexico taxes itself at half the rate of Brazil so they can't even pay their police a living wage.

America's lax immigration policy is keeping Mexican billionaires fat and happy.

Documentation and details:

MEXICO IS RICH
[Link: www.limitstogrowth.org...]

I consider Vlaams Blok's politics to be far more repulsive than some on this thread - they have to be pretty bad for even Charles to give them a little dig.

But banning political parties is wrong, unless they openly call for the overthrow of the state and the imposition of a dictatorship, as the Islamist parties in Algeria did in 1992. Vlaams Blok doesn't even get close to that standard. The way to fight parties like Vlaams Blok is with ideas, not repressive laws.

Vlaams Blok is a neo-Fascist Party like the British National Front and France's Le Pen. Difference between them and Vlaams is that Vlaams was smart enough to see that by drooping its anti-Jewish and anti-non-White stance and concentrate on Anti-Moslem propaganda, it will broaden its appeal and become more respectable. It should be noted that Vlaams is still a collection of bigots however much they have put on a new similey face. However I agree with Gordon Vlaams should not be banned, that just makes them matyrs for free speech and broadens their appeal. Proper way to fight ideas you do not like is with other ideas and let the people decide. That is what democracy is all about.

#190 - Davidall -did you read the article??? Nice try at slamming people for wanting to preserve their heritage. It says that a turkish female member wrote an article .....A TURKISH FEMALE!!

Therefore they aren't quite so BNP as you would have us believe......