Al-Reuters likely believes in females being able to 'reclaim virginity' too......

Thank God for moderate Palestinians!

Nidal al-Mughrabi

Ah, him again.

*spit*

This is OT, but funny... PETA is after Jimmy Carter to quit fishing ....
[Link: story.news.yahoo.com...]

Abbas:

May today's enemies be tomorrow's executioners.

OT

Any truth to this? Any other news agencies reporting it?

[Link: www.chinadaily.com.cn...]

What a slippery slope. It starts with genocidal behavior, but soon enough it leads to insensitive language.

OT - Great news if true...Bad Guy #1 caught

thezionistenemy.com is still available.

I gotta side with the Palestinians on this one, given what the article says.

If I find out that 7 children in my country were just blasted by a tank in a strawberry field, I'd be furious. Israel really fucked up.

#10
The Whitehouse is dismissing this claim as a rumor, "dubious".

craig1f:

I gotta side with the Palestinians on this one, given what the article says.

Think for yourself much?

Abbas: "I came here with the legacy of late leader Yasser Arafat, and I promise you that I will carry forward his legacy," he said.

Umm, Secretary Powell? Any comment? Is he still a "moderate"?

#12

Since when has Palestinians claim of such atrocities ever turned out to be factual?

Everyone's favourite hook handed terrorist inciter Abu Hamza refused to appear at a hearing because his toenails were too long

Muslim cleric Abu Hamza has failed to appear on a video link to the Old Bailey - where he was due to face 16 charges, including soliciting murder

A prosecuting lawyer said Mr Abu Hamza had claimed he was "unable to walk" because his toenails were too long.

Ten of the charges faced by Mr Abu Hamza allege he solicited people at meetings to murder non-Muslims, including Jews.

Sounds familiar: I said Jihad before I said we stop Jihad. It's just nuanced anti-semitism.

#12 Craig1f

Still, you know perfectly that the paleos choose carefully FROM WHERE to shoot and launch missiles and mortar rounds: they go in the middle of civilians, to have them hit when Israel answers back.
We have photos of terrorists shooting from behinds little kids.
And I think that this could be the case today.

#7 DaveRay

Another thread at LGF from yesterday had a link to IDAO.org saying this. Not sure yet - not jumping up and down yet, especially after the assassination in Baghdad.

[Link: www.idao.org...]

Behind...
PIMF

#13

I'll hold my snoopy dance until we can get more verification.
...sigh...

#17 Smit

Now that post is just disgusting! I'm going to suggest to Charles that it be removed. What an awful thought that is early in the morning - captain hooks yellowed toenails! ENOUGH! ;)

#12 craig1f - Even the BBC casts doubt on this story.

The Israelis say six of the dead were 17 and older, and that some were members of the militant group Hamas.

Israeli shell kills seven in Gaza

craig1f #12
I suggest you go look at some of the links on the sidebar concerning the history of the "palestinians" vs. Israel. Come back and tell us what you think.

Moderate Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas called Israel “the Zionist enemy” for the first time Tuesday after an Israeli tank killed seven Palestinian youths in a Gaza strawberry field.

The whole second half of that sentence is suspect. They might as well have written it as "Israeli tank savagely slays Palestinian toddlers as they tip-toed through the tulips in honor of John Lennon." When you engage in terrorist acts against a neighbor who is stronger (and smarter) than you, BAD THINGS HAPPEN. You can overthrow the thugs who are responsible for your situation (*HINT* it's not the Israelis) or you can continue to be beaten down by your moral superiors.

I have no sympathy for any palestinians that aren't accused of collaborating with Israel. I'll save my sympathy for children who aren't virtually guaranteed to be terrorists or terrorist supporters when they grow up.

This may be a bit of 'posturing' on Mazen's part. I sense he has to keep the militant elements in check until after the election. Once he wins, that's when you want to listen very carefully to what he says.

Moderate Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas called Israel “the Zionist enemy” for the first time Tuesday after an Israeli tank killed seven Palestinian youths in a Gaza strawberry field.

Dang, wonder how much more peace symbolism that they could crowd into that statement.....maybe the youths were also caring for their flock of bottle-fed lambs while feeding the doves in that strawberry field? Any chance any of them were mentally handicapped/physically handicapped as well?

craig1f (#12),

Don't you find it the least bit curious that there are no pictures of these seven strawberry picking children's bodies in the fields?

Find their names and ages.

#17 Smit

That's a terrible indignation. Did the infidels deny him the toenail clipper attachment for his new hook?

They should be trimmed forthwith. To insure that this doesn't happen again, they should be trimmed back to...oh, how about his chin?

He condemns terrorism because it's counterproductive? How about because it's evil? But he's just like the majority of Palestinians (and Arab Muslims) who have no problem with killing Jews and other non-Muslims.

Call me depraved, call me juvenile, call me off-topic, but this BBC headline is LOL

#12 Craig1f:

You need to let this story percolate awhile before you condemn the Israelis.

I'd wager a healthy sum that you'll be posting a retraction when they find the mortars aimed at Jewish settlements, in those Strawberry Fields Forever.

#8 Bob G

LOL very well put. Surprise eh? Who would have imagined that our "partner in peace" would call Israel the Zionist enemy? I never saw it coming.

That song "Strawberry Fields For Mortars" keeps running through my head.

Moderate Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas...

Bwahahahhahahaha! Thanks for the laugh this morning, Al Reuters.

#12

“If civilians were wounded, it is because terrorists opt to launch attacks from within the civilian population and we regret the harming of any civilians.”

See my #19...

#33 Powderfinger

That's a terrible indignation. Did the infidels deny him the toenail clipper attachment for his new hook?

They should be trimmed forthwith. To insure that this doesn't happen again, they should be trimmed back to...oh, how about his chin?

Hey, ain't he the guy who has a government-provided ass wiper? Is there some sort of union rule prohibiting ass wipers from trimming toenails?

I surpised that the people here don't understand Abbas is in the middle of an election, and must say things that are unpalatable to our ears if he is to have a chance of winning.

He needs the rejectionist genocidal maniac vote badly. The simple 'terrorist' vote, and 'martyr's parents' vote will not get him where he needs to go.

Sheesh. It's an election!

/Carter Aide

#12 Craig if

"Israel is really fucked up."

Whereas people who strap semtex belts onto their kids and send them out to checkpoints, parties and pizza parlors to blow up some Israelis along with themselves; people who brainwash their kids to hate Jews and all non-Moslems; people who openly threaten Israel (and the US) with annilhation, who refuse to make real peace, who fire rockets into Israeli settlements---THAT'S not fucked up, right, Craigie? It's just normal behavior, quite understandable, cuz they're so downtrodden, donchaknow, and they're occupied, donchaknow, and if America was really fair, we'd send them a few dozen Apache helicopters, and, maybe, an atomic bomb or two, to drive the evil Zionist/Crusaders from their land. . . blah, blah, blah, zub, zub, zub, yattayattayattayattayattaya. . . .

Actually, what's fucked up are morlocks who knee-jerk defend Islamofacists.

#35 V the K

That's not cricket!

It's the "strawberry field" detail that gives this story away as untrue Palestinean propaganda.

Just TOO cute.

Moderate Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas called Israel “the Zionist enemy” for the first time

... since Sunday.

They fear the Zionist Enema.

#41 Maine's Michael

I'll be interested to see what happens to him if he doesn't keep his campaign promises.

Paleos launch rockets from civilian areas wearing civilian clothes in order to maximize civilian casualties. 'Gunmen' hide amongst groups of children. They are recruited into jihad from age two anyway.

Bombs are set to go off in apartment buildings. Every city is booby trapped.

But Israel is careless, bloodthirsty even, when it comes to 'civilian' casualties.

Is that about it?

Now we have the Strawberry al-Aqsa Field of Martyrs from Abu Ghraib Brigades to look forward to.

OT on three topics:

I just read the first few chapters of M. Crichton's book State of Fear. It looks like the plot is going to revolve around a sinister man-made tsunami. I could be wrong because I just started, but it looks like that's where its going. If that's true, brace yourself for a rash of conspiracy theories that somehow Bush created the Tsunami in Asia.

I see Kofi is leading the LGF Idiotarian poll. I dont think this guy is an idiot. Penn, Striesand, Obermann, etc are idiots. I think Kofi is an opportunistic and amoral asshole, but not an idiot. He's running the UN for personal profit and power. Same goes for Chirac.

Take a look at the liberal blogs, they are rooting for elections not to go forward and disappointed with any good news in Iraq, including the capture of top terrorists. What makes a person root against the success of his own country?

#35 V the K

LOL! Yeah, for a laugh I'm easy too!

They fear the Zionist Enema.

So funny I said it twice.

PK

#40 SwampWoman

Is there some sort of union rule prohibiting ass wipers from trimming toenails?

I think it's an OSHA thing when it pertains to Cleric Hook. Too many suicides when they made one guy do both. It was like Spinal Tap trying to keep a drummer.

Moderate Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas called Israel “the Zionist enemy” for the first time Tuesday after an Israeli tank killed seven Palestinian youths in a Gaza strawberry field.

Yes, this is propaganda at its best (or worst, depending on how you view it).

The imagery......nasty faceless killers drive their tanks into the pretty strawberry patch and murder the nice children as they are playing kiddie games after school.

OT More Anti-semitism at Columbia

#41 Maine's Michael

I'm surpised that the people here don't understand Abbas is in the middle of an election, and must say things that are unpalatable to our ears if he is to have a chance of winning.

He needs the rejectionist genocidal maniac vote badly. The simple 'terrorist' vote, and 'martyr's parents' vote will not get him where he needs to go.

Sheesh. It's an election!

LOL.

So is this moving to the center to win the general election?

The game played by the Media Matrix is very simple: the paleos PURPOSELY hit Israeli civilians, BUT Israel is condemned with the harshest words when, defendig its Citizens from those terroristic attacks, COLLATERALLY hits paleo civilians.

It is evident that any person in GOOD FAITH can understand the difference between the two attitudes, but the Media Matrix obeys to the orders of the far left HQ and to the orders of the islamofascist and doesn't "see" the difference.

#49 dll2000

I think Kofi is an opportunistic and amoral asshole, but not an idiot.

He's both, I tell ya! Vote Kofi!

/Kofi '04 spokesman

Here's some pictures of the aftermath of the tank incident, including the first one, where Getty/AP identifies as a "Boy" a male of an age that seems quite a bit older than that conveyed by the term:

GZA: Seven Killed By Israeli Tank Rounds

At least the headline appears to reflect an more neutral stance.

#53

The imagery......nasty faceless killers drive their tanks into the pretty strawberry patch and murder the nice children as they are playing kiddie games after school.

Not faceless killers, insert favorite jew here.

#49 Dll2000

What makes a person root against the success of his own country?

If he is a marxist-fascist it's easy.

#49 dll2000

How's this gem? (from a loony, libby blog)

bin Laden caused the tsunami

Reports are coming in that bin Laden caused the tsunami. He used a nucular device that renegade Russian elements gave him. This makes the Americans directly responsible for this disaster. They have failed to deal with bin laden and instead have wasted their time invading Iraq. And now he has killed close to 100,000 people. 9/11 was nothing compared to the horror of this attack. The Bush government will now use this attack as an excuse to invade Iran and sick Irish republicans like Marty will use it as an excuse to make fun of dead people. As a gay man and a gay loyalist I am sickened by the whole thing.

bin Laden caused the tsunami

If (and that's a big if) the story of wounded children is true, it may be regrettable and sad, but it is not illegal. Under the rules of war, taught in the US military and other nations who have signed the various conventions of war, the use of civilians as human shields is illegal. Armies who shoot at, or in the vicinty of, civilians being used as such shields are absolved of any guilt. The guilt is placed where it belongs. On those who use civilians as a means of avoiding return fire.

OT

If you've not read the comments over at Wretchards this morning, there's a direct report coming out of Thailand from one of his posters, 'Caradine'.

" Friends,
This is Carridine, reporting live from Takuapa, southwest Thailand.

1)The Thais did a great job of tending the wounded, and payng ALL costs to go home.

2)The Thais and various international forensic teams (Aussie, Japanese) are doing a good job here, Wat (temple) YanYao.

But a problem has arisen: I'll let Wretchard introduce it if he chooses, I emailed him just now (1845 BKK time). "

Lots of Hope

These are like the "civilians" that were routinely scraped off the streets of Fallujah. A "civilian" to these people includes anyone who is unable to fire a weapon because they are dead. The Balestinian gunmen operate under a sort of inverse international law of conflict framework. They make a concerted effort to violate every provision of the law of conflict whenever and wherever possible. That's fine. But when you do that, you must live (or more often, die) with the consequences.

Another story you'll never see in the "Iraq's spiralling out of control" press:

CHILD'S TIP LEADS MULTI-NATIONAL SOLDIERS TO A LARGE WEAPONS CACHE

MOSUL, Iraq -- Multi-National Forces from 1st Brigade (Stryker Brigade Combat Team), 25th Infantry Division (Light), discovered a large cache of weapons and munitions based on a child’s tip during operations on Jan. 3 in northern Iraq.

An Iraqi child led Soldiers from 1st Battalion, 24th Infantry Regiment, to a large cache of weapons in an abandoned building during a patrol in western Mosul that consisted of 30 60 mm mortars, 21 rocket propelled grenade rounds, dynamite, various roadside bombs and components, five RPG launchers, more than 100 mortar fuses, grenades, ammunition and intelligence documents.

Soldiers also discovered a stolen fuel truck in the configuration stages of a truck bomb. The discovery of the truck bomb possibly saved the lives of hundreds of people.

I don't even think it's strawberry season in Israel right now, but I could be wrong. But if it wasn't strawberries, it would be laundry, pigeons, looking for the deed to the ancestral home on the roof, looking for a few scraps of bread on the road, selling some Chicklets to the occccccuppayshun forces...that sort of thing.

I posted this elsewhere, so apologies for the repost, it just makes me feel embigelized: Telegraph survey: Britons say Israel is the worst country in the world, deserving of no respect.

In addition, Israel was rated the most unfriendly country after France and Germany.

#53 Dave the....

The imagery......nasty faceless killers drive their tanks into the pretty strawberry patch and murder the nice children as they are playing kiddie games after school.

As opposed to the nasty faceless killers that shoot rockets at Israeli schools and day care centers, huh?

I don't get it. The Israeli's kill people shooting at them from amongst children being used as human shields. Children are killed. Israelis are blamed. Buses get blown up with Israeli children inside them by terrorists. Israelis are blamed.

I have to say that Jews are a helluva lot better people (morally) than I am. If any of my schools were targeted, I'd be shooting back at enemy schools and I bet I can shoot better.

#57 Powderfinger

/Kofi '04 spokesman

Hell yeah, a Kofi pioneer!

OT

MEMRI lets us know what the tsunami really was:The killer wave that swallowed tens of thousands of Muslims was an act of Allah designed to punish the Christians.

Saudi cleric Muhammad Al-Munajiid explained God's tsunami punishment of the Christians stemmed from "the Christian holidays (that) are accompanied by forbidden things, by immorality, abomination, adultery, alcohol, drunken dancing and revelry. A belly dancer costs 2,500 pounds a minute, and a singer costs 50,000 pounds an hour, and they hop from one hotel to another from night to dawn. Then they spend the entire night defying Allah. ... At the height of immorality, Allah took revenge on these criminals. ... Allah struck them with an earthquake. He finished off the Richter scale. All nine levels gone."

Given new information, I retract post #12 .

It's not clear to me: so, were the teenagers that were killed being used as human shields, or were they in fact Hamas recruits? Is there really any difference any more?

And, for #49 dll2000: Crichton has been pretty anti-idiotarian on the global warming thing, and from the reviews I've read, that's what the new book revolves around. The DU crowd is going to blame Bush regardless, as soon as they finish with the "America isn't doing enough to help" rant.

On a related note - 10 memebers of AQ were killed in a kumquat patch in southern Afhganistan recently

France has filed a protest

OT The countries that we love and hate

Whew! For a minute there I was afriad that a large numer of Britons were bigoted anti-Semites. Thankfully, King explains that it's all the fault of those damn dirty Jews. /sarcasm

#66 Writer MOm

I did not notice that you posted the same article. Is the UK suffering form some antiSemitic disease?

#69 Sarah D:

Drudge had a link this morning to an article from a Kuwaiti newspaper scolding Kuwait for the fact that it, and the Arab region in general, has donated almost nothing to the relief effort despite being awash in oil money. One of the complicating factors they mentioned is that quite a few mosques in Kuwait are preaching that the tsunami was an act of Allah's vengance and that the victims were largely infidels who deserved it.

#76 Joel

I would have to say...yes!

#76 Joel

No, the world suffered from a brief lapse in openly vicious murderous antisemitism after the holocaust. The disease moved internally and didn't display outward symptoms. Now, due to the marvellous excuses for jew hatred under the guise of anti-zionism, the disease is once again disfiguring the face of Europe.

Personally, I'm writing to my representatives in Washington. It is absolutely criminal that those "children" weren't in school reading those anti-semitic books that my taxes are paying for.

If they aren't going to school, why am I paying for books?

/sarc

Who is the UN accountable to? Who or what organization does 'performance evaluations' on their department and individual employees? Someone needs to order performance evaulations on the UN's capability to deal with any disaster. They are hopelesslessly incompetent as well as corrupt!

#56 Poitiers-Lepanto:

Your post is spot on.

Your "any person of GOOD FAITH" reasoning is extremely profound, and is the KEY to understanding and resolving the Paleo-Israeli conflict.

You sure said a mouthful.

The Muslim Paleos are MOST DEFINITELY NOT OF GOOD FAITH! They worship a god who is either false or evil--satanic in nature.

Until they recognize and begin to worship the One True God, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; the paleos will never be a people of good faith.

#69 Sarah D.

immorality, abomination, adultery, alcohol, drunken dancing and revelry

That cleric knows me ?
Why he doesn't mind his own business ?

#74 thepouguemahone:

Why is France protesting? Were innocent kumquats harmed?

They think Israel is the scum of the earth, and their social service program funds the one-handed-7000 pound new hook Islamo terrorist with the private duty nurse and crunchy toenails and his family.

I would say there is something wrong with this picture.

#76 WriterMom #79 blueroom127

Reuters, The BBC, The Economist, The Guardian, The Independent, teh Camel Corps (Foreign Office), The Church of England, have all done their job well. However I think that the British psyche was always fertile ground for anti Semitism.

#82 lah-dee-dah-dah

Further to your post, Prager on Judeo-Christian values.

#88 Joel

Yes...but they still managed to use Jewish seichel (Yiddish-brains) when they needed it. I just finished reading an excellent book by Peter Masters on the German speaking Jewish refugees from Eastern Europe who played a very important role in interrogating and assimilating themselves amongst German POWs for the British army.

#90 WriterMom

In a generation or two when the Muslims of the UK try to make Westminster Abbey into a mosque and beautiful British women such as those that look like Elizabeth Hurley are forced to don the burqa, I would like to remind the Brits (I probably will be dead by then however) how they wasted their hatred on an innocent nation like Israel and ignored the real cancer within themselves.

There are some excellent British journalists such as Barbara Amiel, Julie Burchill, Stephen Pollard and Melanie Phillips but the rest seem to be "Hate Israel First."

#91 American Infidel

I am well aware of bigels posts. I was being sardonic.

#85 American Infidel

Ralph Peters thinks that sentiment could go either way.

IN HORROR'S WAKE

Given Aceh's fundamentalist tradition, the response from local mullahs (whose authority is threatened) is apt to be the age-old claim that Allah punished Aceh because it had already become too liberal. The popular interpretation of events is unpredictable for now, but we could see Aceh becoming even more devout — or opening up.

It's just that all those progressive journalists know that even the most seemingly innoccous criticism of Islam can get their throats slit, while you can say anything about Isrealis.

Israel could stop the shelling with a simple and fair policy:

One shell or rocket gets five back. A randomly targeted 155mm artillery shell will be launched into Gaza for each rocket or mortar shell fired into Israel. It's simple, fair and effective. The moment that policy is announced the rockets and mortars from Gaza will stop. Yes innocent lives will be lost but the Israeli shells stop the second the Palestinians stop.

I am so glad I don't live in Israel. I would so organize a group of the like-minded and call it ZOB (after the Warsaw Ghetto heroes, none of this Orange Jewish Star crap, a nice armband that says ZOB, the original Jewish Nazi fighters, fighting the real nazis of today)- get together like minded Hebrews who are tired of this crap and do our own counterbattery fire against the Palestinians. I'd dig a tunnel into Egypt and fire the retaliatory strick rockets from there.

It is so hard being an evil genius....

#88 joel:

However I think that the British psyche was always fertile ground for anti Semitism.

You think so? I'm not at all sure I see it. Thinking about it, I don't know what in general would cause the British to be any more or less suspectible to anti-Semitic propoganda than, say, Americans or Australians.

One thing that does come across to me in reading the poll results, though, is that Britians seem to be pretty unsure about their place in the world right now. I'm not sure what to attribute that to. Maybe some combination of WWII hangover, the breakup of the old colonial system, and its always-iffy relations with the continent combined with the recent divide over Iraq. Y'know, Britian really isn't that big a place, and maybe in times of stress, it produces a bit of a bunker mentality, kind of like what we see to a certain extent in Japan now and then.

Clearly, the British media has done quite a job in hoodwinking the British public re Israel. They have tried to do the same thing regarding the U.S., but their efforts have only been partly successful, and I think the main thing that comes across on this point is confusion.

My advice to Brits: Take advantage of your strong currency and travel in the U.S. some. Get away from New York and see some of the red-state territory. You might be surprised. New York, for all of its virtues and flaws, isn't any more representative of the bulk of the U.S. than London is of the bulk of England.

#89 WriterMom:

It dovetails nicely.

#86 WriterMom

Yes, something is VERY wrong with this picture!

(By the way---do you think the whole T.E. Lawrence mystique has anything to do with modern British Anti-semetism? This question's for you, too, Joel!)

(And, for Craig if, and any of his ilk who may be lurking, reading this.)

Okay, if Israel is, indeed, so very fucked up, why are they being so merciful to this imprisoned terrorist, providing him with social services, etc.?

(I think this charity is mistaken, myself; but it's hardly the action of a bloodthirsty, "fucked up" country, now is it?)

#101 American Infide

Altruism. But foreigners don't really believe this either. There must be oil under Sumatra!

Ah well, so it goes.

#100 TalkinKamel:

One of the surest signs of a heathen society is that they interpret kindness as a sign of weakness.

#98 Cousin Dave

The American media seems to be doing its level best to hoodwink America re Israel too, though, as you pointed out, it hasn't succeeded yet.

Maybe we should be asking ourselves what is the cause of MSM antisemetism? Too much Marxist sympathies, too many Boomers who never got over the 60's?

Zulubaby, you feel free to chime in on this too; I know that---heh, heh, heh---you have "strong" feelings about the MSM. (And I'm glad you're weathering the monsoon okay.)

#71 craig1f - Thankyou - It's just that after a good few years reading LGF some of us have our MSM BS detectors calibrated to a very high level.

My first thought after reading that article was 'Harvesting Strawberries in January?' - I've been to Israel in January, It was snowing.

#103 lah-dee-dah-dah

That's very true. On the other hand, I agree with the Jewish aphorism (correct me, Lizardoids, if I'm getting it wrong), but "He who is kind to the cruel, will soon be cruel to the kind."

I don't want America, or Israel, to loose its generous heart, and descend into cruelty, like our enemies.

On the other hand, I sometimes fear too much of this bend-over-backwards kindliness to terrorists and the like will prove our undoing.

Let's cut craig1f a little slack. I probably would have thought the same thing back in my younger and more innocent days, before I learned more about the Palis' dirty fighting and propaganda tactics, not to mention the media's slanted presentation of the Pali/Israeli conflict. It is SO easy to be duped when you don't have the facts.

Also, re. # 42, craig1f did not say "Israel IS really f*cked up." He said "Israel really f*cked up" as in "made a mistake that will be exploited for propaganda purposes." Very different.

Is "Zionist Enemy" supposed to be a worse dis than "Zionist Entity"?

I wonder where it ranks in the islamofascist lexicon.

If the Israelis keep on defending themselves, pretty soon Mazen will be trotting out the pigs and monkeys references.

Craig if

Fair enough. You rescind #12, and I rescind all my critcisms of it.

#69 Sarah D.

A belly dancer costs 2,500 pounds a minute, and a singer costs 50,000 pounds an hour, and they hop from one hotel to another from night to dawn.

A belly dancer costs 2,500 pounds a minute?
150,000 pounds ($285,000) an hour?

Damn, I'm in the wrong line of work. Any lizard sista's want to join me at belly dancing classes?

#82 lah-dee-dah-dah

Until they recognize and begin to worship the One True God, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; the paleos will never be a people of good faith.

I'd be willing to settle for them backing away from the infidel-hating moon god and his thieving, Jew-killing, pedohile prophet.

But that's just me....

#61 Sean

I have already heard theories that Bush lead global warming has caused the Tsunami. First, I've seen of a theory that Osama was responsible. How do you make the jump that Osama's crimes are Bush's fault? Bush and the British are the only people doing anything about terrorists, and they (MMM) are are categorically against all action (militarily) against them (terrorists). But anything a terrorist does is Bush's fault. That's funny.

#73

I know Crichton is too smart to buy wholesale into the science of global warming. It looks like the book tsunami is going to be created by mechanical means. Again, I am just projecting and predicting - I only read a few chapters on the train this morning. The moonbats and the islamofacists will attribute any disaster to Bush and believe any consipiracy theory.

#69 Sarah D.

Linky no worky :-(

Is anybody running besides Abu Mazen? Does that person(s) get any media coverage at all?

#107 TalkinKamel:

My reference was to paleos specifically, and islamofascists in general; misinterpreting the kindness and generosity of Israel and the USA toward other nations and peoples (often our enemies), as a sign of weakness on our part.

This mistaken belief that kindness is a sign of weakness has been the undoing of much evil.

This is why I'm in favor of Israel and the USA continuing to show kindness, compassion, and generosity--even toward those who hate us.

But only to a certain point.......

Re: strawberries... Far be it from me to contradict WriterMom, but I'm pretty sure strawberries were available incredibly early in the year. And even if they're not quite ripe for picking yet, they would still need tending. So I'm not calling bullshit on the strawberry fields aspect.

Just on the rest of the Pali claims.

#114 Lewis

It was a UPI link, and they removed it. Sorry.

#115 levi from queens:

Is anybody running besides Abu Mazen? Does that person(s) get any media coverage at all?

Yes.
No.

#114 Lewis

Try this one.

craig1f #71
I also received an education from this site - stick around.

levifromqueens #115
I believe that's where Cooper's gone.

#110
In my defense, I said "given what the article says."

But it was naive of me, after how long I've been active in reading blogs, to assume that the article gave an accurate picture. Every damn time I give Palestine, or liberals, the benefit of the doubt, I learn more about the story and feel foolish.

I guess I just want to believe that there is some hope for peace that does not involve destroying Palestine.

#121 whosoever:

I believe that's where Cooper's gone.

LOL!

The press will keep calling Abbas a "moderate" as his first name no matter what he said.

Some in the press even started calling Yassin a moderate after he was killed.

The press will keep calling Abbas a "moderate" as his first name no matter what he ever SAYS, I meant.

#117 cba:

It's painfully obvious that the paleos attack Israelis with mortars fired from strawberry fields, so that Abb-ass can use the unwitting, dimwit press to trumpet his bullshlt charges of Israel attacking innocent pali children, when the Israelis launch a counter-attack against the paleo-terrorists.

It's a pre-conceived cover story that Abb-ass has been able to hoodwink the AP with time after time. Hiding behind children--now there's a brave, original strategy.

The press will keep calling Abbas a "moderate" as his first name no matter what he said.

I will always come off as contrary, because I try to see all sides of an arguement. But lemme just point out something ...

Labeling theory says that if you label a person a certain way, regardless of how that person is predesposed to act, they will begin acting according to that label.

So let's say that I'm a straight-edge person. Let's assume people start accusing me of being hot-headed. I'm not more likely to become hot-headed, because I've been labeled as such. It's like a self-fullfilling prophecy.

I think the news hopes that if they label him as moderate, and make him think that this "moderate" label is the reason why he is gaining support, then he will be more likely to be a moderate. It's the same as people calling Muslims terrorists. I go to a public school, and I know plenty of decent muslims. But after perceiving discrimination (usually it's just in their heads, and not real discrimination) for being muslim, they start to relate with the terrorists. This is pretty much the phenomenon that terrorists use to gain support.

I knew this girl that was complaining about being harassed when she was coming back from Iran. She felt being descriminated against. After I talked to her a little more, I realized that the security guy was just hitting on her. Add that to the fact that she'd bought me a sword, which was in her luggage, and of COURSE they're gonna spend an extra 2 minutes with her.

Or the AP could just have an agenda. I don't know, just throwing this idea out there.

#120 Sarah D.

Thanks. I just wish I could find the article on MEMRI's site.

#122

Well, there is hope for peace without destroying Palestine, since there is no Palestine. :-)

#127 Craig1f:

The AP just has an agenda.

#127 Craig1f:
I think it's a nice idea that the media are trying to get Abass to live up to a better standard. But I'm afraid the truth is, they accept the Pali line hook line and sinker, and the result is not the so-called "moderate" living up to the standard, but Israel is demonized and the "moderates" learn they can do any damned thing they like and get away with it.

# 122

Now, the whole "I know nice Muslims, but people treat them like potential terrorists, so they start relating with the terrorists" is something I can NOT understand. WHAT sort of treatment are they receiving that causes them to identify with savage, barbaric murderers and thugs?

"I got detained at the airport a few minutes and questioned just because I'm Arab and Muslim. Now, I can certainly understand where those dudes who blow up school buses and chop people's heads off are coming from, and I sympathize with them."

If it is so incredibly easy to offend them to the point that they start identifying with terrorists (or actually doing terrorism, like the killer of van Gogh) ... then perhaps, just PERHAPS, this might explain WHY there are so many Muslim terrorists in the first place?

Adding to my post # 132 above:

It seems evident to me that there is something about Islam, more than any other religion, that causes many of its adherents to give free rein to their most vicious, savage impulses--to abandon every shred of decency and morality, even in principle, when it comes to conflict.

And the fact that the vast majority of so-called "good" Muslims to not recoil in horror at the atrocities committed by Muslim terrorists, and that many even profess to identify with them after having suffered a minor bit of hostility or discrimination or inconvenience, should concern us deeply.

#104 TalkinKamel:

Maybe we should be asking ourselves what is the cause of MSM antisemetism? Too much Marxist sympathies, too many Boomers who never got over the 60's?

Good question. Although a lot of the MSM today aren't old enough to have been there in the '60s, I read a very good paper once on how an organization tends to take on the personality of its leaders, and the people who are in charge of the large media organizations in the U.S. today are by and large dressed-up hippies. And, within all age groups, there is a certain segment that finds the libertine, responsibility-free mythos from the '60s to be very attractive. And it's even better when the mythos is combined with the self-important, we're-saving-the-world philosophy that comes out of journalism schools today. Those people tend to gravitate toward today's media organizations, because that is the personality that they have, thanks to the people who lead them.

However, I believe the truth lies closer to the fact that a lot of MSM jornalists are, to be frank, fellow travellers. If they were to be honest with you, they would tell you that they fundementally do not believe in democracy. Where they are concerned, average Americans have not, and will never be able to, earn the right to govern themselves. Therefore, they must be governed by their moral superiors, and of course the MSM places itself in that category. A basic premise of the Left today is that the West, and America in particular, enjoys a standard of living that it morally has not earned, and part of the MSM's mission is to see to it that that standard of living is substantially reduced. And I'm not talking about just material things here; I'm talking about freedoms and basic human dignity. Consider the recent MSM attacks on the blogs involved in uncovering Memogate (of which LGF was a main player). They aren't attacking the blogs for getting their facts wrong (although they may couch their attacks in those terms). What they are doing, fundementally, is attacking the bloggers' freedom of speech.

This is really where the MSM attacks are coming from, and it's a basic tenant of Marxist/Stalinist philosophy: that which does not serve the "common good" (read: the Party) has not business existing. Art's sole valid purpose is to propogandize on behalf of the Party; any art that does not serve this purpose, regardless of its subject matter, is "burgois" and deserves to be suppressed. Same goes for all speech. The speech of the Memogate bloggers clearly did not serve the Party's purposes; therefore, the bloggers responsible should have their freedoms revoked, First Amendment be damned. Thatis where the MSM is coming from.

#111 Smit

Belly dancing! Sounds good to me. I'm also obviously in the wrong line of work...But who will make our outfits? For style ideas, I suppose we could always consult Qadafi's gaggle of gals.

#117 cba

I'm still not sure about the strawberry fields. Hothouse strawberries could be possible...lemme take a little look around...

WHAT sort of treatment are they receiving that causes them to identify with savage, barbaric murderers and thugs?

Let me put that in perspective.

That doesn't mean they suddenly defend Osama Bin Laden or Saddam. But that does mean they're more inclined to believe that the terrorists in Iraq are actually freedom fighters trying to defend their country, and not foreign terrorists trying to take over a country that is not theirs.

It also makes them more likely to believe that America is an evil entity that doesn't have any good intentions. I mean, I've heard people suggest that America knew about the Tsunami, but didn't tell anyone because they had more to gain by coordinating the relief effort than by warning people. When I suggest that they would have warned them, but they didn't know how to tell, and no system was in place, they thought I was "naive for believing that they didn't have a system in place, and for believing that our government cares for people."

Usually, through the course of the conversation, they talk about how cruel the CIA is to people, and how they're just as bad as terrorists. Then they mention Che Guerva (sp?) and what they did to him, and how he was a freedom fighter.

To follow up a bit more on my #134 post: Daniel Pipes has written about how today's Wahhibism, far from being a "traditional" belief system, consists in substantial part of early 20th-century Marxism. Pipes has shown how various European Leftists influenced government and religious leaders in Arabia in the first half of the 20th century. Therefore, a substantial part of the Western Left views the Islamists, consciously or not, as fellow-travellers.

And the fact that the vast majority of so-called "good" Muslims to not recoil in horror at the atrocities committed by Muslim terrorists, and that many even profess to identify with them after having suffered a minor bit of hostility or discrimination or inconvenience, should concern us deeply.

They usually convince themself that those things are not occuring, or that it is in response to worse crimes by the people they are fighting.

#134 Cousin Dave

Nice post Cousin Dave.

If you haven't already read this essay, I think you'll like it. It echoes a lot of what you wrote.

Media and Medievalism

#122 craigf

I guess I just want to believe that there is some hope for peace that does not involve destroying Palestine.

Personally, I think your a cockeyed optimist if you believe peace can be had by destroying only Palestine.

Cosuisn Dave

As a New Yorker I agree with you that thankfully the rest of the country does not think like New York does. As for British anti Semitism, no doubt that Jews in the UK can rise to the highest office, yet for some reason (left over bitterness from 1946-48) the British have never forgivern the Jews for getting their independence. I don't know why as other colonial states fought far bloodier wars with the UK and all seems to have been forgiven - Ireland, Cyprus, Kenya, India, etc. I am just amazed that the British public does not recognize that beloved "Auntie" i.e. the BBC, has pulled the wool over its eyes.

To follow up a bit on tigger2005 and craig1f: What you are discussing looks like another thing that Islam seems to have absorbed from the early-20th-century Left. The propensity to regard anything and anyone that fails to treat one with total deference as an "offense" requiring retaliation is a Marxist pretense. Of course, in the real world, no one goes through life without being inconvienced at some point, so eventually being "offended" is inevitable. Thus, the "offended" person has the rationalization needed to take action on whatever frustrations they may have experienced. Or, to put it less charitably: They already had the terrorist sympathies; they're just looking for an excuse, and for that purpose one thing will do as well as another.

#140

you're

AAAAARRRGGGGHHHH

PIMF

#141 Joel: Thanks for your reply. One thing that I think I missed is that, after all that's happened since, the circumstance of Israel's creation still seem to be an issue for the average Brit. That's an area of history I don't know much about, so I need to go do some reading.

Strawberry alert!

Here's some information about how strawberries are grown. They need hot weather, or else-it's greenhouse time. So, presumably-the Palestinian children were picking greenhouse strawberries?

Most cultivars grow well under cool climatic conditions. However, temperatures below -0.5°C can cause severe damage to full blooms. The temperatures in European countries like Holland, Belgium, U.K. and Germany are below freezing point for a prolonged period of time during winter. Spain and Italy also have very cold winters. Growers in these countries have adopted various methods of "forced cultivation" for off-season strawberry production to take advantage of the high market prices during winter. In Holland and Belgium, strawberries are grown in glasshouses during winter using bags and pots filled with a peat-based substrate. Strawberries are also ‘forced’ under polyethylene tunnels in Spain, Italy, France, U.K. and Germany. In Israel, strawberries are cultivated under polyethylene tunnels and in greenhouses using PVC troughs and styrofoam containers filled with soilless media like a mixture of coconut coir and perlite.

Oh-and strawberries are apparently bisexual and "self-polinated"...Not that there's anything wrong with that!

More details from the NY Slimes:

Palestinians fired four mortars in the morning, wounding an Israeli civilian in an industrial zone on the northern edge of Gaza, the Israeli military said. Another mortar nearly hit a school bus carrying children in northern Gaza, the military added.

[Link: nytimes.com...]

Notice how the fact that the Palestinian had already hit a freaking school bus that morning gets absolutely no mention? Nah, it's just those damn Zionists shooting innocent children frollicking in the strawberry patch.

#139 papajoe: Thanks for the link. That's an excellent article. I'll have to finish reading it later, but from what I've read so far, I'm struck by Kaplan's contrast between legal examination (what happens e.g. in a courtroom, following carefully established procedures for adjucation), and what the MSM engages in -- no-holds-barred moral examination of, effectively, a person's inherent worthiness. (And all the while denying that their examinations are morals-based. They are -- it's just not a values set that most of us are familiar with.)

It's amazing how rocket/mortar/rpg firing jihad warrior/martyrs magically morph into harmless, innocent civilians subsequent to their well deserved liquidation.

#12 Craig 1f -

I gotta side with the Palestinians on this one, given what the article says.

You're a tool. The reason why Palestinian terrorists shield themselves with stone-throwing kids is that they know there are plenty of cretins like you who will give them the public relations coup they crave.

#147 Cousin Dave

It gets much better.

#149

Learn to scan through all the comments before flinging names.

The post hadn't been updated before I posted that. At the time, the information was "7 kids killed in a strawberry field."

#85 American Infidel
Of course the tsunami was Allah's punishment of Christians because just like terrorists blowing up 25 or 30 Iraqis to get one American (maybe), it is preferable to "sacrifice" 100,000 Muslims to get a few thousand Infidels.
The Muslims should be grateful to go Heaven as martyrs to the cause of purifying the world of unbelievers.
And those Muslims shouldn't have allowed Christians into their countries in the first place. All Bin Laden was doing with 9/11 (as he said was revenge for, and to force the US out of Saudi Arabia) was trying to save his people from Allah's wrath on his homeland. That's why OBL is a hero.
/wish that was sarcasm

#145 WriterMom:
Thanks for the update.

BTW, did you catch CBC Radio at the top of the hour? Amazingly, they gave the report from "Israeli military sources" and didn't mention anything about children in strawberry fields. Although, come to think of it, that might have been the local CBC station.

151 craig1F

I think some people get frustrated for precisely that reason -- people rely on media accounts tinged with hatred of Israel to form and sustain a negative impression of Israel. Kudos to you for in this case taking the time to learn the real facts. If everyone were like you, this problem wouldn't exist.

#153 cba

I refuse to listen to that drek...feh! But, now I think that there is serious doubt as to whether or not there could possibly even be strawberry "fields" in January in Israel. This could turn out to be a total fantasy of the 'reporter'.

To those who were commenting on the "Strawberry Killing Fields"
Here is a link to Haaretz reporting on the incident:

The IDF confirmed that troops fired a tank shell at the Palestinians, saying the target was a rocket-launching terror cell. An initial investigation indicated that most of the Palestinians killed were members of the military wing of Hamas, the army said.

A Palestinian farmer who gave only his first name, Suleiman, said militants had been firing mortar shells from among strawberry patches and potato fields when IDF troops returned fire.

Before the IDF tank fire, Palestinians fired four mortar shells at the industrial zone, one of which landed near a school bus, and two Qassam rockets at the Negev town of Sderot. A few hours after the incident, Palestinians fired two more Qassam rockets at Sderot, leaving three people suffering from shock.

But unfortunately, for craig1f and others, the lie has been cast.

#71 Craig 1f -

Given new information, I retract post #12

And I'll retract post #149. My blood pressure goes through the roof when someone gets duped by Palestinian propaganda. My apologies.

Remember, it's only a tiny minority of violent extremists who've hijacked this peaceful religion.
/dorian grey

#154

I refer you to my post, #122.

Craig 1f,

And what do you mean by "Palestine" -- Gaza and the West Bank? The word "Palestine" is itself a propaganda term.

#160

Don't really care. You know I mean Gaza and the West bank when I say Palestine. And I get my point across in fewer keystrokes. Except for now, where I have to explain myself.

I don't even know the whole history, all I know is if Israel didn't exist, the Palestinians would find someone else to blame their misery on. If the Palestinians didn't exist, Israel wouldn't have to armor-plate their school buses.

#141 Joel

yet for some reason (left over bitterness from 1946-48) the British have never forgivern the Jews for getting their independence.

I know of an Israeli couple who had a harrowing experience in London, last year, while visiting some London Jews who cursed them and Israel for "giving British Jews a bad name".

craig1f, I give you a lot of credit for hanging in and educating yourself. In that vein I would like to comment on something you wrote in #161:

if Israel didn't exist, the Palestinians would find someone else to blame their misery on

Close, but no cigar. If Israel didn't exist, there wouldn't be any Palestinians. At least, not in reference to Arabs.

Before 1948, "Palestinian" referred to Jews who lived there. In fact, for many years my parents in England volunteered for a fundraising organization called the Joint Palestine Appeal. It was only some time in the late 60s or early 70s that the JPA was renamed the Joint Israel Appeal.

In fact, it must have been well into the 70s--a cousin of mine, soon after the Yom Kippur War, had made a point of reading a propaganda sheet put out by some Arab organization. He put an ad in one edition that said, "Support peace in the Middle East--Give to the Joint Palestine Appeal."

I got a kick out of that.

#163

Gotcha, that's making slightly more sense. I see why the other guy said that saying "palestinian" is a propaganda term now.

Why is it that the press is extremely cynical and distrustful of the US President, and yet is assumed this piece of work is to be believed? It is maddening.

#136 craig1f
You're fairly young, aren't you? No insult but you're doing a pretty good job of repeating recent psychological theory popular in the public schools. You learned well, whether your grades reflected it or not.
No, the MSM does not have a general "inspire them toward the good" or "treat people as if they were good and theywill become good."
They (MSM) are chaging the definition of moderate to reflect the relativity premise: compared to the worst of the terrorists (those actually shooting at the moment) Abu IS a moderate. He's only talking right now. When he starts shooting, he will still be a moderate, compared to the suicide bombers. When he straps on a suicide vest, he will be a moderate compared to a truck bomber.
Journalism is butchering the English language through the use of generalism instead of precise terminology.
It's no wonder there are so many inaccurate reports, they don't know the complete meanings of the words they are using or the context in which they are appropriate.
For example, my Grandaughter's "Cultural Literacy" class (what used to be middle school English) just had a list of definitions where Hitler was defined as a very bad dictator. Nothing else, no context. They won't get to WWII until June, if at all this year.
During the elections, they had discussions where some of the kids picked up the Bush=Hitler crap and used it. No explanation from any teachers about why Mein Fuerher was in a class of his own. So these kids aren't disturbed by the comparison because they don't know what it is.
These kids are learning to write using all sorts of colorful colloquialisms with only the most superficial notion of what they mean. They aren't being told what's wrong with this. As a result, they are writing essays that may sound like a college composition but is so full of distortion, it's ridiculous, and they genuinly don't know it.
Journalism today is an adjective/adverb pissing contest.

164 craig1f,

Yes, what I was attempting to communicate, albeit inarticulately, is that there has never been a state called "Palestine." Eighty percent of what was historically called "Palestine" is now under the control of the Jordan. The remainder is now Israel proper, the West Bank and Gaza. So when you refer to the West Bank and Gaza as "Palestine", you are adopting the language of the propagandists.

Interestingly, the Arabs no damn well that "Palestine" refers to what is now Israel proper. That is why the Palestine Liberation Organization (and Hamas and all the others) have always maintained that the goal is to "liberate" Palestine, ie, destroy Israel.

Here's more:

MYTH

“Israel usurped all of Palestine in 1948.”

FACT
Nearly 80 percent of what was the historic land of Palestine and the Jewish National Home, as defined by the League of Nations, was severed by the British in 1921 and allocated to what became Transjordan. Jewish settlement there was barred. The UN partitioned the remaining 20-odd percent of Palestine into two states. With Jordan’s annexation of the West Bank in 1950, and Egypt's control of Gaza, Arabs controlled more than 80 percent of the territory of the Mandate, while the Jewish State held a bare 17.5 percent.6a

[Link: www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...]

Good news via Haaretz

IDF finds no evidence of missing personnel following Palestinian report officer and soldier were kidnapped

I'll always said that the british PM and Foreign mInistry should get on their knees and beg forgiveness form the jews for their inactions during WW2 in Europe, and the sum total of their actions in the MiddleEeast beginning with the fall of the Ottoman Empire.

Doesn't look like that's gonna happen, does it?

Get on the Abbas Bus:

Election campaign posters showing late Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and interim Palestinian leader and presidential front-runner Mahmoud Abbas are seen on a vehicle during Abbas' campaign rally at the Palestinian town of Rafah in Gaza Strip, Tuesday Jan. 4, 2005. Palestinian are going to the polls on Jan. 9 to elect the successor for the late Yasser Arafat. (AP Photo/Muhammed Muheisen)

Funny, the media seem to be completely ignoring the other "candidates."

#170 SoCalJustice:
See my #119.

(#171) cba

Thanks - exactly.

And I'm sure the Fatah-run media in "Palestine" is devoting equal time to all the "candidates" as well.

At any rate, President Carter will tell us about the "free, fair, spirited and democratic" election after it's over anyway.

I look forward to no mention whatsoever of Zakaria Zubeidi carrying around Abbas on his shoulders in the forthcoming Carter Center "report."

#112 Powder Finger:

True enough--backing away from their false moon-god would be a great start--but then the fuslims would need some religion to fill the void.

Without the Real One True God to worship; surely the dupe-cake fuslims would fall prey to some other Jew-hating, false pedophile prophet, who'd have them unrolling their prayer rugs at least 8 or 9 times a day.

I'm talkin' long-term solution here, and in my post #82.

SoCalJustice (#170)

We had ice-cream trucks, they have ... something else.

By the way, has Abbas always been this queenie, what with the kaffiya draped just so.

#122 Tigger 2005

When my husband and I were traveling in Ireland, several years ago, we were frequently stopped at airports, by security; my poor husband, unfortunately, bore a strong resemblance to an IRA gunman, who was on the loose just then.

It wasn't fun, but neither one of us turned to terrorism, because of it (and we both despise the IRA).

#134 Cousin Dave

An excellent post! You make some very good points.

Charles Johnson

Extry! Read all about it! Holocaust-denying Palestinian front-runner (only-runner, actually) Abu Mazen uses antisemitic language! Reuters says it’s “the first time!” Extry! Abbas Assails ‘Zionist Enemy’ After Tank Kills

As you well know, Zionism isn’t an anti-Semitic word.

Dictionary definition:

an international movement orig. for the establishment of a Jewish national or religious community in Palestine and later for the support of modern Israel

[Link: www.m-w.com...]

A few current groups of the top of my head: World Zionist Organisation, Women's Zionist Organization of America, The Zionist Federation Of Australia and Hovevei Tsion (Lovers of Zion).

Are these groups anti-Semitic?

Fact is Zionism is a political ideology. Not all Zionists are Jews and not all Jews are Zionists.

(#177) A.P.

As you well know, Zionism isn’t an anti-Semitic word.

He didn't write that "Zionism" was an antisemitic word.

He wrote that the phrase "Zionist Enemy" constitutes antisemitic language.

There is something called context.

I fail to see how this language is anti-Semitic.

#177 An Phalaistin

As you well know, Zionism isn’t an anti-Semitic word.

In this context, it is an anti-semitic word, Philistine.

A best seller in the Arab world is "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" which is an anti-semitic pile of garbage that allegedly describes evil Joooooos plotting to take over the world.

Egypt had a 46 part series (or something like that) on it fairly recently.

When Arabs start HISSING "the Zionist entity" or "the Zionist enemy," they are referring to a 100 year old blood libel.

What is your agenda or did I miss it?

Correction to my #180: The description of evil Jooooos is quite real in black and white in the blood libel "Protocols."

The LIE is that Jooooos wrote this as a "How We Can Be Our Evil Selves and Take Over the World When We Aren't Busy Cooking Non-Jewish Children's Blood in Our Food.'

(#179) A.P

Used in this particular context, it is used to delegitimize the existence of the state of Israel.

I think that's pretty clear.

Another example of a non-benign use of the word Zionist/Zionism.

Far-right wing Americans (neo-nazis, the KKK), and now some far-left wing Americans often refer to the U.S. gov't as ZOG - meaning "Zionist Occupied Government" (read: the Jews run America).

Do you fail to see how that is antisemitic language too?

I mean, "Zionist" isn't an antisemitic word, right?

Also, let's not forget the infamous "Zionism is Racism" vote in the UN.

It was overturned later, but it took a long time.

Jews protecting their lives in self-defense is racist in many people's eyes.

I fail to see how this language is anti-Semitic.

Why am I not surprised.

abu mazen's views are those of arafart. The whole 'election' process is an illegitimate sham. This is because the arabs calling themselves palestinians are an illegitimate 'people'. They never existed before 1967 and in truth they have never existed. They never had a land called palestine because their roots are almost entirely in surrounding arab states. Their purpose in wanting a palestine of their own is merely a stage in the elimination Israel and Jews.

So abu mazen (who wrote a book denying the Holocaust and who is NOT any sort of moderate) may win and he may lose. Whoever replaces arafart will be just the same. The purpose of the arabs (and here I refer to all the arabs) and the muslims is to kill Jews and deny the legitimate birtright of the Jewish People - the land given to the Jews by G-d.

Tony Blair may not think there is a clash of civilisations between the west and mohammedpigism, but he doesn't live in Hevron.

#179 An Phalaistin

"I fail to see how this language is anti-semetic."

You would.

(Heh, heh, heh, sez Fritzie the Talking Kamel!)

Down the street from us there is this big election poster of Abu Mazen no doubt proclaiming his candidacy in the upcoming election (the notice is in Arabic). The posters 3 by 4 meters are in the soviet "heroic" style made famous by Stalin and Lenin's experience in "democracy". Since there is effectively only one serious candidate allowed to run in this election. So perhaps no one is telling palestinians how to vote while in the voting booth, but the clear message is that there is only one leader and one path. No debate. What brings this to my attention is the relatively high level US delegation here to "supervise" the election. What are they supervising? That the regime doesn't inflate it's figures for a victory from 90% to 95%?

Very late to this thread, but it mystifies me.

Since when is "dog bites man" news?

If you go back to April 2003 and read the speech that Abbas made when he accepted the position of Prime Minster of the PNA, it's perfectly clear that he is not interested in any sort of "peace" that is compatible with the survival of Israel as a Jewish state. Among other things, he calls each and every terrorist detained by Israel an honorable hero that must be released, and that he insists that every measure undertaken by Israel for purposes of self-defense represents unjust oppression. And then there's this gem:

The government will concentrate on the question of security. Our understanding of security is the security of Palestinian citizens in their homeland.

You have to pull isolated fragments of that speech out of context in order to make Abbas out as a moderate. He states, as plainly as anyone could ask, that the conflict will continue until every PLO demand is met, including dismantlement of every settlement and a "just resolution" of the refugee issue based on the Arab League's position.

Daniel Pipes says it very well in his column in the NY Sun today - Palestinian Word Games

We read that "Prime Minister" Abbas is running in the elections on Sunday to succeed Yasser Arafat as "president" of "Palestine."

Excuse me, but prime minister, according to the Encyclopedia Britannica, means the "head of the executive branch of government in states with a parliamentary system." Despite tens of thousands of references to Mr. Abbas as prime minister, he in not a single way fits this description.

Oh, and there is also the matter of there being no country called Palestine. Arab maps show it in place of Israel. The U.N. recognizes its existence. So, too, do certain telephone companies - for example, France's Bouygues Telecom and Bell Canada. Nonetheless, no such place exists. One can dismiss use of these terms as symptoms of the same unrealism that has undermined Palestinian Arab war efforts since 1948. But they also promote the Palestinian Arab cause (a polite way of saying "the destruction of Israel") in a vital way.

In an era when the battle for public opinion has an importance that rivals the clash of soldiers, the Palestinian Arabs' success in framing the issues has won them critical support among politicians, editorial writers, academics, street demonstrators, and NGO activists. In the aggregate, these many auxiliaries keep the Palestinian Arab effort alive.

Especially in a long-standing dispute with a static situation on the ground, public opinion has great significance. That's because words reflect ideas, and ideas motivate people. Weapons in themselves are inert; today, ideas inspire people to pick up arms or sacrifice their lives. Software drives hardware.

Israel is winning on the basic geographic nomenclature. The state is known in English as Israel, not the Zionist entity. Its capital is called Jerusalem, not Al-Quds. Likewise, Temple Mount and Western Wall enjoy far more currency than Al-Haram ash-Sharif or Al-Buraq. The separation barrier is more often called a security fence (keeping out Palestinian Arab suicide bombers) than a separation wall (bringing to mind divided Berlin).

What we have here, as Pipes defines, is nothing more than Reuters and AFP spinning their propaganda to keep the Palestinian Arab effort alive.

Abbas, if elected, will not change anything. Nothing really will change as long as the lies of the Arab effort are encouraged and covered by the UN, other Arab Nations, France, NGO's, and willing accomplices in the global media.

Note that Pipes glosses over the greatest word game of them all: the Palestinian Arabs have co-opted the term "Palestinian," a verbal trick that immediately turns the Arabs into the occupied and the Jews into the occupiers.

Note that Pipes glosses over the greatest word game of them all: the Palestinian Arabs have co-opted the term "Palestinian," a verbal trick that immediately turns the Arabs into the occupied and the Jews into the occupiers.

Exactly.

This is the word that also turned this from a David and Goliath battle where it was a few million Jews versus hundreds of millions of Arabs INTO a David and Goliath battle where it's a fewer million Arabs (David) against the HUGE GIGANTIC Goliath of Israel's IDF.

Most people used to call this conflict the Arab-Israeli conflict.

Now it's mostly called the Israeli-Palestinian conflict (as if Israel is the aggressor against a pitiful little people who have done nothing wrong.)

It's been an effective word game for a long time. We've ALL got to work on putting an end to this.