I gave up on homogenized bookstores a long time ago.

“For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority,” Borders Group Inc. spokeswoman Beth Bingham said Wednesday.

Translation: "We fully expect Muslims to act like murderous bloodthirsty savages for no reason whatsoever if we don't appease their every whim."

Thanks for clearing that up.

"the safety of our customers and employees"

Well, at least they acknowlege that Muslims are bloodthirsty little cockroaches...

Borders Group, based in Ann Arbor, Mich., operates more than 475 Borders and 650 Waldenbooks stores in the United States, though not all regularly carry the magazine.

That explains a lot too...

I picked up The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam there.

Got very little eye contact at the epay counter.

One bit of humor I am getting out of all this insanity is watching these LLLs and moonbat types eat at each other and do things they swore they never would do. Bookstores self-banning publications?

A publication by a secular humanist society haveing to defend, to a BOOKSTORE, that they should stock their mag?

I am amused at the gymnastics these groups are going through to maintain their delicate sense of "cultural awareness" and "liberal free for all-you have the right to do anything" attitudes in this current culture clash.

And the next time I'm looking into buying books -- there's a B&N a few miles and 2 malls away from the ones with a borders in them -- and there's another "choice" for you, Ms. Dhimmi Bingham ...

when they celebrate "banned books" in the future, I will go and spit on them. Pure censorship and cowardice.

On the other hand, knowing what I know about the history of violence associated with these cartoons, and I was an employee of these stores, and my employer could not guarantee my safety at work, I would be very concerned.

Islamic tradition bars depiction of Muhammad to prevent idol worship, which is strictly prohibited.

Unless it's a fish or a black rock. Nobody has yet proposed how a cartoon could lead to idol worship but we here in the MSM print boilerplate so we can knock off early.

Islamic tradition bars depiction of Muhammad to prevent idol worship, which is strictly prohibited.

If Muhammad isn't an Idol I don't know what is. Supernatural nonsense has a lot to answer for.

With their location in Ann Arbor, they most likely have a contingent of Muslim employees who had some input into the decision.

Not that I know that for a fact. Just a thought.

“For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority,” Borders Group Inc. spokeswoman Beth Bingham said Wednesday.

This is why terrorism continues to be an effective tactic.

And why it continues to intimidate and scourge the civilized world.

Thank you for confirming that fact, Borders.

seems like they are trying to imply that members of the ROP are unable to behave themselves. Whos call who the racist?

I've never heard of Free Inquiry magazine but I'll make a point of asking for the latest issue at my local Borders tomorrow.

Islamic tradition bars depiction of Muhammad to prevent idol worship, which is strictly prohibited.

Total lie.

dang it! Now I have to boycott borders. How annoying.

# 13 P B

Borders store #1 is right next to the main campus of the U. in Ann Arbor -- haven't physically been there in several years but it was stocked with your garden variety campus LLLs -- nobody else ...

#16 Ringo

I've never heard of Free Inquiry magazine but I'll make a point of asking for the latest issue at my local Borders tomorrow.

I like that idea very much. We should all go in or call for the magazine, and explain why.

# 17 z

You should E-mail the archive link to Borders HQ!

How's the spam lately?
:-0

#17 zombie
The MSM is stuck on that meme (hey, that rhymes). It really pisses me off too.

Everybody go to Borders and Waldenbook and demand copies of the greatest book available right now:

While Europe Slept : How Radical Islam is Destroying the West from Within, by Bruce Bawer

READ THIS BOOK! Mind-blowing, even for LGFers. Imagine Fjordman's blog x 1000.

5{

Here's an answer: let employees go armed. Ann Arbor is in Michigan, a state in the majority of states which issue concealed carry licenses. In Israel, a high velocity lead deposit has been known to bring a halt to a splody's collection of his 72 raisins.

But their Bill of Rights seems to end at the First Amendment...and bits of that have been redacted, too.

“For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority,” Borders Group Inc. spokeswoman Beth Bingham said Wednesday

For me, the safety and security of my freedom is a top priority, and I believe that doing business with dhimmis like Borders or Waldenbooks could challenge that priority.

“We absolutely respect our customers’ right to choose what they wish to read and buy and we support the First Amendment,” Bingham said. “And we absolutely support the rights of Free Inquiry to publish the cartoons. We’ve just chosen not to carry this particular issue in our stores.”

Translation: "We have no respect for our customer's right to choose what they wish to read and we support eliminating the First Amendment," Dingbat said. " And we offer no support for the right of Free Inquiry to publish the cartoons, since no one will buy that issue to sell to customers. We choose to bend over to this terrorist tactic and look forward to questioning why the government allowed these fringe groups to deny us our right to the Freedom of Speech when we loose it permanently in an attempt to not offend anyone."

As we slide closer and closer to oblivion...

Borders has a store policy when it comes to the Koran. It must always be shelved on the top shelf. Nothing may be above it.

Many years ago I worked in NYC for Barnes and Noble as the Accounting Manager. Len Reggio was the owner and I belive still is. At the time I worked there, the company was privately held. Reggio was certainly not a right winger, but he fought for first amendment rights with great energy and without exception.

If my recollection is correct, Barnes and Noble bought out Waldenbooks around '86 or '87 when Dayton Hudson sold them off, and to the best of my knowledge they still own them. In fact, they changed all the Waldenbook stores to Barnes and Noble stores. I'm surprised there are still Waldenbooks stores open.

I just got an email from them for my "Personal Shopping Day" through their" Rewards" program, so I sent back a reply to Ms Bingham's attention to remove me from their mailing list,period. I'm done with playing and paying enemies.

#21 Buckaroo
# 17 z
You should E-mail the archive link to Borders HQ!

Be my guest! (Hint hint.)

How's the spam lately?

Mostly consists of reverse-spam attacks from Morocco, plus ditties like this:

From: Amorafi

I suggest you learn more about Islam. Only in Islam you can find the truth. Islam is the way of life.

Well, I had been planning to go to Borders this weekend. Looks like my plans have changed.

Freakin' hypocrites. I bet they have any number books and publications with Mapplethorpe anti-Christian photos, Serranos "Piss Christ", and the Virgin Mary rendered in elephant dung. Liberals make me puke.

I love to watch them squirm.

Squirm: what you do when your spine turns to jelly.

Wonder if they're willing to stock it online? We don't have a Borders near here and the Walden thing in the mall sells schlock. Haven't been there in years...

Well, it's a good bit of Free Publicity for Free Inquiry. I hope it ups their sales for the month.

Islamists just don't get it: Americans are ornery. Tell them they can't have something and they'll go out of their way to make sure it's available.

Exception: we will allow ourselves to be regulated out of existence by the ditherers in Congress -- as in that stupid low water toilet that was foisted on the public by the Nazi-greens. In reality it's a 12 gallon flush since you often have to hit the handle twice

# 36 ray

Funnily enough, you and OBL agree on that!

/very spooky

#34 Iron Fist

I've been out of the retail world for a long time now and haven't kept in touch. I wonder if someone may have bought the rights to the name and reopened them.

From my experience, the bookselling industry is about the most incestous industry in the country.

#14 Ann:

This is why terrorism continues to be an effective tactic.

And why it continues to intimidate and scourge the civilized world.

Thank you for confirming that fact, Borders.

You know, if this were September 11, 2001 or close thereafter, I'll wager a bet that every household and business in this country would have the damn cartoons in their front windows and as bumper stickers on their cars.

Whatever happened to NEVER FORGET?

I'm not afraid...Michael Moore told me that there was no terrorist threat!

#10 mama winger
On the other hand, knowing what I know about the history of violence associated with these cartoons, and I was an employee of these stores, and my employer could not guarantee my safety at work, I would be very concerned.

Understand what you are saying...but to stand up to it now will prevent a larger flareup later. Better to face the music of a small band of rioters then face a much larger group later...and it will come. It is a choice between bad and worse. But the government must let everyone know that there are consequences for rioting...and then hold them accountable.

Give a chinch an inch and he takes a yard.

"We support freedom of speech but we're such cowards we would never do anything to practice or protect it."

#42 DesertSage:

I'm not afraid...Michael Moore told me that there was no terrorist threat!

Anybody want to dare him to wear a Tshirt with the cartoons depicted? He's big enough that we could fit all of them on one side.

He's always been good at poking the stick at stuff.

23 Zombie,

Just finished Bawer's book. Excellent read.
I sent a copy to my favorite lefty, multi-culturalist, EU-loving, Utopian friend...who insists that everything I say is just crazy paranoia.

Do you know if this book has been published in Europe?

FYI, here is the website for Free Inquiry (which I'd never heard of until tthis thread)

I will pretty much guarantee I disagree with 97+% of everything the council for secular humanism stands for, but I'm tempted to buy a couple issues of their magazine plus the one with the cartoons ...

Son-of-a-bitch, man, are we free and proud or not?

Fuck muhammad, and fuck the corporate weenies who made this cowardly decision.

If every damn magazine and newspaper printed the cartoons, we'd be a hell of a lot safer, and we'd feel like men.

Land of the FREE and home of the BRAVE.

Say it!

Doesn't it mean anything?

Apologies to all, my memory was befogged by martini. Dayton Hudson DID NOT sell off Waldenbooks, the sold for BDalton bookstores to Barnes and Noble in the mid to late 80's, sorry, my bad!

Ann Arbor (home of Borders) is the Berkeley of the Midwest. I live about 50 miles south and the effects of their moonbattery are too often felt here.

This surprises me not one whit.

mamawinger and yesandno:

On Sept 11, my (then) husband's employees wanted to know if he was going to let them go home. Some businesses were closing, and things were a bit chaotic.

But he sent the most profound email to them telling them that the whole purpose of the terrorists is to interrupt and damage our way of life, our economy and to instill fear in us. By shutting down, we would be letting them win.

This is so disappointing. This company is letting them win. If the employees are afraid, they can go on vacation for awhile.

Heck, we'll let an illegal alien take their job! (oops. that's another thread.)

Borders and Waldenbooks stores will not stock the April-May issue of Free Inquiry magazine because it contains cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad that provoked deadly protests among Muslims in several countries.

It's a free country they can do what they want. Being a bookstore, however, you'd think they would emulate men like Guttenberg rather than be cowardly and roll over like they do.

“For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority,” Borders Group Inc. spokeswoman Beth Bingham said Wednesday.

Notice that they aren't saying that they morally object to offending muslims, but rather heavily imply that they are deathly afraid of offending them. Very interesting, seeing that islam is the ROP(MA). They have no trouble offending any other set of people with the books they sell. How offensive is a book on black magic to some Christians? How offensive is a book by a white supremist to a black person? You can find both in these bookstores, in fact you can find a book by Hitler there. How offensive is that to a Jew?

The magazine, published by the Council for Secular Humanism in suburban Amherst, includes four of the drawings *snip*

I don't agree with what this magazine has to say, but I defend their right to publish whatever they want with my life if need be.

Islamic tradition bars depiction of Muhammad to prevent idol worship, which is strictly prohibited.

Here is where the moebius effect comes into play. It's like making Mohamad's depiction too holy, in effect making him a diety. The Koran is also deified in the offense of desecrating it. It is an object, just like any other "holy" book. It contains ideas and words, made of temporal material. Not worthy of worship or reverence. The ideas contained may be worthy, but not the material object. That is idolatry.

“What is at stake is the precious right of freedom of expression,” said Paul Kurtz, editor-in-chief of Free Inquiry.

Damn straight!

"To refuse to distribute a publication because of fear of vigilante violence is to undermine freedom of press — so vital for our democracy.”

It only works because of gutless organizations like Borders and Walden. Thoreau must be twirling in his grave.

“

We absolutely respect our customers’ right to choose what they wish to read and buy and we support the First Amendment,” Bingham said. “And we absolutely support the rights of Free Inquiry to publish the cartoons. We’ve just chosen not to carry this particular issue in our stores.”

Cowards cannot defend free speech. Borders isn't worthy of the legacy of the written word. neither is the MSM dead tree society.

#43 Iron Fist

Sorry, I got my companies wrong. Dayton Hudson sold B Dalton Bookstores to B&N about 86 or 87. I was wrong and I apologize.

#41 Princess Bernie

if this were September 11, 2001 or close thereafter, I'll wager a bet that every household and business in this country would have the damn cartoons in their front windows and as bumper stickers on their cars.

Only those who aren't scared.

Borders management is, so they are part of the problem.

Proof that intimidation works.

Pitiful.

# 51 Dub

I knew there was something wrong with your 1st statement but couldn't put a finger on it! Thx. for the self-fact checking!
:-)

If I were one of you wimmin, (which I am not) I'd be screaming:

"Where the hell are the real men?"

No. 41 Princess Bernie:

You know, if this were September 11, 2001 or close thereafter...

IMHO we should have gone completely ape shit on the islamics on 9-12.

We will have to at some point anyway.

But, it doesn't say anything about them being threatened by muslims. WERE they threatened? Or did they just act like good dhimmis, all on their own.

#36 rayra

Looks like a great big tail light housing off a '50's era Buick.

#46 Princess Bernie

And I'm really not afraid because Harry Reid told me that Osama Bin Laden is dead!

#51 Dublin(CA)Dude 3/29/2006 07:19PM PST

... memory ... befogged by martini.

Beautiful imagery. I am imagining gin, olives, straight.

#29 Montaigne's Cat

Borders has a store policy when it comes to the Koran. It must always be shelved on the top shelf. Nothing may be above it.

Okay, I'll bite, where'd you get this tidbit?

I hope they have a sign in the window reading something like this

"For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could result in Muslims injuring our customers and employees - pleae forgive us for bowing to reality."

Wow. I guess they just lost my business (though I get most of my books via Amazon anyways). I shall give them a call and let them know.

#51 Dublin(CA)Dude

Yep - yer drinkin'. But only mildly fogged as you have but 2 typos in thy post.

#64 USA

Tanquery and dry vermouth, very dry, ice cold, two olives, straight up.

Yup, nice image.

As if we needed another reason to hate her:

Cynthia McKinney remembers Rachel Corrie with anti-Semitic song:

You heard of Rachel Coorie? [sic]
The press won't tell her story
Caught between a house and bulldozer
She found out that Israel
Hates gardens and it will kill
Americans who help rebuild the Gaza Strip.

. . .

No comment on her site about her assault on a police officer today but there is a statement that has been attributed to her out there which pulls the race card (duh) in a big way and claims that the officer "bodychecked" her. Wouldn't surprise me if it was really her statement.

20 mama winger,

They must usually carry the magazine if they're not going to carry this issue.

I'm going to ask for it just so that I can listen to the clerk explain to me why they don't have it.

My guess, he'll have no idea.

#23 zombie

My copy should be here in a few days.

#54 Princess Bernie

Oh,I agree completely. What the employer needs to do is to stock the magazines, and the store next to them stock the magazines, and the store next to them . . . An issue of hanging together or separately.

Let the owners hire extra security, and encourage qualified employess to bring their guns to work.

Unfortunately in today's business environment everyone is crippled by liability issues.

#70 ronald

Only two? Damn.

FWIW, AMZN does carry Free Inquiry as a subscription

#54 Princess Bernie

But he sent the most profound email to them telling them that the whole purpose of the terrorists is to interrupt and damage our way of life, our economy and to instill fear in us. By shutting down, we would be letting them win.

The client I was working for on the morning of 9/11 did esentially the same thing. It generated quite a bit of ill will that lasted for months. There were at least a dozen folks in the office who had loved ones in NYC, and were frantic. The majority of the rest of the staff were just to stunned to be of any use whatsoever to their employer. A great notion, in principle, but at least where I was at, a very lousy policy to enforce that terrible day.

#62 Orson Buggy

#36 rayra

Looks like a great big tail light housing off a '50's era Buick.

I always thought it looked like a Buck Rogers rocket engine.

Although if you want to talk about '50s car taillights, the one that mose closely resembles it is the '59 Cadillac.

#75 mamawinger:

Put the magazine in the rack next to Guns and Ammo and Soldier of Fortune.

heh.

#54 Princess Bernie
mamawinger and yesandno:

On Sept 11, my (then) husband's employees wanted to know if he was going to let them go home. Some businesses were closing, and things were a bit chaotic.

But he sent the most profound email to them telling them that the whole purpose of the terrorists is to interrupt and damage our way of life, our economy and to instill fear in us. By shutting down, we would be letting them win.

I couldn't agree with him more. Eventually we all will have to pay the piper. I would rather have it on my terms now, then on the piper's terms later...

Anyone else watching HBO "Walkout" about Chicano activists in the 60's ... very interesting parallels ...?

Contact Borders

#80 Earth2moonbat

Mecca could sue Cadillac for infringement on their design!

The continuation of the 'slippery slope' of censorship. How long before books such Fallacis or Bawers or Bostoms or Spencers are banned from Borders, etc?

Again, I want to point out that the following phrase can be found on the official House of Representatives website of Congresswoman Cynthia McKiney:

. . .

Israel
Hates gardens and it will kill
Americans

. . .

That website (and her salary and staff and benefits) is paid for by you, the American taxpayer.

#79 Cartman:

I agree. If my husband had been in a situation where his employees had family they were concerned about, he would have individually let them do what they needed to do. But to summarily shut down "just because" was out of the question.

Where I worked, we stayed until mid afternoon. But had actual security issues because we are physically located in an area that could have been a target. So we did have to shut down.

But I felt stupid doing it. I wanted to stay in the building.

#39 Buckaroo - what the hell is that (pardon my ignorance)?

# 87 J

Bangs head against desk

I thought Georgians were sane! Can someone please impeach this nutjob?!

Well, I hope the American public and market put them out of business.

Viva capitalism. Death to cowardice.

#76 dublin(CA)dude

I once worked with a fellow whose naive wife wanted to buy him a bottle of his favorite liquor for his birthday. She went to the liquor store, her first visit ever, and asked the clerk "Where do you keep the Double Dewars?"

Looks like it's time to take a ride to the local Waldenbooks to ask for this issue. I normally don't set foot in the place, as I can't stand the mall, but for this I may have to make an exception.

I'm also tempted to find a Borders and stack a few books on pig-raising on top of their Korans. Think they'd mind?

There are a lot of more controversial books that Borders Books are displaying and selling than a magazine that published a Mohammed cartoon on its cover. I'm sure Mein Kampf editions are flying off the shelves!

What cowardice Borders Group is showing!

well...of course they won't sell them. Did we expect any different?

This PC stuff churns my stomach.

I've seen some books and magazines in Borders that offend the heck out of me. You know what I do about it? I don't buy them. Never once have I thought of exploding a pipe bomb because of it.

The meek shall inherit the earth. (I've got my eye on a few acres in the Appalachian hills.)

:)

Link referencing McKinney's alleged statement re: the incident with the officer today. No confirmation on whether it's authentic or info on where it was posted.

# 89 r w

OBL (and most of the really wacked-out whabbis) have stated before that the black rock is idolatry -- just like rayra believes, like I beleive, and probably a good many lizardoids ...

I was just pointing out this very strange tiny intersection of ageement there is amongst mortal enemies -- I've always found it a bit ironic ...

87 Jheka

Linky?

More OT

.Publius Pundit
has an article out of The Netherlands that has Hugo Chavez making some kind of noise about invading Curacao, a Dutch Antilles about 25 mikles from the VEN coast.

Apparently Hugo thinks we're planning a raid from there.

The Dutch believe their defenses are "swiss cheese" on the island and parliamentarian Zsolt Szabo called on the Defense Ministers to "Get on top of the Chavez Threat.

Why am I salivating?

What? NoMoreMO?

# 101 R

Hugo's not that stup ...

OMG, he would be that stupid ...

Go Dutch go!

Last month the Weekly Standard (to its everlasting credit) printed the original muhammed cartoons in the magazine. So if Borders didn't pull that issue off its shelf (and I guess we would have heard about it if they did) then these cartoons have already appeared in magazines in the Borders stores.

Still I am saddened and angered by this development.

(I hope) Our kids and grandkids will see old movies of brave newspapermen and others standing for a free press and against book burnings. And they'll wonder how long ago that was true in the USA, and how to restore it.

#84 mama winger 3/29/2006 07:33PM PST

Contact Borders

I did. I can't wait to see what kind of return email they send me.

#94 Ploome:

The article is wrong. The officer did not "mistakenly" pursue her. She didn't have her badge on and had changed her hair from the lobster tail look that she is known for to a Buckwheat on crack look, so he didn't recognize her. He did EXACTLY what he was supposed to do when someone that he doesn't recognizes goes around the metal detector and refuses to stop when told to do so. He made no mistake.

#100 Earth2moonbat:

See post #72.

Seems that Borders sells books online through Amazon.

Here's a store locater for Borders to complain locally. The manager at my store hadn't heard about the controversy.

# 109 D

Yep -- borders.com went underneath the AMZN behemoth some years ago ...

Yet as pointed out above AMZN sells free inquiry w/o restcition!

Borders -- how dhimmi can you get?

#72 Jheka

Also on her website:

Today is the third anniversary of the murder of Rachel Corrie, an American who was crushed to death by Israel's American-manufactured Caterpillar bulldozers.

I did not believe that hating her more was even possible. But I do. She is one lying piece of sh*t.

Okay, now I vividly recall the incident when Len Reggio, owner of Barnes and Noble, refused to buckle to Muslim pressure.

Trust me, having worked for him, I'm no great fan of Len Reggio, but, when Salmon Rusdie published his book that got him in so much trouble with the Islamic world, (Satanic Verses I believe), Reggio refused to be intimidated and went on TV defending his stores selling the book.

I wonder if Barnes and Noble is still living up to that ideal? Maybe I'll pay my local B&N a visit this weekend and see whats going on.

#48 Buckaroo

Thanks for the link.

The Council for Secular Humanism, the publisher of "Free Inquiry," includes Paul Kurtz on its board. He's an emeritus philo prof in the SUNY system. He also founded the "Skeptical Inquirer" magazine, published by the Committee for the Scientific Investigation of the Paranormal, which publishes "debunks" of claims of ghosts, UFOs, Sasquatch, etc.

I used to read "Skeptical Inquirer" now and then during the X-Files period of the 1990s. I used to know some weird people, the types who believed the CIA was hiding Elvis in the Area 51 UFO, apparently now piloted by Sasquatch (who earned his wings flying Bush I in the SR71 to meet with the Ayatollah during the 1980 October Surprise). They vehemently denied the Mena, Arkansas rumors (which I always felt were BS), while at the same time believing that the CIA prevented perpetual motion machines from putting Big Oil out of business - that is when the CIA wasn't keeping hemp illegal because hemp-biomass is the only alternative energy source that'll save the planet. What is especially scary is that one of these guys became a Muslim during college!

Although I disagreed with Kurtz's scientistic/materialistic outlook on the world, he's a pretty sharp guy, and he doesn't take any crap from anybody. I guarantee the magazine will unload with both barrels on Borders in their next issue.

I suppose Borders now thinks that when the terrorists nuke American cities, terrorists will somehow spare Borders bookstores from the nuclear explosions, as a way of saying thanks for the appeasement.

So after the Muslim nuke goes off, there will be cockroaches, tupperware, and Borders.

re: 'Sghetti District' McKinney, the most extreme case of gerrymandering in recent history

I hope that she gets her chance to also "counsel the offending officer" -- in court, as a defendant.

Feingold is probably drafting her censure right now.

After having visited the Free Inquiry magazine website and noting their criteria for articles, I can understand the corporate dilemma - to decide whether they want to stand up for free speech vs. keeping their storefronts intact.
They probably made the right decision: Makes more room for, say, Easy Rider magazine (another one I'd never buy but it actually generates sales).

# 113 Dub

bn.com appears to not sell magazines via the site; I suppose we should all check our local store to see if they will place the dreaded Free Inquiry of blashphemy on the shelves!

#115 Iron Fist

Bingo.

Mock the prophets of Ba'al. They can't handle it.

#116 rayra 3/29/2006 07:55PM PST

#89 realwest 3/29/2006 07:36PM PST
#39 Buckaroo - what the hell is that (pardon my ignorance)?
That's teh Giant Silver Vulva of none other than their Allah, realwest. That it the festering orifice at the center of the Kaaba, that they all schizophrenically orbit around during the Hajj

[it is the silver nounting housing the stone that has purportedly turned black from absorbing muslim worshippers' sins through the ages]

The stone is, of course, from outer space: Dr. Abd Al-Basset Al-Sayyid of the Egyptian National Research Center: British Research Proves Holy Stone of Ka'ba to be a Semi-Conductor from Outer Space

[Link: www.memritv.org...]

As noted above Borders has already had magazines containing the cartoons on their shelves. So this must be a change of policy.

“For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority

I beleive 110% that it should be stocked and sold. When a business is concerned that there may be violence beacuse a magazine is published, then that shows there is a MAJOR problem with taht group. I knew that since 9/11 but some people still haven't realized it.

# 118 C

recently read "Last Man Down" and I'm fairly certian Chief Piccito (sp?) talked several times about a Borders on the concourse of WTC 1 that was of course destroyed that morning.

some people just don't learn ...

#115 Iron Fist

Their faith is weak, so they cannot abide any challenge to it.

Damn skippy.

/plus people know the notsohairy-krishnas can't catch anyone if you just throw change at 'em. They bend down to grab it and get caught up in the sheets.

Buckaroo, Excellent point.
If a Borders Bookstore went down on 911, then all the more reason for them not to give in now.

# 130 bsm

Brilliant!
Make these images as iconic as the smiley face, the I "heart" something posters, etc. etc.

What tiny printshop wants to make history?
:-)

buzzaw,
I was thinking the same thing. I thought posters, but the sticker packets are a great idea!

OT:

Cigarettes may really be hazardous to your health:

US charges 19 with selling smuggled cigarettes to aid Hezbollah

The indictment, which was unsealed Wednesday following the arrest of nine people in Michigan and Canada, alleges that a Dearborn, Michigan man ran a multi-million dollar a year contraband cigarette trafficking organization which also dealt in stolen and counterfeit goods.

Good Grief!

I wish I could say this is surprising but it's not.

Can you imagine a book store refusing to sell a magazine that insulting Christians? Gee, I wonder what the difference is. Oh yeah, the whole head-chopping thing.

I was actually going to Borders tomorrow to buy some birthday gifts. I think I will order them from Amazon or Barnes and Noble and print out the receipt. Then I will stop by Borders and pull all the books I would have bought there and bring them to the manager. I'll explain I would have bought these books at his store but bought them elsewhere because of this. They can have a copy of the receipt (probably will total about $100 or so).

It's just a drop in the bucket but since I am not going to chop anyone's head off over cartoons or cowardice, it's the best I can do.

We have officially lost our country.

Perhaps it is not beyond the pale anymore to call for a little counter-intimidation. In the face of this, would it be so bad if Muslims feared to go to their mosque for prayers because "something bad" might happen to them there?

#65 wintercat

I got it from first hand experience. I was in a Borders and heard a ruckus. A customer was complaining when he overheard an employee instructing a new employee about stocking policy in the religion section. When the customer complained that the new employee was being taught that the Koran may only be shelved on the top shelf, the trainer confirmed that he heard correctly that it is corporate policy. When asked why is this so, she replied because nothing may go above the Koran. When he asked who says nothing may go above the Koran, Borders or the Moslem clerics, she did not understand the distinction in his question.

Does anyone know if Border's received any threats before making their decision? If they did, then I'd view their decision in a different light.
(slips into kevlar jammies).

We've already had at least one American muslim at OSU, IIRC, who apparently had no qualms about blowing himself and he hoped hundreds if not thousands of people up at a football game.
One of those with a knapsack in a Border's during a busy time, or simple, old fashioned molotov coctails thrown through window in a number of bookstores, could indeed kill/injure many customers and employees. If I'm an employer and have received credible threats, I go to the FBI and then maybe don't carry the magazine (though I wouldn't announce it to the press). Suppose your son or daughter worked in a Border's that was defiant in the face of these threats; would you feel threatend?
If OTOH, this is a pre-emptive surrender (i.e., no threats received) then Borders deserves all the contempt heaped upon it.
BTW - this is TODAY; but back in the '20's, Al Capone and other mobsters fairly routinely fire bombed establishments that wouldn't pay protection money, or carry only that mob's illegal booze and the Chicago PD was so corrupt they got away with it for years, as witness the fact that the FEDS finally convicted Capone, not for murder or extortion, but for income tax evasion.
Obviously the two situations are not exactly parallel (especially the bars carrying which mob's brand of booze is concerned) but I'm simply pointing out that there is a history of murderous sons of bitch cowards getting away with this kind of extortion.
Ok, flame away.

Whell, my first gut reaction, is that the protection of employees is important.

So while it appears that Walden's and Borders have caved in, the intimidation of bookstores by enemies of the state represents a moral issue of western culture.

If I were a bookstore owner, I would certainly consider the safety of the employees and customers, for to ignore such a threat could be construed as negligence.

I wonder, did the authorities advise them to pull the magazines? Bookstores probably get threats from all sorts, so why cave in to the muslims? If they caved in to everybody, there would be no more books.

I wouldn't blame the bookstores without more information. However, it is certainly a grevious sign of the times. Perhaps thebookstores fear that the authorities cannot or will not protect them. So the deeper focus is not the bookshops, rather the forces that compel them to act.

On that Vote Blue website from just after the elections, did not both these chains give big tome to Dems canpaigns and JeffnK?

#136 Montaigne's Cat

the Koran may only be shelved on the top shelf

Any time I go in Borders or B&N (usually just to browse what to buy on Amazon, or using a XMAS gift card) I always do a little creative rearranging of books in the Mid-East and political sections. Next time I'm in Borders (not that I'll ever spend money in there again), I'll make sure to put the Koran in a more appropriate setting.

Last month, the Western Standard published the cartoons.

They are now being taken to the human rights commission by Imam Syed Soharwardy. He is arguing that only should the WS not have published the cartoons, the WS should not even defend publishing them.

The human rights commission should have laughed at Soharwardy and then shown him the door.

“For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority,”

I note with great interest the refusal to place blame properly. The phrasing is really interesting.

carrying this issue could challenge that priority.

Not:

Violent mobs of rioting Muslim extremists could challenge that priority.

If you're going to knuckle under, at least place the blame where it belongs - even phrasing it that way is insulting to the intelligence of any reasonable person.

Appeasement of those bent on dominating you will only serve to embolden them.

They gave the reason that they feared for their employees' and customers' safety if they sold the magazine featuring the dreaded cartoons. Nowhere did it say anything about Religious sensitivity, offensive nature of the cartoons, or any of the typical mealy-mouthed phrases that so many others have used.

I'm surprised at this very un-PC message. Translated into common English, its "We know how F*ed up in the head these crazy muslims are, and we don't want to p*ss those crazy f*ers off."

So call it Dhimmi, cowardly, or whatever. I'm pleased that they spoke the truth about why they chose not to sell the magazines. And I'm guessing that this statement is vastly different than the one CAIR would have written. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if this statement doesn't piss them off more than if the magazines had made their way onto the store shelves. CAIR has been outflanked.

134 Ferris
I applaud you for your idea. If you are able to carry out your plan I hope you let us know what the manager's response was. Good job.

Appeasement of those bent on dominating you will only serve to embolden them.

This has already happened, to the point that fear trumps all. The [bigoted word]s have already won.

My suggestion? Buy more ammo. We'll all need it sooner or later.

So if MAD Magazine has a cover with Aldred E. Newman with a bomb in is hair, a beard and looking like Muhammad, then I suppose they would pull that issue too.

#140 doss

I like to put Talmuds, the Psalms, and the Gospels on top of the Korans. Also Tao Te Chings and Buddhist sutras.

I think I will print out some MahometToons with a Free Inquiry logo and a paragraph describing the Borders capitulation and leave copies on the magazine racks and around the store.

I bet they have a hell of a lot of books that offend me.

Borders search

Lizards,

Along with the NastyGrams (tm) I'm sure you're sending to the cowards at B/WB, you might want to also write letters of support to FREE INQUIRY head Dr. Paul Kurtz here: PaulKurtz@aol.com

#146 sandbox

So if MAD Magazine has a cover with Aldred E. Newman with a bomb in is hair, a beard and looking like Muhammad, then I suppose they would pull that issue too.

You betcha. That missing front tooth would be the ultimate insult to the ROP. All hell would break loose. ;)

#140 Doss "I always do a little creative rearranging of books in the Mid-East and political sections." LOL, LOL!

There is a "cave" in Tora Bora www.google.ca...] target="_blank">where they could hide out.

/caveist

140 Doss

I'll make sure to put the Koran in a more appropriate setting.

That is a great idea!

hmmm. Which section would be most appropriate? Fiction, Fantasy, or do-it-yourself plumbing?

A sheet of toilet paper as a bookmark in each koran as a bookmark?

Is that what your sayin...?

#153 mich-again hmmm.

Which section would be most appropriate? Fiction, Fantasy, or do-it-yourself plumbing?

How about animal husbandry?

#130 buzzsawmonkey:

Go to the intersection of El Camino and Castro in Mountain View, California. Just below the left turn light, from El Camino north(?!?)bound to Castro southbound, is a trading-card sized sticker of the bomb-turban Mo.

Or, there was, before I moved out of California last month.

There are a hundred names for allah,
many more for snow...

#138 dahvid - "Perhaps thebookstores fear that the authorities cannot or will not protect them."
Gee ya think? I mean, look at how angry our government got over the reactions to the publication of the cartoons in the Danish Paper - yup, we said we believe in Freedom of Speech BUT must also be sensitive to the feelings of others.
When embassies were bombed and set ablaze over those
publications, some governments said "oh my, that's uncivilized". I wouldn't trust the locals or the Feds to protect all of my bookstores.
I did note in my #137, however, that if Border's hasn't received any sort of credible threat, then they just pre-emptively surrenderd and that is despicable, to put it mildly.

I didn't need another excuse not to patronize Borders; headquartered in Ann Arbor, MI (Moscow on the Huron), and it doesn't require any hygenie commitment from their employees. I guess they do provide a service keeping these thirty something, live with mom (or same sex partner), employed. Who else would hire someone with an master's in english lit who shows up to work in shorts reeking of dope?

129-rayra--sh-h-h don't tell anyone else...

Free Associating, I remember in the movie "12 Monkeys" there were posters of I think the different 12 monkeys plastered all over Philadelphia. It was a preview of the danger that was to come. This discussion of the 12 cartoons that we can't be allowed to see reminds me of that movie.

#140 Doss

#136 Montaigne's Cat

the Koran may only be shelved on the top shelf

Any time I go in Borders or B&N (usually just to browse what to buy on Amazon, or using a XMAS gift card) I always do a little creative rearranging of books in the Mid-East and political sections. Next time I'm in Borders (not that I'll ever spend money in there again), I'll make sure to put the Koran in a more appropriate setting.

I luvvv it!

:^D

OT: AntiAmerican & AntiSemitic Congresswoman McKinney Punches Cop Cynthia McKinney allegedly slugs a cop
Atlanta Business Chronicle ... I deeply regret that the incident occurred. I have demonstrated my support for them in the past and I continue to support them now." According to DrudgeReport.com, the entire incident is on tape. Drudge said, "The cop is pressing charges, and the USCP (United States Capitol Police) are waiting until Congress adjourns to arrest her, a source claims."

#163 Baldy

Michelle Malkin blogged it earlier and it seems McKinney has issued a quasi-apology:

***1050pm EST update: McKinney responds..."Earlier today I had an unfortunate confrontation with a Capitol Hill Police Officer...I was urgently trying to get to an important meeting on time to fulfill my obligations to my constituents. Unfortunately, the Police Officer did not recognize me as a Member of Congress and a confrontation ensued. I did not have on my Congressional pin but showed the Police Officer my Congressional ID. I know that Capitol Hill Police are securing our safety, that of thousands of others, and I appreciate the work that they do. I deeply regret that the incident occurred. I have demonstrated my support for them in the past and I continue to support them now."***

Queen of the Unhinged

Nevermind. I read your post and saw something entirely different.

My eyes are old and bent...

Someone should tell Borders that Muslims Don't Like Nudity Either or PIGS I'm sure they have books on Cocktails also... Where does it end?

#147 Montaigne's Cat

I like to put Talmuds, the Psalms, and the Gospels on top of the Korans. Also Tao Te Chings and Buddhist sutras.

I think I will print out some MahometToons with a Free Inquiry logo and a paragraph describing the Borders capitulation and leave copies on the magazine racks and around the store.

Great idea...like the one about cartoon stickers someone had above. A few years ago, I made a bunch of Boycott France things I put on the grocery shelves near the Perrier and near the cheeses. As for where to relocate the Koran, I think right next to some Mapplethorpe book sounds about right.

#129 rayra 3/29/2006 08:09PM PST

280++ highly accurate gliding bombs, individually targetted and dropped from a SINGLE B-2.

/imagining a single pass across North Korea

Imagine a squadron mission at two a.m.! Wow.

There's a little hope ...

#170 The Fourth Photo

# 140 Doss

Wait - the English version has to be on the top shelf too? I thought the English version isn't "authentic" because of the whole "transliteration" thing?

The PsyOps vs Islam blogger is probably in deep trouble.

I was pissed at Free Inquiry and the Council for Secular Humanism a while back when they sent me this unbelievably shitty e-mail singing the praises of George Galloway after his perjurious testimony to the U.S. Congress. I told them to remove me from their e-mail list and never, ever contact me again. Despite three requests, they never did take me off their list.

I hope they're finally coming around and realizing that the number one threat to liberty, not to mention reason and secularism, is not Christians and George W. Bush.

I NEVER go to either store. Never. Borders makes me feel like a lumberjack at a tea party, for some reason. I'd feel more comfortable at a biker bar, and I don't even drink. Waldonbooks is in malls, and I never go to malls. Screw 'em.

I'm happy to see that Amazon.com carries it. I do "go" there a lot.

B&N doesn't seem to be saying they won't carry it. Hope they don't wimp out on this, because I do go there sometimes - just bought a copy of The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (And the Crusades) at my local B&N.

Just another obvious blatant attempt to appease the enemy of this world. Go figure.

What else is new? Maybe they should just go ahead and launch a brown paperbag book section. Or maybe they should open up separate reading rooms, Infidel and Muslim. Infidels to the backrooms!

#134 ferris,

Borders sells its books online through Amazon. Better try plan non-B.

Are those bookstores are French owned?

I have submitted the following comment to Borders.

I am profoundly disappointed in your decision to censor yourself by refusing to carry the April-May edition of Free Inquiry. That decision was bad enough in itself, but you succeeded in adding insult to injury by your Orwellian statement that “We absolutely respect our customers’ right to choose what they wish to read and buy and we support the First Amendment,” Bingham said. “And we absolutely support the rights of Free Inquiry to publish the cartoons. We’ve just chosen not to carry this particular issue in our stores.”

I want you to know that your decision does not come without consequences. You have chosen not carry that particular issue and I have chosen never again set foot in your stores. You have lost me forever as a customer. You do not deserve to be in the book selling business. Hopefully enough other people will make the same decision I have and you will no longer have to worry about not selling books because nobody will be buying them from you.

#158 realwest

Your points are well taken. Regarding your comment:

"I did note in my #137, however, that if Border's hasn't received any sort of credible threat, then they just pre-emptively surrenderd and that is despicable, to put it mildly. "

The way I see it is that Borders is a business. They are not a military company, just a bookshop. Speculation as to the nature of any alleged threat is a moot point.

You are free to start your own bookshop and display those cartoons. I would applaude you if you did.

#172 Abdullah al-Libi
Heh. I remember a site a couple years ago where this group of guys did target practice with a Koran. I think goatse finding a Koran might not be to the liking of the [bigoted word]s.

I'm toying with the idea of buying a koran to keep in my car so that I can rip a page out to wrap my gum up in when I'm done with it.
Does that make me a bad guy?
I love the idea of rearranging the bookstore's shelves! Put the bible or the talmud on top of it! priceless, stealthy, and everyone can do it!

Here's a chance to put your money where your mouth is. On Mark Steyn's website he points out about the Western Standard being sued by the Alberta Human Rights division. The Canadian taxpayer is funding this suit against the Western Standard initiated by Saudi imam Syed Soharwardy. Even if the Western Standard wins it'll still have to bear the legal costs (about $75,000). Mark Steyn asks us to contribute to the legal defense fund. If every LGF reader contributed just $1, they'd be covered. If you're for freedom of expression this is an easy way to support it. [Link: www.marksteyn.com...] and see the Western Standard [Link: westernstandard.blogs.com...]

E-mail Borders, tell them you will never set foot in one of their stores again, and stick to it. Tell everyone you know to do the same. Shut these fuggers down! They operate bookstores , fer Chrissake sake!

Sorry, Christians, I hope I didn't offend any of you and thereby cause you to riot in the streets and kill people who remind you of me. I meant for Allah's sake. (Peach bean a pod hymn).

Folks, we are on the slippery slope and sliding downward at about 60 mph and accelerating. If we don't draw the line at dhimmified bookstores, we ain't never gonna draw the line.

#183 PIMF (my first, and surely not my last).

Chrissake sake is a Japanese Christmas drink. I meant to write Chrissake.

#178 Real Richard

Funny, I just sent a letter that was almost identical!
Great minds think alike. (well, not that I pretend to have a great mind...but, my real name is richard too, so maybe that's the link)
Anyways I hope they get 10,000 more!

Have long refused to buy anything at Borders
now I will boycott Waldens. Amazing how the politically correct self-censor. The last redoubt of freedom of expression is the internet and Google has caved in too and I do not visit Google either.

Well, there. I sent them an e-mail. Called them craven, chicken, cowardly, not upholding freedom of expression, yada yada, no cuss words.

Some poor schleps in customer service must be rolling their eyes right now, because I am sure they are getting a number of messages that are not what they are used to.

#181 redshirt

I'm toying with the idea of buying a koran to keep in my car so that I can rip a page out to wrap my gum up in when I'm done with it

CAIR is nice enough to provide free Korans for desecration, though I wouldn't give a home address, even with a fake name.

#188 Doss

True that!

Although, I know a few jerks I would like to have some mailed too...

#166 rayra - "Why do you give the bookshops a pass? They are quick to bleat and strut about 'Freee Speeech!' when they choose to feature crap like the Little Red Book."
Well for one thing, I don't recall the Little Red Book or Mein Kampf as leading people to become sploydopes, whereas Muslims seem to want to riot and burn and destroy over damn near anything (when they're not busy seething, of course).
And as I've said above in this thread #137 and #158, if (and that's a big if right now) Border's had received credible threats of bombings, burnings, etc. then I would be more sympathetic to Borders for the reasons I ennuciated in my #137.
And, unfortunately, going around heavily armed with mucho ammo won't help anyone if some coward in the back of the store turns sploydope on you (although with good reactons time and aim, going out after the molotov cocktail thrower with such arms and ammo would help thin the herd).
I honestly think our government really needs to fully and completely get behind Freedom of Speech and Press and stick it to Muslims who would go violent over same. Maybe deny the death sentance to these cowards so they don't get to be martyrs, but just multi-use bitches in prison for the rest of their lives.

#140 Doss

Do they let you take books into the bathrooms at Borders?

Pardon the OT post but,

Do you think the South Park guys will tackle this topic? It could be the single greatest act of satire and patriotism in history!

#166 Raya

"Why do you give the bookshops a pass? They are quick to bleat and strut about 'Freee Speeech!' when they choose to feature crap like the Little Red Book. But have the muslim fanatics even hint at aything and they abase themselves in rank cowardice. "

Points well taken indeed. Please do start a bookshop and publish those cartoons!Call it the 'Freee Speeech!' antiquarian Bookseller.

I don't think that this is PC cowardice at work, but an open acknowledgement that Muslims are scarey as hell. People who work in chain bookstores do so because it's a job, not (in general) because of some higher calling as a guardian of free speech. Expecting their employers to invite physical attacks on them by religious fanatics is unrealistic.

Look, I believe in the freedom of religion, too, but I don't think that French Jews who don't wear yarmulkes in public out of fear of being murdered are PC cowards.

#190 redshirt

Although, I know a few jerks I would like to have some mailed too...

If someone's a jerk already, the Koran will just make 'em worse. Sign them up for gay porn instead.

Regarding my own #148

I bet they have a hell of a lot of books that offend me.

I searched and searched and found nothing that caused me to burn anything or kill anyone.

Borders and Waldenbooks you are restricting freedom not advancing it.

The equivalent of not selling this book or magazine is to burn it.

Let me get this straight. A magazine I've never heard of, not being sold, at a venue I never frequent. Excuse me if I don't get my knickers in a twist over this.
If the local, arab owned, convienience store refuses to stock Molson, because thier moslem conscience won't allow it, then I get pissed.

#138 dahvid 3/29/2006 08:19PM PST

...I wouldn't blame the bookstores without more information. However, it is certainly a grevious sign of the times. Perhaps thebookstores fear that the authorities cannot or will not protect them. So the deeper focus is not the bookshops, rather the forces that compel them to act.

I'm apparently not as "nuanced" as you are. To me, the bookstores are just plain wrong to make decisions based on fear, at the expense of liberty. You either uphold and fight for freedom, or you bend over right now and prepare yourself to submit to tyranny. One step at a time, the road leads to submission, fear, and loss of our freedoms, and I don't plan to take that first step.

I'm more with Patrick Henry on this (and I do think it is that important):

If we were base enough to desire it, it is now too late to retire from the contest. There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! Our chains are forged! Their clanking may be heard on the plains of Boston! The war is inevitable--and let it come! I repeat it, sir, let it come.

It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace-- but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!

Interestingly, a search on the Waldenbooks website for Mein Kampf resulted in several hits.

I guess they are for free speech when it involves world domination and genocide, just not when a few muslims are insulted by pictures which are, to be honest, benign.

#183 Mike Z as in Jersey 3/29/2006 09:02PM PST

"E-mail Borders, tell them you will never set foot in one of their stores again, and stick to it"

I'm way ahead of you, I've disliked Borders for years.

#129 rayra

btw...250-lb bomb, JDAM, with a diamond-outline airfoil that gives it a horizontal glide capability in excess of 40mi... something like an F-15E can carry FOUR of them where one larger bomb went before.

...a year ago, the B-2 completed validation testing for dropping 80 500-lb JDAMs. It's carrying capacity would then be 280++ of the things.

280++ highly accurate gliding bombs, individually targetted and dropped from a SINGLE B-2.

VDH: ...On the first day of the war the United States was trying to avoid targeting civilians, avoiding infrastructure as much as possible, and waging a supposed war of liberation rather than one of punitive annihilation.

I believe peace is attained by wars of punitive annihilation.

Buuld some walls while we're at it.

200 Brutus

Related, and your post made me think of it.

I have a button that says "People are more violently opposed to fur than leather because it's safer to harass rich women than motorcycle gangs."

My Aussie pal just informed me that if I can't obtain my favorite adult beverage, it will be impossible to "get pissed"

Shows what I know.

OT: Hostage only selectively Naive

[Link: www.winnipegsun.com...]

Just say it: The CPT dirtbag was a knowning seditionist and get it over with

#176 reader

Thanks for the heads up. There's a Barnes and Noble's right across the street from the local Borders. I'll check and see if they carry this magazine and if they do, I guess I'll buy my books there.

If that doesn't work, I'll have to figure out Plan C.

#199 Cattt

Bravo! Right on! Patrick Henry was one of my heroes (got me in trouble for being uppity, too).

Err..they hanged Mr. Henry, didn't they?

Since you are braver and of greater spirit then please do lead the way! Be the first bookstore to proudly display the cartoons in large 3-D color prints in your storefront!

Talk is cheap, let's see some action, now!

MAY I SUGGEST a Polite Telephone Campaign?

The realm of possibility means that maybe, just maybe, a "renegade" Borders or Waldenbooks might have the April-May issue of Free Inquiry magazine in stock, in defiance of Corporate HQ:

I suggest contacting them.

Waldenbooks Store Locator
[Link: www.bordersstores.com...]

Borders Store Locator
[Link: www.bordersstores.com...]

Indeed, ask if they have the issue. If not, politely find out why not. If that requires speaking to a manager, great!

Perhaps the manager would be willing to explain the statement from Borders Group:
For us, the safety and security of our customers and employees is a top priority, and we believe that carrying this issue could challenge that priority...

I'd really want to know how safety and security could be impaired by carrying this particular magazine. And who would do such a thing?

Borders ticker symbol is BGP. You might catch their attention by discussing this topic on the Yahoo chat board for the stock.

#208 rayra 3/29/2006 09:37PM PST

" #194 dahvid 3/29/2006 09:18PM PST
[rayra's a chickenhawk!]
oh piss off. I've already done enough danger-duty, both in the Marines and in mixing right in the heart of foul LLLiberal demonstrations to document them for everyone else (and will be continuing and expanding those efforts), that your little smug POS post is laughable on its face."

Raya, You are scared (chiken) to open a bookshop and display the cartoons! Admit it, big bbbad raya, your are scared. Talk is cheap, let's see you do what you disparage others for not doing. When you back up your mouth, then I will respect your words, foul as they are.

93 Sil 3/29/2006 07:38PM PST
I'm also tempted to find a Borders and stack a few books on pig-raising on top of their Korans. Think they'd mind?
***
Now that would make things clearer to Infidels, but you really want to upset the Jihadists? Put Dog books there.

First Piglet Then Lassie?

Dogs are also considered ritually impure by Muslims. In fact, according to this ruling, it's easier to remove the ritual impurity associated with pigs than that associated with dogs.

"With regard to how to cleanse oneself of pig-related impurity, some scholars are of the view that it should be washed seven times, one of which should be with earth, by analogy with dogs.

But the correct view is that pig-related impurity should be washed only once"

I mean Dogs are FAR more impure than Pigs

209 dahvid

First, no, Patrick Henry was not hanged. He died a natural death in his 60s.

And second, I am not a bookstore, so I can't hang anything in my window.

Third, you don't know me. If you did, you'd know better than to assume I don't meet words with action.

After my ex and I were separated, he said to me - remember how I used to not want you to go charging into situations, challenging people, speaking up? Well - I was wrong and you were right (he was kind of a chicken).

One day, talking to a bunch of people, in response to a question, I said "oh I couldn't do that - I'm too shy." The resulting loud laughter from everyone who heard me attracted the attention of other groups. I truly didn't realize I was THAT - aggressive. Well, I am.

So save your mealymouthed backstabbing advice for someone you know something about, k?

Sounding off here is helpful for venting also nice are emails to corporate addresses I sent one here

ccare@bordersstores.com

We support the First Amendment?

Don't make me laugh it hurts too much. I will reserve my literary purchases to
Barne's and Noble and Amazon.com hence forth.

"⌠We absolutely respect our customers▓ right to choose what they wish to read
and buy and we support the First Amendment,■ Bingham said. ⌠And we absolutely
support the rights of Free Inquiry to publish the cartoons. We▓ve just chosen
not to carry this particular issue in our stores.■

"We've just chosen not to carry this particular issue in our stores."

What a VALIANT defence of the Principles of the Freedom of Thought, Speech and
Belief, of the Individual and what a craven collapse of a moral defence of the
values of Western Civilization.

All that is necessary for Evil to Triumph is for Good Men to Stay Silent.

Let it be said that when the Principles of Western Civilization were under
attack Borders and Waldenbooks were not only silent, they were Self-Gagged.

Daniel William Kauffman Jr

Go Thou and Do Likewise

212 dahvid

You're projecting.

This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang, but a whimper.

Gas Explosion Injures at Least 12 in Haifa

[Link: israelnn.com...]

May your injuries be healed as quick as the wind.

209 dahvid

Cattt

Thanksfor the history lesson. Regarding your personal problems, perhaps you should see a doctor.

Ad homenim attacks notwithstanding, the pith of it is that you are railing against a business for not displaying those cartoons, but you won't do so yourself. Would you expose another to a danger that you would not accept yourself? Talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words.

#218 Avner

Not good. Probably a strike.

Y'know what? I just had an out-of-the-blue memory. I posted a comment about the exact topic of this thread -- months and months ago -- about bookstore dhimmitude. But Charles' search function doesn't seem to be working properly, so I can't link to it.

Ayway, I related an experience in which a bookstore employee related to me that they wouldn't stock a certain book -- I believe it was Robert Spencer's Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam -- because they didn't want Muslims to "blow up the store." And this person was of course a total dhimmified moonbat who claimed to be oh-so-multicultural. Yet in reality they lived in terror of Muslims, so much so that they actually made inventory decisions based on that fear.

It's the invisible creeping dhimmitude that's the worst -- the stuff you never see.

221 zombie

I remember it. I don't think it was that long ago.

ZOMBIE

Email me - have something to discuss with you.

Other stuff OT -
This is kinda cool!

If this has been posted, sorry! Remember that Borders would not sell 'Unfit for Command', and that their union had a bulletin board bragging about what they were doing, that was made public?

There is just no way we would ever go to either...

#219 Dahvid

The question should not, I think, be whether any of us would have the balls to stand out on a street corner tomorrow with a poster of the cartoons. The question is whether any of us, heading up one of the largest booksellers in the U.S.A., would unilaterally pull a magazine which we otherwise customarily carry, and announce that we were doing so? Given the likelihood that, once one goes down that path, there is no end in sight, I for one think that I would make the business decision to continue stocking the magazine. If any of my employees had received remotely credible threats based on this action, I would be loudly and publicly stating that this had happened and demanding that our government take a stand to support and protect our position. I would also keep my employees informed about the threats, and invite them to cease working for my organization if their concerns were too much for them to handle. In short, I would use my position to take a stand for free speech, derive positive publicity from doing so, and invite my employees to be heroes alongside of me, proudly facing the risks that come from being a seller of books in a free society. Now maybe that is wishful thinking on my part; we will never know because bookselling is not the business I am in. But my honest belief is that I would take such a stand, both out of personal pride and out of a desire to serve my country in its hour of need.

222 rayra

But isn't assaulting a police officer a breach of the peace?

#216 Cattt 3/29/2006 09:54PM PST
"212 dahvid

You're projecting."

Yes, Cattt, astral projecting, hovering over your head imploring your to open that dang bookstore.

So I'm "projecting", eh? Hmmm...sounds like some of that LLL new age comie indoctrination lingo.

No but seriously, I admit that I am scared to open that bookshop as we all are. In case you misunderstood my point, the bookstore is a symptom and I want to get at the cause. I want those cartoons displayed just as much as everyone else.

221 zombie

You were right. It was from 9/14/05.

#198 lummox 3/29/2006 09:27PM PST

Let me get this straight. A magazine I've never heard of, not being sold, at a venue I never frequent. Excuse me if I don't get my knickers in a twist over this.
If the local, arab owned, convienience store refuses to stock Molson, because thier moslem conscience won't allow it, then I get pissed

Just driving by on the way home. I saw this post and just had to say. Your nic fits you well!

#230 Ben-Ami

But isn't assaulting a police officer a breach of the peace?

Usually it's much worse than a similar assault on a civilian. Special statutory provisions often cover attacks on police officers.

Waiting for Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson to inject race into this story in 3... Have they done it already? What's taking so long?

#234 Beagle

Waiting for Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson to inject race into this story in 3... Have they done it already? What's taking so long?

McKinney already did that.

#99 Buckaroo

OBL probably believes that the earth is round (though one never knows with these Islamo-fundy types [Link: albawabaforums.com...] ).

Anyway, getting back on topic, if this silly bookstore had simply put out said magazine on its shelves and not said anything, changes are pretty good that nobody would have ever noticed or cared.

So now the bookstore has a triple loss: They've lost sales of the magazine, lost credibility in terms of supporting free speech, and lost their self respect. They've gone out of their way to shoot themselves in the foot.

This really is one of those hard lines in the sand. Where is the solidarity?

#212 davidh

So the only way someone can win this debate is by quickly opening a book store to sell the magazine in question?

There must be a Latin term for that type of idiotic argument. Can't think of it offhand.

Seems like dahvid needs to join lummox. On their knees, with the sword at their neck, then it may turn on the light in the dim little space between their ears. Morons.

#235 rayra

driving cross country there are signs advertizing little america in the midwestern states of say idaho, nebraska, etc.

Maybe this fella needs a geography lesson. Idaho is Rocky mountain/Pacific Northwest. Not "midwest"...

#219 dahvid
you are railing against a business for not displaying those cartoons, but you won't do so yourself. Would you expose another to a danger that you would not accept yourself? Talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words.

I can't grasp why you're attacking Rayra of all people. He's one of the few individuals here to actually get out of his chair and do something about the culture wars we're involved in. It's absurd to accuse him of hypocrisy.

Besides which, the bookstore industry as a whole is going down the drain, and only a fool would open a bookstore nowadays, especially just to prove a tiny point about cartoons to an anonymous commenter. We each do what we can do in this Battle of Civilizations. Not everyone can be an actual front-line soldier in the culture wars. But the medics and the spies and the analysts and the cryptographers and the people at home with victory gardens -- all of them are engaged in the battle, and each is above criticism.

As for displaying the cartoons: I don't have a bookstore, but is this good enough for you?

#236 solomonpanting

McKinney already did that.

You know who wanted her detained don't you?

The J-E-W-S!

/McKinney Sr.

Contacting Borders:

[Link: www.bordersstores.com...]

brdsales@bordersgroupinc.com

Call 877.254.9229

Mail to:

Borders Corporate & Educational Sales
100 Phoenix Drive
Ann Arbor, MI 48108-9876

#232 Earth2moonbat
221 zombie
You were right. It was from 9/14/05.

THANK YOU! I couldn't find it by myself.

It's so on-point and topical for this thread, that I think it really merits a re-posting. Excuse me to everyone's who read this last year:

I was chatting with a friend of mine who just happens to be a buyer for a Bay Area bookstore. This person has a 100% moonbat quotient (which is why I feel free to post this here, since the chance that they read LGF is zero). While we were discussing various popular books, my friend blurted out, "And have you heard of this book The Politically Correct Guide to Islam? Unbelievable! I mean, they're actually selling it on Amazon!"

I said, "Not only are they selling it on Amazon, but it's in the top ten nonfiction books in the country."

Friend: "Really? You've heard about it?"

Me: "Of course. It was #16 on the NY Times bestseller list last week!"

Friend: (Mouth drops open in utter shock) "I... I flipped through it and couldn't believe what I was seeing. Stuff like, Does Islam promote violence? YES! I mean, who does this guy think he is?"

Me: "Robert Spencer, the author? He's actually pretty knowledgable."

(Climactic comment coming...)

Friend: "I mean, if I were to stock that book, this place would get blown up!"

In one phrase, my friend summed up the battle before us. The Muslims will not need to force us into dhimmitude, for we shall plunge ourselves into dhimmitude willingly, without even being asked.

And why? Because it all comes down to the cowardice of the moonbat. They "sympathize" with the terrorists and "justify" terrorism and "hope to feed the crocodile so that they are eaten last" because on some deep level they are deathly afraid of the violence they know the Islamists are capable of. Dhimmitude is the child of fear, and fear is the child of personal cowardice.

The moonbats, entirely as a result of their self-centered cowardly fear, have all become quislings ready to betray the entire civilization for just a few more years of hedonism.

They have ceded the playground to the bullies.

They are offering tributes of submission to a distant tribe they've never met but whose reputation they fear.

It's bad enough when a nation has a single quisling amongst its ranks; but when 40% of the population are quislings, you have a Code 5 Situation on your hands.

The Terror Threat color ranking may only be at yellow, but the Quisling Threat color ranking is at luminsecent magenta/neon green epilepsy-inducing pulsating checkerboard.

BOHICA, Borders.

Bend
Over
Here
It
Comes
Again

Tonights South Park was about the funniest one I've ever seen.

Liberals are smug!

Let's try this again:

ZOMBIE

Email me - have something to discuss with you.

zombie

Here's the link you were looking for.

#227 rays

Yes, pay attention folks.

1) Raya, when you say that you have already backed-up your mouth, you are evading the issue by infering that military service exonerates you from civil discourse.

2)You say that you have already backed up your mouth. Please be specific, have you opened a bookstore and displayed the cartoons?

3) While my posts have been lively in the spirit of open free thinking debate, yours are meanspirited,n hateful and designed to bait me.

While your military service is admirable, it does not automatically make you right about everything. Some people jon the military because they love to kill and inflict pain, and then continue when the war is over because they miss the fun. So miltary service does not automatically make one an angel in my opinion.

If you want to debate in a civilized manner that is fine, otherwise I can simply ignore you.

OT - I'm going to bed again, but found this: Youths Break Into Agence France-Presse

"We all want to break the system, whether the violence is physical or symbolic," Halima said...Several of those detained were carrying iron bars, pickaxe handles, chisels, tear gas canisters or knives, they said.

Halima? Hmmm. Lovely old Gaullic name, that is.

Here's more where Halima links these French riots to the Muslim riots last year:

"There has to be a stop to the use of this vague concept of 'trouble-makers'. It's not gratuitous violence. It's a way of expressing a political point of view, as happened in the suburbs in November," a student who gave her identity as Halima told AFP reporters.

Link in #252

#248 AngryAmerican

Let's try this again:
ZOMBIE
Email me - have something to discuss with you.

No, you email me at any combination of letters at zombietime dot com.

After getting hacked by jihadis who used the IP routing info from an email they tricked me into sending one of them, I don't send out emails to random people I don't know anymore. No offense to you personally, but I simply have to be hyper-paranoid. If you got the kind of mail I get, you'd understand.

#250 david

Have you opened a bookstore and not displayed the cartoons?

GOOD MORNING, INFIDELS!

I wake up this morning and what do I see? The United Nations has "demanded" that I to give up my pursuit of Nuclear Development. I am eating the breakfast while I type this, and let me tell, you, it is the hard to eat and laugh so hard your sides hurt at the same time! Please, somebody write the another comment about the dreaded "strongly worded letter"! My fellow Lizards, we have much in the common. Triangulation does strange things, no?
Well, I must to go soon-the populace isn't going to just oppress itself--but say Hi to your man El-Baradei for me. I haven't seen him for the nearly eight days. I hope he is okay. It would be a shame for him to get killed just as his plans are to coming together. Oh, and please to give my thanks to Kojo if you see him--tell him the car is FANTASTIC. It is quite the chick-magnet.

Death to America, Death to the Jews, Yadda, Yadda...

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
President,
Islamic Republic of Iran

p.s. what in fuck is a "jamahiriya?"

#242 Zombie

Zombie,

Please be specific regarding your charge that I am "attacking" raya. I am truly confused as to how you arrived at that deduction.

If you objectively read my posts and those directed towards me and you will see that I have been viciously attacked here, especially by raya.

I agree with everyone here, it is just that some do not understand my point. There is a knee-jerk reflex here to hurl hateful recriminations at friends. Who said "Let he who is without sin be the first to cast a stone?" Do I really deserve to be attacked like this, come on now, be fair.

If you actually read the posts then you will understand and your apology is not needed. Keep up the good work.

Well, I just got to the party so I haven't read all the post's...but I found this interesting:

#250 Dahvid

Some people jon the military because they love to kill and inflict pain, and then continue when the war is over because they miss the fun.

In all my years in the Military, and all the great servicemen and women I've known...I have never met one person that joined the military because they loved to kill and
inflict pain...

I swear, I don't know where you guys come up with this shit?

"I hope you will understand and you will save yourself from the deepest place in hell"

Like that zombie?

I can identify. ;-)

I was once informed on the CAIR discussion board before it got deep sixed that

quote

"There are now hundreds of the faithful, praying to Allah on a daily basis that your Soul be Ripped Shrieking from your Body by the Angel of Darkness and Thrown into the Bottomless Pit of Endless Torment"

With complete instructions on how exactly to perform and phrase such a prayer so that Allah would be more likely to hear and grant it for those who wished to join in the Supplication to Allah Jihad.

They also gave me a neat new username instead of my usual

Kentuckydan, I was referred to as Kentucky Fried Caffir,

Cool ;-)

#243 Beagle

/McKinney Sr.

Something I wasn't aware of

Cynthia McKinney's political career began in 1986 when her father, state representative Billy McKinney, submitted her name as a write-in candidate for a Georgia State House district. She received approximately 40% of the popular vote, despite the fact that she lived in Jamaica at the time with then-husband Coy Grandison...

Nothing like an initial tainted send-off from dear old Dad!

Sent just now to: brdsales@bordersgroupinc.com

Dear Waldenbooks and Borders,

I am deeply applaud at your action to appease the tyrants and enemies of this great country. I am sure you have heard from many previous customers as word of this story spreads across the internet. I in no way agree with your decision to not carry the April-May issue of the Free Inquiry. Although I am personally unfamiliar with this publication, I think removing one issue only because an artist uses free speech to illustrate the true meaning behind the islamic 'faith'. How many books/magazines/other publications that actually demoralized this world do you all hold back. Example: gay/lesbian agendas.

A quick search of the borders.com site through amazon revealed beyond gay erotica available. This is appalling and this company should be ashamed of itself. If you want to worry about the future of our children, why don't we start by giving them strong morals to grow on, and not supporting the enemies of our soldiers and citizens.

#250 dahvid

Some people jon the military because they love to kill and inflict pain

Dig a deeper hole with baseless slander.

/Got Plan B?

#262 Freaking spell check changing my word o applaud!
Its sent, what can I do now...

#242 Zombie

"As for displaying the cartoons: I don't have a bookstore, but is this good enough for you?"

Zombie, you are awesome, thanks. Even publishing on the internet, while not the same as opening a brick and mortar shop, is truly commendable.

This all reminds me of going into a Borders bookstore in the Milwaukee airport in the summer of '05. The election season was sizzling hot.

The store was "manned" by men of Middle Eastern Appearance, uniformly hostile.

ALL the political books, in a VERY prominent display up front, were Leftoid trash. NOT ONE BOOK from the Republican side was on view, or even on the shelves. I asked one of the OMEAs if they carried Unfit for Command, and he stared at me with cold dislike as he said No. Bugger gave me the fantods.

Which reminds me of Aunt Pittypat's immortal reaction when she had to refugee south out of Atlanta: "Yankees in Georgia! How did they ever get here?!"

WTF has happened to OUR COUNTRY?

As I said earlier, if they simply hadn't drawn attention to this particular magazine issue, probably nobody would ever have known about it. I've never even heard of this magazine before. . .I'm guessing not a lot of yahoo Islamist types read it.

But aprt from that, I really don't know what this bookstore is afraid of.

Seriously. Have there been any cartoon related incidences of Muslim violence in the USA? Are there likely to be? This late in the game?

Suppose (for the sake of argument) that some Islamists found out about said blasphemous cartoons of bomb-hat and threatened the bookstore. The store could just publicize those threats, and the backlash against them would be immense.

#259 DesertSage 3/29/2006 10:50PM PST

dahvid is a raving, slobbering, registered moonbat liberal.

#242 Zombie

Please be specific regarding your charge that I am "attacking" Israel. I am truly confused as to how you arrived at that deduction.

If you objectively read my speeches and those directed towards me and you will see that I have been viciously attacked here, especially by the Zionists.

I agree with everyone here, it is just that some do not understand my point. There is a knee-jerk reflex here to hurl hateful recriminations at friends. Who said "Let he who is without sin be the first to cast a stone?" Do I really deserve to be attacked like this, come on now, be fair.

If you actually read the speeches then you will understand and your apology is not needed. Keep up the good work.

Death to America, Death to the Jews, Yadda, Yadda...

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
President,
Islamic Republic of Iran

#268 Robert D

dahvid is a raving, slobbering, registered moonbat liberal.

Does he like the smell of his own farts?

#254 zombie

Understand the security issue.

I'll giv'r a try.

#235 rayra

Iwas stopped and shaken-down by the cops while driving through..probably because of my jewsh nose and olive complesion...

Bet you bullets to Navy beans that "dahvid" isn't Jewish at all.

Yes, Borders and Walden Books have legitimate concerns about safety. This does not excuse their conduct. They need to acknowledge that freedom of expression (and conscience and thought) is a right fraught with the greivous risk of offending someone. And heaven forbid if that someone is Muslim.

Well guess what Borders? All freedoms come with risk. All worthwhile principles eventually have a price. If you are not willing to carry your miniscule share of the risk, get out of the bookselling business and don't insult our intelligence with your sniveling and hypocritical reference to the First Amendment. Sorry Mr. Conflicted, Screwed-up-Values Bookseller, but you won't convince me that your employees are at any greater risk than the 7-Eleven clerk, who might be killed or injured, not because of cartoons, but because his cash register contains a twenty dollar bill that some junkie needs for his next fix. Your cynical slight of freedom in favor of some abstract and conjectural security rings hollow when we realize that there are policemen and firefighters who sometimes risk their lives to protect your stores and employees, because the freedom you rely on for your existence means more to them than it does to you. Yes, it is all well and good that nineteen year old boys risk life and limb in battle defending a right that you apparently don't think is worth the trouble.

Well, Walden Wussies, every decent man and woman in America who does anything worthwhile does so without a guarantee of security. Emergency room nurses risk HIV infected needle sticks and having TB coughed into their faces. The truck drivers that bring the books to your stores for sale risk driving off the road in a snowstorm. The construction worker that builds your stores risks industrial accidents. Hell, some people are killed just driving to work, period. Yet you think you should be spared the risk of doing worthwhile things, and hold freedom of expression at arms length to spare yourself the prospect of offending a Muslim. Yep, freedom is great as long as someone else pays for it.

Really, you Borders and Waldens cowards, what do you tell your children? How are they ever to know that there are people in the world who live according to principle? Who will teach them to be honorable and responsible citizens, while you cower under your desk?

#239 Beagle

There must be a Latin term for that type of idiotic argument. Can't think of it offhand.

Reductio ad absurdem?

OT: Mexican Students Attack US

Three boys have been arrested on suspicion of assault with a deadly weapon for allegedly throwing chunks of concrete at officers during the incident at the school.

We have lost the west. Soon, the nation. Off to bed.

#273 z9z99

Don't to get your hijab in a wad. al-Borders and WaldenBurka will be just fine without your infidel business. Nobody needs you to pawing through the literature, anyway.

Really, Charles. Can't we to ban some of the infidels around here?

Death to America, Death to the Jews, Yadda, Yadda...

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
President,
Islamic Republic of Iran

263 Beagle

"#250 dahvid

Some people jon the military because they love to kill and inflict pain

Dig a deeper hole with baseless slander.

/Got Plan B"

Beagle, how much do you want to bet? I was reading about a serial killer in France who was an aristocrat who loved to kill and when the war stopped he became one of the most prolific serial killers of all time.

I won't waste my time here researching for you. This is not a place for reasonable discussion, more like freerepublic. I can tell from the posts here that I am not among friends and not welcome here.

I do recall an earlier post by an lgf'er wondering why one of your own went "over to the darkside and founded "lgfwatch.com" Hmmm...well you geniuses can puzzle with that.

Thank's for the education. I now understand why so many really, really despise some of you people.

#277 dahvid

Don't go! You are my only supporter on this forum!

Death to America, Death to the Jews, Yadda, Yadda...

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
President,
Islamic Republic of Iran

#277 dahvid

. I can tell from the posts here that I am not among friends and not welcome here.

No! It's not true. I know you are not Jewish, and I welcome you here! I need you here. I love you, dahvid!

Would you like to ride in my Mercedes tonight, you beautiful boy?

Death to America, Death to the Jews, Yadda, Yadda...

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
President,
Islamic Republic of Iran

#277 dahvid

Thank's for the education. I now understand why so many really, really despise some of you people.

What'd you have to go and bring the Koz Kids into this for?

#274 Lady of Shalott

That's a good one. We could probably add another ten if so inclined.

I'm actually more angry SFGate is still peddling the lie the riots were something other than an organized strategy by imams, organizations, and governments. Just as bad is the idiotic blurb on idolatry I've seen repeated hundreds of times. One second of reflection should make it obvious that's nothing but a big lie.

There was no reaction until the head of the snake decided it could capitalize on western weakness and ignorance.

Boy, oh boy, were they right.

Borders may be cowardly, but they're just following the examples set by the EU, UN, State Department, pundits, and politicians of every stripe.