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NYT: Saddam Had WMD Capabilities

Mon, Mar 14, 2005 at 1:24:06 pm PST

Here’s an amazing reversal from the New York Times, who reported yesterday that Iraq had facilities for enriching uranium and manufacturing chemical and biological weapons that were looted immediately after the fall of Baghdad and taken to a neighboring state: Looting at Weapons Plants Was Systematic, Iraqi Says. (Hat tip: American Infidel.)

BAGHDAD, Iraq, March 12 - In the weeks after Baghdad fell in April 2003, looters systematically dismantled and removed tons of machinery from Saddam Hussein’s most important weapons installations, including some with high-precision equipment capable of making parts for nuclear arms, a senior Iraqi official said this week in the government’s first extensive comments on the looting.

The Iraqi official, Sami al-Araji, the deputy minister of industry, said it appeared that a highly organized operation had pinpointed specific plants in search of valuable equipment, some of which could be used for both military and civilian applications, and carted the machinery away.

Dr. Araji said his account was based largely on observations by government employees and officials who either worked at the sites or lived near them.

“They came in with the cranes and the lorries, and they depleted the whole sites,” Dr. Araji said. “They knew what they were doing; they knew what they want. This was sophisticated looting.”

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176 comments

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1 yochanan  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:25:07am

wmd's found at the new york times

2 BabbaZee  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:25:39am

So now that their G-d has spoken, will they listen?

3 rightasrain  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:27:08am

The DU Inmates will ask, "Who has taken the NYT hostage?"

4 Ariel  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:27:17am

I thought that BUSH LIED! about the WMD. I'm so confused now.

Anyone remember the poll results that showed that Fox viewers were more likely to believe that Saddam had WMD? And how many folks touted those to show that Fox viewers were uninformed?

5 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:28:25am

NYTimes lied! KosKidz died!

6 IMMORTAL_CTHULHU  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:28:46am

#2 BabbaZee

So now that their G-d has spoken, will they listen?

No. Having their cherished beliefs dismembered will cause their little pointy heads to rotate 360 degrees, ala Linda Blair in 'The Exorcist'.

7 Nancy  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:28:59am

I wonder how long the NYT has known this.

8 Buck  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:29:44am

There were no WMD's and the Bush regime allowed them to be looted...

Give me a break.

9 Wino  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:29:48am

I've been saying from the start that the Kurds knew he had WMD.

And as for this being "looting," it was not. It was premeditated theft... "came in with the cranes and the lorries" is not what looters do.

10 jhn1  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:30:01am

The vast MSM won't tell this story. It conflicts with the efforts to blame everything on the "evil chimp bushitler".
We need to replace the majority of the "journalists" and even more of the editors and exec producers in this country.

11 newton  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:30:49am

Well, well, well...

I believe something even bigger is going to be revealed in the next few days or weeks re: WMD's.

I suspect it will be something that will make all of those leftists eat a Syria-size serving of crow...

12 Peacekeeper  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:31:43am

New York Times ucovers truth: buries it again on A9

13 American Infidel[deleted]  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:32:17am
14 moonsbreath  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:32:25am

We just might get that chance to inspect Bakka Valley afterall.

15 W-lover  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:33:01am

But...but...but, I thought there were no WMDs! Do you mean to tell me the MSM lied to me?! Oh! The humanity!

16 locutus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:33:06am

Obviously Rove controls the NYT now...

/LLL

17 TMF  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:33:09am

Id love to see the hand wringing that went into this story:

"I reaaallly want to report a story that will make Bush look bad and that the occupation has been mishandled etc...


but, this story means ADMITTING THAT THE WAR WAS TOTALLY JUSTIFIED.

"Oh well, guess Ill have to suck it up..."

18 lawhawk  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:33:52am

WMD at NYT? Writers of Mass Distraction. Absolutely.

So, we're now coming on two years from the invasion and WMD is suddenly an issue that the Times wants to highlight? Now they're running on the theory that Saddam had more than the ISG said they did, but we didn't do enough to secure things in the aftermath?

Can someone keep this story straight. It's hurting my logic circuits.

19 vxbush  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:33:56am

But the article isn't exactly nice to the Bush administration...

but the installations were left largely unguarded by allied forces in the chaotic months after the invasion.

Translation: "Not enough troops!"

20 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:34:13am

I notice 7W is no longer beneath the floor humper.

Thank you, Charles.

21 bruiser  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:34:17am

The backpedaling moonbats will claim that this proves nothing. Since the looters stole equipment that had merely the capability to produce WMDs, but served an equally mundane civilian use as well, unless you can prove that those exact pieces of machinery were used in the timeframe of 2001 - 2003 to produce actual tangible WMDs, then this proves nothing. Chimpy McBushitler still lied and people still died. We support the troops, bring them home.

*barf*

22 jahannah  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:34:41am

Ooops! Even though all of the mainstream press takes its cue from the NYT, how much you want to be that this will be one story not widely picked up?

23 carl p  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:35:12am

We have seen this before; Rove and his minions tug the strings of the MSM and the neoCon Bu$Hitler warmongers will howl with delight

/Kos

24 ronaldusmagnus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:35:18am

How long till the MSM editorial boards turn this into:

"Bush screwed up - allowed looting under right under his nose and now the bad guys have all the doomsday machine parts stashed away."

I say less than 24 hours.

25 alkmyst  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:35:22am

Speaking of Anthrax,

for any NYC lizards that want to hear a talk on Bioterror, my sources tell me that there will be one tomorrow at Polytechnic University in Brooklyn. Will provide time details when I dig up the flyer for it.

26 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:35:31am

There were no WMD and Bush lied to take us into an illegal and unjustifiable war that would wreck havoc on the 'stability' of the Middle East'.

The Iraq elections will be a disaster that will simply confirm the wrongheadedness of the Bush administration and lead to a civil war.

The tide of democracy is stirring in the Middle East and stands to redefine the oppressive, dictatorial regimes that have subjugated the people for a century.

Te equipment for producing the non-existent chemical, biological and nuclear weapons was looted after the invasion and its all Bush's fault.

My head hurts

27 Saltmarsh  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:36:08am

NYT editor removes head from ass. Looks around. Sees his shadow. Puts head back up ass.

28 Norwegian kafir  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:36:11am

Turkish Guides twist Gallipoli into a `holy jihad'

Unlicensed Turkish tour guides who claim the Gallipoli campaign was a "holy jihad" decided by the hand of Allah. In lectures delivered on the battlefields, the guides tell their audiences that "Muslim saints" repelled Allied artillery attacks and enemy soldiers were swallowed by a "green mist". The lectures have sparked outrage across Turkey – but The Advertiser has learned senior members of the Turkish Government are now backing them. It is all part of a wider agenda to promote Turkey's Islamic connections and play down the role of Ataturk."

French trial highlights role of friendship in Muslim militant groups

Menad Benchellali allegedly mixed toxic potions in his mother's jars of facial cream at their apartment in Venissieux, outside Lyon, while his father, Chellali Benchellali, collected money for Muslim Chechen rebels at the makeshift mosque he ran. A third son, Mourad, ended up in the U.S. prison at Guantanamo Bay, along with a friend. Both were returned home in July. When questioned about visits and favors for acquaintances, some of the defendants in the U.S. Embassy bomb plot trial showed surprise at what they said was a way of life. ``Where's the problem?'' said Lefkir when asked about services he rendered to suspect friends. ``We Muslims are like that.''

29 Iron Dave  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:36:24am

If it's sophisticated, is it really still looting?

Maybe it's more of a forced re-location, and wouldn't we like to know by whom and to where?

30 dirac-delta  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:36:44am

Let the truth be known, however

You can not expand the horizon of a narrow mind...

31 Evil Squirrel  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:36:49am

Wait? Why isn't this the biggest story of the year?

32 locutus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:37:11am

#21

the looters stole equipment that had merely the capability to produce WMDs, but served an equally mundane civilian use as well,

Those uranium centrifuges can be used to make ice cream, balloons, and those kites that the Iraqi children loved to fly, before Bush killed all of them

/LLL

33 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:37:25am

#24 ronaldusmagnus
Oceania is at war with Eurasia. Oceania has always been at war with Eurasis...

34 sms111  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:37:26am

#21

Since the looters stole equipment that had merely the capability to produce WMDs, but served an equally mundane civilian use as well

... including some with high-precision equipment capable of making parts for nuclear arms, a senior Iraqi official said this week in the government’s first extensive comments on the looting.

The Iraqi official, Sami al-Araji, the deputy minister of industry, said it appeared that a highly organized operation had pinpointed specific plants in search of valuable equipment, some of which could be used for both military and civilian applications

Key phrase is "some of which." I'll bet the high-precision equipment capable of making parts for nuclear arms wasn't in the "some of which" category...

35 eschew_obfuscation  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:37:41am

...Carl Rove hired Israelis posing as Mukhabarat to secretly move the WMD to the Bekaa valley so he sould *find* them later to embarrass us...

/LLL

36 alkmyst  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:37:46am

#14 moonsbreath 3/14/2005 01:32PM PST
We just might get that chance to inspect Bakka Valley afterall.

Why do you think that Asshat pulled his troops back there?

37 Old Dad  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:39:00am

Hmmm...timing is everything. Looks like the WMD trail to Syria is getting hot. Looks like former regime types might be getting spooked. So the WMD materials were "looted" in a very sophisticated way "after" the fall of Baghdad.

Yeah right. The stuff is in Syria and it left before OIF started.

Mark my words.

38 J.D.  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:39:14am

kos attributes it to "Rumsfeld's Incompetence". 316 comments.

39 dhimmishelter  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:39:17am

I will now await the sound of apologies from Howeird Dean, Nancy Pelousy, Hairy Reed, John Skerry, Dick (no name change needed) Durbin, Mich-Al Moore, Allah Sharpton., Boobra Boxer, and the other assorted quislings, nitwits, and charlatans to apologize for "BUSH LIED" comments made over the past three years. I am sure they will be holding news conferences anytime now to make amends.

(...crickets chirping, occastional sound of the egg beater used by Senator Boxer to style her hair)

Oh well, I am sure anytime now we'll be hearing the mea culpas.

Guess I should not hold my breath.

40 scoreboard44  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:39:41am

12# Peacekeeper

That...was good.

41 carl p  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:39:45am

What company was in Iraq prior to the fall of Baghdad that has cranes and lorries?; one word: HALIBURTON

/LLL

42 Ward Cleaver  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:40:02am

No freakin' way! The evil KKKarl Rove has taken over the NYT!

/kos kidz and DU inmates

43 Gagdad Bob  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:40:14am

You don't get it. There were never any weapons, and it's Bush's fault that they're missing. But if the non-existent missing "weapons" are ever found, it will have nothing to do with Bush.

44 Powderfinger  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:40:32am

#9 wino

And as for this being "looting," it was not. It was premeditated theft... "came in with the cranes and the lorries" is not what looters do.

I'm having the same problem, except I'm not so sure you can call it theft either. I'd venture a guess that it was likely part of the regime's plan all along.

Looting makes it sound like a crime we let happen, which, of course, is why they used the term.

45 ronaldusmagnus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:40:35am

#33 JohnSteele

I wonder...of what would Orwell write today?

46 bigwilly  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:41:13am

WMDs in Iraq? How fascinating. Five minutes ago, the cry was "Saddam had no WMDs; the whole reason for the war was so Bushitler's buddies at Halliburton could make more money." Now, it's "Bushitler can't even manage a decent war! If John Kerry were in charge, you can bet those WMDs would have been secured!"

What a joke.

47 jesusland joe  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:41:21am

The WMD was moved to Syria and the Bekaa Valley prior to the US invasion of Iraq. I have been hearing these rumors for a long time.


A guy at a site called the Arkansas Bushwacker and the Parrott Mountain Bully Boys(I know, strange name) has been reporting this for quite some time.


If you are interested, go to his site and get caught up on all things military. I found him to be quite believable.

48 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:41:58am

The other report that I found fascinating is that Rolf Ekeus, arguably the best head of the UN Iraq weapons inspection program, told the Telegraph that Tariq Aziz offered him $2 million to "fix" his WMD reports.

So the Iraqis offered the head of the inspection program $2 million to cover up the fact that they didn't have WMD? I feel sorry for the old Saddam regime, they were so deeply into bribery and corruption that they felt it necessary to bribe people even when there was no reason to bribe them --- now thats corruption.

49 locutus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:42:01am

#43

You don't get it. There were never any weapons, and it's Bush's fault that they're missing. But if the non-existent missing "weapons" are ever found, it will have nothing to do with Bush.

10 PRINT "BUSH LIED"
20 GOTO 10

50 alkmyst  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:42:30am
#40 scoreboard44 3/14/2005 01:39PM PST
12# Peacekeeper
That...was good.

I missed that the first time round - yeah, that was real good :-)

They never seem to put down their shovels, do they?

51 Wallace  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:42:39am

HANS isn't going to like this.

52 scoreboard44  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:42:53am

This story is dead. Going nowhere. Until they dig up the dead bones in the Bekka valley, this dinosaur ain't gonna hunt.

Weapons material that could be used for the contruction on nuclear weapons. Right. Never happen.

53 Joel  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:43:19am

Saddam himself along with the entire Baathist edifice was a WMD.

54 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:43:23am

#38 J.D.

kos attributes it to "Rumsfeld's Incompetence". 316 comments.


Does that mean he acknowledges the presence of such capabilites?

One can't have it both ways, either there were WMD capabilities which weren't properly guarded, or, there weren't such capabilities, in which case they didn't need any guarding.

55 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:43:51am

#45 ronaldusmagnus
Three guesses and the first three don't count...

56 carl p  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:44:18am

OMG!

4th comment on KOS:

they didn't send enough troops.

Maybe that was intentional because they didn't want to protect all of these sites in the days after the war. Halliburton had the cranes, the trucks and the personnel on the ground in Iraq; they also had the knowledge to loot all of these facilities in a systematic and professional way. Why is everyone assuming that it was done by Iraqis or Iranian agents? I have a low opinion of Rumsfeld but I have a hard time believing anyone is this incompetent. When and how the looting happened at each site, and who might have done it, is definitely worth investigating.

/srbaxley

I am getting too good at predicting moonbat response tactics.

57 dennisw  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:44:22am

U.N. to Register Property Damage in Israel
[Link: story.news.yahoo.com...]

RAMALLAH, West Bank - U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan (news - web sites) said Monday the United Nations (news - web sites) is establishing a register of property damage caused by Israel's West Bank separation barrier, as hundreds of Palestinians protested the barrier outside the walled Palestinian government compound where he spoke.

Israel began building the West Bank structure two years ago, saying its aim was to keep out Palestinian attackers. Palestinians insist the real intention is to grab West Bank land and draw a final border without waiting for a peace deal. One-third of the structure has been completed.

Annan spoke to reporters after meeting with Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas.

"We have also been asked to establish a register to register damages and claims and that is going ahead," he said. "In fact I had a chance to discuss it this morning with President Abbas, and we are establishing that register to be able in time to help those with claims."

Annan said the U.N. position on the barrier was clear, reflecting an anti-barrier resolution passed by the General Assembly and an advisory opinion by the International Court of Justice that found it to be illegal.

As Annan spoke, Palestinian policemen restrained hundreds of demonstrators at the main gate of the ...

58 J.D.  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:44:44am

#54 pure francis
That detail seems lost on them, at least as far down as I read the comments.

59 Dayenu  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:44:55am

WHO WANTS TO TAKE A BET?

I bet that if they found actual nuclear weapons, ready to launch, aimed at Washington D.C., the critics would STILL claim the war was not justified, and that Iraq has ever right to have WMD as we do.

Any takers?

60 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:45:26am

#51 Wallace

What's Blix upto these days?

(Apart from asserting that Iran has a right to nuclear facilities.)

61 alkmyst  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:45:39am
#49 locutus 3/14/2005 01:42PM PST

10 PRINT "BUSH LIED"
20 GOTO 10

LOLexcellent
A fool with a keyboard is a dangerous thing

Ok, gotta jet y'all, punchin that card...

62 paul in Va  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:46:11am
The recent monitoring agency report said Unmovic had asked Iraq's neighbors if they were aware of whether any equipment under agency monitoring had moved in or through their countries. Syrian officials, it said, replied that "no relevant scrap from Iraq had passed through Syria." The agency, the report added, had yet to receive a response from Iran and Saudi Arabia.


No? Ok. Nothing to see here, move along.

63 scoreboard44  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:46:18am

Or they were'nt being guarded 'cause most of the bad boys fled by then OR...

It had been arranged ahead of time that should it look like Bagdad was going to fall, Syrian troops would escort the equipment back to their country for safekeeping.

64 ronaldusmagnus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:46:30am

#55 JohnSteele

Stop it - yer killin' me.

65 lancekates  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:46:33am

does this have anything to do with the shipments of weapons that went to Syria to be buried shortly before we attacked? (as seen by satelites run by Israeli inteligence)

66 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:46:41am

#47 jesusland joe

John Loftus has been saying this for years. Two weeks ago on Fox he said that the Syrians are pulling back to the Bekkah Valley because they almost have no choice but to stay --- if they leave the WMD sh*t will hit the fan. According to him the stuff is not "stored" there, its "dumped" there.

67 Powderfinger  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:47:14am

#38 J.D.

Speaking of dkos:

Negroponte's Personal Bodyguard Shot Sgrena

The U.S. government now says that John Negroponte was passing through the area and it was one of his crew who fired the bullet that killed Calipari.

Scuttlebutt is that Sgrena has information embarrassing to the U.S. and Negroponte put out a hit on her and told them to make it look like another Iraqi speeding ticket. Supposedly it was his own personal bodyguard who fired the shot.

Anybody have any other information on this? Seems like it could be a big deal. What is it that Sgrena knows that would cause Negroponte to want her dead? Is she talking?

68 lancekates  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:47:39am

#59 Dayenu

That's because it was a war for oil... that's why the price of oil keeps dropping like it does...

< crickets chirping>

69 Promethea  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:47:52am

So...do you lizardoids think the U.S. is going to attack Syria or invade the Bekkaa Valley and crush Hezbollah and dig up those WMDs?

Cuz that's what I'd like to do.

Unless the U.S. has some other, more devious plan.

If you think it has a more devious plan, what do you think this plan is?

70 Saltmarsh  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:48:18am

Shouldn't it have been "suspected looters"?

71 Ariel  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:49:27am

Dayenu #59 - no chance of taking that bet. I know someone who has a Harvard undergrad degree and believes that even if the US is nuked we shouldn't respond in kind.

72 zulubaby  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:49:52am
So...do you lizardoids think the U.S. is going to attack Syria or invade the Bekkaa Valley and crush Hezbollah and dig up those WMDs?

I think Israel is getting ready to do it. Or maybe the US will take care of Syria and Israel will take care of Iran.

73 zulubaby  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:50:28am

Sorry, that's in response to Promethea (#69).

74 vxbush  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:50:36am

#72 zulubaby

I'm with you. I think Israel is more likely to move first on it.

75 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:50:53am

#69 Promethea

My 'guess' is that:
a) we know where the stuff is;
b) we have it under close watch to make sure it stays there and would move on it if we absolutely have to;
c) we'd prefer some else to 'find' it.

76 lancekates  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:51:05am

#71 Ariel

What a waste of money. I know LOTS of people who think that, and most didn't even go to Community College. They should demand a refund.

77 locutus  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:51:38am

#69

Unless the U.S. has some other, more devious plan.

Never underestimate Lord Rove

78 lancekates  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:52:51am

#77 Locutus

Never underestimate Lord Rove

"We are Rove... you will be assimilated. Resistance is futile"

79 Promethea  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:52:54am

#73 zulubaby . . .

Wouldn't it make more sense for Israel to do the Bekkaa Valley and Syria and the U.S. to do Iran?

Lebanon and Syria are peanut-sized places compared to Iran, which is huge and has a large population.

80 paul in Va  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:53:38am

66 JohnSteele

Yep, Loftus has been saying that for years. Funny he also said that many of the bio and chem weapons in the Bekaa were leaking so that they probably couldn't be transported out even if Hezbollah/Syria/Iran wanted to.

Add the poppy trade in the Bekaa and there's no way they'll leave without a Custer's last stand there.

81 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:54:02am

#67 Powderfinger

Negroponte used to fight communists in South America and Asia, so it doesn't take a rocket scientist to connect the dots here...

/

82 Saltmarsh  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:54:32am

#57 Dennisw

The UN can use the same register to record damage around the Iranian nuclear plant after Israel blows it up.

Afer the dust settles. :^)

83 vxbush  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:55:14am

#79 Promethea

I have a lot of misgivings about the US attacking Iran. I think Iran is out of control, to be sure. But I see a lot of problems occuring if we did. I'm thinking something more along the lines of a Islamic Cold war might be better--but this time ensuring that the ideology does *not* go any farther than it has already.

84 mikeyslaw  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:56:02am

#35 eschew

"Run for your lives! It's the Jooos!"

NYT: WMD? What WMD? We aint got no WMD. We don need no WMD!

85 Buck  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:56:27am

#69 Promethea

Best part of this is, that because of the domino effect, Israel, and the US won't have to invade. Syria will collapse on it's own. Baby Assad is not a very good dictator, and will be overthrown by his people just as soon as they see the weakness.

Israel, just has to watch her back, and make sure she doesn't have any fingers anywhere near the game while it is being played out.

86 Promethea  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:56:43am

#75 JohnSteele . . .

c) we'd prefer some else to 'find' it.

That's a good idea. Make someone else get involved. I hate that everyone thinks that only the U.S. needs to exert itself. Sure, sure I know, we have a big coalition...

But it's time for others besides Americans to do something to save the future.

I like the way you think. This is where games players come into their own.

BTW I know lots of Israeli chess players.

87 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:57:09am

#80 paul in Va

Yes, that's what I interpreted from his "dumped" remark --- for the most part they aren't really usable as weapons per se, just big chemical dumps. But if they really are dumped and leaking the dump sites will be unusable for decades, if ever. (Not to worry though, I'm sure the UN will allow the US taxpayers to clean up the sites :-)

88 contractem  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:57:13am

#67 Powderfinger--- When I first read it,I thought it was scrappleface, this is unreal.

89 narley  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:57:52am

Is there such a thing as "sophisticated" looting? Where you bring trucks and cranes prepared to dismantle and transport specialized equipment?

Perhaps it would be better termed as "transferring" WMD capability to a neighboring state. Almost as if there were a plan in place to transfer the capability? Hmmm?

90 contractem  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:58:37am

#87--- (Not to worry though, I'm sure the UN will allow the US taxpayers to clean up the sites :-) Think Halliburton!

91 baldrick  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:00:07pm

Yeah, the NYT just couldn't help themselves, they had to call the theft of WMD materials 'looting' in order to blame it on Bush admin. As if the theft wasn't going on before the fall of Baghdad. There were satellite photos showing trucks visiting the suspected sites before the invasion. And remember the stories about suspected Russian intelligence forces present in Iraq even after the invasion started, helping to remove materials?

It's unrealistic to expect the NYT to be completely honest after all.

92 Promethea  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:00:53pm

#83 vxbush . . .

I have a lot of misgivings about the US attacking Iran. I think Iran is out of control, to be sure. But I see a lot of problems occuring if we did. I'm thinking something more along the lines of a Islamic Cold war might be better--but this time ensuring that the ideology does *not* go any farther than it has already.

That's a good point. I fear Iran too. We don't want any qugmires.

I have to remind myself constantly this is new Islamic Cold War will take decades, and I shouldn't be impatient.

It's the final results that count. Not WHEN they happen.

93 christheprofessor  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:01:59pm

#55 John Steele

Three guesses and the first three don't count...

Just goes to show: There are three kinds of people the world. Those who can count, and those who can't.

94 vxbush  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:03:05pm

#92 Promethea

Yes, exactly. It took eight years of Reagan standing firm to finally get the USSR and the East Europeans to fall. Four more years of Bush followed by another strong Republican leader would do wonders.

95 IMMORTAL_CTHULHU  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:03:51pm

#67 powderfinger

If you read the article linked to in that post, the article says that the security was extra Army personnel, not Negroponte's 'personal security'. Just how the Kos Kidz inferred it was Negroponte's personal bodyguard is beyond me. What a bunch of crack-heads.

96 jehu  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:04:12pm

It doesn't matter, you could strap an editor of the NYT's to a nuclear tipped missle built in Iraq, aim it at the NYT's building and they would be mumbling no WMD's found, no WMD;s found, sort of a reverse Slim Pikens in Dr. Strangelove.

97 Promethea  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:04:19pm

#85 Buck . . .

Best part of this is, that because of the domino effect, Israel, and the US won't have to invade.

That would be good. In which case Chimpy Mc Bushhitler's poker playing skills will have proven useful.

The LLL is SO clueless. It's embarrassing almost.

98 mjk  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:04:36pm

I heard Saddam's WMD's were in Syria while standing on the Golan Heights with an Israeli who used to be in Israeli Military Intelligence. Of couse, this was the man who also told me that Arafat liked little boys. So who knows if they are true?
Oh, wait, both are true. Go figure.

I'm impressed the NYT of all papers admitted that maybe, just maybe Saddam was skirting the sanctions against him. Colour me shocked.

99 jesusland joe  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:06:02pm

If you want to know what a brain looks like when it is fried on drugs, go to dKos and read just about any of the threads.

Most of these guys and girls need to check and see if a GED program exists in their area. It's quite obvious that they smoked too much dope and cut too many classes and just plain neglected their education.


Or maybe they attended the University of Colorado, or perhaps obtained a degree at Sangamon State in Springfield, Ill.

100 RBMN  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:06:25pm

The car and roadside bombs, as far as I know, have been made 99.99% from standard conventional munitions. Sounds like you couldn't drive 50 miles in Iraq without running into some kind of conventional ammo dump. I suspect that the worst of it (nerve gas, etc.) went where it will just decay in the heat before it gets used--in any organized way.

101 Powderfinger  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:07:26pm

#79 Promethea

Wouldn't it make more sense for Israel to do the Bekkaa Valley and Syria and the U.S. to do Iran?

Pure conjecture here, but it may be that solving the Iranian problem will require an earth shattering kaboom, if you know what I mean, that would be politically unhelpful for the US.

Meanwhile, if we go into Bekaa and find the Holy Hand Grenades, it's a political windfall, and vindication of Bush's ME policy, while it also keeps them from being used on Israel.

/sending Rummy my resume

102 grayp  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:08:48pm

OT OT OT

Hubby just called from the car. WTOP radio is reporting that a branch office of DoD at Skyline (Falls Church, VA) has detected a biohazard. Building in lockdown, ventilation system shut down.

103 Powderfinger  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:12:15pm

#102 grayp

Whoa!

I wonder what...

104 Nancy  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:15:24pm

95 IMMORTAL_CTHULHU #67 powderfinger

Exactly, there was nothing in the links to the articles which supported the contention whatsoever. It was reported immediately that it was a patrol set up for his visit. It isn't as though it was a big secret.

What galls me the most is that anyone would think this woman was important enough to kill for damming information she might think she has.

She had already published in Nov. 2004 that she believed the US used chemical weapons --mustard gas in Fajullah. There was no secret to what her claims were or are.

That she, or any of these people who want to believe they are so superiorly intelligent, could believe that the government would target her is preposterous.

She ain't that important and she ain't that big of a fish!

105 atlasshrugged  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:16:06pm

i am surprised...that they came clean and it didnt take them 40 years:
Book Reveals: New York Times Buried Holocaust News
Jewish World
The New York Times consistently buried Holocaust news in its back pages and downplayed the victims' Jewish identity. So states the first scholarly study of how the Times covered the Nazi genocide.

"Buried by The Times: The Holocaust and America's Most Important Newspaper," by Prof. Laurel Leff, has just been published by Cambridge University Press.

Among the book's key findings, according to The David S. Wyman Institute for Holocaust Studies, are the following:

* Holocaust news was consistently relegated to the Times' back pages. Of the 1,186 articles that the Times published during 1939-1945 about Europe's Jews, only 26 (about two percent) of them appeared on the front page, and even those articles "obscured the fact that most of the victims were Jews."

* New York Times publisher Arthur Sulzberger, an assimilated Jew of German descent, feared that the newspaper would be engaging in special pleading and thus deliberately downplayed news of the Holocaust and the Jewish identity of the victims.

* The Times only rarely published editorials about the annihilation of Europe's Jews, and only once ran a lead editorial about the Nazi genocide.

* Because of its importance, the Times helped set the tone for the rest of the media's coverage of Holocaust news; the Times "might have been able to help bring the facts about the extermination of the Jews to public consciousness ... [instead,] the Times helped drown out the last cry from the abyss."

* When the Nazi death camps were liberated, the Times' coverage downplayed the fact that the victims and survivors were overwhelmingly Jews.

Author Prof. Leff, a former reporter and editor who teaches journalism at Northeastern University, is a leading member of the Academic Council of The Wyman Institute. The Wyman Institute is organizing Prof. Leff's speaking appearances around the United States.

Stuart Eizenstat, formerly the U.S. ambassador for Holocaust-era issues, called the book "engrossing and important," adding, "One can only wonder in great sorrow how many lives might have been saved if the nation's and the world's conscience had been touched by full and complete coverage by the Times of what remains the greatest crime of world history."

Marvin Kalb, elder statesman of American journalism, said that Buried by The Times "stands tall in scholarship, style and importance ... it is an exceptional study of one of the darkest failures of the New York Times..."

106 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:17:08pm

#95 IMMORTAL_CTHULHU

Just how the Kos Kidz inferred it was Negroponte's personal bodyguard is beyond me. What a bunch of crack-heads.


Elementary, Dr. Watson!

107 Dave the.....  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:18:09pm
You don't get it. There were never any weapons, and it's Bush's fault that they're missing. But if the non-existent missing "weapons" are ever found, it will have nothing to do with Bush.


You may be employing sarcasm, but you're pretty much right on with MSM. I saw a story on the local news about this last night and that's pretty much what they said...there were no WMD, but now it's Bush's fault that WMD were looted.

108 TMF  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:18:28pm

KOs

attributes it to "Rumsfeld's Incompetence". 316 comments

I have no doubt that the majority of the KOSsaks could run a 2 million plus soldier military, with deployments in over 50 countries, with two simultaneous wars/massive operations, billions of dollars in financing, recruiting, planning, strategic decision making and management faaar better.

Gotta love these armchair fuckhead losers jerking off on their computers with 2nd grade understandings of history, warfare and geography calling Rumsfeld "incompetent".

109 ToxMan  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:22:43pm

If the "looting" was a Baathist inside job, Syria is likely hiding the materials...

If it was done by Shi'ites within a segment of the former Sadaam regime, I would suspect it is in Iran...

What is interesting is the speed with which Iran's nuclear ambitions came to forefront of the news after the US was in Iraq for some time...

Either scenario seems likely...it's only a matter of time before it all unfolds. These all sound like trump cards just waiting to be played.

110 Beagle  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:29:13pm

#96 jehu

It doesn't matter, you could strap an editor of the NYT's to a nuclear tipped missle built in Iraq, aim it at the NYT's building and they would be mumbling no WMD's found, no WMD;s found, sort of a reverse Slim Pikens in Dr. Strangelove.


It's funny because it's true. LOL.

111 Beagle  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:31:48pm

#28 Norwegian kafir

Galipoli was decided by Allah's hand in the form of Western weapons, especially artillery and machine guns, along with commanding superior ground.

Oh, and the mystical green mist of Allah. Perhaps bad breath?

112 Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:32:14pm

Down the memory hole. The story unexists.

Every time Bush says the word "Freedom" a kitten dies. Won't someone PLEASE think of the kittens.

Bush lied kittens died.
Bush lied kittens died.

113 J.D.  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:37:15pm

#67 Powderfinger
Their little imaginations just go a mile a minute, don't they?
With their minds unemcumbered by knowledge of the facts, I guess they've got to do something to keep busy.

114 bruiser  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:41:02pm

"Looters" sounds too incriminating. Even foreign terrorists on a battlefield are entitled to due process. Call them what they are...undocumented moving companies.

115 J.D.  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:43:53pm

#114 bruiser
I had a link to an article yesterday that said the Russians had helped get rid of all the 'problem' stuff in Iraq.

116 Rancher  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:46:34pm

We should blockade Iran. As the oil money dries up how long before the good Iranian people get fed up and revolt? Add in UN sanctions, which have some affect or Iran wouldn't be so afraid of them. Funding for Iraqi terrorists and Hezbollah would also dry up. Two birds dontcha know.

117 dicentra  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:49:24pm

If Bush were venal enough to fabricate the existence of WMDs as an excuse for war, wouldn't he be venal enough to fabricate their discovery? How hard would it have been for him to dig up some of our old weapons, re-label them, and have some special ops deposit them in a spider hole, where the troops would "accidentally" find them?

Instead, he has stood there for two years with egg on his face, and during a re-election to boot.

Not even the LLL's imaginary Bush is that stupid.

118 Darwin Akbar  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:50:11pm

...so let's see if I got this story so far...

..Saddam Hussein didn't have any WMDs, but gassed the Kurds with excess flatulence produced by eating hummus on top of bean dip...

...Saddam Hussein didn't have any WMDs or factories, but offered a huge bribe to a U.N. weapons inspector to lie about the weapons that he did not have or could not produce or was not trying to acquire...

...Saddam Hussein didn't have any WMDs and was not trying to build them, but right after the invasion, an organized group appeared out of thin air, dismatled his WMD factories and carried them away...

...Saddam Hussein did not have WMDs, but because of BUSH NEGLIGENCE, a huge depot of weapons that could have been used to detonate one of theose WMDs that he did not have and wasn't trying to acquire as looted...

...but BUSH LIED and JOE WILSON'S CREDIBILITY DIED!

119 vickie  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:51:47pm

Just an interesting tidbit..Saddam had whole bunch of Airplanes in the 90's... Before the First Iraq War he transferred those Airplanes to IRAN, his mortal enemy. Gee do you think that kind of thing happened with WMD type material of all kinds THIS TIME? To Iran or Syria or take your pick of any Islamic TERRITORY? HUM?

Any kind of "transfer" doesnt have to be to an Islamic COUNTRY..cause Islam thinks of Separate Countries as a WESTERN Idea or a PAGAN Idea. Wherever there are a majority of Islamic People (to Islamists)...its ONE Islamic Entity or THE Islamic NATION. Get it? PAN Islamism. So he could have transferred anything anywhere there are enough Islamists. Like..Chechnia? maybe..Just suppposin.

120 J.D.  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:51:57pm

Here's an old link
Russia tied to Iraq's missing arms, and I had something newer yesterday but it was from a source I wasn't familiar with and I can't find it. Went into semi-excruciating detail.

121 TMF  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:53:21pm

dicentra #117

Not even the LLL's imaginary Bush is that stupid.

But clearly, the leftist morons who have no choice but to believe such illogic, are that stupid.

The only unresolved question is: is their stupidity environmental or congenital?

122 JohnSteele  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:54:50pm

#100 RBMN

Yes, Saddam was the Imelda Marcos of munitions -- he never saw an explosive that he could resist buying.

123 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:59:25pm

#121 TMF

The only unresolved question is: is their stupidity environmental or congenital?


As so often in these cases, a bit of both.

Congenital factors embody a necessary requirement, however, environmental considerations represent the commensurate condition.

124 vickie  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 12:59:58pm

JD..Interesting..Remember..THe RUS is the RUS and always will be. All that kissy kissy with Russia was for nothing. The Czars, Communism, so called Democracy...No dif. Its RUSSIA dont ya know... They are just "marking time". and building back up and shoring up old "friendships" so as to get back in the game...if ya ask me. Cold War 2 coming up. Maybe Warm War 1 coming up.

125 hs  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:04:33pm
126 Rancher  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:05:37pm

How big is the Bekaa Valley? All that stuff leaking out, maybe biologicals and all, lots of Syrian troops redeploying there. Could get messy.

127 Dov  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:10:24pm

I thought the WMD was settled. If anyone wants to see REAL Weapons of Mass Destruction I will send my Twin Granddaughters over for a surprise visit.

128 TMF  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:10:38pm
129 Catttt  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:11:01pm
White House officials, apprised of the Iraqi account by The New York Times, said it was already well known that many weapons sites had been looted. They had no other comment.

Well, duh. What does the NY Times want them to say?

NYT: We hear weapons sites were looted. Is that so?
WH: Yeah. Didn't you already know that? Everyone else does.

Reminds me of al-Qaqaagate, sprung just before the election by NYT and cBS:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

130 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:13:38pm

#125 Troll

Make up your mind.

Either Bush is evil because there were no WMD, or Rumsfeld is evil because he let looters steal the WMD.

131 doorstop  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:15:19pm

Good Thing Saddam didn't drop Tom Freedman on us !

132 TMF  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:16:48pm

Again, to quote from the Duelfer Report:

Sadaam Hussein so dominated the Iraqi regime that the strategic intent [for WMD production] was his alone. He wanted to end the sanctions while preserving the capability to reconstitute his WMD when sanctions were lifted

WHOOPS!

Try again, clown.

133 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:18:14pm
134 TMF  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:20:59pm

#133

When that story broke, they were playing it up like the four horsemen were arriving for the apocalypse.

Then "poof". Story gone.

Bush won and "missing QaaQaa weapons story" wasnt so apocalyptic.

Wheres the follow up investigation? What happened to those weapons? Who is to blame? Heads must roll!

Inquiring minds want to know!

Its almost as if the story from day one was nothing more than a pathetic, sad, vapid, partisan hack job.

135 christheprofessor  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:29:39pm

#134 TMF

Its almost as if the story from day one was nothing more than a pathetic, sad, vapid, partisan hack job.

I assume you forgot the /sarc tag...

:)

136 Rancher  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:35:50pm

#135 christheprofessor

I assume you forgot the /sarc tag...

It's sad that because of the intelligence level of our trolls we need one.

137 Rufus Lee King  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:36:00pm

Ever watch a wrestler who knows he's going to get pinned, shift desperately from one shoulder to the other?

Same tactic from the oppose-Bush-at-all-costs traitors.

First, milk the no-WMD line, even though Clinton found them and went shooting after them 2 years before Bush came on scene. Because, right before an election, the no-WMD spiel makes Bush sound like he could have lied.

Then, after you lose the election, try the line that, Yeah, there were WMD's, but they weren't hurting anybody until Bush invaded, ham-handedly putting them into play.

Neither line will fool but some of the people some of the time, but the Bush Lied for Oil line has just become too unservicable, in light of events, to keep up with a straight face.

138 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 1:36:51pm
139 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:01:57pm

But that bit of info doesn't fit into the paradigm of the modern day democrat.

so I can't be true.

even though the evidence has been there for years verified by international sources beyond the US.

oy lefties - your "Bush lied - people died" - meme is dying.
What are you freaks and losers going to do now?
onto the next big lie, I suppose.

140 Rufus Lee King  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:09:41pm
"There was no imminent threat. This was made up in Texas, announced in January to the Republican leadership that war was going to take place and was going to be good politically. This whole thing was a fraud," the Massachusetts Democrat told the AP.


-Sen. Edward Kennedy, 9/18/03

Fact: Bush sought to disarm the threat posed by Iraq acting in collusion with other terrorist enemies before it became imminent.

Fact: Bush did not make up Clinton's announced discovery of Iraq - Al Qaeda cooperation in the VX nerve agent facility Clinton bombed in Sudan. Bush did not make up Clinton's announced bombing Iraq's own domestic WMD facilities in Operation Desert Fox. Both occurred only two years before Bush took office.

Fact: The Democratic Party chose, after Clinton left office, to completely abandon its country's defense requirements against the Iraq - terrorist WMD threat for purely poilitical purposes. They chose to obstruct their president in his every effort to secure this country against that threat.

If the Democratic willfull blindness had won the day, there would have been a good many more corpses than Saddam Hussein left to be uncovered in Iraq to answer for their treason.

141 Captain Hate  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:12:04pm

#121 & 123

"Congenital factors embody a necessary requirement, however, environmental considerations represent the commensurate condition."

Steven Pinker spoke at Case Western Reserve U today and indicated that the morons at Kos and DU (not to mention some of their agents that post here) inherited their dimwittedness and that no amount of environmental change can rectify that pathetic situation.

With that in mind, I'd like to point out that they've destroyed Joe Dimaggio's record by being wrong about absolutely everything for far more than 56 days in a row.

142 pure francis  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:24:02pm

#141 Captain Hate

Well, judging by the apparent ability of moonbats to convert to being rational, while, at the same time, the opposite is far less evident, it must be true that environmental, and not congenital, considerations represent the commensurate condition.

143 Rufus Lee King  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:26:37pm
New Delhi, Mar 14 (PTI) In a veiled attack on US, former UN Weapons Inspector in Iraq Hans Blix today said unilateral actions by countries cannot prevent proliferation of Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD) and favoured "global and regional deterrence" to check the problem.

Press Trust of India

Sounds to me that if Hans Blix concentrated on doing his job as a weapons finding sleuth rather than playing anti-US amatuer policymaker he might have been fooled a trifle less than he was by Saddam Hussein.

144 traveler  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:29:10pm

#11 newton

I believe something even bigger is going to be revealed in the next few days or weeks re: WMD's.

I suspect it will be something that will make all of those leftists eat a Syria-size serving of crow...

I get your nuance, and I think you're right on the money...

145 DBN  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:29:11pm

Forgive me if I've repeated something from an earlier comment, but my guess is that all of this "looting" took place prior to the start of the war and the NYT just shifted the timeline to make it look like the Bush administration screwed up.

I wonder if Syria is a nice place to visit this time of year?

146 MajorGeneralWinfieldScottHancock  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:31:10pm

I hope to God the biggie blogs (besides this one) pick it up. If Michelle Malkin, Right Wing News, and others pick it up, we'll have a chance of getting this out into the open. And, of course, there's always the Washington Times and Fox News.

147 zulubaby  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:37:50pm

Promethea (#79)

Wouldn't it make more sense for Israel to do the Bekkaa Valley and Syria and the U.S. to do Iran?

To my mind, yes, but what do I know. It definitely makes more sense logistically though, no?

148 Rufus Lee King  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:51:15pm

147 zulubaby

Wouldn't it make more sense for Israel to do the Bekkaa Valley and Syria and the U.S. to do Iran?

I have a hunch that the latest surprising willingness of the US to humor the European appeasement model toward Iran has much to do with Israel's impending airstrikes there.

That would leave intact the ability for the US to still court the Iranian dissidents from a profile of a nation who "tried to work things out" there, rather than that of a popularly resented military aggressor.

Israel will be resented no matter what it does. So they may as well play the opening hammer hand. But the US has had its admirers in Iran, and may be using subterfuge now to just tactically preserve those connections with sympathetic disidents in view of impending major action there on many fronts.

149 leftover54  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 2:59:10pm
In the weeks after Baghdad fell in April 2003, looters systematically dismantled and removed tons of machinery from Saddam Hussein’s most important weapons installations,

Equals - Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld's fault - the key:

"...after Baghdad fell..."

What's the difference between this story (attack) and the one they did last year saying Bush et al failed to secure the explosives that were sealed by the UN inspectors ?

150 Baldy  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 3:01:03pm

Hannity said he thought it was a sign some big news is coming soon on the WMD front. I do often wonder about the timing of news stories. Isn't this fairly old news? I remember hearing about contaminated items in the Netherlands.

151 leftover54  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 3:03:59pm

#149 ME
OOOpps...sorry ! Should have read the entire thread first !
Well at least I know others were thinking the same as I.

152 Baldy  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 3:04:13pm

I've always believed they existed, just haven't been found yet. Of course when they are located, the MSM & the Dems will move the goalposts...

153 Baldy  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 3:06:34pm

Jammie Wearing Fool -

I notice 7W is no longer beneath the floor humper.

Floor humpers built this nation.

154 _Jim  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 3:10:59pm
?They came in with the cranes and the lorries, and they depleted the whole sites,? Dr. Araji said


Looting?

That's "reclamation of abandoned facilities".

I'd LOVED to have been there; lathes, mills, presses, shears - and all CNC capable at that as well!

155 Baldy  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 3:27:56pm

OT: Hillary - Mullah-Lovers Embrace? (WorldNetDaily)

Iranian Americans accused by members of their community of collaborating with the cleric-led Islamic regime in Tehran have planned a fund-raiser for Sen. Hillary Clinton in the San Francisco Bay Area.

I still think she should change her name to Hillari!
It's snazzy.

156 mich-again  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 4:08:42pm

155 Baldy

The party thrower is Gita Kashani and she's kinda cute!

The IAPAC also has a director named Hassan Nemazee who has a long trail of losing oher people's money and suing Iranian dissident groups for outing him as a Mullah toadie. I'm not sure what to make of them, but any Iranian who wants to shut down the SMCCDI can't be much good.

157 traveler  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 4:34:45pm

#155 Baldy

I still think she should change her name to Hillari!
It's snazzy.

LOL! And dot the "i" with a heart, because she's a caring person, you know...

158 toddhisattva  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 5:46:30pm

Iraq had no WMD capability...Bush failed to secure Iraq's WMD capability...Which did not exist...But it did...Karl Rove...Bush failed...Bush did not lie...But he did...Halliburton...did not...

Norman, coordinate! Norman, coordinate!

159 Bill M  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 8:34:44pm

Don't make too much of this report. First of all, it is coming from someone in the Iraqi government, likely one of the holdovers from the prior government. Second, remember, this is beng reported by the New York Times. This is not what one would term the most reliable of sources.

Perhaps it is true; perhaps it is not. It is a chance for the NYT to take another shot at Bush, which they would never pass up. We have to wait and see.

Patience is a virtue in this case. . . but it is kinds fun to watch the reactions by the DUers and the Kos Kids!

161 manker  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 10:28:35pm

Response of the LLL:

SO! Bush is still the most evil man on earth


#57 dennisw

If they want to register damage, I also want to register damage for terror attacks agaisnt Israel. And I mean all the attacks, plus the small time crime thats connected to terror (like car theft, robbery).

162 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:09:57pm

DUELFER REPORT:"Saddam wanted to recreate Iraq’s WMD capability—which was essentially destroyed in 1991—after sanctions were removed and Iraq’s economy stabilized, but probably with a different mix of capabilities to that which previously existed.

163 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:14:20pm

#32 "Those uranium centrifuges "

Not plural because there was only one.

164 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:29:32pm

#108 "Gotta love these armchair fuckhead losers jerking off on their computers with 2nd grade understandings of history, warfare and geography calling Rumsfeld "incompetent". "


Fighting the Wrong War
From the January 17, 2005 issue: What Rumsfeld's defenders don't want to admit.
by Frederick W. Kagan , The Weekly Standard

01/17/2005, Volume 010, Issue 17
[Link: www.weeklystandard.com...]

165 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:35:04pm

#133 "This is clearly a re-tread of the pre-election "our troops let 400 tons of explosives disappear" story.

That story, of course, was discredited in jig time."

No it wasn't.

Iraq's unsecured ammo dumps providing explosives for insurgency
BY JIM LANDERS The Dallas Morning News
[Link: www.kansascity.com...]

166 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:36:54pm

#108 "Gotta love these armchair fuckhead losers jerking off on their computers with 2nd grade understandings of history, warfare and geography calling Rumsfeld "incompetent". "

Army Historian Cites Lack of Postwar Plan
Major Calls Effort in Iraq 'Mediocre'

By Thomas E. Ricks [Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]
Washington Post Staff Writer
Saturday, December 25, 2004; Page A01
"There was no Phase IV plan" for occupying Iraq after the combat phase, writes Maj. Isaiah Wilson III, who served as an official historian of the campaign and later as a war planner in Iraq. While a variety of government offices had considered the possible situations that would follow a U.S. victory, Wilson writes, no one produced an actual document laying out a strategy to consolidate the victory after major combat operations ended.
During the period in question, from April to June 2003, Wilson was a researcher for the Army's Operation Iraqi Freedom Study Group. Then, from July 2003 to March 2004, he was the chief war planner for the 101st Airborne Division, which was stationed in northern Iraq.
As a result of the failure to produce a plan, Wilson asserts, the U.S. military lost the dominant position in Iraq in the summer of 2003 and has been scrambling to recover ever since. "In the two to three months of ambiguous transition, U.S. forces slowly lost the momentum and the initiative . . . gained over an off-balanced enemy," he writes. "The United States, its Army and its coalition of the willing have been playing catch-up ever since."

167 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:41:08pm

#140 "Bush sought to disarm the threat posed by Iraq acting in collusion with other terrorist enemies before it became imminent. "

VICE PRES. CHENEY: There is--in the past, there have been some activities related to terrorism by Saddam Hussein. But at this stage, you know, the focus is over here on al-Qaida and the most recent events in New York. Saddam Hussein's bottled up, at this point, but clearly, we continue to have a fairly tough policy where the Iraqis are concerned. [Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

168 piniella  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:43:33pm

#140 "The Democratic Party chose, after Clinton left office, to completely abandon its country's defense requirements against the Iraq - terrorist WMD threat for purely poilitical purposes. They chose to obstruct their president in his every effort to secure this country against that threat. "


December 2000 Clinton-Era Report: Strategy for Eliminating the Threat from the Jihadist Networks of al-Qida: Status and Prospects Page 1 of 13 One of two reports attached to former Counterterrorism Chief Richard Clarke’s January 25, 2001 memo to former National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice warning that “al Qida is not some narrow, little terrorist issue.” (December 2000) Source: National Security Archives ___ Go here to see a photo of this actual report: [Link: news.findlaw.com...]

169 Rayra[deleted]  Mon, Mar 14, 2005 11:49:56pm
170 TMF  Tue, Mar 15, 2005 2:44:19am

WOW!

This "Pinella" loser gets upset when he's so blatantly wrong! We clearly struck a nerve with this jackass.

Just suck it up, loser.

Admit that you would prefer to give a genocidal maniac the benefit of the doubt over our intelligence.

I can cherrypick a thousand quotes to support my position too. It comes down to this:

Admit that you hate Bush, you hate Republicans, you hate the military, and that your entire "worldview" is clouded by the irrationality of your emotions.

171 TMF  Tue, Mar 15, 2005 2:47:00am
Wilson asserts, the U.S. military lost the dominant position in Iraq in the summer of 2003 and has been scrambling to recover ever since

Hmmm hmmm. Sure, Mr. Wilson. Whatever you say.

Someone has a little axey waxy to grind. Passed over for a promotion, were we, Isaiah?

172 _Jim  Tue, Mar 15, 2005 4:54:44am

#166 piniella:


Army Historian Cites Lack of Postwar Plan
Major Calls Effort in Iraq 'Mediocre'
By Thomas E. Ricks Washington Post Staff Writer


"There was no Phase IV plan" for occupying Iraq after the combat phase, writes Maj. Isaiah Wilson III, who served as an official historian of the campaign and later as a war planner in Iraq.

...

During the period in question, from April to June 2003, Wilson was a researcher for the Army's Operation Iraqi Freedom Study Group. Then, from July 2003 to March 2004, he was the chief war planner for the 101st Airborne Division, which was stationed in northern Iraq.


This begs the question: WHAT group was responsible for 'phase IV plannning', was 'phase IV' planning even necessary (WHAT the hell is phase IV planning anyway?)

Lotsa words, little meaning (AFAIAC) AND meaning even LESS as we go forward and actual progress is made in Iraq regardless of what nay-saying 20-20 hindsighters bleat ...

173 traveler  Tue, Mar 15, 2005 5:32:25am
#169 Rayra 3/15/2005 01:49AM PST
Such a Reductionist moron Piniella. Right here in a topic that hulls the entire Moonbat credo of 'there was no WMD!'


Maybe pinata has been hit with the "moonbat" one too many times...

174 Ringo the Gringo  Tue, Mar 15, 2005 9:07:51am

Christopher Hitchens : This Was Not Looting

175 piniella  Tue, Mar 15, 2005 11:22:04pm

#170 "Admit that you would prefer to give a genocidal maniac the benefit of the doubt over our intelligence."


“Yes, I, too, believed there were weapons. I began to be skeptical when we went to sites that were given to us by U.S. intelligence and we found nothing. They said this is the best intelligence we have, and I said, if this is the best, what is the rest?” HANS BLIX, NYT, 3/30/04

176 TMF  Wed, Mar 16, 2005 5:11:14am

Blix is the "best you have"?

Your going to give an admittedly anti-American, pro-Sadaam bitter crank credence? A guy who has contradicted himself so many times its scary?

BZZZ. Try again.

Sigh. Here we go:

HANS BLIX REPORT TO THE UN ON WMD 1/27/03:

For nearly three years, Iraq refused to accept any inspections by UNMOVIC. It was only after appeals by the Secretary-General and Arab states and pressure by the United States and other Member States, that Iraq declared on 16 September last year that it would again accept inspections without conditions.

whoops.

The recent inspection find in the private home of a scientist of a box of some 3,000 pages of documents, much of it relating to the laser enrichment of uranium support a concern that has long existed that documents might be distributed to the homes of private individuals.

WHOOPS

When we have urged our Iraqi counterparts to present more evidence, we have all too often met the response that there are no more documents. All existing relevant documents have been presented, we are told. All documents relating to the biological weapons program were destroyed together with the weapons.

whoops.

Again. You would prefer to give a homicidal maniac and/or a narcissistic, incompetent european diplomat the benefit of the doubt. Your really one fucked up and suicidal pacifist.


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