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-RetweetNYT Notices AP Corruption

Mon, Dec 4, 2006 at 9:10:52 am PST

This piece by Tom Zeller at the New York Times about the nonexistent Iraqi police captain and his imaginary war crimes is a little more fair than I expected. He actually seems to realize there may be a problem at the Associated Press, although he does get in the obligatory dark hints that bloggers are driven by some kind of agenda (the Lincoln Group? are they serious?): Separating Hyperbole From Horror in Iraq.

Imagine, if you will, the suffocating arrogance level at this AP damage control meeting reported by Zeller:

The executive editor of The Associated Press, Kathleen Carroll, in a meeting in her office Friday afternoon, explained that the agency had already done all it could to respond to the uncertainties by vigorously re-reporting the article, and suggested that to engage these questions — to continue to write about them — merely fueled a mad blog rabble that would never be satisfied.

These people really do seem to think they’re a priestly class, immune to criticism, existing on some rarefied plane from which they hand down truth to the ungrateful masses.

A quote from Frank Zappa is appropriate: “Your whole attitude stinks, I say, and the life you lead is completely empty.”

But isn’t it interesting that Zeller inexplicably forgets to mention in his article what he reported in the Times “blog” on December 1—that the NYT’s own Iraqi correspondent was unable to corroborate the AP’s reports? (Hat tip: Allahpundit.)

Hi Tom,

You ask me about what our own reporting shows about this incident. When we first heard of the event on Nov. 24, through the A.P. story and a man named Imad al-Hashemi talking about it on television, we had our Iraqi reporters make calls to people in the Hurriya neighborhood. Because of the curfew that day, everything had to be done by phone. We reached several people who told us about the mosque attacks, but said they had heard nothing of Sunni worshippers being burned alive. Any big news event travels quickly by word of mouth through Baghdad, aided by the enormous proliferation of cell phones here. Such an incident would have been so abominable that a great many of the residents in Hurriya, as well as in other Sunni Arab districts, would have been in an uproar over it. Hard-line Sunni Arab organizations such as the Muslim Scholars Association or the Iraqi Islamic Party would almost certainly have appeared on television that day or the next to denounce this specific incident. Iraqi clerics and politicians are not shy about doing this. Yet, as far as I know, there was no widespread talk of the incident. So I mentioned it only in passing in my report.

Best,
Edward Wong

UPDATE at 12/4/06 9:22:57 am:

Curt at Flopping Aces, who blew the whistle and got the blog rabble all upset: Responding To The New York Times.

UPDATE at 12/4/06 10:09:20 am:

The Boston Herald’s Jules Crittenden on Fox News: Video: Fox News covers Jamilgate.

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139 comments

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1 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:12:11am

Wow. So perceptive of them...

2 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:13:26am
the Lincoln Group? are they serious?

Dead serious. After all is was Abraham Lincoln; obviously a Zionist operative.

3 ted  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:13:38am

Double Whammy!

4 Canadastani  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:13:45am

The truth is so much more work

5 carridine  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:14:05am

NY Times?

Waittaminnit! What's the angle?

6 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:15:17am

Kettle, this is Pot. You are black, over.

7 Dianna  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:15:42am

This is going to get even more interesting, I'm willing to bet.

"It's not the crime, it's the cover-up."

I have a few dollars to spare. Anyone want to lay a bet (to Charles' tip-jar, or Curt's, if you prefer) that this story doesn't lie down and die as the press would prefer?

8 BabbaZee  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:16:34am

A quote from Frank Zappa seems appropriate: “Your whole attitude stinks, I say, and the life you lead is completely empty.”

I am the Slime

9 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:17:14am

#7 Dianna

This is going to get even more interesting, I'm willing to bet.

"It's not the crime, it's the cover-up."

Tell that to Rather. He still thinks the memo was real. To this day.

10 bweep  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:17:21am
11 Firebreather  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:18:13am

The NY Times never published the Danish cartoons of Muhammad, citing their extraordinary sensitivity to "religion." On the very same day they ran photos & glowing editorials of praise about "Piss Christ" and cow dung on the Virgin Mary.

Irony is not dead. It's never been more alive.

The Times, AP, UPI, Reuters, WaPo are all priceless. Orwell was too subtle in his descriptions of these people.

12 Kragar (proud to be kafir)  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:18:43am
explained that the agency had already done all it could to respond to the uncertainties by vigorously re-reporting the article

So when caught in a lie, simply keep repeating it louder and more often?

Well, got to go with what works I guess.

13 blutonazi98  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:19:38am

OK Fine! the guy is a fake and there is no merit to what the fake captain reported. this does not mean the information was not accurate. we will consider that the information was correct until it is proven otherwise.

/AP arrrghghrrghgh

14 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:19:44am

Mad blog rabble?

Never satisfied?


HA HA HA HA !


(well I'll be satisfued when the islamic threat is impotent, reduced to about 5 nutcases, and in millenial historic disrepute; that's my agenda. Survival, you might say.)

15 abc-m-xyz  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:20:38am

FoxNews is going to show a photograph of Jose Padilla and ask its viewers to determine if it is torture or not. Right after the current commercial break.

16 Cognito  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:22:19am

The AP continues to mystify me. If they're telling the truth -- if there really was this attack wherein six men were burned alive, then buried after a gun fight -- then it should be too, too easy to prove.

All they need to do is take a NY Times reporter and a U.S. military official to the site where the bodies are buried. If that's logistically impossible, explain why. Simple.

Otherwise -- well. People are drawing their own conclusions. As Gary Kasparov wrote recently in the Wall Street Journal, the only thing worse than a failure is a stubborn refusal to recognize that failure and correct it.

17 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:22:47am

Olby's replacement in a few years


[Link: hotair.com...]

18 NoSubmission  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:24:27am

Zappa also said:
'Poodle bites it. Poodle chews it.'

19 mama winger  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:24:35am

I've been meaning to ask - does Charles have a musical connection to Frank Zappa? Anyone know?

20 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:24:57am

Rotating title possibility here —

"A mad blog rabble, never satisfied."

21 funky chicken  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:24:57am

15 abc My having to look at Jose Padilla is torture. And if I have to see Zac Moussaioui again, I will sue under the Geneva Conventions. Isn't that supposed to be all about protecting civilians?

/oh

22 stevedecatur  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:25:53am

Another Muslim with US citizenship arrested for plotting terror. This terror cell couldn't be any more obvious when its members were "disguised" as Islamic students.

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

23 dll2000  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:26:43am

OT: Ever wonder what Russian pandering and extreme anti-u.s. behavior will get you if you are a European head of state when you leave office.

A job worth millions of course.


[Link: www.brusselsjournal.com...]

24 Firebreather  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:27:31am

The Koran says the earth is flat & we here at the NY Times value all holy books and Muslims say it is the final & absolute Word of God & so in the interests of sensitivity & respect for the great religion of Islam we Times reporters hereby declare that because all values systems/cultures/peoples/religions/civilizations are equal... it is fact that one man's round earth is another man's flat earth & who's to say who is right & who is wrong and...blah blah blah.

/Nonsensical but not irrelevant

25 abc-m-xyz  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:27:47am

#21 funky chicken

15 abc My having to look at Jose Padilla is torture. And if I have to see Zac Moussaioui again, I will sue under the Geneva Conventions. Isn't that supposed to be all about protecting civilians?

/oh

The guy was wearing goggles and headphones, while walking in chains and that is now being defined as torture. It is insane.

26 funky chicken  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:28:12am

Here's another example of the MSM getting half the story right: Newsweak (via the Corner)

The American military is fed up with Maliki. The ground commanders in Iraq felt betrayed by him this summer when he undermined a push to get control of the streets of Baghdad. The Iraqis failed to deliver on a promise to put enough troops on the ground. A four-star general who declined to be identified discussing a confidential conversation told of this encounter with Gen. Peter Chiarelli, who was in charge of day-to-day ground operations. "Do you have enough forces? Enough to clear an area and stay there to secure it 24/7?" Chiarelli replied, "Of course not." The four-star recalls replying, "It's going to fail, it's absolutely going to fail." The Americans never had enough forces to sweep even half the city, much less secure it. Maliki made their job tougher by in effect forbidding the U.S. military from taking on Shiite fighters; ordering them to lift roadblocks around Sadr City, the Shiite slum, and ordering them to release prisoners suspected of running death squads.

It's not clear whether the military made its frustrations known to the White House. Generals tend to salute and say can-do; if anything, the military has not been accurately portraying the dismal events on the ground, at least in the eyes of some White House aides. But with Donald Rumsfeld's departure, the Pentagon is entering a new era of leadership, in hopes it will be one in which the uniformed brass and their civilian bosses will communicate better. Gen. John Abizaid, the overall theater commander, and Gen. George Casey, the ground commander, are exhausted and overdue for replacement. ("There might be a sense that a fresh perspective is needed," said a senior White House aide.) Rumsfeld's former right-hand man, Stephen Cambone, has announced that he is stepping down. Others are expected to follow, stripping the Pentagon leadership of the group around Rumsfeld whose neocon certainties led to such catastrophic miscalculations in Iraq.

I knew Rumsfeld was gone when I head a bit of a press conference where he was openly critical of Maliki. Rumsfeld was trying to get this message through for a while, but got trumped by Condi et al.

Bush still says Maliki is the right man for Iraq. Whatever...except our people are dying over there because Maliki has tied their hands.

27 Spiny Norman  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:28:24am

#17 Elric66

Olby's replacement in a few years

The walking definition of the American Left: a spoiled, petulant child spouting lame-ass talking points. Any wagers the parents are regular Daily Kos contributors?

28 Just_A_Grunt  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:28:37am

Everybody is concentrating on this one story in the AP using this source, but in reading the various blogs concerning this issue it seems that this "source" has been used quite often over the course of a year to year and a half along with another widely quoted source who is under suspicion.
The big story is not this one incident but a whole catalogue of stories that are now being called into question. Can it still be a civil war if only one side is fighting? It would appear that our press have been willing pawns in further enflaming the Muslim community with their dubious reporting.

29 FrogMarch  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:29:14am

Frank Zappa really was a prophet.

30 Spiny Norman  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:29:17am

#20 Ojoe

Rotating title possibility here —

"A mad blog rabble, never satisfied."

Damn, that's a good one.

31 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:29:55am

Torture would be burning to death in the twin towers.

Or have we all forgotten?

32 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:30:06am
#27 Spiny Norman 12/4/2006 09:28AM PST

#17 Elric66

Olby's replacement in a few years
The walking definition of the American Left: a spoiled, petulant child spouting lame-ass talking points. Any wagers the parents are regular Daily Kos contributors?

Or Hufpost

33 funky chicken  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:30:26am

oops heard, not head

34 Ringo the Gringo  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:30:54am

“You can't always write a chord ugly enough to say what you want to say, so sometimes you have to rely on a giraffe filled with whipped cream.”
Frank Zappa

35 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:31:16am
#31 Ojoe 12/4/2006 09:29AM PST

Torture would be burning to death in the twin towers.

Or have we all forgotten?


Most have forgotten. We are in a pre-911 mindset. We wont get out of it until we are hit again.

36 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:31:16am

Hey Charles two votes.

I gotta get to work.

37 funky chicken  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:32:05am

28 just a grunt They discussed just that point this morning on Bill Bennett's radio show. It's a great show if you can catch it.

38 kepler2007  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:32:45am
merely fueled a mad blog rabble that would never be satisfied.

That is what the British nobility use to say about the Sons of liberty in 1770s. They just left out the blog part.

39 Ward Cleaver  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:32:58am

I thought Lincon was dead. Is he still alive, and working for Karl Rove?

Rove, you magnificent, reanimating bastard!

40 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:34:36am
41 Ben Hur  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:38:01am

What is this Lincoln Group, and how can I join?

42 Ward Cleaver  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:38:55am

#38 kepler2007

So the Boston Tea Party was instigated by bloggers? Who knew?

43 Ward Cleaver  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:41:21am

The Lincoln Group? Why am I reminded of the TV ads for Rozerem, with Abe Lincoln, the steak-carving talking beaver, and the guy in the deep-sea diving suit, with his back to the camera, cooking something on the stove?

44 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:42:07am
46 Alouette  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:44:48am

CAIR Outrage of the Day Alert

CAIR demands Dennis Prager be kicked off Holocaust Memorial Council

47 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:44:59am
#45 Dom 12/4/2006 09:42AM PST

OT

1 Controversy: Christian bookshops will no longer stock the Koran

Why would that be a controversy?

48 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:46:26am
#46 Alouette 12/4/2006 09:44AM PST

CAIR Outrage of the Day Alert

CAIR demands Dennis Prager be kicked off Holocaust Memorial Council


If they werent so dangerous, I would be laughing

49 ChicagoBlue  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:47:17am

taxfree ~

first confess the evil or your still the center of evil on planet earth, thats all.

AP, New York Times, and others of like crimes you are the air the ones of terror live on each day

I just love your way...

50 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:47:18am

Dan Rather must be thinking about trying to get his old gig back.

If the bloggers are such rabble, how come they're always the ones leading the pack when it comes to exposing MSM fraud? Becasue they have the truth, not an agenda, on their side.

The drive-by media is like an incoherent old drunk, staggering down the street to oblivion, refusing to address their affliction or seek a remedy to it.

51 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:48:52am
merely fueled a mad blog rabble that would never be satisfied.

Is that a step up, or a step down from scruffy no names, or losers in pajamas?

52 Alouette  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:49:27am

#48 Elrich66

Since when did Muslims ever have anything to do with the Holocaust? Other than supporting Hitler and serving in special Moslem SS units.

53 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:50:25am

46 Alouette

CAIR demands Dennis Prager be kicked off Holocaust Memorial Council

You mean the Holocaust that never happened?

54 Just_A_Grunt  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:50:41am
CAIR demands Dennis Prager be kicked off Holocaust Memorial Council

What do they object to? Is it Prager's comments or the existenance of a Holocaust Memorial?
Hey CAIR you know that whole freedom of speech thing you are so willing to hide behind, well it works both ways.

55 abc-m-xyz  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:51:28am

A timely book Bat Ye'or says of Duries book comparing the ideas of G-d of Christians and Muslims.

Revelation? Do We Worship The Same God? Durie Mark


In his conclusion, Durie writes that profound contrasts exist in Islam and Christianity in their understanding of the identity of God. These have far-reaching implications, affecting attitudes, ethics, and politics. The clarification of misunderstandings and false assumptions, masterly exposed by Durie, is a condition to open the way for more constructive dialogue.

Durie’s book could not have been more timely. He offers a well-balanced analysis, acknowledging the important similarities of the two faiths, without ever misrepresenting the real disagreements or ignoring the hard issues. In this time of globalization, when crucial challenges are emerging for the West’s post-Christian societies, Durie’s reflections provide essential and fundamental guidance that will enable Christians to engage in a dialogue based on truth.

This is all the more urgent now that the cultural jihad in the West is preventing the free expression of thought and belief, and is subverting the whole ethical foundation of Judeo-Christianity.

Which One God?

56 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:51:58am

Why do I get that queasy feeling that some day we may see Kathleen Carroll, White House Press Secretary?

57 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:52:51am

Lincoln group.

A PR firm.

58 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:53:11am
#52 Alouette 12/4/2006 09:49AM PST

#48 Elrich66

Since when did Muslims ever have anything to do with the Holocaust? Other than supporting Hitler and serving in special Moslem SS units.


Got me. I think its just Islam seeing how far they can push the kaffirs around.

59 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:53:27am

Scruffy Unsatisfied Mad Blog Rabble in Pajamas.

60 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:54:44am

#54 Just_A_Grunt

I think you're getting close. They object to anyone on the Holocaust Memorial Council who claims that the Holocaust happened.

61 vxbush  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:55:52am

59 Ojoe

Another candidate for rotating title!

Charles, the lizards are hot today, basking in the warm glow of conviction.

62 aunursa  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:56:14am
These people really do seem to think they’re a priestly class, immune to criticism, existing on some rarefied plane from which they hand down truth to the ungrateful masses.

Charles, you should just post this as a permanent graphic.

63 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:56:52am

I've never been convicted.

64 THX-42  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:58:02am

So which is it, AP/MSM, are you superior to the pajama-clad bloggers because you have multiple layers of editors who can check stories and sources, or are you no better than them because you just have to go with unverified sources?

If you still check and cross-check your stories, how about the following simple tasks to confirm that you are correct:

1) Produce either the person of Jamil Hussein, or his photo and identification papers showing he really is an Iraqi police spokesperson, as you claim he is.

2) Regarding the burning bodies, the corroboration of this story by 3 more unnamed sources does NOT confirm that it happened. Find the families of the supposed victims, have them lead you to their buried bodies, exhume the bodies, and have a qualified forensic pathologist conduct an autopsy.

If you can not or will not do either of these tasks, we can conclude that your stories were false.

65 wanumba  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:58:16am

It's probably more a case of snobby oneupmanship with AP than any real desire to find out the truth.

66 Killgore Trout  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:58:53am

#41 Ben Hur
Exactly, I've never heard of this "Lincoln Group" nor have they sent me Zionist checks. I've never even seen the spaceship they keep in their underground headquarters.
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

67 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 7:59:56am

64 THX-42

AP is superior because they sleep in their clothes.

68 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:00:07am

In case you missed it

[Link: hotair.com...]

69 Dom  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:02:45am

Elric66 (#47),

I agree.

70 Just_A_Grunt  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:02:53am

#64 THX-42
Green Helmet guy is tied up right now in Lebanon getting set up for all the atrocities fixing to carried out there by the "American backed goverment" of Senoria against the "peaceful" demonstrators demanding change.
As soon as he gets a chance he will get some footage shot to back up AP's story.
Or is he under exclcusive contract to Reuters?

Why is it that certain phrases get used over and over again by the MSM? Like Cindy Sheehan, mother of a slain soldier, or American backed goverment of Lebanon.

71 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:03:44am

And we, we are smelly street urchins.

72 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:04:06am
#69 Dom 12/4/2006 10:02AM PST

Elric66 (#47),

I agree.


I guess they expect Chrisitains to bend over backwards for everyone else but Muslims are to be treated different.

73 realwest  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:05:14am

Waaay OT BUT - CHARLES are you in any personal danger from those wildfires in Ventura county (which Fox News made look like the end of the world; "hundreds of homes burned" forced evacuations and etc.) or are you snug in your underground fortress in Denver?

74 pat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:05:49am

The trick of deflection. Something went wrong says the NYT. "But we blame no-one" (except those who brought it to our attention, they had a bad attutude)

75 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:06:51am

Ventura Co. is north of Los Angeles.

76 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:07:39am

CAIR KOs "24"
By Henry Mark Holzer
FrontPageMagazine.com | December 4, 2006

Hi. My name is Kiefer Sutherland, and I play counterterrorist agent Jack Bauer on Fox’s ’24.’ I would like to take a moment to talk to you about something that I think is very important. Now while terrorism is obviously one of the most critical challenges facing our nation and the world, it is important to recognize that the American Muslim community stands firmly beside their fellow Americans in denouncing and resisting all forms of terrorism. So in watching ’24,’ please, bear that in mind.

It is not without reason that Fox TV’s hit counterterrorism show “24,” with its take-no-prisoners protagonist Jack Bauer, has captured the imagination of millions of Americans. Year after year, Bauer’s Los Angeles-based “Counter Terrorism Unit” has faced down and bested domestic and foreign terrorists intent on destroying American cities and eventually our nation itself.


Not surprisingly—because while most Muslims are not terrorists, most terrorists are Muslims—Bauer’s principal enemies have been Muslims. Art imitates life.

Although Bauer is smart, resourceful, and ruthless in his patriotic determination to keep America safe, neither he nor Fox TV were tough enough to withstand pressure from the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR). It was at CAIR’s insistence that Sutherland make the politically correct statement quoted above on national television.

In its Annual Report—“The Status of Muslim Civil Rights in the Untied States 2006, The Struggle for Equality”—CAIR proudly explains how it successfully intimidated Jack Bauer and Fox TV.

[Link: www.frontpagemag.com...]

77 3 wood  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:08:23am

#61 vxbush

Charles, the lizards are hot today, basking in the warm glow of conviction.


Convicted? No, no convictions.

:)

78 Ma Sands  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:08:52am

Oh, man...FAUX-reporting...there are nowhere NEAR the msm-reported one million, or even 800,000 demonstrators in Beirut...Front Page Magazine...

79 SunCat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:10:02am

They are opposed to the Scientific Method.

80 bweep  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:10:12am
Top British defence and manufacturing firms have written to the government to warn that billions of pounds could be lost in contracts with Saudi Arabia.

The Defence Industries Council says the UK stands to lose out as a result of a breakdown in Saudi-British relations

81 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:10:33am

I saw this on Drudge. I cannot believe it.

George Mitchell said to be 'on short list' for UN ambassador...

82 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:13:29am

#81 JammieWearingFool

Crap.

83 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:14:18am
#82 Earth2moonbat 12/4/2006 10:13AM PST

#81 JammieWearingFool

Crap.


GW is working hard to leave office hated by both sides.

84 Obi-wan  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:16:07am

#81 JWF

George Mitchell: The most partisan person ever to go to Washington.

85 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:16:38am

Might as well put Carter on the short list, too.

86 Jack Bauer  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:16:41am

#276 Elric

In its Annual Report—“The Status of Muslim Civil Rights in the Untied States 2006, The Struggle for Equality”—CAIR proudly explains how it successfully intimidated Jack Bauer and Fox TV.

I had no choice. CAIR threatened Chloe with Polonium 210.

87 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:17:40am
#84 Obi-wan 12/4/2006 10:16AM PST

#81 JWF

George Mitchell: The most partisan person ever to go to Washington.


Bush might as well nominate Kucinich or Dhimmi Carter. Go all the way in appeasement

88 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:18:42am

realwest,

Ventura is up the coast a bit; if I'm guessing right, I figure the head lizard is about a good hour south of there.

89 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:19:14am
#86 Jack Bauer 12/4/2006 10:16AM PST

#276 Elric

In its Annual Report—“The Status of Muslim Civil Rights in the Untied States 2006, The Struggle for Equality”—CAIR proudly explains how it successfully intimidated Jack Bauer and Fox TV.
I had no choice. CAIR threatened Chloe with Polonium 210.

Not Chloe, I like Chloe. Now, your daughter, on the otherhand, is a different story. :-)

90 Jack Bauer  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:19:18am

Errr...I meant #76. Sorry, Elric. Stress of my job, and all that, I guess.

91 Catttt  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:21:18am
...mad blog rabble...


? ? ?
Hummmpfhh!

92 Jack Bauer  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:22:00am

My daughter's a certified moonbat. I still love her, tho. It's a Dad thing. ;-)

93 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:22:06am
94 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:24:04am
#92 Jack Bauer 12/4/2006 10:22AM PST

My daughter's a certified moonbat. I still love her, tho. It's a Dad thing. ;-)


I can understand that. :-)


How come in last season, you never refered to the terrorists as Chechens? Was that CAIR strong arming you again?

95 galloping granny  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:24:36am

Something about this burning them alive after dousing them with kerosene story has been bothering me since the day I read it. Been a long time since I took organic chemistry and studied kerosene, so I just went and looked it up. And I was correct. You can drop a lit match in a bucket of kerosene and the only thing that will happen is that the match would go out.

Kerosene is NOT like gasoline: it is a lubricant, not corrosive, not volatile, and extremely stable in storage. The specific gravity of kerosene is about 0.8, and its ignition point is more than 104 F. If you throw a match into a pool of kerosene it will put out the match. You can hold a match right up to the edge of a teaspoon half full of kerosene and it will not ignite (try that with gasoline and you will need to grow new eyebrows).

That particular quote is from this source, but the same exact information regarding kerosene is available in many other places.

THIS STORY IS A FAKE.

96 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:25:17am
97 Killgore Trout  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:25:58am

Koskidz seething over our attack on Jimmah...
Right-wing hatemongers vilify Carter as antisemitic

And here are our friends from Little Green Footballs – they don't like Carter's book, either.

zombie 11/23/2006 06:28PM PST
#2 Cognito anybody who is hated by the Left as much as he is certainly counts as someone I like.

#9 thedopefishlives 11/23/2006 06:31PM PST
I don’t know why Jimmy Carter, who is generally a careful man, allowed so many errors and omissions to blemish his book.
Uh, maybe because Dhimmi Carter is an Islamist shil


...etc.

Democrats are going to have to make a choice when it comes to US foreign policy concerning the MidEast: either they support the liberal values of peace, justice and human rights along with Jimmy Carter, or they can join their voices to the odious chorus of the right-wing noise machine in denouncing him. This is the company they will be keeping.

98 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:28:48am
99 Chyron  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:30:46am
#95 galloping granny 12/4/2006 10:24AM PST

Something about this burning them alive after dousing them with kerosene story has been bothering me since the day I read it. Been a long time since I took organic chemistry and studied kerosene, so I just went and looked it up. And I was correct. You can drop a lit match in a bucket of kerosene and the only thing that will happen is that the match would go out.

Kerosene is NOT like gasoline: it is a lubricant, not corrosive, not volatile, and extremely stable in storage. The specific gravity of kerosene is about 0.8, and its ignition point is more than 104 F. If you throw a match into a pool of kerosene it will put out the match. You can hold a match right up to the edge of a teaspoon half full of kerosene and it will not ignite (try that with gasoline and you will need to grow new eyebrows).

That particular quote is from this source, but the same exact information regarding kerosene is available in many other places.

THIS STORY IS A FAKE.

EXPERIMENT TIME!

100 ctrlL  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:31:30am

#95 galloping granny

THIS STORY IS A FAKE.

You take the prize, granny ... ah, should be Sherlock, IMO !

/what do you say now , A P holes ?

101 realwest  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:32:25am

#84 Obi-wan - Um, hold on a sec there, my friend.
George Mitchell over Nancy Pelosi? Barbra Boxer? Senator Ted the swimmer Kennedy? You sure you want to stick to Mitchell as the most partisan?

102 Jack Bauer  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:32:52am

#94 Elric

How come in last season, you never refered to the terrorists as Chechens? Was that CAIR strong arming you again?

No, that was a case of me having all kinds of trouble on set pronouncing "Chechen" and "Chechnya". They just gave up, and re-wrote my lines. ;)

103 Kenneth  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:33:50am

#99 Chyron

Ah, but can you burn a bunny cage with kerosene and prove 9-11 was an inside job? /moonbat sarc

104 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:33:50am
Obi-wan 12/4/2006 10:16AM PST

#81 JWF

George Mitchell: The most partisan person ever to go to Washington.

That's saying something.

I used to hear him referred to as The Undertaker.

To make it worse, he's a Red Sox fan.

105 Elric66  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:36:51am
#102 Jack Bauer 12/4/2006 10:32AM PST

#94 Elric

How come in last season, you never refered to the terrorists as Chechens? Was that CAIR strong arming you again?
No, that was a case of me having all kinds of trouble on set pronouncing "Chechen" and "Chechnya". They just gave up, and re-wrote my lines. ;)


Russian seperatists is much easier to pronounce than Chechen, huh? :-)

106 Earth2moonbat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:41:09am

#95 galloping granny

Something about this burning them alive after dousing them with kerosene story has been bothering me since the day I read it. Been a long time since I took organic chemistry and studied kerosene, so I just went and looked it up. And I was correct. You can drop a lit match in a bucket of kerosene and the only thing that will happen is that the match would go out.

Not quite that simple. You can drop a lit match in a can of gasoline, and it'll also go out. I've done it. It is perfectly possible to soak people's clothes in kerosene, and light them. Kerosene is less volitile than gasoline, but still burns dandy when absorbed into cloth.

107 abolitionist  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:43:14am

#52 Alouette

Since when did Muslims ever have anything to do with the Holocaust? Other than supporting Hitler and serving in special Moslem SS units.

Long before, as well as since Hajj Amin Al-Husseini

Be sure to read down at least to

1948-1949
Amin Al-Husseini [xliii] : “I declare a Holy War, My Muslim Brothers! Murder the Jews! Murder them all!”

I'm curious about your relationship to [Link: www.jewish-history.com...]

108 3 wood  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:44:47am

#95 granny

Something about this burning them alive after dousing them with kerosene story has been bothering me since the day I read it. Been a long time since I took organic chemistry and studied kerosene, so I just went and looked it up. And I was correct. You can drop a lit match in a bucket of kerosene and the only thing that will happen is that the match would go out.


I helped clear a lot of overgrown forrest land in Michigan as a teenager. I burned out a lot of stumps using kerosene, and had no problems lighting it.

109 The Sanity Inspector  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:46:43am

They're right: I wasn't satisfied with that dismissive response.

110 galloping granny  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:46:57am
#98 taxfreekiller 12/4/2006 10:28AM PST

#95

granny, check with many names weather guy,
he should be able to tell you if they even
sell kerosene in Iraq, it was used in the U.S.
for cooking stove oil, could be they do not even have such a thing, or could be, if you
pour kerosene on something and get it lit with
say a newspaper that you light, then it will
burn easy, we use it to burn mesquite roots, and prickley pears, cheaper and not as much danger as reg. gasoline.

Sorry, taxfree. They probably do sell kerosene in Iraq - quite commonly used as a cooking fuel. It does not burn if you light it with a newspaper - that doesn't burn hot enough to bring the kerosene up to the flash point.

Kerosene is not volatile - which means that it does not evaporate. No explosion if you get a match near it like there would be with gasoline or propane.

Historically kerosene has been used here in the US for lamp oil and to kill head lice by direct application to the head. It requires the presence of a wick in order to burn as lamp oil.

BTW, when petroleum is distilled it divides into various fractions. Kerosene is one of a number of products that are a normal result of distillation. They have refineries in Iraq.

It is possible, I suppose, that if this incident happened - and I do not believe that it did - that they lit the clothes on fire, but even that might take some effort. There have been a number of cases over the years of self-immolation by various individuals as a means of protest. Invariably they use gasoline.

111 BabbaZee  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:46:59am
These people really do seem to think they’re a priestly class, immune to criticism, existing on some rarefied plane from which they hand down truth to the ungrateful masses.

DIND DING DING DING
Behold the Temple Pharisees of the Gramscian Whore Brigades

112 Bill Amos  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:51:00am

Again I remind the AP of its OWN standards. They need to live up to what they promise here

[Link: www.ap.org...]

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS STATEMENT OF NEWS VALUES
AND PRINCIPLES

For more than a century and a half, men and women of The Associated Press have had the privilege of bringing truth to the world. They have gone to great lengths, overcome great obstacles – and, too often, made great and horrific sacrifices – to ensure that the news was reported quickly, accurately and honestly. Our efforts have been rewarded with trust: More people in more places get their news from the AP than from any other source.

In the 21st century, that news is transmitted in more ways than ever before – in print, on the air and on the Web, with words, images, graphics, sounds and video. But always and in all media, we insist on the highest standards of integrity and ethical behavior when we gather and deliver the news.

That means we abhor inaccuracies, carelessness, bias or distortions. It means we will not knowingly introduce false information into material intended for publication or broadcast; nor will we alter photo or image content. Quotations must be accurate, and precise.

It means we always strive to identify all the sources of our information, shielding them with anonymity only when they insist upon it and when they provide vital information – not opinion or speculation; when there is no other way to obtain that information; and when we know the source is knowledgeable and reliable.

It means we don’t plagiarize.

It means we avoid behavior or activities that create a conflict of interest and compromise our ability to report the news fairly and accurately, uninfluenced by any person or action.

It means we don’t misidentify or misrepresent ourselves to get a story. When we seek an interview, we identify ourselves as AP journalists.

It means we don’t pay newsmakers for interviews, to take their photographs or to film or record them.

It means we must be fair. Whenever we portray someone in a negative light, we must make a real effort to obtain a response from that person. When mistakes are made, they must be corrected – fully, quickly and ungrudgingly.

And ultimately, it means it is the responsibility of every one of us to ensure that these standards are upheld. Any time a question is raised about any aspect of our work, it should be taken seriously.

“I have no thought of saying The Associated Press is perfect. The frailties of human nature attach to it,” wrote Melville Stone, the great general manager of the AP. But he went on to say that “the thing it is striving for is a truthful, unbiased report of the world’s happenings … ethical in the highest degree.”

He wrote those words in 1914. They are true today.

113 Pythagoras  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 8:52:01am

Folks, we are witnessing a classic revolution that will be in the history books. The MSM is loosing their power just like a dictator.

Dictators refuse to recognize the authority of the courts that try them right up to the moment of their execution. The MSM will do the same right up to the moment of bankruptcy.

114 Shredstar  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:05:22am

Too funny: "All they have is 3 unnamed witnesses, 1 witness who recanted, and an imaginary police Captain." AP is lying. They know they are busted with the imaginary witness so they totally made up 3 more and made them unnamed - something impossible to double-check.

More "fake, but accurate" crap.

115 mahatma coat  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:09:00am

another suitable Zappa quote..."whats the ugliest part of your body?Some say your nose ,some say your toes...I think its your mind"

116 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:13:20am

The NYT can't help but provide mixed bag coverage on this. Their own reporters can't find Hussein, but they can't get away from the obligatory swipes at the bloggers who only want to make sure that we're getting accurate reporting from Iraq.

How many people are getting a distorted view of the war in Iraq because of inaccurate reporting on the violence. If they're exaggerating reports, using sources that don't exist, how much of an effect does that have on morale. It cannot be insignificant, even though there is plenty of violence that is being catalogued.

The thing is, the AP can avoid this mess by simply providing Jamil Hussein to take questions from other reporters. An interview, if you please. You don't even have to have bloggers present. Simply put him up on the podium at MNF-I or some other secure location and let him answer questions about who he is, why the MOI says he doesn't exist, and other details of his background.

That they do no such thing and that no other news outlets can find this guy suggests that something is rotten within the AP corps in Iraq.

More here.

117 funky chicken  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:22:25am

80 bweep I posted a Telegraph article about that last week. The Sauds are threatening to take their business elsewhere (France, of course) if the Brit government continues a fraud investigation. Apparently the Brit company had established a 20 million pound "slush fund" to provide perks to the Sauds in exchange for their business.

So is the Brit government going to compete with France for the title of best Saudi whore? Or continue the fraud investigation?

118 leftout  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:27:17am

How can the MSM print and circulate stories based simply on rumor and innuendo? Do they not have vast resources at their command to investigate and produce evidence like THX-42 suggests in #64?

For me the most important point to be made from these exposures of MSM fraud is this:

They are not the protectors of freedom and liberty; they are corrosively destroying Western civilization by collaborating with tyrannical theocrats, resurgent socialist Castro wannabes like Chavez, and anti-American traitors like Moore, Sheehan, Chompsky, et al.

Let history record who fought for civilization as we've known it and who with ignorance of history, ingratitude and self-serving smugness contributed to its downfall.

119 gymnast  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:43:07am

#118, leftout. History is written by winners. There is no place for the discussion of the merits of 2nd place.

120 leftout  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:48:15am

#112 Bill Amos 12/4/2006 10:51AM PST
Thanks Bill for that nice bit of work finding AP's code of ethics. It is so ridiculously ignored by their every news report that I sent them this email:

AP liars and propagandists, have you read your own code of ethics lately?

I have and you violate everyone of your own principles.

I don't believe anything you report.

please read this: [Link: www.ap.org...]

Sincerely,

121 Jack Reacher  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:48:36am
...the agency had already done all it could to respond to the uncertainties by vigorously re-reporting the article...

That is perfection; I couldn't write a spoof any funnier. It reminds me of the courtroom exchange in "A Few Good Men:"

"I object."
"Overruled."
"I strenuously object."

122 leftout  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:53:57am

#119 gymnast 12/4/2006 11:43AM PST

#118, leftout. History is written by winners. There is no place for the discussion of the merits of 2nd place.

Yeah, you're right. It's kind of like finishing third in the BCS poll.

Another reason to win the battle for civilization.

123 Cognito  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 9:56:43am

121 Jack Reacher,

There's a quirk of language there that makes that passage seem a little more ridiculous that it actually is. (And it is.)

The New York Times writer forgot that most readers aren't fluent in newsspeak; when he says they "re-reported" the story, it sounds like they re-proclaimed it to the public. (Thus the funny likeness to the line from A Few Good Men.)

But what the NYT writer meant to say by "re-reporting" was that the AP tossed out the sourcing from their original story and "re-gathered" the news. Which would have been a fine and credible, except the re-gathered version is just as questionable as the original.

124 Noam Chumpski  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 10:56:51am

#123 Cognito

Exactly. You can't just throw out the original without an apology and then create a new, unprovable edition.

Should the Iraqi Government take the AP to an Iraqi Court? Sure, why not. It's funny that the NYTimes reporter is afraid of this kind of thing and throws his debate behind the "intimidation" it may create for reporters... If something happens, it's provable. If it didn't, then it shouldn't be reported. If it's unconfirmed, then the Press will just have to actually go to work and prove it.

Why is it 'intimidating' for Iraq to say, "Hey, when you're wrong people die. So, why don't you take the extra 15 minutes and go see if there's a burn spot..."

The Press is lazy; that's their problem. And they answer to noone. These people are running on a "pre-internet" mentality and if they don't wake up they're gonna get left in the dust.

125 Cognito  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 11:19:31am

124 Noam,

I have to admit I get a little queasy when it comes to prosecuting journalists, etc -- if you've ever been to a country that's not a democracy, you know how quickly those things can drift into ugly territory.

That's not a defense of the AP in this case, however.

As a matter of fact, in this case I really don't think courts are necessary. The market will correct bad behavior -- without some changes, the AP will find itself pushed aside in favor of a news agency that can do the job properly.

126 TotallySirius  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 11:54:09am

#123 Cog

Looks like the same story to me,I see no evidence of re-reporting or whatever,they just added a jab at their critics(typical "kill the messenger mentality re:Dan Rather).

Same story,same unverifiable sources,same uncollaborated evidence.

127 Geepers  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 11:55:35am

What a piece of shit that was.

Hey Tom Zeller, just how fucking difficult is it to ask for names and places. You didn't do jack to try to get to the facts.

Just bitch about motives. Hey, the last time I checked you work for one on the most biased organizations in the country.

128 TotallySirius  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 11:55:49am

BTW

Where the hell are my Lincoln Group and Zionist conspiracy checks?

Its been a few weeks.

129 Noam Chumpski  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 12:03:15pm

#125 Cognito

I understand. I, however, do not get quesy.

Published mis-information, or a lie reported as fact, can cause death. An example is the story of Koran flushing in Gitmo. If a news agency is acting in the service of rumor-pushing and refuses to make adequate corrections then I wouldn't have an issue with the Iraqi government fining the representing company. Iraq has never said anything about imprisonment, or anything of that sort.

Why not fine the AP and push the money towards rebuilding the district that got burned down or raped because of their laziness or error. What we would see would be an immediate transition away from unamed sources cited as the only witness to an atrosity.

The Media's inability to act responsibly and professionaly is their own internal problem, but their mistakes are public. Their apologies should be as loud as their condemnations; and if not, they should be fined. In Iraq, anyway. Keep in mind that Iraq permits the journalists freedom to report. They can take that freedom at any time. American Presidents have done the same thing during times of War... Lincoln, for example.

Humble opinion.

130 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 12:29:30pm

I want as baseball hat that says

"Blog Rabble"

131 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 12:52:40pm
132 pembroke1624  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 1:07:59pm

Push back on the AP liars, and the Reuters liars, and the rest of them. We are in the fight for our lives, and it's hard to see how we can win if we lose the media war, which is the War of the 21st Century.

133 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 1:41:59pm

"Blog rabble?"

I like it, has a nice whiff of the Bastille and Tulieres Palace to it.

134 FredWM  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 1:56:57pm

#11 Firebreather

"...cow dung on the Virgin Mary"

It was elephant dung. As Eleanor Clift explained on TV, only the ignorant should be upset as elephant dung is held in high esteem in parts of Africa.

Of course, what that had to do with New York City taxpayers footing the bill for this outrage was beyond me. But then I’m not as nuance sensitive as the semi-divine Clift.

135 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 1:57:38pm
The executive editor of The Associated Press, Kathleen Carroll, in a meeting in her office Friday afternoon, explained that the agency had already done all it could to respond to the uncertainties by vigorously re-reporting the article, and suggested that to engage these questions — to continue to write about them — merely fueled a mad blog rabble that would never be satisfied.

Kathleen Carroll (looking down from office window): "Oh dear! Why are the rabble rioting?"

APe Sycophant: "Because they have no news!"

Kathleen (chortling): "Then let them eat fake!"

136 slaphappy  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 2:02:39pm

Report the reporter´s that report. Report the reporter´s that report to the reporter´s of green zone reporters. If you report and make the reports about/regarding reporter´s reports, then we shall see a winds of change to factual reports. Hence , report on the reporter´s that report to the reporting AP to show rapport.

Get it?

Now what the frack was i sayin´?...Oh right!..No..Forget it...That word seems funny now...

As you were...CCCheers

137 Ojoe  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 2:12:25pm

135 SK

"Let them eat Fake"

ROTFLMAO,

And another rotating title.

At least two from this thread...

138 EE  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 3:32:48pm

Why doesn't the AP simply report what it has high confidence is news, and when it makes a mistake apologize for the misinformation and give its new take on what is the truth?

Why, instead of doing the right thing, do they raise the specter of a new enemy, a "mad blog rabble that would never be satisfied"? It seems that instead of following journalistic ethics, they are making it a political issue, an "us versus them" issue, the "them" being the "mad blog rabble that would never be satisfied". They are acting like scoundrels who, instead of doing the right thing, raise straw men arguments and need scapegoats and manufactured enemies. This is to divert attention from their misdeeds, and to get support for their journalistic malfeasance by turning it into a political war instead of a simple matter of journalistic integrity.

139 Rob Thompson  Mon, Dec 4, 2006 4:13:46pm

I'd like to see AP and NYT hits listed with Reuters on the sidebar.

Just for comparison.


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 Frank says:

I knew Jimi (Hendrix) and I think that the best thing you could say about Jimi was: there was a person who shouldn't use drugs. -- From the second of two FZ interviews which were transcribed from an imported CD called "The Frank Zappa Interview Picture Disk". Conducted sometime in early to mid 1984.