LGF

Is the Haditha Story Falling Apart?

Fri, Jun 9, 2006 at 1:38:48 pm PDT

Clarice Feldman at The American Thinker (with assistance from Sweetness & Light) has put together a narrative report of what’s known so far about the Haditha incident—and the story seems to be unraveling at the edges: Haditha: Is McGirk the New Mary Mapes?

And here’s more: US father visiting Haditha saw no sign of massacre. (Hat tip: Geepers.)

SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - A Presbyterian minister who was an embedded reporter with his son’s U.S. Marine company, which is accused of killing 24 Iraqi civilians in Haditha, said soldiers in private moments gave no indication anything horrible happened in the town.

Rather, the young men in Kilo Company, 3rd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment talked about earlier intense fighting in Falluja and other wartime ordeals.

“I would think that if it was as bad as everybody is making it out to be, I’d have heard something about it when I was there,” said the Rev. Ben Mathes, 53, whose son, 1st Lt. Adam Mathes, is Kilo company’s executive officer. ...

The father spent 12 days with the unit in January in Haditha as a reporter with the Sacramento, California-based K-Love Christian Radio Network. He also ministered to the troops.

“It was freezing cold and everybody gathered around this kind of metal fireplace where we chopped up wooden pallets and burnt them and we’d sit there and talk about home and family and the deepest things with these kids,” he said in an interview on Thursday. “Not once did anything come up that something horrible had happened.”

“They talked about the first battle of Falluja and things that haunt them. They’d talk about they had mortars land right beside them that were duds and three landed right beside them and a third one went off and it injured the buddy next to them and they didn’t get hit.”

He said he also did not feel animosity from Iraqis he encountered while on patrol with Kilo company in Haditha.

“You would think that if something horrible had happened they would just disappear or just have nothing to do with these folks,” Mathes said. “They came out on the streets and brought us bread and tea and invited us into their homes. The businessmen would have them come into their shops.”

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199 comments

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1 Canadastani  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:39:39am

Like Jenin, it will live on

2 ElKafir  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:40:00am

It's the usual Rathergate

3 DocDublU  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:41:10am

i feel a flashing memo coming on!

4 friarstale  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:41:45am

I've just been reading the links
it is falling apart, as it should
will we get retractions?

5 zombie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:42:13am

I had suspected this from the very beginning. Too many suspicious holes in the account of what happened. I'm glad people are jumping on this, and tearing it apart.

6 Abu Al-Poopypants  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:44:53am

Clarice hangs out over at JustOneMinute in the comments. Maybe there'll be some interesting discussions about Haditha there.

7 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:44:53am

ElKafir (#2),

It's the usual Rathergate

In that there is an endless array of glaring inconsistencies, yes it is.

Thanks for the hat tip Charles.

8 J. Lichty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:45:05am

Yeah but to the media, if it hurts America and George Bush, fake = fake, but accurate.

Excellent comparison to Jenin Canadistani.

9 TotallySirius  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:47:22am

Falling?

It was never coherent,it is all accusation,anecdote,innuendo and rumor.

IMHO,it is a construct of an over-zealous news cretin.

There has never been one shred of evidence.

But lets not dwell on the facts when(in the words of Sen. Henri Waxman)the seriousness of the charges is the more important matter.

10 DocDublU  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:48:02am

They told stories that at times they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Ghengis Khan,

With John F'ing Kerry as a role model, it's no wonder today's genertion of 'get elected quick' moonbats don't come up with stories of 'alleged' atrocities even more regularly.

11 Buckaroo  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:48:20am

A former employer of mine was undergoing a somewhat embarassing PR situation, chiefly because information was being quickly posted and re-posted on a handful of enthusiast sites and forums, far faster than any "official" statements were being devised & distributed. One of my older co-workers blurted out one afternoon "Man, this internet thing sucks sometimes!"

I think the LLL media must say that every single day ...
:-)
:-)

12 KevinV  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:48:21am

I read the American Thinker piece this morning and it certainly does raise some serious questions that I assume will be or have been looked at.

On the other hand, the reaction of the NCIS person to the Time report which was basically "if you think the report in Time was bad, wait until you see the full official report in a month's time" leads me to believe that there has to be something going on here.

At the very least, however, this only goes to show yet again how the rush to judgment in the press and by MC Murtha was irresponsible and inappropriate.

13 Andy in Agoura Hills  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:49:37am

Darn Geepers! I guess I wasn't fast enough on my hat tip!

Here's another site that fisked the Haditha story.

14 J. Lichty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:50:27am

Oh, BTW, you Israelis better batten the hatches.

Hamas has called of its truce, which the jew-hating MSM thinks that it has "largely stuck to."

Hamas militants called off a truce with Israel on Friday after a barrage of Israeli artillery shells tore into Palestinians at a beachside picnic in the Gaza Strip, killing seven civilians.

The declaration raised the prospect of a new wave of bloodshed. Hamas militants suspended a campaign of deadly suicide attacks on Israelis after the February 2005 cease-fire, and have largely stuck to the truce. The Islamic group now leads the Palestinian government.

15 Sir Napsalot  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:50:40am

How cruel to burst the LLL's fantasy. They finally got their Vietnam-Winter Soldiers story.

But does Fact really matter? We have ~ 40% here and >80% (or 90%) in rest of the world rather believe the Haditha massacre, because it fits with their "believes".

16 Dianna  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:51:13am

Waiting for the report still seems the best thing to me. And I think the Marines' refusal to comment has been a very good thing.

If this article is right, then the press in its wild eagerness for war crimes, has hung itself, and that is a very good thing. The more naked their bias, and their rush to judgement, the better.

17 xenophobic  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:51:50am

A reporter in my local rag wrote the following article called "Shadows of My Lai" (I guess "shades" was already taken by other Liberal reporters?


"His unit, many of whom where on their third or fourth tours in Iraq, simply snapped.
They went on a rampage through the small Sunni Muslim city of Haditha, killing over 25 civilians that we know of. Old men, women, children even babies were murdered in cold blood"

...

Their blood and tear stain the walls and floors, caught on a tape that will rock your Conservative-Christian Reality"

It then praises Murtha, gives a second hand account of an alleged shooting of a family at a checkpoint [with no mention of a date, of if they failed to yield] claims that Iraqi's are now just called Haji's just like the Vietnamese were 'gooks' and finishes with:
U.S out of Iraq Now!


I have wrote the editor complaining that the NCIS investigation is not complete, no one has been charged under the UCMJ, nor are the Marines accused even being held in the brig, and their reporter is writing as a fact that they are guilty of war crimes.

18 katemaclaren  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:52:33am

Hello! I'm wondering if Time Magazine will have their managing editor do a "Rather." Hey, that could become a verb. "To rather" = To deny proven facts that aren't in agreement with biases and beliefs. Where is this story popping up. I just tuned in and am dying to see those Time Maggots Magaziners squirm.

19 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:55:35am

Gomer Murtha? Where are you? SOS...

20 quiet man  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:56:09am

when have the moonbats ever cared about the facts..since this is what they wanted to happen..a massacre is all they will accept.

21 fapping gn0bheadz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:56:15am

yeah, the very caricature of "rampaging bloodthirsty marines" is what set off the klaxons in my head; our military is not only the most effective but most disciplined - largely due to the fact that its just such a long-lived and large institution with both history and necessity demanding that it be so.

Having read soldiers' milblogs and the book "No True Glory," Iraq seemed like a mess, but half that mess was in the theatric directions taken in its presentation; and the other half was the war itself.

How very sad that Americans are not only loud and obnoxious and largely ignorant abroad but also, apparently, cartoonishly genocidal.

22 ferris  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:56:41am

I haven't said a thing about Haditha because we don't know anything really.

One thing has always struck me as odd about this story (beyond the fact I doubt Marines would do this)...why the hell didn't this make news all over the world the day after it happened? It's not like Abu Gharab which happened within a controlled military facility.

This 'happened' out in the open, in the middle of bad guy country. Why wouldn't the locals have been screaming bloody hell? Reuters, Al Jezera, etc would have been there in 10 seconds.

It hasn't passed the smell test from day one and I won't be one bit surprised if it falls apart. If it does, there are some people who need to answer for this slander (of course they won't, yeah I am talking to you Mr. Murtha).

23 fapping gn0bheadz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:57:37am

Hey, can we burn down some embassies and stampede over some stragglers because of the dishonor brought to our culture?

24 Protagonist  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:57:45am
A Presbyterian minister who was an embedded reporter with his son’s U.S. Marine company . . .

Talk about a helicopter parent, jeez!

25 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:59:31am
26 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 11:59:37am
In fact, Time had originally reported that it was Human Rights Watch who had provided the tape. They then retracted that and claimed that it came from Hammurabi which works with Human Rights Watch. And now they have backed off even that.

Time’s source, Thaer Thabit al-Hadithi, is not a "young man." He is not a "budding journalism student."

And al-Haditha is not separate and apart from the Hammurabi Human Rights Group. Nor is he a man who wanted to remain anonymous because he feared for his safety.

But other than that everything is exactly right.

Now on to Paragraph two.

27 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:00:25pm

#16 Dianna,

If this article is right, then the press in its wild eagerness for war crimes, has hung itself, and that is a very good thing. The more naked their bias, and their rush to judgement, the better.

Yes, but unlike you Dianna, these people out there calling the marines guilt before a trial aren't interested in the truth. They aren't even interested in "fer the childrn'." They don't care about the dead. If it could help their cause, the bloodier, the better.

28 Dianna  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:00:50pm

#21 fappin

I'm sorry, I lost the thread. What did you mean to say? Your last para confused me entirely.

29 Andy in Agoura Hills  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:01:10pm

I'm not an Arabic cultural expert (BIDSAAHIELN), however, it seems to me that Arab culture is prone to exaggeration. I think I even read that on a previous thread here at LGF stated by a military commander. I should think getting Arabs to lie or exaggerate American "atrocities" wouldn't be too difficult.

Three problems I see with this "massacre":

1. Reuters (Arab-owned) stated that bodies were left in the street. Then suddenly, bodies started showing up in houses.

2. Dr. Walid certainly has an anti-American grudge. But how about some autopsies? I would think that would be VITAL to uncovering what happened.

3. The camera-man sat on the tape for months (~4). Why?

30 Silhouette  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:02:49pm

From Sweetness and Light

Time had originally reported that it was Human Rights Watch who had provided the tape. They then retracted that and claimed that it came from Hammurabi which works with Human Rights Watch. And now they have backed off even that.

...

Time’s source, Thaer Thabit al-Hadithi, is not a "young man." He is not a "budding journalism student."

And al-Haditha is not separate and apart from the Hammurabi Human Rights Group. ...

Al-Haditha is 43 years old.

He "created" Hammurabi 16 months ago.

(Before that he worked directly under the head of Haditha’s hospital, Dr. Walid al-Obeidi, who pronounced that all the victims had been shot at close range.)

In fact, al-Haditha is one of Hammurabi’s only two members. He serves as its "Secretary General" while the only other member, Abdul-Rahman al-Mashhadani, performs as its "Chairman.")

Al-Haditha is the one and only person behind this tape.

He made it.

And he sat on it for four months before turning it over to Time magazine.

31 Lazarus  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:02:54pm

Good for Rev. Mathes for speaking up about this. I hope the authorities listen.

32 AMER1CAN  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:03:20pm

It has nothing to do anymore with whether you are guilty or not. It's all about the seriousness of the accusations.

I knew something was fishy, and to be honest, I'd couldn't have cared one way or the other. Shit happens in war if you know what I mean.

I'm glad this is getting thrown right back at the msm.

33 solomonpanting  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:04:01pm
Why did he not mention to this apparently sympathetic group one word about the supposed “atrocity” which he claimed had occurred three months earlier?

Well...

Hammurabi apparently did share the video in March with the largely Soros-funded Human Rights Watch which in turn provided it to Time.

He found the "right" propaganda arm source.

34 Anant  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:04:29pm

While I'd love for this story to be a fake, I have to agree with #12. The NCIS and the Marine Corps top brass wouldn't have reacted the way they did if there weren't something serious here.

35 Dave the.....  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:04:50pm

Was listening too Hugh Hewitt? Bill Bennett? Forgot which one, but he was interviewing someone (civilian, not military) who just got back from Iraq. Asked if there is a lot of talk amongst the Iraqis about this. He said "no, none at all".

That may tell you something. Maybe the story isn't quite what the LLL's wanted it to be.

36 Dianna  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:05:16pm

#27 goodbye_natalie

I understand that, perfectly.

I'm also aware that my immediate, knee-jerk reaction on first reading the accusations was a furious "Nonsense!". But I'm a Marine's kid, so what do you expect.

We care about the truth, not about rumors. Yes, I'm deeply suspicious, and I don't believe Murtha and the press. But I want the evidence. The American Thinker article pleases me down to my toes, which are tapping happily. But the report, with pictures, diagrams and whatever else, is what matters.

37 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:06:24pm
38 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:07:17pm

Anybody in their right mind wouldn't listen to the MSM for anything more than the weather report.

During and since Vietnam, their reporting has always been one sided way to the left. You've got to be an absolute dolt not to recognize it. The only argument is why? Do you believe Bernard Goldberg or Ann Coulter is really the only issue to debate.

39 Lazarus  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:07:20pm

#29 Andy in Agoura Hills

But how about some autopsies? I would think that would be VITAL to uncovering what happened.

Savage had one of the attorneys defending one of the accused soldier on his show yesterday. He reported that they have tried to get the bodies for forensic examinations and autopsies, and the families won't let them for... you guessed it... religious reasons.

40 xenophobic  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:07:33pm

#34 Anant:
So your suggestion is that because NCIS, and the brass responded to an allegations they predicted would cause a firestorm [and did!] in the press, that there is something more to it? I'm glad you're not a defense lawyer?

41 Dave the.....  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:08:00pm
They told stories that at times they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Ghengis Khan,

I haven't told this story for about 2 years, so it's time again. Why I really hate John f'n Kerry.

Left wing college professor at my moderate college would play the tape on this for his students. His goal was to brainwash the students into thinking our Vietnam vets were blood thursty killers. And it worked. The other students would get mad at me when I told them the professor was wacked and what he was trying to do.

42 Canadastani  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:08:16pm

#21 Fapping

How very sad that Americans are not only loud and obnoxious and largely ignorant abroad but also, apparently, cartoonishly genocidal.

Truly a great quote to summarize how the sophisticated and nuanced among us (and especially in Europe) like to view the US and US military. What the US needs is a good soccer riot with some racist monkey chants to prove how developed they are. (You'll notice that the sports in North America don't need a kick out racism campaign to remind their fans to stop being asshats) Throw in a few non-chalant comments justifying terrorist violence in Israel, and the US will be just as advanced as its superiors across the water.

43 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:08:42pm
44 SpiritOf1683  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:09:42pm

#14 J. Lichty

Just heard that story on the BBC News. Julius Streicher would have been proud of its coverage.

45 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:10:54pm

Andy in Agoura Hills (#29),

Nice start on a list of questions we need answered (that no one in the MSM can seem to figure out to ask.)

46 Northpaw  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:11:15pm

I certainly hope that this story is proven to be an utter fabrication.

I can imagine our Marines "snapping" and shooting a few locals who are out "celebrating" a downed chopper. Barely. In no way can I imagine our Marines going door-to-door and just blasting babies and so forth.

Seems to me that in an effort to make this story as shocking as possible the creator of the hoax has perhaps overdone it. God I hope that is the case.

47 Grand Junctionite  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:11:17pm

As a retired Marine Ground Pounder from Camp Pendleton, I have been following this. I know some of the people who are affected by the allegations. It's like a James Bond movie to the left. Anybody who came in contact with the MicroFilm must be eliminated. I emailed this to a friend in Fallujah the other day.

"Marine Captain James Kimber commanded Lima Company of the 3rd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment. The troops involved in the incident were from Kilo Company. He tells interviewers that he first learned about the shootings in February when he heard that a Time magazine reporter was asking questions about civilian deaths. Notably, Kimber says he heard nothing about a civilian massacre during weekly meetings with the Haditha City Council and talks with local leaders. "It would have been huge, there would have been no question it would have filtered down to us," he said. "We reported no significant atmospheric change as a result of that day." Kimber who has been relieved of his command and is back in Camp Pendleton, CA says, “I believe I was a political casualty as a result of the Haditha incident.” Some media accounts indicate that some of the dead were relatives of a Haditha City Council member. The May 12, 2006 edition of Iraq Reconstruction Update carries a photo and short article about Marine officers holding weekly meetings with the Haditha City Council with no mention of the alleged shooting controversy...

Ghengis,

I know Kimber. He was the XO of India with XXX and me. He is not the kind of Officer that would get involved with this stuff. This statement alone from him would be enough to spark "reasonable doubt" with me. I don't understand why he would get relieved for something a sister company alledgedly did though.

Spartan

48 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:15:20pm

Dianna,

I'm also aware that my immediate, knee-jerk reaction on first reading the accusations was a furious "Nonsense!". But I'm a Marine's kid, so what do you expect.

Mine too. I knew I was preaching to the choir and I was really just using your quote as a lead in, but I hope everyone recognizes that these charges were suspicious from the beginning. But that is certainly not how the majority of reporting is has been printed.

Even if these charges are eventually proven to be bogus, I have three real bitches: (1) Why did the military brass appear to have laid down like a dog, (2) why the press always has assumed the worst about the military though their character has said otherwise for at least 40 years, and (3) when are the accusers going to finally be held accountable. I don't want Dan Rather and Mary Mapes to be forced to resign. I want them in prison for libel.

49 sngnsgt  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:15:58pm

O.T. Major:

The Dummycrats just get dumb and dumber every day, Jack Murtha has announced, he will run for Speaker of the House "when" the Dems take back the House!

50 Grand Junctionite  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:16:27pm

#34 Anant

The Marine Corps will do the right thing, but this will also be handled from a PR standpoint. There are alot of factors going into this such as the upcomming reassignment of General Officers and even the Commandant. The standard USMC practice is to temporarily relieve a whole slew of people and let them sweat for months before anything happens. By then your good name and career is tainted but the senior guys are politically protected.

It's the company grade guys that suffer in the end.

51 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:17:11pm

Sorry about the typos in #48. I'm getting really careless about proofing. I admit guilt.

52 Harry Tuttle  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:20:30pm
Buckaroo 6/9/2006 01:48PM PDT

A former employer of mine was undergoing a somewhat embarassing PR situation, chiefly because information was being quickly posted and re-posted on a handful of enthusiast sites and forums, far faster than any "official" statements were being devised & distributed. One of my older co-workers blurted out one afternoon "Man, this internet thing sucks sometimes!"

I think the LLL media must say that every single day ...
:-)
:-)

Dennis Miller put it "getting something off of the internet is like getting pee out of the pool"

53 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:21:02pm

Haditha, Schmaditha.

54 DesertSage  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:21:05pm

#49 sngnsgt

I heard that also. The DemonRats will reward Murtha for convicting our troops of cold blooded murder (without a trial), by making him Speaker Of The House!

I guess that would relegate Nancy Pelosi to Majority Leader?

55 formercorpsman  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:23:36pm

Wow, if this desintegrates the way that memogate did, I suspect this may take another serious chunk out of the dinosaur.

Although we are pretty divided politically in this country, I think there is still an arbitrary middle who would find the msm's credibilty suspect this time, even though many of us see it now.

This does put them in the spotlight now.

56 jehu  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:24:31pm

I hope this falls apart, both for the Marines and to use it as a club to beat Murtha and the MSM senseless.

57 Anant  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:25:51pm

#40

Well, look at HOW they reacted. Apparently (if the "sources" for some of these stories are correct), the Pentagon has been hinting that there might have been a crime, and the top general in the Marine Corps flew out to Iraq to talk about values and stuff. If the reaction had been "this story is a fake and we're going to ignore it," that would have been one thing. But so far the military has reacted in a manner that indicates that they something might have happened. That's obviously not proof that something happened, of course, but it makes it harder to believe (as much as I want to) that this is just a lie cooked up by angry terrorist sypmathizers.

Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, the very fact that we have a military justice system that investigates this sort of thing shows just how much better our society is than theirs. In their society, if you murder civillians, you're a hero who gets to go to heaven when you die.

58 TMF  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:26:53pm

Id love to have this McGirk prick on the stand.

59 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:27:27pm

Frickin' Nancy Pelosi. What a worthless use of skin. I guarantee you if you could perform an autopsy upon her death, you'll find that the injection of at least one of the botox shots used a needle about three inches too long.

Not only did the synapses in her crow's feet atrophy, but so did the dendrites in her brain. It's a wonder she can generate enough energy in her head to bug her eyes.

60 Dianna  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:28:44pm

#48 gn

(1) Why did the military brass appear to have laid down like a dog,

What did you want them to do? I'm sorry, but a categorical denial would have made the press bay like hyenas. Waiting and keeping mum is about all they can do.

As for the press...most of them know nothing, and care less, about the military. Few reporters have even known someone who was military, and their ignorance and preconceptions are astonishing.

61 steve  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:29:23pm

#18 katemaclaren It is possible to add "To rather" to Wikipedia.

62 GoesTo11  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:30:52pm

#29 Andy

...However, it seems to me that Arab culture is prone to exaggeration.

Somewhat of an understatement, that.

63 Fenway_Nation  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:31:02pm
A Presbyterian minister who was an embedded reporter with his son’s U.S. Marine company, which is accused of killing 24 Iraqi civilians in Haditha, said soldiers in private moments gave no indication anything horrible happened in the town.

I'm more inclined to believe him than some Al-Jazeera shill or a jihadi lawyer/reporter with an axe to grind, but the fact that he may well be a blood relative of one of the accused means that what he has to say won't be taken very seriously by many.

64 Proud Army Pilot Mom  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:31:08pm

I hope everyone will read Michael Yon's take on Haditha. It is one of the best perspectives I've come across and should be mandatory reading before anyone makes any judgements of our brave Marines no matter what comes out of the investigation.

Here is the link:
[Link: www.michaelyon-online.com...]

65 David Simon  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:31:24pm

#46 Northpaw - "In no way can I imagine our Marines going door-to-door and just blasting babies and so forth."

Neither can I. It sounds like something the "insurgents" would do in order to frame the Marines. All we know at this point is that a Marine took pictures of a massacre with his phone camera. NCIS confiscated the camera. Period.

66 sngnsgt  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:31:58pm

#54 Desert Sage

I heard that also. The DemonRats will reward Murtha for convicting our troops of cold blooded murder (without a trial), by making him Speaker Of The House!

I guess that would relegate Nancy Pelosi to Majority Leader?

Now I'm hearing on Fox that he's running for Majority Leader. I tested my anti-virus software and trolled over to see what the DUmmies were barking about and it's Majority Leader. Either way, it's a plus for Republicans. I can hear Dean screaming (again) now!

67 Anant  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:33:24pm

#50

Do you think there's any signifigance to the fact that Gen. Hagee went to Iraq to speak to the Marines there? It was certainly seemed that way, but is that just standard procedure?

BTW, my brother is hoping to be deployed to Camp Pendleton once he finishes his course at the DLI. He's really looking forward to it.

68 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:36:33pm
69 Lazarus  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:37:01pm

#55 formercorpsman

Wow, if this desintegrates the way that memogate did, I suspect this may take another serious chunk out of the dinosaur.

The problem is that a lot of the crap being thrown against the wall sticks. The reason there are so many virulent Leftists in the media and politics and academia is because they have a large audience. They know they can say just about any anti-American thing they want to and someone will pay them to say and others will tell them they're great for saying it.

These lies have legs because most people don't make objective judgements. They don't ask who is lying, why it's a lie, and why it's bad to lie. They just go along with the crowd.

70 Canadastani  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:37:03pm

#55 formercorpsman

Wow, if this desintegrates the way that memogate did, I suspect this may take another serious chunk out of the dinosaur.

The dinosaur this could take a serious chunk out of would be the Democrats who are expecting to move into the Speaker's Chair in the Congress this November.

Every Republican incumbent's ads should include "While my opponent claims to support our troops, he said the following about our troops when they were falsely accused in Haditha..."
"He believes, as I do, in the presumption of innocents for alleged criminals, but he does not extend that benefit of the doubt to men and women risking their lives in Iraq"
"Whether you support the war or not, 'Support our Troops' should be more than a slogan discarded at the first opportunity. There is no reason to assume the worst about the men and women of this country, Mr. _"

71 stuiec  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:37:30pm

#14 J. Lichty

And the Gaza beach explosion may not have been an Israeli artillery shell, by the way:

A day after the successful targeted killing of Popular Resistance Committees leader Jamal Abu Samhadana, the apparent misfiring of an IDF artillery shell resulted in 12 civilian deaths and left dozens wounded Friday evening.

Though Palestinians reported that the shells came from a navy warship, an Israeli investigation found that no Israeli warships or fighter planes had been firing at the time. The possibility that the shells came from ground artillery was being investigated, and Chief of General Staff Lt.-Gen. Dan Halutz ordered a suspension of all artillery fire until the investigation was complete.

Also this:

ARMY INVESTIGATING

"We did not fire into a place where there were innocents," Major-General Yoav Galant told reporters. "We are exploring two possibilities, a wrongly aimed artillery shell or an independent incident we were not involved in."

He did not say who else might have been behind the deaths.

72 storagemanager  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:40:10pm

Roommate of 9/11 hijacker took flight lessons in New Zealand last month
An astounding story: "Pilot with 9/11 links found in NZ," from the New Zealand Herald, with thanks to David Farrar: Rayed Mohammed Abdullah Ali, who lived in Phoenix with Hani Hanjour, who piloted American Airlines Flight 77 into the Pentagon, went to New Zealand and was...taking flight training. He has been expelled from the country and is back in Saudi Arabia, which of course, as everyone knows, is our Friend and Ally and will not allow him to get into any mischief.

[Link: www.jihadwatch.org...]

73 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:40:32pm

@60 Dianna,

What did you want them to do? I'm sorry, but a categorical denial would have made the press bay like hyenas. Waiting and keeping mum is about all they can do.

You mean like "values training" for our military?

Keeping Mum?

A slap in the face to all military personnel whether it happened or not. You don't punish the entire fighting force. This gutless general should resign and go to work selling insurance. Even better, sign up for a Fortune 500 H.R. rep. You think Omar Bradley or Dwight Eisenhower would have ordered values training?

74 Thriggle  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:41:01pm
“They came out on the streets and brought us bread and tea and invited us into their homes. The businessmen would have them come into their shops.”

What? No! All Iraqi's hate Americans! And they don't have any bread or tea, since the filthy American capitalists swept in and stole it so they could make it into oil for their colonial empire! Also, civil war.

/LLL

75 scaramouche  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:42:36pm

OT--The invisible man and some buddies protest counter-terrorism in London.

76 joewilson  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:43:00pm

Okay, I know you hate Murtha but the military talks to him.

Murtha shocked them today with this announcement because he has balls and resolve.

He is the best they have to offer.

" All we know at this point is that a Marine took pictures of a massacre with his phone camera. NCIS confiscated the camera. Period."

This sounds familiar.

77 Mark1957  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:43:02pm
But how about some autopsies? I would think that would be VITAL to uncovering what happened.

Savage had one of the attorneys defending one of the accused soldier on his show yesterday. He reported that they have tried to get the bodies for forensic examinations and autopsies, and the families won't let them for... you guessed it... religious reasons.

I'm no legal expert, but if neither defense counsel nor the prosecution can obtain forensic evidence of the sort mentioned above wouldn't this be equivalent, in large part, to important witnesses not showing up to testify? There certainly must be other circumstancial evidence but, if the assertion made on Savage's show is true, then the prosecution's case may well be hamstrung from the outset, if or when this case proceeds to a general court-martial.

I'd appreciate more expert opinion on this matter.

78 RJ_in_Reno  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:43:15pm

Does anyone have any experience dealing with NCIS?

From what I heard through the grape vine when I was in the Navy they aren't anywhere near as good as Mark Harmon on the TV show. All I ever heard was that they could screw up a wet dream.

79 song_and_dance_man[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:44:08pm
80 GregInSeattle  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:44:48pm

Wouldn't it be great to deliver two body blows to the Libs this week with the demise of Zarqawi and the Haditha "massacre"!

81 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:46:05pm

#76 MoeWilson,


Okay, I know you hate Murtha but the military talks to him.

Try and remember this: John Frickin' Kerry doesn't count as military...

82 KevinV  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:47:13pm

# 70 - Canadastani

Every Republican incumbent's ads should include "While my opponent claims to support our troops, he said the following about our troops when they were falsely accused in Haditha..."
"He believes, as I do, in the presumption of innocents for alleged criminals, but he does not extend that benefit of the doubt to men and women risking their lives in Iraq"
"Whether you support the war or not, 'Support our Troops' should be more than a slogan discarded at the first opportunity. There is no reason to assume the worst about the men and women of this country, Mr. _"

We can only WISH the Republicans had enough balls to run ads like that!

They never would of course, spineless wonders that they are. If you don't believe me, ask youself why prominent democrats feel perfectly safe associating themselves with Daily Kos at their big convention. Any political adviser with half a brain could see opposition ads highlighting ol' "Screw em"'s best quotes and then linking those quotes with the Democrats in question with pictures of them speaking at the Riviera.

The only reason the Demos aren't worried about that stuff is

1) The press in on their side; and

2) The Repubs are wimps.

Ah, Lee Atwater! How we miss you!

83 Mark1957  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:49:00pm
I really love Ann would like to marry her but I don't think she handle my rhetoric.

I have this fantasy involving Ann Coulter, a tub full of Jell-O, and a William F. Buckley spy novel.

*Head and neck twitching uncontrollably*

Can't...get...it...out...of...my...head...

84 Lazarus  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:50:23pm

#77 Mark1957

In a just proceeding, the absence of forensic evidence would sink the prosecution. But if the Left screams loud enough, the military may well make scapegoats out of these men just to lower the heat. It's already happened in this war. The punishments from Abu Ghraib were a disgrace of military justice. Expect uncorroborated heresay to carry a lot of weight in this case. The poor Marines will need all the luck they can get.

85 formercorpsman  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:50:59pm

#69 Lazarus
#70 Canadastani

I agree with both of you.

My reference is to those folks who find themselves only involved ankle deep with world events. They decide an issue from emotion, and not from intellect. I know some decent folks who dare not discuss issues such as this with me (I am told I pontificate) because it is just not on their radar. Nonetheless, they get the gest of our troops being smeared, it does register, thus, making up their minds.

While I am still waiting to hear the final report, from what I can see so far, it does beg to question media credibility. If this does turn out to be another rathergate, the only ones we will have to blame for not crucifying the media for their actions will be ourselves.

You know damn well they won't do it themselves.

As for the next election cycle, don't get your hopes up if this does become something a republican could use in their favor, we never seem to capitalize on what could really be a usefull message for some reason.

86 Lazarus  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:52:34pm

Ann's right. The Left and terrorist nations have given us a simple choice: life or death. It's nothing to pull punches over.

87 DesertSage  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:54:23pm

#66 sngnsgt

I haven't found anything about Murtha running for Majority Leader, not even on his own website.
If he really is running, it can't be anything but good for Republicans! Especially if this Haditha thing turns out to be bogus (and it's sure starting to look that way).

88 song_and_dance_man[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:54:42pm
89 neoconundrum  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:54:53pm

Charles -

The Main Stream Media is now "informing" us that Hamas is calling off its "truce".

(giggle)

90 Dianna  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:56:39pm

I go to drink to the health and honor of the USMC.

'Night, all.

91 aRedPhishHead  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:58:41pm

Fits the template, fits the giddy reporting without fact-checking, fits the Vietnam-uber narrative, fits the trends we see with media organizations reporting and running with terrorist and insurgent propaganda as fact, Ishaqi has already unraveled, Illario Pantano was acquitted for similar charges in a similar situation, etc.

I bet the MSM is wishing it was 1969 again - where this information would've never seen the light of day.

92 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 12:59:08pm
93 Canadastani  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:00:54pm

#82 and #85

I know the Republicans almost certainly won't have the sack courage of their convictions to go at the Democrats and call them to the carpet for slandering the troops, but I can dream. Most of the kinder and gentler ones are in the Senate, there are a few in the House who know that driving conservative turnout and sowing seeds of doubt among moderates is their best bet.

94 formercorpsman  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:01:16pm

I shall leave my office in chester county now, begin my trek home, make it over the line to Maryland, make my presence known in the licker store, and replenish my bottle of crown.

Hence, I shall return later, only to second that emotion Dianna.

I go to drink to the health and honor of the USMC.

Well said girl.

95 Tinker  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:01:48pm

If this unravels, it'll rip the heads off of the MSM and Murtha. Abu Ghraib was "excessive" and an insult to the Arabs. Okay, a bad PR situation and poor discipline that's been punished. Rathergate - an MSM partisan effort to unseat the President using forged documents. Again, hard ball, vicious, but without real resonance among Americans since it failed.

But if this unravels like it appears to be doing, we've got the MSM attacking the most courageous, ballsy, patriotic stand-up men and women in the country. When it hits the fan, Murtha will be spitting sh*t for the rest of his life and his political career will be over. The words "in cold blood" will haunt him for the rest of his life.

As for the MSM (think Mike Barnacle - this is his take on what happened as he described it on local Boston talk radio), they've claimed that Marines went door-to-door, tied up captives, then proceeded to execute them, house after house. And a taxi with 4 occupants that came upon the scene were dragged out of the taxi and killed, execution-style.

If this falls apart, Murtha's head should be on a plate with a side of crow for MSM consumption. And all of America should monitor the meal to make sure those rats scarf down every piece.

96 oilbertan  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:02:40pm

Don't worry, if the story turns out to be false all the moonbats and asshats will start crying coverup and claim the dark hand of Rove was behind it all. They don't get it and never will.

97 RJ_in_Reno  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:03:59pm

A reference to one of my posts from the great TFK.

I'm truly honored.

98 Lazarus  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:05:39pm

#85 formercorpsman

As for the next election cycle, don't get your hopes up if this does become something a republican could use in their favor, we never seem to capitalize on what could really be a usefull message for some reason.

They never do. They think it's "unchristian" or "sinking to their level" to criticize their worst enemy.

99 Grand Junctionite  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:09:12pm

#67 ANANT
It is the Marine Corps way for the Commandant to go do this. Significant? no, it's not unusual. It's his way of taking the lead and showing washington and all Marines that this is being taken seriously and being handled at the top.
he is leading from the front and covering his rear. The CMC wants to retire this summer short of his four year tour. He can't do that with this stuff hanging out there. Generals who rise this high are political folks and need to cover their six in situations like this.

General Haggee is a good man, he's no Al Gray, but he does not want to have the reputation of the Corps or his own legacy tarnished.

100 crosspatch  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:11:10pm

OMG! That is all I can say ... OMG!

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

No WAY

101 Redcoat  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:12:07pm

#22 ferris

Reuters, Al Jezera, etc would have been there in 10 seconds.

A Reuters person was there, he neglected to mention anything at the time about the incident that woould indicate a massacre.

It's the dog that did nothing in the night.

102 observer  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:16:32pm

"...when the troops go in, a few of them will kill civilians, bomb schools, torture prisoners. It happens in every war in human history, even the good ones. Individual Americans, Britons, Canadians, Australians did bad things in World War II and World war I. These aren't stunning surprises, they're inevitable: It might be a bombed mosque or a gunned-down pregnant wonman or a slaughtered wedding party, but it will certainly be something."
Mark Steyn "Events at Haditha don't change the need for victory," Chicago Sun-Times, June 4, 2006.

So:
1. A little perspective
2. No rush to judgment
3. No premature denial, either.

103 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:16:55pm

#100 crosspatch

Murtha?

*spit*

104 Truck Monkey  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:17:25pm

#100 Crosspatch

Murtha looks like Jabba the Hut, but what's even funnier than that is that you have Patard Kennedy in the foreground with that stupid blank look in his eyes. Some cousins MUST have gotten together somewhere in their family tree!

105 GregInSeattle  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:18:50pm

If this thing about Haditha unravels as it's looking to do, Murtha better just concentrate on getting re-elected.

But, it's hard to say what would be worse- the screechy traitor Pelosi or the stumbling pathetic traitor Murtha as Speaker...

106 storagemanager  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:19:07pm

Qur’an 9:61 “Gabriel came to Muhammad and said, ‘If a black man comes to you his heart is more gross than a donkey’s.’”... Tabari IX:113 “Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and to beat them, but not severely. If they abstain, they have the right to food and clothing. Treat women well for they are like domestic animals and they possess nothing themselves. Allah has made the enjoyment of their bodies lawful in his Qur’an.” ...Qur’an:8:12 “I shall terrorize the infidels. So wound their bodies and incapacitate them because they oppose Allah and His Apostle.” ( Islam is hate...Islam is Evil...Islam is the Bigot...THE ONE THING ISLAM IS NOT IS LOVE!...

107 BulgarWheat  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:20:11pm

#102 observer...

if these bastards have dared to drag the good name of the Marine Corps in general, and these outstanding young men in particular, the MSM, Murtha, Durbin, Clinton, Kerry and the rest of these swine not only deserve to be voted out of office, they need to be dragged through the street and humiliated and spit upon for the rest of their life.

108 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:22:16pm

#107 BulgarWheat

For every day the marines and sailor accuse spend in the brig and shackled, Murtha and the others deserve a year in prison for slander and libel.

109 GoesTo11  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:23:36pm

#104 TM

Kennedy's "blank look" is the result of being fucking hammered an excessive dose of FDA-approved prescription medications.

110 fapping gn0bheadz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:24:02pm

#28 for Diana:

Sarcasm - I forgot to execute it at the command prompt; I'm surrounded by that culture day in and day out and I've grown to rather enjoy it as a dark cultural comedy.

Honestly, I may have blown an "anger fuse" but its hard not to just laugh at the abject absurdity that plays out before us.

Its been brought up before: mockery and laughter are useful weapons in the culture war. Given certain contexts, they can be very powerful too;

example: my girlfriend was upset that Gitmo terrorists could pray how they used to; i couldnt help myself and burst out laughing. She got pissed; I realized I was being an ass.

But I saw the awesome power of a post-O'reilly approach to discourse. These people are fussy dramaqueens who externalize their myspace issues onto Darfur and Karl Rove and its best to respond to their theatrics as an amused audience rather than a righteous maniac.

Subvert the subversives...

my $.02...

111 crosspatch  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:24:09pm

Yeah, I just heard it on Fox too, Murtha says that if the Democrats take the House (translation: if a meteor impact kills off half the US population) then he will run for House Majority leader.


SIMPLY AMAZING!

112 DesertSage  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:25:40pm

A year ago, nobody ever even heard of John Murtha.
He's only become famous infamous because of his anti-military, cut-and-run rhetoric that the Lefties love so much.

Let him run for Majority Leader, it's only one more reason for Republicans to get fired up and go vote this fall!

113 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:28:59pm

[Link: data1.blog.de...]

The REAL STORY

114 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:29:05pm

At about the same time, a man who stepped out of his nearby house to see what was happening at Ayed Ahmed's home was shot and wounded, according to al-Hadithi. Aws Fahmi, 43, was left to bleed on the street for about two hours before a female neighbor dragged him to safety, al-Hadithi told the AP. Fahmi's family was not able to take him to a hospital until two days later, al-Hadithi said.
Someone must have forgotten that Aws Fahmi was quoted ten times in this WaPo piece from May27, as a witness. Not once did he claim to be involved, let alone shot. Are we to believe he forgot? Or that the WaPo wouldn't tell the story of a man shot and left to die in the street by our Marines?
QUOTES WONT WORK.
I guess the bullet wound to his head caused him to forget.

115 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:30:43pm

/I guess the bullet wound to his head caused him to forget.
SARC

116 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:31:54pm
117 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:33:29pm

Murtha, Pelosi, Boxer, Hillary, Schumer, Kerry, Kennedy...

Well, that's it, the whole Democratic Party, according to the MSM.

118 fapping gn0bheadz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:34:39pm

#42 Canadastani

Again, just want to make sure were on the same page here. I'm not much a fan of Iowahawk's style - I much prefer BlameBush - i'd rather dwell in the surreal comedy of LLL's and witness its huffy cultural resplendence...

...its fashionable hipsters, so sexily adrift and apathetic
...the bombastic students, glorious in their cartoonish models of the world, their global consciences gleaming...
...the exasperated professors, dire and gloomy with inarticulate woe, casting shadows of Haliburton and energy companies on the wall like Noam explained to do
...the empty social interactions, exchanges of expensive biochemicals, competitions of coping mechanisms and exhortations of jadedness
...the boastful and chipper postmodernists, chiming their mashes of art theory with comical understandings of international relations, positing, always positing all...

119 observer  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:34:49pm

#107, BulgarWheat

Your first word is the key.

120 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:38:09pm

I can envision this weekend's planning strategy:

Kerry - "Damnit, now I can't testify at the Haditha Summer Soldier Hearings..."

Aide: "But Sir, you are Chairing that Commitee.."

Kerry: "Reminiscent of My Lai, our soldiers ravaged the innocent Iraqis..."

Aide: "Sir!"

Kerry: "Oh all right, go check the news wires, find out if there's a new "Haditha" in the pipes"

121 ted  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:39:16pm

Yes...the brilliant sleuths of the conservative blogosphere are fisking this story relentlessly and the smell of horseshit is becoming ever more evident...

122 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:41:16pm

#120 Bubbles

I thought Haditha was part of the profit mohammed's umm.. thing.. Haditha? Like it's OK to rape 9 year olds? That Haditha... Ya know?

123 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:41:22pm
Murtha, Pelosi, Boxer, Hillary, Schumer, Kerry, Kennedy...


They have been invited to Zarqawi's funeral.

/I hope they swarm the casket and drop the fng corpse on Murthas fat ass.

124 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:42:17pm

#100 Crosspatch

I weep for what my former party has become

125 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:42:52pm

Al Gore: (slowly, with a lisp) Well, it looks like Haditha is not going to work out after all, which means Kerry can't use it. Good.

Aide: Yes, Mr. Gore

Gore: Find out if there is a global warming crisis I can use and round up all your friends and family to see my movie.

Aide: (mutters) ugh.

126 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:45:21pm

#125 Bubble Girl

Since you brought Al, I'll feel free to post this then:

Top Ten Surprises In Al Gore's Global Warming Movie


10. The role of Al Gore was played by Bruce Willis

9. During summer months, Al and Tipper host nude barbecues

8. Hilarious outtake of Al Gore saying, "Wobal Glarming"

7. It's a musical

6. Refers to Arizona as being "Hotter than Tipper's ass"

5. Claims global warming melted Kenny Rogers' face

4. Blames the crisis on a creepy Albino

3. The scientist who supports all his claims is Al Gore in a mustache

2. Best solution is to contribute heavily to Gore-In-2008.com

1. It felt longer than the Florida recount

127 ted  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:46:01pm

107 108
THIS GOT ME STEAMING... These young Marines are in solitary...For what?...The hype lies and deceit of the scumbag Murtha? THE MSM?

128 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:46:06pm

Murtha: (kneeling before Black Altar) Yes, Lord Satan, I tried, I really tried but it looks like the real truth about Haditha is going to come out..

Satan: Spineless coward, I own you.. now go smear those soldiers..

129 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:46:43pm

[Link: www.chancemccoy.com...] Zarkawi

130 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:48:20pm

OK dang it. Please, help a poor kaffur. How the heck do I re-name a link? Please, no fatwahs, just help. Thank you,
Mufti-Emir Silly Putty

131 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:48:51pm
#100 Crosspatch

I weep for what my former party has become


Here also,
see my football.

But if we keep digging we might get another ...?
I will dig real deep and find somebody.

132 Iron Fist[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:49:27pm
133 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:50:15pm

126 Kragar

So did you see Al's movie? Kerry had one too when he ran for Prez.

Going Up The River Of Lies or something like that...

134 DesertSage  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:51:36pm

#117 Bubble Girl

Murtha, Pelosi, Boxer, Hillary, Schumer, Kerry, Kennedy...

I do think that Pelosi and Boxer have morphed into the same person.

I never see them at the same time together.

They have turned into Peloxer!

135 de La Valette  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:52:48pm

Is there opposition candidate in PA 12?

136 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:53:02pm

132 Iron Fist

You know the other day the State Comptroller of New York (D) gave an introduction to Chuck Schumer where he said Chuck would be the man to put a bullet between George Bush's eyes.

This man later apologized that day. Nothing from Schumer, nothing from the Dems.

And the Left thinks we are fascist?

137 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:53:11pm

Silly Putty (#130),

Hilight the text you want to be the link, then hit the "link" button, then paste the URL into the dialog box.

138 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:53:28pm
139 Canadastani  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:53:57pm

#118

There is a fine line between what should be obvious parodies and Moonbat screeds that look like self-evident parodies. BlameBush.com looked like the former, but appears to actually be the latter.

The condescending attitude you refered to in your previous post (#21 - an obvious parody)seemed to neatly sum things up with good humor. The screeds are OK now and then: self-important, detached lefties spouting conspiracy theories with smug certainty are also funny. Sad and pathetic, but funny.

140 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:54:55pm

DesertSage (#134),

They have turned into Peloxer!

Funny.

141 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:55:18pm

#133 Bubble Girl

So did you see Al's movie?

You know I havent quite gotten around to it, but I'm sure its on my schedule somewhere.

Ah, there it is, right under converting to Islam and waxing my taint.

142 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:55:24pm

134 Desert Sage

Humpty Haditha sat on a MSM wall
Humpty Haditha had a great fall
all the reporters and all the Democrat men
couldn't put Humpty Haditha back together again...

143 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:55:40pm

Shiite

144 Andy in Agoura Hills  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:55:58pm
" All we know at this point is that a Marine took pictures of a massacre with his phone camera. NCIS confiscated the camera. Period."

Really?

It is highly questionable that the Marines would order a rank and file soldier to do such a thing. And to use his own (non-official) camera to document such an important, possibly criminal event.

It is also highly improbably that they would enlist someone who could himself face future charges in such an effort.

And, lastly, it is very unlikely that they would allow such valuable evidence as these photos to disappear.

This latest news, however, may very well shed light on Briones’ motives.

Apparently all of Briones’ statements to the media about being ordered to photograph the Haditha corpses were made after his drunken hit and run felony on April 3, 2006. (His first appearance in the press seems to be an interview with the Los Angeles Times on May 29, 2006.)

If Briones was so traumatized by what he saw in Haditha, why did he wait six months to tell anyone about it?

Isn’t it possible that once the Haditha story came out, Briones latched onto it as a way to beat these very serious charges? They include auto theft, drunk-driving, resisting arrest and leaving the scene of an accident.

link

145 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:56:38pm

Kragar

I will wait until Gore's movie hits the Mystery Science Theater..

146 Canadastani  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:58:34pm

130

Type the name
Highlight
Click "link"
Type or paste the site

Charles at a Kerry Rally

147 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:59:16pm

106 storagemanager

Qur’an 9:61 “Gabriel came to Muhammad and said, ‘If a black man comes to you his heart is more gross than a donkey’s.’”... Tabari IX:113 “Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and to beat them, but not severely.


Are you sure that didnt orginate in the Klan manual?
/clay didnt read that part.

148 doppelganglander  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 1:59:22pm

Doesn't Murtha have to defend his House seat? Surely he's got an opponent who is not clinically insane.

149 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:01:29pm

#145 Bubble Girl

Considering MST3K is no longer in production, that might be a while.

oh darn.

150 haakondahl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:02:50pm

OT: CNN Crawl says "Israeli gunship fires on Gaza beach; 7 killed"

Can't wait to see what the real story is.

151 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:03:05pm

149 Kragar

What is Gore's flick, "The Unconvenient Truth?"

152 RationalLady  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:03:57pm

#48 Goodbye_Natalie

I want them in prison for libel treason.

Fixed that for ya

153 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:04:09pm
Apparently all of Briones’ statements to the media about being ordered to photograph the Haditha corpses were made after his drunken hit and run felony on April 3, 2006. (His first appearance in the press seems to be an interview with the Los Angeles Times on May 29, 2006.)
If Briones was so traumatized by what he saw in Haditha, why did he wait six months to tell anyone about it?
Isn’t it possible that once the Haditha story came out, Briones latched onto it as a way to beat these very serious charges? They include auto theft, drunk-driving, resisting arrest and leaving the scene of an accident.

Murtha,
you ever hear of the Old Shit Hitting the Fan ploy.

154 Silly Putty  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:07:23pm

Bye, bye fuck face:

He obviously had some kind of visual recognition of who they were because he attempted to roll off the stretcher, as I am told, and get away, realizing it was the U.S. military,"

Al-Zarqawi "attempted to, sort of, turn away off the stretcher," he said. "Everybody re-secured him back onto the stretcher, but he died almost immediately thereafter from the wounds he'd received from this airstrike."

Wonder where allah was? Fucktard.

155 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:07:45pm
Doesn't Murtha have to defend his House seat? Surely he's got an opponent who is not clinically insane.

Another lizard said that the Demorats in his district want him to be more Anti-war or they will with-hold donations for his campaign.

The old anti-war for money ploy.

156 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:09:48pm

ibmkeyboard (#153),

Murtha,
you ever hear of the Old Shit Hitting the Fan ploy.

Murtha has repeatedly said his sources inside the military have told him this is bad, bad, bad.

If he didn't know about shit hitting the fan before he's gonna find out about it soon enough.

157 Iron Fist[deleted]  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:10:01pm
158 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:12:18pm

#151 Bubble Girl

The Inconvenient Truth.

Funny how the truth that when Al Gore was actually in a position to do something about "Global Warming" the pseudo-scientists behind the nonsense says it actually got worse while he was VP.

Wonder if they included that inconvenient truth in the film?

159 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:12:31pm

Iron Fist

Perhaps. But we have all the Guns

160 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:12:53pm

157 Iron Fist

True, Iron, true. When Clinton was in office he and Daschle quashed a bill that would allow overseas military to vote at their irrespective bases.

Funny how those votes were held up because they had the wrong postage stamp when Gore ran.

161 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:14:55pm

Kragar @ 158

I think that "Truth" is different for some. For Gore, Clinton, Kerry, ect., "Truth" is malleable, kind of like jello.

162 truthteller  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:19:14pm

At the risk of having my head bitten off, isn't it possible to believe that:

1. The Time reporter is a serious journalist doing his job and that the facts, as we know them so far, do point to the strong possibility that something terrible happened at Haditha.

2. This doesn't change the fact that the marines as a whole are well-trained, responsible and humane and that if the massacre occurred it's less an indictment of the marines or the military as a whole and more a comment on the fact that sometimes in a war even the best-trained troops can snap.

3. Far from showing American weakness, the willingness to investigate this matter seriously and the fact that it inspires domestic debate shows that this is a healthy society. It's the Islamists who are incapable of finding fault with their own.

4. There's a human tendency not to believe what we find emotionally troubling, and therefore the presbyterian father mentioned in the news story here, whatever his other virtues, might not exactly be a disinterested witness.

5. Believing in the likely truth of the Haditha allegations may well be the same as wanting them to be true for moonbats, but that for others there's no contradiction between wanting them to be false (an emotional response) and believing that, sadly, they may be true (an intellectual assessment of the facts).

163 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:27:17pm

#162 truthteller 6/9/2006 04:19PM PDT

At the risk of having my head bitten off, isn't it possible to believe that:

1. The Time reporter is a serious journalist doing his job and that the facts, as we know them so far, do point to the strong possibility that something terrible happened at Haditha.

It is also possible that the timing of this story, released on the Friday before Memorial Day after the actual story broke three months prior leads me to be cynical. I can base my assumptions and opinions based on the prior actions of Time magazine.

There has never been a willingness to hide the truth about this matter, what there has been is the participants who are using this story, taking full advantage before the all the facts are weighed.

You have failed to address these individuals, such as Murtha who has been out calling the troops involved, "killers," who has been attempting to paint this incident the "2nd My Lai," which doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the Left once again trying to draw parallels between Vietnam and Iraq. You fail to acknowledge this.

Why?

164 squeegy  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:28:49pm

Media Lies had documented continually morphing stories as reported by the mainstream media.

[Link: www.riehlworldview.com...]

165 David E  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:30:13pm

Here is Murtah's opponent: Diana Irey

166 Geepers  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:31:15pm

truthteller (#162),

You didn't read any of the links did you?

167 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:35:05pm
1. The Time reporter is a serious journalist doing his job and that the facts, as we know them so far, do point to the strong possibility that something terrible happened at Haditha.

As I see it,
A house full of terrorists destroyed a young Marines Humvee turning him into a closed casket viewing.
The Marines then received fire and possible C-130 gunship support, because the house collasped.
Gunships kill lots of people, even Marines sometimes.
/Murtha could have waited.
But he would rather sell his brothers to the fucking media.

168 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:36:48pm
Here is Murtah's opponent: Diana Irey

I would vote for her,
and I dont live in the district.

169 calcajun  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:37:37pm
At the risk of having my head bitten off, isn't it possible to believe that:

Not biting your head off, but responding point by point.


1. The Time reporter is a serious journalist doing his job and that the facts, as we know them so far, do point to the strong possibility that something terrible happened at Haditha.

Time and its editors have consisttently been opposed to the war and have been unfavoravle in their coverage of both the war and this adminstration. The MSM - all of it - have been waiting for the first chance to find evidence of a "quagmire" so as to support their self-fulling prophecies.

In fact, the intital response from the local politicians in Haditha was far from hostile. There was no indication that anything untoward had happened in the days and weeks following the event.

2. This doesn't change the fact that the marines as a whole are well-trained, responsible and humane and that if the massacre occurred it's less an indictment of the marines or the military as a whole and more a comment on the fact that sometimes in a war even the best-trained troops can snap.

Quite true. In every war, atrocities are comitted on both sides. This was no Mi Lai massacre where the villagers were lined up in a road-side ditch. But, there is no indication that the Marines in question snapped. Conspiracies unravel when there are a lot of people involved. Something like this would have come to light much sooner, with far more corraborating testimony from the men involved.


3. Far from showing American weakness, the willingness to investigate this matter seriously and the fact that it inspires domestic debate shows that this is a healthy society. It's the Islamists who are incapable of finding fault with their own.

Again, true. But, when the investigators have an agenda, then it's important that the agenda be made clear. Part of the investigation into the seriousness of the charges necessarily means investigating the credibility and bias of those making the charges.


4. There's a human tendency not to believe what we find emotionally troubling, and therefore the presbyterian father mentioned in the news story here, whatever his other virtues, might not exactly be a disinterested witness.

I do not disagree. But, again, this minister would know when he is talking to people who are troubled, or are carrying a heavy burden. Add this to the fact that the local authorities in Haditha made no intial complaints and you have two independent pieces of exculpating evidence.

5. Believing in the likely truth of the Haditha allegations may well be the same as wanting them to be true for moonbats, but that for others there's no contradiction between wanting them to be false (an emotional response) and believing that, sadly, they may be true (an intellectual assessment of the facts).

There are those on both side of the political spectrum who love the "gotcha" aspect of the game. There are nuts on both sides of the aisle. But, taking a serious look at the facts that have been made public there is a serious question as to whether or not a "massacre" took place they way some in the media want us to see it. Those women and kids are dead and they are not coming back, despite what we do. The tragsdy is if some heartless people want to make political capital out of their deaths. The issue of the truth is to be left to the tribunal devised for making such a determination and not the media.

170 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:38:26pm
The Marines then received fire and possible C-130 gunship support, because the house collasped.

my bad,
wrong massacre.

171 GeeWiz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:39:31pm

#43 taxfreekiller

TFK, I'm with ya on that one!

172 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:42:34pm

169 calcajun

Great post.

There are those on both side of the political spectrum who love the "gotcha" aspect of the game. There are nuts on both sides of the aisle. But, taking a serious look at the facts that have been made public there is a serious question as to whether or not a "massacre" took place they way some in the media want us to see it. Those women and kids are dead and they are not coming back, despite what we do. The tragedy is if some heartless people want to make political capital out of their deaths. The issue of the truth is to be left to the tribunal devised for making such a determination and not the media.

173 ibmkeyboard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:43:04pm

169 calcajun
you sure type fast,

400 words a min?

lol

174 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:45:11pm

169 Calcajun

Of course they have never come out and claimed they were "political" but their actions, the MSM, leads me to believe they are.

The tragedy is if some heartless people want to make political capital out of their deaths.

175 neocon hippie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:54:30pm

I haven't had a chance to catch up with the details, and won't get to do so until next weekend. But if the Haditha story unravels as thoroughly as Rathergate, it is order of magnitudes more significant. If so, the effort to pull a My Lai on the Marines takes greater and more systemic effort than one news agency with one fabricated memo 30+ years old. Something this big could be a tipping point.

176 Who Watches the Watchmen?  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:54:55pm

#174 Bubble Girl

The tragedy is if some heartless people want to make political capital out of their deaths.

Who would ever do such a thing?

177 sms111  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:55:01pm

Quick! Get Mary Mapes and Dan Rather and Lucy Ramirez to concoct some documents to prove the Marines' guilt!

After all, nobody will be able to prove the documents false!

178 GeeWiz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:56:23pm

#64 Proud Army Pilot Mom

Thank you so very much for posting that. My only wish is that ALL Americans would read that piece. Brought tears to this old man's eyes.

179 Bubble Girl  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:56:23pm

176 Who Watches

That woman. (shakes head) Has no shame.

180 sms111  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:57:06pm

#175 neocon hippie

If so, the effort to pull a My Lai on the Marines takes greater and more systemic effort than one news agency with one fabricated memo 30+ years old. Something this big could be a tipping point.

Yeah. may be time for Marines and ex-Marines to pay some visits to the front doors of our MSM outlets.

181 calcajun  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 2:59:27pm

#173 ibmkeyboard


169 calcajun
you sure type fast,

400 words a min?

lol


Nope, but I really should proofread my stuff.

182 GeeWiz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:04:40pm

# 68 taxfreekiller

Great question! I'd love to see the answer.

183 GeeWiz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:08:42pm

#76 joewilson

He is the best they have to offer.

Well I guess they are in deeper trouble than I thought they were.

184 TMF  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:09:35pm

Dems are pushing Murtha to the forefront.

He is gunning for Speaker of the House.

LOL

185 Little Green Wizard  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:14:57pm

Next time a leftist talks crap just write one word:

Haditha.

186 truthteller  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:17:50pm

169 Calcajun

Thanks for the clarification. Is there such a thing as a three-quarters lizard? In other words can you believe that the media is far too easy on Hamas, football hating Saudis, Canadian terrorists from "diverse" backgrounds, police hating British Islamists, Iranian madmen and our friends in Pakistan, Malaysia and Egypt; that it's not quite fair to Israel, Oriana Fallaci and Ayaan Hirsi Ali; that for the most part it weaseled out of printing the Danish cartoons; BUT that the assessment that the war in Iraq has not unfolded according to plan, whether or not you choose to use the term quagmire, is essentially sound?

I ask because it seems to me that most of the views I've seen here have an all or nothing quality. As for the Time story, I can see where people here are coming from, but knowing that the reporter behind the story has a reputation for accuracy, and that it's unlikely that the magazine would have gone to print with something of this magnitude on flimsy grounds, I'll defer judgment until the official inquiry is made public while believing that the odds of the story unraveling in its entirety are slim.

187 TMF  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:21:56pm

truthteller

the assessment that the war in Iraq has not unfolded according to plan, whether or not you choose to use the term quagmire, is essentially sound?

I would say the war has more or less unfolded precisely according to plan.

The only people who expected it to be a "cakewalk", and/or who were hoping it would be over in a week were ignoramuses, ahistorical idiots and members of the MSM

188 GeeWiz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:26:00pm

#169 calcajun

CLAP! CLAP! CLAP! CLAP! Very well done sir/madam!

189 He's dead, Jim  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:28:54pm

Be wary of the NCIS "investigation" and it's results:

[Link: www.fas.org...]

190 BrianA  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:34:11pm

Jack Murtha = Jane Fonda = John Kerry etc...

191 goodbye_natalie  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:35:29pm

#186 truthteller,

I think one thing you should understand about LGF. When it comes to war, life and death issues, most don't operate under the supposition of 3/4 right. For many of us, Iraq is a life or death issue and either you win or you lose. There is no sort of.

Personally, I feel the shades of gray philosophy is exactly why we find ourselves in the position we do. Let the military fight the war, get the politicians out of it, support the soldiers, understand mistakes happen and let it go at that, and we win. Period.

As to your quote:

As for the Time story, I can see where people here are coming from, but knowing that the reporter behind the story has a reputation for accuracy, and that it's unlikely that the magazine would have gone to print with something of this magnitude on flimsy grounds, I'll defer judgment until the official inquiry is made public while believing that the odds of the story unraveling in its entirety are slim.

Really? I heard something very similar about Mary Mapes - almost verbatim.

192 GeeWiz  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:36:49pm

My $.02

The coverage of Haditha by the MSM and the traitor, Mothra, is what Rush calls, "an attack by the drive-by media". Attack, then move on. I find it very strange that the Haditha story has taken a very back-seat in news coverage lately. Could it be that the MSM sees the story coming apart at the seams? Nah, can't be. Everyone knows that they are in pursuit of the truth. Yea right!

193 truthteller  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 3:54:26pm

#191 goodbye_natalie

Thanks for clarifying. I was just wondering if there were more people like me out there, in agreement much of the time but not all of the time. On Iraq, I can respect your sentiments yet disagree on the facts. That's not a "sort of" position, just one that happens to be at odds with the majority view here. In other words, I'm not trying to split the difference on every issue, simply pointing out that one can broadly sympathize with a worldview--in this case pro-Israel, anti-Saudi--while reserving the right to disagree on this or that policy.

194 M. Simon  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 4:06:07pm

How the military compensates Iraqis for civilian deaths.

Blood Money.

More stuff on why the story is falling apart there as well.

195 M. Simon  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 4:12:59pm

#175 neocon hippie,

Actually it only takes two or three corrupt sources in on the plot and a MSM with a will to believe.

Lies will circle the world seven times before the truth gets out of the door.

The truth, however, has staying power.

196 mattm  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 5:41:02pm

I would say the story is a hoax at this point. After the investigation is done, if it turns out to be one big hoax, it will be dropped by the MSM so they can try to cover their tail.

197 really grumpy big dog johnson  Fri, Jun 9, 2006 6:23:48pm

Right now I'm trying to fight off serious fatigue after a pretty grueling week at work. I've tried conscienciously to read the whole thread, but I may have missed a few points.

A couple of things, however. While taxfreekiller often has insightful points to make, the suggestion of leg irons at the brig at Camp Pendleton was not a useful contribution, unless you know something I don't. Trust me, unless you know more than I'm aware that you know about Marine Corps procedure, you are better off leaving that one alone.

Already I've seen reference to the accused being held in solitary confinement, however I have no confirmation of such a thing. If someone has concrete evidence of such an event, I'd love to hear about it. But from what I know, that would be unlikely, and that's putting it mildly.

Secondly, I remember reading an article locally here in Colorado a number of days ago, about how the mother of a Marine who served with the unit was told by her son how horrible it was to have to clean up the bodies of those massacred so that they could be photographed, and how he will have nightmares forever.

No offense to those "good folk", but this really, really sounds like straight party-line socialist propaganda to me. First, find a "credible" person who will act as spokesman for a non-participant and unwilling party to the atrocity; second, have that person speak second-hand about the horror; third, publicize it to the maximum through the known leftist channels of feeding bullshit to the masses.

I did a search on who this Marine's mother was, and she is a career tit-sucker who has received grant subsidies for years on end on the order of hundreds of thousands of dollars of your hard-earned tax money for her proposal to advance the educational opportunity for non-USA born citizens (and non-citizens?) who are attending community college in central California. That's right, hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Well, I won't go there. Those who know my experiential base will infer what I'm saying. But this story is unraveling faster than the racist-supremacist drunken frat-boy brutal rape of the party dancer at Duke.

So we have the mother of a Marine that was supposedly a witness to a vicious massacre and who will no doubt need millions of dollars in compensation for the suffering that he will endure over the course of the rest of his life. A Marine. A career grant-funded social worker mom. A party of accusation is the message, truth is relative. A massacre reported by a highly-partisan "youthful budding reporter", OH MY GAWD.

We are being lied to again. This has been brought to you by the party of Bushitler and Bushevil and Chimpboy and every kind of obscene cartoonish slander of the personality of our President imaginable. The party that considers the TANG memos as clearly the truth, and evidence to the contrary as a coverup. Of everything the MAJORITY-ELECTED Republican government has done as a coverup, or corruption, or just sheer unvarnished evil.

How are we as citizens supposed to deal with one of only two major political parties in our country that has effectively become false propagandists and extreme traitors to the advancement of our country and the ideals of free man across the planet for self-determination, and instead has substituted a code of conduct that assumes that western idealogy equals unabated greed and evil?

Where on earth did these people come from? Ask your parents and your peers, and you will know soon enough. The poison has been around for a century now, and it may take us another couple of them before it filters out of our societal environment. I think I would call it the silent winter of socialism.

198 Sir Napsalot  Sat, Jun 10, 2006 4:04:09am

#197 and #169,

Remember the fake Army Ranger/Special Force guy which is a "career" leftist demonstrator just recently debunked? First they put out his fake confession, it didn't gain a leg. And the sequal "Haditha massacre" in the same vein.

The purpose is for overseas consumption. Wait a couple of months, for some imam from an European country to stir up the feverish hate a la "cartoon mohamed" (or "flushed koran") back in the ME.

Facts really don't matter. US can investigate to death for the falsehood of these accusations, you can't convince them. Like I said in my earlier comment (#15), facts/truth contrast with their believes. As we all know, for the progressives, "truth is in the eyes of the beholder".

199 really grumpy big dog johnson  Sat, Jun 10, 2006 4:05:19pm

We will never dishonor our dead, unlike Google. Those who do not know me have no idea what comfort that brings to me.

I truly love my compatriots in a way that cannot be put into words. But they understand that our survival is of paramount importance.

As do I, Marine. You are a monument to honor, and will find your place.


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