LGF

The Muslim Mind Is On Fire

Thu, Jul 28, 2005 at 12:51:08 pm PDT

Here’s a bracing dose of intellectual clarity and courage at the Middle East Times, by Youssef M. Ibrahim, a former Middle East correspondent for The New York Times and energy editor of the Wall Street Journal: The Muslim mind is on fire. (Hat tip: Amy.)

DUBAI —  The world of Islam is on fire. Indeed, the Muslim mind is on fire. Above all, the West is now ready to take both of them on.

The latest reliable report confirms that on average 33 Iraqis die every day, executed by Iraqis and foreign jihadis and suicide bombers, not by US or British soldiers. In fact, fewer than ever US or British soldiers are dying since the invasion more than two years ago. Instead, we now watch on television hundreds of innocent Iraqis lying without limbs, bleeding in the streets dead or wounded for life. If this is jihad someone got his religious education completely upside down.

Palestine is on fire, too, with Palestinian armed groups fighting one another - Hamas against Fatah and all against the Palestinian Authority. All have rendered Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas impotent and have diminished the world’s respect and sympathy for Palestinian sufferings.

A couple of weeks ago London was on fire as Pakistani and other Muslims with British citizenship blew up tube stations in the name of Islam. Al Qaeda in Europe or one of its franchises proclaimed proudly the killing of 54 and wounding 700 innocent citizens was done to “avenge Islam” and Muslims.

Madrid was on fire, too, last year, when Muslim jihadis blew up train stations killing 160 people and wounding a few thousands.

The excuse in all the above cases was the war in Iraq, but let us not forget that in September 2001, long before Iraq, Osama Bin Laden proudly announced that he ordered the killing of some 3,000 in the United States, in the name of avenging Islam. Let us not forget that the killing began a long time before the invasion of Iraq.

Indeed, jihadis have been killing for a decade in the name of Islam. They killed innocent tourists and natives in Morocco and Egypt, in Africa, in Indonesia and in Yemen, all done in the name of Islam by Muslims who say that they are better than all other Muslims. They killed in India, in Thailand and are now talking of killing in Germany and Denmark and so on. There were attacks with bombs that killed scores inside Shia and Sunni mosques, inside churches and inside synagogues in Turkey and Tunisia, with Muslim preachers saying that it is okay to kill Jews and Christians - the so called infidels.

Need I say, read it all?

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620 comments

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1 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 10:53:35am
Above all, the West is now ready to take both of them on.

I hope so.

2 FlyingTigress  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 10:54:20am

Refresh my memory...

Osama didn't order the death of 3,000 in the U.S. He tried to kill nearly 50,000+... and if not for a handful of heroes, would have succeeded.

3 Lawrence Schmerel  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 10:55:24am

Great article! Thanks, Charles.

4 donm7007  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 10:58:12am

If you didn't read it all, read the last sentence.

In this new cold and hot war, car bombs and suicide bombers here and there will be no match for the arsenal that those Westerners are putting together - an arsenal of laws, intelligence pooling, surveillance by satellites, armies of special forces and indeed, allies inside the Arab world who are tired of having their lives disrupted by demented so-called jihadis or those bearded preachers who, under the guise of preaching, do little to teach and much to ignite the fire, those who know little about Islam and nothing about humanity.
5 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 10:59:11am

Sadly, this guy now has a HUGE target mark on his back.

6 Ed Driscoll  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 10:59:42am

Curious--he writes, "Palestine is on fire, too", and gets through a several hundred word essay without ever using the I-word: Israel.

7 krisper  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:00:09am

Can it be true? Are the Islamic "intelligentsia" finally beginning to realize that their goal of destroying Western civilization is futile and self-destructive?

I guess we'll see. If the author of this article doesn't get his throat cut in the street in broad daylight, I might even start to be an optimist.

8 poof  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:00:29am

Wonderful and refreshing article. Yes we (the West or at least the U.S.) is amassing an arsenal that can not be matched by those who live in the 7th Century.

9 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:00:49am
10 mickthemick  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:02:09am

Sadly, the great points of this article will be lost on the vast majority of folks in the Arab and Islamic worlds who will continue to put the blame for Islamic terrorism on the U.S., Israel and the West in general. There will be those who will continue to blame U.S. and Israeli policies for "enflaming the Muslim world" and there will also be the complete moonbats who claim Crusader and Zionist forces are committing these acts of terrorism themselves (and making them look as though Muslimes are the perps) so they have an excuse to attack Muslim countries, and to make Islam and Muslims look bad.

11 rokbassist  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:04:04am

Wow - quite an admission. Kind of like when the Japanese, after attacking Pearl Harbor, started to think to themselves .. "Maybe we shouldn't have done that...".

12 Manker  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:04:40am

#6 Ed Driscoll

I noticed that to, he leaves that out.

While he does say this:

with Muslim preachers saying that it is okay to kill Jews and Christians - the so called infidels.

He leaves out Israel

And talking about leaving Israel out

What is more important to remember is this: When the West did unite after World War II to beat communism, the long Cold War began without pity. They took no prisoners. They all stood together, from the United States to Norway, from Britain to Spain, from Belgium to Switzerland. And they did bring down the biggest empire. Communism collapsed.

Will it be left out of this too?

13 alkmyst  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:05:04am
#6 Ed Driscoll 7/28/2005 12:59PM PDT

Curious--he writes, "Palestine is on fire, too", and gets through a several hundred word essay without ever using the I-word: Israel.

Yes, because it is run by the evil "those whom shall not be named"

PA Authority Preparing Palestinian Flags to Cover Previously Israeli Lands

20:54 Jul 28, '05 / 21 Tammuz 5765

20:35 PA Authority Preparing Palestinian Flags to Cover Previously Israeli Lands

(IsraelNN.com) The PA Authority is busy preparing the celebrations for the day after the Jews are finally expelled from Gush Katif. Tens of thousands of flags are being produced in order to place them on the territory that will be evacuated in order to proclaim “This is Palestinian land that has been returned to its owners!”

On Wednesday, Palestinian Authority (PA) Prime Minister Ahmed Qureia (Abu Ala), said, ”Gaza is only the beginning point for the Palestinians. The goal is to get to a Palestinian state whose capital is Jerusalem.”

Because G-d forbid that they spend the money from the US and G8 on things like infrastructure and such.

And G-d forbid this actually goes thru, they'll be one step closer to Jerusalem.

14 Cole Slaw  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:06:46am

"Visas for Arab and Muslim young men will be impossible to get for the United States..."

You would think, but has this actually happened?

15 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:07:20am

#12 Manker

The part about Belgium and Switzerland bringing down Communism is just sad drivel.

Anyone remember those millions of Euroweenies on the streets in 1982 or whenever it was protesting the US' deployment of nuclear warheads in Germany?

Oh no, we might piss off the Soviets...

16 scott in east bay  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:07:23am

Two observations that support his thesis: 1. The new anti-terror laws in Britain would make the ACLU kill themselves. I am waiting to see how long it takes for us to implement some of the same things. Yes, we have free speech, but incitement to violence is not protected. 2. The Islamic world would have almost nothing if it were not for Western technology. Oil is useless under the sand if no one can get it out. They should remember that what we give we can also take away. I think some big changes are coming. I am astounded at the articles I am seeing that shows that a turning point has finally been reached. People have finally had enough.

17 RBMN  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:08:32am

They only see pro-caliphate and anti-caliphate:

---

Daniel Pipes:

The Islamists who assassinated Anwar el-Sadat in 1981 decorated their holding cages with banners proclaiming the "caliphate or death." A biography of one of the most influential Islamist thinkers of recent times and an influence on Osama bin Laden, Abdullah Azzam declares that his life "revolved around a single goal, namely the establishment of Allah's Rule on earth" and restoring the caliphate. Bin Laden himself spoke of ensuring that "the pious caliphate will start from Afghanistan."

(from: [Link: www.danielpipes.org...] )

18 Ed Mahmoud abu al Qahool Martyr Brigades  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:08:59am

Well, if the Muslim Mind is on fire, maybe Uncle Sam should take a big piss on it.

19 mungagungadin  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:09:05am

... and this is why I have told my friends (moonbats among them) that there WILL BE no democratic president until God comes. In times of war, we don't want "peace" presidents.

20 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:09:06am

Without the Gipper we'd still have those Soviets controling half the world.

21 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:09:27am

Maybe, just maybe this is a crack in the mindset of those who have said nothing up to this point?


Perhaps any further bombings (God forbid) will cause more reaction like this from that silent mass of Muslims?

22 FlyingTigress  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:09:40am
Wonderful and refreshing article. Yes we (the West or at least the U.S.) is amassing an arsenal that can not be matched by those who live in the 7th Century.

And who could be returned to a 20st Century B.C. level of civilization if we REALLY got pissed?

23 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:09:59am
24 hornet  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:10:02am

This is required reading for KOS kids to get a dose of truth and have a civil discussion.

25 alice in wonderland  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:10:08am

I prefer to be more optimistic and hope and pray that this sort of thing will spread among the muslim community. Is this guy well known --respected among muslims? It would be great if someone with REAL power would say these things.

26 Peacekeeper  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:10:39am

We didn't start the fire. it was always burnin' since the world's been turnin.

/Billy Joel

27 Prester John  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:10:40am

#15 Give the Belgiques a break. They did in fact allow US cruise missiles on their territory during the 80s, just like the Netherlands and Italy did. Their military wasn't much to speak of but the government did face down the anti-nuke crowd.

28 alegrias  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:10:41am

And readership of the Dubai Energy Newsletter is ? Sorry, muslim minds aren't getting our message yet--we're onto "It's the Caliphate or bust" and want to deliver kingdom come.

29 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:10:53am
30 Free Speech Is Only For über-Libs  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:11:03am

They killed innocent children at Beslan in the name of Islam.

And Oprah won't even admit it.

31 FlyingTigress  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:11:51am

pimf (potentially dislocated wrist, too)

20th

/attack of Dan Rather's TANG typewriter

32 EE  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:12:26am

Kudos to Youssef M. Ibrahim.
Much of his article points out how counter-productive is this terrorism by jihadis, because the West is going to respond to the threat.
Importantly, he makes a very good point at the end, when he describes Muslim preachers setting people's minds on fire, when he says that they know little about Islam and nothing about humanity. Nothing about humanity.
To be a good Muslim, a good Christian, a good Jew, a good Hindu, a good Buddhist, etc., you first have to know what it is to be a good human being. And that is missing from the preachers who set jihadi minds on fire. They know nothing about humanity.

33 heliotrope  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:12:47am
I fear those naïve Muslims who think that they are beating the West have now achieved their worst crime of all. The West is now going to war against not only Muslims, but also, sadly, Islam as a religion.

"Sadly", there is no unified religion of Islam so we have to war against its pieces.

There can be no reformation of Islam, because it lacks the structure to reform itself, save a quick return from its founder for some tiding up activities.

I'm not the least bit sad about Islam. They made their jihad, let them carry it out. I would be especially glad to see a lot of Muslim by-standers trying to see which way the wind is blowing, unable to "put-up" and probably unwilling to "shut-up."

I love Steyn's new word: Islamakazie.

34 mickthemick  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:13:12am

#6 Ed and #12 Manker
Do you guys feel optimistic or pessimistic about the fact that this article does not once mention Israel? I was leaning toward optimistic myself, only because this guy was not blaming Israel for the Muslim world's problems. And the way that he references "Palestine" denotes a deep skepticism, IMO. He sees the real truth of "Palestine"...the organizations like Hamas and the PA who claim to represent it are criminal organizations which, left to their own devices, will set about the business of killing each other when there is no Israel to demonize.

35 alegrias  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:16:23am

What exactly does he mean by "the world of Islam is on fire," does he mean every place there's a muslim? I question his definition.

When he says "the muslim mind is on fire" is he refering to that of a splodeydope in the act?

Is he just better than CAIR at trying to assuage Western hammer?

36 LadyK  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:17:53am

OT
Get a load ofthis delightful guy. Ohhh, he's just so deeep!

37 Ward Cleaver  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:18:14am

Watch your back, Youssef. And your front, too (after all, Van Gogh was stabbed in the chest).

Fatwa coming in 3...2...1...

38 tsflanagan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:19:19am

Run Chaney Run!

Helen Thomas has promised to kill herself if the VP runs for Pres next term

39 Ward Cleaver  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:20:12am

#6 Ed Driscoll

Well, he is talking to a muslim audience.

40 Renna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:20:13am

#2 FlyingTigress

Refresh my memory...

Osama didn't order the death of 3,000 in the U.S. He tried to kill nearly 50,000+... and if not for a handful of heroes, would have succeeded.

True enough.

We often forget in those horrifying lists that show terrorist attacks that seem to go on for pages usually only include the "successful" attacks.

From the prevented attacks we see in Israel, it looks to me like only about 1 in 20 get through. And how many are stopped in the planning stages because of some defensive measure of ours? (us being civilization).

So when we see a list of worldwide Islamic terrorist attacks in the past four years that goes on for over a hundred pages, we must remember the the terrorists likely tried to make that list 2000 pages long.

41 Rednek  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:20:26am
42 Albertanator  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:21:02am

The only mistake in this article by this brave Gentleman is that Jihadi's have not been killing for only the last decade...they have been killing since Muhammed founded this murderous movement 1400 years ago...

I am continually amazed at how people cannot see this blatant truth?
Muhammed himself was a murderer and a terrorist!

43 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:21:03am
44 Manker  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:21:23am

#34 mickthemick

I'll say it like this.

One of the root causes for Israeli arab conflict. Is that the arab do accept Israel's existence. When their is actual acceptance of this, then their can be peace.

Ignoring Israel is like making an exception for terror. Saying it's different, and therefore creates an exception for terror around the world.

45 Ed Driscoll  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:21:46am

#34 mickthemick,

"Do you guys feel optimistic or pessimistic about the fact that this article does not once mention Israel?"

Sadly, pessimistic. I think I still have the memories of the CAIR spokesman Hugh Hewitt had on his radio show on Monday and Tuesday going through my head. He could sound incredibly reasonable and sympathetic until Hugh mentioned the I-word. He'd then immediately start dissembling into a thousand different directions.

46 Ward Cleaver  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:23:09am

#36 LadyK

An MSM "journalist" from Seattle. Yawn.

Somebody get him a waaambulance.

47 Fjordman  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:23:50am

Meanwhile, Tony Blair is embracing a Socialist appeaser:

Blair and Zapatero in anti-terror 'alliance of civilisations'

British prime minister Tony Blair has thrown his weight behind a Spanish idea for an ‘alliance of civilisations’ to form a united front against terrorism. Mr Blair was keen to stress that Turkey, the huge and mainly Muslim EU-hopeful, would also support the idea. "Turkey is particularly involved in this - to form a coalition of civilised people from whatever race or religion to combat the barbarity of terrorism", he said.

48 SevoGuy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:24:20am

Interesting article. Hope normal islamic people are reading it. Even if islam was to do a complete 360 degree turn-a-round, no thanks. The Clerics should still be held responsible for the vast amount of carnage and misery that they have inflicted upon the citizens of planet Earth due to their "evil ideology."

I'm still seething about the NYC subway searches that are randomly being done. You know, that little old lady with a crucifix on her neak having her handbag searched and not the middle eastern looking guy with that God-aweful smell" not being searched because the policeman isn't allowed to search too many middle eastern people.

Were lost.

49 William  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:24:50am

"Indeed, jihadis have been killing for [1,300 years] in the name of Islam."

There you go.
 

50 MysticSmoke (from finger tips)  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:25:29am

This is the second prong of the Bush strategy. Implant the ROP meme and the resulting vacuum will (eventually) breed Moderate Muslims.

It does take time, but the Moderate Muslim commutinty will grow and take over the religion.

The West will not have to impose reforms directly on Islam. I'm not even sure how such a thing could be done.

The fact that the 'carrot' is invisible doesn't mean it's not working.

51 Ward Cleaver  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:25:47am

#41 Rednek

That's what hapens when you mix Poligrip and senile dementia.

52 LadyK  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:26:12am

#46 Ward Cleaver

But... but... he's so deeep! Look, he even SAYS so!

Hee!

53 mickthemick  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:26:27am

#44 & #45 Ed & Manker
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I agree with both of you that non-recognition of Israel keeps those fires burning. Sadly, I believe there are many in the Arab world who would also agree with us (and I'm also talking about Arabs in the West), but are afraid to say anything. Take this author for example. If he mentioned Israel in any kind of positive context in this article, he'd really have a target on his back. I think he left Israel out because he was afraid to say what he truly thinks -- Arabs only dig themselves into a deeper hole by blaming Israel for any of their problems.

54 LemonJoose  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:27:19am

Was this article published in Arabic as well? I hope so.

With their increasingly desperate, brutal, but ultimately pathetic attempts to control others through fear, jihadis are losing the battle for the hearts and minds all over the world.

55 Ward Cleaver  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:27:29am

#48 SevoGuy


Uh, that'd be a 180, not a 360.

56 hecate  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:27:57am

I need an example(s) of situations where a gitmo prisoner has been realeased and has gone on to attack the USA (not verbally).

I'm in an argument with a guy who thinks that gitmo prisoners should be tried in the US.

Thanks in advance

57 karmic_inquisitor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:28:52am

I still think Karl Rove is a bit of a deconstructionist, and this supports the theory.

The Islamists have escalated their tactics in order to be more polarizing, and the Western media has carried water for them - reporting the "ever worsening situation". To maintain momentum and increase body counts, AQ has gone to soft targets. In the minds of AQ, this is all a wonderous success as the western news media report only carnage and none of the progress (AQ learned to not target journalists too much after Danny Pearl).

So you have the whole "false binary opposition" thing set up by the opponent of Rove (in this case AQ). The opponent then discredits himself by going even more polar, to the point that those who might have been sympathetic to him start to walk away. Meanwhile, Rove keeps the focus on that opponent as representing the opposed point of view.

Folks who are undecided see a total loss of meaning in the rhetoric and go for the pragmatic perspective. Here we see it - Muslims starting to count the bodies and realizing that they are destroying themselves as long as they even tacitly follow the AQ lead.

Meanwhile, the White House refrains from any inflamatory rhetoric - it lets its actions speak for themselves.

Same with the John Roberts nomination.
Same with the run against John Kerry.
Same with teh handling of the Plame case.

In each case, the opposition basks in its rhetoric to the point that they become self-mocking, and reasonable minds stay away.

58 centaur  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:29:37am

#36, ladyK ..

I read it for a bit. What a load. I just laughed when used the word "metastasized"--I bet he's very proud--and clicked away ... probably a nice guy, but what a big heaping load.

59 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:29:37am
60 Matticus Finch  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:30:02am

Once again, a nice article, but I don't believe any of these guys until I see action from the so-called 'moderates'. To me it's all taqiya.

Think twice before you invite the scorpion on your back to cross the river.

61 Manker  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:31:59am

#53 mickthemick

and thank you for understanding what I meant, even though I had that mistake.

62 Ward Cleaver  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:32:19am

#49 vs. #59

Ah, there's nothing like a little hairsplitting.

63 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:33:49am
64 Beneficial  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:34:54am

#73
are you sure about that?

65 foreign devil  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:35:37am

Somebody there gets it.

66 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:36:11am
67 LemonJoose  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:36:55am
68 Missy The Cat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:37:05am

#41 Rednek

Wasn't Helen Thomas in that "Boobs Not Bombs" protest?

/no need for a cold shower here

69 boiii  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:38:00am
70 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:38:25am
Indeed, jihadis have been killing for a decade in the name of Islam.

Not to split hairs, but it's been a little longer than that.

71 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:40:21am

#68 Missy The Cat

Why did you have to say that, after I managed to get lunch down?

72 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:40:24am

Aw, cripes ! Didn't even get to post # 20 before I had to say this. I've seen hundreds of posts on this blog, maybe thousands, asking "where are the moderate muslims ?" Charles has even topped whole threads with such things. So finally some muslim (I guess) stands up and calls bullshit on the jihadis, their leaders and their supporters. And receives here ? Squat. Bupkiss. Doubts and denigrations. If you don't want to hear it and have no intention of believing it when you do hear it, then for crying out loud, stop beating your breast and demanding it. At least be honest.

73 Powderfinger  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:40:48am

#63 Beneficial

Absolutely.

74 alegrias  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:41:46am

#47 fjordman

Sad to hear Blair making nice with estupido Zappy. Mucho macho former President JOse Maria Aznar rightly denounced Zapatero's BS about forming an alliance of civilizations against terror. It's a weak FRENCH idea -- to do anything BUT work with the US to FIGHT our attackers. fuhgeddaboudit, french derriere kissing Zapatero: we tried singing Kumbaya at the UN and got Oil for Food, which worked great for you behind our backs but not so great for Iraqis. Colin Powell bent over backwards for you and all he got was played by you & your islamofascist clients.

75 Sean II  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:42:06am

All I can say is...WOW!

Vatican Denounces Some Israel Retaliation

"It's not always possible to immediately follow every attack against Israel with a public statement of condemnation," a statement from the Vatican press office said Thursday night, "and (that is) for various reasons, among them the fact that the attacks against Israel sometimes were followed by immediate Israeli reactions not always compatible with the rules of international law."

"It would thus be impossible to condemn the first (the terror strikes) and let the second (Israeli retaliation) pass in silence," said the statement, which had an unusually blistering tone for the Holy See.

76 FlyingTigress  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:43:53am

#40

And I was thinking about how many could have died on 9/11 in the collapse of the WTC towers if both planes had hit just a LITTLE later in the morning when both buildings were fully occupied for the day, and then in D.C. if Flight 93 hadn't been 'Rolled.'

77 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:44:13am
78 Barking Pumpkin  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:44:32am

Great article!
Where's the picture of the flying pig?

79 William  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:45:53am

This seems like a big deal:

A month before the London bombings, British authorities denied a request from the United States to apprehend a man now believed to have ties to the bombers, according to sources familiar with the inquiry. U.S. authorities wanted to question Haroon Rashid Aswat about a plot to set up a "jihad training camp" in Oregon.

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

80 jimgoism  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:45:55am

On one side i am not surprised.

We in america and the west have been targeted for mass destruction by the muslims.

Non muslims targeted because we are NON Muslims.

Islam the religion of peace has finally shown its true colours.
The colour of Islam is Red for innocent blood

They cant fight like men so the religion of peace kills women, children, targets hospitals and schools, the elderly, the wounded and of course infidels.

Now they are killing each other.

We in the United states have sent our sons and duaghters to the middle east twice to defend muslims in the last 15 years and once to bosnia to protect muslims.
Now they are slaughtering each other again.


We have rebuilt their country and they keep on blowing it up. Perhaps we should pull back a little let them slaughter each other (like the muslims in somalia and when they have wiped each other out) then knock their heads together and ask them are you finished with your Jihad?

Its a lot Islam has accomplished for the world. Nothing but DEATH...
Islam and Mohammed SUCK

81 Matticus Finch  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:46:23am

#72 Mike C

I'd like to be with you, Mike, but I want action, not words. Sorry. Too many dead people to demand anything else.

Moderate muslims need to turn over their radical brothers. Period.

82 gymnast  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:47:52am

And who has your local State U or Community College been Handing out I-20 Visas to? Will the Muslim Students Association on your local campus be a source of Safe Houses for Terrorists or a meeting place for the local terrorists in your community? Tommorow is Friday, check in with the President of your local instition of higher eduction and see if your tax dollars are being used to support those that would destroy you. Drop by the local mosque and take in the Friday Sermon, if you care.

83 Missy The Cat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:48:12am

#71 Earth2moonbat

Just trying to help you with your diet...

84 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:49:40am
The only accomplishment of jihadis is that now they have aroused the great "Western Tiger". There was a time when the United States and Europe welcomed Arab and Muslim immigrants, visitors and students, with open arms. London even allowed all dissidents escaping their countries to preach against those countries under the guise of political refugees.

Well, that is all over now. Time has become for the big Western vengeance.


The Last Jihadi?

Tom Cruise as Mohammed Jihad Shahid Mohammed Mohammed

85 LemonJoose  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:50:05am

#33
Yeah "Islamakazie" has a ring to it. But the analogies to Japanese WW2 kamikazes is not accurate. The kamikazes wore uniforms and attacked military targets.

86 Powderfinger  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:50:28am

#72 Mike C.

I have no doubt that there are moderate muslims. The non-moderates have a name for them: apostate. Irshad Manji, Mansour Ijaz, Ayaan Hirsi Ali and numerous others have been lauded here as Youssef Ibrahim has been on this thread.

The trouble is that such moderates are all too rare, and that even with moderation ginormous cultural problems (Diseases? See 2 threads back) often prevent any moderation from having an impact.

Being fatwaed doesn't help either.

Yes, we love to hear these things. We'd like it even better if they made a difference.

87 savage_nation[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:51:09am
88 FabioC.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:53:41am

Something like a vicious circle: progressive muslims are too few, and it's just words, and they can't make any difference. So we will just let them rot alone and not even spend a word in their support.

Not to mention the resident fanatics who already decided that Islam must be destroyed, possibly with a nice genocide of the Arabs as a side, and will always find excuses to dismiss the positive developments from that part of the world.

89 mickthemick  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:54:16am

#64 benfeficial

#73 are you sure about that?

Were you referring to my post in #53 (sted #73, which had not been posted yet)? Well, I'm not exactly sure about what this author thinks about Israel because I don't know him, I'm not familiar with his work and he does not mention Israel in this article. I'm being cautiously optimistic. I believe this guy is reasonable enough to believe that Israel is not responsible for any of the Arab world's problems. He's writing to a Muslim audience and wants to get taken seriously. Unfortunately, if he goes too far (like telling Muslims to wake up and stop villifying Israel) he'll be denounced or worse.

90 Kohenan The Barbarian  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:54:58am

The West's Achilles heel--although our tools of war are unmatchable, Our homeland arsenal of defence is limp until we attack the enemy within--we must extinguish the incitement and expunge those who preach hate in our midst--the home grown suicide homicide bomber, dirty bomb or suitcase nuclear threat, will not be erased by offshore interdiction and non porous immigration serveillance alone--the majority of Muslims have shown encouragement in breeding this terror in Islamic Nations,and have hampered attempts here at home by whining about "Multiculturalism" and "ethnic profiling" and "dissafection of their youth" and tacitly supporting their numerous Islamofacist Imams--sophisticated armies and weaponry do not prevent or weed out internal rot--its time to stop expecting any help or cooperation from Islam and do the job ourselves forthwith!

91 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:57:06am
92 alegrias  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:57:14am

#72 Mike C.

You're right, we want to hear from any moderates out there.

I personally want a moderate army to rise up, grab the microphone at the mosque, run the crazy mullah out of town, broadcast their jihad is over, parade around their streets as the moderate neighborhood watch-- I want a thousand moderates to bloom, I want a moderate purple revolution, I want the moderates on fire. Moderates of the world, unite.

What we get instead is CAIR-like backpedalling meant for infidel consumption when you know, I know and the American people should know "It's about the Caliphate, stupid."

93 mich-again  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:57:16am

Van Halen's first album features a great tune called "I'm on Fire". Come to think of it, It also had "Atomic Punk" and "Running with the Devil". All three titles conjure up images of insane muslim fanatics.

94 hepcat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:57:48am

Which reminds me Procol Harum's album "The Well's on Fire".

It was all over in a few seconds flat
Blue skies turned grey at the drop of a hat
Pillars of dust blocked out the sun
All that the people could do was run

We thought we were living on easy street
But they pulled the rug from under our feet
They pulled the rug from under our feet

95 savage_nation[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:58:22am
96 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:58:45am

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the passage I quoted is another example of making Arabs and Muslims out to be the victims of terrorist attacks. Though one factor in terrorism, it's overstated and unseemly when victims are lying in the rubble.

If some foreign students are turned away from our universities, I can sleep at night.

97 reader  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:59:01am

I've read the Koran, several times. I know that it is impossible to be a good human being and a faithful-to-the-Koran Muslim. Utterly impossible. No room for compromise. Every westerner needs to read this book, and that goes double for academics. NEVER forget, this is their book. Never forget, Muslims do not and will not criticize nor even question Muhammad. Once again, Islam gets a pass.

This article reads just like more lament over the bursting of the Islamic bubble (thank you, terrorists). You want sincerity? Show me a Muslim fighting for religious and racial equality in Muslim lands, and not against some vague, unrooted notions of terrorism. Show me a Muslim organization fighting against slavery. Imagine if the American south were still the slave-holding south. That is much of what we have in the Muslim world, and these bastards say and do nothing, save whine and seethe, and now lament. They simply cannot come to terms with their own hateful bigotry, whether it be of their history or their scriptures. Such is the supremacist mind.

98 snopes  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:59:02am

I think this guy is sincere. Read his bio, he is a business man. His interests lie with good relations with the West. It doesn't make a *theological* argument, but so what. He is an Arab who wants a shot at a good standard of living and recognizes the jihadis are not going to bring that and peace will.

99 taterhead  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:59:21am

...

an arsenal of laws, intelligence pooling, surveillance by satellites, armies of special forces and indeed, allies inside the Arab world

..okay, so this is what we have on our side


PC, mainstream media, moonbats, blind anti-American/capitalism/responsibility lefty elite types such as Kennedy, Turbin Durbin, Rangel, basking in the glow of their own self importance, Saudi blood money.

..besides their own ideology, this is what is on their side.

It is obvious which has been and will be more deadly...until someone grows the balls and shoves the PC up MSM and Durbin's tooter, shows Islam by more 'We're-not-going-to-f*ck-with-you-anymore' 5 pellets in the head at a time chases, and puts a 'state' sized parking lot somewhere in the ME.

100 BingoBunny  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 11:59:56am

That is the first sane comments writen by a Muslim about this I have read.. he doesn't sound too thrilled about the Imman's either. But my God it took them 4 years to start thinking like this! Our MSM guys could learn from this dude.

/if the war is for oil.. why don't we have it?

101 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:00:07pm

Good, good article, from a Muslim who also happens to be a capitalist. I like capitalists. I like this guy, because he has said in the past that Arab journalists tend to sweep stuff under the rug. He's challenged them to report on things such as slavery (what used to be called "white" slavery), government problems, etc. Here he does just that.

I like this phrase - "the big Western vengeance." I'm looking for music now, for the soundtrack.

102 Sean II  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:00:15pm

MUST READ:

When the Profile Fits the Crime

Young Muslim men bombed the London tube, and young Muslim men attacked New York with planes in 2001. From everything we know about the terrorists who may be taking aim at our transportation system, they are most likely to be young Muslim men. Unfortunately, however, this demographic group won't be profiled. Instead, the authorities will be stopping Girl Scouts and grannies in a procedure that has more to do with demonstrating tolerance than with protecting citizens from terrorism.

Critics protest that profiling is prejudicial. In fact, it's based on statistics. Insurance companies profile policyholders based on probability of risk. That's just smart business. Likewise, profiling passengers based on proven security risk is just smart law enforcement.

Besides, done properly, profiling would subject relatively few Muslims to searches. Elderly Muslim women don't fit the terrorist profile. Young Muslim men of Arab or South Asian origin do. But rather than acknowledge this obvious fact, the New York Police Department has advised subway riders to be alert for "people" in bulky clothes who sweat or fiddle nervously with bags.

103 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:01:34pm

#77 AI

I think the lack of the "I' word in this piece really says it all.

104 hous bin pharteen  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:02:58pm

OT
From Al Reuters-
In regards to the Venice Film Festival

Security in the Spotlight

I am confused again. I thought Michael "Fat Boy" Moore said that there is no terrorist threat. And we know how much Hollywood loves him and thinks he is preaching the Gospel acocording to LLL. So why are all the Hollywierd stars worried about security?

Must be all those militant Amish again.

105 savage_nation[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:04:27pm
106 rightasrain  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:04:40pm

#102 Sean II

rather than acknowledge this obvious fact, the New York Police Department has advised subway riders to be alert for "people" in bulky clothes who sweat or fiddle nervously with bags.

If they're onboard and fiddling, it's already too late.

It's a tough war to fight when we're trying to be fair and kind to people who are brazenly barbaric and bigoted.

107 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:04:47pm
108 One Wish  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:04:51pm

One thing the writer gets wrong is his reference to "Western revenge." It's not revenge we seek. We just need them to join us in purging the nasty elements from thier flock.

109 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:05:09pm

77 American Infidel

Sorry, but I don't think that's fair.

It's as disingenuous for us to yell "takkya" at every Muslim as it is for Muslims to yell "Infidel" at us.

If you take the time to check out this guy's background, you'll find a moderate Muslim, a capitalist, an energy expert, and a reporter on a whole range of issues - I don't always agree with him; I don't always disagree with him. A person, in other words.

110 bunuel  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:05:27pm

EE #32
Very good observation. This is capital.

111 FabioC.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:06:05pm

Oh my god, someone told me to STFU! I can only bow to such a powerful and convincing argument, sign of a clearly superior mind. But I think I'll just have a giggle about it.


#96 Beagle

It seems quite true to me that a lot of Arabs/Muslims are dying at the hands of the jihadis - Iraq, Egypt etc.

This does not mean that we in the West should do nothing; I think that a turn of the screw on immigration is required among other things.

112 Semper Fi  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:06:14pm

#75 Sean II

Maybe they sat on that statement too long before its release.

/tongue in cheek; eyes rolling slightly

113 Mardukhai  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:07:37pm

This Ibrahim nails it!

He could have used a quote from the Japanese Admiral Yamamoto. Just as his countrymen were celebrating the "victory" at Pearl Harbor, he said:

"I fear that all we have done is to awake a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."
114 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:07:38pm

#105 savage_nation

Yep. I can hear that eerie whistle now.

115 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:07:58pm
If this is jihad someone got his religious education completely upside down.


How many times have I heard this before?

116 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:08:04pm

#109 Cattt

So where's that dreaded "I" word then?

117 poof  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:08:24pm

#22 FlyingTigress

Let's hope it never really comes to that. Although what we have is a dangerous mixture of 7th century thinking with 21st century weaponry.

118 rednaxela  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:13:01pm

#88 FabioC.

As I said on an ealier thread, if criticism of Islam is taboo in Western countries, and may even lead to imprisonment, such as in the case of your compatriot Oriana, what hope is there for "moderate" Muslims to be able to speak up?

We must do our part, and that means an end to this criticism of Islam is taboo BS.

119 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:13:30pm

I hear an argument which treads dangerously close to excusing attacks on Americans or Brits in Iraq, trying to separate "jihad" from 'jihad' (again), and more Muslim victimization claims (including 'Palestine').

Who cares if Saudi princes get their degrees in Florida? I don't.

I don't hear anything new we haven't known for years.

120 Prester John  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:16:51pm

"The latest reliable report confirms that on average 33 Iraqis die every day, executed by Iraqis and foreign jihadis and suicide bombers, not by US or British soldiers."

This is the key point that we need to hammer away at. The Islamic world and the Michael Moores of the world do not want to admit it. At some point it has got to start sinking (for some people at least) that it is the Islamofascist terrorists, not "insurgents" that are killing other Muslims

121 alegrias  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:16:55pm

On the other hand, if Mr. Ibrahim is truly making the case we disgruntled plaintiffs bring against his islamofascist defendants interested only in jihadding us until the new Caliphate--that such defendants need to be de-legitimized, expunged, neutered, neutralized, shunned and re-programmed along with their followers, that's nice and more power to him. Case closed.

122 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:17:24pm

On topic really!

Helen Thomas the sorta Muslimist of the AP says she'll kill herself if Dick Cheney runs for President...

Heck all he has to do is run-not even win it!

Come on Cheney-

DO IT!

[Link: www.drudgereport.com...]

123 rednaxela  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:18:01pm

#119 Beagle

I agree entirely, this piece isn't nearly as groundbreaking as it appears, it's just that our expectations for RoPer writers, especially those associated with teh NYT is very very low.

Indeed, this guys interpretation of the Cold War is a testament to his stupidity.
As for the rest of it, as you say, just regurgitating commonly known truisms.

124 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:18:06pm

# 77 AI

Then be up front about it. Nothing any muslim ever says or does will appear in your eyes as anything other than purposeful decption. In that case, I see no alternative to the 'bigel' option. You simply have to gut up and say we should just kill well over a billion people, regardless what they say or do. Oh, and you might want to take Charles to task as well, because judging by the tenor of his statements at the top of the thread, he seems to think this is a good thing. I agree with him.

125 snopes  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:18:58pm

Geez. It's like some of you have started an industry based upon the idea that there are no moderate muslims - and now you are afraid of losing your livlihood.

126 Prester John  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:19:46pm

#122 Wouldn't it be a hoot to see Halliburton Cheney run in 2008 and beat Hillary, or even better, the French speaking one who, in case you hadn't heard, served in Vietnam?

127 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:20:18pm

#41 Rednek

Oh merde I see ya beat me to it...

Dang it!

128 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:20:49pm
129 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:21:05pm
The Muslim fundamentalist who attacked the Dutch film director Theo Van Gogh in the Netherlands, stabbed him more than 23 times then cut his throat. He recently proudly proclaimed at his trial: "I did it because my religion - Islam - dictated it and I would do it again if were free." Which preacher told this guy this is Islam? That preacher should be in jail with him.
130 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:22:18pm

# 92 alegrias

Yeah, well, smacking down the first few that have the guts to step up to the plate and,as a number of other have so aptly put it, "placed a target on their backs" is sure a real good strategy to encourage others.

131 rednaxela  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:23:38pm

#124 Mike C.

While I do believe that there are moderate Muslims out there, I also believe that the PC RoP talk disseminated by our politicians isn't helping their cause one bit.

As I said a moment or two ago, what hope is there for these people to speak up when even Western society deems criticism of Islam taboo?

132 norar  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:24:12pm

This guys shows Western media what does it mean to really care about Iraq and Iraqis, and Muslims in general, as opposite to the false pretences of "caring" produced by the most MSM "journalists" and "analysts".

The only question is how many Muslims will read this article?

#9 American Infidel

Still practicing taqiyya & kitman, the preachers are the good moslems...The preachers are the ones that know islam inside out...

However, he says more about the "root causes" of Islamic terrorism, than most of MSM do.

#10 mickthemick

Sadly, the great points of this article will be lost on the vast majority of folks in the Arab and Islamic worlds who will continue to put the blame for Islamic terrorism on the U.S., Israel and the West in general.

His points will be lost on the bigger part of the Western intelligentsia as well, and they have less excuses for being willfully blind, IMO. How many Western newspaper will pick up this opinion pioece for reprinting, do you think?

#72 Mike C.

You are right. There are plenty of Muslim talking against Islamofascists. And though they are fewer than we would like to hear, it is a huge mistake to ignore or discount them. It takes guts to go against traditional Muslim shame culture, and they are our best allies in the Muslim world.

133 Matticus Finch  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:24:33pm

#109 Cattt 7/28/2005 02:05PM PDT

I know you directed this to AI, but I would like to interject something here. Taqiya is in their holy book. Taqiya is a tenet of Islam. It says that if you don't practice taqiya, it is just as bad as not praying.

Here is a document that describes taqiya. This is an Islamic document, not some anti-Islam site.

So, we have to ask ourselves, "Is this guy for real, or 'defending his faith by lying' (taqiya)?

*shrugs* Hey, it's not my tenet, it's theirs. I'll never trust their words, only their deeds.

134 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:25:04pm

116 pure francis

That's a really dumb comment. I ignored it the first time, because I didn't want to say that. But since you repeated it directly to me, it is fair game now.

The guy is a Muslim. He is writing from an insider's perspective about jihadi Muslims. One must accept the premise that not all Muslims are jihadis to understand the article.

He is tacitly saying "and I'm not one of those jihadis - I am writing about how they are screwing up the world." He's giving a basic cause/effect opinion piece.

His basic idea is that jihadi Muslims are going nuts, using Iraq as an exuse, and biting off more than they will be able to chew; that moderate Muslims (like himself) are going to be swept up in it; and that there will be hell to pay.

The piece doesn't have a "and here is what we can do to stop it" part. It's kind of a doom/gloom thing. I have some nitpicks with the piece, but I'm not quite anal enough to be worried about his pronoun use.

135 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:25:48pm
136 alegrias  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:25:48pm

#124 mike c.

All we are saying, is show us your moderation in any islam-run communities. Trust but verify was Reagan's approach to communist promises of perestroika.

Show us one country where moderates hold sway. All I see is mortal combat on their own "governments" which they call "infidel" though 100% moslem--Egypt, Saudi, Jordan, Sudan, etc. Moslem on moslem violence is proof moderates remain mum.

The onus is on muslims to prove their moderation.

137 rednaxela  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:26:09pm

#125 snopes

IMO its bad etiquette to post blanket accusations without specifying who it is that you mean.

138 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:26:10pm

# 109 Cattt

You'll burn in hell for that. I'll be the guy sitting next to you.

139 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:26:26pm

#75 Screw the vatican, I don't take my marching orders from those idiots anyway.

140 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:27:11pm

#126 Prester John

Them Dems got a Frenchie who did 'Nam-

Heck they might have themselves a winner-

If he was married to a rich gal he'd be a winner fo' sho...

{shudder} {gulp!}

I'm scared...


Helen Thomas she better not be like the rest of them Dems who promised to move to Fwance but then fell in love with Bush runnin' things in America!

I say Cheney plays poker and he should call her bluff!

141 Satan Sidekick  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:27:49pm

122 Madawaskan

Hi Cuz

Helen Thomas - the original goat woman. She will kill herself? Too funny. What a wackjob.

142 bunuel  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:28:33pm

lemon-joose.
warranted rant. agree w. you.

143 Strangelove  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:28:39pm

Forget it...

muslims will win, because Americans are too stupid, too lazy, too bored with 9/11 to get off their fat asses to do anything about the Muslim disease.

They are motivated, we yawn as they fund-raise right here in our country. Can anyone here imagine a Japanese Brotherhood foundation still standing on December 8th , 1941.

You people are dreaming if you think anything substantial will be done to thwart Sharia law. This war on terror is half-assed and will fail. Iraq will fail because we are half-assing that, too.

General Sherman:
"War is cruelty. There is no use in refining it. The crueler it is, the sooner it is over."

We are soft. This war will go on forever, because we don't have the balls to really do war anymore.

144 galtg  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:28:44pm

Yeah but the jihadis will just say that he's a puppet of the west and go right on killing

145 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:29:26pm
146 FabioC.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:30:14pm

#133 Matticus Finch

Asking questions is one thing, and totally legit.

But starting from the assumption that anything good coming from a Muslim mouth/pen is deception, or useless or lip service is different.

There is also Magdi Allam, in Italy, who's living under police escort because he outed radical imams, shed light on the network of radical mosques and terror-financing islamic "charities". He's hated almost as strongly by the Left too.

147 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:31:19pm

#134 Cattt

Perhaps you should have read the whole thread before barging out accusing me of making a stupid comment.

Let me spell it out for you -- and all of the other apologists -- how many times does Mr. Ibrahim mention Israel?

148 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:32:37pm

Kohenian the Barbarian

Strong words.

Got your own funding for Private Black-Ops. ?

Running for McCain's Senate Seat ?

Or just venting ...

149 jrdroll  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:34:02pm

More from the ROP:

"Moroccans Beat Up van Gogh's Son, 14"

Theo Since the murder of Theo van Gogh, last November, his now 14-year-old son Lieuwe has twice been physically attacked by young Moroccans, or (more likely) Dutch citizens of Moroccan descent. [Link, in Dutch.] Van Gogh's parents said this in an interview on national television.

They insisted their grandson had done nothing to provoke the assaults. In one incident, recalled Anneke van Gogh, Theo's mother, "[Lieuwe] was walking the dog in the Watergraafsmeer area of Amsterdam, and they came up to him and said, 'Is your name van Gogh?' Lieuwe said no, of course, but they beat him anyway."
[Link: www.planet.nl...]
[Link: www.bakelblog.com...]

150 Village Idiot's Apprentice  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:34:38pm

Mike C.
Sorry, but I can't let you take all the heat by yourself.

"I want to see actions, not words"

OK, fair enough.
But, there will be no action without first thinking and talking about it.

"We can't trust them, they always lie"

So, how do we ever get around to believing them?

If the moderates start to rise up and fight the terrorists, I'm guessing it wouldn't take long for someone to say "It's a trick to get us to let our guard down"

At some point we gotta say it ain't perfect, but it's a start.

I wish I had saved the links I had read today, but there is alot out there from the muslim side starting to voice opposition to the terrorists.

Is it perfect?
Hell no, but it's going to take some time to swing the inertia of 1,700 years into another direction.


Can we at least hope that they are seeing the light?

151 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:34:56pm

American Infidel-

Damn it you have a track record here-

Don't make me publish the crap you said after the Easter Tsunami hit.

Your hatred oozes sometimes and I thought you promised to check it a tad.


I don't think Ali de Grandpa ever commented again after you had a herd of LGFers make nasty comments that day.

You have to try and check it-

Girl.

Hate like that will make YOU rot-

Do it for yourself...

Dang it I thought you were going to try to curtail it.

152 Satan Sidekick  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:34:58pm

Van Gogh's Son Assaulted

More Islamic Seething

153 rednaxela  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:35:49pm

#146 FabioC.

Oh please.
This guy's no Magdi Allam, not even close.

To be sure, he says a lot of good stuff, but he also says lots of questionable stuff.

I think Beagle (#119) found the right measure here.

154 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:35:55pm

133 Matticus Finch

Hey, I know that Islam is a can of worms. The guy who started the religion was a psycho (IMHO). The whole thing got worse with the incredibly stupid interpretations the various branches put on the original, not to mention that there is a basic "I am better than you; you say you are better than I; therefore, I must kill you" mentality.

That doesn't change the fact that not all Muslims are going to interpret things that way. There are Muslims who say that Islam should allow for diversity in thought and that there are only some very basic articles of faith that make one a Muslim. I admit one is looking through a glass darkly when one knows that that, too, may be a lie.

I guess I choose hope. I just don't think they are all lying.

155 Bubbaman  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:37:49pm

Typical [bigoted word] - they never fail to slip in the Israel thing.

He's totally wrong about the situation in "Palestine". It isn't the internal "jihad" between the factions which is causing problems, it is the inculcation of hatred and anti-Semitism and murdering of Israelis. Why is it that when [bigoted word]s feel "conflicted", innocents die?

Apesass is impotent because he has no intention of doing the right thing. In fact much of the world including the Euro-peons, the developing nations, and the American left has great sympathy for the Paleonazis. Killing Jews is more than just a sport for them.

Ibrahim is making rationalizations and is off the mark.

156 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:38:02pm

Ya cripes sake it's a start-

And who do you think is translating-

OUT IN THE FIELD-

And doing INVALUABLE INTEL-

and a lot of the specialists at military hospitals-

are

Muslim Americans.

157 yankev  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:38:09pm

#16 Scott

The new anti-terror laws in Britain would make the ACLU kill themselves.

From your mouth . . . before the ACLU gets the rest of us killed.

158 FabioC.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:39:30pm

Time to sign off anyway. G'nite.

159 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:39:34pm
160 Matticus Finch  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:39:53pm

#146 FabioC. 7/28/2005 02:30PM PDT


There is also Magdi Allam, in Italy, who's living under police escort because he outed radical imams, shed light on the network of radical mosques and terror-financing islamic "charities". He's hated almost as strongly by the Left too.

That's all I'm asking for. Action. Hats off to Magdi Allam. He should be a role model to 'moderates' everywhere.

Respectfully I'd like to ask a question, though: If he shed light on the network of radical mosques, shouldn't hundreds of 'moderates' from those mosques have come forward to spill the beans about the radicalism running rampant? Why wouldn't at least 50 'moderates' come forward?

161 Van Impe  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:40:48pm
The world of Islam is on fire. Indeed, the Muslim mind is on fire.

Both fires stoked by Al-Jazeera, which continues to add fuel with every broadcast.

162 Axiom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:40:55pm

Isn't this an Arab problem? It sure seems like the Arabs are doing most of the killing or funding the people that are doing the killing.

163 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:42:06pm

If any of you all are in ther active duty military you would see who is risking a lot to be on our side...

They volunteer to serve THE MUSLIM AMERICANS-

And they are a hell of a lot MORE VALUABLE than some DEMOCRATIC LIBERAL-

RICH SPOILED BRAT WHO WHINES AND COMPLAINS ABOUT THE WAR.

While they are kept safe.

Muslim Americans in the US military are-


INVALUABLE

164 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:43:32pm

147 pure francis

I did read the whole thread. I had know idea what you were talking about. I thought the I word was I. Silly me - I forgot that NOTHING can be written about the ME without mentioning Israel! (sarc)

I still think your comment was stupid.

Reminds me of a story Truman Capote told. He ordered bacon and eggs in the south. The waitress said, "I'm sorry - I can't serve you that - we're out of grits."

165 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:44:06pm

Freudian PIMF - know shd be no

166 scott in east bay  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:44:33pm

I think it's interesting that India has 150,000,000 Muslims and yet jihadis rarely ever come from there. My Indian Muslim cabbie tells me it's because India is a democracy. He may be right, or not, but it's interesting none the less.

167 Earl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:45:23pm
168 rednaxela  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:45:46pm

#155 Bubbaman

Well, there definitely is also an internal jihad, also in Palestine. However, so long as criticism of Islam is taboo, the bad guys win. The problem is that as soon as anyone says, wait a minute, the Koran might say all these things about jihad, Dhimmis, veils, etc. but we shouldn't take these things so literally, that person puts a bullseye on their own head. Mind you, not necessarily because he or she is in the minority but because the bad guys will use that as a pretext to mark that person and others are too afraid to speak up. The school yard bully thing comes to mind.

Anyway, I think I've made my point about the "taboo" thing today, so I'll move on now.

169 Right Wing Conspirator  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:46:11pm

Here is another good read to go along with this article -

Fighting Terrorism: Recommendations of Arab Reformists

The question of how to fight Islamic terrorism preoccupies many Arab reformists who are working to denounce Islamist thought, to encourage independent and critical thinking, and to establish values of democracy and human rights in the Muslim world. For example, in February 2005, a group of reformists submitted to the U.N. a request that it establish an international court to judge Muslim clerics who incite to violence and bloodshed. The request was examined by the U.N. legal counseland distributed to the U.N. Security Council. [1]

Following the July 7, 2005 London bombings, Arab reformists further expanded their criticism and honed their arguments, not only regarding Muslim extremists, but also regarding the European countries, particularly Britain, which allows extremist activity within its borders in the name of protecting individual rights. They also increased their criticism of the silent Muslim majority and moderate Muslim intellectuals, who capitulate to Islamist pressure and do not speak out decisively against it.

The following are some of the recommendations by reformist Arab writers.

170 Van Impe  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:47:07pm

#149 jrdroll

Moroccans Beat Up van Gogh's Son, 14

I read this story at dhimmi watch. Sadly the name "van Gogh" instead of being a source of pride (Vincent being the most famous dutchman since Rembrandt)has apparently become a liabilty. Only a matter of time before all the art museums in Europe suffer the same fate as those giant Buddhist statues in Afghanistan.

171 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:47:46pm
172 yankev  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:48:36pm

#75

among them the fact that the attacks against Israel sometimes were followed by immediate Israeli reactions not always compatible with the rules of international law."

And particularly the well known law that Jews are not permitted to use force under any circumstances, and particularly not to defend themselves against bnai Yishmoel or b'naim Edom who are trying to kill them.

173 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:50:00pm
174 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:50:32pm

American Infidel-
I would not call this compassionate-

I remember because it was sooo grooosss and it was just the start-you were still seething about the Schiavo stuff which i was on your side about-

Her is your comment-girl on the tsunami thread-

#18 American Infidel 3/28/2005 09:08AM PST
I am not donating any $$$...They can naturally, beautifully, euphorically dehydrate & starve and subsequently join allah...

here is the link to that thread-

[Link: www.littlegreenfootballs.com...]


You are dangerously close to having the SAME problem that you accuse Islamofascists of having...

The problem is irrational hatred.

175 MJ  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:51:45pm

"Time has become for the big Western vengeance."

Tpical New York Times bullshit. Why is it that whenever the West defends itself against these "Islamic Nazis", it becomes "vengence"?

Too, every time Israelis decide that they aren't going to be killed just because some Muslim Nazi says it OK, it becomes "vengence".

This guy isn't saying it's morally wrong for to kill the "infidel", He's just saying it doesn't help Islam.

176 Matticus Finch  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:51:47pm

154 Cattt-

I've just seen too much "Oh, this is horrible, this is not Islam" crap.

"I guess I choose hope. I just don't think they are all lying. "

I'm not saying they're all lying. I'm saying there is no way to tell.

Your point is taken, and I respect your opinion. *shrugs* Hey, we (lizards everywhere) can't always agree.

See you down the road.

177 savage_nation[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:55:22pm
178 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:57:51pm
179 yankev  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:58:38pm

Ibrahim has written that Israel is responsible for Palestinian terrorism.

Wheaton, Md.: As democracy spreads in the Middle East, do you think Arabs will end their evil terrorist attacks on Israel?

Outlook: Democracy in the Middle East

So much for the condemnation of terrorism.

180 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 12:59:19pm

#164 Cattt

When in doubt ask before accusing.

As for the omission of Israel, I think its a total give-away, given how extensively he talks about "Palestine on fire", but especially when gives his rendition about "Palestinian sufferings".

I might have rushed into this thread thinking that here, we've got a serious RoP voice of reason, but this guy is just trying to sound reasonable, while in actual fact, his bias shines right through.

And before I get accused of pissing on a "moderate" RoPer, I think we just need to be very careful about this and IMHO this guy just sounds a bit dodgy.

181 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:00:01pm

American Infidel

I think we can also talk about people hating Muslims sooo bad that they deny that Muslims were mass-murdered by Serbians.

They say that the Muslims in Kosovo and atSrebrenica made it up.

Or that the numbers were inflated...

To make those kinds od claims borders on or is irrational hatred.

182 yankev  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:00:02pm

#179 Oops, forgot to post his answer

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Yes, once Israel starts treating Palestinians, who are Arabs by the way, as human beings not animals. Cheers.
183 Van Impe  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:00:15pm

#173 American Infidel

No wasn't me. I always thought "islamic art" was an oxymoron.

184 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:00:26pm
185 BH  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:03:37pm
I think we can also talk about people hating Muslims sooo bad that they deny that Muslims were mass-murdered by Serbians.

I, for one, would never deny that such a thing happened. However, I have since come to regret our involvement and wonder exactly why we interfered. Perhaps Billy got paid off by the Fraudis?

186 rcris5  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:04:26pm

OT

Another mind on fire, from Drudge Rept:

Veteran wire reporter Helen Thomas is vowing to 'kill herself' if Dick Cheney announces he is running for president.

The newspaper HILL first reported the startling claim on Thursday.

MORE

"The day Dick Cheney is going to run for president, I'll kill myself," she told the HILL. "All we need is one more liar."

Thomas added, "I think he'd like to run, but it would be a sad day for the country if he does."

...Oh please Dick, announce now!

187 savage_nation[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:04:33pm
188 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:04:43pm

American Infidel

they're partying like it's 1999 after 9/11

doesn't excuse you driving that thread down to shat-that was just your first comment.

Plus there was your blind support of a Serbian lawyer -a defender of the mass murderer of Muslims in Kosovo-

Who's hate book NRO decided was too gross for them.

189 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:08:34pm

American Infidel

If you want to lump everyone together and make stereotypes and if you can't appreciate that there are Muslim Americans making valuable contributions to the GWOT-

Welp that's your problem-

Name one Muslim that you do like-

And no it can't be Omar Sharif.

190 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:08:40pm

#179 yankev

Thanks, what a treasure cove. Turns out some of our suspicions were right on the money.

Alexandria, Va.: While to some it may appear that Bush was right all along, as an American, I find his intentions a little shady. President Bush didn't push "democratization" of the Middle East until afterr it became clear to the world that Iraq did not have WMD and was not involved in the 9/11 attacks.

Youssef M. Ibrahim: You have made several points, and I agree with them. First, you are right in saying Bush never meant to be democratic in his Iraqi adventure, but, frankly, as an Arab, what do I care, if, indeed, it turns out this way?


Oh yeah, thats right, W. never mentioned freedom and democracy prior to the war. Idiot.

Wheaton, Md.: As democracy spreads in the Middle East, do you think Arabs will end their evil terrorist attacks on Israel?

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Yes, once Israel starts treating Palestinians, who are Arabs by the way, as human beings not animals. Cheers.

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Bush is not, repeat, not, my cup of tea. Yes, he went to war for oil in my view.

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Iraq is definitely a trap for the U.S. which may be a good thing... since Vietnam. Maybe we should abandon war or use of force to impose... what do you think?

Youssef M. Ibrahim: I do not like Bush, think he is a moron, do not believe in his motives and I think I made this clear in my article. But, when you see something good happening despite his worse intentions among your people, what the hell?

191 DP111  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:10:23pm

Here is an article of interest

Muhammad’s Dead Poets Society

[Link: answering-islam.org...]

and this from MEMRI. This is a must read.

Coptic TV Show Causes Controversy in Egypt

[Link: www.memri.org...]

192 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:18:14pm

# 136 alegrias

That's the second time this thread I've heard "Trust but verify." Come on now - all I'm asking is that you be honest. Some posters here will never trust muslims on anything, anytime, anywhere, regardless of any statement or action on their part short of converting to Christianity or Judeism. And I wouldn't bet money on that, either. As I said in my first post, I just want to hear a bit of honesty here. Stop all this breast-beating about wanting to see the moderate muslim while slapping down anything that looks like it might be a step in that direction. At least bigel was honest - he wanted to nuke Europe and said just so. I think he was nuts, but at least he was honest.

193 Sean II  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:21:26pm

NETHERLANDS: VAN GOGH'S SON ASSAULTED

On another occasion he is said to have been threatened with a pistol by two young men of North African descent in the neighbourhood where his father had lived. Neighbours called the police but when they arrived the attackers had fled.

According to his grandparents, Lieuwe was also subject to harrassment and insults at school, and was forced to change class after various classmates told him "it is a good thing your father is dead".

194 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:21:45pm

# 147 pure francis

Damn right ! And you'll notice he didn't say anything about the floating of the yuan, either ! Dirty bastard !

195 Kohenan The Barbarian  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:22:02pm

#148 Havoc--still fixated pissing on Canukistan eh!--we just sent a contingent to the most dangerous province in Afghanistan to kill terrorists,--somhow you have forgotten that Canada was into the First and Second World Wars three years before Uncle Sam on both occasions and we never yapped about loyalty and common goals--our countries are distinct Nations with mutual cooperation and respect--lets keep it that way.

196 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:23:57pm

#180 pure francis 7/28/2005 02:59PM PDT
#164 Cattt

When in doubt ask before accusing.
---
I didn't mean to be accusatory - sorry if it came out that way. It's another LaTella moment.

I think we are actually in semi-in agreement. I do agree it is a mine field. I may be being more credulous, but I live in hope. I'm glad you're hopeful as well. Never give up, never give in.

197 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:25:42pm

#193

And he isn't even allowed to own a gun.

198 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:29:28pm

#194 Mike C.

Look, I'm all for supporting Muslims who speak up and all that. But this guy has hypocrisy written all over him. If this article didn't give it away, check out the link in #179.

199 Luigi  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:30:29pm

Muslims around the globe are not opressed by Jews. They are oppressed by antisemitism.

200 Gruen  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:30:43pm

Guys,

If you want to know what the UK is up against, have a look at this Islamonazi message board...See here

It is disturbing to say the least and surely a target for the government to shut down as it clearly incites religious hatred.

I'm sending this to British freinds in the hope that they will wake up...

201 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:31:37pm

#1 Earth to Moonbat:

I hope so too. I bought a Time Special Edition of the 60th Anniversary showing V-E Day. Those folks truly were our Greatest Generation.

Reading this special edition only confirms that we face the same situation today, only the enemy isn't Nazi's. It is islam, a/k/a Nazi's hiding under the protection and cloak of 'religion'. This 'cloak of religion' gives them license to wreak the same havoc that the Nazi's did 60 years ago. The ideology is the same. The goals are the same. The islamic war against all non muslims has been re-invented, using the same geographical areas by way of uncontrolled immigration and muslim population.

I stand proud and firm, and know that perhaps we will be the "Next" Great Generation. God knows we will have to be.

Kafira.

202 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:34:18pm

#196 Cattt

No offense taken.
Anyway, I think some of his remarks in #179 are pretty revealing.

What we need is decent people to speak up, not these sorts of canting phony who can't seem to decide whether removing Saddam was a good thing or not, but it was definitely about oil.

203 BPP  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:34:29pm

179 yankev

So much for the condemnation of terrorism.

I read through that transcript. Ibrahim is no neo-con, that's for sure. A lot of blaming, a lot of claiming. The bit about Hezbollah being a "insurance against Israeli aggression" was also charming.

In this context, I think Charles is wrong to ascribe "mental clarity" to Mr. Ibrahim. I think he actually represents a fairly dominant view among Arab moderates. Terrorism is to be condemned or resisted because it is inconveniencing them, or it is bound to fail, or whatever. Anything but condemning it because it is an immoral, evil thing for which there can be no excuse and no explaining away. And that goes for terrorism against anyone, including Israel.

204 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:37:23pm

I think that this article is important. The author refers to "cowardly jihadis" and makes it quite clear that they are murderers who have accomplished nothing and who should not be seen as acting on behalf of Islam.

He not only attacks the jihadis themselves but also the so-called religious "authorities" who abet them. This is an unsubtle slap at the Saudis.

As for his failure to mention Israel, that's not what this article is about. It's about how what the jihadis are doing (and their entire mindset) has harmed Muslims. It goes without saying that the Israelis will fight back - what he's saying is that so will the rest of the non-Muslim world, and that what the violence has accomplished is to unite the West.

I find it disturbing that no matter what any Muslim says, there are those here who will scream that he didn't say enough, that he's lying, etc.

Self-examination in the Muslim world has been conspicuously absent - it has to start somewhere. This is one of the few things I've seen coming out of the Muslim world that puts the blame squarely where it belongs and expresses moral outrage.

I'm gratified that Charles gave it a thread, and I thank him for the hat tip.

205 Powderfinger  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:37:46pm

#203 BPP

Terrorism is to be condemned or resisted because it is inconveniencing them, or it is bound to fail, or whatever. Anything but condemning it because it is an immoral, evil thing for which there can be no excuse and no explaining away. And that goes for terrorism against anyone, including Israel.

Huh? BPP?

Wow. Bravo. Exactly right. Yes. I concur.

/off to check for hallucinations and then have a fatal heart attack

206 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:37:57pm

#200 Gruen

Uhh, that is vile.

207 norar  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:38:52pm

#145 American Infidel

The preachers are not the 'root causes' of islamic terrorism or jihad...

The root cause is the Qur'an, ...

Well, the not so well kept secret of the Muslim world is the fact that the vast majority of Muslims, including the educated ones, never even read Koran. And even if Mr Ibrahim IS in denial, I still think he and other Muslim who speak out against Islamofascists should be saluted rather than sneared at.

208 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:41:44pm

202 pure francis

Like I said, I don't always agree with him.

The funny thing is, Mr. Ibrahim gets flack for many articles - from Muslims - for focusing on the negative, for comments such as this one (from the Washington Times, reprinted from the Gulf News):

For years [Al Jazeera] has given prime time to the rabid Egyptian so-called religious leader Yusuf Al Qardawi, who issued an edict allowing the killing of Americans in Iraq and wife beating. The other day Al Itihad, the Emirates Arabic daily, to its credit, denounced him as an "ignorant man" misleading Muslims. Abdelrahman Al Rashed, the manager of the competing Arabic network Al Arabiya, also to his credit, also took him on saying he is polluting minds and shaming Muslims. It is now up to the Qatari government to stop these charades.

All this comes shortly after Al Azhar, the highest authority in Sunni Islam, condemned as a crime the kidnappings and beheadings of anyone being carried out in Iraq in the name of Islam.

What's worse is that in an electronic voting on the issue, a huge majority of Al Jazeera's viewers encouraged decapitation while less than 10 percent voted against.

209 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:42:55pm

#204 Amy

Sorry, but this guy's a phony if I've ever seen one.

Not mentioning Israel is suspicious, but we'll let that pass. As for "lying", maybe not, but check out #179 and tell me this guy is talking straight. He wants his cake and eat it, all the time.

Sadly, BPP is right, amongst RoPer men this is about as "moderate" as it gets.

210 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:44:03pm

# 203 BPP

Communism fell because it was a shitty and impossible economic system. Not because it oppresed people, not because Stalin, Mao and Pol pot killed millions of their own citizens. Because people couldn't buy bread and the USSR couldn't keep up the arms race. It was not a dramatic or principled ending. But most were glad of the victory nonetheless. If people want to end even a fraction of the current and threatened terrorism, I'll put that in the 'win' column and move on from there. WW II in Europe did not end on June 7 1944, you know.

211 Wino  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:46:35pm

Mike C. and Madawastrel:

This entire article SCREAMS of Machiavelli.

The author doesn't detest the ends. He detests the means and the results.

He is saying, "Terrorism isn't bringing about a unanimous Ummah, so try something else to convert the infidels."

If you two are too blinded by your love of terrorists to see that, then it is YOU who have the problem.

212 Seven_Stripes  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:47:57pm

#41 Rednek

Interesting race.

Who would win in being the killer, the Grim Reaper or Helen Thomas?

She already looks half dead. Good riddance when she croaks.

213 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:49:14pm

#211 Wino 7/28/2005 03:46PM PDT
Mike C. and Madawastrel:

This entire article SCREAMS of Machiavelli

---

Ha.

If it were truly Machiavellian, we either would be fooled completely, or it would have killed us. :)

/a little weak humor

214 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:51:18pm

Some of zombies girls looked like Helen Thomasvomits on keyboard

215 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:52:14pm

# 211 Wino

I eagerly await your archive search results and subsequent posting of ANYTHING I've ever said on LGF to indicate or hint at any love of terrorists on my part. If you can't produce any such evidence, maybe you might want to re-think that last post. I'll set the timer on my watch to see how long it takes you to produce the proof.

216 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:52:16pm

From #179

Youssef M. Ibrahim: I hope Hezbollah remains. It is Lebanon's guarantee against further Israeli aggressions or attacks... and, in the end, it is a fundamentally Lebanese entity. So if they follow a strictly Lebanese agenda -- not Syrian and not Iranian -- what is wrong? Cheers.


What's wrong with Hezbollah?!

217 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:52:22pm

Canuckistan-is a a poser as a hoser...


Seriously. I went to high school in Canada and when I first ran up against him months ago he couldn't even answer the most rudimentary questions like which Canadian beer is his favorite, or candy bar...

The guy is probably little liberal fourteen year old- if that -who got of on naming himself that after -I don't know was it Pat Buchanan that came up with that term?

Anyways the guy gets off on having us bash Canada-

Hell when a thread gets going LGFers always know more than he does about his supposed own country...

And we end up offending our good real Canadian LGFers like -Foreign Devil because they are still living there...

I don't take offense because my Dad the American had the good sense to drag my Canadian mom out of there...

Heh-but there are plenty of good Canadian LGFers and over at Polipundit.com Conservative Canadians frustrated with their own Paul Martin sometimes out number Americans in the Polipundit.com comments section-it's too funny.

218 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:52:24pm

pure francis #209

This guy is primarily talking to his fellow Muslims, not to Westerners. In that context, I see what he is saying as an important crack in the wall of lockstep ideological support for "jihad." It is supposed to provoke self-scrutiny and challenge the belief that the West is responsible for all of the ills of the Muslim world, that anything and everything goes.

He is telling Muslims to look at themselves and what their demented militancy has led to. The fact that he doesn't go far enough to suit some people on this site doesn't delegitimze what he is saying.

Yes, he is politically pro-Palestinian; I don't agree with him on that point (to put it mildly), but I don't see that as contradictory to what he is saying in this piece. He is not saying that the Palestinians are justified in blowing up innocent men, women and children, is he? No, he is not.

219 Q  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:55:30pm

BPP is right and his detractors are wrong.

Muslim "moderates", even the demonstrably fake ones are to be slobbered over, rather than sneered at, you say? Why? Because they seem to show the promise, however feeble, of the eventual islamic reformation? WHO GIVES A FUCK?

Islam may be malignant beyond redemption, or it may be still be possible -- at the exorbitant cost in blood and money -- to whip it into a semblance of civilized order. But even if the latter turns out to be true, SO FUCKING WHAT? I, for one, is more than ready to get rid of that sickly and quasi-fictitious baby togethjer with the deadly poisonous bathwater of the maisntream islam.

Dubya's messianic delusions already have cost us almost 2000 in lives and untold billions in money. I prefer to keep the blood and money, and let dar-al-islam, with all its phony "moderates", rot.

220 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:55:47pm

Amy, are you aware that many CAIR representatives have proven links to HAMAS?

221 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:56:45pm
222 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:58:29pm

#211 wino

Madawastrel-

Hey you talkin' to me!?!

LMAO!

You have yourself monikered correctly-

Ya bud this is the first time I've seen you in these parts and I'm a terrorist lover!?!?

Ha! LMAO!

Riiiggghhhttt!

Ya I love the Muslim Americans in the military-the translators and my flight doctor,...

As for the Tsunami victims they were Muslim , Hindu and a lot of Catholics-but ya I don't party hardy when Muslims fall victim to Acts of God-and I don't think he sends messages-

BTW- I'm a military dependent FOOL.

223 coulterclone  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:58:50pm

Ohhh I have vertigo and a headache from trying to follow this thread...I scroll UP, I scroll DOWN..I scroll UP...I scroll DOWN...AND I JUST ABOUT GIVE UP until...I see Amy's post. Thank YOU Amy for summing it all up--sensibly.

224 Catttt  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:59:03pm

#211 Wino

And I forgot to say - good point.

Those Wonderful, Wacky Borgias

225 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:59:14pm
226 Mich.manatee  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:59:48pm

#195 Kohenan The Barbarian

The guys Canada just sent to Afghanistan are some of the best in the world, and they would only be asked to join the party if something pretty major was up.

From what I've been gathering, a lot of the international special operations forces that went into Afghanistan originally--Canadian, Danish, Norwegian, German, French, Italian, Australian--are quietly going back. Their governments are saying that they're sending troops to provide security for the upcoming elections, but you don't use the Danish Jaegerkorpset to provide security.

You use the Danish Jaegerkorpset to kill terrorists. They're very very very good at it.

227 pure francis  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 1:59:52pm

#218 Amy

I infer from the fact that you saw it necessary to answer your own question that you are not comfortable with differing opinions. Mind you, not a good starting point for winning arguments.

To be sure, this is what Mr. Ibrahim said regarding blowing up Israelis:

Wheaton, Md.: As democracy spreads in the Middle East, do you think Arabs will end their evil terrorist attacks on Israel?

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Yes, once Israel starts treating Palestinians, who are Arabs by the way, as human beings not animals. Cheers.


Does that help?

I'll leave the answering to you, have a nice day.

228 Solomon X  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:00:06pm

Sorry if this was posted before here (I did see it on an earlier thread), but here is a MUST READ companion piece to the above-cited article from MEMRI

Fighting Terrorism: Recommendations of Arab Reformists

Here's the bullet points, please read link for details and quotes from the arab reformists themselves:

Europe Must Change its Lenient Treatment of Muslim Extremists

Incitement on the Internet Must Be Stopped

Arab Intellectuals Must Stop Speaking in Two Voices

The Terrorists Must Be Separated from Their Sympathizers

Muslims Must Denounce the Terrorists; The West Must Stop Being Naive

Muslims Must Ban Suicide Bombings for Moral Reasons

The Religious Institutions Must Take Practical Measures Against the Terrorists

The Muslims Must Form a New Religious Culture

The Silent Majority Must Speak Out Against the Terrorists

The War on Terrorism Requires Extensive Intellectual, Political and Educational Activity

Shifting momentum perhaps?

229 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:00:49pm

Kafira #220

Am I missing something? Is Ibrahim connected to CAIR? If not, what does your question have to do with anything?

230 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:01:55pm

#218 Amy

Yes, he is politically pro-Palestinian


It's the Hezbollah part which concerns me. Everyone can be "pro-Palestinian" in a generally non-specific way.

231 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:02:10pm

# 219 Q

So you hate them all and want to do away with them all ? Over a billion of them ? I disagree, but hey - at least you're honest about it.

232 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:02:24pm

Hey Ploome you still here?

233 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:03:58pm

PIMF

wait cr*p if that reads like I am a fool to be a military dependent-

Cripes!

Wino-

talk that crapola to my family and friends at CAOC-Nellis AFB...

They're going to laugh their asses off when I tell them I was called a terrorist lover...

Wow-that's too funny

I'm a rant raving George W. Bush lover now that's for sure...

You could call me that.

234 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:04:55pm
235 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:06:53pm

# 228 Solomon X

Shifting momentum perhaps?

Sorry, doesn't matter. They're all lying scum and apparently have to be eliminated from the earth, each and every one. See about 1/3 of the posts above. Oh, and by the way, you're a terrorist lover for posting that.

236 Q  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:07:53pm

Beagle (#231):

Everyone can be "pro-Palestinian" in a generally non-specific way.

Actually, one cannot be "pro-Palestinian" without objectively being anti-Israeli/anti-Semitic.

237 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:10:17pm

#219 Q

Honestly do read any other people's posts?

Who are the translators for the US military?

Who are doing the INTEL work for the US military?

Who are reading the radar scopes in the back of the E-3 birds?

who are the doctors, specialists, and pharmacists at our US military hospitals?

ANSWER: MODERATE AMERICAN MUSLIMS

Come to Nellis I'll take you to the BX where we have scores of Muslims-

SHOCKER we just did an exercise with vast numbers of Muslim flyers from various Muslom countries-

Jusy little over a week ago.

All those Muslims at the BX food court-you might have passed out.

238 Spiritualized  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:11:34pm

Another article illustrating the strategic stupidity of "disengagement."

Rockets Falling; Israel Prepares More Towns For Bombardment

As Kassam rockets continue to fall within Israel's pre-1967 borders, security forces are scrambling to develop a plan to protect towns bordering Gaza following the planned withdrawal.

(...)

There is widespread concern among the security establishment that it is only a matter of time until Gaza terrorists obtain Katyusha-type missiles similar to those possessed by the Hizbullah terror group in Lebanon, placing a large chunk of the Jewish State within firing range as well.

239 Waingro  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:11:48pm

If you haven't posted a question for John Roberts yet then do so here... [Link: democrats.senate.gov...]

Dems like Boxer, Mikulski, Clinton, Cantwell and Murray have put up this site for the very purpose of soliciting questions for Roberts from the public. So have some fun with it and get a good jab in at the Dems with your question.

240 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:13:45pm

Mike C.

Haven't you been at Qutar?

Anyways just because we have first hand experience with Muslims who might be moderate doesn't mean we can bust through the blindness of hatred.


Looks like the terrorist win-

probably exactly the reaction they want.

241 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:14:35pm

pure francis #227

I infer from the fact that you saw it necessary to answer your own question that you are not comfortable with differing opinions.

I don't know why you "inferred" that. I am not at all "uncomfortable with differing opinions." The only thing I am intolerant of is stupidity and intellectual dishonesty.

What I wrote is known as a "rhetorical question" which was simply a way of expressing my opinion. I suggest you look up "rhetorical question," since you evidently don't know one when you see one.

Also from the link in #179 above:

"Clarksburg, Md.: Will the Arab "street" accept the notion of Israel? Not the politicians and elite, but the middle and lower classes. I'm not asking whether or not Israel will be accepted if they do X, Y and Z in response to demands. My question is more of a "pulse" check...

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Accept Israel? On yes or no, the answer is yes. But, and there is always work to do here, it depends on the usual -- giving up settlements, respecting Palestinians as a people and human beings, etc. Is it going to work? I do not know. Your guess is as good as mine. Cheers."

Again, this guy is not a fan of Israel. Again, that is not what this piece is about. Nothing in the link in 179 contradicts what he is saying here. His lack of support for Israeli policies (vs. Israel's right to exist, which he clearly supports) does not make him a liar or a hypocrite.

If support for Israeli policies is going to be the litmus test for deciding whether Muslims are to be believed about anything, then everything they say will be dismissed as "lies." I don't think that that is either honest or productive.

242 Q  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:15:32pm

Mike C. (#231):

I don't want to "do away with them all". I don't give a forcible assfuck what happens to them. What I do want, is total separation of the civilized world -- or at least of the United Fucking States of America -- from the festering shithole known as dar-al-islam.

Incidentally, left to its own devices, islam will wither and die, it being an obligatory-parasitic entity. And the (now former) muslims would only be better off for that, in the long run.

They're all lying scum

Youssef Ibrahim certainly is. Franly, I am surprised at how many seemingly intelligent LGFers chose to blind themselves to this simple fact.

243 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:16:27pm

#236 Q

Actually, one cannot be "pro-Palestinian" without objectively being anti-Israeli/anti-Semitic.


Semantics, semantics. I could argue that the Arabs in the OT would be better off negotiating than they are using terrorism. That doesn't make me anti-Palestinian.

There is a presumption on the part of writers like Ibrahim and the vast majority of the Arab-Muslim world. They seem to suggest that violence against Israel is the only option and therefore justified however it comes about. They reserve for Islam a right to strike out, as a religion, outside nations or armies. Hizb'Allah has sworn to destroy Israel and the U.S.

That's where you find anti-Semitism tied inextricably with 'pro-Palestinian' views.

244 norar  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:16:41pm

#238 Spiritualized

security forces are scrambling to develop a plan to protect towns bordering Gaza following the planned withdrawal.

Send back 100 missiles for each missile falling on Israeli town. This will work wonders.

245 kathyn  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:18:12pm

Although it seems the consensus here is that all muslims are liars, still I have hope when I read that some muslims are stepping up to the plate and denouncing terrorism. Yeah, he's still hates Israel, but he's a far sight better than the jihadis. I don't think he wants to kill me, at least. So I'll take it.

246 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:18:42pm

Would that their bodies, their cities, their inflated scrotums were on fire.

247 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:19:30pm

May I offer just a 'hint of hope'

islam Will implode.

Hopefully many muslims will be delivered from this cult of hate by our hands. Think about this: The penalty for leaving islam is death. This is what the koran, a-Hadiths and the Sura says.

Remember this: Many muslims don't even know what is in the koran. Many that are trapped in the islamic hell holes in the Middle East that still exist, cannot even read or write. They have no comprehension of what is really in the koran, a-hadiths, or the siras. They are born into this cult and fed hatred of non muslims at their mothers' breasts. This hatred festers and cultivates, and breeds children that will murder non muslims "just because dad said so" Or, "just because the imam said so". Not to mention the ultimate prize of 72 virgins (or white raisins) depending on your skills in Arabic.

When we remove the penalty of death for apostacy (leaving the islam), and give those who wish to leave the protection that they need, deserve, and desire, islam will implode on its own.

Imagine what might have happened if 'Hitler's Youth'had this sort of "opt out" option.

Give this "opt out" option to the muslim women, their daughters and sons living in the West, and they will flee in droves.

Without womb factories and no goats to f*ck most muslim men will simply disappear or cower in the caves in which they belong.

The cult of 'islam' will shrivel and die without its female and child slaves. Free the Women and Children. The remaining cultist adherants should be fair game for the REAL MEN who don't hide behind burka's and korans. These REAL MEN will defeat these cowardly, disgusting filthy bastards that get a woody out of blowing innocent people to smitherenes.

Let's find a way to give some muslims the 'opt out' option.

Just my simple Kafira view.

Just

248 Q  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:19:38pm

madawaskan (#237):

ANSWER: MODERATE AMERICAN MUSLIMS

What, only them? We're in deeper shit than I thought.

249 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:20:35pm

#241 Amy

Yeah, and as long as Mr. Youssef M. Ibrahim isn't happy with Israel's policy, it's perfectly ok to blow up people. Nice.

250 Luigi  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:21:03pm

Anyone covered this?

The Brazillian the Brits shot was an illegal alien

Shot Brazilian's visa 'had expired'

The student visa of Jean Charles de Menezes expired more than two years before he was shot by police, a Home Office spokeswoman has said.
The Government also issued a cautiously-worded statement which appeared to indicate Mr de Menezes had a forged stamp in his passport.

Uh-huh..

251 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:21:03pm

# 240 madawaskan

I lived in Qatar quite a while. Also been in Bahrain, the UAE and Oman. May well be headed for Kuwait soon. Sure hope the US military personnel there have developed a way for a guy to get a beer.

252 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:22:05pm

kathyn 7/28/2005 04:18PM PDT
Although it seems the consensus here is that all muslims are liars, still I have hope when I read that some muslims are stepping up to the plate and denouncing terrorism. Yeah, he's still hates Israel, but he's a far sight better than the jihadis. I don't think he wants to kill me, at least. So I'll take it.

KATHYN: You take that hope, and hold on to it tight, dear :o)

If you want to know the true nature and intent of islam, I invite you to [Link: www.jihadwatch.org...] Or, [Link: www.dhimmiwatch.org...] Or, [Link: www.faith-freedom.org...]

Please, take the time to educate yourself and learn what the islam is all about. You owe this to yourself, your family, and especially your children.

Kafira

253 Laffer Curve  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:22:19pm

I'm looking out my office window at the Las Vegas strip. Cops are diverting all traffic on to Convention Center Drive because of a suspicious looking package.

Did our fathers have to put up with this Shiite? Nope.

Without Islam, people wouldn't freak out over an unattended backpack.

254 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:24:09pm

#195 Kohenian

My type of Barbarian.
So how many family did you lose in the great war

What part of Canada ? Are you in PacificSalmon Columbia, lobsterland, or Hockey-vania ?

Would love to help you get your immigration and asylum situation fixed. On this continent all of us "rule of law" types are in this together.

Did this thing ever pass ? Has it helped ?

Two of your Countrymen weren't encouraging.

Ah-yes Toronto-stahn, right around the corner from Buffalo-Stahn, no doubt interconnected to Brooklyn-stahn, Newark-stahn, and Detroit-istahn, with Help from Tuscon-istahn and Chicago-istahn.

You that if things really heat up in EurAbia, and some kind of backlash gets stirred up, their going to make a beeline for the easiest to enter cushy western country, namely your beloved Hockey-vania, then make a bee-line for Chicago-iStahn or Detroit-istahn.

Let these malcontents in, Then for the RCMP and the FBI it's nothing but work work work.

255 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:25:02pm

Laffer Curve

Sure hope it is not a Koran. Some infidel might accidentally touch it, and then some Mooselmen will riot and burn down a Kentucky Fried Chicken store in trasharabia somewhere.

256 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:25:27pm

To all you Muslim haters the stuff you are tossing at me-well maybe I aquise to Charles' opinion-

Charles first sentences about the author-

Here’s a bracing dose of intellectual clarity and courage at the Middle East Times, by Youssef M. Ibrahim, a former Middle East correspondent for The New York Times


So if you have any guts maybe you'll take up your compaints with Charles himself.

Hell maybe he'll even change his mind and then I 'll think twice bercause frankly sense my family members are overseas hlf the time fighting the War On Terror-

I don't read all the stuff that Charles does and that's why I came to LGF for him to wrap it up for me.

So here's another military bon mot for ya-

NO GUTS NO GLORY.

Take it up with Charles-he actually will listen.

Then as a final suggestion get a dos of reality and ask military active duty just how much Muslim Americans are doing for us.

You are ungrateful as heck if you cannot value them.

257 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:28:22pm

This Islamic hate of Israel(Jews) was predicted thousands of years ago. The palestinian issue is bullshit..If they didn't exist,and I feel they don't, they would make some other bullshit up, They don't want Israel to move, they want them to die..The PLO's charter in the early sixties had a goal to destroy Israel BEFORE they 'occupied' territories.

258 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:29:18pm

madawaskan

Are they supposed to get a medal for being normal humans? Obviously they have not read their Korans.

259 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:30:32pm
260 tigger2005  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:30:44pm

Well, let's hope the guy's right about the West. Those who fought and won the Cold War (not to mention WW2) were a different breed from the PC multicultie self-haters so many Westerners are today. Since the mid-60's the West has been indulging in an orgy of self-loathing and tearing down of institutions and values that were the foundation of our strength. Nihilism and subversion have themselves become institutionalized in our societies (and especially our colleges, universities, and media). Plus we have had fifty years of incredible prosperity and relative peace (at least on the home front) unlike anything the world has ever seen ... and excessive ease tends to lead to softness and decay.

But people have written off the West as weak and decadent before ... and they were wrong.

261 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:31:02pm

#251 Mike C.

LOL!

Erh, that beer problem, umh-it's kind of B.Y.O.B.-

That isn't bring your own it's more like brew your own...

Ugh- I hear it ain't so good either...

262 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:31:37pm

Kohenan The Barbarian 7/28/2005 03:22PM PDT
#148 Havoc--still fixated pissing on Canukistan eh!--we just sent a contingent to the most dangerous province in Afghanistan to kill terrorists,--somhow you have forgotten that Canada was into the First and Second World Wars three years before Uncle Sam on both occasions and we never yapped about loyalty and common goals--our countries are distinct Nations with mutual cooperation and respect--lets keep it that way.

Kohenan: I have not forgotten. Canada was in way deep in WWII before the USA ever got involved. Some of us old people Never Forget.

Kafira

263 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:33:12pm

Beagle #243

His statement about Hizbollah bothers me, too, and I don't want you to infer that I support Hizbollah or its goals in any way, shape or form.

Nevertheless, I disagree with your statement:

They seem to suggest that violence against Israel is the only option and therefore justified however it comes about.

I don't think Ibrahim is saying that, at least not in anything that's been posted here thus far. The quote about Hizbollah in the link in 179 refers to Hizbollah as a "native" Lebanese group, which is preferable to meddling by Syria or Iran, and as a deterrent to Israel.

By the way, I think he's wrong on this point - Hizbollah is financed by Iran, is infiltrating Palestinian terrorist groups in Gaza, and played footsie with the Syrians all along. Lebanon will not be a viable state until it brings all of the country under governmental sovereignty, and Hizbollah stands in the way of that.

But again, the article that is the subject of this thread is addressing a different issue entirely.

264 kathyn  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:33:30pm

kafira #252. I'm not wearing blinders. I have read several books about Islam and I don't, for one minute think it's a religion of peace. Nevertheless, it is refreshing to see some muslims questioning the sanity of the jihadis. It's just that Ibrahim seems to get that Americans can turn into tigers and it won't be well with him or any other muslim if things continue as they are. He has a healthy fear of consequences. And that's the point I'd like all muslims to reach.

265 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:34:31pm

#258 jehu

they are probably contributing more than you are...


I remember you condemning Andrew B-for swearing out of fear because he was actually where the tsunami hit-

266 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:36:22pm
267 Laffer Curve  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:36:32pm

#255 Jehu

No infidel would want to touch the Koran. On the LV Strip we have hoards of illegal aliens (oh I'm sorry, undocumented immigrants) handing out pictures of naked women.

Far better material.

268 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:37:29pm

# 261 madawaskan

Kinda hard to brew your own when you're in a hotel room for 6 week stints. And unlike the northeastern part of The Magic Kingdom, you can't just drive across a causeway to hit the bars on a Wednesday night. Oh, well - could be worse. Could be sub-Saharan Africa.

269 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:37:46pm

#248 Q

Well how many other people do you know that know the dialects of Arabic needed?

Soory but that is a rare skill and most likely it is hard to teach so ya if you need to know Arabic than Muslims will be woh you go to...


Of course you're cute and being purposefully obtuse.

270 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:39:14pm

#263 Amy

His overall judgment appears sound in this answer.

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Buchanan's opinion is the complete moron. His blind hatred of Israel gets in the way of his, otherwise, good judgment. Syria killed Hariri. Period. End of story. Regardless, the Syrian regime of the Assads is profoundly evil. It should be toppled. Bush doing it is OK with many of us. Does Bushie boy have the cohones? The Israel theory, in this case, is bull. Israel is not a nice country, but they have no interest on Hariri and I am not a believer in tripple conspiracies.


This is the answer of a policy analyst, not an ideologue.

271 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:39:35pm

#268 Mike C.


Ugh ya during the Gulf War the first AWACS guys over before the deadline were staying in tents.

272 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:40:24pm

Hila #249

WTF are you talking about?

Did I say that?

Does Ibrahim say that?

Please show me where he says that it's OK to blow people up.

Until you can show me that, please do everybody a favor by refraining from making inane statements, OK?

273 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:40:27pm

Mike C. 7/28/2005 03:18PM PDT
# 136 alegrias

That's the second time this thread I've heard "Trust but verify." Come on now - all I'm asking is that you be honest. Some posters here will never trust muslims on anything, anytime, anywhere, regardless of any statement or action on their part short of converting to Christianity or Judeism. And I wouldn't bet money on that, either. As I said in my first post, I just want to hear a bit of honesty here. Stop all this breast-beating about wanting to see the moderate muslim while slapping down anything that looks like it might be a step in that direction. At least bigel was honest - he wanted to nuke Europe and said just so. I think he was nuts, but at least he was honest.

Dear Michael:

Please read the koran. They cost $5.00 at any book store and contain references to the a-hadiths and the sira. Once you read these, I think you might hop off of that high falluttin horse you are sitting on, and what you read might make your bowels move... in a bad way. Hitler was inspired by these 'ancient religious texts' which gave him license to commit the acts that he did sixty years ago.

I'm sure that many folks may appreciate your efforts at islamic appeasement, but once you read the koran, a-hadith and sira, and compare it with Mein Kampf, you will be enlightened. Take the time. It might save your life and the lives of those you love and hold dear.

And, "I'm being honest". Read. It. All.

274 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:40:47pm

I've been following this thread for a while. It illustrates perfectly the dilemna we face now, and will continue to face for the forseeable future. Mike C on the one hand, and American Infidel and Q on the other seem to be the two poles of the argument.

On the one hand I believe that islam is a poison seed. As long as the koran is believed to be the word of God there will be people who believe that God approves of murder, treachery, misogyny, Jew-hatred and everything else that the koran permits and justifies. As the Milgram experiment aptly illustrates, all that is needed for the human being to behave like a monster is permission of authority to do so. What greater authority exists than God? And if God permits murder...

On the other hand, how can we realistically engage in a war of extermination against a fifth of the human race? And by realistically I mean as a moral, not a practical matter. Don't get me wrong, there are times when I get so angry I find myself saying, " Just nuke the bastards." But we can't just nuke the bastards.

So what can we do? As I see it the best we can do is to keep the ummah contained. We can't uproot islam from the mid-east but we can make sure that the West is not fertile ground for the poison seed. That means no more islamic immigration. That means education and publicity. Political correctness is our greatest enemy in this matter. The universities, networks and newspapers need to tell and teach the truth about islam. They need to realize that Christians and conservatives are not the enemy. islam is the enemy. We need to get over dependence on mid-eastern oil (gee have ya heard that one before?)

And past that, I really just don't know. Like everyone I wish there was a single definitive gesture that we could make that would solve this mess and let us get on with the business of civilization. I see no simple solution.

JWM

275 gamblor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:41:44pm
When the West did unite after World War II to beat communism, the long Cold War began without pity. They took no prisoners. They all stood together, from the United States to Norway, from Britain to Spain, from Belgium to Switzerland.


Yeah, right. Dream on. The cold-war unity was all but imaginary. If it were not for people like R. Reagan, R. Pipes or M. Thatcher we would still be discussing our "coexistence" with the USSR.
Sorry for the skepticism.
On the brighter note: three determined people is all it takes.

276 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:42:55pm

Kafira:

Same old same old pissy excuse, "look how bad every one else was, look what THEY did" Moha-mud wasn't so bad, his murdering, pillaging, land piracy, raping and slavetaking wasn't so bad ... see it still works GREAT in the Islamic world.

MohhMud murdered and threatened stole plundered and took slaves, like any other land pirate of his day, he just took the Mecca Moon_god All'ah and invented his own religion to justify his land piracy then urged his tribe to do it on a never ending industrial scale.

Well 1300 years later, the piracy continues.

277 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:43:49pm

Laffer Curve

Drive down Bonanza Ave. before six a.m.

Start at about Eastern Ave.

Then you'll see the American home builders that work for Pulte ,D R Horton and the pool builders like Grube that pick them up.

278 whiterasta  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:45:22pm

#262, Kafira:

Canada used to be a real country and an ally of the Civilized World, until that bastard Trudeau and his gang of French socialists took over the country and bribed us with our own money.

Now, we are a nusiance neighbour, and a fucking embarrasment.

We are an American Protectorate, just like Guam and Costa Rica. (But we have FREE HEALTH CARE!)

279 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:46:10pm

# 271 madawaskan

The 1350 USAF personnel in Qatar for GW I spent the whole damned war in tents. They had a pretty substantial tent city out at the airport. The very first guys in actually were staying in the Gulf Hotel, but Schwartzkof (SP ?) came to town, took one look at that, and ordered everybody out immediately. They spent the next few weeks living on hanger rooftops at the airport without tents, eating cold MREs.

280 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:48:05pm

LOL white

281 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:48:12pm

madawaskan

they are probably contributing more than you are...

I just have to be a non-muslim to contribute more. That there are Muslims that don't follow the orthodoxy of their religion is fine with me, good for them. However the basis and foundation of their religion is a lie.

Someday they will have to come to grips with that as well, not just accepting the inevitable of living within civilization. That you applaud their efforts at just being NORMAL citizens says a lot about the image Islam has managed to create for itself.

It will take generations and a lot more effort to clean up that image, and that is if they stopped their death-cult practices today.

I remember you condemning Andrew B-for swearing out of fear because he was actually where the tsunami hit-

I only get on someone cursing when they use "Fucking" as Jesus's middle name. If he did that then shame on him, and shame on me or any Christian that does not object. Somebody wants to use a religious figure as a curse, try Mohammed, it is a better fit.

282 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:49:02pm

OT: REPORTER VOWS TO 'KILL SELF' IF CHENEY RUNS FOR PRESIDENT

[Link: www.drudgereport.com...]

Good.

283 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:49:47pm

Beagle #270

I agree. He has a certain perspective - and what of that? I don't have to agree with him, and he isn't going to want to kill me if I disagree.

I think that overall he's pretty clear-eyed and hates the sickening violence that he sees as self-destructive.

284 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:50:51pm

BTW Mike C

I have a bead on your IP address.

285 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:52:22pm

#273 Kafira 7/28/2005 04:40PM PDT

Mike C. 7/28/2005 03:18PM PDT
# 136 alegrias

Dear Michael:

Please read the koran. They cost $5.00 at any book store and contain references to the a-hadiths and the sira. Once you read these, I think you might hop off of that high falluttin horse you are sitting on, and what you read might make your bowels move... in a bad way. Hitler was inspired by these 'ancient religious texts' which gave him license to commit the acts that he did sixty years ago.

Kafir:

A little history quiz for you ...

"Okay folks, it has come to my attention that some are in need of a little history lesson here. Let's start by using the Socratic Mehtod shall we?

What famous 20th Century author wrote or said the following?1

We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.

What famous 20th Century political leader wrote this into his party's platform?2

Therefore we demand:

11. That all unearned income, and all income that does not arise from work, be abolished.

12. Since every war imposes on the people fearful sacrifices in life and property, all personal profit arising from the war must be regarded as a crime against the people. We therefore demand the total confiscation of all war profits whether in assets or material.

13. We demand the nationalization of businesses which have been organized into cartels.

14. We demand that all the profits from wholesale trade shall be shared out.

15. We demand extensive development of provision for old age.

16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a healthy middle-class, the immediate communal of department stores which will be rented cheaply to small businessmen, and that preference shall be given to small businessmen for provision of supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities.

17. We demand a land reform in accordance with our national requirements, and the enactment of a law to confiscate from the owners without compensation any land needed for the common purpose. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land.

What famous 20th Century aspiring artist told his date?3

'Go ahead and have it, but I don't understand why you want it. I didn't think you wanted to devour a corpse... the flesh of dead animals. Cadavers!

His press secretary had this to say4:

[He] is deeply religous, though completely anti-Christian. He views Christianity as a symptom of decay. Rightly so. It...[has] no point of contact to the animal element, and thus, in the end... will be destroyed. [He] is a convinced vegetarian, on principle. His arguments cannot be refuted on any serious basis. They are totally unanswerable.

It should also be noted that this artist loudly campaigned for an end to medical experiments on animals5 and for an unprecedented expansion in national parks and land protection.

Now, before you go look at the answers, how would you classify each of these individuals, leftist, centrist, right-winged, conservative, or what? "

Oh, and he was really good freinds with Husseini, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, gave him lots of Money, and his own Radio Show to Spew Antisemitic hatred, Husseini asked for help exterminating the Jews in Jerusalem.

Who was this mystery figure of History ?

286 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:53:12pm

# 273 Kafira

Why, thanks for the suggestions. Already have a Koran. Not a real one, of course, an English language translation. My Arabic was never good enough to wade through a real one. Have read parts of it. I will never read all of it - it just isn't that damned intersting. I did once manage to read all the way through the Bible, though. In line with the question I put to Wino back up the thread, please be sure and let me know when you get your archive research done and are ready to post your proof that I engage in "Islamic appeasement", whatever the hell that means. I assume that you do have proof for such a statement, yes ?

287 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:54:20pm

JWM-

What is surprising is for someone to justify their reaction and to compare themselves to the reaction of hordes celebrating after 9/11.

Shouldn't they realize the differences-

Like education-LGFers are educated.

Economic differences-

and perhaps most importantly access to a freedom of information.

Those that partied after 9/11 what do they read and watch?

They read if they do-newspapers and are exposed to media that is controlled by dictatorial regimes that are interested in deflecting any responsibility for the neglect of their own citzenry onto an external target like the United States-

The Blame Bush phenomena and the US knows no bounds -it is the Liberal and Hollywood mantra, the Green Peace and World Banl phobists favorite tune AND heck LGFers frustrated with the situation inIsrael sing the same tune.

As a dependent of the active duty US military I am sick to death of it.

It's about time that Liberals and Bush blamers stop being hyper-critcal, pessimistic, Never assuming responsibility complainers of the people that are actually doing things while they sit on their keesters.

Also you can lump me in with Mike C. he isn't alone and those that are angry can look at Charles first sentence about the author and likely ascertain that Charles thinks that it is a brave article.

288 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:54:35pm

#272 Amy

Wheaton, Md.: As democracy spreads in the Middle East, do you think Arabs will end their evil terrorist attacks on Israel?

Youssef M. Ibrahim: Yes, once Israel starts treating Palestinians, who are Arabs by the way, as human beings not animals. Cheers.

What excatly isn't clear here? According to Ibrahim terrorist attacks on israel are justified. He may not agree with Israel's policies, but he should denounce terrorism, yeah, even against Israelis.

289 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:54:52pm

hitler

290 Ringo the Gringo  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:58:07pm

I posted this yesterday at the end of a long thread...

Remember the teachers in southern Thailand who have been receiving death threats from head-chopping Islamists? So many if fact that thousands have requested transfers or have quit.

Well, the Muslims have come up with a solution:

Teachers at private Islamic religious schools have resigned en masse to apply for vacant posts at state-run educational institutes in the restive deep South

See? Problem solved...just let the Islamo head-choppers teach the kids.

291 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 2:59:16pm

#284 Kafira


Kafira 7/28/2005 04:50PM PDT
BTW Mike C

I have a bead on your IP address


Is that implied threat you ass?

What are you going to do with it? Ya a LIberal troll tried to get me to shut up at another site by finding my IP and disabling the address and permanently messing up my e-mail...

what are you threatening? JACK.

Glad to see when you are losing an argument you resort to the same tactics as liberal trols that have no answers.

292 Luigi  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:00:56pm

Important new book

The Myth of Hitler's Pope: How Pope Pius XII Rescued Jews from the Nazis

As Pope Pius XII worked to save Jews from the Nazis, the grand mufti became Hitler’s staunch ally and a promoter of the Holocaust, with a legacy that feeds radical Islam today.
293 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:01:11pm

#282 Jewels

Another great reason for Cheney to run...

294 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:01:36pm

# 284 Kafira

BTW Mike C

I have a bead on your IP address.

Uh, OK, you kinda got me here. Is that supposed to be some sort of non-veiled threat or something ? Should I report it to Charles or something ? I see you've been registered here less than a month, so let me give you a little hint. We argue here, sometimes vehemently. Some sling verbal arrows and downright foul language about at times. But we don't make threats, like you just apparently did. You just crossed a line, and I advise you to not continue doing so.

295 norar  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:01:37pm

#259 American Infidel

Well, most Muslim hear what Koran says from their preachers and not from personal reading, Ibrahim says that preachers are ignorant, i.e. what preachers say is wrong. So Ibrahim is decieving the Muslims first of all. However, I have no problem whatsoever with the way he does it. I certainly allow for the fact that he wrote his article for Muslims. He obviouly did not decieve anybody who read Koran, as many posts on this thread alone show.

It is more important for me that he denonces the Jihadists as enemies of the Muslims first of all, and I do not disagree with this. Should I go into splitting hairs as many people above do? I am not a fan of the exercise, as it is never constructive.

Besides, I would like to save my breath for keeping our own press accountable, before I go after Muslim press. Priorities, you know ...

296 Luigi  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:02:00pm

Addendum to #292

I have no way of knowing if the author's theories are correct.

297 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:02:26pm

Havoc

Why it's that "paper hanging bastard"

/Patton

298 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:04:23pm

Sorry if this was posted before here (I did see it on an earlier thread), but here is a MUST READ companion piece to the above-cited article from MEMRI

Fighting Terrorism: Recommendations of Arab Reformists

Here's the bullet points, please read link for details and quotes from the arab reformists themselves:

Europe Must Change its Lenient Treatment of Muslim Extremists

Incitement on the Internet Must Be Stopped

Arab Intellectuals Must Stop Speaking in Two Voices

The Terrorists Must Be Separated from Their Sympathizers

Muslims Must Denounce the Terrorists; The West Must Stop Being Naive

Muslims Must Ban Suicide Bombings for Moral Reasons

The Religious Institutions Must Take Practical Measures Against the Terrorists

The Muslims Must Form a New Religious Culture

The Silent Majority Must Speak Out Against the Terrorists

The War on Terrorism Requires Extensive Intellectual, Political and Educational Activity

Shifting momentum perhaps?


Solomon, I certainly hope so. And, I hope the authors of this are sincere and not simply spreading islamic Taquyyia and false hope to all. Thanks for the positive glimmer of hope that we won't end up back in the 19th Century where we had to detain/deter Japanese folks living here. Because, we could not tell the good from the bad. To any muslims reading this, you're off to a good start. Please, for your own sake and existance, please come out and denounce what has and is happening. Your continued silence will really play against you. Trust me.

299 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:06:51pm

#57 karmic_inquisitor,

Is it deconstruction, or rope-a-dope, or sloth? Inquiring minds want to know.

300 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:07:00pm

If anyone is lurking and is persuaded by Kafira and haters on his side after he made a threat to Mike C. by saying-

Kafira 7/28/2005 04:50PM PDT
BTW Mike C

I have a bead on your IP address

Than you are really gutless.

Kafira you had better explain your intentions by that comment -that is pathetic.

301 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:07:29pm

#229 Amy 7/28/2005 04:00PM PDT
Kafira #220

Am I missing something? Is Ibrahim connected to CAIR? If not, what does your question have to do with anything?

Amy, is Ibrahim Hooper connected with CAIR? Is that your question?

Are you sure that's your question? Did I misread you?

302 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:08:42pm

Hila #288

Note that he does not dispute the characterization of such attacks as "evil."

And his response is not expressing approval of such attacks. He is simply being realistic in saying that the Palestinians are not going to stop doing what they're doing until (in his view, not mine) Israel stops doing what he sees as bad things. Does that mean that he endorses these attacks? Not in my view.

Also note: He is not saying, like the terrorists, that the attacks won't stop until Israel is destroyed and Muslims take over all of "Palestine." He specifically says that Israel has the right to exist.

You may not like his views on Israel (I certainly don't), but insisting that he's saying something that he isn't saying (i.e., that he thinks that terrorist attacks are justified rather than that they will continue to occur) does not help your argument.

Do I think he's right that if the Israelis do certain things then the Palestinians will stop the attacks? No, I don't think he's right. The terrorists will never stop, because they do seek Israel's destruction.

303 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:09:09pm

Kafira

You gutless weasel- why don't you get a bead on my IP Address I'll take my computer into the boys at Nellis so fast it'll make your head spin...

Bring it you weasel...

304 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:11:03pm

time for an ailse cleanup

305 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:11:50pm

PIMF! F%$#

306 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:13:21pm

Kafira #301

Ibrahim is the last name of the author of the piece which is the subject of this thread.

WTF does that have to do with Ibrahim Hooper or CAIR?
WTF does CAIR have to do with this thread?

Are you stupid, or do you just enjoy sowing confusion?

307 coulterclone  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:14:14pm

Does anyone remember the last line of dialogue in the movie "Bridge on the River Kwai"?

Uttered by Capt. Clipton (James Donald) surveying the wrecked bridge and the carnage on both sides:

Madness!...Madness! Madness!

I think that sums up things around here.

Now I have invaded all of your brains with the theme song. See how easy it is to poison other people's minds? Start whistling everyone!

308 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:14:51pm

#289 Greenmiller,

tsk,tsk, no coaching Mr. Kafira Asshat, who believes he knows everything yet seems to Know nothing about the occultic basis in Teutonic myth that was developed for the SS. Still the largest collection of Santanic and Occultic writings ever amassed.

They had a very systematic method of teaching their true believers to murder on command, just like the true believer adherents of a certain so-called religion.

But since you spilled it ... here's the references:

"1. Adolph Hitler Speech of May 1, 1927. Quoted by Toland, 1976, p. 306

2. From the 25 points of the NSDAP (National Socialist German Workers Party, i.e., the Nazis) Program were composed by Adolph Hitler and Anton Drexler and published 24 February 1920 and they were also written about by Hitler in Mein Kampf. You can link to the complete (and anti-semitic) list here, and also see here.

3. Adolph Hitler said this to a date as quoted by Martin G. Hulsey in his The Implications of Nazi Animal Protection over on the Hitler Historical Museum Website.

4. Adolph Hitler's Nazi Minister of Propaganda, Goebbels, as quoted by Martin G. Hulsey, see #3 above.

5. From John J. Ray's (M.A.; Ph.D.) excellent internet article HITLER WAS A SOCIALIST. The quote from his article:

HITLER also banned medical experiments on animals, but not, as we know to our grief, not on Jewish children. And he created many national parks, particularly for Germany's "sacred" forests.

This isn't a coincidence. The Nazis drew heavily on a romantic, anti-science, nature worshipping, communal and anti-capitalist movement that tied German identity to German forests. In fact, Professor Raymond Dominick notes in his book, The Environmental Movement in Germany, two-thirds of the members of Germany's main nature clubs had joined the Nazi Party by 1939, compared with just 10 per cent of all men.

Understand that just because Hitler and the Nazis were slightly to the right of the communists and were German Nationalists doesn't mean that they weren't socialists. Government control of the economy was a key doctrine of Nazi economics. Again from Dr. Ray's excellent article:

I think, however, that the perception of Hitler as a Leftist is more difficult for those with a European perspective than for those with an Anglo-Saxon one. To many Europeans you have to be some sort of Marxist to be a Leftist and Hitler was very clearly opposed to any form of Marxism so cannot have been a Leftist. I write for the Anglosphere, however, and in my experience the vast majority of the Left (i.e. the US Democrats, The Australian Labor Party, the British Labour Party) have always rejected Marxism so it seems crystal clear to me that you can be a Leftist without accepting Marxist doctrines. So Hitler's contempt for Marxism, far from convincing me that he was a non-Leftist, actually convinces me that he was a perfectly conventional Leftist! The Nazi Party was what would in many parts of the world be called a "Labor" party (not a Communist party).

And, as already mentioned, the moderate Leftists of Germany in Hitler's own day saw that too. The Sozialistische Partei Deutschlands (SPD) who, like the US Democrats, the Australian Labor Party and the British Labour Party, had always been the principal political representatives of the Labor unions, on several important occasions voted WITH the Nazis in the Reichstag (German Parliament).

And this:

This emotional rather than intellectual orientation also meant that he felt no need to deny nationalism. He [Hitler - S] could be as nationalist as he liked. And he did like! He in fact had the brilliant idea of using nationalism to justify socialism: Germans deserved to be looked after, not because of their innate equality with everybody else but because of their glorious Germanness. This was extremely clever and hard to resist.

Socialism is not mutually exclusive with Nationalism; in fact it can be a rather seductive combination.

309 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:15:05pm

Amy

No if you haven't noticed he enjoys making threats.

310 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:16:03pm

#308 contiued ...


Source ...

311 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:17:15pm

309 madawaskan

{madawaskan}

312 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:19:04pm

#308 Havoc

How was Bombay?

313 Bubbaman  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:20:39pm

#247 Kafira,

We can only hope/pray that it happens. Islame is the only "religion" whose "holy writings" open spewing hatred of others.

It is beyond me how any sane, rational individual could succumb to this cult.

314 madawaskan  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:20:59pm

#311 Aladin Sane

Thank you!

[am in tears}

Mike C. and the rest you guys are brave.

315 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:21:15pm

madawaskan #309

At first I thought that maybe I had missed some connection that the author has to CAIR (God knows, I'm far from infallible and can miss things when I read quickly), but when I couldn't find one, I asked what he/she/it was referring to. #301 proves that he/she/it wasn't referring to anything that is relevant to anything. No surprise there.

As for the ISP threat, I think that that merits being banned, but that's Charles's call.

316 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:21:18pm

CTP

[MH] Bud!

317 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:23:07pm

314 madawaskan

[am in tears}

Wipe them tears, darlin'. You got a bunch of friends here...

318 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:23:16pm

Interesting havoc

of the Left (i.e. the US Democrats, The Australian Labor Party, the British Labour Party) have always rejected Marxism


That's the only thing I didn't agree with..US Dems never net a commie dictator they didn't like

319 karmic_inquisitor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:24:18pm

122 madawaskan -

Back when Jesse Jackson ran, they had "Run Jesse Run" bumper stickers.

With Helen Thomas willing to kill herself if Dick Cheney runs, time to get a bumper sticker "Run Dick Run"

320 Doctor Phibes  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:24:31pm

The "Muslim mind", singular, is a very appropriate phrase, given the hive-like mentality that causes Muslims in Leeds to rant and seethe about their "brothers" in Iraq.

As for awakening the sleeping giant of the West, he appears to have morphed into an clueless midget while he was asleep. Our troops die so that Iraqis can have a constitution allowing anyone to become an Iraqi, except for Israelis, and our politicians make total fools of themselves as they witter on about that "tiny minority" that seems to get around so much. Islam has little to fear from us, but my advice to them: don't ever mess with the Chinese.

321 Bob's Kid  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:24:52pm
He is saying, "Terrorism isn't bringing about a unanimous Ummah, so try something else to convert the infidels."

This hits on something that I find very lacking in general in even 'moderate' Moslems...they don't think that Jews and Christians should be allowed to be Jews and Christians.

I see this the weakest part of Islam. If you're a Jew or a Christian, especially if you're western, you recognize a person's right to belong to any wacko religion/philosophy you want to. We just shrug our shoulders and figure 'your loss,' and let folks go about your business.

Islam, no matter how 'moderate,' (and I have moderate Muslim friends), doesn't seem to do that. They can't help but see their 'faith' (yeah, scare quotes, as I find almost every aspect of it odious) as almost worth violent means to bring that crescent flag flying over the whole world. By force, by fear, by threats, whatever. I think that back in their minds, in their heart of hearts, they kind of think that while terrorist threats are probably not the best way to go about it, they'll overlook it to get to that happy state of Ummah. Once they get that, then everyone will live happily together in peace and they can conveniently 'forget' about what it took to get there.

I find this frightening, and like I have said before, one of my best girlfriends is a Muslim. She doesn't like terrorism, but I think she'd like to see the Ummah come about.

322 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:25:41pm

315 Amy

As for the ISP threat, I think that that merits being banned, but that's Charles's call.

Okay, Charles can do as he wishes. My dude did an "rd" command on the last hacker that messed with us. That's a "remove directory", while the hacker thought he was messing with us, we re-formatted his entire hard drive. I'll bet his re-boot was challenging...


Just sayin'...

323 SevoGuy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:25:51pm

When the Profile Fits the Crime

Is it possible that someone at the NY Times actually gets it. This is the number one reason why I will never ever vote for Bloomberg.

What Michael Bloomberg is telling America, the islamic-terrorists and the rest of the world is that "Americans are still STUPID." When Bloomberg stated that the NYC Police would not profile subway riders, but instead would search every 5th person, I just shook my head...We can't be this stupid.

Years from now when most of us won't be able to even feed ourselves because the USA is bankrupt from it's fight against islamic-terror, we will be looking back at this kind of lunacy. Islamic persons have earned the right to be racially profiled.

My poor country. What will it take for us to wake up...1,000,000 dead Americans?

324 coulterclone  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:25:53pm

#319 karmic I will get a "RUN HELEN RUN" bumper sticker and put it on the FRONT of my car.

325 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:26:13pm

Aladin

[manly handshake]

Hope you and the family are doing well this evening...

326 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:27:31pm

#302 Amy

Well, then I guess we interpret his words differently. I do find an approval for terrorists attacks. As I said before, he can criticse Israel's policies, but if he is a true moderate Moslem, then at the same time he should condemn terrorism. From his words I understand that Israel deserves it as long as she treats the Palestinians as animals (in his view). I don't find it very moderate.

327 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:28:22pm

325 christheprofessor

Hope you and the family are doing well this evening...

thanks Chris, we are. Just got back from a two day trip to Niagara Falls. It was good, but the zucchini in our garden are the size of baseball bats...

Hot peppers are coming on nicely though...

You doin' okay?

328 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:29:14pm

Anyone seen N2L tonight?

329 Amy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:29:26pm

Aladin Sane #322

Wowee! Love it!

coulterclone #324

LOL! As a friend of mine says when a pedestrian runs across the street in front of traffic: "Hey, stupid, waddaya think, ya got bumpers?"

(You've gotta imagine it in New Yawkese, where it comes out "bumpuhs").

330 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:29:52pm

Christheporfessor --

Since Glen Reynolds has copyrighted and patented the word "Indeed" pressing ahead with litigation and remunerative relief for infringement of "Unauthorized" use,

I've got a hankering to just let Drudge have it with an "Unauthorized Use" lawsuit.

People keep taking my name in vain on a daily basis, slinging havoc this and Havoc that. "I've had it and I'm not going to take it anymore" -- Wishing I could call down fire & brimstone on a city, or shut up all my faithful followers in an Ark full of animals and cause a worldwide flood or something.

(I'm beginning to Understand how G_d and Jesus must feel)

331 Bob's Kid  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:30:02pm

Havoc, as ususal, you provide interesting, thought-provoking posts. Thanks!

332 Coulterclone  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:31:29pm

I know I'm making a mistake for getting into this but...
Hila, your #326...I don't think he was saying Israel "deserves" it, I think he was saying that Israel made itself vulnerable by, in his view, mistreating the Palis.

333 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:32:22pm

# 322 Aladin Sane

I'm not even sure what somebody knowing my IP address even implies, in terms of their capability to damage my communications. But I can recognize a threat when I see one. Charles will deal with the poster if he feels it's necessary. I rarely use this particular computer or ISP, so any damage done here would be minimal unless he/she can cause the computer to catch fire and burn the place down.

334 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:33:35pm

#331 Bob's Kid

interesting, thought-provoking posts.

A couple notches above boob anthropology, right?

335 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:34:15pm

333 Mike C.

I'm not even sure what somebody knowing my IP address even implies, in terms of their capability to damage my communications. But I can recognize a threat when I see one. Charles will deal with the poster if he feels it's necessary. I rarely use this particular computer or ISP, so any damage done here would be minimal unless he/she can cause the computer to catch fire and burn the place down.

Understood, friend! Just letting the competition know that we ain't neophytes, and there could be a price to pay...

336 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:34:44pm
#327 Aladin Sane

Hot peppers are coming on nicely though...

Habeneros or beter I trust?

/mmm . . . habeneros, eating one now, carefully

337 SuperdaveTWC  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:34:48pm

#43 American Infidel

Allah is the greatest of all of the deceivers...

Are you saying that "Allah" (actually a 7th century pagan moon god) is a liar and the Lord of Lies (Lord o' fLies)?

338 coulterclone  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:36:31pm

#333 Mike...I still can't figure out why the threat was made against you in the first place

/dumb blonde mode switch stuck in "on" position

#334 E2m Ya HAD to bring boobs into it huh? And in a thread that mentiones Helen Thomas several times...ewww

339 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:36:45pm

336 Killian Bundy

Habeneros or beter I trust?

Habs, Japs, Serranos, and Hungarians...

No matter how much I like the macho peppers, the Hungarians seem to out-produce them. So I plant the hungarians and enjoy them for lunch every year...

340 Charles  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:38:18pm

Please note: the only person who can see IP addresses at LGF is me.

341 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:38:29pm

#327 Aladin

Doing well, thanks. My peppers didn't grow at all (wasn't really trying) but my basil is doing well -- that's all I planted... Zucchini grow like weeds (just fed some leftover spaghitti and zucchini I made to my father for lunch today -- he said it was good)... Looking forward to some good pesto...

#330 Havoc

Heh. Funny how a word that one sees in a different context takes on new meanings. As soon as I saw the headline I linked, I thought of you, then realized he meant the non-person "havoc," the word I used to know...

342 Bob's Kid  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:39:03pm
A couple notches above boob anthropology, right?

Definitely.

And the really scary thing? I coulda gone on for hours.

Fortunately y'all were saved that fate.

343 coulterclone  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:39:11pm

#337 Superdave...pagan moon god? So now I guess I'm going to have to hate the moon. Bummer.

Good night everyone. Whistling theme to "Bridge on the River Kwai" and leaving.

344 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:39:29pm

I wonder what his point was then?

345 Bubbaman  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:39:31pm

Anyone who doesn't think that Islame is a cult need not read any further than this feature in the Arab News (officially "enlightened" English newspaper of the Saudis). Now excuse me for being "culturally biased" and a Western Imperialist Bastard - I mean, what the hell would a guy who was educated by a bunch of dead white men know?

Q. I got married when I was 19, without practically knowing that I was committed to pay my wife a very large dowry. When I discovered this after a few years, I persuaded my wife to forgo her dowry and she did, making it a condition that I do not divorce her during the following year. However, two years later I married a second wife, and then a third a few years later. My first wife has practically separated herself from me, and is demanding that I pay her the dowry. She also got my three daughters married without my consent. It was close relatives who acted for them in their marriages. What I would like to know is whether my daughters’ marriages are valid, and whether my wife’s demand to have her dowry is correct, considering that I fulfilled the condition she had set.

Read the answer

346 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:39:54pm

#274 JWM

Thank you so much for that post. Can muslim extremists join humanity?

Can the 'mainstream' muslims join the rest of humanity safely without fear of retribution for rejecting or reforming their koranic/hadith/sira texts?

Can we protect them from being labeled apostates? The penalty for being an apostate is Death. Read it.

If I were in the islam and my penalty for leaving the islam was death... where is my deliverance? How could I keep my children safe? Where would I go? My only way is to follow the islam or risk death. This is why the islam has so many followers.

Can the muslims overturn and perhaps ratify the penalty for leaving the islam?

Only the muslims know what they can do.

I hope to someday see the penalty of death for leaving islam overturned. Until then, we will not know peace.

I value and welcome your opinion and thoughts.

Kafira

347 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:40:45pm

#338 coulterclone

#334 E2m Ya HAD to bring boobs into it huh?

Bobs kid was enlightening us on the topic this morning. Before the Berkley nudist thread started. Been kind of a booby day.

But you had to remind us of Helen Thomas.

348 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:40:46pm

Oooo whats we got here? A f/troll that threatens posters?
Anybody gots some new rope they would like to sell? :)

349 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:40:48pm
 #340

Charles  7/28/2005 05:38PM PDT

Please note: the only person who can see IP addresses at LGF is me.

Man, that is just creepy the way you pop in!

350 RickZ  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:40:54pm

I agree with the posters concerning Mr. Ibrahim's omission of the "I" word.

I'd also like to point out that Mr. Ibrahim could not bring himself to write 'Last fall, Beslan was on fire . . .', either. And only circuitously does he mention Bali by mentioning Indonesia.

351 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:41:17pm

340 Charles

Please note: the only person who can see IP addresses at LGF is me.

So, you're not going to tell anyone that I'm posting from the women's underwear department at Gimbel's?

352 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:41:45pm

In case yo gys have not seen this "Islam mens war"

[Link: www.spectator.co.uk...]

353 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:42:12pm

Look I have a perfectly good 89 Landcruiser, we can put the safari seat on the front bumper... I can get the tranquilizer gun... and the big net...

354 greenmiler  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:42:25pm

BTW Charles, never know when you are listening; just wanted to thank you for this "Sanctuary from Insanity"

355 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:43:11pm

The a is sticking on my keyboard. Plus I am getting geritric ! Sorry geriAtric.

356 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:43:19pm
#337 SuperdaveTWC

Are you saying that "Allah" (actually a 7th century pagan moon god) is a liar and the Lord of Lies (Lord o' fLies)?

Allah is a false prophet. Islam is Satan's greatest invention. The strategy and tactics of "radical" Islam are world domination through immigration and a high birth rate.

/any questions/fatwas?

357 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:43:30pm

346 Kafira

Can the 'mainstream' muslims join the rest of humanity safely without fear of retribution for rejecting or reforming their koranic/hadith/sira texts?

I guess it depends on where they think their future lies...

submission or freedom? There has always been a price to pay for freedom...

358 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:43:51pm

# 338 coulterclone

Some people are just insanely jealous of my good looks. Yeah, that's it...

# 340 Charles

Thanks. Good to know.

359 Q  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:44:09pm

madawaskan (#269):

Well how many other people do you know that know the dialects of Arabic needed?

Sephardic Jews. Whom, incidentally, CIA has excluded from such sensitive positions, so as not offend your "moderate" muslim friends.

360 Bob's Kid  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:44:37pm
Please note: the only person who can see IP addresses at LGF is me.

Well, if mine is in any way interesting will ya let me know? I need some excitement in my life, and you never know...my IP address might be it.

361 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:45:59pm

276 Havoc 7/28/2005 04:42PM PDT
Kafira:

Same old same old pissy excuse, "look how bad every one else was, look what THEY did" Moha-mud wasn't so bad, his murdering, pillaging, land piracy, raping and slavetaking wasn't so bad ... see it still works GREAT in the Islamic world.

MohhMud murdered and threatened stole plundered and took slaves, like any other land pirate of his day, he just took the Mecca Moon_god All'ah and invented his own religion to justify his land piracy then urged his tribe to do it on a never ending industrial scale.

Well 1300 years later, the piracy continues

Ummm...Havoc? I think we are on the same side & page, buddy. Re-Read my posts. I tend to copy/paste the poster I'm responding to. Am I doing this wrong?

362 Beagle  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:46:38pm

#349 BG

Man, that is just creepy the way you pop in!


Charles is like the wind.

#352 JohninLondon

In case yo gys have not seen this "Islam mens war"


Islamic men's wear? You're gy?

I heard absinthe is legal in Europe, yo...

;-)

363 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:46:45pm
364 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:47:01pm

Here is Melanie Phillips commenting on the authoritive ""Islam means war" article I just posted.

Read, mark, learn -- and inwardly digest.

[Link: www.melaniephillips.com...]

365 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:47:10pm

#332 Coulterclone

No, he doesn't say it explicitly, but that's what he means. As for Israel making itself vulnerable, that sounds like an excuse. His choice of words indicate that Israel is asking for it.

366 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:48:21pm

362 Beagle

Islamic men's wear? You're gy?

didn't Martha Stewart do a line of table cloths suitable for Islamic Men's Wear?

367 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:49:09pm
 #355

JohninLondon  7/28/2005 05:43PM PDT

The a is sticking on my keyboard. Plus I am getting geritric ! Sorry geriAtric.

Of course you know what having the A sticking on your keyboard means?

368 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:49:18pm
369 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:49:51pm
#349 Bubble Girl 7/28/2005 05:40PM PDT

#340

Charles 7/28/2005 05:38PM PDT

Please note: the only person who can see IP addresses at LGF is me.

Man, that is just creepy the way you pop in!

Kinda like the way Sarah called you when you muttered something about the Zionists...

370 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:50:48pm

Hey BG, Hey E2M!

371 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:50:50pm
372 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:51:31pm

Actually, I need to issue a correction, Mohammed is a false prophet, Allah is a false god.

/it's all a road to damnation

373 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:52:14pm

Note: There are ways to masqurade as another IP. But only for the ubernerds. Bwahahahahahaha

374 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:52:28pm
#366

Aladin Sane  7/28/2005 05:48PM PDT
362 Beagle
Islamic men's wear? You're gy?


didn't Martha Stewart do a line of table cloths suitable for Islamic Men's Wear?

Yes, it is from her Federal Pen Winter Collection... all the towels and sheets at KMart are grey...

375 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:52:51pm

and Islam is a false religion...

376 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:54:37pm

#359 Q

Sephardic Jews. Whom, incidentally, CIA has excluded from such sensitive positions, so as not offend your "moderate" muslim friends.

I know they are excluded, but how does that prevent Moslems from being offended?

377 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:54:43pm

Okay Aladin Sane, what is the word?

378 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:54:48pm

369 Earth2moonbat

R.O.V.E. said something about you yesterday. I was surprised.

379 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:55:49pm

377 jlfintx

Nothing yet from consultant, still waiting.

Believe me, you'll be the first to know if it comes out good!

380 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:56:10pm
381 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:56:20pm
 #372

Killian Bundy  7/28/2005 05:51PM PDT
Actually, I need to issue a correction, Mohammed is a false prophet, Allah is a false god.


/it's all a road to damnation

I was on the Road to Purgatory, but I got off onto the Highway to Hell...

382 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:56:37pm

377 jlfintx

Did you go to the gunshow with N2L? Or is that this weekend?

383 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:57:27pm

Aladin

Hey Aladin... did you go over the Falls in a barrel?

384 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:58:00pm
385 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:58:43pm

#378 Bubble Girl

You were surprised the R.O.V.E. said something, or at what was said?

386 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:59:32pm

383 Bubble Girl

Hey Aladin... did you go over the Falls in a barrel?

Well, I considered it... There are a lot of wineries in that area. If I would have brought my trusty speedo, I might have done it.

I guess the falls are like 160 feet high. They don't look it. They look more like 40 feet. I can see why people think it's doable...

387 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 3:59:44pm

367 Bubble Girl

What does the AAA getting stck on my keybord men ?

And why does it hppen on every keybord I se ?

Plese help.

The U gets fnny too !

388 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:00:02pm

All of your IP addresses are belong to Charles.

389 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:00:46pm

#380 American Infidel

Yeah, but there are Jews in many sensitive positions and apparently that doesn't offend anyone, so why not in that specific position?

390 SwissTex  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:00:47pm

It seems that the way the WoT is run has changed Mr Ibrahim's mind. Here,s what he said (11.18.03) in an article on aljazeera.info under the title: Get the American GIs out Iraq:

It is unconscionable of the Bush crowd of hawkish neo-conservatives, Evangelical Christians and pro-Likud supporters of Israel to drive matters to that extent, solely for the questionable purpose of gaining electoral votes. Indeed it is self-defeating. Bush may loose his job along with the US clout in the Iraqi quagmire

391 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:00:47pm

385 Earth2moonbat

What he said... he does talk... and sing sometime too. He's a pretty happy Super Cray...

392 Luigi  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:01:45pm

Good commentary that improves with age

Why We Keep Getting Islam Wrong

Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to say a few words to you -- Nigeria, the Sudan, Egypt, Israel, Lebanon, Armenia, Macedonia, Yugoslavia, Kosovo, Bosnia, Chechnya, Russia, the Kashmir, Pakistan, Indonesia and the Philippines.
What do they all have in common? In each country or province, there is an ongoing struggle involving Moslems and non-Moslems. Samuel Huntington, author of "The Clash of Civilizations," tells us that out of 22 active conflicts in the world today, 20 involve Moslems and someone else - Moslems and Christians, Moslems and Jews, Moslems and Catholics, Moslems and Orthodox, Moslems and Hindus.
393 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:01:52pm

Aladin, he wrote me Monday that he had sent you two proposals and had not heard back?


The gun show is this weekend. I tried to get an advance but to no avail. Oh well, we'll get to try grips and such.

394 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:02:26pm

On Fox,

Kasich just said "Well Greta, you're the expert in this..."

G-d help us!

395 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:03:09pm

386 Aladin

Ahunh... I think the amount of wineries in the area has something to do with perception of whether the Falls are doable or not.

396 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:03:35pm

Bubble Girl, you never answered my question about what type of plane you went up in?

Single engine, low-wing or what?

397 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:03:37pm

393 jlfintx

Aladin, he wrote me Monday that he had sent you two proposals and had not heard back?

Email or snailmail? I've been out of the office, but checking email...

398 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:04:23pm

Bobs Kid

This hits on something that I find very lacking in general in even 'moderate' Moslems...they don't think that Jews and Christians should be allowed to be Jews and Christians.

I see this the weakest part of Islam. If you're a Jew or a Christian, especially if you're western, you recognize a person's right to belong to any wacko religion/philosophy you want to. We just shrug our shoulders and figure 'your loss,' and let folks go about your business.

You nailed exactly my own uneasiness with the idea of "Moderate," Muslims. Unlike Christianity, Judeaism, Buddhism etc. Which all (except for a few extreme manifestations) have a live and let live attitude. They may think you are going to their version of hell for not believing like them, but they are not taking any action to send you there. And while I think many Muslims do not buy into the orthodoxy of the Koran, that book still exists as central to their religion. And I get the same feeling that any moderateness, is a biding of time, not as it is in other religions, where tolerance to other's views is central to those beliefs.

The problem is deeper in Islam. In that the very founding documents are flawed. Thus you can never reform. You will always have the next Imam, Ayatolla, Grand Zipper, that demands a return to THE book.

399 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:04:58pm
#387

JohninLondon  7/28/2005 05:59PM PDT
367 Bubble Girl
What does the AAA getting stck on my keybord men ?
And why does it hppen on every keybord I se ?
Plese help.
The U gets fnny too !

I hav no ida. I thought you knw! Oh no, thr gos my 's...

400 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:05:17pm

#391 Bubble Girl

I'd be a happy super Cray if I lived in Bubble Girls' closet.

401 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:05:25pm

395 Bubble Girl

Ahunh... I think the amount of wineries in the area has something to do with perception of whether the Falls are doable or not.

Perhaps, but I was referring to the availability of barrels...

402 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:06:21pm

396 Jfl

It was a Pitt... does that help? I do not know planes.. a single engine, I think...

403 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:06:25pm

Aladin, all it said was "sent" two proposals, so I am thinking maybe snail mail?

404 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:07:21pm

#402, well I figured it was single engine, my question was it a single wing, did the wing sit under you?

405 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:07:58pm

403 jlfintx

Aladin, all it said was "sent" two proposals, so I am thinking maybe snail mail?

Must have been. Let me know your liquor of choice so I can send you a case if it pans out...

406 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:08:00pm
407 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:08:02pm
 #400

Earth2moonbat  7/28/2005 06:05PM PDT

#391 Bubble Girl

I'd be a happy super Cray if I lived in Bubble Girls' closet.

By jove, I think you've hit on something... I had left my Victoria Secret bra lying on him... a bright red one, and I think I heard him say... ohhh... please don't... when I took it off...

408 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:09:35pm

407 Bubble Girl

Too much information...

409 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:09:40pm

Kafira

I did Mr. Buddy. Check the hijacked website listing you made in #252 for Faith-freedom.org, they played you for a sucker.

And let's face it, Mr. Honesty -- you've had Shit for Brains governments in Canada Since Trudeau. (Ain't sayin it's been much better during the 1990's here either, and still struggling)

Unless both countries get the Immigration and Asylum situation fixed, and fast, major cities in both countries, one day, Will make the L.A. Watts & Rodney King riots look small & insignificant by comparison

I'm not a fan of vigilante "street" justice, or anarchy, and that's what you'll get unless You get a grip on the Immigration and the 50 Jihadi organizations you already have.

410 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:10:04pm

404 jfl

Yes, it did sit under us...

411 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:11:24pm
381 Bubble Girl

I was on the Road to Purgatory, but I got off onto the Highway to Hell...

Without getting into a discussion of the Catholic concept of Purgatory, I'm sure your good works in life will be your Salvation, doctor.

/in the end, I suspect you'll be okay

412 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:11:48pm

#407 Bubble Girl

I don't think your Cray can handle the megaflops. You're going to have to put a bigger heat sink, or something, or you're going to be cleaning flash ROM off the walls.

413 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:12:18pm

#405 Aladin

Give me a chance to research the best quality liquor on the planet. :-)

I may have to get experts like Bubbles, Rayra and Reaganite to help me out!

414 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:13:06pm

OK sorry I pissed some of you off. Although I've been a huge fan of this site and a fan all of you posters for many (9) months, and I was elated when I had the chance to sign up, I guess I over stepped my bounds. The IP thing was a joke BTW. My bad.

Sorry I couldn't be a part of this group/BLOG. I still think our interests and concerns are the same, but I'm not fitting in quite as well as I thought I would fit in.

I will still come here daily and enjoy reading the articles and your posts, and wish all of you well.

Best regards to all
Linda
(failed lizardette)

415 Kohenan The Barbarian  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:13:38pm

#254-Havoc--Half of my Jewish Family were murdered by the Nazis with the willing help of Poland--those who came to North America to live in Canukistan and the USA did so before 1933 and they fought in the Canadian,British and American Forces against the Axis Powers--none were killed in combat--does that now make my opinion "kosher"?

416 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:13:52pm
417 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:13:53pm

I gotta go you all. I'm considering getting drunker and watching my Eagles DVD.

Okay, so sue me!

{LGF}

418 Aladin Sane  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:15:55pm

414 Kafira

(failed lizardette)

Failed, is only failed if you quit trying...

Keep trying sis. This place is worth it!

[I know I was leaving...]

419 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:16:33pm
420 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:17:07pm

#414 Kafira

Give it another spin. Once people get used to you, things will go better. It's always awkward at first.

And some people here nobody can get along with so don't feel bad...

421 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:17:46pm

414 Kafira Linda

That was a nice apology. I do not know the specifics of what happened, but your apology was sincere.

I never have fit in. Diverse opinions are needed. If amends have been made, then start fresh...

Failure is my middle name!

422 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:19:14pm

@416 Rayarized

Word. :)

423 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:19:22pm

414 Kafira

Psst... Psst

 
#420
Earth2moonbat  7/28/2005 06:17PM PDT
#414 Kafira

Give it another spin. Once people get used to you, things will go better. It's always awkward at first.

And some people here nobody can get along with so don't feel bad...

This is one poster no one can get along with.. :wink:

424 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:19:37pm

Ok, if I have to, I'll cheat Charles' filter:

{{{ Kafira }}}

OK? Does that convinnce you?

425 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:20:20pm

#414 Kafira

I will throw in my 2 cents as well.

Stick around, it's true that some people are mean, like...say Bubble Girl, but you will get used to it.


/running away and ducking

426 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:20:58pm
427 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:21:17pm

Pimf - convince

428 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:23:22pm

Earth2moonbat just killed the thread. :-)

See, it's all about blaming the other person; you'll get the hang of it in no time!

429 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:24:13pm
430 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:25:00pm

417 Aladin

I know it's because No2libs isn't here...

/guns...

431 Mike C.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:25:30pm

# 416 Rayra

What I was calling dishonest is clamoring for moderate muslims to stand up to islamists, and then slapping them down if they try. Like I said to somebody back up the thread, if they (that poster) consistently stated that they don't and never will believe any of them, no matter what, well, at least they're being honest about it. I in no way implied that everybody who disagreed with me was being dishonest for doing so.

Anyway, bedtime here, so later.

432 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:25:39pm

@414 kafira

Didn't you know you're supposed to wear your kevlar jammies when posting at Lgf?

433 jfromfolsomca  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:25:41pm

Thanks Charles for providing such an interesting thread. I read all the comments and have gone back and forth in my thinking.

I think that #274 jwm summed it up best for me.

Thanks all for some serious thoughts to chew on.

#388 christheprofessor

LOL

j

434 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:26:51pm
435 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:29:05pm

Kafira

Quiting?

There's no quiting in blogging!

/Tom Hanks (leaugue of their own)

436 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:29:45pm
437 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:30:19pm

I need a new tip Rayra. What is the best liquor on planet earth? I intend to let Aladin buy it and ship it to me.

438 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:30:43pm

Moslims Must abide by the tenets of All of the koran, or they're not true believers but apostates.
So apparently moderate moslims are really apostates, and many of them either ignore this fact, lie about it or are really just what an apostate is.
There is no middle of the road moderation with islam, it's either the whole shebang or nothing at all.

439 jfromfolsomca  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:30:57pm

#436 Rayra

No s**t, Charles wears a skirt?

j

440 BBEV  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:31:19pm

What pisses me off the most is that it only took 20 years for he Imams to come forward and say something.

441 Hila  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:31:22pm

Terrorists plan to attack Australia, Israelis warn

ISRAELI intelligence agents surfing the internet have warned that terrorists are planning a future attack on Australia.
The warning was revealed at a high-level secret intelligence briefing in Istanbul, Turkey, last month, attended by intelligence experts, police, academics and ministers from nine countries, including Israel’s public security minister, Gideon Ezra.
The meeting was of special significance for Israel, which has agreements with Turkey to share intelligence and military training and to co-operate in the fight against terrorism.
Dr Mark Craig, a graduate of the US Federal Bureau of Investigation national academy and specialist in terrorism and organised crime, was the sole Australian at the Istanbul meeting.
He told the AJN this week that it was there he learned that Israeli agents were monitoring the internet and listening to terrorists speaking on Arab-language chat rooms.

http://www.ajn.com.au/pages/current-paper/national -01.html

442 J.D.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:32:39pm

#440 BBEV
20 years doesn't cover it.

443 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:33:00pm

I posted a deep, important Spectator article by a Muslim scholar on "Islam means war" at #352 above.

Melanie Phillips seized on it quickly --- see #355 above.

Also in the Spectator is a Mark Steyn piece. Good, frothy as usual - but not as deep and informative as #322.

[Link: www.spectator.co.uk...]

444 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:33:03pm

Kohenan

My kind of Barbarian.

My favorite uncle who raised and supported my mother, and her sister (his wife) , and supported my widowed grandmother Lies here.

His entire unit of combat engineers 90th Div. , was overrun, and destroyed on the Sigfried line near Metz trying to take out Dragon's teeth for the tanks, Feb. 12 '45 last day of active Battle, Battle of the Bulge.

I wish he were here. It left a big, big hole.

"Who did what" way back when doesn't make us noble now. The Russian General Yukov, spent over 300,000 grunts and hundreds of tank crews just to get the last 40 miles into Berlin to fly his stupid Soviet Flag over the Reichstad by May Day. Does that somehow make him noble ? I think not.

Your family was apparently smart to get out when they did.

My family's been "Over Here" for over 300 years, Presbyterians, and did what they were asked to do, and that meant killing lot's of Nazi's and Japanese.

If we don't get the immigration and asylum policy for both countries fixed and U.S. southern border situation fixed we'll have to face those dead family members one day on the otherside, and explain why we sat on our hands and let the country be bombed and terrorized, that they died to leave us.

445 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:36:46pm

havoc

If we don't get the immigration and asylum policy for both countries fixed and U.S. southern border situation fixed we'll have to face those dead family members one day on the otherside, and explain why we sat on our hands and let the country be bombed and terrorized, that they died to leave us.

Amen

446 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:36:51pm

Sorry #352 is the KEY article in this week's Speccie.

(the Spectator was founded as a radical magazine 65 years before people started drafting the US Constitution)

447 ballantrae  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:38:03pm

Check this out guys

There's a favorite author of mine - Orson Scott Card. Who's conservative and occasionally writes articles regarding the war in Iraq. He just wrote an article that blew me away completely.

It regards the london bombings - but more - he implies that someone higher up quietly gave him access to something that O.B.L. said on the mike that wasn't released to the general public. Note, that I say he "implies" this. He doesn't say it outright. But .. it's a very cool read. I think everyone should take a look. It will blow you away.

Here's the link to killing the common people

448 Goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:38:07pm

I asked this the other day, but didn't see an answer.

What do imans do to become imans? Do they attend a seminary? And am I correct, only men can be imans? Are they the only one authorized to comduct ceremonies such as weddings and funerals? I know Judaism has naming ceremonies for babies and bar- and bat-mitvahs for teenagers, while Christians have baptism for babies (athough, of course, some denominations have only adult baptisms) and confirmation often in the early teen years; First Communion is also an important milestone. Do muslims have smilar coming-of-age ceremonies?

I am asking sincerely and seriously.

449 negativ  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:38:41pm

All religions are inherently false. Except for mine, of course.

Anyway, anyone care to speculate on how long until these guys turn up folded, spindled, and/or mutilated?

450 BBEV  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:40:03pm

444 Havoc

My family's been "Over Here" for over 300 years, Presbyterians


Mine too. Came over on the Mayflower.

451 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:40:17pm

#398 Jehu:
Exactly. Everyone has seenor met people who are overwhelmemed with religious enthusiasm. Fanatical Christians may be heavy handed and overbearing; they may take to standing on streetcorners and preaching to anyone who will listen. Jews may become ultra-orthodox and rigid in their belief and practce. Hare Krishnas bug you at the airport (at least they used to). There are even some Buddhist sects that try to give you the hard sell. All of these folks have one thing in common: they can sometimes be annoying, but they are never dangerous. You can't say the same about moslems. As you said about "returning to the book", and as I mentioned in my post @174- the koran explicitly advocates murder. Anyone who belives that God wrote the koran belives that God advocates murder. That's a pretty tough stance to moderate.
JWM

JWM

452 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:41:37pm
453 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:42:05pm

Someone discssing the nature of ""Britishness" the other day - rule of law, strong citizenry and all that - said it last changed course in the Napoleonic Wars.

200 years ago is "recent" for the Brits. Your country was founded not long before, and mine in Australia at much the same time.

Blink of an eyelid stuff.

454 N. O'Brain  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:42:47pm

OMG, the 2005 Bulwer-Lytton winners are up!

A sample:

Winner: Historical Fiction
Sphincter, the gladiator, girded his loins in preparation for today's games, glad to be part of the season opener since he hadn't been sure until yesterday that his contract would be renewed, given his slump during the Germans-versus-lions series but he knew that swatting Germans into the lion's pit was trickier than it looked and he told the officials that they should look at his other stats, not just Huns batted in.
-Robert Peltzer
-Baltimore, MD


[Link: www2.sjsu.edu...]

455 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:43:44pm

#448 Goddess...

I am an imam. I just decided I was.

456 Goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:45:42pm

Johninlondon

Are you serious? Is that all it takes?

By the way, I LOVE London. I know my way around it better than any city in the US. I used to live in Oxford, another city I love.

I wish you only peace and happiness in one of my favorite cities.

457 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:46:20pm

#384 Rayra

You've forgotten about cornish intifada, then.

458 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:48:56pm
459 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:50:53pm
460 Joel  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:51:01pm

456 Goddessoftheclassroom
I too love London and know my way around it almost as well as I do my own city. It really bothers me that London has a Trotskyite lunatic for a mayor but hopefully one day - sanity will return.

461 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:51:04pm

Typos TYPOS!
I blame the phone solicitors! Fie on them for interrupting me when I'm trying to post.
:P
JWM

462 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:51:53pm
463 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:52:24pm
#450 BBEV 7/28/2005 06:40PM PDT

444 Havoc

My family's been "Over Here" for over 300 years, Presbyterians


Mine too. Came over on the Mayflower.

Well mine weren't THAT unfortunate, feel for your poor relatives.

They Landed in the "Radicals" settlement Providence, 'bout 1648, either sailors or Scottish Ship Captains or more likely regular folk fleeing "the Queen". Probably just married the local waitress and started farming.

The rest in 1802 after they were fed up with the British in Derry Ireland.

No matter ...

Like the 300 lb. Champion wrestler who taught me to play Jazz and Chopin and took me to see both Horowitz and Ella Fitgerald -- see his family got to come over on a different kind of boat, from Ghana or Cameroon 300 years ago too.

He said, "It doesn't matter now how they came, because we're all in the same boat now"

464 Joel  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:52:43pm

OT- is anyone else out there as sick and tired as I am of the constant coverage on Fox and MSNBC of the Aruba case? I mean I feel sad for the missing girl but enough already - it reminds me of the constant Scott Peterson coverage.

465 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:52:55pm

JohninLondon

I declare myself an Imam from another village and I put a fatwah on your false Imamish self!

466 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:54:00pm

#423 Bubble Girl -- Thank you for that. I have read all of you for so long... BabbaZee. And Sarah D. And Big Ed machmood the weather man, and NY Nana, and Amy, and Havoc, and . And the big get together somewhere in undisclosed locationville. I watched that BBQ blog and just laughed and laughed. I need some laughs, and you folks give me serious thoughts but you also give me laughs. Lots of them.

It's wierd because I have read all of you for so long, I thought I could jump right in as if you would know me. What an ass I am for thinking that. I guess you did not know that you had fans. I'm sorry for being offensive earlier. My heart is heavy with the islamist threat. Thank you all for forgiving me.

I will refrain from posting and go back to what gave me so much laughter before. READING!

BTW have ya'll googled "little green footballs"? 1.3 Million returns.

OK I'm done. And this I think is my own 'drinking thread'

Kafira

467 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:54:55pm

Kafira, this was indeed way over the line and I was not aware of it. An explanation is needed.

Implied threat

468 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:56:12pm

#466 Kafira
:) Welcome to LGF. Fun, ain't it?

JWM

469 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:56:19pm

Joel

OT- is anyone else out there as sick and tired as I am of the constant coverage on Fox and MSNBC of the Aruba case? I mean I feel sad for the missing girl but enough already - it reminds me of the constant Scott Peterson coverage.

It is news of a thousand cuts. Beat you to death with a non-story for weeks until you just give in and agree that a story about some spoiled southern belle, that had no morals, got drunk with some creepy locals, and ended up dead, is really, really the MOST IMPORTANT THING RIGHT NOW ON EARTH!

470 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:57:35pm
471 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:58:47pm

Joel, Goddess

As it goes, the only REAL online debate on what the hell we Brits can now do is at a "leftie" UK site. An old--fashioned Labour site, aaanti--Guardian etc.

Unlike the Dems, Labour here thanks to Blair is mainstream still, and the debate about sick Red Ken, loony Galloway, the real meaning of Islam etc is at Harry's Place :

[Link: hurryupharry.bloghouse.net...]

Starting to approach LGF + Powerline in depth and breadth for the UK scene.

472 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 4:58:58pm

#456 Goddess of the classroom

To become an imam, all you need is 2 (count 'em, 2) adult male followers.

They seriously need a seminary and degree system.

473 jehu  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:01:03pm

Dianna

To become an imam, all you need is 2 (count 'em, 2) adult male followers.

Must be a lot of Imams in San Francisco

474 J.D.  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:02:17pm

#464 Joel
I'm with you. Obsessive television began with Ted Koppel, iirc.

475 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:02:25pm

#466 Kafira
Once you start posting, and even if you promise yourself you won't post again after you make a boo boo (I NEVER drink and post anymore!) Just wait. You will be back! LGF is addictive.

476 JohninLondon  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:03:48pm

465 jehu

fatwah back at you. My villge is smaller nd more backward than yours, so I am obviously a more important imam than you.

AND I know that most of the above posts were written by the CIA or Mossad.

That is why my mosque is now backed by Saudi money.

477 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:04:14pm

#474 J.D.
Obsessive tv started with me with I Love Lucy. I STILL watch and laugh. As fas as being a news junkie, that started with LGF.

478 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:04:19pm

#473 jehu

Groan. I hope not.

Though in SF, all you need to proclaim yourself anything - and get paid for it! - is to produce an incoherent, mimeographed rant and hand it out over at State. Before you know it, you'll have your very own flock of believers.

I've watched it a few times. Comic and scary at the same time.

479 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:05:41pm

#470 AI

Sorry, but I don't think I was speaking to you, although you continually stick your nose where it doesn't belong. No, she did not explain to my satisfaction why she made a threat to Mike C.

I am waiting as to why she made an empty, obvious threat about having a bead on his IP address.

That should not be just ignored until she explains herself!

480 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:06:15pm

#467 Please see above post above. What else do you want from me?

481 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:06:54pm

#472 Dianna
Is that it?!?! That is all you need? Well, if all you need is couple of adult male followers, maybe I could declare myself the title I always wanted, High Priestess of All That Moves. Obey.Now.

482 Havoc  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:07:26pm

#472 Diana

As wierd as it sounds they have one or two in Fwance, because they're trying to cut down on the Wahabbi Death Cult Imams from Yemen and Saudi.

Nice thought, but it'll never work.

PS- When the rioting starts over there, the muslims are all living in fire death traps.

The French need new government leadership, desparately.

483 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:08:06pm

I want to know WHY you told Mike C you had a bead on his IP address, and what the hell you meant?

You never gave any explanation and now your trying this bullshit to act like you are the victim. Explain why you said that, or what you meant.

Pretty simple request!

484 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:08:20pm
485 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:09:10pm

BTW, just to ensure I get jumped on - Mike C. has a very good point. So does Amy.

Kafira, most of us are very clear on the Koran. The curious thing is, one poster had a conversation with an Egyptian who felt that the Korans we're seeing have been tampered with by the Wahabits...we'll see.

I think a moderate amount of hopefulness is called for, here. Not instant searches for condemnation.

But we do need to keep hammering away to make sure "moderates" aren't hiding something.

Ibrahim may have not mentioned Israel to avoid sending his readers off into frothing madness. And who says his views can't be changing?

486 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:09:13pm

Kafira, I for one am calling bullshit on you and I am sure the other posters did not see what you did to raise my ire, as well as Mike C, and others. It was over the line and worthy of a ban.

487 unclassifiable  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:09:17pm

#308 christheprofessor

Given all the firewals/"anonomizers" and other redirection software the typical Windows system comes preconfigured with, having an IP address is pretty worthless.

Now having the password to a few switches...

...priceless

488 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:10:00pm

#467 jlfintx

If it makes you feel any better, an IP address is normally not tied to a physical street address. I won't go into all of the possible arrangements, and how DHCP works, but generally an IP address gets you information on the router, which normally belongs to the ISP. Someone with a search warrant can subpoena the ISP and get the physical location connected to an IP address, but it is not information that is available over the net to hackers.

In short, they might get the neighborhood, but not the house.

489 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:10:19pm

#484

Yeah, that is why you are so loved by so many people here. LOL

490 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:10:41pm

#481 Crimson Fisted

You're going to become a cat?!

491 motorcycle mom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:10:57pm

Kafira 466 480

posting already, well welcome back. :)

492 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:11:58pm

Earth2Moonbat, I appreciate your explanation, but the point of the threat was for a terroristic reason, not so much of the capability to carry it out. Many posters are not going to know the difference and I take exception to that.

493 unclassifiable  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:12:05pm

PIMF #388 on my #487

Looks like my tracert was bad.

494 Goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:12:42pm

Dianna

LOL!

Crimsonfisted

You can be High Priestess of All That Moves anywhere but my classroom...

495 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:15:03pm

#490 Dianna
SSSsssay now, not a bad idea! And on that, this kitten is saying good night.
meow.

496 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:15:03pm
497 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:16:06pm

#492 jflintx

I think it was a wildly inappropriate joke, and Kafira has apologized.

Before jumping down her throat, document, and wait to see what else she says and does. This is the first time I've seen her here, and she hasn't been particularly troll-like. So let's take her at her word.

Yes, I have saved the link to the post, and I will remember, if she does something like that again. For now, though, let's let it go.

498 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:16:56pm

#494 Goddess
I would never dare!

499 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:16:57pm

What does it mean?

Okay, all I did was ask for a reasonable explanation of why she did this and only get b/s in return.

This was what is on that link.

BTW Mike C


I have a bead on your IP address.

So, this is okay, without specifically apologizing to the offended party?

Well, whatever.

500 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:19:09pm

AI, you are a piece of work aren't you? No one wants your love anyway. Someone earlier perfectly described you, whoever the person you were pissing off today. Don't have the time or care to point it out to you.


[yawn]

501 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:19:54pm

#486 jlfintx 7/28/2005 07:09PM PDT
Kafira, I for one am calling bullshit on you and I am sure the other posters did not see what you did to raise my ire, as well as Mike C, and others. It was over the line and worthy of a ban.

to JLFINTX: Chill out ferChrisakes. Listen, I made a comment " I gotta bead on your IP address" Does that make you terrified or freaked out? Geeze oh petes. I'm sorry if I made you worried or afraid, but I'm just a little white girl behind a little white screen who made a comment. Sorry to have freaked you out.

Kafira

502 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:20:04pm

#499 jlfintx

She did apologize to Mike C., specifically, and did explain.

For all we know, she's off on another thread, or reading a link and hasn't seen your demands for an explanation.

503 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:21:13pm

Dianna, well then that is my mistake, I did not see her address Mike C. So if he is cool with it, then I am okay with it as well. Just a little hyped up lately.

504 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:22:21pm

#501 Kafira

Refer jlfintx to your apology post. Then apologize again, to him. Then drop it. Don't get pissy - he isn't familiar with you, and you did rather make a faux pas.

505 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:22:49pm
506 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:23:09pm

#501 Well, then you certainly should not be talking bullshit, whence someone can perceive it as a threat. If I showed up at your door, you would certainly not think it cool!

Someone not as nice and pleasant as me may take you up on something like that one day.

507 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:23:44pm

#503 jlfintx

Yeah, I know. We're all biting each other's heads off, lately. It's been an awful month.

508 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:24:39pm

AI, I could ask any number of people to point out how much of an ass you CONTINUALLY are. All of us are sometimes, but you make a career of it. I don't want to play your games, so go read your own crap.

509 Joel  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:25:09pm

469 Jehu; 474 J.D.Thank you for confirming that I am not alone with my total disgust of the saturation docverages of Scott Peterson, Michael Jackson, and the Arbua girld (I think her name was Natalie). I mean I feel bad for the girl but a missing girl should not be the number one news story day after day after day. On Hannity & Colmes it seems that that is alltheytalk about (to say nothing about Great Van Sustern).

471 JohninLondon
I read Harry's Palce, Natalie Solent, Melanie Phillips, Norm Geras and Stephen Pollard's blogs daily and I really enjoy them. They give me hope that there are a lot more intelligent people in Britain then the BBC, Reuters, al Guardian, Das Independent et al would ahve us believe. The decline of the Tories is truly depressing. I miss the spirit of Maggie Thatcher (one of the greatest statesmen(woman) of the post World War II eara.

510 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:27:34pm

#507 Dianna

We're all biting each other's heads off, lately. It's been an awful month.

Summer heat (for everybody except me)?

511 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:29:31pm

AI

Do you ever post as someone else? Dang it, I think I confused you with another poster.

Shall we just hate each other for kicks?

512 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:30:34pm
513 Al Charabiya  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:30:41pm

#471 JohninLondon

Good to see someone else enjoys Harry's Place. A sign of an anti-idiotarian uprising from within the UK left? Maybe. Certainly Pro-Israel, pro-WOT and vehemently anti-Galloway.

And you're right, for a left-wing site it is pretty mainstream. So much so that they stood hand-in-hand with Scott Burgess of the right-wing blog The Daily Ablution to take down the Jihadi Journalist at the Guardian. Can you imagine if Kos had supported Charles over Rathergate?

514 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:31:19pm

jfilTX: Please don't take me wrong. I think we are on the same side. Please scroll up.

Sorry for disrupting anything, or offending you... it was a joke.

Love to all

Time for some EZ-Mac (a/k/a mac n cheeze)

Hey, Love To All.

515 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:32:52pm

Off to the grocery store.

Take care, all, and stop fighting!

516 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:33:15pm

That's okay Kafira, I am probably just hypersensitive and it goes down easier to take out some frustration via this connection. You are okay, I am just in a real funk and have been for about a month. My apologies to American Infidel as well, as I confused her with someone else.


Now...who else can I piss off this evening?

517 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:34:48pm

Thanks Dianna for being the cool head this evening. Are you sure I can't so something to piss you off before you go?

518 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:35:44pm
519 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:35:55pm

Ahem, AI, you didn't read 511 after you read 508 and the inbetween 509/567, er uh, where was I?

520 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:38:49pm

Alrighty then...I guess my work on this thread is done!

Time to venture to new threads where I can continue to work my magic.

521 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:39:28pm
522 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:39:43pm

AI, I do have a question though. Are you an observant Jew, Christian , or neither?

523 Goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:40:23pm

jlfintx

Maybe I could tick you off by point out that it should be "Whom else..."?

But then again, I don't correct other lizards' grammar unless asked to; it's tacky.

Besides, I make too many typos myself!

[just to be very clear and to avoid the risk of any hurt feelings, I am TOTALLY TEASING to lighten the mood!]

524 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:41:10pm

Okay, then I have to right this tactic down. When pissing someone off and being the guilty party, tell them you mistake them for another poster!

No, really I am the offending party. Confession is good for my soul.

525 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:42:14pm

#523

goddess

Maybe I could tick you off by point out that it should be "Whom else..."?

Haha, your grammer is as bad as mine!


Good one jlf.

526 Kafira  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:42:33pm

Jilftx I rhink this is going to be the dead thread. Are you ok?

527 Goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:44:52pm

jlfintx

As I said, I know the limits of my keyboarding skills too well to get too high and mighty!

However, I really am very good at grammar (she said with modest pride.)

528 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:44:53pm
529 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:45:34pm

Hey Lizards!

Blogging from Fayettnam! I managed to piss Bernadette off and EW1(SG) had to sit between us!

Reaganite also elbowed me in the ribs.

Good start I figure!

/Sarah D.

530 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:47:23pm

Sarah - you missed the mother of all nekked threads.

531 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:47:32pm

AI, I thought so. I don't want to say who I confused you with, as it is moot, since I was the offender. I am Christian getting my solitary butt kicked. I know better than to play the game this way, but I will learn.

532 crom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:48:18pm

Is anyone else in the midwest listening to 610 WTVN radio in Columbus, OH ?

The guest is some dr. kassem kaleel. Spouting the more crap in half an hour about how the [bigoted word]s can't do terror because the core-on says so.
Islam prohibits beheading. London bombings could have been done by Secret Service due to pullout of british troops. Speeaking so nice and friendly in plain english until an arabic word and then in total accent.

Finally after 30 minutes of bullshit, he says:
Media is owned by zionist cartel.
I need to throw up now.

Calling the station, host not taking calls yet.
Hope I get through.

533 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:48:32pm

Okay, well if everyone wants to find a newer thread, I wash up here and kill the lights.

534 American Infidel[deleted]  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:49:06pm
535 Goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:49:41pm

Nighty night, lizards. I'm going to crawl under my rock and diagram some sentences.

536 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:50:20pm

529 Lizards

HI! You kooky people!

537 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:50:21pm

#530 Earth2moonbat

Nooo! Tell me it ain't so!


/Sarah D.

538 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:50:56pm

Glad to see everybody kissed and made up. Any real trolls around?

539 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:52:33pm
 #530

Earth2moonbat  7/28/2005 07:47PM PDT


Sarah - you missed the mother of all nekked threads.

He is not kidding... it was... the Mother of All Nekked Threads...

540 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:53:03pm

Nothing here but a bunch of scales, and Kafiras' tail.

541 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:55:59pm
 #538

christheprofessor  7/28/2005 07:50PM PDT

Glad to see everybody kissed and made up. Any real trolls around

Trolls? Oh PINIELLAAA...

542 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:56:03pm

#534 AI

You know exactly what I am talking about. That course of life trying to live out your faith without any support from others of like mind.

And now I see this thread is being resurrected by Sarah and the party!

Nite Goddess, I want a full report in the morning!

543 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:57:57pm

See what I mean, Bubbles could have come out of lurk mode and helped me out, but nooo, she just let me dig another hole.

I guess she is getting used to my routine?

544 foreign devil  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 5:58:48pm

[Link: www.dailystar.com.lb...]

"Iraq criticizes neighbors for not stopping foreign insurgents"


Compiled by Daily Star staff
Friday, July 29, 2005


"Iraq's foreign minister complained yesterday that some neighboring countries are not cooperating to stop foreign religious extremists from crossing into Iraq and said border tensions with Kuwait should be solved through dialogue. On the ground, a suspected bomb on a railway line hit a train carrying oil products near Baghdad, causing a huge fire, Iraqi police said, adding one person was killed and four wounded in the blaze.

"In a joint news conference, with U.S. Ambassador to Iraq Zalmay Khalilzad, Foreign Minister Hoshyar Zebari said that unspecified "neighboring countries" were not cooperating to control their border and prevent infiltrators from entering Iraq. "Iraq's security is part of the security of these countries," Zebari said.

"Zebari's remarks were made one day after U.S. Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld urged the Iraqis to be more aggressive in complaining to their neighbors about infiltration by foreign fighters..."

545 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:00:52pm

Bubbles

Haven't seen Piney in a few... I guess since the ChappaPlameOut dried up and is essentially off the front pages, s/he has nothing left to talk about...

546 Ann  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:02:17pm

#529 LGF Live Blogging

Good start I figure!


Ok, one more beer...

547 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:04:14pm

545 Chris

Pini was here last night... I shall find his post.

Stay here~

548 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:04:23pm

Hey, maybe Charles can give you an "LGF Live Blogging" thread as the open thread tonight...

549 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:04:36pm

Holy shit, anyone see this?
Helen Thomas is vowing to 'kill herself' if Dick Cheney announces he is running for president. Isn't she already the walking dead?

550 jlfintx  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:05:12pm

time to call it a day


Nytol™

551 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:06:01pm

#547 Bubbles

Yes, with my nephews here, I have lurked a bit when I can and posted only a little -- my not seeing him around could be more because I wasn't here, rather than his not being here...

552 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:07:19pm

Chris

From last night..


#376 piniella 7/27/2005 11:57:33 PM
#367 freedom - "I would like to see my mothers face."

I would like to see Bush swinging from the gallows.

553 Ann  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:09:40pm

#548 christheprofessor

Tomorrow night for the FNDT... We will have at least three computers around for everyone to post from during the party.

Pictures, too.

Uh oh.

554 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:09:43pm

A couple more from Pini..


#344 piniella 7/27/2005 10:13:55 PM
#330 freedom - "How would you win the war on head-choppers? " As General Myers recently pointed out, there is much more to this war than military action. I think a great first step would be sending our war criminals to The Hague.

#358 piniella 7/27/2005 11:02:07 PM
#352 freedom - "our war criminals? Who?" Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Feith, and Rice for starters.

555 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:10:37pm

Bubbles

Thanks. Classic Piney, eh? Pretty horrid thought...

556 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:10:59pm

Bubble Girl:
Please don't-otherwise you-know-who may appear. (and I don't mean Voldemort)
;)
JWM

557 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:12:06pm

#553 Ann

Damn, sounds like it's gonna be one to forget! Still not looking good at my end, but there is a remote pastability... Perhaps I'll surprise y'all...

558 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:12:25pm

556 JWM

okay... I will obey.

Time for a margarita ~~~

559 sailordude  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:13:33pm

This is a wild thread tonight...

560 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:14:21pm

Ann

:D You guys have fun... while the rest of us take on the responsibilities of solving the world's problems.

/It's a tough job but we will hold the fort down while you guys have some R & R...

561 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:15:00pm

...Now if Margarita shows up, that's a different matter. (sigh) and I'm here with a diet coke and nothing flammable. :(

JWM

562 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:15:42pm

#554 Bubbles

I hate it when Piney or others uses terminology like "war criminals" as if the term is merely descriptive and has no other meaning. I wish they would put up or shut up with that crap.

563 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:18:34pm

#529 LGF Live Blogging:

I managed to piss Bernadette off and EW1(SG) had to sit between us!

All right, so it was a good excuse to sit between two pretty women...I'm not THAT stupid!

EW1

564 gonzo  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:19:01pm

#549 Reaganite

I have a horrible vision of slitting her open, crotch to throat, and all these roaches come pouring out. She had been re-animated and was a puppet. A roach puppet.

565 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:19:47pm

#563 LGF Live Blogging

All right, so it was a good excuse to sit between two pretty women...I'm not THAT stupid!

Is that why you were the only one wearing a tie?

566 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:20:53pm

#564 gonzo

A roach puppet.

Dude, that's the best case scenario...

567 Ann  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:21:08pm

#560 Bubble Girl

It's a tough job but we will hold the fort down while you guys have some R & R...

Oh, but we will be around during the party tomorrow night to drag all of you down to our level!

568 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:21:27pm

I think ties are sexy!

/Sarah D.

569 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:24:11pm
 #567

Ann  7/28/2005 08:21PM PDT
#560 Bubble Girl
It's a tough job but we will hold the fort down while you guys have some R & R...

Oh, but we will be around during the party tomorrow night to drag all of you down to our level!

Criminey! I will stop at Church tomorrow for some Holy Water!

570 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:24:18pm

#568 LGF Live Blogging

I think ties are sexy!

They go so well with camouflage! ;-Þ

571 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:28:22pm

A Toast!

May the Wind be always at your back
the Mexican Jumping Beans at your side
your pinatas full of gold
and your hot tamales, tightly wrapped.

Salud

:chink:

572 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:29:16pm

PIMF

:clink:

573 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:30:04pm

#562 christheprofessor:

I've found myself getting furious with pinhead and its digusting cohort canuckisturd lately. What galls me is that these two represent a huge segment of the population. They treat the whole war as a joke. It's as if your house were on fire and a bunch of clowns are partying in the den and they laugh when you try to tell them it's burning. You see the smoke, shove their noses in the ashes of ruined possesions, and they still laugh.
They do it just to piss us off and unfortunately we take the bait over and over again. It's got to be a kind of emotional masochism on their part. It's like walking into a bar where you know you're going to get your ass kicked. But you go back every night. I don't get it.

JWM

574 Ann  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:30:13pm

#569 Bubble Girl

Criminey! I will stop at Church tomorrow for some Holy Water!

I never tried to drink that stuff. I was raised Catholic, so it's a problem for me. Still...

575 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:30:59pm

Dang! Is there a full moon somewhere tonight?

Wowza!

/EW1(SG)

576 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:31:23pm

#572 Bubble Girl
chinkclink!

577 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:33:05pm

573 JWM

i was thinking about it too.. just what are they really up too? Canukstan, you know it's trying to get everyone to bash Canadians..

Pini... this cat is probably in his fifties.. and has an agenda..

578 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:34:25pm

574 Ann

Catholic.. Lapsed... Ex-Communicated if they can ever catch me

:D

579 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:35:51pm

#570 reaganite

Hey stealth and smarts do go together you know.

580 gonzo  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:38:58pm

C'mon guys, Piniella is simply a sociopath. It has a narcisitic worldview with just enough racism to support its over-inflated opinion of itself.

Pini comes on and I immediately start laughing because I see scrotal inflation dude trying to be taken seriously.

581 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:39:32pm

#579 LGF Live Blogging

Hey stealth and smarts do go together you know.

Seems so...

582 Ann  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:39:47pm

#578 Bubble Girl

Ex-Communicated if they can ever catch me

I'm running, too!

583 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:41:52pm

BG@577:
So the pinhead claims. The other night it made a comment about the draft- something to the effect that they were taking the first two hundred and some in the lottery the year he was eligible. I was up for the lottery with a 1A card in '71, and if I remember right they only took the first one hundred birthdays. I was well into the two hundred eighties. I smelled some BS there, but I haven't taken the time to search out the info. I don't think they ever drafted that great of a percentage of those eligible.
JWM

584 Earth2moonbat  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:42:25pm

#578 Bubble Girl

Ex-Communicated if they can ever catch me

Is that one of those Fr. Wile E. Coyote chasing the Road Runner things?

585 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:42:33pm

#573 JWM

Yes, there seems to be something wrong with them on a number of levels. First, liberalism is a mental disease (seriously, stupidity doesn't suffice as an explanation as to why people believe that the US is the source of the world's problems and that we somehow deserve things like 9/11). Second, they do seem to enjoy yanking others' chains (almost a 7th grade emotional level in the delight they seem to get from it). Third, as you say, they keep coming back for more, even though they start out yanking chains then end up getting verbally beaten to a pulp almost every time. Strange, indeed.

586 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:44:36pm

582 Ann

You should have read the thread where two posters and I were talking about our Catholic School days, and who had the worst nuns.

We will be having a Dodgeball Challenge to decide the winner.

587 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:47:23pm
 #583

jwm  7/28/2005 08:41PM PDT
BG@577:
So the pinhead claims. The other night it made a comment about the draft- something to the effect that they were taking the first two hundred and some in the lottery the year he was eligible. I was up for the lottery with a 1A card in '71, and if I remember right they only took the first one hundred birthdays. I was well into the two hundred eighties. I smelled some BS there, but I haven't taken the time to search out the info. I don't think they ever drafted that great of a percentage of those eligible.
JWM

I saw that too. And it was possible. Wasn't by county? If you lived in a big city then there were more guys eligible so the number didn't go as high as the ones who lived in small towns in counties that had less guys eligible for the draft.

I know some men whose numbers were just like his. Same scenario, that is why I think he is from a small town. Originally.

588 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:47:47pm

#580 gonzo

Perfect! If you aren't there next time I see him, mind if I borrow and paraphrase that "scrotal inflation dude trying to be taken seriously" line? (be even better if I could link to a picture, will have to check if zombie's site allows for that).

589 SwampWoman  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:49:34pm

Hey, Sarah D, Ann, Reaganite, EW1!

Waving wildly from Florida.

Y'all be good!

/Yeah, right.

590 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:49:35pm
 #584

Earth2moonbat  7/28/2005 08:42PM PDT
#578 Bubble Girl

Ex-Communicated if they can ever catch me


Is that one of those Fr. Wile E. Coyote chasing the Road Runner things?

LOL... ahunh! LOL... I read your post about your meeting with the women... you should slum and work a bachelorette party, you will be shocked!

591 Geepers  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:50:05pm

Geez, what a lame flame thread. I kept reading up looking for the fireworks and all I got were damp Black Cats and sparklers.

LGF just ain't what it used to be. ;-Þ

592 gonzo  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:50:52pm

#588 Christheprofessor

Sure. But just so you know, that will act as an "ego-inflation device " for me...;)

593 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:52:21pm

585 Chris

Yes, chain yanking...

Pini is that and something more... a vendetta.. obsessed.. and he is in his fifties... an old Liberal. He said Kerry did not lie at the Winter Soldier Testimony.

He needs his a@# kicked.

594 SwampWoman  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:52:27pm

#591 Geepers

Geez, what a lame flame thread. I kept reading up looking for the fireworks and all I got were damp Black Cats and sparklers.

LGF just ain't what it used to be. ;-Þ

Blame it on the nanny state because we can't have cherry bombs and rockets any more.

595 jwm  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:53:58pm

Open thread is up. Final note on trolls: on c-turds profile there's a comment on the size of his penis. I'm not kidding.
JWM

596 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:54:22pm

#565 reaganite:

Is that why you were the only one wearing a tie?

After all the flak I took in Tejas about my tacky shirts?

/EW1

597 Geepers  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:55:33pm

Hey, Sarah D, Ann, Reaganite, EW1!

Waving wildly from Ohio.

Y'all be good!

/Stealing off SwampWoman.

598 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:56:39pm

#596 LGF Live Blogging
Are you getting hit with this storm like we are? There's a river running through my yard!

599 reaganite  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:57:45pm

#597 Geepers
It's a shame you couldn't make it.

600 christheprofessor  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:58:13pm

#592 Gonzo

Thanks. If I remember too, I'll give you credit should I use it...

#593 Bubbles

He really said that? What a maroon. Kerry is so demonstrably full of shit that he gives off noxious fumes. Piney must be further gone than I realized...

601 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:58:38pm

#589 Swampwoman:

Waving wildly from Florida.

Waving wildly back!

/EW1

602 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 6:58:45pm

@593 BG

I'll be glad to help.
I've got a nice quarter horse gelding who has a hell of a back kick. :)

603 Ann  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:01:07pm

#589 SwampWoman

Waves back! Wish you were here!

We are all going to shoot a Barrett tomorrow, and I really don't want to be tired and hungover for it. But I will be!

Goodnight!

Goodnight, BG!

604 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:03:21pm

602 Quark

Excellent!

605 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:03:44pm

#598 reaganite

The lightning is kick ass! We're watching from the balcony!

Awesome!

/Sarah D.

606 Geepers  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:03:50pm

reaganite (#599),

Thanks bud.

I really wanted to. Lots of great people there. I bet it's going to be a blast, ya crazy bastid. ;-)

Drinking a beer in your honor.

607 LGF Live Blogging  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:13:13pm

Power out at the mall here. Lightning is awesome!

And Grolsch still sucks.

/Sarah D.

608 Bubble Girl  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:16:34pm

You people have that stuff falling out of the sky? You know, the wet stuff? Out here we have Old Wives Tales about a time when water fell from the skies and wet the ground. Things grew.. green things..

609 quark2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 7:32:37pm

@607 LFG Live Blogging

And Grolsch still sucks.

Well don't drink them then, send them on down here to Texas. :)

610 carridine  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 8:17:52pm

It takes a while, but even Muslims respond to the Glory of God. Christ wasn't lying, He promised to return 'in the Glory of the Father', and that's just what He did, returning May 23, 1844 to lead humanity to a higher level of development.

According to Michael Yon, even foreign jihadis are choosing personal freedom to choose, rather than accept Islamofascist dictates that they strap on a splodey-belt and meander into a crowd of Iraqi children.

There's hope...

611 gonzo  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 8:25:15pm

#610 carridine

He promised to return 'in the Glory of the Father', and that's just what He did, returning May 23, 1844 to lead humanity to a higher level of development.

And what? Left six years later on July 9, 1850, to the sounds of gunfire? And got an incomplete on his project?

612 Dianna  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 8:32:59pm

Carridine, are you a Jehovah's Witness?

No, that can't be, because their date of return was later...and when it didn't happen, they changed it to even later, then postponed it indefinitely.

Are you a Mormon offshoot?

613 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 9:09:31pm

#607 LFG Live Blogging/AKA Sarah D.

I emailed you the nekkid thread..don't look at it till you get back home; photos can induce nausea...I posted that you were on your way to noodge Reaganite and Ann, as a nekkid tread without you just ain't the same. Uh, better look at it after Kiddo goes to sleep...do the words Berkeley nutjobs on parade mean anything, photos by Zombie? It was quite an edumacation.

Have a blast, and kiss Reaganite for me.

I am off to sleep..going to see the 5 year old in the AM.

G'nite, all!

Have a blast, Sarah D., and try to keep your clothes on. :)

Mazel tov to Reaganite!

614 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 9:15:45pm

#593 Bubble Girl

On Zomgie's thread, wasnt that pinhead with the, um,very visible scrotum problem? :)

Doesn't he hold the patent (no, I mean the patent..stop that giggling!) to the scrotum enhancer?

G'nite, all, again! This time I mean it.

615 i4cu2  Thu, Jul 28, 2005 9:22:17pm

#200 Went to the site you gave and am appalled. Most of the people on the board seem to think they are moderates. If the average muslim in the UK is represented by that site, we are all in trouble.

It is said on the site several times that they moved to the UK and now the UK must eventually become muslim. parasites

In all the bickering on this thread about trusting what a moderate muslim says or not trusting I would have to say don't trust. I pray that muslims can and will become moderate but how can they? Their beliefs say the whole world must become muslim, it is a dictate of their religion.

616 Miss Trixie  Fri, Jul 29, 2005 3:28:01am

OT OT OT OT OT OT OT OT!

I'm listening to an internet connection of a British talk radio.

Apparently, police are raiding an apartment in Notting Hill. Gas masks, flack jacket, riot gear are deployed. One person arrested and six explosions.

Suspected bomber is in the flat.

Unconfirmed reports of gunfire. Early stages of an armed operation.

Listen!

Scroll and click on LBC 1152 AM's 20 Kbps connection.

A bomb had gone off and there is more gunfire. Persons inside are not responding to police. Stun grenades have been used.

Bloody hell! You must hear what's going on! I can hear the cops screaming at the suspects!

617 HVT  Fri, Jul 29, 2005 4:58:32am
The excuse in all the above cases was the war in Iraq, but let us not forget that in September 2001, long before Iraq, Osama Bin Laden proudly announced that he ordered the killing of some 3,000 in the United States, in the name of avenging Islam. Let us not forget that the killing began a long time before the invasion of Iraq.

More importantly, let us not forget that Saddam had absolutely NOTHING to do with 9-11, but that lie was still successfully foisted on a large perecentage of the American public, who still believe it to this day.

618 Smit  Fri, Jul 29, 2005 5:34:06am

#612 Dianna - I believe Carradine is a member of the Bahai faith, but he has not confirmed this to my knowledge.

#617 HVT - You think the level of Saddam's involvement in 9/11 is more important than binLaden's declaration of war on us?

619 Rose  Fri, Jul 29, 2005 6:28:34pm

Excellant read
However I have to remind myself daily not to condemn all Muslims.
We should all by now, be aware of the fate of those who speak out against Islam and need to remember what 'Whistle blowers' suffer in our own society when they expose corruption and problems within the work place.
No difference except that with Islam it is death.

620 Rose  Fri, Jul 29, 2005 6:28:35pm

Excellant read
However I have to remind myself daily not to condemn all Muslims.
We should all by now, be aware of the fate of those who speak out against Islam and need to remember what 'Whistle blowers' suffer in our own society when they expose corruption and problems within the work place.
No difference except that with Islam it is death.


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