Better keep quiet...or Islam will get you.

It was me, CAIR. Bring it!

In retribution for this action, the unnamed couple probably will be dragged into court soon and face the prospect of hiring a lawyer, enduring hostile questioning and paying huge legal bills. The same fate could await other as-yet-unnamed passengers on the US Airways flight who came forward as witnesses.

I hope lawyers come out of the woodwork offering pro-bono representation. Dangerous precedent that can't be allowed into court.

I'm sure the NYT will be ever helpful to the terrorist front group known as CAIR and provide them with all names of all the passengers.

Textbook intimidation 101. Actually, these p***ks are probably up to the 300-level classes.

All Minesotans (of which I am one) should stand up and pronounce, "I am Sparticus" Then let them figure out who to sue.

Where do I send money to aid their legal defense? Seems to me CAIR has a lot more money than your average 'older couple' riding in coach.

Either we fight the bastards now or bow to them later.

This could be a good thing. Show them for what they really are.

Awsome!

How many more feet do they have to shoot?

In plain English, the imams plan to sue the “John Does,” too.

You know, this means war.

Litigation Bombers

Hopefully, this will backfire on them.

Another step into more "noise" in the noisy phase of the invasion.

Deeper and deeper into the pit we go, as no leader is able to see and tell what is happening in the West.

CAIR has drained the resevoir of goodwill dry.

They are the enemy.

I am Spartacus!

Here we go.

What is the islamic version of John Doe?

Sounds awfully like a SLAPP suit. Are these still constitutional?

From wikipedia:

At least 24 other states and one territory have also enacted some form of legal protections against SLAPPs. These are Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Guam, Hawaii, Indiana, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, Nevada, New Mexico, New York, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Tennessee, Utah, Washington, and West Virginia.

Come get some...

I see a coming countersuit that will leave them and their hapless minions broke and penniless for a long time.
Perhaps even reaching out and touching their enablers in SA.

Wouldn't CAIR need to disclose anything the defendants requested?

If they succeed in getting the witness into court, every criminal will sue their witnesses - even victims.

They will have to prove it was malicious (I hope at least), and not an innocent "mistake" that caused the John Does to make their complaint. I'm sure they will try to make it into a hate crime. I can see it now:

Officer, I think someone is being robbed in that alley!

Thanks for the tip, you best contact a lawyer to defend yourself now.

No, I am Spartacus.

15...

No! I am Spartacus!

CAIR wants to take a page from the RIAA playbook? Maybe sue some 13 year old kids, next?
I hope anyone that gets served over this gets the most expensive, bad ass lawyer in the nation. CAIR will end up eating his legal fees.

Based upon what law? Illegal use of cellphone?

Can we countersue, a class action suit? I'm sure they're behavior is endangering any flying passenger, and I would hold any future hijackings against the same 6.

What would the monetary damages be for another 3,000 dead, could CAIR and these 6 pay up?

If not that, what about the mental anguish this is causing me? I don't feel safe flying any more, and this "probing" incident is the cause.

It's time for a tit for tat.

In California, defendants have absolute immunity against litigation where they report criminal activity to the proper authorities, even if the report is knowingly false and done with malicious intent. But the immunity only applies where the report is to a government authority - such as the police. We immediately need some legislation in each state granting such immunity when reports of suspected activity are made to any employee of a transportation company - such as airlines, trains, buses, etc. That would stop this type of nonsense in its tracks.

Even so, I would certainly hope that this lawsuit will be dismissed as to the individual passengers fairly quickly (assuming they have good attorneys who bring the proper motions) based on a public policy type defense.

Discovery's a bitch

/great one

OT.

Check out this correction from the paper which keeps getting everything wrong:

Corrections

Published: March 15, 2007
An article yesterday about competition for Jewish support between Senators Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama incorrectly described Mr. Obama’s views about the culpability for stalled peace talks between the Palestinians and Israelis. Mr. Obama blames Hamas, which controls much of the Palestinian government, for the stalled peace talks; he does not blame Israel. (Go to Article)

I saw that sanctimonious idiot, Geraldo Rivera, on TV last night moaning and whining about the wrongs done to these imams. He went on and on about how innocent they were and how outrageous the actions against them were, but he never said word one about the seat assignments they demanded, the extension belts they requested and placed under their seats, or their general air of belligerence and threat.

This is another implied threat by CAIR, who are getting really good at subtly (or not so subtly) threatening people with death. Everyone knows what happens to people who publicly confront Islam in any way. But we're supposed to pretend this is just ordinary litigation. Yeah, and Obsession was just a controversial movie.

Ben Hur

Wouldn't CAIR need to disclose anything the defendants requested?

Yes. I bet they will try to use some sort of separation of religion and state as an excuse to stonewall on documents requested during the discovery process.

I think everyone is blowing this all out of proportion. Its really just an easy way to collect tax on the unbelievers.

What they try to do in other countries with violence they will try to do here with lawyers. A tactical decision.

#26 Littleoldlady: Based upon what law?

I haven't looked at the PDF but I would imagine it's a defamation theory. Not a criminal law.

you know, I'm really, REALLY getting sick of this crap. When in the hell is someone in a position to put a stop to this going to put their foot down and tell these freaks to control their population or we will control it for you, lawsuits be damned; the remnants of your society can sue us after we have violated all the rights we feel necessary to end your aspirations of religion as political force.

I say let's get ten other subversive groups into the US, give them the same asinine "first amendment" protection for their activities, and shower the public with fawning media puff pieces about them. Since our political leadership seems content to shelter these barbarians, at least we could enjoy watching them compete for attention. How 'bout a prime time reality show: Battle of the Fifth-Columns?

I hope CAIRheads are soon Convicted And Indecently Raped in PMITA federal prison.

If I had witnesses their behavior, I'd have (deleted).

Any rational government - yes I mean you, Bush - would long since have jailed or deposted these six SOBs.

I'm steamed.

Sue zee Q, Sue zee Q

Witness intimidation. How expected. And they just might get away with it too.

"Their lawsuit appears to be the latest component in a national campaign to intimidate airlines and government agencies from acting prudently to ensure passenger safety."

Boom, right on. The point is not just to scare the public into submission (literally). It's to water down security by taking away the best eyes and ears the airlines have. Terrorists know if they can take over a plane, they've still got better than even odds they can bring it down.

It's got to be drummed into peoples heads that what these bastards are doing in Minnesota is no different from what the bastards planting bombs and shooting at soldiers in Iraq are doing, or the bastards chopping heads in Thailand, ad nauseum....

Same war, different front.

Ojoe is Sparticus

loppyd

That's what I thought..
.
.
.
You know, people fear you apparently.

I for one welcome our new muslim overlords.

/Kent Brockman

Well, time for Mr. and Mrs. Doe to file a countersuit against CAIR and the 6 non-flying imams for having their flight delayed and causing mental anguish.

From now, when I fly, I'm wearing a string of pork rinds around my neck to ward off evil.

The mood in the Twin Cities is little or no sympathy for the Imams. But my normally moderate St Paul paper is carry their water. When it first happened, they had the front page headline "Flying While Muslim".

This morning they are asking people to call in if they are angry, but I think the paper is looking to turn it around and make the non-Muslims look like racists (yes I know, Islam isn't a race, but you know what I mean). The example they give was a call to the paper that was rather nasty. One of those "why don't they go back to where they came from" type of calls.

BEN HUR IS......

WELL

BEN HUR!

I am sick and tired of intimidating behavior by CAIR and other individual obnoxious Muslims. I think the incidents on the planes have been deliberate and provocative and should not be tolerated. My fervent wish is that these people who are being sued will stick together, be completely exonerated and then turn around and sue the hell out of these bullies and bastards.

One of the most repeated phrases in the Qur'an, when not paying lip service to Allah's compassion and mercy, is "strike fear into the hearts of the unbelievers. As I've said many times in the past, nothing makes Americans more afraid than having to defend themselves from frivolous litigation. Judges rarely act as gatekeepers at the beginning, as they should, so at a minimum it ends up costing innocent people great piles of money.

CAIR is the litigation wing of the global jihad.

#46 Peacekeeper, I usually find that funny, but not in this case.

Bush is not Spartacus.

The Saudi oil money has bought the LLL, the MSM, the Bar Assn.,...

Is anyone left who isn't a whore for Islam?

Really....this sickens me. Now these poor people that had to sit through these asshats actions and live in FEAR for a few hours have to find a LAWYER they can afford and spend their HARD EARNED MONEY to battle these saudi funded dickheads.

I hope the COUNTER-suits are already on their way. What the hell....lawyers need MORE money.

Ben Hur

You know, people fear you apparently.

Moi? Really? LOL

As my high school teacher son just said,
"lol....that's funny....judges are going to fine them so much money for the petty suit wasting their time"

Can C-A-I-R be counter-sued for frivolous suit?

Deposted is worse than deported

PIMF

#31

Yet another reason why I just cancelled DirecTV (owned by Murdoch, who also owns FOX). (Anna Nicole / Britney / etc. 24-7 instead of NEWS that really MATTERS) and now this.

This is more about their celeb status is the muslim world than anything else.

The funds will flow.

Like the Aussie Imam, we are not their target audience.

They need their dinars.

After the Sept murders, people in planes stopped taking it. They stopped the shoe bomber and we've read more than one similar story.

It is imperative to the terrorists' agenda that the ordinary people be made to again sit still and not act.

Oh goodie! A lawyer! :-)

#36 LAWSHARK,

Thanks!

More questions: Is it still defamation if they made a private phone call? Does "defamation" have to be public? And did they defame or just complain, considering they were stating facts?

/I shoulda gone to law school insteada art school. ;-)

Hopefully when discovered the passengers will countersue for intentional infliction of emotional distress, recounting their flashbacks to the horrors of 9/11 which were cruelly induced by the insensitive imams. Two can play the imaginary damages game.

No, I wanna be Sparticus!

One of those "why don't they go back to where they came from" type of calls.

Why indeed.

As defendents, do all the John Does have to appear. I guess US Air has all their names and addresses. If they don't show up do the plantiffs have a better case?

Can C-A-I-R be counter-sued for frivolous suit?

For most of us, it's not that easy. Hiring a lawyer is biggo bucks. And the process would be very long. Maybe years? Most common types just can't do that sort of thing. Unless you are a professional victim (ahem, like the Imams or connected to Jesse Jackson).

Well, if the new Kennedy immigration "reform" bill passes, we can look forward to a whole lot more of the enemy being let inside the gates.

I recommend everyone sign up at NumbersUSA for legislative updates., and follow them up.

So we get slammed for looking at people now?
And if we can't look at people we get slammed for having a seeing eye dog?

I can't keep up with all these new memos.

Bullying governments, schools, and businesses has proven much easier than getting the average joe to shut up for fear of offending.

But they're working on it.

The complaint describes them as “an older couple who was sitting [near the imams] and purposely turn[ed] around to watch” as they prayed. “The gentleman (’John Doe’) in the couple ... picked up his cellular phone and made a phone call while watching the Plaintiffs pray,” then “moved to a corner” and “kept talking into his cellular phone.”

You mean to tell me that there is no way this gentleman was calling anyone other than law enforcement? There is no way he may have been making a personl call and needed privacy? They assume the call was related to them. Perhaps it was, but you know what they say about assuming... These imams are islamophobe-phobes.

#65 Beagle

Amen! :)

Well folks looks like it is time to go on the offensive. Find the local CAIR chapter in your area and let them know how you feel. I looked the one up in my area and it does have contact info.

CAIR - Northern Georgia
3920 North Peachtree Road
Suite 205
Atlanta, GA 30341
Contact Name: Yusof Burke
Main Telephone: 770-220-0082
Fax Number: 770-220-2799

Email: cair@cair-northgeorgia.org
Website: [Link: www.cair-northgeorgia.org...]

Public information and all that

We need the British law that if you bring a law suit and lose, you must pay the defendant's legal fees.

The reasons to despise these asshats are seemingly unlimited.

This is not on the subject of the airline, but on the subject of muslim dirty tricks (so it sort of is on topic)
From JW:

FGM... MGM! Mind your own business! Who cares, it is not our bidness! Our business is right here, you are being distracted by the details. If they want to cut up their people, so be it. There is nothing said when we do this to the males, so why the bleeding hearts for the females, that are not even ours? If someone wants to teach their kids to fight so be it. We just need to harden our hearts to killing the kids. Our job is to watch after our own, NOT them! Remember the old American Militia saying "nits grow into lice". We see that as being the most awful thing ever said... in 1863-4, but how do we see it now?

I was in Casa Grande Arizona at the cair office there, and they were putting illegal Mexicans into group housing. The line of illegal Mexicans wrapped around the corner, there must have been 3-400 people there. I asked a Mexican what they were doing, and he told me that they were helping Mexicans with food and housing, and all they asked in return is that the Mex sign a pledge to convert to Islam, and never fight against them.

So you tell me, is it so important if they cut off some woman’s nooki, or some little girls? Who cares!

It is like we are all told by our shrink, "focus on your self", deal with your own problems first. And our problem is here, in Dearborn, in Minneapolis St Paul, in Dallas, and Phoenix. We have 3-4 million problems just walking around out there in our Nation. I think we should let them deal with their own crotch, and we will deal with ours!
Posted by: QuadoLama

of all the top 2008 presidential contenders, I think that only giuliani could be a Sparticus. At this time in our history, that is the only criteria for the next president: are you a Sparticus?

Is it defamation if you have a rational, logical set of reasons for your phone call.

It's not everyone else's fault that moslems are stereotyped as dangerous terrorists.

This won't go anywehre. Were I a passenger on that plane, I'd have already sued these scumbags myself after I punched a few of them out.

#66

No, I wanna be Sparticus!

Sure - go ahead. You are, after all, unstable.

#7 OrzBorz

hahaha.....thanks --I needed that. :)

if the people these assholes sue set up a fund to request help i will donate as much as i can.

CAIR must be defeated

Spartacus:

[Link: wirelessdigest.typepad.com...]

Guess CAIR has learned a few things from the Corleone and Soprano families .....

The complaint describes them as “an older couple who was sitting [near the imams] and purposely turn[ed] around to watch” as they prayed.

I was at an anti-war rally in Hollywood and a group of about 15 muslim women got down on the ground right in the middle of Hollywood blvd and began to pray in the direction of Mecca. When myself and some other photographers began to photograph them a number of Muslim men quickly approached us and demanded that we stop. When I didn't stop the largest of them pushed his chest right up into my camera and repeated his demand, "do not photograph our women". I thought he was going to grab my camera so I backed up to the curb where there were about ten LAPD officers with clubs in their hands. The man backed off but continued to give me the evil stare as he and the other men formed a human wall around the women as they prayed.

Of course, if they really didn't want people to watch them as they prayed then why did they do it right in the middle of the road? The same question goes for the Imams at the airport...but of course the answer is that they did it as a display in order to provoke a response.

Charles, if this suit progresses we will need to start a defence fund for Mr. & Mrs. Doe. I'll give a $100.

That couple out to retaliate by intiating criminal charges. Like YESTERDAY.

You know, this is the Mohamad Atta trial right here.

Not the Atta who hijacked an airliner as part of 9/11 but the Atta who was pulled from an airplane on the morning of 9/11 along with 15 other Muslims for no reason 'other than being a Muslim.'.

#81 Jammie:
"Somebody get a leash! Jammies on the rampage again!"

Sic 'em, Fool!

OT,

Not as outrageous as the actions of CAIR, but Howard Dean claims he's been sneaking around meeting with world leaders.

Who the f*** does this guy think he is?

out = ought PIMF

Guess CAIR has learned a few things from the Corleone and Soprano families .....

No Osama, this is the Scientology playbook!
Same Satan. Different clothes.

#87 Ringo the Gringo

Of course, if they really didn't want people to watch them as they prayed then why did they do it right in the middle of the road?

Why does everyone always stare at my purple mohawk and nose-ring?

/

Defamation, ha!

(that's me laughing the case out of the court of public opinion)

Oh, and I am Spartacus!

You mean to tell me that there is no way this gentleman was calling anyone other than law enforcement? There is no way he may have been making a personl call and needed privacy? They assume the call was related to them. Perhaps it was, but you know what they say about assuming... These imams are islamophobe-phobes.

I bet you think this song is about you, don't you, don't you..........

it's ALWAYS about islham.

lgf:I am Spartacus

—rotating title.

Sounds like a SLAPP suit.

I believe we should propose a study of this lawsuit to all all US law schools as the definition of a frivolous suit.

What are the odds that the LLL moonbat judges will notice this, and stop this silly suit to from going forward? I put it at slightly better than a snowballs chance in hell.

I am JOHN GALT. Spartacus is my buddy!

#78 Carolyn

"I was in Casa Grande Arizona at the cair office there, and they were putting illegal Mexicans into group housing. The line of illegal Mexicans wrapped around the corner, there must have been 3-400 people there. I asked a Mexican what they were doing, and he told me that they were helping Mexicans with food and housing, and all they asked in return is that the Mex sign a pledge to convert to Islam, and never fight against them."

No kidding? Holy cow.....is that written up anyplace, as with a link....? ):

The elderly John Does would appear to be someone the ACLU should support and provide pro bono representation for but methinks the ACLU will be on the opposite side because, after all, these are "ugly Americans" who do not drink the multi cult kool aid. And why is it that the ACLU will go apeshit over any Christian icons being displayed in public but will certainly argue that non Christians should be able to practice their religions wherever and whenever they so choose? If I observed a number of people praying loudly in an airport waiting area I would just as loudly tell them to STFU whether they were Muslims, Hindus or New Age whackos. Last time I checked an individual has his or her right to their own space and if you infringe upon mine, better look out.

How do they know the older couple turned around to look at them? If they had their heads glued to their flying carpets like good little muslims, they could not see them turn and look.

Isn't this the same tactic that Scientology uses to shut down critics? Sue them into submission?

This will lead to CAIRs demise - if there is one thing good Americans hate besides people flying planes into our buildings and lousy airline service, it's chumps trying to bully through intimidation via the courts.

However, another CAIR will arise because most Americans are incredibly myopic and politically correct too. Wouldn't want to hurt anybody's feelings - except fat people and Christians; the two groups you can still insult with impunity.

#69 Dave the Librarian: THANKS, Dewd
I figured as much, just wanted to ask...

Me? I'd represent myself and, IF convicted of ANYTHING connected to these pukes, would go to jail triumphantly!

(...uh, I'm here for littering.) Alice's Restaurant

101 ma sands
As far as I know, that was a 1st hand story from the poster (at Jihadwatch) called QuadoLama.

carridine,

Seriously though, a acquaintance of mine who normally worked one of the 9/11 flights but was on vacation that week told me that post-9/11 he goes through the plane and identifies the biggest guys he can find ("guys like you," he said) and reminds them they may be needed to "help out" should there be any trouble.

Even before 9/11, I was always on alert. Moreso now than ever. I will not tolerate anyone messing with my life.

#87 Ringo the Gringo

...but of course the answer is that they did it as a display in order to provoke a response.

Yup --push, push, push. But we're smarter'n them, right? :)

Dear CAIR, You will bow to me not the other way around. You don't like the way you are treated here leave, it is that simple. When Christians have the same rights in the Islamic world that you wish to abuse and take advantage of in this country you can come back to the table with your grievances. Until then STFU

Meh. Who needs law school?

Defamation of character involves written or spoken harm to a person or organization's reputation. Defamation of character includes libel and slander. Libel is written defamation of character. Slander is spoken defamation of character.

Defamation of character is the general term used to describe both libel and slander under one umbrella. The best defense from being convicted of defamation of character is "truth" according to the courts.

CAIR better hope their lawyers have something better than "Defamation of Character" against the Does.

By launching legal suits against people who spotted and reported suspicious behavior by Muslims on the airplane or before boarding, CAIR is frontally attacking our safety and the normal safeguards against terrorism. That goes without saying, though.

Perhaps CAIR should also file lawsuits against the good people who attacked the Muslim hijackers on flight United 93?

#17 Ben Hur

Mohammad Mohammad.

"I saw that sanctimonious idiot, Geraldo Rivera, on TV last night moaning and whining about the wrongs done to these imams. He went on and on about how innocent they were and how outrageous the actions against them were."

Was Geraldo there? So, Geraldo is calling the witnesses liars then. Like O'Donnell vs. Swiftee O'Neill

Alan Dershowitz’s law boyz from Harvard should file a fat harassment suit on the behalf of John Does against CAIR that if not bankrupt it at least would teach it a painful lesson.

In criminal cases, witness intimidation will land your a** in jail for a long time. It's a felony in MA....

I'm not sure about witnesses in a civil trial, but I'm sure the Court doesn't look very kindly upon that either.

On a lighter note my friends and fellow lizardoids...

72 Virgins Contest
heh

Countersue

Countersue

Countersue

With the ACLU likely standing with CAIR, who will stand with the passengers and crew?

#18 chilltheham:

Sounds awfully like a SLAPP suit. Are these still constitutional?

Seems like something that can get tossed out of court, depending on what kind of protection against this kind of nonsense Minnesota provides. Unless the Saudis^H^H^H CAIR is providing poor quality attack lawyers, this just seems to be generalized intimidation -- "you don't want to mess with us!"?

(But... I thought Islam meant "peace"!)

The imams' lawsuit, however, asserts that US Airways and the MAC acted solely out of religious and ethnic discrimination. It includes 17 separate counts.

It also rehearses a catalogue of harms allegedly suffered by the imams, including fear, depression, mental pain and financial injury. They have not only endured exhaustion, humiliation and ridicule, but also have lost sleep and developed anxiety about flying.

Welcome to the post 9/11 world, imams. Does this mean I can sue Osama?

If CAIR learns these good citizens' names, I want them too. I need to know how to contribute to their legal defense, including funding a counter-suit.

#112 Yank in the EU

Perhaps CAIR should also file lawsuits against the good people who attacked the Muslim hijackers on flight United 93?

I understand they were humiliated; that should be worth a few million.

#43 frankp_63:

It's got to be drummed into peoples heads that what these bastards are doing in Minnesota is no different from what the bastards planting bombs and shooting at soldiers in Iraq are doing

PLEASE, DON'T GO THERE.

The war in Iraq has become so unpopular with the American public that if the two things do become equated in the public mind, all that will do is make domestic security equally unpopular.

I wouldn't want a moderate Democrat who opposes the war in Iraq to refuse to report suspicious behavior by Islamists here in America to the proper authorities, just because you've "proven" to him that the two things are the same.

Keep the two issues separate so that we can still keep some semblance of public support for one even if not for the other.

95 Silhouette,

Why does everyone always stare at my purple mohawk and nose-ring?

Exactly.

CAIR meet Merle
The Fighting Side Of Me lyrics
I hear people talkin' bad
About the way we have to live here, in this country
Harpin' on the wars we fight
An' gripin' 'bout the way things oughta be.

An' I don't mind 'em switchin' sides an'
Standin' up for things they believe in
When they're runnin' down my country, man
They're walkin' on the fightin' side of me!

Yeah, walkin' on the fightin' side of me
Runnin' down the way of life
Our fightin' men have fought and died to keep.

If you don't love it, leave it
Let this song I'm singin' be a warnin'
If you're runnin' down my country man
You're walkin' on the fightin' side of me!

I read about some squirrely guy
Who claims, he just don't believe in fightin'
And I wonder just how long
The rest of us can count on bein' free.

They love our milk an' honey
But they preach about some other way of livin'
When they're runnin' down my country, hoss
They're walkin' on the fightin' side of me!

Yeah, walkin' on the fightin' side of me
Runnin' down our way of life
Our fightin' men have fought and died to keep.

If you don't love it, leave it
Let this song I'm singin' be a warnin'
When you're runnin' down my country, man
You're walkin' on the fightin' side of me!

Yeah, walkin' on the fightin' side of me
Runnin' down our way of life
Our fightin' men have fought and died to keep.

If you don't love it, leave it
Let this song I'm singin' be a warnin'
If you're runnin' down my country, man
You're walkin' on the fightin' side of me!

The only reasonable inference from CAIR's inclusion of ordinary airline passengers in the lawsuit is that when the next 9-11 style hijackings occur, they want the passengers to remain paralyzed by fear of lawsuits, or at least claims of bigotry, long enough for the hijackers to seize the cockpit.

CAIR is an active agent of al Qaeda.

I can think of no other reasonable conclusion. This entire exercise was a psychological assault on the post 9-11 tendency of passengers to be suspicious of oddly acting Middle Eastern men.

Oddly enough, one of the passengers frightened enough by the iman's suspicious behavior to notify the flight crew was a Muslim man, who I guess didn't feel like dying that day. How will CAIR claim that guy was an Islamophobe?

This is a classic case of federal law being written without imagining what might happen in the future. The major significant threat to airline passengers these days is Muslims trying to achieve martyrdom through suicide operations, taking everyone on the plane with them. Now I guess you could say the murder-suicide promise of "paradise" contained in Qur'an 9.111 (inter alia) is protected religious belief. Just as one could have said the cult of the emperor in Shinto which led to the kamikaze attacks was protected religion. But I don't think I'm going out on a limb when I say that murder-suicide beliefs, whether founded in religion or not, deserve special scrutiny from security. And who is more likely to believe in a strict interpretation of those many murder-suicide passages in the Qur'an than a bunch of imams?

Sure, we don't want airlines turning people away because of their religion, but when religion crosses over into death and destruction, I'd like to think we're intellectually capable of taking that out of the realm of the "protected class."

I wonder if there will be any judge in this nation who has enough backbone, gonads, spine, whatever, to actually look CAIR in the eye and tell them NO NO NO! and then tell them to go to hell! I don't think that there are and I think that we will see the corrosion of our society when this goes to court. I will applaud any judge that will stand up to these people.

Um, just in case any of y'all get caught up in one of these stupid lawsuits, try to remember the word "discovery"; any and all defendants in a civil suit have the right to discover certain facts about the plaintiffs, their full names, address, names and addresses of any persons or organizations of anyone helping the plaintiffs and - if you get the name of CAIR or some other Islamic supporting group, you have a right to know about their finances too.
I'd a thought after being knocked around in a couple of lawsuits and having to pay fees and expenses to NOT divulge their membership roster and finances, CAIR would have learned their lesson.
Also keep in mind that as a defendant in cases like this, you have the right to counterclaim (i.e., sue the plaintiffs) for damage to your reputation, mental pain and anguish AND LEGAL FEES.

Loppy, Lawshark

Is this in the U.S. District Court? If so, I see a 12(b)(6) motion in their future....

#96 DarulHarb

"...ha! "

There! You've got it! That's the ticket....the louder the laughter gets, at least here in the U.S. where there is yet no scimitar-chopping, the more the "emperor will be admitted to have no clothing on"!

:)

118 countersue

I hope that turns into a drumbeat.

Counter, sue... Counter, SUE...

124 Just_A_Grunt ,

One of my favorite songs.

#103 CowardKerry

Ab-so-LUTE-ly! :)

If this does go to court, I hope that a legal defense fund can be set up by concerned Americans, so that we can contribute to pay the legal bills for these "John Doe" individuals so they don't have to. That way, no one need fear this type of legal harassment by CAIR.

#110 JustaGrunt

They are not worthy... LOL

The point that Ed of many names brings up is very valid. How many of us would be afraid to take action out of fear of being sued? No matter how frivolous it would mean lost time from work and expenditure of money to defend yourself.
How bad has the "legal" profession gotten it's tentacles into our society? Would it suprised you to learn that quite often prior to going out on missions our forces in Iraq receive briefings by JAG lawyers outlinging when they can and cannot engage the enemy? In fact sometimes they are given specific guidelines on what constitutes the enemy. We have placed more service members on trial and in jail then we have enemy combatants interred at Gitmo. (How's that for a little trivia fact?)

If they want a lawsuit, then give them something to sue about. For instance, next time beat the crappola out of them and tie them up for the rest of the flight. Islam must recognize the rights of others if they want rights.

Michael Savage has said (I'm paraphrasing) that it will be the soccer thugs that save Europe, and that the world has forgotten what America can be like when pushed beyond tolerance.

This incident is another pebble in our collective shoe.

#107 Carolyn
Okay...sorry....I had a momentary mind-blank, concerning what "JW" was..... :)

#105 Goodbye-Nat

You forgot bald men and people who wear glasses... I know this from experience.

As a Christian, modestly overweight, balding guy with glasses, I see it first hand every day.

When was the last time you saw a character in a movie or on TV that wears glasses? If you did, wasn't the person portrayed as an egghead or nerd? The lie that it affects the cameras unduly is dispelled by commercials for Lenscrafters where everybody wears glasses.

And don't get me started on baldness... I recently heard a commercial for a baldness remedy that started, "Since you've lost all attractiveness towards women and other men think of you as old and impotent..." or some such nonsense.

To all lily-livered libs and kinda cons:
I know Spartacus Spartacus is a friend of mine [I am Spartacus!]
and you sir, are no Spartacus!

wow
Imams on a Plane

[Link: cruxy.com...]
[Link: cruxy.com...]

Jack Reacher

If CAIR learns these good citizens' names, I want them too. I need to know how to contribute to their legal defense, including funding a counter-suit.

It will be public record at that point.

I want to see discovery. I'm trying to think of what I would ask for were I defense counsel for USAIR.....

I know Charles will keep a close watch on this story, but it would be nice if there was a permanent link here at LGF to any info that comes out. This could prove to be one of the most significant battles of the WOT.

how long before they sue us all?
how long before we are contributing to Charles' legal defense fund?

realwest --

Another word these jackass imams are going to learn real quick? D-E-P-O-S-I-T-I-O-N.

#108 JammieWearingFool

I will not tolerate anyone messing with my life.

Ah. You sound like my old, gone Dad..... :) Thanks.

Has the esteemed US Congressional Representative Keith Ellison spoken up yet? Whose side is he on? CAIR or the citizens of this country. Any reporter worth their salt should pose that question to him just to see where his real loyalties lie.
I almost sure what his non answer will be.

Carolina Girl

It's a federal lawsuit.

Is that the federal rule for summary judgment?

#112 Yank in the EU

Bingo! I have often thought, that in cases like this, we should gather up these LGF good statements of sense, and present them, gratis :) , to the lawyers fighting for our freedom....no? :)

#88 The Crusader Charles, if this suit progresses we will need to start a defence fund for Mr. & Mrs. Doe. I'll give a $100.

I'm riding with you Crusader-- let's get a defense fund started if needed.

More and more the things I'm reading about in Londonistan seem to be going on here too.

Solution is like "Murder On the Orient Express"...all the passengers "do in" the Imans so their is no one to sue....

These Imans need a public asswhiping real fast....sue the passengers because TSA ain't doing their jobs and nailing these r-u-g munchers at the gate. Talk about chutzpah!

So, CAIR is basically trying to intimidate passengers into not reporting suspicious activity on airplane flights.

This is treason. This is aiding and abetting terrorism.

CAIR's entire membership needs to be tried, convicted, and imprisoned for this.

Discovery cuts both ways. CAIR and the Imam-o-thugs are perfect targets for countersuit by the airline, passengers and Port Authority.

If there is a Fed. Prosecutor worth his salt, a RICO case or some form of conspiracy case to intimidate and/or disrupt federally regulated air travel could be made.

Civil and criminal investigations would flush the festering floating turd, CAIR.

#146 friarstale

how long before we are contributing to Charles' legal defense fund?

***shudder***

Beagle --

One of the most repeated phrases in the Qur'an, when not paying lip service to Allah's compassion and mercy, is "strike fear into the hearts of the unbelievers."

But now their big mistake is that they're striking ANGER into our hearts.

And anger can sometimes be a very healthy emotion. Like now.

So keep it up, CAIR. Just keep pushing our buttons and see where it gets ya.

loppy - that's the federal rule for a dismissal. U.S. Courts don't have demurrers (i.e., "your complaint is crap") like the state courts entertain (although each federal court is allowed its own "local" rules). If you think a claim is essentially crap, you file a 12(b)(6) motion which allows the judge to dismiss the action. Any attorney worth his salt files that first. I'm also trying to think what tort the passengers committed that would allow them to sue under a cause of action in federal court. I do not see how these twits have a private right of action against citizens who reported what they deemed suspicious behavior to an airline. I haven't had a chance to read the complaint, but I'm looking forward to it.

And good point on summary judgment - that usually comes after discovery is almost completed, and I'm thinking if the court denies a 12(b)(6), they most certainly would win on summary judgment (no issues of fact, only issues of law, so judge could made decision).

Who is the US Attorney in MN? Sounds like a RICO investigation should be getting underway to me.

-S-

ma sands and others interested. Here is the link to the post above and follow up.

#151 Ma Sands

What you say makes me think about what a service Charles is doing for this kind of issue (involving our own safety in fact). I don't have time to search the news and the blogosphere because of work, so I might never have heard about this story if not for LGF. I sent this link off to Prager and Medved, as well. Yes, it would be great indeed if we could find ways to support the fight against CAIR, I very much agree.

#163 Yank in the EU

"Prager and Medved"-- are those the lawyers on "our" side....? :)

I agree --to quote Killgore Trout, "Charles rocks!" :)

In some States the passengers could counter sue not only the Flying Imams for mental distress , but also the filing Attorneys. I think it would be a good idea.

#162 Carolyn

Thank you! Now, to get someone to write it up as a news article or some such thing, so Charles can post it on the front page of lgf! --that appears a large effort by CAIR... ):

They have no chance in hell to win this lawsuit, really. But that isn't the case: it will get publicity and cost the airlines some serious bucks. In the future, other airlines will think twice before committing an action similiar to this and will probably lead to future terrorist acts ....CAIR's ultimate goal.

Our legal system is a joke. It has been a place for groups like CAIR and the ACLU to use extortion against their opposing forces. It is a legal extortion, which kind of goes against the definition as "extortion" itself is usually written up as illegal. What a weird definition. The fact is, CAIR is extortion airlines via threats of lawsuits. ACLU extorts schools with threats of lawsuits.

The company "Monster Cable" also does the same to every company that puts the word "Monster" in their name. They are one of the worst offenders... and our court systems allow this!

Our congress sells out the public...both parties. All you have to do is look at copyright law and see how big companies have abused the system. Now we have others taking advantage of laws in the exact same way on the "civil rights" side of things.

#127 trip
Or, as I tried to say before the site went down :) ,
look them in the eye, smile, and say, "Don't be so silly. Case dismissed."

:)

Lucky we have too many plenty of lawyers to go around.

Moonbats ate my post!

Our enemy's worst nightmare is an informed, vigilent, and suspicious citizenry willing to report and/or act!

These Islamonazis are attempting to use the discovery process to receive the names and addresses of the "John Does" in order to silence them permanently. As for the ACLU actually protecting these American Patriots, forget about it! The ACLU was founded by the President of the Communist Party USA, Roger Baldwin, and 3 other Communist Party members. Their 35 goals for the USA match 35 of the 45 goals of the Commie Party USA. The only goal of the ACLU is to achieve what the USSR failed to achieve, the complete and utter destruction of the USA by destroying the Constitution. THe ACLU considers the founding fathers to be Marx, Lenin, Stalin, and mohammed (the drunk on hallucenigenic wine pedophilic war monger).

#169 J.D.

No kidding. Charles practically has his own law firm posting here.

#125 Ed Mahmoud abu al Qahool Martyr Brigades

How will CAIR claim that guy was an Islamophobe?

Ab-so-LUTE-ly! :)

Obviously, this is about intimidating people into silence but it could easily backfire. Look at anti-CAIR when the who thing folded because CAIR didn't want to do the whole discovery thing.

But it is certainly possible to drive someone under through nuisance legal action as long as you have money to throw away on lawyers. My ex did it to me. I won every single aspect that I fought back on but it cost me plenty, thousands and thousands of dollars and a lot of stuff I just gave in on because the cost of fighting was highing that what i potentially could have ended up with. Obviously CAIR is playing the same card. One can only hope that this time they went after another anti-CAIR group.

I too will put $100 into the legal fees of any one of those John and Jane Does who wants to fight CAIR.

First off I noticed a spelling error in the doc.
at one point they put John Does....
Instead of John Doe.

How can someone or an organization sue an unknown person? Namely John Doe?
Besides the ages of the so called Imams fit the profile as well as the countries of origin that are currently waging the Jihad war on the U.S. and globally. So thankfully someone had the sense to call security even if it was just for precaution. Its better to be safe than sorry in these circumstances.
Cair and Islam are taking this overboard. AS usual.

On another topic Im looking for a Publisher who knows about the holocaust. I have some memoirs that my grandfather wrote of his escaping poland and his journey to Shanghai. There are lots of personal and political thoughts in there also. IF someones interested give me a shout.

A.T.

#171 IndependentCalguyinTX
Hoping the airline officials & employees are strong enough to resist....is that a possibility?

This is all about "Abuse of Process"

It's about using the "Civil Rights Attorney's Fees Awards Act of 1976." Plaintiff take all ... by shopping venue for a sympathetic judge who won't throw it out of court, for what it is.

In Order ... to beat the hell out of opponents, used very successfully by the ACLU and the National Lawyers Guild.

Eliminating that pernicious law would solve a lot of trouble.

If not, it will spawn more trouble, and not far into the future, violence against malicious plaintiffs, their lawyers and their politically motivated judges, who beat the hell out of normal law abiding people .... and eventually the politicians who enable them with bad law.
-----------------------------
"When the righteous rule the people rejoice, but when the wicked rule, the people scheme evil in their hearts.

#172 Carolina Girl

:) As the hippies of the'60's used to say, "Right arm!"

(...instead of "right on"...:)

175 arier -

The use of "doe" defendants preserves a plaintiff's right to sue individuals whose identities are not known to them by amending the complaint later to actually name the defendants once their identities are ascertained. Traditionally, a complaint with "Doe" defendants is styled Smith v. Jones, Brown, White, and Does 1 through 20, inclusive. I've never seen them called "John Does" so that's a new one on me. Unless their lawyer is some twit who graduated from Mrs. Ferguson's School of Law and Tire Outlet.

Every time I read a story like this, as soon as I take my BP meds (washed down with a shot of tequila), I immediately try to picture the situation reversed. What if a Christian couple was walking up and down the aisles of a plane, praying or trying to speak to other passengers about their religion? Not hurting anyone (as the Imams say they weren't), but clearly displaying their religious beliefs, and acting 'differently' than the other passengers? They would not only be required to stop what they were doing (as they should, at least be required to be seated, as the Imams were asked to do), they would be ridiculed, and the airline would immediately say, "we don't allow this type of behavior, as it might offend non-Christian passengers."

The Muslims were doing much the same thing, only we know THEIR behavior is a prelude to violence in many occasions. It's no secret that suicide bombers pray to Allah before blowing themselves up, and with our history of Muslims & airplanes, I don't think it's unreasonable to get a little nervous when said Muslims start purposely trying to draw attention to themselves (and they had their lawyers and PR lined up WAY too fast for this to have been spontaneous). So they cook up a reason to sue not only the airline, but the poor passengers who were not only frightened, but who have been ASKED to report suspicious behavior. If they actually sink so low as to drag these people into court, the airline (or the US govt) should do the decent thing and represent them, supply them with attorneys, and support them - after all, if they're punished for trying to help, every passenger is going to think twice before ever reporting suspicious behavior again, which is EXACTLY what the Imams are trying to accomplish.

In addition, I believe the airline and these poor people should COUNTERSUE the Imams for intentionally inflicting emotional distress, among other things. These a-holes acted provocatively, purposely scaring their fellow fliers, and then met their lawyers and PR people on the freaking tarmac to scream 'discrimination'. US Airways has to not only refuse to back down, but MUST go on the offensive and sue and prosecute these criminals for causing this entire fiasco.

#177 Havoc
Okay, the old KJ, Proverbs 29:2, reads:
"When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn."
I am quite interested --which translation are you using...?

Ma Sands -

If these guys even tried to come after Charles, there are about 8 of us who'd have the answer drafted and the counterclaim ready before he had a chance to read the summons. Fellow lizardoid Jehka can be particularly biting with his wit - having observed it firsthand. I would hate to think what he could do to CAIR and the Flying Imams (G-d, why does that sound like a high-wire act?)

....and I'd put Havoc in charge of the affirmative defenses....

How can someone or an organization sue an unknown person? Namely John Doe?

Because the filing of the suit forces a court process called "discovery" which then allows the Imams and their lawyers to subpeona the airline and the airport security for the records of the identity of "those who reported them".

So they're going after the individuals.

The imams’ attempt to bully ordinary passengers marks an alarming new front in the war on airline security.

Alternate explanation: The strength of an eye-witness is his objectivity, which is never 100%. Now imagine deciding a case on what the defendant might say.

Not to mention that being a defendant, the lesser-funded among them might be enticed to settle. And guess what part of that settlement would be.

CAIR just undermined the witnesses' credibility, or put them on a path to silence, without uttering a single voir dire. It's Legal Maneuvering 101 - a little difficult to recognize because it comes wrapped in a box of Chutzpah 302.

Let's start a fund for these elderly folks... also, all MINN Lizards should rally round the court and employ "islamic tactics" of mass slogan shouting and such. If anybody can put me up for a night, I'll gladly come and use my big mouth outside the court.

Can we start a class action suit against CAIR for abrigment of our civil liberties?
I mean, even if we lose, we make a statment.
Any lawyers here?

#176 Ma Sands

You can object to any discovery request and force the other side to bring forth a Motion to Compel Discovery answers. It then goes before a judge to decide, after both sides submit briefs supporting their arguments. Since this is happening in Minn., and the fact that Bush did not fire all the US Attorneys when he was originally elected, in the manner that Bill Clinton did; which way do you think this will play out in Minn.?

OT: Memo to the next Republican administration: FIRE all the nominees from previous Democrat administrations and place your own people in those positions!

#182 Carolina Girl

:) Ahhhh....you bless my heart! :)

The complaint describes them as “an older couple who was sitting [near the imams] and purposely turn[ed] around to watch” as they prayed. “The gentleman (’John Doe’) in the couple ... picked up his cellular phone and made a phone call while watching the Plaintiffs pray,” then “moved to a corner” and “kept talking into his cellular phone.”

It would appear that at least on "inman" was more interested in watching the other passengers than in "praying"

#158 NiceLass

It may make you and me a a few others angry beyond words, but we not in power and we have no authority. Unfortunately, those that are in power and do have authority are the ones quaking in fear and trembling! Those that are in authority are in the process of appeasement - just like they did before WW2. We have elected cowards and weaklings!

#184 Havoc

"subpeona"...? ): Is there no rule of law, anywhere, which prevents such a thing? --or, is this going to be the "test" case whereby new portions are put into the law, because of our new status of threat-within-the-wot.....?

LoneSome Journey,

It would appear that at least on "inman" was more interested in watching the other passengers than in "praying"

BINGO!

They were looking for reactions.

How can anyone blame someone for not wanting muslims mulling around on a plane? WTF? It waas muslims moving on planes on 9-11 that cost 3k folks their lives.

excuse me for a moment..... ahem, FUCK ISLAM.

Suggestion for Christian and Jewish airline passengers.

The next time you find yourself seated next to or near muslim "passengers", why not offer to pray to GOD for their immortal souls. Dare I suggest that such an offer would entice a violent outcry from the muslims?

Havoc -

Have you checked PACER to see if they've actually filed this?

LoneSome Journey 3/15/2007 10:31AM PDT

It would appear that at least on "inman" was more interested in watching the other passengers than in "praying"

Good catch!

#31 rw in san diego
Yes I too saw the idiot Geraldo Rivera (fka 1970's porn star Harry Reems) on Hannity & Colmes. I almost put my fist through the TV screen.

I'd be very interested to know if those imams flew together from Phoenix to the conference in Minneapolis. I expect they did, since they all came from Phoenix. If so, did they pray and act up going to Minneapolis? If not, then why did they when they were on their way back to Phoenix? Did they get instructions from someone at the conference to test airport security? Who did they meet with at the conference?

So many questions aside from the obvious ones.

#188 IndependentCalguyinTX

"....object to any discovery request and force the other side to bring forth a Motion to Compel Discovery answers. It then goes before a judge to decide, after both sides submit briefs supporting their arguments...."

So, it is still a long & drawn out process, with no assurance of safety for those alert passengers.....

To the witnesses:

Be not afraid.

Be not afraid. This is a BS legal threat. There is no way any judgment can be won against you. You don't need expensive council. Just sit tight and await the court case if it comes. Don't say anything more outside of court. Don't elaborate. Don't spin yarns at dinner parties.

And when it does come to court, if it does, they'll be the ones spending big bucks, and you'll just testify the simple truth, and you'll be vindicated.

Be not afraid.

#199 Ma Sands

Exactamundo!

#31 rw in san diego

I saw that sanctimonious idiot, Geraldo Rivera, on TV last night moaning and whining about the wrongs done to these imams. He went on and on about how innocent they were and how outrageous the actions against them were, but he never said word one about the seat assignments they demanded, the extension belts they requested and placed under their seats, or their general air of belligerence and threat.
___________________________________________
You got more balls than me. I only lasted 30 seconds listening to him. God, but he's disgusting. How can Fox think he's an asset? O'reilly ought to wake up. I suspect Ger-asshole is losing him viewers.

These terrorists - and they are properly called that, because their goal was to provoke terror - may have overplayed an already overplayed hand. The intimidation of witnesses (who don't even have to be real for intimidation of future witnesses to take place) threatens a primary means of spotting trouble, and as a nation we ignore this at our peril. Expect to see defense funds or organizations and calls for overarching federal law, a la whistleblower law, to protect citizens.

It's also worth noting the supposed attention paid to these alleged passenger/witnesses while the clerics were supposedly praying (preying?) or busily in conversation with one another. It's almost as if they were profiling pale-skinned blonde Minnesotans of Scandanavian descent.

(Ovoid/MN is Spartacus and was at the airport that day making cellphone calls while eyeing people who appeared to want to cause suspicion.)

Beagle,

Hopefully when discovered the passengers will countersue for intentional infliction of emotional distress, recounting their flashbacks to the horrors of 9/11 which were cruelly induced by the insensitive imams. Two can play the imaginary damages game.

Except the elderly couple has real damages. The bogus lawsuit itself is "intentional infliction of emotional distress," since they have no legal basis to sue passengers for reporting their deliberately provocative behavior. Go after these arrogant barbarians with a vengeance!

If this case ever gets going, I predict it is going to be a p.r. and legal bloodbath against CAIR. The victims of this legal abuse, and certainly the airline, ought to counterclaim and insist their cases proceed, imo.

there are so many signs around ny: "if you see something, say something" if cair wants to silence vigilant citizens encouraged to be the eyes of law enforcement who can't be everywhere, ok fine...can't wait for the back lash. everyday more and more people are becoming aware of the encroaching fungus of islam

#203 ovoid

(Ovoid/MN is Spartacus and was at the airport that day making cellphone calls while eyeing people who appeared to want to cause suspicion.)

You were? :) You live here? ....which neighborhood, roundabout....? :) You wouldn't have happened to see Ellison leaving the place where he'd just egged on those imams, would you have? :)

First, let me say that reading this sucked the wind right out of me. I agree this really needs to be a constantly updated post.

However, it would be in the best interest of US Airways to provide the legal defense for these passengers. Certainly they have learned the lessons of flight 93 and the Richard Reid incident. It is much better to have 100 pairs of attentive eyes and ears on a flight than half a dozen. Also, their case partially rests on the testimony of these folks.

Furthermore, were they to divulge a passenger identity without a vigorous attempt to avoid doing so, to an organization with known terrorist ties, they would lose big-time in the court of public opinion. Who would ever fly on US Airways again? And, in a real court, the damages awarded would be enormous.

Hopefully, the most these passengers would ever have to do is a one-time letter from an attorney to remind US Airways of these facts- but I bet they don't even have to do that.

US Airways is going to kick CAIR's collective tail on this. The entire industry is pressuring them. There will be no backing down- in fact, I am really going to enjoy watching this.

Bad Good move, CAIR. The sheeps' clothing has just fallen off the wolves.

You guess who's the biggest wolf, now.

then “moved to a corner” and “kept talking into his cellular phone

Maybe he was trying to get a better signal

purposely turn[ed] around to watch” as they prayed

SO

#111 littleoldlady

Defamation of character involves written or spoken harm to a person or organization's reputation. Defamation of character includes libel and slander. Libel is written defamation of character. Slander is spoken defamation of character.

Defamation of character is the general term used to describe both libel and slander under one umbrella. The best defense from being convicted of defamation of character is "truth" according to the courts.

___________________________________________
The key to a defamation suit is "broadcast." Someone else has to have heard it. You can say anything you want to a person, defame their character to their face, but if no one else hears it, there's no broadcast and they can't sue for defamation, or at least can't win.

I don't have much, but I have $5 for the Doe's defense fund. Hell, I will make it public knowledge and raise money here at home to help them out.

(time for the chewbaca defense)

Have you checked PACER ...

Nope, linky please if you have it.

Ma Sands ...

This is old news ... learn a little ... "discovery"

Well, they've definitely filed this loathsome piece of garbage. Deborah Kay Ellis, a Minnesota attorney, did the initial filing and got her buddy Omar Mohammidini (the lawyer who drafted the complaint) admitted pro hac vice. It's been assigned to Judge David Doty.

They have not made a jury demand -- gee, I wonder why? (That's okay - defendants can demand one in their Answer.)

Any Minnesota lizards out there? Know anything about this judge?

A new form of terrorism. Using our messed up judicial system and the (largely democrat) trial lawyers against us.

Fuck you CAIR. You are nothing but terrorist apologists.

Sue me.

Havoc - no worries, we have a PACER account - so I did a little online checking. I'll be able to pull up the Answer or 12(b)(6) motion to dismiss when it's filed.

P.S. - we're doing the Memorial Day thing again this year - all Norcal lizards are invited and Flyboy will be giving rides in the plane....

Ma Sands

Abuse of Process

Discovery

Subpeona

Three simple ways to force the airlines to reveal the names of those who complain.

Something you can't do if I or any one of 300 million other americans phones in a phony report that you're abusing your children to Child Welfare, and they take away your kids.

The Hon. David S. Doty is a former Marine Captain.

This is getting better by the minute!

Havoc --

Good catch - it's not the damages they want, it's the information obtainable through discovery. And they would get the name, address and telephone number of any one of these people who complained. One wonders if they plan a campaign of harassment against them once their identities are revealed, in addition to naming them in a lawsuit.

test

#216 angst

Thanks - do you have info on who appointed him to the federal bench?

Carolina Girl

"the Plane ?"

the One Seater ?

If i get licensed I'd love to fly it sometime, however flyboy (who is a swell guy) and I just aren't that close to share one seat.

But you two have at it.

Pres. Ronald Reagan, 1987.
Heh, heh,heh.

The elderly couple is obviously guilty of a thought crime and lookism with their creeped out look of concern.

#172 Carolina Girl and
#215 Havoc
We certainly have more than enough lizard lawyers to defend Charles!
And, even though I'm retired from the bar due to my cancer and medications, as well as being retired from teaching law, I would LOVE to assist in any way possible in the discovery process. Just LOVE TO!
Just sayin...........!

Also, Judge Doty has a previous history of handling moonbattery on airplanes- if that's what this incoherent post is all about:

[Link: neworleans.indymedia.org...]

I love it. Grab your popcorn, folks.

Carolina Girl

One wonders if they plan a campaign of harassment against them once their identities are revealed, in addition to naming them in a lawsuit.

Guaranteed

#217 Carolina girl

I'd like to refer you to #171 above. The imams goal is to find out who and where are these John Does so they can have their minions kill them.

Well if the imams do sue the passengers, I doubt that they will just settle like a business/airline would be more apt to do (hopefully not USAirways). Give 'em hell, guys!

#217 Carolina Girl "....it's the information obtainable through discovery. And they would get the name, address and telephone number of any one of these people who complained. One wonders if they plan a campaign of harassment against them once their identities are revealed, in addition to naming them in a lawsuit."
Harassment, eh? (wipes saliva from lips!). I swear - and I am serious about this, I thought CAIR had learned it's legal lessons from the several cases which they "settled" before discovery and depositions could be taken and where CAIR was obliged to pay money to the defendants.
I guess that old saying is right: there isn't any cure for stupid.

Sad to say, but I imagine the airlines will cave long before the case goes to trial.

#228 realwest

It would be interesting to find out which overseas Princes and shieks are funding this faux complaint.

I'm a non-lawyer, just have unfortunately been through a few and successfully defended by the "good lawyers".

Is there process by which to "discover" where CAIR National or individual chapters is getting it's funding to litigate these cases ?

I received a letter from the Transportation Security Administration a few days ago. It was in response to an email I had sent to Senator Shelby (AL) and he forwarded to them. I believe it's interesting in light of this lawsuit. I posted excerpts here.

#230 Havoc - While I'm not as familiar with the rules of the Federal Court System as I am the NY State Court system, I believe that if CAIR can be show to have provided any material support to the plaintiffs, then CAIR would also be subject to discovery, which would, I believe,
include probing into CAIR's finances.
IIRC, there was a case last year (sorry, senior moment on the name) where CAIR itself brought a lawsuit and shortly after depositions and other discovery demands were rightfully made by defendant's counsel, CAIR - who started the lawsuit as Plaintiff - settled the case out of court and paid several hundred thousands of dollars to the defendants, rather than having to disclose their financial data and (perhaps) membership information.

#215 Havoc
Thank you! Will read when I get back --off to my afternoon route now....

This makes me ill.

Nothing more than an outrageous scare tactic to intimidate people and keep them from reporting suspicious behavior.

I recall reading recently (and I can't find where) that more than a few of the very large and powerful law firms in the US wouldn't mind doing their share in the War on Terror.

My recollection was that they might be inclined to stand up to the ACLU over the “enemy combatant” questions, but again, I can’t find any links. Perhaps I’m mistaken.

But in any event here’s a chance for them to do at least something: represent ALL of the John Does, pro bono, against the imams.

The sides and stakes are clear. The airlines are more likely to settle than to defend the public good, and the individuals are unlikely to have the resources to defend themselves, let alone the public good..

Will no Master of Litigation-Fu step up?

#3

I just came across this outrage. I haven't had a chance to read all of the comments yet (I will as soon as I've posted this), but I've already sent an email to Charles notifying him that I am a lawyer and would like nothing better than to defend these John Does and crush (legally speaking of course) the imams and their supporters. Don't know that I'll be able to do a damn thing to help, but I'm too old to join the military. I want any kind of piece of these assholes I can get.

Does anyone know if any national legal group has been formed to go after CAIR and its' ilk? I haven't heard of one. If one doesn't exist, then one needs to be formed.

That's it: I'm sueing to let my 135 lb protection-trained Italian Mastiff fly in the cabin with me if they're gonna let people pull this kind of crap on airplanes.

Any interest in starting PigAirlines?

The only airline with 100% pigskin seats and the best in pork and pork by products served at every meal.

Cockroaches.

#212
Is Deborah Ellis related in any way to the Muslim rep. from Minn.?

#238

Fly the porcean skies™

#231 scorpio
Hey, thanks for the link & letter.

I think that the problem is- "Wrongly accused" of what?
Of being terrorists? At least not at that particular moment, they weren't. So if TSA means "wrongly accused" in that particular context, okay.

But, if TSA means "wrongly accused," of engaging in suspicious behavior that got them taken off the flight, TSA is wrong. I don't think that's what they mean, though. Because they went on to reaffirm that the crew and passengers have to be vigilant.

I think what TSA is trying to say, in a PC sort of way is, "So sorry, Imams, but that's what happens when you act like a nutjob." I hope that's what they're trying to say.

Well, in reading the comments, I believe the rep from Minn. is Ellison, not Ellis. Please excuse my ignorance and ignore the question I asked in #240.

So basically CAIR wants to put the entire American nation with their backs against a wall ,offering us the following two options:
you either take action and risk a law suit,or
you don`t take any action for fear of a law suit and you accept being killed in an airplane by muslim fanatics....

#242 angst

I think what TSA is trying to say, in a PC sort of way is, "So sorry, Imams, but that's what happens when you act like a nutjob." I hope that's what they're trying to say.

The letter would confirm the passengers and crew were doing what was expected, but if something's not done to prevent these lawsuits, people will stop reporting suspicious behavior. Which is exactly what the imams and CAIR want.

And I'd really like to know "what" the imams were wrongly accused of. Maybe I'll write Mr. Bernier and ask him.

#236 fore
Here you go, Anti-CAIR.

#246 applesweet

Thanks.

#232 realwest 3/15/2007

#230 Havoc - While I'm not as familiar with the rules of the Federal Court System as I am the NY State Court system, I believe that if CAIR can be show to have provided any material support to the plaintiffs, then CAIR would also be subject to discovery, which would, I believe,
include probing into CAIR's finances.

Since this is supposedly about "defamation" than I would expect it to be in Minnesota State Court or the Home state of the Airline HQ, "American West" ? Dallas ?

If so, let's hope the "defendants" go after "discovery" of CAIR immediately as well as the Imams and their Mosques funding this "Abuse of Process"

I am Sparticette!

A question for those who live in the Mpls/StP area: if the John Does ARE identified, is there a local group that could offer some sort of physical presence to help guard these people?

That would accomplish two things: it might save the lives of the witnesses. It might also garner some very interesting and useful publicity. "We are keeping an eye out on these folks because of possible repercussions from CAIR".

Then again, I guess CAIR would sue THEM.

As for the basic problem of too many Muslims being allowed into the country: this is not going to stop until we have leadership that is not in the back pocket of the house of Saud. (ahem harumph-GW-andGHW-Bush-ahem-hrm).

Just like a Strategic lawsuit against public participation, only more evil.

#220 Havoc

Oh, furry pawed one -- we'll have 2 four seaters - a Cessna and (I think) a Piper available to us.!

Arbalest:

That's exactly what I was thinking....if the airline and/or the US Govt (ha) won't stand up and do what's right by providing representation and support for these passengers who were doing what BOTH entities have asked citizens to do - report suspicious behavior - then some law firm could garner a lot of publicity and respect by stepping in to defend them pro bono. It's sad that the ACLU's role in this will be to protect the terrorists instead of the innocent Americans who were brave enough to speak up when they saw something amiss. They really should change their name to the Muslim Civil Liberties Union, they seem to be the only group they're interested in protecting.

And my earlier comment stands, as repeated by many - this whole campaign by the Imams and CAIR is meant to serve one purpose, and that's to scare the airlines and its passengers into ignoring any and all 'suspicious' behavior on the part of these cretins, so that next time, no one will report the guy with the rocket launcher, lest he be sued into bankruptcy. I wish I had the means to pay for the defense of these folks, but since I'm not in a position, I really hope some "Denny Crane" steps up and takes on CAIR.

Who are these unnamed culprits? The complaint describes them as “an older couple who was sitting [near the imams] and purposely turn[ed] around to watch” as they prayed. “The gentleman (’John Doe’) in the couple ... picked up his cellular phone and made a phone call while watching the Plaintiffs pray,” then “moved to a corner” and “kept talking into his cellular phone.”

Kind of hard to sue people who turn around and who make cell calls, methinks.

#252 CG

Hmmm tempting. I've been more focused on educating the dog pack lately and getting it paid for.

Piper eh ?

the friendly grizzly:

THAT is blatant racial profiling (never mind that Islam is not a race, we seem to have just given up on that argument).

Assuming that the Imams (or any Muslims) might do harm to someone who pointed the finger at them or plans to testify against them is insulting. Insinuating that Muslims might possibly be violent when they're insulted or provoked in any way is demeaning. They'd be in no danger from the RoP, there's no evidence they would hurt anyone who speaks out against them, and offering them protection would be discriminatory, inflammatory, and downright racist. It would, at the very least, taint the jury pool into assuming the Imams were guilty, kind of like making a prisoner come to court in his jail jumpsuit - if the witnesses were given protection, that would give the impression that they were somehow in danger, which would be offering an unfair and inaccurate assessment of the Imams and their religious followers.

Wow, all that sarcasm gets really tiring after awhile. And of course, I am not being serious, but can't you just see this being the CAIR press release if your suggestion were to come true? Remember, the Imams are the VICTIMS here, they are only trying to get justice for the pain and suffering they endured at the hands of Ma and Pa Kettle, who I'm sure scared these poor religious souls to their core, what with their CELL PHONES and their TALKING to each other and whatnot. Poor men, poor, poor men.

So the Imams want the witnessess names? Are The Imams names and adresses public knowledge?

250 the friendly grizzly

Don't forget the clintons being members of the house of suad(spit). Where else did his funds for his unpresidential library originate?

As I said upthread, I cannot think of a cause of action they can bring against the individuals who reported the activities of the Imams. They simply informed the airline what these individuals were doing, and the Highwire Act was engaging in textbook terrorist behavior.

The response to any discovery request by the Highwire Act attorneys designed to disclose the identity of the individuals should end with the phrase "not reasonably calculated to lead to the discovery of admissible evidence."

The judge is an ex-Marine and Reagan appointee. That's about as good as it gets, since forcing recusal of a federal judge is not so easy.

#255 Havoc

Either the Arrow or the Warrior - low-wing, very comfortable. Hey bring the dog pack. (I'd bring Hansel and Gretel but they'd take off for the runways.)

Maybe I'm wrong, but these Imams are enemies of America? And they want to know the names an addresses of people who would save the lives of all our loved ones? Shouldn't we know their names and where they live? Seems to me common sense.

258: that is very true indeed. It is just that the Bush family is so dad-blamed open about it!

Ahh, yes. The Clinton library. It has architecture that is so much a hint at old double-wides! How fitting.

And lest anyone on here jump me about a Southern stereotype: I live in Tennessee. Californian by birth, Tennesseean by choice.

And for Carolina Girl: I, too, am a furry pawed one, and even hold a pilot certificate. Can't afford it, but still have the license. And I learnt in Grumman AA1Bs and Travelers thank you very much! :-{)}

CAIR is leaving this country WHEN....?

55 Sean,

The Saudi oil money has bought the LLL, the MSM, the Bar Assn.,...

Is anyone left who isn't a whore for Islam?

Ah, yes. The famous Saudi money. I keep it with my Zionist money.

And you'll note that this information -- the post we're discussing, here -- came from the MSM.

#262

I hear ya! I'm a Californian by birth, and a Texan by choice and ancestral heritage!

Can anyone explain how CAIR (spit) has avoided a RICO indictment?

#265: No fair, I'm a Texan by birth and a Californian by LACK of choice. I'm not sure anyone's a Californian by choice, are they? It's always "Californian by birth, ANYTHING ELSE by choice."

Sorry, don't mean to offend, just my homesickness for Texas talking.

Sue the passengers. That'll make 'em love Muslims.

#267 Lorenska

Don't gotta tell me about homesickness, baybee - Carolinian by birth and Californian by unfortunate place to divorce. If you're in the Northern California area, email me - we gotta party going on Memorial Day and I need to get the word out to the lizards.

Friendlygrizzly - that goes for you, too! My better half is the pilot, and nothing makes him happier than spending time with pilots and almost pilots and would like to be pilots - just ask Havoc!

Suing people that speak the truth about your religion and/or your associated behavior? I thought that was only Scientology....

I am John Does!

#215
Well, I tell ya, Havoc, you uncovered a sad, old wound, with your last sentence there.....reading now, to see if I can comprehend through that.... ): :) (sad smile....)

#267

I actually love where I grew up, the bastion of freaks and weirdos, the SF Bay Area. It was a great place to grow up when I did from the late 60's to the early 80's. Now, not so much. Unfortunately, everyone else's freaks moved there and screwed it up with their ignorant love of socialism and taxation.

I love going back to visit, and then I realize who the people there have become and I am happy to be back home in Texas.

California might be the garden of Eden, but Texas is Heaven on Earth!©

CarolinaGirl: Thanks for the invite, I WISH I was in Northern Cali...if I have to be in this state, I think that area is better, I'm stuck down here in the "Southland," as they insist on calling it. I'm about 12 miles from Edwards AFB, 80 miles north of LA, in the absolute desert....so the ONE thing in Cali everyone raves about - the nice climate -doesn't even apply to me, it's hot and dry and I'm basically in Phoenix without the attractions. Sorry, but coming from Austin, this will never be home for me, it's just not a friendly place....have a drink for me at your party. :(

#214 Carolina Girl
Hmmm.....someday I might be able to increase the wing presence.....I pilot those Cessnas too..... :)

The utter ridiculousness of these attacks is obvious to us. That's not why I wanted to post.

I can't say enough good things about the LGF-reading lawyers who are willing to work pro bono for anyone involved in these suits!

Fantastic ladies and gents! Although I wasn't one of the passengers I think your actions are amazingly marvelous and I would be willing to cook a 4 course meal for you in my own home if I knew you!

HUGE RESPECT !

#274

My heart goes out to you there in the SoCal desert, but when did Phoenix acquire attractions other than spring training? lol I don't know if you've been to Austin lately, if not, be prepared for the most California like city in Texas (I have lived there and could not wait to get back to Houston and full time employment), although the Austin Music Channel rocks (Austin is the only city in the USofA with its own 24/7 music channel devoted entirely to the local and state scene). And beware of all the new highway construction (they try to complain about traffic, but I'm from Cali and laugh at what is called traffic here in Texas).

The weather everyone raves about is up north anyway because LA LA land is also a desert!

Sounds to me like if this happened again and the passengers were in fear for their lives (recall 9/11) and beat the crap out of the threats - their defense WOULD NOT be temporary insanity.
Defense would be: Sudden Infidel Survival Instinct

Ma Sands, Havoc, friendlygrizzly, et al.

It would appear that Charles Johnson not only has his own lizard law firm, he apparently also has his own lizard air force.

Back on topic, when the defendants file an answer or motion to dismiss, I can pull it off PACER and email a pdf to the Lizard Master to do with what he pleases, if he doesn't beat all us legal types to it, which he has a way of doing.

#278

Sudden Infidel Survival Instinct

Ah yes! The SISI defense!

While I'm not going to claim to be Spartacus, I will say that the Non-Flying Imams should be compelled to experience Islam from the victim's point of view.

Except I generally don't tolerate rust on my knives.

(Okay! I'm Spartacus and so is my Alien Sybiont!)

we are supposed to submit!
/except that we'll probably punch their lights out next time, instead of complaining to the stews and pilots