Does "viable" mean well-armed?

are we back in full swing?

it never ends

And good morning, Charles.

It's viable.

Like pancreatic cancer cells are viable

The Saudis are right.
Arab settlements need to be dismantled.

The term "contiguous territory" sounds ominous.

I think there was a mistake in the arabic-Elgnish translation.
What he meant to say was Volatile, and they thought he said Viable

Doesn't contiguous mean linking the West Bank and Gaza by taking another chunk out of Israel?

Yes, and 15/19ths of the 9-11 hijackers were Saudi, and the Saudis have not paid one iota.

We have a deficit of leadership in this country like you would not believe.

And - OT - Iran is enriching uranium as we speak.

Palestinian state should be viable. Israel, however, doesn't have any such needs. The Saudis continue to push the mistaken view that Israel is required to return all land captured in 1967 for peace.

If the Saudis truly back the Administration's own plans for Israel, publicly recognizing that Israel doesn't have to give back all territory would be a starting point.

The problem is that doing so would unleash the hounds on the Saudis and everyone else who admits the obvious - the jihadis and Islamists don't tolerate any Jewish state of Israel in the region, and accepting even a greatly reduced Israel is insufficient.

re: #10 Ojoe

at least something is being enriched by iran's presence

Saudis.

They just can't spare a square.

Not a square to spare.

How do the 1.5 Billion muslims all fit into Gaza and West Bank?

Yes, Charles...good morning! :)
All news is good news --in a way, if it means you are well... :)

re: #9 MandyManners

The plan would be to use either a bridge or tunnel to connect the two - crossing the Negev so that a Palestinian could travel between the two regions without entering Israel proper.

OT: Jimmy Carter's New Project-Baptist/Muslim Dialogue

Drill Anwar already so we can filp the bird to opec and the rest of the saudi empire...

Put a friggin well in my FRONT YARD if there's oil there...I don't care.

re: #15 lawhawk

re: #9 MandyManners

The plan would be to use either a bridge or tunnel to connect the two - crossing the Negev so that a Palestinian could travel between the two regions without entering Israel proper.

That sounds safe.

re: #9 MandyManners

Doesn't contiguous mean linking the West Bank and Gaza by taking another chunk out of Israel?

Or maybe even ALL of Israel?

OT but IMPORTANT: FoxNews car chase seems to be coming to an end.

re: #18 Know Your Enemy

Just something else for them to blow up.

re: #7 Ward Cleaver

The term "contiguous territory" sounds ominous.

That was my thought as well.

Whatever, the Saudis still suck.

OT
2 charged with pipe bombs near Navy base
By BRUCE SMITH -- Associated Press Writer

"The executive director of a civil rights organization for Muslims in Tampa criticized the arrest as racial profiling, an accusation South Carolina police denied. It's not clear if the item found in the vehicle is actually a bomb, said Ahmed Bedier of the Council on American-Islamic Relations"

re: #15 lawhawk

re: #9 MandyManners

The plan would be to use either a bridge or tunnel to connect the two - crossing the Negev so that a Palestinian could travel between the two regions without entering Israel proper.

Gee...I don't see any problems with that...

re: #15 lawhawk

And we all know that those peaceful Jordyptians would just merrily skip along the corridor.

I love Saudi threads. So much to discuss.
Here we have the Saudi Religious Police beating American and British Muslims who think they are going on a reigious pilgrimage. Called infidels by the Saudi (Our Friends, TM), some are very seriously injured. I wonder if the got to sissy throw there rocks>

[Link: www.breitbart.com...]

"The executive director of a civil rights organization for Muslims in Tampa criticized the arrest as racial profiling, an accusation South Carolina police denied. It's not clear if the item found in the vehicle is actually a bomb, said Ahmed Bedier of the Council on American-Islamic Relations"

Is it just me, or is cair just not getting the fact that their credibility is dwindling by the day...

re: #19 reine.de.tout

Maybe I'm just cynical but, I dont' believe they'll stop at a corridor.

The key word here is "appears". sometimes it "appears" ted kennedy is sober, sometimes it "appears" that nancy pelosi blinks, sometimes it appearsthe administration will quit this wishful thinking nonsense about the saudis. but i doubt it.

re: #24 MandyManners

re: #15 lawhawk

And we all know that those peaceful Jordyptians would just merrily skip along the corridor.

Oops--I dropped my satchel under this structural beam, ins'allah

end Arabic Imperialism now!
US out of Saudi Arabia
let Iran have it
(and then...)

Arab demand

Because they come from a position of strength.

He who controls the spice controls the universe.

re: #27 MandyManners

re: #19 reine.de.tout

Maybe I'm just cynical but, I dont' believe they'll stop at a corridor.

I'm as cynical as you are, then.

“The success of this conference depends on dealing with the core issues of the conflict and a comprehensive solution, establishing a viable Palestinian state on contiguous territory, dismantling settlements and solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem,” the senior Saudi royal said.

1) The Palestinians have been raised on hate for generations and need to be deprogammed on a national level.

2) A contiguous Palestinian state has been established. It is called Jordan.

3) no reason to dismantle anything

4) Solve the refugee problem by allowing them to migrate and receive citizenship or residency in other Arab States, not keep them in camps.

5) Jerusalem belongs to Israel. Period. End of Story.

That about settles it.

re: #31 Ben Hur

Arab demand

Because they come from a position of strength.

He who controls the spice controls the universe.

so true!
hey, who wrote that?

re: #29 Know Your Enemy

What rocket? That's not a rocket. It's fireworks.

re: #32 reine.de.tout

Glad to know I'm not the only one.

“The success of this conference depends on dealing with the core issues of the conflict and a comprehensive solution, establishing a viable Palestinian state on contiguous territory, dismantling settlements and solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem,” the senior Saudi royal said."

This is Saudi-speak for "wiping Israel off the map".

Is it Hajj time?

Have the BBC and the rest of the BRitish MSM whipped out their female reporters to send like they do every year?

I could never make up my mind, was it the networks doing it on there own, or was it conditional for access? You know, window dressing, as to hide their Jasmine Crowe Laws.

Saudi says Palestinian state should be ‘viable’.

If only they had access to a sea, so they could have a port.

If only they had some standing commercial venture, like greenhouses.

If only they were in an attractive locale, like beach front property on the Mediterranean.

If only they had world-wide sympathy.

If only they had a population that was mostly young, working age.

Then, maybe then, they could manage to squeak by. But alas...

“The success of this conference depends on dealing with the core issues of the conflict and a comprehensive solution, establishing a viable Palestinian state on contiguous territory, dismantling settlements and solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem,” the senior Saudi royal said.

Meaning:

As long as it is part of this viable Palestinian state it won't be a problem.

Ralph Peters told me not to worry, so I won't.

Saudi says Palestinian state should be ‘viagra’.

It is.

re: #35 MandyManners

re: #29 Know Your Enemy

What rocket? That's not a rocket. It's fireworks.

That whole story is hilarious
first they had no answer when the cops asked where they were going
then they were going on vacation to a birthday party

first one of them said he made the pipe bombs
then they were fireworks, not pipebombs

then CAIR claimed racial profiling
except they were stopped for speeding... at night

not necessarily pipe bombs...
but they were already exploded by the bomb squad

methinks the bomb squad knows better than a CAIR mouthpiece

re: #22 Kreuzueber Halbmond

Whatever, the Saudis still suck.

OT
2 charged with pipe bombs near Navy base
By BRUCE SMITH -- Associated Press Writer

"The executive director of a civil rights organization for Muslims in Tampa criticized the arrest as racial profiling, an accusation South Carolina police denied. It's not clear if the item found in the vehicle is actually a bomb, said Ahmed Bedier of the Council on American-Islamic Relations"

We call it a bomb, you guys call it "religious items". It's all about the vocabulary, yo.

Please tell me why it's necessary for the Palis to be able to go from Gaza to the WB without entering Israel.

If they are going to live in peace with their Israeli neighbors, crossing into Israel shouldn't matter.

Kind of like going through Ontario to get from Buffalo to Detroit.

I think it's all irrelevant, anyway. Ain't gonna be no state.

re: #39 Silhouette

As the saying goes, "you can lead a horse to water..."
Or in this case "you can give them a state..."

re: #26 Sponge

Is it just me, or is cair just not getting the fact that their credibility is dwindling by the day...

Keep in mind that Al Sharpton is still assumed to have some credibility by the mainstream media.

Most of the people who hear CAIR's pronouncements are not LGF readers

re: #43 Pawn of the Oppressor

Tomayto, tomahto...fireworks, splodeydopes...

re: #44 scott in east bay

Please tell me why it's necessary for the Palis to be able to go from Gaza to the WB without entering Israel.

Two words: Smuggle weapons.

Show support for Israel. I hope linking to this doesn't break any rules.

[Link: www.judaicaheaven.com...]

Anything but discussion about Saudi laws and culture.

re: #50 Ben Hur

BEN HUR!

Anything but discussion about Saudi laws and culture.

But it's so riveting.

re: #26 Sponge

"The executive director of a civil rights organization for Muslims in Tampa criticized the arrest as racial profiling, an accusation South Carolina police denied. It's not clear if the item found in the vehicle is actually a bomb, said Ahmed Bedier of the Council on American-Islamic Relations"

Tell you what, Mr. Bedier. You get a match , I'll get a video camera. Then we'll go out to the nearest abandoned rock quarry, and you can prove that the piece of pipe with caps on both ends and a fuse sticking out of one isn't a bomb. You hold it up, and light the fuse. I'll videotape the whole procedure for evidence.

Through a telephoto lens, so at least one of us will be around to offer sworn testimony after the fact.

I'm still trying to decide as to whether the gang who run CAIR are complete idiots, or whether they think the rest of us are stupid.

cheers

eon

Fool me once, shame on me.

Fool me 472 times... wait, what... Lindsay Lohan story... must watch.

re: #43 Pawn of the Oppressor

Really, how many of us have traveled out of state with bombs to celebrate our birthday? Couldn't they have just stayed in Florida and ordered a birthday cake with candles or something?

re: #10 Ojoe

please use some common sense

why do you think osama used saudis?
he hates the saudi royal family as well as us.

or do you beleive that is is ok to blame the whole country for the actions of a few?
if so, what does that say about john f'ing kerry, the traitor that helped kill millions in southeast asia?

yes, the saudis are part of the problem, but they need to be dealt with in a way that is different than we dealt with saddam.

To me it doesn't matter what they say since the Saudis are so devout we can never be sure they are not lying to us to gain advantage as their "prophet" taught them to do.

re: #33 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

except that this will neve happen

the arabs are not going to give up their hammer until Israel is gone or they they (the arabs) get defeated in a big way, as we did with Japan

re: #9 MandyManners

The plan would be to use either a bridge or tunnel to connect the two - crossing the Negev so that a Palestinian could travel between the two regions without entering Israel proper.

How does that create a "viable" palestinian state; with no Jews to kill?

re: #39 Silhouette

"Sil" -

There is a "viable Palestinian State" - its called ISRAEL.

-S-

The "contiguous" bit was already dictated by Madam Doctor Secretary Rice quite a while back. Along with Israel removing "checkpoints" that inconvenience Palestinians -- including the ones carrying bombs.

OT:

according to Drudge, Rudi likes Mccain

well, that means there is no republican i can vote for except Tancrado.

re: #59 wargammer2005

re: #33 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

except that this will neve happen

the arabs are not going to give up their hammer until Israel is gone or they they (the arabs) get defeated in a big way, as we did with Japan

I'll take the latter.

re: #33 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

1) The Palestinians have been raised on hate for generations and need to be deprogammed on a national level.

2) A contiguous Palestinian state has been established. It is called Jordan.

3) no reason to dismantle anything

4) Solve the refugee problem by allowing them to migrate and receive citizenship or residency in other Arab States, not keep them in camps.

5) Jerusalem belongs to Israel. Period. End of Story.

Nicely and concisely stated. Except that two Palestinian states have been established, i.e. Jordan and Israel. The idea of an Arab national identity of "Palestine" is a fiction created to provide a rationale for wiping out all of the Jews in the region. Palestine was a British colonial mandate, and it no longer exists. People who lived there, whether they're now Israeli Arabs, Israeli Jews, Jordanian Arabs, Jordanian Jews (actually these were pretty much all massacred or violently forced out of the country), or stateless Arabs -- they're all Palestinians.

Appeasement or 'Grand Strategy'
by Diana West

Boy, when it comes to Saudi Arabia, that Condi Rice and Bob Gates sure drive a tough bargain.

Visiting "the kingdom" (the grating, fairytale nickname for that oil-rich human-rights pit), the U.S. secretaries of state and defense delivered a blunt message: If you keep fomenting and financing global jihad; if you keep teaching and preaching the eradication or repression of non-Muslims; if you keep trampling human rights, women's rights, freedom of conscience and freedom of speech; and, last but not least, if you keep supporting Sunni insurgents in Iraq who are battling American troops, well, then, the United States of America will be forced to act. Yessir, you can bet your bottom petrodollar. You Saudis keep doing all that bad stuff and Uncle Sam is going to... deliver $20 billion of cutting edge weaponry to you, ASAP.

That'll fix them.

[Link: washingtontimes.com...]

re: #63 wargammer2005

* * *

Wargammer, Rudi's kindness to McCain goes way back. Rudi was kind to McCain when McCain ran for president in 2000. In fact, Rudi sent New York's finest to escort McCain's Straight Talk Express IN RUSH HOUR through the tunnel from Hoboken to Manhattan on a weekday back in September 1999, during McCain's presidential announcement tour.

Perhaps Rudi on Sunday was only trying to be kind to the cranky old man who looks like the odd man out on the Republican dais, compared to the younger, more optimistic presidential hopeful candidates.

re: #57 wargammer2005

I would have taken out by air a lot of SA madrassas, especially those that the hijackers attended, if I could have determined that. If not, 15 of them starting from the biggest on down.

And I would have said "we'll have no more of this shit from this so-called religion.

By contrast.

What a load of rubbish. The ROP is always complaining that they are misquoted, mistranslated or misunderstood. Just like a man cheating on his wife. "My wife doesn't understand me" he bleats. Of course the problem is that she understands him far too well.

We understand them too well, despite all their double talking.
Translation: Israel goes, then there will be peace.
All together now: "Oh No there won't" (bit early for Panto season but WTF)

Why is anyone wasting time on this. Buzzsawmonkey#56 makes a very good point. MAKE THEM RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR BEHAVIOUR. Every attempt to throw it at Israel bring it back to the Pals own behaviour - consistantly, and hit them with it every single time. Sooner or later the penny might drop with their Arab neighbours that their base strategy (everything is Israels' fault) isn't working. They still haven't got over losing to the Israelis 40 years ago. Forget impotence, this should melt their brains.

6.20pmGMT

re: #66 opinionated

A couple, three years ago, I was criticizing the Democrats and Left with the best of you.

Today I realize that while they continue to be scumbags, they only have the power to talk, write and agitate. Any real and permanent appeasement damage is being done by Bush/Rice/Baker.

re: #65 Last Mohican

re: #33 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

1) The Palestinians have been raised on hate for generations and need to be deprogammed on a national level.

2) A contiguous Palestinian state has been established. It is called Jordan.

3) no reason to dismantle anything

4) Solve the refugee problem by allowing them to migrate and receive citizenship or residency in other Arab States, not keep them in camps.

5) Jerusalem belongs to Israel. Period. End of Story.

Nicely and concisely stated. Except that two Palestinian states have been established, i.e. Jordan and Israel. The idea of an Arab national identity of "Palestine" is a fiction created to provide a rationale for wiping out all of the Jews in the region. Palestine was a British colonial mandate, and it no longer exists. People who lived there, whether they're now Israeli Arabs, Israeli Jews, Jordanian Arabs, Jordanian Jews (actually these were pretty much all massacred or violently forced out of the country), or stateless Arabs -- they're all Palestinians.

I was taking it as an established LGF fact that the idea of the "palestinian" people was a myth to refer to Arabs who were living in the region at the time of Israel's modern re-establishment. Disecting the myth that is Palestine and its people would have taken waaay too long.

We shouldn't forget that oil is a fungible asset, and that for the Saudis to "punish us" for disapproving of their policies is societal suicide for the ruling Wahhibist clans of that unsettled nation.

Maybe our leaders need to be reminded that we do have tremendous natural resources of our own, and that resisting extortion by religio-political measures probably means a more dominant position for our country in the future.

I'll except Iceland from this discussion, they are far from normal.

re: #72 really grumpy big dog Johnson

Here is where the hippies with their alternate energy and conservation have a valid point.

When I was a hippie I had a bumpersticker on my car that said:

Develop Solar Energy.

The sun faded it too.

Israel forgot to ask for a contiguous and viable state. Oops.

Break out your armagddon programs. You can't watch the latest end times struggle for Jerusalem unless you have your armageddon programs.

And after they bounced the rubble thrice, lo, they did have the holy glass. And it was shiny.

Please, somebody explain this to me, if the pre-1967 boundries are so "sacred" to the Arabs, WHY DID THEY GO TO WAR WHEN THE HAD THOSE BOUNDRIES IN 1967?

/SORRY FOR SHOUTING.

If a Palestinian Arab state is made that is contiguous in joining the West Bank to the Gaza Strip, then Israel will cease to be contiguous.

Although the scale of miles is vastly, vastly smaller there then it was with India and Pakistan, when a partition was made between mostly-Hindu India and mostly-Muslim Pakistan, it turned out that there was West Pakistan and there was East Pakistan, not contiguous, with India in between. If the two of them, West and East Pakistan, had been joined together to form a contiguous Pakistan, then India would have ceased to be contiguous. As it turns out, there were differences between West Pakistan and East Pakistan, and a war that resulted between them, and West Pakistan took the name Pakistan while East Pakistan took the name Bangladesh.

Israel should on no account give up its own contiguity, in order to join the West Bank to the Gaza Strip.

There cannot be contiguity for all. Israel has the contiguity, it should not give it up for the sake of a 22nd Arab state. Let there be two more Arab states, a 22nd and a 23rd, Hamastan and Fatahland, since none of the other Arab states wants to absorb these, and certainly Israel does not want to end its existence as a Jewish state by absorbing them.

Hamastan and Fatahland are developing in different directions anyhow. Hamastan is becoming an Islamofascist state, ruled by a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas. Fatahland might possibly be able to avoid being taken over by Hamas, if they stop inciting their people toward jihad against Israel, and if they stop indoctrinating their schoolchildren toward jihad against Israel, if they disarm all of the militias, and if they stop the corruption of Fatah officials.

Since there are 21 Arab states now, why not have two more? Then, if they want to kill each other, they will have to do it via some means other than with ground forces, as was done in the recent battle over the Gaza Strip in which Hamas seized power from Fatah in a putsch.

re: #75 cybermonk

If they get 1967 the previous version will become sacred. DUH.

re: #77 Ojoe

yeah, then they will want the pre-1948 boundries, i.e; NO ISRAEL.

The success of this conference depends on dealing with the core issues of the conflict and a comprehensive solution, establishing a viable Palestinian state on contiguous territory, dismantling settlements and solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem,” the senior Saudi royal said.

This sort of thing could only come out of the mind of a diplomat and be made to sound good by a leftist media.

1st: The core issues have NEVER been able to be resolved, nor have they changed. It is the Arab insistence on these "core issues" that have exacerbated the problem for so many years.

Let's review:

"establishing a viable Palestinian State": How is this possible exactly when the Arabs' priorities are destroying Israel, building rockets, joining tribal mafias, and indoctrinating hate? They put the cart before the horse in Gaza, and we got Hamas, chaos, & more Terrorism.

"...on contiguous territory": This would mean that Israel would have to become noncontiguous. They want Judea/Samaria and Gaza to be the 28th Arab/Muslim state. As we all know, J/S is on the East of Israel nad Gaza the Sound West. To make them "continuous" that would mean that you would have to split Israel in 1/2. How exactly is that fair, or sensible?

"Dismantling Settlements": Ok, this is probably the least problematic, but still unjust, Anti-Semitic, and short sighted. It is unjust because the Phakestinians should not be allowed to have as their demand that this new Palestine be Judenrein. Israel graciously accepts a 2% Phakestinian population, and who-knows how many other Arab/Muslims, yet the Arabs are allowed to demand that not one Jew live in Palestine? The Jews should be given the opportunity to become Jewish Palestinian Citizens and stay in their homes. We learned this lesson ourselves in the 1960s. Seperate-but-equal doesn't work. To ensure that two groups learn to live with one another they need to be forced initially to coexist. We are taking the complete opposite road with this plan. The Jews have to allow hostile Muslims to live in Israel but the Arabs are allowed to demand that every Jew get the F--- out now! Palestine will be MUSLIM (and minority Christian) ONLY! Additionally, this idea is short sighted. The neighborhoods in J/S should NOT be dismantled as they are probably the nicest areas in J/S. They should be sold to the Phakestinians at a high cost. Why destroy them?

"solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem": Well, we should all know what this means. It means that Judaism's holiest city will be stolen from them and divided (again). The offense to Judaism in this move is immense. It would never be accepted to be done to a Muslim city or religious law. Could you imagine the world dividing Mecca for any reason? Security wise, this is also horribly stupid. Israel will be going back to the borders that caused every Arab army to attack Israel in a bid to destroy it. Is it the "peace" of 1967 that we are attempting to accomplish? As for refugees, this means that Israel is going to be asked to accept a plan that allows more non-Jewish Arabs into Israel (ie: the complete opposite of what is being asked of Palestine. Palestine is to be Judenrien, Israel is to be Multicultural) Also, these "refugees" will significantly insure that Israel ceases to exist. With this move Israel will not create just one more Arab/Muslim country but two.

Cybermonk:

Pre: 1967 boundries would give them control of Jerusalem, I believe. Wasn't it during that war that they gained the Temple Mount? Hoisted the Israeli flag, and (I think) Ben Gurion had the troops bring it back down. (Big mistake)

Getting control of Jerusalem, without firing a shot, just a slam dunk deal.

By going back to before the 1967 war, Israel would have a territorial neck that is only 9 miles wide. That is very attractive to the Arab and Muslim states, because their mujahadeen have a fondness for murdering people by striking at the neck, that is stated in the Quran. That's what was done to the journalist Daniel Pearl and to others that were murdered by the mujahadeen.

Just as the mujahadeen love to murder people by striking at their necks, and beheading them, as the Quran states, the Arab and Muslim states would love it if Israel had a territorial neck only 9 miles wide, as it would have if it went back to pre-June-1967 lines. That would be an enormous temptation, just as it was in the days and weeks before June 1967.

Our basic objective will be the destruction of Israel.

-- President Gamal Abdel Nasser of Egypt, May 27 1967, nine days before the start of the Six-Day War.

The existence of Israel is an error which must be rectified. This is our opportunity to wipe out the ignominy which has been with us since 1948. Our goal is clear -- wipe Israel off the map.

-- President Abdel Rahman Aref of Iraq, May 31 1967, five days before the start of the Six-Day War.

re: #75 cybermonk

Please, somebody explain this to me, if the pre-1967 boundries are so "sacred" to the Arabs, WHY DID THEY GO TO WAR WHEN THE HAD THOSE BOUNDRIES IN 1967?

/SORRY FOR SHOUTING.

A question I have asked numerous times when te 'bats tell me that "all would be well iif Israel jsut went back to those "sacred borders". A Crock./

re: #83 Jimash

re: #75 cybermonk

Please, somebody explain this to me, if the pre-1967 boundries are so "sacred" to the Arabs, WHY DID THEY GO TO WAR WHEN THE HAD THOSE BOUNDRIES IN 1967?

/SORRY FOR SHOUTING.

A question I have asked numerous times when te 'bats tell me that "all would be well iif Israel jsut went back to those "sacred borders". A Crock./

Olmert, the Saudis, the UN, US, EU, etc., are all working very hard for the "peace of 1967".

re #82, an article by Charles Krauthammer, Prelude to the Six Days:
[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

If Israel wants to rid itself of the problems of the "West Bank", it should do so while keeping Jerusalem, and Hevron.

They cannot allow the New Palestine to be created on the premise of Anti-Semitism, and the insistence that it be Judenrein.

re #85 (Krauthammer)

Prelude to the Six Days

By Charles Krauthammer
Friday, May 18, 2007; Page A23

There has hardly been a Middle East peace plan in the past 40 years -- including the current Saudi version -- that does not demand a return to the status quo of June 4, 1967. Why is that date so sacred? Because it was the day before the outbreak of the Six-Day War in which Israel scored one of the most stunning victories of the 20th century. The Arabs have spent four decades trying to undo its consequences.

In fact, the real anniversary should be now, three weeks earlier. On May 16, 1967, Egyptian President Gamal Nasser ordered the evacuation from the Sinai Peninsula of the U.N. buffer force that had kept Israel and Egypt at peace for 10 years. The United Nations complied, at which point Nasser imposed a naval blockade of Israel's only outlet to the south, the port of Eilat -- an open act of war.

Wrath

"solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem":

All the fake holy sites of Islam, and they still want to take away the one holy site of Judaism.
Just remember people, that single wall in the basement of the temple mount was off limits to Jews pre 1967.

re #85 (Krauthammer)

How Egypt came to this reckless provocation is a complicated tale (chronicled in Michael Oren's magisterial "Six Days of War") of aggressive intent compounded with miscommunication and, most fatefully, disinformation. The Soviet Union had reported urgently and falsely to its Middle East clients, Syria and Egypt, that Israel was massing troops on the Syrian border for an attack. Israel desperately tried to disprove this charge by three times inviting the Soviet ambassador in Israel to visit the front. He refused. The Soviet warnings led to a cascade of intra-Arab maneuvers that in turn led Nasser, the champion of pan-Arabism, to mortally confront Israel with a remilitarized Sinai and a southern blockade.

re #85

Why is this still important? Because that three-week period between May 16 and June 5 helps explain Israel's 40-year reluctance to give up the fruits of that war -- the Sinai Peninsula, the Golan Heights, the West Bank and Gaza -- in return for paper guarantees of peace. Israel had similar guarantees from the 1956 Suez war, after which it evacuated the Sinai in return for that U.N. buffer force and for assurances from the Western powers of free passage through the Straits of Tiran.

All this disappeared with a wave of Nasser's hand. During those three interminable weeks, President Lyndon Johnson did try to rustle up an armada of countries to run the blockade and open Israel's south. The effort failed dismally.

It is hard to exaggerate what it was like for Israel in those three weeks. Egypt, already in an alliance with Syria, formed an emergency military pact with Jordan. Iraq, Algeria, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Tunisia, Libya and Morocco began sending forces to join the coming fight. With troops and armor massing on Israel's every frontier, jubilant broadcasts in every Arab capital hailed the imminent final war for the extermination of Israel. "We shall destroy Israel and its inhabitants," declared PLO head Ahmed Shuqayri, "and as for the survivors -- if there are any -- the boats are ready to deport them."

re: #88 Jimash

Wrath

"solving the problem of the refugees and Jerusalem":

All the fake holy sites of Islam, and they still want to take away the one holy site of Judaism.
Just remember people, that single wall in the basement of the temple mount was off limits to Jews pre 1967.

I'll give the Muslims 1/2 of Jerusalem for 1/2 of Medina or Mecca.

If Israel gives away any part of Jerusalem I am very sure it will mean more violence and great internal strife in Israel. We always fear the Muslim rage...but giving away Jerusalem will awaken the Jewish sleeping giant.

(maybe this really IS all about Moshiach)

re #85 (Krauthammer)

For Israel, the waiting was excruciating and debilitating. Israel's citizen army had to be mobilized. As its soldiers waited on the various fronts for the world to rescue the nation from its peril, Israeli society ground to a halt and its economy began bleeding to death. Army Chief of Staff Yitzhak Rabin, later to be hailed as a war hero and even later as a martyred man of peace, had a nervous breakdown. He was incapacitated to the point of incoherence by the unbearable tension of waiting with the life of his country in the balance, knowing that waiting too long would allow the armies of 100 million Arabs to strike first his country of 3 million.

We know the rest of the story. Rabin did recover in time to lead Israel to victory. But we forget how perilous was Israel's condition. The victory hinged on a successful attack on Egypt's air force on the morning of June 5. It was a gamble of astonishing proportions. Israel sent the bulk of its 200-plane air force on the mission, fully exposed to antiaircraft fire and missiles. Had they been detected and the force destroyed, the number of planes remaining behind to defend the Israeli homeland -- its cities and civilians -- from the Arab air forces' combined 900 planes was . . . 12.

If Olmert goes through with this...on never mind...don't want to get banned.

/hmmm...who was the last guy that tried to give away Jerusalem?

re #85 (Krauthammer)

We also forget that Israel's occupation of the West Bank was entirely unsought. Israel begged King Hussein of Jordan to stay out of the conflict. Engaged in fierce combat with a numerically superior Egypt, Israel had no desire to open a new front just yards from Jewish Jerusalem and just miles from Tel Aviv. But Nasser personally told Hussein that Egypt had destroyed Israel's air force and airfields and that total victory was at hand. Hussein could not resist the temptation to join the fight. He joined. He lost.

The world will soon be awash with 40th-anniversary retrospectives of the war -- and exegeses on the peace of the ages that awaits if Israel would only to return to lines of June 4, 1967. But Israelis are cautious. They remember the terror of that June 4 and of that unbearable May when, with Israel in possession of no occupied territories whatsoever, the entire Arab world was furiously preparing Israel's imminent extinction. And the world did nothing.

-- Charles Krauthammer

re: #94 EE

re #85 (Krauthammer)

We also forget that Israel's occupation of the West Bank was entirely unsought. Israel begged King Hussein of Jordan to stay out of the conflict. Engaged in fierce combat with a numerically superior Egypt, Israel had no desire to open a new front just yards from Jewish Jerusalem and just miles from Tel Aviv. But Nasser personally told Hussein that Egypt had destroyed Israel's air force and airfields and that total victory was at hand. Hussein could not resist the temptation to join the fight. He joined. He lost.The world will soon be awash with 40th-anniversary retrospectives of the war -- and exegeses on the peace of the ages that awaits if Israel would only to return to lines of June 4, 1967. But Israelis are cautious. They remember the terror of that June 4 and of that unbearable May when, with Israel in possession of no occupied territories whatsoever, the entire Arab world was furiously preparing Israel's imminent extinction. And the world did nothing.

-- Charles Krauthammer

Exactly!

Today, we work so hard for the "peace" of 1967

re: #92 EE

The Israelis cratered the Egyptians runways so their planes could not take off.
Then destroyed their airplanes on the ground. But they left enough runway intact so that their own transports cold land.

Big Arab humiliation, seethe ever since.

EE, Wrath of G-d: I really wish that Israel had just gone ahead and annexed Gaza and the West Bank as "spoils of war" following the 1967 war. And any Gaza or West Bank resident who didn't like it should have been deported to Egypt or Jordan respectively. (Oh the joys of hindsight!)

re: #97 Timbre

Egypt and Jordan are seemingly never mentioned in any peace deal.
Nothing is expected of these states. Highpocrisy.

re: #97 Timbre

EE, Wrath of G-d: I really wish that Israel had just gone ahead and annexed Gaza and the West Bank as "spoils of war" following the 1967 war. And any Gaza or West Bank resident who didn't like it should have been deported to Egypt or Jordan respectively. (Oh the joys of hindsight!)

hindsight...harumph

re: #83 Jimash

O.k., I'll tell you why, but first want to point out that there is a subtle attempt by Jew-haters to refer to the pre-'67 armistice lines as boundaries, as if there was some fixed, agreed upon territorial lines, when lines were only in effect after the new, internationally recognized nation of Israel victoriously fought off the Arab agressor nations in a war of defense. "Armistice lines" not "boundaries."

In their own words (from Netanyahu's A Durable Peacep143), here's some "why" :

"The problem before the Arab countries...(is) how to exterminate the State of Israel for all time." (Egypt's Nasser, 5/25/67)
""Our goal is clear; to wipe Israel off the map" (Iraq's Aref, 5/31/67)
"The Arab struggle must lead to the liquidation of Israel" (Algeria's Boumedienne, 6/4/67)
"Throw them into the sea." (Syria's Radio Damascus, 6/5/67)
"Kill the Jews wherever you find them. Kill them with your arms, with your hands, with your nails and teeth." (Jordan's Hussein, 6/7/67)

re: #97 Timbre

EE, Wrath of G-d: I really wish that Israel had just gone ahead and annexed Gaza and the West Bank as "spoils of war" following the 1967 war. And any Gaza or West Bank resident who didn't like it should have been deported to Egypt or Jordan respectively. (Oh the joys of hindsight!)

They could have done that anytime after 1967 also. The demand from the World, or the Arabs would not have changed. Israel had/has nothing to lose.

If the world really got all that upset about it & it truly affected Israel to the point where they needed to capitulate, they would have been forced to give 1/2 of Jerusalem to the Arabs, allow the Arabs to move into Israel, forced to financially compense the Arabs, and create a Palestinian State. While the Arabs were in Egypt and Jordan, Israel would have been labeled a brutal, violent, apartheid using, occupying force.

This would have been different how exactly?

re: #100 Orde

"Kill the Jews wherever you find them. Kill them with your arms, with your hands, with your nails and teeth." (Jordan's Hussein, 6/7/67)

At the time, when we heard this quote my mother commented " I hope theyy can fight with their asses and the soles of their feet. That's all the Israelis are going to see."

Olmert needs to read up on the PLO "Phased Plan"

8 shug-HahaHa...that is a good one. Or he meant to say
"venomous" and it came out viable.
/this is fun game...if it wre not so serious.

I like the idea of a tunnel. It would be easy to close, and a Pali economy dependent on a tunnel would give Israel a point of leverage.

33 kragar---any time anyone sys "comprehensive" now, ifeel it means that we are gonna get f**ked.

See you have a good plan, great plan. How come no one listens to you?

see charles is gone now for a while..we can fight, an' cuss each other out and threaten,and he'll never know.
/first!heh ,heh...

84 Wrath.. they lie to each other all the time the mslims. and they blow each other up. The Muslims are the worst murder of their own. they lost the war and npow are seeking world pressure to undo the defeat.

"I like the idea of a tunnel. It would be easy to close, and a Pali economy dependent on a tunnel would give Israel a point of leverage."

Don't the Palis already have a number of tunnels in various stages of completion at any givin time?

Only slightly OT but very scary:

Russian Navy to operate from Syria: For first time since fall of Iron Curtain, Russia plans to build permanent bases on Syrian soil as part of large arms deal between two countries. Defense establishment officials fear Russian ships may try to spy on Israel's weapon systems.

See more on [Link: www.joelrosenberg.com...]

How many "Palestinian refugees" have the Saudis agreed to take in? How many have they taken in the past?

re: #105 Sabraguy

Yeah, something tells me that the Palestinians would be closing that "tunnel" very quickly all by themselves.

Also (to inject a small note of reality here) the distance between Gaza and the West bank is over 30km.

Who is going to pay for this tunnel?
Suha Arafat?
The Saudis?

With friends like them, who needs enemies...

Its not like they're financing a quest for total world domination or anything... Oh, you say they fund Whabbism? That most of the Islamofacist terrorists DO recieve funding channeled through the Saudi's many front organizations? That Whabbism originated in SA?

We're boned, if only because we consider them to be friends.

"...“The success of this conference depends on dealing with the core issues of the conflict..."

The "core issues" are spiritual, for the Jordyptian-Muslim third-generation 'refugees' those "core issues" include Jew-hatred, ignorance, self-loathing, sloth and misogyny!

So forgive me if I state publicly that the Jordyptians will NOT deal with these "core issues", either at the conference or elsewhere!

re: #110 Cygnus

Only slightly OT but very scary:

Russian Navy to operate from Syria: For first time since fall of Iron Curtain, Russia plans to build permanent bases on Syrian soil as part of large arms deal between two countries. Defense establishment officials fear Russian ships may try to spy on Israel's weapon systems.

See more on [Link: www.joelrosenberg.com...]

I'm glad you mentioned this, because I hadn't heard about it. But in general I sure don't like the way Russia is going: basically regressing to fascist dictatorship and reestablishing the cold war, except that this time they're going to supply nuclear weapons to an Iranian fascist state that is going to use them to attack Israel, the United States, and probably Western Europe and anyone else who doesn't seem Islamic enough.

Basically, Saudi Arabia is at war with us, and we're pretending that we're friends. We're moving toward a point where Russia is also at war with us, and we're pretending that we're friends.

OH YEAH! We sent them money to..we send all of our enemies money if they start to sink.

Fraudis and Barriod *