Maybe they can get some pointers on 'cartoon rage' to protest the DaVinci Code.

Charles, I bet it doesn't even cross their radar screen to look and see if the people at the IIIT are affiliated with terrorism. Not everyone looks this stuff up as well as you do.

"Revering Mary" WTF?

Oh yeah, Maryam was muslim. Shouldn't it be "Reverting Maryam"?

If they just can see that we do not threaten them, maybe they will just play nice.
/Cardinal Chamberlain

Islamic & Catholic Perspectives in Dialogue

"Dialogue" =

"Submit to Allah, Infidel!"
"OK."

Maybe they can trade their black schmatas.

...and next on the agenda: The Reverend Jim Jones. How his real message got lost in all the bad publicity.

JWM

At least the Pope's Army book signing gets the top billing on the upcoming events page...

Probably just clueless, although it should be noted there was a Jesuit priest in Daniel Ortega Saavedra's 'Revolutionary Council' in Nicaragua.

On the other hand, both my new pastor, a Filipino priest, and our recently retired pastor, a nice Texas bred Irish-Polish man, both have mentioned Islam in less than favorable light in sermons. They, however, are rank and file type parish priests.

One block south of the Washington ComPost headquarters... don't expect any MSM coverage.

5 zombie

No, they won't do that at first. They will push to demonstrate all the similarities between our beliefs, and play nicey-nice. The submission demand will come later.

If Christian groups want to have a dialogue with Muslims it should involve issues concerning the persecution of Christians in Muslim societies. You cannot be a true Christian and accept Islam as a legitimate religion, since Islam is based on the principle of Muhammad being the last of God's prophets. If you think Muhammad was a prophet at all, you may not be a Muslim, but you can't really call yourself a Christian.

The Catholic Bishop of Buffalo has also fallen into the trap of opening a dialog with reps from the RoP. Very disheartening.

#7 jwm

...and next on the agenda: The Reverend Jim Jones.

I was going to say Madonna and Sinead O'Connor.

Too many Christian churches are transforming into support groups where the emphasis is put on "feeling good." I wouldn't be surprised if this meeting had lots of group hugs and Kumbaya's.

and a light non-alcoholic reception

The Catholics are even going to cut back on the alcoholic beverages for these a**wipes. Will not be many KoC members hanging around for this crap.

Are they clueless?

More likely than not.

Do they think it doesn't matter?

Probably.

My observations of some of these Catholic social organizations is they tend towards LLLeftist policies - which lumps them in the same corner as the other useful idiots who make nice with terror-huggers. I would not be the least bit surprised if these people fill the bill.

#13

You can still love your enemy (even if you dont accept their religious beliefs).

I don't see how its possible for real dialogue between Islam and Christianity since the text of the Koran itself is anti-Christian (and of course anti-Jewish).

The first question for Christian/Muslim dialogue, I would imagine, is to explain what the Koranic prohibition against Muslims befriending Christians means in the real world.

Birds of a feather flock together.

#13 mickthemick

Not sure I understand your post:

You cannot be a true Christian and accept Islam as a legitimate religion

A true Christian can accept that other religions are "legitimate religions" (i.e. not cults), but if someone calling himself a Christian accepts all the tenets of Islam, then that person is not a Christian. I mean, I accept Islam as a legitimate religion which has a pedophile caravan bandit as its prophet, an imperialist outlook (jihad), a requirement for domination (dhimma) of non-believers that leads to two-track rules of behavior (one for Muslims, one for infidels) instead of universal rules of behavior. Those reasons are why I am not a Muslim. I am not a Jew, Hindu, Buddhist, or Zoroastrian either, but I do not consider those beliefs illegitimate simply because I do not share them.

You know what kills me the most about this: "non-alcoholic beverages" will be served.

I often attend CIC masses and events -- they have excellent speakers and a beautiful chapel. I support their mission. However, this time around they're going to forgoe the wine usually served at the reception that follows.

Silly appeasement.

Still, I'm looking forward to seeing a radical Islamist in person.

#16

Let them try to put grape juice in our chalices while they're at it...

The people in the pews, and many rank-and-file priests, do "get it." Our parish is near an AF base and has a substantial military presence in the congregation. We have a young, well-read pastor. No anti-war rhetoric in our homilies...of course we can't convince him to come out and say "nuke the sob's" either.

Here's a curriculum vitae for a Father Francis Tiso.

PajamasMedia says don't miss Misha @ The Anti-Idiotarian Rotweiller who has a few choice (Warning: Very choice) words for Madonna and “the “bravery” exhibited among the feckless, “progressive” cowards that is the kind that doesn’t involve any actual, you know, risk.”

Stretch your naked, skanky, aging body out on a crescent. Urinate on a prayer rug. Make a picture of yourself performing cunnilingus on a replica of the vagina of the black rock in Mecca.

You want to really turn yourself into an icon against established religion? You want to hear your name whispered in awe of your bravery? You want to become a crusader against dogma and the establishment? Go ahead, because there’s your chance. Stand up, just for once in your miserable, useless life, to something and somebody likely to actually strike back rather than shake their heads in pity.

While we all wait for Hurricane Season 2006 to start in 8 days...UPPER MIDWEST SEVERE WEATHER ALERT!

Illinois main target for severe weather and flooding this evening!

The new NAM (WRF) shows max tornado threat in extreme Northeast Missouri, with a bit of Southern Iowa and Western Illionois as well, based on EHI. Old NAM (ETA) shows wider area under the gun for tornadoes, Eastern Missouri, much of Western Illionois, up into parts of Iowa and Southern Wisconsin.

After the individual cells merge to form a squall line, straight line winds, hail, and flooding rains will become the main threat.

Whooo-Hooo! Sunny skies in Eastern Missouri into Illinois, with the first storms firing up just East of Kansas City!

29º with a dewpoint of 20º at Saint Louis at Noon Local.

Latest SPC Day 1 Convective Outlook

This is in the Ohio Valley tomorrow, East Coast from South Carolina to maybe as far North as NYC Friday, clearing Saturday, and good beach weather Sunday and Monday.

Bonus, and just in time for Hurricane Season, 12Z AVN suggests this disturbed area in the Pacific South of Mexico may drift through the Gulf of Tehuanepec into the Southern GOMEX, and possibly try to spin up before landfall in Tamaulipas.

This month's issue of First Things includes a very anti-idiotarian assessment of Islam by Cardinal Pell (Australia). It was mentioned here on LGF a few weeks ago, as it created a little stir. Having read it, I can tell you that it pulls no punches.

I really fail to see what any person who claims to believe the bible is true could possibly think they have in common with mo's death cult. Jesus is said to have been sinless where mo commited with "allah's" good wishes every crime known to man. Jesus said love your enemies, mo said kill them.

The world is full of stupid people. I guess that pretty much sums it up. BLEAH

#20 Canadastani

OK, here it goes. I agree that Christians can recognize the legitimacy of Islam as a religion in the sense that it is recognized by billions of people around the world as such (both Muslim and non-Muslim peoples). But, if you are an authentic Christian, you have accepted Yeshua as your Lord and savior. Islam is based upon the principle that there is no God but Allah and Muhammad is His prophet. My main point was that you can't accept Muhammad as a prophet of God and also call yourself a Christian. That's a contradiction. Ofcourse, Churches are full of contradictions (as are all religions, I guess). :)

27 fireangel

But people who get involved in these interfaith dialogues don't talk about the basic tenets of the faith. They look for common ground along the perimeter topics--or cherry-pick materials from their holy books.

These people are probably bubble headed Jesuits.

Also in Washington DC today;

Flight 103 familes: Libya must abide by its agreement

Families of the victims of Pan Am Flight 103 are holding a news conference this afternoon in Washington, D-C.

The families plan to urge Congress to ensure that Libya abides by its agreement to pay the remainder of the two-point-seven (b) billion-dollar compensation package to them.

President Bush last week removed Libya from the list of state sponsors of terrorism.

A few other things Congress should urge Libya to come clean about.

No word on whether Kaddafi received his extortion payments for his still captive, raped, tortured and death sentenced Bulgarian nurse hostages.

#24 Terp Mole

Madonna was scheduled to perform a show in Israel, but she withdrew when there were terrorist threats made against her and her children.

The point is, "Esther" the so-called Kaballist, had already had the chance to show real bravery and she's caved.

She's all for expressing religious and sexual freedom. . .to the women who already have it. I don't begrudge her the ability to do that. If she can make a zillion bucks crucifying herself on an electric cross, bully for her. . .but this concept of her as a daring iconoclast is just so much nonsense. Her schtick is designed to sell albums and tickets. . .period.

We can always hope that familiarity will breed contempt.

28 mickthemick

I agree that you can't (in essence) agree with two or three religions, especially when they actively contradict (Jesus is son of God OR Jesus is some lesser Prophet while Allah is God and Mohammad is his Prophet). While that contradiction is more obvious than say the contradictions between Christianity and Judaism (or among Orthodox Christianity, Catholicism, and Protestant beliefs), there is always a place to draw the line and a case to be made that the people on the other side are wrong. Admittedly (your point), that line is a little thicker between Islam and Catholicism than between Methodist and Presbyterians.

My only point is that there is a difference between thinking something is legitimate but not your beliefs (Judaism or even "other" Christian sects, in my case) and personally believing in/ practicing it (Protestant Christianity in my case).

A number of religious leaders of all faiths have fallen into the same ignorant trap. They have been used in an effort for these radicals to gain some sort of credibility and will continue on this path until they WAKE UP!

There is no excuse. A simple internet search and a bit of reading could save these clueless "tolerant" folks from future embarassment...

Here's a start in the quest for a clue: Avoid those with ties to CAIR, ISNA, MSA, AMC, ICNA...

Though I can't vouch for Judaism, I can tell you that those professing to be Christian don't consider Christianity a "religion" in the truest sense. We consider it a "relationship."

To the best of my knowledge, the word religion is only used a handful of times in the New Testament and never in the Old Testament under the translations I'm familiar with.

Even then, only one time in the New Testament is the word religion expressed in a positive light and then with the description of pure and faultless - hardly words I would use to describe the Muslim faith.

#34 Canadastani

Capiche. I think we agree, but perhaps the contention was my application of the word "legitimate." Anyhooo, thanks for the dialogue. :)

#36..don't consider Christianity a "religion" in the truest sense. We consider it a "relationship...( i feel religion is manmade...relationship to GOD...GOD made.

Are they clueless at the Catholic Information Center, or—even worse—do they know about IIT’s background but think it doesn’t matter?

I'll take what's behind door #2. :-(

This information isn’t hard to find. Are they clueless at the Catholic Information Center, or—even worse—do they know about IIT’s background but think it doesn’t matter?

Charles, I'd say they're clueless. Speaking as a Catholic, I wouldn't be surprised at anything coming from the USCCB or their minions. Every time some edict has come down from the Vatican (like how you're supposed make a sign of reverance when receiving the Eucharist, for example), the USCCB immediately wants to know if they can get permission to somehow water it down.

You will always have useful idiots no matter what.

Every religion has it's drunken uncles who are invited to the party, with the hope they don't make a scene.

With the intellect of this blog, it does not even need to be mentioned.

It is the level of civility that accompanies civilization, which allows differences to be different with devestation.

I am Catholic, and look at this as a manipulation. If the MSM runs with this, it will be exorted to the level of something more than fringe, that speaks for the whole.

What would be great, is if someone was at the front door handing out flyers for ladies night for one of the local establishments, free refreshsments of course.

Such fools. I am Catholic and I am ashamed at the level of stupidity by this group.

Formercorpsman,

I agree. Married to a Catholic, I can appreciate that statement being that I feel the Catholic Church is the most visibly mocked by the MSM.

All denominations have their "progressive" movements as a guise to suit their tastes. I call them the friends of the world groups.

#41 formercorpsman

I am Catholic, and look at this as a manipulation. If the MSM runs with this, it will be exorted to the level of something more than fringe, that speaks for the whole.

Sadly, this is from an organization that's part of the USCCB, who we're supposed to follow. I'll bet that the good bishops, like Bp. Bruskewicz of Lincoln, Neb., think it's crap. But they're in the minority.

#21 TheLeague--

I'd be attending too if I didn't have another commitment. I hope you'll post a report here after the event.

Related:

From [Link: www.catholic.net,...] May 15, 2006:

"Christians must particularly open their hearts to the lowliest and the poorest, in whom Christ himself is especially present," [said Pope Benedict XVI]. In virtue of reciprocity, he added, "it is to be hoped that Christians emigrating to countries with Muslim majorities, find there welcome and respect for their religious identity."

Of course, the Holy Father knows better than to think this is what Islamic countries will do. I view this as a challenge.

Sorry for the departure, had to actually do some work.

I am getting ready to turn 37. I was raised Catholic, you know the story. It was not until then end of my enlistment, faced with some life occurences, that I had to seriously consider what my faith meant.

As for this, and for the Church itself, it has always engaged on some level, wanton politicization.

Hey the Vatican opposed the war.

While I do think that one is supposed to accomodate religion, and not the other way around, common sense will prevail.

Look at the response from the parishoners with the pedophelia scandal. It is up to the lay people to solve political issues, and remind the church elders as to what history has served them.

You will always have those who utilize authority for their own purpose.

History does not lie.

A heads up on Josemaria Escriva he is the founder of Opus Dei.

And as a traditional Catholic I have a LOT of problems with Escriva and with Opus Dei. Mind you the problems I have with them have nothing to do with the fictional garbage in Da Vinci Code. In fact that Da Vinci Code sprung all that fake garbage makes the entire situation worse by detracting from the very real problems and making them look like victims (which they most certainly are not).

Anyway, anytime you see Opus Dei and/or Escriva's name count on the situation stinking and also count on traditional Catholics (that have done their homework) completely disagreeing with anything they're associated with.

In the intrest of understanding they invite speakers froma religion that would kill them without a second thought.

yes, Mary bore Jesus under a palm tree, not, as the Christians say, in a manger
I know because it says so in the Qu'ran

[Link: www.hti.umich.edu...]

I wrote a little Muslim Christmas Carol:

Go Away

Away with the manger, how wrong can you be?
The Qu’ran says Jesus was born ‘neath a tree
He spoke right away unto Mary his mom
Have no shame, I am holy, I’ll keep you from harm

Away with the manger, with Joseph and all
The shepherds and wise men, with gifts, so enthralled
Away with the myths your forefathers have said
Away with the Bible, here’s a Qu’ran instead

My parish priest is a weeping, hand-wringing, leftist. He actually praised Louis Farrakhan in one of his homilies. At another nearby cathedral, the priest prayed for Ghandi to intercede on our behalf!

The Catholic Church is on the far-left side of many political & social issues. They are becoming such an embarrasment that I cannot take communion any longer. (Fuming at the homily is not the proper way to accept the host.)

I think The Church knows exactly what they're doing, & who they're getting in bed with. And I think it goes beyond believing it doesn't matter, or not caring. They want to be on the side of the poor, down-trodden, misunderstood Muslims, just like they want to be on the side of the poor, down-trodden, misunderstood people who are illegally living in the US.

Whatever happened to the hard-ass nuns who taught me in school? I cannot believe that Sr. Mary Francis would have ever stood for this crap. She didn't even allow feet in the isles.

I sat through two hours of a Muslim expert explaining Islam to interested folks in my Catholic parish a few months back. Yeah, it was the whole combination platter of predictable RoP talking points, heck I could have practically written the guy's speech for him.

But I did get to ask him a couple questions that really ruined the good impression he had made on the gullible crowd who were all too happy to sit back and eat the cornbread.

1) What do Muslims believe about the crucifixion and resurrection? Answer. They believe that Jesus was taken to heaven before he was crucified, and one of the apostles, most likely Judas was crucified in his place. That went over like a turd in a punchbowl.

2) Do Muslims believe in the concept of love your enemy? He danced around that for a while and did his best to squirm out of it, but the longer he avoided answering, the crowd started mumbling and whispering to each other, shaking their heads. He lost the crowd with that performance.

I'd recommend any other Christians who get the opportunity to attend one of these "Meet the Muslim" nights at their parish to go to it. And do go to rant, ridicule or insult them, just ask them some tough questions and sit back and watch. I do want all people from different religions to be civil with each other and give each other respect, but Christians can not be led to believe that Islam is an extension of Christianity just because the Koran has a chapter about Mary, and that they revere Jesus.

And we owe it to our fellow parishioners to not let them be mislead by half-truths and obsfucation from Islam pushers.

mich-again

God bless you, that is exactly what's needed. Well done!

#52 mich-again--

A Baltimore-based imam who was born and trained in Syria spoke at my synagogue earlier this year. He too gave a good, smooth spiel, with many references to his Jewish brothers. A question from me about the Alawites set him off on a rant about heretics that, to my ear, effectively exposed his intolerant side. But I'm not sure how many of my fellow congregants heard it the same way that I did.

52 Pimf
"do go" should have been "don't go". duh.

51 finnschick

We had a Priest with the strong Leftish slant for a year or so. I called him Father Sandanista and did my best not to roll my eyes, sigh, or shake my head "no" during his Marxist speeches homilies. He actually once said in a homily that we should all feel guilty when we eat a grape because of the low wages that were paid to the grapepickers. Geeze O petes, whadya make that Muscatel from?

Our Priest now is as apolitical as any I've seen. Always reasonable and has never once shown a trace of BDS.

finn

They are becoming such an embarrasment that I cannot take communion any longer. (Fuming at the homily is not the proper way to accept the host.)

You're making a mistake. The Catechism states:

1415 Anyone who desires to receive Christ in Eucharistic communion must be in the state of grace. Anyone aware of having sinned mortally must not receive communion without having received absolution in the sacrament of penance.

1416 Communion with the Body and Blood of Christ increases the communicant's union with the Lord, forgives his venial sins, and preserves him from grave sins. Since receiving this sacrament strengthens the bonds of charity between the communicant and Christ, it also reinforces the unity of the Church as the Mystical Body of Christ.

As a Catholic, you know that the re-presentation of Christ's sacrifice is an objective reality. The state in which you receive this is important, but I hardly think your anger at a misguided homily should damage your soul and faith mortally. If it does, you should talk to a good priest immediately.

There are thousands upon thousands of them, all over the world.

mich-again

Awesome.

Really amazing that this goes on, especially when you consider what was done to the Church of Nativity.

Godfrey, Friarstale--

You do know, I presume, that Jesus was the nephew of Moses and Aaron. (The Qur'an states that Maryam, the mother of Isa, was Aaron's sister.)

formercorpsman

It's amazing to me how little oversight these get-togethers often have. At our parish, one of our more liberal members invited a lapsed Episcopalian academic to lecture us on Islam. I doubt that our pastor had any idea what this guy was about. His sole stated purpose was to show us how Islam and RC were in fact quite similar.

He fooled no one.

#13

Well said. We have to stop embracing these genocidal, xenophobic, maniacs (ie muslims). Christians have much more in common with Buddhists and Jews than muslims.

As a Catholic I have been happy, so far, with the Popes views on Islam, but this sort of dhimmi nonsense will get us no where.

54 Ben F.

from your link..

Dr. Arafat is founder and president of Civilizations Exchange and Cooperation Foundation (CECF), which is dedicated to bringing people together in an environment where dialog and exchange can effectively support the creation of a better world that encourages peace, love, and understanding.

Oh, how nice. I think I'm going to have to dig out my old Elvis Costello cassette tape and sing along.

Ben F

*rolls eyes*

Right, I guess the apostles left out the part about Isa turning the Red Sea into wine.

Maybe the "Nazarene" bit confused them.

60 Snow Dawg

genocidal, xenophobic, maniacs (ie muslims)

All of them?

I think all you have to do is take a look at a couple of the once fine institutions of higher learning, and see what they have become.

Although I am not old enough to speak of, but I had an orthopaedic sales rep who went to georgetown in the early seventies, and the stories he would tell about the teachers on acid, etc. These were priests expanding their minds.

No religion is exempt, but then again, there is a pretty big divergence between the the RoP, and perhaps the mainstream ones out there.

OT, but CBN, Christian Broadcast Network last night reported from imam Mahdi's holey city of Qom.

Yes, Pat Robertson's network for muscular Christians looks the islamic threat in the face unlike these other simpering appeasers.

Even Haysus Christo himself ran after the blasphemous moneychangers with a whip. Why can't some folk grow some righteous indignation at the debbil himself?

#61 mich again

I think I'm going to have to dig out my old Elvis Costello cassette tape and sing along.

Don't waste your time, there's nothing peaceful loving nor understanding about your old fave musician Elvis Costello--who stomped on an effigy of Pres. George Bush a couple years back while hosting the Late Late Show...

Elvis Costello became a shrieking hatah.

KAROAKE!

Wait

KARAOKE!

YES.

66
I'm an old Elvis C fan

you can't beat his Oliver's Army
(I wonder if he disowns it, too bad he turned into a moonbat)

Hong Kong is up for grabs
London is full of Arabs
We could be in Palestine
Overrun by a Chinese line
With the boys from the Mersey and the Thames and the Tyne

58 Ben F
thanks!
where is that reference?
Is it in the same Maryam sura?

#48 KG

I can't say I share your sentiments about Opus Dei. The men and women associated with the group that I've met are some of the brightest, accomplished, and, yes, orthodox in the DC area. I'm not a member, but I respect their mission.

If anything, tonight's guest is an aberration.

oh

The problem for most of those musicians, is that they bought into their own hype.

It was all great music, but somehow I think they have become bitter in their older years.

Invalidation. They watched their movement pull into the station, the train was boarded, but never left.

Now that they can't compete with the younger artists, they need a sense of validation still.

As if I care what their political ideology is. They lost me when they needed all of the brown m&m's picked out of the bowl.

Albeit, a very frustrating abberation.

#62 Godfrey--

To be fair, some read "sister of Aaron" not as the Qur'an confusing the Torah's Miriam with Jesus' mother, but as the Qur'an asserting that Mary was of the tribe of Aaron, that is, of priestly descent. I don't know how this would or would not mesh with Christian tradition; as I understand it, the Gospels only give the genealogy of Jesus' step-father.

Ben

I think Luke gives Mary's genealogy as being in the line of David.

Luke also says she's related to Elizabeth, mother of John the Baptizer.

Elizabeth is in the line of Aaron.

IIRC

#71 Friarstale:

Yes, that's the surah; the ayah is 28. Some English translations "helpfully" render ukhta, literally sister, as descendant, so the discrepancy is not visible in those texts. You can see both renditions of 19:28 at WebQT, which offers several parallel translations.

Wait a sec...

/fact-checking self

Here are some relevant passages from Luke:

Luke 1
5: In the days of Herod, king of Judea, there was a priest named Zechari'ah, of the division of Abi'jah; and he had a wife of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elizabeth.

Luke 2
26: In the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city of Galilee named Nazareth,
27: to a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.

Luke 3
23 Jesus, when he began his ministry, was about thirty years of age, being the son (as was supposed) of Joseph, the son of Heli,
24: the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, the son of Melchi, the son of Jan'na-i, the son of Joseph

So Luke doesn't give Mary's lineage. He offers one for Jesus, starting with Joseph, back to David.

Hm. So I'm guessing that if Mary is related to Elizabeth, she might be in Aaron's line after all.

#72 TheLeague

Oh I have no doubt that's the case, they are doing a bang up job recruiting Catholics with conservative leanings that have not researched them, their teaching, and whether their teaching are compatible with the orthodox teaching of the Church. That is precisely why they are dangerous to the faith.

On the surface they do appear at least to be "conservative" leaning. But look at their teaching then compare them to the Magistrum of the Church.

To get started here are a few questions:

- What Cardinal Virtue does "holy shamelessness", an Opus Dei maxim, fall under?

- What precisely is "The Way" of Opus Dei?

- Why did a convent of nuns in the '30's in Spain burn copies of "The Way" on the public street outside their convent doors?

- In defining his members' mission, why does Msgr. Escriba teach Genesis wrongly and point to man's pre-fall status in regard to "work", as if man had the same pre-fall status now? Is this not the heresy of pantheism?

- Why are Opus Dei's Catholic-sounding teachings only slightly askew from true Catholic teachings? Is it so Catholics who join up won't notice?

- Has there ever been a saint in all the history of the Church who required the laity, under obedience to Msgr. Escriva, to beat themselves? (In other words has there EVER been a case where one Catholic ordered another Catholic to take upon themselves mortification or has mortification ALWAYS been self directed)

You might also check: [Link: www.odan.org...]

Here's an example of one-way dialog, quoting from Investors Business Daily:

In a recent federal decision that got surprisingly little press, even from conservative talk radio, California's 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled it's OK to put public-school kids through Muslim role-playing exercises, including:

Reciting aloud Muslim prayers that begin with "In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful . . ."

Memorizing the Muslim profession of faith: "Allah is the only true God and Muhammad is his messenger."

As I understand it, the recitation of these words in front of a witness, for any reason, qualifies the speaker as a Muslim, and the words cannot be recanted. The speaker is now a Muslim forever.

I hope that anyone engaging in touchy-feely dialog with Muslims is not invited to participate in "harmless role-playing games" like these ones approved by the California courts!

I would Jean de la Valette as Catholic spokesman.

Islamic and Catholic Perspectives in Dialogue.

Translation: "We Muslims talk, you kaffirs listen."

SOMEONE NEEDS TO SHOW THESE PEOPLE A COPY OF THE KORAN...THEN ONE OF BIBLE...WAIT...LET ME...Abraham and Ishmael built the House and dedicated it, saying . . . "Lord, make us submissive to You; make of our descendants a nation that will submit to You..."

Q 2:127...And Sarah saw the son of hagar (ishmael) the egyptian mocking...Wherefore she said, Cast out this bondwoman and her son(ishmael)for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even ISAAC!...there is no room on the TEMPLE MOUNT FOR MOCKERS!..

Part 1

Clueless.

I think that’s probably the best word to describe the sponsors and participants of the ecumenical event tonight. It was a fair showing for a Wednesday night. It drew about 40-45 people (and the chapel only holds about 60). Perhaps you had something to do with it, Charles.

I was surprised to find out that the Catholic Information Center did not sponsor the event; they only provided the venue. The event organizers were a group called Washington Catholic Forum. Never heard of them before. The event didn’t draw any overt lizardoids, but I suspect I wasn’t the only one there. There were a few Marian devotees, and the Q & A fell quickly into the apparitions, etc. None of that interests me, and I could tell our Muslim brother was zoning out too.

The moderator was an articulate young woman who told the story of how she bonded with an Egyptian roommate over the image of a volcano, or something. It was then and there I realized – they’re clueless. I mean really clueless. I could have stood up and asked about IIIT’s unwavering support for Sami Al-Arian or its deep connections to dozens of shady “charities,” but it occurred to me that the moderator and co-presenter, a Father Tiso, would know absolutely nothing about these things. Zero.

This surprised me more than anything else. I think because DC is always on the verge of terrorism. It’s a target unlike other cities, because there’s a certain inevitability to it all. We know we’re going to get hit again. It’s only the timing and means in doubt. The city is soaked in radical Islam, too. The radical Saudi mosques are everywhere, and the “charitable” organizations almost always have a DC, VA or MD address. Go to Tyson’s Corner (VA) mall and just watch the abayas and chadors float by. You would think that this would generate a broader interest or awareness in the topic of Islamic extremism, but that’s just not the case.

A word on the Muslim speaker. Khaled Troudi is a new comer to the US. His English is only so-so. He's not confident in speaking, and he read from a paper he had written in English. Give him a few years, and he’ll be up to speed in all the idiomatic expressions needed to convey the soothing message of multicultural “understanding” and ecumenical dialogue that are still popular with some Catholics (and other Christians, too).

Part 2

Watching the priest stick up for a man who preaches at one of the most radical Sunni mosques in the US -- All Dulles Area Muslim Society -- was sort of sad. I was thinking about how quaint this kind of ecumenical dialogue appears now. After five years of slaughter and demonizing hyperbole coming out of that tiny minority of Saudi-inspired extremists, I could really care less how much Muslims like Mary. All the rhetoric of sharing commonalities as a path to reconciliation, blah…blah…blah… sounded like the theological equivalent to one of those 70’s-era rooms pictured in Lilek’s book, Interior Desecrations.

Which brings me to probably the scariest revelation of the evening. Mr. Troudi appears to be a very nice man, but his biographical information has too many similarities to too many ecumenically-focused radical Sunni extremists in the US. He’s Saudi-educated with a bachelor’s degree in Koranic studies (or something like that) from the Islamic University in Medina; he has an MA from a US school, and now he’s at CUA, earning a PhD in comparative religion (or something like that). He’s working at a mosque known for Sunni fundamentalism. I wonder if our Saudi friends aren’t attempting to bring a new generation of imams to the US to maintain their dawah mission here. Add this to Georgetown’s policy of supporting Islamic dawah, er, inter-faith dialoq, and I can’t help but wonder how far into the cathedral the camel’s stuck his nose

The priest also mentioned that they consult Muzzamil Siddiqui on ecumenical matters! Argh!

Perhaps the conference of catholic bishops should branch out a little and add a few Shia or Sufi leaders to the rolodex. They could get one of those Indonesian guys who worship tea pots, or something.

Oh, and one last thing. Just before I left one guy in the audience was talking about the origins of the town named Fatima in Portugal. For non-papists out there this is a town that experienced a Marian apparition in the 1800s. I don’t know much about it, but then again, I don’t care. However, the town was supposedly named after a Muslim princess who converted to Christianity and stayed with her Christian husband (a Portugese military officer) when all the Muslims fled during the reconquista.

Perhaps a little more reconquista-ing and a lot less kumbaya-ing is in order.

What the real Christians are doing:

[Link: www.cufi.org...]
[Link: www.jhm.org...]

CUFI: Christians United for Israel
Washington D.C. Event July 18 &19, 2006

Washington/Israel Summit
July 18th - 20th, 2006

Israel is facing a great crisis! Iran's president is threatening to use nuclear weapons to exterminate the Jews of Israel. We are reliving the year 1938 when Hitler began the systematic slaughter of 6,000,000 Jews...AND THE WORLD WAS SILENT.

Iran's president is the new Hitler of the Middle East! He is maniacal! He intends to attack and destroy the Jews! NOT ON OUR WATCH!

Christians United for Israel will gather in Washington D.C. on July 18-20 to SPEAK OUT to our Senators and Congressmen on behalf of Israel.

Isaiah commands us, "For Zion's sake I will not hold my peace...I have set watchmen on thy walls O Jerusalem, which shall never hold their peace day nor night; Ye that make mention of the Lord KEEP NOT SILENT!"

IT'S TIME TO STAND UP AND SPEAK UP FOR ISRAEL!

Join us July 18-20 for the Washington D.C. Israel Summit.

For your convenience please register at [Link: www.cufi.org...]

Feel free to make your own travel arrangements or contact Frosch Travel online at: [Link: www.froschtravel.com...]
call 1-800-866-1623.

This invitation is open to every pro-Israel Christian in America.

Say, is this Fr. Tiso related to the late, unlamented Msgr. Josef Tiso, who ruled Slovakia as the puppet state of Nazi Germany? That Tiso excelled at the slaughter of Jews, complaining that the Germans weren't deporting them fast enough. After the war, the Russians hanged him without much complaint from anyone. I've always wondered what the Vatican files have on him and his relationship with Pius XII.