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 RetweetHearts and Minds

By: Charles Johnson • Dec 16, 2004 at 8:06 pm PST

Go read this post at BlackFive from a Marine Gunnery Sergeant in Iraq, and know that we have friends: The Heart of America.

As you know, I asked for toys for the Iraqi children over here and several people (Americans that support us) sent them over by the box. On each patrol we take through the city, we take as many toys as will fit in our pockets and hand them out as we can. The kids take the toys and run to show them off as if they were worth a million bucks. We are as friendly as we can be to everyone we see, but especially so with the kids. Most of them don’t have any idea what is going on and are completely innocent in all of this.

On one such patrol, our lead security vehicle stopped in the middle of the street. This is not normal and is very unsafe, so the following vehicles began to inquire over the radio. The lead vehicle reported a little girl sitting in the road and said she just would not budge. The command vehicle told the lead to simply go around her and to be kind as they did. The street was wide enough to allow this maneuver and so they waved to her as they drove around.

As the vehicles went around her, I soon saw her sitting there and in her arms she was clutching a little bear that we had handed her a few patrols back. Feeling an immediate connection to the girl, I radioed that we were going to stop. The rest of the convoy paused and I got out the make sure she was OK. The little girl looked scared and concerned, but there was a warmth in her eyes toward me. As I knelt down to talk to her, she moved over and pointed to a mine in the road.

Immediately a cordon was set as the Marine convoy assumed a defensive posture around the site. The mine was destroyed in place.

It was the heart of an American that sent that toy. It was the heart of an American that gave that toy to that little girl. It was the heart of an American that protected that convoy from that mine. Sure, she was a little Iraqi girl and she had no knowledge of purple mountain’s majesty or fruited plains. It was a heart of acceptance, of tolerance, of peace and grace, even through the inconveniences of conflict that saved that convoy from hitting that mine. Those attributes are what keep Americans hearts beating. She may have no affiliation at all with the United States, but she knows what it is to be brave and if we can continue to support her and her new government, she will know what it is to be free. Isn’t that what Americans are, the free and the brave?

If you sent over a toy or a Marine (US Service member) you took part in this. You are a reason that Iraq has to believe in a better future.

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211 comments

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1 zulubaby  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:10:47pm

This just melted my heart.

2 LSD  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:11:24pm

damn.

3 On the Mark  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:13:05pm

Absolutely WOW! Thanks for sharing this one.

4 oceanfire  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:13:32pm

That is an awesome story. I'm glad and so proud of that little girl!

5 Bad Doggy  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:14:49pm

Let's see the MSM do a story on this.


Oh wait that would mean actually being fair and balanced, my bad.

6 tripletdad  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:15:08pm

That's really cool, and this is probably the only place I'll hear about it.

7 earth56  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:16:47pm

Now that is worth all the gold in the world. I would please ask everyone else to e-mail this to every news organization you know...even if a few actually read it on the airwave.

8 Sean  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:18:51pm

MSM? Who cares? It's going all around the globe without them!

Pajamadeen rule!

9 Michael in SC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:20:34pm

"As you know, I asked for toys for the Iraqi children over here and several people (Americans that support us) sent them

I wonder who those were...

10 Oktober  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:23:00pm

Can we carpet bomb cities using teddy bears instead of bombs? do we have that capability?

11 ThomasAgee  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:24:41pm

Read thus on Blackfive, heartily recommend him & 2Slick if you like milbloggers, also Mudville Gazette &, well just follow the links on their homepages.

The U.S. servicemembers over there are doing a helluva job, and have some damn fine blogs too !

12 Dagenham  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:25:08pm
Isn’t that what Americans are, the free and the brave?


No. Cowardly and stupid, well the red states anyway

/moonbat off

Great post Charles. If leftists didn't donate to the Spirit of America Blogger Challenge because they "didn't trust right-wing America" more fool them. Every LGFer who did should big up their chest rightabout now. Atrios et al., please FOAD. A teddy-bear to an Iraqi kid is worth far far more than some protest poetry or a BusHitler costume...

Thank you.

13 Kafirus Maximus  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:25:33pm

Great story, won't see that one from the acursed evil MSM.

14 AtlasShrugged  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:31:36pm

G-d love those boys...they will make it happen

15 Catttt  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:32:48pm

Oh my goodness! I am as close to crying as I get.

Time to go get beanie babies and send them along.

Thanks for this post.

16 carefulnow  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:33:12pm

Our boy scouts organized and sent out toys for the Iraqi children; I sent this story to the committee chair to be distributed.

Truly bread upon the waters...

17 ajackson  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:33:41pm

Great story. If the MSM won't step up to the plate, it's up to us. I cut and pasted this into an e-mail (along with the link back to Blackfive) and sent it to a bunch of my friends.

18 Pamela  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:35:33pm

It has been a great week for me personally but this is far and above anything that happened to me this week.


tears of joy, this is an example of the beauty in the world.

19 Luigi  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:37:03pm

O'Reilly had a person named Heather Mac Donald from the Manhattan Institute. She basically told him liberals are against immigration enforcement because they believe this is a racist country and we don't have the right to keep anybody out for any reason.

I believe that, too. Our immigration enforcement these days is based on self-hatred.

20 ctomrun  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:37:38pm

Outstanding story! What a little kindness will do.

21 TheElephantMan  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:38:09pm

Charles,

If you keeping posting all this heartwarming stuff, you might distract from the message that this is a war for oil, our soldiers are cowards, and that the Iraqis hate us...

You might even put Kos out of business.

Praying to that.

22 Elcid  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:38:21pm

How can anyone say what we are doing Iraq and Afghanistan, is wrong?

How can anyone say, having women treated with dignity and giving them their rightful place at the table, replacing rape rooms, burkas, killing fields, torture chambers, with toys, books and their chance at freedom are wrong?

How can anyone say, replacing the horrors of watching your parents or parents watching their children, being killed for no reason, with hope, a hand, a toy, a smile and a determination of that countries future in peace, is wrong?

It has cost us, as well as other Nations greatly, in the loss and injury of our fine young men and women under arms and in money. All those men and women are still in harms way, but we are giving 50,000,000 plus people the chance to see their children, smile, grow, prosper.

How, HOW can that be wrong?

23 William  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:38:43pm

Here's where you can donate toys, or money (probably easier) to the troops:

[Link: operationgive.org...]
 

24 justdanny  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:43:33pm

Reminds me of a story a family member told me with tears in his eyes after his tour in Bosmia.

Children crowded the area around a temporary control facility he worked and lived at for a few months. He thought of them everytime he got a package from home and would go out and share homemade goodies with the children.

As time went on he began collecting things from the other soldiers to give the children. Eventually he set up a drop off point inside the facility for soldiers to collect and distribute items to the kids outside.

Before long soldiers were writing home for family members to send specific things the children needed.

Soon the soldiers began noticing the area around the control faility getting cleaner. The children, as a way to repay the soldiers, without being asked, began taking care of the area around the facility. My family member told me how with the sound of heavy guns cracking in the distance, a few small children rolled a heavy fifty gallon drum to a spot where it could be used to dump the trash they collected.

Occasionally a parent would show up with home cooked dishes for the soldiers. A community was being formed around the kindness of US soldiers. A community of respect and caring for one another.

I have no doubt had any of these children seen a plot being layed to hurt the soldiers, they would have done exactly as this young girl did.

So horrible that eventually the cults of hate infect childrens minds. The innocent child becomes the guilty carrier of the virus that knows only killing and ignorance.

The entire loving universe is out here for that wonderful little girl. It is sad beyond words that she was unfortunate enough to be born in a place that will never grant her an opportunity to dance carelessly in that loving universe of freedom.

25 be the meat  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:46:13pm

Chin, chin...

I wish all Iraqi's were as opened minded as this young women..

26 Catttt  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:51:16pm

28 pages of good news from Iraq (pdf)

They're even trying to reverse the catastrophic damage Saddam did to the southern marshlands.

27 WarBicycle  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 6:55:26pm

That little girl will remember that act of kindness for the rest of her life.

28 DocDublU  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:02:50pm

OT

Big Unit to the Yanks
Shawn Green and Brad Penny to the DBacks
Dodgers get sh*t

Sounds great to me.

29 RightDad  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:04:41pm

A miracle in a simple Teddy Bear...Every night my 4 and 6 year old daughters remember to pray for the safety of our soldiers...God answers prayers and I can't wait to tell them this story.
Sure would be nice to see this on the MSM...but I am glad I saw it here.

30 Phil.  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:05:18pm

#22 Elcid

How, HOW can that be wrong?

It's simple. Their position isn't derived from logic. It is derived from intense hatred of the President. The so-called "progressive" movement has become so hateful that they have become disgusting human beings in my view. Go read the posts at Atriosor Daily Kos. At this point, my antipathy for them is not due to politics - I strongly dislike them as people. I think those who actually bother to fester there at this point are basically miserable and hateful human beings.

Just like Ted Rall, this is no longer about politics, this is personal. I personally do not like any of the members of the moonbat Left. They've had plenty of time to come to their senses and abandon the Michael Moore wing of their party, but I was told as recently as today that doing something so horrible as trying to promote democracy in Iraq is criminal, even if it were done without war.

The left no longer cares about democracy. It is anti-Bush no matter what is he is for, and damn the consequences. How else could one explain the Nation pining for the Orange Revolution to fail because Yushenko's wife "worked for Reagan" as one Nation columnist reported.

Worked for Reagan?! The horror! Better to have an old Soviet authoritarian steal the election apparently.

31 zulubaby  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:05:51pm

justdanny, how beautiful.

32 justdanny  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:06:18pm

#22 Elcid

How can anyone say what we are doing Iraq and Afghanistan, is wrong?

Because they do not care. Because they are only concerned with their utopian hallucinations. Because they think if they can get along with their neighbor, than anyone can get along with anyone at anytime with no effort whatsoever.

How can anyone say, having women treated with dignity and giving them their rightful place at the table, replacing rape rooms, burkas, killing fields, torture chambers, with toys, books and their chance at freedom are wrong?

Because these are parts of the culture of those people, and if they did not want them, they would not have them. Its very simple. We have no right to care. We have no right to act like we care. We have no right to pretend we care. We don't really care. Many of those people are brown. How could we possibly care about brown people. We have no right to judge their violent customs. Why? Because many Americans are fat and white and drive big trucks, thats why.

How can anyone say, replacing the horrors of watching your parents or parents watching their children, being killed for no reason, with hope, a hand, a toy, a smile and a determination of that countries future in peace, is wrong?

None of that matters, see, those kids dont watch 6 hours of tv a day and wear $100 sneekers. So surely they dont even exist to fat truck driving white under-educated backwards Americans. Americans don't know anything or care anything about anybody, remeber?

It has cost us, as well as other Nations greatly, in the loss and injury of our fine young men and women under arms and in money. All those men and women are still in harms way, but we are giving 50,000,000 plus people the chance to see their children, smile, grow, prosper.

No no no. Where did you hear that? We are'nt there to help them, we're their to make them like us so that McDonalds and Wal MArt can make a bigger profit. Americans are not humans, don't forget that. We are the worst group of humans that have ever existed. We are ignorance squared. We are laziness squared. We are heartless and blind. Look at us. We are so white and so stupid. The hellishness of Islamic culture is superior to all others because it is not democratic, it is not advanced. It is closer to socialism and communism which we all know are the answers to all the problems with humanity. We wear red and bright green and listen to loud music and laugh almost every day. How the hell can we possibly know anything about anything.

How, HOW can that be wrong?

Its not wrong. You know it, I know it, almost every person who reads this will know it. I believe we all here would rather be penniless and homeless here in America than wealthy beyond measure in any of those countries. But I bet the liberals don't feel that way. They'd take key holder of the rape room in a minute given the choice of that or without a roof here.

33 be the meat  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:07:22pm

If they can't hold elextions in a resonably civil fashion...the elextions will be held for them.

Thank you very much U.S. Marines and Co.

We are behind you.

34 foreign devil  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:08:00pm

Because the marines had given the little girl the toy days earlier, she returned the gift by saving their lives. He didn't write that in the story but had she not received that gift, it might not have occurred to her to do what she did, a very dangerous, brave thing to do, indeed. G*d Bless her and the soldiers and G*d Bless whoever sent that gift and all the others.

35 Iron Fist[deleted]  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:11:50pm
36 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:13:03pm

/Taking a moment to shill for anysoldier.com and the other websites for our troops.

If reading about this almost makes you cry then go and scour your house NOW and I promise you before you know it you'll have put together a package to send to our troops that they'll just treasure. Lots of the troops are requesting toys and clothes for the children in Iraq and Afghanistan, school supplies, food that reminds them of home, DVD's, CD's AND A LETTER!

Now, come on. We've all got this sort of stuff cluttering up our homes. So, you'll clean up the home for the holidays AND make a service member happy.

That's called WIN/WIN.

JUST DO IT!

/shill off

37 Phil.  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:14:00pm

Oh and to add one more thing. This is just my belief and nothing more but it is based on extensive evidence and experience that I've had debating with LLL's. This is no longer about the war really. This is about ego and about being right in the end. The LLL's do not want to see democracy in Iraq simply because it would prove them wrong. This whole thing is an ego booster for them. Much of the LLL's suffer from excessive narcissism so rooting for their own country to fail just so they will "be right" is not beneath them.

It's an indefensible position of course and one that cost them the election. But they still maintain it for personal, not political reasons. I don't think they oppose democracy in Iraq per se, but their ego gets the best of them. If Iraqi democracy flourishes, it proves all of the LLL's argument wrong. They would rather it fail and have their egos stroked than root for what's best for the country.

38 justdanny  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:16:30pm

zulubaby

That made me cry picturing that little girl. I've seen defiance like that in a niece or two down through the years, but usually thats because she doesnt want to leave or doesnt want to do something she has been asked to do. We have all seen that.

But what that little Iraqi girl was doing it, as a show of defiance against those who are killing American Soldiers and the future of Iraq, is just chilling to me. I cried for five minutes before I could write a word.

And yes, those horrible US soldiers do get home, and sit with their uncles, and cry ugly faced tears, about the kids they saw. And then, amazingly enough, they go back again and again to different parts of the world and are crushed in their hearts by other kids in other countries who are innocent and precious, and dieing slowly from the unfortunate fate of being born in a bad place.

39 Rancher  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:17:00pm

Brianstien showed us this on Sgt. Peralta's thread. This is so amazing I had trouble believing it. Then justdanny gives us another example. Y'all melting my cynical heart.

40 zulubaby  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:21:56pm

justdanny, it restores the faith, doesn't it?

41 Barbara Skolaut  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:21:57pm

Beautiful. Thank you for posting this, Charles.

I'm so grateful my great-howmany-ever-grandparents got on those boats. It is a blessing and a privilege to be an American.

And the American military is a gift to free people everywhere.

Thank you and all your compatriots, Gunney. You and yours truely are the greatest friends of all.

42 Pamela  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:25:05pm

#36 Irene NYC


exactly, scouring everyday. I have a large Boyds Bear collection, gathering all my smaller ones that are pocket sized and donate them to the kids of Iraq. I also been on ebay looking at lots of Beanie Babies. ebay also has many lots (as in group of items) of toiletries too that many soldiers request.


My husband and I are spending most of the Chrismtas bonus money sending packages to the troops and the children of Iraq.

43 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:40:57pm

#42 Pamela

LOL! So are we (or almost!). I was ripping books out of my husband's hands (some of his old favorites on the premise that if he loved them so would our troops). I got my family and friends involved and it's been great.

If anyone out there is thinking of sending out a package to our troops, BEWARE! It becomes highly addictive, life takes on a new purpose - and lo! - you actually start to BELIEVE again. (Oh dear, I'm not supposed to say things like that anymore, am I?)

Don't say I didn't warn you.

44 Asher Abrams  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:50:06pm

30-37/Phil

Exactly! You've got it. I feel the same way about these nitwits.

45 Rancher  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:53:49pm

Goddessoftheclassroom showed us this link, again on Sgt. Peralta’s thread, on how to determine who needs what where. And don’t be sending stuff till after Christmas because units will be overloaded with packages.

46 justdanny  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:57:22pm

zulubaby

I feel 'blessed' to know so many good men who serve and have served our country. I guess I'm their scratching post because they always seem to get emotional when they tell me about things they've seen and done. And everyone of them have told me about the children.

But I have no faith that we can turn around any part of that part of the world. I have no faith in Middle Easterners to reform their cultures. I have no faith in our ability to turn them around. But in American soldiers and innocent Middle Eastern children, yes, tons of faith.

Were I king, I would not be fighting this war the way it is being fought. I would be fighting to contain the whole region. Shut it off from the rest of the world. Break all ties with it and enforce its seclusion from the non Islamic world. And then I'd sit and watch as it caved in on itself.

How many years did Saddam rule and no Iraqi raised his head to kill the evil filth ?

How many years has the mullah regime rulked and no Iranian has risen to kill it ?

How long will the West Bank and Gaza go with filth at its leadership while no "palestinian" raises a hand to challenge it ?

All these Islamic dictatorships go unchallenged by their own prisoners. All of them have the approval by the inactive revolt of their citizens, to do as they wish to their own and abroad.

Islam cannot be healed. It must be cutoff and contained. Cordaned off and isolated.

47 ferris  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:58:45pm

The next time I see some crazy ass jihadi and I think that we should just drop a couple of nukes and get it over with, I will think of this little girl and calm down.

In so many ways America's best ambassadors our servicemen and women. They truly represent the best of what we as a nation are...selfless (despite what the LLLs will have you think this is THE most generous nation on Earth), caring and hopeful.

Our soldiers and Marines could write home and ask for anything to make their lives better but what do they send for? Toys for children. What other army in the world sends such men and women into the world? None.

They will kill those who are too far gone in their hatreds to be redeemed but they will show tenderness and offer hope to those who will accept it.

We will drag the middle east and Islam kicking and screaming in to the modern, decent world. The politicians, businessmen and diplomats will celebrate this achievement at some point and congratulate themselves for all they have done. But the real credit will go to our servicemen and women who are changing the world one child, one street and one city at a time.

48 Rancher  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 7:59:47pm

Oops, Irene NYC, I was reading to fast to notice you mentioned anysoldier.com in your post. Hat tip.

49 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:02:53pm

#48 Rancher

Yes, but you provided the link. ;)

50 Rancher  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:06:11pm

Justdanny, don't be so cynical. Listen to ferris because if we don’t succeed then we will be nuked sooner rather than later. Unfortunately we will be nuked.

51 RayH  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:13:00pm

That was absolutely beautiful. I hope that the jihadis don't
punish her for what she did. Word of what she did was sure to have been spread and those bastards will kill anybody for any reason.

52 Iron Fist[deleted]  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:15:19pm
53 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:16:23pm

Okay kids, a little perspective and history here.

Baghdad was a pretty sophisticated city before Saddam. Beirut was too before the civil war. Both of these were diverse and tolerant societies (especially compared to what came later).

It's very easy to sit here relatively safely in the U.S. and bemoan the "fact" that the Muslim masses did not rise up against Saddam and the other dictators.

Well, guess what? THEY DID and they were slaughtered like lambs. Which, incidentally, may be part of the reason that the Shi'ia in Iraq are a little dubious about American motives.

I understand your frustration, we are ALL frustrated. But, I would suggest doing something constructive (like reading some history). I'm not lecturing here, just giving a friendly tip. ;)

54 Rancher  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:24:28pm

First, because of your damn rule this will probably be my last post. Second, how do we know where a suitcase nuke came from. Sure we can identify where the fissionable material came from, but if it came from Russia that doesn't mean the Russians nuked us, only that their stuff was sold to somebody else.

55 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:28:18pm

#54 Rancher

What "rule" are you referring to that would probably make this your last post?

56 justdanny  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:34:20pm

Rancher

I believe I am being a realist. I support President Bush and our troops in what they have done and are doing in Afghanistan and in Iraq. I support strikes against Irans nuclear facilities. I would support military actions in a few other countries in that region. We are punishing them.

Irene NYC

I feel I have an unusually good understanding of the region. I do not come to these conclusions from a lack of knowledge. In fact, it is through my many relationships with residents of the region that I have been persuaded into my fatalistic view. Befriend a few tens of Middle Easterners and listen to them. They live in a 'hell' that grows hotter every day.

Today is December 17th 2004. Those "great" places of old are'nt sitting somehwere waiting to be reassembled.

57 Rancher  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:35:35pm

Exactly. I meant to preface that post with #52 Iron Fist. The Iron Fist rule states that if you think you’re too drunk to post then you probably are. Too drunk. What? Oh yeah, too drunk. I’m not as think as you drunk I am. Good night lizards.

58 MagnaniomousCoward  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:38:38pm

I'm sorry, but I call urban legend untill we get some more details about this.

Nice story though.

59 Wuptdo  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:40:55pm

Well that certainly brought a tear to this old sailor's eye. Many Thanks!

60 Catttt  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:43:01pm

OT
Apostates of Islam - site created by ex-Moslems

We are ex-Muslims. Some of us were born and raised in Islam and some of us had converted to Islam at some moment in our lives. We were taught never to question the truth of Islam and to believe in Allah and his messenger with blind faith. We were told that Allah would forgive all sins but the sin of disbelief (Quran 4:48 and 4:116). But we committed the ultimate sin of thinking and questioned the belief that was imposed on us and we came to realize that far from being a religion of truth, Islam is a hoax, it is hallucination of a sick mind and nothing but lies and deceits.

and from the FAQ:

Do you hate Muslims? No we don't, but we do hate Islam, because it hates us and non-Muslims and threats peace on Earth.
Typical Muslims do not know and do not want to know that Islam is evil; they only see the good points in Islam. For fear of hellfear and the fear of losing the chance to get big breasted women with large eyes, they will not see the truth, no matter how much sense it may make.

Good stuff about the Qu'ran, Mohammed, and other Islam issues. The site deals strictly with Islam as false. It is in no way religious, although some of the ex-Moslems are now believers in other religions. Most members seem to think that all religions are false but that Islam is DANGEROUS.

61 Troy Rochford  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:43:51pm

1 zulubaby

This just melted my heart.

Hi honey! I'm back from the dead!

Speaking of melting your heart, check your email. ;-)

T

62 ibu guru  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:45:36pm

Love is a much greater power than hate. Clearly this little girl had not been poisoned by some of the hatred around her and responded to love and generosity with a caring of her own. This is a wonderful little miracle worth telling & retelling everywhere.

I've gotten hung up on [Link: anysoldier.com...] myself. Read through post after post until I found a small unit that just seemed most in need. In the past 3-4 weeks, I've sent 6 small packages, one larger one, plus a envelope full of Christmas cards, one for each soldier in the unit. Keep checking back to see if the contact has gone on line again (he has, once, with a photo). Have another little package ready to go. It's addictive, and one can come to feel a bit possessive - and protective, perhaps mother-hen-ish -- praying for a group of soldiers and their contact.

Next, I'm looking for little toys to send them.

63 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 8:52:23pm

Justdanny

I was just trying to gently make the point to you that Iraqis did
try to rise up against Saddam Hussein. So, when you wrote,

"How many years did Saddam rule and no Iraqi raised his head to kill the evil filth?"

that indicated that, notwithstanding all your acquaintances, you might benefit from some historical context.

There is a video of the first parliament meeting when Saddam took control. Have you seen it? One by one, parlimentarians are called up and lead out to their death. You can hear the firing squads and see the reaction inside. That was day one of his regime. There is no video footage that I am aware of covering the slaughter of the Shi'ia after GWI, but there are many newspaper accounts as this is all within recent memory. Then, of course, there is also the case of the Iraqi Kurds who were gassed for the sin of existing (FYI The New Yorker had an excellent article on this).

These regimes rule by terror. Saddam took a few cues from Stalin and his other totalitarian predecesors. And it is really not easy to resist these regimes, especially if the world has taught you for the last 30 years that they don't care, don't want to know, and can't be bothered.

64 justdanny  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:12:00pm

These regimes did not rise to power because of neglect from the west. These are tribalistic societies. Brutality in leadership is a signature of theirs.

Yes, I know all about the Shia uprising after GW1 and I know all about Saddam killing his way to the top. And how this forgives the tens of millions of men who could have continued the assault on Saddam, I dont understand.

The point is this. The people do not want rid of the dictators bad enough to get rid of them. Thats the point I was trying to make. And for this, I believe the only recourse the civilized world has is to barricade them in and let them have what they obviously do not dislike enough to stop.

We'll have to agree to disagree on who is responsible for the decades long dictatorships all over the ME. I don't believe it is the fault of the world. I believe it is the fault of the citizens in those countries. Some choose to live on their knees instead of dieing on their feet. I say, if that is a choice they can live with, let them have it.

Couple of things before I go to bed. I'm not a "kid". You don't have to "gently" spoon feed me your opinion. You have a few good points, but your delivery is for shit.

Night minions.

65 Irene NYC  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:17:36pm

Justdanny

If you're not a "kid" than don't behave like one. Try expanding your world and your horizons.

As for my delivery, at the very least, it's polite, which is more than can be said for yours.

66 Grafton  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:21:20pm

#58 Yeah. Note there are no details about who, where, when. This seems like an absolutely typical urban legend aka made-up nonsense. Those who are proud of their critical thinking, ask yourself, if this is true, why has the author done his best to not verify the story?

This is the kind of incident that, were it true, would have been told by clearly indentifiable sources. Why not? Note that the 'patrol' stopped and cordoned off the 'mine', etc etc. There would be pictures of the little girl, etc etc.

No, this is BS. And there will be no followup to 'prove' this story.

67 Uhller Isshaytan  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:23:53pm

OT

Church vilified Muslims: ruling
December 17, 2004

I just heard (on the radio) the pastor Danny Nalliah say that each time they tried to quote from the koran, the Islamic Council jumped up to object that "out of context quotes were defamatory to islam" and the judge accepted this.

Further, this action was instigated by someone from the Equal Opportunity Commission (a muslim I think) sending two muslims to the Christian meeting as spies.

Uhller Isshaytan
...
AN evangelical Christian ministry has been found to have vilified Islam during a seminar and in a newsletter which mocked the religion.

The Victorian Civil and Administrative Tribunal (VCAT) today blasted the Catch the Fire Ministries, its pastor Danny Nalliah and speaker Daniel Scot over the March 2002 seminar in Melbourne and several articles in the church's newsletter.

In a decision handed down today in a key test of Victoria's three-year-old racial and religious vilification laws, Judge Michael Higgins found in favour of the Islamic Council of Victoria, which took the action against Catch The Fire.

In a summary of reasons for his decision, Judge Higgins said Pastor Scot had throughout the seminar made fun of Muslim beliefs and conduct.

"It was done, not in the context of a serious discussion of Muslims' religious beliefs," Judge Higgins said.

"It was presented in a way which is essentially hostile, demeaning and derogatory of all Muslim people, their God, Allah, the prophet Mohammed and in general Muslim religious beliefs and practices."

Judge Higgins said that, during the seminar, Pastor Scot had claimed that the Koran promoted violence, killing and looting and that Muslims were liars and demons.

Pastor Scot also had said Muslims had a plan to overrun western democracy by violence and terror and wanted to turn Australia into an Islamic nation, and he exaggerated Muslim population numbers in Australia.

"I find that Pastor Scot's conduct was not engaged in reasonably and in good faith for any genuine religious purpose or any purpose that is in the public interest," he said.

in full

68 lindsayg  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:29:18pm
69 Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:54:40pm

We were looking for liberal blogs donating to Spirit of America.


Aziz Poonwalla may or may not be a liberal, but he is a democratic activist and a Muslim - and his blog is collecting for Spirit of America.

70 Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 9:59:14pm

I should have capitalized "Democratic" I meant an activist in the Democratic party.

71 ibu guru  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 10:02:03pm

#67

I hope this ruling is appealed and overturned. Perhaps on the basis that the judge was biased. What a crock full of cr**!

72 EIDE_Interface  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 10:09:26pm

we can't win hearts and minds because we're bombing them, and it's all Bushitler's fault!

FOAD to Atrios and Kos.

73 EIDE_Interface  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 10:10:05pm

sorry meant to have a:

/moonbat, but it was swallowed due to an angle bracket...

74 garnier  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 10:14:21pm

surprised that no one has pointed out the obvious: toys like teddy bears and dolls are unislamic. the height of idolotry, in fact.

all the more reason to pass them out, i guess, but its funny that many of our soldiers are probably unaware of how subversive their actions are.

the prohibition of "graven images" muslims plagiarized from the jews extends, in islam, to anything anthropomorphic (doll), zoomorphic (teddy bear), or phytomorphic (no problem here as only a few children wish to play with artificial plants).

who ever thought a teddy bear could be so dangerous?

75 Uhller Isshaytan  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 10:18:46pm

#71
ibu guru,

The pastor said that they had spent A$300,000 on legal expenses so far. I hope that they have funds or donations come in for an appeal.

The idiot hosting the afternoon talkback on 3AW said that it we were fighting terrorism by a few extremist muslims who had hijacked islam.

76 Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 11:08:01pm

74 garnier

Funny that the zoomorphic (teddy bear) is illegal, but the zoophilic (fucking animals) is sanctioned.

Come to think of itl, the teddy (Fredrick's of Hollywood) is also unislamic.

Does anyone know the reasoning behind making representational art illegal - or does it just come down to some insane egomaniac dictator going "Only pictures of me, your great god king will be allowed"

77 Uhller Isshaytan  Thu, Dec 16, 2004 11:15:50pm

#67#71#75

Re evangelists fined for insulting islam in Australia

A better account is here :

[Link: www.cnsnews.com...]

78 ajaxlikid  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 12:57:25am

Awesome story.

OT
***
Another good news from the most perforated border in the world

Gaza smuggling tunnel collapses, trapping 5

- Ahmed, bring on explosives. We're gonna open the tunnel to let them out.
- Uh, Tariq, explosives are inside the tunnel...

79 vftokyo  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 1:00:25am

OT

More troubles with jordyptian workplace safety standards.

Gaza Smuggling Tunnel Collapses, Trapping 5

too bad so sad!

80 The Big Guy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 1:42:43am

#74 garnier

the prohibition of "graven images" muslims plagiarized from the jews extends, in islam, to anything anthropomorphic (doll), zoomorphic (teddy bear), or phytomorphic (no problem here as only a few children wish to play with artificial plants).

My understanding was that that only applied to things that had souls, i.e. humans. It sounds to me like you're saying every living thing has a soul, according to Islam.

If that's true, than why is it permissable, under Islam, for a prepubescent child to play with dolls, like Aisha did?

Of course, if that is true, why are the Islamic terrorists so keen on being videotaped and photographed?

81 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 1:50:03am

Now it's six palestinians trapped in a tunnel.

Tunnel collapse traps six in Gaza

82 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:04:00am

OT - You remember the oil for bribes scandal? Where corrupt despot Saddam Hussain bribed senior UN people & other government officials, (I'm looking at you, EU) using money that was meant to be for food for his subjects, so they'd oppose action against him?

Apparantly we got it all wrong and the actual scandal was that Saddam was corrupt.

Both men (Annan & Powell) said they wished to "get to the bottom" of allegations that Saddam Hussein was able to siphon off money from the oil-for-food programme administered by the UN during his rule.

Mr Annan said he was anxious to see the investigations concluded so "we can... put it behind us".

Annan resists further Iraq pledge

83 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:20:47am

Trifecta?

Funniest anti-terrorist plan ever.

The Saudi's encourage Al-Qaeda terrorists to turn themselves in by advertising pleasant condtions in jail.

Prisoners praise Saudi conditions

Jailed suspected militants have appeared on Saudi TV praising prison conditions and calling for al-Qaeda sympathisers to turn themselves in.

The men described their conditions in jail as better than in their own homes.

"The prison authorities sympathise with the prisoner and respond to the prisoners' wishes.

Let me get this straight, the Saudis funded the terrorists, supported them and now 'imprison' them in good, modern, 'hi-tech' facilities with sympathetic stewards responding to their needs.

Looks like bin laden has cleverly disguised his new training camps as saudi prisons.

Either that or these guys have been tortured.

84 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:23:17am

Damn, where are the dawn patrol? Scaramouche? American Infidel? Papijoe? Geepers?

Did I miss a TNDT?

Off to investigate.

85 FabioC.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:31:09am

1 - The little children was just a CIA plant.

2 - Taqqiya, as usual

/Double parody

86 Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:42:55am

#83 Smit 12/17/2004 04:20AM PST

WTF.

Anyway didn't that kid we release say the same about Guantanimo?

87 American Infidel[deleted]  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:47:48am
88 RickZ  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:56:43am

# 87 American Infidel:

The story was told at the height of the Abu Ghraib feeding frenzy by a soldier that had returned from Iraq...He said that he and his group of men had captured at least a couple hundred of the Abu Ghraib residents and he said that if he could he would have executed many of them on the spot...He told of one in particular, that had come to his attention because a small boy ran to them for help and when they arrived at the boys home he and his men found several females that were beaten bloody & if I remember correctly a couple or few of the girls were also raped (they were LITTLE GIRLS)...

Ahh, the root causes of Abu Ghraib! Funny how those details somehow escaped the MSM radar. After all, child abuse goes on in the States, so who are we to criticize by bringing up that little peccadillo of theirs? One more dot where MSM white-out became very handy.

89 Sarah D.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 2:57:43am

OT

CIA's prison within a prison at Gitmo

If it were up to the MSM the US would have no leverage. How do you intimidate potential terrorists when they know full well that they will be treated humanely and the IRC will be handing them cookies and letters? Can we have no secrets?

Sheesh.

90 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:00:10am

American Infidel

So, I am not surprised that this child would protect someone that was kind to her...

Can you imagine how frightened she was sitting in the middle of the road by a road mine? - But she still did it. The example of kindness could save the middle east, it's infectious!

I'm not hopeful tho'.

===

OT - School bans tinsel in case students strangle each other.
(Students are 16 years old.)

School ban on 'dangerous' tinsel

I'm only linking to this because it's amusing and happened in one of the great villages of England. Chipping Sodbury.

91 American Infidel[deleted]  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:07:14am
92 jleaper  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:08:39am

This story restored my flaggin faith on the righteousness of our actions. Maybe all of the good deeds of our soldiers are finally paying off. What a great Christmas gift!

93 Buckeye Abroad  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:11:45am

Charles

Something that might interest you.

Open Call for Bloggers at CPAC

94 MarkX  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:13:08am

Have you ever seen a 48 year old man cry in his office cubicle?

*wipes tear*

95 scaramouche  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:13:23am

OT - Tunnel collapse in Gaza; six Palestinians trapped undergroud.
[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

96 Ballistic Renegade  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:15:00am

WOW

97 Sean II  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:17:58am

#95

Oops! Poetic Justice

98 FabioC.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:21:44am

#90 Smit

School authorities in Britain are considering to mandate kids being handcuffed while at school: "It's for their own safety; kids moving hands can injure themselves or others. We are designing special pens to let them write while handcuffed. Or we won't require them to write; learning to write is a terrible stress for kids" a spokesperson said.

99 American Infidel[deleted]  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:23:45am
100 J.D.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:26:43am

This is a(nother) great story that will probably not be covered by the legacy media.

Speaking of which, this is good for laughs. Strangely enough, the Quote of the Year was by "The Dan" Rather.

“What drives American civilians to risk death in Iraq? In this economy it may be, for some, the only job they can find.”
Dan Rather teasing a report on the CBS Evening News on March 31, the day four American civilians were killed and mutilated in Fallujah, Iraq.



The Best of Notable Quotables 2004 - The Seventeenth Annual Awards for the Year’s Worst Reporting

101 jetprop  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:30:15am

An awesome story.

102 Powderfinger  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:30:54am

#66 Grafton

Yeah. Note there are no details about who, where, when. This seems like an absolutely typical urban legend aka made-up nonsense. Those who are proud of their critical thinking, ask yourself, if this is true, why has the author done his best to not verify the story?

This is the kind of incident that, were it true, would have been told by clearly indentifiable sources. Why not? Note that the 'patrol' stopped and cordoned off the 'mine', etc etc. There would be pictures of the little girl, etc etc.

No, this is BS. And there will be no followup to 'prove' this story.

And you know this how, asshole? Did you read the Blackfive story? Did you look at the comments to the Blackfive story? Obviously not, because then you would have seen this:

Can anybody identify the this Gunny or his unit?
We have a number of them with us but no Mark.
For the last year we have been advocating sending toys (especially beanie babies) to the folks there, they are our best ambassadors.
Any help would be appreciated.
Marty@AnySoldier.com
-marty

and then Blackfive's response:

Email me, Marty, I know who he is.

I stripped out the relevant info for the blog.

Find something else to piss on, you miserable POS.

God Bless that little girl, those fine Marines and the Americans who support them. And if He has a little time left over, may He send the likes of Grafton some irritible bowel syndrome for Christmas.

103 Ballistic Renegade  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:33:02am

This is very OT.

Anyone seen this?

San Francisco supervisors propose sweeping gun ban

San Francisco supervisors want voters to approve a sweeping handgun ban that would prohibit almost everyone except law enforcement officers, security guards and military members from possessing firearms in the city.


"If gun control worked, Washington, D.C. would be the beacon. However, it's the murder capital of the United States," Arulanandam said

Un-frickin-believeable!

104 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:36:26am

But Michael Moore says it's all LIES LIES LIES. The evil Bush-Americans went in there and killed all the innocent Iraqi children kite flyers.

/Chevey Chase/off

105 Ballistic Renegade  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:39:14am

#102 Powderfinger

AMEN!

106 J.D.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:42:44am

Whoa! Back up there!
Re: ^^^#100^^^
I didn't mean The Dan's quote in particular was good for laughs.
You all know that, right?

107 Anna  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:44:01am

Thank you for posting this.

Let ie be known that the kind American is still alive and well. From Lt. Halvested -The Chocolate Bomber- of the Berlin Airlift to those soldiers in Bosnia and to these selfless Marines in Iraq.

God Bless the USA. And God speed brave Marines.

108 Ed Moran abu GOMEX aob 26.5C  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:45:34am

OT

ETA model shows no big snow (just a couple of inches eastern New England) with upcoming storm, AVN showing more snow, but the big heavy dump stays just offshore. NYC doesn't get more than showers turning to light snow, accumulating snow iffy. From the 06Z run.

In happier news, the 06Z GFS shows that as of Christmas Eve about noon, the 540 dm thickness line, which is usually near the rain snow line, through all of Texas except the extreme lower Rio Grande Valley, with 6 hour precip near .10 inches at Houston (.25cm), and over to .25 inches (.7cm) at San Antonio and Corpus Christi. The 850mb 0C line is near the 540 dm thickness line, suggesting that would be all snow. As a rough rule of thumb, when its just cold enough for snow, one inch of liquid rain means 8 to 10 inches of snow (if it is very cold, 10 to 15 inches). By Midnight Christmas morning (Central Standard Time) the precip is tapering off in San Antonio, but another .1 inch of liquid (1 inch of snow) will have fallen during the preceding 6 hours. The 540 dm line is pushing through Venice (I have flown from the Chevron Heliport in Venice) while nearly .5 inch liquid is falling in New Orleans. The 0C 850 isotherm is already out to the Gulf, suggesting late Christmas Eve rain changes to sleet then snow in New Orleans, with snow heavy for a while.


Now, this is still over a week away, but while every run of the GFS changes the precise timing and location of the snow, they have been consistent with an amazing blast of arctic air coming into the Plains and South around Christmas.

06Z GFS says by end of day Christmas, snow is on the ground all of Texas except the Red River Valley, the I-10 corridor from the Davis Mountains just east of El Paso all the way to the western suburbs of Jacksonville, and the Gulf Coast beaches are white from Corpus Christi, TX to Panama City Beach.

The nation will be a White Christmas donut, the Southwest and Pacific Coast barren and brown, Peninsula Florida left out, and a big donut hole centered in Missouri.


I have to go get blood drawn, then off to work. I'll check 12Z model runs when I get to work.

109 mad_scientist  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:54:18am

That is a great story...

110 Uhller Isshaytan  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:54:50am

#91
American Infidel,

This is not about "anti-Christianity" so much as the "useful idiots" of islam and dhimmis that don't understand the basics. The catholics and another christian demonition were in support of the muslims.

The defendants were not allowed to quote from the koran!

The trial has been going a couple of years but the story was undereported.

This was a great opportunity to publicise the true nature of koran and Allah's pedophile bandit of Mecca and Madina. But it looks to me like a case of suppression.

Churchill did not at least have this problem when warning of the Nazis.

111 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:56:47am

OT

If you want a good chuckle this morning tune in c-span 1 hafex al-mirazi from al jazerra tv and david rennie from the UK's daily telegraph are appearing with brian lamb...

callers are a hoot...

112 big L  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:58:32am

100--J.D. That rather is such a son of a Biotch.

OT : did anyone else hear about Chevy Chase at a party in the Lincoln Center for Norman Lear's group. He referred to President Bush as a dumbf*ck
...It is" People for The American Way" a leftie bull group filled with dopes and usefull idiots.
I heard about it on Medved's show.

113 Furious J  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:58:43am

Okay, this post is not totally off-topic. As Washington-based lizards are aware WMAL Talk Radio in Washington is raising money for Fisher House. Fisher House is described as follows:

Fisher House is known to many as the “Ronald McDonald House” for military service men, women and their families to stay while recuperating from injuries sustained in Iraq and/or Afghanistan. These “comfort homes” donated and built on the grounds of military and major Veteran Administration Medical Centers also provide a warm, compassionate environment where families and caring friends can nurture one another in time of need.

The campaign began the week of Thanksgiving. with a goal of raising $250,000 by Christmas. Well, the greedy, selfish, right-wingnut listeners of WMAL met that goal in less than a week, so they upped the goal to $500,000. So, now, the goal is a million dollars, and as of this morning, donations had surpassed $900,000.

Anyway, clicking on the above link and donating is a way lizards can show real support for the troops.

114 mich-again  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:59:15am

91 American Infidel
I always doubt coincidences, perhaps that makes me a conspiracy theorist. whatever. But when I see that the new-world order globablists always acting as apologists for the radical islamists I wonder why they are alligned.
There are several explanations, but I think the best is that the escalating terrorist threat to world stability skyrockets the public debt as nations fight wars and increase security. Large debts eventually lead to large bailouts, which are the world financier's dream.
Any policies, laws, or UN actions that increase the tension between Christians and Islamists is a good thing if you like public debt.

Amschel Mayer Rothschild (1773-1855) in 1838 said: "Permit me to issue and control the money of a nation, and I care not who makes its laws."
115 Ballistic Renegade  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:59:34am

#188 Ed moran

Can you make it snow in Orlando?

Just kidding. Would be nice though. Last time it snowed here was Christmas Eve of '89. Didn't stick to the ground of course, but did stick to the windshield, and locks were frozen.

Hey, I'll take what I can get!

116 scaramouche  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 3:59:53am

#100 J.D.

Thanks for that link. It was most amusing.

117 FabioC.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:00:15am

#99 Infidel

Yes, I'm kidding... but it sounds even too real, doesn't it?

118 scaramouche  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:05:39am

One of my fave's from J.D.'s link:


Jack Cafferty: “Can you say liberal? And the liberal talk radio station Air America debuts today...The question is, does America need additional ‘liberal’ media outlets?...”
Bill Hemmer: “I think it’s a good question...Why hasn’t a liberal radio station or TV network never taken off before?”
Cafferty: “We have them. Are you, did you just get off a vegetable truck from the South Bronx? They’re every-where...What do they call this joint? The Clinton News Network!”
— Exchange on CNN’s American Morning, March 31. [37]
119 jas  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:11:06am

OT

The latest from VDH - [Link: www.nationalreview.com...]

The man simply runs circles around the left.

120 Baldy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:17:03am

OT: Saudi Arabia to Overturn Ban on Camera Phones (Arab News, S.A.)

Body search is a common practice in universities for all female students to ensure they don’t carry camera phones
121 mich-again  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:22:26am

119 jas

Thanks for that link.

VDH stands above all the others. I wish the NYT would attempt to rebut that column.

122 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:24:32am

OT

Activists led by Rev. Jackson claim pattern of vote fraud

By JAMES DREW
BLADE COLUMBUS BUREAU CHIEF

COLUMBUS - The chief justice of the Ohio Supreme Court yesterday dismissed a lawsuit that activists led by the Rev. Jesse Jackson filed to contest President Bush's victory in Ohio.
The lawsuit dismissed yesterday alleged that votes were taken away from Democrat John Kerry's column and added to Mr. Bush's. It refers to a "pattern of vote fraud and discrimination," and problems with voting machines around the state. It also asserts that electronic voting machines could be hacked.

On Dec. 6, Secretary of State Ken Blackwell certified that Mr. Bush carried Ohio over Mr. Kerry by 118,775 votes. Ohio's electoral college met Dec. 13 and unanimously cast its 20 electoral votes for Mr. Bush.


Ohio's chief justice dismisses lawsuit contesting Bush victory

Do you think these tools will ever give up?

124 thomassowellfan  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:26:23am

61 million Americans know that we are not conquerors and this letter is just more proof of that fact. We are not out to steal oil (We won't even drill for oil in ANWAR) or wantonly kill people for the thrill of it so we can feel better about our nation. We take extreme caution to avoid collateral damage and reduce civilian casualties. We are, at heart, a compassionate people who truly believe in the ideals of freedom and liberty.

I can't imagine how difficult it must be to serve in Iraq right now, always having to be on the alert, and fighting an enemy that hides behind women and children. The world is providing very little support and your own country's media is decidedly against your actions. Add to that 58 million Americans who voted for a presidential candidate who called our involvement in Iraq a "grand diversion" and you have a recipe for bad morale amongst our troops. That morale is high amongst so many of our military men and women serving in Iraq is a testament to their mental and moral fortitude.

As for that little girl in the street clutching a teddy bear given to her by American Marines this is not a "grand diversion". It is a chance for her to finally taste freedom and live a rewarding life. Our presence in Iraq will someday allow this little girl, and millions like her, to grow up in a society where a person can dare to dream and work to make those dreams come true.

125 American Infidel[deleted]  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:28:02am
126 big L  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:29:21am

#26-Cattt-Absolutely amazing your US aid post. 26 pages pdf or good news and success and SMILES.
Those kids and women smiling is wonderful. And the earnest expresions of the Iraqi men is asight to behold. How can what we are doing there be wrong. To teach people to fish. To restore the Marsh lands, 8000 acres. This area is reputed to be the site of the GArden of Eden.sadddam drained it to drive out the Masrsh Arabs that lived in the area. Ruined the marsh system as it was. but now the fresh wter is coming back in and it may recover.

We seen none of theis in the press. I talked to an 80 yr old moonbat snow-bird yesterday.I told him you are being lied to. The press is telling lies. It is going amazingly well there. Go to the Internet and read some of the info there. People on the site are writing about it, direct. with photos.
Just think 50 million people given tools to live and not be in fear.

127 J.D.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:30:56am

#112 big L

100--J.D. That rather is such a son of a Biotch.


Indeed.

#116, #118 scaramouche
I guess Jack is aware that CNN's also been referred to as the Communist News Network. Poor little Bill Hemmer - in over his head and it so shows.

128 Submariner  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:40:40am

Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar #76
garnier #74

Must be something to do with the name "Teddy." I don't think the islamists were big fans of Teddy Roosevelt either.

129 Mike C.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:42:46am

The incredible tales of heroism and sacrifice by our valiant service people notwithstanding, that is the single most moving thing I have read during this entire conflict. Thank you, Charles.

OT, but important. I am addicted to reading Tounge Tied as often as possible, and at this time of year, it is usually stories and reports of yet another insane PC group trying their very damndest to stamp out any and everything to do with Christmas. And yet here I find myself in China, an officially atheistic country, populated mostly by people who have been raised to believe that religion in general and Christianity in particular are delusional evils. And what do I see ? A city fairly overflowing with Christmas (NOT 'winter holiday') trees, covered in signs saying 'Merry Christmas' and a populace that fairly fights for the chance to wish any suspected westerner a 'Merry Christmas'. Am I missing something here ? Forget Islamist terrorism - this PC crapola will be the downfall of western civilization unless we fight it tooth and nail. And that's the opinion of an atheist, for Christ's sake (so to speak) !

130 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:47:02am

OT

a major step in furthering a muslime take-over of europe or a crack in the door for the west to attempt to democratize muslime countries?..

Turkey concedes over Cyprus to save EU talks
By Times Online and agencies in Brussels

European Union leaders appeared to have won a major concession from Turkey today when its leaders promised to go some way towards recognising Cyprus as part of a deal to win EU membership.
131 Roger  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:51:07am

This is the most remarkable post and comments I've read. Well I haven't gotten thru all of the comments yet. The letters and words keep melting together.

132 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:51:57am

120 Baldy

That must be their new-years reform concession, in total - maybe the entire decades. :-)

133 mich-again  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:54:06am

123 Zulubaby
I wonder how long before the Pali's complain that Israel didn't respond fast enough to help find the survivors?

WAY OT, but funny. It seems the Scots have taken a real liking to deep-fried Mars bars. I'm no health nut, but my goodness, what are they thinking?

134 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:56:31am

OT

A chance for peace here, says Sharon
Times Online

But Mr Sharon said that it was esssential that the Palestinians elected a leadership that was truly ready to forsake violence.

Mahmoud Abbas, the Palestinian election frontrunner and leader of the Palestinian Liberation Organisation, has described the four-year Palestinian uprising as a mistake.

Mr Sharon said: “Now there is a real chance that a new Palestinian leadership will rise, those who will be elected, who will truly abandon the path of terror and instead will advance the strategy of reconciliation and negotiation without violence, terror and hatred.”

He added that if the new leadership seized the chance proffered by his Gaza withdrawal, he would co-ordinate the pullout that he once termed “unilateral” with the new Palestinian authorities. However, Mr Abbas swiftly rejected that offer.

135 WriterMom  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:58:45am

Beautiful story. Thanks for posting it.

Here is a link about the Christian pastor in Australia prosecuted for hate speech against Muslims.

136 FabioC.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:03:06am

#133 mich-again

I've got Scot friends and they confirm.

I have to try that, just for a morbid fascination...

137 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:06:10am

OT

U.N. European HQ May Be Full of Bugs - Security Source
By Stephanie Nebehay

GENEVA (Reuters) - The United Nations European headquarters, where a listening device was discovered in a ministerial meeting room, is probably rife with secret spying equipment, a U.N. security source said on Friday.

"It's like Swiss cheese," a U.N. security source told Reuters, referring to the Swiss Emmenthal cheese which contains holes.

"If we had the technnical means and staff for thorough searches, I'm certain that we would find one microphone after another. The U.N. in New York and Vienna are the same," said the source, speaking on condition of anonymity.

138 Occasional Reader  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:09:13am

What a beautiful story. Dare I hope that this little girl and her generation in Iraq just might represent a break from the traditional psychoses of Arab political culture?

139 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:15:21am

OT

Terror suspects in jail illegally
Herald Sun News

LONDON -- The British Government says it does not intend to free nine foreign terror suspects imprisoned without trial, despite a ruling by the nation's highest court that they are held illegally.

A specially convened panel of Law Lords decided by 8-1 yesterday that the jailing of the men on suspicion of terrorism alone was incompatible with both democratic norms and obligations under the European Convention on Human Rights

140 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:15:25am

#137 dustyroad guy - I'd be upset if we weren't bugging them - although I pity the poor operatives who have to listen to hours of mind numbing self important bluster.

141 Ed Moran abu GOMEX aob 26.5C  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:19:07am
142 mich-again  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:19:27am

135 writer mom

Very scary story. WTF is going on down under?

It's very evident that all we have said is the truth, but that has not been taken into consideration," Nalliah said, noting that lawyers for the complainant had stressed to the judge throughout the case that "truth is no defense."

The truth is no defense! How can it be when the "victim" is nothing but a lie.

143 RickZ  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:19:58am

# 133 mich-again:

It seems the Scots have taken a real liking to deep-fried Mars bars. I'm no health nut, but my goodness, what are they thinking?

What, you've never had fried ice cream in a Mexican restaurant?

144 mich-again  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:24:36am

143 RickZ

Good point. I have and I liked it. OK, they can do what they want to the Mars bar, but dammit, leave the Snickers bar alone. Some things are sacred!

145 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:25:05am

125 AI

Exactly, anything they can do to demean and disrupt in order to regain their corrosive influence...

140 Smit

one can only imagine the conversations taking place, just not sure it really has much value...

146 zulubaby  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:25:16am

RickZ, not Mexican, Chinese, no?

147 Intestinal Fortitude  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:27:36am

What about the child in that sweat-shop that had to make the toy bear, where's the hearts and minds for them…where…huh…where…where ?!

/moonbat off

148 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:30:13am

OT

fried ice cream recipes:

MEXICAN FRIED ICE CREAM

149 armytramp  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:30:34am

If you want to get LOTS of toys for the best price, Dollar Tree stores are your best bet. Everything at Dollar Tree is a dollar.

Nothing is of bad quality. All items are returns and overstocks. You can get many name brand goods there. Whever I shop, I go to Dollar Tree first.

They have ROWS of great toys and you can fill an antire shopping cart for no more than $20!

Last time, I just asked the little kids with their parents around me in the store, "If you were a little boy or girl in Iraq and you had no toys or games at all, what would YOU want?" I let the little kids pick out what they would want to send to the kids in Iraq.

I've been able to send boxes and boxes of goodies; great toys, puzzles, magic markers, jump ropes, and other cool stuff to kids in Iraq and my biggest cost so far has been postage. I even found a huge load of overstocks on Harry Potter calendars, journals, stickers and more for my nephew. He loves Harry Potter! I bought nearly $125 of Harry Potter licensed merchandise for $5.

I really recommend that if you have a Dollar Tree store in your area that you check it out, especially in January. Returns and overstocks from Christmas will flood the shelves and you will be able to get loads of terrific stuff to send to Iraq.

This is also a great price to get overstocks on books, toiletries, candy and other great and useful items for our soldiers. You don't have to have a lot of money to help out.

150 Smit  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:30:47am

Deep fried battered mars bars are Ok, but I prefer my Mars straight out of the fridge.

Malteasers are best tho'.

The Mediterranean diet is penetrating into Scotland, "albeit in the form of deep-fried pizza," say Morrison and Pettigrew.

I've never eaten deep fried pizza. But fried bread is great instead of toast.

You have to drink a can of diet coke for every deep fried item you eat so the calories cancel out.

True dat.

151 paul02085  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:32:34am

God I am touched by this.

Lets forget the LLL and their hate. We should just keep our hearts involved in this. Let the left fester in their poison.

Everyone please do what you can to help this cause.

I am so glad to be a part of a group like LGF who put their money where there heart is.

Lets just keep on giving. What a wonderful way to celebrate Xmas!

Thanks to all.

152 Baldy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:32:37am

OT: Well, there's a suspicious package outside my post office (Pittsburgh, neighborhood of Squirrel Hill). They've evacuated all buildings within about 1/3 mile around it, which includes the Jewish Community Center. At first, that's where I though the package was. A radio station said it was at the PO, which is across the street from it. There is yellow police tape blocking everything from Forbes to Beacon. I was kicked out of a coffee shop within the blocked off area about 30 mins ago. They also made everyone leave the area. At first, I didn't know what was happening, since there were dozens of people standing outside of everything - I though it was some strange yuppie protest. I assume it's nothing, but I'm glad the Police take no chances here.

153 Sarah D.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:33:27am

#149 armytramp

To add to armytramps post, be sure to use the USPS's new flat rate shipping boxes. The same rate ($7.70) no matter how much you stuff in them.

154 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:34:10am

148 IF

the first labor laws passed in the US during the Industrial Revolution were 'child labor laws', the moonbats will use it to establish unions and Iraq will be well on its way to democracy...

155 Mike C.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:34:31am

# 138 Occasional Reader

Dare I hope that this little girl and her generation in Iraq just might represent a break from the traditional psychoses of Arab political culture?

You miss the point (in my humble opinion). This does not represent a 'break from traditional psychoses'. This just represents the ordinary person who hasn't yet been corrupted by political mis-information. And you can find the same person many times over in every country. Of course children, but also adults. Arabs, Pakistanis, Chinese, Russians, whatever. Maybe even a few French - who knows ? They don't hate anybody, they just want to live their lives, get ahead, provide for their families and enjoy their lives, just like Americans. They truly appreciate the few kindnesses they encounter, just like'real' people. I sure wish more folks would realise that. It doesn't mean that there aren't many truly evil people, or people consumed by hate out there, but my bet, based on some pretty broad experience, is that most people of whatever stripe are not like that at all. And it would do all of us, particularly at this time of year, a bit of good to try and remember that.

156 WriterMom  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:34:38am

#142 mich-again

I know :(

"Truth is no defence." That is one of the creepiest things I've read in a while.


#150 Smit

You have to drink a can of diet coke for every deep fried item you eat so the calories cancel out.

LOL! Here's another tip...it doesn't count if you eat something standing up.

157 Furious J  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:35:39am

OT: Yesterday, I linked to another "Undermine the troops" story in the Christian Science Monitor which contained this item.

something ... is happening now in Iraq with what appears to be growing resistance from the troops. Evidence includes numbers of deserters (reportedly in the thousands),

This morning, UPI reports

Washington, DC, Dec. 16 (UPI) -- The number of annual military desertions is down to the lowest level since before 2001, according to the Pentagon.

The Army said the number of new deserters in 2004 -- 2,376 -- was just half the number of those who deserted prior to Sept. 11, 2001.

CSM, your bias is showing.

158 RickZ  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:35:57am

# 146 zulubaby:

RickZ, not Mexican, Chinese, no?

Maybe out on that left coast, home of the pineapple pizza! Chinese food uses very little, if any, milk and cheese products in their food preparations.

159 Melody_in_Houston  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:41:06am

Thank Heaven for little girls...and thank you God for protecting our military. Whether this story is true or not, I am still thankful.

160 Intestinal Fortitude  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:41:48am

OT

For current or former military that uses First Command:

First Command Financial Services, one of the best-known companies marketing financial products to military families, agreed yesterday to pay $12 million to settle accusations that it used misleading information to sell mutual funds to thousands of military officers over the last five years.
NASD and the Securities and Exchange Commission said that First Command exaggerated the track record of its high-cost fund products - with fees that ate up 50 percent of an investor's first-year contributions - and misrepresented the costs and availability of cheaper investment alternatives.
The company neither admitted nor denied the accusations, but accepted the punishments, which included a formal censure.
"We at First Command look forward to returning our full focus and attention to helping families pursue their financial goals," the chief executive, Lamar C. Smith, said. "We believe in the integrity of our company, our agents and the products we sell."
The settlement requires First Command to compensate any customer who paid an effective sales charge of more than 5 percent on investments made since January 1999. The remaining money, estimated by regulators at $8 million, will be spent on a financial education program for military families. The company also agreed to hire an independent consultant to review sales practices.
161 zulubaby  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:41:52am

RickZ, LOL at "home of the pineapple pizza". I don't think anyone in LA eats pizza -- too many carbs ;-)

162 dustyroadguy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:42:08am

157 FJ

the monitor ought change its name to the "Science Fiction Monitor', I refuse to associate the name Christian with them any longer, they seem to forget that 'bearing false witness', and 'Thou salt not murder' both carried the same penalty, death. They go out of their way to 'murder' the truth everyday...

163 Mike C.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:44:16am

# 158 RickZ

Steamed fish, and the damned bones make it (for me, anyway) more trouble than it's worth. But at least the Chinese eat vegetables, and have a vast cuisine of vegetable dishes. Latin Americans seem to regard vegetables as merely decorative trimmings, not something to actually eat. I have no idea why they don't all fall over dead from that sort of thing.

164 MachiasPrivateer  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:46:29am

OPERATION BEANIE BABY

KIDS HELP! Santa just got a letter that says 10,000,000 Iraqi kids have no toys! He and the elves are working overtime, but they could use some help. Santa wants to recruit 10,000,000 Junior Elves to help out. Each Junior Elf is to take one (and only one - you need to let other kids have a chance too) Beanie Baby from your collection and give it to whoever you normally give your letters to Santa. Mom & Dad, the postman, UPS driver, Fedex, Airborne, DHL; they all have a pipleline to the North Pole! Hurry, its only 8 days to Christmas. Help make it a Merry Christmas in Iraq too!

Merry Christmas to you all. Ho, Ho, Ho!

Santa

165 Occasional Reader  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:48:32am

#155 Mike C.:

You miss the point (in my humble opinion). This does not represent a 'break from traditional psychoses'. This just represents the ordinary person who hasn't yet been corrupted by political mis-information.

Well, actually, that IS my point. I'm hoping that this little girl and her generation will be in the vanguard of a new kind of Iraqi society that will NEVER be corrupted by the same sort of politicial misinformation, rabid Jew-hatred, conspiracy theorizing and atavistic paranoia that have characterized Arab political culture up until now. And if, indeed, this comes to pass, it will be because of the courage and sacrifice of people like the Marine who penned this article (as well as that of certain brave Iraqis like PM Allawi).

166 RickZ  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:49:23am

# 161 zulubaby:

I don't think anyone in LA eats pizza -- too many carbs ;-)

If you get the pie sliced into sixths, not eighths, less carbs! (Sorry, old joke.) The thin crust, coal oven pies at John's on Bleecker in the City are great. They even have a topping of fresh sliced garlic! Wonderful for those blind dates that never end.

167 papijoe  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:52:11am

#122 dustyroadguy

Martin Luther King Jr. must look down from Heaven and grieve to see what his protege has become.

168 RickZ  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:54:49am

# 163 Mike C:

Latin Americans seem to regard vegetables as merely decorative trimmings, not something to actually eat. I have no idea why they don't all fall over dead from that sort of thing.

Mexican restaurants consider parsley a vegetable.

But, yeah, I agree bony whole fish are a pain to eat, no matter how good they taste.

169 paul02085  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:56:27am

*149 Armytramp

I want to send a box of toys. Do you have an address you can give me?

170 Occasional Reader  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:56:28am

OT: Iowahawk has posted the 2004 Annual Report of Iowahawk Industries. (That he managed to do this even before 2004 had actually ended is a tribute to his efficiency.) Highlights include:

Specific financial challenges included US currency devaluation. It was thought that this would be offset by an increase in Euro-based revenues, but foreign advertising sales may have been adversely impacted after a June editorial in which Iowahawk referred to France as a "festering gallic mime-hole" and suggested the US resume carpet bombing of Germany.
171 Baldy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:57:13am

Well, now supposedly it's "been cleared." I'm glad it was nothing. I'm always a bit concerned here, since there are many synagogues & Jewish orgs in my neighborhood. There are a lot of nuts rolling around.

172 mich-again  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:58:32am

163 Mike C

The Habaneros and Jalopenos offset the bad stuff. I've learned from them and now put Quaker Steak Atomic Wing sauce on my scrambled eggs and hash browns. That gets your morning off to a good start.

173 Occasional Reader  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:58:39am

#163 Mike C.:

Latin Americans seem to regard vegetables as merely decorative trimmings

Except for Argentinians and Uruguayans, who regard vegetables as "what you feed to animals in order to make good, tasty meat."

174 armytramp  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 5:59:08am

#169


Operation Give has a new address! You can now ship toys and other donations to the following address:

Operation Give Utah Warehouse
Bridgepoint Systems
542 W. Confluence Ave.
Salt Lake City, UT 84123
(801) 261-1282

You may send ALL donations of toys, clothing, or other merchandise to the above address! Volunteers from local churches and from the American Legion will be there to accept your donations and make sure they get to Iraq!

Please send any and all donations to the above address!


Remember: no Barbie dolls or the like. Remember the culture. Jump ropes, stuffed animals, toy horses, etc. No violent toys.

175 armytramp  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:00:58am

That is, DO send stuffed animals, etc. DON'T send Barbie.

Carry on.

176 realwest  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:04:31am

141 Ed Moran abu GOMEX aob 26.5C Hi Ed - my 80 year old mom is flying into Newark on Tuesday, November 22 - is the Monday snow apt to delay, postpone flights (if you know) and how's it look for Tuesday November 22?
She's flying in from D.C.

Oh and Charles, thanks for starting my day with "misty" eyes.

177 realwest  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:07:50am

#24 justdanny - thank you for a truly wonderful story.

178 Bob with one O  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:17:03am

Armytramp,

No Barbie dolls but Harry Potter is OK?

179 piglet  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:17:35am

ot It is possible to donate a LLama to a needy family in south america:


[Link: catalog.heifer.org...]

Light Up a Life with Llamas



When resources are scarce, it's important that livestock don't use up land reserved for people. At home in rough, mountainous areas of Latin America, llamas are a blessing to families with limited pasture land, and they play a pivotal role in the cultural life of indigenous communities on the high plains of Bolivia, Ecuador and Peru.

Women weave their llamas' fleece into warm clothing to wear or sell. They load them up with goods for market and trek with them across rugged slopes at high altitudes. As they travel, llamas' padded feet don't damage the fragile terrain and their selective browsing doesn't destroy sparse vegetation.

Llamas and their kin, the alpaca, provide Heifer families with invaluable sources of transportation, income and wool, which is prized for making blankets, ponchos, carpet and rope.

180 Utahn  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:18:35am

Oh heck, sobbing again at work. Gotta read LGF after hours from now on. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU for these stories Charles.

Also thank you to those who gave the toys and saved someone's father and brother and son.

God Bless.

181 Mike C.  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:18:54am

Night all - have to get up tomorrow and climb on to the big bird to get the hell home. No Christmas in a hotel room away from the family for me.

182 HECTORUBALDO  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:24:38am

This is a great story which has given me back some faith in humankind.

But one is left wondering several things: why aren't we hearing this on CNN or even on FNC? Is there a blanket policy against good news on cable TV? Why does the US gov't give $20M to the PA when they could be spent *winning these hearts and minds*? This act by this Iraqui girl was more courageous than all the Palestinian Authority's thugs put together.

183 PackerBacker  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:24:49am

Also from BlackFive - a simple way to show Marines your support - post a message and it will be put up on a bulletin board - or send a private message to a Marine if you know the unit address. Read the whole thing for more info:

MotoMail

184 Ed Moran abu GOMEX aob 26.5C  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:25:17am

12Z GFS sees close to 6 inches of snow in NYC and nearly a foot (30cm) in BOS Monday and Tuesday. The 12Z ETA sees almost no snow for NYC, and much lighter snow for BOS.


¡ MODEL CONTROVERSY !

185 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:25:17am

OT - two excellent pieces today. Of course VDH continues, continuing on with, Cracked Icons.
but as the Weekly Standand's, Mario Loyola writes of the Un and their latest travesty... the proposed reform - Mend It or End It - Taking U.N. reform seriously.

I'm kinda partial to the 'End It' with its nice ring, especially when Mario states its purpose so clearly as,

...a brazen attempt to seize control of our national security policy--and impose on us a policy of appeasement, no less.

and it is.

186 EW1(SG)  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:40:49am

#138 OR: These are the stories that tear me up inside.

187 Grafton  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 6:56:48am

#182 - Why isn't the story out there?

Good question. Why isn't (at least) the unit identified? Absent *any* detail, the story reads like something made up. Maybe it is true, but how could you tell?

And it's not partisan or anti-war or anything to ask that question. If, in fact, the story is a plant, those who've been 'touched' by it, should be very angry for being manipulated this way.

But maybe it is true. If so, expect to see the details above come out in the next few days. My guess is you won't. It will go round the email lists and end up as an entry in SNOPES.

188 Bob with one O  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:04:11am

Grafton,

Season's Greetings to you. I have friends who've been to every shithole we've sent troops to in the last 15 years. I can't tell you their units as they've asked me not to reveal the pertinent info due to basic security concerns. I've also been told stories that you'll never hear from the media. That doesn't automatically consign them to myth status. Now it does seem odd to me that a very young girl would know about mines but my ten year old here fixes my computer. Different cultures.

189 Bob with one O  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:07:02am

writermom,

"...it doesn't count if you eat something standing up."

Clintonesque.

190 Grafton  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:21:24am

Bob with one O

There are plenty of 'human interest' stories in print and on the web where troops and units are identified. What possible reason would there be to keep this unit's ID secret. I'm sorry, but the story feels completely fabricated. What did the 'little girl' see that made here think there was a mine there? Wouldn't she run and tell a relative? Wouldn't some passer by (Iraqis are human) pull a little girl out of the middle of a busy road? Wouldn't the troops have stopped in the first place (perhaps fearing an ambush?) It just doesn't make sense on so many levels, and, as I said before, everyone should be wary of being manipulated. If it's a true story -- great. But I don't think so.

191 paul02085  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:33:08am

I really dont care if it is true or not if it motivates someone to help our soldiers or the innocent civilians in some way.

I am not worried about being manipulated in this way.

Why are you?

192 Grafton  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:43:20am

#191 paul02085 12/17/2004 09:33AM PST
"I really dont care if it is true or not if it motivates someone to help our soldiers or the innocent civilians in some way.
I am not worried about being manipulated in this way.
Why are you?"


Why? Because fiction should be labeled as such. But if it doesn't bother you, that's fine for you. Most people don't like being deceived.

193 Powderfinger  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:49:44am

It also shouldn't be labeled as fiction when you have no idea whether that's the case. But, then again, we do have an idea, as Matt at Blackfive says he knows who the Gunny is.

So...who are you calling a liar? Matt? The Gunny?

194 Geepers  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 7:58:24am

I'm with you Powderfinger.

It seems pretty simple Grafton, email Matt at Blackfive and get the Marine's name, then you can call him a liar to his face.

I'm betting you won't do either one of those things.

195 EW1(SG)  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 8:13:43am

#194 Geepers: I'll chime in along with you and Powderfinger.

Grafton, this is not the first incident of its type, nor, unfortunately, is it likely to be the last.

196 armytramp  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 8:29:38am

#178

I don't know about Harry Potter in Iraq. I bought the Harry Potter goodies for my nephew! I didn't send them to Iraq, but I imagine they would be OK since there are no sexy women on them.

There are some Harry Potter stickers with monsters on them and I wouldn't send those, but the pics of Harry, the journals with the pictures of the Owl on them, that sort of thing should be fine.

197 composmentis  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 8:38:44am

Must be true as I have not seen in/on MSM. Can't be false, or MSM would be on it 24/7.

198 grafton  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 8:50:29am

#197 -
If it were true, you don't think that Fox would run it? Or Drudge?
I'm sure a bunch of people have sent it to both.

199 armytramp  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 8:56:11am

Fox will have a report in a few minutes on what is best to send to Iraq including which cameras, books and other items will build the best relationships between Americans and Iraqis.

Most stories that reflect well on the Iraqis or on American troops do not make it to the MSM. Why should this one be any exception?

And the absence of photos means nothing. If I had a picture for every celebrity or every major event or every noteworthy episode in my life, I wouldn't have room left in my house to live, even though I carry a camera around with me almost 24/7. Yet, when I am int he middle of an event, I usually forget touse it because I am more interested in the experience than I am in recording the experience.

However, any happy stories are obviously false until proven true (to some people). Nice.

OK, here's the list on FOX:

from [Link: www.spiritofamerica.net...]

Tools for Iraqi tradesmen. Hand tools to help them get a better start on life. $150

Operation snapshot: Polaroid instant cameras. The children love to have pictures taken of them with soldiers, kids and families. Send polaroid cameras and film or send $17 through Spirit of America.

Books to read, most in English. Curious George, Cat in the Hat, the Hobbit. Reference books to learn English. $20 buys Curious George complete library.

"What you get out of Iraq in the mainstream media is not what is going on in Iraq...what we hear is not necessarily the view of the people...the work we support saves lives...both Iraqi lives and American lives."

OK! There you go.

200 Bob with one O  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 9:08:44am

armytramp,

It was the witchcraft aspect to which I referred.

201 Baldy  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 9:15:49am

Thank you for a lovely posting, Charles. It's good to hear these things.

202 Semper Gumbi  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 9:25:10am

I posted this in the traitor Senator thread but this thread is much more appropriate:Until Then

A moving tribute to the troops in Iraq. If it has been posted before I apologize.

Enjoy,

Semper Gumbi, USCG

203 hogman  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 9:40:45am

Why is it that certain people refuse to believe that our soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines are doing such an incredible job in Iraq? Good news is always discounted as untrue. The most farfetched stories are always counted as gospel.

This story is a great example of the nobility of America’s military.

204 Grafton  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 9:56:16am

#203 - It's simple enough. There just needs to be one, verifiable detail. The name of the Gunny and/or the unit. If it's true, its a great story and should go wide. If it's not true, then it needs to be revealed as a fiction. Or is 'fact-checking' only important sometimes?

205 Powderfinger  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 10:13:17am

A bit more from Matt at Blackfive:

If someone from the MSM wants the story, I'll help them. But good luck, people. I've been sending stories like this for the last two years.

The last time I posted a Sergeant's address on the blog, he received about a hundred anti-war posters in Afghanistan.

Grafton, the details are verifiable, especially if you're a reporter willing to get the story out. So, why don't you stfu and go find one of those. Or, stop by Blackfive and tell Matt he's a liar.

206 paul02085  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 10:50:37am

armytramp, Big box of goodies is on its way to Utah via UPS as we speak. Thanks again for the info!

207 motorcycle mom  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 10:59:11am

Just ignore Grafton. Probably thinks memogate is "fake" but accurate too.

208 zulubaby  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 4:54:22pm

Grafton, you're awfully jaded.

209 garnier  Fri, Dec 17, 2004 11:37:40pm

#76 #80

got a second to check this extinct thread.

joshua, lol

#80 joshua had it right in that i was approaching things from an art historical perspective.

i don't think i'm mistaken in pointing that islam inherited an iconoclasm from the jews that has been the rule rather than the exception. this rule applies to even "non animate" vegetal and animal forms and their representation in the visual and plastic arts. i could well be mistaken, but i thought dolls were verboten.

thus the splendid use of abstract geometry in islamic art that even an "islamophobe" can admire.

Actually I'm I'm not afraid of Islam, I just loathe it.

Still love the architecture.

210 MagnaniomousCoward  Sat, Dec 18, 2004 3:09:44pm

#102 Powderfinger
I don't know where "grafton" is comming from, but I'm just saying this because I'm sceptical. Period. I was sceptical of the "TANG" memos. I was sceptical of "Bowling for Columbine".

There are many positive, real, stories about how the coalition troops are helping. My motivation was not being suckered with a fake one.

"Blackfive" says he has the details? Fine, say that then. But hold the insults.

211 Powderfinger  Sun, Dec 19, 2004 9:19:33am

MagnanimousCoward, those facts were readily available to anyone who bothered to click the link and read. To call "bullshit" without bothering to investigate the story in the slightest is:

1) lazy

2) in keeping with Grafton's contrarian nature, and

3) an insult to those who have provided the story, namely Matt and Mark the Gunny.

Scepticism is admirable. Uninformed condemnation is not, especially when you direct it at people who are putting their lives on the line to fight on our behalf.


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The Beatles Are Here. Reissues and Rock Band.

 Frank says:

Mr Zappa, I am astounded at the courtesy and soft voiced nature of the comments of my friend, the Senator from Tennessee. I can only say that I find your statement to be boorish, incredibly and insensitively insulting to the people who were here previously, that you could manage to give the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States a bad name, if I felt you had the slightest understanding of it, which I do not. -- - Senator Slade Gorton