Tancredo calls it like it is.

How do they get away with this sh*t and still get called a "civil rights" organization in the MSM? Its enough to make you puke.

Time to "Lets Roll" on CAIR!

Heh

Hey CAIR FOAD ok?

those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on 9/11

Just happened to crash, good f*cking grief.

(The crescent itself has no religious significance in Islam, but is commonly associated with that faith.)

They had to throw that in, of course...

No, no! Let them TALK! This is exactly the sort of statement that NEEDS to be heard by every living American! Pretty soon they'll be saying things that will even make Terezzza say, "Now why didn't I say that?"

"The Magen David is commenly associated with Judeism, but has nothing to do with that faith"

They did seem to mention some blogs, I don't think they meant us. ;)

Extremist and anti-Muslim Internet bloggers have associated the design's semi- circular shape with Islam

Bastards. Tie them to the trees.

Perhaps the Council should pass away (context free, of course)...

Like, the memorial for buildings that collapsed...

Awad added that CAIR is only challenging Tancredo's implicit linkage between the faith of Islam and terrorism, and will respect whatever the victims' families believe is an appropriate design for the memorial.

Gosh, how could anyone come to the conclusion that there is a link between Islam and terrorism?
/s

(The crescent itself has no religious significance in Islam, but is commonly associated with that faith.)

other items commonly associated with Islam...Mass murder, total disregard for human life, religious intolerance, racial, ethnic and gender intolerance.

If we played this PC BS during WWII we would be speaking German or Japanese now. F**k the PC bulls**t and call a spade a spade. Like Bush said, "you're either wth us or against us". I suspect they are not with us? Ya think? DUH!

And people actually believe this shit? Taqiya, thy name is CAIR.
Sub-human bastard scumbags.

Yeah, let's string them up!

America, f*** yeah! Iraq and Roll! Hi-tech GI Joes!

Well, it did just happen to crash in a mishap of sorts. you see, we all need to understand that there were some Muslim youths on board who were engaged in some rather intense "personal striving" when some rather obtuse and insensitive macho men from the back of the plane interrupted it, which caused the plane to crash.

It was a missed opportunity for the passengers of the flight to "embrace" the personal striving of these young men and thereby learn fron the experience rather than die in a plane accident.

/CAIR approved apologist narrative

"Extremist and anti-Muslim Internet bloggers have associated the design's semi- circular shape with Islam."

I got a circular shape for 'em called Louisville slugger...

These CAIR-heads should (to borrow a phrase I just heard on a Friends rerun) JUTOAAD!

_{/Jump Up Their Own Asses And Die}

Tancredo’s assessment is right on track. Allowing such a memorial would only bolster their effort to make the west a Muslim stronghold.

We should take the same stand against Muslims in the U.S. as they have in Australia; and that is (paraphrase) 'if you have no intention to assimilate into our culture, get out'.

Yes, and although the swastika has no political significance in National Socialism, but is commonly associated with that ideology.

/cynicism

How ridiculous can CAIR get?

Tancredo is on radio and TV all the time, plus visits to, ahem, New Hampshire and Iowa for political speeches, as well as public appearances all around the country helping political candidates and issues. The guy gets more media attention than almost any other member of the House.

Ibrahim Hooper would give his favorite prayer rug to have half the press time Tancredo gets.

Yeah, it's a cynical political ploy to expose extreme islam for what it really is. But CAIR will have no part of that. They also meant to replace "those" with "zionists."

Please note: comments advocating violence will be deleted.

I would like to order one "small" Clue Bat from the LGF Store, same to be applied liberally about the head and shoulders of CAIR.

"a memorial to those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on 9/11."

That's an telling quote from CAIR, it looks as if they're trying to re-write history. 1) Apparently CAIR thinks [or wants us to think] the memorial is to everyone who died on that jet, including, presumably, the hijackers. 2) The "plane" crashed in Pennslyvania on 9/11, apparently by coincidence, misfortune or some act of God. No indication that four Muslim hijackers deliberately slammed the jet into the ground at 580mph.

What a sleazy nest of slugs.

Sorry Charles,

Your right...

#25

Sorry Charles

Caustic sarcasm gets a bit heated at times. Please forgive.

I think it's time to let the Muslim fundamentalists know that we have the power to eliminate them from the face of the earth. We have used that power in the past and we have not ruled it's future use out of the equation. It trumps head-chopping everytime it has been used. Allah Snackbar my ass!

CAIR also called on state and national leaders of the Republican Party, including President Bush, to repudiate Tancredo's Islamophobic stance on the memorial issue.

So - not wanting to celebrate the murderers is now considered "Islamophobic".

okay.

#25 Charles,

Noted. (goes over and kicks chair)

Would it help if we contacted our state representatives over the disgust of this selection - it is a National Monument, supposedly designed to attract the public and if enough outrage is out there and strong enough - us/public may refuse to visit the site as the design currently is.

I know I'll refuse to visit it, if nothing else for lack of desire to hurl!

Why the hell doesn't the politically correct apply to something patriotic!

Charles, you ought to have an update with a link to the article with the comments that CAIR is responding to:

Tancredo in Washington Post: Crescent must go

Rep. Tom Tancredo, a Republican, says the design, called "Crescent of Embrace," could invite "controversy and criticism." In a letter sent Tuesday to National Park Service Director Fran Mainella, Tancredo said many have questioned the shape "because of the crescent's prominent use as a symbol in Islam _ and the fact that the hijackers were radical Islamists."

# 25 Charles

Someday, Charles, we may not have a choice.

Please remember that our Founding Fathers "advocated violence" against the British Crown.

Don't you just appreciate their whirled peas speechifying?
They are almost as good as the [bigoted word]s at buying new rope.

Anyone care to guess who they are talking about when they refer to "those aboard"...

#32 AngryAmerican

I guess you didn't get the memo. We can't offend the muslims in our midst because they might take offense and cause us harm.

/s

Can we start demonstrating somewhere? We have to do more than send e-mails and blog. We need focus.

those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on

Hmmm. Just the other day I watched video of the Palestinians and certain Arabs celebrate upon learning the news of the Twin Towers.

In my heart, I don't believe that Muslims are cabable of "sympathy" for anyone else other than Muslims. And I don't believe they understand the meaning of remorse. Nor do they care to learn.

Quark,

They are almost as good as the [bigoted word]s at buying new rope.

They aren't buying the rope, the MSM and the LLL are giving it away to them.

#32

May I suggest here?

Council on American-Islamic Relations
453 New Jersey Avenue, S.E.
Washington, DC 20003

I would imagine that CAIR is also a little of the fearful side, especially if bloggers along with others are influential in getting that memorial changed.

Can we buy them some real big shovels sos they can dig their holes even bigger?

Sorry

#38

Ooh ooh, word of the controversy has reached the White House! AP reporters asked at the WH, but didn't get an answer -- but at least that means that the White House is now aware of the controversy!

White House refuses comment on Crescent controversy.

Associated Press

The Republican lawmaker thinks the design called "Crescent of Embrace" could be a problem because of the crescent's use as a symbol in Islam. The hijackers were Muslim.

The Council on American-Islamic Relations says Tancredo's comments are, "a cynical political ploy designed to gain national attention." It's calling on President Bush and other Republican leaders to repudiate them.

The White House isn't commenting.

I assume that means that AP asked, and got a "no comment" in reply.

It's a start!

#25 Charles

Please note: comments advocating violence will be deleted.

Another reason why Charles would make a lousy imam...

#39 Revelator,

I'd take that further. The jihadis have no sympathy for anyone. Killing anyone - Moslems included - to achieve their aim is not only fine but worthy of celebration. The term "death cult" is not too strong for the jihadi insects. Organizations like CAIR seem to think that either a) such appeasing words will protect THEM from the jihadis or b) that we're all too stupid to see the blatant lie. My only problem is I'm not sure which of these it is.

Incidentally, the sons of Allah got some bad press today, and CAIR may be working on a little distraction action.

Fired Principal Awarded $788,000

A Superior Court jury has ordered the Islamic Society of Orange County and two of its officials to pay the former principal of its elementary school nearly $800,000, agreeing that they discriminated against her when she was fired two years ago.

Zakiyyah Muhammad, an African American woman who converted to Islam, was fired after serving five years as principal of the Orange Crescent School in Garden Grove. [...]

The council warned that the matter could widen a rift between immigrant and U.S.-born Muslims and "invariably be seen as proof that immigrant Muslim communities look at African American Muslims as their inferiors."

CAIR: CO Rep's 'Crescent' Comments a Ploy to Gain Publicity
GOP Leaders Urged to Repudiate Tancredo's Islamophobic Views

My comments so there is NO misunderstanding...

Islam is from SATAN PERIOD

Mohammed was a mass butchering child molesting demonic filled genocidal maniac.
mOHAMMED AND all MUSLIMS want only one thing
EVERY ONE ELSE DEAD..

Also Islam is RACIST as muslims cant stand the Jews Gods people

You cant stand it that WE arent gfoing to take this islamic shit any longer. WE WILL FIGHT and BURY your stinking koran in PORK where it BELONGS...

CAIR: CO Rep's 'Crescent' Comments a Ploy to Gain PublicityGOP Leaders Urged to Repudiate Tancredo's Islamophobic Views

Yea Bite me ... ISLAM SUCKS...
ISLAM IS FROM THE DEVIL

CAIR also called on state and national leaders of the Republican Party, including President Bush, to repudiate Tancredo's Islamophobic stance on the memorial issue.

Islam is the SOURCE OF ALL TERRORISM...wel ok 99.138% according to the latest death tolls committed bvy Muslim mass murders..

Cair doent like it when WE FIGHT BACK

SCREW ISLAM

(The crescent itself has no religious significance in Islam, but is commonly associated with that faith.)

The Image fits islam

Yep a CIRCLE of blood broken by the victims relatives dragging their children to be buried after muslims slaughtered them...

said CAIR Executive Director Nihad Awad.
"He apparently believes he can only gain attention on the national political stage by fabricating a false controversy based on bizarre Internet conspiracy theories

How about 20 MUSLIMS slamming the aircraft into buildings..
How about 1400 Suicide bombers
How about the MASS rape in the SUDAN done by the lovers of the child molesting Mohammed the PIG...

@39 revelator

Remorse is not in their makeup. For a people who can murder their own without a blink of the eye, there's never any remorse for the ill they do to others not of their kind.
Remorse and sympathy are alien to them.

He's making noise, maybe a little support would help him...

[Link: tancredo.house.gov...]

Update-worthy:

Article in the Tribune-Democrat has UNIQUE details on the Tancredo letter!

In a letter sent Tuesday to National Park Service Director Fran Mainella, U.S. Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo., said the crescent shape could invite controversy and criticism.

“Regardless of whether or not the invocation of a Muslim symbol by the memorial designer was intentional, it seems such a symbol is unsuitable for paying appropriate tribute to the heroes of Flight 93 or the ensuing American struggle against radical Islam that their last historic act and the ‘Let’s Roll’ effort has come to symbolize,” Tancredo wrote.

A copy of the letter was obtained by The Tribune-Democrat.

“I hope that you will reject this recommended design, and urge the committee to select a more appropriate design,” Tancredo wrote.
...
“There are obvious concerns in having a major symbol of Islam as part of a 9/11 memorial,” Tancredo spokesman Will Adams said in a telephone interview from Washington.

“The memorial should focus on the heroic acts of the passengers of Flight 93 who stopped fundamentalist Muslim terrorists.”

Tell it, baby!

#25 Charles

Noted. It is very difficult to watch reminders of 9/11 and contain anger considering todays political climate. I, for one, will do my best. You need to explain to my dog & cat why I have so much pent up anger. I hope they understand. Somehow I think they will understand more that the islamofacists. After all they have feelings.

/s

Thanks Charles for the opportunity to vent.

#44 zombie,

Interesting. Note the AP's use of the word "hijacker" as if they where going to take the planes to Havanna.

CAIR - FOS

Text of Tancredo Letter

The Honorable Fran Mainella
Director
National Park Service
U.S. Department of Interior
1849 C Street NW
Washington, DC 20240

Dear Director Mainella,

I am writing in reference to the recently unveiled design to commemorate the victims of Flight 93, which crashed in Pennsylvania on Sept ember 11. The final design for the memorial recently received preliminary approval from the 15-member selection committee.

As you know, the design for the memorial is called "Crescent of Embrace," and was created by Paul Murdoch Architecture. The appropriateness of the design has been questioned by many people because of the crescent's prominent use as a symbol in Islam — and the fact that the hijackers were radical Islamists. Indeed, it has raised questions in some circles about whether the design, if constructed, will in fact make the memorial a tribute to the hijackers rather than the victims whose mission the flight's passengers helped to thwart. The architect has stated that the crescent design is meant to be a symbolic circle — broken by the path of Flight 93.

Nonetheless, the memorial is a powerful symbol for the whole nation and a testament to the courage and will of the passengers of the flight. That said, it seems to me that the Department ought to direct the committee to choose a different design rather than moving forward with a design that could make the memorial a flashpoint for controversy and criticism.

Regardless of whether or not the invocation of a Muslim symbol by the memorial designer was intentional or not, it seems that such a symbol is unsuitable for paying appropriate tribute to the heroes of Flight 93 or the ensuing American struggle against radical Islam that their last historic act and the "Let's Roll" effort has come to symbolize.

I hope that you will reject this recommended design, and urge the committee to select a more appropriate design.

Sincerely,

Tom Tancredo, M.C

I'm just starting to think about this: why not leave the design as-is. As a symbol, to remind us just who did this to us. In fact, we could redesign it even further, maybe add a few Quranic verses regarding, you know, killing the infidel wherever you find him, that sort of thing. Dress it up, make it stand out even more. Just change the damn name. Crescent of Satanic Death-worship, maybe.

I like this idea as much as the (somewhere recently) proposed "Communist Holocaust Museum" right in the middle of DC, commemorating the deaths of a hundred million innocents over less than a hundred years, by Pol Pot, Hitler, Stalin.

-Taq

OT, but while the enemy, CAIR, gets the oh so PC LLL morons to fall for their crap, this is what Israel, who the f*ing IRC has not allowed to join since dot, now gives Israel as a choice (ah, but the same red crescent, the symbol of the cult of islam that they are trying to use in the memorial for Flight 93 is OK) Magen David Adom to be 'crystalized'

If Israel agres to this, then it is tragic. The IRC is not worth spit. The Red Cross here is not much better. I would love to know what happened to then moneys from 9/11, etc., and the blood donations, etc.

A red diamond-shaped emblem called a "crystal" into which a red Star of David is inserted may be approved by a majority of the 191 countries who are members in the International Red Cross Movement and the national societies before the end of this year.

Late last night, diplomatic representatives of 123 countries were meeting at a "pre-conference" in Bern to tell the Swiss government whether they would approve recognition of a neutral symbol, in addition to the Red Cross and the Red Crescent, that would give legitimacy to other countries' first-aid, ambulance and blood supply societies.

Most eager is Magen David Adom, which has observer status and has been waiting for decades for full membership.

Dr. Noam Yifrach, chairman of MDA's executive board, told The Jerusalem Post in an interview Tuesday that the Swiss government had initially insisted that the decision by participating countries be unanimous. "But they have backed down, after it was made clear to them that if the Red Cross itself were put up to a vote today, it would not be unanimous."

Yifrach said he was "more optimistic now about us getting full membership than any time in the past."

The proposed four-sided shape is officially called a "crystal," as some countries objected to its being referred to as a "diamond" on the grounds that this recalled African slaves working in diamond mines, Yifrach said.

If the Swiss government finds that a majority of the countries are willing to vote for the crystal emblem at a diplomatic convention in October, such a vote would be followed by approval by member organizations from around the world who comprise the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies.

Yifrach says that if it reaches this stage, he is sure that the proposal will pass, because "we have near unanimous backing among member organizations, including the Egyptian, Jordanian and Palestinian Red Crescent organizations."

Israel's Foreign Ministry has sent representatives to persuade the governments to voice their support at the Bern meeting.

He recently took England-based Israeli magician Uri Geller, who is president of MDA's Israeli Friends organization, to see the Swiss foreign minister in Bern. Geller told him he felt that if a diplomatic conference is indeed held at the end of next month, it will be a success. Geller has not, however, used his spoon-bending powers to persuade member countries.

If the crystal emblem is approved, Israel will receive not only prestige as a full-fledged member of the International Red Cross movement, but its annual funding will be increased beyond its current $1.5 million.

In addition, Israelis from MDA will be able to ask to go to any country where their help is needed – including those where persecuted Jews need to be rescued or imprisoned Jews need to be visited – and receive immunity from being attacked when they hoist their red Star of David embedded in the crystal emblem...

see rest of article.

Israel should not allow the symbol of Judaism to be spit on. It is not worth it. MDA is doing a Sharon, IMHO.

E-mail all of your government officials. You can find a list here

[Link: www.congress.org...]

Make sure you email both of your senators and the House Members in your area. Just enter your Zip Code for the complete list.

#13 nuke gingrich

Islam is associated with terrorism? What the heck are you talking about? The only terrorists I know of are the Zionist Americans and their military. I know because I used to serve and we constantly raped and pillaged just for our radical Christian ideology.

/sarc

FOAD CAIR

Wake the H#ll up America
Great, now I have to go to bed pissed...

#58

Yeah, Boxer & Fine-stine, damn, I got a chance.

WorldNetDaily jumps in with a good article featuring another juicy Tancredo quote:

"It has raised questions in some circles about whether the design, if constructed, will in fact make the memorial a tribute to the hijackers rather than the victims whose mission the flight's passengers helped to thwart," wrote Tancredo in a letter to Fran Mainella, director of the National Park Service.

OK, now we know at least ONE congressman is paying attention to the blogosphere -- particularly Real Clear Politics, Little Green Footballs, and/or Michelle Malkin, who were the first three to really bring attention to this. Tancredo repeats essentially verbatim the memes first voiced here.

This is a taste of what Kos get to savor all the time -- being able to drive the debate because the media follows your lead.

Every minute of every day we are in a struggle for the Mind of America.

Never rest!

CAIR can't have it both ways. They went ballistic over the BC cartoon with the moon on the outhouse door. Now to mention a "crescent of embrace" with a copse of trees where the star would be as a symbol of Islam is a "cynical political ploy." Either the crescent is or is not the Symbol of Islam they don't get to choose when it is applicable.

I am going to go and calm down now, maybe a little target practice, followed by a ham sandwich a glass of beer, a bed time read on the History of the Crusades. Yep that'll make me feel better.

#61 zombie

Amen! Amen!

#55 Branda

Thanks for posting that letter. Tancredo is going to be savaged by the MSM for it, watch for editorials denouncing him in the NY Times, LA Times, WaPo and the networks.
He's going to need all the support we can muster.

CAIR Executive Director Nihad Awad [said] "He apparently believes he can only gain attention on the national political stage by fabricating a false controversy based on bizarre Internet conspiracy theories."

I'm waiting for CAIR's disavowal of various Muslim-nutjob conspiracy theories, e.g. the Twin Towers' collapse was a demolition job, or how 4000 Joos stayed home from work that day. By all means CAIR, let the debunking of bizarre conspiracy theories begin.

/crickets

Just a plane that crashed? I'd like to tie Ibrahim Hooper to a stump in a pasture, coat him with honey and turn loose a flock of starving ewes. Bastards.

Whomever did that global aerial view that shows the crescent pointing to Mecca is hilarious.

Was that just an incredible coincidence?

The other interesting use of the crescent is that the coat of arms of Christians in the Balkans use the crescent as a symbol of battle and victory with Turkish Muslims.

So you could look at the use of the crescent in Shanksville as symbolic of a victory over Muslims. However, the Muslim hijackers were Arabs and the Arabs don't appear to have any historical connection to the use of the crescent as a symbol.

#65 religion of bacon: I'm sure that CAIR gets the Al Jazeera sat feed. Yosri Fouda, A.J. correspondent, interviewed KSM and Ramzi Bin al-Shib where they admitted to the attack and described the planning process in May 2002.

Whether or not the damnable desin is an official symbol of Islam, it is not just inappropriate, it is outrageous!

CAIR is a fraud, and a dangerous element in our society.

Dogpile!

Here is the email address of Fran Mainella, the Director of the National Park Service to whom Tancredo addressed his letter:

Fran_Mainella@nps.gov

or

Director_Mainella@nps.gov

Both emails work. Please add your voice to Tancredo's. Let her know that the design is extremely unpopular.

But be polite!

Time to start a pool on when dipshits such as Ibrahim Hooper and that other spokesman,fat blob, need massive amounts of dental surgery to correct trauma suffered as a result of collisions with clenched hands.

And shame on Yahoo for publishing this tripe.

#70

Ahnolds got more than a boat load of shit coming at him right now from the Dems...He will have no time for this, sorry to say.

Has anybody called the ACLU to see if we can get an injunction against building this religious symbol in a public park? Anybody here still a member?

Hell, what do you expect from these apologist mouthpieces? I mean, is anyone here really surprised at any of this?

CAIR's entire reason for existing is to:

spin everything so as to blunt any criticism of Islam and Muslims,

to use the freedom of speech which they have in this country to undermine the rest of us,

to constantly try to intimidate the opponents of Islamic fascism through attacks on their credentials, hysterical accusations of discrimination, threats of lawsuits, etc.,

to achieve mainstream legitimacy for their cult,

to lull us to sleep with their protestations of how peace-loving Muslims are,

to turn public opinion against Israel,

and yadda, yadda, yadda.

This crap is par for the course.

"...a memorial to those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on 9/11..."

The more I read that sentence the more pissed off I get. It's not even Flight 93, it's "a plane".

[Yeah, it's a plane that crashed while something was going on in Manhattan and at the Pentagon. It happened in Pennsylvania and now here's this Islamophobic Congressman trying to make a big deal about a memorial to a plane crash.]

/channeling CAIR

wow. ".. a plane that crashed on 9-11". now for a non-judgemental headline i'd like to read: " Mecca suffers nuclear mishap at American hands. U.S. says more hijinx to come."

Any doubt about the crescent shape being a symbol of Islam, can be disspelled easily. The crescent moon is the traditional symbol for the end of ramadan. In 1684-5, when King Leopolds' french army(go figure) defeated the Turk's near Vienna, it marked the end of the second great jihad. In celebration of the victory, the cook's for the french army were instructed to bake the loaves of bread in the shape of the crescent's on the captured Turk battle flag's. Thusly, we have the croissant, an enduring symbol of a mocking gesture, to islam. In my mind, to tolerate anything that resembles the crescent, at the memorial to the tragic heroism of the passenger's of flight 93, is an insult to their memory, and mock's us as a nation.

If we can get the crescent design scrapped, this could be a great symbolic setback for CAIR and others. The dhimmis fight back.

#68 Axiom

You're underestimating the power of Islamic cognitive dissonance and taqqiyeh. Hell, Osama himself praised the 9/11 attackers, and Mohammed Atta is held as a near-god among many Muslims. But at the same time, the whole thing was an inside CIA / Mossad plot to set the warmongering Christians and Jooos against the peaceful, spiritual Muslims. Suuure, that makes sense...

Bald-faced, jaw-dropping bullsh***ing appears to be a high art form in the Islamic world. Mix that with a Bush-hating Western media and a bunch of lefties who are more into feelings than logic, and you've got a scary combination.

# 25 Charles

Please note: comments advocating violence will be deleted.

That could be a bit difficult, sir.

For example, I believe that peace is a good thing, but history has shown that real peace can only be achieved over the dead bodies of would-be conquerers. So the advocacy of peace is in effect the advocacy of lethal violence.

The el-cubo moonbats on the other hand believe that peace is brought about over the dead bodies of those who raise their own hand in self-defense or in the defense of others.

I want to see the restoration of peace, and if CAIR or any jihadist-huggers have an issue with that, well that's really too bad.

Well, here I am again, late to a thread (had to figure out how to obtain world peace, democracy and capitalism on other threads) and at the risk of being considered genuinely stooopid, I don't understand Charles' comment about how they describe the passengers on Flight 93; the aricle says: "Awad added that CAIR is only challenging Tancredo's implicit linkage between the faith of Islam and terrorism, and will respect whatever the victims' families believe is an appropriate design for the memorial."
The only description I picked up was the "victims" families.
What am I missing here?

The new book Fighting Immigration Anarchy has a full chapter about Tancredo, 38 pages. Highly recommended.

#17 Tantraman

"Yeah, let's string them up!

America, f*** yeah! Iraq and Roll! Hi-tech GI Joes!"

Very funny. Frickin moby.

Please stick your head up your ass, then firmly stick your ass in the sand.

realwest

Check the portion bolded by Charles:

"...a memorial to those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on 9/11..."

The plane just... crashed. Y'know, one of those unfortunate accidents. No mention of terrorists, hijacking, etc.

The planned Flight 93 Memorial will have a tough time in PA, especially rural PA. Been a resident here my whole life. They want to place this insult in the heart of a deer hunting, patriotic farming county. No way. Still lots of flags flying here in remembrance of all our heroes. This is not moonbat territory like Philly. Will keep faxing and writing to bring attention at the state level to make all aware of the insult.

A good headline would be:

Westernophobes Protest Memorial in the Shape of Giant Pig Turd where an ICBM Landed on Mecca

Just looked at Tancredo's bio page. Points in his favor:

+ he's not a lawyer (is a former teacher)
+ he's the congressman from southpark! F$%$ yeah!

Orson Buggy #88

Funny, but not quite an apt analogy, unless you're saying that a giant pig turd is a symbol of the United States.

#85 hous bin pharteen,

Thanks for the visual.

An alternative headline could be:

AMERICAN ICBM COLLIDES WITH BLACK ROCK IN ARABIAN DESERT. NO AMERICANS DIED BUT THE MISSILE WAS A COMPLETE LOSS.

Bad Penny #89

+ he's not a lawyer (is a former teacher)

What do you do for a living?

#75 Bad Penny
Has anybody called the ACLU to see if we can get an injunction against building this religious symbol in a public park? Anybody here still a member?

Good idea. I'm serious. Let's really go for it.

Here is a list of crucial email addresses we should be barraging with concise but devastating criticisms of the "Crescent of Embrace" design:

Paul Murdoch, the designer:

paul@paulmurdocharchitects.com

Fran Mainello, Director of the National Park Service:

Fran_Mainella@nps.gov

Gale Norton, Secretary of the Interior, and final arbiter of the design:

gale_norton@ios.doi.gov

ACLU (seriously -- they ought to be on our side for this):
ACLU Web contact form

I don't care that not all of these people will automatically agree with us -- we need to tell even those people who don't want to hear the message that this is a major issue.

Crank up your emailing engines;

Ready, set -- EMAIL!

#82 The Other Les

No, it's not difficult at all. It's his site, and he can delete any comment he wants to.

We all know how incredibly frustrating this situation / war is and will continue to be. Take that energy and use it to do something constructive, not to post comments that will get LGF sued or shut down. And you can get away with doing quite a bit of venting here without crossing the line to overt calls for violence.

How do they get away with this sh*t and still get called a "civil rights" organization in the MSM?

Because the MSM is 100% anti-American.

Tancredo was recently involved in a controversy over similarly Islamophobic remarks suggesting support for bombing Mecca, Islam's holiest site.

He didn't say nuke Mecca... he just said that if an object were to fall from the sky that may or may not be resposible for a bright flash and a green glow, no one should use that situation as a "cynical ploy for attention."

You know, it's time like these I wish I lived somewhere out of the city and owned a .45 Colt 1911 and could blast some shit in the back yard when I get pissed...

other items commonly associated with Islam...Mass murder, total disregard for human life, religious intolerance, racial, ethnic and gender intolerance

Victor Davis Hanson on Islam: "Take your pick of the Western agenda. Women's rights? They want to go back to the Dark Ages. Homosexual rights? They want to kill them. Democracy? They don't believe in it. Religious tolerance? You're dead if you're not a Muslim. Technology? They don't like it."

That should have read "On Islamic Terrorists." My bad.

My 101 was in reference to my 99, btw...someone jumped in between my posts.

#100

Me too.

Keep it up. Letters to editors, congress, etc. This 'Crescent' is blatant attack against America depending on our apparent ignorance. Not since 1941 has the US been held in such contempt by our enemy. And now they have American collaborators and quislings. This will not stand.

My email to Mainella:

Ms. Mainella:

On 9/11, nineteen men claiming to be acting in support of Islam hijacked four of our passenger jets and murdered over 2,500 innocent people.

Using a design which incorporates a commonly-recognized symbol of Islam, the stated motivation of those murderers, is fundamentally offensive to the freedoms we are guaranteed by the Constitution.

Tom Tancredo is right. Calling him "Islamophobic" (or whatever latest insult is in vogue) is only a weak attempt to divert attention from the bravery of the front-line responders on Flight 93.

Tancredo is right on, again!

Tancredo has been mentioned as a long shot in '08. Supposedly (according to the MSM) he blew it with the bomb someone's (un)holy sites.

His stock keeps going up in my estimation.

As a further note, the pilot of Flight 93, was a constituent of Tancredos'

#76 Amy

"spin everything so as to blunt any criticism of Islam and Muslims

to constantly try to intimidate the opponents of Islamic fascism through attacks on their credentials, hysterical accusations of discrimination, threats of lawsuits, etc.,

to achieve mainstream legitimacy for their cult, "

Wow, CAIR sounds like a bunch of Scientologists!

There are alot of pissed off people about this besides us my fellow lizards.

I was just made aware that this insult has reached the, shall we say, special operations community. They are not happy, and it is spreading very quickly. These are not gentleman you really want pissed at you.

The park service is getting angry messages from Bragg, Benning, Fort Lewis, Coronado Island, and Fort Stewart.

those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on 9/11

Whonder why it crashed? Was it a massive engine failure or some other mechanical problem. No. TERROISTS, hijacked it in the name of Islam to kill Americans!

#107 Bob with one O

Supposedly (according to the MSM) he blew it with the bomb someone's (un)holy sites.

Tancredo made the first, perhaps fumbling, effort to apply the doctrine of deterrence to a mass movement based on religion. At least among politicians, he's way ahead of the curve. All the old rules of warfare seem to have flown out the window. What do we do if the Osama-with-nukes stories are true? What does Osama / Joe Jihadi value? Who might be able to influence his / their actions?

#108 howyadoin

You've seen one cult, you've seen 'em all...

Always attack, never defend
- L. Ron Hubbard

#86 Amy - oh, that! Sorry all, but (from CAIR's point of view) it was a crash - broght on by American's attacking Muslim highjackers, but still a crash. I was expecting something in the story referring, in a denigrating fashion, to the passengers or relatives/friends of the "crash victims" and got myself a little faked out.!
Well ya know, saving the world for democracy, maintaing world peace (except with the Islofascists)and stuff like that, all in one night, no less, can get a guy tuckered out.
Night youse'all.

#104 MarcusAurelius:

Since when did letters to Congress ever acheive anything? It's all just a waste of time. Bush and the rest of the technocrats are laughing while sipping champagne.

Mr. Pharteen

Seems the redneck nation got it also...

See # 87

What's that smell?

#116

The smell of VICTORY

sniff..

#112 Religion of Bacon

Very good comment with telling qoute! One question I am always asked by my Jr. and Sr. High youth at church is how to tell if a group is a cult. Your comment illustrates a great "bench marker".

#109 pharteen (hilarious nic, btw...)

glad to hear the men in green have heard about this. they will be a huge help.

Beagle,

Letting a lesser member say something a major player could never say has it's advantage.

BTW Hope your family is well. I've been sidetracked and not here often.

OT - big carbomb in baghdad...

80 dead, 120 injured preliminary.

were they soldiers? Heck no.

they were laborers looking for construction work?

tell me again how its a religion of peace.

Just a quick observation. For a bunch of peacey lovey feely touchy folk, the design committee sure picked/designed a design that created DIVISION, DISSENT, ANGER and many other nasty feelings. I thought they wanted "healing" Do you think they're doing Zen meditations right now under their "pyramids" to cleanse themselves of all the nasty, mean vibes now directed at them? Vibes they engendered? True oat juice swilling moonbats of peace have to be gnawing themselves at both ends in schiziod paranoia over this.

#121 blue_like_jazz

Go ahead, ask him where the nic came from. We all could use a laugh right now to break the anger. I did once and am still getting a chuckle from it.

Bob with one O

Hey Bob! Long time no see.

#120 howyadoin

Just google on

characteristics of a cult

and you'll get plenty. Here's a typical list - comparisons to radical Islam are left as an exercise for the reader:

1. Members swear total allegiance to an all-powerful leader who they believe to be the Messiah.

2. Rational thought is discouraged or forbidden.

3. The cult's recruitment techniques are often deceptive.

4. The cult weakens the follower psychologically by making him or her depend upon the group to solve his or her problems.

5. The cults manipulate guilt to their advantage.

6. The cult leader makes all the career and life decision of the members.

7. Cults exist only for their own material survival and make false promises to work to improve society.

8. Cult members often work fulltime for the group for little or no pay.

9. Cult members are isolated from the outside world and any reality testing it could provide.

10. Cults are anti-woman, anti-child, and anti-family.

11. Cults are apocalyptic and believe themselves to be the remnant who will survive the soon-approaching end of the world.

12. Many cults follow an "ends justify the means" philosophy.

13. Cults, particularly in regard to their finances, are shrouded in secrecy.

14. There is frequently an aura of or potential for violence around cults.

Bubbles,

Good to see you as well. I assume no hanta virus from the cabin cleaning?

: )

#127

IS that Islam your talking about?
Or is it Weight Watchers?

;-)

Nite all! Had my dose of bad news for today. Need to catch some zzzs. Hope for a better tomorrow.

#127 Religion of Bacon

May I print this and use it with them?

I'm assuming that if a decent amount of the points apply to a group, you can safely assume it's a cult. Some of the groups I know to be cults hit several and miss on some on your list. I'm not sure I remember the Rev. Sun-ny Moon-shine ever advocting world dominace.

I think the servers are melting down my emails to Manella, Nortan and a few other are getting bounced backed.

Keep emailing, if they have to pay the IT guys OT to keep the servers up they'll definitely notice.

even CAIR can't believe it...they think we will velieve anything at this point

I mean we designed a shrine to our murderers

Bob with One O

Nope, no hantavirus yet... lots of bleach spray... so probably will die from massive chemical exposure..

:D

#123 Ed from Ohio: They put a Jihad on everyone. In a Jihad they can ignore all the normal codes of Islam.

Codes if Islam "Does not compute"

I smell smoke...damn puter!

Bubbles,

Glad to hear it, sort of.

: )

'Night all.

Did ya catch this bullshit at the end--

CAIR, America's largest Muslim civil liberties group, has 31 offices and chapters nationwide and in Canada. Its mission is to enhance understanding of Islam, encourage dialogue, protect civil liberties, empower American Muslims, and build coalitions that promote justice and mutual understanding.

--Whata lie!

WWIII=America vs islam

#132 jcm

I think the servers are melting down my emails to Manella, Nortan and a few other are getting bounced backed.

Keep emailing, if they have to pay the IT guys OT to keep the servers up they'll definitely notice.

I don't know whether to say "Drat!" or, alternately, "Excellent."

I mean, it's a pain in the ass that our emails can't get through to these people now; but since that's because we've probably overloaded their mailboxes with outraged emails, I'm glad.

Hopefully they'll be back up tomorrow, or sooner. Keep trying!

W's Thursday speech...Don't miss it.

i think cair were referring to themsleves when they spoke of cynical political motives.

they are the true face of modern evil.

OT - The wonderful people at Palestinian Media Watch (the folks who translate what the Arabs are really saying from Arabic to English for us) have an article in JPost.

It is exactly what we've all been talking about here for a long time:

The Palestinian Authority figured out a long time ago that the world loves a victim. Indeed, it has successfully seized the mantle of "victim" as the dominant message to both its people and the outside world.

Teaching its own people that Israel is the source of their suffering creates anger, hatred and a population eager to confront Israel with violence and terror. Presenting itself to the world as the perpetual victim of "Israeli aggression" creates sympathy and, often, understanding of even the most heinous forms of terrorism. Along the way, victimhood has become a dominant component of the developing Palestinian national identity.

The PA-controlled media, schoolbooks and numerous other social-educational frameworks all disseminate the victimhood narrative. By such means the PA has engaged in a wide range of hate promotion – generally called "incitement" – under the umbrella of advancing the victim myth.

PA television, for example, broadcasts "historical" movies that depict rifle-toting Zionists chasing Arabs off "Arab" land in before Israel's establishment to teach Palestinians to see themselves as permanent victims of land theft. A PA TV documentary broadcast more than 15 times in 2004 and 2005 presents all of Israel as "Palestine," stolen by the "forces of oppression" who are "still dividing up the world."

Haifa, Jaffa, the Galilee and the Negev are said to be waiting for their rightful owners to return. The Palestinians are taught to see themselves as victims simply by virtue of Israel's existence.

Israel is repeatedly accused of intentionally poisoning land, water and food. Recently the PA issued warnings not to enter Gush Katif until the land had been tested for toxins Israel may have planted in the ground. Israel is often accused of intentionally creating drug networks for Palestinians. Palestinians are said to be victims of Israeli-induced drug addictions and cancers.

Dozens of video clips depicting Israeli soldiers shooting innocent men, women and children have been broadcast many thousands of times on Palestinian Authority TV.

It a short step from such footage to broadcasting calls to murder Israelis, such as "The Muslims will kill the Jews, rejoice! Rejoice in Allah's victory... everything wants vengeance on the Jews, on these pigs on the face of the earth..." (PA TV September 10, 2004).

WE MIGHT have expected all this to end with the swearing in of Mahmoud Abbas as PA leader in January this year. Yet four months later, in June, PA TV was still broadcasting a "history" showed a crying infant shot and murdered in cold blood by actors depicting Israeli soldiers.

Similarly, when the media and even the newest of Palestinian schoolbooks cite the Protocols of the Elders of Zion as an authentic Jewish document planning Jewish world domination, they are presenting themselves as the newest victims of the demonic Jewish plot to rule the world...

This is excellent. Glad to see it in JPost.

Victims forever?

The crescent itself has no religious significance in Islam, but is commonly associated with that faith.

Funny, but from the Islamic forum hosted by Huda, it says,

[Link: islam.about.com...]

"Legend holds that the founder of the Ottoman Empire, Osman, had a dream in which the crescent moon stretched from one end of the earth to the other. Taking this as a good omen, he chose to keep the crescent and make it the symbol of his dynasty."

Well, they've got plans to add one in Pennsylvania now, on the ground where Osman's followers killed Americans. Looks like Osman was right.

Bubble Girl,

I tried to e-mail you through the LGF safe mail and something went wrong.

I just switched on my e-mail addy instead of my blog for this post.

#109
excellent news.
btw, tancredo can have my vote

Would that be that jet that crashed over the Islamic symbol in that Pennsylvania field?

What an irony that people who fought to proect our freedom would somehow crash into an Islamic memorial monument.

It must be like serendipity, or something...

I think I'll go vomit now.

Disgusting. These pigs and vermin need to be exposed and shut down.

glad to know i am an extremist...

watch out world...

oh yeah, let's see, all those on board the plane just happened to collectively get together(?borg mentallity) and say, "let's crash the plane and see what pretty shapes and colors we can make."

i listen to my dad who served in WW2 and he's simply disgusted the way our own people in this country make constant excuses for every little action we do and say. the same kind that my brother and his friends had to put up when they came back from nam. why is it when something is just plain wrong, and yes it $#%#%(& is, there is alway some group who is offended by my offendedness. when are people going to wake up and see what these people are. this deals with the simple fact they are just blinded to the truth and are nothing more than living in a neville chamberlin world, appease, appease appease until your dead. the ROP is nothing more than willing at all costs to destroy the American culture.

either your with us or your one of them!

those aboard a plane that crashed

That crashed? Well, I suppose you could say the two planes that augered themselves into the Twin Towers "crashed", couldn't you? I mean, the end result of hitting a building or solid ground from the air is termed "crashing".

What we CAIR about is what made them crash, you CAIRfully worded jihadi asshats.

Putting a big red crescent on the memorial may be all right to the blind or unenlightened, but any sighted person with half a brain should find it intolerable.

That and Arafat's tomb - I'd take a leak on either one of them.

Beagle

Thanks, I just sent it.

Am

Hitchens on the WoT:

Watching the towers fall in New York, with civilians incinerated on the planes and in the buildings, I felt something that I couldn’t analyze at first and didn’t fully grasp (partly because I was far from my family in Washington, who had a very grueling day) until the day itself was nearly over. I am only slightly embarrassed to tell you that this was a feeling of exhilaration.

Here we are then, I was thinking, in a war to the finish between everything I love and everything I hate. Fine. We will win and they will lose. A pity that we let them pick the time and place of the challenge, but we can and we will make up for that.

[Link: www.frontpagemag.com...]

Lady of Shallot

Tomorrow Hitch meets Galloway... here is a quote from his latest Slate... on Galloway..

It is rather crude... so beware...

In a recent interview he made opprobrious remarks about the state of my midriff, which I will confess has—as P.G. Wodehouse himself once phrased it—"slipped down to the mezzanine floor." In reply I do not wish to stoop. Those of us who revere the vagina are committed to defend it against the very idea that it is a mouth or has teeth. Study the photographs of Galloway from Syrian state television, however, and you will see how unwise and incautious it is for such a hideous person to resort to personal remarks. Unkind nature, which could have made a perfectly good butt out of his face, has spoiled the whole effect by taking an asshole and studding it with ill-brushed fangs.

OT

Roberts pic via Reuters

LMAO!

#152 Bubble Girl

I simply can't stop laughing. Especially about:

Unkind nature, which could have made a perfectly good butt out of his face, has spoiled the whole effect by taking an asshole and studding it with ill-brushed fangs.

This could be the debate of the century. Poor VDH -- his evisceration of Arriana will simply have to be the warm-up act!

Bubble Girl, zombie,

I'll be there with bells on. Of course, since I'm one of those barbaric Southerners, they'll have to restrain me from throwing chairs at Gormless Git Galloway, live-wrestling style...

Have at him, Hitch! Run him through!

#153 thscott
Roberts pic via Reuters
LMAO!

Now I'm in complete hysterics. That has to be the most insanely biased news photo I have ever seen. It's funny on about five different levels -- three of which are painful and ironic.

#153 thscott: What the hell? Reuters put the Isreali Flag mirrored in Roberts' eye?

j/k, but if it were AFP...

#155 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)
I'll be there

We shall require of you a most thorough ringside narrative!

153 Scott

LOL ~~ Damn! Too funny...

Been watching Roberts.. he's good.. really good.. no matter how the MSM tries to spin it!

#153 thscott

Yow, now that's a strange photo!

Something I've noticed on news programs (especially where I live) is that camera operators will be filming someone who is being interviewed for a human interest story - then, quite suddenly, the camera shot is an extreme, extreme closeup (like the photo in your link.)

I think the camera people like the color of someone's eyes or something - they just go absolutely all the way into the shot so that one or both eyes fill the entire television screen.

I think it's hideous (invasive) when they do this.

I had a chance to be interviewed about something and I declined.

It doesn't matter to me if a camera person loves or hates my eyes - I don't want someone with a 52 inch television screen having my eyeball stretched across their family room wall.

I think it looks truly stupid to do this as part of an interview on TV.

159

No Borking this time.

Perhaps Clement will go in for O'Connor.

Bubble Girl,

I'm done. Feel free to contact me again. What I sent should be helpful.

Hitch on Sheehan...

When are the bureau chiefs of our newspapers and networks going to snap out of their own vacation-induced trances and send some grown-up correspondents down to Crawford, Texas? For weeks now, Cindy Sheehan has not been asked a single question that is any tougher than "How does it feel?" The media have been acting as her megaphone. After Slate published her real opinions on politics (a weird confection of pacifism with paranoid anti-Zionism) last Monday, she was eventually asked about her statement that her son Casey had been killed in a war for Israel, and she denied ever having made it. So, we must now say that, as well as being a vulgar producer of her own spectacle, and an embarrassment to her family, Cindy Sheehan is at best a shifty fantasist.

Lady of Shallott

It is with great regret I will not be attending... I've never considered myself a groupie but Hitchens just floors me..

160

True, but I see this pic "popping" up in the future... DUmmy icons.. the usual suspects.

Beagle

Thanks, I received it and it will be extremely helpful.

Am

163

I think that Casey's grave has been danced on long enough even for the MSM... The fact that they can't put her on the network shows, for obvious reasons (insane rants that perplex etc..) nipped attention for this display in the bud.

#153 thscott
LOL!

I know that look. "If I fall asleep the professor will call on me. Must...not...fall...asleep!" I don't think I've ever seen a news photographer go for a close up quite like that one.

I've been known to do it.

Off to bed. Good Night Lizards.

Message to CAIR: Peace baby .V.. (see # 82)

OT - It's interesting that Sharon is on his way to NY (unless he's arrived already) to address the UN General Assembly.

Abbas was supposed to go, too, but he can't since his barbarians are being, well, barbaric.

The Paleos are out of control. Egypt is ticked off that thousands of Paleos rushed into Egypt - these people are going to be thrown back into Gaza.

Abbas is a complete failure.

What a surprise. :/

#168 Beagle

I hope that we see a similar look from Galloway during the debate with Hitch.

"UH OH!"

#167 thscott

I think that Casey's grave has been danced on long enough even for the MSM... The fact that they can't put her on the network shows, for obvious reasons (insane rants that perplex etc..) nipped attention for this display in the bud.

Wonderful, isn't it?

I can just imagine the MSM network producers saying at staff meetings, "Uh, no. I don't think we'll put Cindy on our program with her claims that the U.S. has been nuking Iraq."

They'd have to put subtitles under her face, saying things like, "Pay no attention to this woman. We have not nuked Iraq. She's out of her flipping mind."

#172

Exactly. When she was asked about Afghanistan, the reporter (I think it was Wolf B.) obviously thought she was out of her mind.

#170

Hopefully if the Palestinians are given enough rope, they will hang themselves properly.

#174 thscott

Hopefully if the Palestinians are given enough rope, they will hang themselves properly.

They are already a Freak Show ExtravaGaza.

Even the rest of the Arab world is shaking its head.

One of these days, I'm expecting the Arab League to try selling it to the world that these guys aren't really Arabs.

"They're really just Canaanites. We let them borrow our language..."

# 175 rightasrain

Correct. There was an editorial cartoon in today's Kuwait Times that took a pretty hard shot at Palestinians crying over their land still being 'occupied' by the rubble they just created. Heh. Those folks certainly are not respected by the majority here.

#176 Mike C

Correct. There was an editorial cartoon in today's Kuwait Times that took a pretty hard shot at Palestinians crying over their land still being 'occupied' by the rubble they just created. Heh. Those folks certainly are not respected by the majority here.

Yeah, nobody wants 'em livin' in their neighborhood.

CAIR will not even admit the cause of the crash. If CAIR is not afraid of the truth, that these people were murdered by Islamic hijackers, then why can they not bring themselves to say it? Do they dispute that this was even an act of terrorism at all? If the facts do not indict Islam itself, why is there this denial and frankly ridiculous obfuscation?

CAIR and its many agents and apologists persist in believing that labels such as "Islamophobic" and "hate" can short-circuit any discussion of the facts surrounding the present conflict. We know what the facts are. I am fed up with denials and insults from those who would conquer and rule the world on their own medieval terms. I do not buy the argument that Muslims are entitled to special consideration because they are victims of "hate." They are victims of facts, logic, and their own actions. What would the reaction of the "progressive community" be if Christian fundamentalists had murdered 3000 people on 9-11? Would Christians suddenly be able to have littering and scurrilous graffiti investigated as "hate crimes" rather than glorified as "art"? (I am a Jewish agnostic btw.)

CAIR and it media apologists are terrorist agents and liars. Why are the media so afraid of CAIR, continuing to refer to them as a "civil rights" organization when they are plainly a propaganda outlet promoting and defending terrorism and the medievalist cult that drives it?

Finally, why did this item appear in business news? Could the trillion dollars the Saudis alone have invested in the US have something to do with it?

To tell the truth, I think we are headed for civil war. The level of real rage I see directed toward the institutional media; social, corporate and academic elites; Islamic apologists, and terror denialists is building toward violence.

A word of advice: don't accept
Arab investment money. It isn't worth it in the final accounting that will surely come.

Good morning Dead Threaders!

Haven't read through all that's above (I'm still trying to dig out from under all the things that piled up in the month that I was away). But does anyone know for sure that's CAIR's wording and not Yahoo's? If it's CAIR's it's disgusting but not surprising. If it's Yahoo's, it's much more pernicious IMHO.

OT

A.P. Fashions a News Feed for the Young

"We're pushing the envelope in terms of some of the things The A.P. has done, but we're maintaining A.P. values, not being biased, getting our facts right, being fair, giving people their say," he added. "But the fact is, some of what resonates the most with this audience is not necessarily traditional journalism, and so it will be a hybrid."

#181 trespasser

but we're maintaining A.P. values, not being biased, getting our facts right, being fair, giving people their say," he added. "But the fact is, some of what resonates the most with this audience is not necessarily traditional journalism, and so it will be a hybrid."

Rolling on the ground howling with laughter. I thought this was some kind of satire and then I followed the link and it was from the New York Times.

So, is the thread dead, or merely sleeping?

#178 Shiplord Kirel

Why are the media so afraid of CAIR...?

I had a seemingly minor but very telling incident today that relates to your question. I was chatting with a friend of mine who just happens to be a buyer for a Bay Area bookstore. This person has a 100% moonbat quotient (which is why I feel free to post this here, since the chance that they read LGF is zero). While we were discussing various popular books, my friend blurted out, "And have you heard of this book The Politically Correct Guide to Islam? Unbelievable! I mean, they're actually selling it on Amazon!"

I said, "Not only are they selling it on Amazon, but it's in the top ten nonfiction books in the country."

Friend: "Really? You've heard about it?"

Me: "Of course. It was #16 on the NY Times bestseller list last week!"

Friend: (Mouth drops open in utter shock) "I... I flipped through it and couldn't believe what I was seeing. Stuff like, Does Islam promote violence? YES! I mean, who does this guy think he is?"

Me: "Robert Spencer, the author? He's actually pretty knowledgable."

(Climactic comment coming...)

Friend: "I mean, if I were to stock that book, this place would get blown up!"

In one phrase, my friend summed up the battle before us. The Muslims will not need to force us into dhimmitude, for we shall plunge ourselves into dhimmitude willingly, without even being asked.

And why? Because it all comes down to the cowardice of the moonbat. They "sympathize" with the terrorists and "justify" terrorism and "hope to feed the crocodile so that they are eaten last" because on some deep level they are deathly afraid of the violence they know the Islamists are capable of. Dhimmitude is the child of fear, and fear is the child of personal cowardice.

The moonbats, entirely as a result of their self-centered cowardly fear, have all become quislings ready to betray the entire civilization for just a few more years of hedonism.

They have ceded the playground to the bullies.

They are offering tributes of submission to a distant tribe they've never met but whose reputation they fear.

It's bad enough when a nation has a single quisling amongst its ranks; but when 40% of the population are quislings, you have a Code 5 Situation on your hands.

The Terror Threat color ranking may only be at yellow, but the Quisling Threat color ranking is at luminsecent magenta/neon green epilepsy-inducing pulsating checkerboard.

CAIR is certainly not with us, therefore they are. . . .

Is there any difference between having CAIR offices in the USA at the present time and Germany having Nazi propaganda centers located in major US cities in 1942 ?

"those aboard a plane that crashed in Pennsylvania on
9/11" ?

I interpret this as CAIR not differentiating between the brave passengers/crew and the cowardly islamic terrorists on the plane.
Next thing you know, they'll be inviting the families of the terrorists to fly over and attend the opening of that so called memorial.

#184 Zombie

Was the bookstore buyer afraid of getting blown up by actual Muslims, or by politically correct LLLs wanting to make a point?

WASHINGTON - Could the salt that preserves hot dogs also preserve your health? Scientists at the National Institutes of Health think so.

They've begun infusing sodium nitrite into volunteers in hopes that it could prove a cheap but potent treatment for sickle cell anemia, heart attacks, brain aneurysms, even an illness that suffocates babies.

Those ailments have something in common: They hinge on low oxygen problems the government's research suggests nitrite can ease.

Beyond repairing the reputation of this often maligned meat preservative, the work promises to rewrite scientific dogma about how blood flows, and how the body tries to protect itself when that flow is blocked. Indeed, nitrite seems to guard tissues - in the heart, the lungs, the brain - against cellular death when they become starved of oxygen.

DAMN, now if they find something spectacularly healthful about Raspberry Krispy Kreme donuts, everybody that has scoffed at my nutrient-free diet will have to f*** off.

#187 Rayra

On the other hand, I have two of the foulest (LGF Ladies TURN AWAY)

Okay, can I look yet?

#184 - Zombie

Excellent post. I believe you have nailed a very important point.

And why? Because it all comes down to the cowardice of the moonbat. They "sympathize" with the terrorists and "justify" terrorism and "hope to feed the crocodile so that they are eaten last" because on some deep level they are deathly afraid of the violence they know the Islamists are capable of. Dhimmitude is the child of fear, and fear is the child of personal cowardice.

But I do wonder if they (LLL Moonbats) are even smart enough to realize that the crocodile WILL eventually eat them.

j

Swamp Woman

Nothing official about it, but I've taken to considering 2 AM PDT as the start of the Morning Dead Thread. Completely arbitrary, but one has to start somewhere.

Mark my words, science will someday prove that donuts, bacon, alcohol and cigarettes are essential to a long life. And they'll hold that opinion for months.

#191 jfromfolsomca

But I do wonder if they (LLL Moonbats) are even smart enough to realize that the crocodile WILL eventually eat them.

j

I don't think so; they seem to think that if they give the Islamist bastards everything they're screaming for, they'll pet them on the head like good little pets and go on their merry way.

#186 SwampWoman
#184 Zombie
Was the bookstore buyer afraid of getting blown up by actual Muslims, or by politically correct LLLs wanting to make a point?

Since this friend is a politically correct LLL, the presumption (which is universal around here) is that all PC LLLs are the most wonderful peaceful nonviolent people in the world. No, the point was very clear: it was fear of Muslims and what they might do.

#193 Swamp Woman

Then lets hope some of them get eaten soon. Maybe the rest will wake up.

j :)

#192 Mike C

Mark my words, science will someday prove that donuts, bacon, alcohol and cigarettes are essential to a long life. And they'll hold that opinion for months.

Well, you're screwed on the donuts part, then, aintcha? Sigh. And no cigarettes for me. At this point in my life, I'll take all the preservatives I can get.

#194 Zombie

Since this friend is a politically correct LLL, the presumption (which is universal around here) is that all PC LLLs are the most wonderful peaceful nonviolent people in the world. No, the point was very clear: it was fear of Muslims and what they might do.

Incredible. I suppose they don't read anything on their shelvs, then.

Cowards die many times before their deaths;
The valiant never taste of death but once.
Of all the wonders that I yet have heard,
It seems to me most strange that men should fear;
Seeing that death, a necessary end,
Will come when it will come.

Julius Caesar II, Shakespeare

Ooops. Shelves! (It is 4:20 a.m. here and I haven't been to sleep yet.)

#199 - 200 Swamp Woman

Not bad - quoting Shakespeare at 4am. Me, I'm for bed. I just got back from a real quick trip to Reno and needed to unwind and find out what was going on today. Where else but LGF.

Good night all

j

#199 SwampWoman

Honest response to Shakespeare quote: Chills running through my body.

PC LLL response to Shakespeare quote: Shakepeare is a Dead White Male! Smash the patriarchy! Give us Amy Tan and Mumia abu Jamal and other craptastic modern "authors" who have the PC stamp of approval!

#201 Rayra

I just hope it goes 'hot' while I'm still young enough to get my licks in.

I figure I'm the perfect age! Still fairly strong but have already fulfilled my reproductive duties. I ain't got no special reason to live, and I'm pissed off.

Gosh, I'd better get right on this whole CAIR "Red Crescent of the Embrace of Death" business and contact my senators RIGHT AWAY, lets see, who are they again?

Boxer, Barbara- (D - CA) Class III
112 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3553
Web Form: boxer.senate.gov/contact

Feinstein, Dianne- (D - CA) Class I
331 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3841
Web Form: feinstein.senate.gov/email.html

Hmmm...on second thought maybe I'd better duct tape a pillow over my mouth, stare at a light bulb for a couple days, listen to Helen Reddy's greatest hit(s), put multi-colored power tools in my bathtub, and then write my manifesto instead.

# 197 SW

It takes about 20 minutes after I eat a donut (if memory serves) before I start getting those little internal messages telling me that that was a really stupid thing to do. I finally learned to not do that anymore. Same with 'fast food' burgers.

#205 bruxellesblog

Hmmm...on second thought maybe I'd better duct tape a pillow over my mouth, stare at a light bulb for a couple days, listen to Helen Reddy's greatest hit(s), put multi-colored power tools in my bathtub, and then write my manifesto instead.

Frowning disapprovingly. Well, that would be the easy way, but is that the cowboy way?

WWJWD? (What would John Wayne do?)

# 205 bruxellesblog

Sounds like you need to move.

#206 Mike C

It takes about 20 minutes after I eat a donut (if memory serves) before I start getting those little internal messages telling me that that was a really stupid thing to do. I finally learned to not do that anymore. Same with 'fast food' burgers.

Heh. And imbibin' tequila makes me drop inhibitions quicker than the last "g" on a word. I'll eat the donuts and the quarter pounders, you better handle the tequila and cigarettes.

#207 SwampWoman

Well, that would be the easy way

Jeeze, easy? Have you TRIED to force yourself to listen to Helen Reddy recently? I think you would be taking a trip to Bruxelles to help me day-glo paint the Bosch circular sander in no time.

#203 Zombie

PC LLL response to Shakespeare quote: Shakepeare is a Dead White Male! Smash the patriarchy! Give us Amy Tan and Mumia abu Jamal and other craptastic modern "authors" who have the PC stamp of approval!

Well, I can't recall any meaningful quotes out of any of those, but Shakespeare!

#210 bruxellesblog

Jeeze, easy? Have you TRIED to force yourself to listen to Helen Reddy recently? I think you would be taking a trip to Bruxelles to help me day-glo paint the Bosch circular sander in no time.

No, baby, I wouldn't subject my ears to any such thing without industrial hearing protection.

/I'm a redneck woman, I ain't no high class broad!

#208 Mike C.

Sounds like you need to move.

Funny you bring that up

OT
Got a job offer for a consultancy here in Belgium. Just found out what my tax bracket will be with me working as an independent...are you sitting down?

60-65%!

That’s right, nearly 2/3rds of my income will be going to the corrupt French poodles of Belgium. As my wife and I own a house in Brussels, I am not entitled to the wonderful tax shelters that are afforded to ex-pats.

I've got a meeting next Wednesday for a Business Development job in London.

# 209 SW

Well, I'm not a true tequilla afficianado, but I can handle it if it's decent stuff. I still haven't cracked the seal on that bottle of Centanario I picked up in Mexico a couple of years back. Why drink even good tequilla when one has a collection of good scotch ?

# 213 bruxellesblog

Welcome to the wonderful world of socialism ! But hey - everything you need there is "free", right ? Heh.

Aw, dang, if I leave right now, I can watch the sunrise over the ocean. It would almost be worth the fight I'd be having with my husband when I got back home.

How 'bout this:

"A nuke that happened to fall on Mecca."

Do you s'pose they might use that "T" word?

#215 Mike C

Well, I'm not a true tequilla afficianado, but I can handle it if it's decent stuff. I still haven't cracked the seal on that bottle of Centanario I picked up in Mexico a couple of years back. Why drink even good tequilla when one has a collection of good scotch ?

Just a matter of individual taste, I suppose.

I humbly submit this argument for use upside recalcitrant LLL acquaintances:

Even the most charitable interpretation of this miserable design is that it is a simple "Emergent Property" of an otherwise innocent design. If this were a park in Boulder CO, nobody would care. If it were 3/4 of a square, or a triangle, nobody would care. It isn't, however, it is a RED CRESCENT at a memorial for people killed resisting ISLAMIC TERRORISM. So even if the designers were so clueless that they neither intended nor realized the significance of the symbol, the facts literally "on the ground" are more than common sense will bear, and more than decency will permit.

Here's an example of the "Emergent Properties" problem: A license plate issued innocently to an elderly man in Florida. Many drivers called the state to complain about the obscenity. If you don't get it, I will post the "translation" a few posts down from here.

New Zionist anti-Jihad robot!

The 'Guardium' wheeled robot in a photo released by the Israeli Aircraft Industries Tuesday Sept. 13, 2005. The Israeli army is testing sophisticated robots to be used along Israel's border with the Gaza Strip, that could identify Palestinian gunmen, call out a warning in Arabic and shoot to kill, defense industry officials said Tuesday.

#217 Mike C. 9/14/2005 01:32AM PDT

Welcome to the wonderful world of socialism ! But hey - everything you need there is "free", right ? Heh.

Do you want to know what REALLY pisses me of in Belgium (continuing OT)? There are NO capital gains taxes. So, if you are part of the old aristocracy (old money), you pay NO TAX!

Tax the workin' folks, while the fat, stupid fifth generation Jean-Noël du Putain who is 'connected' gets to bilk the treasury.

Hypocrites, every single last one of them. And of course, if you think the US MSM is bad, try sifting through the pages of Le Soir (called Le Sewer by many of us), Belgian's fine daily. No wonder the average Belgian has NO CLUE what is going on.

Later, y'all! It's either the beach or bed for me, haven't decided which.

# 224 Bruxellesblog

Hey - you're in Belgium, for God's sake. There IS nothing going on, or at least nothing in-country. Belgium is the nearest thing Europe has to Delaware.

#226 Mike C.

Belgium is the nearest thing Europe has to Delaware.

Last year we started calling it Europe's answer to Arkansas, of course, Arkansas even has lower taxes.

# 227 bruxellesblog

EVERY PLACE in the US has lower taxes than the numbers you mentioned. But it sounds like the UK is the exciting EU location du jour, what with gas lines and protests on the main island and Orange Order riots in N. Ireland.

It's unofficially the Morning Dead Thread, and it appears discussions of Belgium have (not surprisingly) put everybody to sleep.

#229 Mike C.

discussions of Belgium have (not surprisingly) put everybody to sleep.

I think I've heard of that place before; isn't it somewhere north of Luxembourg?

# 230 zombie

Beats me. Whereinhell is Luxembourg ? I thought that was an imaginary place.

Pardon me for this:

Dear Goat-fuckers at CAIR,
Lick my sweaty danglers.

Thank you,
SOTG

#231 Mike C.:

Now I remember where I read about the name "Belgium" before: it used to be a German artillery range.

So these lefty people are all yellow? LOL Afraid even of what might happen to them in some probable future. I guess that's why they also cater to Hispanics and blacks, they are afraid of them too. I kinda feel sorry for people like that. And also I feel contempt for them. Appeasers have always been harmful even for their own , but they don't realized it because their thinking is paralized with fear. Maybe that's what happens with these people and that would explain why their views are so detached from reality. They are afraid of reality! Wow, great finding. Thanks a lot for the example, Zombie :)

#231 Mike C.,

I've been Luxembourg: it's one of the favorite tax havens for Belgians seeking to put their money in an anonymous account and to avoid the crippling taxes. They have a lot of castles among rolling hills and forest. The inner cities are super clean, medieval-styled, with a certain technologically elite element that is similar to Holland, if you have even been there.

The openness and emotional warmth of the populace seems on part with Belgium, Germany, etc.

# 233 zombie

By golly, I think you're right !

Re: pimf "par"

Totally cool.

My Belgian bookstore has just notified me that my "Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam and the Crusades" has arrived. I better run down there.

I wonder if anyone's leafing through it, aghast?

/mornin' lgf

These jokers that came up with this "Red Crescent" design could take some lessons from this 9/11 Memorial

I forgot my main question on this thread oops.

HAVE THE FAMILIES OF THE VICTIMS BEEN ACTIVELY INVOLVED IN THE PROCESS OF THE MEMORIAL?

If not, the whole thing is a travesty.

Morning!

Belgium is the shortcut to France from Germany. Take the Eban Emal "Highway."

# 235 Yank in the EU

The openness and emotional warmth of the populace seems on part with Belgium, Germany, etc.

Do I detect a faint hint of sarcasm here ?

Good morning everybody.

Mike C
It's a stench, according to my nose.

#219 Doug

How 'bout this:

"A nuke that happened to fall on Mecca."

Those wacky cruise missiles can have a mind of their own. If properly jammed, sometimes they miss by hundreds of miles.

Ask China about their stubborn streak. I've always wondered if Clinton wasn't sending a message about loose lips with this one. If so, he was willing to risk all of us to save his 'legacy.' The Gorelick wall, the cruise missile, all the campaign dollars... Makes me wonder.

Mike C, Swampwoman and everybody around,
I want to apologize because the other day I was very pumped up making jokes and remarks and I think I was rude, not minding other people around. If that's the case please excuse me. I was approaching Iron Fist's edge and when I got there I just droped off. If I didn't do anything wrong, then my guilty concience is betraying me. Lol.
Peace.

Peace? where have I read that before?

# 245 Miguel

Don't bother me none. Some things do, but not that.

I was warned that northern Germans were cold and unfriendly folk, but when I spent six weeks in Hanover, I sure didn't notice anything unusual in their behavior.

# 247 Mike C
Ok, that's cool :)

I guess that's what you call a stereotype, the idea about Prussians, but sometimes people DO fit it. Don't start me with drunk Mexicans, Aussies, Americans, yes, Germans...well Noah was such a bountiful Patriarch wasn't he? That prejudice is a right judgment LOL

# my 247
It was #246 Mike C. Sorry.

#231 Mike C.

Beats me. Whereinhell is Luxembourg ? I thought that was an imaginary place.

The Austrians swear it exists. I looked all over Europe and couldn't find it. I found the heurigans in Austria though. Maybe that's why I never found Luxembourg.

My Belgian bookstore has just notified me that my "Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam and the Crusades" has arrived. I better run down there.

Might better. Europe definitely needs it.

A radical vows to fight Britain's expulsion plan

France announced last month that it would be deporting a dozen or so North African immigrants it deems dangerous, using administrative procedures not subject to prior judicial review. "In France we are very well organized with regard to expulsions," says Guillaume Larrivé, an adviser to Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy. "We don't ask ourselves major juridical questions."

European human rights activists are up in arms, complaining that those sent back to their countries of origin, mostly Middle Eastern nations such as Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Algeria, face torture.

"It is absolutely scandalous," says Jean-Pierre Dubois, president of the French Human Rights League. "Are human rights not for all humans, or have we decided that radical imams are monsters?"

The United Nations' special rapporteur on torture, Manfred Nowak, also condemns the growing trend. "The risk is very high that these people would be subjected to torture," he warns. "Most of the Muslim fundamentalists' countries of origin unfortunately do have a clear record of torture."

# 249 Beagle

Perhaps you blinked and missed it. Kinda like Rhode Island.

#250 trespasser

have we decided that radical imams are monsters?"

I can't speak for you, Jean-Pierre. The Magic Eight Ball said "signs point to yes." Seriously. That's what it said. It's always good to consult the Magic Eight Ball.

# 250 trespasser,

Ha! radical imams are part of the problem, not of the solution. They have aided, very efectively, to the construction of a world vision that allows for things like torture to be implemented and accepted in their flock's societies. These people are full of it.

#252 Beagle
LOL LOL LOL

I'll concentrate and ask again LOL

#251 Mike C.

I consulted my globe. Sure enough there is this county-sized thing they call the nation of Luxembourg. My train rides missed it by (..) that much.

# 255 Beagle

Probably downright huge (in land surface area) compared to some of the Pacific nations. There are beach resorts bigger and more populous than those.

#238 Yank

I hope they didn't decide it 'Fascist' and destroy it.....for your own good, of course.

#242 Mike C.

Generalizations about a whole society can be rough, but it seems fair to say in this case that we talking about an intensely insular society (in Belgium). Passive-aggression is not only the general reaction to America but, as those who live here for a long time discover, the general mode of dealing with issues amongst each other and the world. Basically, all of us ex-pats living here agree on the bizarre herd-like, exclusive and yet pretentious mentality of the locals. That's all fair to say, I think.

This happened a few years back:

My good friend and fellow doc student agreed to a public debate vs. a Flemish student (who is actually a pretty nice guy and our friend) on the issue of the Afghan War and American foeign policy. A good and rowdy crowd showed up. My buddy easily and quite graciously won the debate as his knowlegde of current affairs was enormous compared to the other guy's. It was also not too complex an issue to argue that it was a just, necessary war. The Marxist / radical leftist audience raised all the typical talking points: "Violence only breeds more violence," no war for conquering /imperialism, America is a corrupt global policemen, the 'hyper-power' must decrease in strength and we brought 9/11 on ourselves, etc.

After a heated exchange on whether or not it was right for America to do violence against Hitler in WWII, one Flemish guy with a feminine voice (I recall, and I know this guy is an anti-war activist) said, 'America invades countries and it never leaves. That's why all the world hates America. Look (gestures to my friend), you're still here. Why do you go home?' The majority of the Flemish students in the audience (boys and girls) then joined in the call for my friend to go home. 'End the occupation', they said.

Can you believe that?

Of all the PC crap, this one upsets me the most. It is a cruel joke. Matbe now the issue will be covered more by the press. People need to hear about this. Even after the Rev Mcrae threatened to sue, there were only a handful of articles about it. I am sick of the free pass given to Islam. I am sick of the lack of respect for our own history. Islam's contribution to American history is death and disaster. Todd Beamer, while on the phone, prayed with the woman at the phone company. He prayed the Lord's Prayer. I would think many others prayed, and they weren't praying to the moon god allah. I just get so mad about this...

Madness Red Ken Livingstone needs to lay off the absinthe.

An Islamic scholar who has been accused of supporting suicide bombers was likened by Ken Livingstone, the London mayor, yesterday to Pope John XXIII.

He said that Yusuf al-Qaradawi, a Qatar-based imam who is banned from America, was "an absolutely sane Islamist engaged with the world" who believed in democracy and an increasing role for women.

Sheikh Qaradawi meets with Ken Livingstone during his 2004 visit "Of all the Muslim leaders in the world today, Sheikh Qaradawi is the most powerfully progressive force for change and for engaging Islam with western values," Mr Livingstone told the Commons home affairs select committee.

"I think his is very similar to the position of Pope John XXIII."

The pontiff, who reigned from 1958 to 1963, was one of the great reforming popes and was credited with advancing co-operation with other religions. He met Protestant leaders, the head of the Greek Orthodox Church, the Archbishop of Canterbury, and a Shinto high priest.

Of course Red Ken means Stalinist values. It's still a tough fit. "Religion is the opiate of the masses" unless it hates the United States apparently.

Those Northern Frenchies, the Wallons, are tired of the American pride. They want to be ruled by Muslim humility. Good for them.

# 258 Yank in the EU

Oh, I believe it. I almost never get into such situations myself, since I am moving about on business. In such circumstances, one does not engage anybody in political or religious debate of any sort. Even if you have to just flat-out lie to avoid it. But as to the Germans in Hanover, the folks I interacted with (aside from the business folks) were just shopkeepers and such. And they seemed reasonably tempered to me.

Also, people will Rep. Tancredo's comments about nuking Mecca against him, but remember, he was responding to a reporter's question about what our reaction should be to the destruction of a US city. In this case, context is important. He didn't just call a press conference and say we should do it, he was answering a hypothetical...

# 263 Baldy

Still a dumb answer, since now it's out there in the public record, ready for anybody to use against him anytime, context or no. Doesn't show a lot of political savy.

The answer should always be, "The U.S. reserves the right to use any means at our disposal to protect our people." General, diplomatic, scary if you can read between lines.

#257 aboo-Hoo-Hoo

I hope they didn't decide it 'Fascist' and destroy it...for your own good, of course.

Those hustlers and rogues do not deserve to be in the same room with Ms. Fallaci, much less comment on whether or not she is a fascist. I'm sure they consider themselves to be tolerant and sophisticated leftists though.

Note once again how the crescent on the outhouse in the "BC" comic a few years back caused an outrage. THERE, Muslims associated the crescent with Islam. Either it is or it isn't. I know it is. CAIR does too, though they're lying now.

Hello folks

Luxembourg is tiny state crammed with banks.

The notion that the proposed Flight 93 memorial is crescent-shaped isn't a conspiracy, but an easily verifiable fact.

And its convex side does face Mecca, that's another fact.

Still I don't think it is an Islamist plot, but rather the inane idea of a multiculturalist architect.

Either way, it's the apex of bad taste to say the least.

#262 Mike C.

Sitting in the audience, listening to these students call for my Yank friend to go home ('end the occupation') after a debate about whether or not America was right to do violence against Hitler, I was just thinking what scoundrels they were. I have two great uncles who died in Operation Overlord and my blood was boiling.

Personally, I would rather see a memorial named "The Finger of Defiance".

#267 Baldy
Seems that outrage trumps serenity and reasoning in our current society. There must be a way to change that. And, of course, the crescent is an Islamic sign. Many years ago, when I was a kid, my grand mother would point the half moon to me and say: "Look! The Muslim moon". I mean, it's been around for a long time in that standing.

Re: my #258, oops, I meant "Why don't you go home?"

Our allies the Pakistanis

The group, even more militant in its opposition to Mr. Karzai and his pro-Western government than erstwhile Taliban leader Mullah Omar, was divided over whether to kill the hostages. Karim claimed to sympathize with their plight and to understand that the abduction wasn't winning the Taliban any friends. Still, he said that he had little choice. It was a surreal meeting in many ways, but what made it especially remarkable to Ms. Gannon was how relaxed Hakim seemed. A well-known Taliban terrorist, he was supposedly a wanted man in Pakistan. Why did he seem so nonchalant? Soon enough the reason became clear.

Karim abruptly ended the conversation and headed out to his waiting car. Ms. Gannon caught a glimpse of the license plate--it started with the number 83. From her years of experience she had learned that, in Pakistan, such a number belongs only to plates that have been issued by the ISI, Pakistan's military intelligence service. This numeric talisman confirmed what she had long suspected: that three years after Gen. Pervez Musharraf, Pakistan's president, had made an about-face and ditched the Taliban under U.S. pressure, his military intelligence service was still offering support to Islamist groups, including a resurgent Taliban.

What's interesting is that one cannot assume Musharraf has the support of his own ISI. It's very possible some of the attempts on his life were carried out, or assisted by, factions of the ISI. And by the way, Pakistan has nuclear weapons. A.Q. Khan is a national hero for distributing nuclear technology all over the Middle East.

# 272 Yank in the EU

No worry - I caught your drift.

264 Mike C - No it's not. The context DOES make a difference, in my mind. Still, I wished he hadn't said it. The time may well come when a response will be needed after an American city is destroyed, especially since neither party is serious about protecting the US. The Republicans are better than the Democrats, but the border is still wide open, "racial" profiling is out, the FBI meets with terrorist sympathizers, etc.

Well, good-night all. God bless always :)

For those not aware of it, CAIR is suing Andrew Whitehead of Anti-CAIR, pretty much because he dared to tell the truth about them. Whitehead now has a legal defense fund:

American Center for Civil Justice, Inc.
422 Martin Luther King Dr.
Lakewood, NJ 08701

Make checks/money orders out to: “American Center for Civil Justice, Inc.” Whitehead says that they will also be accepting credit cards soon.
The Anti-CAIR web site is here.

# 275 Baldy

I know YOU keep the context in mind. But that's not the issue. All anybody needs is a film clip of him making that statement and he's derailed politically, at least for any position higher than the one he currently holds. It's just that simple. This isn't a discussion of right or wrong, just of political tactics. He handed any future opponents a huge club with which to beat him. Not the act of a political master.